Latest / Nutrition Connection by Dr. Kristen Hicks-Roof / 65: Kelly Patterson MS, RD, LDN, CSSD - INDUSTRY / BIOMARKERS

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65: Kelly Patterson MS, RD, LDN, CSSD - INDUSTRY / BIOMARKERS · Nutrition Connection by Dr. Kristen Hicks-Roof

• Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: Welcome back to the Nutrition Connection Podcast, the show where science meets storytelling. I'm your host, Dr. Kristen Hicks Roof, dietitian, researcher, and lifelong advocate of the role of nutrition, health, and wellness. Each episode, I sit down with dietitians and nutrition experts across the field of food and healthcare, leaders whose work touches nearly every aspect of our lives. So if you're a student, a seasoned professional, or someone simply curious about food, nutrition, and health, this podcast is just for you. The views, thoughts, and comments on this podcast do not reflect those of my employer nor the employers of my guests. So let's go ahead and get connected. I'm really excited to bring on a new guest today. We have Kelly Patterson. She is the clinical nutrition educator with Omega Quant Analytics. Welcome to the show, Kelly. Kelly Patterson: Thanks so much for having me. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: So I was really interested in bringing you on the show because way back in the day during my master's, it was actually on omega 3s and quantification. And when you had submitted an application, I was like, I definitely want her. Cause there's so much when it comes to measuring omega threes and what does that look like in clinical practice or in private practice. And so I'm just excited to have you on to just talk about what you do in your day to day and Kelly Patterson: Yeah. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: I haven't had someone in your type of role yet. So I'm really pumped to just talk about being a clinical nutrition educator and what exactly that means. So let's start from the beginning though, Kelly. What inspired you and made you want to become a nutrition professional? Kelly Patterson: So I was, I was like a lot of dietitians and a lot of people that, you know, end up in that kind of either health or wellness field. I was an athlete in high school and in college. And I just kind of started to have an interest in I knew I wanted to do something in the sciences. I kind of went into college. I was a biology major. It's a pretty familiar story. I think a lot of dietitians kind of start off like, you know, general sciences. I knew I wanted to do something in maybe healthcare. but I wasn't quite sure what. And kind of through that I found nutrition and just found it really interesting. I didn't know back then that, you know, what being a dietitian even looked like. I didn't know anything about you know, where you could work as a dietitian, nothing. And so once I kind of found that as a path and sort of started to, you know, understand that wow, there was like a ton of options that you could do. And even that was, you know. almost fifteen years ago. And so now there's even more options. that was kind of what what led me down that path that and I've just found it really interesting. And it's something that, you know, everybody has to encounter every single day. So I just, you know, found it to be interesting for myself personally, but that it could also be, you know, kind of very professionally versatile as well. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: You know, and I think you're right, over the last 15 years, you've started to see more and more what I call niche careers, but really they're kind of more of the norm, right? Like you used to be clinical, food service, community, and now it's like well beyond that. It'll be interesting to see if they ever update the dietetic internship to rather than be like three core concentrations to just have more variety, because there's so many different careers out there now. And I think that is a perk. of becoming a dietitian is to say, I could go into being a clinical nutrition educator or I could go into X, Y, or Z or whatever you want to go into. Kelly Patterson: Yeah, it's it's it's great. Like it just being able to at some point, and you know, if you're feeling, you know, maybe you've kind of maxed out on one area of practice in your career or just looking for a change, it's just you can go do anything. you know, with with the skill set. And so yeah, I mean, there's there's so much more. I I haven't been to a a fency in a couple of years, but the last time I went, I was my mind was just blown by how many you know, I went with the company that I I work for now and I was just like absolutely mind-blown by how many different types of practitioners were, like the different jobs that people had. it was just it was great to see people doing like just such niche, cool, interesting things. and it just made me feel like, okay, like there's just so many options out there for people. And you know, it's it's it's great to see the career field kind of exploding in that way. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: When if you've never been to Fincy, Fenty has almost 8,000 dietitians, and you're right. They come from like every niche and sector. And and I, you know, that's one of the things that I really wanted to come across with the podcast is say, hey, let's bring on nutrition professionals from all these niches and sectors and say, hey, here's what you do, here's what your day-to-day is. so that way if someone is interested, let's say in a career path like yours, which we're gonna get into, what would that look like? Kelly Patterson: Yeah. Yeah. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: So let's talk about your journey though. You decided you want to become a dietitian. So you went that path. What had what kind of roles have you had ultimately to get you to what you are today as a clinical nutrition educator? Kelly Patterson: Mm-hmm. so my journey has been a little bit all over the place. I had a very, I would say non-traditional, have had a non-traditional career path. I've hopped around a little bit. I did for my undergraduate, I was, you know, this was before the master's requirement. So I did a coordinated undergraduate program. So I graduated with my RD with my bachelor's, or I got my RD when I had just my bachelor's. and I started off in clinical nutrition. I worked my first real big girl job was at a a long-term care facility. I was it was kind of like a subacute care and long-term care facility combined, and I worked there for a while. And you know, I enjoyed it, but I kind of thought that clinical wasn't gonna be my forever, but I didn't know what I wanted to do. my internship had been in clinical nutrition. That was our, you know, our main focus where we spent most of our time. We did obviously a little bit of of the other, you know, domains, but our main focus was clinical nutrition. So I just wasn't, I didn't know what other options. Like I said, like back then I feel like I just I had no idea what else I could do. and through sort of a very random sequence of events, I ended up being contacted by a recruiter who was looking for. Dieticians at military bases, they were looking for dietitians that would go work in these soldier health clinics. So you were outpatient dietitian, seeing both soldiers and their families. and it was the wide range of things you were seeing people for, from weight management to diabetes education to working with pediatrici. I covered a pediatrics clinic. And I was living, I I graduated from Buffalo State College. Now it's Buffalo State University, but and so I was living in Western New York, and the job that was offered to me was in El Paso, Texas. And I and I just was really looking for a change. I was really young and I just wanted to go do something different. And so I took the job, and that was how I started my career working for the military. I was a military contractor, so I was a civilian, but working on a military base. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: That's quite a change. Kelly Patterson: and I just really loved it. I loved working with the population. I found the variety really interesting. I could be sitting with, you know, someone who was preparing for the best ranger competition and doing like real sports nutrition. And then the next appointment could be an older retired couple who, you know, need help with diabetes management. it was just like I did all sorts of like health events, things like that. It was just, it was very Interesting to me and it kept me engaged and I found the variety really engaging. And then I ended up moving. I met my husband and I moved to we moved to North Carolina, which is where we still live. and I ended up working at the military base here at Fort Bragg, and I got a job working for a special forces unit here as a performance dietitian. So I worked there for five years. doing performance nutrition for a special forces unit down at Fort Bragg. And it was just like the coolest experience. I'll have that for the rest of my life. It was awesome. I loved every bit of it. It was challenging. And you know, I I say that I didn't come from the kind of traditional path because most of the folks who work in that area come from sports nutrition backgrounds. So they were either had a sports nutrition focus during their internship or did fellowships and things like that. I didn't. I came, you know, more from the clinical background. and then when I was at my my job at Fort Bragg, I you did several projects related to brain health and concussion management for soldiers and omega-3s were a big focus from nutritional management perspective. And that's how I became familiar with OmegaQuant as a company and A few years later, I ended up ended up here and I am I've been here now for almost five years as well. and I love it. I'm the clinical nutrition educator and it's it's been great. So my career path has been a little little different. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: Well, and I think that's so cool that you went from clinical to sports. So talk about that transition for someone who's interested, but they maybe don't feel like they have the qualifications to the to do that. Like I know you're a CSS D. So did you get that while you were a clinical dietitian and that that helped you kind of like pivot to that sports area? Kelly Patterson: No, I actually got that while I was working for the military. So I got it during my first job working for the military. working with any military population, you know, at the time counts towards performance nutrition since I was working with active duty troops. and so that counted towards my practice hours, the the supervised practice hours that you need for or the documented practice hours you should you need, I should say. but no, I mean For me, like I I and I've talked to, you know, dietitians and students who want to go into sports nutrition, but you know, if you don't get like the fellowship or the internship maybe with the big sports teams, things like that. The thing I would say is just taking on any opportunity that you can, whether it's through your job or outside of your job, even if it's I've seen dietitians who will like counsel high school athletes and their in their spare time to kind of get some more of that experience or When I was working with the military, any sort of performance related thing that I could do, I did health events where I gave talks to groups on that were preparing for a deployment or coming home for a deployment and preparing for recovery, things like that. Any opportunity. I did health fairs and I said yes to all of it because I knew it would gain me more experience in that area and that's where I wanted to go. and so the the advice I would give is just say yes to those things. And even if you don't have the, you know, the internship or the fellowship or the you know, you don't get the SNP internship for the the sports nutrition, you can get there through other paths. It just may not look the same. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: Love that advice because I'm well over 50 episodes. And I would say at least 90% of them say yes to an opportunity. It's the it's the same consistent theme. And you know, that was even for my own life. It was kind of like, do you want to try this out? I'm like, I have no experience in it, but yeah, that sounds really fun. and you just kind of it opens doors that you don't know that you need open, right? To be able to to move to the next step. So Kelly Patterson: Yeah. Yeah. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: I think that's really interesting that like while you were in that military nutrition role, you started to look at those omega threes. So what was that transition like to going from that role into working for an industry or a corporation? How did you decide to make that jump? Kelly Patterson: Yeah, it was very different. It was very different. kind of why I decided to make the jump was a few reasons. Some of them personal. I have I have twin twins. So I was pregnant with twins at the time and kind of just looking at possibly, you know, changing roles. And so it was a little bit of a personal decision, kind of personal life consideration there too. But I had been in my role with with that at that particular job with the army for five years and kind of felt like I had, you know, was ready to move on. I had done what I wanted to do. And obviously there's always more to do. So it's, you know, it's never done, but I was kind of ready to to move on. And I had used some of Omega Quant's products, our Omega 3 index testing in our practice. We had used it for a pilot program and I thought it was just a really great product. I really liked the usability of it. And also just, you know, direct nutrition biomarkers, a big thing when you're working for in any sports nutrition or anywhere in nutrition, but especially working for the government. you know, being able to show kind of ROI on being a dietitian, if you are, you know, you you kind of got to show that what you're doing is working. And you know, there are kind of not That many direct ways to prove that. a lot of, you know, unfortunately, like a lot of the higher ups would be like, well, we'll just look at, you know, body composition. Well, that fluctuates and there's so many things related to that. But having like biomarkers that you can measure that show that, hey, you know, the things the interventions we're doing is working was really great. But also specifically with regard to concussion, you know, showing that we were increasing blood omega-3 levels. and that that, you know, we could show some research behind that showing that that might be effective in improving outcomes with related to concussion was really, really, really good for us. And so like I said, I like the product. I liked the company. It's you know, a small company, very research-based. That's kind of something you run into a little bit when it comes to industry, is you know, wanting to not get too much into you know, I I don't want to be a snake oil salesman kind of thing. you know, I wanted to work if I was gonna go into industry, I wanted to go somewhere that was gonna be very research-based, very science-based, that wasn't gonna, you know, make claims they couldn't back up. and that's how I feel about, you know, where I work now. Like the people I work with are incredible. The company is amazing. And you know, I'm very lucky to to do what I do now. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: Well, and I think there's a lot of roles in companies, whether it's food or supplements or whatever. You know, I've had several guests on the past working for a number of different industry corporations. And you're right, it's a way that you can have nutrition experts on staff to almost be the in-between of here's the science behind the product. Here's what we want to tell our consumers to buy the product or to, you know, purchase it in the clinic. Kelly Patterson: Mm-hmm. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: And then you're like the in-between of the science communicator. So talk about what your day-to-day is like. I mean, a clinical nutrition educator, you know, you kind of have that like clinical title, but then you're a nutrition educator, but then you're also like helping conduct and coordinate clinical trials and sales. So like give me a give me a day-to-day. Kelly Patterson: Yeah. I do a lot of different things. And so my day-to-day my days don't ever look all the same. I kind of work a little bit with different teams within our within our business. You know, we we're a small company, so I a lot of people have kind of a lot of different roles, but I would say my role falls in kind of three buckets. So the first is the actual nutrition education part. I work with customers, whether they are just, you know, like consumers or a lot of healthcare practitioners, answer a lot of questions, go over testing with them, help them understand results, things like that. the second bucket would be marketing. That's probably where I spend most of my time. So I do a lot of I help create webinars to do educational. We have a large healthcare practitioner base, customer base. And so we feel that, you know, our role as the omega three experts is to kind of keep people up to date on the latest science and the latest, you know, understandings of omega 3s and really all fatty acids in general. And so I do webinars, create education materials, I do videos, social media videos. explainer videos. I also host a podcast called Omega Matters. If anyone wants to shout out, we'll if anyone wants to listen about all things, omega 3s and any kind of fatty acids. We talk about the science, we interview scientists. So that's where probably I spend the bulk of my time. and then I also we have a connection with a group called Fari, which is the Fatty Acid Research Institute. And we conduct clinical trials or help conduct c clinical trials with them in conjunction with them. And so I do coordination for a lot of those trials and you know, do kind of the back end coordination for for those. So I get my hands in a little bit of everything. you know, sometimes I help out on the sales side. you know, it Talking to customer groups, things like that. If they want a more kind of scientific presentation, I might come in and do that. I've gone to trade shows as well too to help out there. Again, we're a small company, so we have a a lot of helping hands and in w everybody's kind of doing a little bit of everything. But yeah, it's my no day looks the same. and it keeps me keeps me busy. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: That is busy. Well, and it does sound like, you know, when I've talked to people who work at these smaller companies, it's like, yeah, you are helping marketing, you're helping helping regulatory affairs, you're helping with consumer education, with health professional education. But you know, that's really where dietitians are so uniquely positioned that we we can be science communicators to all the different stakeholder audiences. And I think that's a skill set that we build you know, during our education, especially with the graduate degrees and things like that. So Kelly Patterson: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: Omega-3s are super fascinating to me. Like I said, this was actually my master's thesis project, even though it was like a small blip in in my career, and I didn't focus on that afterwards. But how does like how has that science changed? And then how do you use scientific data in what you do in your day-to-day? Kelly Patterson: I mean the science is you know, continually evolving, right? Like we see all sorts of research coming out now. I mean, omega threes, I would say, you know, we just continue to see the piling up of evidence that omega threes are very beneficial, that most people are not getting enough omega threes, and that we see in all sorts of areas of health and wellness and disease that omega threes can be beneficial in reducing risk, things like that. Where I think some of the most interesting research is actually on the omega-6 side. especially given how much, you know, unfortunately social media spreads a lot of misinformation about, you know, certain types of food. My goodness, if I hear seed oils or poison one more time, it's really driving me crazy. you know, and I think there's just really interesting research to just show that that's absolutely not the case. that actually having certain types, more of certain types of omega sixes in your diet is more beneficial. and that, you know, it's not necessarily that we are eating too many of omega sixes. It's probably more that we're not getting enough omega threes. and also just overall diet quality, right? Nobody here is arguing that, you know, we want to eat more ultra-processed foods. That's that's certainly not what we're saying, but yeah, I mean, there's just, you know, the research is is constantly, constantly evolving. And and our goal is to help practitioners understand that, you know, omega-3 blood levels are worth measuring because so few people get them measured and that they have so the the main measure that that our company that Omegaquant is actually pioneered is called the Omega 3 index. It's a red blood cell. EPA and DHA percentage of red blood cell membranes. And that gives kind of a similar measurement to like an A1C, right? It gives a three-month average of omega-3 intakes. And you know, part of our job is to kind of convince healthcare providers that this is a worthwhile measurement. an omega-3 index of over 8% is associated with decreased decreased risk of cardiovascular disease, cardiovascular death. dementia, you know, all sorts of things, longevity. and so and more and more we see that association getting stronger and stronger. And so we know that, you know, most people are not getting nearly enough omega-3s. The average omega-three index in the United States is like three percent, and it should be around eight percent. and you know, people just are not are not getting enough. We don't eat enough fish. We don't have a culture that's eating enough fish save for maybe a few kind of localized areas, coastal areas. but otherwise, you know, I I wish I ate more fish. Like I I'm not perfect either. Like, you know, it's hard. And so you know, we kind of have to make that up where we can. And so that's where supplementation can come in. But you know, even encouraging people to eat more fish, like you know, I'm always encouraging people to go the food first route if they can, but it's just not realistic for everybody. So yeah. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: When I think you're right. Like, I think the science is changing and we're seeing it both in the in the protein world, like when you break down to the individual amino acids on maybe where you have deficiencies or over consumption. And then I think the same in fatty acids. Like I feel like we've had in nutrition these huge buckets of fatty acids, for example, and omega-3. Like at least you can measure that. But when you get down to like individual fatty acids, I think they're Kelly Patterson: Mm. Mm-hmm. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: There's some pluses and minuses with all of them, especially anything over consumed sometimes does not always have a beneficial effect. So I think the future of these sort of analyses are just going to get more desired. Like you're seeing it with, you know, the continuous glucose monitors. Like people are now more interested in measuring biomarkers. And what I see omega quant. And when you think about the the quantification of an omega 3 index. Kelly Patterson: Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: It allows you to almost have a biomarker or a target goal to say, okay, here's my starting point. And that's where I see like clinical nutrition experts, whether you're in private practice or in the clinic or in a military position, you're like, here is a baseline and we want to get here. We can intervene diet, and we'll see if the patient actually adheres to the diet or takes a supplement because you can actually change the biomarker. And I think that's something that our field needs more of. is to have like actual biomarkers of change and not just, we're increasing fruit and vegetable intake. Well, now you have the veggie meter. So you can actually measure fruit and vegetable intake. Right. So like there's things that I think our profession will do a lot better if we actually have measurable biomarkers for all these different things, depending on what the patient is interested, right? Like Kelly Patterson: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: I could eat more fish too, but I don't. I live in Arizona and it's not like we're a seafood rich state by any means. and so I think that's something that it will really help our profession over time. Kelly Patterson: Exactly. Yep. Yeah, I mean it and it's it's super motivating for patients too because it's hard to quantify. Like sometimes, you know, weight for a lot of folks has been a big, you know, can be a motivator, at least in the short term anyway, to try to make nutrition changes or diet and lifestyle changes. but first of all, like weight changes are difficult. I mean, we see that now with, you know, the kind of proliferation of GLP one medications. weight changes are difficult and you know, it's hard to stay motivated. with a a change that takes so long. and being able to show somebody on their lab work, like, hey, here, the things you did actually made a difference, like a quantifiable, measurable difference. And these things are associated with these better health outcomes. You don't have to just like trust me on this one, you know, you and you know, as much as we want like patients and providers to trust us, like it's It's hard when you don't have a measurable outcome. you know, especially something that's like a little bit more short term than you can say, like, hey, this is actually working. The thing you're doing is working. you know, it's it's very, it's motivating to people, I think. And and yeah, it's helpful to the more of these kind of diet quality measures that we're able to get via biomarkers, I think it'll make dietitians more effective. and I think it also, you know, motivates motivates patients. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: What I think is great career opportunities for dietitians to continue beyond the cutting edge of new biomarker analyses or new, you know, supplements that can help with X, Y, or Z or whatever it is. And I agree with you, I'm a food-first approach too, but at the same time, sometimes you physically cannot take it in enough. It's like creatine. Like, I would love a food only approach to creatine, but like there is no way unless you just eat like massive quantities of meat, right? Kelly Patterson: Yeah. Yeah. I can't eat that much beef. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. And it's, it's, yeah, absolutely. And I think you know, I hear a lot about, you know, especially when kind of AI, generative AI first came out, you know, there was this like, we won't need, you know, dietitians. And I'm like, pfft, you know, no way. Like, I think the other technologies and kind of the more we get into personalized nutrition, there is absolutely a role for dietitians. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: So Kelly Patterson: and in you know, both in companies and in the healthcare system, like I think we'll be needed just as much or more than ever in the future. So I'm I'm I'm not worried too much about that. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: Yeah, no, I agree with you. And I think that AI technologies can make us more efficient and to help support, but the more biomarkers and data we can collect, the more we can actually show that physical change. Cause you're right, like weight is so hard. I mean, I remember I was a corporate dietitian and it was like, I see people once a month, and there's only so many pounds that a person can change. Plus, I'm sure you and I both know, like you could step on the scale this morning and the tonight and you weigh a different number. Right. And so it's like, Kelly Patterson: Yeah. So hard. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: To actually see that change versus like having a biomarker change within your body to show physiologically the diet or the exercise that you're doing is changing a physiologic number, which then has associations in the research for better improvements in health. So super interesting and it sounds like a really fun job. I that's awesome. But what's been, you know, between all your different career paths that you've kind of had. Kelly Patterson: Yeah. Ha ha ha. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: what's been your favorite or something you're most proud of so far? Kelly Patterson: my gosh. I mean, in my time working with special forces, I got to do an experience and see things that like I I were just like incredibly cool. I had opportunities that were just like I still think about it. I'm like, I can't believe I actually got to do that. and yeah, that was just like such a purpose driven job. you know, you feel very much, especially when you're working with, you know, the military, that you're some, you know, part of something that's much larger than yourself. you're helping people who are, you know, part of a mission that is is much larger than you. You're doing something, you know, even in in what I felt was my small way of of, you know, helping your country, there's just that, that is just it's a an experience that I'm so like grateful that I got to have. and yeah, I mean I, you know, that that probably in terms of like specific things I did, you know, getting to go and actually see how how those like soldiers train and kind of try to implement what nutrition looks like in sports in that setting and try to figure out with the unique challenges. like how do you feed and hydrate somebody who is wearing it's called mop level four gear, which is basically it's not a hazmat suit, but it's like a hazardous materials suit, right? But with also all of their military gear. Like how do you feed and hydrate somebody who can't take the mask off? How do you feed and hydrate somebody who might have to wear that for eight to twelve hours at a time? like those challenges, like working on that was so hard, but it was also like really cool. and like I got to contribute just like a teeny tiny little bit to to you know, maybe solving that bigger problem. and that was probably those are were my favorite things. We're just like trying to solve those like really weird challenges. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: Well, and think you're right. Tactical athletes, whether it's a, you know, a firefighter or military or even the future of space, like you're gonna need nutrition experts, both scientists and dietitians, to be able to say, here's what we can how we can meet your physiological needs, right? Because in in creative ways that maybe can last a month, you know, out on the field and be available for them that's nutrient dense, that actually tastes Kelly Patterson: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: somewhat decent that they don't have to choke down. You know what I mean? Like, you're right. I mean, I've read a lot of the literature and tactical athletes because it's so fascinating. And I'm a research nerd. Like this is also why I love having so many different guests on, because I'm like, we get a nerd out a little bit here. but yeah, I think that would be so fun. And it's a small piece, but you know, I think in a way, that's how every dietician feels, right? Like Kelly Patterson: Yep. Yep. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: Whether you're in clinic or you're in community or you're in a food industry or in agriculture or wherever you're at, you're a small piece, but it is to a bigger thing, a bigger mission. It's the mission of which we all have is making people healthier, making people live nutritious lives that they are, you know, mobile and functional and happy, right? And like food is the epicenter to health. so I think we all Kelly Patterson: Yeah. Mm. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: share that same sentiment, but you're right. Like it feels different depending on what role you at you have. And I've felt the same throughout my career. Like, you know, I was an educator and while I wasn't impacting the masses, it was like I still get my former students coming to me and they're like, here's what I'm doing now. Like I've had a couple former students on the podcast and it's like, that is so cool that you're doing that now. And I was like a little piece to their success, right? So it's a fun, fun way. So what suggestions or tips would you have for someone who's interested in a career path like yours? and especially I think I want you to dive a little bit deeper on like working with Omega Kant and like that type of role. Like how what tips would you have for someone to land that sort of role? Kelly Patterson: I mean, I think the first thing would be like it is impossible to overestimate the like importance of relationships throughout a career. You know, you can be very like well educated and have all the expertise, but if you like especially when it comes to kind of networking and things like that, and I feel like most dietitians are are pretty pretty good about that. but you know, maintaining relationships, that's kind of how I ended up. with my job was you know, I had a relationship with someone who worked there, just knew them and kind of c cultivated that and then sort of you know, was able to interview for the job. I applied and interviewed as well. so I can't like I can't express enough how important it is to kind of maintain pro professional relationships and to keep you know, kind of always keep that in the back of your mind of, you know, don't burn bridges and and keep those doors open all the time. You never know when a company that you really like is gonna be hiring for something. You know, something may maybe it's a role that, you know, it's a company that whose product you use or product you or you've worked with before as far as like being a customer. you never know when they will be hiring. And so if you can, you know, keep those relationships, you just you don't know when those doors will open. so kind of always keeping that in the back of your mind. and, you know, honestly, like Apply for jobs that do not necessarily require an RD. I think, and I used to feel this way too. I would think I'm a dietitian, I have to be applying for a dietitian job. and that is just not always the case. Sometimes there are, I've seen there's some folks on LinkedIn who post kind of different nutrition jobs that a lot of them don't really have the they're kind of nutrition adjacent, but they're certainly not RD required. they don't even require like a nutrition degree, but the skills and experience that some dietitians have map absolutely perfectly onto those roles. So don't necessarily box yourself into applying for jobs that only require an RD and just always make sure you're kind of keeping awareness of those professional relationships because you never know when a door will open and you kind of want to be ready to walk through it. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: I mean, I post niche jobs twice a week on my LinkedIn too. And that's what I want to convince people too is it's not gonna say dietitian in the title. It's not gonna say you have to have the RD credential. And that's okay. Like it it doesn't mean that we're not qualified or we're overqualified. It's just that they don't even know what they're looking for. Like, think of the amount of people who are dietitians now who had no idea what a dietitian was before they started. Or, you know, when I was in health profession and education. Kelly Patterson: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: A lot of other health professionals have no idea what a dietitian does. So how would you expect a marketing manager or a or a research facility to necessarily know what a dietitian does? And so I think you're right in that we can apply for things that are nutrition adjacent. And that is going across food and industry and supplements and agriculture and sports, right? Like marketing, communications. I mean, all these roles. And we have this like extra layer of. Kelly Patterson: No idea. Mm-hmm. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: education and skills that we can offer to all those jobs. So I agree with you. I think LinkedIn is a great platform for many dietitians. And we're actually speaking on it. We have a session on Tuesday at Fenty, if anyone is going, all about elevating your voice on LinkedIn to be able to be a yeah, scientific communicator, but also recognizing that nutrition experts have a very unique voice across sectors. So Awesome advice. I agree with you completely, really. I mean, you're speaking my language right there. And I think that's such a powerful thing for dietitians to know. And when you talk about connections and relationships, that's bi-directional, right? And what I always try and tell people is like it's maybe not equal, right? Like maybe Kelly, you share with me a job and then Kelly Patterson: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: A year later, I ask you if you want to be as part of a a quote for an article, right? Like so that's not necessarily a time bound, it's not an equal sharing, it's but it is showing reciprocity and it's not take, take, take. and I think some people don't realize that, that it is a bi directional. Have you experienced that too? Kelly Patterson: Absolutely. Yes. Yes. Yeah, I mean, I I think especially I think a lot of the times when, you know, you see younger dietitians or newer dietitians, you know, they don't it's it's just not recognizing that, and understanding that like, you know, yeah, that reciprocity that it's it's offering, you know, experiences also to getting experiences. And also I think there's a little bit of sometimes feelings of awkwardness, right? Like, I I only, you know, know this person from kind of an we have an email relationship in the sense that like, you know, you've emailed back and forth via a company. but you'd be surprised how many people are very open if you just reach out and say, hey, like I have this, you know, thing or whatever it might be. and even if you, you know, were only email, you know, had an email professional relationship, you didn't really know each other in person, you'd be shocked at how many people were are totally willing to help out or can give you guidance. and give you direction. So I think some of it is also just confidence and and being willing to reach out to people. I've there have been many times where I was like, should I ask this person? And I'm just like, well, what do I have to lose? And almost always they're like, Yeah, sure, whatever, I can help you with that. And it's like, my gosh, thank you. And also anytime you need anything, please reach out. and and yeah, most people are so much more willing to help than you realize. And a lot of it just comes down to having to ask, yeah. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: Yeah. And and you're you know, I don't remember the quote, but it's kind of like if you don't ask, you're back at zero, which is where you started. So really you don't have anything to lose. The worst thing is they're just not gonna reply to you, which I'm guilty of sometimes. I try not to, but like sometimes you're just busy. Yeah, we we've all done it. Exactly. Exactly. Okay. My my favorite question here, Kelly, as we close out, if you had a crystal ball, what do you think is coming next in nutrition? Kelly Patterson: Yeah. Yep. Yeah. We've all done it. And it's usually not because they're mad. It's just 'cause they forgot. Yeah, it's 'cause they forgot. I mean, I think, you know, you've mentioned it a couple of times, like dietitians as nutrition communicators. I think with life being so much online now, you know, when you kind of you mentioned like the three domains, kind of, you know, clinical and food service and like community nutrition. I I come the the first thing I thought of as like I think a fourth good bucket would be nutrition communication. I think communications And getting information out to people through, you know, whether it's social media or other channels is probably the most important thing that we're gonna see in the next, you know, it's already happening, but it's going to continue to be the most important thing that we're gonna see as far as nutrition. And I think that's that's just it I think we're gonna need more of it. We're gonna need more people involved in it and we're gonna need you know, more training, I think. in in that aspect of of nutrition. So like if I had to add a fourth bucket, you know, of of that sort those domains in nutrition, right away, I think the first one I would I would add would be like nutrition communications. I think that's where the field is really gonna be going is is nutrition communications. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: When and your job is a clear example of that, right? Like you have to have communications to all your different stakeholder audiences, right? So, like what you say to a health professional is gonna be different than what you say to a researcher who's doing the clinical trials, right? Because they're gonna not that one's smarter than the other, but they just have different levels of expertise and they're expecting different types of communications versus a consumer. Kelly Patterson: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm. Yeah. Absolutely. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: Who maybe you're not gonna talk about all the different fatty acids in the protocol, right? They're just looking for the fatty acid index number or the omega-3 index. So yeah, I I believe nutrition communications is such an important opportunity, but it's a skill that takes time to develop. I think people say, well, I wanna be a nutrition communicator. And it's like, yeah, sometimes you have to do write free a new newsletter, go on TV, like. Kelly Patterson: Right. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yes. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: Start on your own social channel. I mean, there's a lot of things that you can do, and they're not necessarily paid right off the get-go. If you talk to any big communicator or an influencer that's a dietitian, they didn't start off making buku bucks. They started off, right, like writing for free in their local newspaper. And then they started like accepting a little ad hoc gig. And then they were working on the side and they had a private practice. And like it's slowly built into what it is today. And so I say. Kelly Patterson: Yeah. Kristen Hicks-Roof PhD, RDN: For anyone who's listening, I agree the crystal ball is nutrition communications, but it's also give yourself grace, get time, start learning, start learning from others. I think there's so many good nutrition communicators out there. And all of us do it just in different ways so we can learn from each other. Well, Kelly, thank you so much for being on the show. It was awesome hearing your story. And we got to nerd out a little bit on Omega 3s, which was really fun, brought back some of my old memories. but if you like the podcast, make sure you like, subscribe, leave a review. But most importantly, check out the next episode because every episode I bring on a different dietitian and nutrition expert to share their story and give you tips and advice on how to be successful.