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Transcript

The Late Debate | 7 July · The Late Debate

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Welcome to the Late Base.
• 0:07
  Speaker 2: Good evening and welcome to the program. I'm wondering if
• 0:09
  Speaker 2: I go like that, whether or not like a big
• 0:11
  Speaker 2: fat check money he's just gonna don't here in my
• 0:14
  Speaker 2: hands or not. Probably not. Welcome to the program, of course.
• 0:16
  Speaker 2: I'm Kayla Bond with Anika de Giorgio and Joe Hildebrand. Now,
• 0:20
  Speaker 2: as Paul just mentioned there, in an hour's time there
• 0:23
  Speaker 2: will be an announcement from Nigel Fragi says on his
• 0:27
  Speaker 2: future in public life, so we will have plenty more
• 0:30
  Speaker 2: to talk about on that and a bumper episode of
• 0:32
  Speaker 2: the show. We're going to go right through till eleven
• 0:34
  Speaker 2: thirty this evening, so please stick with us. I Meanwhile,
• 0:37
  Speaker 2: some of the other stuff going around. Donald Trump has
• 0:40
  Speaker 2: touched down in Turkey in the past hour for the
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: NATO summit and we're expecting a welcome ceremony very soon.
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: We'll bring you the latest as it happens. A fight
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: has erupted in court between the ABC and a group
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: of athletes who are fighting to stop the broadcaster publishing
• 0:53
  Speaker 2: messages from a private group chat that we're linked by
• 0:56
  Speaker 2: a discramtled ex girlfriend, and the labor party has to
• 0:59
  Speaker 2: say to go all in on its support for the
• 1:02
  Speaker 2: ULARU statement will formally stated support for Welcomes to country.
• 1:06
  Speaker 2: That's on the front of Tomorrow's Australian. But of course,
• 1:09
  Speaker 2: as I said later in the show, we will bring
• 1:12
  Speaker 2: you that statement from Nigel Farage, the leader of Reform UK,
• 1:16
  Speaker 2: about his future in public life. He put up a
• 1:19
  Speaker 2: post about an hour ago on Twitter saying that this
• 1:23
  Speaker 2: would be coming now as we understand it. This will
• 1:25
  Speaker 2: be a video message that he will post online, so
• 1:29
  Speaker 2: there won't be any opportunity for questions. It won't be
• 1:31
  Speaker 2: a live press conference, so he will not be interacting
• 1:34
  Speaker 2: with the media. And all of this comes on the
• 1:37
  Speaker 2: back of investigations now into millions of dollars that he
• 1:41
  Speaker 2: took in donations and gifts from people. There are two
• 1:45
  Speaker 2: investigations that he is now potentially facing over these allegations.
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: There was also a confrontation overnight between Nigel Farrage and
• 1:55
  Speaker 2: a SKA News UK journalist. Now, Forage says that a
• 2:00
  Speaker 2: journal from sky News UK went to his daughter's house
• 2:05
  Speaker 2: to talk to her and he took great umbrage to that.
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: Sky News UK says that did not happen, but one
• 2:11
  Speaker 2: of their journals went to meet him as he got
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: off on a plane or off a plane, I should say,
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: And this was how it went.
• 2:17
  Speaker 3: Was it a mistake not to declare the gifts?
• 2:19
  Speaker 4: From George Cottrelza?
• 2:21
  Speaker 1: You tell your bosses you harrass my family anymore? I'll
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: thank you the serious consequences. That's what your organization has
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: done this morning. Go away.
• 2:29
  Speaker 4: Was it a mistake not to declare the gifts?
• 2:31
  Speaker 1: Sir?
• 2:32
  Speaker 5: Do you not hear me?
• 2:34
  Speaker 6: You have broken all the rules Levison and everything else.
• 2:37
  Speaker 2: Cut So this announcement that will come from Nigel Frage
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: is on the back of a pretty testy day, you
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: would have to say. I guess the question now is
• 2:47
  Speaker 2: what will he announce Denika at eleven o'clock our time
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: two pm in England. Will we hear that he is
• 2:55
  Speaker 2: going to step down for a while. Will we hear
• 2:57
  Speaker 2: that he is leaving public life all together? Will we
• 3:00
  Speaker 2: hear him basically say you can all get nicked. I'm
• 3:03
  Speaker 2: going to keep doing what I'm doing well.
• 3:05
  Speaker 7: I mean, no matter what he does, I think this
• 3:06
  Speaker 7: will only just rile up his supporter base even more
• 3:09
  Speaker 7: because he has become so front and center of politics
• 3:12
  Speaker 7: in the UK that even if he was to step down,
• 3:15
  Speaker 7: I think that all it would do would seek to
• 3:16
  Speaker 7: boost his own popularity, and he was already on track
• 3:19
  Speaker 7: to become the next prime minister of the country. In
• 3:22
  Speaker 7: that video that we just showed after say, he did
• 3:24
  Speaker 7: look quite stressed out. Now, if of course the media
• 3:27
  Speaker 7: is indeed harassing his family, then that is a big problem.
• 3:30
  Speaker 7: But he doesn't normally get that testing. I mean, we've
• 3:32
  Speaker 7: seen him fired up before, but clearly that there is
• 3:34
  Speaker 7: a lot of pressure on his shoulders right now. I
• 3:37
  Speaker 7: don't know whether it's a case where he does maybe
• 3:39
  Speaker 7: step back for a couple of months let this investigation
• 3:42
  Speaker 7: into these donations.
• 3:44
  Speaker 8: Take hold, or is it a case does he step.
• 3:46
  Speaker 7: Down and he goes okay, then let's do a by
• 3:49
  Speaker 7: election in his seat of Clacton, stare down his critics,
• 3:53
  Speaker 7: tell his critics come at me and.
• 3:55
  Speaker 8: Do it that way. But either way, I think that
• 3:58
  Speaker 8: a person like Nigel.
• 3:59
  Speaker 7: Farage has the personality and the carryover that I don't
• 4:04
  Speaker 7: actually think that it will work negatively in his favor.
• 4:08
  Speaker 8: Whatever he seeks to.
• 4:09
  Speaker 4: Do work negatively in reforms in.
• 4:11
  Speaker 7: Reform, but I mean in terms of his popularity, because
• 4:13
  Speaker 7: it will see he's not running.
• 4:16
  Speaker 4: I mean, if he's not, if he's not lead, he's
• 4:18
  Speaker 4: got a big base.
• 4:19
  Speaker 8: He's got a big base people.
• 4:21
  Speaker 4: Who for I mean, look what happened with him if
• 4:23
  Speaker 4: he's not there.
• 4:23
  Speaker 7: But look what happened with Donald Trump after he lost it,
• 4:26
  Speaker 7: for example, when he lost it to Joe Biden. He
• 4:29
  Speaker 7: only became more popular after that, but he became that's
• 4:32
  Speaker 7: he didn't come back.
• 4:32
  Speaker 8: But I'm saying I just think that his popularity will
• 4:35
  Speaker 8: carry him.
• 4:35
  Speaker 4: That's just what I don't think. I think if he
• 4:38
  Speaker 4: steps down or even steps back, it's a huge mistake.
• 4:40
  Speaker 4: I think it will make him look weak. This is
• 4:43
  Speaker 4: not a judgment of his guilt or innocence, but he's
• 4:46
  Speaker 4: only a political tactic I think is to tough it out,
• 4:50
  Speaker 4: say that it's all fake news, so that everyone's lying.
• 4:52
  Speaker 4: They're just out to get me because they're scared because
• 4:54
  Speaker 4: reform is so popular, and you know, and just punch
• 4:57
  Speaker 4: it on because if he's not the leader of reform, who.
• 5:00
  Speaker 2: Is, well, And that's that's the thing, right, It'd be
• 5:03
  Speaker 2: a bit like if you had one nation without Pauline
• 5:05
  Speaker 2: Hanson or Donald.
• 5:06
  Speaker 4: Trump without Donald Trump.
• 5:08
  Speaker 2: But you know, and of course at some point you
• 5:09
  Speaker 2: do have to make a political party bigger than just
• 5:12
  Speaker 2: one person. But when you are establishing yourself as a force,
• 5:16
  Speaker 2: it's that personality that gets the job done. And so
• 5:19
  Speaker 2: there really is no reform without a Nigel Farage. You
• 5:24
  Speaker 2: raise the point about a by election that the issue
• 5:26
  Speaker 2: is that if he is found to have committed misconduct
• 5:30
  Speaker 2: in these inquiries, that the first one into the five
• 5:34
  Speaker 2: million dollars he allegedly received as now he pushed back
• 5:37
  Speaker 2: to September. But if he's found to have committed misconduct,
• 5:40
  Speaker 2: that will force a by election in his seat of Clacton.
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: Now presumably after that he can just put himself back
• 5:48
  Speaker 2: on the ticket, and.
• 5:50
  Speaker 4: If it depends if it's a criminal. Again, I can't
• 5:53
  Speaker 4: pretend to be expert in UK law, but certainly in
• 5:56
  Speaker 4: Australia and New South Wales, if you are convict sit
• 6:00
  Speaker 4: of a crime that carries a penalty of more than
• 6:02
  Speaker 4: one year's jail, you are disqualified from parliament. Likewise, if
• 6:07
  Speaker 4: you're bankrupt, you are disqualified from parliament. So if he
• 6:11
  Speaker 4: was borrowing this money because it was the only way
• 6:14
  Speaker 4: he could fund reforms operations and he couldn't get the
• 6:16
  Speaker 4: money from anyone else. Also, here's a tip, don't borrow
• 6:19
  Speaker 4: from people called Posh George. I mean, Posh George is
• 6:23
  Speaker 4: a very very I'm pretty sure there's a character on
• 6:25
  Speaker 4: minder called Posh George.
• 6:26
  Speaker 7: I think that was his was his crypto I think
• 6:28
  Speaker 7: was a cryptocurrency.
• 6:29
  Speaker 8: This is a cryptocurrency person anyway.
• 6:31
  Speaker 4: But in all, seriously, yeah, so if there is, if
• 6:34
  Speaker 4: he's found guilty of a criminal offense that carries more
• 6:38
  Speaker 4: than an insubstantial amount of jail time, then he would
• 6:42
  Speaker 4: be disqualified from parliament. But again, even then.
• 6:44
  Speaker 2: At the moment they're talking about an inquiry, that's parliamentary,
• 6:48
  Speaker 2: right exactly.
• 6:50
  Speaker 8: He's maintained, he's maintained.
• 6:53
  Speaker 7: Every day that the last the Sinces saga first came
• 6:56
  Speaker 7: to light, that he did not breach parliamentary rules.
• 6:58
  Speaker 8: And he has said that. He's said that multiple times.
• 7:01
  Speaker 8: So I agree with you, Joe.
• 7:03
  Speaker 7: I think the best thing to step aside for a
• 7:04
  Speaker 7: couple of months.
• 7:05
  Speaker 4: No, no, no, I'm saying, don't do not step aside
• 7:07
  Speaker 4: at all. He's got a punch.
• 7:08
  Speaker 7: You don't think he should step aside. What investigation is going.
• 7:12
  Speaker 4: You go, you smash it, and you just go harder
• 7:14
  Speaker 4: and harder and harder look. And I guess like that
• 7:16
  Speaker 4: that's why I think a statement.
• 7:18
  Speaker 8: Anyone can stare down critics.
• 7:19
  Speaker 7: It's Nigel Farage because the Tories are having a field
• 7:22
  Speaker 7: day with this. Of course Kenby Badenoch is absolutely going
• 7:26
  Speaker 7: to town on this, as you would, because the Tories
• 7:28
  Speaker 7: would be thinking, great, this might be our chance to finally,
• 7:31
  Speaker 7: finally get ahead of reform labors in their.
• 7:34
  Speaker 8: Own world world of pain at the moment.
• 7:36
  Speaker 7: But I don't think we can underestimate the impact though
• 7:39
  Speaker 7: on the right side of politics in the.
• 7:42
  Speaker 4: If he vacates the field. And again I'm not a
• 7:45
  Speaker 4: fan of reform. I'm just telling them this. He loses
• 7:49
  Speaker 4: all the momentum while this is being investigated. Presumably the
• 7:52
  Speaker 4: people who are investigating him wouldn't be too unhappy about that,
• 7:55
  Speaker 4: and so they will drag their heels or go on
• 7:58
  Speaker 4: forever it looks look like he's guilty, whether he is
• 8:01
  Speaker 4: or not, because any time anyone steps down, it always
• 8:05
  Speaker 4: looks a bit to us, whether it's true or not.
• 8:07
  Speaker 4: And again, even putting out a statement saying I'm going
• 8:10
  Speaker 4: to be making a public statement about my future is
• 8:12
  Speaker 4: almost always code for I'm resigning and you're letting that
• 8:17
  Speaker 4: or stepping backs, being down whatever, and you're letting all
• 8:20
  Speaker 4: that speculation swirl, so that even if you do come
• 8:24
  Speaker 4: out and say I know I'm staying on, you look
• 8:27
  Speaker 4: a bit like a lane duck anyway. So again I
• 8:31
  Speaker 4: suspect that he's going to something. He might say something
• 8:33
  Speaker 4: like he's stepping around, but I think this would be
• 8:35
  Speaker 4: a mistake.
• 8:35
  Speaker 2: And of course what you're going to consider is that
• 8:37
  Speaker 2: the landscape has changed. I mean, yes, the honorable thing
• 8:40
  Speaker 2: to do has always been while I'm being investigated, I
• 8:42
  Speaker 2: step aside so I don't cause damage to the party, etc.
• 8:45
  Speaker 2: But two things to note, as you say, he is
• 8:48
  Speaker 2: the party basically, so if there's no Nigel Frage, there
• 8:51
  Speaker 2: is no reform, and people like that have the support
• 8:56
  Speaker 2: of their base in spite of any other thing that
• 9:00
  Speaker 2: may be an issue. It's worked for Donald Trump. I mean,
• 9:03
  Speaker 2: look at one nation. Everyone knows that one nation doesn't
• 9:07
  Speaker 2: have a fully funded, costed policy package, but they don't
• 9:10
  Speaker 2: care because they're upset. They're not happy with what is
• 9:14
  Speaker 2: being presented to them by the major parties. And so
• 9:17
  Speaker 2: really the only road forward I think is Forfarage to
• 9:20
  Speaker 2: push through it. But as I say, we will bring
• 9:22
  Speaker 2: that to you as soon as we have that statement.
• 9:24
  Speaker 2: It's expected to drop at eleven PM, So stick with us.
• 9:28
  Speaker 2: We're going all right through till eleven thirty tonight with
• 9:30
  Speaker 2: that statement and all the analysis afterwards. So let's talk
• 9:34
  Speaker 2: about some Australian news. In the meantime, a councilor down
• 9:38
  Speaker 2: in Tasmania Block by the name of Andrew mccullor, who
• 9:42
  Speaker 2: also happens to be the blog who brought Pringles to Australia.
• 9:45
  Speaker 2: Would you believe it? That's his claim to fame. But
• 9:48
  Speaker 2: in the meantime he also sits as a councilor for
• 9:50
  Speaker 2: the Northern Midlands Council. Now, look, it's a bit of
• 9:53
  Speaker 2: a long story. A number of years ago there was
• 9:56
  Speaker 2: a complaint brought against him by the Deputy mayors husband,
• 10:00
  Speaker 2: and then the Code of Conduct Panel found that he'd
• 10:03
  Speaker 2: committed a Code of Conduct breach and so he was
• 10:06
  Speaker 2: to be suspended from the council for a short period
• 10:08
  Speaker 2: of time. So he goes off to the Administrative Appeals Tribunal,
• 10:12
  Speaker 2: the Civil and Administrative Tribunal as it is at a
• 10:15
  Speaker 2: state level, to say, look, I don't think this is
• 10:17
  Speaker 2: legit and he lost that case. So he then went
• 10:20
  Speaker 2: off to the Supreme Court to appeal his suspension and
• 10:23
  Speaker 2: this has been held up in the courts for roughly
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: three years now, but the Supreme Court has thrown his
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: case out and said that he should serve this suspension
• 10:31
  Speaker 2: because his arguments were made with AI. Yes, what were
• 10:37
  Speaker 2: you thinking, councilor mccullor anyway. This is quote directly from
• 10:43
  Speaker 2: the Mercury down in Tasmania. They say that the Supreme
• 10:47
  Speaker 2: Court Associate Judge Michael Daley said a great deal of
• 10:50
  Speaker 2: time was wasted endeavoring to understand those documents, those AR
• 10:54
  Speaker 2: generated documents before convening a further directions hearing to put
• 10:58
  Speaker 2: to the applicant that they were I generated. Where those
• 11:01
  Speaker 2: documents make an intelligible submission. I have taken the submission
• 11:05
  Speaker 2: into count into account. Sorry, but because the applicants materials
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: had been generated by AI, if the content of those
• 11:12
  Speaker 2: documents was not reliably supported by corroborative documentation, I would
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: give it little or no weight. Now you know, if
• 11:22
  Speaker 2: you've been watching this show for a while, that I
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: think AI is sort of like the devil, and it's
• 11:26
  Speaker 2: coming to take all our jobs, and we should all
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: be worried about it, but some people clearly think it's
• 11:32
  Speaker 2: the answer. Counselor mccallor thought it was good enough for
• 11:35
  Speaker 2: him to use in court. I'm glad the court has said, actually,
• 11:40
  Speaker 2: we're not going to take into account this AI generated
• 11:43
  Speaker 2: stuff because it causes us problems. You know, you should
• 11:47
  Speaker 2: respect the court enough to bring content that you have generated,
• 11:52
  Speaker 2: that you have thought about and has been thought through
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: for us to consider. We're not going to sit here
• 11:57
  Speaker 2: and read unintelligible slop that has come from a robot
• 12:02
  Speaker 2: and then ask you to come and explain to us
• 12:05
  Speaker 2: what the unintelligible slop from the AI robot meant. I
• 12:09
  Speaker 2: think the courts made the right decision.
• 12:11
  Speaker 7: I don't think we can knock a bloke for giving
• 12:13
  Speaker 7: it a good old crack, you know, I mean, I
• 12:16
  Speaker 7: give it a yeah, but obviously doesn't have the ipart
• 12:20
  Speaker 7: he doesn't speak legal speak.
• 12:23
  Speaker 8: This is the reality, now, lawyer, yea, what is if
• 12:26
  Speaker 8: you can't afford a lail?
• 12:27
  Speaker 4: We don't know, We.
• 12:32
  Speaker 7: Don't know, we don't know the guy's private circumstances. Now,
• 12:34
  Speaker 7: what I will say is, I think you're very foolish
• 12:36
  Speaker 7: that if you are actually going to use artificial intelligence
• 12:39
  Speaker 7: for any sort of work, you need to be able
• 12:41
  Speaker 7: to review it yourself. So to quote Caleb, that you're
• 12:43
  Speaker 7: not taking into a courtroom for example, and it ends
• 12:45
  Speaker 7: up being a bunch of slop. But I'm not going
• 12:47
  Speaker 7: to sit here and and have a go at this
• 12:49
  Speaker 7: guy for using AI as a tool, because I think
• 12:52
  Speaker 7: that AI, in conjunction with good practice with your own research,
• 12:57
  Speaker 7: can be a wonderful tool to actually get by in
• 13:00
  Speaker 7: your day.
• 13:01
  Speaker 8: To day tasks.
• 13:02
  Speaker 7: Now again, I don't know exactly what the writing was,
• 13:06
  Speaker 7: but lawyers use AI to try for their investigating for
• 13:10
  Speaker 7: the investigtive skills and their organizational skills. That they don't
• 13:12
  Speaker 7: use it in the legal sense that they're not relying
• 13:14
  Speaker 7: on AI to make their legal decisions. But I think
• 13:17
  Speaker 7: it's a great tool in the armor. And whether we
• 13:19
  Speaker 7: like it or not, I know you think it's the devil.
• 13:21
  Speaker 7: Whether you like it or not, it is going to
• 13:22
  Speaker 7: be there and more and more people are going to
• 13:24
  Speaker 7: probably ask for advice for legal circumstances. I mean, I
• 13:28
  Speaker 7: know of people who just putting the most basic mundane
• 13:31
  Speaker 7: tasks into AI, into chat GPT for help.
• 13:35
  Speaker 8: So I'm not.
• 13:35
  Speaker 7: Surprised that he's gone, I've got to represent myself. I
• 13:39
  Speaker 7: need a bit of advice. Go straight to AI, as.
• 13:41
  Speaker 4: This I reckon it is big law, knowing that AI
• 13:45
  Speaker 4: is actually confeder No, it's true that one of the
• 13:48
  Speaker 4: biggest professions, one of the professions they think is most
• 13:50
  Speaker 4: at risk of being completely replaced by AI. AI is law.
• 13:55
  Speaker 4: And now a lot of that might be sort of
• 13:57
  Speaker 4: solicitors were conveyancing, you know, transactions, commercial law, stuff like that.
• 14:02
  Speaker 4: But it could very easily get into the court room.
• 14:05
  Speaker 4: And maybe this judge is just, you know, maybe the
• 14:08
  Speaker 4: Supreme Court is just protecting its own backyard and saying, no,
• 14:11
  Speaker 4: we cannot allow AI into the coorum, even.
• 14:13
  Speaker 2: Though we could end up with AI judges.
• 14:16
  Speaker 4: Well, the judging, the judge himself even actually said, where
• 14:20
  Speaker 4: those documents make an intelligible submission, I've taken the submission
• 14:23
  Speaker 4: into account, so it's not entirely sort of dismissing it.
• 14:26
  Speaker 4: But he says, but because they were submitted generated by AI,
• 14:30
  Speaker 4: if the content of those documents was not reliably supported
• 14:33
  Speaker 4: by corroborative documentation, I would give it little or no weight.
• 14:37
  Speaker 4: And presumably he is saying that, you know, in saying
• 14:42
  Speaker 4: that is different to an expert, a lawyer, or even
• 14:45
  Speaker 4: a you know, they say a man who represents himself
• 14:47
  Speaker 4: as a fool for a client, but even someone who
• 14:50
  Speaker 4: has actually gone and looked at the law themselves and
• 14:55
  Speaker 4: cited aspects of the law is basically saying I don't
• 14:57
  Speaker 4: trust it because it's a machine. I think that is
• 15:01
  Speaker 4: quite healthy. I think it's a vote one for humanity
• 15:03
  Speaker 4: and vote none for the machines. But again, it is
• 15:07
  Speaker 4: also pretty self interested because AI is coming for the seal.
• 15:11
  Speaker 8: That's what I think.
• 15:12
  Speaker 7: AI is coming for every single industry, and if anything, the.
• 15:15
  Speaker 4: Journal will be fine.
• 15:16
  Speaker 7: Well, you don't know, we could have three robots sitting
• 15:18
  Speaker 7: here in the near future.
• 15:19
  Speaker 8: The only criticism I would.
• 15:20
  Speaker 7: Say of this is I don't know why this Why
• 15:22
  Speaker 7: would you bother continuing this through the courts in the time,
• 15:26
  Speaker 7: the money that has been wasted dragging this sort of
• 15:28
  Speaker 7: an issue through I just think.
• 15:31
  Speaker 8: Maybe put it up and wipe your hands off.
• 15:32
  Speaker 4: You asked. If you asked Chat GPT, is this guy
• 15:35
  Speaker 4: a serial pest? I would probably say yeah.
• 15:39
  Speaker 7: Chat will probably say yes. Well, look, finally, some common sense.
• 15:43
  Speaker 7: In Victoria, a senior planner at a Victorian Council has
• 15:47
  Speaker 7: lost his bid to work at the office one day
• 15:51
  Speaker 7: a week.
• 15:51
  Speaker 8: Yes, just that.
• 15:52
  Speaker 7: The Measley one day with Stephen Polak is his name.
• 15:56
  Speaker 7: He is a building and planning officer with the Massive
• 16:00
  Speaker 7: Rangers Shire in central Victoria. According to this article on
• 16:03
  Speaker 7: the Daily Telegraph, he was already on a hybrid arrangement
• 16:07
  Speaker 7: working just two.
• 16:08
  Speaker 8: Days a week at the office. He pushed the.
• 16:10
  Speaker 7: Council for a one day a week arrangement for three
• 16:13
  Speaker 7: weeks a month, arguing he had experienced some work related
• 16:18
  Speaker 7: fatigue as a result of his age and work. Demard
• 16:21
  Speaker 7: as well, Jee Steve, and I've got to say we're
• 16:23
  Speaker 7: all a bit tired working. We're working full time, but
• 16:27
  Speaker 7: there you go.
• 16:28
  Speaker 8: And now.
• 16:28
  Speaker 7: He also said that he had a dependent who needed
• 16:31
  Speaker 7: to use his car to travel to university, and he
• 16:33
  Speaker 7: could communicate with colleagues effectively through Microsoft Teams. Now, I
• 16:37
  Speaker 7: don't know about you at home, but I certainly do
• 16:40
  Speaker 7: not like communicating through Microsoft Teams from a remote workplace
• 16:43
  Speaker 7: because you can't judge the meetings. You can't sit and
• 16:47
  Speaker 7: have a proper discussion or a debate about topics when
• 16:50
  Speaker 7: you've got somebody in dialing remotely It just reminds me
• 16:52
  Speaker 7: of the old zoom days during COVID, and personally, I
• 16:55
  Speaker 7: do not think that that is an effective working arrangement.
• 16:58
  Speaker 7: Now he's taken in the matter to the.
• 17:00
  Speaker 8: Fair Work Commission. The Fair Work Commission has actually ruled
• 17:03
  Speaker 8: in the Council's favor.
• 17:06
  Speaker 7: It's said that his seniority and experience meant that his
• 17:09
  Speaker 7: employer could demand that he spent more time on site
• 17:12
  Speaker 7: to pass his knowledge onto younger workers.
• 17:15
  Speaker 8: I actually thought that was a wonderful point.
• 17:16
  Speaker 7: Because given his seniority, maybe he could mentor the next generation.
• 17:23
  Speaker 4: Have a whole generation of council workers that only want
• 17:25
  Speaker 4: to work one day a way.
• 17:26
  Speaker 8: I was going to say, maybe not.
• 17:29
  Speaker 7: On his work ethic as such, but if he's clearly
• 17:32
  Speaker 7: got knowledge in the industry, then I think he need
• 17:35
  Speaker 7: a mentor like that on site. I think mentorship is
• 17:38
  Speaker 7: really important. Now, the Council did actually offer a compromise solution.
• 17:43
  Speaker 7: They said to him, well, you can choose which two
• 17:45
  Speaker 7: days a week you want to come into the office.
• 17:47
  Speaker 4: They may have they.
• 17:49
  Speaker 7: Laid it out to him on a silver platter, but
• 17:51
  Speaker 7: that wasn't enough, and he simply took the matter to court.
• 17:54
  Speaker 7: But look, Finally, thank goodness, the Fair Work Commission has
• 17:58
  Speaker 7: actually ruled in flavor in fail of the employer. And
• 18:01
  Speaker 7: I have said this many many times on this show.
• 18:03
  Speaker 7: It is a pain to do business right now in
• 18:06
  Speaker 7: this country. When you've got new age employees thinking well,
• 18:09
  Speaker 7: we can just go off and do some you know,
• 18:11
  Speaker 7: freelance style work. Couple that with hr IR issues rather
• 18:17
  Speaker 7: energy bills. In the end, I think if you have
• 18:20
  Speaker 7: a problem with the arrangement, the working arrangement that your
• 18:23
  Speaker 7: boss has put in place, I'm sorry you need to leave.
• 18:27
  Speaker 7: Go and find another job. Your job is not there
• 18:30
  Speaker 7: designed to work around you and your lifestyle. You need
• 18:34
  Speaker 7: to make some sacrifices if you want to be able
• 18:37
  Speaker 7: to earn money. And so I just think show on
• 18:40
  Speaker 7: the door. If you've got a problem, leave.
• 18:43
  Speaker 2: I think mister Polk is rather lucky he didn't become
• 18:45
  Speaker 2: mister pole Ax after this.
• 18:47
  Speaker 4: To be quite frank, I support you making that joke,
• 18:51
  Speaker 4: because that's the exact joke that I.
• 18:52
  Speaker 2: Was, good, good, good. You know, seriously, people are having
• 18:56
  Speaker 2: a lin that day, like so so COVID came along,
• 19:00
  Speaker 2: and you know, because the sneeze police said we all
• 19:03
  Speaker 2: had to go and work from home. It was only
• 19:05
  Speaker 2: going to be for two weeks.
• 19:06
  Speaker 4: Let everyone managed to work in the office before.
• 19:10
  Speaker 2: So we're all forced to work from home for a
• 19:12
  Speaker 2: period of time because otherwise we're all going to die
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: or something. So we went and did that, and then
• 19:18
  Speaker 2: everyone decided that it was now their right to keep
• 19:21
  Speaker 2: doing that. And as far as I'm concerned, it's a
• 19:23
  Speaker 2: matter between you and your employer. You can talk to
• 19:27
  Speaker 2: the boss about what arrangements work for you both. You
• 19:31
  Speaker 2: don't then get to run off to the Fair Work Commission.
• 19:33
  Speaker 8: Say, but my boss already wants me to bring off two.
• 19:39
  Speaker 2: A comment for one. I mean short. Presumably before COVID,
• 19:43
  Speaker 2: you were going in five days a week. Most people
• 19:45
  Speaker 2: were going to the office five days a week. If
• 19:48
  Speaker 2: you were lucky, you might have had an arrangement to
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: work from home one day a week because you know,
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: you did it from some other location or something. Right,
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: Most people were going to the office sick years ago,
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: and then all of a sudden it changed because of COVID.
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: We decided, well, that's now the standard unless it is
• 20:05
  Speaker 2: written into your contract. You know you've got an agreement
• 20:09
  Speaker 2: with your employer when you've taken up the job that
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: I work from home or the office or whatever it
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: is X number of days a week. I don't see
• 20:17
  Speaker 2: how you have any claim to say that you have
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: the right to work from home at all unless it's
• 20:24
  Speaker 2: written in an agreement somewhere. You just got to follow
• 20:27
  Speaker 2: the rules that are set.
• 20:28
  Speaker 1: Down for you.
• 20:28
  Speaker 4: It's got Any job is an agreement between you and
• 20:31
  Speaker 4: your boss as to what you can provide and what
• 20:34
  Speaker 4: they need. And you find that sweet spot. And as
• 20:37
  Speaker 4: long as you know, as long as the boss is
• 20:40
  Speaker 4: paying you your wages. I mean, obviously you have to
• 20:43
  Speaker 4: be paid fairly for the work that you do. Obviously
• 20:46
  Speaker 4: the conditions can't be too onerous, and there are all
• 20:48
  Speaker 4: these rules are really really important, but ultimately it's a
• 20:51
  Speaker 4: relationship between an employer and an employee about what the
• 20:56
  Speaker 4: employer needs and how that matches the employee's ability to
• 21:00
  Speaker 4: provide it. And frankly, this guy seems to be doing
• 21:04
  Speaker 4: everything he can do in his power to demonstrate how
• 21:07
  Speaker 4: redundant he is. I said, oh, it's really important. All
• 21:12
  Speaker 4: the kids look up to you.
• 21:13
  Speaker 2: And he's saying he needs an extra day from home
• 21:16
  Speaker 2: because he has work related fatigue. I'm sorry, buddy, we
• 21:20
  Speaker 2: all have do you reckon? If I called up my
• 21:23
  Speaker 2: boss and said, look, I'd like to do a one
• 21:26
  Speaker 2: day week of the Late Debate from my living room,
• 21:30
  Speaker 2: I'd love to say that, because I just I can't.
• 21:33
  Speaker 2: I don't want to go from the home to the studio.
• 21:36
  Speaker 2: You know, just too much work related fatigue. Say mate,
• 21:40
  Speaker 2: if you don't want the job, go and get it.
• 21:42
  Speaker 4: Know what, I there's a whole board under this building
• 21:44
  Speaker 4: just for people who have actually suggested that.
• 21:46
  Speaker 7: But I mean, what do you love to see though,
• 21:48
  Speaker 7: Caleb at home drinking his wine with his nice little
• 21:50
  Speaker 7: antique bookshelf behind it. I think that would be just
• 21:52
  Speaker 7: an absolute great The point is but the point, and
• 21:55
  Speaker 7: that's exactly what I was saying before. If you do
• 21:57
  Speaker 7: not like the rules in place by your employer, the
• 22:01
  Speaker 7: door is open, go and find another job that suits
• 22:04
  Speaker 7: your lifestyle, that suits your needs. You cannot expect your
• 22:07
  Speaker 7: boss to just bend the rules so you can work
• 22:10
  Speaker 7: one day a week from from the office and the
• 22:12
  Speaker 7: rest of the time you can sit on your couch
• 22:13
  Speaker 7: and your perdramas and log onto Microsoft Tea pretending that
• 22:16
  Speaker 7: you're actually doing your job.
• 22:17
  Speaker 4: The problem is being your counsel bureaucrat is already about
• 22:20
  Speaker 4: I know, I know. It's like a job as you
• 22:22
  Speaker 4: could possibly get. It's a god, I'm never going to
• 22:24
  Speaker 4: get my garbage bins collected every again, am I No?
• 22:26
  Speaker 4: But so like, where does he go from here? There's
• 22:29
  Speaker 4: something you know?
• 22:30
  Speaker 7: Yeah, no, well maybe maybe maybe go to go to
• 22:35
  Speaker 7: uber eats. Now, look, speaking of where to from here,
• 22:37
  Speaker 7: you may have heard of the upcoming movie called Odyssey. Now,
• 22:41
  Speaker 7: this was based on a very ancient grief, a Greek
• 22:45
  Speaker 7: mythological drama. I suppose it was written by a poet, Homer.
• 22:52
  Speaker 8: Homer, there's the.
• 22:53
  Speaker 7: Father of Western literature, as he as he is known. Now,
• 22:57
  Speaker 7: Odyssey is being absolutely canned because, like many Hollywood movies,
• 23:02
  Speaker 7: it's gone down the woke path. You've got the main character,
• 23:05
  Speaker 7: Helen of Troy, who is being cast as a black woman.
• 23:09
  Speaker 7: So she's Lapeter Niongo. I think that's how you say
• 23:13
  Speaker 7: her name. That that is the actress for this. She's
• 23:17
  Speaker 7: a black woman, and the whole movie is from more
• 23:20
  Speaker 7: of a feminist perspective. So already you can see that
• 23:23
  Speaker 7: it's going down down the way of the bye bye. Now,
• 23:27
  Speaker 7: the team, the actors, the cast members are currently doing
• 23:30
  Speaker 7: a press tour, and let me tell you, this press
• 23:33
  Speaker 7: tour is going about as great as.
• 23:36
  Speaker 8: The actual movie itself.
• 23:37
  Speaker 5: Here was.
• 23:40
  Speaker 7: Lupetera Nyongo when she was asked about the movie.
• 23:45
  Speaker 9: When you read the Iliad and the Ardyssey, very little
• 23:49
  Speaker 9: time is spent in the perspective of the women, right,
• 23:53
  Speaker 9: it's all from a very masculine side of things. But
• 23:56
  Speaker 9: this film takes a lot of it takes time to
• 24:00
  Speaker 9: consider thing from the female perspective. And so we see
• 24:04
  Speaker 9: in Helen and Clastemnestra how this war has affected them
• 24:07
  Speaker 9: both and they respond to it very differently because the
• 24:11
  Speaker 9: experience of it is very different. And so for me
• 24:14
  Speaker 9: that was very enriching to take the time to kind
• 24:18
  Speaker 9: of like humanize them and consider what this time could
• 24:23
  Speaker 9: have looked like for them.
• 24:25
  Speaker 7: Sorry, we're talking about Greek mythology for goodness sake. She
• 24:28
  Speaker 7: was even asked in that interview, what would she ask
• 24:31
  Speaker 7: Homer if she had an opportunity. That was her answer,
• 24:34
  Speaker 7: and that was her answer. But then she also went
• 24:36
  Speaker 7: on to say that she is Greek now herself. That
• 24:40
  Speaker 7: was her assessment, that she feels like she is greaked
• 24:42
  Speaker 7: out now school. So you know how bad this has been. Okay,
• 24:45
  Speaker 7: this is how diabolical this has been. The final trailer
• 24:48
  Speaker 7: had more than five hundred thousand dislikes on YouTube, ninety
• 24:54
  Speaker 7: percent negative to positive rating.
• 24:57
  Speaker 8: That is absolutely horrendous.
• 24:59
  Speaker 7: It's so bad that comments have been turned off all
• 25:02
  Speaker 7: of its marketing. So if you go on to for example,
• 25:04
  Speaker 7: it's Twitter page where trailers are there, you can no
• 25:07
  Speaker 7: longer put a comment. They have censored comments on that. Look,
• 25:12
  Speaker 7: we've seen this with snow White. We've just seen this
• 25:15
  Speaker 7: with Superwoman. If Hollywood doesn't start learning the lessons that
• 25:19
  Speaker 7: they're going to lose billions and billions of dollars, stop
• 25:22
  Speaker 7: doing these woke remakes, stop hiring the Dei because when
• 25:26
  Speaker 7: you go down the.
• 25:27
  Speaker 8: Dei pathway, you lose money. But Hollywood is so desperate
• 25:31
  Speaker 8: to tick all these boxes.
• 25:33
  Speaker 7: And you know, the Academy, they actually have a certain
• 25:36
  Speaker 7: criteria now to be able to win Academy Awards, you
• 25:39
  Speaker 7: have to tick the diversity boxes. Whatever happened to go
• 25:41
  Speaker 7: into the cinema and just watching a good movie.
• 25:44
  Speaker 4: Yeah, look, I think a snow White was just a
• 25:47
  Speaker 4: terrible movie. And Supergirl, which I had such high hopes
• 25:49
  Speaker 4: for and thought would be awesome, was awful.
• 25:52
  Speaker 1: It was awful. It was just terrible.
• 25:54
  Speaker 4: I don't think it was terrible because it was woke,
• 25:55
  Speaker 4: though it was terrible because the plot and the character development,
• 26:00
  Speaker 4: the interaction between the two main characters was just not there.
• 26:03
  Speaker 4: And I've got to say, I'm the first person to
• 26:05
  Speaker 4: say it is just stupid to you know, I think
• 26:08
  Speaker 4: that every movie is a ticker box exercise. But if
• 26:10
  Speaker 4: you actually do it right and you have a great movie,
• 26:13
  Speaker 4: then nobody even notices. No one even notices the diversity
• 26:17
  Speaker 4: of say, for example, the Spider Man movies where they
• 26:19
  Speaker 4: change the color of a whole bunch of people, including
• 26:23
  Speaker 4: his love interest, including the kid who was bullying him
• 26:26
  Speaker 4: at school, which was a nice twist. So they had
• 26:28
  Speaker 4: the bully be a South Asian person now, because they
• 26:31
  Speaker 4: have to have diversity inclusion among villains as well as heroes.
• 26:35
  Speaker 4: And no one's banging on about how Spider Man's woke
• 26:38
  Speaker 4: because they made it well. And I've got to say,
• 26:41
  Speaker 4: if you go and look at the actual audience feedback
• 26:45
  Speaker 4: from the actual film that has just started to come
• 26:47
  Speaker 4: through from the Odyssey, because I couldn't handle another disappointment
• 26:50
  Speaker 4: this year, it's amazing. They are calling it a masterpiece.
• 26:54
  Speaker 4: They are saying it is quote unquote perfect. It's very
• 26:58
  Speaker 4: meant when you said, I don't do it hurt the movie.
• 27:00
  Speaker 2: You see the audience feedback, Do you mean the critical
• 27:02
  Speaker 2: reception from.
• 27:03
  Speaker 4: The people who have had the critics as well as the.
• 27:05
  Speaker 2: Because quite often the critics have a very different view.
• 27:08
  Speaker 4: That can often happen. But what I think is happening
• 27:10
  Speaker 4: here is that you've just got people who are thinking
• 27:13
  Speaker 4: it's reving people up and just going to bombars.
• 27:15
  Speaker 8: And why would you turn off your comments?
• 27:17
  Speaker 7: Why would you turn off the comments on the marketing
• 27:19
  Speaker 7: section there if you were so if you did.
• 27:22
  Speaker 4: Bartered by an online trollgy.
• 27:24
  Speaker 7: The other thing is is that I disagree with what
• 27:26
  Speaker 7: you said, Joe about that you don't think people notice D.
• 27:29
  Speaker 8: I think people do notice D. I've just been watching.
• 27:32
  Speaker 7: A series called l and that it was based off
• 27:36
  Speaker 7: the Legally Blonde as a prequel to Legally Blonde. And
• 27:38
  Speaker 7: you've got a lot of black characters, now you've got
• 27:41
  Speaker 7: Hispanic characters. You've got a man with two gay dads.
• 27:45
  Speaker 7: I just and to me, that was just it's a
• 27:47
  Speaker 7: deliberate placement of the left.
• 27:50
  Speaker 4: And that was one of the first show, It doesn't matter.
• 27:52
  Speaker 4: The point is when people think, I just do this
• 27:55
  Speaker 4: and then everyone will have to love it.
• 27:56
  Speaker 2: Because take your point, it's easier to get away with
• 28:02
  Speaker 2: it if it's a good show. But why this need
• 28:06
  Speaker 2: to foister it upon us? I mean, let's be honest.
• 28:09
  Speaker 2: In Greek mythology, Helen of Troy was never a black woman,
• 28:13
  Speaker 2: So why do you need to then say, oh, well,
• 28:16
  Speaker 2: you know, I'm making a point here by taking a
• 28:19
  Speaker 2: well recognized mythological character and turning it into a black woman.
• 28:24
  Speaker 2: Like I agree, it's easy to get away with it
• 28:27
  Speaker 2: if the program is good, But why do they try
• 28:29
  Speaker 2: so hard to push that a gin?
• 28:31
  Speaker 7: Well?
• 28:31
  Speaker 4: I think people interpret it in different ways all the time.
• 28:34
  Speaker 4: I mean, if you were going to have an absolutely
• 28:38
  Speaker 4: historically accurate version of Greek mythology, it would be a
• 28:42
  Speaker 4: hell of a lot different to what a lot of
• 28:44
  Speaker 4: people think it would be. For one thing, there'd be
• 28:46
  Speaker 4: a lot of male to male sex, including sex between
• 28:49
  Speaker 4: adult men and underaged males boys. That's called pedagogy a
• 28:56
  Speaker 4: pederasty sorry, because it involved a teacher taking a young
• 29:00
  Speaker 4: boy and teaching him things. And so again, movies change
• 29:07
  Speaker 4: all the time. Sometimes I think what people think the
• 29:10
  Speaker 4: ancient world was actually like is not what it was
• 29:14
  Speaker 4: actually like. And again, as long as you do it well,
• 29:16
  Speaker 4: I don't care if someone thinks I'll just make Helen
• 29:19
  Speaker 4: black and everyone I'll just go, oh, how inspiring. I
• 29:21
  Speaker 4: don't worry. That is laziness, That is crap. But if
• 29:24
  Speaker 4: you do it, if you do it in such a
• 29:25
  Speaker 4: way that you're still making a really, really good movie,
• 29:29
  Speaker 4: then what is the problem.
• 29:31
  Speaker 8: But why do you need to do that?
• 29:32
  Speaker 7: Why do you need to insert DEI I just I don't.
• 29:36
  Speaker 7: There's no need to it. Great mythological myriology, mythology movie.
• 29:44
  Speaker 7: Just cast the characters as they were portrayed by Homer,
• 29:48
  Speaker 7: as they were portrayed in the first place, by his
• 29:50
  Speaker 7: wonderful poetry, by his literature.
• 29:53
  Speaker 8: Change that is quote just because you think old.
• 29:56
  Speaker 4: Oh no, many ways the left might get upset. Well,
• 29:58
  Speaker 4: in many ways, we don't know. We don't know. You
• 30:00
  Speaker 4: know what Helen looked like. There were no pictures of her,
• 30:03
  Speaker 4: so she wasn't blonde either, But that's how she was
• 30:05
  Speaker 4: portrayed in Troy. And no one was jumping up and
• 30:07
  Speaker 4: down about that, and in fact it wasn't.
• 30:09
  Speaker 7: But it's like when they put a Snape.
• 30:13
  Speaker 8: Rather Professor Snape and the Harry Potter as black again.
• 30:15
  Speaker 4: It's just why they were like that, and if it
• 30:18
  Speaker 4: makes it a crap show or a crap movie, then blasted.
• 30:21
  Speaker 4: And there are plenty of ones that have done that.
• 30:24
  Speaker 4: But I don't like from all accounts from people who
• 30:27
  Speaker 4: have actually seen the movie, not just hit dislike on
• 30:30
  Speaker 4: the trailer, this movie is absolutely fantastic. And so what
• 30:34
  Speaker 4: is the point of all the hate, What is the
• 30:37
  Speaker 4: point of all the criticism.
• 30:38
  Speaker 2: Well, let's go from a battle over what should be
• 30:40
  Speaker 2: in a movie to a court room battle going on
• 30:42
  Speaker 2: here in Australia now to a strange one. So what
• 30:48
  Speaker 2: has allegedly happened is that this involves three sportsmen, athletes
• 30:54
  Speaker 2: former or current, some of whom are involved in the
• 30:57
  Speaker 2: media in some way. And girlfriend of one of these men,
• 31:02
  Speaker 2: while clearing out her house, found his old phone and
• 31:06
  Speaker 2: so she has gone through the phone, it has been
• 31:09
  Speaker 2: said in court because she knew the code his phone
• 31:12
  Speaker 2: and found an old group chat that he had with
• 31:16
  Speaker 2: these other athletes. Now apparently included in the messages in
• 31:20
  Speaker 2: these group chats were jokes insults of other people who
• 31:25
  Speaker 2: were known to these men who were involved in their sport,
• 31:28
  Speaker 2: and also crude descriptions of sexual acts and domestic violence. Now,
• 31:34
  Speaker 2: these text messages have then been leaked by the ex
• 31:37
  Speaker 2: girlfriend to a journalist at the ABC, who has then
• 31:40
  Speaker 2: contacted these men and said, well, I intend to publish
• 31:44
  Speaker 2: a story that contains these messages that you had in
• 31:47
  Speaker 2: your private group chat. So they have gone off to
• 31:50
  Speaker 2: court and successfully sought an injunction to prevent the publishing
• 31:56
  Speaker 2: of these messages. Now, to quote from Fox Sports News,
• 32:00
  Speaker 2: they reported today that two of the men are married
• 32:02
  Speaker 2: with children, with one of those men holding many high
• 32:05
  Speaker 2: profile ambassador roles, commercial sponsorship arrangements, and media roles. He
• 32:10
  Speaker 2: told the court his messages will be devastating to the
• 32:12
  Speaker 2: important work he performs as an advocate within and outside
• 32:16
  Speaker 2: his sport, and all three men said the messages were
• 32:19
  Speaker 2: quote likely to lead to serious harm to their reputations
• 32:22
  Speaker 2: and standing, as well as their financial interests. The men
• 32:26
  Speaker 2: also conceded, according to Fox Sports, that they could be
• 32:29
  Speaker 2: in breach of their club contracts and could face punishment
• 32:33
  Speaker 2: from their sports governing body for bringing the game into disrepute. Now,
• 32:38
  Speaker 2: the reason that this injunction was granted by the Court
• 32:40
  Speaker 2: by Justice Anthony McGrath is that he says the court
• 32:44
  Speaker 2: needs to ascertain whether the way these text messages were
• 32:48
  Speaker 2: accessed was quote improper or reprehensible, that being the ex
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: girlfriend accessing the man's phone without his knowledge. The ABC,
• 32:57
  Speaker 2: for its part, says the ABC stands by the conduct
• 32:59
  Speaker 2: of its journalist acting in the public interest. The ABC
• 33:03
  Speaker 2: is also concerned about the broader ramifications this decision may
• 33:06
  Speaker 2: have on investigative journalism and the public's right to know. Now, look,
• 33:11
  Speaker 2: you know, I'm all for the public's right to know,
• 33:14
  Speaker 2: but to be frank, I think the court's made the
• 33:16
  Speaker 2: right decision here because I mean, what a dirty sort
• 33:20
  Speaker 2: of act is it to go through someone else's phone.
• 33:24
  Speaker 2: You've broken up with them, You then go through their phone,
• 33:27
  Speaker 2: you find messages that you know, really you shouldn't have
• 33:30
  Speaker 2: access to. And the first thing you then think you
• 33:33
  Speaker 2: will do is go and according to the court what
• 33:37
  Speaker 2: has been heard in court, go and give it to
• 33:40
  Speaker 2: a journalist at the ABC to try and inflict reputational
• 33:44
  Speaker 2: damage upon your ex boyfriend and his mates. Now they
• 33:48
  Speaker 2: may well have we don't know, because we haven't seen
• 33:51
  Speaker 2: these text messages. They may well have made jokes about
• 33:54
  Speaker 2: domestic violence or whatever in these messages, But it was
• 33:58
  Speaker 2: a private group chat and that has then been leaked,
• 34:02
  Speaker 2: and so do we use the public then have the
• 34:05
  Speaker 2: right to exit someone's private messages because a jaded ex
• 34:09
  Speaker 2: girlfriend has decided to link them to the abass No.
• 34:12
  Speaker 7: It sounds to me like she's on some sort of
• 34:14
  Speaker 7: revenge tour. To be honest, So the age is reporting
• 34:17
  Speaker 7: it says that they had an acrimonious end to their relationship.
• 34:22
  Speaker 8: The woman then saw the photo a photo of.
• 34:25
  Speaker 7: These messages in her camera role and felt a quote
• 34:29
  Speaker 7: strong moral obligation to then speak up. She said that
• 34:33
  Speaker 7: she knew that the messages existed in the past and
• 34:36
  Speaker 7: did nothing then, but post breakup, obviously she did. It
• 34:40
  Speaker 7: just sounds like a jilted ex girlfriend who's upset and
• 34:45
  Speaker 7: is looking for ways to try and bring her boyfriend
• 34:48
  Speaker 7: and his mates down. Now, if she had a problem
• 34:51
  Speaker 7: with those said text messages whenever they first appeared in
• 34:55
  Speaker 7: her camera role, whenever that year was, why didn't she
• 34:57
  Speaker 7: do something about it? Then That's why to me sounds
• 35:00
  Speaker 7: like this is just petty and revengeful the way that
• 35:05
  Speaker 7: she has done it. In the end, these were private conversations.
• 35:08
  Speaker 7: If these people weren't in the public eye, nobody would
• 35:11
  Speaker 7: be batting an eyelid over it.
• 35:13
  Speaker 8: Nobody would care. I quite frankly, don't care what was.
• 35:16
  Speaker 7: Involved in their private chats, because well, that's none of
• 35:18
  Speaker 7: my business. As long as they haven't done anything publicly
• 35:21
  Speaker 7: to bring the game into disrepute, what they do in
• 35:23
  Speaker 7: their private life has nothing to do with me.
• 35:25
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I think, I struggle, and you only have to
• 35:28
  Speaker 4: sort of think one step further to realize how kind
• 35:32
  Speaker 4: of creepy this is. I'm again, of course, all for
• 35:36
  Speaker 4: the public's right to know, but you only have the
• 35:39
  Speaker 4: right to know about something that is a matter of
• 35:42
  Speaker 4: public interest, and that means more than just the public
• 35:45
  Speaker 4: being interested in it, but it means that it's something significant,
• 35:49
  Speaker 4: and not just because I feel like knowing it. I'm
• 35:50
  Speaker 4: a member of the public, therefore I want to know it.
• 35:52
  Speaker 4: But what is really interesting here is that were it not,
• 35:56
  Speaker 4: it seems, were it not for the fact that these
• 35:58
  Speaker 4: messages had already been slipped to the ABC reporter, nobody
• 36:03
  Speaker 4: would know that they existed. No one would know that
• 36:07
  Speaker 4: there was anything happening, you know, untoward in this private
• 36:11
  Speaker 4: group chat and so if you were to say that, well,
• 36:14
  Speaker 4: now I do know that this private group chat that
• 36:17
  Speaker 4: was not in the public domain does not appear to
• 36:19
  Speaker 4: have had any impact that we know of on the
• 36:22
  Speaker 4: men's public behavior or behavior to people in their lives.
• 36:26
  Speaker 4: If it was, that's a difference. If someone's charged with
• 36:28
  Speaker 4: domestic violence, you go and you get all the stuff
• 36:30
  Speaker 4: in their phone to see if you can prove it.
• 36:32
  Speaker 4: But if they're not doing any of this, if it
• 36:34
  Speaker 4: is just jokes, then what you're effectively saying is I
• 36:38
  Speaker 4: should be able to see the private messages on every
• 36:42
  Speaker 4: single person's phone to decide whether or not that they
• 36:46
  Speaker 4: are acceptable or whether they meet my standards. Because this
• 36:51
  Speaker 4: group of private messages that I would never have seen,
• 36:54
  Speaker 4: and which would never have would never have known the
• 36:56
  Speaker 4: existence of, there would be no pointers to the existence
• 36:58
  Speaker 4: of just because I happen to have seen them. Correct,
• 37:01
  Speaker 4: I now think that they are in the public interest
• 37:03
  Speaker 4: because because crazy.
• 37:05
  Speaker 2: Because effectively the standard you said if you allow this
• 37:07
  Speaker 2: stuff to happen is to say that you know the
• 37:10
  Speaker 2: three of us, because we're on the telly, we are
• 37:12
  Speaker 2: public figures, and therefore what we say and do is
• 37:15
  Speaker 2: of public interest. And I accept to some degree that
• 37:18
  Speaker 2: is true, and that every now and again some idiot
• 37:21
  Speaker 2: at the Daily Mail writes up some you know, stupid
• 37:24
  Speaker 2: gossp piece about me or whatever. But but does that
• 37:27
  Speaker 2: then mean that every text message I've ever sent're doing,
• 37:32
  Speaker 2: every conversation I've had over lunch with my mates, is
• 37:36
  Speaker 2: in the public interest. Because if that's the standard we're
• 37:39
  Speaker 2: going to set, we're all stuffed. Who has not made
• 37:43
  Speaker 2: a blue joke, who has not said something yeah, I
• 37:48
  Speaker 2: know you as pure as the driven stuff.
• 37:52
  Speaker 4: Who judges the jokes as well like people have where
• 37:56
  Speaker 4: you know, we go back and forth, and the joke
• 37:58
  Speaker 4: is that the jokes are completely inappropriate. And that is
• 38:01
  Speaker 4: the whole point of the joke. If you had a
• 38:03
  Speaker 4: humorous knark from you know, anywhere, the abs or whoever
• 38:07
  Speaker 4: who was reading through it all and taking it literally,
• 38:09
  Speaker 4: they'd be thinking, oh my god, you know this is terrible,
• 38:12
  Speaker 4: not realizing that in fact, and you know, Ricky Gervais
• 38:15
  Speaker 4: has to explain this to his audience incredibly. I don't
• 38:18
  Speaker 4: know why what we've become, but that the whole point
• 38:21
  Speaker 4: is the irony. The whole point is that it's the
• 38:23
  Speaker 4: opposite of what you find fight But anyway. But having
• 38:26
  Speaker 4: self incriminated myself on that note already lately, idea that
• 38:32
  Speaker 4: I should be able to see everything. I mean, it
• 38:34
  Speaker 4: was it's a bit like the former Human Rights commissioner saying, oh,
• 38:37
  Speaker 4: you know, unfortunately, we can't control what people do and
• 38:40
  Speaker 4: don't say I did dinner chat the kitchen table intrigued.
• 38:44
  Speaker 4: And again it is the same, the same principle I
• 38:47
  Speaker 4: should be able to And it was again that when
• 38:49
  Speaker 4: there were when people were exposing private emails between you know, academics.
• 38:54
  Speaker 4: In one case that came out and there was a
• 38:56
  Speaker 4: private email exchange that contained a racial reference. Yes, and
• 39:00
  Speaker 4: this was blown open by an an old friend of mine,
• 39:03
  Speaker 4: actually a journo, who said, I know, this absolutely has
• 39:07
  Speaker 4: to be on the public domain. And it's like, if
• 39:09
  Speaker 4: there is nothing pointing to it, if this guy was
• 39:12
  Speaker 4: going around, for example, marking down all the Asians in
• 39:15
  Speaker 4: his class and marking up all the white people, you know,
• 39:18
  Speaker 4: you could then say, all right, we're going to have
• 39:19
  Speaker 4: an investigation and see if this guy has a problem
• 39:22
  Speaker 4: with Asian people. But if it is not having any
• 39:24
  Speaker 4: impact on anyone's performance or public life, if there's no
• 39:29
  Speaker 4: clues to any misbehavior, no signs of any criminality. You
• 39:33
  Speaker 4: should be able to say, I know, I should be
• 39:35
  Speaker 4: able to just go through all your private chats, all
• 39:37
  Speaker 4: your private conversations, you know, put my ear to your
• 39:40
  Speaker 4: bedroom door and make sure that I approve of everything's
• 39:43
  Speaker 4: going on. I mean, well, what kind of mentality is that?
• 39:46
  Speaker 8: Great?
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: And we're going to go to the break. Now, after
• 39:49
  Speaker 2: the break, we'll come back and take a little bit too.
• 39:51
  Speaker 2: Tomorrow's front pages the Labor Party is going all in
• 39:54
  Speaker 2: on welcomes to country. We'll see that it goes for them.
• 39:56
  Speaker 10: Don't go well.
• 40:05
  Speaker 2: Now, if you're just tuning in, we are waiting for
• 40:08
  Speaker 2: in roughly fifteen minutes time, a statement from Nigel Farage,
• 40:13
  Speaker 2: the leader of Reform UK, on his future in public
• 40:17
  Speaker 2: life on the back of investigations that have been launched
• 40:20
  Speaker 2: into donations he has received from billionaires. It will be
• 40:24
  Speaker 2: going live on X at two pm British time British
• 40:28
  Speaker 2: summer time, which is eleven pm Australian Eastern Standard time.
• 40:34
  Speaker 2: So stick around with us. We will take that when
• 40:36
  Speaker 2: it goes up and we will be discussing that afterwards,
• 40:40
  Speaker 2: crossing over to the UK. In the meantime, let's find
• 40:43
  Speaker 2: out what's going on in Australia tomorrow, Joe on the
• 40:46
  Speaker 2: front Page's pretty much one story, only.
• 40:50
  Speaker 4: One story, Kaylin, Yes, that's absolutely right. The Chinese could
• 40:53
  Speaker 4: currently wipe out Sydney and Brisbane with an intercontinental ballistic missile.
• 40:57
  Speaker 4: Donald Trump is in NATO to decide whether or not
• 41:00
  Speaker 4: America is going to stop World War III. The King
• 41:03
  Speaker 4: and his youngest son fighting with each other again. Marine
• 41:06
  Speaker 4: La Penn is guilty of misusing public funds, so Nigel
• 41:09
  Speaker 4: Farage may or may not be just about to stand
• 41:12
  Speaker 4: down as leader of the Reform Party. But the only
• 41:15
  Speaker 4: story in town, Caleb, The only yarn in town is
• 41:19
  Speaker 4: the mighty State of Origin between New South Wales and Queensland.
• 41:22
  Speaker 4: Tomorrow night, and the telegraph has opened up the bidding fire.
• 41:26
  Speaker 4: The very first salvo mission is Cleary, and this is
• 41:31
  Speaker 4: of course Game one Origin Star Nathan Cleary has the
• 41:35
  Speaker 4: world on his shoulders, the world, of course being the
• 41:38
  Speaker 4: Great State of New South Wales because nowhere else matters,
• 41:41
  Speaker 4: and he is going into bat for the Blues. And
• 41:46
  Speaker 4: on the Courier Mail front page, we've got Kings of
• 41:49
  Speaker 4: the Cauldron because they think that somehow sun Corpse Stadium
• 41:52
  Speaker 4: might be too much for the Blues to handle. They say,
• 41:56
  Speaker 4: how the sun Corp furnace for just mighty maroons in
• 42:00
  Speaker 4: to an unstoppable force. Yeah, you're only as good as
• 42:02
  Speaker 4: your home ground. I could take them on myself.
• 42:05
  Speaker 8: You could take a well, you forgot one story.
• 42:07
  Speaker 4: Feeling about this line. I'm even wearing the blue, just
• 42:09
  Speaker 4: show my commitment.
• 42:11
  Speaker 8: You forgot one story. Prince Harry's in London. You forgot
• 42:15
  Speaker 8: that one as well. About the kids without the kids.
• 42:18
  Speaker 4: Yeah, Harry is in London without the kids. That's right,
• 42:20
  Speaker 4: the King and his the youngest son. I said that,
• 42:21
  Speaker 4: did you?
• 42:22
  Speaker 3: Sorry?
• 42:22
  Speaker 8: I missed that.
• 42:24
  Speaker 7: Sorry, I I was thinking about Nigel Farage Oka. The
• 42:29
  Speaker 7: mine was focus about what he might do The Australian
• 42:33
  Speaker 7: Let's take a look at the os now right Fright
• 42:36
  Speaker 7: sees Labor go for woke exclusive. The Rise of One
• 42:40
  Speaker 7: Nation has prompted Labor to amend its draft national platform
• 42:44
  Speaker 7: to commit Anthony Albanesi to developing an anti racism strategy,
• 42:49
  Speaker 7: with the party to use its fiftieth National Conference to
• 42:52
  Speaker 7: formalize its support for Welcome to Country ceremonies while standing
• 42:56
  Speaker 7: by the principles of the Ulary Statement from the Heart
• 42:59
  Speaker 7: There will also be a push at this month's national
• 43:02
  Speaker 7: conference in Adelaide to amend the platform to delete references
• 43:05
  Speaker 7: to labours supporting the Reserve Bank's approach to containing inflation,
• 43:10
  Speaker 7: amid warnings that interest rate rises were sending mortgage holders
• 43:14
  Speaker 7: into the arms of Pauline Hansen. You know, is labor
• 43:18
  Speaker 7: reading the room or is labor not reading the room?
• 43:21
  Speaker 8: It would definitely be the latter. The latter.
• 43:26
  Speaker 7: Does labor understand why Pauline Hansen is so popular right now?
• 43:33
  Speaker 7: Do you seriously think that welcome to Countries are the
• 43:38
  Speaker 7: issue on the agenda right now? Well done, Anthony Abeazy.
• 43:43
  Speaker 7: You're really outdoing yourself. You're really not listening to the
• 43:47
  Speaker 7: mood of the nation right now.
• 43:48
  Speaker 8: But go ahead. This is great for Pauline hands.
• 43:51
  Speaker 4: This isn't even album. This is just the idiotic left,
• 43:54
  Speaker 4: which you know, it's just so stupid. It's just so stupid.
• 43:59
  Speaker 4: They're like lemming, here's the cliff, guys, which way did
• 44:02
  Speaker 4: want to go?
• 44:03
  Speaker 5: Let's go?
• 44:04
  Speaker 4: You know, moronic?
• 44:06
  Speaker 2: Bring it on, Bring it on, don't It's fun to watch.
• 44:10
  Speaker 2: On the front of the Canberra Times tomorrow, it says
• 44:13
  Speaker 2: higher learning the use of generative artificial Intelligence has rendered
• 44:18
  Speaker 2: the traditional public service job application process nearly obsolete, sparking
• 44:22
  Speaker 2: a search for the human behind the screen. Found a
• 44:26
  Speaker 2: resume writing platform, recruitible hub. Meg Salter says, no one's
• 44:31
  Speaker 2: bad on paper anymore, and the aps must find new
• 44:35
  Speaker 2: ways to decide who to put through to an interview.
• 44:40
  Speaker 4: So hang on, Cambu.
• 44:43
  Speaker 2: Where So, because everyone is now using AI, all the
• 44:49
  Speaker 2: job applicants look really good. So it's creating more problems.
• 44:54
  Speaker 2: How do you win? I mean, I thought this, You know,
• 44:56
  Speaker 2: the one good application for AI might be that we
• 44:59
  Speaker 2: have few public servants. But now we're being told that
• 45:02
  Speaker 2: actually it means it's harder to assist the people you
• 45:04
  Speaker 2: want to employ many more public servants.
• 45:08
  Speaker 4: But how good is it that? How apt is it
• 45:10
  Speaker 4: that AI can just already just perfectly replicate everything of
• 45:14
  Speaker 4: public servants well does or thinks or is meant to
• 45:18
  Speaker 4: be good at.
• 45:18
  Speaker 7: See, it's not only being used in a court of law,
• 45:21
  Speaker 7: it's now being used on job applications.
• 45:24
  Speaker 2: Would probably argue that public servants have been robots for
• 45:26
  Speaker 2: a long time.
• 45:27
  Speaker 4: That's right. First they came for the lawyers and I
• 45:29
  Speaker 4: said nothing. Then they came for the bureaucrats. Then I'll
• 45:33
  Speaker 4: come for the economists. This is my favorite story of
• 45:37
  Speaker 4: all time, close second only to Origin three. And this
• 45:42
  Speaker 4: is the story of Neil the Seal, who has made
• 45:47
  Speaker 4: suburbs of Hobart his home in recent days, and no
• 45:51
  Speaker 4: one knows what to do about him, so we've got
• 45:53
  Speaker 4: love him, leave him. Bus Loads of tourists are reportedly
• 45:57
  Speaker 4: inundating a small seaside suburb as Neil the Seal's celebrity
• 46:02
  Speaker 4: status intensifies, fueling concerns for the wait for it, one
• 46:07
  Speaker 4: thousand kilogram mammals safety, and it calls for a management
• 46:11
  Speaker 4: plan to be put in place before he next comes ashort.
• 46:15
  Speaker 4: So this is this seal that has just decided that
• 46:18
  Speaker 4: this suburb is now his home, and he just comes in.
• 46:22
  Speaker 4: He literally weighs a ton. They try to put they
• 46:25
  Speaker 4: try to put everything in front of him, They try
• 46:26
  Speaker 4: to put high luxes in front of him. Unbreakable. They
• 46:29
  Speaker 4: were not until Neil came along. And he just just
• 46:33
  Speaker 4: go and watch this footage on It's amazing. He just
• 46:36
  Speaker 4: plows through it, plows through utes, trucks, flows through fences
• 46:41
  Speaker 4: and then he just curls up and has a little
• 46:42
  Speaker 4: sleep next to this fence. That he likes and it's
• 46:44
  Speaker 4: happening all the time and people can't get enough. And
• 46:47
  Speaker 4: I am so there for it.
• 46:48
  Speaker 8: And he was born there. It's actually very sweet. That's
• 46:50
  Speaker 8: why he goes there. He goes there because he knows
• 46:52
  Speaker 8: his home. G Animals are intelligent.
• 46:55
  Speaker 2: But what they're saying is leave the guy alone. If
• 46:57
  Speaker 2: you want him to survive the plan.
• 47:00
  Speaker 8: They made to do something, they need to see the deal. Oh,
• 47:04
  Speaker 8: that was a good one. That was a good one.
• 47:06
  Speaker 7: Let's take a look at the herald son from Flipping
• 47:09
  Speaker 7: the Bird to Jail Bird. The accused Pam the bird
• 47:13
  Speaker 7: graffiti vandal is back behind bars after being reminded in
• 47:17
  Speaker 7: custody for allegedly scaling the bolt bridge and spray painting
• 47:20
  Speaker 7: the infamous bird during a nine hour stunt.
• 47:23
  Speaker 8: Jack Gibson Burrell.
• 47:25
  Speaker 7: Had been freed on bail and feb last year charge
• 47:27
  Speaker 7: with more than two hundred offences, including seven hundred thousand
• 47:29
  Speaker 7: dollars of property damage.
• 47:31
  Speaker 8: There are now growing.
• 47:32
  Speaker 7: Calls for mister Gibson Burrell to stay in jail as
• 47:35
  Speaker 7: he repays the full costs of the damage. There you go,
• 47:38
  Speaker 7: and that is the pan of the bird graffiti there
• 47:40
  Speaker 7: on the front page that's on the bolt bridge.
• 47:44
  Speaker 8: Well there you go.
• 47:44
  Speaker 2: And he was protesting about high Texas and wow, wow,
• 47:49
  Speaker 2: you might have a point in Victoria on the front
• 47:52
  Speaker 2: of the Gold Coast bullis and tomorrow says woman led
• 47:54
  Speaker 2: to Gold Coast school. Top Gold Coast School, fake nurse jailed.
• 47:58
  Speaker 2: An Orange woman who used fake degrees to get and
• 48:01
  Speaker 2: keep a job as a nurse for a prestigious Gold
• 48:03
  Speaker 2: Coast school for more than three years, wrote down in
• 48:06
  Speaker 2: tears after she was jailed. I mean you kind of
• 48:10
  Speaker 2: got a hand it to her.
• 48:12
  Speaker 8: So many questions to be keeping up for.
• 48:14
  Speaker 2: Three years, your fake credentials school nurse.
• 48:17
  Speaker 4: All you've got to do is tell kids, you know,
• 48:19
  Speaker 4: they don't really have a headache and to get back
• 48:21
  Speaker 4: to class.
• 48:21
  Speaker 7: Okay, but they still have to know about like epipenn
• 48:24
  Speaker 7: news that there's a lot of allergies in schools.
• 48:26
  Speaker 8: You need to know your basic CPR.
• 48:29
  Speaker 4: Don't sweat the small stuff. You're never going to pass
• 48:31
  Speaker 4: nursing school with that kind of you know, dear, chuck
• 48:37
  Speaker 4: a band aid on it.
• 48:39
  Speaker 2: Let's get ready for the biggest story going around at
• 48:42
  Speaker 2: the moment, of course, not the state of origin. It's
• 48:44
  Speaker 2: Nigel Farage about to make an announcement on his future
• 48:47
  Speaker 2: in public life that will be live on the other
• 48:50
  Speaker 2: side of this stone. Go away, all right, in less
• 48:57
  Speaker 2: than four minutes, we're expecting that statement from Nigel for
• 49:00
  Speaker 2: Edge on his future in public life. We're going to
• 49:02
  Speaker 2: talk to Paul Murray in just a moment, but first
• 49:05
  Speaker 2: Jacob riis mog who's a colleague of his at gb
• 49:08
  Speaker 2: News and also a former MP, has had this to
• 49:11
  Speaker 2: say in recent hours.
• 49:13
  Speaker 11: The further question of whether there is more to come,
• 49:16
  Speaker 11: People inside Reform indicate to me that there is more
• 49:19
  Speaker 11: to come, that there are more problems around the financing
• 49:22
  Speaker 11: and structures of Reform. It is a new party and
• 49:26
  Speaker 11: it has faced teething problems to put it at its mildest,
• 49:31
  Speaker 11: and beggars can't be choosers that when you need to
• 49:34
  Speaker 11: fund a new party, you're not overwhelmed by.
• 49:38
  Speaker 1: The great and the good offering you cash.
• 49:40
  Speaker 11: You have to take it sometimes from more peripheral figures.
• 49:43
  Speaker 11: So that is a line of attack. And Nigel is
• 49:46
  Speaker 11: not a details man. He is somebody who has a
• 49:50
  Speaker 11: broad and big picture that for it is perhaps not
• 49:53
  Speaker 11: surprising that his registrations have sometimes been late and sometimes
• 49:57
  Speaker 11: been not entirely complete. So if there's more to come,
• 50:02
  Speaker 11: what next?
• 50:04
  Speaker 1: This is the big question.
• 50:05
  Speaker 11: People have been saying that there are others in Reform
• 50:08
  Speaker 11: who want to replace Nigel. My gas is that this
• 50:11
  Speaker 11: information has been leaked by Nigel's opponents who are trying
• 50:15
  Speaker 11: to do him done. My bat is that these stories
• 50:18
  Speaker 11: come from inside Reform.
• 50:21
  Speaker 2: Scarne New's host Paul Murray joins us. Now, Paul, thank
• 50:23
  Speaker 2: you for staying around mate. Of course you've been talking
• 50:26
  Speaker 2: to Nigel on air for years every week. What are
• 50:29
  Speaker 2: you expecting he'll say in a few minutes time.
• 50:31
  Speaker 5: Well, again, none of us know. None of us are
• 50:33
  Speaker 5: on the inside.
• 50:34
  Speaker 10: Those that are on the inside that have been briefing
• 50:37
  Speaker 10: the media in the UK in the past hour, including
• 50:40
  Speaker 10: the TV station that he works for over their GB News,
• 50:43
  Speaker 10: suggesting that you're going to see a statement here of defiance,
• 50:47
  Speaker 10: not of resignation as the leader of Reform. It seems
• 50:50
  Speaker 10: that the snapping point has been this interaction that he
• 50:53
  Speaker 10: claims happened to his daughter at one of the properties
• 50:58
  Speaker 10: that I understand he owns, and that was apparently with
• 51:01
  Speaker 10: representatives of Sky News in the UK. Now, Sky News
• 51:04
  Speaker 10: in the UK have denied that that's taken place, but
• 51:07
  Speaker 10: there was that confrontation a little bit earlier today when
• 51:10
  Speaker 10: he was being questioned. The reality of what faces Nigel
• 51:14
  Speaker 10: Farage at this moment is this lengthy inquiry into sizeable
• 51:19
  Speaker 10: donations multimillion pound donations that happened prior to his time
• 51:24
  Speaker 10: becoming an MP. Now, remember reform existed well before the
• 51:27
  Speaker 10: last federal election in the UK, but it was only
• 51:30
  Speaker 10: about six weeks out from that election that Richard Tice
• 51:33
  Speaker 10: was replaced by Nigel Farrage as the leader and that
• 51:36
  Speaker 10: he was going to run for a seat in the
• 51:38
  Speaker 10: Parliament in an area called Clacton.
• 51:41
  Speaker 5: He won that pretty easily.
• 51:42
  Speaker 10: The expectation is that if he brought on a by
• 51:44
  Speaker 10: election as a way of circumventing this process that's playing
• 51:49
  Speaker 10: out now, that could go through till September to work
• 51:51
  Speaker 10: out whether those donations prior to him entering the parliament
• 51:55
  Speaker 10: would see him no longer be an MP. It's a
• 51:57
  Speaker 10: way of resetting the clock. The way the system works
• 52:00
  Speaker 10: is it's twelve months prior to the day you become
• 52:03
  Speaker 10: a politician. So if that date was a by election,
• 52:06
  Speaker 10: that date would of course be his time in parliament,
• 52:09
  Speaker 10: not the time before he entered parliament.
• 52:12
  Speaker 4: It's a pretty high risk strategy, though, isn't it. I mean,
• 52:15
  Speaker 4: I mean, he strikes me obviously as a very crash
• 52:17
  Speaker 4: through a crash kind of guy. How much damage you
• 52:20
  Speaker 4: think he's done just by allowing the speculation that he
• 52:24
  Speaker 4: will stand down or step back or step aside. Allowing
• 52:28
  Speaker 4: that to swirl for so long, even just in an hour,
• 52:31
  Speaker 4: is a long time in politics. By saying that you're
• 52:33
  Speaker 4: going to make a statement about your future, that almost
• 52:36
  Speaker 4: always means stepping back. But I think that would be
• 52:40
  Speaker 4: a big mistake in his case.
• 52:41
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I would think.
• 52:42
  Speaker 10: So look again, who knows, we'll we'll find out together.
• 52:45
  Speaker 10: I think it very unlikely that he's about to pull
• 52:47
  Speaker 10: a pin on public life because past behavior is a
• 52:51
  Speaker 10: predictor of future behavior, and the past behavior is fighting.
• 52:54
  Speaker 10: I mean, he fought for how long in the European Parliament,
• 52:57
  Speaker 10: he fought how long to get into the UK Parliament.
• 53:00
  Speaker 10: So my default setting would be that he's going to
• 53:03
  Speaker 10: fight hard again. Some of the briefing and the media,
• 53:07
  Speaker 10: of course, as a whole selection of newspapers in the UK,
• 53:10
  Speaker 10: and all the different political flavors, the ones that are
• 53:12
  Speaker 10: more reform connected or claiming to have insiders, suggesting that
• 53:17
  Speaker 10: the focus is going to be the fight is going
• 53:19
  Speaker 10: to be the pushback.
• 53:20
  Speaker 5: Also, I suppose for.
• 53:21
  Speaker 10: A politician, the death by a thousand cuts thing is
• 53:24
  Speaker 10: normally what happens. But this is not a normal politician.
• 53:27
  Speaker 10: This is a person of course, representing a party that
• 53:29
  Speaker 10: has never been in opposition, let alone been in government.
• 53:32
  Speaker 10: So it's a way of trying to jump on top
• 53:36
  Speaker 10: of that speculation or whatever's been mounting for a little while.
• 53:40
  Speaker 10: But the reality for Reform is that there's one more
• 53:42
  Speaker 10: than three hundred opinion polls in a row and then
• 53:45
  Speaker 10: things started to taper off. At the by election that
• 53:47
  Speaker 10: got Andy Burnham into the parliament, Reform was assumed to
• 53:50
  Speaker 10: have done very well, if not won that seat. Instead,
• 53:53
  Speaker 10: Labor one with a primary vote I think at fifty
• 53:56
  Speaker 10: four percent. Their system is one that's first passed the
• 53:58
  Speaker 10: post without preferences. So he's hoping to replicate essentially what
• 54:02
  Speaker 10: Labour did in the last election, which was to have
• 54:04
  Speaker 10: a primary vote with a three in front of it.
• 54:06
  Speaker 10: They've currently got it in the high tee at the
• 54:08
  Speaker 10: high twenties. So we'll all find out together shortly.
• 54:11
  Speaker 8: Yeah, we certainly will standing by for that announcement.
• 54:14
  Speaker 7: You mentioned Paul that he's not a certain type of
• 54:19
  Speaker 7: politician and really there is no reform without Nigel Farage.
• 54:24
  Speaker 7: Do you think that this will have an impact regardless
• 54:27
  Speaker 7: on that right side of politics.
• 54:29
  Speaker 5: Well, there's already a skizhim inside it.
• 54:31
  Speaker 10: As you guys know that there's this other report at
• 54:33
  Speaker 10: this other party which is started by a blow called
• 54:35
  Speaker 10: Rupert Lowe who used to be part of the reform world.
• 54:37
  Speaker 10: Then there was a giant breakup. He started Restore Britain.
• 54:41
  Speaker 10: It's got the backing of people like an Elon Musket's
• 54:43
  Speaker 10: got a very solid fight up online base and it
• 54:47
  Speaker 10: is making a little bit of a dent in the polls.
• 54:48
  Speaker 10: And whether it's five percent here or seven percent there
• 54:51
  Speaker 10: is the difference between reform being in the high twenties
• 54:55
  Speaker 10: or the early thirties can be the difference between either
• 54:59
  Speaker 10: a strong protest or things starting to break through.
• 55:01
  Speaker 5: I mean, the reality of.
• 55:02
  Speaker 10: British politics is the known time for a federal election
• 55:06
  Speaker 10: is still three years away. There's about to be a
• 55:08
  Speaker 10: transition into a new prime minister. Now, whether the new
• 55:12
  Speaker 10: Prime Minister Andy Burnham, the earliest he can take over
• 55:15
  Speaker 10: is towards the end of this month, and if he
• 55:19
  Speaker 10: sees a weakening that's happening with reform, maybe there's a
• 55:22
  Speaker 10: pounce for an early general election and then well all
• 55:25
  Speaker 10: bets are off. But in terms of you know, this
• 55:27
  Speaker 10: hasn't been a great month for reform. But as we've
• 55:30
  Speaker 10: seen with one nation, the reality is that you can
• 55:33
  Speaker 10: only exponentially grow for a certain period of time before
• 55:36
  Speaker 10: you start to plateau. You want a plateau in a
• 55:38
  Speaker 10: position where you're either going to be competitive or you've
• 55:41
  Speaker 10: got your nose in front. And the reality of the
• 55:45
  Speaker 10: upside for a politician like Nigel Feraj in a moment
• 55:49
  Speaker 10: like this is that if he had done a press
• 55:51
  Speaker 10: conference yesterday, would it have been breaking news on Australian
• 55:54
  Speaker 10: television No. Would it have been breaking news in the
• 55:57
  Speaker 10: US No. Would it have been rolling coverage across the
• 56:01
  Speaker 10: entire British media No. So in many ways it's a
• 56:04
  Speaker 10: way for him to be able to get to as
• 56:08
  Speaker 10: many people as possible, to deliver what you would imagine
• 56:11
  Speaker 10: to be the statement of defiance, take on the media,
• 56:14
  Speaker 10: take on the establishment, frame the process that's investigating the
• 56:17
  Speaker 10: donations as one that's always been out to get him.
• 56:20
  Speaker 10: And the nuclear option, of course, is for him to
• 56:23
  Speaker 10: just say, all right, well I'll take it to the people.
• 56:25
  Speaker 10: If the people of my local electorate don't think I'm
• 56:27
  Speaker 10: good enough, well then we'll all find out together. But
• 56:29
  Speaker 10: let's reset the clock, which has the double effect that
• 56:32
  Speaker 10: I mentioned before.
• 56:33
  Speaker 2: And as you say, Paul, you know, it's not been
• 56:35
  Speaker 2: a great month for Reform, but it is ultimately about
• 56:38
  Speaker 2: the people. And to be frank, I'm not sure people
• 56:41
  Speaker 2: really care about this stuff. It's in fact, in spite
• 56:46
  Speaker 2: of this stuff that parties like Reform and people like
• 56:50
  Speaker 2: Nagel Farage, like Donald Trump manage to gather support because
• 56:54
  Speaker 2: they look at this stuff and say, well, actually, if
• 56:56
  Speaker 2: they're coming after him, it means they're coming after me
• 56:59
  Speaker 2: as well.
• 56:59
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 57:00
  Speaker 10: And the truth is, Caleb, that, of course the normal
• 57:02
  Speaker 10: rules don't apply to abnormal political figures sort of once
• 57:06
  Speaker 10: in a generation disruptors until of course it does, and
• 57:11
  Speaker 10: that often more so is going to be ballot box
• 57:13
  Speaker 10: related than.
• 57:16
  Speaker 5: Ending up in scandal.
• 57:19
  Speaker 10: But again, you know, the threshold for what people are
• 57:23
  Speaker 10: willing to put up with web scene with Trump is
• 57:25
  Speaker 10: through the roof we've seen with Reform, because Reform has
• 57:29
  Speaker 10: become this giant position of basically f you to any
• 57:33
  Speaker 10: and everything that has existed before. Then presumably again those
• 57:37
  Speaker 10: people lock in. But I just keep going back to
• 57:40
  Speaker 10: the mats that Let's imagine if there's a hard twenty
• 57:42
  Speaker 10: percent of people in the UK who are not for
• 57:44
  Speaker 10: turning great, there's a maybe five percent that there's a
• 57:48
  Speaker 10: difference between twenty and twenty five percent, Okay, but it's
• 57:51
  Speaker 10: about getting to that next level, and that's where the
• 57:54
  Speaker 10: Conservative vote has has sort of tapered off.
• 57:57
  Speaker 5: It hasn't collapsed any further. And the further.
• 58:01
  Speaker 10: Growth for in this case, reform, as it has been
• 58:05
  Speaker 10: for one nation in Australia, is to get labor supporters,
• 58:08
  Speaker 10: particularly working class supporters.
• 58:10
  Speaker 5: In the North of England, the people.
• 58:11
  Speaker 10: Who voted labor their whole lives, voted for Brexit, then
• 58:15
  Speaker 10: voted for Johnson in twenty nineteen. They went back to
• 58:18
  Speaker 10: the Labor Party at their most recent federal election in
• 58:22
  Speaker 10: twenty four but those people at the local government elections
• 58:26
  Speaker 10: where they moved back to reform, So they've already sort
• 58:28
  Speaker 10: of been broken away from the traditional places in which
• 58:31
  Speaker 10: they were going to support and the people that they
• 58:33
  Speaker 10: were going to double down on. So again, an hour
• 58:36
  Speaker 10: is a long time in politics. Are week's a long
• 58:38
  Speaker 10: time in politics. But it's also about getting in charge
• 58:41
  Speaker 10: of the narrative, being able to say rather than a
• 58:45
  Speaker 10: new allegation a day is trying to frame well, all
• 58:47
  Speaker 10: of the allegations come from a whole bunch of people
• 58:50
  Speaker 10: have always hated me, hate what we represent, and hate
• 58:53
  Speaker 10: what you want to vote for.
• 58:54
  Speaker 5: If I was a betting man.
• 58:55
  Speaker 10: And an okleb you a little more than I, at
• 58:58
  Speaker 10: least on the horses more pokemashine man, which of course
• 59:01
  Speaker 10: means nothing other than just randomly hoping something's going to happen.
• 59:05
  Speaker 10: Is that I imagine that there is this sense of
• 59:07
  Speaker 10: defiance that is going to come out to any moment.
• 59:10
  Speaker 4: Now, Yeah, I think you're right, and I certainly think
• 59:13
  Speaker 4: that's what he should do, whether he does it or
• 59:14
  Speaker 4: not he does the Trump playbook, you say it's all
• 59:17
  Speaker 4: fake news. They're all coming out of it, And that
• 59:18
  Speaker 4: way you actually sort of inoculate yourself from anything more
• 59:22
  Speaker 4: that comes out, because you've already told all the people
• 59:24
  Speaker 4: that whatever happens, you know, oh they're going to they
• 59:26
  Speaker 4: will be making up even more stuff next. You know what,
• 59:29
  Speaker 4: what's going to come out of their mouths next time,
• 59:31
  Speaker 4: and then everything that comes out is seen through that prison.
• 59:34
  Speaker 4: And also, I mean, I know the by election that
• 59:39
  Speaker 4: got Andy Burnham up. You know, reform didn't do as
• 59:42
  Speaker 4: well as it thought it might. But you know, there's
• 59:45
  Speaker 4: only one Andy Burnham. There's six hundred and fifty seats
• 59:48
  Speaker 4: in the House of Commons. And if they and you're
• 59:50
  Speaker 4: absolutely right, same with one nation. The real concern is
• 59:53
  Speaker 4: not the cannibalizing or the facing of the right vote.
• 59:57
  Speaker 4: It's the it's the picking up those working last voters
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 4: who are leaving labor. Once that happens, you've kicked the
• 1:00:03
  Speaker 4: stilts out from under the Labor Party and it's all over.
• 1:00:07
  Speaker 4: It's all she wrote.
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 5: Well, that's why.
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 10: Also, and apart from the North of England, where so
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 10: many of those Labor seats have come from.
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 5: Before, there's also Scotland.
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 10: Now Scotland, the Conservatives actually, after not being in the
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 10: fight for a little while, they did well. But in
• 1:00:21
  Speaker 10: Wales reform did pretty well, Labor did pretty poorly. So
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 10: there's well and truly a path. There is well and
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 10: truly a way again, if you put your faith in
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 10: the book makers. The book makers say that anyone getting
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 10: a majority is most likely not to be the outcome
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 10: of the election, But there is so much time between.
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 5: Now and then.
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 10: Interestingly, again, I just keep talking back to the One
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 10: Nation of it all because today in the UK, and
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 10: you've got to assume these meetings have been put off
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 10: because of everything that's happened in the past few hours,
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 10: and what will happen as a result in the next
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 10: couple of minutes is that there was about to be
• 1:00:52
  Speaker 10: a meeting between Paul and Hansen and Nigel Farage And
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 10: there's a lot that Hanson and One Nation could learn
• 1:00:59
  Speaker 10: from Reform through their growth period. Right, So obviously Reform
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 10: was the replacement for a bunch of disaffected Conservative voters,
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 10: but the growth is moving into the center and then
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 10: again moving across to those working class voters. So you've
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 10: seen Nigel Faraj not present himself as the Conservative or
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 10: the Conservative choice. He still has all of the strong
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 10: borders language culture policies, the legal immigration and legal immigration
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 10: and culture questions are absolute. But what he's done as
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 10: the party has grown is that he has these incredible
• 1:01:35
  Speaker 10: press conferences sort of once a quarter where he'll stand
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 10: up there.
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 5: In a pretty glitzy way.
• 1:01:40
  Speaker 10: There'll be him and a couple of other podiums and
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 10: he'll introduce he is going to be my treasury spokesperson.
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 10: He's going to be my defense spokesperson. Some of those
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 10: people already in the parliament. Some of those people not
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 10: in the parliament. And we saw one nation in and
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 10: around the National Press Club making the decision that the
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 10: person representing them on treasury matters was going to be
• 1:01:59
  Speaker 10: Barne be Joyce. And presumably as we get closer and
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 10: closer to our federal election, they start to mention who
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 10: these other people who are who aren't currently in the parliament.
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 10: But the thing about Farage also as a character, right,
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 10: is that he is one of these people. And there
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 10: is a certain type of person who is more thick
• 1:02:19
  Speaker 10: skin than anything else. Right, There's more thick skin than
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 10: there's muscle. There's more thick skin than there is bone.
• 1:02:25
  Speaker 10: And Nigel Farage has been copying it from every angle
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 10: for basically all of his public life. So I wouldn't
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 10: imagine that multiple weeks of these media conversations have resulted
• 1:02:39
  Speaker 10: in a breaking point. I think it is about trying
• 1:02:42
  Speaker 10: to choose a breaking point to reframe the pressure that
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 10: he is in an under but.
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 5: I can't underscore here that if he remains in the Parliament.
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 10: Just delivers a big sort of you know, as you say,
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 10: fake news, screw the system. Well, the system is going
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 10: to continue to investigate. These sizeable donations came at a time,
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 10: as I said, when he wasn't planning to run for politics,
• 1:03:03
  Speaker 10: But they fall inside the period of time where you
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 10: get to have a look at anything that happened twelve
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 10: months prior to becoming an elected official in the UK.
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 10: The process which previously, remember we saw Boris Johnson go
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 10: through all of this in and around party Gate, is
• 1:03:20
  Speaker 10: apparently going to stretch on all the way to September.
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 10: So that means there's a lot of stories between now
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 10: and September. So obviously there is you would have to
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 10: think some significant defensive crouch that comes from realizing what
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 10: that time period is and obviously you could have a
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 10: by election within that period of time. So essentially you're
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 10: able to wrestle the story and send it in a
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 10: different direction between now and September as opposed to rolling
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 10: through and the sort of death by front page and
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 10: not even death by front page. But I'm just saying
• 1:03:52
  Speaker 10: the leading to the seemingly inevitable conclusion of a committee
• 1:03:56
  Speaker 10: of your peers made up exclusively of people who would
• 1:03:59
  Speaker 10: never vote for you, don't want you to succeed, who
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 10: will unsurprisingly say this is on the wrong side of things,
• 1:04:05
  Speaker 10: and therefore you get booted out. But it's not like
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 10: an American impeachment situation where somebody would be banned from
• 1:04:12
  Speaker 10: ever running again. It's you would simply be forcing a
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 10: by election. So worst case scenario, you sit there till
• 1:04:20
  Speaker 10: September they make the decision.
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 5: Well, here is all I'm just.
• 1:04:23
  Speaker 2: Going to interrupt now. Nirad just getting up to speak here.
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 5: It is.
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 6: When she's seeing that called a snap election, that it
• 1:04:30
  Speaker 6: would be beyond me. But I did it, and I
• 1:04:32
  Speaker 6: was very very proud that evening going into the morning
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 6: of July the fifth, twenty twenty four, to be the
• 1:04:37
  Speaker 6: elected member for Clacton On C.
• 1:04:40
  Speaker 1: I was very proud of that evening.
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 6: And I have to say the last two years I've
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 6: really enjoyed the job of being an MP the people
• 1:04:47
  Speaker 6: the constituency. It's an office that I genuinely, genuinely adore.
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 6: I couldn't believed that night that we'd have rocketed to
• 1:04:55
  Speaker 6: the top of the opinion polls, and now we'd be
• 1:04:58
  Speaker 6: number one for the last three hundred and fifty opinion
• 1:05:01
  Speaker 6: polls in a row, often with big leads. We've also
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 6: built the biggest membership of any political party in the country.
• 1:05:10
  Speaker 6: And of course on May the seventh just gone, we
• 1:05:12
  Speaker 6: achieved some huge successes in my local elections.
• 1:05:16
  Speaker 1: Not only do we.
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 6: Achieve breakthroughs in Scotland and in Wales, but we absolutely
• 1:05:21
  Speaker 6: dominated in the midlands of the North, the old Labour heartlands,
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 6: and that is why Keir Starmer is now on his
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 6: way out. Not to forget that in East Anglia the
• 1:05:32
  Speaker 6: Conservatives have now by us been reduced to nothing more
• 1:05:36
  Speaker 6: than a rump. It seems to me that the establishment
• 1:05:40
  Speaker 6: have now decided that they can't beat us fairly, so
• 1:05:45
  Speaker 6: they've chosen to use foul means. Let me be absolutely clear,
• 1:05:51
  Speaker 6: after the Ferrari and the media pylon, when not just
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 6: the media, the other political parties too, Let me be
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 6: absolutely clear. I have done nothing wrong. I have not
• 1:06:04
  Speaker 6: broken the law in any way at all. I have
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 6: not misused public money. And you know, for the first
• 1:06:12
  Speaker 6: two years of being an MP, my personal MP expenses
• 1:06:18
  Speaker 6: are zero, not of course that you'll read about that
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 6: in mainstream media. And yes, of course Parliament has its
• 1:06:27
  Speaker 6: rules about how members ought to behave and I believe
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 6: I've absolutely obeyed those rules and done so under getting
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 6: good legal advice.
• 1:06:39
  Speaker 1: The standard rules are clear. This is what they say.
• 1:06:42
  Speaker 6: The code applies to members in all aspects of their
• 1:06:46
  Speaker 6: public life. It does not seek to regulate what members
• 1:06:50
  Speaker 6: do in their purely personal lives, though it would seem
• 1:06:56
  Speaker 6: from the last couple of years, from the way I've
• 1:06:58
  Speaker 6: been treated, that the press would rather that our members
• 1:07:01
  Speaker 6: of Parliament had no assets and no wealth at all.
• 1:07:05
  Speaker 6: They seem to fundamentally object to any MP that has
• 1:07:09
  Speaker 6: outside income. Indeed, they view those that have continuing business
• 1:07:14
  Speaker 6: interests with severe, severe skepticism. Making money is not a crime. Now,
• 1:07:22
  Speaker 6: going back to my nineties, I was in the commodity markets.
• 1:07:25
  Speaker 6: I had a very very good, high earning career. I
• 1:07:28
  Speaker 6: gave that up at a huge cost. Being a member
• 1:07:31
  Speaker 6: of the European Parliament for twenty years cost me a
• 1:07:34
  Speaker 6: huge amount of money. But I did it because I
• 1:07:37
  Speaker 6: had a goal. I had a goal and a belief
• 1:07:40
  Speaker 6: that we should leave the European Union, get back to
• 1:07:42
  Speaker 6: being a self regulating nation that makes its own laws,
• 1:07:46
  Speaker 6: charts its own destiny, and among other things, of course,
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 6: controls its own borders. We might not yet ten years
• 1:07:54
  Speaker 6: on have reaped as many of the benefits as we ought,
• 1:07:57
  Speaker 6: but one day I believe we will. And let's be
• 1:08:01
  Speaker 6: If I hadn't done what i'd done, there would have
• 1:08:03
  Speaker 6: been no referendum, there would have been no Brexit. I
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 6: came out at the end of that with very little money. Indeed,
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 6: but over the last ten years I've been writing, I've
• 1:08:15
  Speaker 6: been lecturing, I've been broadcasting, I've been investing. I promoted
• 1:08:20
  Speaker 6: one or two financial products, and for those that followed
• 1:08:23
  Speaker 6: me into them, they've more than doubled their money, which
• 1:08:26
  Speaker 6: I'm pleased about. I also worked extensively in those years
• 1:08:30
  Speaker 6: of twenty twenty one to twenty twenty four as an
• 1:08:32
  Speaker 6: influencer with over seven million followers on social media. So yes,
• 1:08:39
  Speaker 6: over the last ten years I have financially done well.
• 1:08:43
  Speaker 6: But that of itself should not be looked upon as
• 1:08:46
  Speaker 6: a crime. And yes, I had the equivalent of a
• 1:08:50
  Speaker 6: lottery win, a large personal gift, and I'll come to
• 1:08:54
  Speaker 6: that and the details of that.
• 1:08:56
  Speaker 1: In just a second.
• 1:08:58
  Speaker 6: The really big question that I want to pose is
• 1:09:00
  Speaker 6: do we want leaders that know how to make money?
• 1:09:04
  Speaker 6: Do we want leaders that have run businesses, employed people
• 1:09:07
  Speaker 6: and understand.
• 1:09:08
  Speaker 1: How the world works. Well, I'm going to argue today.
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 6: We absolutely need successful people from all walks of life,
• 1:09:16
  Speaker 6: but particularly from business and industry. We need them not
• 1:09:19
  Speaker 6: just in Parliament, we need them in government if we're
• 1:09:23
  Speaker 6: even going to have half a chance of turning around
• 1:09:25
  Speaker 6: the dire economic state this country now finds itself. In
• 1:09:31
  Speaker 6: contrast that with a cabinet twenty four men and women,
• 1:09:34
  Speaker 6: not one of whom is any serious experience of private
• 1:09:37
  Speaker 6: business who frankly haven't got a clue. So don't be
• 1:09:41
  Speaker 6: surprised that in economic terms we are going down the drain. Now,
• 1:09:47
  Speaker 6: Standards investigating me over the Gift has now reared its
• 1:09:52
  Speaker 6: head again as a result of a loss of copy
• 1:09:56
  Speaker 6: in this week's Sunday Times, incidentally written by journalist who
• 1:10:01
  Speaker 6: publicly says that he despises me, And despite the fact
• 1:10:06
  Speaker 6: that many of the things that were written in the
• 1:10:07
  Speaker 6: article were wholly inaccurate or indeed irrelevant, yet another standards
• 1:10:14
  Speaker 6: investigation is underway. Standards are now being used as a
• 1:10:19
  Speaker 6: political tool on the Gift. It was given to me
• 1:10:23
  Speaker 6: on an unconditional basis. I can do with that money
• 1:10:28
  Speaker 6: exactly as I wish. But there is a much bigger
• 1:10:34
  Speaker 6: reason why I'm going to need that money, and it's
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 6: simply this. For over twenty years now, I have been
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 6: subject to constant demonization by the press for daring to
• 1:10:46
  Speaker 6: be outside the consensual view on many issues. I've been
• 1:10:50
  Speaker 6: attacked again and again, and I am the most physically
• 1:10:55
  Speaker 6: and verbally attacked public figure or politician of modern times. Yes,
• 1:11:01
  Speaker 6: you will know of some of the incidents, milkshakes thrown
• 1:11:04
  Speaker 6: in my face, placards bashed over my head, but let
• 1:11:08
  Speaker 6: me promise you only know about a fraction of the
• 1:11:12
  Speaker 6: number of times that I've been assaulted. One little example
• 1:11:16
  Speaker 6: you've probably never heard of. It was a Sunday afternoon
• 1:11:18
  Speaker 6: a few years ago in the local village pub. In
• 1:11:22
  Speaker 6: come the mob, about fifty of them. We decided the
• 1:11:25
  Speaker 6: safest thing to do was as quickly as possible to
• 1:11:28
  Speaker 6: get into the car and to drive away. But the
• 1:11:31
  Speaker 6: mob surrounded the car, banging on the bonnet and the windscreen,
• 1:11:36
  Speaker 6: kicking the side of the doors. It was a genuinely
• 1:11:39
  Speaker 6: dangerous and terrifying situation to be in.
• 1:11:43
  Speaker 1: The car was written off.
• 1:11:45
  Speaker 6: I didn't even bother with an insurance claim and did
• 1:11:48
  Speaker 6: everything I could not to make it public. But these
• 1:11:52
  Speaker 6: are the kind of things that I've had to put
• 1:11:54
  Speaker 6: up with over many, many years, and over the last
• 1:11:58
  Speaker 6: year it's got worse, with an attack on my home
• 1:12:02
  Speaker 6: very similar to the one that the Prime Minister suffered,
• 1:12:05
  Speaker 6: and literally daily online calls for me to be murdered
• 1:12:11
  Speaker 6: for some reason that doesn't seem to worry the police.
• 1:12:16
  Speaker 6: Repeatedly over the years I asked the Home Secretary for help.
• 1:12:21
  Speaker 6: I was rejected again and again. And in that period
• 1:12:25
  Speaker 6: when I wasn't in elected politics between twenty twenty one
• 1:12:28
  Speaker 6: and twenty twenty four, I ran up personally, very very
• 1:12:32
  Speaker 6: substantial bills to make sure that I was safe. When
• 1:12:37
  Speaker 6: I became an MP, Parliament said yes, we will help
• 1:12:40
  Speaker 6: you with security, but almost unbelievably, just a couple of
• 1:12:45
  Speaker 6: days after the murder of Charlie Kirk, seventy percent of
• 1:12:51
  Speaker 6: that security funding was withdrawn. I am going to need
• 1:12:56
  Speaker 6: security for the rest of my life and I cannot
• 1:12:59
  Speaker 6: even tell you how grateful I am to Christopher Harborne,
• 1:13:03
  Speaker 6: because now I will never ever need to worry about
• 1:13:06
  Speaker 6: whether I've got the resource. Well, the new attack from
• 1:13:10
  Speaker 6: the media is that somehow I am a crook, I
• 1:13:12
  Speaker 6: am dishonest. He has another reason to hate me. Commentators
• 1:13:17
  Speaker 6: over the weekend have said, oh, look at the interviews
• 1:13:19
  Speaker 6: Nigel's doing. He's not himself. He's getting angry. Well, here's why.
• 1:13:27
  Speaker 6: For some reason, last week the editor of the Times
• 1:13:29
  Speaker 6: newspaper decided to publish a picture of where my daughter lives.
• 1:13:37
  Speaker 6: There is no public interest in my daughter whatsoever. She
• 1:13:40
  Speaker 6: is not involved in current affairs, doesn't seek to be
• 1:13:44
  Speaker 6: involved in current affairs, and has never been used by
• 1:13:47
  Speaker 6: me once at any point in my political career, no
• 1:13:50
  Speaker 6: photographs on election addresses or anything like that. I've always
• 1:13:54
  Speaker 6: done my absolute best to protect the privacy and safety
• 1:14:00
  Speaker 6: of my family. By publishing that photograph, the editor of
• 1:14:04
  Speaker 6: the Times has directly threatened her security. I wonder what
• 1:14:09
  Speaker 6: happened to the Levison inquiry of years ago, an inquiry
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 6: that sought to bring better balance but in what the
• 1:14:15
  Speaker 6: press could do and families of those in public life
• 1:14:20
  Speaker 6: were still She now has broadcasters haranguing at Sky News.
• 1:14:25
  Speaker 6: Were one of them, and when I questioned them on it,
• 1:14:28
  Speaker 6: they willfully and deliberately lied and said on their channel
• 1:14:33
  Speaker 6: that they hadn't contacted the family.
• 1:14:36
  Speaker 1: Will.
• 1:14:36
  Speaker 6: Let me be clear, I will not tolerate intimidation of
• 1:14:41
  Speaker 6: my family. I will not tolerate the location of where
• 1:14:45
  Speaker 6: they live being revealed. I will not tolerate any of
• 1:14:49
  Speaker 6: my family being endangered because of what I choose to
• 1:14:52
  Speaker 6: do in public life. So yes, you can ask, am
• 1:14:56
  Speaker 6: I angry? Well, I've never been angrier in my life.
• 1:15:02
  Speaker 6: I'm always pretty upset with the behavior of this labor government.
• 1:15:06
  Speaker 6: They began in twenty twenty five and then tried again
• 1:15:10
  Speaker 6: into twenty twenty six to cancel elections for taxpayers, and
• 1:15:18
  Speaker 6: to do so on a vast and epic scale, albeit
• 1:15:22
  Speaker 6: with the connivance of the Conservative Party.
• 1:15:24
  Speaker 1: Why well, of course, fear of reform.
• 1:15:27
  Speaker 6: I'm proud of the fact that we fought a legal
• 1:15:29
  Speaker 6: action that got nearly five million council tax voters the
• 1:15:34
  Speaker 6: right to go out on May the seventh and give
• 1:15:36
  Speaker 6: their view. Now, of course, they want to reduce the
• 1:15:40
  Speaker 6: voting age down to sixteen again. They think that will
• 1:15:44
  Speaker 6: help damage reform, And just a couple of weeks ago,
• 1:15:48
  Speaker 6: following the Makerfield by election, they've changed the voting rules
• 1:15:52
  Speaker 6: for the Manchester mayoral by election. They've gone away from
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 6: first past to the post again for fear that perform
• 1:16:00
  Speaker 6: might win, and now they've come after our money.
• 1:16:04
  Speaker 1: Now, to be clear, in.
• 1:16:05
  Speaker 6: The early days after the last general election, it was
• 1:16:08
  Speaker 6: the huge increase in our membership at twenty five pounds
• 1:16:11
  Speaker 6: a time that actually got us into a position where
• 1:16:14
  Speaker 6: we could build a proper party. Over the last year
• 1:16:19
  Speaker 6: some big donors have been attracted.
• 1:16:21
  Speaker 1: To us extraordinary.
• 1:16:24
  Speaker 6: These are men who've gone off as entrepreneurs around the
• 1:16:26
  Speaker 6: world and succeeded, the sort of people we used to
• 1:16:29
  Speaker 6: admire over centuries. Now government ministers refer to them in
• 1:16:33
  Speaker 6: Parliament as malign actors, and so they keep changing all
• 1:16:38
  Speaker 6: the rules again and again just to stop reform. Frankly,
• 1:16:43
  Speaker 6: it is like living in a communist country. I could
• 1:16:45
  Speaker 6: never have believed such a thing.
• 1:16:47
  Speaker 1: Would happen here.
• 1:16:49
  Speaker 6: Ignore the fact, of course that over decades peerages have
• 1:16:52
  Speaker 6: been given to donors, and that Labour's donors in the
• 1:16:55
  Speaker 6: run up to a twenty twenty four general election now
• 1:16:58
  Speaker 6: seem to have been awarded the most extraordinary government contracts.
• 1:17:02
  Speaker 6: Perhaps Dominic Cummings was right last year when he said
• 1:17:05
  Speaker 6: Whitehall will break the law to stop reform winning power.
• 1:17:08
  Speaker 6: And we've been subject to the last few months so
• 1:17:11
  Speaker 6: the use of illegally obtained information, firm evidence of computer hacking,
• 1:17:17
  Speaker 6: and now leaks from government agencies.
• 1:17:21
  Speaker 1: And this is all cause.
• 1:17:21
  Speaker 6: A great distraction because we're about to get a prime
• 1:17:24
  Speaker 6: minister who's coming in with no mandate whatsoever. He didn't
• 1:17:28
  Speaker 6: even stand on the twenty twenty four manifesto. This country
• 1:17:32
  Speaker 6: needs a general election, even if Labor, the Conservatives and
• 1:17:37
  Speaker 6: the media don't want it. And whilst this pylon against
• 1:17:41
  Speaker 6: reform happens, the votes continue to cross the English Channel.
• 1:17:47
  Speaker 6: Our fractured defenses make us look weaker and weaker against
• 1:17:51
  Speaker 6: what I think is now an increasingly dangerous Vladimir Putin.
• 1:17:56
  Speaker 6: Business confidence is the lowest it's now been for sixteen years.
• 1:18:00
  Speaker 6: And I speak to you from a capital city where
• 1:18:02
  Speaker 6: men can't wear watches and women can't wear jewelry on
• 1:18:05
  Speaker 6: the street. Britain is broken and the public know it,
• 1:18:09
  Speaker 6: and we need change now. The issue with my daughter
• 1:18:13
  Speaker 6: was the final straw. Enough is enough, And I've thought
• 1:18:16
  Speaker 6: over the weekend what shall I do. I could go
• 1:18:19
  Speaker 6: out and try and make some real big money. I
• 1:18:22
  Speaker 6: could go to the USA, where I've got plenty of offers.
• 1:18:27
  Speaker 6: And then I thought, why should I be judged today
• 1:18:33
  Speaker 6: or in history in the future by Sky News and
• 1:18:35
  Speaker 6: their ILK Why should they be the people that decide
• 1:18:39
  Speaker 6: my fate when, as I repeat, I've done nothing wrong.
• 1:18:45
  Speaker 6: I've thought about it hard, and I've decided today. Today
• 1:18:49
  Speaker 6: I will resign as a Member of Parliament for Clacton
• 1:18:52
  Speaker 6: on Sea, thereby forcing a by election, which would happen
• 1:18:58
  Speaker 6: I hope in short order. Now I've decided that the
• 1:19:01
  Speaker 6: people of Clacton should be the judges of my actions.
• 1:19:06
  Speaker 6: This will be a people versus the establishment by election.
• 1:19:11
  Speaker 6: It's a chance to stick two fingers up to the
• 1:19:14
  Speaker 6: entire establishment to frankly tell them where to go. And
• 1:19:19
  Speaker 6: that is why I will be putting my name forward
• 1:19:22
  Speaker 6: to stand in this by election. I will fight to win.
• 1:19:26
  Speaker 6: I will fight to continue the political revolution that reform
• 1:19:31
  Speaker 6: has started. And I would say this to you, the
• 1:19:34
  Speaker 6: voters of Clacton, if I win, you win, because if
• 1:19:38
  Speaker 6: I lose, they win, and we will never with the
• 1:19:42
  Speaker 6: two old parties get the type of fundamental change that
• 1:19:44
  Speaker 6: we need to fix broken Britain.
• 1:19:48
  Speaker 1: Thank you.
• 1:19:53
  Speaker 2: That was Nigel Ferrad speaking Live from London. Then I
• 1:19:57
  Speaker 2: will clear up before I go any further win. He
• 1:19:59
  Speaker 2: makes references to sky News Nigel frag is talking about
• 1:20:03
  Speaker 2: sky News UK, not sky News Australia, which is a
• 1:20:06
  Speaker 2: separate entity of course, soon to become News twenty four.
• 1:20:09
  Speaker 2: But he says there is You just heard that he
• 1:20:11
  Speaker 2: is going to force a by election in his seat
• 1:20:14
  Speaker 2: of Clacton by resigning. Earlier in his speech he said
• 1:20:17
  Speaker 2: that they can't beat us fairly, so they're trying to
• 1:20:19
  Speaker 2: do so by foul means. He said he's absolutely obeyed
• 1:20:23
  Speaker 2: the rules, He's done nothing wrong, that the money he
• 1:20:26
  Speaker 2: received from Christopher Harborne is for his own personal security,
• 1:20:30
  Speaker 2: the funding of which he said was cut by seventy
• 1:20:32
  Speaker 2: percent after Charlie Kirk was killed, and that the harassment
• 1:20:37
  Speaker 2: of his daughter was the final straw that caused him
• 1:20:41
  Speaker 2: to do this.
• 1:20:42
  Speaker 5: Talk.
• 1:20:42
  Speaker 2: TV host Mark Doland joins us Now Live from London. Mark,
• 1:20:47
  Speaker 2: as we have just heard going to force this by
• 1:20:50
  Speaker 2: election in the hopes that he can reinforce his mandate
• 1:20:54
  Speaker 2: from the British people in the face of this assault.
• 1:20:59
  Speaker 12: Well, I don't think it's an exaggeration to Shay say
• 1:21:03
  Speaker 12: that this is the biggest and greatest publicity stunt in
• 1:21:06
  Speaker 12: the history of British politics, because we've all been on
• 1:21:10
  Speaker 12: the edge of our seats to find out why Nigel
• 1:21:12
  Speaker 12: Farrage was going to gather the nation together and reveal
• 1:21:16
  Speaker 12: his future in public life. It sounded kleb like an
• 1:21:20
  Speaker 12: impending resignation.
• 1:21:22
  Speaker 3: Now.
• 1:21:22
  Speaker 12: I spent half a day with Nigel Farag two weeks
• 1:21:25
  Speaker 12: ago at his Clacton constituency, where as you mentioned there's
• 1:21:28
  Speaker 12: going to be a by election. He looked incredibly happy.
• 1:21:31
  Speaker 12: He looked rested, he looked enthusiastic. He had the bit
• 1:21:33
  Speaker 12: between his teeth. This is the most consequential politician of
• 1:21:37
  Speaker 12: his generation, without ever having achieved power. The United Kingdom
• 1:21:41
  Speaker 12: would still be in the European Union if it wasn't
• 1:21:43
  Speaker 12: for Nigel Farage. All of that happened outside of the
• 1:21:46
  Speaker 12: House of Commons. The debate about immigration has been sparked
• 1:21:50
  Speaker 12: by Nigel ten years ago. He was at Dover looking
• 1:21:53
  Speaker 12: at the illegal crossings. They called him crazy, they laughed. Well,
• 1:21:57
  Speaker 12: they're not laughing now. And this revolutionary figure, once again,
• 1:22:00
  Speaker 12: kaylab broken all the rules, gathered the world's attention help
• 1:22:05
  Speaker 12: this press conference, and has gone the other way and
• 1:22:07
  Speaker 12: said I'm not quitting at all. In fact, I'm doubling
• 1:22:10
  Speaker 12: down iron here to day. Now I can assure you
• 1:22:12
  Speaker 12: I'll give you the exclusive. He will win that by
• 1:22:15
  Speaker 12: election by an order of magnitude. I spent a lot
• 1:22:19
  Speaker 12: of time down in Clacton on Sea. He is an
• 1:22:21
  Speaker 12: iconic figure down there, and what he's seeking to do
• 1:22:25
  Speaker 12: is renew his authority and essentially set the people against
• 1:22:30
  Speaker 12: the establishment.
• 1:22:31
  Speaker 3: And I wouldn't put it past him to win.
• 1:22:35
  Speaker 8: Mark it's Deneka.
• 1:22:37
  Speaker 7: Yeah, you're right, because he said it's the people of
• 1:22:40
  Speaker 7: Clacton who should judge me. He said, it's this is
• 1:22:42
  Speaker 7: a people versus the establishment establishment. By election, I will
• 1:22:47
  Speaker 7: fight for you. And he was very very strong in
• 1:22:50
  Speaker 7: his language on that. What will this now do to
• 1:22:54
  Speaker 7: his base because he's going after the media, he's going
• 1:22:59
  Speaker 7: after his haters. Will that just only galvanize his supporters
• 1:23:04
  Speaker 7: even more?
• 1:23:06
  Speaker 12: Most definitely, I mean, no one saw this coming, Daniaka.
• 1:23:10
  Speaker 12: This is an act of political genius. You've got seasoned
• 1:23:13
  Speaker 12: hats who have been in Cleet Street for decades that
• 1:23:16
  Speaker 12: assumed Nigel was going to stand down because there was
• 1:23:19
  Speaker 12: some unedifying footage of Nigel Farrage being greeted by reporters
• 1:23:24
  Speaker 12: from Sky News UK just after his trip to the
• 1:23:28
  Speaker 12: United States celebrating the July the fourth celebrations, and Farage
• 1:23:32
  Speaker 12: looked exhausted. He got off the plane and he's asked
• 1:23:35
  Speaker 12: about the five million. He's asked about this guy called
• 1:23:37
  Speaker 12: George Cottrell, who is a convicted financier.
• 1:23:41
  Speaker 3: He looked exhausted, he looked angry.
• 1:23:43
  Speaker 12: Clearly does a personal element to this, which is that
• 1:23:46
  Speaker 12: his family are now involved and that's a red line
• 1:23:48
  Speaker 12: for Nigel. He's always kept his family out of politics.
• 1:23:52
  Speaker 12: Unlike a lot of politicians who liked to present the wife,
• 1:23:55
  Speaker 12: present the kids. Nigel is a sole operator as a
• 1:23:58
  Speaker 12: political figure. And I can assure you, Danika, to answer
• 1:24:02
  Speaker 12: your question, this is not going to galvanize the base.
• 1:24:05
  Speaker 3: This is going to ignite.
• 1:24:08
  Speaker 12: It is going to make Nigel farrage and unstoppable force.
• 1:24:12
  Speaker 12: Because the bottom line is that it's the establishment of
• 1:24:15
  Speaker 12: the United Kingdom that have overseen our national decline, and
• 1:24:19
  Speaker 12: that's the broadcasters who have supported this ruinous project of
• 1:24:24
  Speaker 12: net zero, which has given us the highest energy costs
• 1:24:27
  Speaker 12: in the developed world, that has opened the borders and
• 1:24:30
  Speaker 12: issues that Australia dealt with a decade ago, and yet
• 1:24:33
  Speaker 12: for us, upwards of one thousand people land on our
• 1:24:36
  Speaker 12: shawls on a daily basis.
• 1:24:38
  Speaker 3: We don't know who they are.
• 1:24:39
  Speaker 12: Nigel called it out, and don't get me started on
• 1:24:42
  Speaker 12: the economy. I mean I spoke to Nigel two weeks ago.
• 1:24:45
  Speaker 12: We sat down for a long interview from the Daily
• 1:24:47
  Speaker 12: Express and I spent the morning with him. Of course
• 1:24:50
  Speaker 12: it ended up in the pub because that's Nigel, and
• 1:24:52
  Speaker 12: he said, Mark, I'll be honest with you. We got
• 1:24:54
  Speaker 12: ten years to save Britain and if we carry on
• 1:24:57
  Speaker 12: at this rate, the United Kingdom will be a third
• 1:24:59
  Speaker 12: world country. Now that is significant in a language for
• 1:25:03
  Speaker 12: Nigel Flage, but he looked me in the eye and
• 1:25:05
  Speaker 12: he meant every word. So clearly what's happened Danika is
• 1:25:08
  Speaker 12: that he's decided that he's got to save Britain. That
• 1:25:12
  Speaker 12: has been an uncomfortable few days and as the brilliant
• 1:25:15
  Speaker 12: Paul Murray said earlier.
• 1:25:17
  Speaker 3: Reform have had a rough month.
• 1:25:19
  Speaker 12: You know, it is strange to receive a gift of
• 1:25:21
  Speaker 12: five million pounds from a crypto billionaire overseas, and there
• 1:25:27
  Speaker 12: is an issue about George Cottrell, the guy that's been
• 1:25:29
  Speaker 12: paying for his office, who's a convicted felon, so you know,
• 1:25:33
  Speaker 12: and of course they lost the by election, Andy Burnham's
• 1:25:36
  Speaker 12: coming into number ten. So it hasn't been a perfect month.
• 1:25:40
  Speaker 12: But politics is a long game. We're two and a
• 1:25:42
  Speaker 12: half three years away from the general election. In particular,
• 1:25:46
  Speaker 12: I think what Nigel's done is he's launched the boil
• 1:25:49
  Speaker 12: because this issue about the money and the sleeves, it
• 1:25:52
  Speaker 12: was starting to affect his brand, his man and the
• 1:25:55
  Speaker 12: people image, and I think on a personal level, Danika,
• 1:25:59
  Speaker 12: it was starting to eat away at Nigel. WITHO footage
• 1:26:02
  Speaker 12: talking to this sky and his reporters, he looked angry,
• 1:26:04
  Speaker 12: he looked exhausted. In fact, it was like a Nixon
• 1:26:08
  Speaker 12: moment Richard Nixon, you know, when he went on TV unshaven.
• 1:26:11
  Speaker 3: And lost that election to Jfka.
• 1:26:13
  Speaker 12: So I think that what he's done is he's realized,
• 1:26:16
  Speaker 12: you know, like maybe like a boxer that has been
• 1:26:18
  Speaker 12: on the routes, he is actually he's hit, He's hit
• 1:26:22
  Speaker 12: the ground, and then he's decided I'm actually going to
• 1:26:25
  Speaker 12: come out fighting.
• 1:26:26
  Speaker 3: And it's a big moment for British politics.
• 1:26:29
  Speaker 4: Market certainly is it's Joe here. How much do you
• 1:26:31
  Speaker 4: think this speech was directed at his internal critics within
• 1:26:36
  Speaker 4: Reform who may or may not have been leaking against
• 1:26:38
  Speaker 4: him or plotting to replace him, and indeed other parties
• 1:26:42
  Speaker 4: on the right like Restore that could split further the
• 1:26:45
  Speaker 4: Conservative vote and undermine reforms chances of beating Labor. Was
• 1:26:49
  Speaker 4: this as much as a stance of defiance against his
• 1:26:53
  Speaker 4: own side as it was to the government.
• 1:26:56
  Speaker 12: Yes, I think that's a brilliant point, and I think
• 1:26:58
  Speaker 12: that we know the all political parties are just absolutely
• 1:27:01
  Speaker 12: full of ambitious people who want the top job. It
• 1:27:05
  Speaker 12: was ever thus and it's like a Shakespearean play, isn't it,
• 1:27:08
  Speaker 12: And someone's going to wield the dagger. I've never heard
• 1:27:12
  Speaker 12: of a united political party because people go into politics
• 1:27:17
  Speaker 12: to make a difference, but also to achieve power and
• 1:27:20
  Speaker 12: get the top job. So yeah, the bottom line is
• 1:27:22
  Speaker 12: that it's a flex isn't it. It's a reassertion from
• 1:27:27
  Speaker 12: Nigel Farage, it's a statement and yeah, you know what
• 1:27:31
  Speaker 12: this guy is doing is he's fighting a war on
• 1:27:34
  Speaker 12: several fronts. He's got the establishment, he's got the media,
• 1:27:37
  Speaker 12: he's got the governing Labor Party, and yes he's got
• 1:27:41
  Speaker 12: figures on the right.
• 1:27:42
  Speaker 3: So Rupert Low.
• 1:27:43
  Speaker 12: He's a very talented politician, former businessman of cause.
• 1:27:46
  Speaker 3: Very articulate.
• 1:27:47
  Speaker 12: Elon Musk is a big fan, so that's a threat
• 1:27:49
  Speaker 12: restore UK. Then he's got the Conservatives, who, yes, their
• 1:27:53
  Speaker 12: reputation is absolutely in the toilets at the moment, but
• 1:27:57
  Speaker 12: they've got a couple of years to regroup, and I
• 1:27:59
  Speaker 12: think underestimate at your peril because they've been around for
• 1:28:01
  Speaker 12: a couple of hundred years. They're the most successful political
• 1:28:04
  Speaker 12: party in the history of Western democracy.
• 1:28:07
  Speaker 3: So they're down, but they're not out. So yeah, the
• 1:28:09
  Speaker 3: guy is battling it.
• 1:28:10
  Speaker 12: In terms of the internal politics within reform, I don't
• 1:28:14
  Speaker 12: think that was ever hugely in doubt because you've got
• 1:28:16
  Speaker 12: figures like Zia Yusef who is the shadow Home Secretary.
• 1:28:20
  Speaker 3: He'll be dealing with immigration and law and order.
• 1:28:22
  Speaker 12: If he becomes a reform win, then you're Robert Jenrick
• 1:28:25
  Speaker 12: who came over from the Tories. He would be the
• 1:28:28
  Speaker 12: shadow Chancellor so he look after the economy. None of
• 1:28:31
  Speaker 12: these people have the footprints, the status, the profile, the
• 1:28:38
  Speaker 12: recognition and indeed the character and personality of Nigel. I'm
• 1:28:42
  Speaker 12: going to be honest with you, guys, will reform ukate
• 1:28:45
  Speaker 12: is the Nigel Show and if we were reflecting on
• 1:28:47
  Speaker 12: his resignation, then it's over. But it turns out it's
• 1:28:51
  Speaker 12: quite the opposite based upon this press conference.
• 1:28:54
  Speaker 3: It's on and it's on Big time market.
• 1:28:57
  Speaker 5: Paul Murray and the main Cave. Firstly, your background, I
• 1:29:01
  Speaker 5: love you over time a little bit, just a little bit. No, no,
• 1:29:07
  Speaker 5: this is for the love here right now.
• 1:29:09
  Speaker 10: Listening to some of the speculation, right is that if
• 1:29:13
  Speaker 10: they're with this by election now and again I agree
• 1:29:15
  Speaker 10: with you about the stunt portion of this, but again
• 1:29:19
  Speaker 10: the genius of the tactic to go and as soon
• 1:29:21
  Speaker 10: as I saw those two flags behind him and went oh,
• 1:29:23
  Speaker 10: this is the prime ministerial play, right and it was
• 1:29:25
  Speaker 10: beautiful setting you automatically new that's not somebody who's pulling
• 1:29:28
  Speaker 10: the pin.
• 1:29:28
  Speaker 5: That's a bloke who's doubling down.
• 1:29:30
  Speaker 10: Now, obviously we all find out in real time in
• 1:29:33
  Speaker 10: the next little while about how many people will end
• 1:29:35
  Speaker 10: up running for the by election. Do you think that
• 1:29:39
  Speaker 10: there's a possibility that Andy Burnham, after being essentially freshly reelected,
• 1:29:45
  Speaker 10: freshly becoming the Prime Minister Labor, doesn't take part in
• 1:29:49
  Speaker 10: the by election, that the Lib Dems don't, and they'll
• 1:29:53
  Speaker 10: see that potentially this Restore versus Reform fracture could end
• 1:29:58
  Speaker 10: up being quite an ugly fight, and that would most
• 1:30:01
  Speaker 10: likely be what they believe to be the tactical way
• 1:30:06
  Speaker 10: of money. Nigel Farage up because it's pretty obvious he
• 1:30:09
  Speaker 10: knows how to take on Team really knows how to
• 1:30:11
  Speaker 10: take on Team Blue. He knows how to take on
• 1:30:13
  Speaker 10: Team Orange, but he hasn't quite got his hands around,
• 1:30:17
  Speaker 10: certainly the online stuff that comes with Restore.
• 1:30:23
  Speaker 3: Most definitely.
• 1:30:23
  Speaker 12: And the relationship between Donald Trump and Nigel Farage has cooled,
• 1:30:27
  Speaker 12: and Nigel's just got back from the State's Poor He
• 1:30:29
  Speaker 12: wasn't granted an audience with the President, which is quite
• 1:30:33
  Speaker 12: a different scenario to how their relationship was two or
• 1:30:36
  Speaker 12: three years ago. He gets a photo op with the
• 1:30:39
  Speaker 12: Vice president. Meanwhile, Rupelo endlessly being retweeted by Elon Musk
• 1:30:44
  Speaker 12: And it's my understanding that Trump and Myers rup below.
• 1:30:47
  Speaker 3: So, I mean, that's a fascinating thought.
• 1:30:49
  Speaker 12: The idea that Labor and the lib Dems, you know,
• 1:30:51
  Speaker 12: the political left in the United Kingdom should set a
• 1:30:54
  Speaker 12: bear trap for Faras by not running is tantalizing.
• 1:30:57
  Speaker 3: It would be a powerful move I think.
• 1:30:59
  Speaker 12: It's unlikely though, Paul, because these legacy parties they still
• 1:31:04
  Speaker 12: like to be seen to be represented at every national pole.
• 1:31:08
  Speaker 12: There was a debate about whether the Tories should have
• 1:31:10
  Speaker 12: stood down their candidate at the Makerfield by election in
• 1:31:14
  Speaker 12: order to help keep Andy Burnham out of Number ten.
• 1:31:17
  Speaker 12: But the Tories are thinking, look, you know, we're this
• 1:31:19
  Speaker 12: iconic brand. There's no way that we're going to step
• 1:31:21
  Speaker 12: away from from the fight. And I think that's probably
• 1:31:24
  Speaker 12: what will happen with Labor and the Lib Dems, and
• 1:31:27
  Speaker 12: Nigel's going to win, and he's going to win big
• 1:31:29
  Speaker 12: time in this constituency. I will say another thing, which
• 1:31:32
  Speaker 12: is that I'm not sure how entirely necessary all of
• 1:31:35
  Speaker 12: this is, because it's priced in that Nigel Farage is
• 1:31:39
  Speaker 12: a character.
• 1:31:40
  Speaker 3: He's a maverick.
• 1:31:42
  Speaker 12: You know, he's not like, he's not a British Donald Trump,
• 1:31:45
  Speaker 12: but he's you know, he's no angel that this guy's
• 1:31:48
  Speaker 12: never presented himself as the Archbital of Canterbury.
• 1:31:51
  Speaker 3: You know, he's been divorced a couple of times. He's
• 1:31:54
  Speaker 3: got a French girlfriend.
• 1:31:55
  Speaker 12: Now he enjoys a good lunch, which I think, as
• 1:31:59
  Speaker 12: you know, as a youthmis and for quite a liquid lunch.
• 1:32:01
  Speaker 12: He's a bon viva and also he's a very enterprising
• 1:32:06
  Speaker 12: man and he likes the high life.
• 1:32:08
  Speaker 3: So I think where where he's an ex film for this.
• 1:32:13
  Speaker 12: By the way, I think that ambulance is on its
• 1:32:15
  Speaker 12: way to the High Court because I believe Prince Harry
• 1:32:17
  Speaker 12: has just fainted having lost his ast to Daily Mail.
• 1:32:24
  Speaker 5: Harry.
• 1:32:25
  Speaker 3: I'm sure all come to that.
• 1:32:26
  Speaker 12: Prince Harry has lost his legal action against the Daily Mault.
• 1:32:29
  Speaker 12: It could cost him millions of dollars and Elton's lost
• 1:32:32
  Speaker 12: as well. Elton John Elton can afford it, Harry cart
• 1:32:34
  Speaker 12: But we'll come back to that. You know, guys, it's
• 1:32:37
  Speaker 12: priced in. Nigel Farrage is a bit of a roadue
• 1:32:40
  Speaker 12: and therefore I'm not sure how incredibly damaging these financial
• 1:32:44
  Speaker 12: allegations were. And I don't white know why Nigel is
• 1:32:47
  Speaker 12: decided to pull this rather significant lever, but either way,
• 1:32:52
  Speaker 12: it's another surprise from.
• 1:32:53
  Speaker 3: This incredibly unpredictable guy. And I can, as Denika was asking.
• 1:32:58
  Speaker 12: Me earlier, it's going to enliven the base and it's
• 1:33:00
  Speaker 12: going to silence his critics. I mean, the only other
• 1:33:03
  Speaker 12: issue we've got is what you mentioned earlier, Paul, could
• 1:33:06
  Speaker 12: Andy Burnham decide actually, now's the time I meet all
• 1:33:09
  Speaker 12: of this turmoil to call a general election.
• 1:33:12
  Speaker 2: Indeed, Mark Dolin, thanks so much for jumping in for
• 1:33:15
  Speaker 2: us this evening, our time. I see now it's twenty
• 1:33:18
  Speaker 2: to three in the afternoon. Where you mentioned a liquid
• 1:33:21
  Speaker 2: lunch there, I'm sure it's time for you to go
• 1:33:23
  Speaker 2: off and have a pint after working so hard for
• 1:33:26
  Speaker 2: us this evening. Mark, great to see was always and
• 1:33:29
  Speaker 2: thank you for your insights. We'll bring in now. News
• 1:33:31
  Speaker 2: Corp Europe correspondent Sophie Ellsworth. Sophie, as Mark was talking
• 1:33:36
  Speaker 2: about there, it is a big lever for Nagel Ferrage
• 1:33:40
  Speaker 2: to pull because, as he says, I don't think this
• 1:33:42
  Speaker 2: stuff actually really affects him in the public's view. They
• 1:33:47
  Speaker 2: factor in to someone like Nagel Ferras, just as they
• 1:33:50
  Speaker 2: factor in to someone like a Donald Trump, or they
• 1:33:53
  Speaker 2: factor into a one nation party in Australia, that it's
• 1:33:56
  Speaker 2: not perfect, that perhaps the policies are not fully costed,
• 1:34:00
  Speaker 2: perhaps these people have made mistakes in their lives or
• 1:34:03
  Speaker 2: not morally pure, but it doesn't matter because they're upset
• 1:34:08
  Speaker 2: with what they otherwise see what is offered to them
• 1:34:11
  Speaker 2: by the major parties. I think the reason Nigel Farrache
• 1:34:14
  Speaker 2: has decided to pull the lever for a by election
• 1:34:18
  Speaker 2: now is that he has to go and do this
• 1:34:21
  Speaker 2: and then that'll prove his point, assuming that he is reelected.
• 1:34:24
  Speaker 2: But if the Standards Committee then finds him guilty of
• 1:34:27
  Speaker 2: breaking the rules, he'll have to go to another by election.
• 1:34:31
  Speaker 2: So what he's set up is essentially he could twice
• 1:34:35
  Speaker 2: go and beat the establishment, as he puts it, in
• 1:34:38
  Speaker 2: this fight.
• 1:34:41
  Speaker 13: Well, Caleb, if you ever thought British politics was not interesting,
• 1:34:45
  Speaker 13: it's certainly a great time to be here in the
• 1:34:48
  Speaker 13: UK because.
• 1:34:48
  Speaker 14: It is absolutely all happening.
• 1:34:51
  Speaker 13: I mean, hours before Nigel Farrage gave that video address
• 1:34:55
  Speaker 13: that was released, there were no media. It was obviously
• 1:34:58
  Speaker 13: an address that was issue UYA the different TV networks
• 1:35:02
  Speaker 13: and radio stations. He is showing that he's incredibly angry.
• 1:35:06
  Speaker 13: He feels that he's been treated unfairly in the media,
• 1:35:10
  Speaker 13: he's been scrutinized unfairly, and he's triggered this by election now,
• 1:35:14
  Speaker 13: which he should win easily.
• 1:35:16
  Speaker 14: I doubt that he would.
• 1:35:18
  Speaker 13: Lose that by election, but the questions are remaining about
• 1:35:22
  Speaker 13: this significant five million pound gift that he received, and
• 1:35:26
  Speaker 13: whether or not he broke any parliamentary rules.
• 1:35:29
  Speaker 14: Now he's saying that he didn't. He's saying that he
• 1:35:32
  Speaker 14: had done nothing wrong.
• 1:35:34
  Speaker 13: But this is really, as he said, a moment for
• 1:35:37
  Speaker 13: him to stick the two fingers up to the establishment.
• 1:35:40
  Speaker 7: Here.
• 1:35:41
  Speaker 13: Let the British people decide do they want this guy
• 1:35:43
  Speaker 13: to stay around or they do they want him to go?
• 1:35:46
  Speaker 13: And I think he can sense in that video address
• 1:35:49
  Speaker 13: how angry he is. Particularly also when the media approached
• 1:35:54
  Speaker 13: his daughter at her home, they published a photo of
• 1:35:57
  Speaker 13: her house in the paper. She is non political. He
• 1:36:00
  Speaker 13: said he's never had her involved in his political life.
• 1:36:04
  Speaker 13: He is absolutely furious, Caleb, and I think a lot
• 1:36:08
  Speaker 13: of British voters are furious. We've got a guy who
• 1:36:11
  Speaker 13: is the Manchester mayor who's about to walk into ten
• 1:36:15
  Speaker 13: Downing Street in a couple of weeks. He didn't go
• 1:36:18
  Speaker 13: to an election. He's going to waltz in and get
• 1:36:20
  Speaker 13: the keys and start running the country. There is a
• 1:36:22
  Speaker 13: lot of angry people here on the ground and I
• 1:36:26
  Speaker 13: think Nigel Varraj is showing that in his address today.
• 1:36:29
  Speaker 2: Indeed, if you're just tuning in, this is a little
• 1:36:31
  Speaker 2: bit of that address from in the last hour.
• 1:36:35
  Speaker 6: I thought about it hard and I've decided today Today
• 1:36:38
  Speaker 6: I will resign as a Member of Parliament for Clacton
• 1:36:42
  Speaker 6: on Sea, thereby forcing a by election, which would happen
• 1:36:47
  Speaker 6: I hope in short order. Now I've decided that the
• 1:36:51
  Speaker 6: people of Clapton should be the judges of my actions.
• 1:36:55
  Speaker 6: This will be a people versus the establishment by election, Sophie.
• 1:37:01
  Speaker 2: There's also just been a statement from the Labor chairwoman
• 1:37:05
  Speaker 2: an At Turly. She's accused Nigel Frag of playing the
• 1:37:09
  Speaker 2: victim in this by election announcement. She said, imagine getting
• 1:37:14
  Speaker 2: a free party political broadcast on all news broadcasters to
• 1:37:18
  Speaker 2: play the victim when you've broken the rules, I suppose
• 1:37:23
  Speaker 2: again it goes back to the previous point. It's not
• 1:37:25
  Speaker 2: yet been established that he has broken the rules, but
• 1:37:29
  Speaker 2: the rule book when it comes to politics has been
• 1:37:32
  Speaker 2: torn up.
• 1:37:34
  Speaker 13: Well, she needs to be very careful Caleb saying these things,
• 1:37:38
  Speaker 13: because he maybe question over this in the coming weeks,
• 1:37:42
  Speaker 13: and I think she needs to not jump the gun.
• 1:37:45
  Speaker 13: We need to see has he, according to the rule book,
• 1:37:48
  Speaker 13: done anything wrong, and to date it appears that he
• 1:37:52
  Speaker 13: has not done anything wrong. Now there's a difference between
• 1:37:55
  Speaker 13: that and does it past the pub test. Now we
• 1:37:58
  Speaker 13: know Nigel Frage, he's known as a knock about bloke.
• 1:38:01
  Speaker 13: He loves to sink a pint, he loves to have
• 1:38:04
  Speaker 13: a cigar, he loves to have a yap with the
• 1:38:07
  Speaker 13: general punters. He's a man of the people, or he
• 1:38:09
  Speaker 13: tries to show that he's a man of the people.
• 1:38:12
  Speaker 13: And what his critics are saying after you receive this
• 1:38:15
  Speaker 13: five million dollar pound gift.
• 1:38:18
  Speaker 14: That it shows that he's not a man of the people.
• 1:38:21
  Speaker 13: So you've got to understand for the viewers here, there
• 1:38:24
  Speaker 13: are people desperate to bring this guy down. He's the
• 1:38:28
  Speaker 13: biggest threat in British politics right now and they can
• 1:38:31
  Speaker 13: sense it. In those over three hundred polls, I think
• 1:38:34
  Speaker 13: he said he'd won consecutor to consecutively. He's the guy
• 1:38:38
  Speaker 13: that could be the next prime minister when there is
• 1:38:40
  Speaker 13: a general election. So I can assure you there's a
• 1:38:43
  Speaker 13: lot of people in Westminster on the opposite side of
• 1:38:46
  Speaker 13: the political spectrum hoping this is the end of him.
• 1:38:49
  Speaker 14: But Caleb, I think it's far from it.
• 1:38:52
  Speaker 8: Well, that's you know, I think that's an interesting point.
• 1:38:54
  Speaker 8: As Sophie. It's Danika.
• 1:38:57
  Speaker 7: You know, we've got already Labor or coming out and
• 1:39:00
  Speaker 7: yet he's broken the rules. They've already made up their minds.
• 1:39:04
  Speaker 7: But I just wonder maybe internally.
• 1:39:07
  Speaker 8: Within Labor, even within the Tories, how.
• 1:39:09
  Speaker 7: Concerned they would be because this is a man who's
• 1:39:12
  Speaker 7: only going to get stronger.
• 1:39:13
  Speaker 8: His base are going to rally right behind him.
• 1:39:17
  Speaker 7: He's going to look the establishment in the eye, as
• 1:39:19
  Speaker 7: he has said, he said this is people versus the establishment.
• 1:39:23
  Speaker 8: Now he is not going to back down.
• 1:39:25
  Speaker 7: He is going to take them on and take the
• 1:39:27
  Speaker 7: fight straight to this by election. I just wander behind
• 1:39:31
  Speaker 7: the scenes from all sides of the political spectrum that
• 1:39:35
  Speaker 7: internally they're going to be worried that this will actually
• 1:39:38
  Speaker 7: have a completely different effect to what they are hoping.
• 1:39:42
  Speaker 14: Well, that's right, Janika.
• 1:39:43
  Speaker 13: And there's so many moving parts because we've got Secure
• 1:39:46
  Speaker 13: Starmer packing his suitcases.
• 1:39:48
  Speaker 14: Right now, getting ready to get out of Downing Street.
• 1:39:51
  Speaker 13: We've got Andy burnh and packing his suitcases in Manchester
• 1:39:54
  Speaker 13: and about to roll them into Downing Streets. We're about
• 1:39:57
  Speaker 13: to get a new Prime minister. We've got many Aidennok
• 1:40:00
  Speaker 13: who's doing quite well in the polls despite the fact
• 1:40:03
  Speaker 13: that Britain's can't stand the Conservative Party. They're furious at
• 1:40:07
  Speaker 13: what they did to this country in the last fourteen years.
• 1:40:10
  Speaker 13: And then we've got Reform UK now with their leader
• 1:40:13
  Speaker 13: standing down from his position as an MP and forcing
• 1:40:16
  Speaker 13: a by election. So there's lots of different aspects to this,
• 1:40:20
  Speaker 13: but I think his base will rally behind him. I
• 1:40:24
  Speaker 13: think he will come out, he will win that by
• 1:40:27
  Speaker 13: election easily and he'll be able to say, well, I
• 1:40:29
  Speaker 13: put it to the voters and they wanted me to stay.
• 1:40:32
  Speaker 13: But I can assure you there's many people trying their
• 1:40:35
  Speaker 13: utmost to put an end to Nigel Fraj's a political
• 1:40:40
  Speaker 13: career and Tanika just in the few hours in the
• 1:40:42
  Speaker 13: lead up to this press conference, there was a lot
• 1:40:45
  Speaker 13: of chatter here in the British in the British media, radio, talkback,
• 1:40:49
  Speaker 13: radio TV.
• 1:40:51
  Speaker 14: Is he going to resign? I mean, Westminster was on
• 1:40:54
  Speaker 14: tenter hooks. So it's tensions are high at the moment.
• 1:40:58
  Speaker 13: Nigel Fara's angry and the next few weeks, if not months,
• 1:41:02
  Speaker 13: are going to be incredibly fascinating here in the UK.
• 1:41:05
  Speaker 4: Sophie, it's Joe here and one of the reasons, or
• 1:41:08
  Speaker 4: the main reason in Nigel Farage is so angry is
• 1:41:11
  Speaker 4: because Sky News UK no relation. He said they approached
• 1:41:16
  Speaker 4: his daughter's home. Let's just have a listen to him
• 1:41:19
  Speaker 4: talking about that.
• 1:41:20
  Speaker 6: For some reason, last week the editor of the Times
• 1:41:23
  Speaker 6: newspaper decided to publish a picture of where my daughter lives.
• 1:41:30
  Speaker 6: There is no public interest in my daughter whatsoever. She
• 1:41:34
  Speaker 6: is not involved in current affairs, doesn't seek to be
• 1:41:37
  Speaker 6: involved in current affairs, and has never been used by
• 1:41:40
  Speaker 6: me once at any point in my political career, no
• 1:41:44
  Speaker 6: photographs on election addresses or anything like that. I've always
• 1:41:48
  Speaker 6: done my absolute best to protect the privacy and safety
• 1:41:54
  Speaker 6: of my family. By publishing that photograph, the editor of
• 1:41:58
  Speaker 6: the Times has directly threatened her security. Will let me
• 1:42:03
  Speaker 6: be clear, I will not tolerate intimidation of my family.
• 1:42:08
  Speaker 6: I will not tolerate the location of where they live
• 1:42:12
  Speaker 6: being revealed.
• 1:42:13
  Speaker 4: I will not.
• 1:42:14
  Speaker 6: Tolerate any of my family being endangered because of what
• 1:42:18
  Speaker 6: I choose to do in public life. So yes, you
• 1:42:22
  Speaker 6: can ask am I angry? Well, I've never been angrier
• 1:42:26
  Speaker 6: in my life.
• 1:42:28
  Speaker 4: It's powerful stuff. So that Sky News UK says they
• 1:42:32
  Speaker 4: never approached that house or his daughter or anything like it.
• 1:42:36
  Speaker 4: Both those things can't be true. Do you think though
• 1:42:40
  Speaker 4: it even matters. Do you think the narrative is just
• 1:42:42
  Speaker 4: all with Farage?
• 1:42:43
  Speaker 14: Now, so there's a part here, Jo.
• 1:42:47
  Speaker 13: We've got the Times of London who published that photograph
• 1:42:51
  Speaker 13: that is separate to sky News UK, which wasn't in
• 1:42:54
  Speaker 13: that clip. Sky News UK is not related to sky
• 1:42:58
  Speaker 13: News Australia. They're separate entities, just so the viewers are clear. However,
• 1:43:02
  Speaker 13: sky News UK interviewed Nigel Frage when he flew back
• 1:43:07
  Speaker 13: in from America and he basically said enough, stay away
• 1:43:12
  Speaker 13: from my family. He was furious and they came out
• 1:43:16
  Speaker 13: on their reports and said they did not approach his family.
• 1:43:18
  Speaker 13: Now it's since come out that they did approach the family.
• 1:43:22
  Speaker 13: It was off camera, they said who they were and
• 1:43:26
  Speaker 13: then they left the premises. So there's quite a lot
• 1:43:28
  Speaker 13: of mixed messages going on here, Joe. He's very very cross.
• 1:43:33
  Speaker 13: He feels that the media are treating him unfairly. He
• 1:43:36
  Speaker 13: doesn't like his family, which many people would argue rightly,
• 1:43:40
  Speaker 13: so getting caught up in this and.
• 1:43:42
  Speaker 14: You can sense that anger in his comments there, Joe.
• 1:43:46
  Speaker 2: And so for you, we've just had a statement come
• 1:43:48
  Speaker 2: through from Rupert Lowe, who is, of course the leader
• 1:43:51
  Speaker 2: of Restore Britain when he splintered away from Reform. He
• 1:43:56
  Speaker 2: has said Faraj has proven one thing today and one
• 1:43:59
  Speaker 2: thing only. Everything that he does is about one person,
• 1:44:02
  Speaker 2: Nigel Farage. The people of Clacton do not need a
• 1:44:05
  Speaker 2: media circus descending on their town over a busy tourist
• 1:44:09
  Speaker 2: season because their MP has made a series of banned decisions.
• 1:44:12
  Speaker 2: He should have declared that five million pounds. He knows it,
• 1:44:15
  Speaker 2: We all know it now. He is going to weaponize
• 1:44:18
  Speaker 2: a by election to distract from that. This is going
• 1:44:20
  Speaker 2: to cost the taxpayer a fortune, a quarter of a
• 1:44:24
  Speaker 2: million pounds, he says, I watering sums of money. Think
• 1:44:27
  Speaker 2: about what that money could do for the people of Clacton.
• 1:44:31
  Speaker 2: And I'm not sure though, whether the people of Clacton
• 1:44:35
  Speaker 2: are going to be jumping up and down Sophie about
• 1:44:37
  Speaker 2: the fact that he's called a by election, because as
• 1:44:40
  Speaker 2: I suspect, as you have said, they'll re elect him
• 1:44:42
  Speaker 2: in a canter.
• 1:44:45
  Speaker 14: Well that's right, Kayleb.
• 1:44:47
  Speaker 13: But Rupert Lowe despises Nigel Frush, so you have to
• 1:44:50
  Speaker 13: remember where he's coming from on this. Those two are
• 1:44:53
  Speaker 13: allies now. They can't bear the side of each other.
• 1:44:56
  Speaker 13: Also not forgetting that Andy Burnham had that election up
• 1:45:00
  Speaker 13: in make Afield that cost tax pays a lot of
• 1:45:03
  Speaker 13: money too, when the chat before him stood down to
• 1:45:07
  Speaker 13: make way for Andy Burnham to contest in the by election,
• 1:45:10
  Speaker 13: win it and now get the keys to ten Downing Street.
• 1:45:13
  Speaker 13: So Rupert Low, we expect him to attack Nigel Farage.
• 1:45:18
  Speaker 13: He's obviously got his own Restore Britain right leaning political party,
• 1:45:23
  Speaker 13: which is proving.
• 1:45:24
  Speaker 14: Some threat to reform, not a lot.
• 1:45:27
  Speaker 13: They didn't do overly well in the Makeerfield by election,
• 1:45:30
  Speaker 13: but look it's a grubby business, Caleb. You can see
• 1:45:33
  Speaker 13: people are throwing stones from every angle here. But Nigel
• 1:45:37
  Speaker 13: Farrage I think will survive this, and I think it
• 1:45:40
  Speaker 13: will probably make him stronger, and it will probably make
• 1:45:43
  Speaker 13: his supporters even more so get behind him and throw
• 1:45:48
  Speaker 13: their support behind him.
• 1:45:49
  Speaker 14: So I don't think this will do him immense lot
• 1:45:52
  Speaker 14: of amense harm at all.
• 1:45:54
  Speaker 2: So feels worth. Thank you for joining us in your insights.
• 1:45:56
  Speaker 2: As always, let's bring Paul Murray back in the first
• 1:45:59
  Speaker 2: time we've had a chants to talk to Paul after
• 1:46:01
  Speaker 2: the speech. What were your immediate thoughts, mate?
• 1:46:04
  Speaker 5: He hited out of the park. I mean for what
• 1:46:06
  Speaker 5: he wanted to do, regardless with you like or dislike him.
• 1:46:09
  Speaker 5: I obviously like him. He hit it out of the park.
• 1:46:11
  Speaker 10: I mean, think about the fact that he just had
• 1:46:14
  Speaker 10: fifteen minutes of global television, right global television. This was
• 1:46:19
  Speaker 10: on arsubs on C and then obviously BBC Wall to
• 1:46:23
  Speaker 10: wall in the UK and on the radio, because of
• 1:46:25
  Speaker 10: course there was the specter that he was about to resign. Ironically,
• 1:46:29
  Speaker 10: the very people who he is talking about as being
• 1:46:34
  Speaker 10: the people who are trying to bring about his end
• 1:46:37
  Speaker 10: have delivered him this incredible megaphone where he has been
• 1:46:42
  Speaker 10: able to shape the allegations against him when it comes
• 1:46:47
  Speaker 10: to donations, to leapfrog the process that he claims is
• 1:46:51
  Speaker 10: rigged against him because it's MPs, of course, all the
• 1:46:54
  Speaker 10: MPs that are against him, and he throws it into
• 1:46:57
  Speaker 10: a position where it's a by election where you notice,
• 1:47:00
  Speaker 10: even in the Rupert Low tweet, he didn't say that
• 1:47:03
  Speaker 10: Restored was going to be running at that by election.
• 1:47:05
  Speaker 10: So again there could be this early days Mark Dolan
• 1:47:09
  Speaker 10: suggesting that everyone probably gets in because hey, it's an
• 1:47:12
  Speaker 10: opportunity to get in. There's a chance that maybe very
• 1:47:15
  Speaker 10: few get in and essentially it's a very expensive stunt,
• 1:47:19
  Speaker 10: but certainly it's one that's going to produce a result,
• 1:47:23
  Speaker 10: presumably for Nigel Faras that he's able to point to
• 1:47:26
  Speaker 10: whatever the next phase of the donation situation is. But
• 1:47:30
  Speaker 10: I've got to say again if you're a fan of Farage,
• 1:47:34
  Speaker 10: and for the people in the UK who are a
• 1:47:36
  Speaker 10: of fan of Farage who see and want him to
• 1:47:39
  Speaker 10: be the wrecking ball to both sides of establishment politics
• 1:47:45
  Speaker 10: that have caused much of the systemic problems that are
• 1:47:49
  Speaker 10: now in existence in the UK, well.
• 1:47:52
  Speaker 5: He hit it right on the head.
• 1:47:53
  Speaker 10: To all the people who hate him, it's a rush
• 1:47:56
  Speaker 10: Act test and they'll find new ways to say that
• 1:47:58
  Speaker 10: it's the single most offensive thing seen somebody do.
• 1:48:01
  Speaker 5: And of course the.
• 1:48:03
  Speaker 10: Media who always have had it in for Farage. But
• 1:48:05
  Speaker 10: remember with this bloke, this is a guy who literally
• 1:48:08
  Speaker 10: got debanked. So if he can come back from when
• 1:48:11
  Speaker 10: they tried to literally take away his bank account, there's
• 1:48:15
  Speaker 10: no way he was going to give up tonight. He
• 1:48:17
  Speaker 10: was always going to fight and he will fight like
• 1:48:19
  Speaker 10: hell between now and presumably when he gets sent back into.
• 1:48:23
  Speaker 2: The parm Indeed, Paul Murray, thank you for sticking around
• 1:48:25
  Speaker 2: tonight and for helping us along through all this. We've
• 1:48:28
  Speaker 2: got twenty seconds to go very quickly, Janika, what do
• 1:48:31
  Speaker 2: you think.
• 1:48:32
  Speaker 8: I think he will fight now and I think he
• 1:48:33
  Speaker 8: will win it. Come to Blake, Joe, I.
• 1:48:35
  Speaker 2: Think he smashed it to say, I don't think there's
• 1:48:38
  Speaker 2: any other real analysis of that. Of course, extraordinary news
• 1:48:41
  Speaker 2: tonight Nagilfrage, the leader of Reform UK, saying that he
• 1:48:45
  Speaker 2: will be sticking around and causing a by election in Clacton.
• 1:48:48
  Speaker 2: Thank you so much for joining us tonight up next
• 1:48:51
  Speaker 2: Newsnight with all of this