Latest / Stuff You Should Know / ADHD pt 1

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ADHD pt 1 · Stuff You Should Know

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Hey, everybody. In today's episode and in part two, we
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: talk very frankly about ADHD and all that that means
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: over the lifetime of a person who has it. So
• 0:11
  Speaker 1: if you're a parent with a kiddo who has ADHD,
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: maybe considered listening by yourself first before you share it
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: with them. Just a thought. Hope you enjoy these episodes.
• 0:22
  Speaker 2: Welcome to Stuff you Should Know, a production of iHeartRadio.
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark, and
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: there's Charles w chuck'bryan, and there's Jerry Jerome Roland. You
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: put the three of us together and you got yourself
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: a podcast called Stuff you Should Know.
• 0:47
  Speaker 3: That's right. And this is the.
• 0:50
  Speaker 4: Sort of long simmering we've had it on the back
• 0:53
  Speaker 4: burner down to as low as a consummer. You had
• 0:57
  Speaker 4: many many months the ADHD. What is now to be
• 1:00
  Speaker 4: a two part episode because we've had I mean, that's
• 1:03
  Speaker 4: not why we're splitting it up, but we have had
• 1:05
  Speaker 4: a lot of requests for this over the years, and
• 1:09
  Speaker 4: you know, it's big that could certainly be more than
• 1:12
  Speaker 4: two episodes. And as much as I wanted to try
• 1:14
  Speaker 4: and split this up into AD and HD for fun,
• 1:18
  Speaker 4: and it kind of doesn't work that way, so we're
• 1:21
  Speaker 4: just gonna split it up into two parts.
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: I think you're more thinking of ac DC.
• 1:26
  Speaker 3: Oh, okay, that's that's what I think it is. Yeah,
• 1:29
  Speaker 3: I gotcha, No, chuck.
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: Instead, today we're talking about ADHD, which stands for attention
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: deficit hyperactivity disorder. Kind of wordy, but it really does
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: get the point across because with ADHD, I'm sure a
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: lot of people are familiar with it, especially the people
• 1:46
  Speaker 1: who requested it. It's a I'm not exactly sure exactly
• 1:51
  Speaker 1: what kind of disorder it is, whether it's a mental disorder,
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: a personality disorder, an externalizing disorder. There's actually a lot
• 1:57
  Speaker 1: of debate about it, but essentially, it's where people have
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: a lot of trouble paying attention, sitting still focusing, and
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: a bunch of other stuff that we'll talk about, and
• 2:09
  Speaker 1: you put it all together and it can make life
• 2:11
  Speaker 1: kind of hard to navigate. And at first we'll talk
• 2:15
  Speaker 1: about it a lot more. But kids, it used to
• 2:17
  Speaker 1: be like little boys fidgeting essentially was what ADHD or
• 2:21
  Speaker 1: ADD at the time was considered. But over time it's
• 2:23
  Speaker 1: really kind of expanded. We've realized way more girls have
• 2:27
  Speaker 1: it than we thought before, and we've also come to
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: realize that adults have it too, and that's a I mean,
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: it's a really big, huge disorder, and a lot of
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: people just kind of use it as shorthand, like, you know,
• 2:40
  Speaker 1: I forgot my keys, it's my ADHD or something like that.
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: But the more you know about it, the more you
• 2:44
  Speaker 1: realize it's a genuinely debilitating disorder that people have.
• 2:48
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and sometimes you may lose your keys.
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: It's true, that is a big part of it. I mean,
• 2:54
  Speaker 1: they're not wrong about that.
• 2:55
  Speaker 3: One for sure.
• 2:56
  Speaker 4: So you know, when it comes to something like this,
• 2:59
  Speaker 4: that is only and I mean, honestly, in the last
• 3:02
  Speaker 4: like twenty five ish years, really come more into focus
• 3:05
  Speaker 4: as far as our understanding of it.
• 3:07
  Speaker 3: When you look.
• 3:08
  Speaker 4: Back through medical and you know, psychiatric literature, you're going
• 3:13
  Speaker 4: to see it pop up. They just didn't know what
• 3:15
  Speaker 4: it was at the time. And in this case you
• 3:18
  Speaker 4: can probably go back all the way to the eighteenth
• 3:20
  Speaker 4: century with a Scottish physician named Sir Alexander Crichton, who
• 3:26
  Speaker 4: in his seventeen eighty nine book talked about children who
• 3:29
  Speaker 4: were unable to focus on one thing at a time
• 3:32
  Speaker 4: and you know, it's one of those clear cases kind
• 3:35
  Speaker 4: of like, oh, well, it was probably somebody with ADHD.
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  Speaker 4: It is not just a modern condition because kids eat
• 3:42
  Speaker 4: too much sugar and they have screens in their lives.
• 3:46
  Speaker 4: Screens can we'll talk about that. Can certainly, you know,
• 3:49
  Speaker 4: make things worse, But it's not like, oh, because people
• 3:52
  Speaker 4: are so busy and there's too many distractions these days,
• 3:55
  Speaker 4: and back in the olden times when there were no distractions,
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  Speaker 4: people didn't suffer from something like this. It's just not
• 4:01
  Speaker 4: true when you hear about some of these old descriptions.
• 4:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah, no, not at all. And our understanding of it
• 4:07
  Speaker 1: has progressed like over the centuries. But it is interesting
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: that it started in the eighteenth century because I mean
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  Speaker 1: Crichton nailed it on the head, like he's like, there's
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  Speaker 1: definitely something here, and I guess it just kind of
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  Speaker 1: stayed there for a little while until nineteen oh two
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  Speaker 1: when a pediatrician from the UK named Sir George Frederick.
• 4:24
  Speaker 1: Still ironically, yeah, I thought that too. He described children
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  Speaker 1: who had a defect of moral control, which is essentially
• 4:33
  Speaker 1: saying that these are kids who have troubled delaying gratification,
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: not thinking about negative consequences when they carry out actions,
• 4:44
  Speaker 1: and that's impulsivity. That's what we call it today, is impulsivity.
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  Speaker 1: And that's what Still was essentially describing at the time.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, in the thirties, some more descriptors came along from
• 4:56
  Speaker 4: the courtesy of some German physicians I named Franz Kramer
• 5:00
  Speaker 4: and Hans pol No in this case talking about more
• 5:04
  Speaker 4: of the hyperactivity side of things. And then about five
• 5:07
  Speaker 4: years after that, still in the nineteen thirties, in nineteen
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  Speaker 4: thirty seven, a big I guess breakthrough came along when
• 5:13
  Speaker 4: a doctor for the Rhode Island Facility for Children with
• 5:17
  Speaker 4: neurological problems, saying Charles Bradley was doing an experiment where
• 5:22
  Speaker 4: he was doing a imaging test on the brain, and specifically,
• 5:26
  Speaker 4: in this case with kids, he was draining some brain
• 5:30
  Speaker 4: or some fluid around the brain. Rather gave the kids headaches,
• 5:33
  Speaker 4: he treated them with benza dream, which is an amphetamine,
• 5:37
  Speaker 4: And what he found out was, Wow, this doesn't seem
• 5:41
  Speaker 4: to make any intuitive sense, but giving these children amphetamines
• 5:47
  Speaker 4: is at least for about half of them, made them
• 5:49
  Speaker 4: less vigety and more focused, and all of a sudden
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  Speaker 4: you're onto a pharmaceutical potential, pharmaceutical treatment.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, what a way to accidentally stumble into that,
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  Speaker 1: because even today we're not exactly sure how stimulants like
• 6:04
  Speaker 1: take care of ADHD symptoms. We just know they really
• 6:07
  Speaker 1: really work. Luckily, this doctor was like quick complaining, take
• 6:10
  Speaker 1: some benz adream and shut up little.
• 6:13
  Speaker 3: Kids, and back then the kids obeyed, So.
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: There was a so that was actually kind of a
• 6:20
  Speaker 1: diversion nineteen thirty seven when when Charles Bradley discovered this
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: that amphetamines treat ADHD, it didn't like take off like wildfire,
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  Speaker 1: because there was an interim period between then and like
• 6:31
  Speaker 1: the fifties where psychiatrists and psychologists were like, all this
• 6:35
  Speaker 1: stuff needs to just be talked out through psychoanalysis. That's
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: how you treat you know, mental disorders. And in the
• 6:42
  Speaker 1: fifties finally people were like, no, let's start prescribing drugs.
• 6:47
  Speaker 1: And one of the first companies was Siba Geige pharmaceutical company.
• 6:52
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 6:53
  Speaker 1: I mean, you're definitely going to go out of business
• 6:55
  Speaker 1: if that's the name of your pharmaceutical company. But they're
• 6:57
  Speaker 1: the first ones who developed Riddlin. And it turns out
• 7:01
  Speaker 1: that the guy who developed the drug leandro penzone penizone.
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: His wife was named Rita and he named it as.
• 7:08
  Speaker 3: That's right, lovely Rita.
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  Speaker 4: So it was the first half of the twentieth century
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  Speaker 4: when things started to change, you know, you know not
• 7:19
  Speaker 4: I guess I could say begin in earnest as far
• 7:21
  Speaker 4: as researching this kind of thing. A lot of like
• 7:24
  Speaker 4: research into brain injuries were happening at the time, and
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  Speaker 4: they thought that, well, hey, this is what's going on
• 7:32
  Speaker 4: with any kind of developmental issue. It's almost certainly a
• 7:36
  Speaker 4: brain injury. That can be the case for sure with
• 7:39
  Speaker 4: all kinds of developmental issues, including ADHD in this case.
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  Speaker 4: But in the nineteen sixties that started to go out
• 7:45
  Speaker 4: of favor a little bit and they started to realize that, hey,
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  Speaker 4: a lot of this stuff, there are a lot of
• 7:51
  Speaker 4: actually distinct conditions, and you can't just lump them all
• 7:54
  Speaker 4: in there and say it's because a kid hit his
• 7:56
  Speaker 4: head when they were young.
• 7:58
  Speaker 1: No. So in the late sixties, the DSM two, the sequel,
• 8:04
  Speaker 1: the introduced to diagnosis called hyperkinetic Reaction of childhood and
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  Speaker 1: it's essentially ADHD that they were talking about, And this
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  Speaker 1: is the first time it showed up in psychiatry or
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  Speaker 1: it's like, this is actually a thing. We just aren't
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  Speaker 1: clear what to name it yet, clearly because we're calling
• 8:19
  Speaker 1: it hyperkinetic reaction of childhood. And within a decade and
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  Speaker 1: a half we finally had it nailed down to attention
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  Speaker 1: deficit disorder ADD, which people of our age, that was
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: what the name we were first exposed to. For sure,
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  Speaker 1: it was not ADHD, this new fangled version. It was
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  Speaker 1: ad D and that's the way it was, and you.
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  Speaker 3: Liked it, right, right.
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  Speaker 4: ADD had a couple of subtypes depending on whether there
• 8:46
  Speaker 4: was hyperactivity involved, but they it wasn't like a part
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  Speaker 4: of the actual definition at this point. I think seven
• 8:53
  Speaker 4: years later it finally landed upon I guess this would
• 8:57
  Speaker 4: be nineteen eighty seven. But a junior, I'm sorry, sophomore
• 9:01
  Speaker 4: in high school?
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  Speaker 1: How is eleven?
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  Speaker 3: Oh, you were just a cute little eleven year old.
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  Speaker 4: How was a well I didn't get pimples, luckily, but
• 9:08
  Speaker 4: it would be pimply faced teenager when ADHD finally rolls
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  Speaker 4: through the door. And I think if you had no
• 9:18
  Speaker 4: hyperactivity attached at that time, it could it was called
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  Speaker 4: undifferentiated ADD Right am I.
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  Speaker 3: Saying all this?
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  Speaker 2: Right?
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  Speaker 3: I think so yeah, yeah.
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  Speaker 1: You totally.
• 9:27
  Speaker 4: And then in the nineties, another big breakthrough came through
• 9:30
  Speaker 4: when they found out, hey, there's a genetic component to
• 9:34
  Speaker 4: all this, and there are actually a lot of.
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  Speaker 3: Adults that have this.
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  Speaker 4: We thought kids just grew out of this kind of thing,
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  Speaker 4: but now adults are saying, like when they're diagnosing like
• 9:45
  Speaker 4: gen xers, basically diagnosing their kids, they're saying, wait a minute,
• 9:49
  Speaker 4: that sounds a lot like me, maybe I have it,
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  Speaker 4: and oh, my goodness, I do, and that maybe also
• 9:54
  Speaker 4: why my kid has it.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah. One of the reasons why they used to think
• 9:59
  Speaker 1: it was just a child the disorder that you grew
• 10:01
  Speaker 1: out of was because the first batch of kids with
• 10:04
  Speaker 1: ADHD or ADD they weren't followed into adulthood. They stopped
• 10:09
  Speaker 1: studying them after they were kids, so they just didn't
• 10:11
  Speaker 1: think about it. And then also, and this is really
• 10:14
  Speaker 1: sad if you think about this as an adult. As
• 10:18
  Speaker 1: you grow up, you get so good at masking your
• 10:20
  Speaker 1: symptoms in order to blend into society totally that researchers
• 10:24
  Speaker 1: were unaware that there was a whole group of people
• 10:27
  Speaker 1: with a disorder that was just went unrecognized because they
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: were good at disguising it, which is a huge part
• 10:34
  Speaker 1: of ADHD, and it turns out just being neurodiverse in general.
• 10:38
  Speaker 4: Yeah, for sure. And we'll get to masking more in
• 10:41
  Speaker 4: a little bit. But another revision in ninety four in
• 10:45
  Speaker 4: the DSM finally divided ADHD up into three types, the
• 10:50
  Speaker 4: enotent of type, hyperactive impulsive type, and then the combined type,
• 10:55
  Speaker 4: which is both.
• 10:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's where we are today.
• 10:59
  Speaker 3: Right where we are today.
• 11:00
  Speaker 4: But you know, the more we learn, I feel like
• 11:02
  Speaker 4: every ten years that there's another change.
• 11:05
  Speaker 3: So who knows where it's gonna stop.
• 11:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, they're just going to keep adding letters. Maybe, So
• 11:13
  Speaker 1: I say we take a break and come back and
• 11:15
  Speaker 1: talk about how this whole thing kind of works in
• 11:17
  Speaker 1: the brain.
• 11:17
  Speaker 3: As far as we know, let's do it.
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: Definitely should know a.
• 11:27
  Speaker 5: Y s K. Lately I've been learning some stop about
• 11:34
  Speaker 5: insoma or aluminia.
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: How about the one on border like disorder, that ynder order,
• 11:44
  Speaker 2: that one be warm But it was so nice I
• 11:48
  Speaker 2: learned this, why definitely, body listen, stop stop.
• 12:04
  Speaker 3: Chuck.
• 12:04
  Speaker 1: I can't remember if I said it already, but I
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: have ADHD myself. What Yeah, And then Jerry does too.
• 12:12
  Speaker 1: It turns out this is the most amazing part of this.
• 12:17
  Speaker 1: Jerry and I were diagnosed within like a week of
• 12:20
  Speaker 1: each other, and we both told you on the same day,
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: and you found out that you were the only third
• 12:28
  Speaker 1: of stuff you should know that doesn't have ADHD.
• 12:30
  Speaker 4: Now, and I was like, oh, this is great to
• 12:33
  Speaker 4: know here fifteen years into our career.
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm surrounded.
• 12:37
  Speaker 4: I'm surrounded. But you guys are both wonderful and understanding
• 12:40
  Speaker 4: this stuff helps everybody understand things because, as you'll see
• 12:44
  Speaker 4: throughout this episode, ADHD affects you, and it affects your parents,
• 12:49
  Speaker 4: your loved ones, your partners, your business partners. And I
• 12:54
  Speaker 4: think the more people understand all this stuff, the more
• 12:56
  Speaker 4: empathy we can all have for each other.
• 12:58
  Speaker 1: That sounded like a really word prey children's book.
• 13:01
  Speaker 3: About ADHD, not a kid's book writer. Even though we
• 13:04
  Speaker 3: have a kid's book exactly.
• 13:08
  Speaker 1: That still holds true. So Chuck, there's like it's clear,
• 13:13
  Speaker 1: like you said, they have a genetic or they found
• 13:15
  Speaker 1: a genetic component to this whole thing. They've also found
• 13:18
  Speaker 1: that there are definite differences in brain structure with people
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: who have ADHD. The brains are just simply physically different.
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: One of the things is that they're smaller in places,
• 13:29
  Speaker 1: like they have less volume. Maybe some parts are thinner,
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: some parts maybe thicker. And it's really important to point
• 13:37
  Speaker 1: out that brain size is not relative to intelligence. So
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: if you're verin smaller doesn't mean like you aren't intelligent.
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: And maybe here's a really good place to point out
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: that one of the things that I think is kind
• 13:49
  Speaker 1: of overlooked about people with ADHD is they have the
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: same thoughts and feelings and emotions that anybody else does.
• 13:59
  Speaker 1: It's just that they have trouble regulating those emotions and
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: regulating those behaviors that the same impulses that everybody else
• 14:06
  Speaker 1: gets can slip through with a person with ADHD. That
• 14:09
  Speaker 1: that damper that's like, well, I can't do that because
• 14:12
  Speaker 1: it's socially unacceptable that neurotypical people have is kind of
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: absent for the most part in people with ADHD unless
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: they're really paying attention and trying to hold it back.
• 14:22
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 14:22
  Speaker 4: Absolutely, And what's you know fascinating is that they can
• 14:27
  Speaker 4: detect some of these differences, like you know, with brain scans,
• 14:31
  Speaker 4: physical differences as early as age four h which you know,
• 14:35
  Speaker 4: it suggests at least that like this is innate like
• 14:40
  Speaker 4: you were probably born with this if you can be
• 14:43
  Speaker 4: you know, four years old and detect differences in brain scans.
• 14:47
  Speaker 4: Another big one, and this is kind of the the
• 14:50
  Speaker 4: real crux of the whole thing is if you were
• 14:53
  Speaker 4: a person with ADHD, then that means that you have
• 14:56
  Speaker 4: a deficit of two things that really make a big
• 15:00
  Speaker 4: difference in your life. Dopamine and nora epinephrine, two things
• 15:05
  Speaker 4: that we've talked about quite a lot over the years.
• 15:08
  Speaker 4: But you know, we know what dopamine does. And part
• 15:12
  Speaker 4: of the challenge of ADHD is if you're not getting
• 15:17
  Speaker 4: a dopamine hit. And this is just a sort of
• 15:19
  Speaker 4: a big generalization, but I think if you have ADHD,
• 15:23
  Speaker 4: you can probably relate if you're not getting that hit
• 15:26
  Speaker 4: of a dopamine, which is a you know, part of
• 15:28
  Speaker 4: the reward center, like, hey, you did a great job
• 15:32
  Speaker 4: cleaning that room and making that bed, and just look
• 15:36
  Speaker 4: at it, my dopamine is hitting and I feel great
• 15:39
  Speaker 4: about that. If you're not getting that, or that's you know,
• 15:43
  Speaker 4: dampered in some way, then you're not gonna be as
• 15:46
  Speaker 4: interested in cleaning that room or making that bed.
• 15:48
  Speaker 3: It's not that.
• 15:50
  Speaker 4: Your kid doesn't care or as lazy or loves a
• 15:53
  Speaker 4: mess is because they literally don't get that same reward
• 15:56
  Speaker 4: or adults that same reward that someone who doesn't have
• 16:01
  Speaker 4: that neurodiversity does.
• 16:03
  Speaker 3: And so they're not going to be incentivized to do
• 16:05
  Speaker 3: that thing.
• 16:06
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 16:06
  Speaker 1: And as we talked about in the dopamine episode, it's
• 16:08
  Speaker 1: not like dopamine gives you that hit of feeling good.
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: It's the thing that comes along with whatever makes you
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: feel good and says this is important, learn this and
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: remember this so that the next time you're faced with
• 16:20
  Speaker 1: cleaning a room, you can remember, Oh, there's some good
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: feeling at the end of this, and if you don't
• 16:26
  Speaker 1: have that, yeah, there's there's no reason whatsoever for you
• 16:29
  Speaker 1: to get up and clean a room. Especially there's like,
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: as we'll see, there's actual brain function that's missing or
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: impaired in people with ADHD that allows them to self
• 16:42
  Speaker 1: arouse and be like, I should really do this. I'm
• 16:44
  Speaker 1: going to get up and do this.
• 16:45
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 16:46
  Speaker 4: And fatigue is another sort of I guess, cosymptom of
• 16:50
  Speaker 4: ADHD sometimes because maybe you don't sleep as well, maybe
• 16:54
  Speaker 4: the hyperactivity is just wearing you out, or your anxiety which.
• 16:58
  Speaker 3: Can also come along.
• 16:59
  Speaker 4: So not only are you not getting that dopamine hit,
• 17:02
  Speaker 4: and your body isn't learning and your brain isn't learning, Like, hey,
• 17:06
  Speaker 4: here's the reward that comes with making that bed if
• 17:10
  Speaker 4: you're fatigued at the same time, and let's say you're
• 17:13
  Speaker 4: an adult and it's not just like make your bed,
• 17:16
  Speaker 4: small child. If you have a huge amount of things
• 17:19
  Speaker 4: on your plate and you're fatigued and you're not getting
• 17:21
  Speaker 4: that dopamine hit, it can I'm sure feel like the
• 17:24
  Speaker 4: weight of the world is coming down on you and
• 17:27
  Speaker 4: you could go into shutdown mode.
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah, So one thing I saw is that they don't
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: think that people with ADHD produce less dopamine. The current
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: understanding is that people with ADHD have more dopamine transporters,
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: so that dopamine gets moved out of the brain faster,
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: so you have less of it at any given point
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: in time, not that you make less of it. The
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: other one you mentioned is nora pineffron, and that's usually
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: the thing that allows you to kind of rouse yourself,
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: and it helps you also very import and regulate emotion,
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: regulate self control, regulate attention. And so those are the neurotransmitters,
• 18:06
  Speaker 1: the big ones that definitely in some way, shape or
• 18:10
  Speaker 1: form effect ADHD. We just don't fully understand it. But
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: one of the other big things that has to do
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: with the brain is the typically the frontal lobe or
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: the frontal cortex contains like our higher thinking, our higher behaviors,
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: and that's usually put together in something called executive function
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: which is a suite of behaviors and cognitive abilities that
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: essentially let us just be you know, functioning people in
• 18:42
  Speaker 1: society as far as the terms of society.
• 18:45
  Speaker 4: Require, Yeah, like how you prioritize your tasks, how you
• 18:50
  Speaker 4: handle distractions that come your way, how you control what
• 18:54
  Speaker 4: impulses that come your way that may or may not
• 18:56
  Speaker 4: distract you from those tasks. And you know, we're going
• 19:01
  Speaker 4: to talk about I guess like six broad executive functioning components,
• 19:06
  Speaker 4: and if you have ADHD, one or all of these
• 19:11
  Speaker 4: are going to be dinged in some way. Doesn't mean
• 19:14
  Speaker 4: you can't you have zero executive functioning by any means,
• 19:18
  Speaker 4: but it just means with these six things, some of
• 19:20
  Speaker 4: them may be worse than others because ADHD, like most things,
• 19:24
  Speaker 4: sort of exist on the spectrum as far as how
• 19:26
  Speaker 4: sibiera might be for each individual. The first part of
• 19:30
  Speaker 4: that executive functioning is working memory. Of course, that's just
• 19:35
  Speaker 4: your you know, that's your working memory. It's just like
• 19:37
  Speaker 4: thoughts at any given moment about what you're doing and
• 19:41
  Speaker 4: what you are remembering to do.
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: Right. You usually think of working memories like remembering a
• 19:46
  Speaker 1: phone number while you're going to write it down, you know,
• 19:49
  Speaker 1: but it also involves everything from like engaging in a conversation,
• 19:53
  Speaker 1: planning a vacation, like anything where you're having to hold
• 19:56
  Speaker 1: a bunch of thoughts like in the front of your
• 19:58
  Speaker 1: mind while you're kind of working it all out. That's
• 20:01
  Speaker 1: working memory, and it's really important and it's very frequently
• 20:04
  Speaker 1: impaired in people with ADHD. Another classic executive function that
• 20:10
  Speaker 1: is essentially universal as far as ADHD symptoms go is
• 20:14
  Speaker 1: self restraint or inhibition control, and not just physically, but
• 20:18
  Speaker 1: also emotionally and attentionally too, like staying in a conversation
• 20:24
  Speaker 1: not blurting out something offensive about someone's hair style even
• 20:28
  Speaker 1: though you don't mean to hurt their feelings. Another one too,
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: being on a diet and then just being like, I'm
• 20:34
  Speaker 1: just gonna eat a bunch of cookies too. Who cares
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: a lot of all of those things? Have to do
• 20:38
  Speaker 1: with inhibition control, and that's just a big part of it.
• 20:41
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and you can still say, like geez, who wears
• 20:43
  Speaker 4: a mullet these days? Just say it very quietly to
• 20:45
  Speaker 4: your friend.
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: Or just think it. And that's another thing too. I
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: think that's why a lot of people who don't have
• 20:50
  Speaker 1: ADHD recognize because they were thinking the same thing, but
• 20:55
  Speaker 1: they know not to say it. This person says it,
• 20:58
  Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. That's the friends.
• 21:00
  Speaker 4: Yeah, if you've ever heard anybody say something like, oh,
• 21:04
  Speaker 4: I got no filter, that person has no filter.
• 21:08
  Speaker 3: That person may have ADHD.
• 21:10
  Speaker 1: Is a good chance, you know, they're just irresponsible one
• 21:14
  Speaker 1: of the two.
• 21:14
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's true. You can also just be a jerk.
• 21:17
  Speaker 4: Planning, organizing, and problem solving is another big one. If
• 21:21
  Speaker 4: you have a goal for work or life or whatever, school,
• 21:25
  Speaker 4: what you usually do when you're executive and when you're
• 21:29
  Speaker 4: an executive, no, when you're when you're functioning executively. As
• 21:34
  Speaker 4: you take that goal, you look at it, you break
• 21:36
  Speaker 4: it down into steps and smaller parts. You do an
• 21:39
  Speaker 4: evaluation of, like what's the best way to tackle this thing?
• 21:43
  Speaker 4: And that's a big, big part of problem solving. If
• 21:47
  Speaker 4: that is impaired with ADHD, and you're throwing a big
• 21:50
  Speaker 4: task or a big worker school project, you may kind
• 21:53
  Speaker 4: of just freeze for a while, and you know, you
• 21:57
  Speaker 4: know this sounds bad, but you might just sit there
• 22:00
  Speaker 4: and think about something entirely different for a little while.
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you might go to great links to avoid that task.
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: And also not just procrastinating, but like really genuinely having
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: trouble focusing because you don't know what to do. You
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: don't know where to start.
• 22:14
  Speaker 4: Yeah, like you can't do it. It's not that's a
• 22:16
  Speaker 4: disinterest or anything like that.
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: Right. Another one's decision making, which kind of ties into that,
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: where you know, you can't just say yes to everything.
• 22:25
  Speaker 1: That's not how life works. So you have to take
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: into like account future consequences and you have to figure
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: out do I have time to do all of these things,
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: and if not, which one's more important? Like all that
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: goes into decision making, and that can be largely impaired too,
• 22:42
  Speaker 1: not just not like necessarily all the time, But you
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: were just kind of mentioning something called ADHD paralysis that
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: where like things can get so overwhelming you cannot know
• 22:51
  Speaker 1: where to start your you know, like your bosses coming
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: down the hall to get this report. You haven't even
• 22:56
  Speaker 1: started on, and like you just shut down. You can't
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: decide anything, you can't really focus on anything. That's called
• 23:03
  Speaker 1: ADHD paralysis, and that can come from having to make decisions.
• 23:08
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and that's where as a parent or as a partner,
• 23:11
  Speaker 4: a business partner or life partner to someone, if you
• 23:15
  Speaker 4: don't have that challenge, that's when you can really step
• 23:18
  Speaker 4: up and sit down with your kid or your friend
• 23:20
  Speaker 4: or partner and say, all right, let's sit down and
• 23:22
  Speaker 4: look at this. Let's talk about the steps, like maybe
• 23:25
  Speaker 4: what a good first step might be, maybe get a
• 23:28
  Speaker 4: little help organizing something. Those are Like to be a
• 23:32
  Speaker 4: really active involved parent or partner is key to everyone,
• 23:37
  Speaker 4: you know, doing the best they can in life.
• 23:39
  Speaker 3: Yeah, totally.
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: And we'll talk more about like what parents and like
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: family members and spouses and all that can do later
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: on down the road. But that's a great that's a
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: great thing to hit multiple times, you know.
• 23:50
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 23:51
  Speaker 4: Time management is another big one that kind of ties
• 23:54
  Speaker 4: into a little bit of the planning and organization and
• 23:57
  Speaker 4: stuff like that. But just being able to allocate your time,
• 24:00
  Speaker 4: keep track of the deadlines.
• 24:02
  Speaker 3: It may seem counterintuitive.
• 24:05
  Speaker 4: But if you are a person with ADHD, you might
• 24:08
  Speaker 4: do much better with a deadline instead of some just
• 24:11
  Speaker 4: amorphous task this handed to you. So like knowing the
• 24:15
  Speaker 4: deadline may be really good for you, or the deadline
• 24:19
  Speaker 4: may just come and go sometimes as well.
• 24:21
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and it's not necessarily because they're like I don't
• 24:23
  Speaker 1: care about this deadline. They may have literally forgotten about it.
• 24:27
  Speaker 1: I read a horror story Chuck about a guy with
• 24:29
  Speaker 1: ADHD an adult whose boss came to him and said, Hey,
• 24:33
  Speaker 1: you know, why don't you run Monday's meeting. I'm not
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: going to be there, And the guy was like, I
• 24:38
  Speaker 1: knew that this was like a step toward like getting
• 24:41
  Speaker 1: me ready for the next level, for a promotion into management,
• 24:44
  Speaker 1: So he was really excited about it, and then over
• 24:47
  Speaker 1: the weekend he totally forgot about it. When the Monday
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: meeting came around, he sat down with everybody else waiting
• 24:52
  Speaker 1: for the boss, wondering where the boss was, and they
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: all just left the meeting and went back to work,
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: and his boss came and asked him how the meeting went,
• 25:01
  Speaker 1: and he's like, what are you talking about? And it
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: finally sunk into him, like what had just happened, and
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: think about that, like, he just probably totally scuttled any
• 25:10
  Speaker 1: chance of that promotion. Yeah, because he just forgot about it.
• 25:15
  Speaker 1: And that's just something that can happen with it. That's
• 25:17
  Speaker 1: a frequent reason people with ADHD miss deadlines. They just
• 25:20
  Speaker 1: forget that they have one.
• 25:22
  Speaker 4: You should have saved that for Halloween. That horror story, Yeah,
• 25:26
  Speaker 4: where's the knocker?
• 25:27
  Speaker 1: Didn't that just turn your stomach least imagining that guy
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: for sure.
• 25:33
  Speaker 4: And then the last part of executive functioning that can
• 25:37
  Speaker 4: be impaired is another big one. It's called task shifting,
• 25:41
  Speaker 4: and it leads into a couple of things we're going
• 25:43
  Speaker 4: to talk about. That means you get out of your
• 25:45
  Speaker 4: default mode, which we'll expand on here in a second,
• 25:49
  Speaker 4: and doing something called set shifting, which is you know,
• 25:52
  Speaker 4: being able to switch from task to task, being flexible
• 25:56
  Speaker 4: as you're doing that, maybe realizing that different tasks and
• 26:01
  Speaker 4: different situations require different rules. And if you don't have that,
• 26:05
  Speaker 4: if that's impaired, you might be really rigid in how
• 26:08
  Speaker 4: you think something has to be done, a very black
• 26:10
  Speaker 4: and white thinking. They can come across to others as stubborn,
• 26:13
  Speaker 4: but in the ADHD mind, you just have a hard
• 26:17
  Speaker 4: time task shifting right exactly.
• 26:20
  Speaker 1: And that's a huge classic one too, like you just
• 26:23
  Speaker 1: focus on one thing or you can't start another thing too.
• 26:25
  Speaker 1: And if you put all that together in life, people
• 26:29
  Speaker 1: with ADHD, they have trouble remembering to pay bills, they
• 26:35
  Speaker 1: forget that they have homework, They say or do in
• 26:38
  Speaker 1: appropriate things like not waiting for their turn to speak.
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: They have trouble self motivating, staying on task. They misplace things,
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: They have false memories, which is a really big one
• 26:49
  Speaker 1: that we'll talk about. They can't remember important dates or
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: that they're supposed to run a meeting. And another big
• 26:55
  Speaker 1: one too is that they'll very frequently ADHD causes you
• 27:00
  Speaker 1: to walk into a room and you have no idea
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: what you went in there for. You knew you went
• 27:06
  Speaker 1: in there for. Something that happens sometimes too, but imagine
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: every time.
• 27:11
  Speaker 4: Yeah, now I can't because it's it's frustrating and it
• 27:14
  Speaker 4: can also be alarming.
• 27:16
  Speaker 1: Yes, that's another thing too, is especially as you age
• 27:19
  Speaker 1: with ADHD, you can still be like, okay, is this
• 27:21
  Speaker 1: ADHD or am I developing early on said dementia? Like
• 27:24
  Speaker 1: there's a lot of overlap and it can be very scary,
• 27:27
  Speaker 1: but sure you also learn tricks like you just leave
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: the room and go back out to where you just were,
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: and you're going to see like a clue that will
• 27:35
  Speaker 1: prompt you to remember, and then you just think about
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: it while you're going into the room and then you remember.
• 27:40
  Speaker 1: It's usually just amounts to an extra trip back out
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: of the room and then back into it. But it
• 27:44
  Speaker 1: is just frustrating for sure.
• 27:46
  Speaker 4: You know what they call that in the l film biz.
• 27:48
  Speaker 4: Do you remember a mcguffin, Now you go back to one?
• 27:53
  Speaker 1: Oh okay, yeah, that's right, that's right back to one.
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: Dad saying that he would always pinch the bridge of
• 27:57
  Speaker 1: his nose while he was saying, yeah, back.
• 27:59
  Speaker 3: To one just means first position of that scene.
• 28:01
  Speaker 4: Like if the scene starts and you're in the doorway,
• 28:04
  Speaker 4: go back to one, You go back to that doorway.
• 28:06
  Speaker 4: So maybe that's a fun way to remember that kind
• 28:09
  Speaker 4: of thing.
• 28:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I love that, Chuck.
• 28:11
  Speaker 3: Way to go.
• 28:14
  Speaker 4: Now, let's not take a break yet, because I think
• 28:16
  Speaker 4: we should talk. I mentioned default mode. Default mode network
• 28:21
  Speaker 4: is a very big part of this, at least understanding
• 28:25
  Speaker 4: of this. The brain regions collectively that function when you're
• 28:31
  Speaker 4: just hanging out when you're hanging out on the couch,
• 28:34
  Speaker 4: you don't have anything to do in the moment. I
• 28:37
  Speaker 4: mean people with no children can identify with this, maybe
• 28:41
  Speaker 4: I can't. But the times of the day where you
• 28:44
  Speaker 4: can just sit around and introspect and daydream and zone
• 28:46
  Speaker 4: out a little bit, that's called default mode. And when
• 28:50
  Speaker 4: you're doing that, there are parts of your brain that
• 28:53
  Speaker 4: become really active and light up during default mode. And
• 28:57
  Speaker 4: if you have if you're a neurotypical person, going between
• 29:02
  Speaker 4: default mode, because once you have to kick into action mode,
• 29:05
  Speaker 4: that default mode turns off and switching between those if
• 29:09
  Speaker 4: your neurotypical is you know, it works as it should
• 29:12
  Speaker 4: if you have ADHD, and the problem is that default
• 29:17
  Speaker 4: mode stays on sometimes they've shown this in brain imaging studies.
• 29:23
  Speaker 4: So if you're doing a task that requires focus, your
• 29:28
  Speaker 4: default mode still may be on and that's active at
• 29:31
  Speaker 4: the same time. And those two things are not SYMPATICO.
• 29:34
  Speaker 1: No, and like by sometimes it's pretty much all the time,
• 29:38
  Speaker 1: like it just does not shut off. So that amounts
• 29:41
  Speaker 1: to there's a psychiatrist and Ned Hollowell, MD, who put
• 29:47
  Speaker 1: it as a persistent magnetic pull away from the task
• 29:50
  Speaker 1: at hand into distraction. So you're because your brain is
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: like no, no, no, we're over here, We're going to daydream.
• 29:57
  Speaker 1: Because your default mode network is on, you can't focus
• 30:02
  Speaker 1: for long periods on the task at hand, or if
• 30:05
  Speaker 1: you can, it's a constant struggle to resist. You're letting
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: your mind wander. You have to actively keep it focused
• 30:13
  Speaker 1: on the thing you're doing because you're like you said,
• 30:15
  Speaker 1: the action network didn't take over and the default mode
• 30:18
  Speaker 1: network go down, you know, proportionately to one another. Now
• 30:23
  Speaker 1: they're just both.
• 30:24
  Speaker 3: On default net network go down turned into tuk took
• 30:29
  Speaker 3: for me?
• 30:29
  Speaker 4: Yeahs is so, And we'll talk about medication and you know,
• 30:34
  Speaker 4: I guess probably in part two. But aside from medication,
• 30:39
  Speaker 4: if you are trying to help turn that default mode
• 30:44
  Speaker 4: network down or off, breathing techniques are a big part
• 30:48
  Speaker 4: of that, Like trying to stay in the present, bring
• 30:51
  Speaker 4: yourself back to the present through breathing techniques and mindfulness exercises,
• 30:55
  Speaker 4: those can go a long way.
• 30:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure. Do you want to take a break
• 31:01
  Speaker 1: and then come back and talk some more about you
• 31:03
  Speaker 1: know ADHD Yeah?
• 31:05
  Speaker 3: Sure, so it three here.
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: Definitely should know.
• 31:16
  Speaker 4: Y s K get.
• 31:19
  Speaker 5: Lately, I've been learning some stuff about insomnia or aluminia.
• 31:27
  Speaker 2: How about the one on borderlight disorder that are under order?
• 31:33
  Speaker 2: Heard that one before, but it was.
• 31:35
  Speaker 1: So nice I learned this.
• 31:38
  Speaker 5: Why except everybody listen up.
• 31:43
  Speaker 2: Shot, stop stop stop?
• 31:52
  Speaker 3: All right?
• 31:53
  Speaker 4: So, uh, this is a big one, maybe one of
• 31:56
  Speaker 4: the biggest sort of downsides to ADHD. Uh, And don't worry,
• 32:00
  Speaker 4: there are some upsides too, because you know there are
• 32:02
  Speaker 4: some quote ADHD superpowers here and there that we're going
• 32:06
  Speaker 4: to talk about, so take heart. But one of the
• 32:10
  Speaker 4: biggest drawbacks is called rejection sensitive dysphoria or RSD.
• 32:16
  Speaker 3: It's a very.
• 32:17
  Speaker 4: Destructive thing if you have it. It's very destructive to
• 32:20
  Speaker 4: people around you. It's the basically it's basically when any
• 32:25
  Speaker 4: any kind of rejection or even appearance of rejection, even
• 32:29
  Speaker 4: if it's not rejection, will trigger a very very intense
• 32:34
  Speaker 4: flood of emotion that is, it almost has and can
• 32:38
  Speaker 4: feel like it's having, and can have an actual physical
• 32:42
  Speaker 4: effect that is so strong. Not just a fear of rejection,
• 32:47
  Speaker 4: just a because no one likes rejection, but if you
• 32:52
  Speaker 4: have ADHD and RSD anything like that can bring a
• 32:57
  Speaker 4: real flood of negativity around you.
• 32:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it can be actual rejection, but it can also
• 33:02
  Speaker 1: be something like constructive criticism, which is important to be
• 33:05
  Speaker 1: able to take a perceived slight, maybe a made up slight,
• 33:11
  Speaker 1: somebody's fleeting facial expression, and offhand comment your own false beliefs.
• 33:16
  Speaker 1: And then there's two ways generally that a person with
• 33:20
  Speaker 1: RSD or we should just say ADHD will respond to
• 33:24
  Speaker 1: that to that perceived rejection. They can internalize where they'll
• 33:28
  Speaker 1: just emotionally curl up into a ball and just shut down,
• 33:33
  Speaker 1: or they may also lash out and they'll have a
• 33:36
  Speaker 1: meltdown or an outburst, or they'll become angry. That's called externalization.
• 33:41
  Speaker 1: And so to really kind of put it in perspective,
• 33:44
  Speaker 1: imagine either one of those being the response that you
• 33:48
  Speaker 1: get when you ask someone to not leave their dirty
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: dishes in the sink.
• 33:53
  Speaker 3: Yeah, Like that's RST.
• 33:54
  Speaker 1: That's what it's like living with RSC. That's what it's
• 33:56
  Speaker 1: like having with RSC. And the big problem is the
• 33:58
  Speaker 1: whole thing is instant. It's not like I'm gonna have
• 34:02
  Speaker 1: an outbur burst, I'm gonna melt down, I'm gonna emotionally
• 34:05
  Speaker 1: ball up. It just it just it goes from trigger
• 34:08
  Speaker 1: to response with nothing in between.
• 34:10
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and then you know, the person in your life
• 34:13
  Speaker 4: may end up, even if they're understanding of what's going on,
• 34:17
  Speaker 4: may end up walking on eggshells, may not want to
• 34:20
  Speaker 4: criticize or constructively or otherwise anything about that person in
• 34:25
  Speaker 4: fear of like a meltdown or an emotional outburst or
• 34:28
  Speaker 4: something like that, because it can it can really disrupt
• 34:31
  Speaker 4: like a relationship. So you know, you've got one side
• 34:35
  Speaker 4: where someone can't help something, and you've got the other
• 34:38
  Speaker 4: side where even if that person can't help it, it's
• 34:42
  Speaker 4: destructive to the relationship. So I'm just gonna do everything
• 34:45
  Speaker 4: I can to avoid any sort of confrontation.
• 34:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it makes it really hard to have a connection
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: with somebody who might just melt down at you at
• 34:52
  Speaker 1: the slightest provocation, right, Yeah, and you said something the
• 34:56
  Speaker 1: person can't help it. The person with RC cannot help this.
• 34:59
  Speaker 1: They're not being a jerk, like, they can't not do this.
• 35:04
  Speaker 1: And one of the problems with it is that it's
• 35:07
  Speaker 1: really fleeting. It's like a tidal wave or getting punched
• 35:10
  Speaker 1: in the stomach, that's what it feels like. The overwhelming emotion,
• 35:13
  Speaker 1: like you said, but that's fairly fleeting, and then that
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: gets replaced by regret and then feelings of shame every
• 35:21
  Speaker 1: time because you're just so ashamed you can't control yourself. Right, So,
• 35:26
  Speaker 1: some people who have RSD will become people pleasers where
• 35:31
  Speaker 1: they don't share their thoughts, they're true emotions, they're true opinions,
• 35:35
  Speaker 1: they don't share themselves because what they're doing is cutting
• 35:39
  Speaker 1: off as much risk as possible of being rejected and
• 35:44
  Speaker 1: thus triggering an about of RSD.
• 35:48
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, that's a vicious cycle, it is.
• 35:52
  Speaker 1: And so initially they used to think that it was
• 35:54
  Speaker 1: comorbid with ADHD, that it was a separate thing, and
• 35:57
  Speaker 1: it's not even recognized in the DSM yet. It's that
• 36:00
  Speaker 1: that recently recognized. But apparently studies have found that essentially
• 36:05
  Speaker 1: one hundred percent of people with ADHD also have RSD.
• 36:09
  Speaker 1: So they're just basically coming to the conclusion that it's
• 36:12
  Speaker 1: a it's a terrible symptom of ADHD.
• 36:15
  Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly.
• 36:17
  Speaker 4: We'd mentioned some benefits and positive things. Hyper focus is
• 36:21
  Speaker 4: one of them. It's sometimes called the superpower of ADHD.
• 36:26
  Speaker 4: If you and I've seen this with all kinds of
• 36:29
  Speaker 4: people in my life that have ADHD, if it's there,
• 36:32
  Speaker 4: if it's something they're into and they're interested in, and
• 36:35
  Speaker 4: they can zero in on that thing. It is like,
• 36:39
  Speaker 4: I mean, hyper focus doesn't even begin to describe it.
• 36:42
  Speaker 4: They can tune out everything, and sometimes to their own detriment,
• 36:47
  Speaker 4: you know, if it's like other things in their life
• 36:49
  Speaker 4: that need attention, hyper focus can distract away from those.
• 36:53
  Speaker 3: But it can also be a great thing. If you
• 36:57
  Speaker 3: are someone.
• 36:59
  Speaker 4: With ADHD, you may have a real like a real
• 37:04
  Speaker 4: skill for like zoning in on something. Maybe a particular
• 37:08
  Speaker 4: kind of job might be really really good for you, right,
• 37:10
  Speaker 4: or particular tasks maybe really really great for you, and
• 37:13
  Speaker 4: you can get a lot done sometimes that way.
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's like the exact opposite of your inability to
• 37:19
  Speaker 1: self motivate, right.
• 37:20
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 37:21
  Speaker 1: I saw a corporate study bandied about the statistic all
• 37:25
  Speaker 1: over the place, but essentially this one company found that
• 37:30
  Speaker 1: a person, a neurodiverse person who is locked into something
• 37:35
  Speaker 1: that interests them in their work will essentially do the
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: job of two people. They produce between ninety and one
• 37:41
  Speaker 1: hundred and forty percent more work than their peers in
• 37:45
  Speaker 1: the same, say, department, and that their work is consistent
• 37:49
  Speaker 1: and error free, typically because they're just totally laser focused
• 37:53
  Speaker 1: on that thing. So if you can find a job
• 37:56
  Speaker 1: that holds your interests like that, you're you're very much
• 38:00
  Speaker 1: in luck, because unfortunately, one of the things that is
• 38:03
  Speaker 1: a huge challenge for people with ADHD is finding a job.
• 38:06
  Speaker 1: When you have to find a job that doesn't hold
• 38:09
  Speaker 1: your interests, it's very difficult to arouse yourself to do that,
• 38:13
  Speaker 1: even though you know like you have to do this
• 38:15
  Speaker 1: and you should be doing it and you feel terrible
• 38:17
  Speaker 1: for not doing it, it's really hard to do sometimes.
• 38:21
  Speaker 4: Yeah, which is why I sort of understanding yourself and
• 38:25
  Speaker 4: your challenges is like really key when you go out
• 38:27
  Speaker 4: into the world and join the workforce, Like it's important
• 38:32
  Speaker 4: for anyone to go into the job starts thinking like,
• 38:35
  Speaker 4: all right, what am I really good at and what
• 38:37
  Speaker 4: are my challenges? But I just think it's probably times
• 38:40
  Speaker 4: a million if you have ADHD.
• 38:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and yeah, for sure. Another kind of something related
• 38:47
  Speaker 1: to this is you can become laser focused on just
• 38:50
  Speaker 1: everyday tasks that end up catching your interest somehow surprisingly,
• 38:55
  Speaker 1: and so people with ADHD, if they're doing a task
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: and they're in hyper focus, it'll take them way longer
• 39:00
  Speaker 1: to do it frequently, But that's because they're doing a
• 39:04
  Speaker 1: perfect job of it. So, like say vacuuming the car,
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: you just go to vacuum the car and you're like, huh,
• 39:09
  Speaker 1: this caught my interest in Now I'm totally focused on
• 39:11
  Speaker 1: making this car immaculately clean in every way, shape or form.
• 39:16
  Speaker 1: So of course it's going to go from taking fifteen
• 39:18
  Speaker 1: minutes to taking an hour and a half. You know,
• 39:21
  Speaker 1: but when you're done, the car looks awesome.
• 39:24
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 39:25
  Speaker 4: So maybe they're probably CEOs all over the place now
• 39:29
  Speaker 4: trying to staff up certain departments.
• 39:30
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's actually a thing, and there.
• 39:32
  Speaker 4: Are probably people that should be auto detailers and start
• 39:37
  Speaker 4: up your own a small business that way.
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, one of the things I saw I read
• 39:42
  Speaker 1: a del Watt or how do you say that that
• 39:45
  Speaker 1: consulting firm.
• 39:46
  Speaker 3: I don't know, it doesn't matter.
• 39:48
  Speaker 1: I read one of their reports and they were saying that,
• 39:51
  Speaker 1: you know, traditionally people think like, Okay, there's there's got
• 39:54
  Speaker 1: to be a good job for a neurodiverse person, like
• 39:56
  Speaker 1: maybe programming or coding or something like that. Just let
• 39:59
  Speaker 1: them go off and be themselves by themselves. Yeah, and
• 40:02
  Speaker 1: they're starting to recognize like, no, like you can put
• 40:06
  Speaker 1: somebody that's neurodiverse in any job, and if they find
• 40:09
  Speaker 1: something interesting in it, they're going to excel at it.
• 40:12
  Speaker 1: It's not necessarily a specific field that applies to neurodiverse people.
• 40:17
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, for sure.
• 40:19
  Speaker 4: And you know, kind of tagging onto what we were
• 40:21
  Speaker 4: just talking about, viewing yourself as you know, not having
• 40:26
  Speaker 4: some sort of defect or deficit and like, hey, this
• 40:29
  Speaker 4: is who I am, this is.
• 40:32
  Speaker 3: How I like.
• 40:33
  Speaker 4: I have no choice but to operate this way and
• 40:36
  Speaker 4: try and work, you know, within that framework, not the
• 40:39
  Speaker 4: framework of somebody who doesn't have this, who doesn't have ADHD.
• 40:44
  Speaker 4: Like it's a the world and jobs a lot of
• 40:47
  Speaker 4: times are kind of structured around I mean, yeah, the
• 40:51
  Speaker 4: entire world is structured around people who aren't neurodiverse. So
• 40:55
  Speaker 4: fitting into that world can be a real challenge no
• 40:58
  Speaker 4: matter what your neurodiversity is. So kind of working with
• 41:02
  Speaker 4: who you are and understanding that is a real key
• 41:05
  Speaker 4: to moving forward in life.
• 41:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and there are a lot of positives upsides to
• 41:10
  Speaker 1: having ADHD that kind of give you talents that other
• 41:14
  Speaker 1: people don't necessarily have. Like one of them is I
• 41:18
  Speaker 1: saw it described as you're getting so much noise at
• 41:20
  Speaker 1: any given time you're inevitably going to also get more
• 41:23
  Speaker 1: data points than other people at any given time, And
• 41:26
  Speaker 1: people with ADHD have a typically an ability to connect
• 41:30
  Speaker 1: dots that other people make, connections that other people can't see.
• 41:35
  Speaker 1: That's a big one. Another one is like, if you
• 41:38
  Speaker 1: are multitasking and you actually get those projects done, that
• 41:42
  Speaker 1: kind of boundless energy that's synonymous with the hyperactive part
• 41:47
  Speaker 1: of ADHD, you're gonna get a ton of stuff done
• 41:51
  Speaker 1: in any given day, way more than like a neurotypical
• 41:55
  Speaker 1: person who you know, poops out halfway through the day.
• 41:59
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 42:00
  Speaker 4: Another potential positive is, you know, earlier when we were
• 42:03
  Speaker 4: talking about some of the impaired executive functions and being
• 42:07
  Speaker 4: super just sort of black and white and rigid, when
• 42:09
  Speaker 4: you apply that to a moral code, you may have
• 42:12
  Speaker 4: a very strong moral compass, whereas somebody who's a little
• 42:15
  Speaker 4: more sees like the gray instead of the black and
• 42:19
  Speaker 4: white might be like, well, you know, it's really not
• 42:22
  Speaker 4: so bad if this kind of if you do this
• 42:24
  Speaker 4: kind of thing, Whereas if you have a very strict
• 42:27
  Speaker 4: sort of view of right and wrong in a black
• 42:29
  Speaker 4: and white sense of that, you may be like, no,
• 42:31
  Speaker 4: that's just wrong.
• 42:32
  Speaker 1: Chuck, there was this one time where I tried to
• 42:34
  Speaker 1: fight two guys who I thought were throwing rocks at
• 42:36
  Speaker 1: a manateee and like I was seeing red. You me
• 42:41
  Speaker 1: was even like it's not a manity stop and I
• 42:43
  Speaker 1: didn't even hear. And those guys were like, it's a rock,
• 42:47
  Speaker 1: We're not throwing rocks amanities. I was like, oh all right,
• 42:50
  Speaker 1: and luckily they were cool with it. But I was
• 42:53
  Speaker 1: ready to fight two dudes for throwing rocks at amanity.
• 42:56
  Speaker 1: Like my sense of justice was just that stricken.
• 43:00
  Speaker 3: I wish I would have been there. How might we
• 43:01
  Speaker 3: might have fought them anyway.
• 43:02
  Speaker 4: Josh, Just because I've never been in a fight, right, So,
• 43:07
  Speaker 4: like I don't know, it'd be fun to get in
• 43:09
  Speaker 4: a fight.
• 43:09
  Speaker 3: With you, right, sure?
• 43:10
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah back to back?
• 43:12
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, exactly with the two Musketeers.
• 43:16
  Speaker 1: Another one Chuck is if a person with ADHD gets excited,
• 43:19
  Speaker 1: it's infectious. Typically if they're in a place where they
• 43:22
  Speaker 1: feel safe and comfortable, like just showing their excitement and
• 43:25
  Speaker 1: just letting it hang out, You're probably going to get
• 43:27
  Speaker 1: excited along with them because it's just so it just
• 43:30
  Speaker 1: fills over. It can be really nice to.
• 43:32
  Speaker 3: Be around, for sure.
• 43:35
  Speaker 1: One more thing if you have ADHD, you very typically
• 43:41
  Speaker 1: catastrophize as far as thinking goes. You're just constantly expecting
• 43:45
  Speaker 1: the worst, just because over and over and over again
• 43:48
  Speaker 1: in your life the worst has come around because you
• 43:50
  Speaker 1: forgot to do something or whatever. So that catastrophic thinking
• 43:55
  Speaker 1: can actually be an asset in that you can look
• 43:58
  Speaker 1: at something that everybody's about to do, like, well, we're
• 44:00
  Speaker 1: all gonna die if we do this that no one
• 44:03
  Speaker 1: else saw, and you can find a safer option in
• 44:06
  Speaker 1: that way. It's actually a huge benefit of having ADHD,
• 44:09
  Speaker 1: even though you have to suffer with catastrophic thinking in
• 44:12
  Speaker 1: order for that to be an asset too.
• 44:14
  Speaker 2: You know.
• 44:15
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Chuck, I say that we end part.
• 44:19
  Speaker 3: One here, Yeah, just getting cooking too, and then we're.
• 44:22
  Speaker 1: Going to pick up part two and we're going to
• 44:25
  Speaker 1: talk more about ADHD and part two, and then while
• 44:28
  Speaker 1: we're talking about ADHD, we'll eventually finish part two and
• 44:31
  Speaker 1: then that will complete part one and two of ADHD.
• 44:35
  Speaker 1: What do you think about that.
• 44:36
  Speaker 3: For a plan? I think that sounds great.
• 44:38
  Speaker 4: And as is custom here, we don't do listener mail
• 44:41
  Speaker 4: or anything for these two parters, so I guess we'll
• 44:43
  Speaker 4: just say see you Thursday.
• 44:45
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and finish on that dramatic pause, like the very
• 44:47
  Speaker 1: special episode of Different Strokes.
• 44:54
  Speaker 3: Stuff you Should Know is a production of iHeartRadio. For
• 44:57
  Speaker 3: more podcasts my heart Radio, visit the Iheartrate you up,
• 45:00
  Speaker 3: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
• 45:06
  Speaker 1: H m hm