Latest / Pit Talk / Is Norris back in the title fight? Dutch GP Review I Pit Talk

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Is Norris back in the title fight? Dutch GP Review I Pit Talk · Pit Talk

0:05
Speaker 1: Hello and welcome to Pitt Talk, brought to you by Shannon's.
0:08
Speaker 1: On today's episode, Lando Norris wins the Dutch Grand Prix,
0:12
Speaker 1: his second victory on the bounce, but is the reigning
0:14
Speaker 1: champion back in the title fight? And after a big
0:17
Speaker 1: week of driver contract announcements, what's next for the silly season?
0:22
Speaker 1: My name's Michael Laminato. It's great to have your company
0:24
Speaker 1: and the company of my co-host. He's been playing European
0:28
Speaker 1: electronic dance music loudly all week to commemorate the final
0:31
Speaker 1: Dutch Grand Prix. It's Matt Clayton.
0:33
Speaker 2: That just sounds like every other week in this house, Michael.
0:35
Speaker 2: That's no different as far as I'm concerned. I'm disappointed
0:38
Speaker 2: that the Dutch Grand Prix is off the calendar because
0:40
Speaker 2: I've just finally learned the words to the Supermax song.
0:43
Speaker 2: It's taken me a while. But I've got there eventually.
0:46
Speaker 2: There's only two of them. I've got them in the
0:49
Speaker 2: correct order. But yeah, it is bizarre, that Grand Prix,
0:52
Speaker 2: because even when we had the red flag on Sunday
0:55
Speaker 2: with the crash at the start, it's like, oh, here's
0:57
Speaker 2: another chance to play some more music. So they just
0:59
Speaker 2: do that. So it's an interesting crowd. But yeah, They're
1:02
Speaker 2: up and about, but they weren't quite as up and
1:04
Speaker 2: about as they often are in that particular race.
1:06
Speaker 1: No, although they do, it seems obviously the first three
1:09
Speaker 1: races all won by Max Verstappen here and they partied
1:12
Speaker 1: well into the night. It didn't seem to make much
1:14
Speaker 1: difference from what I observed when other drivers won this race. No.
1:17
Speaker 1: They continued to party and good on them. They all
1:20
Speaker 1: seem to be having a very good time, except for Max, perhaps,
1:22
Speaker 1: but we'll talk about him a little bit later on.
1:25
Speaker 1: Let's start with the winner of this Grand Prix. Lando
1:27
Speaker 1: Norris didn't think he was going to be able to
1:29
Speaker 1: do it, even after he qualified in pole position, said
1:31
Speaker 1: the car wasn't fast enough. That's, of course, based on
1:34
Speaker 1: the sprint that had happened earlier that day in which
1:36
Speaker 1: his car did fade. The tyres did not stay alive,
1:39
Speaker 1: had rear problems. No such problems for most of the
1:43
Speaker 1: Grand Prix overcame Kimi Antonelli in what was actually, I think,
1:47
Speaker 1: one of the races of the season. You had a
1:48
Speaker 1: little bit of strategic variability thanks to some rain before
1:51
Speaker 1: the race and things really opened up. But more to
1:53
Speaker 1: the point, another win for McLaren after that upgrade in
1:57
Speaker 1: Hungary and some more upgrades this weekend, the ones that
2:00
Speaker 1: Team boss Andrea Stella said could put them back into
2:02
Speaker 1: the mix and has, in fact, for regular victories, very regular,
2:05
Speaker 1: two out of two. The question, though, Matt, is that's
2:09
Speaker 1: being asked this week, of course, because there's no race
2:11
Speaker 1: this weekend, so we've got to ask something. Is this
2:13
Speaker 1: enough to put Norris, the defending world champion, back in
2:16
Speaker 1: the hunt to defend his world championship?
2:18
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's interesting, by the way, in that preamble there,
2:20
Speaker 2: you mentioned the sprint. I'd actually forgotten there was one,
2:22
Speaker 2: so that's how well that went on Saturday, but... another
2:26
Speaker 2: great chapter in a memorable Formula One sprints, the world's
2:29
Speaker 2: shortest book. But look, it's interesting, isn't it? Because on
2:32
Speaker 2: performance alone, you would have to say that you're starting
2:35
Speaker 2: to get vibes from about this time last year when
2:38
Speaker 2: we all thought mathematically Max Verstappen had no chance to
2:40
Speaker 2: win the world championship. And then lo and behold, he
2:42
Speaker 2: loses it by two points. And I mean, that's obviously
2:45
Speaker 2: a very, very, very special driver in a team that
2:48
Speaker 2: knows how to win world championships and so on. So
2:50
Speaker 2: I'm not quite putting it in that category yet, but
2:53
Speaker 2: The fact we're even having this discussion, I think, is
2:55
Speaker 2: the really interesting part for me. The uncertainty of how
2:59
Speaker 2: many races we have to go and where the finish
3:01
Speaker 2: line is and will it be sub-10 degree temperatures at
3:04
Speaker 2: the finish line of the season, all these other things.
3:06
Speaker 2: It would be nice to know that before we get
3:08
Speaker 2: definitively into is this actually on or not. But on
3:12
Speaker 2: the basis of what we've seen these past two weekends...
3:16
Speaker 2: I would say it's the most accomplished Formula One win
3:20
Speaker 2: Norris has had. I think he's had, what, 12, 13
3:22
Speaker 2: of them now? I think it was just incredibly impressive
3:25
Speaker 2: in the way that he handled it. You were right.
3:27
Speaker 2: It was a thoroughly entertaining race, which we've not said
3:30
Speaker 2: too many times this year. And particularly, I didn't expect
3:32
Speaker 2: it at this particular track, because this is like Suzuka
3:35
Speaker 2: by the Sea, isn't it, really? It's like a one-line,
3:37
Speaker 2: super-fast track, designed by the same designer, by the way.
3:40
Speaker 2: And where passing is at a premium, but the drivers
3:42
Speaker 2: love it. But a bit of rain, red flag, tyre variability...
3:46
Speaker 2: really fluctuating pace. And Norris just handled what was a
3:49
Speaker 2: bit of a tricky race to execute with so much assurance,
3:54
Speaker 2: I suppose. We'll look back at this and go pole
3:55
Speaker 2: to win. What's the big deal? This was nowhere near
3:57
Speaker 2: as easy as that and won it very comfortably. So
4:01
Speaker 2: the long-winded answer to your question is, look, I think
4:03
Speaker 2: on pace, you'd have to say this could be on.
4:06
Speaker 2: The deficit is still large. Let's not kid ourselves here.
4:09
Speaker 2: So he's going to require some help. But then this
4:11
Speaker 2: time last year, McLaren did their very best to help
4:14
Speaker 2: Max Verstappen get back into the world championship with all
4:17
Speaker 2: sorts of things from Monza through to Qatar and others.
4:19
Speaker 2: So I think we have to actually ask the question
4:22
Speaker 2: because we know that he can do it. He's done
4:24
Speaker 2: it in the past. He's still 83 points off the lead.
4:26
Speaker 2: It sounds like a lot, but there are a lot
4:27
Speaker 2: of points still up for grabs and, uh, The trajectory
4:31
Speaker 2: arrow is certainly going in the right direction.
4:33
Speaker 1: He's probably the person hoping hardest that we have a
4:34
Speaker 1: Qatar and Abu Dhabi Grand Prix this year, more than
4:37
Speaker 1: perhaps even the organisers themselves used to say, because that's
4:40
Speaker 1: the extra points. He needs that extra runway if he's
4:43
Speaker 1: going to close this margin. It is remarkable how similar
4:46
Speaker 1: this is to last year. As you say, it was
4:49
Speaker 1: exactly at this point last year. Well, in fact, it's
4:51
Speaker 1: happening maybe slightly earlier, because this point last year is
4:53
Speaker 1: when Max Verstappen's margin to Piastri, as it was at
4:56
Speaker 1: the time, peaked at 104 points. So a larger margin,
5:00
Speaker 1: whereas Norris feels like he's just tipping the balance where
5:02
Speaker 1: he has in the last two races, hasn't he? And
5:04
Speaker 1: McLaren feels like it's beginning to tip that balance as well.
5:07
Speaker 1: I think that's a very interesting element. Similarities to last
5:10
Speaker 1: year and differences to last year, I thought it was
5:13
Speaker 1: funny that after qualifying when he was asked this question,
5:16
Speaker 1: or perhaps after the Sprint race on Saturday, he was asked, well,
5:20
Speaker 1: is it going to happen? Are we moving in that direction?
5:22
Speaker 1: He said, well, we'll need Mercedes to make the same
5:25
Speaker 1: mistakes we did and name-checked double disqualification in las vegas
5:29
Speaker 1: the pit stop blunder the catastrophe of qatar that cost
5:33
Speaker 1: well actually cost oscar piastri more than it cost him
5:34
Speaker 1: in terms of that championship challenge but did name as
5:37
Speaker 1: you say that the help that he'll need from mercedes
5:40
Speaker 1: but what uh is working in his favor this year
5:42
Speaker 1: that perhaps wasn't in verstappen's favor so much last year
5:45
Speaker 1: is that potentially there are quite a few other drivers
5:49
Speaker 1: who could take points off antonelli of course the up
5:52
Speaker 1: The inverse of that is could take points off him,
5:53
Speaker 1: make it harder for him.
5:54
Speaker 2: Yes.
5:55
Speaker 1: But we've got sort of two Mercedes drivers in the mix. One,
5:58
Speaker 1: at least, that should on paper be capable of scoring
6:00
Speaker 1: more points than Anzali. Hasn't for many races yet. And
6:04
Speaker 1: we have the Ferrari drivers as well. Maybe we bring
6:06
Speaker 1: them in here a little bit. I shouldn't. Dismiss Oscar Piastri.
6:09
Speaker 1: We'll talk about Piastri separately in a moment. Maybe we should.
6:13
Speaker 1: But Ferrari this weekend impresses the wrong word, obviously, for
6:17
Speaker 1: a team that didn't get onto the podium in the
6:18
Speaker 1: Grand Prix. But just stand out yet again in the
6:22
Speaker 1: way they've turned a car that, by my analysis, was
6:25
Speaker 1: at least as fast or roughly in the ballpark with
6:27
Speaker 1: McLaren and Mercedes, two cars that looked very evenly matched
6:29
Speaker 1: to the race. And as I said, managed to not
6:32
Speaker 1: even get anywhere near pole position, anywhere near the podium,
6:35
Speaker 1: managed to hurt both cars strategically at the same time.
6:39
Speaker 1: This is the problem at Ferrari. I mean, we've been
6:41
Speaker 1: saying it for years, really, but it's disappointing that they
6:43
Speaker 1: get to a point where they have a car that
6:44
Speaker 1: could be winning the title, that could be charging towards
6:47
Speaker 1: the title lead. But the team is really letting itself
6:50
Speaker 1: down enough that for the first time, I think, in
6:53
Speaker 1: this year and a half that Lewis Hamilton's been there,
6:55
Speaker 1: even Hamilton's starting to feel like maybe he's no longer
6:57
Speaker 1: the one dragging the chain.
6:59
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's interesting, isn't it? They seem to me, despite
7:01
Speaker 2: the fact that on pace, they're right in the mix,
7:03
Speaker 2: as you say. And whereas last year was literally, it
7:06
Speaker 2: was A or B, it was McLaren or Red Bull
7:08
Speaker 2: winning races. Everyone else had turned the tap off for 2026.
7:12
Speaker 2: This year, it feels there's more contenders to win races
7:14
Speaker 2: and get on podiums. The Ferrari has the machinery to
7:17
Speaker 2: do it, and they have the drivers with the pedigree
7:18
Speaker 2: to do it. But you still have trust issues with
7:20
Speaker 2: them because you never know what you're going to get
7:22
Speaker 2: on a week-to-week basis. Sometimes within a session-to-session basis, you
7:25
Speaker 2: don't really know what's going on because... open up the
7:28
Speaker 2: door of a strategic blunder and they will charge headfirst
7:31
Speaker 2: through it, as we know from previous years. But your
7:35
Speaker 2: point is well made in that what is in Norris's
7:38
Speaker 2: favour here to a degree is there are just potentially
7:41
Speaker 2: more people who could upset the established order. And this
7:45
Speaker 2: McLaren thing, look, it's a sample set of two races.
7:48
Speaker 2: It's two very good races and a sample set, clearly.
7:51
Speaker 2: But I don't know about you. I have more faith
7:53
Speaker 2: in that they will be able to sustain something closer
7:57
Speaker 2: to this And I think we kind of know what
7:59
Speaker 2: Mercedes are, despite Toto Wolff crying poor that they maybe
8:02
Speaker 2: don't have enough money to upgrade the car, but that's
8:04
Speaker 2: another discussion. I feel that if you're dealing with a
8:07
Speaker 2: title fight with multiple contenders, I feel like I know
8:10
Speaker 2: what those two teams are. And I still don't know
8:13
Speaker 2: what Ferrari is necessarily because it can just so wildly
8:16
Speaker 2: fluctuate because of the variable of them just tripping themselves
8:19
Speaker 2: over all the time. On speed and driver pedigree, you
8:22
Speaker 2: would say absolutely yes. And they looked very, very impressive
8:25
Speaker 2: at Sandville and finished fourth and fifth. It just seems
8:27
Speaker 2: so underwhelming for the performance that they actually had there.
8:30
Speaker 2: So they could absolutely be in the mix. But I
8:33
Speaker 2: sense because of the way they operate, that it will
8:35
Speaker 2: be more to shape who wins the championship rather than
8:37
Speaker 2: actually win the championship.
8:39
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's, I mean, you've got to be frustrated. I mean,
8:42
Speaker 1: both drivers are clearly frustrated. They were after the race.
8:44
Speaker 1: Lewis Hamilton very much was in the cockpit. Charles Leclerc
8:46
Speaker 1: as well. Because you can see an opportunity that's there
8:50
Speaker 1: for the taking. And I feel like, you know, to
8:52
Speaker 1: some extent, maybe Charles Leclerc is used to this emotion.
8:55
Speaker 1: There was a certain amount of resignation, I think, after,
8:58
Speaker 1: in his post-race press conference. With Lewis Hamilton, the frustration
9:02
Speaker 1: was more real because he's been in this situation before
9:04
Speaker 1: where the car is capable of it. But in the
9:06
Speaker 1: teams prior that he's raced for, well, McLaren and Mercedes,
9:09
Speaker 1: They've normally executed and gone on to get those results,
9:12
Speaker 1: maybe the first time. He's felt so many results slip past.
9:15
Speaker 1: But I like the way you put, you know more
9:18
Speaker 1: what you're getting with other teams. And I think with
9:21
Speaker 1: McLaren being a good current example as the team that
9:23
Speaker 1: feels like it's on the up, these are two tracks,
9:25
Speaker 1: and this is an asterisk and a thumbs up if
9:27
Speaker 1: you like, these are two tracks that they suspected with
9:30
Speaker 1: the upgrades they were going to do well at. Historically,
9:32
Speaker 1: they've done well at these tracks. That maybe gives us
9:34
Speaker 1: some pause for thought. But then they've executed and done
9:36
Speaker 1: well at those tracks. They say that Monza and Azerbaijan
9:40
Speaker 1: coming up, they will undoubtedly have tweaks. But they're going
9:42
Speaker 1: to be relatively weaker tracks. They have the Mercedes engine,
9:45
Speaker 1: but the car is draggier. It doesn't love slow corners
9:47
Speaker 1: like the chicanes in Wanza or most of the corners
9:49
Speaker 1: in Azerbaijan. And you can have that in the back
9:52
Speaker 1: of your head. Maybe they have a performer wait and see.
9:54
Speaker 1: Whereas Ferrari, it's the opposite. You know, one of the
9:56
Speaker 1: races they won at Silverstone, okay, there was some fortune
9:59
Speaker 1: in there in terms of Antonelli's unreliability but generally performed
10:02
Speaker 1: very strongly there when they shouldn't have two tracks they
10:04
Speaker 1: should have done well at two tracks arguably should have
10:06
Speaker 1: won at Hungary and Zandvoort completely the opposite couldn't even
10:09
Speaker 1: get onto the podium and that's the crux of the
10:12
Speaker 1: trust problem is that even they don't seem to understand
10:15
Speaker 1: why they're not getting results when they should and when
10:17
Speaker 1: they are when they shouldn't. And that's something they'll have
10:20
Speaker 1: to resolve if they're going to obviously get over the
10:22
Speaker 1: line in the title fight. Before we move on completely,
10:24
Speaker 1: let's touch on George Russell and then Oscar Piastri. I'm
10:29
Speaker 1: still not sure what I feel about George Russell's weekend.
10:33
Speaker 1: A lot of optimism coming into it, that the break
10:36
Speaker 1: had given him that chance to reset a little bit
10:39
Speaker 1: after a pretty bruising first half of the year. Certainly
10:41
Speaker 1: had the pace for two out of three days, I guess,
10:44
Speaker 1: and he wasn't dramatically off the pace in the race either.
10:47
Speaker 1: But the takeaway message for me is that in the
10:49
Speaker 1: Grand Prix, he still managed to finish behind a teammate
10:52
Speaker 1: he'd qualified ahead of.
10:53
Speaker 2: Yes.
10:54
Speaker 1: And to use his words, or to paraphrase them, after
10:57
Speaker 1: taking a sprint pole or finishing second in sprint qualifying,
11:00
Speaker 1: or in Grand Prix qualifying rather, pace this year hasn't
11:03
Speaker 1: been a massive problem for him. One lap pace anyway.
11:05
Speaker 1: It's actually quite close between him and Antonelli, both head-to-head
11:08
Speaker 1: and in terms of the time. But it's just getting
11:10
Speaker 1: the results. And this weekend, in that sense, felt like
11:12
Speaker 1: almost any other weekend. Yeah.
11:14
Speaker 2: Yeah, and it's interesting. Obviously, we had a sprint, again, forgettable,
11:17
Speaker 2: but it was still there, and there were still points
11:19
Speaker 2: on offer. Russell and Antonelli both scored the same number
11:21
Speaker 2: of points over the course of the weekend. So, effectively,
11:24
Speaker 2: it's like a nil-all draw in football at this point,
11:26
Speaker 2: and it's great for Kimi Antonelli. He shipped absolutely no
11:29
Speaker 2: margin to the guy on the other side of the
11:31
Speaker 2: garage who could take the World Championship off him, and
11:33
Speaker 2: there's one fewer race to go now. So, we've got
11:35
Speaker 2: 11 or maybe 10 to go. He's had the equivalent
11:38
Speaker 2: of the nil-all draw, and we just move on to
11:40
Speaker 2: the next one. So, it's a great result for Antonelli.
11:42
Speaker 2: In saying that, Russell felt more at the races. He
11:46
Speaker 2: felt more convincing at points over the course of the weekend,
11:49
Speaker 2: which is not something that we've necessarily said a lot lately.
11:52
Speaker 2: It's mostly been glass half empty for him. So, you
11:54
Speaker 2: could say that, yes, it's an uptick in terms of
11:57
Speaker 2: the performance, but it had no discernible benefit on the
12:00
Speaker 2: scoreboard at all. There isn't a momentum world championship. They're
12:03
Speaker 2: not giving points for that. So, maybe they should, but-
12:07
Speaker 2: You know, it's a better weekend for him and it's
12:09
Speaker 2: a weekend he needed to have, but there was no
12:11
Speaker 2: mathematical gain for him. And there's one fewer race to
12:14
Speaker 2: overhaul a 59-point deficit to his teammates. So it still
12:17
Speaker 2: is very sizable. And again, not knowing that finish line,
12:20
Speaker 2: you know, how many more races we have left, he
12:22
Speaker 2: could actually have one fewer races than he needs.
12:25
Speaker 1: I think it's probably worth adding here as well that
12:27
Speaker 1: he's been, for whatever reason, very good on sprint weekends
12:30
Speaker 1: this season. Three sprint poles, three sprint victories this And
12:33
Speaker 1: they haven't always translated, not always for reasons within his control,
12:36
Speaker 1: but didn't win in China after winning the China sprint.
12:38
Speaker 1: Maybe would have won in Canada, but had technical problems.
12:40
Speaker 1: Certainly wasn't outright the fastest in that Grand Prix and
12:43
Speaker 1: then didn't manage to do so here either. So there's
12:46
Speaker 1: perhaps some element of that that he's hitting the ground
12:48
Speaker 1: running a little bit better than his teammate. That won't
12:50
Speaker 1: count for as much now that we've only got one
12:52
Speaker 1: sprint race left for some reason in Singapore. But we'll
12:55
Speaker 1: wait and see how that bounces out of the year.
12:57
Speaker 1: We can't wrap up the Dutch Grand Prix without talking
12:59
Speaker 1: about Oscar Piastri. Another driver who came into the second
13:02
Speaker 1: half of the season feeling like he had some pretty
13:04
Speaker 1: clear objectives and that he wanted to move forward. Obviously,
13:07
Speaker 1: after Hungary was a little bit disappointing. One lap pace
13:09
Speaker 1: was really right there. I certainly was heartened by that.
13:12
Speaker 1: He seemed heartened by that. It seemed like it was
13:14
Speaker 1: going to be closer. In the race... Not very good.
13:18
Speaker 1: On a weekend where his teammate won, that obviously makes
13:20
Speaker 1: things much more difficult. Just wasn't really there. Didn't really
13:23
Speaker 1: have much of an effect. A lot of it did
13:26
Speaker 1: seem to come down to really just the middle stint
13:28
Speaker 1: on that hard tyre. Similar to Antonelli in a weird way,
13:31
Speaker 1: where two drivers just managed, just couldn't get any pace
13:34
Speaker 1: out of that in the conditions for whatever reason. But
13:36
Speaker 1: it felt more on brand for Piastri. I think that's
13:38
Speaker 1: the risk here. Didn't feel like such an outlier. And
13:41
Speaker 1: he ends this weekend still searching for answers how to
13:44
Speaker 1: get a full and complete race out of this car consistently?
13:48
Speaker 2: Well, 32 seconds behind his teammate and 55 points behind
13:52
Speaker 2: his teammate in the driver's standings. They are two numbers
13:54
Speaker 2: that I am pretty surprised to be saying in August
13:57
Speaker 2: of 2026 based on, I mean, go back to the
14:00
Speaker 2: Dutch Grand Prix last year. I mean, it was all
14:02
Speaker 2: looking pretty good then, wasn't it? So it's obviously been
14:03
Speaker 2: a full year since he's won a race now. But
14:05
Speaker 2: those two numbers that I just mentioned now You mentioned
14:08
Speaker 2: the qualifying and how the one-lap pace was good. It's
14:11
Speaker 2: interesting how you interpret these things now, because my reaction
14:14
Speaker 2: to that was not to necessarily be surprised, but like, ooh,
14:18
Speaker 2: that's good, because it was a real uptick and it
14:20
Speaker 2: was kind of against the narrative of the story. And
14:22
Speaker 2: at the risk of causing everyone listening to a Fox
14:24
Speaker 2: Sports podcast to... down their beers in disgust or whatever
14:27
Speaker 2: you're drinking at 11.23 on a Wednesday morning. Do we
14:31
Speaker 2: need to start having the uncomfortable conversation here with McLaren
14:34
Speaker 2: about do they need to actually prioritise Lando Norris if
14:38
Speaker 2: they are going to get back into this championship fight?
14:40
Speaker 2: Because as much as that's a sentence I can't believe
14:43
Speaker 2: that I'm verbalising, it certainly has crossed my mind. It's
14:46
Speaker 2: uncomfortable to say, it's uncomfortable to countenance how that would work.
14:51
Speaker 2: But You do have to wonder, because there is a
14:54
Speaker 2: degree of mathematical legitimacy to actually having that discussion now,
14:59
Speaker 2: and that's awkward, isn't it?
15:00
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, I did some numbers on this, and the
15:02
Speaker 1: last time we were talking about this, of course, was
15:04
Speaker 1: two years ago, 2024, when it seemed like Norris was
15:07
Speaker 1: also an outside chance at the championship. Many different circumstances,
15:10
Speaker 1: dramatically different. McLaren wasn't in the kind of form it
15:13
Speaker 1: was in now. Obviously, no one had won the world
15:15
Speaker 1: championship there for a very long time. But if you
15:17
Speaker 1: crunch it on a points-per-race basis, it's actually remarkably... I did.
15:22
Speaker 1: It's within 0.1 of a point difference in terms of
15:25
Speaker 1: how many races we've got left and how many points
15:27
Speaker 1: Norris would need to score. Compared to the time in
15:30
Speaker 1: 24 when they said, if you remember, it was the
15:32
Speaker 1: Azerbaijan Grand Prix, that yes, we're going to back Norris.
15:35
Speaker 1: It doesn't mean we're going to be, you know, ignoring
15:38
Speaker 1: Piastri for the rest of this season. We still didn't
15:39
Speaker 1: perform well. They were still locking out the Constructors' Championship
15:42
Speaker 1: at the time. But we're going to, when situation requires it,
15:47
Speaker 1: have Piastri give Norris points. And the only time that
15:49
Speaker 1: really came up, though, was the sprint in Brazil where
15:51
Speaker 1: he gave up a victory there. And that sort of
15:54
Speaker 1: speaks to the other element of this, isn't it? It's
15:56
Speaker 1: all well and good and controversial and fiasco. People have
15:59
Speaker 1: to talk about number one and number two drivers. But really,
16:02
Speaker 1: it only makes much of a difference if Piastri struck
16:05
Speaker 1: form and suddenly was racing ahead of Norris and was
16:07
Speaker 1: there to give up points. There was talk in commentary.
16:10
Speaker 1: I'm not sure that it turned out to be accurate.
16:12
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure it didn't, in fact. that in Piastri
16:15
Speaker 1: this weekend could have been holding up drivers to benefit Norris.
16:18
Speaker 1: I don't think that was happening, and even if it was,
16:19
Speaker 1: it didn't have any effect on the race in the end.
16:21
Speaker 1: That's the only other situation in which Piastri could play
16:24
Speaker 1: a role without being ahead of Norris, but even that
16:26
Speaker 1: can only really work at certain circuits and in certain circumstances.
16:29
Speaker 1: So there's one element of it being much less dramatic
16:32
Speaker 1: than it sounds. But otherwise, I think you're absolutely right.
16:35
Speaker 1: I think it'll be hard for McLaren to make the decision,
16:38
Speaker 1: having for 12 months had worked into their muscle memory
16:41
Speaker 1: that they must be as fair as possible, even if
16:43
Speaker 1: the way that was expressed occasionally was ugly and controversial.
16:47
Speaker 1: But that's what they say, and that's what they've been
16:49
Speaker 1: trying to do. I suspect if they're going to make
16:52
Speaker 1: that call, it comes at the end of the European season.
16:54
Speaker 1: That's sort of when it feels like things get real.
16:56
Speaker 1: That'll also have been after the test of Monza, when
16:59
Speaker 1: we'll know if that trajectory is set or if it
17:01
Speaker 1: really is more circuit-specific, because there's No point getting ahead
17:03
Speaker 1: of yourself before that. But I think that conversation has
17:06
Speaker 1: to be had because I think this would be a
17:08
Speaker 1: remarkable driver's championship to win if they did. The Constructors'
17:11
Speaker 1: Championship seems much more unlikely, not just because Piastri hasn't scored,
17:14
Speaker 1: but Ferrari's just scoring that much more consistently and should
17:18
Speaker 1: on paper get it done ahead of McLaren at least
17:21
Speaker 1: and then Mercedes obviously is way out ahead as well
17:23
Speaker 1: and they're looking more comfortable there. But I just think
17:27
Speaker 1: in much the same way that Red Bull in part
17:29
Speaker 1: decided to keep developing last year's car because... as the
17:32
Speaker 1: momentum built, it was hard to ignore that possibility of
17:35
Speaker 1: Verstappen winning that title. I think McLaren has to make
17:38
Speaker 1: that decision if things continue in this direction when we
17:42
Speaker 1: get to, again, Azerbaijan, the first race out of Europe.
17:45
Speaker 1: Because to ignore it, I think, would be... It would
17:49
Speaker 1: be a more baffling decision, I think.
17:51
Speaker 2: Yeah, completely. And you mentioned the key point before. This
17:53
Speaker 2: is only a relevant discussion if Piastri is fast enough
17:55
Speaker 2: to actually aid his teammate anyway, which, on the basis
17:58
Speaker 2: of Zanvoort, he clearly wasn't.
17:59
Speaker 1: So..
18:00
Speaker 2: That's another element to put in this. There needs to
18:02
Speaker 2: be a performance uptick to be able to prioritise one
18:04
Speaker 2: driver over another, because right now that's not really going
18:07
Speaker 2: to make any difference. The really difficult part about this,
18:10
Speaker 2: and you mentioned 24 and the fact that the stats
18:12
Speaker 2: are more or less identical. In 24, the hierarchy of
18:16
Speaker 2: what that team was or would be was still taking shape.
18:19
Speaker 2: And so it was a legitimate question because the past
18:23
Speaker 2: had brought us to a point where, okay, now we
18:25
Speaker 2: need to make a decision in 24. Both of these
18:27
Speaker 2: guys are on a pretty similar trajectory now. You think
18:29
Speaker 2: of everything that has happened since and all that happened
18:32
Speaker 2: last year. I mean, we're about to go to Monza next.
18:34
Speaker 2: Let's not talk about swapping positions because of dodgy pit
18:36
Speaker 2: stops and so on and so forth. So much water
18:38
Speaker 2: has gone under the bridge since that it's a really
18:41
Speaker 2: difficult call for McLaren having gone through this, as you said,
18:44
Speaker 2: fairness and hashtag papaya rules last year every five minutes
18:49
Speaker 2: and then having to go to the situation. It's like, well, actually,
18:51
Speaker 2: could you just help the other guy, please? It would
18:54
Speaker 2: make a lot of the hand-wringing and stuff last year
18:57
Speaker 2: bring that into sharper focus, wouldn't it? But Just on
18:59
Speaker 2: a purely performance level, and as you rightly said before,
19:03
Speaker 2: if there is an opportunity to win a world championship,
19:06
Speaker 2: you would be derelict in your duty as a team
19:08
Speaker 2: to not pursue that until it's not an option anymore.
19:11
Speaker 2: And we're almost facing that question right now. If they
19:13
Speaker 2: are really in this, if the pace can sustain over
19:16
Speaker 2: the next couple of rounds, there has to be some
19:18
Speaker 2: difficult conversations. Because otherwise, what are we actually doing here?
19:21
Speaker 2: Are we just cruising around to come second? If there's
19:23
Speaker 2: a chance, you have to go for it.
19:24
Speaker 1: Yeah, especially with their home Bahrain Grand Prix coming up
19:27
Speaker 1: in Malaysia. You've got to have something good to talk about.
19:29
Speaker 2: That Malaysia one, yeah, that'd be good.
19:30
Speaker 1: Yeah, yes, yes. I think as well, just before we
19:32
Speaker 1: move on completely, there's an irony in that I think
19:36
Speaker 1: this conversation would have been easier to have if Piastri
19:38
Speaker 1: had had a win already.
19:39
Speaker 2: Yes.
19:40
Speaker 1: Because, you know, without getting into the hypotheticals of what
19:43
Speaker 1: being a number one, number two driver for the rest
19:45
Speaker 1: of the season might mean, the idea that McLaren, you know,
19:49
Speaker 1: because the idea for McLaren now to wrap up the
19:51
Speaker 1: championship is you actually have a car that can win
19:53
Speaker 1: almost every race right or is always thereabouts which means
19:55
Speaker 1: in some tracks that soon you might be running one
19:57
Speaker 1: two the idea that Piastri might be leading a one
20:00
Speaker 1: two for his first win of the season and what's
20:03
Speaker 1: been a increasingly pretty ordinary season with some highlights, but
20:06
Speaker 1: a lot less, um, or, or a lot more races
20:09
Speaker 1: that do not fall into that category to tell him, oh,
20:12
Speaker 1: by the way, not today, but maybe next year, uh,
20:16
Speaker 1: is much harder to have because it just means you
20:18
Speaker 1: don't get as a driver that closure, I guess, don't
20:22
Speaker 1: like using that word really, but that sort of closure
20:24
Speaker 1: on what's been an ordinary season to say, all right, I've, I've,
20:26
Speaker 1: I've summited the mountain now. It's too late to get
20:28
Speaker 1: into the championship. I can't help my teammate from here
20:31
Speaker 1: because it's kind of my job, but at least I
20:32
Speaker 1: can feel confident and, knowing that next year I'm sort
20:34
Speaker 1: of on top of things. He's not going to probably,
20:37
Speaker 1: if this is the way they go, get that moment,
20:39
Speaker 1: unless he's way out ahead and can't do anything for
20:41
Speaker 1: Norris anyway. So some difficult conversations that might be even
20:44
Speaker 1: more difficult in the context, but very hypothetical for now.
20:47
Speaker 1: We need to wait and see how the next race
20:48
Speaker 1: in Italy goes, because perhaps it's all for nothing. But
20:52
Speaker 1: let's move on now to Move of the Week, brought
20:54
Speaker 1: to you by Shannon's. I didn't expect to have so
20:57
Speaker 1: many moves to contemplate after the Dutch Grand Prix, much
20:59
Speaker 1: like you. I suspected this would have been a bit
21:02
Speaker 1: of a snoozefest, much like the sprint. But no, great race.
21:05
Speaker 2: Thank God we're not doing Move of the Week for
21:06
Speaker 2: the sprint, because I think there was one. We'd have
21:08
Speaker 2: to share it, go half each. It was pretty grim.
21:10
Speaker 2: But I had a long list that I whittled down
21:14
Speaker 2: to three, and I'm going to, you know what? It's
21:17
Speaker 2: been a bit sad trombone Oscar Piastri corner for the
21:21
Speaker 2: last five minutes, so I'm going to go to the
21:23
Speaker 2: Piastri move on George Russell on the first lap of
21:25
Speaker 2: the restart, I believe it was, wasn't it? Through a
21:28
Speaker 2: section of track where, quite frankly, you can't pass there, mate,
21:31
Speaker 2: as someone might say. Unbelievable pass. I loved it on
21:34
Speaker 2: its face. I was frustrated because... And I'm going to
21:39
Speaker 2: go down my battery usage on the graphic rant again.
21:42
Speaker 2: I remember saying to you at the time, that was
21:44
Speaker 2: an amazing move. I really hope it was legitimate because
21:47
Speaker 2: you just don't know these days whether someone's harvesting or
21:50
Speaker 2: they're in full battery or whatever. But honest face, it
21:53
Speaker 2: was a spectacular move that caught absolutely everybody by surprise,
21:57
Speaker 2: possibly even Piastri, because I don't think anyone's even attempted
22:00
Speaker 2: to pass someone there previously. It was a brilliantly opportunistic
22:04
Speaker 2: first lap move. I thoroughly enjoyed it. I wish I
22:06
Speaker 2: wasn't confused or I had some sort of scepticism and
22:10
Speaker 2: was everyone fighting with a full pack here? I don't know.
22:13
Speaker 2: Thank you, Formula One graphics. But I did enjoy it.
22:15
Speaker 2: It was a very, very good move. And yeah, let's
22:18
Speaker 2: inject a little sunshine into the Oscar Piastri day. Let's
22:20
Speaker 2: give him move of the week. There were plenty of others.
22:22
Speaker 2: This is a good thing for you this week. I
22:24
Speaker 2: haven't just taken the lowest of low-hanging fruit. I had
22:27
Speaker 2: two others on my shortlist. I'm curious to see if
22:29
Speaker 2: your nomination here is one of those two.
22:32
Speaker 1: Yes, I did like as well, as part of that move,
22:35
Speaker 1: just before I give you mine. I'd like is maybe
22:38
Speaker 1: the wrong word because that makes it sound more cynical.
22:40
Speaker 1: But I think there was something a bit indicative about
22:42
Speaker 1: George Russell being caught unawares there. I mean, the first laps,
22:46
Speaker 1: starts and first laps just don't really seem to be
22:48
Speaker 1: his strength at the moment. And just getting caught, as
22:51
Speaker 1: great as the move was, and part of, you know,
22:53
Speaker 1: part of great moves is catching drivers unawares. That's part
22:55
Speaker 1: of it, but... Russell just had no awareness that that
22:58
Speaker 1: was going to happen. And for, you know, up until
23:00
Speaker 1: that botched to his pit stop at Piastri, that could
23:02
Speaker 1: have cost him a place, could have cost him a
23:03
Speaker 1: place on the podium and more championship points. So yes,
23:05
Speaker 1: a great move, but also I think a worrying one
23:08
Speaker 1: from the Russell perspective. My move, off track, Liam Lawson
23:13
Speaker 1: going to Red Bull Racing. That's my move of the
23:16
Speaker 1: week for one week only, or maybe two, we don't
23:18
Speaker 1: know yet. Because I just think how often do drivers
23:23
Speaker 1: get their Comeuppance is the wrong word, obviously. Their chance
23:26
Speaker 1: to correct the record. How often do they get the
23:29
Speaker 1: right of reply? In the last 12 months or a
23:31
Speaker 1: little bit more, really, since he was dumped by Red
23:33
Speaker 1: Bull Racing two rounds into last season, he's been very
23:36
Speaker 1: adamant that he felt he was set up to fail
23:39
Speaker 1: at that team. The circumstances were bad. Obviously, no one
23:42
Speaker 1: can argue two races was enough to prove himself, but
23:45
Speaker 1: he was dumped anyway and also had the... The unfortunate
23:49
Speaker 1: commentary of Christian Horner saying publicly that he was mentally
23:53
Speaker 1: suffering in a top team and needed to be sent
23:55
Speaker 1: back to Racing Bulls for his own well-being, which he
23:57
Speaker 1: took great objection to and has taken greater objection to
24:00
Speaker 1: since Christian Horner was sacked by the team. But to
24:02
Speaker 1: go back and have your chance against Max Verstappen to
24:05
Speaker 1: prove that you're not, on average, a second-a-lap slower in
24:09
Speaker 1: the same car and a hopeless driver and can't score
24:11
Speaker 1: points and this and that, Um, to do it with
24:13
Speaker 1: one race notice, obviously got only one practice session of
24:15
Speaker 1: sprint weekend, had a bit of simulator time, which helped, um,
24:18
Speaker 1: also had the same engine as him at racing bulls,
24:20
Speaker 1: which also helps since it's such an engine formula these days.
24:23
Speaker 1: but acquitted himself very strongly, scored his first points for
24:25
Speaker 1: Red Bull Racing in a season he's not even racing
24:27
Speaker 1: for the team. Continued, you know, did well for the team,
24:30
Speaker 1: was the only point scorer, obviously, the weekend, because Max
24:32
Speaker 1: Verstappen crashed out on lap one, but did everything he
24:35
Speaker 1: needed to do in those circumstances. It's probably not going
24:39
Speaker 1: to change the world for him, although you never know
24:41
Speaker 1: with the Red Bull driver program in general, but because
24:43
Speaker 1: Isaac Hatch is doing generally a pretty good job there
24:45
Speaker 1: and Max has now re-signed. But I thought it was
24:48
Speaker 1: a great random... unexpected opportunity for him to just say,
24:53
Speaker 1: I was right. You know, for him, for a driver
24:55
Speaker 1: to be able to say, I was right and I've
24:56
Speaker 1: got the data to prove it. I like that as
24:59
Speaker 1: a story.
25:00
Speaker 2: No, I do too. It's funny to think that his
25:01
Speaker 2: second Red Bull racing career could be longer than his
25:03
Speaker 2: first one. I mean, if he does the next race
25:07
Speaker 2: at Monza, then we've already equaled the first hit at
25:09
Speaker 2: Red Bull racing, which just closes the circle of the
25:12
Speaker 2: stupidity of that entire story. But I did like the
25:15
Speaker 2: fact that he turned up and did a really nice job.
25:17
Speaker 2: And I think one of the disappointing aspects of obviously
25:20
Speaker 2: for the Dutch fans seeing Verstappen crash out on the
25:22
Speaker 2: first lap I was really curious to see how that
25:24
Speaker 2: would have translated over 72 laps because we saw in
25:27
Speaker 2: qualifying in the sprint I think Lawson was as close
25:31
Speaker 2: or as good as he could have been given the
25:33
Speaker 2: limited preparation to a guy that's so embedded into that
25:35
Speaker 2: team we never got the full story over the Grand
25:37
Speaker 2: Prix because Verstappen's was over before the first lap was
25:39
Speaker 2: finished so that was a shame that we didn't get
25:41
Speaker 2: the comparable data there but when you think of the
25:44
Speaker 2: circumstances that he was thrown into that seat, and then
25:47
Speaker 2: you think of all the past, all the history, I
25:50
Speaker 2: thought he did a really, really good job. And I
25:52
Speaker 2: think the best thing about that now is that I
25:54
Speaker 2: feel like his stock is up a little bit now.
25:56
Speaker 2: I wasn't surprised at all that he went in there
25:58
Speaker 2: and did a good job. Whereas what happened at the
26:01
Speaker 2: beginning of 2025 was so completely ludicrous that it could
26:04
Speaker 2: have broken a driver completely. So the fact that he
26:06
Speaker 2: went back in there and did a really, really accomplished job,
26:09
Speaker 2: I think he's standing... I think because people realise how
26:12
Speaker 2: totally ridiculous and untenable that 2025 situation was, I feel
26:16
Speaker 2: that he's got the sympathy vote and I feel that
26:18
Speaker 2: people are probably a bit higher on him than perhaps
26:20
Speaker 2: they were, which is a strange resolution to actually losing
26:24
Speaker 2: your job two races into a season, isn't it? But
26:25
Speaker 2: there you go.
26:27
Speaker 1: Yeah, so I like that one. Only a tenth in
26:29
Speaker 1: the end, just looking at the numbers, tenth difference in
26:31
Speaker 1: qualifying compared to on average more than nine tenths last year,
26:34
Speaker 1: over two races admittedly, but it just shows the sort
26:37
Speaker 1: of scale of difference there. And it's also nice that
26:40
Speaker 1: a Red Bull driver might get a little bit of
26:42
Speaker 1: a moment like that that doesn't rely on saying, well,
26:44
Speaker 1: everyone else was awful in that seat as well. It's
26:46
Speaker 1: nice to have the positive side of that story. So
26:49
Speaker 1: I enjoyed that one.
26:50
Speaker 2: You know where I thought you were going with Move
26:51
Speaker 2: of the Week here? And I'm going to set you
26:53
Speaker 2: up in what's called a professional segue here, Michael. I
26:57
Speaker 2: thought you were going to talk about Carlos Sainz and
26:59
Speaker 2: Alex Albon crashing into each other while they were disputing
27:01
Speaker 2: 14th place late in the Grand Prix. That is a
27:05
Speaker 2: move of a week. I'm not sure it's one that
27:07
Speaker 2: anyone wants to actually celebrate. But in a delightful segue
27:11
Speaker 2: to the final part of this week's podcast, Michael, let's
27:13
Speaker 2: talk about the driver market.
27:14
Speaker 1: Yes, celebrating their new contracts, taking each other out of
27:17
Speaker 1: the race. One driver retired from the race and Carlos
27:20
Speaker 1: Sainz was penalized for it. Two of the three driver
27:23
Speaker 1: announcements we got over the course of the week was
27:26
Speaker 1: Williams hanging on to their drivers, maybe against the odds
27:30
Speaker 1: for at least another year. That's Alex Albon. He's had
27:33
Speaker 1: his contract, from what I understand, what's been reported, extended
27:36
Speaker 1: or an option has been taken up on it for
27:38
Speaker 1: another year. The press release notably did not use the
27:41
Speaker 1: word contract. But Carlos Sainz has signed a new deal.
27:45
Speaker 1: It's a multi-year deal. It's virtually the only deal everyone
27:48
Speaker 1: signs these days. which we're going to say is two years,
27:50
Speaker 1: but probably with a pretty good option to leave the
27:53
Speaker 1: team next year if they continue to fall backwards, one
27:55
Speaker 1: would imagine. But this is obviously good news for Williams
27:59
Speaker 1: in a year that they need some good news. Two
28:03
Speaker 1: very capable, high-quality drivers. Carlos Sainz, a race winner as well.
28:07
Speaker 1: Alex L won a podium. He got a podium at
28:09
Speaker 1: Red Bull Racing, didn't he? He got one, I think.
28:10
Speaker 2: He did. A Mugello, I believe.
28:12
Speaker 1: Yes, that's right. What a great podium to get as well.
28:15
Speaker 1: One of the great circuits. That's good. That's good in
28:17
Speaker 1: a year they need a little bit of positivity.
28:19
Speaker 2: You know that I'm going to remember the Mugello Formula
28:21
Speaker 2: One Grand Prix, Michael. But yeah, look, I think, you know,
28:24
Speaker 2: it's been a year of pretty bad news for Williams
28:27
Speaker 2: for the most part. And so retaining the driver lineup,
28:30
Speaker 2: there's few questions about those two. And I think that's
28:33
Speaker 2: really important for a team that doesn't seem to have
28:35
Speaker 2: a lot of answers to a lot of other questions
28:37
Speaker 2: right now. You can take the driver variable out of
28:39
Speaker 2: the equation and And the way it's turned out, I mean,
28:42
Speaker 2: they are drivers who frankly are too good for the
28:45
Speaker 2: seats that they're occupying because right now that car's not
28:47
Speaker 2: really giving you a great deal and they've got a
28:49
Speaker 2: lot of things to sort out. So it's good for
28:52
Speaker 2: Williams because it takes the variable out of the equation.
28:55
Speaker 2: There can be no questions about the drivers. Now we
28:57
Speaker 2: need to solve a whole bunch of other things. The
28:59
Speaker 2: science one is interesting for me in that As accomplished
29:03
Speaker 2: as Albon is these days and how he's resurrected his career,
29:06
Speaker 2: I don't feel there would have been a large line
29:08
Speaker 2: of people trying to get hold of him if he
29:10
Speaker 2: managed to shake loose out of Williams, where Sainz, to me,
29:13
Speaker 2: feels like an overqualified driver and an underperforming team still.
29:16
Speaker 2: And we've seen that because he's been at Ferrari and
29:18
Speaker 2: he's won Grand Prix. He strikes me as the guy
29:20
Speaker 2: who could most easily jump into a higher seat up
29:22
Speaker 2: the grid. But at the moment, where's the higher seat?
29:25
Speaker 2: And there perhaps isn't one. So I don't feel... You
29:29
Speaker 2: feel that Carlos Sainz has another F1 address in him somewhere.
29:31
Speaker 2: I guess the question is, what happens in the intervening
29:34
Speaker 2: one to two years that opens up an opportunity? And
29:38
Speaker 2: will he get the chance for that opportunity? because there
29:40
Speaker 2: was a top line seat available for him not so
29:42
Speaker 2: long ago and red bull did not want to sign
29:44
Speaker 2: him for reasons i don't know why they had their
29:46
Speaker 2: reasons and going back to liam lawson and let's start
29:49
Speaker 2: that conversation all over again but it's good for williams
29:52
Speaker 2: it's probably more than they deserve quite frankly but it's
29:54
Speaker 2: good news for them.
29:55
Speaker 1: Yeah i think For me, the Carlos Sainz one was
29:58
Speaker 1: interesting to reflect on beyond the fact that he would
30:01
Speaker 1: have been more in demand this year when so many
30:03
Speaker 1: seats were available. Admittedly, this feels like very much a
30:06
Speaker 1: fizzer of a driver market, I think. There's probably very
30:08
Speaker 1: few changes. One or two tops, I'm thinking, which we'll
30:11
Speaker 1: get into in just a second. But I thought it
30:13
Speaker 1: was interesting in some of these post-decision commentary, I guess,
30:17
Speaker 1: talked about, you know, I'm not a quitter at the
30:18
Speaker 1: first sign of difficulties at this team and they need
30:20
Speaker 1: show of faith, which I think is all true. But
30:23
Speaker 1: I wonder as well, given his only options were likely
30:26
Speaker 1: in the midfield, teams like Alpine might have been able
30:28
Speaker 1: to force himself in there considering he would be an
30:31
Speaker 1: upgrade on Franco Colapinto, even though Colapinto's doing okay. Doesn't
30:34
Speaker 1: seem like Audi would have been that interested. You've probably
30:37
Speaker 1: got to say, considering you turned them down two years ago,
30:38
Speaker 1: there would have been a little bit of, well, why
30:40
Speaker 1: now sort of talk there. But they would have been,
30:43
Speaker 1: you know, based on Williams' results this year, not sideways,
30:47
Speaker 1: certainly moving forwards, but not a great step forwards. This
30:50
Speaker 1: is a driver who's, had a career racing for almost
30:53
Speaker 1: every team on the grid at this point. Perhaps the
30:54
Speaker 1: majority of them. Actually, go back and count them. Some
30:58
Speaker 1: stability on his part is probably as good as stability
31:01
Speaker 1: on William's part, I think. Actually settling down for more
31:04
Speaker 1: than two or three years at a time, building into
31:07
Speaker 1: that team. He's probably seeing here more than he has
31:10
Speaker 1: in any other team the influence he can wield internally
31:13
Speaker 1: to kind of get what he wants out of the
31:14
Speaker 1: car and of the people and of the development as well.
31:17
Speaker 1: Despite his last two races being... crash prone has actually
31:21
Speaker 1: otherwise had really quite a good year maybe even a
31:24
Speaker 1: better year than last year on the whole I think
31:27
Speaker 1: it's in that sense makes a lot of sense for
31:31
Speaker 1: him in this stage of his career to actually just
31:33
Speaker 1: sit down for a bit and see what he can
31:35
Speaker 1: get out of this as an opportunity.
31:37
Speaker 2: Well and if there is a resurrection of Williams I
31:39
Speaker 2: mean his fingerprints will be all over it and it's
31:42
Speaker 2: not a chance you get to have as a driver
31:44
Speaker 2: to really shape the destiny of a team Now, Williams
31:48
Speaker 2: aren't going to be going back to, you know, the
31:50
Speaker 2: Williams that our forefathers supported many, many years ago, of course.
31:53
Speaker 2: But if they are to climb their way up the
31:56
Speaker 2: constructor's table, you get the sense that he's going to
31:59
Speaker 2: have his fingerprints all over that. And the personality and
32:03
Speaker 2: the experience and the way he operates, I think that
32:05
Speaker 2: would probably quite appeal. And it is funny, isn't it? Like,
32:07
Speaker 2: you look at the driver's standings and you can find
32:10
Speaker 2: truths and lies in all of them. The fact that
32:12
Speaker 2: I think he scored one more point than Alex Alvord
32:13
Speaker 2: all year in no way shows the type of season
32:17
Speaker 2: he has. other than the past two races where he
32:19
Speaker 2: seems to be running into things. It's been a pretty
32:21
Speaker 2: strong season, but the car is just so bad that
32:22
Speaker 2: he can't do anything with it.
32:24
Speaker 1: I've got to touch on Max Verstappen here, who signed,
32:26
Speaker 1: it depends on exactly how you want to sell it,
32:28
Speaker 1: a new four-year contract, I think, despite having two years
32:31
Speaker 1: to run on his current deal or his previous deal now,
32:33
Speaker 1: I suppose. Had that exit clause available to him for
32:36
Speaker 1: being so down by the Drivers' Championship order, by all reports,
32:39
Speaker 1: he was already the highest-paid driver in Formula 1. This
32:42
Speaker 1: will enhance that by some margin. Of course, when he
32:45
Speaker 1: signed his previous contract in 2021, Formula One was much
32:47
Speaker 1: smaller than it was now. He also had only one
32:49
Speaker 1: championship to his name and was talking a lot like, well,
32:52
Speaker 1: that might be enough for me. But now he's a
32:53
Speaker 1: four-time world champion and doing very well indeed. That, for me, answers, obviously,
32:59
Speaker 1: this year, the biggest driver market question. Would the biggest
33:01
Speaker 1: driver at one of the biggest teams remain either at
33:03
Speaker 1: that team or in the sport at all? He said
33:05
Speaker 1: he was closer to retiring than moving teams, which talks
33:08
Speaker 1: a lot to some of the rumors about McLaren and
33:10
Speaker 1: Mercedes over the last six or so months. But probably
33:14
Speaker 1: for the medium term, I would say, locks down those
33:18
Speaker 1: front-running seats, I think, considering that everyone else there is
33:21
Speaker 1: pretty young. Lewis Hamilton may be the only other question
33:23
Speaker 1: in the next couple of years, depending on how he
33:25
Speaker 1: wants to go with retirement, I guess, after that. But
33:29
Speaker 1: beyond that, this feels like a very locked-in top four teams.
33:33
Speaker 2: It does. I mean, it would be, you know, going
33:36
Speaker 2: back to something we talked about about 20 minutes ago,
33:39
Speaker 2: I can't imagine Oscar Piastri would be super keen to
33:41
Speaker 2: stick around at McLaren if his teammate was a two-time
33:43
Speaker 2: world champion, by the way. So there's things that can
33:45
Speaker 2: happen on a performance level that might shake things loose
33:49
Speaker 2: a little bit. And then the Hamilton question. I mean,
33:51
Speaker 2: if you ignore the fact that if you ignore the
33:52
Speaker 2: date on the birth certificate, he still looks like a
33:54
Speaker 2: perfectly capable front-running Formula One driver. So you have to
33:57
Speaker 2: look at it in the context of that. But. We
34:00
Speaker 2: spent so long talking about the driver market and expecting
34:02
Speaker 2: to be complete chaos, and it's all a bit sort
34:04
Speaker 2: of stayed at this point, which is normally the first
34:07
Speaker 2: sign that something a bit wacky is going to happen.
34:09
Speaker 2: So that's why I never rule these things out. But
34:12
Speaker 2: it is interesting, as you mentioned before, the Verstappen comments,
34:14
Speaker 2: if I'm not driving for this team, I'm not driving
34:16
Speaker 2: in Formula One. He is one of the least complicated
34:20
Speaker 2: Formula One drivers in terms of the way he thinks.
34:22
Speaker 2: It's very binary. It's yes or no, black and white.
34:25
Speaker 2: I have no doubt that that would have been the intention.
34:27
Speaker 2: It's like, well, I'm either driving for these guys or
34:28
Speaker 2: I'm not, and that's it. And he would just perfectly
34:31
Speaker 2: be fine with that and move on with the rest
34:32
Speaker 2: of his life if that was going to be the case.
34:34
Speaker 2: But yeah, it certainly takes a bit of the intrigue
34:37
Speaker 2: out of it, but we know that things just happen
34:41
Speaker 2: in this sport and contracts are not often even worth
34:44
Speaker 2: the paper that they're printed on, let's be honest. So
34:46
Speaker 2: I wouldn't rule out something completely crazy happening, but it's
34:49
Speaker 2: certainly taken some of the steam out of it for
34:50
Speaker 2: the time being.
34:51
Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, just before we wrap up, let's look at,
34:52
Speaker 1: I think, the the key seats remaining because not everyone
34:55
Speaker 1: has re-signed out he hasn't formally re-signed its drivers but
34:58
Speaker 1: seems all intents and purposes it will do Franco Colapinto
35:01
Speaker 1: probably will be retained but is yet to be re-signed
35:04
Speaker 1: this is all the time of recording considering what happened
35:06
Speaker 1: three contract announcements were made shortly afterwards Fernando Alonso is
35:10
Speaker 1: the question mark he said he was going to come
35:12
Speaker 1: back from the mid-season break with a decision says he
35:14
Speaker 1: never said that although he did He's going to decide
35:18
Speaker 1: based on, I still think, what that Aston Martin trajectory is.
35:21
Speaker 1: And it seems to be positive. You know, scored points
35:23
Speaker 1: again at the weekend. But clearly needs a little bit
35:26
Speaker 1: more time to decide what he wants to do and
35:28
Speaker 1: perhaps how much he wants to be paid to do it.
35:31
Speaker 1: The seat for me, beyond that though, that remains an
35:34
Speaker 1: open question, is Aston Martin Ocons and Haas. Had really
35:36
Speaker 1: quite an ordinary first half of the year. Has improved
35:39
Speaker 1: in the last couple of races, maybe just at the
35:41
Speaker 1: right time. Who's to say? Lots of rumours around that seat.
35:44
Speaker 1: But I want to talk about One driver who probably
35:46
Speaker 1: deserved to be spoken about this weekend a little bit
35:47
Speaker 1: more as well to wrap this up, Yuki Tsunoda, who
35:50
Speaker 1: was on that shortlist, I understand it, at Haas. Still
35:53
Speaker 1: is on that shortlist, but I believe just in the
35:54
Speaker 1: last couple of months been shuffled down it in favour
35:57
Speaker 1: of younger drivers, in particular Ferrari junior Rafael Camara, the Brazilian,
36:01
Speaker 1: who's in Formula 2 this season. But a decent, more
36:06
Speaker 1: than a decent weekend, quite a good weekend for a
36:08
Speaker 1: driver who hasn't raced a modern Formula 1 car and
36:10
Speaker 1: has been thrown into a sprint weekend. Okay, finished ahead
36:13
Speaker 1: of Arvid Lindblad, a lot of circumstances around that, Lindblad
36:17
Speaker 1: having a penalty and then his race being compromised after that.
36:20
Speaker 1: But acquitted himself really quite well. Another driver whose last
36:23
Speaker 1: race was really quite ordinary at Red Bull Racing and
36:25
Speaker 1: then was sacked. But maybe coming at just the right
36:29
Speaker 1: time to, if Haas has any doubts about some of
36:31
Speaker 1: those younger drivers and of course does choose to turf
36:33
Speaker 1: Esteban Ocon... Maybe he's appearing at just the right moment.
36:37
Speaker 2: Yeah, it feels if he was to be back on
36:38
Speaker 2: the grid full time, it might be a bit of
36:40
Speaker 2: a stopgap, perhaps like he's keeping the seat warm for
36:43
Speaker 2: the next guy. But it's better than not being on
36:44
Speaker 2: the grid at all. And I think everything we talked
36:46
Speaker 2: about with Liam Lawson a little while ago, you can
36:49
Speaker 2: add degrees to that because at least Lawson has driven
36:51
Speaker 2: a 2026 Formula One car and the complexities of having
36:54
Speaker 2: to deal with that. But Zandvoort's not an easy place
36:57
Speaker 2: to just jump in either. It's, you know, of all
36:59
Speaker 2: the tracks, it's not one of the tilka drones. It's
37:00
Speaker 2: a car park and you can run off a few
37:02
Speaker 2: times and test the limits. Like you run wide at Zandvoort,
37:05
Speaker 2: you're in the hedge and you're going to hurt yourself
37:07
Speaker 2: and hurt your car. We saw that over the course
37:08
Speaker 2: of the weekend. He acquitted himself really well. You know,
37:11
Speaker 2: the one lap pace was pretty much there. It felt
37:14
Speaker 2: like he was as close to getting the limit out
37:16
Speaker 2: of that particular car as you could possibly be with very,
37:19
Speaker 2: very little preparation. Yeah. And it is funny, isn't it?
37:21
Speaker 2: It's continuing the theme of things looking a bit grim
37:24
Speaker 2: for people that wash out of Red Bull and then
37:25
Speaker 2: someone throws a lifeboat towards you. So look, he would
37:28
Speaker 2: be a stopgap if he was to get back on
37:30
Speaker 2: the grid full time with someone like Haas or anywhere really,
37:33
Speaker 2: but it's better than watching from the sidelines. I'm not
37:35
Speaker 2: sure he could have done a whole lot more than
37:37
Speaker 2: he actually did on the weekend. I thought he was
37:38
Speaker 2: super impressive.
37:39
Speaker 1: Yep. And well, we'll wait and see if Isaac Hedges
37:41
Speaker 1: is coming back for Montreux. He probably will, I think,
37:43
Speaker 1: but no confirmation yet. Maybe there's a second run for
37:46
Speaker 1: both Lawson and Sunoda at their old, new, old teams.
37:51
Speaker 1: But that's all the time we have for Pit Talk
37:52
Speaker 1: this week. You can subscribe to Pit Talk wherever you
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38:03
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38:04
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38:09
Speaker 1: Clayton and me, Michael Laminato, thanks very much for your company,
38:12
Speaker 1: and we'll catch you next week.