Latest / The Trauma Therapist / Episode 833: Undoing The Aloneness with Erin Moran

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Episode 833: Undoing The Aloneness with Erin Moran · The Trauma Therapist

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Trauma Therapist Podcast. Plus listeners can listen to episodes early and ad free right
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now. Become a Plus listener by going to Apple Podcasts searching for the Trauma
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Therapist Podcast and signing up today. All right, welcome back to the Trauma
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Thepist podcast. My name is Gamiferson. My mission is to help trauma therapist
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be their incredible selves, to be human, to be real, not just
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a clinician. I'm a big believer in who we are is more important than
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what we know, and this requires cultivating authenticity, genuineness, and vulnerability,
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and that requires intention. Can learn more about my courses and workshops by going
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to the Trauma Therapist project dot com. That's the Trauma Therapist Project dot com.
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Let's get started, all right, here we go, so five four
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three two one. Welcome back to the podcast. I'm very excited to have
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as my guest today, Erin Moran, Erin, welcome, Hi, glad
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to be here. Awesome, Thanks so much so. Aaron Moran, originally
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from New York with a bachelor's degree in business marketing, moved to Florida in
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twenty eleven to study for her master's in Clinical mental health counseling. She's a
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licensed mental health counselor in the state of Florida and gained clinical experience working at
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a university counseling center, a residential addiction treatment facility, and an outpatient eating
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disorder. In twenty twenty one, she connected with Rick Padlow to develop the
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clinical program at soft Row's Recovery. Aren a certified group practitioner, and she's
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taken several intensive trauma trainings, which has fueled her passion for helping clients at
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SOFTWAWS to heal and transform their lives. Erin welcome, thank you, Thank
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you so much. You're welcome. So before we get going, share with
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the listeners where you're from originally and where you are currently. Yeah, I
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say originally I'm a New Yorker. I feel like that's also my heart.
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I have a tattoo over here, and I have an Apple to represent New
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York. Wow, I'm to represent Florida. So I feel like those are
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both in my hearts. Yeah. I grew up, spent about twenty years
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in New York, followed my sister down to Florida. She had gone to
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UF decided to stay in Florida. I came down here with her and she's
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also a therapist. So we say, like, must have been a really
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smooth childhood. Have all of us become therapists? Right? Interesting? So
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yes, I've been in Jacksonville, Florida now for over a decade. Wow,
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okay, so well let's talk about that. How did all this start
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for you? Yeah? Oh my goodness. So my journey you know,
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clearly said like my background, I was a business marketing so I was not
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interested in becoming a therapist. I had people telling me in my early twenties,
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like, you'll be a great therapy and my response then was like,
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why would I ever want to do that? I have to tell people that
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life has a sense of humor, and you know, here I am.
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It took me a while to get to this path. I really struggled in
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my early twenties figuring out what did I want to do, what really fit?
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What did my career and future look like? And after many people planting
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that seed, I finally decided to kind of follow my sister's footsteps. So
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she graduated about two years before I did in this program and became fascinated hearing
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her and her friends talk about therapy and just talk about what they're learning.
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And so I decided to take that leap, and very quickly it was like,
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I get it. I get what everyone was saying that this is why
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would they let me, let me, let me stop you that? Why
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were a lot of people saying that to you, you'd be a great therapy,
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you'd be a great therapist. Yeah, great question. I think,
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since I was very young, had probably a passion and an interest in seeing
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potential in people, sometimes to a fault, you know. I definitely my
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my recovery journey is making sure that I'm recovering like people pleasing and codependent tendencies
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and when we might get into that some today, but I really always wanted
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to hold space for people. I was the person coming up with advice for
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people. I was a cheerleader for people. I was coming up with different
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perspectives, you know, really since a very young age, and so people
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have been like, wow, you really you know, you really see me,
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or you really give really good advice. And so that was the thing
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that was prompting people to be like, I feel like you do a really
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good job at this. But it seemed like such a daunting, you know,
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heavy hard space to hold without really knowing what was in this field and
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it is I mean it could be heavy and hard to hold, but also
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hold. That's so interesting, you know we I often hear that from people.
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I mean people said would say that to me, And I don't know
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if it's true for you, But when when I would hear that, you
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think you'll value it that much because it's it's who you are. It just
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like comes so easily. It's just pure thing. But that's so cool that
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people said that. So okay, you decided to go forth. So what
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did you do? You? Where'd you go? Yeah? So I went
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to University in North Florida. Their clinical mental health Counseling program was a great
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program. I had a wonderful experience. I had really good professors. Some
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of my best friends I still have from my cohort. So now a decade
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later, we're still we call ourselves the like the Fantastic four. There's four
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of us. So yeah, I just I jumped in, went to the
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program, and very quickly it was like this is one hundred percent exactly where
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I meant to be. I felt that, like you said, it was,
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it was like a skin just sort of stepping and falling into place,
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being like this is exactly what I'm meant to be doing. This is I
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thrive off of this. I love holding space for other people. I love
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being able to maybe see things that other people aren't, you know, helping
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to point those patterns out together, helping us to challenge some of those negative
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spirals that you know, even relating like I'm a very transparent therapist, Like
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I love being like I'm going to bring me into the room appropriately, you
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know and quick healthy boundaries. But I'm like, hey, I'm going to
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model that, like being a human is messy and hard, and that's okay,
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and there are ways to do it that are healthier and that you don't
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have to be as alone. So yeah, it's been a wonderful, amazing
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journey and I'm so glad people did plant that seat, Otherwise I might have
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waited even longer to join into this field. So weird. Does the recovery
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part come in you touched upon a little bit? Yeah, So I have
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a lot of addiction in my dad's side of the family, So that's something
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that I grew up being familiar with. Didn't think again, like I say,
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like does like a sense of humor? The other thing I also said
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when very early in my career was like, I don't ever want to work
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with eating disorders or addiction. Okay, okay? And I, you know,
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because I really struggled early on in my career or in my life figuring
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out what I wanted to do with my career. I really felt like I
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wanted to work with college students that sort of I'm not a kid anymore,
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but yet, what is this adulting thing? And you know who am I?
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And I loved that, and that's where I started my first four or
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five years in my career. It was an amazing experience, had amazing colleagues,
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amazing mentors. And then I was sort of like what else. You
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know, I kind of got into some of my trauma, my passion for
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trauma, got exposure to group therapy, started supervising a new therapist at that
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point, and I was like what else? And I just happened to apply
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to a job at a residential addiction facility and fell in love. Took that
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leap and was like wow, this is It was a whole new world.
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I mean, people who are struggling with addiction and say like it's a symptom
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of mental health, It's a symptom of trauma. It's a symptom of anxiety
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depression. You know, so many wounds that have existed in our life,
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and so many people don't have any tools or resources. So being able to
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really just shine some light on some of this was so cool to see this
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transformation and this healing sometimes in a really short period of time, and people
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being so hungry for connection as well as hungry for oh there's another way,
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or oh that was a trauma that I experienced. It maybe wasn't PTSD,
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but it was a trauma. And just sometimes having that light click could be
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completely transformative for somebody. So yeah, and a lot of times and correct
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me from off the market here, but a lot of times people with addiction
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don't. It's the addiction becomes the giant thing that almost obscures the trauma.
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Right, It's like, what do you mean, I've had tried enough trauma.
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I wasn't in combat, I wasn't hit by a truck. So when
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you when you first got into this program, now are we talking about at
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soft rows here, was that we didn't get there. Okay, we're there
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yet. Okay, So when you first started, when you in this program
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with addiction, you said, you know, you were just like this was
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incredible. Talk more about what fit for you, What sparked you in that,
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Oh, that's a fantastic question. I think that was when I really
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started to to solidify my passion for really doing trauma work and recognizing the need.
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And really, you know, my style of like when I work with
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trauma is undoing the aloneness, is allowing someone to be like I am here
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and allowing my clients to like feel seeing and care for and allowing them to
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then see care for not care for me, but like see that like my
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care is genuine. And so I would say that really sparked a difference.
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I think a lot of clients have had bad experiences at treatment facilities. The
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amount of clients who have been like I've gone a treatment X amount of times
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and have felt sometimes that some staff are just there for a job, are
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burnt out or over it or just checking a box. And that is a
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whole new trauma in and of itself. If you're coming into this really vulnerable
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state, say probably I want to heal and I want to change, and
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I want to learn something new. But you know, this addiction, the
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substance has its clause in me to then feel like people are annoyed by you
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or that you're just a burden. It's like, wow, we're now adding
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on a whole other layer. And so that part of being like these people
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matter and seeing that if somebody is sometimes they say like we tanser and we
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all tanger and we have these younger versions of ourselves that are like, you
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don't like this, And if I could just hold some space for that and
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validate that, like, Okay, there's a part of you, whether it's
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his angry part, this sad part, this scared part that's having a really
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strong reaction, and that's valid. And at the same time, I wonder
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if there's another way that we could get this need met, a way in
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which I could be your teammate and way which you don't have to be alone
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and don't have to engage in maybe the same self destructive behavior. And then
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as clients saw that, like, oh, she's not going to be intimidated
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by my anger, she's not I don't have to worry about getting rejected by
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her, and I could show up in these same ways that people would have
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said, oh, you're too much, and knowing that like this person's willing
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to sit and hold space with me and saying like okay, cool, I
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get that you're angry, give me and I'll talk about it. And that
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was like amazing. Like, I had some clients that people, unfortunately at
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the facility I've previously worked out, we're labeling them of like oh yeah,
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that's she's a tough one. And I got to see that person all the
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time. Yeah, all the time. Yeah. So that was the part
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that was like, that was so rewarding to be like, oh, I
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know they can come in my office and be seen all parts of them and
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then that gives them permission to start to show up as a different version of
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themselves. That was the part that was so good. Where does all this,
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I mean, you sound amazing. Where does this come from? Did
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you start out like this? I think if you probably were to ask,
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my family probably probably came out of the womb in some ways. So I
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think from my own trauma. That's the reality of it. You know.
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It's like, I love my family, and I'm very grateful that I have
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several family members who have really done the work as well. We've had to
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have some really hard conversations, but the reality is I grew up with a
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lot of conflict in my house, and so I was sort of thrust into
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this first role from a very young age. That's why I say that people
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pleasing codependent. I one hundred percent took on the label of like being the
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good the good daughter, whatever that may mean. You know, really lost
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my connection with myself, which makes sense my struggles in my twenties, like
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how would I figure out my career when I didn't even know how to really
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connect with what was my truth? Being willing to let people be angry and
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upset with me. So yeah, from a very young age, I was
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being playing a therapist for my parents, trying to de escalate conflicts, trying
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to help them to slow down and make sure that they're talking to each other
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and not storming and slamming doors and name calling and all that. So,
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you know, really just growing up in a highly emotionally reactive household with a
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lens and a mask of thinking it was a super loving household and then also
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realizing like, oh but maybe a b aren't adding up. So I say,
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it's like, in some ways, that's the resiliency that can come from
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trauma. Is there was a lot of hurts, a lot of things that
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I had to shed, you know, in my life, and a lot
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of therapy that I had to go to to be like, this isn't serving
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me. Being a people pleaser, being codependent telling people what I think they
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want to hear just to avoid rejection and avoid conflict is causing them pain.
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Me pain. I don't even know who I am, and so I had
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to work on those things. But then the other part of it is I
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give me an angry client, give me a client who wants to scream,
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and I'm like, sam me up, Like I can de escalate, like
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nobody's business. I'm like, I got this. So I'm like I could
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take these things that were these beautiful traits that really helped me to become an
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amazing therapist and to be patient and to see all perspectives. Like that's probably
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why I am so good at the addiction world, is I could see all
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of the parts, and all the parts play their roles, and yet I
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have to work on And this is the benefit of becoming also a therapist is
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I had to work on oh anger is okay, And conflict is so beautiful
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because it gives us the opportunity for repair. So it's been a cool life
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journey. Yeah, yeah, beautifully said. So now for forgive my naivete
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here. But there's a uh, there seems to be an understand like a
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cultural understanding that recovery is a long process, right, It's it's almost understood,
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like you're going to go into recovery multiple times. That seems to be
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understood. Is there truth to that? Is that just the way? It
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is? Absolutely? And I think you know this is where it's not just
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substances. I view recovery as recovery from maladaptive, unhealthy, harmful behaviors and
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the ways of thinking, and that is undoing, like a huge foundation and
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framework. You know, for most of us, it's childhood, or it's
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our early relationships, it's the way that we view life, the way that
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we view relationships, the way that we view relationships with authority, figures with
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men with women, and we develop these ways of coping. And so for
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a lot of people, it's we all I think all of us numb out
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in some ways, whether it's I'm taking a nap, I'm gonna, you
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know, spend hours on TikTok, I'm going to go shopping, I'm gonna,
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you know, have an unhealthy relationship with food either eat you know,
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too much or too little, or I'm gonna, you know, engage in
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a substance to try. And I mean it's so common of people being like,
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you know, talking about wine moms, I've had a stressful day,
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I'm gonna have my wine after work. You know, right, it is
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a lifelong journey. I love that point. Yeah, let's talk about soft
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rows. So software's recovery. How did that come about? Yeah, so
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our CEO is in recovery himself. He is a very smart and talented individual.
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And I feel very lucky to have had us just kind of stumble into
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each other's lives. A person I previously worked at the residential facility had reached
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out to me years later. I was no longer at the residential facility and
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thought, I was like, I need a break from treatment centers. I
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had unfortunately a lot of not the best experiences with leaders throughout my career and
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was like, I'm going to just do my private practice. I would to
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do this thing on my own. And this guy reached out and said,
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Hey, there's an IOPPHP opening in Jacksonville, Florida, and this guy's looking
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for a clinical director and someone to develop the program, and you know,
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I'm not really in it, but I'll get you guys in contact, and
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got in contact with Nick and Stars aligned. So him being in his recovery
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journey, he really felt passionate about this level of care. You know,
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there's a lot of residentials and there's a lot of really good residential facilities.
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There was not an abundance of this sort of aftercare, and there's a lot
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of outpatient therapists, not enough, but they do exist. And so this
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in between level, which I love. I think it's like the cream of
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the or however that's saying goes. It is like perfect for me because it's
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intensive, you get to work in a team. The clients get really immersed
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in this healing, but yet they're not away from from life. They're still
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having to deal with triggers. They're so I'm gonna go to the grocery store
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and you know, drive past the liquor store and you know, still exists,
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still have to plan for dinner and deal with traffic, but they get
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really intense support. So that's why I love it. But yeah, we
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just kind of came into each other's lives and our values really aligned. He
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really really cares about the clients, like he client centered passion is you would
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think he's a therapist. He's not. He's a West Point grad Stanford,
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MBA. Like he's definitely like more of a bitter. We created Softwares in
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and of itself. He created the business, and then I created the clinical
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okay, so like I developed the group program, I you know, created
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the like the therapy component. I don't know how I did it, but
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I did it. Now, just to be clear, So this is not
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a residential facility. It is not okay, so anyone can go there or
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is it most opportune or most optimized for people who've already done residential and then
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they come to you guys, So we do both. We have some people
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who have done residential and then they step down, so it's like the step
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down aftercare. But we have some people who maybe don't meet criteria for residential
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it's not necessarily that severe, or some people who are just flat out refusing
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and then they also go So like I view addiction on such a spectrum,
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and so it's that part of it being like some people maybe aren't to that
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super severe, like they could stop on their own but we don't want to
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just white knuckle it. We don't want to just be like, Okay,
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I'm not using a substance, but I've not developed any new tools. So
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that's where we come in to really not only how to stay sober tools,
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but how to human healthier, how to exist in this world in a more
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balanced way. And that's where we come in and really provide those tools,
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provide that support, provide this safe, supportive, loving environment. So yeah,
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anyone, I say, it's sort of like a part time slash full
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time job, you know, And that's the people who you know come and
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really invest and immerse themselves into this program. Because you're getting groups, you're
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getting individual we have medical providers like you're just getting kind of sounds amazing,
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A warm hug. Yeah, it's amazing. It is when you said you
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when you said, Okay, I'm going to do this, I'm going to
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take on this job. What are some of the elements, qualities, the
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things that you wanted to bring to this program that maybe you felt weren't around
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or were lacking. Yeah, I think first and foremost, I wanted to
21:55
hire well and I wanted to ensure my team also felt safe, supported,
22:03
respected I don't necessarily think treatment is fully reinventing the game. There's bits and
22:10
pieces with it. Like so we do offer yoga, we have nutrition,
22:12
health and wellness, so like we try to and then we also have the
22:15
medication propone it, so like we try to address like the full person.
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So yes, that's not like mind altering brand new information. You know,
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we are doing like some basic therapy, the CBT skills, the DBT skills.
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We're doing an understanding trauma, introducing people to what trauma is, you
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know, communication skills, emotion regulation skills, like all of that stuff.
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But I think first and foremost it is if I can hire well, but
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I can retain my team, and I can create a space, I say,
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like a therapist where the container for sort of all of the stuff we
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helped our clients to hold it. I want to make sure that I give
22:56
the container everything it needs to be successful. And so I want my team
23:02
to feel that they have resources, that they have support, they can come
23:06
to me, that anything can exist, like they can come as they're messy,
23:11
imperfect versions of themselves and know that like that's okay. Let's talk about
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it and figure out how I can best support you. That's what's different.
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I can hire well and I can keep really good therapists who are so passionate
23:23
about this work. My team cares. I mean, we have a channel
23:26
communication channel that's a celebration channel, and they are like constantly celebrating each other
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of like oh yeah, and they teamwork. They're jumping in for each other
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and it's just amazing. I think that's why we're changing the game. You
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come in the door and you feel, oh, people want to be here
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and they care. They're not just saying things that sound nice. They buy
23:48
it. That's the difference. That's crucial. I mean that your ability to
23:56
provide that space where those therapists can feel like they can show themselves without fear
24:03
of oh my god, I'm going to get fired or I'm not going to
24:07
be viewed and I'm going to be viewed as lesson or not a good therapist.
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That's crucial. And that space that allows them to do that just fuels
24:17
their energy and creativity, which of course then trickles down with the clients.
24:22
You know, yeah, that's amazing. Wow. Yeah. Soft ros Is
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Where is it in? Jacksonville, Florida, So Northeast Florida Okay, now
24:38
people, Now it's is everything you guys offer is it in that space?
24:44
You know? Are you doing any online stuff or what? So quick question.
24:48
So we're opening Jacksonville, Florida. We are opening hopefully in the next
24:52
two weeks in Tampa, so Temple Terrace near Bush Gardens, USF. That
24:57
area will be doing the same thing a php IOP. We already have an
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amazing team hired there, love them, so grateful for the team that we
25:07
got there as well. And then in the next few months, once Tampa
25:11
is up and running, we're going to launch a virtual program which will be
25:15
really for clients who are in the middle of a state, clients who are
25:19
like the nearest treatment is two hours away. You know, even an hour
25:25
an hour plus is a long way if you're driving somewhere three days a week.
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So we really want to be able to offer to people who don't have
25:33
access to that a program that's still top tier, super awesome. So we're
25:37
still in the process of launching like what that looks like, to kind of
25:41
tweak it to make sure that those clients still get the same exact type of
25:45
experience and still that feel of like these people are in my corner really care,
25:49
even if they're through a screen. That's awesome. Now, as we
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kind of wind down here, I want to ask you a question, just
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so that everyone doesn't think you're superwoman. I want you to share. I
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want you to share like an early clinical experience where you like, holy crap,
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I can't do this, this sucks up? You know what? Am
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I doing? Many of those? And so now I'm going to supervise many
26:21
of my people on my team. And I say all the time, like,
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that's such a normal And I think a healthy experience as a therapist to
26:26
be like I don't know what I'm doing. I still have experiences where I'm
26:30
like I don't know what I'm doing. I'm like, that's good because if
26:33
I use that as long as I don't spiral in a like feeling small and
26:37
insecure. But if I use it to be like, well, let me
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take a check in with myself, like am I tired or burnt out?
26:44
Am I needing to do some more professional development? Is there something I would
26:48
want to do differently in that situation? And sometimes the answer to those things
26:51
is yes, and so it does fuel me. Other times it's just simply
26:55
saying like no, I would do it exactly the same. It's just the
26:57
way that things aligned. But man, early in my career I talking about
27:03
this journey of growth and healing. I mean, I wouldn't have been able
27:06
to do this. I once co facilitated a group and I stayed silent the
27:12
entire It was an hour and a half group and I didn't say a word.
27:17
And I was a facilitator of this group. I didn't ask a question.
27:19
I had a lot of thoughts in my head, but I just censored
27:25
everything. And my co facilitator at the end was like, what happened right?
27:30
And I was like, I was so anxious and I don't know,
27:33
And I just allowed my fears and my censoring of myself to exist, which
27:40
it still does exist, but it was in the forefront. And that was
27:42
such a valuable lesson for me because as I was telling telling her like,
27:47
well I thought about this at this moment, I would have said this,
27:49
she was like, those were brilliant. That was perfect. And so it
27:55
really kind of like I learned that I just have to sometimes take a risk.
28:00
And I also learned, which I now teach my team, that there's
28:03
not much that we could do wrong. We can you know, sometimes maybe
28:07
make mistakes, but sometimes mistakes are beautiful because they give us an opportunity for
28:12
that repair. It gives us an opportunity to even deepen and strengthen the connection.
28:18
So that was a really valuable and awkward and uncomfortable learning experience, but
28:23
one that I still reflect on because I'm like, wow, I started out
28:27
feeling so small and that I could be wrong and I could do harm and
28:33
I you know, I was like, let me just quiet, let me
28:36
keep myself wrapped up so tight, and I recognized that like that was serving
28:41
no one and no one would benefit from me blooming. And so I really
28:45
learned to try and take those risks. And it's scary and it's hard.
28:48
It's still scary, I mean doing these podcasts, like I still had a
28:52
little bit like my heart racing ahead of time, but it was like,
28:56
okay, like I could do the risks and the scary things because yes,
29:00
usually it's worth it. Yeah, that's amazing, You're amazing. I love
29:03
talking to you, man, love to have you back at later later time.
29:07
Yeah. Yeah, I know a lot of people see this going,
29:11
oh my god, yes, you know, and that's that's what a lot
29:15
of people need and can benefit from. All right, so what's the best
29:18
way for people to reach out and contact you? Aaron, Yes, so
29:25
you could go to soft roust Recovery dot com and that's s O P h
29:29
r O S softwarest Recovery dot com. If people want to reach me personally,
29:34
you know my emails super easy. It's Aaron E. R i In
29:37
at softwrost Recovery dot com. Be happy to you know, answer any questions.
29:42
But if you want to check us out and then the Tampa wanted softwast
29:45
Recovery Tampa dot com. So if you want to check out kind of what
29:48
we do, take a peek at our team and see some of these amazing
29:52
therapists. The things that I feel the most proud of is my team.
29:56
Definitely check us out. Awesome, Awesome, Well, I really appreciate you
30:00
being here and taking the time, and you just have this really beautiful way
30:04
of articulating what I feel is really beautiful about the work you do. Yeah,
30:14
it was awesome. Thank you so much, Thank you, Thank you
30:17
for having me and this has been wonderful. All right, thank you