Latest / Pittsburgh Sports Memories / Athletes Who Killed Pittsburgh

Transcript

Athletes Who Killed Pittsburgh · Pittsburgh Sports Memories

0:00
SPEAKER_04: Hello and welcome to another killer episode of the Pittsburgh Sports Memories podcast.
0:06
SPEAKER_04: I'm your co-host, Steve Werton.
0:08
SPEAKER_04: As usual, I'm joined by I'm Tim Hannon.
0:11
SPEAKER_04: Hey Tim, do you feel like you're, you know, these you ever had like a traumatic experience?
0:18
SPEAKER_01: Uh when it comes to Pittsburgh sports, I've had lots of them.
0:21
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah.
0:22
SPEAKER_04: Can you show me on the football where you know these players have hurt you?
0:26
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
0:42
SPEAKER_04: So yeah, um today, you know, you we get those like highs of a championship and you know, all the good stuff that comes with that, like Tim was talking about in one of our uh current events podcasts where the when the kicker from the Ravens missed the kick and people were jumping up and down and the whole city's in a great mood.
1:00
SPEAKER_04: And then you get the uh the Houston Tech in Texans game from uh a couple weeks ago, and boy, the city really wanted to kill somebody.
1:08
SPEAKER_04: And uh apparently Mike Tomlin sensed that and ran for the hills.
1:12
SPEAKER_04: Um uh yeah, so those lows, those lows can be just bad and very painful, and there's been many painful losses.
1:20
SPEAKER_04: So today we're gonna relive those painful.
1:22
SPEAKER_04: We're gonna have a nice little group therapy session here.
1:25
SPEAKER_04: It's fun to remember these guys, you know.
1:27
SPEAKER_04: You can't always just you know live on the uh good times, you gotta remember the lows sometimes.
1:31
SPEAKER_04: And it can be therapeutic and cathartic and all those other words that I've looked up on my thesaurus before we started.
1:38
SPEAKER_04: But um are are are you ready, Tim?
1:41
SPEAKER_04: Are you are you ready to go through this?
1:42
SPEAKER_04: Are you have you emotionally prepared yourself?
1:45
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, well, and and I think some of these guys, because I've I've I've seen your list, you know, some of these guys you just kind of hold your head down, you're like, oh my gosh, that guy just killed us.
1:56
SPEAKER_01: But there's other guys on here where I just looking now that some time has passed, you kind of have some respect for too.
2:03
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
2:04
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
2:05
SPEAKER_04: All right.
2:05
SPEAKER_04: Uh starting off, I'm gonna start with a category called the visional foes.
2:09
SPEAKER_04: And um, I mean, this one on a scale of like, you know, meh to oh my gosh, I'm in the shower crying, is probably you know, pretty close to in the shower crying kind of, you know, than just I'm sad for a day or two.
2:24
SPEAKER_04: Um Steve McNair.
2:27
SPEAKER_04: Um who was Steve McNair?
2:29
SPEAKER_04: Tim, he was a Pro Bowl QB for the Tennessee slash Houston slash Oilers slash Titans.
2:37
SPEAKER_04: That was a very confusing era of uh Tennessee football there, Tennessee slash Texas football.
2:45
SPEAKER_04: I mean, who knew Tennessee was such an oil-producing state?
2:51
SPEAKER_01: Just like the uh the lakes in Los Angeles.
2:55
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah.
2:57
SPEAKER_04: Um, so how did he how did he hurt us?
3:00
SPEAKER_04: Uh he had an 11-5 record against the Steelers overall.
3:03
SPEAKER_04: He had 21 touchdowns and 14 interceptions.
3:06
SPEAKER_04: Uh, and this is just against us.
3:09
SPEAKER_04: So, and you gotta remember early in his career he had some bad games.
3:13
SPEAKER_04: He didn't really become that, you know, really thorn in the Steelers' side and probably till like what 98, 99.
3:21
SPEAKER_04: And um, 21 touchdowns, 14 interceptions, 2,912 yards.
3:27
SPEAKER_04: Um he his probably his biggest moment, I mean, there's kind of like two.
3:32
SPEAKER_04: There, there's one where it's like definitely the most important was he had a 2002 divisional game.
3:38
SPEAKER_04: He had 338 yards, two touchdowns, a rushing TD, but he did throw two interceptions.
3:45
SPEAKER_04: Um, he's definitely uh that game is definitely more famous for the um Joe Nedney kick.
3:51
SPEAKER_04: That I think we covered this in the um, what's it called, the Tommy Maddox season.
3:56
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
3:57
SPEAKER_04: Um then, of course, there's the legendary game, Tim.
4:01
SPEAKER_04: And uh September 24th, 2000, um, this the Titans come to Three River Stadium, and uh the the Neil O'Donnell, uh the former Steeler quarterback, actually starts this game, and um the Titans actually kind of dominated the game, and they were up three or four points late in the game.
4:25
SPEAKER_04: The Titans were, and then the Steelers put together a drive, and they s they take the lead with nine minutes left of the game on a Jerome Bettis touchdown.
4:34
SPEAKER_04: So there's like two or three minutes left, and McNair and McNair's on the bench because the previous week, I think actually the week before that he got hit in the sternum and he actually had been hurt and he hadn't practiced for like either a week or two.
4:50
SPEAKER_04: And Neil O'Donnell is playing okay, you know, they're scoring points, but now they've kind of given up the lead, but there's still some time left in the game.
4:58
SPEAKER_04: And on a second down, Jason Gilden hits Neil O'Donnell, and unfortunately for the Steelers, like you think, yeah, sack, what a great play, Tim.
5:08
SPEAKER_04: It puts him in like third and 15.
5:10
SPEAKER_04: Unfortunately for the Steelers, that that uh bloodied Neil O'Donnell, his Neos was actually bleeding him because Jason Gildam hit him so hard, and um Neil O'Donnell had to leave the game, which meant that Steve McNair had to come in cold.
5:25
SPEAKER_04: No practic I don't even know if he had any practice throws.
5:28
SPEAKER_01: He was actually he was actually in the hospital that week.
5:30
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, he was in a hospital battle.
5:33
SPEAKER_01: So he wasn't talking about coming in cold.
5:37
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah.
5:37
SPEAKER_04: He he comes off the bench, and it wasn't like a first down, like, hey, let's just give him an easy swing pass.
5:42
SPEAKER_04: No, it's like third down with like three minutes left, gotta have it third down.
5:49
SPEAKER_04: And goodness knows he doesn't complete a pass to uh geez, he he to uh I want to say Chris Sanders, and it was a third and eleven, actually.
6:02
SPEAKER_04: He completes a pass the third and Chris Sanders, and then on the rest of the drive, he goes three for three and throws a touchdown with a minute and thirty-one seconds left to Aaron Kinney.
6:14
SPEAKER_04: Who why did Aaron spell his name E-R-R-O-N?
6:18
SPEAKER_04: You done wrong there, Aaron.
6:20
SPEAKER_04: Aaron.
6:20
SPEAKER_04: I guess you couldn't call him Aaron, you call him Aaron, like error.
6:24
SPEAKER_04: Like, what is he, an error?
6:27
SPEAKER_04: He's an error.
6:28
SPEAKER_04: Except on this play, he wasn't.
6:30
SPEAKER_04: He scored a touchdown that clinched the game for the Titans.
6:33
SPEAKER_04: Um, we have some really cool links on all this.
6:35
SPEAKER_04: Uh, there's like a Tennessee flashback where they interview Eddie George and um Jeff Fisher.
6:42
SPEAKER_04: No, I don't know if Jeff Fisher was in this interview, but definitely Eddie George has a nice little take on it in one of the Tennessee offensive linemen who talked about when when uh McNair came in the huddle.
6:54
SPEAKER_04: And um it's a very cool thing.
6:56
SPEAKER_04: We'll link it there on our uh website if you go and go check that out.
7:00
SPEAKER_04: Um sadly, uh Steve McNair was killed in a homicide in 2009.
7:06
SPEAKER_04: Um very sad end after he retired.
7:09
SPEAKER_04: Um but boy, he um he really uh stuck into the Steelers that time and he even went to Baltimore.
7:16
SPEAKER_04: I don't remember him doing a terrible amount against us at Baltimore.
7:20
SPEAKER_01: Oh, he beat us, he beat us twice in 2006.
7:23
SPEAKER_01: First grade he got there, he beat us twice.
7:25
SPEAKER_01: I mean he he just he just owned us.
7:28
SPEAKER_01: There was a there was a stretch there where yeah, he just he always beat us.
7:33
SPEAKER_01: And I and I was at that that game in 2003 over stadium, and I can probably count on one hand the amount of times I've left the game walking back to my car, just totally bewildered and befuddled and like not having any words.
7:47
SPEAKER_01: Because usually you're either happy or you're frustrated, or you're just you know, whatever, this team isn't whatever.
7:55
SPEAKER_01: But the the that was you know, that game, the Jesse James game, like I said, there's like three or four games I can count on on my hands.
8:02
SPEAKER_01: I I just couldn't believe first of all, he even came into the game because again, he was in the hospital, and then he just marched right down the field and beat us.
8:12
SPEAKER_01: And and you, you know, like I said, looking back on it, you you almost wanted to like give him a standing ovation, but but not really, because just beating the Steelers yet again.
8:23
SPEAKER_04: Well, I mean, I wonder, boy, if they would have been better off not hurting Neil O'Donnell there.
8:27
SPEAKER_01: They would have been 100% would have been.
8:30
SPEAKER_04: I don't know, Neil still might have pulled it off.
8:33
SPEAKER_04: You never know.
8:34
SPEAKER_01: Uh yeah, maybe, but I mean that was again, get getting McNair in there just he always beat us.
8:40
SPEAKER_01: Always beat us.
8:41
SPEAKER_01: You and I were at a game, Steve, the year before that.
8:44
SPEAKER_01: I want to say like on New Year's Day, or maybe like the day after New Year's Day.
8:48
SPEAKER_01: It was like the last game of the season.
8:50
SPEAKER_01: He torched us in that game.
8:51
SPEAKER_01: There's so many games over the years where he just came in and and beat us, including, like you said, the playoffs.
8:57
SPEAKER_01: It was really sad.
8:58
SPEAKER_04: It wasn't like that early on in like when I guess maybe Houston.
9:02
SPEAKER_04: Well, Houston was always like like it was weird.
9:05
SPEAKER_04: Jeff Fisher kind of like had like that Mike Tomlin, like he always would seem to go eight and eight, you know, seven and eight.
9:13
SPEAKER_04: Like it was just odd.
9:14
SPEAKER_04: Like he he never had like a bad team, he only had like one or two really good teams.
9:20
SPEAKER_01: That team was in limbo for a few years because they were the Houston Oilers, yeah, then they were the Tennessee Oilers, and they were playing at Vanderbilt, then they were playing in Memphis.
9:29
SPEAKER_01: It it it really that 90, like you said, 98-99, that's when they became the Titans, and that's when they became that's when McNair really found his footing because they finally had some stability.
9:41
SPEAKER_01: And from that point forward, really, all the way till he got into Baltimore, like we said, he he just completely owned the Steelers.
9:48
SPEAKER_04: I think Eddie George in that interview um said that actually that before that game, McNair had ri contemplated retirement.
9:57
SPEAKER_04: Yes, and that's kind of the game that that you were at that he became a legend.
10:02
SPEAKER_04: He became Steve Eyre McNair.
10:04
SPEAKER_04: Because he had had that nickname in college at Alcorn State, but then in the pros.
10:08
SPEAKER_04: This is kind of like a big moment in his career where it began.
10:11
SPEAKER_04: So you were there the witness to beginning, Tim.
10:14
SPEAKER_04: There you go.
10:15
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, unfortunately.
10:16
SPEAKER_01: There's a um there's a good podcast that a writer from Sports Illustrated did.
10:21
SPEAKER_01: It's like a like an eight or nine part podcast around the death of Steve McNair.
10:26
SPEAKER_01: Um questioning the the official police story.
10:31
SPEAKER_01: It's it's a really interesting listen.
10:34
SPEAKER_04: Um, I won't go into the details of that, but it's it's suspicious to say the least, yeah.
10:40
SPEAKER_04: Yes, yes.
10:42
SPEAKER_04: Um, speaking on uh Tennessee, Houston, Tennessee Oilers, Titans, whatnot, uh Frank Wycheck, Tim.
10:51
SPEAKER_04: You gotta remember Frank Wycheck.
10:53
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
10:53
SPEAKER_04: Was he tight end, H back, a little bit of both?
10:56
SPEAKER_04: He was kind of like the predecessor to the modern tight end.
11:00
SPEAKER_04: He really was like a modern tight end.
11:02
SPEAKER_04: Could you imagine him playing in the league now?
11:04
SPEAKER_04: He boy, he would have had a field day.
11:06
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's true.
11:06
SPEAKER_04: But the they kind of used him like that, and that was before because like Tennessee really never had great wide receivers.
11:13
SPEAKER_04: And so, I mean, you know, well, they had Yancy Thig pen, didn't they, for a minute?
11:19
SPEAKER_00: For for the six games that he's healthy for, yeah.
11:21
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah.
11:22
SPEAKER_04: Um uh Frank Wojak was originally a sixth round pick by the Washington Redskins in 1993.
11:29
SPEAKER_04: They were the Redskins in 1993, so don't try and correct me.
11:32
SPEAKER_04: Ha.
11:33
SPEAKER_04: He was the other half of the Tennessee Titans connection that tortured the Steelers for years.
11:38
SPEAKER_04: Uh, once again, I referenced that 2002 playoff game.
11:41
SPEAKER_04: He had 10 catches for 20, 123 yards and a touchdown.
11:45
SPEAKER_04: Of course, Joe Nedney kicks the field to beat us.
11:49
SPEAKER_04: He's a three-time pro bowler.
11:51
SPEAKER_04: He's one of six tight ends to reach 500 receptions in a career.
11:56
SPEAKER_04: Would you like to hear his career stats against the Steelers, Tim?
12:00
SPEAKER_04: I can only imagine.
12:01
SPEAKER_04: He had 51 receptions for five 551 yards to six touchdowns.
12:08
SPEAKER_04: That's like for a tight end, that's amazing.
12:11
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
12:12
SPEAKER_04: Yep.
12:13
SPEAKER_04: And that's against one team.
12:15
SPEAKER_04: Right.
12:16
SPEAKER_01: Yep.
12:17
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, he he burned us a lot.
12:19
SPEAKER_04: Um, he was kind of the other half of Steve McDair there.
12:23
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
12:24
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, because really Eddie George was probably their most.
12:28
SPEAKER_04: But we could always shut him.
12:30
SPEAKER_04: That was back when we could stop the run.
12:31
SPEAKER_04: So we could always kind of like Eddie George is the one person on that team that I think he had one good game against us.
12:37
SPEAKER_01: That's that's what I was just gonna say.
12:38
SPEAKER_01: Eddie George was never the problem, even though he was the problem for every other team that they played.
12:43
SPEAKER_01: It wasn't it wasn't him, it was McNair and Waitek, like you said.
12:47
SPEAKER_04: Even in that that Joe Neddy game, do you remember like they knocked out?
12:51
SPEAKER_04: They actually concussed him.
12:52
SPEAKER_04: Like he was knocked out, like and he fumbled.
12:55
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, I think that was Casey Hampton hit him, and he they actually knocked him out.
13:00
SPEAKER_04: So like not just out of like literally concussed him.
13:04
SPEAKER_04: So Frank Whitek's another guy that tried to he got a yeah, he got another lot of concussions, and then he died in 2023 after a fall in his home.
13:14
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
13:14
SPEAKER_04: They they're thinking that might I think they did some research that might have been CTE related.
13:19
SPEAKER_04: He did take a lot of hits to the head, so unfortunately for him.
13:24
SPEAKER_04: That is weird that both of them have passed away.
13:27
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
13:28
SPEAKER_04: I mean, because they were relatively young.
13:31
SPEAKER_01: I mean Oh yeah, for sure.
13:34
SPEAKER_04: They they didn't even make it past their 50s.
13:36
SPEAKER_04: So um, speaking of tight ends that killed the Steelers, how about Rob Gronkowski?
13:44
SPEAKER_04: There's another guy.
13:45
SPEAKER_04: Um, did you know Rob Gronkowski in his he played seven games against the Steelers, his record was five and two.
13:52
SPEAKER_04: And boy, he actually had less receptions than uh Frank Wycheck.
13:56
SPEAKER_04: He had 41 receptions, but he had more yards and touchdowns, 685 yards and eight touchdowns.
14:01
SPEAKER_04: And um, you know how many playoff games Rob Gronkowski played against the Steelers?
14:07
SPEAKER_01: Just the one, I think.
14:09
SPEAKER_04: That would be zero.
14:10
SPEAKER_04: He never played a playoff game against the Steelers.
14:12
SPEAKER_01: Oh, he didn't play in that championship game?
14:14
SPEAKER_04: I guess not.
14:15
SPEAKER_04: There's no stats, or he didn't have any stats.
14:18
SPEAKER_04: If he played, he didn't record a catch.
14:20
SPEAKER_04: I don't know how everybody else.
14:22
SPEAKER_04: You know what?
14:23
SPEAKER_04: That was the game they beat us with the lacrosse star guy.
14:27
SPEAKER_04: It was like, here's some lacrosse player, let's put him out of here and burn the Mike Tomlin defense.
14:34
SPEAKER_04: What a joke.
14:36
SPEAKER_04: Uh so um his biggest game was that regular season, the Jesse James game.
14:40
SPEAKER_04: Gronk had nine catches for 168 yards.
14:43
SPEAKER_04: But he was another guy, like they for whatever reason, they just could never seem to match up well against the tight end.
14:49
SPEAKER_04: And you would have thought they would have had done a better job.
14:53
SPEAKER_04: I guess so.
14:54
SPEAKER_04: He's first season was 2010.
14:56
SPEAKER_04: When did Troy Palomalu retire?
14:58
SPEAKER_04: Not till like 2008.
15:00
SPEAKER_01: Uh after the 2014 season.
15:02
SPEAKER_04: So, I mean, looking, I mean, I don't know, he had good he had five receptions for 72 yards and three touchdowns in 2010, 2011, seven receptions for 100 uh for like 94 yards and in 2013 he had nine receptions for 143 yards in a touchdown.
15:26
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that was a game where they scored 50 plus points against us, if I remember correctly.
15:30
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, that was in 2000.
15:31
SPEAKER_04: So, like, even like I thought, well, maybe Troy Palomalu could have matched up against him.
15:36
SPEAKER_04: I don't know when when did they I don't remember when they drafted Ryan Shazier.
15:40
SPEAKER_00: It would have been after that.
15:42
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
15:43
SPEAKER_04: But they never really I guess Troy was at the end of his career there and he just didn't have enough left in the tank.
15:49
SPEAKER_04: Because like I'd have liked to see that would have been a great matchup, prime Troy Palomalu against Gronk.
15:55
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and and you call it out the Jesse James game.
15:59
SPEAKER_01: No one remembers that, you know, that that that play that got the Steelers down to the 10-yard line to set up the Jesse James touchdown, and it was a touchdown, was was like kind of a fluky, like real long pass to Juju Smith Schuster when the Steelers were like backed up all the way to like their own 20 with not a lot of time left.
16:21
SPEAKER_01: And the reason that that happened was because like Brady and Gronk just like marched Gronk really by himself just marched down the field and got the go-head touchdown late in the game, and we couldn't do anything to stop it.
16:33
SPEAKER_01: It was just like Gronk, gronk, gronk, gronk, gronk, touchdown.
16:36
SPEAKER_01: And and again, that if the Steelers just go for and out on their own 20, then that's what everybody remembers.
16:44
SPEAKER_01: But because of all the events that happened afterwards, I think people forget how badly he destroyed us in that game, especially at the end of that game.
16:52
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, and then Ben throwing that interception after, like just too aggressive.
16:57
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that was another that's another thing people remember.
17:00
SPEAKER_01: Uh so yeah, you're right, a lot of things from that game that people people have forgotten because of the call.
17:09
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, it was a bad call.
17:10
SPEAKER_01: Well, bad, bad roll.
17:12
SPEAKER_01: I mean, I we talked about that before.
17:13
SPEAKER_01: I think the refs kind of called it correctly, but the NFL had no idea what a catch was.
17:19
SPEAKER_01: And uh anyway, I we won't rehash all that, but yeah, Gronk Gronk was a monster.
17:23
SPEAKER_01: Gronk was really good too.
17:25
SPEAKER_01: I mean, he was a really, really good team.
17:26
SPEAKER_04: I I didn't look up his overall, but I'm sure he killed a lot of other teams too.
17:31
SPEAKER_04: Sure.
17:31
SPEAKER_04: But so maybe it's unfair just to single him out against the Steelers, but there were other good players who the Steelers shut down, you know.
17:38
SPEAKER_04: Right.
17:39
SPEAKER_04: So he just wasn't one of them.
17:41
SPEAKER_04: Right.
17:42
SPEAKER_04: Um how about Mark Brunel?
17:45
SPEAKER_04: Do you remember Mark Brunel, Tim?
17:47
SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah.
17:48
SPEAKER_01: From the Jaguars.
17:49
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, he was their first QB ever.
17:53
SPEAKER_04: Ever, Tim.
17:54
SPEAKER_04: Ever in the history of the team.
17:57
SPEAKER_04: Um, he had 16 touchdowns and 10 interceptions over his career against the Steelers, 2,601 yards passing, only a record of 7-6, which I was surprised by.
18:08
SPEAKER_04: I thought he would have a much better record than that.
18:12
SPEAKER_04: Um, his best season against the Steelers were definitely the 95 and 96 season, and then he kind of did it again in 2001, 2002.
18:21
SPEAKER_04: Um, very surprising.
18:22
SPEAKER_04: That first game, was that the first game of the season in '95, or was that like the second or third game?
18:29
SPEAKER_04: It was it was it was early in the season.
18:32
SPEAKER_04: And the Steelers didn't really hadn't settled on a quarterback at that point.
18:37
SPEAKER_04: And I just remember they went to Jacksonville and it was like, oh, it's an expansion team.
18:41
SPEAKER_04: The Steelers should walk all over them.
18:43
SPEAKER_04: They were just in the Super Bowl the year before.
18:46
SPEAKER_04: And like the Steelers lost like badly.
18:49
SPEAKER_01: Well, you're all you're mixing up two seasons.
18:51
SPEAKER_01: So am I?
18:52
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
18:53
SPEAKER_01: 95 was the year they were expansion team.
18:56
SPEAKER_01: 95, the first year they were in the league.
18:58
SPEAKER_01: We went down there and we we lost, which was shocking because it was like their it was like their sixth ever game in the we lost 20 to 16.
19:07
SPEAKER_01: And that was the year we went to the Super Bowl.
19:08
SPEAKER_01: And then in 96, that was the first game of the season there.
19:12
SPEAKER_01: And that was where, like you said, we hadn't set it on a quarterback.
19:15
SPEAKER_01: Tim Miller was the starter, but then like Tom Zach came in at the end.
19:19
SPEAKER_01: Greg Lloyd got hurt for the season in that game, and we lost again.
19:23
SPEAKER_01: And and I think that was the I think that's why Mark Brunel.
19:26
SPEAKER_01: You know, it's funny, Steve, you said he was only seven and six against us.
19:29
SPEAKER_01: I think the reason it sticks out in our mind more is because this team that wasn't even a team a few years earlier just came out and was instantly like beating us every time.
19:43
SPEAKER_04: It wasn't just competitive, like that like you couldn't go in there and expect the win.
19:47
SPEAKER_04: It wasn't yeah, they were just they're very tough to beat.
19:51
SPEAKER_04: And so, yeah, I forgot about so I I did kind of mix up the 95 and 96 games, but it still happened the first time they ever played the Jaguars, they lost.
20:00
SPEAKER_01: Right.
20:00
SPEAKER_01: And and like and and again, expansion teams back then.
20:03
SPEAKER_01: Well, I mean the NFL hasn't expanded in a while, but expansion teams.
20:06
SPEAKER_04: Well, it used to be like the Tampa Bay, like, oh my god, we didn't win a game for two years.
20:11
SPEAKER_04: Or even even Seattle, like who was more respectable, wasn't like super competitive until like three or four years later.
20:19
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, this isn't like I think when people think expansion teams, they might think of like the Vegas Golden Knights, who had this weird thing where Annie Kell teams wanted to unload contracts.
20:30
SPEAKER_01: The NFL, when they expanded, it's like you had to make a couple of your players available, and that's who the expansion team gets to pick from.
20:37
SPEAKER_01: And so expansion teams were supposed to be pretty bad until they have a couple of drafts and a couple of seasons to build up.
20:43
SPEAKER_01: And the fact that they owned us, especially at their at their home, I think it took us what five or six years to finally win down there.
20:50
SPEAKER_01: I think so.
20:51
SPEAKER_01: So yeah, I mean that was um I think that's what was I think that's why we remember Mark Brunel killing us because of the because of that context.
20:59
SPEAKER_04: Which is odd, you know, because like them and Carolina both were surprising.
21:04
SPEAKER_04: Like, I think Carolina was in the championship game.
21:07
SPEAKER_04: Like I didn't no, I don't think we did.
21:10
SPEAKER_04: We had a chance to have an all-expansion team Super Bowl.
21:13
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, that was that was in '96.
21:14
SPEAKER_04: That was the second year for them.
21:16
SPEAKER_04: Because they beat they beat uh Denver in that playoff game.
21:20
SPEAKER_04: And I think was that the year Carolina went to the championship game?
21:23
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
21:23
SPEAKER_00: Carolina Green Bay.
21:25
SPEAKER_04: They went to yeah, against Green Bay, yeah.
21:27
SPEAKER_00: Yep.
21:27
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
21:27
SPEAKER_00: So you're right.
21:28
SPEAKER_04: It was so I remember some things, Tim.
21:31
SPEAKER_01: You're right.
21:31
SPEAKER_01: Literally, both expansion teams were in the conference championship games in their second year.
21:36
SPEAKER_01: They both lost.
21:37
SPEAKER_01: But my goodness, like, that's hard to believe.
21:40
SPEAKER_04: Well, I think they they learned like when guy when these teams came in, like the owners or whatever, like, no, I'm not gonna suck for 10 years and not have any attendance.
21:50
SPEAKER_04: And maybe the NFL realized too that like you're really trying people's patience.
21:54
SPEAKER_04: Like, you're lucky to have a team in Tampa that the fans stood by and were so loyal.
22:00
SPEAKER_04: oil you know because I I was actually watching a um what was it Amazon has like a little uh series on the Tampa Bay Buccaneers history and it was interesting like how bad they were for the they didn't win uh they're like 0-24 like people think 0-14 they were actually like 0-21 0-20 like they didn't win a game till halfway through again halfway through the second season and it was actually against the Saints in New Orleans Archie Manning led Saints and it in Tampa this is like how much the Tampa fans stood by them like when they came back they had like a like they they all met the team at the airport and stuff and like it it's wild.
22:42
SPEAKER_04: So I I think that was kind of the reasoning is the uh you know the NFL didn't want to have a repeat of that they wanted to have like these buy-ins in these new markets like Jacksonville and you know Charlotte is that where they are they're in Charlotte Carolina wherever they are but I mean it it's still a full credit to to them for like Mark Brunel putting together well Mark Brunel was a backup on but come on look at look at the quarterbacks were on that Green Bay team.
23:09
SPEAKER_04: They had Brett Favre Ty Detmer Mark Brunel and do you know who who blocked out how many of those guys became MVPs?
23:25
SPEAKER_04: I don't know Mark Brunel was ever MVP.
23:27
SPEAKER_04: I don't think he ever was but he was very good though yeah so interesting and very good against the Steelers too but there there were some times the Steelers got his I think you know maybe more of like a mixed bag especially in Pittsburgh I think the Steelers did much better at home than on the road against the Jaguars.
23:46
SPEAKER_04: So um moving to hockey do you remember a guy named Tim Kerr Tim?
23:52
SPEAKER_04: Yeah so in it yeah he kind of killed us in 89 and that was the uh the uh podcast the False Summit podcast I did and I remember talking about this guy but you know 54 games played he uh his record was 35 14 and 5 hey ties cool um 31 games 30 uh no 31 goals um 30 assists 61 points um then in the playoffs oh my goodness did he murder us 11 uh games played he had 11 goals five assists and 16 points and his record's only six and five and that's because he was on the Rangers team in 92 that the penguins beat it's kind of interesting how like you know he was that big forward who'd stand in front of the net and the penguins really had no answer for that as that series went on in 1988 89.
24:46
SPEAKER_04: But then it's funny in 1991 92 he'd the penguins kind of learned from that and they had the bigger like they had the better defensemen like did they have shell I think they had shell sammons but they had yeah like big guys that could deal with him and the uh he couldn't push the now he was a couple years older too but you know they couldn't play that game because like that was that was the Rangers series where they broke was that where they broke Mario's hand I think or correct yeah so so you know whatever I mean it it he was a pain in the butt I remember to play play against well I didn't play when he played against the penguins but I just remember hearing he was a problem.
25:26
SPEAKER_01: Yeah that was that era like you covered in that Fall Summit episode that was that era where the the the Flyers beat us for upteen straight years at the at the spectrum and then we finally got a win there but then we had to play them in the playoffs and and they that was a a a playoff series that still hurts to this day that we lost and Tim Kerr was like the face of that.
25:48
SPEAKER_04: Well too like when they scored was that Scott Mellonby that scored that goal and like did the windmill celebration and uh because that was Robbie Brown's like there that was just that was that Flyers series was very painful because it was like the Penguins finally made it to the playoff after all those years.
26:05
SPEAKER_04: They actually win their first series against the Rangers ironically enough and then that second series they just they never could get out of that second series for so long and I guess beating the Rangers finally though is you know kind of like their cathartic moment.
26:21
SPEAKER_04: They finally made it to the conference final and you know they they was just kind of all downhill from there it seemed for the Penguins.
26:31
SPEAKER_04: Steve Avery Tim we're switching we're we're we're switching around the sports here remember Steve Avery or maybe you don't want to remember Steve Avery I guess he wasn't in the division with the Pirates but he certainly killed them in the playoffs since the Braves were in the West division.
26:49
SPEAKER_04: Because you know Atlanta is very west of Pittsburgh I think or no I was actually watching so that Atlanta is further west than Cleveland but I don't think they're further west than St.
27:01
SPEAKER_04: Louis or Cincinnati or Chicago who was also in the east yeah yeah so they're still trying to figure it out there Major League Baseball back in the 90s.
27:14
SPEAKER_04: So in game six of the 1991 NNLCP NLCS playoffs the Pirates are one win away from the World Series Tim they're gonna do it.
27:24
SPEAKER_04: It's uh what was that a home that was in Three Rivers I do believe yes and Steve Avery throws a gem in a pitcher's duel with drug Doug Draybick Avery pitches eight innings eight strikeouts two walks no runs and three hits and Doug Drabick does pitch and actually you know this is the weird thing I found out researching this Doug Drabick pitched a complete game and lost by but he only gave up one run and Steve Avery I think it was Alejandro Peña or whatever their closer was pitched a complete game shutout and you know for his part Drabick gave up one run seven hits five strikeouts and three walks and man that that that's just a one-nothing loss I don't know much about sports but I know you can't win scoring zero runs the best you can do is tie or play extra innings so I I'm thinking I'm thinking that's how that analytics worked do I need to consult the Rams analytics guy the the worst thing about that game well there were so many bad things about that game.
28:34
SPEAKER_01: There were one win away one two runs two runs Tim two runs yeah well the the the the thing that was really maddening about that was that was the second time in that series at the River Stadium that Steve Avery beat us one to nothing because game two he also beat us one to nothing against Zane Smith.
28:57
SPEAKER_01: And Zayn Smith pitched a great game in game two but he gave up one run which you know shouldn't be too bad just like Draybick.
29:04
SPEAKER_04: But Steve Steve I think this was more because we were actually like all we had to do was win this one you know sure sure no it it it it was it was the worst of the two but I mean my good like twice in a seven game series well yeah Steve Avery just unhitta like you know Bonds Bonilla and Van Slick just could not get it figured out against him I guess.
29:26
SPEAKER_01: Yeah and and all we had to do both times like you said was was get a run.
29:31
SPEAKER_01: You know both times we gave we we had really good pitching support on our side but we you know we gave up one he gave up zero like how how do you that was just yeah that was brutal and Steve Avery at the time wasn't a real well known pitcher.
29:46
SPEAKER_04: Well he and during the regular season he had 18 games pitched 1210 innings six and five on his win loss 3.75 ERA 64 strikeouts 39 that's really nothing that's super impressive.
30:03
SPEAKER_04: Yeah but then the playoffs five games 24 inches 24 innings uh three and one uh two ninety six ERA 20 strike so he just he just for whatever reason he had the Pirates number yeah that's enough about Steve Avery that that one hurt that one hurt and like everybody remembers the year after that because of Sid Bream and all that stuff.
30:27
SPEAKER_04: Yeah but that 91 team they probably should have went to the World Series that year for sure.
30:33
SPEAKER_01: That team was probably better than the 92 team and and like you said they were up three games to two they had game six and game seven at home and that game six that was the with with with the the reigning Cy Young award winner for the Pirates pitching that was the one where you really thought this is going to be the clincher and we're going to the World Series and it didn't happen what was the score at game seven I even forget three to nothing.
30:56
SPEAKER_04: Three to nothing who pitched that was that that was another John Smiley for us yeah and and it was the uh was it uh was it Glavin?
31:05
SPEAKER_01: I think it was Glavin I think yeah either Glavin or Smoltz is one of the two of them but we couldn't score any runs in that game either so yeah literally uh couldn't score any runs in game six or game seven and and Annie Vance likes on record too saying that they thought that was the best team that they ever had that's just like what a shame like you just think the Pirates just out of all the years they've been in the playoffs and stuff it just for whatever reason they just and we'll there's there's a couple other instances where they run into guys actually the next guy well he's a couple next guys down but we'll see that again.
31:40
SPEAKER_04: Do you remember Kevin Hatcher, Tim?
31:43
SPEAKER_04: Yeah well yeah for multiple reasons so Kevin Hatcher during the regular season was 68 games played against the penguins he was a defenseman stay at home defenseman for the Capitals so he has nine goals 30 assists 39 points in the playoffs 18 games 8 and 10 record four goals and this is all against the penguins nine assists 13 points which for playing for the Capitals joy he really was a pain in the Penguins side although they do always seem to beat the Capitals but he was just always such a pain always like oh man Kevin Hatcher again and so finally in 1996 the Penguins got tired of playing against him and um yeah they they traded they they uh they they got him uh they got him in ninety six they they uh signed him to a contract so Kevin Hatcher played for them for two years and then uh wasn't it didn't do much for us he was the only thing I ever heard is I know I know he lived up in South Point and I remember somebody was telling me like he used to like drink beer and stuff like in his lawn and like hang out with the neighbors.
32:48
SPEAKER_04: Like he was just like a a personable late neighbor apparently so there's a we'll have some fun fight video of Ked Kevin Hatcher fighting penguins tough guy Dan Frawley back in the 80s or 90s.
33:03
SPEAKER_04: Probably the 90s but fun times there of good old hockey fights um I always thought the reason yeah the penguins signed him is because they just didn't want to have to play against him anymore and he really was a penguin killer.
33:16
SPEAKER_04: Yeah yeah it's it's the old if you can't beat him join him and that never seems to really work out for our teams maybe they should have signed Gronk still wouldn't have worked out um moving to the next type of player uh I'm gonna call these guys um one game wonders so or the Oneeters um a movie reference there um the do you remember Jake Arietta who could forget Jake Arietta um he was a career journeyman but in 2015 he caught lightning in a bottle or something else in a bottle um he once allegedly allegedly still could have been well we'll talk about that yeah so um he he had seven wins uh 22 wins seven losses an ERA of 1.77 um in the 2005 15 season against the Pirates he had a 0.75 ERA and 36 innings pitched and then that darn 2015 NL wildcard game he strikes out 11 in a four hit no run outing um why why was he what why because against the Pirates overall he had 27 games and he almost has an ERA of three but for some reason that season and I I mean I I I don't know I I I think he was either he had some sort of spider tack or he was doing something to the ball.
34:53
SPEAKER_04: I don't think it was steroids quite honestly I think it was spider tack because he was more of like a movement he would try and get like a lot of movement on his pitch so I think he was using an illegal substance if anything in the I think the major league baseball just looked the other way because they wanted the Cubs to win a World Series.
35:13
SPEAKER_04: And that's my tinfoil hat theory about Jake Arietta because he you look at it it's weird he had one good year and that's it.
35:22
SPEAKER_04: Even for Baltimore I think he like the Pirates like smacked him around later and it was like too little too late.
35:29
SPEAKER_01: So yeah he really did have that one and that one year was like historic dominance uh and and he hadn't had it before that he didn't have it after that so I I can see why people have conspiracy theories because it's just so unusual but that but I remember when we had to play him in that wildcard game it's like oh crap we're not gonna be able to hit him and sure enough we couldn't.
35:57
SPEAKER_04: Well look I'm even looking 2013 he has his 3.27 ERA he only pitches two games against the Pirates in 11 innings but they have 10 hits and five runs you know I I don't know I I just like it's weird to see a guy like and this wasn't like Steve Blast where he just couldn't throw a strike he just was never all that good he was he wasn't like terrible but he was like yeah he's okay yeah yeah whatever so you don't think he was cheating Tim he just just I mean it's possible that you just think he had a good year maybe I mean I guess guys do have just like one good year here or there.
36:39
SPEAKER_01: Yeah it's it's it's entirely possible he just caught like you said lightning in a bottle it's happened before to to other athletes in other sports uh it's just unfortunate that you know it was a one game playoff.
36:53
SPEAKER_04: You know if that was a seven game series maybe we can survive it's not our way out of that but a one game playoff we were toast so next up on our one game wonders is Cincinnati quarterback Jeff Blake and um boy I have fond well not so fond memories of this guy.
37:11
SPEAKER_04: He was our quarterback in Cincinnati like which is odd because Cincinnati like he was a decent quarterback he really wasn't terrible from 94 to 99 um mainly the season that I remember him for was the 95 season and boy man did that was that was that Thursday night game Tim that me and you went to yeah yeah he just like I was that I think it was Alvoid Mays he just he could throw these balls like they would those moon balls where they would like go off the screen and he was dropping that into Carl Pickens and boy they just the Steelers had no answer for that early in that season.
37:51
SPEAKER_04: In two games that season he had 492 yards passing six touchdowns and no interceptions and a 74 completion percentage that's like insane like even the second game that was in Cincinnati like I think the the Bengals scored like 24 28 points and I don't know what happened like in the second half of that game but the Steelers finally figured out like Cincinnati's defense and Cordell Stewart had a great game and that was the only way is they could beat Cincinnati that year is they outscore him.
38:23
SPEAKER_04: So that was a game in November um as a game in October that me and Tim were at the Steelers lost 24 to nine mainly due to Jeff Blake um that made the Steelers three and four it's kind of the low point of the season and that was facilitated Carnot Lake moving the corner and that really totally changed the Steelers season around the the the the second game like you said was it was I just had the score in front of me here it's it was 4931.
38:54
SPEAKER_01: Yeah so it wasn't like it was Jeff Blake's fault that they lost that game because it scored 31 points.
39:00
SPEAKER_01: But but the Bengals were just so bad back then that they just couldn't help but lose a game like that.
39:06
SPEAKER_01: So yeah he just he just boy if he would have played on imagine him on those Jacksonville teams we talked about or those New England teams like with Gronk he would have been he would have been you know a a Super Bowl contender.
39:21
SPEAKER_04: Yeah he he played in 2002 uh with the Ravens um he did okay better than Elvis Gerback but not much and it's funny his overall stats um I think he has 16 touchdowns and 15 interceptions because he really like that 95 season really was his best year.
39:41
SPEAKER_04: Like even the Baltimore year in 2002 he had five interceptions to three touchdowns so it wasn't great but boy that that season in 95.
39:51
SPEAKER_04: Yeah you're you're right he killed us in that 95 season for sure that really was like the memory of like you know he definitely was a maybe a two-game wonder more than a one maybe one season wonder because he went to Arizona and didn't have a good game although he had two touchdowns in the one game in Arizona he played for against us in 2003 and two touchdowns and no interceptions before riding off into the sunset.
40:15
SPEAKER_04: It was just Jeff Blake just one more time gonna stick it to you.
40:22
SPEAKER_04: Another one game wonder um I remember this guy Eric Metcalfe and uh he was mainly a punt returner for the Browns um he actually played 13 games against the Steelers um he he did like he was kind of like a very smallish running back like a Pegrim but he was really good at returning punts for some reason and and he could he he would run the ball but he wasn't a very physical runner.
40:48
SPEAKER_03: He in 93 how he killed the Steelers was the Steelers had really bad special teams that year and there was a game where he has two uh two punt returns for a touchdown so um we'll play that uh right now Eric Metcalf has already taken one 91 yards for a score.
41:07
SPEAKER_03: He has this one at the 25.
41:08
SPEAKER_03: Metcalf to the outside.
41:10
SPEAKER_03: Will roll.
41:11
SPEAKER_03: Metcalf at midfield.
41:12
SPEAKER_03: Metcalf cuts back.
41:14
SPEAKER_03: He's still on his feet.
41:15
SPEAKER_03: Metcalf will go.
41:17
SPEAKER_03: What his goal! Unbelievable.
41:22
SPEAKER_03: yeah and that and that was that one was with like a minute left in the game.
41:28
SPEAKER_04: Yeah it actually won the game.
41:30
SPEAKER_01: Yeah we were just going to pin them back deep and let our defense win the game and he just returns it all the way it was it was you you can hear the announcers in the crowd there it was shocking because he had already returned one so I that was another one of those games where you just shake your head and shrug your shoulders and say what in the world just happened I think I looked it up there's been like 13 or 14 players that have done two punt returns in a game in NFL history.
41:59
SPEAKER_04: There might be more I think that the most is three somebody had three in a game oh wow which is just crazy.
42:06
SPEAKER_04: And it wasn't Devin Hester which is crazy um and actually he did it again um Eric Metcalf and uh he it it was in Cincinnati but he was with the Chargers in ninety seven so he did two punt returns twice in his career.
42:24
SPEAKER_01: Oh wow yeah he was a he was a great returner he was an okay running back like I don't think really running back because he was so small was really his thing no no I mean like you you mentioned like Devin Hester or like Mel Gray or you know there's there's guys who were just specialists as returners and he was one of the best ones.
42:45
SPEAKER_01: Talk about a position that really you'll never see again yeah the way that the way that they have the kickoff set up now it's it's harder for that to happen.
42:54
SPEAKER_04: And punt return for touchdown boy you you see it occasionally but not all that often you definitely don't have a a Devin Hester like player in the league anymore.
43:06
SPEAKER_04: Yeah you always wonder why those guys just it never translates to offense for the like remember the Bears tried to put Devin Hester at like wide receiver and stuff like for whatever reason it just never seemed to like translate as well.
43:20
SPEAKER_04: The only guy like Dave Meggett like Dave Meget was pretty good at returning kicks.
43:25
SPEAKER_04: Yeah D Dion Sanders Yeah, yeah, yeah, there's another guy, and he was a really good corner.
43:31
SPEAKER_04: So it's such a specialized skill in this is like some people really good at it.
43:37
SPEAKER_04: Like Antoine Randuel was good at it too.
43:39
SPEAKER_04: Yeah yeah that's true um here's a guy like I I just remember him for this one season but for the most part the penguins kind of owned this goaltender and that's John Van Biesbrook.
43:53
SPEAKER_04: It's just a great name John Van Biesbrook um in the regular season he uh sixty three games against the Penguins, 28 uh wins, 29 losses, um, 3.61 goals against 8.79, 0.879 save percentage, which is really not that great.
44:13
SPEAKER_04: In the playoffs, it gets even worse.
44:15
SPEAKER_04: Um, 13 games play, a record of four wins and nine losses, um, but a.915 save percentage.
44:24
SPEAKER_04: And the thing is, what's weird is like he really only had like those four wins, it all happened in one year.
44:32
SPEAKER_04: And that year would have been the 95-96 season of your Pittsburgh Penguins.
44:39
SPEAKER_04: And what had happened that year was John Van Biesbrook had left the Rangers, who the Penguins had actually tortured him on.
44:46
SPEAKER_04: I don't think, yeah, it's right, in two playoff series, Van Biesbrook had not won a game against the Penguins.
44:52
SPEAKER_00: Wow.
44:52
SPEAKER_04: And that was in five games, so in two different years.
44:56
SPEAKER_04: So um, the rat year.
44:59
SPEAKER_04: Do you remember the rats in Florida?
45:02
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
45:03
SPEAKER_04: So this is once again Scott Mellonby, the legendary Scott.
45:07
SPEAKER_04: Maybe he was a penguin killer.
45:08
SPEAKER_04: I don't know.
45:09
SPEAKER_04: He threw his he threw his stick at the first game of the season and killed a rat in the locker room.
45:14
SPEAKER_04: Or like, I guess a rat was running across the floor and he like chucked the rat against the wall and killed it.
45:20
SPEAKER_04: And you know, thank God PETA wasn't paying attention because boy Scott Mellenby would have got in trouble.
45:27
SPEAKER_04: But I don't know, maybe they could have used um Scott Mellenby back in the uh what was that?
45:33
SPEAKER_04: The was that the 1500s?
45:35
SPEAKER_04: When was the black plague?
45:39
SPEAKER_04: Went around whacking rats.
45:41
SPEAKER_04: Whacking rats, yeah.
45:42
SPEAKER_04: The Pope needed his help.
45:44
SPEAKER_04: We have this plague going around, Scott.
45:46
SPEAKER_04: Can you kill some rats for us?
45:48
SPEAKER_04: Wow, historical.
45:49
SPEAKER_04: Who knew we mentioned the Black Death on this uh podcast?
45:53
SPEAKER_04: Here we are.
45:56
SPEAKER_04: He carried the Penguins to uh Van Biesberg carried the penguins to the Stanley Cap final where they lost the Avalanche in four games.
46:03
SPEAKER_04: But that year they really they really shut down that Mario-led team.
46:07
SPEAKER_04: And the the Penguins weren't bad.
46:08
SPEAKER_04: Who was the goalie?
46:09
SPEAKER_04: Like they had a weird goalie.
46:11
SPEAKER_04: Was it no, it was Barrasso, was it?
46:13
SPEAKER_04: It was Reggie.
46:14
SPEAKER_01: It was Reggie and Barrasso.
46:16
SPEAKER_04: Because that that was that weird, yeah.
46:19
SPEAKER_04: Tom Fitzgerald like shoots a puck, I swear to god, from like second F in the Civic Arena.
46:25
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
46:25
SPEAKER_04: Well, yeah.
46:26
SPEAKER_01: I mean, really.
46:27
SPEAKER_01: I mean, seriously, he was like up, he was up at the top of the seats, he was getting some nodules, and he just shot the puck down and it went in the net.
46:35
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, it was really far away.
46:37
SPEAKER_04: He almost was upsize when he shot it.
46:43
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, they will here's somebody that can relive that memory.
46:47
SPEAKER_03: Murphy gets it out of there.
46:49
SPEAKER_03: We're one-one shots 30-20 in favor of the pens.
46:52
SPEAKER_03: Scrum and gun shot from the top of the circle by Tom Fitzgerald.
47:00
SPEAKER_03: Right out of nowhere.
47:02
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, like you said, Tim, uh, he was getting some nachos in the stands.
47:05
SPEAKER_04: Um I don't know what to say about that.
47:09
SPEAKER_04: The penguins, I don't know.
47:10
SPEAKER_04: The penguins probably would have lost the Avalanche too that year.
47:13
SPEAKER_04: So I don't know.
47:14
SPEAKER_04: It would have been nice to see him go back to like because I remember thinking, well, they made the final, and every time they made the final, they always go on to the Stanley Cup final.
47:23
SPEAKER_04: But unfortunately, it was not to be because of Tom Barraser not being able to stop a slap shot in a game seven.
47:31
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I mean, but uh but I mean, like you said, it it kind of all came down to that.
47:35
SPEAKER_01: But it the reason it came down to that because is because Van Biesbrook was really stopping us the whole series.
47:41
SPEAKER_01: They were playing really tight defense.
47:42
SPEAKER_01: They had they went to like that trap.
47:45
SPEAKER_04: They're like a trapping team.
47:46
SPEAKER_01: That was that era of you know playing that kind of style of hockey, which stunk because the Penguins had the I think it was like the top three scores in that league in the year in the league that year with Lemu Francis and Jager, and they just couldn't beat the the Panthers now.
48:01
SPEAKER_01: To be fair, you know, the trap was garbage and the NHL shouldn't have allowed that, and it's just nobody wanted to watch that.
48:08
SPEAKER_01: But then the Colorado swept them out of the Stanley Cup finals.
48:12
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
48:12
SPEAKER_01: So, you know, Joe Sakik and Peter Forsberg figured out a way to round it.
48:17
SPEAKER_01: We just couldn't.
48:20
SPEAKER_04: I guess there weren't a lot of rats thrown on the ice because that was their celebration.
48:24
SPEAKER_01: Was it was it after a goal or yeah, it was after a goal they would throw like these it wasn't real rats.
48:29
SPEAKER_01: Real rats, obviously.
48:30
SPEAKER_04: Oh, thank God.
48:31
SPEAKER_04: Can you imagine horrible?
48:34
SPEAKER_04: Although people do keep pet rats, weirdly enough.
48:37
SPEAKER_04: I mean, apparently they make great pets, but yeah.
48:40
SPEAKER_01: I'll tell I'll tell you uh I'll tell you a story uh once we're off of the air about um about that in my house.
48:47
SPEAKER_04: Okay.
48:49
SPEAKER_04: Anyway, uh I smell a rat.
48:51
SPEAKER_04: Uh uh speaking of uh well, I don't know.
48:56
SPEAKER_04: I don't know what to call it to say this guy.
48:57
SPEAKER_04: Um Michael Waka.
48:59
SPEAKER_04: Do you remember Michael Walka to him at all?
49:01
SPEAKER_04: Vaguely.
49:03
SPEAKER_04: That's that's exactly how you should remember him.
49:06
SPEAKER_04: I just remember really being pissed that the Pirates lost to this guy.
49:10
SPEAKER_04: So he is like a pretty mediocre pitcher, kind of like what's his name?
49:14
SPEAKER_04: The uh Jake Arrietta, only not as celebrated.
49:17
SPEAKER_04: He had 19 games pitched, a hundred nineteen games played against the pirates, a hundred innings pitched, an eight-and-three win-loss record, a 359 ERA.
49:27
SPEAKER_04: Um, in the playoffs, one game.
49:30
SPEAKER_04: He only ever pitched one game against the Pirates.
49:32
SPEAKER_04: He went seven innings, seven and a third.
49:36
SPEAKER_04: He won that game, 1.23 ERA, nine strikeouts, two base on balls.
49:43
SPEAKER_04: Um, I don't think he gave up any.
49:45
SPEAKER_04: He gave up one run in that seven innings, and that was in 2013.
49:50
SPEAKER_04: So we're in 2013, and the Pirates have just come off the high of beating the um Johnny Quato game, which we covered in a whole podcast.
49:59
SPEAKER_04: I think it's the only you know playoff series-ish that the Pirates have won since 1979, and so now they're actually one, you know, they were they were a couple wins away from getting to the NLCS again, and they were in the NLDS, and uh they were up in game four.
50:20
SPEAKER_04: They're actually, I think all they had to do was no, I no, they were up.
50:25
SPEAKER_04: And they this this guy, Michael Walker, who's a rookie, comes in and he pitches seven and a third.
50:30
SPEAKER_04: It was the longest, it was a no-hitter into the seventh inning by a rookie, and um, you know, then since some guy from the Giants in 1912.
50:41
SPEAKER_04: And um, but Pedro Alvarez did break up Walka's no-hit hitter in the eighth with a home run.
50:48
SPEAKER_04: It goes to a game five because that was it, because that was a short five-game series.
50:53
SPEAKER_04: So the Pirates were up two games to one, and if they win one of the last two, they're on to the NLDS and they lose.
51:00
SPEAKER_04: This really was the key one.
51:01
SPEAKER_04: They really needed to beat Michael Walker, who was, like I said, a rookie.
51:05
SPEAKER_04: A Wookiee, a rookie, no no Chewbacca, um, to add they lose five games to Adam Wainwright, who's a really good pitcher.
51:14
SPEAKER_04: And yeah, that's it.
51:16
SPEAKER_04: They they never they've not won an actual series since 1990.
51:21
SPEAKER_04: No, since 1979, I guess.
51:23
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
51:24
SPEAKER_04: So yeah.
51:25
SPEAKER_01: The the six years in in the postseason since 1979, and I would argue that all six times they didn't advance to the World Series because the pitching of some other team was just a little better.
51:40
SPEAKER_01: Was just better and and un and and in some cases unhittable.
51:44
SPEAKER_01: You're gonna talk about another one later.
51:46
SPEAKER_01: Where like we just come on, Michael Walker, come on, I that guy's yeah, but you know, again, Steve Avery, you know, same thing.
51:54
SPEAKER_01: It's like you just Yeah sport that's sports.
51:59
SPEAKER_01: You know, what did David Tyree ever do other than beat the undefeated Patriots?
52:04
SPEAKER_04: Well, he but he he scored that overtime touchdown against Pitt.
52:07
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, right, exactly.
52:09
SPEAKER_01: So that's what I mean.
52:10
SPEAKER_01: It's like that's that's sports.
52:11
SPEAKER_01: You just you have your one moment and that's all you really need sometimes.
52:14
SPEAKER_04: I mean Troy Noone's Eli Manning, really.
52:18
SPEAKER_04: But anyway, I digress.
52:21
SPEAKER_04: Uh yeah, it's really frustrating because that that's like another example.
52:24
SPEAKER_04: The Pirates had this golden opportunity.
52:26
SPEAKER_04: They're kind of the opposite of the Steelers.
52:28
SPEAKER_04: Boy, they really although the Steelers recently, you know, but at least it was against like Tom Brady and the Patriots, like really good teams.
52:36
SPEAKER_04: But here's another guy you'll remember, Tim.
52:39
SPEAKER_04: Uh this is gonna be painful.
52:43
SPEAKER_04: Can you handle this?
52:44
SPEAKER_04: Uh, one Larry Brown.
52:48
SPEAKER_01: The guy who I mean, you want to talk about really good at covering grass.
52:53
SPEAKER_01: Nobody nobody covered grass better than Larry Brown.
52:57
SPEAKER_04: That 30-yard line wasn't gonna score.
53:00
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I mean, he just all the green was not going anywhere when he stood where he stood.
53:07
SPEAKER_04: Uh in 1995, he had six interceptions.
53:10
SPEAKER_04: He was a defensive back for the uh Dallas Cowboys um in '95.
53:16
SPEAKER_04: He actually was going into a contract year that season.
53:19
SPEAKER_04: So he just he's like a perfect example of like, oh, I really got to get it together this year.
53:24
SPEAKER_04: So he had six interceptions, 47 tackles, and he really decided he wanted to cash in because he got two interceptions in the second half of the Super Bowl.
53:34
SPEAKER_04: And so he's like the Super Bowl MVP.
53:37
SPEAKER_04: He's on Married with Children, he's gonna get a big payday.
53:41
SPEAKER_04: He gets signed by Al Davis at the Raiders, and he proceeds to get cut by the Raiders because obviously he just was, you know, a paycheck guy that, like you said, was in the right place at the right time, made a bunch of money from the Raiders.
53:56
SPEAKER_04: He actually returned to the Cowboys and had a mediocre season or two after.
54:01
SPEAKER_04: But boy, he is definitely the definition of a one-game wonder.
54:05
SPEAKER_04: And I don't even know how much wonder it was, it was just kind of right place, right time.
54:09
SPEAKER_04: I mean he caught the ball, Tim.
54:10
SPEAKER_04: He could have dropped it.
54:12
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
54:13
SPEAKER_01: I I I always we talked about it when we did the episode about that season.
54:17
SPEAKER_01: One of my biggest what ifs ever would have been if any other player on the Cowboys makes the one of those two interceptions, right?
54:28
SPEAKER_01: Makes the second interception.
54:30
SPEAKER_01: Because it would have been really, really hard to pick who the MVP was for that game.
54:36
SPEAKER_01: Because there really wasn't anybody on the Cowboys.
54:39
SPEAKER_04: I think Ebbett Smith had like 50 yards rushing.
54:41
SPEAKER_01: But it was all in the first half.
54:43
SPEAKER_01: He had like nothing in the second half.
54:45
SPEAKER_01: And and and let's say the Cowboys still win, but it's you know, sharper, or one of those guys gets that second interception.
54:51
SPEAKER_01: I don't I it would have been really hard to pick the MVP, but you know, good for good for Larry Brown.
54:55
SPEAKER_01: The O'Donnell made him a very, very rich man.
54:58
SPEAKER_04: Maybe he gives Neo Donnell a check every once in a while.
55:01
SPEAKER_04: Doubtful.
55:04
SPEAKER_04: All that married with children money.
55:06
SPEAKER_04: Um so next up on our list are Hall of Famers.
55:11
SPEAKER_04: And um, yeah, Hall of Famers, Tim.
55:14
SPEAKER_04: These are just guys that are really good, right?
55:17
SPEAKER_04: Um, first up would be Albert Poohholes.
55:21
SPEAKER_04: And my goodness, did Albert Poohhols have a Hall of Fame career against the Pittsburgh Pirates?
55:27
SPEAKER_04: And especially imagine like if he would have been played his whole career in PNC Park, he might have broke in um Barry Bond's record.
55:36
SPEAKER_04: I mean, this dude loved a hit in PNC Park.
55:39
SPEAKER_04: He played for the Cardinals from 2001 to 2011 when he did most of his home runs against them.
55:45
SPEAKER_04: He played for the Cardinals, I think, another time, but he played for the Angels some too.
55:50
SPEAKER_04: He actually played a long time for the Angels.
55:52
SPEAKER_04: He had 35 home runs in PC Park, which is like a season's worth of home runs.
55:57
SPEAKER_04: And I and the Cardinals only play in PC Park like what four or five times a year?
56:04
SPEAKER_01: Not many, yeah.
56:05
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, I mean, maybe six.
56:07
SPEAKER_04: If they do two series, maybe.
56:08
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
56:09
SPEAKER_04: So six games a year.
56:11
SPEAKER_04: That's crazy.
56:13
unknown: Yep.
56:15
SPEAKER_04: He is 57 home runs in total against the pirates are the third most by any by him against any team.
56:21
SPEAKER_04: Um he did hit home runs 701, 702, and 703.
56:26
SPEAKER_04: And uh he ended up with 703.
56:29
SPEAKER_04: So that last home run against the pirates was his last home run, Tim.
56:33
SPEAKER_04: How about that, huh?
56:34
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and that's pretty impressive because there's only what four guys ever that hit 700?
56:39
SPEAKER_01: I think so, yeah.
56:40
SPEAKER_01: It would have been Bonds, Aaron, Ruth, and him.
56:44
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
56:45
SPEAKER_04: I don't think uh Alex Rodriguez hit 700.
56:48
SPEAKER_01: I don't think he did either.
56:50
SPEAKER_04: I think it was Mays is like in the 600s, isn't he?
56:53
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
56:54
SPEAKER_01: Well, because because Ruth had 714.
56:56
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
56:57
SPEAKER_01: So I don't think anybody really came that close.
57:00
SPEAKER_01: Other than Poole Holmes.
57:02
SPEAKER_04: Do you know Pool Holmes used an illegal bat for most of his career?
57:05
SPEAKER_04: Nobody cares about that.
57:07
SPEAKER_01: No.
57:08
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
57:09
SPEAKER_04: Fun fact.
57:10
SPEAKER_04: His bat was outlawed, I forget which year, but like he was grandfathered in, so the Major League Baseball let him keep keep using it.
57:19
SPEAKER_04: So like when the people complain about stats and stuff and steroids, I don't want to hear it because they have spitball pitchers and Albert Poohs in the Hall of Fame using his bat that was banned.
57:31
SPEAKER_04: Because like another guy like borrowed his bat or something in a game and like got in trouble for it because it was like, oh, you can't use that because you're not Albert Poohs.
57:40
SPEAKER_04: What what a what an idiotic sport baseball is with the rules sometimes.
57:44
SPEAKER_04: Like, if you make something illegal, just make it illegal or don't make it illegal.
57:47
SPEAKER_04: You can't like, oh yes, you were this isn't like a hockey helmet where, like, well, whatever, you know, it's not really gonna help you play, it's just gonna protect your head.
57:58
SPEAKER_04: Dumb.
57:58
SPEAKER_04: Uh, whatever.
58:00
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's baseball.
58:01
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah, and they do it all the time with like rules, it's weird.
58:04
SPEAKER_01: Yep.
58:05
SPEAKER_04: So next up is a guy who's like he's had an odd career.
58:09
SPEAKER_04: Madison Bumgartner.
58:11
SPEAKER_04: Do you remember Madison Bumgartner, Tim?
58:14
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, because again, like we said, this the six times they went to the playoffs and got destroyed by another pitcher.
58:20
SPEAKER_01: He was one of them.
58:21
SPEAKER_04: And and what's interesting is like Madison Bumgartener in the regular season is not the same Madison Bumgartner that's in the playoffs.
58:30
SPEAKER_04: Like he literally goes in like uh you know a telephone booth, changes into like real Madison Baumgartner and comes out, okay, it's playoff time.
58:38
SPEAKER_04: He is probably like the most clutch pitcher in baseball history.
58:43
SPEAKER_04: Like, if you need a game seven guy, this is your dude.
58:47
SPEAKER_04: In the because like in the regular season, the Pirates he had an ERA of 363, and um, let's see, uh, I don't know how many wins, but like, you know, it's not that great of an ERA, like it's a like a more normal ERA, and he like uh I don't have his wins written down, but it's still it's just not not that great.
59:09
SPEAKER_04: But then that one game, and unfortunately, you know, you don't want to play the San Francisco Giants when it's an even numbered year, Tim, because um that's when they win World Series.
59:20
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
59:21
SPEAKER_04: So if you play them in an odd number year, you're okay, but even number years, you're in trouble, and the pirates were in trouble because it was 2014.
59:30
SPEAKER_04: Um he just like, you know, they beat him in this wild card round, and uh Bob Gardner pitches a complete game shutout.
59:41
SPEAKER_04: I I think he gave up four hits.
59:43
SPEAKER_04: Um I don't think the Pirates got a guy to second base the whole game.
59:49
SPEAKER_04: I mean, ten strikeouts and one block gave up four hits.
59:53
SPEAKER_04: That's just insane.
59:54
SPEAKER_04: That's that's a great pitching performance in the playoffs in a one game.
59:58
SPEAKER_04: They get in that wildcard game again.
1:00:00
SPEAKER_04: I think that was against uh Garrett Cole, wasn't it?
1:00:03
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, I believe so.
1:00:06
SPEAKER_04: So I don't know what to tell you about that, Tim.
1:00:10
SPEAKER_04: It was just once again the Pirates run into like a great pitcher and just nothing.
1:00:14
SPEAKER_04: But that killed me.
1:00:14
SPEAKER_04: That really killed me that game.
1:00:16
SPEAKER_04: I really thought they had a chance, but I guess this isn't as bad as like, you know, that that yeah, they should have beaten Michael Walker, like really.
1:00:25
SPEAKER_04: They they just that's that one just always bothered me because I never like you can understand losing to like Madison Baumgartner, even Steve Avery, I think, is pretty good.
1:00:34
SPEAKER_04: But Michael Waka, really?
1:00:36
SPEAKER_04: It's just because it's one game and anything can happen at one game.
1:00:40
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I think the reason it feels a little different than Walker or or Jake Arietta the year after that is because nobody else could hit him either.
1:00:51
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
1:00:52
SPEAKER_04: I don't have his overall, like he's like World Series MVP.
1:00:56
SPEAKER_04: I I should have got his world like his overall record in the playoffs.
1:01:00
SPEAKER_04: His overall record in the playoffs against everybody is unbelievable.
1:01:03
SPEAKER_04: He's one of the greatest postseason pitchers of all time.
1:01:07
SPEAKER_04: And when he goes to the Hall of Fame, which he will, if he's not there already, he he will be in because of his World Series and playoff performances.
1:01:17
SPEAKER_01: What I remember about the World Series that year was he he shuts out Kansas City in game five, and then all they have to do is win game six or game seven, so they don't pitch him for game six and Kansas City wins, and they really can't pitch him for game seven because it's like he only has like three days.
1:01:36
SPEAKER_01: So they started some other dude for like the first inning.
1:01:40
SPEAKER_04: I remember that.
1:01:41
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah, and then he comes in and pitches like seven innings, no hit.
1:01:44
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, I remember that.
1:01:45
SPEAKER_04: Yes, I remember that distinctly.
1:01:47
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yes.
1:01:48
SPEAKER_04: That's what I mean.
1:01:56
SPEAKER_04: It was like, well, just get us like two innings and if we give up a run or two, I think we can you know live with that.
1:02:01
SPEAKER_04: Yes, and boy, man, Madison Bumpgardner is just he's like a guy like you.
1:02:07
SPEAKER_04: I wish I man, you you just love to have him on your team in his prime.
1:02:11
SPEAKER_04: He was absolutely unhittable in the postseason.
1:02:14
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
1:02:17
SPEAKER_04: Another guy that killed is a coach, is the only coach to make the list.
1:02:21
SPEAKER_04: Uh Al Arbor, Tim, we've mentioned him a couple times before.
1:02:25
SPEAKER_04: He coached the Islanders for a long time from the 70s to the 90s.
1:02:30
SPEAKER_04: Um, famously coached the orchestrated the comeback on the Penguins in 1974, when the Islanders were down three games to none.
1:02:40
SPEAKER_04: Um also, you know, he coached the Islanders when they beat the best Penguins team ever in '92 and '93 in that Game 7 loss.
1:02:50
SPEAKER_04: Um and then he came out of retirement in 2007 to get his 740th win of all time against against the Penguins.
1:03:00
SPEAKER_04: Boy, that guy just killed the Penguins in many, many different errors over 50 years.
1:03:08
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I I I I can't even get started on the New York freaking islanders and how badly that the yeah, there's just so many, so many bad memories there.
1:03:20
SPEAKER_04: And he's you always have Brooks Or Brooks Or pick overtime goal to him.
1:03:24
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
1:03:24
SPEAKER_04: Just think of that.
1:03:26
SPEAKER_04: Great.
1:03:28
SPEAKER_04: Um, Martin Brodeur, uh, here's another Hall of Famer.
1:03:32
SPEAKER_04: And I, you know, he had 49 wins, 29 losses, a 2.45 goals against, 9-4, 9, 9.04 save percentage.
1:03:42
SPEAKER_04: Um, he was actually 11-6 in the playoffs against the Penguins, a 9.07 save percentage in the playoffs.
1:03:50
SPEAKER_04: And uh let's see, uh, I don't think the Penguins uh no, it says the Penguins did beat him one time, I guess, in 98-99.
1:03:58
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that was the um year that we did the episode on Yager scoring goal that everybody you know, people said save the franchise.
1:04:06
SPEAKER_04: So yeah, so we did get the best of him once.
1:04:09
SPEAKER_04: Once, but for the most part, boy man.
1:04:11
SPEAKER_04: Whew.
1:04:12
SPEAKER_04: He he was really, really good.
1:04:14
SPEAKER_04: Um he had big saves too on both Yagar and Mario.
1:04:18
SPEAKER_04: I remember I think it was 94 or the 2000 season, one of those yeah, I just remember like he he I don't know.
1:04:26
SPEAKER_04: Was he a product of that trap system, or was he like a I think he was a legitimately good goaltender?
1:04:31
SPEAKER_04: You put him on any other team, he's he he was really gonna be really good.
1:04:36
SPEAKER_01: So yeah, he he the the year I remember the most was the year that Mario came back and we made it all the way to the conference finals, and we had that game seven where we beat Hoshik, you know, Darius Gaspar just beat Hashik in overtime, and then Brodor just completely stonewalled us that entire series.
1:04:54
SPEAKER_01: We had like we had no chance.
1:04:56
SPEAKER_04: That would have been 2000, 2001, then the year.
1:04:59
SPEAKER_01: Correct.
1:04:59
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:05:00
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, it's it's kind of weird, like definitely a Hall of Famer, and you know, it kind of goes back like before I do the last guy here.
1:05:08
SPEAKER_04: Like, are these the are they like Steelers or are they like Pittsburgh sports killers, like penguins, steelers, pirates, or are these guys just Hall of Famers and they're just really good and they're good against everybody?
1:05:20
SPEAKER_04: But the ultimate Pittsburgh killer, sports killer guy is one Tom Brady, for sure.
1:05:28
SPEAKER_04: Um nine and four record in 13 games against the Steelers.
1:05:34
SPEAKER_04: Um you know, just in the playoffs, you know, he was crazy.
1:05:39
SPEAKER_04: Five touchdowns and no interceptions.
1:05:42
SPEAKER_04: He had fifty-eight completions with you know eighty-one attempts.
1:05:46
SPEAKER_04: That's the grand total in the playoffs.
1:05:50
SPEAKER_04: He had thirty touchdowns and five interceptions of his career against the Steelers.
1:05:56
SPEAKER_04: He only ever threw one pick six against the Steelers.
1:05:59
SPEAKER_04: I can actually Actually, remember it.
1:06:00
SPEAKER_04: Do you remember what game?
1:06:01
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it was Deshay Townsend on Halloween 2004.
1:06:05
SPEAKER_04: That's pathetic, isn't it?
1:06:07
SPEAKER_04: The only other like big interception I can remember him throwing was to Joe Hayden.
1:06:12
SPEAKER_04: Was that 2018?
1:06:17
SPEAKER_04: I think the biggest time, like we talked about this is probably one of the most painful losses outside of like Pitt West Virginia in '94.
1:06:24
SPEAKER_04: I don't know what is it with years that end in four to him that causes painful playoff losses.
1:06:30
SPEAKER_04: The 2004 Steelers team, 15-1.
1:06:35
SPEAKER_04: And um have we covered this in a in a podcast?
1:06:38
SPEAKER_01: I think we you did an episode on it about the Benz rookie year.
1:06:42
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
1:06:44
SPEAKER_04: 15-1.
1:06:45
SPEAKER_04: And I really thought, boy, if the Steelers are ever gonna win the Super Bowl, I had been a Steelers fan since 91-92, and just thought, boy, man, I I'd really like to see a Super Bowl my lifetime.
1:06:59
SPEAKER_04: It just felt like we came close and we just could never get over the hum.
1:07:03
SPEAKER_04: And that boy, he went 14 for 21 in that game, 207 yards, two touchdowns, and no interceptions.
1:07:10
SPEAKER_04: And he wasn't like I don't know, we just could never beat him for whatever reason.
1:07:14
SPEAKER_04: I I think it was just because the Steelers, the way the Steelers play defense, they play a lot of zone.
1:07:19
SPEAKER_04: And Tom Brady against the zone just is he's very accurate and he's very smart with the football.
1:07:27
SPEAKER_04: And like a guy like that, I always thought he did, he always struggled against like more like the Rex Ryan, the Baltimore Ravens defense, because they played more man.
1:07:37
SPEAKER_04: And that year they beat him in what was that, 2018.
1:07:40
SPEAKER_04: The Steelers played a lot more man against the Patriots.
1:07:44
SPEAKER_04: So I don't know.
1:07:46
SPEAKER_04: He he definitely the all-time, you know, that that game just killed me.
1:07:50
SPEAKER_04: I thought the Steelers would never, never, ever, ever win a Super Bowl, but thank God I was proved wrong the next season.
1:07:56
SPEAKER_04: So what a payoff.
1:07:57
SPEAKER_04: What a payoff.
1:07:58
SPEAKER_04: Made for it's always darkest before the dawn, right, Tim?
1:08:01
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah.
1:08:03
SPEAKER_01: That's that's true.
1:08:04
SPEAKER_01: And yeah, three AFC championship games, and he's three and oh in all three of them.
1:08:09
SPEAKER_01: And I know I know the first one, Bledsoe had to come in and and all that because he had gotten hurt, but still, I just three AFC championship games and then all those regular season games where he just owned us.
1:08:21
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, 2016.
1:08:23
SPEAKER_04: Uh there was the three touchdown, no interception game against the Killer Bees, like with the stupid lacrosse player guy that we mentioned earlier in the podcast.
1:08:32
SPEAKER_04: And um just what what a joke like the Steelers defense was against him.
1:08:37
SPEAKER_04: They just never did.
1:08:39
SPEAKER_04: I mean, I guess he torched a lot of other defenses too, but it just seems like you know, there were just players like Vinny Testaverdi was never all that great against the Steelers.
1:08:48
SPEAKER_04: And I mean, I guess he's not a Hall of Famer, but even Eli Manning, they could shut down at times, Tony Romo.
1:08:55
SPEAKER_04: But like, just for whatever reason, Brady, man, even Marino, like Marino at times they could shut him down, but yeah, Montana too.
1:09:05
SPEAKER_01: They actually had a really good record against Joe Montana.
1:09:07
SPEAKER_01: Uh, not that they played him a whole ton.
1:09:09
SPEAKER_01: But but that's the but I mean Brady's Michael Jordan, and what what NBA teams can say, like, well, they Michael Jordan never really did anything against us, the Milwaukee Bucks.
1:09:19
SPEAKER_01: Like, they they there's no team that can really say that.
1:09:22
SPEAKER_04: Maybe the Pistons.
1:09:23
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, the Pistons early, early in his career.
1:09:26
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah.
1:09:27
SPEAKER_01: But but but I mean, Brady, you know, and and like you said about the defenses, it wasn't Tomlin or Cower or Lebeau or it was just everybody.
1:09:36
SPEAKER_01: It was it was whoever.
1:09:38
SPEAKER_01: It it came it went across errors.
1:09:40
SPEAKER_04: They always kept the same scheme for the most part.
1:09:44
SPEAKER_04: Well, thank you for joining.
1:09:45
SPEAKER_04: If you could go ahead and uh like us on whatever podcast service.
1:09:49
SPEAKER_04: Thank you so much for everybody listening all over these years, and we definitely appreciate it.
1:09:54
SPEAKER_04: Appreciate the feedback.
1:09:56
SPEAKER_04: We'll catch you next time on Pittsburgh Twords Memory.