Latest / Pit Talk / Cadillac boss Graeme Lowdon on leading F1's newest team + Max Verstappen loses his race engineer

Transcript

Cadillac boss Graeme Lowdon on leading F1's newest team + Max Verstappen loses his race engineer · Pit Talk

0:05
Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to Pit Talk, brought to you by Shannon's.
0:09
Speaker 1: On today's episode, we catch up with Cadillac team principal
0:13
Speaker 1: Graham Loudon to get his take on how Formula one's
0:16
Speaker 1: newest team is tracking three rounds into the season, and
0:19
Speaker 1: Max Vestafan's race engineer Jean Piero Lmbiaze sensationally joins McLaren
0:24
Speaker 1: in a senior role in a move that could hasten
0:26
Speaker 1: the Dutchman's exit from the sport. My name is Michael Lamonato.
0:30
Speaker 1: It's great to have your company and the company of
0:32
Speaker 1: my co host. I offered him a ride in my Cadillac,
0:35
Speaker 1: but he said he'd written in a Cadillac hundreds of
0:37
Speaker 1: times thousands, it's Matt.
0:38
Speaker 2: Clayton Heavens in the back seat. Michael, so the so
0:42
Speaker 2: the song tells us. But very much looking forward to
0:45
Speaker 2: our chat with Graham Laddin actually, because as we've discussed
0:48
Speaker 2: on this podcast numerous times this year, they've been quietly
0:51
Speaker 2: impressive for a first year Formula One team. I'll be
0:53
Speaker 2: very curious to see what he thinks about it. From
0:55
Speaker 2: the outside looking in, it looks like they've looks like
0:58
Speaker 2: they've been around in Formula One for longer than three race,
1:00
Speaker 2: doesn't it.
1:00
Speaker 1: Yes, we'll considering the state of some of the other
1:02
Speaker 1: teams in Formula One at the moment. You may not
1:05
Speaker 1: have picked if you were coming at this one fresh
1:07
Speaker 1: that Cadillac was the brand new team built from nothing
1:10
Speaker 1: over the last couple of years. A little bit later
1:13
Speaker 1: on we'll be talking about, as I said, the news
1:15
Speaker 1: from red Bull. Of course, there had to be some
1:17
Speaker 1: item of big news in the long break. That is
1:19
Speaker 1: the way of Formula One moving to McLaren and what
1:22
Speaker 1: that means well, actually for both teams and of course
1:24
Speaker 1: Max forstap and two. That was the news of the
1:27
Speaker 1: last week or so in Formula One all the day
1:29
Speaker 1: seem to be blending at one at this point in time.
1:31
Speaker 1: But why don't we get straight to Graham Loudon now,
1:34
Speaker 1: the team principle of Cadillac, who joined us a little
1:36
Speaker 1: bit earlier for the pit Talk podcast. Well, Graham Louden,
1:40
Speaker 1: thanks so much for joining us on Pittalk.
1:42
Speaker 3: Yeah, good to be here now.
1:44
Speaker 1: This is it's an unusual break obviously for Formuda one.
1:47
Speaker 1: This five weeks we've got between Grand Prix, but it
1:49
Speaker 1: feels like it could be reasonably well timed for you
1:52
Speaker 1: to reflect on the opening three rounds of your team's
1:55
Speaker 1: new life, the very first year of Cadillac in Formula one.
1:59
Speaker 1: You were building up to the month of March all
2:01
Speaker 1: of last year. How does it feel to now be
2:03
Speaker 1: on the other side of it.
2:05
Speaker 3: Uh, well, it's great. You know, we always made it
2:09
Speaker 3: clear that the destination for us wasn't just being at
2:14
Speaker 3: the first race. It's you building, building the whole team
2:18
Speaker 3: and and moving beyond that. But obviously you have milestones
2:22
Speaker 3: along the way, and so Melbourne was obviously a key one.
2:27
Speaker 3: But even before that, you know, we had Shakedown which
2:30
Speaker 3: we managed to hit on time, and then the shakedown
2:33
Speaker 3: week in Barcelona, and then the bar in tests and
2:37
Speaker 3: then and then obviously h Melbourne, which was a double
2:41
Speaker 3: headed with Shanghai. So you know, as you know, Formuly
2:44
Speaker 3: ones normally relentless, So it's not it's not all about
2:49
Speaker 3: the the first race, but there's always one after and
2:52
Speaker 3: then and then now here we are with, you know,
2:54
Speaker 3: with with something of a break. But it's funny if
2:57
Speaker 3: I had if I had a few dollars for everyone
2:59
Speaker 3: who said, you know, how you're enjoying the holiday between
3:03
Speaker 3: between between Melbourne and Miami, then I'd be a rich man.
3:06
Speaker 3: But trust me, it's there's no holiday, and we're using
3:09
Speaker 3: the time as wisely as you know, as wisely as
3:12
Speaker 3: we can, which which I'm sure every other team is
3:14
Speaker 3: doing as well.
3:16
Speaker 2: It's not usual, grame is that you get a nice
3:18
Speaker 2: five week break after your first three Grand Prix in
3:21
Speaker 2: existence as a team. But I wanted to look at
3:23
Speaker 2: these first three that you've done so far because I think,
3:25
Speaker 2: you know, certainly from within the paddock, it feels that everyone's,
3:28
Speaker 2: you know, quietly impressed with how you've gone so far,
3:31
Speaker 2: and certainly the car has been quick enough not to
3:33
Speaker 2: be last by default. So you know, looking back at
3:37
Speaker 2: this opening brace of races, how would you assess how
3:40
Speaker 2: it's been going on track? I mean, is it satisfying
3:43
Speaker 2: for you? Or is this more just validation of what
3:45
Speaker 2: you expected from this this first brace of the season.
3:48
Speaker 3: It's kind of it's kind of what we expected. I mean,
3:52
Speaker 3: you know, the downside of murder racing is you probably
3:55
Speaker 3: know as you're never satisfied because you're you always want
3:57
Speaker 3: to have more, you always want to go faster. But
4:01
Speaker 3: you know, my own view is that the whole team
4:04
Speaker 3: has done spectacular job actually, you know, and this is
4:07
Speaker 3: what we've told them as well. It's it's really not easy.
4:10
Speaker 3: It's not easy to go from you know, literally what
4:14
Speaker 3: we had, which was an empty room in a and
4:16
Speaker 3: a set of regulations, to building a Formula One team
4:20
Speaker 3: to compete against the likes of Ferrari and Mercedes and
4:25
Speaker 3: McLaren and you know, these teams that have been doing
4:27
Speaker 3: it for a huge amount of time and even you know,
4:30
Speaker 3: even the newest team prior to us on the on
4:34
Speaker 3: the grid have been there for you know, at least
4:37
Speaker 3: a decade or so. So it's it's not an easy
4:40
Speaker 3: task at all. You never really know where you're going
4:43
Speaker 3: to be in terms of performance because it is a
4:47
Speaker 3: relative game, you know, so we you know, we could
4:51
Speaker 3: invent what we think is an absolutely fabulous car and
4:53
Speaker 3: then find out that ten other teams have done an
4:56
Speaker 3: even even better job. So it's very differfficult to kind
5:00
Speaker 3: of predict where you're going to be. But if someone
5:04
Speaker 3: had said in advance, you know that we are, you know,
5:07
Speaker 3: well inside the one O seven, which is kind of
5:12
Speaker 3: the benchmark for for for where a team from a
5:15
Speaker 3: stand and start could could end up reliability is there.
5:22
Speaker 3: You know, we've finished five with five car finishes out
5:28
Speaker 3: of six possible in the three Grand Prix that have
5:31
Speaker 3: been so far, which is pretty good with the back
5:35
Speaker 3: you know, with a backdrop of you, I think you
5:38
Speaker 3: can see from from what's happened with some of the
5:41
Speaker 3: other teams, the regulation sets, super difficult, formula ones, super
5:46
Speaker 3: difficult overlay all of this one on top of the other,
5:50
Speaker 3: and you know, some teams are struggling to start Grand Prix,
5:54
Speaker 3: let alone finish them. And performance wise, you know, we're
5:59
Speaker 3: you know, we're not completely at the back and so
6:03
Speaker 3: from that point of view it's encouraging. But you know,
6:06
Speaker 3: I think I think the key thing for us now is,
6:09
Speaker 3: you know, is how how how we progress as opposed
6:12
Speaker 3: to kind of where we where we started, and that
6:14
Speaker 3: was that was really what we emphasized with with the owners,
6:18
Speaker 3: with you know, with the people who've really invested the
6:22
Speaker 3: time and effort and money and resource in the in
6:24
Speaker 3: the team, is you know, is to really look at
6:27
Speaker 3: how how we go from here. Wherever we start, we
6:31
Speaker 3: want to be moving forward and that's really the focus.
6:34
Speaker 1: Certainly in Australia, we know a little bit about not
6:36
Speaker 1: being able to start ratings. But I wanted to drill
6:38
Speaker 1: into that that difficulty of setting up a brand new
6:42
Speaker 1: Formula One team because they don't come around very often,
6:45
Speaker 1: and it's even rarer that one is built completely from
6:47
Speaker 1: the ground up, as is the case here, never mind
6:50
Speaker 1: getting their formal entry only just over twelve months ago. Now,
6:54
Speaker 1: I think it was as roughly Australian Grand Prix time
6:56
Speaker 1: as the twelve month.
6:57
Speaker 3: Was we had. We had our sort of first birthday
6:59
Speaker 3: in Melbow, so yeah.
7:02
Speaker 1: We did, which is remarkable in itself how quickly it's
7:05
Speaker 1: come together. It's probably impossible to sum it up so simply,
7:09
Speaker 1: and you've touched on a little bit already, but can
7:10
Speaker 1: you give us a sense of what it is like
7:13
Speaker 1: to start a Grand Pro team from stratch? What were
7:15
Speaker 1: the biggest challenges you were facing in the last I
7:18
Speaker 1: guess fourteen or fifteen months now to ensure that this
7:21
Speaker 1: group of people could be ready to go racing.
7:23
Speaker 3: I mean, the biggest challenge is always time. You know,
7:26
Speaker 3: time is your enemy when you're trying to set something
7:30
Speaker 3: like this up, you know, but equally times your friend
7:34
Speaker 3: when you're actually racing, you know, and you want to
7:36
Speaker 3: you're constantly trying to chip away at it. But I
7:39
Speaker 3: think it's quite well known that right from the very
7:42
Speaker 3: start we put countdown clocks on the walls of every
7:46
Speaker 3: office counting down to FP one in Melbourne, you know, so,
7:52
Speaker 3: and that was from before we even had the entry confirmed,
7:56
Speaker 3: and Chris Greeno ahead of it, actually had a small
8:01
Speaker 3: version of the countdown clock in the garage in Melbourne
8:07
Speaker 3: and it ticked the seconds down to the start of
8:10
Speaker 3: FP one, And I thought that was actually quite cool,
8:13
Speaker 3: because you know, we'd spent weeks and months and days
8:16
Speaker 3: look at looking at these sort of countdown clocks and
8:22
Speaker 3: a year a year sounds a long time, but when
8:25
Speaker 3: you are trying to put everything together, you know, we
8:29
Speaker 3: didn't just have to get these cars on track in
8:32
Speaker 3: time for a shakedown. But you've got to build them.
8:34
Speaker 3: And before you build them, you go to manufacture all
8:36
Speaker 3: the bits. And before you manufacture the bits, you got
8:38
Speaker 3: to design them. And before you design them, you've got
8:41
Speaker 3: hired of people to design them, and then you've got
8:43
Speaker 3: to put in in place all of the systems, the
8:46
Speaker 3: CAD systems, the ERP systems that you know, everything had
8:50
Speaker 3: a modern manufacturing company needs. And we're doing that across
8:56
Speaker 3: two continents as well. We're building factories in in Indianapolis,
9:02
Speaker 3: in Indiana, in Charlotte, North Carolina, and then also at
9:07
Speaker 3: Silverston as well. So we've got construction projects on the go.
9:11
Speaker 3: So kind of when you take a step back and
9:13
Speaker 3: look at it, that the biggest challenge is is definitely
9:17
Speaker 3: time the biggest remedy to that, you know, because Formula
9:23
Speaker 3: One is it's the greatest team sport in the world.
9:25
Speaker 3: You know, that's my that's kind of my view, and
9:27
Speaker 3: all team sports are about people, and so you know,
9:30
Speaker 3: the biggest asset on your side is building that team
9:33
Speaker 3: of people. And so what we try to do from
9:36
Speaker 3: the very very start is is get the very best
9:39
Speaker 3: people that we can in very people that we've known
9:43
Speaker 3: in this industry, and and we want the team to
9:46
Speaker 3: be the team that everybody wants to join and nobody
9:49
Speaker 3: wants to leave, and everyone's proud to be part of
9:52
Speaker 3: and you know, and I genuinely believe that that's that's
9:56
Speaker 3: part of the achievement that we've you know, that we've
10:01
Speaker 3: got and so getting them really really you know, really
10:04
Speaker 3: good people on board, and then there's just been a
10:06
Speaker 3: lot of you know, late nights and all nights and
10:10
Speaker 3: early starts and everything else, because as I said before,
10:14
Speaker 3: time was the biggest that's that's the biggest penalty. And
10:17
Speaker 3: what a lot of people don't realize because the the
10:21
Speaker 3: entry process that we went through is everyone knows, was
10:23
Speaker 3: quite lengthy to say the least, and there were all
10:26
Speaker 3: sorts of hurdles. But you don't actually get access to
10:31
Speaker 3: everything that Formula one team needs until you are actually
10:36
Speaker 3: a Formula one team. So you know, you can download
10:42
Speaker 3: the sporting regulations and technical regulations alike from you know,
10:46
Speaker 3: from the internet. Anyone can any fan can can do that,
10:50
Speaker 3: but they're backed up by hundreds and hundreds of pages
10:53
Speaker 3: of technical directives and determination documents and all sorts of stuff,
11:00
Speaker 3: and so we couldn't have access to any of that.
11:02
Speaker 3: We couldn't have access to any of the single at
11:06
Speaker 3: the common source component designed. We couldn't We couldn't get
11:10
Speaker 3: any wind tunnel tiers because you can only get wind
11:13
Speaker 3: tunnel tiers if you're a Formula one team. So alo
11:19
Speaker 3: we did a lot of planning and a lot of preparation.
11:23
Speaker 3: The realities you can't really start in earnest until you've
11:29
Speaker 3: actually got that entry and as you said, you know,
11:30
Speaker 3: we got that pretty late in the in the whole day.
11:34
Speaker 3: So yeah, so that was the biggest challenge for both
11:37
Speaker 3: far time.
11:38
Speaker 2: I'm sure there were some days Graham that those countdown
11:40
Speaker 2: clocks were taking a bit a bit too fast for
11:42
Speaker 2: your life, for your liking, and plenty of other people
11:44
Speaker 2: in the factory. But you mentioned before about hiring the
11:47
Speaker 2: right people, and I wanted to sort of switch gears
11:50
Speaker 2: here and talk about the drivers, because it was really
11:52
Speaker 2: interesting that you chose to go with a lineup of
11:55
Speaker 2: to really experienced drivers with Sergio Perry's and val Thrie Botouse.
11:59
Speaker 2: Obviously we know their success in other teams. I've been
12:02
Speaker 2: around the sport for a long time and that's got
12:04
Speaker 2: huge value for a startup. What you guys are tell
12:07
Speaker 2: us a bit about how they're adapting to the challenge
12:10
Speaker 2: of joining such a new project like this, because we
12:12
Speaker 2: know their history, it was still being built around them
12:15
Speaker 2: as they join. How have they accepted it, embraced that
12:18
Speaker 2: and what benefits have you seen with having such an
12:20
Speaker 2: experienced lineup.
12:22
Speaker 3: I mean, you know, you're quite right, It's it's very
12:25
Speaker 3: clear what was driving the decision making for us in
12:29
Speaker 3: driver selection. I've been through the new team route before,
12:33
Speaker 3: so I had some idea of what characteristics are needed,
12:38
Speaker 3: you know, in every part of the business, but in
12:43
Speaker 3: particular on the on the driver side. And so you know,
12:46
Speaker 3: right from the get go we were looking for experience.
12:50
Speaker 3: And it's not just like number of Grand Prix or anything.
12:53
Speaker 3: If we look at both Ailtree Unchecker, they've been at
12:56
Speaker 3: multiple teams as well, not just one or two, but
13:03
Speaker 3: they've had experience across the board. So so that kind
13:07
Speaker 3: of reassured me that they know what it's like to
13:09
Speaker 3: be in a small team, they know what it's like
13:10
Speaker 3: to be in a big team. They won't know what
13:13
Speaker 3: it's like to be in what was effectively a startup environment.
13:17
Speaker 3: But they had the kind of the two attributes that
13:20
Speaker 3: are needed there. One is one is experience, but secondly,
13:26
Speaker 3: they both demonstrated desire. This is a tough game, it's
13:32
Speaker 3: really hard, and you know, we want people who want
13:36
Speaker 3: to be here. But both drivers had experienced a scenario
13:41
Speaker 3: where they stepped out of Formula one for a while
13:44
Speaker 3: and then go You go through a load of emotions
13:46
Speaker 3: when that happens, and and it reinforces I think, you
13:49
Speaker 3: know it rekindles that desire and it reminds you about what,
13:54
Speaker 3: you know, why you want to be in Formula one.
13:56
Speaker 3: And so the reaction of both drivers where when I
14:01
Speaker 3: told them that we wanted to sign them for me,
14:04
Speaker 3: was really quite important. And and in both cases the
14:07
Speaker 3: reaction was kind of the same reaction as if you know,
14:10
Speaker 3: when you tell the guy n F two that they're
14:14
Speaker 3: going to get a drive. It was like excitement, enthusiasm, commitment,
14:21
Speaker 3: and that you know, once I saw that, I knew
14:25
Speaker 3: we were going to be in a good place with
14:27
Speaker 3: with with both drivers. If we'd seen you know, a
14:30
Speaker 3: bit of indifference and okay, you know, I'm here to
14:34
Speaker 3: get paid and do a few more laps or whatever,
14:36
Speaker 3: then you know, then we'd be really worried. But it
14:40
Speaker 3: was it was as far from that as you can
14:42
Speaker 3: as you can get. And so and in terms of adaptation, uh,
14:48
Speaker 3: you know, the you don't forget how to drive at
14:52
Speaker 3: the level that they that they drive at. And you know,
14:55
Speaker 3: right from shakedown onwards, we had you know, super accurate
14:59
Speaker 3: fee back focus on all of the right things. They're
15:04
Speaker 3: saying all the right things to the engineers. You know,
15:06
Speaker 3: in certain areas of our engineering team we've got, you know,
15:09
Speaker 3: we've got a mix of experience, but we've also got
15:12
Speaker 3: a lot of quite young people as well. And the
15:16
Speaker 3: drivers have really played their part in gelling gelling that
15:20
Speaker 3: engineering team together and so you know, I couldn't ask
15:23
Speaker 3: for any more from you know, from from both of them.
15:27
Speaker 3: And actually that extends as well into the reserve driver
15:31
Speaker 3: with with Joe Guan, you again very experienced, but he
15:34
Speaker 3: didn't have that experience of multiple teams that the other
15:38
Speaker 3: that the race drivers have got. And then obviously Colton
15:41
Speaker 3: Herd her in the test driver role as well. And
15:44
Speaker 3: then you know, we have a roster of sim drivers
15:46
Speaker 3: who've all played their part as well. So yeah, I
15:50
Speaker 3: just I'm super happy with with the drivers that we've
15:53
Speaker 3: got on board in the team.
15:55
Speaker 1: I want to go to Colton Herder because it's a name,
15:57
Speaker 1: if one fans will become familiar with over the last
15:59
Speaker 1: couple of years, whether they're IndyCar fans as well, or
16:02
Speaker 1: they've just enjoyed a bit of driver market speculation as
16:05
Speaker 1: he's been involved in for quite a few seasons now.
16:08
Speaker 1: He's left the US to race in Formula two this
16:11
Speaker 1: year is a stepping stone to Formula one is the
16:13
Speaker 1: test drive. As you said, that looks like a real
16:15
Speaker 1: commitment and a slightly unusual commitment from what we're used
16:19
Speaker 1: to score points in Australia first round out this season.
16:23
Speaker 1: How's that transition been going for him back into the
16:26
Speaker 1: European racing scene and what's he bringing to the team
16:29
Speaker 1: as well?
16:30
Speaker 3: I think it's great what he's doing. It kind of
16:34
Speaker 3: you know, maybe it's because I'm so old that, you know,
16:39
Speaker 3: hark back to the good old days, whether they whether
16:41
Speaker 3: they existed or not. But I just love the fact that,
16:45
Speaker 3: for me, he's taking a decision that a proper racing
16:48
Speaker 3: driver would take. You know, there was when he announced
16:52
Speaker 3: the decision, there were a few commentators who kind of said, well,
16:55
Speaker 3: you know, make Risky's image or this out neither, And
16:58
Speaker 3: I'm like, you know, if you bothered about just the image,
17:04
Speaker 3: you know, just just spend your whole time on social
17:07
Speaker 3: media and pictures, pictures of the gym or something like that,
17:11
Speaker 3: and and and memes or whatever they are. But if
17:16
Speaker 3: you're a proper race and drive, and I mean a
17:18
Speaker 3: proper racing driver, then you know, this is this is
17:22
Speaker 3: the move that you would take. You would you know,
17:26
Speaker 3: he wants he wants to go into Formula one, and
17:28
Speaker 3: if you want to be in Formula one, it makes
17:30
Speaker 3: sense to look at that well trodden path, and it's
17:34
Speaker 3: well trodden for a reason. You know, the tires are
17:37
Speaker 3: quite unique. The circuits are not ones that you get
17:40
Speaker 3: a chance to drive on at Miami Monaco. You know,
17:46
Speaker 3: these these are Melbourne. Uh and and also just getting
17:53
Speaker 3: used to you know that the the environment and the
17:56
Speaker 3: way things work and it's it is very very different
17:58
Speaker 3: from from IndyCar and and everything around it as well.
18:05
Speaker 3: So you know, I take my hat off to him
18:07
Speaker 3: if if you want to do F one, you know,
18:10
Speaker 3: I think he's doing exactly what what a proper racing
18:14
Speaker 3: driver would do. And you know, in our class him
18:16
Speaker 3: is a proper racing driver. He's quick and and again
18:19
Speaker 3: his attitude is not very very very first thing he
18:23
Speaker 3: said to me when we discussed the F two thing
18:26
Speaker 3: is it was very clear that he knew that that
18:30
Speaker 3: championship attracts very very fast drivers. You don't just go
18:33
Speaker 3: and then blow everyone away. But that's not that's not
18:37
Speaker 3: the objective. The objective is, you know, understand the circuits,
18:40
Speaker 3: learn the tires, you know, understand the the environment, you know,
18:44
Speaker 3: how does the media work all that kind of all
18:47
Speaker 3: that kind of stuff. So yeah, and he's a great
18:51
Speaker 3: guy as well. You know, really it's really good to
18:54
Speaker 3: have him on the team.
18:55
Speaker 2: That's a willingness to be comfortable with being uncomfortable. That's
18:59
Speaker 2: not a decision that everyone makes imotorsport in twenty twenty six?
19:01
Speaker 2: Is that? So?
19:02
Speaker 3: I do?
19:02
Speaker 2: I know what you're saying about maybe being a bit
19:04
Speaker 2: old school with that, but Graham, I'm conscious of your time,
19:06
Speaker 2: but I did want to ask you what's the response
19:09
Speaker 2: been like in the US to Cadillac's arrival. It's obviously
19:12
Speaker 2: such a big name. We know, we know how big
19:15
Speaker 2: of an automotive name this is. Is it too early
19:18
Speaker 2: to tell you, like, is Miami going to be the
19:20
Speaker 2: real tell for you in terms of what the Cadillac
19:22
Speaker 2: name means to be in Formula one? Or have you
19:24
Speaker 2: already started to see some sort of ground swell within
19:28
Speaker 2: the US having this name on the grid and what
19:30
Speaker 2: it means to compete in Formula one?
19:32
Speaker 3: We have and you know, I get something happened last
19:37
Speaker 3: year which really kind of worked me up to it
19:39
Speaker 3: a little bit. We're in Austin, you know, I've been
19:42
Speaker 3: going to Grand Prix in various worlds for quite some
19:46
Speaker 3: time now, and most of the time you just you know,
19:50
Speaker 3: you slip in the paddockt slip out, nobody notices or whatever.
19:53
Speaker 3: But Austin last year I got stopped constantly on the
20:00
Speaker 3: street by Formula one fans, American Formula one fans who
20:08
Speaker 3: were very very proud to say that they could support
20:12
Speaker 3: Cadillac and who are looking forward to it. And you know,
20:17
Speaker 3: I won't insult or embarrass anyone by trying to do
20:20
Speaker 3: the accent which would which which would kind of recreate
20:24
Speaker 3: the moment much much better. But as you can tell,
20:28
Speaker 3: I'm you know, I'm not American. That doesn't really matter.
20:32
Speaker 3: What the fans are interested in is you know, this
20:34
Speaker 3: this fantastic brand which is not only got a very
20:39
Speaker 3: long history of innovation and the like, but also racing.
20:43
Speaker 3: You know, real race fans understand that GM has been
20:48
Speaker 3: involved in racing for you know, for a long time
20:51
Speaker 3: and a lot of different series, and they're very loyal
20:53
Speaker 3: to the series. Is that they go into and mix
20:56
Speaker 3: that with the Cadillac brand and then and then also
20:58
Speaker 3: the t w G element be because because our other
21:02
Speaker 3: part of ownership t w G. They own or have
21:06
Speaker 3: heavy investment in a whole bunch of other team sports,
21:11
Speaker 3: you know, so like the LA Lakers and the Dodgers
21:15
Speaker 3: and the like, and so there's just this whole swathe
21:19
Speaker 3: of fans who who were really excited.
21:24
Speaker 2: You know.
21:24
Speaker 3: That was the thing that came across tom Me. I
21:26
Speaker 3: just met a lot of excited F one fans or
21:30
Speaker 3: people who were going to be F one fans because
21:33
Speaker 3: you know, they feel that they had a brand that
21:36
Speaker 3: they can they can identify with and support. And that
21:40
Speaker 3: was a bit of a wake up moment for me
21:42
Speaker 3: because I guess, you know, we've just been head down
21:44
Speaker 3: looking at clocks on the wall, thinking, right, we've got
21:47
Speaker 3: to build some F one cars and hire a few
21:49
Speaker 3: hundred people and well a thousand people, and build some
21:52
Speaker 3: factories and the like. So you know, it was it
21:55
Speaker 3: was brilliant to have that feedback, and I think in Miami,
21:58
Speaker 3: I generally think in Miami, will you know, we'll see
22:01
Speaker 3: more of that.
22:01
Speaker 1: And finally, before we let you go, we've got nineteen
22:04
Speaker 1: more rounds to go this season. It's a lot, isn't it.
22:07
Speaker 1: Progress is the name of the game. As you've said,
22:09
Speaker 1: the Cadillac this year. But what are the things you
22:11
Speaker 1: want to see achieved this year for the team to
22:14
Speaker 1: feel like you've got the most of it? And there's
22:15
Speaker 1: a second part of this question, what are you going
22:18
Speaker 1: to do with all of the clocks you'd accumulated over
22:20
Speaker 1: the last twenty four months now they're no longer counting
22:22
Speaker 1: down to Melbourne.
22:24
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a very good question. You know, we said
22:29
Speaker 3: quite early, you know, we tried not to set targets
22:33
Speaker 3: in terms of, you know, championship positions or anything, because,
22:36
Speaker 3: as I said before, we don't know what the other
22:39
Speaker 3: teams are going to be like, where they're going to
22:41
Speaker 3: be performing. But what we did say was that we
22:45
Speaker 3: have huge respect for the other teams. You know, I've
22:47
Speaker 3: worked with many of them. I've certainly worked with a
22:49
Speaker 3: lot of people in them in a massive respect for
22:52
Speaker 3: those people. And our first target was to get in
22:55
Speaker 3: the respect of the of our competitors, and I genuinely
22:59
Speaker 3: think we've done that already with the way that we've
23:01
Speaker 3: turned up and the performance of the car and the
23:05
Speaker 3: attitude to the sporting side and everything else. So you know,
23:10
Speaker 3: I think to some extent, you know, i'd like to
23:13
Speaker 3: think that that we've either achieved or well on our
23:17
Speaker 3: way to achieving that. And then a little bit like
23:20
Speaker 3: I said earlier, I think it's important that we demonstrate
23:23
Speaker 3: forward momentum. It is a difficult game. Nobody stands still.
23:28
Speaker 3: In Formula one, we have a whole bunch of things
23:33
Speaker 3: that work against a new team. You know, both in
23:38
Speaker 3: the regulations are not really written for new teams. You know,
23:41
Speaker 3: you have things like testing of previous cars, which is
23:44
Speaker 3: very very useful for a team where we don't have
23:46
Speaker 3: a previous car, you know, so there's there's there's all
23:49
Speaker 3: sorts of elements like that. But yeah, you know, we
23:52
Speaker 3: just want to demonstrate progress going forward. And in terms
23:56
Speaker 3: of the clocks, thankfully most of them, most of them
24:01
Speaker 3: were embedded in TV screens which which now show you know,
24:06
Speaker 3: some other deadline. We just have deadlines. It is strewn
24:09
Speaker 3: around everywhere, so they're fully repurposed and reused, so nothing's
24:16
Speaker 3: gone to waste in terms of the In terms of
24:20
Speaker 3: the deadline, the deadline devices.
24:25
Speaker 1: Very very fore voting name indeed, Graham, thanks so much
24:29
Speaker 1: for joining us in the podcast. Hope you enjoyed Miami,
24:31
Speaker 1: I'm sure you will, and good luck for the rest
24:33
Speaker 1: of this first season of Cadillac.
24:36
Speaker 3: Michael and Matt, It's my pleasure. Has been great to
24:38
Speaker 3: talk with you, and you know we'd love to keep
24:41
Speaker 3: you updated on the story.
24:43
Speaker 1: Great to catch up with Graham Loud and a little
24:46
Speaker 1: bit earlier on as he. I don't know if enjoys
24:48
Speaker 1: is exactly the right word, but experiences this long break
24:51
Speaker 1: before the first of three Home grownd Prix in fact four,
24:54
Speaker 1: if you Counselston, I suppose four Cadillac Home racers coming
24:58
Speaker 1: up in their future. Let's go to Move of the Week,
25:02
Speaker 1: brought to you by Shannon's and I think there can
25:04
Speaker 1: really be only one move. And there's been some racing
25:06
Speaker 1: going on, not FORMUD one or Murder GPS recently, but
25:09
Speaker 1: of course supercars in New Zealand. But I think in
25:11
Speaker 1: the spirit of this segment in our hands, which it
25:14
Speaker 1: tends to be a bit of a left field move,
25:17
Speaker 1: I think I'm going to pick and I'm going to
25:18
Speaker 1: enforce your pick as well on this one. Jianpiero Lambiaze
25:21
Speaker 1: to McLaren. He is Maxwistappen's race engineer. Interesting times in
25:25
Speaker 1: Formula one as well, that race engineers are enjoying that
25:29
Speaker 1: kind of notoriety where you can drop that name and
25:31
Speaker 1: people realize it is significant. Let's just run through a
25:34
Speaker 1: couple of the facts first before we get into what
25:36
Speaker 1: this might mean for both teams and for maxwith Stappen
25:39
Speaker 1: as well. He's contracted to Red Bull Racing till the
25:42
Speaker 1: end of next season, but McLaren says you'll start work
25:45
Speaker 1: as it's chief racing officer no later than the start
25:48
Speaker 1: of twenty twenty eight, which surely suggests there's going to
25:50
Speaker 1: be some kind of negotiating going on, given that even
25:53
Speaker 1: contracted to the end of next year, that would usually
25:56
Speaker 1: entail quite a bit of gardening. Ly for a person
25:58
Speaker 1: as senior as here, that of course means that Red
26:01
Speaker 1: Bull Racing probably won't make him or won't be able
26:04
Speaker 1: to make him see out that contract as it says
26:06
Speaker 1: that it will. Perhaps that means as well, he'll be
26:09
Speaker 1: phasing himself out, if you like, over perhaps the rest
26:12
Speaker 1: of the year early next year. We don't know. That's
26:14
Speaker 1: one of the timelines to be talked about between those
26:17
Speaker 1: two teams. We'll get to the McLaren part of the
26:20
Speaker 1: story in a moment, but let's go to Red Bull first.
26:23
Speaker 1: This is another senior figure from the team that's left
26:26
Speaker 1: the squad, adding to a quite a long list now
26:27
Speaker 1: over the last couple of years. It wasn't a foundation member,
26:30
Speaker 1: but he has been there for more than ten years.
26:33
Speaker 1: This feels like and it's something we've definitely said before
26:35
Speaker 1: on this podcast, but this is just another nail in
26:38
Speaker 1: that coffin. Perhaps coffin not so advisable here, but it
26:40
Speaker 1: feels like the old or original Red Bull doesn't really
26:44
Speaker 1: exist in the way we know it anymore. This feels
26:46
Speaker 1: very much like part of that turning of the page
26:49
Speaker 1: of this team.
26:50
Speaker 2: Yeah, and it's been this steady exodus. I guess you
26:53
Speaker 2: would describe it from Red Bull Racing as we knew it.
26:55
Speaker 2: I mean, the name is the same and the colors
26:57
Speaker 2: are the same. There's not much else that is now
27:00
Speaker 2: when you look at GP leaving and you know wherever
27:02
Speaker 2: Max sits at this point, there's been so much change,
27:05
Speaker 2: and we're already talking about people like Jonathan Wheatley moving
27:08
Speaker 2: on to their next job after they've already left forep.
27:10
Speaker 2: This is how long this has been going for. But
27:12
Speaker 2: it's really interesting to me in that well, to go
27:16
Speaker 2: back to something you said earlier, the dates that were
27:18
Speaker 2: given when the two teams made their announcements yesterday. I
27:21
Speaker 2: always think that when you've got a period of it's
27:24
Speaker 2: so long for these two parties to continue working together
27:26
Speaker 2: in this relationship as is, this is just the starting
27:29
Speaker 2: point of negotiations, right, So I'll be shocked if it
27:32
Speaker 2: lasts this long before they do part ways. On a
27:35
Speaker 2: practical point of view, But if you're wondering about Max
27:39
Speaker 2: for Stappin's future, I guess you could spin this one
27:41
Speaker 2: of two ways. Does Lambiassi already know that Vastapan is
27:45
Speaker 2: out and therefore he's sort of getting out before the
27:48
Speaker 2: Stappan is actually going to leave? But to my mind,
27:51
Speaker 2: maybe the truism in this is this is certainly not
27:54
Speaker 2: going to be something that extends Verstappan's tenure, is it.
27:57
Speaker 2: I mean, it's only going to be the saber or
27:59
Speaker 2: it's going to be less. You would imagine these two
28:02
Speaker 2: have a relationship that goes back. So he was Danny
28:04
Speaker 2: Kivyat's engineer when they did the swapover in twenty sixteen.
28:07
Speaker 2: So the only race engineer Max for Stappan has had
28:10
Speaker 2: his in his entire time at Red Bull Racing is Lambiasse,
28:13
Speaker 2: so they have this really close relationship. Cast your mind
28:17
Speaker 2: back to last year. Do you remember when Max just
28:19
Speaker 2: about won the title last year and he made some
28:22
Speaker 2: comment he was quite emotional actually about the relationship with
28:24
Speaker 2: the two of them, and there'd been some sort of
28:26
Speaker 2: suggestion that Lambiassi had had some personal stuff going on
28:30
Speaker 2: away from the track that have been difficult. This is
28:32
Speaker 2: not your classic driver engineer relationship, and we do see
28:36
Speaker 2: this with these really long standing partnerships. You cast your
28:39
Speaker 2: mind back to I don't like to use the word
28:41
Speaker 2: iconic and get straight around too much these days, but
28:43
Speaker 2: there are these relationships. You go back to gim Rockolan
28:46
Speaker 2: and Sebastian Vestal, you look at Bono with Lewis Hamilton.
28:49
Speaker 2: There are these relationships that endure over time, and you
28:53
Speaker 2: can't help but think that, you know, the tea leaves
28:56
Speaker 2: have suggested that Max Forstappa may be in Formula One
28:59
Speaker 2: for a good time rather than a long time. And
29:02
Speaker 2: the times aren't particularly good right now. And we were
29:06
Speaker 2: having I'll let the listeners in on this one. It's
29:08
Speaker 2: a bit of an offair conversation we had the other day.
29:10
Speaker 2: I think we've sort of found out For my mind,
29:13
Speaker 2: I reckon Max Forstappa might be Formula one's Casey Stainer
29:17
Speaker 2: in that he could be someone who maybe leaves at
29:19
Speaker 2: the peak or close to his powers in his late
29:22
Speaker 2: twenties because he has achieved all he wants to achieve.
29:26
Speaker 2: To my mind, I do wonder if this lambiasse departure
29:29
Speaker 2: is all part of a wider plan with Max and
29:32
Speaker 2: that he may not be around for a super long time.
29:35
Speaker 2: We know how to satisfied he is with this year's rules.
29:37
Speaker 2: He's not the only one, but he's certainly been the
29:38
Speaker 2: one that's the most outspoken about that. It's just another
29:42
Speaker 2: sign to me that perhaps this is coming to an end,
29:44
Speaker 2: maybe a little bit sooner than we thought.
29:46
Speaker 1: Yeah, if you were Max for Stappen and you were
29:48
Speaker 1: writing your pros and cons columns on whether or not
29:51
Speaker 1: disdained Formula one, oh yeah, certainly GP's departure is in
29:54
Speaker 1: the cons column, to leave the sport, because it's just
29:57
Speaker 1: one other element. Because he talks he has this year.
30:00
Speaker 1: In fact, he said one of the things that's keeping
30:02
Speaker 1: him motivated is his enjoyment working with the team. Now
30:05
Speaker 1: the team is a lot more people than just his
30:06
Speaker 1: race engineer, but it is the person he works most
30:09
Speaker 1: closely with. So if you take that card away, as
30:12
Speaker 1: will presumably be done, I would guess I mean, I'd
30:15
Speaker 1: be surprised if he was still working there by passed
30:18
Speaker 1: the end of this year. GP. He's joining McLaren. It's
30:20
Speaker 1: such a senior role, it's going to be the end
30:22
Speaker 1: of this year. You would have thought that's the logical
30:25
Speaker 1: jumping off point for Max with staff, and it seems
30:28
Speaker 1: it's not only that it's just too convenient. It just
30:30
Speaker 1: seems too likely, doesn't it. I mean to go back
30:33
Speaker 1: to your point that he's worked together with him so long.
30:34
Speaker 1: It's not even to my mind just that they've been
30:36
Speaker 1: together so long. But Max was at when he joined
30:40
Speaker 1: Red Bull Racing. This is almost you know, he wouldn't
30:42
Speaker 1: want to call it a father son relationship, obviously. I
30:45
Speaker 1: don't actually know how old GP is off the top
30:46
Speaker 1: of my head, but it's I think, when you're doing
30:49
Speaker 1: it from that young, it's a little bit more than
30:51
Speaker 1: just a collegial relationship. It's a really personal one. And
30:55
Speaker 1: so for him to move on for Max have a
30:57
Speaker 1: different race engine he has worked with other ones, I
31:00
Speaker 1: think that just feels like to me a massive reason
31:02
Speaker 1: for him to if he's already swaying towards quitting the
31:05
Speaker 1: sport at the end of the year, where a sabbatical
31:06
Speaker 1: or long term this seems like a pretty motivating factor
31:10
Speaker 1: in that column, which is also bad us for Red
31:12
Speaker 1: Bull Racing obviously because of the team that would like
31:14
Speaker 1: to keep Max, quite apart from the experience that loses
31:17
Speaker 1: with losing GP. If this is accelerating that generational shift,
31:22
Speaker 1: if you like, by moving not only a very experienced
31:24
Speaker 1: member of the team personnel, engineering, personnel out, but also
31:27
Speaker 1: from the driver lineup, then next year is suddenly going
31:30
Speaker 1: to look very different, and it looked different again depending
31:33
Speaker 1: on where this team ends up this season. Right like,
31:34
Speaker 1: we're talking only three rounds into the campaign. Two of
31:37
Speaker 1: those rounds the team was thoroughly midfield. If it's still
31:41
Speaker 1: there at the end of the year, then I think
31:43
Speaker 1: the way we think about Red Bull Racing will be
31:45
Speaker 1: very different ahead of twenty twenty seven. There is a
31:48
Speaker 1: McLaren perspective of this, of course as well. This is
31:50
Speaker 1: I thought it was actually interesting talking about wording in
31:52
Speaker 1: press release that McLaren made a mention of it. You know,
31:55
Speaker 1: it's how good is it. McLaren is such an attractive
31:58
Speaker 1: place to work. We get all this starf The only
32:00
Speaker 1: staff had mentioned was staffed. It pinched from rental racing. Oh,
32:04
Speaker 1: I thought was very it was very deliberate. I think
32:07
Speaker 1: that's probably political about a very deliberate thing to have said.
32:11
Speaker 1: So it's a good point, I guess. I mean we
32:12
Speaker 1: shouldn't forget that. I mean Zach bound had his beef
32:14
Speaker 1: with Christian Hornway. Guess maybe not the Red Bull organization,
32:17
Speaker 1: but clearly there's still a little bit of competition between
32:20
Speaker 1: them off the track as much as it has on it.
32:23
Speaker 1: The reports and this was broken we probably should acknowledge
32:27
Speaker 1: by various outlets in the Dutch media to Limburger and
32:30
Speaker 1: also the Telegraph in the Netherlands. The ever thought I'd
32:32
Speaker 1: have to say them out loud that there you are.
32:34
Speaker 1: Their reporting suggested somewhat contrary, I suppose to what's come
32:39
Speaker 1: out since officially, that this wasn't just McLaren attracting engineering
32:43
Speaker 1: talent to the team, but also something of a bit
32:47
Speaker 1: of an insurance policy, if we can describe it like that,
32:50
Speaker 1: against the prospect of Andrea Stella, the team principal, leaving McLaren.
32:54
Speaker 1: According to the Telegraph, he signed a pre contract with
32:56
Speaker 1: Ferrari to become presumably their team principal if Fredrick Vasser
33:01
Speaker 1: does not work out over the next couple of years.
33:03
Speaker 1: That I thought was extraordinary obviously wasn't in the official announcement,
33:06
Speaker 1: which says that GP will be supporting Andrea Stella in
33:10
Speaker 1: the team principal role. But there is an interesting additional
33:13
Speaker 1: dimension through the seniority of GP at McLaren in this.
33:17
Speaker 2: Well, and the thing we talked about earlier. This is
33:19
Speaker 2: by Formula one terms. This is so far into the future.
33:22
Speaker 2: We've got one and nine tenths of a season still
33:25
Speaker 2: to play out, and so you can imagine this new
33:27
Speaker 2: rule set was going to be the big salvation for Ferrari,
33:30
Speaker 2: Like this is our clean sheet of paper. Here we go.
33:31
Speaker 2: It's going to be all great again. So much could
33:34
Speaker 2: play out. I mean, there's about forty nine thousand races
33:36
Speaker 2: between now the end of twenty twenty seven, give or
33:39
Speaker 2: take what or two. But you look at where Ferrari
33:43
Speaker 2: might be at the end of twenty twenty seven, let
33:45
Speaker 2: alone red Bull and McLaren we've talked about earlier in
33:47
Speaker 2: this conversation so if that stellar pre contract thing is
33:51
Speaker 2: to be believed, I mean that would be entirely sensible
33:54
Speaker 2: for someone like Ferrari, which I perhaps have the successor
33:56
Speaker 2: lined up just in case you happen to need one.
33:58
Speaker 2: But in terms of how on McLaren ce lambiase in
34:02
Speaker 2: that he will either work shoulder to shoulder with Andrea
34:05
Speaker 2: Stella or could possibly take over the entire thing by himself,
34:08
Speaker 2: I think that's really interesting as well, and he would.
34:10
Speaker 2: So they've what they've had. They've got Will Courtney from
34:13
Speaker 2: Red Bull, They've got Rob Marshall, They've got a whole
34:15
Speaker 2: bunch of people in there that they've sort of rated
34:17
Speaker 2: Red Bull from in the past couple of years. And
34:20
Speaker 2: it does show you that perhaps these are two teams
34:22
Speaker 2: going in very very different directions. Because this is, you know,
34:25
Speaker 2: the new McLaren. We're still getting used to McLaren being
34:28
Speaker 2: the benchmark as the constructors champion and the raiding drivers champion.
34:31
Speaker 2: These two teams feel like there are passing the passing
34:35
Speaker 2: on Formula ones escalators right now, aren't they as they
34:37
Speaker 2: wave to each other on the way through. Because the
34:39
Speaker 2: Red Bull thing at the moment, you'd like to think
34:42
Speaker 2: that it will get better, but it's coming from a
34:44
Speaker 2: pretty low base right now, and even with McLaren not
34:47
Speaker 2: being as sharp as they have been for the past
34:48
Speaker 2: couple of seasons early in this one, they're still at
34:52
Speaker 2: worst the third best team in Formula One and probably
34:54
Speaker 2: the second best team. So it is really interesting. But
34:57
Speaker 2: I just can't look away from the fact that all
35:01
Speaker 2: of these ducks in a row now and the verstapp
35:03
Speaker 2: in future is such a talking point. Now we know
35:06
Speaker 2: that there's a gap between now and the next race
35:08
Speaker 2: in Miami, which will possibly kick the story along a
35:11
Speaker 2: little bit further. But the first chance the world's media
35:14
Speaker 2: gets a chance to talk to a Stappan in Miami,
35:16
Speaker 2: I think will be super, super interesting because he's dissatisfied
35:20
Speaker 2: on a good day at the moment. You do wonder
35:22
Speaker 2: how that's going to play out once we get to
35:23
Speaker 2: round four.
35:24
Speaker 1: Yeah, he's used to a big press conference, is Max
35:26
Speaker 1: with Staffan is one of the bigger ones. I imagine. This
35:29
Speaker 1: does feel like the most forward planning any team almost
35:33
Speaker 1: ever has undertaken in Formula One, whether or not if
35:36
Speaker 1: we're talking about I mean to begin with, we are
35:38
Speaker 1: talking about a multi year hiring process, which is not
35:41
Speaker 1: super unusual in F one, but I guess when it's
35:43
Speaker 1: this high profile, you've got to make a public But
35:45
Speaker 1: then the prospect that it might be a multi year
35:47
Speaker 1: process to replace a team principal who's just one two
35:50
Speaker 1: constructors title because he might be in some future year
35:53
Speaker 1: replacing a Ferrari principle who may or may not have
35:56
Speaker 1: won some titles is a really remarkable long term game
35:59
Speaker 1: for these teams that sometimes, I mean clearly weren't even
36:02
Speaker 1: prepared for these rules, which were published about a year ago.
36:05
Speaker 1: So I think that in itself is just very interesting,
36:07
Speaker 1: and you've got to imagine how much can change in
36:09
Speaker 1: that time as you've touched on. And also I wonder
36:11
Speaker 1: if you remember this anecdote. I don't have enough information
36:14
Speaker 1: probably to prompt your memory, but the Ferrari for whatever positions,
36:18
Speaker 1: including drivers, tends to have several people on pre contract
36:22
Speaker 1: at any one time, which ultimately are worthless because they're
36:25
Speaker 1: non binding correct, So it may well be true and
36:28
Speaker 1: it may well mean nothing as well. So there's sort
36:31
Speaker 1: of an interesting duality with that one.
36:33
Speaker 2: And doesn't that feel like something of a bygone era too?
36:35
Speaker 2: You have the replacement for the replacement already signed with
36:39
Speaker 2: a document that two people might have seen in Inzo
36:41
Speaker 2: Ferrari's top drawer or something. It doesn't feel a bit
36:44
Speaker 2: that sort of era of Formula One, doesn't it. But
36:46
Speaker 2: I guess one thing has told us with Ferrari that
36:49
Speaker 2: the success does it follow. But the names at the
36:51
Speaker 2: top of the top of the organizational hierarchy sheet tend
36:54
Speaker 2: to change a fair bit, so perhaps it's just part
36:56
Speaker 2: of that.
36:56
Speaker 1: Yes, as you say, plenty more to come, I imagine
36:59
Speaker 1: the next couple of weeks and then absolutely in Miami
37:02
Speaker 1: when Formula one convenes. But that's all the time we
37:04
Speaker 1: have for pit Talk this week. You can subscribe to
37:07
Speaker 1: pit talk where if you get your favorite podcasts, and
37:09
Speaker 1: you can leave us a rating and a review as well,
37:11
Speaker 1: and you can keep up to date with all the
37:12
Speaker 1: latest F one, Moto GP and supercars news at foxsports
37:16
Speaker 1: dot com dot are you from Matt Clayton and me
37:18
Speaker 1: Michael Lamonado. Thanks very much for your company. We'll catch
37:21
Speaker 1: you next time.