Latest / Making The Impact - A Dance Competition Podcast / Throwback! S2 Ep 53 - Tricks vs Technique

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Throwback! S2 Ep 53 - Tricks vs Technique · Making The Impact - A Dance Competition Podcast

0:07
SPEAKER_02: Have you ever wondered what goes on behind the table at a dance competition?
0:10
SPEAKER_02: Exactly what are the judges looking for anyway?
0:13
SPEAKER_02: This is Making the Impact, a dance competition podcast.
0:15
SPEAKER_02: Each week we'll cover a different topic related to the world of competitive dance, from the perspective of the judges behind the table.
0:27
SPEAKER_05: Hey y'all, it's Courtney Arteens, and we're back with another throwback episode, all the way to season two, episode 53, Tricks versus Technique.
0:37
SPEAKER_05: In a competitive dance world where dancers are constantly pushing the boundaries with more turns, higher extensions, bigger acro skills, and jaw-dropping tricks, we have to ask ourselves: are we prioritizing impressive skills over quality techniques?
0:51
SPEAKER_05: And are more tricks actually helping dancers for higher competition?
0:56
SPEAKER_04: In this episode, Leslie and I are joined by IDA judge and dance educator Troy Haywood and Expressions Dance Center's owner, Carla Curatolo, to break down the difference between tricks and technique, the importance of building a strong technical foundation, and why sometimes let's really is more for the competitive dance stage.
1:14
SPEAKER_05: Whether you're a teacher, dancer, choreographer, or parent, this episode is packed with perspectives that might just change the way you look at competition dance.
1:24
SPEAKER_05: So, are tricks really worth the extra points?
1:27
SPEAKER_05: Let's find out.
1:28
SPEAKER_05: Throwing it back to season two, episode 53, Tricks versus Technique.
1:35
SPEAKER_04: Hi everyone, and welcome to this week's episode of Making the Impact a Dance Competition Podcast.
1:41
SPEAKER_04: I'm your host, Courtney Ortiz, and I'm here with my co-host, Leslie Mueller.
1:45
SPEAKER_04: Hey everyone, happy to be here.
1:47
SPEAKER_04: It is March.
1:48
SPEAKER_04: Can't believe it.
1:49
SPEAKER_04: Oh my goodness.
1:50
SPEAKER_04: And I'm sure some of you listeners and dancers who are listening may have already had a chance to attend a live in-person competition event because the season is here.
2:01
SPEAKER_04: And I really hope that everybody gets to experience a live event this season because I know last year got cut short, so fingers crossed, everybody can make it to an event.
2:10
SPEAKER_04: But we've had a lot of our IDA judges on the roster back at events live in person, and they are so grateful to be doing what they love and sharing their passion for dance again in this 2021 season.
2:22
SPEAKER_04: So shout out to all of our amazing IDA judges who are out there.
2:26
SPEAKER_04: Shout out to all of our IDA affiliated competitions who are running successful events this season.
2:31
SPEAKER_04: It's just, it's been a blast to be able to see this season be such a success for so many around the country.
2:37
SPEAKER_04: And I hope it continues on throughout the rest of the season.
2:39
SPEAKER_04: So best of luck to all you dancers who are competing.
2:43
SPEAKER_04: And speaking of competing, I'm sure you've heard us talk about it, but just sending a little fresh reminder to you all that IDA has a virtual competition that we run, and our registration is now open for our March event.
2:56
SPEAKER_04: So this is for solo and group routines.
2:59
SPEAKER_04: You can submit uh group routines for your studio.
3:02
SPEAKER_04: If you're a soloist that you would like to submit on your own, you can absolutely do that.
3:06
SPEAKER_04: We accept entries worldwide.
3:07
SPEAKER_04: You can submit as an independent, and you will get some of the best feedback from our IDA judges.
3:14
SPEAKER_04: I promise you, it is spectacular.
3:16
SPEAKER_04: And you will have such great feedback to take back into the rehearsal studio.
3:19
SPEAKER_04: And it's just a great way to even prepare before you hit the live stage, if you'd like, or as an alternative option.
3:25
SPEAKER_04: So definitely check it out.
3:26
SPEAKER_04: We'd love to have you.
3:27
SPEAKER_04: Registration closes for a March event on March 15th.
3:30
SPEAKER_04: So you have a few more days to get those entries in.
3:33
SPEAKER_04: And head over to our website to learn more about our events at impactdanceedjudicators.com/slash virtual competition.
3:42
SPEAKER_04: And we hope you'll join us.
3:43
SPEAKER_02: And we wanted to give a special shout out to all our new friends and fans on our Facebook group.
3:47
SPEAKER_02: Yay.
3:48
SPEAKER_02: Yay! Thanks everybody for connecting with us there, as well as all of our IDA judges.
3:53
SPEAKER_02: We've got almost everybody on the roster is participating and having conversations, answering questions.
3:58
SPEAKER_02: So if you haven't joined our community yet, head over to Facebook, search for Making the Impact, a dance competition podcast community.
4:04
SPEAKER_02: We will ask you to answer a few questions related to how you're involved in the dance world, and you'll be in.
4:09
SPEAKER_02: We actually got a really wonderful review on Facebook that we wanted to share with you guys.
4:13
SPEAKER_02: It is from Lexi, a dance mom in Florida.
4:16
SPEAKER_02: So let's see what this Lexi has to say.
4:19
SPEAKER_02: Lexi says, My daughter Parker and I love your podcast.
4:21
SPEAKER_02: We find that it brings us together to have conversations that we normally would not have.
4:25
SPEAKER_02: She's a dancer and I am not.
4:27
SPEAKER_02: I have zero knowledge of the industry except what I've learned over the last eight years.
4:31
SPEAKER_02: And this helps us spark conversation and bridge the gap between what she loves and what I know.
4:35
SPEAKER_02: Thank you for always providing good content with credible guests.
4:38
SPEAKER_02: Well, you are welcome, Lexi and Parker.
4:40
SPEAKER_02: I love that you guys connect, you know, through the podcast.
4:43
SPEAKER_02: And I'm glad that, you know, you found use for all of the information we have to share, because that's why we do it.
4:49
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
4:49
SPEAKER_04: That really is why we do it.
4:51
SPEAKER_04: And it's so cool to connect with our guests in the group and hear exactly that.
4:55
SPEAKER_04: Like a lot of dancers are listening with their mom on the way to dance class and kind of sharing that as an experience and learning, hopefully learning from us as well.
5:05
SPEAKER_04: Because this is definitely an educational resource on our podcast, is what we're hoping to, you know, share all of our knowledge from so many spectacular guests.
5:15
SPEAKER_04: We've we've had amazing guests on this podcast throughout season one and two.
5:18
SPEAKER_04: So thank you so much, Lexi, and thank you to everyone who's left reviews, which, by the way, go to Apple Podcasts and tell us what you think.
5:26
SPEAKER_04: Leave us a review, subscribe, rate us.
5:28
SPEAKER_04: We'd love to hear your thoughts.
5:29
SPEAKER_04: Speaking of this week's episode, we're talking about tricks and technique and all of those things that you love so much during competition dance.
5:38
SPEAKER_04: We're going to talk about that today with two wonderful guests, and I'm so excited to introduce them.
5:44
SPEAKER_04: So it is time to meet our two guests that are joining us.
5:48
SPEAKER_04: And the first guest, you may remember him from our very first episode ever, season one, episode one, What Dance Competitions Taught Me.
5:59
SPEAKER_04: I'm so excited to welcome back Mr.
6:01
SPEAKER_04: Troy Haywood to the podcast.
6:03
SPEAKER_04: Welcome, Troy.
6:05
SPEAKER_00: Hello, everybody.
6:06
SPEAKER_00: I'm super excited to be here again.
6:08
SPEAKER_04: Yay, again.
6:09
SPEAKER_04: Welcome back.
6:10
SPEAKER_04: It's been a minute.
6:11
SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
6:12
SPEAKER_00: It has been.
6:13
SPEAKER_00: Last time I was in Los Angeles recording, and now I'm back home in Charlotte.
6:18
SPEAKER_00: So it's super cool to be coastal, yeah.
6:21
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
6:22
SPEAKER_04: Listeners, if you haven't had a chance to listen to our very first episode ever, go back and listen.
6:27
SPEAKER_04: It's a it's a really great episode, and it was a great way to kick off our podcast back way back when, over a year ago.
6:33
SPEAKER_04: But Troy is back.
6:34
SPEAKER_04: And Troy, if you wouldn't mind sharing with our listeners a little bit about you and your career credits and what you're working on.
6:42
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, sure.
6:43
SPEAKER_00: So I am Troy Haywood.
6:45
SPEAKER_00: I am a choreographer and educator based in Charlotte, North Carolina.
6:50
SPEAKER_00: I also am on the IDA roster and judge lots of competitions during competition season.
6:56
SPEAKER_00: I spent some time in Miami and LA whenever I was first breaking out into the professional world.
7:03
SPEAKER_00: And me, like so many of the other judges, are Royal Caribbean kiddos.
7:08
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
7:10
SPEAKER_00: And probably I would say about a year and a half ago, I came back from Los Angeles.
7:16
SPEAKER_00: I spent some time over there.
7:17
SPEAKER_00: Whenever I first broke out into the professional world, I loved teaching.
7:22
SPEAKER_00: And I never really got the opportunity to navigate auditions and professional gigs other than really just Royal Caribbean.
7:32
SPEAKER_00: So I really wanted to go and get that experience under my belt so that I could come back and kind of teach kids how to audition because I never had really had that opportunity.
7:41
SPEAKER_00: So it was a really cool experience.
7:43
SPEAKER_00: I was signed with MTA for a year and now I'm back and show it.
7:47
SPEAKER_00: I teach yoga a lot.
7:49
SPEAKER_00: And I like I like to incorporate that with the dance because it's not only good for the body and kind of figuring out how the mechanics work, but also for the mind and kind of just like the self-confidence it's given me.
8:03
SPEAKER_00: I like to kind of give that over to the kids too.
8:06
SPEAKER_00: So yeah, that's pretty much about me, what's going on.
8:10
SPEAKER_00: Last year was crazy.
8:11
SPEAKER_00: I took a little bit of a hiatus, but I'm back in action and um really had some time to figure out where I wanted to direct myself for my 30s.
8:23
SPEAKER_04: So yeah, I'm happy to be here.
8:25
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, welcome to the 30s.
8:28
SPEAKER_04: It's great over here.
8:29
SPEAKER_04: They're cute.
8:31
SPEAKER_04: I'm not mad at them so far.
8:33
SPEAKER_04: I'm not mad at them either.
8:35
SPEAKER_04: No.
8:35
SPEAKER_04: Based on when this is airing, I'm now technically 32.
8:40
SPEAKER_04: Not yet, but as of this podcast airing, I'll be 32.
8:44
SPEAKER_04: So I'm I'm in there.
8:46
SPEAKER_04: Sweet, y'all.
8:47
SPEAKER_04: Well, awesome, Troy.
8:48
SPEAKER_04: So happy to have you.
8:49
SPEAKER_04: Thanks for joining us again.
8:51
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, thank you for having me.
8:53
SPEAKER_04: All right, and our next guest that I'm very excited to welcome is a new guest to our podcast.
9:00
SPEAKER_04: And you may know her as the studio owner of the very successful and popular Expressions Dance Center in Indianapolis, Indiana.
9:10
SPEAKER_04: I'm so excited to welcome Carla Curatolo to the podcast.
9:15
SPEAKER_04: Welcome, Carla.
9:16
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I really appreciate you guys asking me to be on.
9:19
SPEAKER_01: I'm excited to be here.
9:20
SPEAKER_01: So thank you.
9:21
SPEAKER_01: You kind of said it, but yes, I'm the owner of Expressions Dance Center in Indianapolis.
9:26
SPEAKER_01: This is my 13th year in business.
9:28
SPEAKER_01: I started with just 11 kids in my company program.
9:31
SPEAKER_01: We even have a rec program that first year, and now we have like 135 in company and probably around 400 total with recreational and whatnot.
9:41
SPEAKER_01: And I have 22 staff members.
9:42
SPEAKER_01: It's definitely grown since that first year, but it's been a really exciting and somewhat crazy journey.
9:49
SPEAKER_01: But I wouldn't trade it for the world.
9:51
SPEAKER_01: It's been um really rewarding.
9:53
SPEAKER_01: Um, some of our cool things that I've gotten to do is world of dance on season two.
9:58
SPEAKER_01: That was a super unique and awesome opportunity.
10:02
SPEAKER_01: And then also we've done Um America's Got Talent.
10:05
SPEAKER_01: Some of my kids are dancing in both ballet companies, modern companies, and also commercial work throughout the United States.
10:12
SPEAKER_01: And I have kids actually right now all over the United States in different college dance programs, some of the top in the industry.
10:18
SPEAKER_01: So it's been really exciting.
10:20
SPEAKER_01: I love seeing my students go on and continue their love and their passion for dance.
10:25
SPEAKER_01: So that's that's really rewarding as a teacher to see your kids do that.
10:29
SPEAKER_01: So it's been a really awesome journey.
10:31
SPEAKER_01: And yeah, that's pretty much it, I guess.
10:34
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, that's awesome.
10:36
SPEAKER_04: Wow.
10:37
SPEAKER_04: I'm I'm super excited and I'm really, really excited to have you on this episode in particular because we're talking about tricks and technique, and your dancers have both.
10:49
SPEAKER_04: And also I'm very excited to hear coming from a studio owner perspective on this topic.
10:54
SPEAKER_04: So I'm really happy to have you here.
10:56
SPEAKER_04: Thanks so much for joining us.
10:58
SPEAKER_04: Awesome.
10:58
SPEAKER_02: Well, friends, let's jump right on in because this is a big one.
11:02
SPEAKER_02: This is, we could talk for hours and hours about both both tricks and techniques.
11:06
SPEAKER_02: So I guess my question to start with is what do you consider, like what is technique?
11:13
SPEAKER_02: Do we do we talk about technique as just a general thing, or do we talk about technique as honing on an individual styles technique?
11:21
SPEAKER_02: Like what's sort of your opinion about when we talk about technique?
11:25
SPEAKER_02: What are we actually talking about?
11:26
SPEAKER_00: So whenever I think of technique, I think of kind of the basis and the foundation of kind of everything.
11:35
SPEAKER_00: Everything kind of has a technique to it, not even just in dancing, but how you drive a car, how you spin spaghetti on your court.
11:44
SPEAKER_00: There's a technique to everything.
11:46
SPEAKER_00: So yeah, I would say that each individual style has its own foundation of technique, how things are meant to be done.
11:55
SPEAKER_00: And it for me, it's universal.
11:59
SPEAKER_00: So there's jazz dance technique, and then there's different types of ballet technique.
12:03
SPEAKER_00: But for the most part, it's something that is taught the same around the all across the board.
12:09
SPEAKER_01: I think technique is a quality.
12:11
SPEAKER_01: So, you know, like having that, like he said, like that foundation.
12:15
SPEAKER_01: Um, I think every style has it.
12:17
SPEAKER_01: I am a little old school in the sense that I think that a lot of technique, maybe not necessarily hip-hop and tap, but like for jazz, lyrical, contemporary, modern, a lot of it stems from ballet.
12:28
SPEAKER_01: I think without a strong ballet foundation, you really can never truly master those other styles.
12:33
SPEAKER_01: I think that's why it's important to take ballet, even if it's not your favorite technique or style of dance.
12:39
SPEAKER_01: I think that to be a really strong jazz or contemporary modern, even you know, tap hip-hop, I think everything really comes down to having a strong foundation of ballet technique.
12:50
SPEAKER_01: But I do agree that each each technique in itself has its own technique and quality that is shared universally, that everyone understands as being correct and the fundamentals.
13:01
SPEAKER_02: As you guys were talking, I was I was looking it up actually, just the word technique because that's something I hadn't done yet.
13:07
SPEAKER_02: Just look at the actual definition.
13:08
SPEAKER_02: And something that speaks to both what of what you guys just said is that part of a definition of technique is a skillful or efficient way of doing or achieving something.
13:18
SPEAKER_02: I love that.
13:19
SPEAKER_02: And I think the efficiency part of it is kind of what hits the nail on the head for me in each particular style.
13:26
SPEAKER_02: Because, like you said, Troy, you know, anybody truly can drive a car.
13:30
SPEAKER_02: But like if you're doing it skillfully and efficiently, that is what the technique is.
13:34
SPEAKER_02: And I think that comes into play, you know, in your ballet, in your jazz, in your hip-hop.
13:40
SPEAKER_00: Yes, I like that word efficient.
13:42
SPEAKER_00: Because I feel like a lot of times we overthink technique.
13:47
SPEAKER_00: Like almost like, especially me, whenever I was dancing, I would tense up my entire body because I thought that that's what engagement was.
13:57
SPEAKER_00: And I really, really work super, super hard at every little bitty thing that I was doing when that's not efficient.
14:05
SPEAKER_00: And that doesn't really feel good.
14:07
SPEAKER_00: I feel like technique, although it is strict for lack of a better word, it should also feel good in the body rather than forced.
14:16
SPEAKER_01: And technically, I guess if you have good technique, it also helps with injury.
14:20
SPEAKER_01: It's to help dancers be able to have longevity so that they don't, you know, hurt themselves.
14:25
SPEAKER_01: It's uh you know, doing it correctly with correct placement so that you can do it and continue to do it for a lot of years to come.
14:32
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, because we all want to dance forever.
14:35
SPEAKER_04: And I I think that what you just said, Carla, you know, about preventing injury is so important to hear in the sense that this discussion is also about tricks.
14:46
SPEAKER_04: And tricks need to have the proper technique and that's how you're going to execute those tricks safely.
14:56
SPEAKER_04: Because if you don't have that technique, then you're just attempting tricks without a foundation and you could really get injured very quickly.
15:04
SPEAKER_04: It's no different than gymnastics.
15:06
SPEAKER_04: It's you know, you have to start from the ground, the foundation level when you're learning big tricks in gymnastics.
15:14
SPEAKER_04: You don't just throw a back, tuck back handspring your first try, you know?
15:18
SPEAKER_04: Whereas, like, I'm sure there are many dancers who are like, oh, cool, turns in second, I want to try, and then they just start trying to do it, and you know, you might not know how to spot yet, or you might not know what the position is actually supposed to be, or what a releve looks like.
15:33
SPEAKER_04: And they're they could very well get injured, but also we're practicing something with improper technique from the you know from the very beginning.
15:42
SPEAKER_04: So I'm excited to have this discussion go in that direction, but I kind of want to go backwards to another thing you mentioned, Carla, which is ballet.
15:50
SPEAKER_04: I think that a lot of us associate technique and ballet, and they're like besties and they hold hands and they go hand in hand, 100%, for a lot of our styles.
16:01
SPEAKER_04: However, a lot of people will say that ballet isn't the foundation of dance.
16:08
SPEAKER_04: And what are what are your what are your thoughts on that?
16:10
SPEAKER_04: And I know that you mentioned, you know, you're specifically talking about the lyrical, contemporary, jazz, modern styles, but do we feel like that tap dancers need to take ballet?
16:22
SPEAKER_04: Do we feel like hip-hop dancers need to take ballet to be successful at their genre?
16:28
SPEAKER_04: Or do they just have their technique in those specific styles?
16:33
SPEAKER_01: Well, I think that the strongest dancer is the one that can do it all.
16:36
SPEAKER_01: So, like I make my kids take tap and hip-hop, even though, you know, a lot of them are very strong technical ballet geared contemporary type dancers, because I think that tap helps with like musicality and it helps with timing.
16:51
SPEAKER_01: And I think hip-hop helps them learn to get grounded.
16:54
SPEAKER_01: And I think the isolations and the movement is so important.
16:57
SPEAKER_01: I think that it all dance as a whole kind of has evolved so much that it all is kind of intertwined.
17:04
SPEAKER_01: And I think that I'm gonna kind of go a little bit backwards here, but growing up, I had to go to two different studios.
17:10
SPEAKER_01: I went to a Russian ballet school to get my my ballet training, and then I went to a competition studio to get competition, and I feel like there was, and I think and I think it's blended a more a little bit more now, but for a long time there was these two worlds, and it was like they were on these separate paths, and there was no intermixing them.
17:29
SPEAKER_01: And it was really kind of sad because I felt like I loved being able to compete, I loved being able to do these other styles, but I loved ballet, and I knew I wasn't getting quality ballet at that competition studio.
17:40
SPEAKER_01: Bottom line is I ended up going to college at an all-ballet uh program, a pretty much conservatory, to be honest.
17:46
SPEAKER_01: I went to Butler University and then I was a dance major and it's it's ballet, pretty much all I did was ballet.
17:51
SPEAKER_01: There's some uh gram modern and you know, and some jazz, but in general it's it's a ballet program.
17:57
SPEAKER_01: But when I was there, I was really missing doing other styles.
18:00
SPEAKER_01: And so I started teaching in the area and I wasn't from the area, and I asked to teach anything but ballet because I miss doing jazz and contemporary and lyrical.
18:10
SPEAKER_01: So I started teaching and choreographing and doing competition stuff, and I just saw this need.
18:15
SPEAKER_01: I'm like, why are these kids not getting both?
18:17
SPEAKER_01: And that's really how Expressions was founded because I wanted to create a studio that had strong, serious, classical ballet and you know, strong competition dance, which really could lead to commercial because you never know, you know, everyone's body is different, everyone's talents are different.
18:32
SPEAKER_01: You never know where the world of dance is gonna take you.
18:36
SPEAKER_01: So, you know, to be able to offer both allows kids the opportunity to train in more styles, which could ultimately give them a better chance of actually getting to be a professional dancer, whatever that looks like for them.
18:47
SPEAKER_01: So I think, you know, at our studio, we really push them doing all styles.
18:52
SPEAKER_01: And I think that that if you really want a well-rounded, talented dancer in all aspects, I think doing it all is important.
18:58
SPEAKER_01: So yes, I do think a hip-hop and tap dancer, to get back to the question, I guess, should do ballet because I think that there's things in ballet that could help a hip-hop and tap dancer.
19:08
SPEAKER_01: So I'm a firm believer that, yes, I still think that ballet is important for even dancers that maybe don't love ballet or prefer other styles like tap and hip-hop.
19:19
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and just to add on to that, I think it's definitely ballet is definitely a foundation, but I wouldn't say that it's the foundation.
19:27
SPEAKER_00: It's not the foundation of hip-hop.
19:29
SPEAKER_00: It's not the foundation of tap, but it definitely will help you.
19:34
SPEAKER_00: One thing that like tap teachers used to say to me all the time, and something that I say whenever I'm judging, and every dancer has heard this if they take tap is stay on your toes, don't drop your heels.
19:46
SPEAKER_00: And that is like ballet right there.
19:49
SPEAKER_00: Just how to keep the weight in your toes and not flat footing and slapping all across the stage.
19:56
SPEAKER_00: It's just like being able to and being able to mentally know what the technique is so that the body can follow that.
20:04
SPEAKER_00: I just think that being at the bar helps for sure.
20:06
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, I'm I'm kind of curious, Troy, being that you are a hip-hop dancer as well as a classically trained dancer who grew up taking lots of ballet and you teach lyrical and contemporary, you have to have a solid foundation to be able to to dance lyrical and contemporary and teach it.
20:27
SPEAKER_04: But you also are a hip-hop dancer where I'm not gonna lie, like I can hip hop, but I'm not a hip, I don't call myself a hip-hop dancer.
20:35
SPEAKER_04: You know, like yes, I'm versatile, I can do it.
20:37
SPEAKER_04: But being that you are skilled at both of those at a high level, do you feel like looking back that ballet, taking ballet growing up, helped you in hip-hop?
20:46
SPEAKER_00: Looking back at it, I would say that it helped me understand my body and and how it works, and kind of being able, like even just like the anatomy of the body and how being able to balance the two because because another thing that I think is you have to know the rules, learn the rules, gain the technique before you can break it, before you can lose it all.
21:14
SPEAKER_04: I love it.
21:14
SPEAKER_00: And and I think that that's that's one of the big things in hip-hop is we have to stay grounded, and that's not necessarily the first thing that my body wants to do naturally.
21:25
SPEAKER_00: I like to stay lifted, I like to keep my my chest high.
21:28
SPEAKER_00: And a lot of times I have to remind myself everything needs to get a little bit more sunken in, but I wouldn't know what this feels like.
21:36
SPEAKER_00: I'm contracting right now.
21:38
SPEAKER_00: I never feel I have to know what I need to know what my body can do, my spine can do, my hips can do, my pelvis can do, before I can learn, so that I can learn how to shape it in a different way.
21:53
SPEAKER_02: Totally.
21:53
SPEAKER_02: That's I mean, that just like built upon that phrase that we love here at the podcast like you have to know the rules.
22:00
SPEAKER_02: Before you can break them.
22:01
SPEAKER_02: So I feel like Maddie said that for the first time on the podcast and like we just keep building on it.
22:05
SPEAKER_02: I think that was diverse contemporary.
22:07
SPEAKER_02: It was most popular episode to date.
22:09
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
22:10
SPEAKER_02: But you know, you have to know the rules to break them.
22:13
SPEAKER_02: And then you have to know what your body can do before you can make your body do it.
22:17
SPEAKER_02: Like, I mean, that's just that's why we learn how to dance.
22:20
SPEAKER_02: So we can figure out, oh, my body can make this shape, it can make this shape, it can do this thing.
22:24
SPEAKER_02: And and that's that's such a beautiful way to describe it, Troy.
22:28
SPEAKER_02: I love that.
22:28
SPEAKER_00: And also one thing that I that I like to talk about a lot is like the physicality of the movement rather than just what it looks like.
22:35
SPEAKER_00: How does it feel inside the body?
22:37
SPEAKER_00: Because I can grab my wrist like this, but am I really grabbing my wrist and like feeling what that feels like?
22:44
SPEAKER_00: So I think that the that ballet technique is a really great way to feel it in the body.
22:50
SPEAKER_00: The muscle memory is right there, and it's like just gets ingrained.
22:54
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
22:55
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, just you know, the repetition of ballet and it really does transfer over to so many other styles.
23:03
SPEAKER_04: There's not another, I mean, yes, you can train and tap five days a week, and yes, you can in any style of dance if that's what you choose to do.
23:10
SPEAKER_04: But ballet's the one that always gets typically is the one that always says, Oh, you have to take three days a week ballet, you have to take four days a week ballet, or whatever it is, or even if it's just one day a week.
23:21
SPEAKER_04: I mean, it just depends.
23:22
SPEAKER_04: But I think it comes the the foundation and the technique of ballet itself is based around repetition.
23:29
SPEAKER_04: And by creating that repetition in ballet, it's automatically carrying over with us into our other styles of dance.
23:36
SPEAKER_04: And we don't even realize it.
23:38
SPEAKER_04: I tell I tell dancers that all the time.
23:40
SPEAKER_04: I'm like, your ballet technique should be coming with you to jazz class and and to contemporary class and to lyrical class.
23:46
SPEAKER_04: And once you've kind of started doing it enough and it's getting a little bit more easier, more natural for you, you're not even going to be realizing that how much ballet technique you are using in these styles when you're doing it.
23:58
SPEAKER_04: It should be an automatic.
23:59
SPEAKER_04: You shouldn't have to think about it.
24:00
SPEAKER_04: You shouldn't have to know I have to lead with my heel in lyrical because you're already doing it, because your ballet technique is so fantastic.
24:08
SPEAKER_04: So, you know, I and it was actually interesting talking to teachers who have used to only do like one or two days a week ballet and have stepped it up to like three, four days a week ballet for their dancers, like their advanced competitive dancers, and saying how much of a difference that extra day a week ballet has made them as dancers in their technique across the board for all styles of dance with their musicality, with how they carry themselves, with the articulation of their feet, with their use of their arms connected to their back.
24:39
SPEAKER_04: I mean, there's so many things.
24:40
SPEAKER_04: So I do think that ballet is super important, and that's really where the technique comes.
24:44
SPEAKER_04: But kind of like what we mentioned, there is a technique to every style of dance, and you know, I think it it's just really making sure that we're starting from the ground up and learning those fundamentals in each style and not kind of jumping ahead before we're ready.
24:57
SPEAKER_04: We have to really make sure that we're laying the ground rules out for every genre.
25:02
SPEAKER_00: Yes, just like at the ballet bar, everything, every exercise is put in that specific order because it literally builds on top of one another.
25:10
SPEAKER_00: And I think that that's another key quality of what technique building blocks on top of each other.
25:16
SPEAKER_02: Love it.
25:17
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
25:17
SPEAKER_02: And I think one other thing that we haven't touched on that I know gets talked about a lot, that I just want to mention, is that, you know, we we as a Western dance Eurocentric culture look at ballet as that's the foundation.
25:30
SPEAKER_02: And that gets criticized a lot, especially these days, with, you know, well, that's a Western Eurocentric, you know, white people view of things.
25:38
SPEAKER_02: And that is true.
25:39
SPEAKER_02: What I what I think that people, what I would love for people to, I think, understand is I think you said it earlier, Courtney, it's only gonna help.
25:48
SPEAKER_02: Learning ballet, we're I'm not saying that learning ballet is going to make you the best hip-hop dancer ever, is going to make you the best Indian cultural dancer ever.
25:55
SPEAKER_02: No, that's that that may not, but it's not gonna hurt you.
25:58
SPEAKER_02: So by us, you know, suggesting that yes, ballet is a technical foundation that everybody should know, yes.
26:04
SPEAKER_02: Because it's also not going to negatively influence whatever other style you're doing that is valid in its own right, right?
26:11
SPEAKER_02: You know, and has its own technique and has its own rich cultural history on its own.
26:16
SPEAKER_02: So, you know, when we talk about technique, like I don't think learning any technique is going to hurt you in any way.
26:23
SPEAKER_02: Right.
26:23
SPEAKER_02: Like it's only gonna make you better and more rich in what you can do physically.
26:30
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26:35
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26:42
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26:43
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26:49
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26:51
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27:03
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27:34
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27:40
SPEAKER_05: Let's talk about these tricks, y'all.
27:43
SPEAKER_04: Right?
27:43
SPEAKER_04: So a trick.
27:45
SPEAKER_04: If you are familiar with competitive dance, which if you're listening to this podcast, you probably are in this world.
27:51
SPEAKER_04: You know what I'm talking about when I say a trick.
27:54
SPEAKER_04: And that could be from a tilt jump to a front aerial to a layout to a headspring.
28:03
SPEAKER_04: That's a that's a new popular trick.
28:05
SPEAKER_04: Oh yeah, that's a new one.
28:06
SPEAKER_04: That's a popular trick these days.
28:08
SPEAKER_04: Headspring.
28:10
SPEAKER_04: And how important do we feel as teachers and judges?
28:16
SPEAKER_04: How important do we feel these tricks are when it comes to competitive dance?
28:22
SPEAKER_04: Because let's be real, like it's a competition, so we're trying to impress someone, which usually is the judges, but how important are they?
28:32
SPEAKER_01: Well, I personally don't think it's everything.
28:35
SPEAKER_01: I think I compare technique and tricks to like, okay, this is gonna be a really weird analogy.
28:40
SPEAKER_01: But uh cake, okay.
28:41
SPEAKER_01: Technique is your cake, it's your substance, okay?
28:44
SPEAKER_01: Tricks are like the sprinkles, it adds some interest, it's exciting, it's fun to look at, it makes it prettier, okay?
28:51
SPEAKER_01: But at the end of the day, you can have a really good cake without the sprinkles.
28:55
SPEAKER_01: However, you cannot have good sprinkles.
28:58
SPEAKER_01: You're never just gonna eat sprinkles, right?
29:00
SPEAKER_01: That's that's weird.
29:01
SPEAKER_01: So the point is that without technique, you really don't have any good tricks.
29:06
SPEAKER_01: And that's what I hate.
29:07
SPEAKER_01: I go to competitions and I'll see people trying to do pirouettes on flat feet and do these things with bad technique.
29:13
SPEAKER_01: And it, I mean, it it's cringeworthy a little bit, you know, and not to mention the fact that you're like, oh my gosh, don't hurt yourself.
29:19
SPEAKER_01: So I just think that at the end of the day, I would rather have less than and have proper technique and have substance, have a cake, than have sprinkles.
29:29
SPEAKER_01: So that's what I would talk about with my kids at the studio, what I've kind of always believed in.
29:35
SPEAKER_01: But that's kind of how I look at t uh tricks versus technique.
29:38
SPEAKER_01: I I don't think that tricks are bad.
29:39
SPEAKER_01: I think it just like sprinkles aren't bad on cake, it it definitely adds, but it's not necessary.
29:45
SPEAKER_01: And it also doesn't add anything if there's no cake.
29:48
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, right.
29:49
SPEAKER_01: It's actually gonna hurt.
29:51
SPEAKER_04: It's gonna hurt you if there's no cake.
29:54
SPEAKER_04: Like if you're doing tricks without the technique, you're gonna get points taken off, not added.
30:00
SPEAKER_04: Right.
30:01
SPEAKER_04: Go, Troy.
30:02
SPEAKER_04: You were gonna about to say something.
30:04
SPEAKER_00: The substance, yes, I like that.
30:06
SPEAKER_00: Like it's the the substance of what the tricks should be portraying.
30:11
SPEAKER_00: And just like um as Carla was saying, it's like sometimes these dancers do come on stage, and I can tell, we can tell whenever a dancer walks on stage if they're technically trained just by the way that they hold themselves.
30:24
SPEAKER_00: And yes, sometimes whenever I'm at the table judging, especially some of those like big gymnastics acro routines, I'm like holding my breath and I'm like kind of scared for everybody's life.
30:36
SPEAKER_00: And like having that technique, it's like that is going to make me feel more comfortable.
30:42
SPEAKER_00: And it should definitely make the dancer feel more comfortable because they have that substance to back up what they're putting out there.
30:50
SPEAKER_00: I do think that tricks are important, especially if the dancers are interested in breaking out into like the professional world, because that's you never know what someone's gonna ask you if if you can do.
31:04
SPEAKER_00: Right.
31:05
SPEAKER_00: And so having that that portfolio of a bag of tricks is is important, especially like in the freestyle moments at an audition, is what's going to pull the panel's focus.
31:19
SPEAKER_00: And it might be a trick rather than just me bouncing and moving the whole time.
31:24
SPEAKER_01: So But don't you think if you have see, I feel that if you have solid technique, you automatically can do tricks nine times out of ten.
31:32
SPEAKER_01: Most of my kids have the best training and the best technique that take their their technique classes so seriously, their ballet so seriously, those are the ones that are doing the six pirouettes.
31:41
SPEAKER_01: Those are the ones doing all the tricks per se, because they have the technique to back it up.
31:47
SPEAKER_01: They can actually do it.
31:48
SPEAKER_01: So I think that to have good technique, you will automatically have good tricks.
31:53
SPEAKER_01: I mean, to some extent, you'll have something in your back.
31:57
SPEAKER_01: Maybe you might not be super, you might not want to put your leg in a side tilt, but you might have beautiful pirouettes, you might have beautiful, you know, to sustain balances or like whatever.
32:05
SPEAKER_01: You have things that you can offer that really wow someone or flipping or you know, acrobatics, those kind of things.
32:11
SPEAKER_01: So everybody has their thing, but if you have the technique, you really you're I'm assuming you'd have tricks if you have technique.
32:17
SPEAKER_01: Right.
32:19
SPEAKER_00: The tricks would be more accessible, which is more accessible technical foundation.
32:24
SPEAKER_02: Right.
32:24
SPEAKER_02: Because I'm even thinking of something I don't even consider this a trick because it's an actual step, it's you know, Shane Coupe jete or calypso.
32:32
SPEAKER_02: Like, how many tragedies have you seen because nobody understands what a back attitude looks like or feels like?
32:38
SPEAKER_02: That, you know, so it's like if you don't have the technique to do to stand there in a beautiful back attitude, I don't want to see your Shane Coupe jete in a back attitude because it's not gonna look nice.
32:48
SPEAKER_02: Like it's not I'm not impressed by that.
32:50
SPEAKER_02: So you do, you know, the the technique does back it up.
32:53
SPEAKER_02: And I think, you know, even like you said, Carla, like I'm somebody who has great technique, but I'm not very flexible, have a really, really non-flexible back.
33:00
SPEAKER_02: So like I can't do cool stuff.
33:02
SPEAKER_02: But, you know, it some of it would have been more accessible to me because I had that technique, minus bad back.
33:09
SPEAKER_04: And I I think the other thing that is important to mention is there's I like that you mentioned Troy at the fact that like tricks are important when you need to stand out.
33:20
SPEAKER_04: And Carla, you mentioned like every dancer is different.
33:23
SPEAKER_04: Every dancer is gonna have, you know, a quality that works best for them.
33:28
SPEAKER_04: And oh, you're the turner, oh you're the flexi bendy, oh your Ponche is stunning.
33:33
SPEAKER_04: You know your bag a trick and what your trick is in your bag, and you're always gonna pull that out when you have to in a professional setting, even if it's an audition or if you decide to pursue it.
33:43
SPEAKER_04: The other important thing to remember is there's a handful of like tricks, so to say, like your example, Leslie of a Shane Coupe's jatte calypso, that are that should be like standard in every dancer's training, because those are tricks that are less in well, not intense, but like a little less difficult.
34:05
SPEAKER_02: So Yeah, I mean, root rooted in ballet, rooted in a technique.
34:08
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
34:09
SPEAKER_02: You know, it's it's not like some of the some of the acro that we see that just gets thrown around that like doesn't exist in the dance world, like it's been plucked from somebody else's world, like the rhythmic gymnastics world or the gymnastics world.
34:21
SPEAKER_04: Because I guess what I'm I'm trying to get at is there's a lot of tricks that we need to know how to do just in our regular jazz contemporary class that will take us into the the professional world that will be included in our choreography as a professional dancer.
34:37
SPEAKER_04: For all of us that dance on Royal Caribbean, we did a Shanage Coupé jete on Royal Caribbean, we did a triple quad pirouette, we did a granjete.
34:46
SPEAKER_04: I mean, simple things, an axle.
34:48
SPEAKER_04: I mean, depending on who choreographed that dance and when, there might be an axle up in there.
34:54
SPEAKER_04: And axles are old school now, but I love an axle.
34:58
SPEAKER_04: Me too.
34:58
SPEAKER_04: Like wash your hair.
34:59
SPEAKER_04: Yes, like people need to know how to do it.
35:02
SPEAKER_04: And because, like you said, Troy, you don't know what the choreographer is gonna ask.
35:06
SPEAKER_04: But most likely, the choreographer is not gonna say every single dancer in this 20-person group for this commercial needs to do a scorpion.
35:13
SPEAKER_04: They're probably not, unless it was specifically casted like that.
35:17
SPEAKER_04: And then you have a one-up on everyone else that can't do a scorpion and you got the job.
35:21
SPEAKER_04: Cute.
35:22
SPEAKER_04: That's when the tricks like that's when the tricks are kind of great.
35:25
SPEAKER_04: But I feel like that so many dancers feel the pressure of I need to get all these crazy tricks to be good.
35:31
SPEAKER_04: And I don't necessarily feel like that's true.
35:34
SPEAKER_04: I think you need to just have like your few tricks in your bag and then also have like all the basic tricks under your boat.
35:40
SPEAKER_00: I think I'm not sure if I'm going off topic here, but I think, but don't quote me, it was Derek Huff that said he was on set one time, actually dancing in a gig, and the director or the choreographer, I'm not sure who it was, asked him if he could do a back tuck.
35:57
SPEAKER_00: And he was like, I've never done a back tuck in my life.
36:00
SPEAKER_00: But the guy's technique is immaculate, and whatever he does, he's strong, so he's obviously got some power behind him.
36:08
SPEAKER_00: So he just went off off the set for seven minutes and was just trying to throw back tucks, and he did it, and so they put it in the job.
36:16
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
36:17
SPEAKER_00: So just like I think all of us were saying, you would he wouldn't be able to have done that without that technique to back it up, without that power, without knowing how his body works.
36:28
SPEAKER_00: Right.
36:28
SPEAKER_01: So I don't mind when my kids like, you know, they do.
36:32
SPEAKER_01: I mean, I think kids get excited about new tricks that they see on social media and whatnot.
36:37
SPEAKER_01: And I love to see that enthusiasm and them wanting to like try something new and explore and all that stuff.
36:42
SPEAKER_01: Like, that's all good.
36:43
SPEAKER_01: But I always go back to what I want you to focus on is your training, your training, your training, your training.
36:48
SPEAKER_01: Because at the end of the day, they get some kids get too wrapped up in trying to get some of that stuff that they're actually doing things before they're ready or they aren't learning it properly because they're trying to learn it via social media instead of by a teacher.
37:01
SPEAKER_01: That to remember that at the end of the day, the technique and training your technique is ultimately the most important thing.
37:08
SPEAKER_01: And then the tricks and the fun stuff are just like I said, the icy on the cake, the extra thought that you can build upon with that technique.
37:17
SPEAKER_04: Totally.
37:18
SPEAKER_04: And I feel like that's really important to hear you say, Carla, especially because so many dancers listening probably know of your studio.
37:25
SPEAKER_04: Follow your dancers on Instagram and look up to your dancers as those two social media influence to learn tricks from.
37:33
SPEAKER_04: And to also hear that your dancers are doing the same and you're kind of pulling them back and saying, Hey, actually, don't learn that trick on social media.
37:41
SPEAKER_04: Let me teach it to you the right way.
37:43
SPEAKER_04: You know, I think that more teachers kind of need to approach it in that sense because it is exciting, you know.
37:50
SPEAKER_04: It is cool to see how much dance has taken over the social media world.
37:55
SPEAKER_04: I mean, I I would have been one of those dancers when I was young.
37:59
SPEAKER_04: Like I would have been like learning those tricks if I had access to it.
38:03
SPEAKER_04: We didn't.
38:04
SPEAKER_04: We went to dance and that's how we learned our tricks.
38:07
SPEAKER_04: Now it's everywhere.
38:08
SPEAKER_01: Dance has grown so much, right?
38:12
SPEAKER_01: I look at the mini category now versus the mini category when I was a kid.
38:16
SPEAKER_01: And it I don't even think we had a mini category.
38:18
SPEAKER_01: I think it was like junior and then that was at this two.
38:21
SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah.
38:21
SPEAKER_01: Either way, the mini category has evolved so much.
38:24
SPEAKER_01: I'm like, what is expected of a mini now to actually, you know, place at the national level is so much more than a mini back, you know, even 10 years ago.
38:32
SPEAKER_01: So yeah, I think so much of that is social media though, because it's pushing kids, kids are seeing what other kids their same age are doing, and it's kind of pushing the levels up as well.
38:42
SPEAKER_01: So it's a good and a bad, the double-elegge sword.
38:44
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
38:45
SPEAKER_02: Well, I would be curious to know, Carla, what you know, so you've you've got some of those pretty awesome minis at your at your studio.
38:51
SPEAKER_02: And so what is like, what is your your mini training life like?
38:55
SPEAKER_02: I mean, are those kids in ballet three times a week?
38:57
SPEAKER_02: Are they like, what are they doing?
38:58
SPEAKER_02: What are y'all doing to produce such amazing talent that combines beautiful technique and stunning tricks?
39:04
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
39:05
SPEAKER_01: What's the job in ballet?
39:07
SPEAKER_01: Our foundation's definitely ballet here.
39:09
SPEAKER_01: I make the kids, we'd even do like a full-length nutcracker just because I want them to perform and respect ballet.
39:14
SPEAKER_01: I think it's one thing to take ballet class.
39:16
SPEAKER_01: I think it's another thing to have to like look forward to a show or like try to perfect it for a performance.
39:21
SPEAKER_01: I think that's one of the things that some competition studios lack.
39:25
SPEAKER_01: I mean, if there's all this training with no reason to like try to grow, I think that sometimes it can feel a little stagnant.
39:31
SPEAKER_01: So I feel like doing Nutcracker, like there's a fight for the roles.
39:34
SPEAKER_01: There's a fight to grow in the in the ballet program.
39:37
SPEAKER_01: We also, a handful of our kids, you know, choose to do YEGP too.
39:40
SPEAKER_01: So I think that helps as well with keeping ballet competitive.
39:44
SPEAKER_01: You know, when you're dealing with competitive kids, they're competitive by nature.
39:47
SPEAKER_01: So to make ballet in its own way and a healthy, uh, healthy competition, but make it competitive so it's exciting, not just, oh, I have to take ballet class again for the hundredth time this week because my teacher says it's important for me.
40:00
SPEAKER_01: It's I think that for our kids, they actually like ballet because they are, you know, they do have performances in it and they do do YGP and they do these things that require them to get better in ballet.
40:12
SPEAKER_01: So they're they have goals.
40:14
SPEAKER_01: So I think that that helps.
40:15
SPEAKER_01: But with the minis, yeah, I mean, they it depends on the age and the level of the mini.
40:20
SPEAKER_01: So if they, you know, come in brand new, you know, fresh to our studio or from our recreational program, they're gonna have lesser schedule than you know, minis that have maybe been with us in our company for longer.
40:31
SPEAKER_01: But in general, the you know, more advanced mini is gonna dance ballet probably three to four times a week.
40:38
SPEAKER_01: And a lot of them do ballet privates.
40:39
SPEAKER_01: Uh, privates are really big at our studio.
40:41
SPEAKER_01: I think we have a hundred and fifty-five privates that take place a week.
40:45
SPEAKER_01: So pretty much all six of our studios are operating from like two in the afternoon till 10 15 at night, to be honest, which is crazy.
40:53
SPEAKER_01: But that's just how badly our kids want private time.
40:57
SPEAKER_01: So we try to and we and we operate full on Sunday as well, and all rooms are being operating, being used for private lessons on Sunday.
41:05
SPEAKER_01: So I think that the private lesson time mixed with all the ballet training, they get they take jazz technique, an hour jazz technique class, they take conditioning every week, stretch every week, and then we start contemporary or modern technique class.
41:20
SPEAKER_01: Modern, I think we start a at a level uh six, but level five for three get contemporary technique.
41:27
SPEAKER_01: So they also take a tech contemporary class, and then they take obviously tap and then hip-hop is if they're they want to.
41:33
SPEAKER_01: We don't require hip hop at that young of an age, but they are required to take quite a few classes.
41:37
SPEAKER_01: They're here quite a few hours for being so little, but they love it and seems to be working.
41:43
SPEAKER_01: So I think it's always working, yeah.
41:45
SPEAKER_01: But they do take a lot of ballet.
41:47
SPEAKER_01: I think a lot of people underestimate minis.
41:49
SPEAKER_01: I think that they're capable of a lot more hours than people realize, especially if they have a good teacher that engages them and makes them excited to learn.
41:56
SPEAKER_01: But yeah, I mean, our minis take a couple days a week of ballet.
41:59
SPEAKER_02: Well, and what I love to hear too is that we actually talked about this on an episode recently, that some studios are not teaching ballet classes, but they have replaced the ballet class with a technique class.
42:11
SPEAKER_02: But you have just said we take jazz technique, we take contemporary technique, we take ballet technique, which speaks to what we spoke about earlier.
42:18
SPEAKER_02: Is that each of these styles has a technique?
42:21
SPEAKER_02: There is no broad what even is a technique class, just you know what's interesting to piggyback on that.
42:27
SPEAKER_01: It's funny because I get a lot of people think that we spend like so many hours in our rehearsals.
42:32
SPEAKER_01: Our average rehearsal for small groups are 30 minutes, sometimes 45 if it's minis, younger kids, large groups 45 minutes, lines 45 minutes a week.
42:41
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
42:42
SPEAKER_01: A week a week we spend and because all their their main bulk of their schedule is their technique classes.
42:48
SPEAKER_01: So they they will have like that rehearsal, like for that lyrical small group.
42:52
SPEAKER_01: We'll meet at the same time every day for their half hour, 45 minutes every week.
42:57
SPEAKER_01: But I think the reason that I think we got a really efficient method of cleaning at this point, but I think they're so well trained in their technique that the cleaning is a lot easier because their yeah, their technique is really strong.
43:08
SPEAKER_01: So I'm a big believer that you don't need 20 hours of rehearsal if you have good technique and they're well-trained kids.
43:14
SPEAKER_01: But with that said, we had I mean, before the first competition, we'll like jam-pack sometimes Sundays and Saturday evenings with extra practices if we feel certain dances needed before that first comp or whatever, but or before nationals and things.
43:27
SPEAKER_01: But I don't want to get the wrong idea.
43:29
SPEAKER_01: But in general, their normal week only has a 30-minute or 45-minute rehearsal for their actual technique or for their rehearsals, their technique classes are where the bulk of the time is.
43:40
SPEAKER_04: Right.
43:40
SPEAKER_04: Well, it's just really refreshing to hear, especially from your studio in particular, who is so well is so well rehearsed and clean and technically beautiful, but also have the tricks.
43:53
SPEAKER_04: It's it's nice to hear it coming straight from you as the studio owner.
43:58
SPEAKER_04: We do not replace.
44:00
SPEAKER_04: Our technique classes with rehearsal.
44:03
SPEAKER_04: And I think a lot of studios do that.
44:06
SPEAKER_04: It might be jazz on the schedule, and that might have been it for maybe two months.
44:11
SPEAKER_04: And then once you learn your competition dance, you're like, well, let's just run the competition dance instead.
44:16
SPEAKER_04: And now we've completely eliminated all technique in that specific genre that's supposed to be happening because, yeah, sure, you're getting some style, you're getting you're learning things in your competition dance.
44:27
SPEAKER_04: Let's not like absolutely 100%.
44:29
SPEAKER_04: But there's more to it than that.
44:31
SPEAKER_04: You can drill a dance so much, but and I also believe that that is a perfect example of convention versus competition and how when those two worlds combine, like at a if I'm teaching at a convention and I teach jazz, and the dancers are struggling through my class, and for whatever reason, they don't have the style, they don't understand the musicality, whatever it is.
44:52
SPEAKER_04: Then they come hit the stage at that night at competition in a jazz dance that blew me away.
44:56
SPEAKER_04: I'm just like, where was that in my class?
44:59
SPEAKER_04: It's because they're just drilling competition routines and they're just making that competition routine look fabulous in that moment, but they don't know how to actually do the style correctly or have the foundation of that technique for that genre.
45:12
SPEAKER_04: And I think it's I think a lot of people, a lot of studios might care more about the win than they do about actually teaching the correct foundation of each genre of dance.
45:22
SPEAKER_04: The technique.
45:49
SPEAKER_00: They don't know how to do it.
45:50
SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, but this what oh okay.
45:56
SPEAKER_00: All right.
45:56
SPEAKER_00: So let's go over here and let me teach you how to pot a bureau.
46:01
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
46:02
SPEAKER_04: Like that's like Jazz 101.
46:04
SPEAKER_00: Like I know, it's it's really crazy.
46:07
SPEAKER_00: It's walking or running before you can walk.
46:10
SPEAKER_01: Yep.
46:10
SPEAKER_01: I think it's what gives competition a bad reputation, though.
46:14
SPEAKER_01: Because, you know, coming from the ballet and competition world, that's what the ballet world hates about competition dance.
46:19
SPEAKER_01: There's no substance, they're not well trained.
46:21
SPEAKER_01: Why?
46:22
SPEAKER_01: Because they're only rehearsing their dances, they're not really getting technique or training.
46:26
SPEAKER_01: In fact, I know because I grew up with that.
46:28
SPEAKER_01: That's why I had to go to another studio to get my ballet training.
46:30
SPEAKER_01: So I feel like that is a big misservice that a lot of studios do to their kids is not put enough emphasis in the technique and the technique classes.
46:41
SPEAKER_01: I mean, those should be the classes that you never miss.
46:43
SPEAKER_01: If you need to add extra rehearsals, do that on top of what their schedule already is.
46:48
SPEAKER_01: You should never replay because I think it's just such a disservice.
46:52
SPEAKER_00: I was just gonna say, I I came from a studio that was just like you miss Carla.
46:56
SPEAKER_00: It's like I was I I didn't learn how to dance, I just learned dances.
47:02
SPEAKER_01: Bingo, yes.
47:03
SPEAKER_01: I think that that's definitely, and I think that that's so important.
47:07
SPEAKER_01: And I think that's why the ballet world and like I said, the competition world are very split.
47:11
SPEAKER_01: But I do see it blending more.
47:12
SPEAKER_01: I think the studios that really tried to like have a really strong technical background and then also have all that other fun stuff too, and blend it.
47:21
SPEAKER_01: There is a blend, and honestly, I think you're gonna have a true triple threat amazing dancer if you can blend the two worlds because I'm telling you, I went to you know, Butler, and here I was this you know, comp slash ballet kid, not really sure who I was when I was there.
47:34
SPEAKER_01: Like, what am I?
47:35
SPEAKER_01: I we go to like I remember we took this jazz class and we did this like Fossi type number they brought in, like I guess.
47:41
SPEAKER_01: And these ballerinas like struggled so much with it.
47:44
SPEAKER_01: I'm talking ballerinas at the bar and in ballet class, phenomenal, like literally phenomenal.
47:50
SPEAKER_01: Ended up going on to be in ballet companies and whatnot, but they couldn't do anything beyond ballet.
47:56
SPEAKER_01: And I was thinking, man, like they are so talented.
48:00
SPEAKER_01: If they could just learn to use their body and to in a different way and be comfortable in their skin doing something other than just ballet, they would just be even 10 times better than what they are right already are right now.
48:11
SPEAKER_01: And so I think that both worlds could really benefit from blending a little bit more because I do think that some of the best dancers out there, especially right now, and think we're seeing it in social media because it's easier to see.
48:23
SPEAKER_01: A lot of them are the ones that are doing intense ballet, YGP, all that stuff, summer ballet programs in the summer, and then also competing and doing the conventions and doing all that stuff to keep that well-rounded, you know, dance experience.
48:36
SPEAKER_01: Cause I think that's gonna be where I think that's where the world's going now.
48:39
SPEAKER_01: And I think without it, you're gonna get lost in the shuffle a little bit.
48:44
SPEAKER_02: Agree.
48:45
SPEAKER_02: A hundred percent.
48:46
SPEAKER_04: The other thing to kind of briefly talk about is acro and how that's heavily influenced tricks in the competitive world.
48:52
SPEAKER_04: Because I know that when I was growing up, acro was not what it is now.
48:57
SPEAKER_04: Like I we had a tumbling class, I learned how to do an aerial.
49:03
SPEAKER_04: Every kid in dance can do an aerial now.
49:05
SPEAKER_02: Every kid.
49:06
SPEAKER_02: Like that's all there was 25 years ago.
49:09
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
49:10
SPEAKER_02: Maybe you saw an aerial, right?
49:11
SPEAKER_02: It maybe probably wasn't very good.
49:13
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
49:13
SPEAKER_02: You know, somebody learned it in the front yard and they were like, look what I can do.
49:16
SPEAKER_02: Right.
49:17
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
49:17
SPEAKER_04: So like seeing how Acro has really kind of taken over the competitive dance world in one way or another, whether it's with elbow stands, chin stands, chest rolls, front aerials.
49:31
SPEAKER_04: I mean, the front aerial is the new aerial, is every kid can do a front aerial.
49:36
SPEAKER_04: And when every kid can kind of do it, when that's when that's a a trick that is extremely hard to do and up here for me as far as like acro, then it kind of becomes unimpressive in a weird way.
49:47
SPEAKER_04: And especially when kids are throwing front aerials with flexed feet and improper technique.
49:52
SPEAKER_04: I shouldn't be like, you said this earlier, Troy.
49:55
SPEAKER_04: I shouldn't be scared and cringing and jolting in my seat while you're doing your acro trick on stage.
50:02
SPEAKER_04: I can tell as a judge if that acro trick is going to be successful the moment you start prepping into it.
50:07
SPEAKER_04: I can tell based on your prep if it's gonna be good or bad.
50:10
SPEAKER_04: And usually if I'm if I'm jolting in my seat, then it's gonna be bad.
50:15
SPEAKER_04: And I usually scream a critique and then I say, maybe we need to take that out.
50:18
SPEAKER_04: Because the technique's not there.
50:20
SPEAKER_04: But I feel like there's that that pressure of, well, everyone's doing it, so I need to put my aerial in my routine.
50:26
SPEAKER_04: But I don't really know.
50:28
SPEAKER_04: I'm curious to hear, you know, how you feel like acro has played a part in competitive dance world as far as tricks when when it comes to tricks and how necessary.
50:37
SPEAKER_00: Acrobatics and dance is getting really, really muddy.
50:41
SPEAKER_00: It's like, what's what is what is dance and what is contortion, and it's like, yeah, it's like another thing that we talk about all the time is just like categories.
50:54
SPEAKER_00: It's like this, you put this in a jet, you put this in jazz, but you're like rolling over your face eight different times, and that's not jazz to me.
51:04
SPEAKER_00: That's that would be acrobatic.
51:06
SPEAKER_00: I definitely think it's as the years have passed, it has absolutely influenced the dance world.
51:12
SPEAKER_00: I think it's gotten kids a little like like what's the next level?
51:17
SPEAKER_00: What's the next level?
51:18
SPEAKER_00: What can I do after this and this and this?
51:20
SPEAKER_00: And it kind of just like built on each on top of each other.
51:23
SPEAKER_00: Like y'all were saying, whenever we were competing, the three people at the competition that were able to do an aerial were just like the stars.
51:32
SPEAKER_00: And now it's just like the norm.
51:34
SPEAKER_00: That's the standard.
51:35
SPEAKER_00: If you don't have an aerial, you don't get to be part of this team.
51:38
SPEAKER_00: It's strange, and especially coming from this perspective, where that's who I was as a dancer growing up.
51:45
SPEAKER_00: I had to have the aerial, I had to have the aerial walkover.
51:48
SPEAKER_00: I had to be able to walk on my hands in my musical theater solo.
51:53
SPEAKER_00: That doesn't make any sense anymore.
51:55
SPEAKER_00: Yes, I can't tell you I every single production that I was in from the time I started dancing until I graduated high school, I had to handstand walk over a line of girls in a jazz dance.
52:09
SPEAKER_04: Gotta love that trick.
52:11
SPEAKER_04: It's like, what's the point?
52:13
SPEAKER_00: I it's there's there's it just doesn't make any sense to me anymore.
52:17
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
52:19
SPEAKER_01: I actually I can't do any accro.
52:21
SPEAKER_01: Like I tried, I never got even a back walk over or front walkover.
52:25
SPEAKER_01: That's I'm such a scary cat.
52:26
SPEAKER_01: Like, I don't want my head, like that's why I wanted to do dance.
52:29
SPEAKER_01: Didn't want to do gymnastics growing up.
52:31
SPEAKER_01: Like, I hated tumbling.
52:33
SPEAKER_01: I actually went to a studio that had a pretty good acro program, but I didn't participate in it, obviously, because I was scared.
52:38
SPEAKER_01: But with that said, I do have kids that can do it.
52:41
SPEAKER_01: We do have an acro program here at the studio, kids that take it.
52:45
SPEAKER_01: My thoughts on it, not necessary, but not bad either.
52:49
SPEAKER_01: I feel like having that in your bag, I always tell kids if it's in your bag of tricks and it's something that you're comfortable doing and you like it, like, yeah, we'll put it in there.
52:56
SPEAKER_01: You know, if you can do it and do it well and not look like you're gonna like fall on your head, I'll you know, I'll put it in.
53:01
SPEAKER_01: And I mean it does.
53:02
SPEAKER_01: I definitely think it adds some excitement value here and there, throwing a front aerial randomly on a big boom in the music or whatever.
53:08
SPEAKER_01: But I don't think it's necessary.
53:10
SPEAKER_01: I don't think I actually can't stand when a dance has too much acro and chin stands on it.
53:14
SPEAKER_01: I like it dance to me.
53:16
SPEAKER_01: I think I don't think it's dance, but that's just me personally.
53:21
SPEAKER_01: But I don't think that they don't deserve a spot at all in dance.
53:24
SPEAKER_01: I think if it fits and it makes sense and the kid can do it, it's kind of like the sprinkles goes back to sprinkles, sure, put it in there.
53:31
SPEAKER_01: But I think that just needs to be done tastefully and like in a way that actually looks good on the kid and it makes sense with the choreography, but doesn't make sense choreographically because I've seen it done really cool where it like comes out of nowhere and it makes sense, and I'm like, wow, like that was genius.
53:46
SPEAKER_01: But then other times I'm like not really sure that even makes sense.
53:49
SPEAKER_01: I think you're just throwing it in there just because so I don't know.
53:52
SPEAKER_01: I'm not a huge acro fan, but I don't dislike it either.
53:55
SPEAKER_02: So yeah.
53:56
SPEAKER_02: I think when you get into the world of you know, Troy's experience of okay, well, we have this boy who can do this thing and we're gonna put it in every single dance.
54:04
SPEAKER_02: Like, that's that's when it's like, okay, you're you're just truly being lazy and like just filling time where you could be creative and come up with a really cool, you know, sequence or a formation change or something, but like we're just gonna put poor Troy just across the stage.
54:18
SPEAKER_03: Right.
54:18
SPEAKER_02: Like there's, you know, I think we have to be it, there's a place for it when there's a place for it.
54:23
SPEAKER_02: And if there's not a place for it, you've got to do something else.
54:26
SPEAKER_04: And I think it's important to know, like, like you said, like that was the go-to for you, Troy.
54:31
SPEAKER_04: Like the handstand walk over the dancers, that was the go-to for your teacher because that was a trick that you could do.
54:38
SPEAKER_04: And there's a lot of teachers out there who look at a student that says, You're the turner.
54:42
SPEAKER_04: Do you're gonna always be the feature turner in this in our group dances?
54:46
SPEAKER_04: You're the beautiful girl with the scorpion, you're the scorpion girl.
54:50
SPEAKER_04: You know, I mean, whatever it is, like the teachers are gonna use that to their advantage when they can because it's a well-executed trick and might be an enhancement.
54:59
SPEAKER_04: But I, as far as like acro goes, I think that it's definitely helpful for dancers.
55:06
SPEAKER_04: I think that it has made dancers stronger.
55:08
SPEAKER_04: I think that a lot of dancers have started to work on their flexibility even more, which I don't know if if that's a good or bad because that that's a whole nother podcast.
55:16
SPEAKER_04: I think we need to talk do that one.
55:18
SPEAKER_04: Do we have we done that flexibility or stretching?
55:20
SPEAKER_04: I think we need to do a podcast on that.
55:22
SPEAKER_04: Mainly because I feel like a lot of dancers are are doing learning flexibility improperly and stretching improperly.
55:27
SPEAKER_04: So, like that's an issue for me.
55:29
SPEAKER_04: But I think that acro has made a lot of dancers stronger, more aware of their body, upper body strength as well, core strength.
55:36
SPEAKER_04: So I think there's a lot of benefits.
55:37
SPEAKER_04: I think that for me, when I think acro training comes into play in a good way, is when dancers can hide their preparations and kind of surprise you with an a cool acro trick or maybe infuse it into their floor work for contemporary or something like that, that is not just this stereotypical expected acro trick, but you're kind of creating an artistic way to go in and out of a movement by using your acro training and technique.
56:03
SPEAKER_04: So, you know, do we need to see back hands bring passes in in random dances out of the blue?
56:09
SPEAKER_04: No, like you said, Carla, like it needs to make sense.
56:12
SPEAKER_04: And if it's poorly done with bad technique, you're getting points off.
56:17
SPEAKER_04: I think that's the thing that people don't understand.
56:19
SPEAKER_04: People, a lot of a lot of people think that the more tricks we can put, the more points we might get because wow, we're doing so many tricks.
56:25
SPEAKER_04: The more tricks you put in that are poorly done are actually going to make my score go lower because I'd rather see less is more.
56:33
SPEAKER_04: Less is always more.
56:34
SPEAKER_04: I think every teacher will say that.
56:36
SPEAKER_04: I don't want to see a sloppy triple, I want to see a clean double.
56:39
SPEAKER_04: Everyone's gonna say that.
56:40
SPEAKER_04: So, as teachers who are cleaning dances, maybe in preparation for the season, if you're looking at this tumbling pass or if you're looking at this turn sequence where there's that one dancer off in the back, do we remove the dancer or do we shorten the turn sequence?
56:53
SPEAKER_04: How do we fix this?
56:54
SPEAKER_04: Because that is going to get points taken off, and that's to me considered a trick.
56:59
SPEAKER_04: That is, is it necessary?
57:00
SPEAKER_04: I think we've said that a lot.
57:02
SPEAKER_04: Is it really needed?
57:03
SPEAKER_04: Do we need the sprinkles there or are we cool with the cake?
57:06
SPEAKER_04: I love that.
57:07
SPEAKER_04: I love that we're I just love that so much.
57:09
SPEAKER_04: I mean, as long as the cake is is solid and good, like we may not need the sprinkles every time, y'all.
57:16
SPEAKER_04: Well, y'all, this was so good, and I hope that all of our listeners out there really, really heard our thoughts on our on our technique and and all the tricks that we love to see so much at competition and maybe give you a new perspective on them as well, and in a good or bad way, who knows?
57:30
SPEAKER_04: Hopefully you enjoyed the chat with these love lovely guests that we have.
57:34
SPEAKER_04: But to our guests, Carl and Troy, if you either of you would like to share anything for the the listeners to just kind of lead us out with any sort of advice when it comes to technique, to tricks, to the competitive dance world in general, and just any kind of guidance and way to lead us out.
57:51
SPEAKER_01: I think that the big thing is it's just really encouraging kids to love and appreciate technique and the foundation and the process, reminding them that it's a journey to get there.
58:02
SPEAKER_01: It's not just trying to get a triple pirouette.
58:04
SPEAKER_01: Like that's that's enjoy the process of getting the single and then mastering the double and then getting in that triple pirouette.
58:10
SPEAKER_01: I think as educators and educators and teachers, that's so important to teach kids to enjoy the process because this is a long process.
58:17
SPEAKER_01: And if you this is something they want to do forever, the process never ends.
58:21
SPEAKER_01: It grows and grows.
58:22
SPEAKER_01: And learning to be able to enjoy that and to continue to want to grow, I think is so important.
58:29
SPEAKER_01: So just I think encouraging that.
58:30
SPEAKER_01: I think less focus on perfecting the routines and more focus on just uh letting them love technique and training so that it just adds to the routines, it's gonna make the routines better because they have that that great foundation.
58:45
SPEAKER_00: So I totally agree with that.
58:47
SPEAKER_00: I think that if a dancer can get in the mindset of really enjoying the journey, the ride, being able to enjoy how things feel and not force things, let things flow a little bit more and just kind of have fun with it.
59:04
SPEAKER_00: But but always stay disciplined.
59:06
SPEAKER_00: I think that that is going to make qualified dancers that will have a long career ahead of them, that are safe and happy and feel good with what they're doing with their bodies.
59:20
SPEAKER_05: We hope you enjoyed our latest throwback episode from season two, episode 53, Tricks vs.
59:25
SPEAKER_05: Technique.
59:26
SPEAKER_05: Special shout-out to our guests, Troy and Carla, for joining us on the chat.
59:31
SPEAKER_04: Be sure to follow them on Instagram.
59:33
SPEAKER_04: You can find Troy at Troy AlexanderHaywood and Carla at Carla Greer.
59:39
SPEAKER_04: And don't forget to follow her studio Expressions Dance Center at Expressions.
59:44
SPEAKER_02: Don't forget to follow Making the Impact anywhere you listen to podcasts.
59:47
SPEAKER_02: And new for season eight, we're on video.
59:50
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59:54
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1:00:00
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1:00:16
SPEAKER_02: Coming up in the next few weeks, look forward to an episode about musical theater, a throwback episode, and another episode in our Day in the Life series.
1:00:25
SPEAKER_04: More new episodes are coming your way on making the impact soon.
1:00:28
SPEAKER_04: We'll see you then.