Latest / Simply Bitcoin / $2.5T Bank CONFIRMS $5M Bitcoin IS CLOSER Than You Think! | EP 1165

Transcript

$2.5T Bank CONFIRMS $5M Bitcoin IS CLOSER Than You Think! | EP 1165 · Simply Bitcoin

• 0:00
  Yo, the CEO of America's second largest bank, $2.5 trillion
• 0:07
  giant just said something at Davos this morning and it
• 0:11
  reminded us of Michael Saylor's $5,000,000 Bitcoin prediction.
• 0:17
  But before we talk about what that prediction was, we have a
• 0:22
  video for you guys and how Trump's potential executive
• 0:26
  order on day two of his administration could be the the
• 0:32
  the, the force that is needed for other multi trillion dollar
• 0:37
  banks to follow in the footsteps of Bank of America.
• 0:42
  All right, everybody, let's check out the clip.
• 0:43
  We will be right back. There's still 4000 banks, so
• 0:47
  it's not like there's considering.
• 0:49
  Let me ask you a separate. Question and Becky's got one
• 0:53
  back in Washington, but on crypto, we just had Brian
• 0:55
  Armstrong sitting in the seat that you were in and obviously
• 0:57
  there's a lot of excitement about crypto.
• 0:59
  The banking business for the most part has stayed away from
• 1:02
  crypto. Given President Trump's full
• 1:06
  throated support for crypto, do you imagine Bank of America is
• 1:10
  going to be full, full on in the crypto business if we have this
• 1:15
  conversation 12 months, 24 months from now?
• 1:17
  I'd separate out this sort of crypto versus stable assets and
• 1:24
  digital movement of money because we already move the
• 1:26
  vast, vast majority of our money digitally.
• 1:29
  Our consumers do, our companies do.
• 1:30
  And so the question is what's the business practice that you
• 1:35
  have to have to move another type of currency.
• 1:37
  So if they live, if the rules come in and make it a real thing
• 1:40
  that you can actually do business with, you will find
• 1:43
  that the banking system will come in hard on the
• 1:45
  transactional side of it, non anonymous, transactional,
• 1:49
  verified etcetera because we have to because it's just
• 1:51
  another way our customers are. Going to was the possibility
• 1:54
  that Bitcoin and some of these crypto currencies actually are a
• 1:56
  threat to the US dollars. Scott Besson's talked about
• 1:59
  needing the US dollar to be super powerful.
• 2:01
  Is it? Is it a threat?
• 2:03
  I think there's a whole bunch of dynamics about all the trade and
• 2:06
  all the consumption of the US consumer and all the stuff that
• 2:08
  goes on. But I think we do need a strong
• 2:10
  U.S. dollar. We need AUS dollar of reserve
• 2:11
  currency. It's good for our country.
• 2:13
  But what I'm saying is if you go, you know, down the street
• 2:16
  here and you go in and, and buy lunch, right, If you can pay
• 2:19
  with Visa, MasterCard, a debit card, Apple Pay, etcetera,
• 2:24
  etcetera, this will just be another form of payment in an
• 2:26
  instantaneous cash transfer. And so I, I think if it becomes
• 2:32
  regulatory, OK, which it wasn't before and that's one of the
• 2:34
  issues you'll see the banking system enter with.
• 2:36
  We have hundreds of patents on blockchain already.
• 2:39
  We, we know how to enter the field.
• 2:41
  When you get to the investment side and the, you know, the
• 2:43
  Bitcoin stuff that that's really a separate question.
• 2:45
  That's one investment side from the transaction side.
• 2:47
  I think you'll see the bank industry to make moves.
• 2:54
  Absolutely massive, basically the CEO of America's second
• 2:59
  largest bank, Bank of America, basically saying two things that
• 3:04
  really stuck out to me. Thing number one was that they
• 3:08
  are not really going to have a choice here.
• 3:11
  They're going to have to do it because just it's going to be an
• 3:14
  an alternative form of payment. And the second thing that I
• 3:18
  found interesting too was that he said, look like we're just
• 3:22
  waiting for the regulatory green light.
• 3:25
  And with the Trump was inaugurated yesterday.
• 3:28
  He hasn't released any executive orders were relating to the
• 3:33
  Bitcoin and crypto industry as of yet.
• 3:36
  But if he, you know, sticks to all his campaign promises, all
• 3:40
  the things that he's promised to the industry, we should be
• 3:42
  getting one or two. And I think the one that I'm
• 3:45
  most paying attention to is specifically the repeal of SAB
• 3:51
  121. SAB 121 is this this regulation
• 3:55
  that was that came out of the SEC that essentially makes it
• 4:00
  incredibly difficult for you to custody Bitcoin as a bank from
• 4:05
  an accounting, from an accounting perspective.
• 4:08
  And it actually, there was a law that was passed that passed the
• 4:12
  House and it passed the Senate as well and bipartisan as well,
• 4:17
  but it was actually vetoed by Biden.
• 4:20
  There are rumors that, and I'll read you from the headline that
• 4:24
  there is rumors coming out of DC, out of the Trump
• 4:27
  administration that he is in favor of repealing SAB 121.
• 4:34
  And to connect it to what I was saying in the beginning of the
• 4:36
  show, How does this relate to Michael Saylor?
• 4:39
  How does this relate to his $5,000,000 prediction?
• 4:42
  Well, Michael Saylor said that three things needed to happen in
• 4:46
  order for Bitcoin to hit $5,000,000.
• 4:49
  Thing number one of the approval of a spot Bitcoin ETF thing #2
• 4:55
  the change in the FAS B accounting rules, which actually
• 4:58
  went into effect, I believe December 25th of 2024 of 2024.
• 5:03
  And the last thing was the ability for banks to custody
• 5:09
  Bitcoin, which SAB 121 are repealing SAB 21 121 is going to
• 5:15
  it's a necessity you're going to have to do it.
• 5:17
  So again, it seems like the bankers, the including the CEO
• 5:21
  of Bank of America is just waiting for that regulatory
• 5:25
  green light from that regulatory thumbs up and it's extremely,
• 5:29
  extremely exciting. Anyways, guys, today we have a
• 5:33
  very special guest. We have Mauricio, the chief
• 5:36
  strategy officer of Leadnd joining us on the show today and
• 5:40
  of course, my legendary Co host Optimus Fields.
• 5:43
  And if you're we're wondering why I'm in a suit, I'm in the
• 5:46
  Imperial city of Washington, DC and I have a very special
• 5:49
  interview later on today. So have to after I finish the
• 5:52
  show, I have to run to that. So that's why I'm wearing what
• 5:56
  I'm wearing today. Anyways, Mauricio, very excited
• 5:58
  to have you on the show. I'm sure that is someone that is
• 6:02
  working in the industry is, is a, is a Co founder, is a Bitcoin
• 6:06
  entrepreneur. You are definitely, definitely
• 6:09
  paying attention to a lot of these regulatory developments,
• 6:13
  Mauricio. Yeah, thanks guys and and happy
• 6:17
  to be here. First for the first time this
• 6:19
  year and I think this is going to be hopefully the beginning of
• 6:23
  a new, a new era. I think there's just general
• 6:25
  optimism as you can see in the price and in the industry from a
• 6:29
  regulatory perspective. What I, what I think we're going
• 6:33
  to see very quickly, and I think this, I have a slightly
• 6:36
  different take on the, on the interpretation, I guess on the
• 6:39
  comments from the Bank of America CEO, which is I expect
• 6:43
  to see the US move very fast to regulate U.S. dollar denominated
• 6:48
  stable coins. And I think banks are salivating
• 6:51
  at this opportunity for a few reasons #1.
• 6:56
  Why is the US going to move so fast to regulate these things?
• 6:58
  Well, they are of strategic importance to the US for two
• 7:01
  reasons #1 making them more accessible and easier to use
• 7:05
  will perpetuate the use of the US dollar globally.
• 7:08
  And the second one is, I believe part of the regulation package
• 7:12
  that will be presented to this part of the industry will
• 7:14
  include forcing or requiring U.S. dollar denominated Symbico
• 7:19
  providers to hold their reserves in U.S.
• 7:21
  Treasuries or U.S. debt, making them a strategic buyer of these
• 7:26
  of these bonds or this paper at a time where nobody really wants
• 7:30
  to be holding this paper. And so I think for those two
• 7:33
  reasons, you're going to see them move very quickly into
• 7:35
  that. And again for the strategic
• 7:38
  significance of those two, it is in the best interest of the
• 7:41
  United States to have these U.S. dollar stable coins grow and
• 7:44
  proliferate within, within a framework that is, you know in
• 7:49
  they feel they are comfortable with.
• 7:51
  So I do foresee one of my predictions in fact for 2025 is
• 7:55
  that stablecoin market cap will probably double to over $500
• 7:58
  billion over the course of this year.
• 8:01
  And I think why what's so interesting about this for the
• 8:05
  banks is that potentially if you look at banks, banks have to
• 8:11
  deal with groups like Visa and other payment processors.
• 8:14
  And every time you make a payment transaction, you end up
• 8:16
  paying like 5 or 6 middle men. And the banks are seeing this
• 8:19
  and saying, well, if this USDC network actually gets to scale,
• 8:24
  we could potentially stop needing intermediaries like
• 8:27
  Visa, like the SWIFT network, like things, and basically
• 8:30
  continue to get more and more. So that's when he talks about
• 8:34
  separating transactional instruments versus investing,
• 8:38
  which is what he'd deal with Bitcoin.
• 8:40
  I think there's going the bankers are going to make a big
• 8:42
  push to say Bitcoin isn't money, it's an investable asset.
• 8:45
  Stable coins are money use this. And I think that will be in many
• 8:50
  ways, touting the same line that the strategic interests of the
• 8:54
  US want. Absolutely.
• 8:56
  And then also to, to add to your point, Manisha, I believe Howard
• 9:01
  Lupnik, who I know is very associated with Tether was just
• 9:06
  appointed head of commerce. So it's again talk about
• 9:10
  alignment of incentives. So I, I do agree with you and I
• 9:13
  think it's a fascinating point in regards to stablecoins.
• 9:16
  I definitely think they're, they're, they're, their adoption
• 9:20
  and their use is going to increase.
• 9:21
  And we see this specifically, buddy.
• 9:23
  So me and me and you both know this, right?
• 9:25
  The, the adoption of stable coins in developing countries is
• 9:29
  absolutely astronomical. I, I think a lot of people were
• 9:34
  not expecting it. And again, I think it, it
• 9:38
  provides a, a life, a lifeline essentially to those people,
• 9:41
  because those are, those are people that like don't have the
• 9:44
  privilege that we do, that we have a stable Fiat currency,
• 9:48
  right? They, they don't have that.
• 9:49
  Most of the world doesn't have that.
• 9:51
  And I, I truly believe that stablecoins are a stepping stone
• 9:54
  towards Bitcoin because it gets people very used to the idea of
• 9:58
  dealing with a non sovereign alternative and it gets them
• 10:02
  used to dealing with a, a digital wallet for holding their
• 10:05
  money, sending money. And there's no, the, the
• 10:08
  barriers of entry are not there, right?
• 10:10
  They don't have to go and sit in a bank for an hour and a half to
• 10:14
  open a bank account. They can just literally
• 10:16
  download, you know, a wallet. And I believe Samsung Mau's
• 10:19
  wallet, Aqua has both Bitcoin and tether capabilities.
• 10:24
  So it has both Bitcoin and the stablecoin.
• 10:27
  So I agree with Mauricio Opti. Real quick, do you have an
• 10:29
  opinion on the video of the Bank of America CEO talking about
• 10:35
  basically just waiting, waiting for the regulatory thumbs up?
• 10:39
  Opti, what's your take? Yeah.
• 10:40
  Well, first of all, I really like Mauricio's take on that.
• 10:43
  And I also see that that playing out and that's kind of the angle
• 10:46
  going on 2nd is I think this is obviously something we've been
• 10:50
  saying for a while and it's becoming very clear that the
• 10:53
  banks are salivating to get their holds on quote UN quote
• 10:56
  digital assets. Now the part to me that stuck
• 10:58
  out and I we say this all the time is that Fiat money is
• 11:02
  already digital. And This is why they're kind of
• 11:04
  already so comfortable with this idea of like, yeah, you know,
• 11:07
  Bitcoin, cryptocurrencies, digital assets, whatever.
• 11:11
  You know, it's all, it's already digital within their internal,
• 11:14
  you know, their internal workings here.
• 11:16
  And it is very interesting to hear these guys finally kind of
• 11:20
  get off the FUD ledge and be like, yeah, like money's already
• 11:22
  digital. This new digital money thing is
• 11:24
  not that new of a an idea to us. It's just more of their lack of
• 11:29
  control around this new money, AKA Bitcoin that concerns them.
• 11:32
  And hence why they need all the regulation and the guide rails
• 11:36
  to ensure that, you know, they they don't hurt themselves here
• 11:40
  or rather hurt their reputation. So that that's the part that
• 11:42
  stuck out with me is like, our money's already digital.
• 11:45
  And so few people understand that, yeah, you may be using
• 11:48
  cash, but that money in a bank internal Ledger is already
• 11:52
  digital. It's just, it's just digital
• 11:53
  already. So this is not a new idea, but
• 11:56
  so few people even understand that simple idea.
• 11:59
  Absolutely, guys, it's go ahead Money, Sir.
• 12:02
  No, I, I was just going to say that I, I think if I read
• 12:04
  between the lines, I think these banks are trying really hard to
• 12:08
  signal to their investor community that they are not that
• 12:12
  far behind, right? If you, if the reality is they
• 12:15
  are incredibly far behind. You know, we've been lending for
• 12:18
  six years. These guys still don't touch
• 12:19
  Bitcoin. Yes, you are far behind as an
• 12:22
  investor. You don't want to feel that way.
• 12:24
  So what I, when I hear things like we already have a lot of
• 12:27
  patents on this, We already have digital money.
• 12:29
  We know how to do this, we know how to enter the space.
• 12:32
  That sounds to me a little bit like, please don't sell my
• 12:36
  shares. I promise we're going to get
• 12:38
  into this, into this thing. And, and you know, we're, we're
• 12:41
  there, we got it. We're just waiting for the
• 12:42
  light, you know, and it's like, it sounds to me a little bit
• 12:44
  more like a like a defense, as in we're not going to get
• 12:48
  trampled by this fast moving, you know, incredibly more
• 12:52
  experienced groups that are running laps around this right
• 12:54
  now. And so I, I see that as a, as a,
• 12:57
  Oh my God, we're almost there. But I don't, I don't think of it
• 12:59
  as a yeah, no, for sure. We agree with this.
• 13:02
  I think this is more of a of a no.
• 13:04
  Please, please don't punish us so hard for being so far behind
• 13:06
  you. Know absolutely I think I think
• 13:08
  you're absolutely spot on Mauricio and there's been many
• 13:12
  entrepreneurs like yourself that have been able to successfully
• 13:15
  navigate the regulatory environment the hostile
• 13:18
  regulatory environment and I think with the Trump
• 13:22
  administration coming in I think it's going to be a lot easier
• 13:24
  right things are going to get you know the the roadblocks and
• 13:31
  how do I say this nicely I'm just going to leave it at that
• 13:34
  anyways guys, if you guys are enjoying the show so far we're
• 13:39
  about to break 100 likes we're at 700 live viewers already make
• 13:44
  sure to smash that like button. You guys are watching simply
• 13:47
  Bitcoin live. We have a 700 on YouTube alone
• 13:51
  2000 across all platforms including X and rumble.
• 13:55
  So shout out to all you guys, guys, we have a lot to talk talk
• 13:58
  about today. First up, we're going to talk
• 14:00
  about Ross. Why is Ross not free?
• 14:03
  It is the promise was free Ross day one.
• 14:07
  So we're going to have a discussion about that.
• 14:09
  And also during the new segment, we're going to be talking about
• 14:12
  potential Trump executive orders as it relates to our industry.
• 14:18
  Again, no executive orders as it relates to our industry as of
• 14:22
  yet, but today is Day 2, January 21st of the Trump
• 14:27
  administration's second term. So we're going to talk about all
• 14:30
  of that. And of course, we have Mauricio
• 14:33
  joining us today from Leadnd and we're going to talk about
• 14:36
  Leadnd. I think that this is a trend
• 14:38
  that's going to accelerate over the next coming years is
• 14:43
  something that I've done personally myself.
• 14:45
  Bitcoin is one of the strongest collaterals on planet Earth and
• 14:50
  there's different ways to use your Bitcoin, not sell your
• 14:54
  Bitcoin and incur a capital gain to access the wealth of your
• 14:59
  Bitcoin. So we're going to talk about
• 15:00
  that and we're also going to be comparing and contrasting
• 15:04
  because Coinbase recently announced that they released a
• 15:09
  Bitcoin loan product. So we're going to compare that
• 15:12
  with what our friends over at Lenin are doing.
• 15:15
  So guys, it's going to be a jam packed show, tons to talk about.
• 15:18
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• 15:21
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  At the time of recording, the Bitcoin price is $105,600 block
• 19:12
  height 888 1236 sats per dollar under 1947 market cap 2.09
• 19:20
  trillion Bitcoin verse gold market cap 10.96% percentage
• 19:27
  issued 94.34% decline from all time high -3.3% realize monetary
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  inflation 1.06% to continuing to take Fiat currencies to absolute
• 19:42
  school. All right, everybody, the topic
• 19:44
  of yesterday on Bitcoin Twitter, remember a lot of us gave Donald
• 19:50
  Trump, the orange man who is now the 47th president of the United
• 19:55
  States, their vote specifically, maybe not because of his
• 20:00
  promises towards the Bitcoin industry, but specifically
• 20:04
  because of his promise to free Ross on day one.
• 20:10
  As things currently stands, Ross is still in prison and there has
• 20:14
  been no official pardon coming out of the Trump White House.
• 20:20
  Now, according to the Poly market odds and according to my
• 20:24
  instincts as well, I truly believe that Ross will be free
• 20:28
  by the end of the week There. People have to be.
• 20:33
  You guys have to understand something.
• 20:35
  People have to be realistic, OK. And you know, this is this is
• 20:40
  someone who was attacked by the media.
• 20:42
  This is someone who was almost assassinated.
• 20:45
  This is someone that the whole political establishment
• 20:49
  essentially tried to destroy for, for many, many years.
• 20:52
  So the amount of things that he probably had to do yesterday,
• 20:56
  I'm not trying to excuse him or anything, were probably a lot.
• 20:59
  So I, I kind of already had that perception of this coming in.
• 21:04
  I think believing that that Ross was going to be free on day one
• 21:09
  just based on, you know, Trump and the whole thing with I think
• 21:12
  was a little bit naive, But I will, you know, preface that
• 21:15
  with saying, or I will give a little bit of context with
• 21:18
  saying that I do believe that he will be free by the end of the
• 21:21
  week. I think expecting that he was
• 21:23
  going to be free on day one was a bit naive.
• 21:25
  It obviously sucks that he did promise that he was going to do
• 21:30
  it on day one. But hey, it's politicians and
• 21:33
  politicians need to get votes. But I will, you know, another,
• 21:37
  another very thing that's very promising is Elon Musk, which is
• 21:44
  working closely with the Trump administration.
• 21:46
  He was sitting one of the on the front row or the second row in
• 21:50
  Trump's inauguration. In the inauguration speech, you
• 21:53
  see Elon right next to Trump's son, Baron Trump.
• 21:56
  So Elon's going to be working very closely with the Trump
• 21:59
  administration, with the so-called Department of
• 22:01
  Government efficiency. See.
• 22:03
  And he tweeted 15 hours ago that Ross will be freed too.
• 22:09
  It seems like Trump was focusing on the 1500 January 6 protesters
• 22:15
  first. Those were part of his first
• 22:17
  pardons. And here is Angela Mccardo, and
• 22:20
  she says President Trump's staff just confirmed to me Ross's
• 22:25
  pardon will be issued late tonight or tomorrow morning.
• 22:29
  That sweet that tweet came out at 9:47 PM.
• 22:32
  Yeah, it's obviously tomorrow morning.
• 22:35
  I mean, it's tomorrow afternoon already.
• 22:37
  It's past noon. So, you know, nothings happened
• 22:40
  so far. But like I said, it is very
• 22:42
  promising that Elon is saying Ross will be freed.
• 22:45
  It's very promising that we're seeing this type of activity and
• 22:48
  just based on my own intuition and I, I, I don't know if you
• 22:51
  guys know this about me, but I, I love politics.
• 22:54
  I like to the stay to stay on top of a lot of things that are
• 22:57
  going. I was never expecting it to
• 22:59
  happen on day one, but I do expect it to happen by the end
• 23:02
  of I do expect it to happen by Friday like the latest.
• 23:06
  Maybe not today. It should be.
• 23:07
  It'd be great today, but I do expect it to be happen to happen
• 23:11
  by Friday at the latest. Ross will be a free man.
• 23:14
  It's going to happen very, very quickly and it's going to be a
• 23:17
  huge victory for Bitcoiners and the and the freedom movement
• 23:22
  overall, right? We had Julian Assange, who was
• 23:25
  freed last year. Now Ross Albrecht is on the
• 23:28
  verge of being freed. I mean, the only one that we're
• 23:30
  missing really is Edward Snowden.
• 23:32
  I think that's going to happen eventually as well.
• 23:35
  Anyways, Mauricio, what's your take on this?
• 23:37
  Do you feel a little bit let down that it didn't happen on
• 23:40
  day one? Are you a little bit more of a
• 23:41
  realist? You kind of understand so many
• 23:44
  things that are happening. I'm not trying to make excuses,
• 23:46
  but it's just the reality of, you know, of Washington, DC So,
• 23:50
  Maricia, what's your take? Yeah, thanks, Nico.
• 23:53
  I, I think I broadly agree with your take in the sense that I,
• 23:56
  I, I wouldn't my call, I wouldn't call myself a sort of,
• 23:59
  you know, political expert in terms of how these pardons get
• 24:02
  get processed and signed and the time that it takes.
• 24:05
  I think I'm coming at this from the point of building trust,
• 24:11
  that the way you build trust is you say you're going to do
• 24:12
  something and you go and do it. And the way you lose trust is
• 24:15
  you say you're going to do something and you don't do it.
• 24:17
  So this is I think test number one for for this administration,
• 24:21
  which is you made a promise, you said that it was going to be
• 24:23
  done by a certain time. And I think there's an
• 24:26
  expectation and the Bitcoin community that something's going
• 24:28
  to happen very soon. And you know, will, will, you
• 24:33
  know, will it still be as impactful if the pardon comes
• 24:36
  in, you know, a week from now? I'm sure it will be for Ross and
• 24:38
  for his family and for everybody.
• 24:40
  A few days after so many years, it's not going to be a a deal
• 24:43
  breaker. But I think what's most
• 24:45
  important here is the image of trust around keeping your
• 24:49
  promises to this, to this community or to this group that
• 24:53
  that supported you so strongly in the elections.
• 24:56
  And so if he wants to keep and build the trust in with the with
• 25:01
  this Bitcoin community, with this industry, he should follow
• 25:04
  through. And I would, I mean, again, I
• 25:06
  don't have there's no like running clock on this.
• 25:08
  There's no shot clock for him to go and do it.
• 25:10
  But I think that if it doesn't happen by sometime before the
• 25:14
  end of this week, you're going to start seeing a lot of anxiety
• 25:16
  and questions around the Bitcoin or community that was so
• 25:20
  fervently supporting this administration.
• 25:23
  So I, I, I, we're, we're all going to be watching Intent
• 25:26
  intently what happens between now and the rest of the week?
• 25:29
  100 percent, 100% he, he promised, he promised the
• 25:33
  community that he was going to free Ross.
• 25:35
  Ross is a, is a martyr. He's a martyr for our move and
• 25:38
  what this is all about. He got unjustly sentenced.
• 25:42
  They tried to make an example out of him.
• 25:44
  And yes, it's extremely important for our community, our
• 25:47
  movement, that this man is freed.
• 25:50
  And Trump obviously keeps his promise.
• 25:53
  Like I said, instinctively, I think he will.
• 25:57
  The only question is when this is going to happen.
• 26:00
  My bet is by the end of the week, Ross is going to be a free
• 26:03
  man. But Mauricio said something
• 26:04
  really, really, really accurate, which is you want to build trust
• 26:08
  with people. You keep your promises, You keep
• 26:10
  your word. And so far, the promise was
• 26:14
  free. Ross on day one.
• 26:16
  OK, maybe we give him a pass on Inauguration Day.
• 26:19
  Let's say this is day one. OK?
• 26:21
  You know, put up or shut up. Let's see what happens.
• 26:24
  You know it. It's really all all they need is
• 26:26
  a signature, right? It's all that all that needs to
• 26:28
  happen. So Opti, what are your thoughts
• 26:32
  on this? Man?
• 26:33
  It is slightly disappointing, but again, as long as Ross is
• 26:37
  freed, I think it's it's a huge victory for us.
• 26:40
  And, and something that we haven't talked about yet.
• 26:43
  We're going to talk about it during the news segment is,
• 26:46
  ladies and gentlemen, we are now in the room and you don't get
• 26:50
  included in the deal unless you are in the room.
• 26:53
  Our industry is in the room where they make the deals and
• 26:57
  that's a very, very good place to be in, right?
• 26:59
  Opti, what's your take? Yeah, well, first of all, I
• 27:02
  think if Ross is freed, whether you know, it's today or by the
• 27:07
  end of the week, it's a win overall, like Mauricio was
• 27:10
  saying, for his family and for Ross in particular.
• 27:13
  And personally right now, you know, like I said in the chat, I
• 27:15
  wouldn't want to feel what Ross is feeling right now.
• 27:18
  I'm sure he's having a lot of thoughts right now and hopefully
• 27:21
  it happened by end of day. I think the big confusion that
• 27:24
  everyone's, you know, asking themselves is what is actually
• 27:27
  day one was yesterday day one or is today day one.
• 27:30
  And I really like the takes on Twitter from the the Bitcoin
• 27:33
  developers. It's like, well, you know, maybe
• 27:35
  Trump failed for the normies by not releasing Ross on
• 27:39
  inauguration day, but developers index on day zero.
• 27:43
  So I'm going to say that today is day one and it would be very
• 27:46
  fitting if Ross does get freed on the 21st.
• 27:49
  So I'm hoping by end of day we see that executive order get
• 27:53
  pushed through and of of course, all the other executive orders
• 27:55
  that we are kind of speculating on.
• 27:57
  So we still, it's still going to be a long day.
• 27:59
  If, if yesterday's a signal of what he's going to be doing,
• 28:02
  then I'm sure we're going to see executive orders go all the way
• 28:05
  through until the night. So I'm very hopeful that we see
• 28:08
  it happen today. And you know, depending on how
• 28:11
  you define day one, I think this is going to be a huge win if, if
• 28:15
  Ross is free by the end of the night.
• 28:16
  So that's kind of my take, you know, Free Ross, and we'll see
• 28:20
  what happened by the end of the day.
• 28:22
  Absolutely absolutely guys, this is an incredible show today 3300
• 28:27
  live viewers brought to break 1000 viewers just on loot
• 28:32
  YouTube alone we're at 900 and we peeked at 977 on YouTube
• 28:37
  guys. If you guys are enjoying the
• 28:39
  show so far, make sure to smash that like button.
• 28:42
  We're at 200 likes. Help us break 3 to 400 likes
• 28:46
  within the 1st 45 minutes of the show.
• 28:48
  So if you guys are enjoying simply Bitcoin live, smash that
• 28:52
  like button today I'm joined with Mauricio from lead end and
• 28:56
  of course my legendary Co host who's always optimistic optimist
• 28:59
  fields guys, we have so much content to cover Today we're
• 29:03
  going to talk about the potential executive orders
• 29:05
  coming through. Has Trump let us down once
• 29:08
  again? And of course, we're going to be
• 29:10
  talking about lead end during the culture segment.
• 29:13
  All right, ladies and gentlemen, we will be right back.
• 29:16
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  video description. All right, everybody, let's get
• 31:37
  to today's news. So what are the Poly market odds
• 31:43
  currently? It peaked yesterday at almost
• 31:45
  48%. We are down to 37%.
• 31:50
  And the question is, will Trump create a Bitcoin reserve in the
• 31:55
  1st 100 days? Here's a Reuters article that I
• 31:59
  want to cover today. The headline for the audio
• 32:01
  listeners is Bitcoin rally cools as Trump makes no mention of
• 32:07
  crypto. It goes on to say Bitcoin and
• 32:09
  other crypto, cryptocurrencies, even the and even the newly
• 32:13
  minted token bearing Donald Trump's name, cooled on Tuesday
• 32:17
  after the US president's first set of policies following his
• 32:20
  inauguration made no reference to the asset class.
• 32:25
  It goes on to say Trump's own cryptocurrency launched on
• 32:28
  Friday night, was trading at $37, having roughly peaked at
• 32:34
  7575 dollars. Trump's inaugural speech on
• 32:38
  Monday was accompanied by a host of executive orders and plans
• 32:42
  relating to trade, tariffs, immigration, energy deregulation
• 32:46
  and even a reprise for popular Chinese short form video app
• 32:51
  TikTok, but no mention of cryptocurrencies.
• 32:56
  It goes on to say the digital asset market is disappointed to
• 33:00
  not have been mentioned in the inauguration speech or day one
• 33:05
  executive orders. I, I suspect Bitcoin will end up
• 33:09
  going lower so long as as, as long as we get no news from
• 33:13
  Trump on digital assets. So it goes on to say, I think in
• 33:18
  the short term and there's a chance this could be a sell the
• 33:21
  news event. So anyway, just to get provide a
• 33:24
  little bit of context and we'll open up the conversation with
• 33:26
  Mauricio and Opti. I mean, once again, I was not
• 33:30
  expecting that Trump was going to mention this in his
• 33:36
  inauguration speech. However, I was about 5050 fifty,
• 33:41
  5060% sure that there was going to be a day one executive order
• 33:48
  specifically to provide some relief for the industry
• 33:53
  regarding Operation choke point 2.0.
• 33:55
  I mean, we did like figure metaphorically get beat up by a
• 33:58
  2 by 4 for the last four years or so.
• 34:01
  I know that there was a tweet that came out earlier on the
• 34:04
  week coming out of Senator Lummits's office talking
• 34:08
  basically asking the FDIC staff to preserve documents because
• 34:14
  they want to get to the bottom of what really happened during
• 34:17
  Operation Choke .2 Point O. So I got to say was not
• 34:20
  surprised that it was not included that he did not include
• 34:23
  it in the his inauguration speech at the Capitol.
• 34:28
  But I was a little bit surprised that there was no day one
• 34:32
  executive orders for the Bitcoin and crypto industry.
• 34:36
  Mauricio, what's your take on this?
• 34:38
  What were you thinking? Thanks Nico.
• 34:42
  I think as a, as a, as a founder in the space, as an entrepreneur
• 34:47
  and as a bitcoiner and, and everyone watching this show is
• 34:50
  we all look at Trump's actions through the lens of Bitcoin,
• 34:53
  through the lens of what he's doing for the crypto industry.
• 34:55
  But I think we tend to forget that he's not the president of
• 34:58
  our industry. You know, our industry is one of
• 35:01
  many such lobbies that supported, you know, his
• 35:04
  administration or his campaign to get elected, right.
• 35:07
  And, and in in fairness, if you, if you, if you want to talk real
• 35:09
  numbers, our industry is still a drop in the bucket for the US
• 35:13
  economy compared to housing, compared to energy, compared to,
• 35:16
  you know, mining, you know, a plethora of other industries.
• 35:20
  So I don't think I, I, I in fact think that if he continued to
• 35:25
  lean so hard into crypto, it, it might have actually turned off a
• 35:32
  lot of his other supporters because he has been, I mean, I
• 35:35
  think for me, the bigger signal is I, I had, I, you know, I was,
• 35:38
  I had the privilege of attending the crypto ball earlier this
• 35:41
  year or earlier this week, actually in DC or last last
• 35:44
  Friday. And for me, the big signal here
• 35:47
  is that you had the new crypto tsar open the event.
• 35:50
  David Sachs was there. It was a it was a celebration
• 35:53
  held in DC for our industry and you had Treasury Secretary
• 35:58
  Bessett and you had Commerce Secretary Lutnick and other
• 36:02
  members of DC and senators and congressmen in the room.
• 36:06
  And if you have been following this industry for the last six
• 36:11
  months and you think that because he didn't mention it in
• 36:14
  his speech, you are there, that is your reason to go out and
• 36:16
  press sell on your Bitcoin that you shouldn't probably have been
• 36:21
  here in the beginning, right? So, so I would say take this
• 36:27
  with a take this with a grain of salt, understand that Bitcoin is
• 36:30
  a part of the broader economy. It's not the economy, even
• 36:33
  though for us it's the most important thing for many people,
• 36:35
  it's not most people that you walk through in the street will
• 36:38
  will just tell you they don't have it.
• 36:40
  In fact, I would, I would guess that probably 10% of my friends
• 36:42
  have it, even though I'm in the space.
• 36:44
  So I don't, I don't take offense to this.
• 36:47
  I don't think this means he's not going to follow through.
• 36:49
  I think this is a lot of competing priorities and he's
• 36:51
  just having to hedge his bets. Absolutely 100%.
• 36:55
  Also want to give a shout out to YouTube.
• 36:57
  We just broke 1000 live viewers on YouTube alone and almost 4000
• 37:05
  live viewers between Rumble and X.
• 37:09
  If you guys are enjoying the show so far, make sure to smash
• 37:13
  that like button Opti. Looks like I'm going to have to
• 37:15
  wear a suit more often. I might have to.
• 37:18
  Buy a suit first. Day first day I wear a suit on
• 37:22
  simply Bitcoin. We break 1000 live viewers.
• 37:24
  That's it's crazy anyways, guys I mean I'm in DC that's why I'm
• 37:28
  wearing this and I have an interview a little bit later.
• 37:31
  I normally don't do that, but it looks like I might have to
• 37:34
  change up the entire. Or or or we got to be on time.
• 37:37
  I don't know which one is it. Maybe on time or maybe the suit,
• 37:39
  who knows, but maybe it's the subject matter.
• 37:42
  Anyways guys, it's smash the like button if you guys are
• 37:44
  enjoying the show. Opti, what's your take on this?
• 37:48
  I mean, Opti, you have taken a more skeptical stance this
• 37:51
  entire time. You've been like Nico.
• 37:53
  You know what? I don't U.S. politicians, I
• 37:55
  don't, you know, I don't do this like you know, it's are, are you
• 37:59
  vindicated, Opti, or do you agree with Muddis?
• 38:01
  Because I do agree with Muddis here, right?
• 38:03
  The art industry, it truly is, especially it's nothing.
• 38:06
  It's just this tiny little speck.
• 38:07
  It's getting bigger, it's getting exponentially bigger,
• 38:10
  but in the grand scheme of things, it's still very, very,
• 38:14
  very small. Opti, what's your take?
• 38:15
  Yeah. I mean, look, I am still
• 38:17
  skeptical of politicians. Obviously that's like my default
• 38:20
  here. But what Mauricio saying, I
• 38:23
  think is that the key take away, like, you know, I may be a 65 IQ
• 38:27
  Bitcoiner here, but I am not, you know, a 45 IQ Bitcoiner that
• 38:31
  thinks that Trump was going to talk about Bitcoin in his
• 38:34
  inauguration speech. That just is like this is a new
• 38:38
  part of his campaign here. And if you really kind of go
• 38:40
  down into like the Trump movement, he's really doing a
• 38:45
  lot of things that his base likes on day one or day 0 or
• 38:48
  whatever you want to, you know, call it.
• 38:50
  And so if you follow through today, then I think that is a
• 38:53
  huge W in regards to Ross being free and or repealing Saab 121.
• 38:59
  So, you know, I'm a holding judgment.
• 39:01
  Obviously, I'm skeptical of all politicians first and foremost.
• 39:04
  That's just kind of like my default view and and personally,
• 39:08
  I don't want to be vindicated on this one.
• 39:10
  Like I want to see Ross walk out hopefully by end of day.
• 39:13
  I think that is going to be huge.
• 39:15
  But what Mauricio said, I think is the fair take here, like he
• 39:18
  did day one, a lot of things that his base wants.
• 39:21
  And I think like Mauricio was saying, Bitcoin or even the
• 39:25
  crypto industry, we're still a very tiny portion of the global
• 39:29
  economy. We're still a relatively small
• 39:31
  movement here. And a lot of the things that he
• 39:34
  he did yesterday are what his base wants to see.
• 39:37
  So I'm hopeful that by the end of the day, we'll see something.
• 39:41
  It's still, we're still kind of small in the grand scheme of
• 39:44
  things, but a lot of us Bitcoiners think that we're the
• 39:46
  biggest kahuna in the, in the, you know, in the Bay.
• 39:49
  But we're not like no one cares about Bitcoiners.
• 39:52
  No one cares about Bitcoin. It's, it's a recent development.
• 39:56
  But we are, as Nico saying, and as is referenced by the suit
• 40:00
  here, we are finally in the room now.
• 40:02
  So things are changing and. And I think by the end of the
• 40:06
  year, or rather maybe by midterms and the next election,
• 40:10
  Bitcoin will be the defining conversation.
• 40:12
  We, we saw that timeline get popped up this year and we were
• 40:16
  surprised that we weren't even in the conversation at all.
• 40:18
  And so now things are getting kicked into OverDrive and things
• 40:21
  are becoming very serious. And as we can tell from Nico's
• 40:25
  suit, we are the mainstream, or rather entering the mainstream
• 40:27
  now. So yeah, I, I think I'm holding,
• 40:30
  I'm holding judgement till end of day.
• 40:32
  But if we don't see some Bitcoin and ask executive orders by the
• 40:36
  end of the day, then yeah, I'll come on tomorrow and.
• 40:38
  I'll be going kind of hard. Yeah.
• 40:40
  I mean, the look, we were saying this early when we were talking
• 40:43
  about Ross, The the the clock is on.
• 40:45
  The clock is on. Because, you know, OK, fine.
• 40:48
  You know, maybe today's day one, maybe he's got a lot of stuff on
• 40:51
  his desk. But I'm telling you, including
• 40:54
  myself, if we're on Friday and Ross is not out of prison, out
• 41:00
  of like penitentiary, out of the highest security, maximum
• 41:04
  security level prisons, it's it's a, it's called FDA, it's
• 41:08
  FCI Florence. It's like, it's crazy, like the
• 41:11
  level of security that they have in that prison.
• 41:13
  If Ross is not free by Friday, I mean, I think a lot of people
• 41:18
  are going to be very, very upset.
• 41:21
  So because that was the promise, Manisha said this is how you
• 41:24
  build trust with the industry that put trust in you.
• 41:27
  You can make a very strong argument that the Kamala
• 41:32
  administration stance or the Kamala campaign stance on the
• 41:37
  industry might have cost for the election.
• 41:39
  You can make a very strong case on that.
• 41:43
  And again, what what a better what there is no better way to
• 41:48
  destroy trust by not keeping the one thing that you would say.
• 41:52
  You then say free Ross. You said free Ross day one,
• 41:57
  right? It was very specific what you
• 41:59
  said. So, yeah, a lot of people put
• 42:02
  faith and we shall see what happens.
• 42:04
  Like I said, my personal opinion.
• 42:06
  You saw the tweet from Elon. I think he will be free.
• 42:09
  Mauricio, before we move on to the culture segment, we start
• 42:12
  talking about lead and I want to get your take.
• 42:14
  Is there anything else that you're expecting from a a
• 42:18
  regulatory perspective now that the hostile Biden
• 42:21
  administration, they're not in power anymore?
• 42:23
  The Trump administration is here.
• 42:25
  Is there anything that you're looking forward to that you're
• 42:27
  looking forward to as a Bitcoin entrepreneur?
• 42:32
  I think broadly speaking, it would be the same thing that
• 42:34
  most other entrepreneurs in the space are looking for or, or,
• 42:39
  you know, desire, which is more regulatory clarity around
• 42:43
  financial services, including Bitcoin financial services,
• 42:46
  including things like stablecoins.
• 42:49
  So for me, the the things that I'm looking forward to are these
• 42:53
  updates, like you said, to, to the Michael Saylor sort of
• 42:56
  checklist, which is allowing banks to interact with Bitcoin,
• 43:00
  having fair accounting rules for those that do and, you know,
• 43:04
  clear clarifying what you know, more assurances and guarantees
• 43:08
  around U.S. dollar denominated stablecoins.
• 43:11
  I think a lot of those things are at least from my corner of
• 43:14
  the Bitcoin space, which is financial services.
• 43:16
  It will remove a lot of the uncertainty that had in many
• 43:21
  ways castrated progress and more product innovation in this
• 43:24
  space. So I'm very excited for them.
• 43:27
  Just just let us build. You know, we're not really
• 43:29
  asking for much. Just just, you know, give us the
• 43:32
  goal post so we could go out and build.
• 43:34
  Yeah, absolutely. And leave us alone, right?
• 43:37
  Like that's, that's what we're asking for is, is just leave us
• 43:40
  alone. Like it all the other things are
• 43:42
  like, you know, icing on the cake.
• 43:44
  But it's more so like, don't attack the industry.
• 43:48
  Remove the army and we can do the rest.
• 43:50
  Just we don't. We don't need you to push us
• 43:52
  forward. Just just remove the blockers.
• 43:54
  Let us build. Absolutely guys, we're already
• 43:57
  at 350 likes on YouTube. Help us break 100 likes within
• 44:03
  the first hour of the show. Smash that like button.
• 44:07
  We're almost at 4000 live viewers in total.
• 44:11
  Shout out to all you guys. I'm I must, I have to wear suits
• 44:15
  every day I guess or we have to show up on time.
• 44:18
  I don't know what's happening, but anyways, guys, we have tons
• 44:21
  to talk about. We're going to be talking about
• 44:23
  lead end. We're going to be talking about
• 44:25
  different ways to use your Bitcoin without having to sell
• 44:28
  it, without incurring capital gains, leveraging your, your,
• 44:33
  your wealth. And, and you guys, you have to
• 44:34
  understand that Bitcoin is the best collateral the world has
• 44:38
  ever seen. And obviously you don't want to
• 44:41
  sell it. So there's different ways to
• 44:43
  approach this. Obviously you have to do it
• 44:45
  responsibly. You have to do it, you know, you
• 44:48
  have to do it with a strategy. You can't go full D Gen. but you
• 44:52
  definitely there's definitely tools out there that let you
• 44:56
  take advantage of the of your Bitcoin of of the of the best
• 45:00
  collateral on planet earth. So we're going to be talking to
• 45:04
  Mauricio about that from Leaden and of course we're also going
• 45:08
  to be talking about the Coinbase product that recently released.
• 45:12
  So guys, we'll be right back. We are going to hit the culture.
• 45:15
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• 46:58
  All right, I want to take advantage of the fact that
• 47:01
  Mauricio is in the house joining us today.
• 47:03
  Mauricio, how you doing? I, I wanted to, I want to get
• 47:06
  you on the show, man, to talk about what, what, what's going
• 47:10
  on with this Coinbase stuff? They they just announced a new
• 47:12
  product. You know, they just announced a
• 47:18
  new product. What is the difference between
• 47:20
  the Coinbase product and the Leaden product?
• 47:24
  Yeah, Yeah. Thanks, Nico.
• 47:25
  And and I think I I would say broadly speaking, just to set
• 47:28
  some context, every time we have this surge in asset prices or
• 47:32
  Bitcoin goes up and to the right.
• 47:34
  And this idea that selling your Bitcoin is a bad idea sort of
• 47:37
  jump starts this new wave of offerings of of Bitcoin, you
• 47:42
  know, as collateral types of products.
• 47:45
  We saw this in every particular cycle.
• 47:47
  Like this has been true for I would say every single cycle.
• 47:50
  So Lenin, where we come from is we started this back in 2018, We
• 47:56
  did Canada's first Bitcoin back loan in 2018.
• 47:59
  And our approach has been in the way we differentiate our
• 48:04
  offering in the market is we wanted to create the safest,
• 48:06
  most responsible, in many cases, what some people would perceive
• 48:09
  as the most boring place to keep your Bitcoin safe as collateral
• 48:13
  and borrow dollars against it. We are a Bitcoiner.
• 48:15
  So we, we, I was a Bitcoiner before we started all of this.
• 48:18
  And the, the, the team itself is, is made-up by Bitcoiners.
• 48:22
  So we understand the importance of, you know, transferring
• 48:26
  custody to someone else. We understand that it's, it's
• 48:30
  something that you need to be, you need to do your research,
• 48:32
  right? You need to do your diligence
• 48:34
  and understand really the risks that you're taking when you're
• 48:37
  interacting with any one of these platforms and taking one
• 48:39
  of these loans. So over the years, we've built a
• 48:41
  track record. You know, we were the first
• 48:44
  lenders to bring on proof of reserves.
• 48:45
  We've stood by our clients and basically had 100% up time for
• 48:49
  the entirety of our trajectory, which is, you know, since 2018
• 48:52
  until today. Every time we see a wave like
• 48:56
  this, we see a new plethora of new lenders come into the space,
• 49:00
  whether it's traditional, you know, you know, an exchange
• 49:03
  that's tacking on lending or it's a net new offering, or it's
• 49:09
  a decentralized offering or a peer-to-peer offering.
• 49:12
  There's always just a wave of, of loans that, that just pop
• 49:15
  into the market. And as I've said in my
• 49:19
  predictions, I, I, I said this, I think in the 2024 or 2025
• 49:22
  predictions, like we are going to see a new wave of lenders
• 49:26
  that are going to try to seduce you with, you know, sexy rates
• 49:29
  and sexy offerings for you to get to test these products.
• 49:35
  Lending is a, a relationship that doesn't reach finality
• 49:39
  right away. When you take a loan, you are,
• 49:41
  you're basically picking a partner to be with you for a
• 49:44
  year, 2 years, three years. I have clients that have rolled
• 49:46
  loans for four years. So you have to really feel
• 49:49
  comfortable with the other person or the other party that
• 49:53
  is on the other side of that transaction.
• 49:54
  And trajectory and experience as anyone in this space, you know,
• 49:59
  anyone that's been around in this space for longer than
• 50:01
  longer than two years understands the value of
• 50:04
  experience and having been in the space and seen the
• 50:06
  curveballs and the volatility that this space is known for.
• 50:10
  A lot of these new guys, all they see is the rates and the
• 50:13
  fact that they can sell the Bitcoin and they think, Oh my
• 50:15
  God, this is the dollar signs light up.
• 50:18
  But they're coming at this with exactly that dollar signs in
• 50:21
  their eyes. They're not really out there to
• 50:24
  think about the long term bet of this problem product.
• 50:26
  They see a spread, they see dollar signs and they just want
• 50:28
  to jump in it. And again, this cycle has been
• 50:32
  no difference. There's there's been a plethora
• 50:34
  of of, you know, peer-to-peer coming soon types of lenders
• 50:39
  that that see dollar signs and they want to come in.
• 50:42
  It's very important as a potential user of these products
• 50:47
  to do your research because the biggest problem we have here is
• 50:51
  that a lot of these things look similar on the surface.
• 50:54
  But when you start peeling the layers, you realize that these
• 50:57
  services are very, very different on the back.
• 51:00
  And they have, based on how they're structured, they can
• 51:04
  have a lot of risks that you may or may not be aware of or even
• 51:08
  understand. So in the case of this new
• 51:11
  product, I'll highlight a few things, right?
• 51:14
  It's pitched as a Bitcoin back loan in, in some of the branding
• 51:17
  that I've seen. But when you are looking at the
• 51:19
  weeds, it's not a Bitcoin back loan.
• 51:22
  You are transferring your Bitcoin, your Bitcoin's getting
• 51:24
  wrapped into something else. They're using a decentralized
• 51:27
  finance protocol that is 6 months old.
• 51:29
  You know, you, you can verify it.
• 51:32
  I have, I have kids at daycare that are older than than than
• 51:35
  this. So it's important for you to
• 51:38
  understand how this product is being carried out.
• 51:41
  Who's on the other side or what is on the other side and what
• 51:44
  are the risks of this? Am I facing a company?
• 51:46
  Am I facing a protocol? What happens if the price goes
• 51:49
  down? Is my, is my claim against you
• 51:51
  with the company or is no one going to help me because I'm on
• 51:53
  some decentralized finance protocol?
• 51:55
  Is there is, could there be a tax implication of me wrapping
• 51:58
  this asset? You know, and, and so these are
• 52:02
  the types of questions that you as a user need to ask yourself.
• 52:05
  It it, you know, is the rate fixed or variable?
• 52:08
  It's variable. If it's variable, what happens
• 52:10
  in my interest compounds? And if it compounds too fast, do
• 52:12
  I get liquidated? And so all of these things are
• 52:16
  the, the questions that you need to be asking as a user.
• 52:18
  They have a very, all these questions that I mentioned have
• 52:20
  a very simple answer at let it, but I'm just highlighting that
• 52:23
  these are some very key differences that at at surface
• 52:27
  level a lot of people may not appreciate.
• 52:30
  I see the comment on SpongeBob wear wear camps.
• 52:33
  I can't SquarePants. But just to clarify there, we do
• 52:37
  offer custody loans where the collateral is not
• 52:39
  rehypothecated. So you can check it out.
• 52:41
  And I saw some questions earlier about California.
• 52:44
  Unfortunately, we cannot service California today, but we're
• 52:46
  working very hard to open up more of the US for for having
• 52:49
  access to our loans. Yeah.
• 52:51
  And and I, I want to talk about the re hypothecation aspect of
• 52:54
  it, right. So essentially you guys offer
• 52:57
  two choices, you offer the the re hypothecated, the re
• 53:03
  hypothecated one. And then you offered the
• 53:06
  custodian option, which is a little bit more expensive, but
• 53:09
  you're paying for, you know that that extra premium or, or or
• 53:13
  whatever for it not to be re hypothecated.
• 53:15
  Now, could you talk a little bit about that Maudicio, for anyone
• 53:20
  that perhaps is not familiar with that term, what are the
• 53:23
  differences between those two products, the non rehypothecated
• 53:27
  version, the rehypothecated version, what's the risk on one?
• 53:31
  Why is it, why is it a cheaper rate on one?
• 53:33
  Why is it more expensive rate on the other?
• 53:35
  What are the pros and cons? Great question Nico.
• 53:39
  So where we offer two types of loans.
• 53:42
  We offer a loan where you tell us, hey, I want my Bitcoin to
• 53:46
  remain in custody at all times. I don't want this to be lent
• 53:49
  out. I am OK to pay the interest rate
• 53:51
  that you that you need for this loan.
• 53:53
  Those loans are 13.9% today. And that that loan is very
• 53:57
  simple. You pledge Bitcoin collateral to
• 53:59
  Latin. Latin keeps it safe either in
• 54:01
  our custody or in any one of our bank partners who is where we
• 54:04
  draw the liquidity from for these custody loans.
• 54:07
  And that's all that happens you give us Bitcoin, we keep it safe
• 54:10
  when you repay us the dollars, you get the Bitcoin back on the
• 54:15
  standard loan in in order for us to give you a lower interest
• 54:18
  rate. You are basically OK with let in
• 54:23
  with let in lending part of your collateral roughly it's between
• 54:26
  30 to 40% of the collateral. We lend that to institutions
• 54:29
  that pay us an interest rate and then we pass through that
• 54:32
  savings to the clients by way of a lower interest rate on the
• 54:36
  dollars. So today.
• 54:42
  Compare that to 13.9 on the Cust 2 offerings are separate and
• 54:48
  distinct, meaning that you if you choose to take on a custody
• 54:52
  loan, would not be subject to any potential risk of our
• 54:57
  lending activities that are associated with any of our other
• 54:59
  products. So your custody loan is ring
• 55:02
  fenced both legally and technically from our other
• 55:05
  offerings such that there is no risk to that particular product
• 55:10
  of anything happening in our other lending and our other
• 55:14
  products that do have potential lending risk.
• 55:17
  Yeah, absolutely. Then Monisha, like I I want to
• 55:19
  address some of the things in the chat right, because it's
• 55:21
  Bitcoiners like no, you take self custody of Bitcoin do this
• 55:25
  I 100% agree with that That's like that should be the like
• 55:30
  that should be the approach. However, what we strive to do on
• 55:33
  this show is give you guys options and and also educate you
• 55:38
  on all the things that you can do with your Bitcoin.
• 55:41
  So obviously we recommend self custody wallets, self custody
• 55:46
  exchanges, you know, the stamp seat, all that stuff, but also
• 55:50
  what you guys are going to find yourself.
• 55:52
  You're going to find yourself in this situation, especially if
• 55:55
  you've been huddling for quite a while, is the idea of eventually
• 56:01
  what's going to happen is you're going to want to use your
• 56:04
  Bitcoin. And if you sell your Bitcoin,
• 56:07
  there's a capital, there's a capital implication on that.
• 56:10
  There's a capital gains implication on that.
• 56:12
  So another way that you can, like you can leverage your
• 56:17
  Bitcoin again is to borrow against it.
• 56:19
  If you borrow against it, that there is no capital gain
• 56:22
  implication 'cause you're not really profiting.
• 56:25
  You're essentially taking on a loan.
• 56:28
  And again, this is ways where you can leverage your Bitcoin.
• 56:32
  This doesn't mean that you're going to 5050 to 80% of your
• 56:36
  stack or 20% of your stack. No, no, no, no, no.
• 56:40
  You take a small percentage of your stack, 5 percent, 10% if
• 56:44
  you need the cash, This is a great tool to access cash
• 56:48
  without incurring a capital gain.
• 56:52
  And then once again, if you do it responsibly, you know, you're
• 56:56
  not really it's, it's, in my opinion, it's not really that
• 57:00
  big of a risk, right? Of course there is a risk that
• 57:03
  comes with it. When you trust another person
• 57:07
  with your Bitcoin, you're giving up custody.
• 57:09
  Of course there's risks associated with it, but that
• 57:13
  doesn't mean that it isn't a tool that you can't use.
• 57:16
  Depending on your situation, and I'll give you a personal
• 57:19
  example. In the early days of simply
• 57:22
  Bitcoin, I didn't want to sell my Bitcoin.
• 57:25
  I didn't want to sell my Bitcoin.
• 57:27
  I needed the cash, so I just took out a small loan against my
• 57:33
  Bitcoin. I got the cash and then
• 57:35
  eventually when bitcoins price went up, I paid back the loan.
• 57:38
  But when I realized is like, instead of paying back the loan,
• 57:41
  I should just roll it over, just keep it going because the price
• 57:45
  of Bitcoin, the the annual appreciation rate of Bitcoin is
• 57:48
  higher than the the the loan rate.
• 57:50
  But again, like, and and it's something it's not exactly the
• 57:54
  same, but, but Michael Saylor is, is he's using a very similar
• 57:58
  strategy. He's leveraging his company to
• 58:00
  borrow against it to buy Bitcoin.
• 58:03
  And again, like Bitcoin is the most pristine collateral the
• 58:05
  world has ever seen. And I want to give you want to
• 58:08
  give you guys all the options. There are ways to access the
• 58:12
  wealth of your Bitcoin without directly selling it, therefore,
• 58:15
  without directly incurring a capital gains.
• 58:18
  There's different tools out there that you had that you
• 58:22
  could use responsibly in order to do that.
• 58:24
  Now, does that mean that it's useful for everyone?
• 58:27
  No. Does that mean that that means
• 58:32
  that it's the same as self custody?
• 58:33
  No. But does that mean that it's a
• 58:35
  tool that you can use for your benefit?
• 58:37
  Absolutely. If you do it responsibly, if you
• 58:40
  do it strategically. That's my take.
• 58:42
  And again, I I'm one of those people that have done this.
• 58:45
  So Marisa, I don't know if you want to add on that and tell
• 58:49
  stories. Yeah, tell stories of there,
• 58:52
  there's a there's an example for and you came on the other day
• 58:56
  where you're essentially talking about these OG Bitcoiners that
• 58:59
  wanted to buy a house. So they want to put a down
• 59:00
  payment on that, but they didn't want to sell their Bitcoin.
• 59:04
  No, totally. And like I said, you know, this
• 59:06
  is this product, like any other product, is a tool, right?
• 59:09
  It's a tool in your toolbox. Like how?
• 59:11
  How often do you need a hammer in your life?
• 59:12
  You don't. You don't always need a hammer,
• 59:14
  but when you need to, you know, hit a nail, a hammer comes in
• 59:16
  pretty handy, right? So you come and you use it.
• 59:19
  A hammer, just like any other tool can advance the speed at
• 59:21
  which you're working if you use it right.
• 59:23
  If you use a hammer responsibly, you're going to bump, you know,
• 59:26
  you're going to bump your hand, you're going to you potentially
• 59:27
  break a bone. So it's like any other tool.
• 59:30
  If, if you use it properly and what it's designed for you, you
• 59:34
  can do better. If you don't use it properly and
• 59:36
  you don't plant properly, you can hurt yourself.
• 59:38
  So it's like any other tool. So what I would say also is
• 59:41
  that, you know, do we think everyone should need a loan and
• 59:45
  have a loan under the Bitcoin? No, take a loan when you need a
• 59:48
  loan. Not everyone needs a loan.
• 59:49
  Not everyone needs a loan all the time.
• 59:50
  We have clients that took out loans with Bitcoin was a 20K and
• 59:54
  Bitcoin got to 100K and they're closed their loan.
• 59:56
  That's a happy client. That's a happy client that'll
• 59:59
  come back to us once they need a loan again.
• 1:00:01
  If they've they've reached their investment out their goals, they
• 1:00:03
  they let it help them grow their wealth tremendously.
• 1:00:06
  Excellent. I'll give you a few examples.
• 1:00:09
  We had a client in 2022 that had to close on a house in the
• 1:00:12
  middle of the debacle where the markets were were just being
• 1:00:15
  incredibly volatile and companies were collapsing.
• 1:00:17
  Bitcoin was at 16 K, he didn't want to sell his Bitcoin, he's
• 1:00:21
  an OG. He wanted to close on the
• 1:00:22
  property, took it a loan with us, managed the loan for two
• 1:00:26
  years. So it's a $4 million loan.
• 1:00:27
  And at the end of the two years, his the value of his additional
• 1:00:32
  Bitcoin collateral had appreciated by more than the
• 1:00:34
  money he used to pay for the house.
• 1:00:36
  So not only that, at Lenin, if Bitcoin appreciates the way it
• 1:00:40
  should and your loan becomes over collateralized, you can
• 1:00:43
  take the excess over collateralized Bitcoin out from
• 1:00:46
  your LTV. Basically, if once your LTV goes
• 1:00:49
  below 30, you can take off as much Bitcoin as you want to
• 1:00:51
  bring it to 40 and take that back to self custody.
• 1:00:53
  We don't ask you to keep Bitcoin at Lenin.
• 1:00:55
  That is you know that more Bitcoin than we need.
• 1:00:58
  You know, we understand the importance of having the Bitcoin
• 1:01:01
  in yourself custody and in fact, our clients took back over 1000
• 1:01:06
  Bitcoins over the course of last year back to self custody.
• 1:01:08
  So we we love that and we track that.
• 1:01:11
  So yeah, like I said, you know, if you're a bitcoiner and you
• 1:01:14
  live your life in the system and you go to a traditional bank and
• 1:01:16
  you try to get a loan, a credit card, anything, they'll tell you
• 1:01:19
  no because you're underwritten based on your credit score.
• 1:01:23
  You're underwritten based on your Fiat life.
• 1:01:25
  If you don't have a Fiat life, your credit score sucks and you
• 1:01:29
  may have $10 million worth of Bitcoin, but you can't afford to
• 1:01:32
  buy a one bedroom house. So what we do is we bridge the,
• 1:01:37
  the ability to port that digital wealth into the real world for,
• 1:01:41
  for people that want to live in that digital economy, they don't
• 1:01:44
  care to have the greatest credit score because their life is
• 1:01:48
  here. So we can connect your the best
• 1:01:52
  credit, the best credit in the world, which is your Bitcoin.
• 1:01:56
  We can use it as collateral and extend dollar financing for
• 1:01:59
  everything, anything you need. And that's really the the sort
• 1:02:02
  of the only thing I would say other everything you said, I
• 1:02:05
  agree with Nicole. Absolutely.
• 1:02:07
  And then and let's also talk about reputation, which is
• 1:02:10
  everything in this space. And also your guys is, is is
• 1:02:14
  reviews because you guys have been doing this for more than
• 1:02:17
  six years. Your Trustpilot reviews are
• 1:02:19
  currently at 4.8 out of five. And I, I think that that
• 1:02:25
  industry, the Bitcoin backed borrowing industry had a huge PR
• 1:02:33
  drop ball steaming pile of garbage last cycle that I and I,
• 1:02:38
  and I remember telling you this when we were at bit block boom
• 1:02:40
  in Texas. I'm like, dude, like Celsiate,
• 1:02:45
  like all of those things are like just put into this, into
• 1:02:48
  this industry and then people have this negative reaction
• 1:02:53
  towards it. So could you talk a little bit
• 1:02:55
  about how much, how much effort you've put into building up that
• 1:03:00
  reputation? What makes you different
• 1:03:03
  compared to a lot of these competitors that you guys have?
• 1:03:05
  For example, I believe the Gemini product went down at one
• 1:03:08
  point. Of course, remember Celsius,
• 1:03:11
  What makes Leaden different? What?
• 1:03:15
  Why should people trust you with their Bitcoin if they want a
• 1:03:19
  loan, Mauricio? I will.
• 1:03:23
  People have to reach the decision to do business with
• 1:03:26
  Lenin after they do their own research.
• 1:03:27
  I'm not going to tell anyone to trust us.
• 1:03:29
  I'm going to tell you to go do your homework and go read about
• 1:03:32
  other people, what other people have to say.
• 1:03:34
  Read our terms and conditions, read the fine print in the legal
• 1:03:37
  agreement if you want. Ask the questions you need to to
• 1:03:39
  our support team. We will answer them.
• 1:03:40
  And it's OK if at the end of the day you say, you know what?
• 1:03:43
  I'm not ready for this. This is not for me.
• 1:03:45
  We've helped thousands of bitcoiners get loans over the
• 1:03:48
  last six years. And what we do is what we do
• 1:03:53
  differently, in fact, is that we we do what we say we're going to
• 1:03:56
  do and we don't misrepresent, you know, things that aren't
• 1:04:00
  true about our products. So I'll give you a few examples.
• 1:04:05
  Very simple, right? But, but it sounds very simple,
• 1:04:08
  but believe it or not, these other lenders were doing
• 1:04:10
  completely the opposite. So we focus on the assets that
• 1:04:14
  we know have liquidity on both the client side and the
• 1:04:17
  institutional side. At Lenin, we support Bitcoin,
• 1:04:19
  USDCUSDT, and just most recently we supported Ethereum so we
• 1:04:23
  could bring over the refinancing clients from the Celsius
• 1:04:26
  bankruptcy who in fact actually refinance the majority of that
• 1:04:29
  book refinance into Lenin out of that bankruptcy.
• 1:04:33
  Lenin has never had a token. We have no plans for a token,
• 1:04:36
  and tokens, as people know already, can allow companies
• 1:04:40
  that offer them to do all sorts of financial engineering, and it
• 1:04:43
  creates a bunch of broken incentives.
• 1:04:46
  The other one is we are incredibly diligent with the
• 1:04:52
  ensuring that everything that we are telling our clients matches
• 1:04:56
  what we have on the other side. So for example, if a client is
• 1:04:59
  making a a deposit that can be withdrawn at any time and we are
• 1:05:03
  supposed to, you know, lend that asset out to earn interest, we
• 1:05:06
  will lend that asset out under the agreement that we can call
• 1:05:08
  that asset back out at any time as well.
• 1:05:10
  So we can meet the demands of our clients.
• 1:05:12
  Why this matters is because in Celsius and Block Fight and
• 1:05:15
  other groups, we're taking open term deposits and investing that
• 1:05:18
  into mining of farms and operations that have five year
• 1:05:21
  paybacks. So our business and the business
• 1:05:24
  of lending, lending is older than money itself.
• 1:05:27
  Lending can be done responsibly. The the underlying method by
• 1:05:33
  which we lend is we take your Bitcoin, we keep it safe and we
• 1:05:36
  advance dollars to you. Once you repay us those dollars,
• 1:05:38
  we give you the Bitcoin back. It's a very simple business.
• 1:05:41
  Where it can get hairy is when you start throwing bells and
• 1:05:44
  whistles and additional products and you don't have the right
• 1:05:47
  ring fencing or the right structure on the back.
• 1:05:50
  I, I, I explained to you earlier on that our custody product is
• 1:05:53
  ring fence from our others. This wasn't the case in Celsius
• 1:05:57
  and other groups. When Celsius went bankrupt, you
• 1:06:00
  were on the same line and you were on the same bankruptcy boat
• 1:06:03
  if you had a Bitcoin in their custody or if you had a leverage
• 1:06:07
  position on Shiba Inu, right? This doesn't happen in Tratfi.
• 1:06:12
  And importantly, this doesn't happen at let in.
• 1:06:14
  At let in our products are are separated and if you are paying
• 1:06:17
  more to get a particular risk profile, you should be getting
• 1:06:22
  just that. And so the other, the painful
• 1:06:25
  thing too is that on the surface people try to portray their
• 1:06:29
  loans to be Apple to apples with our loans, which is a massive
• 1:06:33
  issue because a lot of people don't read the fine print at a
• 1:06:36
  high level. If you were to look at this coin
• 1:06:38
  based product and you were to look at a Lenin product, you
• 1:06:40
  might say, oh, they're both Bitcoin back loans.
• 1:06:44
  Actually, they are not one your Bitcoin stays spot.
• 1:06:47
  It's not turned into anything else.
• 1:06:49
  It's kept in Bitcoin. It's it's kept in our custody or
• 1:06:52
  pledged to our one of our banks and you get dollars for the Fiat
• 1:06:55
  dollars on this other one. Your Bitcoin on the back is
• 1:06:58
  getting turned into something else, sent to it, to a protocol
• 1:07:00
  that's six months old and you're getting some other currency that
• 1:07:04
  is sent to a protocol to another centralized entity who is then
• 1:07:07
  sending you the cash It it. It's just completely different.
• 1:07:11
  But they are portrayed to be looking like they are the same
• 1:07:15
  because they want to basically piggyback on this industry or
• 1:07:19
  this reputation for these products that we've been
• 1:07:20
  building for the last six years. So it's very important for you
• 1:07:23
  that the only person that can save you from this is yourself.
• 1:07:27
  So it's really, really important that you do the homework.
• 1:07:30
  And once you do the homework, most often people wound up but
• 1:07:34
  let it. So This is why I just encourage
• 1:07:37
  people is don't, don't come to let.
• 1:07:39
  And if you're interested in a Bitcoin back loan, do the
• 1:07:41
  research, figure out yourself what's the best place to borrow.
• 1:07:45
  I feel pretty confident that you'll wind up here.
• 1:07:50
  Beautiful. And I, I see a question in the
• 1:07:52
  chat. Do you have proof of reserves?
• 1:07:54
  Leaden does have proof of reserves.
• 1:07:56
  You got again, do what Mauricio was saying, do your research,
• 1:07:59
  put Leaden and proof of reserves on Google and you'll see more
• 1:08:03
  information. All right, last question guys
• 1:08:05
  before I have to run. Mauricio, this is a question for
• 1:08:09
  you from SAT Wise Jenks. I believe the catalyst for rates
• 1:08:13
  lower than your current 15% for Bitcoin loans will be
• 1:08:17
  overturning Gary Gensler's last second in kind transfers to
• 1:08:20
  ETFs. Your thoughts?
• 1:08:23
  I don't necessarily agree with that.
• 1:08:24
  I think the biggest unlock for this is going to be SAB 121 and
• 1:08:28
  bank custody because bank banks are.
• 1:08:32
  We already work with banks. Banks are already our biggest
• 1:08:35
  funding partners. They get this business better
• 1:08:38
  than I would say most of the exchanges or any of the crypto
• 1:08:42
  natives. Like I was telling you earlier,
• 1:08:43
  lending is older than coined money.
• 1:08:45
  Groups like JP Morgan and Bank of America have been in business
• 1:08:48
  for hundreds of years. So what I think the biggest
• 1:08:52
  catalyst to rates dropping is going to be allowing banks to
• 1:08:56
  participate in the space and clearing their accounting rules.
• 1:09:00
  Because they when they see that Lenin has pushed almost a
• 1:09:03
  billion dollars over these things at double digit interest
• 1:09:07
  rates without losing a penny or satoshi, they are salivating and
• 1:09:12
  they will be bidding these rates down and we're all going to
• 1:09:15
  benefit from it. Beautiful, beautiful.
• 1:09:18
  Anyways, guys, I do want to thank Mauricio for coming on
• 1:09:22
  Simply Bitcoin Live Today. We appreciate Mauricio.
• 1:09:26
  Leaden is not. I saw that question in the chat.
• 1:09:28
  Leaden is not a sponsor of the live show, but Leaden is a
• 1:09:32
  sponsor of one of Simply Bitcoin show Bitcoin simply with Dante.
• 1:09:36
  But I've been having Mauricio on the show for years now before he
• 1:09:40
  was never a sponsor and we've been talking about exactly the
• 1:09:43
  same thing. Why?
• 1:09:44
  Because again guys, our job is to bring on bitcoiners and
• 1:09:48
  entrepreneurs from all walks of the industry, whether they're
• 1:09:51
  paid or not paid and to highlight their products to
• 1:09:55
  highlight what they're working on to help you guys on your
• 1:09:58
  Bitcoin journey. Perhaps Bitcoin loans are not
• 1:10:01
  for you. Doesn't that's the whole beauty
• 1:10:03
  of Bitcoin, right? You make the decisions, but
• 1:10:06
  again, we're here to educate you guys.
• 1:10:08
  We're here to expose you to all of the world of Bitcoin.
• 1:10:11
  So anyways, I'm your host Nico, my legendary Co host today,
• 1:10:15
  Optimus Fields, and our special guest for today, Mauricio from
• 1:10:19
  Leaden, a Co founder and chief strategy officer.
• 1:10:23
  Guys, we love you all. We'll be back tomorrow for brand
• 1:10:25
  new episode of Simply Bitcoin Live.
• 1:10:28
  Today's episode was brought to you by bitcoinwell.com, a
• 1:10:31
  Bitcoin only platform on a mission to enable financial
• 1:10:34
  independence.