Latest / The BIG LIFE / NCAA Women's Soccer in Full Swing; Big Ten Surprises, and the Realities of Soccer Burnout

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NCAA Women's Soccer in Full Swing; Big Ten Surprises, and the Realities of Soccer Burnout · The BIG LIFE

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Hey everyone and welcome back to the Big Life Podcast.
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Jordan, we have a lot to cover today and there was a lot that happened this
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weekend. So first of all, how are you?
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I'm good. I'm on top of the world right now. I mean, we talked last week.
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I was like, hopefully we'll come back still being undefeated.
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We are officially 3-0-0 in conference play.
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And according to Andrew on the NCAA, who always does like the breakdowns for
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us, we are number three in the nation, which is a great feeling to have moving forward.
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And like I said, it's not something I ever would have expected when I committed
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to Michigan State and like looked at my career thus far is that we'd be in this position.
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So it's an amazing feeling to have and to go against two really good opponents
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in Nebraska and Penn State, which is my favorite game of the season every season.
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I think that's definitely even a bigger rivalry or better game for me personally
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than even the Michigan game.
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So that's always really fun and to come out with with a 1-0 win against them, was huge for us.
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That's fantastic. And I do believe Miss Girl also got her first goal on the
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season. Let's talk about that for a second.
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Oh, my God, yeah. It feels like forever ago now, but I guess it was this week. Yeah, it was...
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In a lot of ways, we've talked about this season, and it felt like the end for me.
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And I think in that moment and watching the ball go in the back of the net and
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being able to celebrate that, it felt like the beginning.
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You know, it felt like the start of something. I feel really good.
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I've carved out some more playing time, you know, for myself.
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I played some, you know, better minutes against Penn State as well after that.
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And it feels like I'm going in the right direction.
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I feel good about my play. I feel good about where I'm at. And I think the goal
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was the start of it for me. It was a left footed shot too.
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So like, proud of that, because that's not my strong suit. So love it.
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Love to hear. Well, I have a little bit of news and a little bone I need to
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pick with the universe right now.
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So before we get into our big moments in the big life, let me get on my rant.
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Jordan, do you remember about this time a year ago,
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about let's just say 11 months ago when I was rocking a
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really cute little face mask that I had
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to wear when I played you oh my goodness yes you
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looked you've never looked better Sam I appreciate it well
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the face mask might be back I I don't know what it is like I have a big nose
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I'm just gonna say it and I have a big nose because I've broken my nose four
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times I don't Last night,
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in my game, sure enough, like 94th minute,
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2-2 tie, super intense game, I'm defending a corner kick, bam, there goes the nose.
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So it's like I'm a little zoomed out and I got a lot of makeup and a lot of
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other stuff going on to cover it, but homegirl is some black and blue and swollen
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again, and now we're on hit number five, so...
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I swear, just once a year now, my nose is going to go out, which of all things,
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I guess it's like my nose and I can't be too mad,
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but I'll have to like insert a picture of what my nose looked like after last
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night's game because she looked crooked and I thought I finally had a straight nose again.
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And apparently the universe just couldn't let that happen for more than a year.
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So she's back to being crooked.
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Are you going to get it like rebroken and put in place?
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I don't know. There's doctors and stuff we got to deal with that to actually
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see. and I wouldn't do anything until at the end of season anyway.
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But yeah, so I can't breathe out of my right side.
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And it's like funny because like I've kind of been like bullied on the team for it.
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And like before girls even knew my roommate, we have the same roommate,
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like every away trip and her and I are close.
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But the first night she ever spent with me, she was like, Sam, I have a weird question.
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Like, do you have a deviated septum or anything? And I was like, no, why?
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And she's like, you breathe really heavy out of your nose. She's like,
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I can hear it when you sleep.
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I'm like, my I've broken my nose four times like I
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really don't want to hear it from you so she was the first person
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to come up to me and be like great now I'm gonna have a hard time sleeping
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on away trips so I'm glad that that was the first thing that went to her mind
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was her own ability to sleep next to me but yeah I got I got a big big nose
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and hit number five really wasn't wasn't appreciated do you snore I don't like
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snore but like you can hear me breathing like I'm definitely a little.
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Bit of a mouth breather to compensate from the lack of
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air that's able to get up there i mean this is not going to help
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that this is not going to help that by any means well not
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at all oh like at least like trey in high school too
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broke his nose and like his was like real jacked up so
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he also has it so it's like neither one of us
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can get mad at the other one for being loud through their nose because
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we both are so yeah it's just it's a roommate on a
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travel trip thing that they just got to kind of deal with that's tough
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that's interesting though that you guys have the same roommate for every travel trip yeah
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it's actually really nice you get in a nice little routine for me
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I get like another English speaker so I'm not always around Swedish
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it's it's pretty nice I was super quiet my
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first you know a little story I guess but
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I was super shy when I first got here and I guess like they
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thought Lauren Kozel would pull me out
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of my shell or something like I'm not really sure but like
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we we got room together and then
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we were the only ones to repeat roommates and I
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think in the two years I played with her we
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roomed together maybe like 10 times any big
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game or anything important any of it they would room us
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together and it was so nice because we had like a schedule down like we we knew
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what to do we were in I mean we could function around each other and it's so
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it was so nice so to have that every time I think is is nice not that I I kind
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of like having different roommates too though to like bond with other people and like we talk.
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About things maybe you wouldn't normally in like a group setting or people you
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wouldn't normally have those interactions with but I can see how the same roommate
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would be super nice unless you snore which then I don't know if I'd love you as a roommate Sam,
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No, I completely agree. Like I do kind of miss the aspect of college of like,
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I feel like I've seen this meme on the internet, but it's almost like Love Island
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recoupling ceremonies about like who your roommate's going to be on every trip.
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And you're like waiting to hear your name.
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And you're right. It's like, you get to talk to people that you normally wouldn't
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talk to, you know, get those like almost like deeper conversations that you might not get.
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But yeah, in the beginning of the season here, they literally like pass the
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paper around and they're like, who do you want your roommate to be?
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And my aunt Juan was the other non-Swedish speaker
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at the time we're like yep all right you me boom let's go
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and ever since we've been roommates on every trip but like
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you said you get a schedule down like at this point maya knows that i'm
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gonna fall asleep in five minutes with the lights on and it's her job to close
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the windows and turn off the lights because i'm already asleep with them on
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like little things like that you kind of figure each other out that's crazy
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i could never well all right enough about our sleeping habits let's transition
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to some big moments that also happened in the big 10 this weekend.
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Kicking it off with, I think we talk a lot about great teams in the Big Ten,
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and I think every game in the Big Ten has its moments to be competitive,
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but it also was a question coming in about who would be towards the bottom of
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the Big Ten with the new teams coming in.
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I know Oregon had a struggle last year in the Pac-12, and Maryland's been typically
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the struggle of the Big Ten as of recent years, and Maryland and Oregon played,
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and Oregon took that win, so I was curious which team is going to come out on top of the other.
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So it was definitely interesting to see Oregon out on top.
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I think one of the ones that caught me by surprise when we talk about being
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the bottom of the big time was Nebraska now being 0-3.
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They were co-champs with us last year, and they lost Eleanor Dale up top,
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which was their scoring machine.
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However, they still have Sarah Weber, who has put up double digits in the back
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of the net for the last couple years.
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And they just, I don't know, they're struggling more than I would have predicted
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for them to be 0-3 at this point in the season. They're still a really talented team. They just...
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I guess are not able to find the back of the net as well as they used to with
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Eleanor up there. So that was really interesting to see.
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I completely agree. You know, we've talked a lot about preseason rankings,
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the validity of them and stuff like that.
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But that's a team that came into preseason ranked number six in the country.
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And so to now be 0-3 in the Big Ten, I think it's interesting.
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Like you said, they did lose a very crucial player, but they still have extremely talented players.
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So I'd love to be a fly on the wall of like what's kind of going on in that
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program and what they kind of see and but yeah to be a question if they're even
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going to make the big 10 conference is is really interesting and definitely
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a shock I think for a lot of people yeah yeah absolutely not not one I saw coming
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for sure and and other news in the big 10 we have.
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Newcomers that we've been kind of kind of trying to keep tabs on see
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how they're doing and both UCLA and USC are off
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to a 3-0 start and I did just see
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USC just finish a nine game
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in a row away streak so I can only
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imagine how incredible it must be for them to be at home next week but
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nine games in a row playing away is just insane that's.
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Brutal I mean yeah no
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that is brutal we had like the opposite of a nine
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game in a row home streak which was the nicest thing ever
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and now we have like two away games back to
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back and I'm you know already ready to cry about it
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I cannot imagine doing that I mean
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nine games you're talking five weeks of just being on
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the road home absolutely insane like they haven't
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even been in LA I can't even imagine the school aspect how
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tired frankly you must be of your team I know like after
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those five day like long weekends when you're on the road and they
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were just in the road at Indiana and Purdue so they were doing a five day
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or like those are the worst by the time you
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get to the end of it so I can I can only imagine what nine games
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would have felt like yeah that's that's brutal like
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you said the academic portion of it I hope they're all
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like online courses for all of
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them because I mean there's just that is
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brutal I don't think anyone like until
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you go through these trips especially with I wonder how they're traveling yeah
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I wonder if they're you know it makes a huge difference if you're chartering
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if you're flying commercial or if you're busing because those those make a huge
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difference on your body I would assume hopefully they're they're treating them
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right if they're around the road for that long.
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But with the way things are going, we talked about it last week,
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the financial aspect of everything.
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That's a long time on a bus. Yeah, I can only imagine.
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But so thoughts and prayers out to USC women's soccer. Happy for them that they
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have a home streak coming up.
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And in other news, the Big Ten, Minnesota's Kaya Harper is off to a hot start.
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We talked about Eleanor Dale, how important she was for the Nebraska team last
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year. She led the nation in goals in the NCAA.
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And Kaya Harper is now taking over that Big Ten streak for her.
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And she is currently in the top two goal scorers in the nation with 12 goals on the season.
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So it's super exciting to see, you know, a program that maybe not get the talk
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of the town as much, but someone really stepping up and hoping to do big things
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with Minnesota this year. Yeah, absolutely.
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12 goals at this point in the season. Absolutely incredible.
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And hopefully she continues to have that level of success. I mean,
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that's a real athlete right there. It'll be interesting to see.
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You'd assume already she's on
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everyone's scouting report as the number one target to kind of take away.
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And the fact that she's still finding a way to get the ball in the back of the
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net and get the job done is incredibly impressive.
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Yeah. So Big Ten is hot and running. We have three games into the Big Ten season, so lots more to do.
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And Jordan, I do have a question. I know I have been scouring the internet,
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but have you heard anything about the Big Ten tournament this year?
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Have and have not. So like, I think finally our coaching staff and everyone
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knows what's going on, like the people who are supposed to, because in the beginning
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of the season, and we were asking questions and even they were like I don't
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know what's gonna happen.
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So I think we're gonna definitely have a team talk
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here soon and I'll update you next week with all the
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logistics of it but yeah it it
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was a mess for a while I think we're finally starting to get some real
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answers as to what this will look like I am not informed on
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what that is exactly other than that I don't know
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how many games how many teams are any of any of the details that are
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probably really important to know at this point well that's
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crazy just like as a player you knew especially if your
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season didn't start as great as you may have wanted it to
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or you're really pushing for that Big Ten tournament because you're
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maybe a team like Michigan who needs the Big Ten tournament to advance to
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a postseason you knew we have to be in the top eight top eight was always kind
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of the hunt of you know that's where the cutoff was of where we're going to
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make it and so having you know four more teams you would think that the top
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eight would change but there's been no official confirmation to this point with
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the Big Ten conference so as an outsider who now out and doesn't get the inside scoop.
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I know I'm at least curious, but I'm sure even the athletes are about what place
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do we need to be aiming for?
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You know, what is that cutoff and at what point is it do or die?
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Yeah. Yeah. And I think that's part of our, I'm sure other coaching staff or
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other schools probably know a little bit more than we do at this point.
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I think just mentality with a lot of it is that we're going to be number one. So it doesn't matter.
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The rest of it is, you know, it's not important information for us to worry
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about or be concerned about at this point, But I do think we'll definitely have
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to have a talk about the logistics of things here moving forward just to kind
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of kill the curiosity of it all. But...
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At this point in the season, we're already three games into conference play,
15:21
and I have no idea what a postseason looks like for us, which is really crazy
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and not something you would typically have as a team or as an athlete going forward here.
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I don't know at all. But speaking of you guys finishing number one,
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Jordan kind of dug up this stat for me, and I think it's kind of crazy.
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There are officially two teams in the Big Ten Conference that have zero losses,
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so they're undefeated with wins and ties.
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Those two teams are Michigan State
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and the Iowa Hawkeyes so I'm
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glad my Hawkeyes are still representing I'm still always
15:54
cheering them on of course but I just I think it's
15:57
a little podcast like we joke about the podcast curse but clearly
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the two of us are doing something right absolutely I
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mean we're 8-0-2 Iowa 7-0-3 both
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of us going undefeated at this point in the season I I blame
16:10
the podcast for this right without the podcast I'm
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sure that wouldn't have happened it has nothing to do with our
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talent or the players or any of that it's simply the podcast that
16:19
got us where we are 100% I'm glad the the good mojos are still going you know
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I feel like last way the way that the podcast ended last season with you know
16:29
us playing each other twice getting all those rematches it was a storybook ending
16:33
so I'm glad I'm glad that the the good vibes of the podcast are still going.
16:37
Oh, yeah, absolutely. And we both got the we've got to win out of it.
16:41
So I'll take our split, you know, not salty at all. And we've both got a Big
16:45
Ten championship in different ways.
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So it couldn't have ended better last season.
16:49
Sure. Yeah, exactly. I'll choose to believe that.
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All right. And transitioning into a bigger subject today, I think Jordan and
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I are going to address us a topic that can affect a soccer player at any level.
17:04
And I know I've been at least asked to asked about by players at all ages and
17:09
all levels. And that's the conversation of burnout.
17:12
You know, there's certain parts of the season. I was actually thinking about this earlier today.
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Jordan, you made a analogy a couple weeks ago about how sometimes sports are
17:21
like drugs, and you're on that low or you're on that high.
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And I think that there's a place
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for both of them. And there's different ways to kind of go through it.
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And I think Jordan and I are kind of in two different spots right now in terms of that.
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So Jordan, talk to me about you and your stance with burnout right now and how
17:38
you are at the moment currently doing.
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Yeah, yeah. So we've had plenty of conversations about my career,
17:45
my injury, the comeback, all of it.
17:47
For anyone who hasn't listened to those episodes, I tore my PCL back in the
17:52
beginning of spring, so back in March.
17:55
And I had lots of setbacks, lots of issues with it.
18:02
And basically, I sat four games in our preseason this season for injury purposes,
18:07
maintaining eligibility for a possible redshirt, et cetera.
18:10
Yeah. So now I'm finally at a point where I'm starting to carve out a little
18:14
bit more playing time for myself and kind of get back into the flow of things.
18:18
At this point in the season, it feels like really I'm just starting.
18:23
I've missed four games where I just didn't compete at all. So everyone who's
18:27
10 games in, I'm only six games in.
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And even out of those six games, really, it feels like I played maybe three or four of those games.
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And two were kind of limited minutes or against teams that I wasn't really doing much.
18:41
So body-wise and physicality-wise, I'm just getting started.
18:44
I feel pretty fresh, pretty good, probably the best I have since the injury,
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where you have a lot of players on our team who are the opposite,
18:52
who've been playing some super significant minutes, getting knocks,
18:55
everything like that, which I've been on both sides of it.
18:59
So right now, for me, it feels like I'm just starting.
19:02
I'm just getting into it. I'm just getting a little bit of the high again from being able to play.
19:06
I just scored. I'm on top of the world.
19:09
And it really does feel like the start for me. And it feels like a high.
19:14
I feel like I was at the lowest of lows here just two weeks ago,
19:18
crying on the podcast about the devastation of my career and mourning the death
19:23
of something that was still happening.
19:24
And now I get the resurrection of it. So for me and my mentality and my physicality
19:31
with the way my season has gone, I feel in a really, really good spot.
19:37
I do have plenty of teammates that I've been able to talk to that I think can
19:40
relate more closely to you, Sam.
19:42
You want to go into where you're at with it? Yeah, I'm in an interesting spot.
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And I think so much of my year has been defined in the unknown of I'm frankly
19:51
doing something you've never done before.
19:53
And I know for me, when I like went into my freshman year of college,
19:56
I was like, this is the hardest thing I've ever done.
19:58
I don't know how to transition this. And so much of like figuring it out.
20:02
And so much of it is kind of to figure it out as you go. No one can teach you
20:06
what's the best thing for you.
20:07
And that's where I'm at as a pro too, is I'm a rookie all over again,
20:10
and I'm figuring it out as I go.
20:12
And I think that there's been extreme highs and lows in that.
20:16
And I think where I'm at right now is I'm tired. I'm going to be really honest.
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I'm just a little physically and mentally tired.
20:24
For me, if you think about my season, this is the longest soccer season I've had in my life.
20:30
College soccer, as we know, was super intense. And then that ended around Thanksgiving last year.
20:36
Then I got a break. I got some downtime and figuring out what my pro looked
20:39
like. But I went to preseason at Louisville January.
20:43
I think we kicked off, I want to say January 17th, just to throw out a random date out there.
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And obviously I was in there for a little bit. And then I moved to Sweden.
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And I don't even, I think between me moving from Louisville and me moving to
20:54
Sweden, I had two days off in that process.
20:56
And then I was practicing in Sweden. So it's not like that That was a transition
21:00
where I got any time off or anything.
21:02
And then we played until July.
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And what would be our summer break was two weeks long.
21:09
And so like it was a great two weeks. I literally toured Europe and I can't
21:13
complain about that at all. But it's not like that was a significant break.
21:17
And then we went right back into preseason mode to then go right back into game mode.
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And I'm now at week 20 of a pro season we just completed. And I've played 28
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pro games, which is about the length of a college season just spread out over
21:31
such a longer period of time.
21:34
And I think because of that, I'm just a bit mentally and physically tired.
21:39
I've been blessed. I mean, I can't complain about anything when it comes to my playtime.
21:42
And part of me almost feels guilty having this conversation because I'm so lucky
21:46
that I've played 100% of my pro career so far.
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Like, that is a fact that I cannot be more thankful of. I'm not going to lie.
21:54
When I got my nose bumped yesterday, I was kind of scared I was going to get subbed off.
21:57
I'm like, this cannot be the reason I ruined my Iron Woman season. It's my nose.
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I'm so grateful. And I've learned it. and I'm developed, and I'm getting better,
22:04
and I kick a ball for a living.
22:06
It's incredible. It's everything I've ever dreamed of, but it's also tiring.
22:10
So yeah, I'm in a limbo, and I think the other thing I'm kind of struggling
22:14
with is we just hit on Big Ten. You finish top eight. You go to the Big Ten tournament.
22:20
You have something to compete for. You have something to play for.
22:22
You're going to postseason. You have that thing that you're kind of chasing,
22:25
and the interesting thing I think about the situation as a pro is the way that
22:30
our league's set up is I don't really we know what we're chasing right now?
22:33
We're chasing to get better.
22:35
Personally, I have goals I'm chasing, but the top three teams in our league make Champions League.
22:40
And at this point, with six games left, we're not going to catch the top three.
22:46
It's a fact. It's, you know, great. And we're growing, but we're not going to
22:50
catch the top three. But we're sitting in fifth.
22:52
And so we're also not going to get relegated, which is a great thing to know.
22:55
So it's not like we're fighting for our lives.
22:57
But we're also not fighting to be at the top. And so like, we're kind of just
23:01
fighting to be the best mid table team we can, which is great,
23:04
but it's nothing tangible.
23:06
And I think that's also kind of like where it's hard to be like,
23:09
this game is life or death or this game is whatever. Cause like, frankly, it's not.
23:15
And so I don't know, it's just a hard thing to channel.
23:18
And so I think it's a great opportunity for me to focus on personal goals,
23:20
but because of that, it makes waking up and going to practice tomorrow morning
23:24
a little bit harder, if that makes any sense.
23:27
No, absolutely. And that's a really interesting take on
23:30
it because there is always something in college that
23:33
you are theoretically like chasing and
23:36
if you're not chasing something then usually you know
23:39
the the lineups the way you go about these
23:42
games are very very different because the coaching staff
23:45
has something they want to accomplish or you have personal goals there's
23:48
something it's always something but as a pro I assume
23:51
they go about everything the same exact way because
23:54
you know that's your career it's now now
23:57
your job to do these things it's not like it
24:00
is set up currently in college where you were there as a
24:02
student athlete and competing and doing all these things and when
24:06
it's your life i assume it's a lot different too because
24:09
for us like if soccer's on the back burner or something like you still have
24:13
air academics you still have this huge thing that consumes much if not all of
24:18
your free time that you still have to this other road this other thing that
24:23
you're chasing in addition to the athletic portion of it.
24:26
But when you live, eat, breathe and are a pro soccer player.
24:30
I imagine that has something to do with the burnout as well,
24:32
because this is your whole life now. Yeah, no, it's hard. And it's over.
24:36
It's all encompassing. And you know, it's also like little decisions you have
24:40
to make that, frankly, I'm sure I've made the wrong ones a couple times.
24:44
And I'm just trying to figure it out. You know, I was the kind of player in
24:47
college that anytime we had extra training options, or anytime I could grab
24:52
my coach to do extra reps for something, I always wanted to do it.
24:55
And a lot of that's because I know where I'm at mentally. And I know how I play
25:00
my best is what I'm confident.
25:01
So if it's hitting a couple balls the day before games, that way I know I can
25:05
hit that certain pass or that certain ball in the game that like tends to be
25:08
what makes me feel better or potentially after a bad game, I need to get that
25:13
bad game out of my system.
25:14
So I'm just going to touch a ball as much as I can to kind of convince myself
25:18
I know how to touch a ball again.
25:20
You know, the little things like that. And to be completely frank,
25:23
I was not happy with my game last weekend.
25:26
And so that kind of is weird because in college, you don't have enough time to dwell on that.
25:30
You don't have enough time to think about that because if it's Thursday and
25:33
you have a bad game, well, guess what?
25:34
Friday's recovery because Saturday's prep for Sunday's game.
25:37
I had what I considered a bad game on Saturday of last week,
25:41
and I did not play again until Monday of this week.
25:43
So I had nine games to have that bad game in my mind.
25:47
And that's something I frankly never have dealt with.
25:49
So for me, as someone who did play the full 90 minutes, I have a decision to
25:54
make on Monday when I got to training.
25:56
OK, am I going to participate in training or am I going to do a recovery session?
26:00
My body needed a recovery session. I'm 100% aware of that.
26:04
But my brain and my mental state needed the soccer session because I needed
26:09
to touch a ball and just feel confident in that.
26:11
So I decided to practice because that's what emotionally and mentally I want
26:15
to do. But physically, probably wasn't the best call.
26:18
So then I've practiced on Tuesday, which is a hard practice.
26:21
And then Wednesday is typically an off day. But we do have optional individual training.
26:26
Once again, at this point, I opted to train on Monday. Should I have trained on Wednesday?
26:31
Absolutely not. To be completely frank, I'm aware of it, but I'm still trying
26:36
to get that bad game out of my system.
26:37
And I think I'm beating myself up so much about that bad game that I went to training on Wednesday.
26:43
And then we had training on Thursday and Friday. So now, in a lot of ways,
26:48
I'm burnt out because I'm just freaking tired.
26:51
I'm not helping my own decisions. I'm well aware of that.
26:54
But then you're balancing, is it better for me to feel good physically or mentally?
26:58
And so I think because my life is soccer and because I don't have that school
27:03
factor so much else and I have more time to kind of dwell in things,
27:07
I'm feeling burnout, frankly, to a level that I don't know if I've felt before.
27:11
One, I sympathize with you that you're going through this, but I think it's
27:14
a very, very real thing that a lot of athletes face is that that level of burnout.
27:19
You get it at every stage. I think you have a club career that is now very,
27:25
very serious and going more towards, you know, single sport ideals where you
27:30
almost have to focus on it.
27:32
And you go that year round and you get burnout there where you have it at the
27:36
collegiate level or high school level.
27:37
It's something that always happens and that you have to face and deal with.
27:41
And I think the biggest thing with that is listening to both your body and your
27:45
mentality and getting them to be on the same page again, which is so hard.
27:50
And it's something that like I think you always you're just gonna have those dips,
27:55
and it's being able to manage them and kind of the other
27:57
way I wish I had like a cure or something
28:00
that we could just go and do and I think it's something that burnout
28:04
for me and maybe for you too it sounds like it happens when things aren't going
28:10
well you know it's something really easy to manage when you're playing well
28:15
your team is doing well and you know life is going good you're You're physically
28:19
maybe exhausted and tired,
28:21
but mentally you're so bought in and you're on this high of soccer because we're
28:27
all soccer addicts here.
28:29
You're on this high of it that it's easy to manage that. But when things are
28:32
on the low and they're not going well, then you have the mental aspect of it
28:35
and the physical aspect and you really get to like buy in and almost snowball through this process.
28:40
So I appreciate you opening up about it because I think it's something super,
28:44
super real that everyone kind of goes through and being able to kind of manage
28:48
it is something that I wish there was just like an easy cure for.
28:52
But I think the biggest thing is just time and being able to get yourself up
28:55
on that high again in and ride it out till you're gone.
28:59
Yeah, absolutely. It's interesting. I was told something pretty early into my college career.
29:04
And I think it's something that's lived with me that I think is really real
29:08
for any athlete. And that's, you never can get too high and you never can get too low.
29:12
A game is always going to be a little bit better or a little bit worse than
29:17
you thought. It's kind of just finding that average.
29:19
And in the sport that we play, unfortunately, Fortunately, there's going to
29:23
be highs, which are incredible, and there's going to be those lows.
29:26
And it's how do you stay even through that all? You can't get too high and you can't get too low.
29:31
And I think that that is 100% true.
29:35
I also think it is the definition of easier said than done is how do you not snowball?
29:40
And I think the reason it's hard is because it's different for every person.
29:43
Jordan and I can sit here. It's something that both of us have faced the highs and the lows.
29:47
Frankly this year both of us have faced the highs and
29:50
the lows on so many regards and you know Jordan
29:53
and I can list what works for us but what works for everyone's a little bit
29:58
different and it's it's really interesting to see how different people respond
30:02
to certain things so when you are in your lows Jordan you know what is some
30:06
things that kind of got you out of it yeah I I actually I mean,
30:11
I don't know if this is the best thing to do at all,
30:14
but I was on such a low, right? I mean, I sat here.
30:19
I felt like my career was over.
30:23
I was down and out. I mean, I was low.
30:28
And I really was struggling with trying to find that middle ground.
30:31
And I think at a certain point, it became a state of apathy where it wasn't
30:35
middle ground of this emotion. It was no emotion.
30:39
I was checked out because I was trying to manage it because I couldn't feel
30:44
that sad anymore about my career and about these situations that were happening.
30:48
And I think it got to the point where now I got a little taste of good that
30:54
I'm almost ignoring the rest of it.
30:58
There's conversations I want to have with my coaching staff.
31:01
But I know that if they don't tell me the right thing right now,
31:04
I'm going to go back down to that low part. I can't hear it.
31:07
I can't hear anything bad.
31:08
I have to put my earmuffs on and just kind of ride this wave.
31:13
You know, this little taste of
31:14
hope that I have for my career this far and that this week has given me.
31:19
You know, I haven't gone back and watched any film or looked at the games or done any of that.
31:23
We've done team sessions, which is very different than going back and like watching
31:26
me play because I felt good about it.
31:28
I felt good about what I did. I felt good about where I'm at.
31:31
I have my own ideas going on, whether they're right or wrong.
31:34
I feel like I have to ride it out.
31:36
And I don't know if that's maybe like the healthiest thing or the best advice to
31:39
give anyone but that is currently what my plan
31:42
is and what I'm doing because I know at this point that if I
31:45
do anything else or if someone like you know Jeff
31:47
tells me something maybe I'm not ready to
31:50
hear because I know I'm not emotionally probably the strongest I've been in
31:54
my career this far I think I'm definitely still in a fragile state of dealing
31:57
with everything that's happened and watching that clock kind of still tick down
32:02
you know my eligibility is over like I stepped foot on the field we played once
32:06
that last whistle blows like I'm done being a collegiate athlete
32:09
you know with all that happening I think I'm not as strong as I should be in
32:13
order to go in and have those conversations to be able to watch that film and
32:16
really dissect my gameplay on that level where I can be critical of myself so
32:20
I'm just kind of trying to ride out the high right now which is,
32:24
Like I said, I don't know if this is healthy or the best thing to do,
32:26
but this is my current plan. So we'll keep you updated on whether or not this works.
32:31
So I'm going to fight you on the concept of I don't know if this is healthy
32:34
because I think that's extremely healthy to know what you need and what you
32:39
emotionally need right now.
32:41
And I think that's one thing I'm struggling with is I think I need one thing
32:47
and I like also physically need one thing. And it's hard. Like you said,
32:52
like you're not watching film.
32:54
Honestly, I thought I had a really good game last night. I remember feeling
32:57
confident. I got my first ever pro assist. I was like, hi.
33:01
And then I watched the game and it brought me back down. I'm like, why did I do this?
33:04
And so I think like one thing you're making an executive decision to almost
33:09
what we talked about a little bit ago and put your blinders on and focus on
33:12
you and not overthink it.
33:14
And I think that's one thing with all of this new free time I have,
33:18
I'm struggling with because I have the time.
33:21
So, of course, I woke up this morning and watched film and then immediately I didn't feel as good.
33:25
And I'm like, oh, OK, let's get humbled really quick.
33:27
And so I think for me, burnout is really interesting because my life is soccer.
33:34
And I mean, obviously, with so many people, their life is soccer,
33:38
whether they are a student athlete or not.
33:40
We all know where our brains tend to skew in a lot of regards and different things like that.
33:44
And so I'm trying to figure out how to navigate it.
33:47
I think the last time I felt this burnt out was after my freshman year,
33:52
like I said, and that was after we finished season my freshman year.
33:55
I don't think I worked out or looked at a ball for a month.
34:00
And that's myself to the gym in off season to get a workout in just because
34:06
I wasn't feeling it and I didn't want to be there.
34:09
And so that's a state I don't think I'm in right now because I still am driven.
34:15
I still do have personal goals, but also I need to be better at not making soccer my life.
34:20
And I think that's one thing I'm struggling with. And I think.
34:24
Something that always helps my burnout is a bit of a distraction and to realize
34:28
that like, guess what? Yes, soccer is my life, but it's also not.
34:31
So for me, like I said, this weekend, we had an off day on Saturday and I looked
34:36
at Trey and I said, you're going to plan a date and this entire day you're planning.
34:41
I'm not doing anything. I'm waking up. I'm looking cute. That's my job,
34:44
but we're not allowed to speak at soccer.
34:47
I will not be on social media. We will not talk about soccer.
34:50
We will not have a conversation.
34:52
I don't care if it's about my My soccer, any soccer, it's not happening.
34:55
My mom called me to check in like she always does.
34:57
And she's like, oh, did you see someone's scores? I was like,
34:59
nope. It's like, we're not talking about soccer today, mom. I just can't do
35:02
it. And she was great. She respected that. She loved that.
35:04
And I think like I have to have the people in my life around me keeping me accountable
35:09
right now for not making soccer my life because it's really easy to slip into
35:13
it on any level, whether that be me thinking about my soccer,
35:17
me scrolling on Twitter and checking scores, me doing whatever.
35:21
I feel like I'm really bad at making soccer my life.
35:25
And because of that, it makes burnout feel so much more worse because that's
35:28
all you're supposed to do.
35:29
If I don't have soccer to think about, then I'm just going to sit on my couch in silence.
35:34
And so I think my biggest advice for burnout, which I am currently struggling
35:38
with myself, is find something to not make soccer your life and just enjoy soccer as it is.
35:44
But know that you have another thing to distract yourself or to go do or to
35:48
look forward to. You know, it's really hard to look forward to a game when all
35:51
you have in your next calendar is games.
35:53
But it's a lot easier to look forward to a game when you've been doing other
35:56
fun things and you're like, oh, now I get to play again.
35:58
And so I think it's finding that spice or that drug or that fix somewhere else.
36:04
And if anyone has suggestions on a hobby that Sam Carey can pick up, I desperately need it.
36:10
I think that's really interesting because i know i've definitely experienced
36:14
burnout as a student athlete but usually the thing that crash and burns is the
36:17
student part of that so like you have,
36:21
like you know this you said it like this balance of things almost and when you experience burnout,
36:27
usually people prioritize the athletic portion of it but you're not able to
36:32
fully be engulfed in it the way you would be as a pro because you still have
36:36
to do the student aspect of things
36:38
and when you experience it the thing like I
36:41
said that crash and burns is the student aspect where you can still kind of
36:44
like salvage your athlete and and use
36:47
that as the escape from what you blame the burnout
36:50
on which is the student part which in a way I think makes you love the game
36:54
even more because it becomes this sort of escape from from your academics or
36:58
from everything else that you experience that burnout with so yeah it's it's
37:02
something that's really interesting and obviously like I've I've never had to
37:06
deal with it I've actually never been a single sport athlete until I got to college.
37:09
So even in that aspect of growing up, like I always had basketball or track
37:14
or something of that nature to distract me. I know.
37:18
Some people that will go and play intramural basketball at IM or do different
37:23
things like that if they want to get a break from it or escape while still,
37:26
like you said, I've only ever known to be an athlete.
37:28
It's all of my escape, all my coping mechanisms.
37:31
But to still take that athletic portion and put it into a different sport,
37:34
I think could be something that's super helpful to people.
37:37
I know it's definitely helped me. Anytime we go through it, grab a group of
37:41
us and we go play some basketball at the IM facilities or do things like that.
37:44
That you find a way to make it fun again.
37:47
Or people will play pickup soccer, where it is the most unserious thing in the
37:52
world and you're just messing around and you get to fall in love with just the game again.
37:56
There's no film involved. There's no tactics involved. There's nothing technical about it.
38:00
It is just you doing the sport, having fun, goofing around, and being able to
38:05
fall in love with it again without it being so serious.
38:07
Because I think that's the big part about burnout is things become so
38:10
serious and you forget forget
38:13
why you did it in the first place that little kid who like had no idea what
38:16
was going on and just like liked running around and having a
38:19
good time and kicking a soccer ball so being able to find that
38:22
aspect of it again I think is something that you know is really important whether
38:26
it's in practice or it's something you do pick up outside of it or you know
38:30
a random training session where it is just like the most random stuff only fun
38:35
things you want to do like learn a new juggling trick or whatever it is and
38:38
being able to fall in love with the game again in a very un-serious manner.
38:42
Yeah, no, I think you hit the nail on the head. And I'm even thinking like,
38:45
I'm sure there was times in my youth career where I felt this too, right?
38:48
Where you have all those weekends, you're missing all of the high school life
38:53
that you miss because of traveling, whatever it is.
38:57
But I always had my friends in
38:59
high school that I could call up and have a sleepover on a Friday night.
39:02
And I'm thinking about it now, frankly, I'm just coming to this realization.
39:07
My high school life getting to
39:10
that a whole nother day my friends weren't soccer
39:13
players so I would be able to have those sleepovers
39:16
have those hangouts and never speak a word about soccer
39:19
because they couldn't have given less of a crap to be fair you know
39:23
they were in my girl scout troop they were people I met
39:26
at school like all these things I think one reason
39:29
I frankly am struggling now because as much as I can
39:31
be like oh yeah I have friends here I can go hang out with I go hang
39:34
out with my teammate and I think it would be dead
39:37
silence if we weren't talking about soccer or talking about the game
39:40
or talking about what that one person said at training that one time like
39:43
let's all be real we all have those moments too you know it's like I think I
39:48
can't escape soccer because when I want to go break I go hang out with a soccer
39:52
player and that doesn't really work well for like hey let's talk about something
39:55
other than soccer that never is realistic to ever have a conversation that's
39:59
not about soccer with someone on your team I feel like Like,
40:01
and so at least it always somehow goes back to soccer.
40:04
You can have it for like 20 minutes and then you're talking about soccer again.
40:07
And so I think one thing is like.
40:10
You don't have that person. And honestly, Trey was that for me in college,
40:13
you know, dating someone who was not a college athlete, who was not,
40:17
you know, a part of it. That was my escape.
40:20
And, you know, in like high school, it may even have been like hanging out with my mom.
40:25
And I like, it's a blessing having Trey here.
40:28
And that's why I think like having, you know, a day where I was like,
40:30
you're not like my job is to not talk about soccer today.
40:34
And he's great with that. But also he's so invested in my soccer.
40:37
He goes to every game. He's there for my highs and lows.
40:41
He like understands the game now and also understands my moods.
40:44
And so like, because he now understands the game, whereas when we first started
40:49
dating, he didn't like I could talk to him about soccer and he would listen,
40:52
but he didn't understand what's going on.
40:53
He's been around five years now. He knows what's going on.
40:56
So it's now hard for me to hang out with him and not talk about soccer.
41:00
And so I think the biggest thing is finding people in your life that will completely
41:04
remove yourself from the situation.
41:06
And I think I lost that in college and now in pro because everyone you know is through soccer.
41:12
I'm in a foreign country. I only know soccer people.
41:15
And I think that adds an extra layer to the burnout when there is no escape.
41:20
Yeah. Yeah. That's something really interesting that I didn't think about at all.
41:24
And I think I've been super fortunate and blessed with, you know,
41:27
and it got lucky. It wasn't planned this way. They just happened to become my
41:30
really, really close friends.
41:32
But I live with one other soccer player and then
41:35
three gymnasts so they are able to be
41:37
like the sounding board for all the frustrations and whatever you need while
41:41
understanding what being a student athlete is but also like not so invested
41:46
or involved in the soccer world where they can take a step back and be like
41:49
I don't know we can talk about gymnastics forever we can talk about you know anything and,
41:55
they're not they're not there they're not on my team or my teammates and and
41:59
the more I think about it.
42:00
I don't know if I've really hung out with my teammates where we've gone a whole
42:04
day being together and not talked about soccer.
42:06
It seems very unrealistic, to be honest, because it's our whole life.
42:11
That's what we do. That's how we know each other. That is our relationship, is through that ball.
42:17
So yeah, I think it's something that.
42:20
Very, very lucky and fortunate to have. And I didn't think about when you go
42:24
overseas, you go abroad.
42:25
The idea is that you have these built in friendships and teammates with or you
42:30
built in friendships within your teammates, which is nice that you're not going
42:33
abroad alone and part of the kind of draw to it.
42:36
But on the other end, when you face this burnout, you only know soccer players.
42:41
You only know people who are going through, you know, going through it with
42:46
you, which is really, really interesting and something I, yeah,
42:49
I didn't think about at all.
42:51
Honestly, I don't know if I did before this conversation. So we've kind of had
42:54
like a little therapeutic awakening that I'm glad many people get to listen
42:57
in on as we do this. It feels healthy.
42:59
And I mean, I think that just goes to say, like, I think burnout is something
43:04
that all athletes at all level will face at some point or another.
43:07
100%. Frankly, I think it is healthy in some regards because it shows how much
43:12
you care and it shows the effort you put in.
43:16
And it also shows maybe it's time to pull back a bit in different regards.
43:20
I think it's just a natural evolution of sports.
43:23
And clearly Jordan and I do not have all the burnout answers.
43:26
And I think one of the reasons why we can't is it is so individualized to every person.
43:29
When some people are burned out they need to dig deeper other people need to
43:33
pull back some people need distractions you know it is just something you have
43:37
to face and you kind of have to figure out what works best for you on this individual
43:41
level but i think jordan i could both say,
43:44
the biggest advice is find a way to a find the fun and reconnect with that little
43:49
girl that fell in love with the game.
43:51
And B, find a way to have a community or have something outside of it.
43:56
You know, what is it that you have to do or people that you get to see are the
44:02
little things that you can look forward to that have absolutely nothing to do with your sport?
44:06
Because I know Jordan and I both
44:07
know that our worth and who we are are definitely not tied to our sport.
44:11
But when you're in those burnout cycles, it's really, really easy to start feeling
44:16
like that. So how do you break the cycle and just find something completely
44:20
untied to your sport that you get to do?
44:23
And finally, Sam Carey needs a really new hobby, apparently.
44:26
So if anyone got any ideas, that's a desperate need because I don't think I'm
44:30
a knitter or anything like that. So I'm going to need a different thing.
44:33
Yeah. Yeah. We'll ponder and get back to you next week.
44:37
Submit your answers to our Instagram or you know what, just text them to me
44:42
and I'll pick the best ones and we'll send Sam a little gift basket here or something.
44:46
But I think you hit the nail on the head. I think me and you experience burnout
44:50
very differently while you are someone who needs to pull back and you get super invested in it.
44:57
I think when I experience burnout, I give up in a sense or it's something I
45:01
need to push through and probably do more soccer or do more things in order to get out of it.
45:07
And everyone else in between us is going to be very, very different and experience it differently.
45:11
And I think your advice and those major components are things that I've noticed
45:16
help the best and any advice we would have to give it.
45:19
And, you know, if you are experiencing burnout, I'm sorry.
45:23
You'll get through it, though. It'll be better. I promise. There is green grass
45:27
on the other side of that.
45:29
There's a high waiting. There's a high waiting. Yeah, that's...
45:33
I don't even... I think it's just combined.
45:35
I don't even know what... I love it. I love it. It's all right. Listen.
45:40
The grass is green on the other side. That's not even that's not applicable
45:43
to this at all. I think that's the saying I was going with. And I'm not sure why.
45:48
But so anyway, Jordan, we got a big week coming up. We got some exciting games.
45:54
Jordan, you have a big one with a pretty big rival, but also with you.
45:58
Let's preview your game coming up this week. Yes.
46:02
Yes. So we play the Ohio State University.
46:06
I'm so excited. This is being able to go to Ohio State.
46:12
It was something I was really looking forward to. And we scouted it out from
46:16
the moment I committed that this was going to be my senior year.
46:19
I was going to be away at Ohio State. and it's something that
46:22
I think I had circled on my calendar for a long time especially this
46:26
season I didn't tell any of my friends that we were going and
46:28
we were playing there because I I think I
46:31
felt like a large part of embarrassment for the
46:34
build-up of my career being ready to play I was supposed to be this all-star
46:39
year for me and then I had no idea I really didn't think I was going to be playing
46:45
at all so I finally told my friends they're coming to the games a lot of them
46:49
go to Ohio State because I'm from Ohio.
46:52
So I'm really, really excited about that and excited that they get to come and
46:56
kind of celebrate this last year with me and be a part of it.
46:59
And, you know, obviously my whole family is going to be there as well.
47:01
This is definitely a big one for me personally, but from a soccer aspect,
47:04
they're doing really well.
47:06
You know, it's going to be a big game for us as a team to be able to come out
47:10
and hopefully with this win.
47:12
Last time we were at Ohio State, it was for the Big Ten conference champ for that 2022 season.
47:18
So fond memories on that field. So really, really, really looking forward to that this week.
47:24
And then the other big game we have is the Minnesota and Wisconsin with the trip out west.
47:30
Absolutely. I said I was going to highlight a Big Ten game that I thought was
47:34
interesting since I have a little less investment.
47:36
And for me, I think it's going to be very interesting to see for the The first
47:40
time in Big Ten Conference, we have the two Midwest teams heading out to the West Coast.
47:45
So USC finally gets that home game.
47:47
And both Wisconsin and Minnesota are headed out to play UCLA and USC.
47:51
So it's going to be interesting to see how the Midwest goes out.
47:55
Both USC and UCLA came and they did the double weekend with Purdue and Indiana,
47:59
where both teams played those and they both left 2-0 from those games.
48:03
So how does the Midwest travel out to the West Coast? I think will be a big
48:07
question that we'll get some answers to this week.
48:09
As well as Minnesota and Wisconsin have had a strong start, you know,
48:13
maybe not the start that Wisconsin would have dreamed of comparing that they
48:17
were in the conference championship for the Big Ten tournament last year.
48:20
But they've had some, you know, good momentum as they roll into this Big Ten
48:24
season and same with Minnesota and their leading goal scorers we already touched on.
48:27
So I think that those will be two
48:29
fun games to highlight and see how the Midwest travels out West for us.
48:33
Absolutely. And then on Sunday, we have our Rutgers game, which is one of the
48:38
other four teams that are 3-0-0.
48:41
So hopefully we'll both be 4-0-0 going into that game. So that should be a big
48:45
one as well. So we're really looking forward to that.
48:47
Awesome. Well, it sounds like a fantastic weekend for you, Jordan.
48:50
As always, tune into games, Big Ten Plus, ESPN Plus.
48:54
There's always different College Soccer games going on. This year,
48:57
College Soccer has had some of the tightest and craziest results that I have seen.
49:02
Wake Forest beat number one and number two in the country back to back over the last two weeks.
49:07
There's been some other crazy playouts and different games and upsets going
49:11
on. We have Michigan State ranked number three.
49:14
You know, a lot of targets on backs, a lot of big things happening.
49:18
So I know that it is a very exciting time to be a women's college athlete to
49:23
make sure we're tuning into these games and supporting them and watching high level soccer.
49:27
Well, as always, guys, Thank you for tuning into the pod and soccer on.