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Grace That Shatters Our Merit System · Main Thing Podcast

• 0:19
  Speaker 1: Thank you, reminder for us to recall in today's divisive and dark culture, from foundational truths and scripture to the hot topics of today's culture.
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: Allow this podcast to inspire and motivate you on your faith journey.
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: Well, good morning, pastor, steve.
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: Good morning, glad to be here with you again.
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: Great to be here.
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: Welcome to everyone who's watching or listening.
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: We're on episode 21 this morning and we're going to be in Matthew, chapter 20, verses 1 through 16, the workers in the vineyard.
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: So I'm going to read that and we'll jump right in.
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: So Matthew, chapter 20, verses 1 through 16.
• 0:56
  Speaker 1: For the kingdom of heaven is like a landowner who went out early in the morning to hire laborers for his vineyard.
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: When he had agreed with the laborers for denarius for the day, he sent them into his vineyard.
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: When he had agreed with the laborers for denarius for the day, he sent them into his vineyard.
• 1:06
  Speaker 1: And he went out about the third hour and saw others standing idle in the marketplace, and to those he said you also go into the vineyard and whatever is right I will give you.
• 1:15
  Speaker 1: And so they went Again.
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: He went out about the sixth and ninth hour and did the same thing, and about the eleventh hour he went and found others standing around and he said to them why have you been standing here idle all day?
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: They said to him, because no one hired us.
• 1:29
  Speaker 1: He said to them Go into the vineyard too.
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: When evening came, the owner of the vineyard said to his foreman Call the laborers and pay them their wages, beginning with the last group to the first.
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: When those hired about the eleventh hour came, each one received a denarius.
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: When those hired about the eleventh hour came, each one received a denarius.
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: When those hired first came, they thought they would receive more, but each of them also received the same pay.
• 1:52
  Speaker 1: When they received it they grumbled at the landowner saying these last men have worked only one hour and you have made them equal to us who have borne the burden in the scorching heat of the day.
• 2:02
  Speaker 1: But he answered and said to them Friend, I am doing you no wrong.
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: Did you not agree with me for a denarius, take what.
• 2:08
  Speaker 1: So the opening question, Steve's kind of spur us on this morning, is why does God's grace sometimes offend our human sense of fairness?
• 2:34
  Speaker 2: It's a good question, I think, especially in America, we're wired for a reward system, and the better we do or the better we comply, the better we follow the rules, the more we achieve it's usually associated with greater reward, and so I think it's probably human nature, at least in our culture, to feel like we're being wronged in some way If someone else who hasn't done as much as us should possibly get the same reward that we would get.
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and just like you said, the human comparison to God's grace.
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: I think in a sense God did not wire us in a way to fully understand his generosity and his heavenly grace towards us.
• 3:30
  Speaker 2: I think it's beyond our comprehension, to be honest with you, when you look at the fallen state of humanity and that God offers the same grace to every one of us.
• 3:41
  Speaker 2: That just doesn't register for us.
• 3:45
  Speaker 2: If I'm a good person, I don't cuss, drink, chew or run with girls that do, I don't kick my dog, I don't mistreat my wife, how in the world can a guy that's been a vile human being get the same grace from God that I got?
• 4:04
  Speaker 2: That's why I say I think it's beyond our comprehension to be honest.
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: Right, I was visiting a church member one time and he said come here, he's about 80, 85, and he showed me this chain.
• 4:20
  Speaker 1: I mean that's the best chain of medallions of perfect Sunday school attendance for like 30 years.
• 4:27
  Speaker 1: And you can tell that was his.
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: He was prideful of that, that was serious for him and I think that goes in line with just what you said, just the human nature that we have to work towards something you know.
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: Yes, now Scripture is very clear.
• 4:40
  Speaker 2: Yes, now Scripture is very clear and there's been very little written on it.
• 4:46
  Speaker 2: There is reward for being one of God's children and being obedient, and so the concept of reward is huge throughout the New Testament and I think probably the average academian the guys who write the books are afraid to address it for whatever reason because there's very little written about it, but the concept of reward is there beginning to end.
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: Right, let's talk a little bit about the relationship between works and reward.
• 5:19
  Speaker 1: We know that it's good to work, you get rewarded here, but there's also rewards in heaven, and Scripture actually says that if you seek rewards here on earth, that you'll lose rewards in heaven, and so let's talk a little bit about that.
• 5:32
  Speaker 1: What does that mean, steve?
• 5:35
  Speaker 2: Well, it's another example of our human nature.
• 5:40
  Speaker 2: We love to be recognized, we love plaques, we love bonuses, we love whatever that says to us we appreciate you, you're doing a good job, we want you to know it, and I think the understanding of Scripture is that you live obedient.
• 5:57
  Speaker 2: You do what you ought to do for Christ and you are willing to be patient for him to reward you in due time in his timing.
• 6:08
  Speaker 2: But as humans, we want to be rewarded now for what we've done.
• 6:16
  Speaker 2: We can't help ourselves, and so I think what the Lord is saying there, if I understand it correctly, is that if you've got to be rewarded for what you did right now, that's fine, you can have that, but there's nothing for you in heaven.
• 6:34
  Speaker 2: When I call you home, you've received that reward.
• 6:37
  Speaker 2: You had to have your due now, and so I think that's the hardest thing for a believer is to just serve the Lord faithfully and let the reward be His deal.
• 6:53
  Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, why do you think?
• 6:56
  Speaker 1: And let's just walk through.
• 6:57
  Speaker 1: Well, these questions will walk through the scripture that we just read in Matthew, chapter 20.
• 7:01
  Speaker 1: Why do you think the early workers were so upset?
• 7:05
  Speaker 1: Why wasn't their wage good enough?
• 7:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah, well, it's back to that human nature.
• 7:10
  Speaker 2: I've been out here all day.
• 7:11
  Speaker 2: I came early this morning and you know I love to say this is the formation of the first ever workers union.
• 7:22
  Speaker 2: You know, because you know their rights are being violated.
• 7:28
  Speaker 2: They worked all day and got paid the same money as some guys who worked a fraction of the time they work.
• 7:35
  Speaker 2: So what we have going on here is collective bargaining.
• 7:39
  Speaker 2: Right, you know, lord, you, you got to straighten this problem out.
• 7:44
  Speaker 2: So again, it's our human nature.
• 7:46
  Speaker 2: We feel like we did more than somebody else.
• 7:52
  Speaker 2: But the point of this parable is, when God saves you, you do nothing.
• 7:57
  Speaker 2: So whether you got saved at eight years old or at 88 years old, the salvation is still an act of holy God.
• 8:07
  Speaker 2: You didn't do anything to earn that, and so you have no rights to demand anything.
• 8:16
  Speaker 2: That's right, and so I think that's the point of the parable.
• 8:19
  Speaker 2: When a person comes to Christ, you get all that Christ offers you.
• 8:24
  Speaker 2: At whatever point in your life journey, you come to him, and if the average Christian is smart, that's very refreshing.
• 8:35
  Speaker 2: You know, I mean and I've even done it you know you're by a bedside, you're praying with somebody.
• 8:43
  Speaker 2: They're on their last leg, no-transcript for 50 years.
• 8:54
  Speaker 2: And now he's going to come to Jesus.
• 8:56
  Speaker 2: He's going to be all right.
• 8:57
  Speaker 2: You know, it's just our human thinking.
• 9:00
  Speaker 2: It just doesn't seem fair.
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: But God's grace for us is not fair to begin with because none of us deserve it.
• 9:09
  Speaker 2: And so even if we come to the Lord at eight years of age, his grace is adequate but it's not deserved.
• 9:19
  Speaker 2: So that's the hard part for us to get.
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: Right, this works-based mindset that we have.
• 9:28
  Speaker 1: We've said it over and over again, this human nature.
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: Whenever we're in the kingdom of God, we're in the family of God and we see someone accept Christ and inside of our own hearts maybe there's some ill-intended malice or jealousy or whatever it is.
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: Does that prove that someone is not saved or does that prove that someone may just not fully understand the Scripture and understand the grace of God?
• 9:54
  Speaker 1: Could be either.
• 9:55
  Speaker 2: Could be they're not saved and it could be that they don't really understand Scripture.
• 10:01
  Speaker 2: I've made reference to this in sermons before.
• 10:04
  Speaker 2: Back when we used to do the old school Wednesday night prayer meeting and pastor would teach a little devotional on Wednesday night and then you'd entertain prayer requests and some guy would raise his hand and say I have a praise, I got a big promotion at work and it comes with a huge raise.
• 10:24
  Speaker 2: I just want to thank the Lord for that.
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: And you could watch the faces around them and you could tell that they were not celebrating with it.
• 10:32
  Speaker 2: What they were most likely thinking is well, why did you get a raise?
• 10:36
  Speaker 2: Why?
• 10:36
  Speaker 2: did you get a promotion.
• 10:37
  Speaker 2: Why did you get a promotion?
• 10:38
  Speaker 2: I should have gotten a promotion.
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: If you really understand walking with the Lord, you ought to be each other's greatest cheerleader.
• 10:46
  Speaker 2: See those believers sitting around.
• 10:48
  Speaker 2: That guy should be celebrating what Christ is doing in his life.
• 10:53
  Speaker 2: But instead we tend to fall into carnal thinking.
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 10:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 11:01
  Speaker 1: In ministry today, the people who come into the kingdom.
• 11:05
  Speaker 1: I mean there's situations in my mind that I can think of through the years where, just like you were saying, at the deathbed of someone and I mean I'm thinking of a good friend that was a homosexual, I mean he lived like the Dickens his whole life and then he just came to the Lord at the last minute I think that if we begin to understand the grace of God in that way, I think that should motivate us even more to build his kingdom, because his grace is open to everyone.
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: That's right.
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: That's the beautiful thing about God's graces it is exclusive to anyone who's breathing.
• 11:46
  Speaker 2: You know it's open.
• 11:49
  Speaker 2: My own mom and dad came to the Lord very late in life, both of them just a couple of years before they passed on.
• 11:58
  Speaker 2: And, as I've talked about many times, my dad could be about as vile as any human being walking.
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: My mother, while she had a very distinct sense of right and wrong, was a very ethical person in many ways, could outcuss anybody walking, you know, and had no use for God or his church 90% of her life.
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: And yet God saved those two people and in our human way of thinking you could look at either one of them and say what that's not right.
• 12:36
  Speaker 2: You know there ought to be some punishment here.
• 12:39
  Speaker 2: My dad, who lived a very, very evil life, died in his sleep, peaceful, and I've often told God that ain't right.
• 12:51
  Speaker 2: He should have suffered, but in God's grace he takes us the way that he wants to take us.
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: That's his choice, that's right.
• 13:02
  Speaker 2: And so yeah.
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: You know, Steve, I don't think we ever really understand God's grace unless we experience it personally.
• 13:12
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, this is what I tell people about the different flavors of Christianity.
• 13:17
  Speaker 2: It's really pretty easy to understand if you think about it.
• 13:21
  Speaker 2: People who come to Christ and they really have not lived a difficult life, maybe they were blessed to grow up in a Christian home, they've not seen drugs and alcohol and fistfights at home and these kind of things their salvation is just as genuine, but it's a milder salvation experience.
• 13:48
  Speaker 2: I often find what I mean by that is, you know, they worship in a milder way.
• 13:55
  Speaker 2: People who live like the Dickens and come to Christ.
• 14:00
  Speaker 2: You know, you've heard the old saying we work hard and we play hard right.
• 14:04
  Speaker 2: Well, I find that people who sinned hard and then come to Jesus, they tend to worship hard Right, because they are so thankful They've been on the other side and they, they've seen it and they know what it is and it profoundly affects them, and so they cannot help but worship heart.
• 14:26
  Speaker 2: That's why I preach all the time that people need to worship in their own personality, who they are.
• 14:33
  Speaker 2: The guy beside you may be dancing, raising his hands, you may be sitting there with your arms crossed, but you love Jesus just as much.
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: But your experiences do not lead you to a more pronounced worship, and so we just got to give each other room, because God's grace works at all phases of every life experience.
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: Right, and I've always found this interesting in my studies People respond differently to worship, depending on the environment too.
• 15:11
  Speaker 1: Yes, you know, like, for example, the second great awakening on the frontier in America, it was a very outward emotional response because people were living in the woods, they had a different living than London and England and Europe and all that area.
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: The revival was happening, but they were responding differently.
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: Yes, absolutely.
• 15:32
  Speaker 1: So how does this parable the workers in the vineyard reshape our view of the prodigal son story in Luke 15?
• 15:42
  Speaker 2: Well, we tend, when we look at Luke 15, to focus primarily on the prodigal son and his coming home, which is a beautiful picture of God's grace.
• 15:52
  Speaker 2: We need to be reminded anybody who may be listening to this when it airs if you're living out in the pig pen, you can come home.
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 16:05
  Speaker 2: And what Satan wants to tell you is that if you're in the pig pen, you've gone too far.
• 16:10
  Speaker 2: Yeah, god won't possibly forgive you and bring you home, and that's a lie straight out of hell.
• 16:16
  Speaker 2: The other part of that parable is his brother, and his brother represents what I like to call the super Christians.
• 16:27
  Speaker 2: You know, we deal with them even today.
• 16:29
  Speaker 2: They're not living a bad life, but they spend their time observing everyone else to see what they're doing wrong, and so God gives the prodigal son the same grace he gave his brother, and simply, there ought to be a great celebration when someone comes home to the Lord whether they've been gone a short time or a long time, there ought to be a celebration that takes place.
• 17:04
  Speaker 2: I've often said and I heard this originally from Henry Blackaby he said when a couple's going through a divorce at the church, the lights ought to come on at the church and people ought to be on their knees until that couple comes back together.
• 17:17
  Speaker 2: Amen, come on at the church and people ought to be on their knees until that couple comes back together.
• 17:19
  Speaker 2: Amen, you know.
• 17:19
  Speaker 2: And then there ought to be a celebration that God has delivered.
• 17:23
  Speaker 2: And so, yeah, we see in the prodigal son and in the parable of the vineyard the workers.
• 17:34
  Speaker 2: The same troops, just a different expression.
• 17:38
  Speaker 2: You know, the workers were mad.
• 17:41
  Speaker 2: Some people got paid the same as them.
• 17:43
  Speaker 2: The brother is mad.
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: There's a celebration for this guy.
• 17:48
  Speaker 2: That's messed everything up.
• 17:50
  Speaker 2: But the truth is in Scripture.
• 17:53
  Speaker 2: When Christ saves a soul, there's a celebration in heaven, and the celebration doesn't vary based on the number of sins or the depth of sins that a person came to Christ with.
• 18:09
  Speaker 2: It is a saved soul joining the family of God.
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: Right Amen.
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: I mean, that's just like you're preaching through Colossians right now and the sufficiency of Christ.
• 18:18
  Speaker 1: Right Amen.
• 18:18
  Speaker 1: I mean, that's just like you're preaching through Colossians right now and the sufficiency of Christ.
• 18:20
  Speaker 1: And you talked about the justification through his blood and how God sees us, the way he sees Jesus.
• 18:28
  Speaker 1: I mean, my human brain just can't truly comprehend that.
• 18:33
  Speaker 2: I know I find that profound.
• 18:36
  Speaker 2: But just as he says I'll remove your sins as far as the East is from the West, God has the ability, being God, to make himself forget your sin, and he has the ability to look at you and look past your imperfection and see you as Christ presents you Right, you know, and to me that's just incredibly amazing.
• 19:03
  Speaker 1: Amen, amen.
• 19:04
  Speaker 1: So how can this challenge, the challenge we see in the Vineyard Parable, help us as a church to look for, look toward help new believers?
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: How does this translate in today's time, in our church, to be a blessing to new believers?
• 19:24
  Speaker 2: We've got to try to help our people, who've been believers for a substantial amount of time, to understand that people need the same God they have.
• 19:37
  Speaker 2: If you're not careful, the love of Christ is expressed inward and we're not good sometimes of expressing it outward, to those who are not already in the body, and so we ought to have a celebration every time somebody comes to Christ.
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: You know, for years when somebody came to Christ or joined the church, you kept them down front afterwards and everybody came by and greeted them and welcomed them to the family.
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: And we've gotten away from that because you have 1,000 people in church and six will come down and welcome them.
• 20:19
  Speaker 2: Everybody else trying to beat each other understand the specialness of that moment when a person comes to Christ, the preciousness of it and how it ought to be celebrated.
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: You know, from just the perspective of being at a smaller church compared to here, I think it happens so often here, which is amazing, praise God.
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and I think, because it happens so often, it becomes a normal process of worship and it's not something new, whereas if you're at a smaller church, a person may get saved once every six months and it's like, oh, wow, this is something new and exciting, and so you're right, just constantly keeping it in front of our people and teaching them, yeah it's forever a teaching thing.
• 21:15
  Speaker 2: And look, you use the phrase small church.
• 21:18
  Speaker 2: I think a church can only be small in number.
• 21:22
  Speaker 2: I'm going to talk about it in a few weeks.
• 21:25
  Speaker 2: I pastored early in my ministry in Alabama at a little church in a closed farming community and if you saw one or two saved a year, look, it's like somebody in a big city having 200 saved that year.
• 21:42
  Speaker 2: Statistically you did as good as them, or maybe better.
• 21:46
  Speaker 2: So numbers are relative Right.
• 21:51
  Speaker 1: Amen, amen.
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: And just a couple of scriptures to kind of close us out with Matthew, chapter 20.
• 22:00
  Speaker 1: Romans 9, 15 says for he says to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I have mercy and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion.
• 22:08
  Speaker 1: And then that just proves and hones in on the fact that God will give grace to whom he will give grace to.
• 22:14
  Speaker 1: And Luke 23, 42 through 43 says and he said Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.
• 22:20
  Speaker 1: And he said to him truly, I will say to you today you will be with me in paradise, and obviously that's the thief on the cross at the very end of his life.
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: Ephesians 2, 8 through 9,.
• 22:35
  Speaker 1: For by grace you have been saved through faith, and this is not your own doing, it is the gift of God, not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.
• 22:38
  Speaker 1: You know, I'm just going to say something.
• 22:39
  Speaker 1: I was raised Catholic and I know whenever we say anything about the Catholic church on the podcast, I'm going to end up getting comments and everything, which is fine.
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: I'll answer them.
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: But the truth of the matter is is that, no matter what my friends in the Catholic Church say about their doctrine, what they truly believe and act out is that there's a works-based system to their belief.
• 23:04
  Speaker 1: And I think this just demolishes.
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: I mean this parable demolishes that.
• 23:06
  Speaker 1: Sure it does.
• 23:06
  Speaker 1: And I think this just demolished, I mean this parable demolishes that.
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: Sure it does.
• 23:11
  Speaker 2: We have to remember the Catholic Church is based on the Word of God and church tradition.
• 23:17
  Speaker 2: We're based solely on the Word of God and so there are a lot of variations to what they believe that they created themselves, and that's fine.
• 23:27
  Speaker 2: They certainly feel like they can defend those positions and I feel like I can destroy those positions based on the Word of God.
• 23:37
  Speaker 2: I'm not critical of the Catholic Church.
• 23:40
  Speaker 2: I just want people to have the best understanding of Scripture they can have.
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: Correct.
• 23:46
  Speaker 2: And that's why I say it here all the time we are to do good works out of our love for Christ.
• 23:54
  Speaker 2: After he's come into our life and radically changed us, the natural position of our demeanor should be to do good, but we don't do good, hoping he'll notice and then have favor on us.
• 24:10
  Speaker 2: That's just not what Scripture teaches.
• 24:13
  Speaker 2: And so, yeah, they're church, they can do what they want, and we're just going to try to be as faithful as we can to the Word.
• 24:23
  Speaker 1: Amen.
• 24:24
  Speaker 2: But I do want to address the faith on the cross creates a theological problem for most people.
• 24:32
  Speaker 2: He didn't go through a catechism, he didn't go through a church member class, he wasn't baptized, he didn't subscribe to any theological confession of faith.
• 24:49
  Speaker 2: All of the things that we have in our human design created that, we think, keyholes God into how he can save someone.
• 25:01
  Speaker 2: A thief in the cross just destroys every bit of that.
• 25:05
  Speaker 2: He never spoke in tongues.
• 25:07
  Speaker 2: I mean, there's a whole element out there If you don't speak in tongues, you're not saved.
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: And so I think what the thief in the cross is?
• 25:16
  Speaker 2: A screaming statement that God saves and he can save whomever he wants to save and he'll do it the way he wants to do it.
• 25:29
  Speaker 2: And in our own humanity we can struggle with it all we want, but he is God.
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: He's the one who saves.
• 25:37
  Speaker 2: That's right.
• 25:38
  Speaker 1: Yes, Imagine if that one part is not in Scripture and it's there for a reason.
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: You know it's there for a reason, just for the point you just mentioned.
• 25:47
  Speaker 1: Yes, you know, yes.
• 25:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and God forbid.
• 25:51
  Speaker 2: He didn't belong to any certain church.
• 25:53
  Speaker 2: Right, Because there are whole denominational belief systems that believe if you don't belong to their church you can't possibly go to heaven.
• 26:01
  Speaker 2: That's right.
• 26:01
  Speaker 2: They need to read the Bible.
• 26:05
  Speaker 1: Yes, good deal.
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: Well, thank you, pastor Steve, appreciate you today, brother, oh my blessing.
• 26:10
  Speaker 1: And yeah, good deal.
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: Well, thank you, pastor Steve, appreciate you today, brother, oh my blessing.
• 26:14
  Speaker 1: And on the next one, guys, we'll see you then.