Latest / BREAK/FIX the Motorsports & Vehicle Enthusiast Variety Show / Evening With A Legend: Doc Bundy

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Evening With A Legend: Doc Bundy · BREAK/FIX the Motorsports & Vehicle Enthusiast Variety Show

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Evening with the Legend is a series of presentations exclusive to
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Legends of the Famous 24 Hours of Le Mans, giving us an opportunity
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to bring a piece of Le Mans to you.
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By sharing stories and highlights of the big event, you get a chance
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to become part of the Legend of Le Mans, with guests from different
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eras of over 100 years of racing.
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Doc Bundy is a renowned figure in motorsports and has left an
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indelible mark on the iconic 24 Hours of Le Mans throughout his career.
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His journey at Le Mans also spans multiple years in teams, each marked
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by displays of exceptional skill, determination, and sportsmanship.
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Doc's driving record reflects a remarkable consistency and competitiveness on
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the legendary circuit, where he has navigated the grueling endurance
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race with precision and flair.
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Whether piloting prototypes or GT cars, Doc's performances have often
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been characterized by a blend of speed, strategy, and resilience,
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earning him admiration from fans and fellow competitors alike.
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This Evening with a Legend was hosted by David Spitzer, a member
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of the ACO USA, and who you might recognize as one of the pit reporters
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from the 24 Hours of Le Mans.
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Welcome to all of our guests this evening from the ACO club.
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We're excited to host another of our theories all about an
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evening chat with racing legend.
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And tonight we are very honored and very excited to speak to doc Bundy with
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a wonderful history and Porsche's and racing many years spent with Al Holbert
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and that legendary team and driving for a number of different manufacturers, but
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without further ado, let me introduce doc.
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Hello y'all.
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So doc, I'm going to kind of get you started and I know because you and I had
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a great chat recently that once we get you going, the wonderful stories will flow.
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Do you want to start with a little bit about how you got into racing, but make
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sure you work us up to Lamar and a little bit of how you got to Lamar, but go ahead.
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Tell us a little bit about getting into racing and the early part of your career.
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Like most karts as a youngster.
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I grew up in a very tiny little town.
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They used to tell me when I was little that it was 2, 000 people, but I think
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they counted all the farms and all the farm animals in that number, because
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I think realistically it was maybe 600 people or something like that.
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I became a paper boy there, took over from another guy that got older and so
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he was ready to quit and hand it down.
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He delivered five different newspapers and two Sunday papers.
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So I increased it to seven daily papers, seven from different
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towns and three Sunday papers.
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So as you can imagine, I start out with a bicycle with baskets and I would have to
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go back to the drugstore and pick up more papers because I couldn't carry all that
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I needed to deliver to the whole town.
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I had a moped for a while.
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After the moped, I had a bicycle.
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Bad rep.
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I ran out of paper about a mile out of town.
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So I got to go back to the goat store and get it real quick.
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So I'm flying back 35 40 mile an hour on the moped and the town was in a valley
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that had two sets of railroad tracks.
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with a creek between them that you crossed.
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As a young boy, I had a friend on the other side of town.
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Two of us rode our bicycles to meet up with him and he went around the
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crossing gate and the train hit him.
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Oh goodness.
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Oh yeah.
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Now you got to help us get back to racing.
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Come on, how does this get us to racing?
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Were you making money with your paper route and that got you to get a go kart?
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What happened was, I was on a Saturday, I was collecting.
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At this time, I had a yard cart with a Clinton engine on it, and I fiddled
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around with it a little bit to try to make it a little bit faster.
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When I was on one side of town, I heard this noise that sounded
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like my engine with no muffler.
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I worked my way down, customer wise, to the ballpark, and here
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was two go karts running there.
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Real go karts.
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Not yard carts.
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Proper go carts.
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Yeah.
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And so I ride up these two guys and they were just riding down there at the
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park with ball field from another town.
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They'd come over trying to get kids or people to show up
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because they wanted to sell them.
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I couldn't wait to get done.
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So they let me drive it.
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I thought, Oh, this is the real thing.
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And I have grown up.
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My father taking me to race.
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Where was that now?
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What track?
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Would we know it?
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They were okay.
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As soon as I got home, you know, I grabbed my dad and I said,
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Dad, you got to see these things.
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These are amazing.
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He was a race fan.
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So he got into it.
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He got along with some other fathers and they, in the end, they built a racetrack.
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Oh, wow.
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We started out down there beyond the ballpark on a dirt track.
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Oh, that lasted not too long floods and things kind of ruined it.
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They ended up making a paved track and I was part of the building process.
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That's when I learned to drive a pickup truck.
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And so we raced go karts till I was probably a senior.
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Then I went off to a school in Minneapolis and went to work
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for an airline in Chicago.
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The weirdest thing is my ideal race car.
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Post Vietnam, a Formula B car, which morphed into a Formula Atlantic
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eventually, that was my dream car.
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I just had to have one of those.
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I never had one.
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I never got to drive one.
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That was the goal to get to that level of pace, that level of
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power and everything else, right?
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Yeah.
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I had a friend that we went together and bought a Lotus 22
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Formula C car, 1100 cc engine.
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That didn't last very long.
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Got crashed.
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Wasn't my crash.
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Driven up to Watkins Glen to do a regional, forgot to charge the battery.
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So I was out first practice and a guy spun in front of me and
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so I had to spin to miss him.
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Going into turn one, so I went off on the outside and it wouldn't restart.
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Battery was dead.
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They wouldn't let me move the car.
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And of course, I got hit.
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We almost got into a fight.
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This is not worth your life.
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It is fine.
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It's everything I have is invested in this thing.
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There's a waving yellow.
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There's no problem.
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All the cars have gone by.
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They've seen it.
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You were in the strike zone.
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Yep.
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And I saw this car coming and I could see his eyes and he was
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staring at my race car and I thought, no, no, no, no, don't look at it.
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Because your hands follow your up.
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So sure enough, he realized the last second that he was going to
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hit it, and he blocked up, went into the side of it, bent the chassis.
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So I had no clue how to fix that.
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So if we go on Wikipedia, this made you chuckle because I shared with you
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what it says on Wikipedia about you.
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It says you started out, I thought it said mechanic, but it says car prep.
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Tell us a little bit about the early days with Peter Gregg, the
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legend from the Brumos organization.
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Give us a few minutes of what it took to get into your first Porsche race car.
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From that experience, God knows how I ever convinced him to even take my phone
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calls, but I started calling John Bishop.
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I'm trying to talk him into taking Making formula be part of it was new to talk.
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And so that was my goal.
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And I call him all the calls.
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I don't know.
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Bless that man.
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Everybody talks about him being a saint.
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Now I've got more evidence.
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It was when Peg would answer.
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Usually Peg would answer, but sometimes he would.
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And she would say, Okay, Doc, just a minute.
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I'll get John.
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And he would take the call.
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So, and eventually what he did is he said, Doc, he says, you've got
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great ideas, very enthusiastic, and you need to Get experience.
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You need real world experience.
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You need to go work for a race team.
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So after the crash of my car, I didn't have a choice.
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Quit the airline, called Peter Gregg out of the blue.
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I picked him because I wanted to be in EMSA.
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To me, it was either or.
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Roger Penske, but I was afraid of Roger Penske because he
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looked too military oriented, and I'd come out of the military.
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I didn't want to stay in there.
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Or Roy Woods, because he ran 5, 000 Trans Am in Canada, which was great
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racing, but I wanted to be in EMSA.
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I saw an ad that said that Peter, Greg was looking for people, a gopher.
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I called Peter, he said, well, if you'll come down here to Jacksonville,
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I was up in Ohio at that time.
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If you'll come down here to Jacksonville, he says, I've got about
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seven of you guys I'm gonna try out.
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And he says, whoever works the best, that's who I'm gonna hire.
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Well, that was simple to me.
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'cause you know, I'm a returning vet.
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I could outwork anybody, so I didn't have anything.
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I go down there.
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Get to the shop.
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They're getting ready for Sebring and they'd already won the 24.
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So I lived in the race shop for a couple of weeks and then we
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went to Sebring and we won there.
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He sold that car and we've got another new car.
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for the next event, which was back then Road Atlanta.
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We went there, we won there.
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So we won four races in a row.
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Now, he hadn't hired me officially, but after each race, because he won
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or sat on the pole one or the other, he gave us each a hundred dollars.
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I had some to live on.
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When I came back, I couldn't keep living in the race shop.
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One of the other guys that got hired, his dad was the sheriff of Ruvala
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County, which is the whole city.
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And his mother was a doctor.
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Later on, he becomes a FBI agent.
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So that's how I started with Peter.
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I just outworked everybody.
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And I would stay in the shop.
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There was a little MG dealership in front of the warehouse where the race shop was.
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I would go over there because they had a shower and I could shower and that
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story though is everybody in racing.
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I mean, everybody's got to make a sacrifice.
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You've got to have that journey to really value it.
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So you spend some time taking care of the motor home for them and kind
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of working your way into things.
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How many years of hard work was it before you started driving?
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And then how many years of driving before you were graced with the
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opportunity to run at Le Mans?
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I was two years with Peter and realized there was no future for what I wanted.
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About the early fall of the second year, I went to Peter and I said, look, I'm
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going to leave at the end of the season.
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He said, where are you going to go?
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And I, Oh, I'm looking for, Someplace where I might have an opportunity
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to drive at some point and he goes, it's never going to happen.
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He says, I've met your family.
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They have no money.
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Who's going to give you a 50, 000 race car to learn to drive?
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And I go, I know how to race like that.
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But his telling me no, no, no, just motivated me.
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That much more, I was determined and along that period, I had met Al
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Holberg, he had an engine, a three liter that Peter bought from him.
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So I got sent to get the engine.
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I already had met Al and had talked with him and that sort of thing.
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So I went up there to get the engine and he just kept delaying, delaying,
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delaying, delaying, giving it to me.
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And so finally I sat down with Al and he said, What's your big hurry to go back?
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It was on a weekend.
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I'd driven up Friday, and then I had the weekend off, and
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then back to work on Monday.
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He wanted me to stay and chat with him, because we talk racing,
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much to the chagrin of his wife.
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So Al said, why don't you come to work for me?
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And I go, well, no, I'm committed to Peter for the balance of this year.
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I said, besides Al, what I want to do is drive eventually.
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You know, I made it clear up front, and he said, okay.
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I said, we're about the same age, and you have all this experience,
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and you are really good.
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I could never drive with you because I have to go through the learning phases.
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He eventually convinced me, because I finished with Peter at the
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Christmas party, actually got a handwritten letter of recommendation.
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Anytime you ever want to come back, we'll welcome you.
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And I said, well, I hope I won't be back, unless you're hiring me as a driver.
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And he laughed, and we parted on friendly terms.
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I didn't want to go to work for Al because I just didn't think
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I would have a future there.
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Didn't feel like I had a lot to offer, but he kept calling, how
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would you view this happening?
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How do you view that you could get to drive?
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And I said, well, I have some ideas about sponsorship and
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I'll search out sponsorship.
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I can help on the race car, but I'm not going to be a mechanic.
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Brumos tried to make me a mechanic.
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I didn't want to be one.
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I learned to do things.
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I disassembled a 917 engine cannon with the real mechanic.
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He made me take everything apart.
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And I said, how are we ever going to get it back together?
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He just laughed.
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He says, I'll put it together.
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Don't worry.
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I just knew enough and could do enough to understand mechanics.
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You know, I knew the cars because I would turn just enough
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wrenches To learn the cars.
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Eventually, Al convinced me to come to work for him.
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That next year, still living in Jacksonville, he had me come down
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to Daytona and he says, we'll move you to Pennsylvania after the race.
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We did pretty good in the race.
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I don't remember where we finished that first year, but we were in
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contention through a lot of the race.
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And I think it had some kind of a problem that we lost time.
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And then we get up to Pennsylvania.
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He moves me in the house with him, his wife and two children.
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I was there for probably about two months, finally got a place of my own.
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In the meantime I started learning how to promote Al.
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He didn't have much of a reputation then, other than he was Bob Holbrook's son.
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His father was a banker.
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pretty successful racer.
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Father was a wonderful guy, but Al, you know, like most sons and dads, the
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two of them didn't always get along.
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So he would always put me in the middle.
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And I didn't want to be in the middle.
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And he treated me like a brother and he felt like a brother to me.
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So we got really close.
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So I started making sponsorship deals.
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They were small deals, but.
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Nevertheless, brought money to the team and then I developed a press kit.
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I went to Penske because his connection to them over and over.
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So I went over and they kind of taught me how to do a press kit and give me
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one of theirs to use as a example.
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From that, I started a newsletter that I would send out to sponsors and fans.
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And I started getting him to do clothing, t shirts and hats and things
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like that, jackets, apparel, that started going really well on its own.
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And then I would find him rides and things that he would never
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have thought about, like super Vs.
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I got to ride in a super V a couple of times, an Atlantic car.
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And he would say, why are you doing this?
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He says, I know why you're doing it.
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These are cars you want to drive.
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And I said, no, Al, I'm trying to expand your portfolio.
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So it actually included IMSA races.
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So I was well known in the paddock, Mr.
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Friendly to everybody.
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And Mr.
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Make it happen.
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No excuses, not afraid of hard work.
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You're going to make it happen.
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Yeah, I did some crazy things, I recommended him for rides, I'd write
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to people and they would know him and I knew he had a connection and they call
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him and they say, uh, who's Doc Bundy?
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And he goes, Oh, he works for me.
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He's in charge of sparkle and glitter.
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Sparkle and glitter.
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Yeah, you know, trying to promote out.
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I figured if I pushed him hard enough up, he might drag me along.
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I truly was invested in helping to build Holbrook racing, a real entity, and he
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had a great work ethic, how he approached racing, the cars, everything was just
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wonderful and super good driver, most sensitive driver I've ever met in my life.
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He never told me how to drive, would ask questions.
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And then make me give him the answers to him.
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And we did a lot of testing and I learned to love that he never owned a 935.
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So I made deals that would include me.
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And so I get one or two races a year in other people's cars.
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Gary Belcher out of Florida, he invented the bang stick.
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Anyway, his 935, I was friends with his crew chief.
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And when I would talk to him about maybe using Al.
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And he goes, Al would drive our car.
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And I said, yeah, I know how you prepare a car.
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You do a good car.
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And Al has a good year contract.
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So for a 24 hour race, can you imagine a better situation?
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You have to pay Al something, but he'll bring tires to the deal.
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And you got to let me drive.
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So my friend says, okay.
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We'll do it.
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And then later on it was Preston.
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His old crew chief is a good friend of mine, a guy named Gary Cummings.
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Yeah.
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Gary's a very good friend, but keep on going.
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So you got with Preston.
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You're starting to get a little bit of driving.
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I would get to do these one offs here and there.
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I drove Moby Dick, you know, Preston had bought that was
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not part of the plan at all.
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It was at the Daytona Finale.
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Back then, you know, they would run around Thanksgiving.
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Yep.
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And I was driving with Bonnie in a 935.
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He had like two 935s in the special car.
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He and Al were driving it while I was leading the race and Preston
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doesn't want to get in the car.
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The car that I was driving with Bonnie blew a rear tire going into three.
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And of course, put it up almost on its nose and came back down and I, I
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kept it from crashing tire tore up the right side and took out an oil cooler.
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So we were out of the race, tow it back to the pits and I'm in the pits and Preston
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comes up and he says, get your helmet.
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And I said, get my helmet for what?
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I thought maybe he wanted me to help fuel or something.
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And he says, you're going to get in the car.
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I've already talked to Al, Al's okay with it.
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And I said, what?
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I've never even sat in that car.
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And he goes, you'll be okay.
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You'll be okay.
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Well, the seat was like way wide.
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So I had to have him put pills in.
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And even then I go into the infield and come into the corners and I have to slide
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up on this side of the seat, go through this one back to this side and see for
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this one, but I'm running first and second, I'm racing Wallach and I raced
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him in the wrong place because I could pass him anytime I wanted on the bank.
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It was inexperienced.
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And he short braked me going into the kink in the infield.
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He short braked me all at once.
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He was smart.
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He knew I wouldn't hit him.
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So I spun off and I fell back.
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But I ended up finishing second in the race in the end.
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I was catching back up and then the race was over.
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What was your first year at Le Mans?
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What was your first Le Mans experience?
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82.
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82.
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Okay.
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I had won the runoffs in 80 with the deep production, the deep production 924.
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That was my first full time ride.
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Became an instructor at Road Atlanta.
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I separated from Hobart racing.
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And that was because I believed that if I was there, Al would always
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count on me to straighten things out with his race cars and his crew.
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And I wanted to be separate.
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I want concentration on what I was going to drive.
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And he was pretty good about that.
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At one point, he was questioning, why doesn't Doc drive with
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you in the Michelob portion?
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And I helped him get that sponsorship.
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And he goes, Doc's very demanding.
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Doc knows what he wants, gosh darn it.
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Anyway, racing the 924, we win the runoffs.
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And of course, Hoppin promised me the world if I won the race and nothing
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happened and afterwards I kind of went through withdrawals because through
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the balance of November and through December into January, I didn't
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know if I was ever going to get to driving because there was no plan.
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So I'm working at Road Atlanta.
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Just hustling rides wherever I can find them.
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Usually not getting paid anything.
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Usually do good with whatever car I drove.
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I'd get the max out of it and put it in places where it had never been before.
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So things weren't terribly bleak.
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I drew upon my experiences from Vietnam where, you know, if you were super
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aggressive, you got a lot of praise.
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You go out and shot people or created good situations for the army.
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Then they praise you a lot and put you on a pedestal and all that silly stuff.
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So I realized, okay, I'm going through that here in peacetime in racing.
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Then it was decided, okay, the 924 turbos coming out.
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So we got one of those.
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Al was playing with stock cars at that time.
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I still said, well, we have to do sports car racing.
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You know, that's your roots.
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And I said, I hate stock car racing, the rules and all the
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crap that you can go through.
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I would threaten to leave so many times.
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You know, we were a Northern team, so we got a lot of crap.
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We don't cotton to your kind around here, Yankees, right?
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Yeah, they liked Al, but I was not as personal and I would tell Al,
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I say, you know, when I pull into the NASCAR track, I know it's going
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to be a battle that it's not fun.
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So I didn't want to continue doing it.
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After that, Porsche offered him a deal to run the 924 turbo and it was going
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to be him and I, because now I'm at a level that I don't hold him back, not
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necessarily quite as fast, but Far off.
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And he picks Rick Mears as the third driver.
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Wow.
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Yeah.
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And I'm going, Oh my God, what are you doing to me, Al?
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I got to drive Rick Mears.
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I go there and Porsche is running Porsche Motorsports and he's the, Making a
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big deal about the 924 and this team.
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And so we have to do a press conference.
22:28
So we go over to the tower, do a media thing.
22:32
On the way there, Al goes and says, okay, you're going to be team leader in this.
22:38
And I said, what?
22:39
He said, you're going to be the team leader.
22:41
Rick and I've already talked about it.
22:42
Rick agrees.
22:44
And I said, okay, whatever.
22:46
So we do the news conference and they ask Al questions.
22:50
Then they ask Rick questions and they started asking Rick about IndyCars
22:55
because the car season hadn't started yet.
22:57
He says, I'm not here to talk about IndyCars.
22:59
I'm here to drive a Porsche, and the team leader is Doc Bundy.
23:03
He says, that's who you need to direct your questions at.
23:07
And I was floored.
23:08
To get any kind of respect from somebody at that level blew me away.
23:12
We didn't do so well in the race.
23:14
We had problems with the car, but we did finish.
23:17
I don't know where, but we did finish.
23:19
But that led on to me running Trans Am races with the 924 Turbo.
23:26
Transcribed And because I did that, obviously got experience running
23:31
the 924 turbo, and that was the BF Goodrich car was a 924 turbo that
23:38
Buzz put together with BF Goodrich.
23:40
And I knew all the BF Goodrich people from IMSA racing.
23:44
Yep.
23:45
So I knew them all.
23:46
So when they asked me if I would drive, you know, I said, sure.
23:49
A little different schedule.
23:51
It was Daytona and Sebring and Le Mans.
23:54
So I was going to say the first time you went to Le Mans, was it in that 924 turbo?
23:58
Yes.
23:59
And the livery on that car was BFG?
24:01
Yes.
24:02
So we had run Daytona, I think we finished, and then we went to Sebring.
24:07
And I was given a new teammate, James Brolin.
24:11
Oh, wow.
24:11
The movie star.
24:13
And he may have been at Daytona.
24:15
I don't remember that if he was, he was in this, the other car, he
24:19
and I were together at Sebring and during night practice, he hit a pig.
24:24
Oh, that's a bummer.
24:26
And it wasn't his fault.
24:28
Somebody had brought it there as a pet.
24:30
And a dog chased it.
24:31
And you know, being around racing, we had a lot of what we called agriculturals.
24:35
You know, when you're driving a race car, you're committed.
24:37
And if an animal gets in the way, it's an ugly scene.
24:40
You know, it's just, there's nothing you can do.
24:42
You know, it's horrible for that pig.
24:43
And it's a pretty dense thing to hit.
24:45
I'm sure it tore up the race car real good.
24:47
You know, I'm on the radio.
24:49
I'm out of the car.
24:50
Obviously, James is out there.
24:52
And it happened right after the hairpin, then the high speed S's.
24:57
It was in the ICS is where it broke.
24:59
I can picture it.
25:00
Yep.
25:00
You know, you're faster.
25:01
You're flat out.
25:02
It freaked him out pretty much.
25:04
I figured it totaled the car.
25:06
First, when he called in, he said, I've been in a wreck.
25:09
I just hit a pig.
25:10
And you're like, what?
25:12
James, where are you?
25:13
Cause I figured he ran off somewhere in the back straight
25:16
of missed that corner back there.
25:19
He says, I'm just outside the SS.
25:21
And I said, after the hairpin, and he said, yes, I said, are you okay?
25:25
He says, yeah, but the car really messed up.
25:27
I can't drive it back.
25:29
Obviously they had to stop the session and load it on a flatbed and bring it back.
25:34
The crew repaired the car.
25:35
They pulled the frame out and finished the race.
25:38
And after the race, You know how the paddocks open?
25:42
People from over there can get into the paddock.
25:44
And these people showed up and they said, can we talk to James Brolin?
25:49
James was in the motorhome.
25:50
And I said, nah, I don't think he wants to talk to anybody.
25:53
He's pretty shy.
25:54
And they said, well, we brought him a plate.
25:57
pig.
25:58
I said, no, I really don't think you want that.
26:02
Was it cooked or was it raw?
26:04
So, I go in the motorhome.
26:05
I was trying to be nice to them.
26:07
So, I go in the motorhome.
26:08
I said, James, I think I know what you're gonna say but would you be
26:12
interested in eating some pork?
26:15
And he goes, what?
26:16
What are you talking about?
26:17
And I said, the people butchered the pig and And they brought a plate
26:24
over, they want to give to you.
26:26
And he says, I don't want to meet him.
26:28
And I said, I understand.
26:30
I said, I'll take care of it.
26:31
So I went back out and I made apologies and everything.
26:34
And I said, but I think the crew might.
26:36
Oh, heck yes.
26:37
That crew was going to relish every bite and tell that story.
26:40
That's as good as it gets.
26:43
That's Sebring through and through, isn't it?
26:47
So from there, then I ended up at Lamar and Lamar was unique was my first visit.
26:53
So I had so much to learn.
26:55
There's so much going on.
26:57
You're there very early.
26:59
Go through the tech stuff and all that goes on.
27:02
We have Jim Busby, me, and Mignot was our French driver because
27:07
they wanted a local driver.
27:09
Always a good idea to grease the skids when you go to Le
27:12
Mans to put a French guy in.
27:13
We had Christophe Tanso and the four of that guys had Franck Friant.
27:17
Always the same thing.
27:18
You pick a good French driver and put him in and it just makes
27:21
everything a lot easier at Le Mans.
27:22
Well, Mignot, he'd run many times.
27:25
in the race itself, everything.
27:27
Mostly Porsches, but every model of Porsches.
27:30
And he was the head instructor at their school there.
27:34
So he knew everybody by first name.
27:38
So he thought it was kind of a shoot.
27:39
Well, guess what?
27:41
The engine let go in night practice and he had only had two laps when it let go.
27:46
We didn't really think anything of it.
27:48
We weren't surprised the engine let go, a little disappointed.
27:51
I got my laps in, Jim had gotten his laps in, but then Jim got in the second car.
27:58
Back then you, if it was a team car, you could move over
28:02
and do laps in another car.
28:04
So he did that just to experience in the other car, the Herman Miller car.
28:08
Make a long story short, the ACO decided there was only one driver, me, because
28:14
we had turned a lap time fast enough to be in the field, not very far out because
28:20
of the car, but we were right up with all the other 924 turbos in the race.
28:25
on race tracks and all.
28:26
And we qualified on the street tires, though BF Goodrich had brought us a set
28:31
of, they removed the sidewall, but I think they were Dunlop's slicks in case
28:35
we needed them, but we never needed them.
28:37
We were fast enough.
28:38
Wow.
28:39
They interpreted by who told them, you know, it was one of the officials at the
28:44
pit said, well, he got in the other car.
28:47
So he's driving the other car.
28:48
Yeah.
28:48
So there was a big thing and Porsche was involved, we have Goodrich was
28:52
involved all day Friday and finally we got reinstated, but they didn't tell us.
28:57
They said, well, be ready to do warmup in the morning, just
29:01
in case, change your mind.
29:02
They said, well, there's only one driver and he can't do that.
29:05
So they argued, no, we didn't take Jim out of that car.
29:09
And they said, well, you know, didn't do his required night.
29:14
In the end, they let us start last, and it was Jim and I.
29:18
In morning warm up, it had rained some, a little bit, so the grass was wet.
29:23
I went off in the Porsche curves, and the back end hit the guardrail,
29:27
and it broke the taillight.
29:29
We didn't have a spare taillight.
29:30
So, Porsche goes, We know where there's one.
29:33
In the parking lot.
29:34
It was Derek Bell's car.
29:38
They didn't tell him.
29:39
They just took it.
29:40
Of course not.
29:40
He was gonna say no.
29:42
Screw that.
29:42
They just took it.
29:43
I think he was driving without.
29:45
They'll give it back at the end of the race.
29:47
It'll be fine.
29:47
He'll never notice.
29:48
Right.
29:49
Fast forward one year.
29:50
The following year you went back to Le Mans and I think you did real well.
29:54
Is that correct?
29:55
No, I never did.
29:57
We won our class with a blown head gasket, one tire, one tire for 24 hours.
30:04
Argued with the BF Goodrich guys.
30:06
I said, no, no, we can't change it.
30:09
It had a very slight cut in the sidewall on the right front tire.
30:13
And I said, oh no, we can't change it.
30:15
It's.
30:15
Sunday, you know, it'll make it.
30:17
It's as good as the other tires, other than that little cut.
30:20
And they go, we cannot risk it.
30:21
So they changed one tire.
30:23
So it was you and Busby.
30:25
With a blown head gasket.
30:26
And Mignot didn't get in the car.
30:28
Never got in the car.
30:29
And the two of you guys with the same set of tires ran the whole
30:32
24 hours and won your class.
30:35
Yes, and it came down to a race at the end with Billy Hagan.
30:38
We were in the same class with Billy Hagan's Camaro.
30:41
I was going to say I had to be a Camaro if it's Billy Hagan.
30:44
They kept breaking gearboxes.
30:45
Bless their hearts.
30:46
We'd be ahead and they'd run us down passes, passes, passes with no boost.
30:51
We're doing two laps at a time.
30:52
Sunday afternoon, coming in, putting bars, leak in, putting water back
30:56
in, going back out for two more laps.
30:58
That's how we spend Sunday afternoon.
31:01
So you're not just a little bit of blown head gasket.
31:03
Your head gasket is junk.
31:04
You are pumping water out of that thing.
31:06
Yes.
31:08
That's crazy.
31:09
We held her breath.
31:11
There was a little bit of a showdown thing that happened because I was
31:14
supposed to finish and I got yanked out of the car by a then team leader owner.
31:20
I was really, really upset.
31:23
I bet.
31:24
I went back to the trailer and was packing up.
31:26
I'm going home.
31:27
The heck with him.
31:27
Gary Pace, BF Goodrich, the guy at the races that ran the thing.
31:32
And Gary came in the trailer where I was.
31:34
He says, Doc, you got to put your gear back on.
31:37
I said, I won't drive for that blankety blank ever again.
31:41
He says, no, you don't understand.
31:43
If Jim finishes the race, he goes illegal.
31:45
We lose.
31:46
Oh, we had to follow the rules.
31:50
Yeah.
31:50
Right.
31:51
Yes.
31:51
He was going to go over the time limit.
31:53
I bitched for a little while and finally I realized, you know, I
31:57
can't throw them under the bus.
31:59
No, and all the crew guys and everything.
32:02
There's so much that's gone into this at that point.
32:04
And I said, if you remove her from the pit, I'll come back
32:07
out and I'll finish the race.
32:09
So he said, get your gear on and he left.
32:11
So when I come out, I didn't even look over there.
32:14
I just got my helmet on and they says, we'll bring Jim in now.
32:18
He'll be right in, got in the car and finished the race, which was an experience
32:21
in itself because Al was in that race.
32:25
And I can't remember if that's the one they won.
32:28
Or he was second, but you know, it was Porsche one, two, I
32:31
think maybe one, two, three.
32:33
And so i'm trying to go fast enough because they were catching
32:36
me right at the end of the lap.
32:38
So I wanted to cross the finish line right behind them if I could but I
32:41
couldn't keep up with them, you know On the last lap nobody's really racing as we
32:46
come on to this Start, finish straight.
32:48
There's like a sea of people, flagmen in front of them,
32:52
running with the checkered flag.
32:54
The cars are all coming to a stop and turning right.
32:57
And I said to the crew, I'm not even going to get the checkered flag.
33:02
The race is over.
33:03
It's okay.
33:04
Back it up.
33:05
And he goes, no, it's okay.
33:06
The race is over.
33:08
We won our category.
33:09
So it's stop and go, stop and go, stop and go, stop and go.
33:12
We get up, and it's the impound area, and there's joint arms all
33:16
around it, people everywhere.
33:18
They open the gate and let you in, they close the gate, open the gate, let you in.
33:22
So we get in there, and there's people everywhere, and
33:25
they're pounding on the car.
33:27
So I'm afraid to get out of the car, and I'm talking to the crew, and
33:30
they said, you got to come over here, because we got to go up on the stand.
33:34
And I go, I'm afraid to get out and I'm not taking anything
33:38
off and it's hot as hell.
33:39
Come and get me.
33:40
Come and get me.
33:41
I don't know where I am.
33:42
So they finally get over there, get all my gear up and they said,
33:45
the car is going to be okay.
33:46
The John Arms are here and all.
33:48
And I said, but there's people everywhere.
33:50
They said, yeah, well, they're watching.
33:52
They won't steal anything off the car.
33:53
I said, yeah, right.
33:54
So they start walking towards tower.
33:57
Well, the gate was the left.
33:59
And I said, we got to go out the gate.
34:00
They said, what are you talking about?
34:01
And we walk over and the fence around the impound was like a foot and a half.
34:06
So it's no wonder it was full of people.
34:09
Cause they didn't step over it.
34:11
So we step across and we go over to the tower to do the, Victory thing.
34:16
That's crazy.
34:17
And I love the story.
34:18
So during the race coming out of Arash, kind of a slow corner, you
34:23
come back towards the Porsche curves.
34:24
Yep.
34:25
But when you come out of that corner, it was the second gear corner for
34:28
us, and you'd shift to third and there was a little road right there
34:32
where you shifted the third cut.
34:33
Something outta the corner of my eye.
34:35
I haven't looked over.
34:36
And here's a guy in a bikini and he is shooting me the bird.
34:41
Then I'm shift third and I'm gone.
34:43
And I'm thinking, did I really see that?
34:46
Is that real?
34:47
I think about it the whole lab.
34:49
I come around again.
34:51
When I come off the corner, I look over there and there he is.
34:53
And he gives me the thing.
34:56
Well, now I'm perplexed.
34:57
Does he hate Americans?
34:59
Hate BFGoodrich horses?
35:01
Why is he eating fingers?
35:04
So I never really tell anybody about this.
35:08
I just kind of forget about it after the race and all.
35:10
But he was there every lap.
35:12
So we get back to the States.
35:14
We're at a race somewhere.
35:16
I'm in the Trans Am car and Al's in the Can Am car.
35:18
We're talking, we usually broom together when we race together.
35:22
I remembered that guy, Lamar, and I said, I gotta tell you something.
35:26
So I told him the story and he goes, Oh yeah, he did the same thing to me.
35:32
We both laughed about it and wondered, you know, what was his motivation?
35:36
Maybe he just hated all racers and he lived in that village back there.
35:40
Right.
35:41
It was crazy.
35:41
That's hilarious.
35:42
That same part of the racetrack, as you come off of Arnage and
35:45
head up towards Porsche Curves.
35:46
On the right side, there's about three or four people that live there, and I've
35:50
had the opportunity to go around the racetrack with a guy that puts up all the
35:53
fences, and they block those people in.
35:55
Those people are landlocked.
35:57
They gotta, they gotta have groceries for a week because,
36:01
or whatever, for a couple days.
36:02
They put the racetrack up, and those people can't go anywhere.
36:04
There's a bloody racetrack going across the end of their driveway.
36:07
Now see, that confirms why he was that way.
36:10
He gave everybody the fence.
36:13
You know what the best part about this evening with a legend tradition is that
36:16
we're building is that we get wonderful people on here with great experiences
36:20
but we never know where it's going to go.
36:22
I guarantee you I did not think we were talking about that today.
36:25
You know, I went back with Jaguar a couple years later.
36:28
With Bob Tullius and the group 44 Jag, right?
36:31
Right.
36:31
My big suggestion to him was we needed to take our own toilet paper.
36:38
Because what you get at Le Mans is not what you're going to be used to.
36:43
It's not very comfortable and it runs out quickly.
36:48
So our whole rig went.
36:49
The truck driver made sure that we had two big bundles of toilet
36:54
paper when we went over there.
36:55
We were the only ones comfortable.
36:57
That's great.
36:58
You had a ton of success over many, many years, and we're certainly
37:01
honored to have this time with you.
37:03
What a great pleasure.
37:03
What a treat for us all to get to know you a little bit this
37:06
evening and to hear these stories.
37:09
I mean, it's just priceless.
37:10
I admire you for the hard work.
37:12
You're an inspiration.
37:12
As I explained to you, I'm an amateur, but all of us Have our own goals,
37:17
whether it's in racing or whatever, and your perseverance, your attitude of
37:21
whatever it takes is certainly inspiring.
37:24
So thank you so much for being with us.
37:37
This episode has been brought to you by the Automobile Club
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For over a century, the 24 Hours of Le Mans has urged manufacturers to
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To learn more about, or to become a member of the ACO USA, look no further than www.
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