Latest / The Town Square Podcast / Rev. Dr. Terrence Evans on St. Paul AME Church and Faith in Community—Episode 102

Transcript

Rev. Dr. Terrence Evans on St. Paul AME Church and Faith in Community—Episode 102 · The Town Square Podcast

0:00
[SPEAKER_01]: Welcome to the town square podcast where local advocates for a better community bring their different perspectives into the messy middle to have a conversation where aim is unity, not uniformity.
0:12
[SPEAKER_01]: Churches often tell the history of a community in ways that court houses and history books just cannot do.
0:18
[SPEAKER_01]: Saint Paul AME Church has been a part of Covington since 1878.
0:23
[SPEAKER_01]: It has rebuilt after fires, lived through Jim Crow and integration, hosted civil rights meetings, registered voters, and continued serving generations of families.
0:33
[SPEAKER_01]: And today, we are joined by a senior pastor, Reverend Dr. Terrence Evans, to hear his story.
0:39
[SPEAKER_01]: to learn more about AME, the AME tradition, and understand what St. Paul is doing in our community now.
0:45
[SPEAKER_01]: Dr. Evans, welcome to the Town Square podcast.
0:47
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you so much.
0:48
[SPEAKER_00]: I appreciate the invitation.
0:51
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
0:51
[SPEAKER_00]: Sorry, I'm excited about what it is that we can, we can discuss the day.
0:55
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to forward to it.
0:56
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, that's great.
0:57
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, we're so glad to have you and at the very outset of our faith and community series as I was explaining to our viewers how we're going to be setting this up and having different pastors and church leaders come in to kind of share how churches are different in Newton County and the surrounding areas and what different denominations look like and as you know, my co-host Gabriel here, you win.
1:18
[SPEAKER_01]: He's black guy, I'm white guy and we he's a pastor.
1:21
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm a pastor.
1:21
[SPEAKER_01]: And so we've always had these conversations about how even just black church and white church are different and why they're so segregated on Sunday morning.
1:28
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's a whole another conversation.
1:29
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, that's a whole mega can of words a different podcast.
1:34
[SPEAKER_01]: But really what we just wanted to get to is, and I kept hearing CME and AMME and I've been in the Christian world for a long time.
1:41
[SPEAKER_01]: So I've seen those words, and I just wanted to get a little help understanding them.
1:45
[SPEAKER_01]: And so I know that's part of your background as well, and so we'll jump into that in just a minute.
1:49
[SPEAKER_01]: But before the titles, the degrees, the pastoral appointments,
1:53
[SPEAKER_01]: Who was Tarantz Evans growing up in Miami and you said, Opalaca, Opalaca, Opalaca, not Opalaca.
2:01
[SPEAKER_00]: It's the difference.
2:02
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I said, Opalaca is in Alabama.
2:05
[SPEAKER_00]: Opalaca is in Florida.
2:06
[SPEAKER_00]: So Opalaca is, if you feel familiar with the metropolitan Atlanta area, Opalaca is like the college park to Atlanta.
2:15
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, so it's, you know, it has its own municipality, its own police, mayor, all those types of things will bring it home, it's like Portadale.
2:23
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, there you go.
2:24
[SPEAKER_00]: So a little bit of its own cultural flair too, absolutely, absolutely.
2:29
[SPEAKER_01]: This episode of the Town Square podcast is brought to you by Luther Rice College in Seminary.
2:33
[SPEAKER_01]: A community's well-being often reflects the spiritual health of its people.
2:37
[SPEAKER_01]: That's why a local Christian college like Luther Rice is a critical voice in our time and culture.
2:42
[SPEAKER_02]: You're absolutely right, Train.
2:43
[SPEAKER_02]: For me, this is more than just an ad-re, because I'm actually a Luther Rice alumnus.
2:48
[SPEAKER_02]: So my degree there helped prepare me not only for ministry, but also for engaging with the community and meaningful ways.
2:54
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, same here.
2:55
[SPEAKER_01]: I trusted Luther Rice for my education too.
2:57
[SPEAKER_01]: And I can tell you firsthand they're committed to shaping leaders who impact the church, the marketplace and the world.
3:03
[SPEAKER_02]: Absolutely.
3:04
[SPEAKER_02]: So listen, whether you're high school student looking for a biblically-based dual enrollment option and adult learner wanting to deepen your biblical knowledge or a working professional looking for development to impact your workplace, Luther Rice is a trusted option for continuing your education from a Christian world view.
3:21
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, every program is 100% online and designed for your unique calling from dual enrollment and undergraduate degrees to certificate programs and doctorate level study.
3:31
[SPEAKER_01]: They have options for the entire community that are biblical, affordable, accredited and completely online.
3:37
[SPEAKER_02]: All right.
3:37
[SPEAKER_02]: So here's the call to action.
3:38
[SPEAKER_02]: Set your next step toward your calling, visit lootorice.edu to learn more again that's lootorice.edu.
3:48
[SPEAKER_00]: but it is where I was born and raised.
3:52
[SPEAKER_00]: You asked who I am, I am sharing and Willie's son.
3:57
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
3:58
[SPEAKER_00]: The grandson of James and Willie and Cecil in birth to me.
4:03
[SPEAKER_00]: There you go.
4:04
[SPEAKER_00]: No, I just reared up and I called, I do it together, Opalaka Miami area and that's who I am.
4:12
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, just a guy who loved to hang out with his friends
4:18
[SPEAKER_00]: play basketball when basketball found me.
4:20
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
4:21
[SPEAKER_00]: And, uh, that's it.
4:23
[SPEAKER_00]: That's me.
4:23
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, just family guy love to be around with family hang out.
4:26
[SPEAKER_00]: That's it.
4:27
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, what people can't see probably from podcast perspective is pretty tall.
4:32
[SPEAKER_01]: How tall are you exactly?
4:33
[SPEAKER_01]: 67.
4:34
[SPEAKER_00]: 67.
4:34
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
4:34
[SPEAKER_01]: 67.
4:35
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
4:35
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm 63 is and when I see people that are out in your tall, I'm like, hmm, they're
4:41
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, yes, yes, yes, you know, when you don't realize how tall you are, you know, I have a tall family and so, you know, it's normal, you know, for us, you know, some people are amazed when we walk in buildings, but, you know, I'm like, this, this is the way there's a few door frames, you kind of absolutely, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
5:07
[SPEAKER_00]: with a lean, you know, it's just, Bob, it's just gonna happen.
5:10
[SPEAKER_00]: It's just gonna happen.
5:12
[SPEAKER_01]: We're in the grocery store.
5:12
[SPEAKER_01]: How many times?
5:13
[SPEAKER_01]: All the time.
5:14
[SPEAKER_01]: All the time.
5:15
[SPEAKER_00]: Somebody say, at least, at least once a week.
5:18
[SPEAKER_00]: Can you grab that for me?
5:19
[SPEAKER_00]: That's right.
5:19
[SPEAKER_00]: Or the, you know, how's the weather there?
5:22
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
5:23
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
5:24
[SPEAKER_00]: We come up with something a little more original.
5:27
[SPEAKER_01]: So, I'm assuming then, well, I know for sure.
5:29
[SPEAKER_01]: I've read your post.
5:30
[SPEAKER_01]: So, you went to Georgia State Play Basketball.
5:31
[SPEAKER_01]: I did.
5:32
[SPEAKER_01]: All right, I did.
5:32
[SPEAKER_01]: Just tell us, how was it like, leaving Open Locker to go to the big city in Play Basketball?
5:39
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, you know, Open Lockers.
5:41
[SPEAKER_00]: is Miami.
5:43
[SPEAKER_00]: So it's, it's, it's Miami.
5:45
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like literally in the middle.
5:47
[SPEAKER_00]: And so it's, it's, it is see, got it.
5:49
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, but coming to Georgia State was my first time coming to Atlanta.
5:54
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, I knew nothing about Georgia State until I started being recruited.
5:59
[SPEAKER_00]: I was probably on my way or at least I wanted to be on the way to the HBCU, but you know when you grown up and you know, on the tight you look for scholarships and things like that in.
6:14
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm assuming I was a pretty decent basketball player, so maybe some of the HBCU didn't think I would come, because I was being recruited by, there's no bigger schools or things like that, and so Georgia State came.
6:30
[SPEAKER_00]: And coach Carter Wilson, you know, is my coach at the time, was actually Bob Rinehart initially, but they came and recruited me and my mother felt comfortable.
6:42
[SPEAKER_00]: that was important right my mom was good with it yeah and then when I came there alone it was similar to Miami you know few differences but you know like this almost almost city kid and so I boiled down to Georgia State and farming and I was I was almost looking at farming and it boiled down to
7:11
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, you know, Joe just takes like we got the scholarship and they offer the scholarship first and You know save my mom a couple of books and that's how I'll do a bit, Joe just think I hear you and and then it Atlanta a little bit better than we're firm and it's located as well as you if you've been in absolute city I was absolutely now that was it that was a change because I was like where are my people
7:41
[SPEAKER_00]: But, you know, they were really nice, hospitable, it was a really good opportunity, but then I came here.
7:48
[SPEAKER_00]: And when I went to Georgia State, I was like, okay, this is home.
7:54
[SPEAKER_00]: And kind of like what sealed the deal is, I came and I didn't have an opportunity to get a haircut before I left.
8:03
[SPEAKER_00]: For a long time, I had a partner who would cut my hair at his house and just something to happen and he couldn't cut my hair.
8:10
[SPEAKER_00]: And so I got here in the first thing I did.
8:12
[SPEAKER_00]: So as I got to playing is I asked Coach Wilson at the time.
8:16
[SPEAKER_00]: Coach Carter Wilson, I was like, Coach, you know, I didn't hear him.
8:20
[SPEAKER_00]: I, I hope he was like, no problem.
8:22
[SPEAKER_00]: He told me right to the barbershop and I was, I was there home.
8:26
[SPEAKER_00]: I was like, yeah, this, this, this is spot.
8:28
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, this, this is spot for me.
8:30
[SPEAKER_00]: And so it was been good.
8:32
[SPEAKER_00]: So it was good to me.
8:33
[SPEAKER_01]: So you played basketball for years there?
8:36
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I was there for five.
8:37
[SPEAKER_00]: I had a rare sort of year, so I had an injury.
8:41
[SPEAKER_00]: And so I had the rare sort of year.
8:42
[SPEAKER_00]: But my time at Georgia State was good.
8:47
[SPEAKER_00]: I like to tell people we were part of the foundation.
8:49
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's going to get started.
8:51
[SPEAKER_00]: I wore it.
8:52
[SPEAKER_00]: They were moving up.
8:53
[SPEAKER_00]: Actually, what made Georgia State could get on my radar.
8:57
[SPEAKER_00]: It was the year before they started recruiting me as when they went to the NCAA tournament and they caught Marta To the game because they played right over at George's turn to tick.
9:09
[SPEAKER_00]: That's crazy And that was a huge story.
9:11
[SPEAKER_00]: I remember what he asked me about the team that just just got on the train to go to the game I was like, who is this?
9:18
[SPEAKER_00]: It's just ragging off and stuff going on.
9:20
[SPEAKER_00]: But then I was like Georgia State made a connection.
9:23
[SPEAKER_00]: I saw what it is.
9:25
[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, I was familiar with them in that sense.
9:28
[SPEAKER_00]: And so we were starting to get better.
9:31
[SPEAKER_00]: OK, up and down seasons.
9:34
[SPEAKER_00]: But again, it was one of the best times in my life.
9:36
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, you mentioned to pretty prominent coaches, as you were discussing them, um, any or any lessons learned from those guys.
9:45
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that's like guess just a treasure trove.
9:47
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm sure.
9:50
[SPEAKER_00]: I'll start with Coach Rihar, Coach Rihar, it was so, I just liked his demeanor.
9:57
[SPEAKER_00]: He was very quick with it, very direct, and so that helped me to understand not to daily daily.
10:07
[SPEAKER_00]: If you will, we're trying to get you a point across, or just say what it is that you need to say, and then when the coaching charge is made in, you know, Coach Wilson was there
10:18
[SPEAKER_00]: But when he became the head coach, it was a different coaching style that lend itself more to be, I guess, kind of player friendly, and his leadership was more relational.
10:39
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
10:40
[SPEAKER_00]: And that is something that I believe helps me more today, understanding that you can get a lot done when your relationship with who it is that you're sitting across from.
10:55
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's what's in solid.
10:57
[SPEAKER_00]: Not that it wasn't the same with Coach Ryan Hart, but it was different, right, with Coach Wilson.
11:02
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, like even today, you know,
11:06
[SPEAKER_00]: He, and 15, 16 former players, we all in a group chat.
11:12
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, really.
11:13
[SPEAKER_01]: That's great.
11:13
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, communicate weekly.
11:16
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
11:16
[SPEAKER_01]: That's great.
11:17
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
11:17
[SPEAKER_01]: So you feel like of the two then, because I figure Coach Ryan Hart would be a little more structure top down, right?
11:27
[SPEAKER_01]: What's more, your leadership style?
11:28
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you've lead a pretty healthy congregation, man.
11:31
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I believe in partnership, I believe, you said some clear directives and you allow people to do what God has purposeed them to do and in that it is reciprocal so I don't look at myself as
11:56
[SPEAKER_00]: this authoritarian person who is very dogmatic and cannot receive a feedback.
12:04
[SPEAKER_00]: And so I learn from the leaders that I would serve just as much as I believe they learn from me.
12:11
[SPEAKER_00]: And I believe that that helps in the leadership is that they know that I will listen.
12:16
[SPEAKER_00]: And if I need to pivot on some things, I will.
12:20
[SPEAKER_00]: As long as it's going to be beneficial.
12:22
[SPEAKER_00]: to advance in the gospel and advance in the church.
12:24
[SPEAKER_01]: There you go.
12:25
[SPEAKER_00]: And so as long as that's happening, then we're good.
12:27
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's great.
12:28
[SPEAKER_01]: I love to hear that.
12:30
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm assuming then at some point you make this transition then from Georgia State into the ministry, like, what's that look like?
12:36
[SPEAKER_01]: Wait.
12:38
[SPEAKER_00]: because you might as well work with it's winding.
12:41
[SPEAKER_00]: And so when I left Georgia State, you know, I was like, okay, what am I gonna do?
12:47
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
12:48
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I graduated with my degree in criminal justice, the minor in sociology.
12:53
[SPEAKER_00]: Initially, I thought I was gonna either go into the police academy in Atlanta or go back to Miami and follow the footsteps of my mother.
13:03
[SPEAKER_00]: My mother's a police officer in Miami.
13:08
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not a biggie, no comeback.
13:11
[SPEAKER_00]: If really, she was like, do not come back to my end.
13:14
[SPEAKER_00]: And I was like, why, she was like, just don't come back.
13:18
[SPEAKER_00]: Your future is there, you know, maybe that was something that she ever see, perfectly.
13:23
[SPEAKER_00]: Right, right.
13:24
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.
13:26
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe, you know, just being in that.
13:29
[SPEAKER_00]: field.
13:30
[SPEAKER_00]: She saw Miami that I didn't see at the time.
13:32
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, it's I understand what Miami is about You know, it's not all you know glitz and glamour that you see on the streets, you know, I'm from that real Right, the other side of Miami.
13:42
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and so I stay One of my teammates former teammates was working in a Full-time county government
13:52
[SPEAKER_00]: And he's like, hey man, I got this job, it's a summer youth employment job and we need some mentors or coordinators for the program.
14:03
[SPEAKER_00]: How about you?
14:06
[SPEAKER_00]: And I said another teammate of mine.
14:08
[SPEAKER_00]: I want y'all to do it and we apply and that was my foot into Fulton County government and it just grew from there so I worked all that summer then the summer was over and I'm okay now what are you doing?
14:24
[SPEAKER_00]: And he's like man just hold on and
14:29
[SPEAKER_00]: entry-level position at a transition to housing program called Jefferson Place.
14:36
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
14:36
[SPEAKER_00]: There's no longer an existence as close now, which hurts my heart because it's so needed.
14:46
[SPEAKER_00]: But you know, you know, how government and all that kind of stuff can get in the way sometimes, but we went in myself and the gym now, so we can know we went in as
14:57
[SPEAKER_00]: house managers working to 11 to 7 ship 11 p.m. 11 p.m.
15:04
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, and yeah, so I was responsible for just making sure all the guys got in at night and took rooms and
15:13
[SPEAKER_00]: And then eventually I learned some tricks of the trade and learning some things and then with some of the case managers there and Gleaning from them in Opportunity opened up and and I applied for the case management position and I elevated up a case manager and I believe it was in that space where I
15:37
[SPEAKER_00]: started to see that this is a just work.
15:44
[SPEAKER_00]: Like that, this is something different, right?
15:47
[SPEAKER_00]: Because when you see men at their lowest, I mean, when you can get to a space where there's no one that you can go to, and you have to rely on strangers
16:05
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
16:06
[SPEAKER_00]: That takes a lot of humility and a trust.
16:14
[SPEAKER_00]: And so when we're not started looking at it in that capacity, I was like, okay, this is a ministry.
16:22
[SPEAKER_00]: This is, you know, these walls, it was in the old
16:31
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, it turned into a flagship program at one point.
16:35
[SPEAKER_00]: It was a model that, you know, President from all over the country came to see how the transition to housing program at Jermison Place ran.
16:46
[SPEAKER_00]: But it was a wonderful time that I had there.
16:49
[SPEAKER_00]: I had no idea that I would be there for 18 years.
16:53
[SPEAKER_00]: You were there for 18 years, too, that was.
16:55
[UNKNOWN]: Wow.
16:56
[SPEAKER_00]: went in and stayed at one spot for 18 years.
16:59
[SPEAKER_01]: So you saw probably a lot of success stories and then a lot of absolutely unsuccessful sources.
17:05
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, you have the great success stories and you see those those wars that kind of crash and burn and it sticks with you forever.
17:18
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I have
17:22
[SPEAKER_00]: Folks who am up, you know, I have in my phone right now that we're on my case low that I now consider, you know, friends, you know, they still call Mr. Evans, you know, I tell you, drop the Mr. You know.
17:37
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, just, you know, just, you know, just, you know, but I understand, you know, like, you know, like my coach always be my coach, you know, and so like that's this kind of look at it, but you know, persons who have their own age fat companies now, you know, they, you know, during the time they were in the program, we were sending the technical school in.
17:56
[SPEAKER_00]: they would get those things done and now doing that, you know, you know, folks of married were, you know, been able to re-establish their families, all those types of things, and then you see, you know, the other side, you know, one of the stories that just kind of sticks with me is, we have some very strict ways, and I guess some people say that we operate it is,
18:24
[SPEAKER_00]: At the time when you are there, then what's the main start of working?
18:29
[SPEAKER_00]: They have to pay rent if you will.
18:34
[SPEAKER_00]: And we kept it in the account.
18:37
[SPEAKER_00]: But then when they got ready to leave, they got half of what they paid in rent.
18:42
[SPEAKER_00]: They got it back.
18:43
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
18:44
[SPEAKER_00]: The stipulation is, as you had to stay clean.
18:49
[SPEAKER_00]: And we had a gentleman who was literally one day from leaving.
18:58
[SPEAKER_00]: I guess check was already cut and I believe just
19:06
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe that excitement about the leaf.
19:09
[SPEAKER_00]: And he sprinkled it a place that he shouldn't go and he relapsed.
19:16
[SPEAKER_00]: And as much as, you know, I wasn't his case manager, you know, as much as we were like, man, can he have another opportunity?
19:24
[SPEAKER_00]: The guidelines were there.
19:26
[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, I wasn't the case manager at the time.
19:30
[SPEAKER_00]: So I was working this night shift and I can vividly see it right now.
19:35
[SPEAKER_00]: He drove up and down the street all night like all night.
19:42
[SPEAKER_00]: I already had his clothes packed everything.
19:44
[SPEAKER_00]: He used to use clothes in the car and I was like, that's tough.
19:50
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, man, that was tough.
19:52
[SPEAKER_00]: And so you see that side, right?
19:56
[SPEAKER_00]: And then you see the other side, you know, the, the side where they're getting these successes and persons who do a day, you know, know how to do.
20:05
[SPEAKER_01]: You see the program work and the humanity work.
20:08
[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
20:09
[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
20:10
[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
20:10
[SPEAKER_00]: So it was a, it was a wonderful time.
20:12
[SPEAKER_00]: I literally stay there until the door is closed.
20:16
[SPEAKER_01]: Wow.
20:16
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
20:17
[SPEAKER_01]: I bet it did break your heart, man.
20:18
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, stuff.
20:19
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
20:19
[SPEAKER_00]: It was tough.
20:20
[SPEAKER_00]: Like we were dying.
20:21
[SPEAKER_00]: I was there.
20:22
[SPEAKER_00]: I couldn't leave.
20:23
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
20:24
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, as we knew that the program was shutting down, but we had men there that needed.
20:31
[SPEAKER_00]: You're right.
20:31
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
20:32
[SPEAKER_00]: Places to go.
20:33
[SPEAKER_00]: And, um, and so not so from one of the other case managers,
20:46
[SPEAKER_00]: that very last day.
20:47
[SPEAKER_00]: Wow.
20:47
[SPEAKER_00]: And so yeah, so it was a great ministry work.
20:51
[SPEAKER_00]: It was humbling.
20:53
[SPEAKER_00]: It helps me to see grace and action.
20:56
[SPEAKER_00]: Mm-hmm.
20:57
[SPEAKER_00]: It helped me to see how it is that they are consequences.
21:00
[SPEAKER_00]: Mm-hmm.
21:01
[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, all of that mixed up in there.
21:05
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
21:05
[SPEAKER_01]: And somehow, then in the midst of all of that, what's going to let's soup of life that you had been through here comes then the opportunity to minister to others in a different way?
21:16
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you know, it's interesting.
21:21
[SPEAKER_00]: I think back on it, I asked my mother, I said,
21:32
[SPEAKER_00]: As far as I know and looking back there, I know before me stepping out and saying, hey, I'm answering a call and I'm going into ministry and looking to be a preacher and pastor, but I didn't even know that at the time I was just answering a call, but there are no other preachers or pastors in my family.
21:54
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
21:55
[SPEAKER_00]: that are ordained.
21:57
[SPEAKER_00]: Of course, we have a person's faith, but like nobody who's ordained, as far as I know.
22:03
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
22:04
[SPEAKER_00]: And so she would tell me she was like, you know, you've always been a very calm and quiet type of guy.
22:14
[SPEAKER_00]: She's even as a baby, you were very quiet until the preacher started preaching.
22:20
[SPEAKER_00]: She was like, I can church you, she's like, you may be quiet the whole time.
22:23
[SPEAKER_00]: And then as soon as the pastor starts, preacher, now you want to start, you know, cool and know, whatever it was.
22:30
[SPEAKER_02]: So she was like, you know, she kind of laughed.
22:32
[SPEAKER_00]: So she was like, maybe something was happening.
22:36
[SPEAKER_00]: But it wasn't until that time, of course, I'm married now.
22:41
[SPEAKER_00]: And you know, I'm at Jefferson plays, I'm married, and then, you know, my life and now I
22:49
[SPEAKER_00]: And all of these things are happening and that's a different ministry in itself.
22:53
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, absolutely.
22:54
[SPEAKER_00]: And You know, I just thought filling this pool I am now
23:05
[SPEAKER_00]: In an AMB church, I wasn't born and raised AMB, you know, I was Baptist, and now I'm going to AMB church and, and I don't know what's happening, you know, I can think back now, I decided it's 2020 while I was in college, you know, maybe some people saw some things in me, but I, you know, I know I was running now, um, I just thought I was,
23:34
[SPEAKER_00]: folks don't basketball, you know, whatever it was, but, you know, God was kind of trying to pull me in the pound of heaven.
23:44
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, that's it, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, you know, and it's, you know, you can think back in those times and literally where,
23:57
[SPEAKER_00]: You know that God saved your life and you know, you could look back and say, yeah, that was God.
24:03
[SPEAKER_01]: Wow.
24:03
[SPEAKER_00]: And, but it was during that time when I jumped someplace when I asked my call and started going, you know, expressing it to my pastor at the time and then immediately, I went into the minister's training.
24:21
[SPEAKER_00]: Really, a program of Amy Church who's called a board of examiners, and it just started moving.
24:30
[SPEAKER_00]: Then it fell right.
24:31
[SPEAKER_00]: It was, I probably still was saying, for real good, not the key from overlocking, not me.
24:40
[SPEAKER_00]: But it was a yes, and I am thankful that I accepted.
24:51
[SPEAKER_01]: How long ago was that?
24:53
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, how long have you been I guess in full-time ministry?
24:56
[SPEAKER_00]: In full-time ministry?
24:57
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
24:58
[SPEAKER_00]: Full-time ministry since 2016.
25:02
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, about 10 years.
25:04
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, our first started pastoring was in 2010.
25:07
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
25:08
[SPEAKER_00]: And so I was a Bible patient.
25:10
[SPEAKER_00]: Gotcha.
25:11
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, while going to seminary, full-time.
25:14
[SPEAKER_01]: Hmm.
25:15
[SPEAKER_01]: Dude, you have a seminary.
25:16
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
25:17
[SPEAKER_00]: And Mary and three-two.
25:19
[SPEAKER_00]: Three little children.
25:20
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you had to be good.
25:21
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, maybe I had to be the lower.
25:24
[SPEAKER_00]: It had to broke down cars in, you know, yeah, it's every seminary.
25:32
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's all that sort of thing that could get you off.
25:37
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.
25:37
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
25:39
[SPEAKER_00]: But it was during that time in 2010, when
25:48
[SPEAKER_00]: I was overdaying, you know, an AMB church, we have two ordinations, one as a decant, and then as an elder.
25:54
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
25:55
[SPEAKER_00]: And I was in seminary at the ATC, turned to theological seminary at the ATC.
26:02
[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, I was being ordained in a decant and I was happy to go back to my home church from which is first AMB church in Atlanta.
26:13
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
26:14
[SPEAKER_00]: And it was a late,
26:18
[SPEAKER_00]: And my wife was there and children of there.
26:20
[SPEAKER_00]: My mother come on, my mother lie, everybody coming.
26:24
[SPEAKER_00]: I said, hey, I'll go ahead and go home.
26:26
[SPEAKER_00]: I'll see y'all a little while.
26:28
[SPEAKER_00]: And literally as I was walking out of the church, I wanted to preside an eldest came and was like, hey, I got this as a church that I need you to go serve and I was like, well, let me talk to you.
26:41
[SPEAKER_01]: Today, here I am.
26:43
[SPEAKER_01]: I just got ordained.
26:44
[SPEAKER_00]: I literally, I just got off my knees, right here.
26:46
[SPEAKER_00]: I just got, I just got, I just got the layers laid on.
26:49
[SPEAKER_01]: We can write it.
26:50
[SPEAKER_00]: It was like, look, I need you.
26:56
[SPEAKER_00]: And what I want you to do, go back to your home church, let us see in your rope because you can't, you can't wear a rope until you are dying.
27:05
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
27:05
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
27:06
[SPEAKER_00]: Go home, go back to your home church, let us see in your rope and the next Sunday I need you to meet me.
27:11
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh my goodness.
27:12
[SPEAKER_00]: And I was like, what?
27:16
[UNKNOWN]: What?
27:16
[SPEAKER_00]: I know it's called my wife.
27:18
[SPEAKER_01]: I was like, hey, just gave me a church.
27:22
[SPEAKER_00]: She's like, really?
27:24
[SPEAKER_00]: Where?
27:25
[SPEAKER_00]: Dallas, Georgia.
27:27
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
27:27
[SPEAKER_00]: That was like, I have no idea what Dallas, Georgia is, but sounds big.
27:32
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm gonna go.
27:33
[SPEAKER_00]: And so when I said Dallas, you know, my family, like Dallas, Texas, I can't believe it.
27:39
[SPEAKER_00]: Like no, no, no, Dallas, Georgia.
27:41
[SPEAKER_00]: And so yeah.
27:43
[SPEAKER_00]: And so I guess right now, I'm kind of booking into because my first church was St. Paul in Dallas, Georgia.
27:49
[SPEAKER_00]: And now I'm at St. Paul in Cubs.
27:51
[SPEAKER_01]: Wow.
27:52
[SPEAKER_01]: All right.
27:52
[SPEAKER_01]: So for folks who are like me and curious about what those initials stand for, maybe you can just kind of give us what the initial stand for and then maybe what why each word is important.
28:05
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
28:05
[SPEAKER_00]: So AMB is African Methodist Episcopal.
28:10
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
28:10
[SPEAKER_00]: That's all the A is African because the church was founded by a person of African descent.
28:15
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
28:16
[SPEAKER_00]: the methods is comes out of the Wesleyan tradition, the method in which we do what it is that we do, and a physical has to do with our governance.
28:26
[SPEAKER_00]: And so we have a hierarchy, if you will, bishops and, you know, council of bishops, and so has to do the structure.
28:36
[SPEAKER_01]: All right, so, and this is my ignorance.
28:39
[SPEAKER_01]: I have seen AME plenty of times, and I was pretty sure I knew,
28:43
[SPEAKER_01]: What that the M in the E were for?
28:45
[SPEAKER_01]: Methodists in Episcopal, but I think because my brain thinks two branches of Christianity Methodists in Episcopal in the United States Those I was like, well, which one is it?
28:56
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
28:56
[SPEAKER_01]: I got it.
28:57
[SPEAKER_01]: And I forget that Episcopal is a structure actually the Episcopal Church in America is really the
29:03
[SPEAKER_01]: Church of England when it came to America.
29:05
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
29:05
[SPEAKER_01]: So, the Anglican Church today.
29:08
[SPEAKER_01]: And so the but episcopal for people who are paying attention, want to understand that it's a it's a bishop correct structure you're talking about.
29:16
[SPEAKER_01]: So you and you and I answer to but you you have a hierarchy that that you that you respond to and it holds you accountable and that would be a
29:24
[SPEAKER_00]: So right above me, who I would be a presiding elder, and so we have presiding elders who are appointed by Bishops.
29:34
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, got you.
29:35
[SPEAKER_00]: And so here in the sixth district, Bishop is Bishop Michael Mitchell, and my presiding elder is Reverend Dr. David Roan, and so that is who I report to
29:50
[SPEAKER_01]: So, for people who are listening, then they might think of, like, you said you grew up Baptist and I grew up, just to, that's a congregational type of structure, which is different.
30:00
[SPEAKER_01]: Then I'm looking at, like, the camera, like, if you all are listening, the Episcopal is a different structure than, then, congregational, Baptist or congregational.
30:07
[SPEAKER_01]: They vote on a lot of things.
30:08
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah.
30:09
[SPEAKER_01]: Episcopal is not going to vote as much, right?
30:10
[SPEAKER_01]: That structure.
30:11
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, when it comes to bishops, but there is, then we actually vote, who becomes a bish...
30:20
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
30:21
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, presiding elders are appointed them by bishops.
30:24
[SPEAKER_00]: Gotcha, okay.
30:25
[SPEAKER_00]: And then pastors are assigned to churches by bishops.
30:30
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
30:31
[SPEAKER_00]: So we have all of these conferences and, you know, those types of things.
30:34
[SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, we have...
30:37
[SPEAKER_00]: about general conference, which meets every four years, I quadri-neal, and that's where Bishops' connection to officers and things like that are elected.
30:48
[SPEAKER_00]: So there's an actual campaigning that goes on, and all that kind of stuff you have to be voted in as a delegate to be able to vote all those types of things.
30:59
[SPEAKER_00]: Very structured.
31:00
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, absolutely.
31:01
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and used to conference.
31:02
[SPEAKER_01]: So is that like a is the AME like in the just United States is like a national international thing.
31:09
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, so we have churches on the continent of Africa South America Canada.
31:15
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, wow, all over the continent of the United States.
31:20
[SPEAKER_00]: And every four years, we all come together and look over legislation, there's some things that need to be tweaked, offered new legislation, things that may come need to go into a book of doctrine and discipline, and to elect officers, and so we're like some connection to officers.
31:44
[SPEAKER_00]: and business.
31:45
[SPEAKER_00]: And so, so you have that conference there, you know, I hope I'll tell you as they confuse, but there, you know, we have all these structures.
31:54
[SPEAKER_00]: And so we have the general conference, which is the highest conference.
31:57
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
31:58
[SPEAKER_00]: Then it comes down to annual conference.
31:59
[SPEAKER_00]: And that is where Georgia got you.
32:02
[SPEAKER_01]: We have the AME churches of Georgia gathered together.
32:05
[SPEAKER_00]: and so we have different ones like different conferences which in with in Georgia.
32:10
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'm in a Latin or Georgia conference.
32:12
[SPEAKER_01]: That's district six, you said, Michigan.
32:14
[SPEAKER_00]: So the sixth district is all of Georgia.
32:16
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
32:16
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
32:16
[SPEAKER_01]: Gotcha.
32:17
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
32:17
[SPEAKER_00]: And so we have in all of Georgia we have annual conferences.
32:22
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
32:23
[SPEAKER_00]: And so there is a South annual conference, a South West annual conference.
32:29
[SPEAKER_00]: and Augusta and your conference.
32:31
[SPEAKER_00]: Atlanta, New York, Georgia, conference.
32:32
[SPEAKER_00]: The making conference.
32:34
[SPEAKER_00]: And you can call old Georgia, which is like Savannah.
32:37
[SPEAKER_00]: And so we have all of these conferences because in Georgia they're over 500 and some AMB churches.
32:43
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, wow.
32:43
[SPEAKER_01]: So you still have like nine or 10 conferences in the state of Georgia years?
32:47
[SPEAKER_00]: We have six.
32:48
[SPEAKER_00]: Six total and six.
32:49
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'm in Atlanta, Atlanta, New York, Georgia conference.
32:51
[SPEAKER_00]: And so that is an annual conference.
32:53
[SPEAKER_00]: Gotcha.
32:54
[SPEAKER_00]: then below the annual conference, you have a district conference, okay?
32:58
[SPEAKER_00]: And so I'm in the east district of the Atlanta, New York, Georgia conference.
33:02
[SPEAKER_00]: Gotcha.
33:03
[SPEAKER_00]: And then there's another conference.
33:05
[SPEAKER_02]: Come off.
33:05
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm serious.
33:06
[SPEAKER_00]: And so then the presiding elder, this is where we kind of meet with in the church to do quarterly updates.
33:13
[SPEAKER_00]: And so that is called the quarterly conference.
33:16
[SPEAKER_00]: Gotcha.
33:16
[SPEAKER_00]: And then there's one more conference.
33:18
[SPEAKER_00]: You got it from them.
33:19
[SPEAKER_00]: And then there's a church conference, and that is where I come to the church to say, you know, we need to meet about ABC.
33:28
[SPEAKER_00]: You present it over that one.
33:29
[SPEAKER_00]: Correct.
33:30
[SPEAKER_01]: Wow.
33:30
[SPEAKER_01]: All right.
33:30
[SPEAKER_01]: So for anybody's listening, that is a very structured system with lots of checks and balances.
33:35
[SPEAKER_01]: It sounds like an hierarchy to it.
33:38
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, look, I did was not anticipating all that to be honest with you, but that's great.
33:42
[SPEAKER_01]: That's like, it's a lie.
33:44
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but I mean, I like to hear that.
33:46
[SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely.
33:47
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I love that kind of checks and balances.
33:49
[SPEAKER_01]: That kind of accountability within a church structure.
33:52
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it's just helpful and healthy for churches to have that.
33:55
[SPEAKER_01]: So, that's fantastic.
33:58
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34:42
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34:46
[SPEAKER_01]: more and so much.
34:47
[SPEAKER_01]: All right.
34:47
[SPEAKER_01]: Now the AME Church itself born in 1787 and if I'm I'm reading history to you that you probably know much better than me someone will get you to comment on it.
34:58
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
34:59
[SPEAKER_01]: AME Church born in 1787 after black worshipers face discrimination inside a Christian church.
35:05
[SPEAKER_01]: Philadelphia.
35:05
[SPEAKER_00]: Great.
35:06
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
35:06
[SPEAKER_01]: Philadelphia.
35:07
[SPEAKER_01]: What should Christians today understand maybe about that founding story and I think Richard Allen plays a huge part in that, just maybe give a snapshot of that and what we need to remember today.
35:17
[SPEAKER_00]: So one of the things that I really love about the AMB church, first of all, I love the structure of the AMB church, but just that founding story.
35:26
[SPEAKER_00]: of the Free African Society, which is 1787, started by Richard Allen at Absalom Jones, another preacher who went on to become an Episcopal priest, if you will, and starting his own, you know, going that direction, but they had the Free African Society, which was a mutual aid arm of St. George's Methodist Church.
35:53
[SPEAKER_00]: and after experiencing some discrimination as black worshipers were coming and they were told that they could worship in one space and pray at a certain time.
36:05
[SPEAKER_00]: That's just to retails us and we believe it to be so.
36:11
[SPEAKER_00]: They were we're shipping and praying and they were removed from their knees as they were oh, my goodness praying And it was at that point that there was a leap, you know, the march out if you will and 1787 they leave St. Saint George's Methodist Church
36:32
[SPEAKER_00]: and they go to a blacksmith shop and they start worshiping there and then in 1794 Richard Allen files mother Bethlehem Beach Arch at the corner of six in Lombore Street in Philadelphia.
36:49
[SPEAKER_00]: First day in Me Church.
36:50
[SPEAKER_00]: First day in Me Church, and from that space is where so many things are birthed.
37:00
[SPEAKER_00]: That story of resiliency, a church that was built out of a social movement, if you will, because you think about free African society was about mutual aid helping
37:17
[SPEAKER_00]: to feel whole, feel seen, and then to feel like you cannot be seen and be made whole in the church.
37:27
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
37:28
[SPEAKER_00]: While you're worshipping, while you're worshipping, is problematic.
37:34
[SPEAKER_00]: And so,
37:36
[SPEAKER_00]: Richard Allen and those who were alongside him at the time made a powerfully prophetic if you were a move that we're going to leave.
37:50
[SPEAKER_00]: and believe God on whatever it is that God has for us next to the out of hell.
37:54
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
37:54
[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, over 200 years later, here we are.
38:00
[SPEAKER_00]: Hero of faith.
38:01
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, he's amazed.
38:02
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
38:03
[SPEAKER_01]: So what do we got to remember that?
38:04
[SPEAKER_01]: We got to remember that moment, right?
38:05
[SPEAKER_01]: Not like just let it be something that doesn't.
38:07
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you know, we can't allow that to be race.
38:10
[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, without getting on a soapbox here, you know, we are in an era.
38:17
[SPEAKER_00]: We had a time
38:20
[SPEAKER_00]: history is being overlooked and being dismissed and specifically that history in Philadelphia where instances of understanding I may be some of our founding fathers and
38:40
[SPEAKER_00]: participated in one of the atrocities of this country now is having slaves and things like that.
38:47
[SPEAKER_00]: Philadelphia, you know, there were markers about that in and around mother Bethel and so to have such an institution as the ambient church.
38:59
[SPEAKER_00]: that was able to just highlight to talk about where it is that we were, and the progress is that we're being, that it may, and to try this as if that didn't happen, I believe it's in the front to the ancestors of this country, and also to the ancestors and the four pairs of our church.
39:18
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
39:19
[SPEAKER_00]: And so when you have someone like Richard Allen, who is
39:27
[SPEAKER_00]: a profit, if you will, a pastor, who?
39:33
[SPEAKER_00]: Purchase his own freedom, 2000 colonial dollars working.
39:39
[SPEAKER_00]: Purchase his freedom has conversion moment where he literally talks about how his dungeon shook the soul, his spirit shook and to step out and say, you know, I want to do something for my people to provide a space for them to worship and to not talk about that and realize that that is not just
40:01
[SPEAKER_00]: amig history, that is American history, right, because of the institution of the first predominantly black
40:16
[SPEAKER_01]: the nomination to be Barth is the AMB search man that's a great dentist's story for sure but born out of struggle right born out of persecution I would have to guess then and this is that that social advocacy social action ministry is an important part of the AMB church too
40:38
[SPEAKER_01]: through throughout.
40:39
[SPEAKER_01]: But I knew it's a part of an important part of St. Paul.
40:41
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, absolutely.
40:42
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's where that's where I met you for the first time.
40:44
[SPEAKER_01]: I was at a political forum.
40:47
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it's earlier this year, before the primer.
40:50
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's just enormous, you know, tables, end to end with every person running in for a time.
40:56
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, we were so happy.
40:57
[SPEAKER_00]: You were like, hey, well, this is this is great.
40:59
[SPEAKER_00]: That was a great show.
41:00
[SPEAKER_01]: There's 20 plus, I guess, folks on the stage of this.
41:02
[SPEAKER_00]: That's overwhelming.
41:03
[SPEAKER_00]: So we liar from that.
41:05
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
41:05
[SPEAKER_00]: So, yeah.
41:06
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I guess what I want to just kind of mention it is that
41:10
[SPEAKER_01]: That doesn't happen in every church, right?
41:12
[SPEAKER_01]: That kind of social action.
41:14
[SPEAKER_01]: And you guys have a ministry for social action, right?
41:16
[SPEAKER_01]: So maybe just tell us the importance of that.
41:18
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's got to be tied back to the history, right?
41:20
[SPEAKER_01]: Like this is a, yeah.
41:22
[SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, our church, Saipal and itself has a long history of social engagement,
41:35
[SPEAKER_00]: a church that went out to help persons to be registered to vote.
41:41
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
41:42
[SPEAKER_00]: And so for that to be so ingrained in who we are as a church.
41:51
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh.
41:53
[SPEAKER_00]: is linked to the story of the amateur, you know, with social engagement.
42:02
[SPEAKER_00]: And so that lives in us now, you know, even after
42:09
[SPEAKER_00]: the destruction and things have happened, you know, I said you read history in over a year, multiple fires and having to rebuild and start over the resiliency in that means that, hey, we know that there's something for us to do.
42:27
[SPEAKER_00]: And so I would search as a
42:38
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, President is also, you know, of that, you probably know it will, and I'm just a Ruth Banks, she keeps us active, and I say, Oscar's on the part of the committee is where she keeps us engaged.
42:52
[SPEAKER_00]: And we take pride in that, um, say Paul is actually a polling site.
42:59
[SPEAKER_00]: right and so we have to guard that because we know that how important accessibility to places to vote.
43:11
[SPEAKER_00]: So what does not being on that website, you know, it's a growing area and so we need to make sure that we stay.
43:20
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
43:20
[SPEAKER_00]: Stay who we are.
43:21
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you guys.
43:21
[SPEAKER_01]: We're
43:23
[SPEAKER_01]: We stole Mountain Street Street Street.
43:24
[SPEAKER_00]: I know a short street.
43:25
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, I thought so.
43:27
[SPEAKER_00]: And then so how long have you all been?
43:28
[SPEAKER_00]: It's been about 12 years.
43:30
[SPEAKER_00]: 12 years now.
43:31
[SPEAKER_01]: All right.
43:31
[SPEAKER_01]: That's Brown Bridge, right?
43:32
[SPEAKER_01]: Brown Bridge, right?
43:33
[SPEAKER_00]: Brown Bridge, right?
43:33
[SPEAKER_00]: Brown Bridge, right?
43:34
[SPEAKER_00]: Brown Bridge, right?
43:35
[SPEAKER_00]: Brown Bridge, right?
43:35
[SPEAKER_00]: Brown Bridge, right?
43:36
[SPEAKER_00]: Brown Bridge, right?
43:37
[SPEAKER_00]: Brown Bridge, right?
43:38
[SPEAKER_00]: Brown Bridge, right?
43:39
[SPEAKER_00]: Brown Bridge, right?
43:40
[SPEAKER_00]: Brown Bridge, right?
43:41
[SPEAKER_00]: Brown Bridge, right?
43:43
[SPEAKER_00]: Brown Bridge, right?
43:43
[SPEAKER_00]: Brown Bridge, right?
43:44
[SPEAKER_00]: Brown Bridge, right?
43:46
[SPEAKER_00]: Brown Bridge, right?
43:48
[SPEAKER_00]: Brown Bridge, right?
43:49
[SPEAKER_00]: Brown Bridge, right?
43:51
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, some of the practical things that I couldn't dress kind of, it's time to build kind of construct it, um, but also history is not in the walls.
44:07
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, history is in the spirit, and so you take it with you, and so it lives on Brown Bridge Road.
44:16
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
44:17
[SPEAKER_01]: And so with a much bigger, bigger parking lot.
44:20
[SPEAKER_00]: A bigger parking lot.
44:21
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, most of my room in the movie around is so I laugh and I would want to remember that he was telling me he was like, you know, we had some folks that they didn't want to move until they came over here.
44:36
[SPEAKER_01]: That's right.
44:37
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
44:37
[SPEAKER_00]: That doesn't work.
44:38
[SPEAKER_01]: That absolutely works.
44:39
[SPEAKER_01]: That'll get you.
44:40
[SPEAKER_01]: That'll work.
44:41
[SPEAKER_01]: That'll do it.
44:42
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, so back to the AME right quick, because it pisc will be the structure.
44:48
[SPEAKER_01]: Methodist then is the primary doctrine that you align mainly with the United Methods Church for the most part, or is it?
44:56
[SPEAKER_00]: It is out of like the Wesleyan.
44:58
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
44:58
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's the roots of it first.
45:00
[SPEAKER_01]: Correct.
45:01
[SPEAKER_00]: So that's going to be most of our doctoral.
45:03
[SPEAKER_01]: We'll be very similar to what we've talked about as the Westland Methodists.
45:06
[SPEAKER_00]: We went in 1816 after the convening of about 15 charges from that area.
45:18
[SPEAKER_00]: That was experiencing discrimination and racism and the AMB charges birth that Richard Allen is elected as the first bishop.
45:33
[SPEAKER_00]: basically all of the tenets of Wesleyan doctrine were adopted.
45:40
[SPEAKER_00]: Gotcha.
45:42
[SPEAKER_00]: and then this special layer of, but we need to make sure that we're not gonna be handcuffed by racism.
45:50
[SPEAKER_00]: We're not going to deal with these types of things.
45:53
[SPEAKER_00]: So we're gonna continue the things that we're doing as a free African society, along side.
46:01
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
46:01
[SPEAKER_00]: We bring this Wesleyan, actually, all is it, and moves us that way.
46:05
[SPEAKER_00]: And so it's a beautiful, I think it's a beautiful Mary,
46:12
[SPEAKER_00]: What it is that Bishop Allen saw and felt in his spirit is alive and we have to keep it alive today You know churches change sure, but when we call back to that Genesis story when we understand What it is that we came from it helps us to refocus on what it is that we supposed to be doing.
46:34
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, well, it just as a
46:37
[SPEAKER_01]: As I thought, is there any social action ministry work we have done right now leading up to the general election?
46:43
[SPEAKER_00]: Or is there just being, is there still been drawn up as for our church?
46:48
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's for your church.
46:49
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, absolutely.
46:50
[SPEAKER_00]: So we are planning on doing another forum.
46:53
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, yeah, we're planning on doing that.
46:56
[SPEAKER_00]: And one of the things that we have been working to do with our social action committee as well as our Christian education department is to work alongside community organizations to assist with education for new voters.
47:15
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
47:16
[SPEAKER_00]: It's because many new voters don't understand the political process.
47:20
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
47:20
[SPEAKER_00]: Including process.
47:21
[SPEAKER_00]: Who's my representative?
47:22
[SPEAKER_00]: All those things.
47:23
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
47:23
[SPEAKER_00]: So that is one of the things that I introduced, you know, as a goal.
47:28
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
47:29
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's try to do this.
47:32
[SPEAKER_00]: Because we have so many people who don't know who they're voting for.
47:37
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
47:38
[SPEAKER_00]: Not what they voted for.
47:39
[SPEAKER_00]: They don't even know who it is.
47:40
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's not just young people.
47:44
[SPEAKER_00]: Doing that is one of the major pushes that we have for our social action committee Again, just trying to encourage persons to get out to vote.
47:57
[SPEAKER_00]: And that is something that Six district and we church encourages and so we're working alongside Ministries and Amy church
48:08
[SPEAKER_00]: that provide resources for to have get out of the vote.
48:13
[SPEAKER_00]: We're out of this, and these are no partisan things.
48:15
[SPEAKER_00]: We just want people to exercise right to vote.
48:18
[SPEAKER_00]: We're not telling you who to vote for, but we do know that we have a history of persons.
48:27
[SPEAKER_00]: who were sacrificed, you know, in their lives were taken, because they were fighting for the right, right, yeah.
48:38
[SPEAKER_00]: And it is quite honest to sometimes this hardening to see people on my vote don't count.
48:43
[SPEAKER_00]: It doesn't matter.
48:45
[SPEAKER_00]: you know, whatever you are to say, but it's so many persons that fought for you, to have the opportunity, to do something powerful as it going into that ballot box and saying, this is who I want to represent.
49:01
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
49:02
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
49:03
[SPEAKER_00]: This is the person.
49:04
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and so yeah, that's what we
49:06
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and I'll tell you, you know, you're talking about that feeling like your vote doesn't count kind of thing.
49:11
[SPEAKER_01]: And I understand when you're looking at a national election, it may feel like that, but later down on that same ballot, you're going to have someone who in one of.
49:22
[SPEAKER_01]: To the candidates at your political forum, one of the, I guess, the, the person who's going to be on the ballot and in this fall, one by 11 votes.
49:34
[SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely.
49:35
[SPEAKER_01]: So that vote can't, that vote's counted.
49:38
[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
49:39
[SPEAKER_01]: So you may be thinking, no, oh, maybe when the millions of votes, yeah, but everybody on that, everybody on that ballot,
49:49
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
49:50
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
49:51
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, all right.
49:51
[SPEAKER_01]: So.
49:53
[SPEAKER_01]: This is an amazing history.
49:55
[SPEAKER_01]: I love the social action part of it.
49:56
[SPEAKER_01]: But let's talk about just the church itself for a second.
49:59
[SPEAKER_01]: So if someone words and show up Sunday, kind of walk me through from parking lot to benediction.
50:04
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, what happens?
50:05
[SPEAKER_01]: What happens in the church?
50:06
[SPEAKER_01]: Was it look like?
50:07
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, you come in, of course, we have readers.
50:10
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'm going to do it as well.
50:13
[SPEAKER_00]: Welcome you into Saipal.
50:16
[SPEAKER_00]: There's always room.
50:18
[SPEAKER_00]: And so, you know,
50:20
[SPEAKER_00]: Come as you all, that type of field, they come one in our order of worship is a standard, order of worship.
50:28
[SPEAKER_00]: That's one of the things that is part of the method that we actually have a standard order of worship that is in our book of doctrine that you can follow.
50:40
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, of course, it can be
50:42
[SPEAKER_00]: massage a little bit.
50:43
[SPEAKER_00]: Right, especially for the most part, if you go to a M.B.
50:48
[SPEAKER_00]: Church in California or in Georgia, you're going to know that you're an M.B.
50:55
[SPEAKER_00]: Church.
50:56
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, because you're going to come in and most often you're going to ask worship starts.
51:02
[SPEAKER_00]: You're going to hit a dark side of it.
51:03
[SPEAKER_00]: Praise God from whom all blessings you're going to hear that okay, and then you're going to go into a prayer and then you're going to have a scripture And it's so it's going to be some order to that and we stick fairly close to that First on days are a little bit more traditional I believe that we can't straight too far away from
51:28
[SPEAKER_00]: some of the things that they grow on me and granddaddy like, that they grew up on, and so on first on days, you know, not only were you here, praise God, I'm more blessed to floor.
51:40
[SPEAKER_00]: You go get him.
51:41
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.
51:42
[SPEAKER_00]: And so I love him.
51:45
[SPEAKER_00]: He still works.
51:46
[SPEAKER_00]: That's right.
51:47
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
51:47
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a lot of theological problems.
51:57
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm the proponent at him, but so you know you come in and you go feel welcome about that's that's what I Until a person's when they come to the church is that you go to feel like family as soon as you walk in the door and that comes from the people mm-hmm When I came to say Paul in June of 2023
52:21
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, I immediately felt like, okay, this is a cool place, you know, the people were hospitable and open and we know that in some church settings, that's not the case.
52:37
[SPEAKER_00]: In some church settings, you can feel kind of ordinary because you're a little cold.
52:41
[SPEAKER_00]: You're in my seat.
52:42
[SPEAKER_00]: That touched up.
52:44
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, uh, some sort of so-sees I got.
52:49
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, you know, and people just know that that's the church mother-in-law, and you lead out when they're alone, but for the most part It is it is a welcoming for it is there's a beautiful
53:09
[SPEAKER_00]: congregation.
53:10
[SPEAKER_00]: And so you're going to get some some songs, you're going to get some contemporary things and and preferably you get a good work.
53:19
[SPEAKER_01]: And is that that you're a role everybody?
53:22
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I'm preaching pretty much every week.
53:25
[SPEAKER_00]: We do have minutes to use to have who I absolutely trust, and you know, there's some time we'll one of them will bring the message before the most part is, it's me every week.
53:38
[SPEAKER_00]: And how do you do that?
53:39
[SPEAKER_01]: Are you like I was summing your style as much like this right here, right?
53:45
[SPEAKER_01]: I believe so.
53:45
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, all right.
53:47
[SPEAKER_00]: my wife to even kill my wife tells me you know I think I get a you know the spirit the spirit gets moving that's right and I guess in the in the tradition in the you know and I don't want to you know paint with a lot of swath but you know in the in the African-American black preacher tradition I may get a little animated okay but I am not a hooper you don't know I don't have that in me
54:13
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, the Lord did give me that.
54:15
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, the organ that he with you.
54:17
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
54:18
[SPEAKER_00]: I hear someone want to go and I would like none.
54:21
[SPEAKER_00]: That's not me.
54:23
[SPEAKER_00]: But you know, I could go with it a little.
54:25
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
54:25
[SPEAKER_00]: For the most part, I think I am a teacher.
54:33
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, very, um, that deck to God believe, um, a you story, uh, all I'm telling you in the good storyteller.
54:45
[SPEAKER_00]: All right.
54:45
[SPEAKER_00]: Good.
54:46
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, and so I'll say, well, thank you, you know, big bias, but that's right.
54:49
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
54:50
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, so how does the servants had do they come to you?
54:53
[SPEAKER_01]: Is this do you like the legendary type thing?
54:54
[SPEAKER_01]: Where you use a D. Stay on like a go through a book of the Bible?
54:58
[SPEAKER_00]: Like what's your?
54:59
[SPEAKER_00]: So I have,
55:01
[SPEAKER_00]: often been a legendary preacher.
55:05
[SPEAKER_00]: Recently, I've started to do series where there'll be some thing and I'll go from there.
55:16
[SPEAKER_00]: So that's how it works and I try to have my weaker structure
55:25
[SPEAKER_00]: this time and read and think and so by, you know, Saturday morning to be pretty much done, you know, but always listening.
55:40
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm trying to say no to people.
55:42
[SPEAKER_00]: God is talking even while you're preaching.
55:45
[SPEAKER_00]: And then if we believe, you know, in the ancients of the Holy Spirit, you know,
55:54
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'll stand up when the Lord like that ain't it.
55:59
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm like, for real God.
56:02
[SPEAKER_01]: You catch yourself sometimes when you're preaching and you go, wait a minute.
56:04
[SPEAKER_01]: That was for me.
56:07
[SPEAKER_00]: Or who I looked back on my wife will have written something down.
56:13
[SPEAKER_00]: Like when you say it, it's such a thing like.
56:15
[SPEAKER_01]: You sure?
56:15
[SPEAKER_00]: It's going back over my main story.
56:18
[SPEAKER_00]: I've never started.
56:19
[SPEAKER_00]: I say that.
56:20
[SPEAKER_00]: You say yes you do.
56:21
[SPEAKER_00]: I said what that was.
56:23
[SPEAKER_00]: That was all.
56:24
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
56:24
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
56:26
[SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, you know, so it's, I, I pray that
56:31
[SPEAKER_00]: the way that we prepare to welcome any one that comes into the church is indicative of how God has welcomed us.
56:44
[SPEAKER_00]: And so I pray that the preaching moment is like that as well.
56:48
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, you know, us, you know,
56:53
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, we say way, way the words of my mouth and the meditation, when I say that, I say, way the words of our mind, because I, I believe that the preaching moment is a collective space.
57:03
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
57:03
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, like, pre-producing that is called a response.
57:06
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
57:07
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
57:07
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, yeah.
57:08
[SPEAKER_00]: But even if they don't come, yeah, still collect it, still collect it.
57:13
[SPEAKER_00]: Mm-hmm.
57:13
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I re-faces, you know, and, you know, sometimes,
57:20
[SPEAKER_00]: most effective sermons are the ones when it's like crickets you know it's you know you get the call later in the week you know I need to hear that yeah right but I wish you would have said it I couldn't preach it I couldn't say I couldn't but
57:41
[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, but you know, as I call it, it is a wonderful space, we, we, we pride ourselves on be hospitable.
57:50
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
57:51
[SPEAKER_00]: And so we pray that that's the experience.
57:54
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
57:54
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I think for every pastor that's been on here so far, they have a similar story in which they go, I could explain it to you.
58:01
[SPEAKER_01]: You just got to come see.
58:02
[SPEAKER_01]: You've got to come be a part of it.
58:04
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like that, during COVID, I would talk about our, our, our, our, our, our, our, our, our, our
58:08
[SPEAKER_01]: our online church services.
58:10
[SPEAKER_01]: He was kind of like watching a screen saver of a fireplace.
58:14
[SPEAKER_01]: He was like, I see the flame.
58:16
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't feel like he didn't come.
58:20
[SPEAKER_01]: So he's like, you got to see it to experience probably.
58:23
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'll do it for you.
58:25
[SPEAKER_01]: I'd encourage people to come check out St. Paul AME Sunday morning 11 o'clock.
58:30
[SPEAKER_01]: We're just service.
58:31
[SPEAKER_01]: And I see
58:37
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, for people who are looking for more information, this is a historic church, but it is on the internet, right?
58:46
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
58:46
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, you said you might struggle with getting that.
58:49
[SPEAKER_01]: So we have exactly right.
58:50
[SPEAKER_01]: So you want to read people.
58:51
[SPEAKER_00]: We are Saint Paul AMECOV.org.
58:56
[SPEAKER_00]: St. Paul AMMECOV.org, so that is our website.
59:04
[SPEAKER_00]: St. Paul AMMECOV, just like that, just Instagram and we are SP AMME on Facebook.
59:13
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, man, look at you.
59:15
[SPEAKER_01]: You did commit it all the memory.
59:22
[SPEAKER_01]: All right.
59:22
[SPEAKER_01]: So we got all that stuff.
59:23
[SPEAKER_01]: Let me, let me get, let me set you up to you up for one final question here.
59:26
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
59:27
[SPEAKER_01]: First of all, if it is anything you didn't cover, you would like to.
59:29
[SPEAKER_01]: That's, there's the floor is yours.
59:30
[SPEAKER_01]: But I would love to just say, if there's, if you could just have all of Newton County in the surrounding areas, if they had, if you, you had their attention to 150,000 people, and you could give them one message right now.
59:43
[SPEAKER_01]: What would that be?
59:44
[SPEAKER_01]: What would you tell?
59:44
[SPEAKER_00]: That's a big message about God.
59:49
[SPEAKER_01]: Man, it's up to you.
59:50
[SPEAKER_01]: You've got 250,000 people listening right now.
59:52
[SPEAKER_01]: What do you want to tell them?
59:54
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I would start with that is that we have a God that is available.
1:00:02
[SPEAKER_00]: And how that availability looks to you.
1:00:05
[SPEAKER_00]: That's where God is.
1:00:07
[SPEAKER_00]: And you can find yourself in that space.
1:00:13
[SPEAKER_00]: not knowing that I would be in a and be church, um, not knowing that I would be a preacher, not knowing that I would be a pastor of a wonderful congregation.
1:00:26
[SPEAKER_00]: And those of pastor before St. Paul and Dallas, Greater Ward, Chapel and Columbus, and now here at St. Paul in Covington,
1:00:37
[SPEAKER_00]: My belief is that we all save my grace, and that is not knowing what it was, but that is all Wesleyan.
1:00:48
[SPEAKER_00]: He knows that.
1:00:48
[SPEAKER_00]: He gives the God, right?
1:00:49
[SPEAKER_00]: It is the gift of God, you know, not by works, so that no man can boast.
1:00:55
[SPEAKER_00]: That is like my favorite scripture, and we are created in Christ, Jesus, to do good works.
1:01:02
[SPEAKER_00]: It's God that has prepared an advance for us to do.
1:01:06
[SPEAKER_00]: On that, if God has prepared things for us to do, then God is making God self available for us, because we know we can't do it without them.
1:01:16
[SPEAKER_00]: That's how I feel.
1:01:18
[SPEAKER_00]: And so if I could just let people know something, is that we have a God that is available.
1:01:23
[SPEAKER_00]: It is where everybody is that you are in your station in life, up, down,
1:01:27
[SPEAKER_00]: disappointed, feeling great, experiencing a trauma or healed.
1:01:35
[SPEAKER_00]: God is available and the availability of God and my belief never wears out.
1:01:42
[SPEAKER_01]: has a beautiful past.
1:01:43
[SPEAKER_01]: And I appreciate you sharing that with us.
1:01:44
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, for folks who are looking for the church Saint Paul AME, it is on Brownbridge Road, right past the intersection of Salem, Salem.
1:01:52
[SPEAKER_00]: So right, I said, what do you want to wait?
1:01:54
[SPEAKER_00]: Brownbridge's role.
1:01:55
[SPEAKER_00]: Awesome.
1:01:56
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I hope, uh, I hope the views are filled on Sunday.
1:02:00
[SPEAKER_00]: I received that in the name of Jesus.
1:02:02
[SPEAKER_00]: All right.
1:02:03
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you so much for being here today.
1:02:04
[SPEAKER_01]: Love learning about you and about the church.
1:02:06
[SPEAKER_00]: appreciate you.
1:02:06
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you so much.
1:02:07
[SPEAKER_00]: I appreciate you.
1:02:09
[SPEAKER_00]: Nothing but well wishes and pray that this podcast has a million followers.
1:02:14
[SPEAKER_01]: So thank you.
1:02:15
[SPEAKER_01]: I will receive that as well.
1:02:17
[SPEAKER_01]: And hopefully we'll see you at the next political forum.
1:02:19
[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
1:02:20
[SPEAKER_00]: All right.
1:02:20
[SPEAKER_01]: Thanks, Pastor.
1:02:21
[SPEAKER_00]: All right, yeah.