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Transcript

Twin Peaks: Fire Walk With Me · Citizen Frame

0:00
I slipped and hit my head on the mirror. The glass broke when my head struck it.
0:07
It struck me as funny, Harry. Do you understand me? It struck me as funny.
0:15
You're going right back to bed.
0:18
But I haven't brushed my teeth yet.
0:20
Music.
0:32
All right, people, I do apologize. We had a little Mad Max issue there,
0:37
but it's back up and running, so you can dive in and listen to the travesty
0:41
as Mad Max, Beyond the Thunderdome, and what a piece of crap that was.
0:46
But it's back up, and we do apologize for the delay.
0:50
And this one, we're throwing this one in at you, actually, because we got a
0:55
real busy month coming up, and that's obviously Halloween month,
0:58
and it's going to be so jumbled.
1:00
We got the titles picked and so it's, a lot of us, I'm going to a horror con in Manchester.
1:08
I think you're doing something as well. Yeah, I have stuff to do over October as well.
1:14
So yeah, it's sort of, we're going to get them recorded and ready before then for October.
1:19
And there might be no spoilers, but we might have a very special guest.
1:23
That's all I'm saying. Well, there is a spoiler because I'm about to say it.
1:26
All right, well, there you go.
1:29
Wow. Yeah. Yeah, so we always watch these movies, and whether we like them or
1:34
not, we always have a good fun, and we rip on them, but we could love the film.
1:39
Yeah. Especially when it comes to horror films.
1:41
One of my particular horror films is a movie called Wishmaster.
1:43
It's a guilty pleasure, I guess you could call it.
1:46
And it came out produced by Wes Craven. This was when Wes Craven at the time
1:49
was just producing a lot of horror stuff, because he was making resurgence,
1:52
and Scream, and rightfully so, he's earned that.
1:56
And so Wishmaster, I just happened to mention to Trevor that I'm a big Wishmaster
2:01
fan. We're going to do Make Your Wish.
2:03
You know, it's so good. And it's got great horror cameos, good practicals,
2:08
some CGI that works and doesn't work, but it's still fun.
2:11
Yeah, so I mentioned that I want
2:13
to do Wishmaster. It's one of my guilty pleasures of the mid-90s there.
2:17
And so Trevor goes, well, I know him. I know the guy who wrote that. His name is Pete Atkins.
2:23
And he's also famous. is he wrote Hellraiser 2, Hellbound, Hellraiser 3,
2:28
and Hellraiser 4, and he did Whismaster.
2:31
So, and he's romantic, he's got a great sense of humor, and he likes listening
2:36
to us, and, you know, wants to have good fun.
2:39
And so I decided, why not review Whismaster like we do all of our other films,
2:45
but have the writer on board, and we all have a good laugh, and,
2:49
because he has a great sense of humor.
2:50
He goes with date. And just learn about, about the
2:53
actually the artistic process of from you know
2:56
from paper to screen and so that'd be i think that'd be really fun
2:59
so guys look out for that that's coming out we'll probably have an up and running
3:03
at the end of october as our special yeah but yeah pete atkins uh screenwriter
3:07
horror screenwriter and he'll be on board for the whismaster podcast and all
3:11
around great guy yes yeah he'd be
3:13
perfect for this podcast because like ourselves he just says it as it is.
3:18
That's right What more do you need Exactly We do apologize for this one as well
3:24
This has gotten a little delayed here You know what really sucks about watching David Lynch work What,
3:30
I'll tell you what it was When you watch it fresh off your mind And you're ready
3:34
to record it for the podcast And they got all these notes I'm like oh fuck I
3:38
won't get lost because fucking Rain Man David Lynch is talking to me And so.
3:45
But all of a sudden, I'm moving, right? And things fell out of place where I
3:50
had to go wait for furniture to be moved and this to be moved.
3:54
And I was knackered and I said, I can't do the podcast tonight.
3:57
Because in all fairness, we don't want to do a podcast if we're fucking tired
3:59
as hell. Yeah. It just won't be fun.
4:02
We have to be fun and in the mood.
4:05
Especially if you're talking David Lynch. Indeed.
4:09
Now, the only downside of this is that I haven't seen the film in about five days.
4:14
So I've got the notes I'm pretty sure all the fucking nut job shit that's in
4:21
the film I remember but just bear with me guys as I try to get this straight
4:26
because let's face it it's not exactly a linear film you know we're just talking Whismaster.
4:34
We will be classic alright you know let's start off let's just talk Twin Peaks
4:42
here now Now, in the late 80s, massive marketing campaign around the Twin Peaks,
4:49
and it was from 88, 89.
4:52
It was two seasons. Now, it got canceled primarily because I think people were
4:58
a little misled with the Twin Peaks. There was a lot of stuff going on behind the scenes.
5:02
Basically, Lynch didn't like being restrained by basically television,
5:06
which completely shows and far walk with me.
5:09
So he sort of lost his fist. Yeah.
5:12
Well, there's more to it.
5:15
Lynch is wrong in a lot of his ideas. I know you, yeah, go Lynch.
5:20
I love you. But you got to kind of grow up.
5:24
Lynch needs to grow up a bit and take accountability.
5:28
You have this series where you're promised a murder mystery.
5:32
And the first season was quite well received, a little quirky, a little nuts.
5:38
And the second season tanked and they got canceled because people were sick
5:41
of what he was throwing in there.
5:44
And a little too artsy-fartsy crap. Well, to be honest. Please don't interrupt.
5:50
Go ahead. You interrupted the first time. Don't interrupt. Go ahead.
5:52
I swear to God. What?
5:55
I'm going to beat you with this mic. Okay.
5:58
Threats, valence and everything? Yeah. There you go. There you go. Yeah. Unbelievable.
6:02
Yeah. And I just sent you a sweet, sweet tech net mouse for a gift.
6:07
Well, thank you. You can sit there and slam this fucking thing on the thing
6:10
to get it fucking moving again.
6:12
If anyone doesn't listen to our previous podcast, they're not going to understand that at all.
6:16
No. And so it got canceled and he went on to do other stuff.
6:19
That's no big deal. But he won. He did. He won to finish it.
6:23
And so obviously, and the fans who did appreciate what he was trying to do.
6:27
The batshit crazy crap is, and I like that. I do respect him on that.
6:33
I do respect the fact that he went back, he didn't sell out.
6:37
He actually went to, he went back to his, the original material and he gave
6:43
people kind of what they wanted to see, the fans at least. It's a fan service movie, all right?
6:49
You get that a lot, actually. You get that with Marvel, you get that with Star
6:52
Wars, you get that with a lot of stuff, you know?
6:54
And there's nothing wrong with that. I actually kind of respect it.
6:57
And David Lynch did do that with Twin Peaks Fire Walk With Me. Now, is it any good?
7:02
Here's the problem. Again, with Lynch, if you don't watch him regularly,
7:07
I think you kind of get lost in the shuffle.
7:10
And I mean, I'm a little lucky, I guess.
7:14
I don't want to say lucky, but Trevor has coerced me to do David Lynch films
7:19
on the podcast with threats and stuff.
7:22
So I did Blue Velvet and I did Mulholland Drive.
7:26
And so I'm kind of You're a Lynch Fawn. Kind of.
7:32
No, I'm not. No, I never sell Blue Velvet. You like them.
7:36
I like Mulholland Drive. I actually bought that on 4K. So there you go.
7:43
Blue Velvet, I don't give a shit if I watch it again or not.
7:46
But anyways, this is the longest opening ever but who cares? I'm just rambling.
7:51
I'm on caffeine and I just got done fucking cleaning an apartment and I better
7:55
get my security deposit back or I'm going to be pissed.
7:58
Anyways back to Maybe I'm more lynched than it is Because I have a tendency
8:03
to stay on topic And then I go fucking back shit crazy,
8:07
You're actually behaving tonight Like a lynch character So you know good on
8:11
you You're keeping within the theme So you know it's good to see Good to hear
8:15
Good to see you getting really well into it Even more than me,
8:20
That's those lynch fans for you.
8:24
So My concern was I haven't watched Twin Peaks since the day in 88, 89.
8:31
That's it. Not was remembering. Now, the one thing I will say,
8:36
don't know if he literally is the devil, David Lynch, or he's got some curse
8:42
on people where you watch his films and the movie is actually embedded in your
8:46
brain and you don't know what's really there, kind of like with long legs.
8:51
Yep. And an FBI agent harker where you don't know something's wrong inside your
8:56
head And then when you're, when you finally see something of David Lynch, everything comes back.
9:01
It triggers it. Yeah. You know what I mean? Kind of like you're a Lynchian.
9:05
Yeah. He's like hypnotizing. Yes.
9:09
Your hypnosis until you, until he releases his next film and then poof.
9:13
Oh, I remember all that now. Yeah.
9:15
Yeah. Wow. This, I should edit some of this. This is long. No,
9:19
it's all right. Go ahead. It won't be a long part. All right. Yeah.
9:22
We're going to jump into this and I just like to tell you about some of the cast.
9:27
I mean, kudos to the cast. I mean, we know the regular Cheryl Lee,
9:31
Ray Weiss, Matt Zanamek, Damian Asperick, Fulby Augustine, David Bowie,
9:35
Eric Dier, Miguel Ferreira, Pamela Gidley, Heather Graham, Chris Isaac, Maura Kelly,
9:38
Peggy Lipton, James Marshall, Kiefer Sutherland, David Lester,
9:41
Gary Brockow, Harry Dean Stanton, and the terrible Kyle MacLachlan.
9:45
Oh, Kyle MacLachlan's not terrible, but anyway. He's terrible.
9:49
Thank God he's barely in it. There's, boom, plus one.
9:52
Hey, I didn't realize Mark Frost produced this.
9:55
No, not this. He produced Twin Peaks, but him and Lynch had a bit of a sort
9:59
of, they went their separate ways for this. His name's in the titles.
10:02
Yes. His name's in the titles. Yeah, he is sort of connected,
10:05
but he used to basically, he would have basically co-written Twin Peaks,
10:09
the series, and the 2017 third season of it.
10:13
But with this he did take a step back He was doing other things So there was
10:17
No he wasn't Mark Frost Mark Snow Was a composer Chris Carter did the X-Files.
10:29
Chris Carter Are you sure I'm a massive X-Files fan and Twin Peaks fan Trust
10:35
me Mark Snow Snow and Frost Yeah who was a composer of the X-Files his theme, Mark Snow.
10:44
Mark Frost went on to direct his own films and stuff.
10:48
But then he came back and he did the third season in 2017 with Lynch.
10:52
But there was a bit of a part of the way he's far far walked with me.
10:56
So he wasn't as involved as with the series and stuff as he was with the series.
11:04
But yes, he does have a heavy connection overall with Twin Peaks and Lynch.
11:09
Not the ex-fucking files!
11:13
Oh, okay. That's funny. Come on. Yeah, I mean. Will people mess that up?
11:19
I keep you right, as always, you know.
11:22
He's written some good stuff. Equalizer, Hill Street Blues, $60 million man.
11:26
Yeah, he's been a job and writer and stuff for the last few decades.
11:31
Fair enough. All right, well, I'll give this a fuck then. Yep.
11:34
All right, so I remember David Lynch's character. He plays Gordon.
11:38
Gordon Cole, yes. where he's always yelling because he's got to wear the earpiece. Yes.
11:44
I do see that all started coming back to me pretty quickly.
11:48
And you meet Chris Isaac and they're there. Well, first there's a school bus
11:53
of kids and there's a hooker. Yes, who held them ransom.
11:59
Oh, they didn't say what that was. They've hijacked the bus.
12:02
No, it's just like a Lynch quirk.
12:04
And then it's Gordon Cole, then played by Lynch,
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basically tells them to go to deer meadow
12:11
but before that they they meet the dancing girl to
12:13
give them clues because it is a blue yeah you're just yeah yeah you're
12:17
kind of jumping though ahead because they he calls chris isaac away from the
12:21
scene yes and that's where the school bus kids and the hook i thought it was
12:24
hookers i think it is hookers yeah they've like hijacked oh that makes sense
12:27
yeah oh okay whatever fucking this is what i'm talking about yeah could i just
12:32
say as well But before this,
12:34
the very first scene, the opening scene,
12:37
is of the killer killing Teresa Banks.
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And the very opening scene is important. The very first shot is of the killer smashing up a TV.
12:47
That's basically Lynch saying, we're not in TV world anymore.
12:51
This is basically, the gloves are off, you know.
12:55
And then we meet Chet Desmond and Sam Stanley and Gordon Cole. Yeah, so...
13:02
Yeah. So we meet this dancing girl. Yes.
13:06
It's fucking just, fuck me. Come on, guys. I mean, she got Kiefer there.
13:11
We love our Kiefer and Chris Isaac. I guarantee you both of them, like, what the fuck?
13:17
So we're like, and I'm looking at her and she's wearing red.
13:23
She looks ill and she looks like she's got some bone disease and then it looks
13:28
like she's eating a sour ball.
13:29
Yes. And I'm like, what the fuck? And so he breaks down the- The blue rose kiss.
13:37
Yeah. He goes, he breaks the kefir. I'm just saying there are fucking real names.
13:42
The kefir, eyes blinking.
13:45
It was the one hand in the pocket means somebody's hiding something. Yes.
13:49
Walking in place, lots of leg work involved.
13:52
Yes. A tailored dress is code for drugs. Yeah.
13:56
The blinking eye, both blinking eyes means.
14:00
They're hiding something as well. They're hiding something. No,
14:02
that's one hand in the pocket means something. Yes, yes. The fist means.
14:06
They're going to be belligerent. They're going to be belligerent.
14:08
They're not going to help you.
14:10
And the blue rose, well, I can't tell you about that. What the fuck?
14:15
No, no, because the blue rose is important.
14:16
It's connected to the Black Lodge entities.
14:19
There's the Black Lodge and the White Lodge, which are basically lynched versions of heaven and hell.
14:24
And the in the Black Lodge and the Red Room which is in the Black Lodge that's
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where the likes of Bob and the dancing dwarf you know the arm yeah and that's
14:34
the that's the date rage scene is that the no,
14:37
we'll get to it that's the nightclub you know yeah I mean we'll get to it this
14:42
movie is pretty gratuitous and.
14:45
It's sad that actresses are treated like this. Now, don't get me wrong.
14:48
She signed a contract. She consented to do this.
14:53
And I'm shocked to see Moira Kelly take her clothes off.
14:57
But it's really sad when you see women being sodomized or whatever in cinema.
15:05
Look, I'll be jumping in there. Please let me say something.
15:08
I would say that, yes, they're tough scenes to watch.
15:11
Yes, there's nothing on that. But that is the intention.
15:14
Attention because this addresses some very this
15:17
is not it's not gratuitous but i would say it's lynch
15:21
it's good too no no i don't think it is but well
15:23
that's that's that's kind of sad no no i think like you know it's a case of
15:28
it's dealing with some very dark i mean the darkest of dark you know sort of
15:33
issues here and lynch it is sort of burning it out there for you know because
15:40
yeah i I mean, it's a tricky one. Do you know what?
15:42
I think watching certain scenes with Laura Palmer later on whenever they're
15:47
nude and stuff, especially in the nightclub scene, as I've got older,
15:50
I found them tougher to watch.
15:52
Do you know what I mean? And you sort of, you know, obviously,
15:54
you know, Cheryl Lee and David Lynch are still on great terms and stuff.
15:58
Obviously, it was completely consensual and, you know, all that sort of thing.
16:04
But yes, there are scenes that are a tough watch here.
16:08
Yeah. Well, we'll get to him as we go.
16:12
Now, I'm not going to hear and dismantle the film because I know there's a lot of Liz fans out there.
16:16
And he does play fan service. This movie, like I mentioned in the beginning,
16:20
it's fan service to the fans of the Twin Peaks. Yeah.
16:24
And so, like I said, movie studios are doing it to this day.
16:29
Alien Romulus, perfect example. Fan service, the greatest hits.
16:32
That's what he's doing here. here, but it's not that, I like the story itself.
16:38
I like, it's pretty much Leland, it's pretty much the Palmer story,
16:42
the father and daughter relationship. This is what this is based around.
16:45
And I did like, I think Ray Weiss is an underrated actor, always thought,
16:49
and we all love him from Robocop, but the guy has got some good street cred.
16:54
He's very good here. And to play this role, very tough. Yeah. Very tough role to play.
17:00
And we'll shortly dive into that. Now we're here in- Deer Meadow,
17:04
first of all. Deer Meadow, Deer Meadow. Yes.
17:06
And we meet Sheriff Cable. And this is where they were talking about the lady in the dress.
17:11
Yes. Where they're going to be belligerent. They're not going to help you, yada, yada, yada.
17:15
And I do like when- This is the kind of lunch I like, where it's more grounded,
17:24
keystone coppery stuff.
17:26
Yeah, it's the quirky sort of humoring type-
17:30
Like when you got this smart-ass deputy coming in and Chet just breaks his nose. Yeah.
17:35
Get some coffee, you know? And so I do like, you know, that whole introduction
17:42
to this town where this is where Teresa Banks was killed.
17:46
Yes. And Deer Meadow is like the polar opposite to Twin Peaks.
17:51
I think it's literally on the map of the polar opposite, but it's also where
17:54
Twin Peaks is quirky and friendly and some fine cherry pie and,
17:59
you know, coffee and stuff.
18:00
These are quite nasty. These guys, including their sort of secretary at the
18:06
station, you know what I mean?
18:07
They're very awkward and it's the polar opposite of Twin Peaks, essentially, the town.
18:13
So what we do find out, the connection between Teresa Banks,
18:17
now it kind of cuts away with all Teresa Banks' investigation investigation,
18:23
because as quickly once it leads to one year later, it would be the Palmer.
18:29
But we do find out Teresa Banks does have a relationship with Palmer.
18:33
That is which we find out. But also she was having an affair with her father.
18:39
Well, she wasn't having an affair with him. He was paying her. She was a prostitute.
18:43
So you don't think he's having an affair with the father because he's paying
18:47
for it? Well, it's, I suppose, well, I suppose it is. No, wait a minute.
18:50
No, let's see an audience. So Trevor just said. She was a hooker?
18:57
No. If you're married, gentlemen, it's okay.
19:01
You're not having an affair if you're paying for it. I don't mean it like that.
19:04
That's what he just said.
19:05
But she wouldn't have considered him her boyfriend.
19:08
Let's put it like that. It wasn't like. But he was having an affair.
19:12
Well, he was paying her, you know?
19:13
Yes. Well, yeah. As far as his wife's concerned, yes.
19:18
What's your definition of an affair?
19:22
Yeah, well, I suppose they were having an affair of sorts, but it wasn't like
19:26
they were like boyfriend-girlfriend. He was paying her.
19:30
Let's just move on. I know, but I know, but I just don't think it's funny that
19:35
you... You know what I'm saying?
19:37
I'm just saying. I'm just saying it is not the traditional affair,
19:42
but he was basically, he was paying her. You know what I mean? Yeah.
19:47
Yeah, I'm keeping this in. I don't give a fuck. Do keep it in.
19:50
This is too good. Do keep it in. This is gold. Good.
19:54
For any of you adulterers out there, you give us a lot of likes because Trevor's on your side.
20:03
Oh fuck that was great yeah so yes
20:07
so he is having the fair with the hooker yes and she's
20:11
good friends with palmer they work
20:13
together yes no she worked at the she was a waitress
20:16
yes theresa banks was a waitress no no that was just one of our jobs but they
20:21
yeah our other job was basically being a hooker along with laura palmer yeah
20:26
yes okay yeah yes And that's where you meet Harry Dean Stanton.
20:35
He plays Carl. He runs this trailer park. Yes.
20:38
And he's going to show Teresa Banks' trailer. Yes.
20:45
And they keep showing a sign. They keep a sign that says number six on a telephone pole. Yes.
20:53
Yes. I'll tell you what that's connected to. It's the electric.
20:56
There's lots of references to electric. electric that's how the entities from
21:01
the black lodge travel they travel through electricity,
21:05
and that's basically looking at the electric pole that's why it sort of focuses
21:11
in on that even whenever they're at the diner agent chet desmond and sam stanley
21:17
there's the electrics a bit off do you notice and they've got a spark in fixing
21:21
the electric and stuff and there's a.
21:25
It's basically the entities that's how they travel through
21:28
electricity and this is elaborated more on in
21:32
the 2017 series but basically
21:35
right i'm going to give you a quick history of where the entities come from the
21:38
the entities back in the 1940s and
21:42
i think what's the desert in america
21:45
anyway there was nuclear testing going on and this
21:48
one particular nuclear test basically caused so much damaged in the atmosphere
21:54
or whatever it basically opened a door to another dimension which is how these
21:59
uh basically entities came through oh so it's buckaroo bonsai not well yeah and yes it is.
22:07
David lynn stole yeah from buckaroo bonsai
22:10
what's well you could argue that i'm sure
22:13
it's been done way before buckaroo bonsai but yes these entities
22:17
came through from another dimension now there's
22:20
good entities like the giant but there's also the who
22:23
live in the white lodge and then there's the evil entities
22:26
like bob the child fonts the jumping man
22:29
the the arm you know the dancing dwarf guy
22:32
they're evil entities and the evil entities they
22:35
meet above a convenience store which we see david bowen
22:37
but also they survive on gormon
22:41
bosia or gormon bosia which is
22:44
translated as pain and suffering which takes the
22:47
form of creamed corn which we
22:50
see them eating but yes it becomes whenever they they basically the pain and
22:54
suffering of their victims gets turned into creamed corn that they eat in the
22:58
red room in the black lodge how do you sit there and say how do you sit there
23:06
and say and you literally did it with a straight face i love all this,
23:10
They turn their victims into cream corn and then they eat them in the red room. Yes, yep.
23:16
And you didn't chuckle. You just like were so passionate about that.
23:23
You know, I've been living in this world of Twin Peaks and Lynch's Head since.
23:29
Oh my God. It must be nearly 30 years.
23:32
That explains so much. Yeah, it must be near 30 years. I was like,
23:36
I think I was still in my teens when I happened by pure chance upon a Channel
23:40
4 in the UK late night showing of Twin Peaks Fire Walk With Me.
23:46
And ever since then, I've been smitten.
23:50
So there you go. Okay. So, well, there we go. They got to read Cream Corner.
23:59
So Kiefer Sullivan had not much to do. It was more of a cameo.
24:02
He chucks off with the body.
24:04
They have a ring. they found the ring the cursed ring the first ring which is
24:08
underneath the missing trailer underneath I think it was the deputies trailer
24:11
no no the deputies trailer was there as well the trailer that Carl the Harry Dean,
24:18
Stanton character points out which Dale Cooper asks
24:21
him says it was an old woman and her grandson that's the telephones also known
24:26
as the three mons and that's the one with the dancing he's the dancing fucker
24:29
yes the kid yes with the mask the jumping fucker yes and his grandmother mother
24:34
who he lives with in the trailer park is the old woman. They're Black Lodge entities.
24:39
So what the fuck goes with the introduction of fucking Cooper with the camera?
24:43
And he's looking at the camera. He goes back, looks at the camera again,
24:47
and then we see David Bowie behind him, goes back to the camera.
24:50
He's still in front of the camera even though he's not in front of the camera anymore.
24:54
Because... What was that album? Because it's David Bowie playing the long lost
24:58
agent Philip Jeffries who went missing and he...
25:02
Magically basically reappears for a very brief time he has been jumping between these different,
25:09
dimensions so he has and he even says i have
25:11
been to one of their meetings you know above the convenience store and
25:15
then it sort of flashes back to their meeting where you see the jumping man
25:17
and stuff and the way guys go on you know this is a formic yeah the cult that
25:22
was the cult jeffries was part it looked like a well it wasn't so much michael
25:25
myers guy and then it wasn't so much and But then Agent Philip Jeffries does
25:31
return in the 2017 series.
25:34
Obviously, Bowie had passed away, so he couldn't play him. So David Lynch turned
25:38
the character into a giant talking teapot.
25:45
I'm not making this up. How can you sit there?
25:49
And it's almost like we're talking Alice in Wonderland all of a sudden. Yeah, I mean.
25:54
And you're just so passionate about this. this how the how
25:57
can you sit there and it's it's just
26:00
so creative so david bowie passed away god
26:03
rest his soul he's passed away and how
26:06
do they you know honor his memory by turning into a fucking teapot isn't that
26:10
what fucking angela lansbury was in the fucking beauty and the beast cartoon
26:14
it's actually a giant talking time traveling teapot so oh my oh my you know
26:22
what you left Left that part out.
26:24
That's very significant. Thank you. Now it makes sense. Well,
26:26
actually, stuff like this does blow me away.
26:28
It's just so unique and so creative and just, Lynch is the real deal.
26:34
I think if a monkey showed up on the screen There is a monkey in it? wiping its ass.
26:41
Oh, jeez. Yeah, I know. Yeah, exactly. If a monkey showed up wiping its ass,
26:46
licking its feces from its fingers,
26:48
flicking them out the screen, you would sit there and go,
26:51
oh my god i get it you're
26:55
a sucker i'm not a sucker i have examined this
26:58
this is just this is just stupidity no
27:02
it's not stupid no no no no no no no no i see as much i'll admit it's batshit
27:07
crazy but as batshit as it is within this universe it makes sense within this
27:13
universe that lynch has created it does make sense yes it's completely off the
27:16
wall i mean lynch himself has been described as Jimmy Stewart from Mars.
27:21
You know, it's completely off the wall. And sometimes Lynch does troll the fans and the critics.
27:28
See all the crazy stuff that I'm talking about within the context of this universe
27:32
that Lynch has created. It does make sense.
27:37
Yeah. So he pretty much ends with the killer's going to strike again.
27:40
Yes. Because they find that little letter underneath the nail. Yes.
27:44
Of Teresa Banks. And this is where it's one year later. And we're in twin.
27:47
And then the Twin Peaks theme. The Twin Peaks theme kicks in.
27:50
I will say this. It's very iconic. I do like the Twin Peaks theme.
27:54
Angelo Alimenti. Yes. It's very eerie. It's ominous, but it's also soothing.
28:00
Yeah, oh, it's beautiful.
28:01
It's very hypnotic, and it's definitely atmospheric.
28:07
Without his score, this movie would suck. I mean, it's just like if John Williams
28:12
wasn't around for Raiders or blah, blah, blah.
28:15
It does hold up. The one saving grace this film would have would be his score.
28:22
Right. Well, I think it's great all around, but yes, I do love the score,
28:25
especially later on where you he composes
28:28
him and lynch actually composes a song in
28:32
the basically in the nightclub where laura palmer
28:35
first enters it it's called questions in a world of
28:37
blue to perform by julie cruz and it is so like melancholic and profound you
28:43
know because if this is the point in her where she realizes she's doomed she
28:49
is you know she's screwed you know and it's just again Again,
28:54
Badalamenti, Cruise and Lynch together,
28:56
and not just Twin Peaks, but other films, you know, superb.
29:01
So we were introduced to Laura. You get this whole TD Bopper scene.
29:05
Yes. Like you see in the Slasher series. Yeah.
29:09
You get Bobby, you get James again. We kind of figure, you see she's pretty
29:13
much a daddy's girl, but she fucks, she does cocaine, she smokes.
29:17
She has a diary that we find has been violated, pages torn out,
29:20
which we'll quickly find out what that's all about. Yeah.
29:23
This stuff I kind of know better because we obviously know the characters from the original series.
29:28
I actually thought the first part was better. I like that. Those guys,
29:31
I want to see more Chet and Sam.
29:34
And those are the guys I kind of like. When you get back to this world,
29:38
I've been here, done this.
29:39
I was disappointed that in the 2017 series, we didn't see Agent Chet Desmond and Sam Stanley again.
29:47
I think we can both agree that they were like, thank Christ.
29:55
Jesus. You want to come back for 10 minutes and try to solve a murder?
30:01
No, thanks. Well, the lady in the red dress is back. No, I'm good.
30:06
Actually, just going back to that scene, I love the thing that Lynch's Gordon
30:10
Cole does. He puts the hand in front of his face in this really weird manner.
30:17
Let me ask you this. Go ahead. Is Harold her shrink? Yes. No,
30:22
no, no, no, no. He's her tutor.
30:24
But he's also doing home tutoring. But he's also become like a sort of Proxy
30:30
sort of shrink to her In the series So yeah and so he's also having A fur brother.
30:37
Yeah, I figured that. Because she kind of tells him she's losing it,
30:42
yada, yada, yada, and her diary's been violated.
30:45
He's crying for her because he's obviously in love with her. Yes, yes.
30:49
He's obsessed with her. That's what that is. Again, it's like Lynch going back
30:52
to the whole sort of. She's a horrible character. She's not a very nice person.
30:55
No, that's because she's deeply traumatized.
30:59
She's being raped by her own father, possessed by an evil spirit since she was
31:02
12 years old. Okay, yeah, I don't think the possessing's happening.
31:04
I think the father's raping her. Yes, no, that. Well, I don't care about Bob
31:09
or not Bob, whatever the fuck the homeless guy's name is.
31:12
I don't care. It was the father. I think it's reversed.
31:14
I think you're supposed, I think they're playing it like, oh,
31:18
I think, you know, I do think. It's being confirmed.
31:21
I think it's his personal own demon that the daughter has conjured up as it's
31:28
not my father doing this to me. This is somebody else.
31:31
My father wouldn't do this to me. so she created this alter,
31:35
you know, this different version. Well, it has been confirmed that Bob is a
31:38
real entity and it is Bob behind it all in the 2017 series, but yes,
31:42
that is one way of reading it.
31:44
You know, it could be a metaphor for a way of dealing with this unimaginable trauma, you know?
31:50
So that is one way of reading it, although in later series and stuff,
31:54
and even within this film it is confirmed that Bob is a real entity.
31:57
But yes, yeah, go ahead.
32:01
What's with that? No, I'm not going to, I don't care about the old woman,
32:04
the jumpy boy. Fucking, I don't care.
32:07
Actually, let's skip all that. Let's skip all the bullshit.
32:12
Hold on. We're almost done here then.
32:17
Let's talk about the really seedy underbelly. We talked about this with Blue
32:22
Velvet. Yes. I was just about to mention that.
32:23
And how Lynch treats his women in films. Oh.
32:26
And a lot of actors didn't want to, you know, I know a lot of actors didn't want to work with them.
32:32
I'm not saying Lynch is a bad guy or anything, but I'm sorry.
32:37
I mean, the women in here are treated like, Like it's, it's,
32:41
it's maybe, maybe it's because I'm older now and I'm seeing it now more as an adult. Yeah.
32:48
And it's pretty disturbing shit. Yes, it is disturbing.
32:51
Then you see movies like, then you see movies like Mulholland Drive where it's kind of the opposite.
32:59
Where, yeah, well, the women's are still kind of true like shit,
33:01
but the kind of finding their, I don't know.
33:04
I don't, I don't know. I just think. Well, I think what, what it all boils down
33:06
to Lynch is Lynch grew up in small town America.
33:08
So with blue velvet and this he does
33:11
this sort of arc within his stories about
33:14
small town america picket fences everybody's
33:18
happy and smiley and all that sort of thing and but
33:21
basically there's a dark underbelly so yes it's sort
33:24
of extreme here especially in this twin peaks fire walk with me
33:26
but it's not restrained and you know what you know i don't know there's a lot
33:31
of people including Cheryl Lee have said that it was important to show certain
33:37
things in this because it would be almost it wouldn't be right for real life
33:44
victims of these sorts of horrible things.
33:47
Yeah but why would you why do you have to show?
33:49
Don't get me wrong I agree it is a tough watch and like you have just said as
33:54
I've got older I've found it more of a tough watch you know?
33:59
Yeah. Whereas whenever you're You don't care, and you're just looking to be
34:01
shocked and stuff like that.
34:03
But as you sort of mature a bit, you do sort of think, I mean, but you know what it is?
34:08
It's because Lynch is doing such, and Shirley, are doing such an excellent job
34:12
of making it so realistic.
34:15
I know there's all the crazy shit going on, but Shirley's performance here,
34:19
it's operatic, it's superb.
34:21
She knocks it out of the park. And apparently, according to what I've read up
34:25
on it, apparently she gave this role her all. So she did.
34:29
So she was 150% committed to this, and it shows.
34:34
And you totally feel for her. So you do. Yes, she's not, I mean,
34:38
she's getting up the all sorts of, you know, she's only 17, by the way, the character.
34:42
Shirley was probably in her mid-20s. but the
34:45
character is the homecoming queen you know and it goes
34:48
back to the whole what we've just discussed about you know on the
34:51
face of things everything's great and nice but there's a dark underbelly and
34:55
in twin peaks the homecoming queen is a prostitute a coke snorting prostitute
35:00
who is being raped by her own father possessed by this demonic type entity it's
35:07
just dark shit all All right, yeah.
35:10
This ring, let's get back to the ring. So Teresa Palmer had a ring. Yes. Teresa Banks.
35:16
Sorry, yes, Teresa Banks, yeah. Teresa Banks had a ring, and she's found dead.
35:23
Laura wakes up, and she has a ring in her hand. Yes. Does that mean she's marked
35:27
and she's going to die? Yes, that's basically the cursed ring, yeah.
35:31
She was basically set up by the telephones. You know,
35:34
whenever they give her the picture, her this
35:37
would look good on your wall you know whenever she's
35:40
out doing the meals on wheels with shelly yeah they're basically
35:43
they set her up because they are evil entities as well
35:46
you know i'm part of this cult in the black lodge you know yeah is that shelly
35:54
and leo are those guys who own the black lodge who shelly and leo no no the
35:59
black lodge isn't no not the physical lodge the The Black Lodge is like an otherworldly place,
36:04
but where they go to the actual, that sort of in our world lodge at the end,
36:09
it's basically, that's like a lodge in our world, but nearby,
36:13
it's a portal. No, I want to know what lodge that is.
36:16
Yeah, no, that's like a, for want of a better phrase, a real world sort of cabin.
36:23
That's not actually the Black Lodge. The Black Lodge is, there's a portal near
36:27
there, which we see Leland get into at the very end before he gets into the Red Room.
36:31
Which actually leads to, the Black Lodge is hell, basically,
36:35
in this other dimension.
36:37
So it is. All right. So when Donna, her best friend and the only probably decent
36:43
character in the entire film. Yeah.
36:45
Goes with her to this lodge, it's way, way, way, way, way too long.
36:52
This nightclub with all the red lights beaming down. It's a relentless scene.
36:55
Really shot and jazzy sequence, but pretty much just watching two girls getting manipulated.
37:01
Yeah. One drugged, one roofied, and the other one just out of her mind because
37:05
of her, you know, what she's going through personally. Yes.
37:08
So, and these men are taking advantage of these women.
37:11
Yeah. and Jacques Renaud he's in
37:15
on it you know the big heavy guy that's what
37:18
I meant Jacques that's not Shelley that's what I meant I meant those guys Jacques
37:22
and Leo is the other guy who goes to the cabin later on with Laura and Renette
37:28
Polanski who also shows up in the nightclub and they rape them that's when they
37:33
rape them in that scene too well yeah they tie them up and rape them.
37:38
Jesus dude you know what I'm getting with this I'm not denying this is heavy
37:43
I understand but my point is how do people enjoy this,
37:47
how do you enjoy a 17 year old being great multiple times in a film mostly by
37:55
your father how do people watch this you don't watch stuff like this to enjoy
37:59
it per se you watch it to be blown away by the storytelling,
38:03
it's powerful it's a gut punch so it is you don't actually sit there and say
38:07
whoa this is great you know what I mean You know what I mean Maybe there are
38:12
sick freaks out there who do I don't know, probably
38:15
But I ain't blown away by the storytelling The power of the drama Not by the
38:20
nasty shit that's going on You know what I mean, I'm not like getting off on it You know what I mean.
38:26
So it's a case of where it's just a powerful, powerful story.
38:32
And Lynch does not fucking hold back here.
38:35
When Laura and her father are in the same car. Yes.
38:41
An old man pulls up and is pretty much yelling. That's the one on Laura.
38:45
I think he's warning her.
38:48
Yes, he's a good. Not him. He's not talking to him. him he's and
38:52
he and leland panics he wants to get her out
38:54
of there because he doesn't want her yes that's
38:58
because that's how i know this is how i know that it's
39:01
the father who consciously knows what he's doing to her daughter because he's
39:05
trying to get all those set of traffic lights so this man doesn't warn her again
39:09
that's that man is actually a major character in the series that's mike the
39:13
one-armed man and what actually happened to him was one of his arms became
39:18
possessed by bob so he cut the arm off and the arm then became you know the
39:25
little guy the dancing dwarf guy that's why we're the guy he turns around and says i am the arm.
39:32
And then and and then later in the
39:36
2017 series the arm has morphed into like this really talking on three thing
39:41
oh fuck me come on people let's make the one you know i love how you say it
39:49
with such confidence and such yeah don't make the one-armed man,
39:54
You literally just said, without breaking a sweat, that's, oh,
39:58
come on. That's Mike, the one-armed man.
40:01
Remember? He cut off his arm because he was possessed by Bob,
40:03
and then the arm became the dwarf, talking backwards dwarf.
40:07
You don't know that, Kieran? Oh, my God. That was a program.
40:10
I'm shocked. That was a program, man. You know what I mean? You know?
40:14
I just want to watch Star Wars or something. I just, give me my big space bear and Harrison Ford.
40:23
Yes. What would you think, just come back a little bit, what would you think
40:27
of the dinner table scene? That's intense.
40:32
Where Leland is jumping between being well-possessed by Bob and then back to Leland.
40:38
Oh, that's why I was going to ask you that.
40:41
That sort of thing? Yeah, yeah, yeah. There's no one can do tension quite like Lynch.
40:48
Grace, oh, that's, I can go through quite a few directors who could do that
40:53
easily, quite easily, starting with Hitchcock.
40:57
But no, let me, so let's piggyback on their family dynamic there.
41:03
The mother, who I do love, I love Grace Brzezinski, and he's drugging her.
41:08
He's drugging her so she'd fall asleep with the milk or something,
41:11
and then he goes to rape her. That's what he does. That's his MO,
41:14
right? That's certainly what's suggested.
41:16
Okay. Although it's never explicitly said. I'm sorry, I don't think it's Bob.
41:19
I do think Lynch writes it in, and like you said, in the near future that this is what's happening.
41:24
But I think right now, Bob doesn't exist. No, it literally shows you whenever
41:28
his face changes into Bob and back and forward several times in this film.
41:33
I think that's an alter ego.
41:35
I think that's just the alter ego. Bob is a real entity.
41:38
I don't think Bob's a real entity. He always has been since the original series.
41:41
But yes, I respect that take on it. That is an interesting take.
41:46
I'll be completely fair. But in my head, Bob, you know, going by the host,
41:52
the series overall, Bob is a real entity. You know what I mean?
41:56
But certainly to watch this film as a standalone, you could take that from it. It's a metaphor.
42:02
Now, when the next rape scene, when they're tied up. Yes.
42:09
And they're beating him. Oh, sorry. It's in the tree. Yeah, it's in Jacques
42:13
and Leo. There's a little cabin. Yes.
42:17
Haunting cabin probably. Yes. And Leland's going after him because at this point,
42:23
this is where I get confused and you might be right.
42:26
I think it's more alter ego where he's switching back and forth because you
42:29
have Leland who's worried as fuck for his daughter because that's what a father would do.
42:34
And then you've got the sinister fuck of him, which ends up killing her. Yes. From the train.
42:40
Now, and does, is James the only decent, another decent character?
42:45
James and Don are probably the only two decent characters In this entire show,
42:50
James, he's one who's accused Of killing her in this TV show He is one of the
42:56
suspects But there's multiple The great thing about the first season Actually
43:00
the first season and the first half Of the second season were great Some of
43:04
the best TV ever That really set the ball rolling for so many series That were to follow,
43:09
Like The X-Files, just one of them And many others,
43:12
Northern Exposure and stuff like that but yes there were many suspects
43:16
and that was one of the great things about the original series before
43:19
the killer was revealed midway through the second season was
43:22
that who did it like who killed laura palmer and james was one of the suspects
43:27
along with leland and several okay i thought i can't remember if they made an
43:32
original arrest and then there's other side no there's multiple suspects but
43:35
i wasn't sure i know james and bobby were the two go to yes they were the main
43:39
suspects Especially in the first few episodes.
43:42
So when he kills her in rage, we find out he's the one who took the pages from
43:47
the diary, obviously. And I don't think he.
43:51
Yeah, so, and then we see the famous music kicking in, and he's wrapping her
43:55
body like we did. Wrapped in plastic. I'll say this. I'll say this part's effective.
43:58
Where you see her being wrapped up, her dead body, you feel very bad for this girl at this point.
44:04
She's literally being dead. It does bring back the images we had,
44:09
because that was a famous image of her. Wrapped in plastic.
44:11
Body wrapped in the plastic from the original Twin Peaks. So it's very nostalgic
44:15
for me to see that, because I do remember that and the music.
44:18
Music so it's nice to come full circle to
44:20
that and then it's a nice way for people to want who actually
44:23
enjoyed this film can go watch twin peaks now and kind
44:26
of get back into the universe and kind of understand what's going
44:29
on and then of course you ruin everything by seeing a
44:32
man eating some cream corn and then we cut to a monkey because yeah
44:36
you got to cut to a monkey at the end of the at the end of this
44:39
why wouldn't you well they have to because that's the
44:41
was the whole point that that is even during the
44:44
david bowie scene the the dancing dwarf
44:47
he basically says basically fell a victim to bob with this ring id wed this
44:55
is a formic table green is its color and then he basically says that he wants
45:00
his garmambosia which they get at the end through laura's pain and suffering
45:05
then they eat it as creamed corn.
45:08
It's beautiful So poetic Yeah Brings tears Brings tears to my eye The way you told that,
45:15
Fuck me This is Okay What's your overall thoughts,
45:19
Uh It's Yeah Nah Nah This is This is why I don't like the man It's,
45:25
It's I mean it's There's stuff there There's elements there Don't get me wrong
45:29
This is I can't I would never fault Any of his actors Because his actors Always
45:33
bring their A game to him So he's doing something right I,
45:36
I just think he's batshit crazy
45:37
and I do think there's an ugliness to him with his treatment to women.
45:43
You know, we talk about slasher films getting a bum rap.
45:46
We made that famous one about Roger Ebert saying Friday the 13th was sadistic
45:51
to women, blah, blah, blah. But yet they'll call this film art.
45:54
And I'm like, really? So Friday the 13th is cruel and sadistic to women, but this is art.
46:01
And I'm like, where do you – you know what I mean? I don't understand where
46:05
people draw the line. I get what you're saying.
46:06
And listen, I'm not a prude, guys. If I'm watching Fatal Attraction or Basic
46:12
Instinct, all right, cool.
46:14
And maybe I'm being a little bit of a hypocrite because I like those films and
46:17
the women's the one that was always exposed, not the man. So I could be a hypocrite myself.
46:22
But those are films. David Lynch, and you'll bring it up and I'll applaud him
46:27
for it, there's a realness to his stuff.
46:30
Despite the fact it's got a lot of fucking quirky, batshit, crazy shit in there.
46:35
There, it's done to the point where you kind of can see the small town in USA
46:40
happening. It's believable.
46:41
It's got a believability to it. So maybe that's why there's a rawness to it
46:45
and you kind of have to have it.
46:47
But it's just not for me. I applaud the score. Ed Loban will be missed.
46:52
I never understood why he never did more. He always seems to be like a Lynch
46:56
guy and that was it. He might have done more. I didn't really do research on him.
46:59
I'm sure I've seen his name pop up in some other films. He worked regularly over the years,
47:03
you know what i mean but he's more well known for his work with lynch
47:06
yeah yeah this one is a big pass
47:09
i'll never ever ever ever view it and watch it again
47:11
i have no right just to just just to sort of
47:14
jump on what you're saying my my mom's a
47:17
horror fan i watched this with my mom one time and she
47:19
hated it oh come on yeah she hated
47:22
it but anyway well at least
47:25
at least your mother tried to help
47:28
so uh i think this is just
47:31
powerful powerful drama and i would say as well you're talking
47:34
people who say that lynch or whoever three or
47:37
even ebert about friday the 13th treating women badly we're
47:40
talking about fictional characters here yes i i get
47:43
the argument don't you don't get me wrong but at the end of the day it is fiction
47:47
and it is powerful powerful drama i think this is a fantastic piece of work
47:54
a fantastic film power one of the most powerful and hard-hitting gut punched
47:58
things I've ever seen in my life and all the quirky stuff and all,
48:02
I love all that anyway you know all the stuff with the other entities and you
48:07
know the Black Lodge and you know all that just crazy stuff,
48:10
I love all that because I come away from that and I like be like blown away
48:15
and thinking well I want to work it out in my head and stuff like the lighthouse,
48:18
stuff like that just I love stuff that blows me away,
48:22
there's also that powerful drama there as well.
48:25
All right, well, T-Sterone. Like, I'm not going to rip the guy to shreds.
48:28
I do think there's something there with the treatment of women.
48:32
However, Mulholland Drive was a pleasant surprise, and Blue Velvet was not as
48:39
bad as I thought it would be.
48:40
But what are you going to do? All right, I'm going to wrap this one up,
48:44
and I promise you guys we're going to go back to the Mad Max.
48:47
So we got to wrap that one up. And for now on, I think for now on,
48:50
we're going to keep our retrospectives in order.
48:52
I did have somebody ask me And someone,
48:55
me and Trevor know Why'd you skip on Mad Max Beyond Oh no it's coming We just
49:01
took a little break from it In all fairness it makes sense The retrospectives
49:05
just stay as a clear retrospective So we're for now on Not right now because
49:09
we're still sloppy bastards,
49:11
And we got a lot coming out So we'll get
49:14
there We're not going to do retrospectives now until next year We
49:17
are going to do the Bolt Beetlejuices Because it's only two films so
49:21
that it's not really a retrospective but so but
49:25
next year we'll be a little more you know organized when it comes to our retrospectives
49:29
and get those in order but anyways thanks for giving us a shout and give us
49:35
a shout if you liked anything we talked about if you're a lynch fan god love
49:39
you and god help you i guess i can say and give us a shout at citizen frame underscore
49:44
podcast on Instagram and of course Facebook.
49:47
That's all I have to add. I am worn out and I'm thinking I'm going to have,
49:51
I have an urge for some cream corn.
49:54
I find sitting waiting on my, that's what I eat every night. Yeah.
49:57
Karens. That's really sad. That's every night. You're eating somebody's soul.
50:01
No, it's their pain and suffering.
50:04
Me and my wee pet monkey, we just sit here and slurp our way at it.
50:10
I think on that note, we're going to end. Thank you guys. See you later.
50:26
Music.