Latest / Dr Justin Coulson's Happy Families / #204 Teaching Kids Kindness

Transcript

#204 Teaching Kids Kindness · Dr Justin Coulson's Happy Families

• 0:03
  Speaker 1: It's the Happy Families podcast.
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  Speaker 2: It's the podcast for the time poor parent who just
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  Speaker 2: wants answers.
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  Speaker 3: Now, we seem to let a lot of things fly
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  Speaker 3: in our house that we would never accept anywhere else.
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  Speaker 1: And now here's the stars of our show, my mum
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  Speaker 1: and dad.
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  Speaker 3: Hello, this is doctor Justin Coulson, the author of six
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  Speaker 3: books about making our families happy.
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  Speaker 1: I'm here with my wife Mum to our six kids.
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  Speaker 3: Kylie, my podcast partner and co host.
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  Speaker 2: We just love getting feedback, and we've had some really
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  Speaker 2: great feedback come in lately.
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  Speaker 3: Five star review Apple podcasts so simple to write those.
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  Speaker 1: Reviews, Thank you so much for sending them through.
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  Speaker 2: We've had some great feedback from AMC zero one, who
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  Speaker 2: says great parenting tips for busy people. I have only
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  Speaker 2: just discovered this podcast, but have loved all the episodes
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  Speaker 2: I've listened to so far.
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  Speaker 4: I love that the episodes are so short.
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  Speaker 2: I can listen to a whole episode without being interrupted
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  Speaker 2: and then apply the tips straight away to my.
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  Speaker 3: Parenting as soon as they come over and realize you're
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  Speaker 3: listening and they could interrupt.
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  Speaker 1: You, but you've already finished. Isn't that great?
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  Speaker 3: We love those five star reviews. Thank you very much
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  Speaker 3: a mco one. Please send in your feedback to podcasts
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  Speaker 3: at Happy Families dot com dot a you or, better yet,
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  Speaker 3: jump onto Apple Podcasts and tell us what you think.
• 1:17
  Speaker 3: Tell everyone what you think so that other people can
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  Speaker 3: find the podcast. A big topic today because we've got
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  Speaker 3: a webinar tonight. If you're a Happy Family's member, this
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  Speaker 3: webinar is included in your membership. We do one every
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  Speaker 3: single month, guaranteed, that's included in the membership.
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  Speaker 1: And this one, we've had so many.
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  Speaker 3: Requests basically, how do we get the kids to get
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  Speaker 3: along and actually be kind to each other? Not just
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  Speaker 3: how do we stop them fighting, but how do we
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  Speaker 3: get them to actually like each other?
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  Speaker 4: This is so tricky. Have we got any answers for
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  Speaker 4: this one?
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  Speaker 3: We have six kids who give lots of opportunities to
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  Speaker 3: try different experiments on how to make this work. Did
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  Speaker 3: you fight with you so you're the eldest of three girls,
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  Speaker 3: at least within your nuclear family, because you had a
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  Speaker 3: half sister as well, did you fight with your little sisters?
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  Speaker 1: Oh?
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  Speaker 2: Look, this strikes a really sensitive chord with me because
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  Speaker 2: I probably was just an awful big sister.
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  Speaker 4: I have so many regrets when I think back to
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  Speaker 4: how I treated them.
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  Speaker 1: Really, yeah, what did you do?
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  Speaker 3: Oh?
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  Speaker 2: Look, they just drove me crazy. They just wanted to
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  Speaker 2: be in my space all the time. They wouldn't leave
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  Speaker 2: me alone, they wanted to touch.
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  Speaker 1: My stuff, they breathed my air. So you looked at
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  Speaker 1: me the wrong way? Like I just so pretty much
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  Speaker 1: everything everything.
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  Speaker 2: I'm a very independent person, and I just really struggled
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  Speaker 2: having a tag along with me all the time.
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  Speaker 3: The fact that they existed was annoying, and that, yeah,
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  Speaker 3: it probably was. There's three years between you and your
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  Speaker 3: next sister, there is, and then how many between her
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  Speaker 3: and your another three years? Okay, so it's pretty and
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  Speaker 3: it's almost exactly three years for each Yeah, okay, so
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  Speaker 3: I was the worst big brother. I'm the oldest of
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  Speaker 3: six kids. Myself, there's I mean, you know this, but
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  Speaker 3: for people who are not familiar with me and the podcast,
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  Speaker 3: there's me. Then I've got twin sisters four years younger
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  Speaker 3: than me. Then I've got a little brother who is
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  Speaker 3: nine years younger than me.
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  Speaker 1: And then I've got twin.
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  Speaker 3: Sisters again who are fifteen years younger than me. So
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  Speaker 3: mom and Dad had boy, twin girls boy, twin girls
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  Speaker 3: four five and six years apart or something crazy like that.
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  Speaker 3: And I don't really know my littlest sisters that well,
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  Speaker 3: there's fifteen years between us and I moved out. But man,
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  Speaker 3: I was terrible to my twin sisters that are four
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  Speaker 3: years younger, Like I was just not a very nice
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  Speaker 3: big brother. And the research tells us that this is
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  Speaker 3: sad but true. In fact, I came across some research,
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  Speaker 3: some observational data that indicates that children fight with their
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  Speaker 3: siblings up to eight times per hour.
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  Speaker 4: Holy smile.
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  Speaker 1: So you do the maths on that, there's sixteen.
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  Speaker 4: Minutes six children in the houses. Just do the mass there. Oh,
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  Speaker 4: my head's hurting.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah.
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  Speaker 3: And so when parents saying, oh, the kids are just
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  Speaker 3: always fighting, they're always scrapping. There's always so much rivalry
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  Speaker 3: going on, it's just over the top. My best research, though,
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  Speaker 3: comes from our own children, and I've discovered that nothing
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  Speaker 3: ignites sibling rivalry quite like buttons on an elevator.
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  Speaker 2: There have been plenty rides in the elevator where we've
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  Speaker 2: actually stopped it unnecessary flaws just to appease.
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  Speaker 1: They just get in the middle. I want to push
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  Speaker 1: that one where you can't. Well, they actually opened the door.
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  Speaker 3: They remember that time we got into the elevator and
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  Speaker 3: one of the kids wanted to close the elevator door,
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  Speaker 3: and the other one wanted to do it as well,
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  Speaker 3: and so one of them held it open while the
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  Speaker 3: other one was trying to I mean, just this is
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  Speaker 3: this is our life, folks, this is what we deal with.
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  Speaker 3: I reckon that most of the time parents are not equipped.
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  Speaker 3: In fact, I'm sort of saying that jokingly, but when
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  Speaker 3: I looked through the research preparing for tonight's webinar on
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  Speaker 3: how to teach our kids to get along and to
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  Speaker 3: be kind to each other, what the research showed pretty
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  Speaker 3: clearly is that parents need a skill set that we
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  Speaker 3: don't like. You can't buy this skill set we need.
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  Speaker 4: You need a PhD in kindness.
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  Speaker 3: Well no, but you do need social skills. You do
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  Speaker 3: need conflict management skills. You do need empathy. You do
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  Speaker 3: need the ability to take another person's perspective even when
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  Speaker 3: you're cranky. You do need excellent verbal skills. You do
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  Speaker 3: need to be in control of yourself and have that
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  Speaker 3: self control. Like, that's a big list of stuff that
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  Speaker 3: you've got to be able to do while you try
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  Speaker 3: to look after dinner, workout who's supposed to be at
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  Speaker 3: swimming in twenty minutes, and find the flippers and the
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  Speaker 3: goggles and whatever else they've lost, and deal with this
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  Speaker 3: sibling conflict all at the same time. There's so much
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  Speaker 3: going on, But as hard as it is to find
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  Speaker 3: good solutions, my research has led me to sum and
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  Speaker 3: that's what tonight is all about. After the break, I
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  Speaker 3: want to give you a bit of a hint about
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  Speaker 3: what some of those solutions that I found were.
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  Speaker 1: It's a Happy Famili's podcast.
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  Speaker 2: For a happier family, try a Happy Families membership, because
• 5:53
  Speaker 2: a happy family doesn't just happen.
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  Speaker 3: Details at happy Families dot com dot au.
• 5:58
  Speaker 2: I'm always looking for new to stay connected with my
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: children while giving them the opportunity to have the same
• 6:03
  Speaker 2: level of freedom I enjoyed when I was their age.
• 6:06
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• 6:07
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• 6:10
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• 6:17
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• 6:19
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• 6:22
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• 6:26
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• 6:29
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• 6:32
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• 6:34
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• 6:35
  Speaker 1: And that's why we love it.
• 6:36
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• 6:40
  Speaker 2: It's the Happy Families podcast, the podcast for a time
• 6:43
  Speaker 2: poor parent who just wants answers now. And today we've
• 6:46
  Speaker 2: been talking about the bane of parents' lives, sibling rivalry.
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  Speaker 2: This is just at the core I think of most
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  Speaker 2: contention in anybody's home.
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  Speaker 1: It's agonizing.
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  Speaker 3: I remember one time one of the kids was fighting
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  Speaker 3: with her sister and I said to her, you really
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  Speaker 3: need to apologize to your sister for what you've done.
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  Speaker 3: And she looked at me with this almost hatred in
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  Speaker 3: her eyes.
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  Speaker 1: She was like, you told me not to lie.
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  Speaker 3: I was like, oh gosh, say you're sorry, but don't lie.
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  Speaker 3: In fact, that was the moment when I realized that
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  Speaker 3: forcing your children to apologize was actually a pretty lousy
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  Speaker 3: parenting technique. And there's a real secret to apologies, which
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  Speaker 3: I'll talk about tonight. But when I was looking through
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  Speaker 3: all of the very best research and all the very
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  Speaker 3: best articles that I could find on this sibling rivalry thing.
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  Speaker 3: What I discovered is that the empirical research and even
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  Speaker 3: the experts that are out there don't have a lot
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  Speaker 3: to say on it because it's just such a hard challenge.
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  Speaker 3: But what I also saw was we seem to let
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  Speaker 3: a lot of things fly in our house that we
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  Speaker 3: would never accept anywhere else. If kids treated each other
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  Speaker 3: in the classroom the way they try at each other
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  Speaker 3: at home, they'd be on detention, they'd be writing out lines,
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  Speaker 3: they'd be letters getting sent home to parents, they'd be
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  Speaker 3: all sorts of stuff going on. But in the home,
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  Speaker 3: we seem to let this stuff happen. And I've kind
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  Speaker 3: of got this feeling that if it's not okay, if
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  Speaker 3: we want our children to learn how to have empathy
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  Speaker 3: and resolve conflicts and do things well at school or
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  Speaker 3: in public or down at the local park when they're
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  Speaker 3: you know, one kid's going up the slide and the
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  Speaker 3: other one wants to go down the slide, we need
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  Speaker 3: to teach them that at home.
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  Speaker 1: It actually has to start at home.
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  Speaker 2: What's amazing to me is that most children can function
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  Speaker 2: under those circumstances, and that when they're at school they
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  Speaker 2: just know that there's a code of conduct, and they
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  Speaker 2: accept that code of conduct, and then they come home
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  Speaker 2: and it's like that code of conduct goes out the window.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah.
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  Speaker 2: A recent New York Times article specifically on sibling rivalry
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  Speaker 2: gave us a couple of suggestions about how we can
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  Speaker 2: actually resolve this whole sibling rivalry.
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  Speaker 3: But I didn't buy it. I was upset with the article.
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  Speaker 3: I got cranky. I didn't think that was a good article.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah.
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  Speaker 2: So their first tip was to resuld by turn taking.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah.
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  Speaker 3: In other words, when the children are upset with each
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  Speaker 3: other and they're having a fight with one another, sit
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  Speaker 3: down and be the mediaty between them and say, okay,
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  Speaker 3: you tell me what happened. Now, you tell me what happened,
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  Speaker 3: and get them to take.
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  Speaker 1: It in turns.
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  Speaker 3: So, I mean, you've been a parent for twenty something
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  Speaker 3: years now, can you see anything wrong with that advice?
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  Speaker 4: I don't even need to be a parent.
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  Speaker 2: I actually had an opportunity to do this as an adult,
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  Speaker 2: and it actually just fueled the fire because each person
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  Speaker 2: seems completely justified in the way they feel about something
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  Speaker 2: and the way they feel mistreated, and so while ever
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  Speaker 2: we're just wanting to share our side of the equation.
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  Speaker 2: There's no understanding, there's no empathy being able to be offered.
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  Speaker 2: We don't see each other side of the story because
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  Speaker 2: we're so busy telling our own.
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  Speaker 1: What happens is.
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  Speaker 3: I'm sitting here waiting for you to finish talking so
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  Speaker 3: that I can tell you all the reasons you're wrong.
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  Speaker 3: I don't actually listen to you, and like you said,
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  Speaker 3: there's no empathy. What I think they should have said is,
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  Speaker 3: instead of getting the kids to resolve this issue by
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  Speaker 3: turn taking, is you take it in turns, but do
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  Speaker 3: it exactly the opposite way to what you've said. Instead
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  Speaker 3: of saying what happened to you why you're feeling upset,
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  Speaker 3: say to child number one, your sister seems really upset.
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  Speaker 3: Why don't you tell me why she's upset?
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  Speaker 4: Is a real perspective, taking.
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  Speaker 3: Exactly let's stand in her shoes well, and then you
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  Speaker 3: look at that little sister or that big brother whoever,
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  Speaker 3: also say is that a good restatement of why you're
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  Speaker 3: feeling so upset and why this went badly? And they're
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  Speaker 3: going to say yes it is, and you say, well,
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  Speaker 3: your sister or your brother seems upset, maybe you can
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  Speaker 3: tell me why they feel the way they do. And
• 10:40
  Speaker 3: what happens then is the kids get out of what
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  Speaker 3: I call bed blame, excuse and denial and they start
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  Speaker 3: using their or that is their ownership, their accountability, their responsibility.
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  Speaker 3: They have to take responsibility for the part they've played
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  Speaker 3: in the conflict that they're now experiencing. So when you say,
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  Speaker 3: why is you sister feeling that way, really they've got
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  Speaker 3: to say, yeah, because I yelled at it all because
• 11:00
  Speaker 3: but I only did it because I just want to
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  Speaker 3: know why you think they're feeling that way.
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  Speaker 1: It's a really powerful, really.
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  Speaker 3: Striking way to resolve that turn taking issue. So it
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  Speaker 3: was the first one that I didn't like from the
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  Speaker 3: New York Times, and I think there's a better way.
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  Speaker 1: To do it.
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  Speaker 2: So the next one they said was to actually praise
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  Speaker 2: in public but punish in private.
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  Speaker 1: What awful advice. And there's a few reasons for that.
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  Speaker 3: First of all, let's say we go with the praising
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  Speaker 3: in public, so we see the kids doing something we
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  Speaker 3: really like and we praise them for it. And we've
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  Speaker 3: got that amazing interview that we did with Elfie Cohne,
• 11:32
  Speaker 3: a couple of months ago that we're put in the
• 11:34
  Speaker 3: show notes about why we don't want to be praising
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  Speaker 3: our kids. I've got a webinar about why we don't
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  Speaker 3: want to be doing that in the Happy Families membership.
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  Speaker 3: But imagine you're out with your sister and you hear
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  Speaker 3: your mum or your dad call out and say, I
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  Speaker 3: really love how you let your sister go first. So
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  Speaker 3: as the big sister who just got the praise, how you're.
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  Speaker 4: Feeling standing tall?
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's awesome.
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  Speaker 3: And if you're the little sister who hear's big sister
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  Speaker 3: getting praised for doing that, how are you feeling?
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  Speaker 4: Well?
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  Speaker 2: I kind of wondering why you haven't anything nice about
• 12:00
  Speaker 2: me because I was really nice to her a minute ago,
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  Speaker 2: but you didn't see that.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, So verbal rewards actually can sometimes put our children
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  Speaker 3: in competition with each other. There's a whole lot of
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  Speaker 3: other reasons that I think that it's concerning, and we
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  Speaker 3: don't have time for that in this conversation, but I
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  Speaker 3: just think it's lousy. The other part of this is,
• 12:14
  Speaker 3: you know, praise in public and punish in private. Why
• 12:17
  Speaker 3: do we where do we get this crazy idea that
• 12:19
  Speaker 3: punishing our children is going to help them to be better,
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  Speaker 3: Like the research shows when you make children feel bad
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  Speaker 3: about things, that doesn't help them to be good. When
• 12:27
  Speaker 3: you make your children feel lousy about life, that's hardly
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  Speaker 3: going to set them up to be successful.
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  Speaker 4: Can I play Devil's advocate at the minute?
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  Speaker 1: I think the devil has enough advocates. But if you
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: want to give me an alternative view, I'm fine with that.
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  Speaker 2: I obviously am not the person who wrote this, but
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  Speaker 2: I'm wondering if what they're actually trying to suggest is
• 12:43
  Speaker 2: that when we have an altercation with our child, the
• 12:46
  Speaker 2: last thing we want to do is reprimand them or
• 12:50
  Speaker 2: challenge them or anything when they're surrounded by other people.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure. So you know you never ever ever
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: do any kind of disciplining in front of a crowd.
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: Yes, so well, the words say punish in private. I
• 13:03
  Speaker 2: think we can take some really great advice from that
• 13:07
  Speaker 2: if we kind of look at a bigger picture in
• 13:10
  Speaker 2: that if my child needs some attention because they're doing
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: something that's wrong, me trying to correct that behavior in
• 13:19
  Speaker 2: front of everyone is going to be more damaging than
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: not correcting it at the moment, and so taking us
• 13:26
  Speaker 2: away from the situation is really important. But it's not
• 13:29
  Speaker 2: necessarily about doing it in private. It's about picking your
• 13:32
  Speaker 2: time so that you can have that one on one
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: space with your child.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, timing is really important when it comes to discipline,
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  Speaker 3: and especially when it comes to sibling rivalry. I mean,
• 13:40
  Speaker 3: the reality is, if emotion's really high, your intelligence is
• 13:43
  Speaker 3: going to be pretty low. You're not going to resolve
• 13:45
  Speaker 3: things in the rational effective way that you might otherwise.
• 13:48
  Speaker 3: So timing is everything. Whether it's in public or whether
• 13:51
  Speaker 3: everyone's emotional, you've got to work through that. We're going
• 13:54
  Speaker 3: to talk about that and a whole lot more tonight
• 13:56
  Speaker 3: in the webinar. It's called Teaching Kids Kindness. You can
• 13:58
  Speaker 3: get all the information on Happy Families dot com dot au.
• 14:02
  Speaker 3: Just go to the shop, or you can visit our
• 14:04
  Speaker 3: Facebook page. That's doctor Justin Colson's Happy Families. Do you
• 14:08
  Speaker 3: remember that time when everything was really quiet and we
• 14:12
  Speaker 3: went up to one of the kids and said, hey,
• 14:13
  Speaker 3: where's your sister?
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  Speaker 1: And she said playing hide and seek? Who with me?
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  Speaker 1: You don't seem to be looking for them, No, I'm not.
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  Speaker 3: And she just let her sister go off to hide
• 14:23
  Speaker 3: and hide and seek, And every now and again she'd
• 14:25
  Speaker 3: yell out, I'm still looking for you, make a noise
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  Speaker 3: and one of.
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  Speaker 2: Us sister go ah, I don't remember that, but I
• 14:31
  Speaker 2: wouldn't put it past any of them.
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  Speaker 1: She was like, I don't worry, I'll find her once
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  Speaker 1: my chapter's finished.
• 14:38
  Speaker 4: That's a good way to get some peace and quiet.
• 14:40
  Speaker 3: We really hope you enjoyed the podcast. We'd love for
• 14:42
  Speaker 3: you to join us on the webinar. To not Happy
• 14:43
  Speaker 3: Families members, it's yours as part of the membership. If
• 14:46
  Speaker 3: you're not a member, you can find out more information
• 14:49
  Speaker 3: at Happy families dot com. Dot you the take home
• 14:52
  Speaker 3: message real quick, let's go over it. What do we
• 14:55
  Speaker 3: learn about sibling rivalry from this? If you can't make
• 14:57
  Speaker 3: the webinar, and by the way it is being recorded,
• 14:58
  Speaker 3: see can watch the replay take home message.
• 15:01
  Speaker 2: The number one for me is perspective taking, encouraging our
• 15:04
  Speaker 2: kids to take someone else's perspective.
• 15:07
  Speaker 3: And for me, I reckon it's that as parents, we're
• 15:10
  Speaker 3: really ill equipped for this, so we've got to be
• 15:11
  Speaker 3: really thoughtful. We've got to be really intentional about making
• 15:15
  Speaker 3: sure that our conversations with our children are constructive and helpful.
• 15:18
  Speaker 3: We really hope you've enjoyed the podcast, Thanks so much
• 15:20
  Speaker 3: for listening. If you do, please leave those ratings and reviews.
• 15:23
  Speaker 3: Five stars is always good at Apple Podcasts. We appreciate that.
• 15:26
  Speaker 3: We also appreciate Justin Rulan from Bridge Media for doing
• 15:29
  Speaker 3: a great job in making the podcast sound fabulous, and
• 15:31
  Speaker 3: our executive producer as always is Craig Bruce. If you'd
• 15:35
  Speaker 3: like more and fo about how we can make your
• 15:36
  Speaker 3: family happier, please visit happyfamilies dot com dot a u