Latest / Rugby Rivals - Sir John Kirwan & Victor Matfield / Boks Strike Back: How South Africa Saved the Series vs. All Blacks

Transcript

Boks Strike Back: How South Africa Saved the Series vs. All Blacks · Rugby Rivals - Sir John Kirwan & Victor Matfield

0:00
This week you could see it was all about we need to win.
0:03
So they came out very physical.
0:05
I think the kicking game early put us under pressure, but then we come back with an amazing try.
0:11
Ethan Blackadder, it's got a work rate that's unbelievable.
0:15
Why is he not ever looking?
0:17
The beautiful game, which is something that I think we all love.
0:20
And I don't think South Africa are particularly playing that.
0:23
Why?
0:24
Why?
0:24
There's different ways of playing the game.
0:26
I don't disagree with you, but it just bores me to tears.
0:29
Did the Springboks cheat by telling us the wrong team?
0:33
We announced our right team before you guys.
0:35
They changed the team on the team list.
0:37
But luckily, remember, Jaka, I think when you cheered with us at lunch, you said, may the best team won.
0:43
And luckily that happened.
0:50
Brian, welcome to an edition of Rugby Rivals, brought to you by Ram Hand-to-Hand Couriers, and look what they've delivered, JK, a nice Springbok jersey.
1:12
Yeah, I like it.
1:13
Ram Hand-to-Hand Couriers is just like they're in two hours after the game was there.
1:21
You know when you see the players, when they're under pressure, they're breathing?
1:24
I'm just breathing.
1:26
Give me a minute.
1:30
You're looking fantastic, Victor.
1:31
It actually suits you.
1:35
Green is not my colour.
1:37
Green is not my colour.
1:38
I feel so uncomfortable.
1:39
It feels like, you know, when you get like...
1:43
Anyway, congratulations, Victor.
1:47
Thank you, sir.
1:48
Yeah.
1:49
Congratulations, my friend.
1:50
I thought it was just off the bat, I just thought it was a great game of rugby, mate.
1:55
Like that is rugby at its best.
1:57
And I think both teams can be proud.
2:00
You know, it was just such a good game of rugby.
2:03
That's what I enjoyed.
2:04
Yeah, I think the All Blacks fans, it's almost like we were last week.
2:09
Although it's a loss, I don't think you guys will feel so bad.
2:12
I think some of your attack was probably better than last week for me.
2:17
Put us under pressure.
2:19
We did defend for long stages of the game that we look good.
2:23
But the moment you get a little bit of momentum, we make one mistake, we're under pressure.
2:28
So I think it's going to be two great test matches coming up.
2:32
It's going to be tough.
2:35
It's going to be, hopefully, the bottle just pulled it through, but it's going to be tough.
2:40
What did you do differently this week, Victor, as a team?
2:45
No, I said it last week.
2:47
I thought we weren't bad last week.
2:50
We just couldn't finish when we got to the 22.
2:53
The rhythm wasn't there once we got to the 22.
2:56
I also thought there was too many balls last week in the 22 when we attacked that went back to 10 that didn't go to Antwerp this week.
3:05
Once we got to the 22, it was Springbok rugby like we know.
3:08
It's physical, direct, guys coming around the corner, running hard, being physical, and that got us over the line.
3:16
So, our scrum didn't dominate this week like it did last week, but our line-out, I thought, really did well.
3:24
There was two critical line-outs, five to ten metres from our line that we stole.
3:29
And I think, like we saw last week,
3:33
The All Blacks, if they get that ball in at 22, it's very difficult to keep them out.
3:37
Yeah, look, I think the Springboks had an incredible start.
3:42
And I think the All Blacks would... You know, when you talk about an on-sport, when you talk about how hard the Springboks are gonna come out, you know, sometimes it's harder to go, well, okay, what does that feel like?
3:55
A lot of these guys might not have experienced that before.
3:58
And so I think they definitely won the first 20 minutes.
4:00
What I was really proud of
4:02
with the All Blacks, is their ability to hang in.
4:04
Like, you know, that onslaught was incredible.
4:08
I think the kicking game early put us under pressure and the spring blocks were very, very good.
4:12
But then we come back with an amazing try.
4:16
And so, you know, we were chasing the game a wee bit in the first half.
4:20
And I think that...
4:22
and this is more your speciality, Victor, I think our scrum improved by probably 50%, but then the lineouts, I think the pressure that the Springboks put us under, and I think the changes, the changes were outstanding for the All Blacks, but possibly not from a three-option lineout point of view, so we got put under pressure late, and when we're needing to win those little lineouts to keep the pressure on,
4:52
finished incredibly strong.
4:53
You know, the last 20 minutes I felt that the Springboks were just hanging on.
4:57
We just run out of time a wee bit.
4:59
So I think it was, you know, I talk about DNA all the time.
5:03
And if you're a New Zealander, you come away from that game and you go, wow, I can see our DNA.
5:09
And there's some of those little things we need to fix up.
5:12
Stay competitive in the scrum, but you cannot lose line outs.
5:14
I thought, you know, It's the Best was outstanding at putting pressure on our callers as well.
5:20
And what happens under pressure, Victor, and you're better at this than me, sometimes to get the right call, you slow down the line-outs a wee bit.
5:28
And I thought that those were the probably things, you know.
5:32
They'll need to look at the bench.
5:34
They'll need to look at the line-out and certainly the start.
5:37
But this is game on, people.
5:39
Like from a spectacle point of view.
5:42
Can I ask a question, JK?
5:44
Yeah.
5:45
Ethan Blackadder, why isn't he just, he was outstanding on Tuesday night against the Lions.
5:53
He just carries and keeps going and he's just, it's the kind of work rate that's unbelievable.
5:58
Why is he not ever looking?
6:02
Just because I think he's been out of the game for a while at this level, came back in, we all know what Ethan can give.
6:11
I think the question, I think to answer your question, it is what are we going to do with our loose forward replacements to keep our four options alive in the line-up?
6:22
I think that's the big question.
6:23
That's what I'm thinking about.
6:25
Yeah.
6:26
Yeah, exactly, exactly.
6:27
I knew you would because you're a line-out sort of guru.
6:30
So I think what do we do to make sure we've got four line-out options and then what does that look like?
6:36
Is it Ethan?
6:38
Is it a swap round a wee bit with the locks?
6:40
Do you bring in a bit more of a lock, put Tupor back on at six and then have Parker coming on late?
6:45
So I think that would be the big challenge for the team
6:47
for the selectors and the All Blacks this week.
6:49
Okay, how are we going to make sure that we're covering all those things?
6:54
And you know what it's like, Victor.
6:55
Sometimes you might be concentrating.
6:57
This week I'm pretty sure the All Blacks might have concentrated on the scrum a wee bit more, and that came right, you know, and maybe to the detriment of the line-out.
7:08
So I think good learnings, you know.
7:10
Victor, as J.K. said, you're the line-out expert.
7:14
If you were looking at the All Black line-out, where did you see the weaknesses?
7:19
Yeah, I think when you go into playing the Springboks in the last few years, you know they cover up the middle and the back of the line out.
7:30
They actually give you... J.K., you're going to let me look bad now because I didn't wear the All Blacks shirt.
7:37
I didn't tell you to wear it.
7:39
That's exactly what he's done.
7:40
You just wear it because you want to get me into trouble.
7:43
I know that.
7:44
But you...
7:47
Idiot.
7:48
Um...
7:51
I forgot where I was now.
7:53
Yeah.
7:54
We're talking about what you would do.
7:57
Springboks cover the middle and the back of the line.
7:59
No, no, no.
8:01
Springboks cover the middle and the back of the line.
8:04
And, I mean, we knew in our era when you play the All Blacks, when they get to the 22, just inside the 22 media attacking, they almost try and force that ball.
8:15
And, yeah, so the Springboks went and they went for it.
8:20
I think there's only one ball and they haven't thrown it once.
8:23
It's like in between the two pots, the throw jump, where the hooker throw first and the guy goes straight up.
8:29
All of this stuff was dummies and that gave Yibin and Ruan chances to move.
8:33
So Ruan just covered the back.
8:35
Yibin played around.
8:37
He's a
8:37
kind of a little bit back and that caught him.
8:41
So I think if you want that back ball, you need to walk in and you need to hit it immediately.
8:47
Otherwise, I mean, that front ball is on the whole day and work something out from that front ball.
8:51
I mean, the one try came off the front ball.
8:54
So these days, the scrum-offs passes are so good.
8:58
If you get a good ball in the front, good delivery to nine in the run, and he throws it 15 meters, 20 meters, then you're in the game.
9:05
JK, what was the, for you, who was the Ram Handan Currier's person that delivered under pressure in this test?
9:17
I thought Artie, especially in the second half when we needed something special, he made that break close to the ruck and that just sparked sort of a moment that we had to have to stay in the game in the first half, you know.
9:31
I also thought, I'm pretty sure that the Springboks were really conscious of Artie.
9:35
They really targeted him.
9:36
I thought he took a battering yesterday.
9:39
So for me, the critical moment goes to Artie.
9:43
I thought he was really good all day again and...
9:46
For me, that was it, that moment where he makes a break.
9:50
We score that incredible try and we're back into it.
9:55
Psychologically, I want to tell you psychologically why I picked that moment.
9:59
The Springboks have just had a great 20 minutes.
10:01
Probably if you're prepared for the week and you don't want them to start like that, they started like you don't want them to start.
10:06
Then to come back, get into the game and get some of those moments back.
10:11
Once again, you're going at halftime.
10:13
Yeah, we're behind, but we're still in the game.
10:16
And for you, Victor, the Ram... That's something, that's something, Odie gets right quite regularly.
10:21
In critical moments, he just comes up with a big play.
10:24
So that's almost something you expect from him.
10:27
For you, Victor, the Ram, and the and couriers, who delivered under pressure for you?
10:33
I think we had to mention Iben Etzebet.
10:37
At line-out time, he was outstanding.
10:39
He was also under pressure in South Africa.
10:41
He hasn't played a lot, he's not in great form.
10:44
But I think he stood out.
10:49
At line-out time, he was fantastic.
10:51
His work rate was just unbelievable.
10:53
And that's Iben we know.
10:54
So, I think for me, it was important that our most experienced player in a week like this, where there was a lot of pressure,
11:03
Yeah, he stood up and he just showed why he's probably the best spring-offer full title.
11:10
I mean, I'd just like to emphasize that.
11:13
I mean, you know, we've both been old bastards, Victor.
11:17
You know, when you get later on in your career and you have one bad game and everyone's saying you're too old, including people like us who are pundits.
11:24
So I think that...
11:25
I thought he was outstanding as well.
11:27
I thought he was incredibly physical.
11:31
But I also like there's a real battle coming.
11:34
You know, I think Fabian for us, Fabian Holland, man, he was really physical.
11:38
There's a few hits between the two on each other.
11:41
That was just big hits.
11:44
So, yeah, he's a great player.
11:47
I mean, you guys still need to go like better to come back.
11:49
But I think... Just take it off.
11:51
Can you just take it off?
11:53
Do you sell it?
11:54
No, do you sell these jerseys with ants in them?
11:57
You make the jersey look bad.
11:58
Just take it off.
12:00
I don't make anything look bad, Victor.
12:04
Those glasses and your face make the jersey look bad.
12:08
Is it true that after the test, you're no longer the oldest ever person to play for the Springboks, Victor?
12:15
Yes, that record got broken by Dion Fari.
12:18
But the interesting thing is Dion is also from my school, so we only need three Springboks that comes from...
12:24
Petersburg Oursko.
12:25
The other one was Adolf Milan.
12:27
That was a locker as well.
12:28
So, yeah, Petersburg Boiki taking from a Petersburg Boiki.
12:33
So they make us tough in Petersburg.
12:34
I was going to say, and finally, one of your Centurions gets a win because I believe that was the first win that a Centurion had.
12:45
So 10 Centurions.
12:47
Against the All Blacks.
12:49
I told you, this Springbok team might to break records, sir.
12:52
So it's great.
12:54
Lose the first game in the series and go and win it.
12:56
It's not that hard.
12:58
Look, obviously congratulations on the win, but neither team is perfect.
13:03
That's the way rugby works.
13:06
Where do the Springboks need to get better, Victor?
13:09
I think this week you could see it was all about we need to win.
13:15
So they came out very physical.
13:18
We knew that there's going to be a lot of kicking.
13:21
I thought our aerial kicks, we spoke about it last week, where I said to the new New Zealand also doing that, where the wing runs back in front and almost keep our contesters away from the ball.
13:31
We will kick in a little bit midfield.
13:34
And we did it.
13:35
And I mean, Ethan Hooker was outstanding in the air, won all of those balls back.
13:39
But then, again, the All Blacks adjusted.
13:42
They came over, they put...
13:45
Jordy Barrett on that side as well for him to fall back and catch it.
13:48
So they adapted quite quickly on the field.
13:51
But for me, so it was an effort from the box that you think what's going to happen after they lose.
13:58
Physicality, great kicking game.
14:00
But we need to, I think, in the last year or two, we've developed our attack as well.
14:07
And we haven't seen that.
14:08
We haven't seen us in this game.
14:10
We didn't attack well between the 3-22.
14:12
So it was.
14:14
about the kicking game, about physicality, dominating set-piece, and that came through.
14:19
But I think, especially from turnovers, we need to get our wingers in the game.
14:25
I mean, we've got some dangerous runners from the outside, so we need to get them in the game as well.
14:31
And, J.K., the All Blacks, what do they need to do better in the next test?
14:36
Well, it's obvious they need to fix up the line-up, line-out, you know, make sure the scrum continues to grow and continues to be competitive.
14:43
So I think line-out and a start, you know, you've got to make sure that you're in the battle in the first, you know, sort of 20 minutes.
14:52
So I think they'll take a little look at the kicking game as well.
14:55
Just early I felt we might have kicked away a bit of possession when we needed to run it.
15:01
But I think the team...
15:05
you know, is getting better.
15:06
I love the style of play.
15:08
You know, I think a lot of South Africans who came up to me afterwards going, yeah, we won, but you know, it's great to see you guys playing rugby.
15:17
And I think, you know, that can be as provocative as you want it to be, Victor, but you know, for 15 minutes in the game, all the Springboks did was kick box kicks.
15:27
Now, let's talk about the philosophy of the game, you know.
15:32
The beautiful game, which is something that I think we all love.
15:37
And I don't think South Africa are particularly playing that.
15:40
I know they had to get the win yesterday, but sometimes the way they play frustrates.
15:45
Why?
15:46
Why?
15:47
There's different ways of playing the game.
15:49
Everyone doesn't have to play it the way you do.
15:51
In South Africa, we love a big scrum going over guys.
15:55
I mean, box kick winning back just here, the cheers.
15:58
So...
15:59
Can you just keep to your way of playing and we keep to what we do?
16:02
And let your style beat us, then you're fine.
16:05
Don't tell us our game is right.
16:08
I don't disagree, Victor.
16:09
I don't disagree, but it just bores me to tears.
16:13
That's your problem.
16:14
We love it.
16:15
Doesn't it bore you when you go 15 phases just across the field?
16:21
Just go left to right, left to right.
16:22
Don't go anywhere.
16:24
Keep throwing, but nothing happens.
16:26
Doesn't that bore you?
16:27
Yeah, but Victor, half the time when you're pushing so hard in the scrum, you're trying to push your front row, like we're standing out the back there doing nothing.
16:37
It's a 15-man game, you know what I'm saying?
16:41
Look at the birds.
16:42
Look at the airplanes coming over.
16:47
I thought that thing was going to play Crash, but anyway.
16:52
When we talk about the two DNAs, South Africa played with a DNA and they're awesome at it.
16:59
We are starting to play at our DNA, right?
17:01
And they're two different philosophies.
17:03
That doesn't mean I have to like the philosophy.
17:06
You know what I'm saying?
17:06
That's what I love about the game.
17:09
Everyone doesn't have to play the same.
17:11
I'm just hoping.
17:13
And the only thing that matters is who wins.
17:16
Yeah.
17:17
And look, ours is way more high risk.
17:19
Ours is way more high risk and it's way more 15-man game.
17:24
So, you know, two different philosophies.
17:27
And I think I want our philosophy to win.
17:32
Can I ask you gentlemen, you managed to actually physically spend some time together in Coketown and have a cup of coffee and Coke.
17:44
Is this how the conversation went when you hung out in the build up to the test?
17:49
We were actually nice to each other for a while.
17:51
You know I love Victor, but even when you're with him, like I love Victor, you know that, but even when you're with him, he's annoying.
17:59
Like he put his fingers into my clippies and he put his fingers into my clippies and coke.
18:05
Like, okay, just tell me and I'll put my fingers in there.
18:08
It's not African culture.
18:10
You guys put up your tongue before a game to us.
18:14
I put my finger in your clippies.
18:15
That's just culture.
18:18
Doesn't mean we're nasty.
18:19
That's out of love, JK.
18:20
It's just out of love.
18:21
Oh, thank you, mate.
18:22
Make sure it tastes perfect.
18:23
And you enjoyed it.
18:24
You actually enjoyed the clippies, huh?
18:26
You said it was good.
18:28
Yeah, I did.
18:29
I did enjoy it, actually.
18:29
And I had another couple, but that night I stirred it with my own fingers.
18:34
But to answer your question, Ricardo, you know, the thing I love about Victor is he's really annoying.
18:41
and he's got his opinion.
18:42
And when we come together, it was like we're old brothers, you know?
18:47
And he talks some cuck, mate.
18:48
Like, honestly, he talks some cuck.
18:52
But I love it because I don't agree with him.
18:55
So he came over and I think the guys that had lunch with me really enjoyed him.
19:01
Told him a little bit about the work he's done with mental health.
19:05
And then he invited me over to the All Black function on the Friday night and it was so nice to meet some of my heroes.
19:12
I mean, Frank Bunz was really, and I had some time to sit with him and just have a lack of chat.
19:19
And it was so amazing to be there.
19:21
And again, we go back and JK, it's not me, you're the annoying one.
19:25
And everyone in South Africa say that.
19:27
Even when they say we were with the guy with the glasses, that's annoying.
19:31
So I just need to put you in your place sometimes.
19:35
But all the other all blacks are such nice, great legends.
19:43
And you know those glasses, I put it on.
19:47
It's not prescriptive.
19:48
It's just normal glasses.
19:51
It doesn't work.
19:52
Yeah.
19:53
It's called fashion.
19:55
It's called fashion, mate.
19:56
That's weird.
20:00
Yeah.
20:00
Wait till I get my new pair and I've got glasses for you.
20:05
You both.
20:06
It will work.
20:08
So what was your, Victor, what was your clip drift moment of the test match?
20:14
No, my clip drift moment of the test match is between, I wanted to go for that steal of Eben, but I already gave him the Ram hand-to-hand career moment.
20:25
So I would say, ball went over the top.
20:29
Artic caught it and just the way Sia smashed him in that tackle was my clip of the moment and again well done to Sia I mean he's coming back from an injury and he definitely brings something to the team when he's there I mean the work rate that he put in the hard work the donkey work that he gets out and he does so yeah well done to Sia and that was a massive feat
20:56
JK, your Clip Drift moment at the test?
21:00
Yeah, my Clippy's moment was really, you know, if you're an artist, Victor, if you paint, if you are pre-tustle.
21:07
I'm just saying, last week when you guys won, both my moments were all blacks.
21:11
I hope this is going to be a Springbok one.
21:14
No, not at all.
21:16
He's an artist.
21:16
Why would I?
21:18
I'm an artist.
21:18
Okay, artist, yes.
21:19
I'm talking about art.
21:19
I'm talking about painting on a canvas.
21:22
And painting on the canvas of rugby, when all 15 guys get involved, passing, running, stepping, coming in behind, you know?
21:31
And when all 15 players touch it twice and you score down the other end, how good is that?
21:37
You go, what a masterpiece.
21:39
That's Leroy Carter's try.
21:41
Rugby as it should be played.
21:42
The beautiful game.
21:45
What about the draft Jesse Creel?
21:47
All the South Africans carried the ball as well.
21:50
They just didn't pass it.
21:51
They just got it from nine, but everyone carried it at least once and just made me this.
21:55
It's my moment.
21:56
So much easier to do it.
21:57
It's my moment.
21:59
It's my moment.
22:00
Okay, thanks.
22:01
I've got a question for you though.
22:03
I've got a question for you.
22:04
Did the Springboks cheat by telling us the wrong team?
22:10
Why?
22:11
We announced our right team before you guys.
22:13
They changed the team on the team list.
22:15
They changed the team on the team list.
22:17
You can't do that.
22:18
I think they changed the referee, didn't they?
22:22
And we adjusted to the referee.
22:25
And the weather.
22:26
Oh, but you're not allowed to do that.
22:27
Are you?
22:28
I'm just asking.
22:29
It's an honest question.
22:30
You need to have your team out 48 hours or something.
22:32
24 hours.
22:34
We put out a team that we think might play on a Monday.
22:38
In the World Cup, you're not allowed to make late changes, but in an international like this, it's okay.
22:44
Russie explained that he thought it was going to be wet and he had a front row for the wet, and then when he saw it was dry, he put his dry front row on to start.
22:54
Dave Ritty, to his credit, was asked about it in the press conference, and he said, I didn't really care.
22:59
They don't really worry too much about it.
23:02
Just mind games.
23:04
Part of the fun of playing against Russie, I think.
23:07
Yeah, and I think it worked for us.
23:09
I think in the first test, we didn't have the impact of that bomb squat or the guys coming off the bench.
23:15
And this week with Malcolm and with Ox and Wilco, just had impact.
23:23
I mean, Malcolm were unbelievable when he came onto the field.
23:27
The amount of turnovers he made.
23:29
And that's another area that we need to talk about.
23:31
I think in the first test match,
23:33
New Zealand dominated the breakdown.
23:35
This test match, we dominated the breakdown.
23:38
I don't think there was maybe one or two only.
23:41
I don't even think there was one turnover when we were attacking.
23:44
Well, we got probably about four or five turnovers at breakdown at critical times as well.
23:51
Actually, JK, question for you from- I have three, excuse me, Ricardo.
23:55
Excuse me.
23:56
Excuse me, Ricardo.
23:57
Sorry to interrupt.
23:58
Not really, but- It's the first time.
23:59
I have three things to say about South Africa.
24:03
Three things, Victor, so here we go.
24:07
Don't underestimate the leadership power of Sia, Koalessi, and I thought he was outstanding yesterday in the 50-odd minutes that he played, or 40-odd minutes.
24:17
I brought him off pretty early.
24:18
And I was very, very happy for him.
24:20
You know, he's had a rough time and he's a great man and a great leader of men.
24:24
I thought Malcolm Marks was absolutely outstanding.
24:27
Yeah.
24:28
like when he came on.
24:30
And so was our front row, you know, Osafa.
24:33
Like those boys, when they came on, they were really, really good.
24:37
I just want to say one thing about mind games and changing stuff up.
24:43
Don't play mind games and do silly stuff if it's to the detriment of the
24:50
the game as we know it.
24:52
Otherwise we start heading towards other sports that have forgotten the values of their game.
24:56
So that's all I'm saying about changing teams and trying to be, you know, that would be my only thing.
25:02
And I'm sure, and I trust Russ, and I'm sure he didn't do it.
25:04
But if he has, you know, you need to look at yourself and say, wow, am I really doing it within the, you know, the values of the game?
25:12
I'm sure he is, but I just like to question those things, make sure we keep each other honest.
25:18
Just a question for you from Shane.
25:22
Isn't it pretty much like going and running to the IRB, to the chairman because he's New Zealander, and ask him to talk to the referees about the South African scrum?
25:34
Isn't that a bit against the tradition of the game?
25:40
Which is Australia, but that's the same thing.
25:42
It's from the Australasia.
25:47
I think we'll agree to disagree.
25:49
We'll agree to disagree.
25:50
That's two completely different things, Victor.
25:53
Different things, I believe.
25:55
I have a question.
25:56
J.K., can you both be quiet, please?
25:59
I had a question from Shane on our rugbyrivals.com team room.
26:04
He wants to know whether we should be starting Asafa Amor.
26:09
Yeah, look, I think the beauty, and this is the beauty of...
26:13
What's happening with this rugby team is that there are pressure on every single player to be selected.
26:20
So is Cody under pressure?
26:22
Yeah, he is.
26:23
Of course he is.
26:25
You know, and I think that all the boys are under pressure and that's what makes a great site.
26:30
Cody Taylor is one of our leaders.
26:33
You know, he's like Malcolm Marks.
26:34
You know, he's like all these guys that are playing lots and lots of tests.
26:39
So they're all under pressure and they'll all be under pressure this week because they lost.
26:43
Yeah.
26:43
You know?
26:44
And will Dave Renner go, I'm putting you back out there, boys, or will he make some tactical changes?
26:50
I think Cody will survive because of his leadership.
26:53
I thought he was better this game than he was in the first game.
26:56
And I think don't underestimate when your leaders are out there.
27:00
And the impact came on, and the impact was amazing from our young boys.
27:09
I must say, it feels like in the second half...
27:14
What's his name?
27:14
I can't say it exactly.
27:15
What's the hooker's name?
27:18
Asapa and Moor.
27:19
Asapa and Moor.
27:20
Yeah.
27:20
Asapa and Moor.
27:23
Yeah, and is it the low guy?
27:24
The flanker?
27:26
The low guy.
27:27
Yeah.
27:29
There was just more carrying ability that gave you momentum and that's why you scored those two trials at the end as well.
27:35
So, I thought they had a big impact.
27:39
So, yeah, it will be interesting to see.
27:40
And I think just on team selection, if you...
27:44
think about it, I think Rossi probably planned on this third team match to play some different combination.
27:52
I mean, both teams are so under pressure.
27:54
It will be interesting to see what both teams do.
27:59
I think it was the plan actually to make some shifts.
28:02
But, yeah, it's not going to be easy to make those changes.
28:06
And the beauty for the All Blacks is obviously having a tour means that players have had the build-up games to put their hands up.
28:15
Guys like Rico, guys like Blackadder, et cetera, that have been playing well, they're going, you know what, if there is a drop in form, you know, I'm knocking on the door.
28:24
Amen.
28:26
That's the beauty about touring.
28:27
Bring it back.
28:27
Because you're under pressure on every tour you're on.
28:33
I was, I was.
28:35
Like as a player, as a player, I was under pressure all the time.
28:38
I mean, you know, Vaingatuga Mala was coming up, John Timu, you know, I was getting older and I had these young guys, you know, chasing at my heels and that's what it's all about.
28:50
You know, when you make the spring box or when you make the All Blacks, you're at the ceiling.
28:55
You've got to keep getting better, otherwise they keep coming.
28:57
And that's what makes for a great side.
28:58
If you want to win the World Cup, and I reckon there's three sides at the moment that have created this full squad, and I think New Zealand's just started that this year.
29:07
France did a great job.
29:08
They've got a full squad, 35 players you can pick from.
29:11
Same with South Africa.
29:12
And New Zealand, after this tour, will get there.
29:15
We have Boat and Bale, we have Rico.
29:18
I've told you two months ago there's only three teams that can win the World Cup, but now you're saying it after two months.
29:24
I'm glad you remember what I said.
29:27
Yeah.
29:28
We've run it down.
29:28
I'll have to go back.
29:30
Victor, I'll have to go back to that episode and re-look at the video.
29:34
Maybe that's the same time that I said that if we lose, Ricardo said if we lose, we've got to wear an all-black or springbok jersey.
29:40
Maybe I'll go back and have a look at the footage and see who's true or not.
29:46
No.
29:47
Can I just ask you, you mentioned briefly the planes.
29:51
I mean,
29:54
I remember vividly being at the 95 World Cup final and the first time it happened, and it came out of nowhere.
30:00
No one was expecting it.
30:01
And in fact, we thought it was a terrorist thing.
30:05
That's, you know, at the moment it happened, it's like, oh, my God, there's a plane going to crash into the stadium.
30:10
That was our fear.
30:11
And then, you know, eventually we worked it out.
30:14
But these guys were low, man.
30:17
They're like, were you there in the stadium?
30:20
Yeah.
30:22
Yeah, I was at the bottom waiting.
30:25
It was so close.
30:27
And if you look at all the YouTube clips now, especially when he went up, he still almost touched the roof.
30:34
But it's unbelievable.
30:35
It was so great.
30:37
With the fireworks and everything.
30:38
So, Victor...
30:40
Victor, maybe this is why the selection of the team, you just changed the rules.
30:43
Because I asked someone yesterday after the plane flew, and I said, I'm pretty sure there's an aviation rule that says you must be like 1,000 feet or something.
30:52
And he said, yeah, only in Africa.
30:54
We don't care.
30:56
Okay.
30:59
We've got snakes.
31:00
We've got everything here.
31:01
So we can do whatever we want.
31:04
to survive.
31:05
And on Rekki as well.
31:06
Rekki as well.
31:08
Whatever is needed.
31:10
Now, just before we go, Victor, in the build-up to this test, Peregrine Capital had a magnificent function for the Centurions.
31:19
And you were there.
31:21
So can you tell us about that function?
31:23
Because it looked amazing.
31:26
Yeah, I think it was just great having.
31:29
I mean, we had Dan Carter and Richie McCaw over as well.
31:33
And yeah, just celebrating, going from zero to 100.
31:38
They've done it in their business.
31:39
I mean, all the players was there.
31:41
So it was just a great evening.
31:45
Billy LaRue, we missed out on some of the boys that are still playing.
31:48
So, Iben weren't there.
31:50
Damien weren't there.
31:51
But, yeah, I think Peregrine getting behind the boys, unbelievable.
31:56
So, yeah, it was a good night.
31:59
Yeah, congratulations, Victor.
32:01
I think those things are to be celebrated.
32:04
And, you know, when you look at that line-up,
32:06
What an amazing group of men.
32:09
I was very fortunate to see Joel and Zinni get their Hall of Fame stuff too.
32:14
And I think it's, I think the most beautiful thing that has been for me over the last few weeks is just how the rugby comradery on the field, the boys praying, shaking hands, you know, us,
32:29
The public know that we can give each other a hard time, but it must be based on respect.
32:34
And I think that's beautiful.
32:36
I think the South African people, I think the South African people might have really embraced that.
32:40
You know, you can give each other shit after the game as much as it hurts because we are competitive and we want our country to win.
32:48
Shake hands, have a hug and then make sure.
32:51
I'll just say to all New Zealanders, if they give you one of those shots, that is shit.
32:57
Springboks.
32:58
What is that?
32:59
It's nice, the spring ball.
33:02
But luckily, remember, Joke, I think when you cheered with us at lunch, you say, may the best team won.
33:08
And luckily, that happened.
33:12
But I just want to ask you a bit more about the Peregrine Capital function.
33:19
You went to battle against Dan and Richie a lot in your career, Victor.
33:26
Does having those battles make the friendship stronger?
33:31
No, I think, and that's what J.K. is saying, it's about getting that respect for players on the field.
33:40
I think the harder they play, the better they are, the more the respect you've got for them.
33:47
I mean, we targeted Fritschi our whole careers.
33:49
And the one thing I always tell about him, he would just not react at all.
33:54
He'll just go back, but the next break time he's in there.
33:57
He's throwing himself at the ball.
33:59
He's throwing himself into tackles.
34:01
It doesn't matter what you do to him.
34:02
He just doesn't react and he just gets on with the game and he focuses on what they need to do to win.
34:07
So, yeah.
34:09
I mean, we had some great battles with the Springboks.
34:11
I mean, Bulls, Crusaders against each other as well.
34:15
And it almost felt like it was almost myself and Furi against him and Dan Carter when it came to the Bulls.
34:22
And then, I mean, with the Springboks, there's so many other guys as well.
34:25
But, yeah, I mean, two of the legends of the game, two of the best players that ever played the game.
34:32
And, yeah, to have them there at the function were really special.
34:35
And I think the people also enjoyed it very much.
34:38
It was actually so nice.
34:40
Dan's dad was there and he was smiling the whole time.
34:45
He was having the best time in South Africa, went to three of the best golf courses, played with Dan, played with some of the Springboks and he was just loving it.
34:55
You actually, the Centurions group in South Africa is something that's pretty important, isn't it?
35:00
You actually do a lot of work together.
35:02
You raise money.
35:03
You know, it's actually quite a well-formed organization.
35:09
Yeah, I think John Smith started with the idea, and then we had Adley Murray that came in with John and Tyne, drive it.
35:20
And then, I mean, with Peregrine coming in and supporting us, it's so much easier.
35:25
And I mean, the function, I haven't been to a function that was so well planned.
35:30
It was really something special.
35:33
We did play a little bit of a quiz game, and I thought that's where you wanted to go, and I did come last, so I thought that's why you're bringing it up.
35:39
Yeah.
35:39
I haven't yet, but yeah, it was just an unbelievable evening and it was so special.
35:46
Mate, next time you're in a quiz, just remember you're representing the rivals and last is unacceptable.
35:53
I had Willy LaRue next to me and he gave me the wrong answers the whole time.
35:57
That's why.
35:58
Listen to it back.
35:59
This is why you and J.K. get on so well because you both relied on other people giving you the answers at school.
36:05
Yes.
36:05
Yeah, well, I used to cheat on you.
36:07
That didn't work out too well.
36:09
I don't know.
36:09
I think I've got too many knocks against my head.
36:12
I can't remember.
36:13
It's like scores of games.
36:14
I don't even know what the World Cup final score was when I played it.
36:17
So it's just one of those things.
36:20
Yeah, just wait for the point of whistle and see if everybody else is cheering.
36:24
J.K., I think we'd better bring this to an end so you can get changed.
36:27
Yes, please.
36:28
Please, get out of you.
36:29
You're embarrassing that shit.
36:30
Please take it off.
36:34
All right, looking forward to seeing what happens next week.
36:37
Any predictions?
36:38
Let's have a prediction from you, Victor, first.
36:40
You're so good at them.
36:41
I must say it's stuffer than I thought.
36:45
No, no, no.
36:45
Hang on, hang on, hang on.
36:47
Can I say something, Ricardo?
36:49
Yeah, sure.
36:50
I would like for us to get together quickly later in the week to do predictions because we need to make sure that the team doesn't change four times during the week with Yarurashi.
37:01
And then we get together.
37:02
You only announced it like on Friday.
37:06
When he announced it, I think we should get together and have five minutes and talk about our predictions.
37:11
Mate, you don't know the team until Russie sends them out of a tunnel.
37:15
That's when he announces his team.
37:18
We can talk about the team you think is going to play on Friday or Thursday.
37:22
That's fine.
37:23
Exactly.
37:24
You're right.
37:25
Thanks very much.
37:26
Great edition of Rugby Rivals brought to you by Ram Hand-to-Hand Couriers.
37:31
And we've got an all-black jersey on its way for you, Vector.
37:36
Thank you.
37:37
For next week.
37:38
Next week.