Latest / The Midlife Momma Podcast - Empty nest mom, Parenting adult children, Midlife transition, Christian mom / 235. When the Empty Nest Never Comes: Parenting an Adult Child with Special Needs with Cindi & Joe Ferrini.

Transcript

235. When the Empty Nest Never Comes: Parenting an Adult Child with Special Needs with Cindi & Joe Ferrini. · The Midlife Momma Podcast - Empty nest mom, Parenting adult children, Midlife transition, Christian mom

0:02
[SPEAKER_02]: Christian Parenting.
0:09
[SPEAKER_02]: Hey mama, I'm Pamela Hinkelman, certified emptiness coach and you're listening to the Midlife Mama Podcast.
0:15
[SPEAKER_02]: This show is for Christian moms navigating the emptiness, learning how to let go with grace, set healthy boundaries, reconnected marriage, and step confidently into their God-given purpose.
0:27
[SPEAKER_02]: Each week I'll coach you through this season with faith-filled encouragement, honest conversations, and practical tools that you can apply right away to your relationships and your life.
0:37
[SPEAKER_02]: If this episode encourages you, I'd be grateful if you leave a quick rating and review.
0:42
[SPEAKER_02]: It helps other moms find the support they need.
0:45
[SPEAKER_02]: You'll find the link in the show notes, and make sure you're following the podcast, and let's get started!
0:51
[SPEAKER_02]: For many moms, the emptiness is a season the anticipated for years.
0:56
[SPEAKER_02]: But what happens when your child has special needs, and launching into adulthood looks very different than you imagined.
1:02
[SPEAKER_02]: Today, I'm joined by Cindy and Joe Farini, authors of the new book, Special Needs Parenting.
1:08
[SPEAKER_02]: Cindy and Joe live in Cleveland, Ohio with one child Joey at home and two married daughters and their families nearby.
1:14
[SPEAKER_02]: Together they spoke for family life we can to remember for 20 years.
1:18
[SPEAKER_02]: And they have been caring for their special needs child for 40 years.
1:22
[SPEAKER_02]: Together we'll talk about the unique joys, challenges, grief and blessings of parenting a child with special needs into a adulthood.
1:29
[SPEAKER_02]: We'll also discuss what it means to embrace God's purpose when you're nest may never fully empty.
1:35
[SPEAKER_02]: and how to find hope, strength, and joy for the journey ahead.
1:38
[SPEAKER_02]: If you're a parent of a child with special needs, or you'd love someone who is, I think you'll find encouragement in this conversation.
1:45
[SPEAKER_02]: Welcome, Joanne Cindy.
1:46
[SPEAKER_02]: Thank you so much.
1:48
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you.
1:49
[SPEAKER_02]: It's so good to have you here.
1:51
[SPEAKER_02]: Your new book is called Special Needs Parenting.
1:54
[SPEAKER_02]: Can you please share a little bit about your family story and how God led you to write this book?
1:58
[SPEAKER_01]: We'd love to.
1:59
[SPEAKER_01]: As you said, we have a son who's Joe and he Joey.
2:02
[SPEAKER_01]: And he actually is going to be 45 in just a month.
2:05
[SPEAKER_01]: We can't leave it.
2:07
[SPEAKER_01]: And then we have two daughters who live close to us.
2:09
[SPEAKER_01]: And
2:10
[SPEAKER_01]: total we have five grandchildren.
2:13
[SPEAKER_01]: One of the girls is foster care, parenting, and so we have extra grandkids here and there, and we love what they're doing.
2:21
[SPEAKER_01]: We really appreciate their hearts in that.
2:24
[SPEAKER_01]: So we've been married for almost four or three seven years, and we never thought that this would be a part of our life.
2:31
[SPEAKER_01]: And so when Joey came to us, it really changed everything.
2:34
[SPEAKER_01]: It didn't just change the day, or for a little season, and then things get better, it changed us for a lifetime.
2:40
[SPEAKER_01]: And so writing this book, the special needs parent was so much on our heart to encourage parents to go the long distance that it is.
2:50
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not a sprint, it's on the earth on.
2:53
[SPEAKER_01]: And we've written two other books.
2:55
[SPEAKER_01]: One is called Unexpected Journey.
2:56
[SPEAKER_01]: That's a really thorough book on.
3:00
[SPEAKER_01]: special needs of many different kinds and then also love all ways, A-L-L always more on the marriage idea in terms of how do you handle a marriage when you are dealing with special needs or caring for someone, but this book, the special needs parent is specifically for parents, single or married that are struggling maybe or they're on the beginning part of the journey
3:28
[SPEAKER_01]: And we both feel like we've had enough experience that we have enough to say on this topic after four years, every thing, someone needs to go through their child going through puberty before you can actually write a book parenting as a whole.
3:50
[SPEAKER_01]: I think we have that background.
3:58
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, and Joey, he's almost 45, and so he's really given us a whole spectrum of what life looks like.
4:06
[SPEAKER_01]: And we're even seeing that he's growing older, you know, as we're getting older, we laugh.
4:11
[SPEAKER_01]: We say that we're finally catching up to how slow he is.
4:13
[SPEAKER_01]: We're slowing down.
4:14
[SPEAKER_01]: We're getting on the same page.
4:16
[SPEAKER_01]: We all like to go to bed early now.
4:17
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.
4:18
[SPEAKER_01]: Mellowing out.
4:19
[SPEAKER_01]: And there is a lot of joy in this season, even though things haven't changed in terms of
4:27
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
4:27
[SPEAKER_02]: So can you tell us a little bit about Joey?
4:30
[SPEAKER_02]: What's his personality like?
4:31
[SPEAKER_02]: Tell us about his disability.
4:34
[SPEAKER_00]: I think one of the more interesting.
4:36
[SPEAKER_00]: it's multi.
4:37
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
4:37
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
4:38
[SPEAKER_00]: Factory over there, but the joy has been diagnosed.
4:41
[SPEAKER_00]: Actually, the diagnosis, pecky gyro.
4:43
[SPEAKER_00]: And what that is, it's a syndrome that includes cerebral palsy epilepsy and mental retardation.
4:51
[SPEAKER_00]: And he has several other little things like allergies of all different types there.
4:56
[SPEAKER_01]: And, but again, and I always like to interrupt the mental retardation.
5:02
[SPEAKER_01]: was the diagnosis.
5:04
[SPEAKER_01]: So sometimes people think that's they shouldn't use that word.
5:06
[SPEAKER_01]: But when used properly and not used to be derogatory, it really is a very sitting diagnosis.
5:13
[SPEAKER_01]: We heal.
5:15
[SPEAKER_01]: So like Joe's accurate and then I just want to clarify for those listening that it's not derogatory.
5:20
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, thank you.
5:21
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.
5:22
[SPEAKER_00]: Joey does live with us and he is a blessing.
5:26
[SPEAKER_00]: I'll just say that if the 45 years I can say that confidently for you and with you.
5:32
[SPEAKER_00]: I didn't always feel that way.
5:33
[SPEAKER_00]: Initially when Joey was born, he was a perfect looking baby and she had it.
5:37
[SPEAKER_00]: He had a 10 out of 10.
5:38
[SPEAKER_00]: He had the cars score and we thought, Mike, we had a genius on our hands here.
5:43
[SPEAKER_00]: Great athlete or something.
5:45
[SPEAKER_00]: And
5:51
[SPEAKER_00]: that he should have been hitting.
5:53
[SPEAKER_00]: We finally said at nine months, I think, is what we said.
5:57
[SPEAKER_00]: There's something not right here.
5:58
[SPEAKER_00]: And Sidney being very proactive.
6:01
[SPEAKER_00]: My doctors were just kept telling us, he'll get better.
6:04
[SPEAKER_00]: He'll can't job.
6:05
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, we can't job.
6:06
[SPEAKER_02]: And was he your first child?
6:07
[SPEAKER_02]: Yes.
6:08
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
6:09
[SPEAKER_02]: So you been no, right?
6:10
[SPEAKER_01]: No.
6:11
[SPEAKER_00]: We know that he wasn't catching up.
6:13
[SPEAKER_01]: And you don't expect that we've shared so many times how our background, there's really nothing in our background that we would say, oh, you shouldn't have done that or you shouldn't have done this and that's why he turned out the way that he did that isn't the case here and
6:42
[SPEAKER_00]: just really confronted said his mom and said, are you seeing it's pretty obvious to me as an observer and I'm trying that the show is just not doing close things that he should be doing.
6:55
[SPEAKER_00]: Then send it his mom just basically in said he talked and
6:59
[SPEAKER_00]: That began the ball real in for us, and so we're very thankful for that friend who is still a friend and after all these years But it's I think the way it started for us was that Cindy went to the library and she took out a book a whole medical book by all as you book whatever and she just began down
7:17
[SPEAKER_00]: But we feel like it's in the basic way that you do your homework and so I started doing some research on showing and just looking at his symptoms and basically I came up with the diagnosis that Joey has room of palsy and Epilepsy mental retardation and we want to the doctor at that point and I we said This is what we think our son has and Her adult at offer him and he says yes, you're right and just got up and walked out of the room
7:45
[SPEAKER_00]: and that was the whole of that conversation, and so we just, we were left by ourselves, we just looked at each other, burst the tears because now we realize that we had before us a life-changing thing that was changed our life forever.
8:00
[SPEAKER_01]: Change everything.
8:01
[SPEAKER_01]: And to give you just a picture too, my dear friend was so gracious to
8:07
[SPEAKER_01]: carefully go talk to my mom.
8:09
[SPEAKER_01]: We were having was just a bunch of moms with their kids.
8:12
[SPEAKER_01]: And we were at my mom's house.
8:14
[SPEAKER_01]: And we were actually celebrating Joey's first birthday.
8:16
[SPEAKER_01]: It wasn't really a party.
8:17
[SPEAKER_01]: We were just there to hang out and just enjoy our time.
8:21
[SPEAKER_01]: And Joey was in the heights, or he was one.
8:24
[SPEAKER_01]: And he was in a height chair.
8:25
[SPEAKER_01]: And he was just like, had no muscle tone.
8:28
[SPEAKER_01]: He could barely hold his head up.
8:30
[SPEAKER_01]: And his hands were still really close,
8:37
[SPEAKER_01]: and his friends around him, they were running into the pond and throwing in stones.
8:44
[SPEAKER_01]: Some of them were not quite walking yet, but they were far advanced from Joey.
8:49
[SPEAKER_01]: And I did see the difference, so you're just as a new mom, we just stay.
8:54
[SPEAKER_01]: He's going to catch up.
8:55
[SPEAKER_01]: Everybody said he's going to catch up.
8:57
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to take with the professionals are saying will happen and that began the ball rolling between nine months in a year.
9:06
[SPEAKER_01]: Seeking things out looking for answers and then really pretty soon from there after talking with the doctor and getting.
9:15
[SPEAKER_01]: on board with going to where is near us, it's a metro hospital that did physical therapy, occupational therapy.
9:23
[SPEAKER_01]: It was all beginning stages of things.
9:25
[SPEAKER_01]: They were wonderful.
9:27
[SPEAKER_01]: And whatever they would teach me there, I would bring home and Joe and I would go over and over it with Joey.
9:33
[SPEAKER_01]: And just for instance, like the crawling stage, and I might be a little off on this, but as I recall it, it's like 13 steps.
9:42
[SPEAKER_01]: until a child actually crawls.
9:44
[SPEAKER_01]: So it's being that having the good core to sit up straight and then turn and then to go into the crawl.
9:51
[SPEAKER_01]: Now so we kept practicing over and over like the sitting up straight, the sitting up straight and then the turn.
9:58
[SPEAKER_01]: So until his brain could get into those grooves, E.
10:04
[SPEAKER_01]: So it was just getting that motion into the grooves of his brain going over so that he could learn what to do and how to actually make those crawling movements.
10:15
[SPEAKER_01]: So today, as a 45 year old, he walks.
10:19
[SPEAKER_01]: He does talk.
10:21
[SPEAKER_01]: It's very hard to understand him, but such that we are good interpreters for him and we're always with him so we can help him.
10:29
[SPEAKER_01]: But there are times where we don't get it and somewhat recently I had 20 minutes I sat at the kitchen table with him trying to figure out what he was saying and I'm so thankful he's patient To not get upset but then a lot of times he just it just he drifts and I think he just forgets about it and or frustrated it goes okay as a nup with mom like a mom
10:55
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so don't necessarily just a quick overview, but even through puberty and things like that, there were a lot of different things that we really had to learn a new.
11:05
[SPEAKER_01]: And then when girls got to be that age, it was so different.
11:09
[SPEAKER_01]: And so much easier, I will have to say exactly.
11:12
[SPEAKER_02]: I want to know what are some of the biggest emotional challenges couples face when they realize that their parenting journey may look very different from everyone else's.
11:21
[SPEAKER_02]: What was that like for you guys?
11:24
[SPEAKER_00]: I think just to generalize here, after we, after you say I do at the altar, walk down that aisle with individual set of blueprints tucked underneath your arms and a pire, those blueprints you set off to build your marriage and of course they, the problem is that your spouse also has set up blueprints tucked underneath your arm and upon those blueprints they set off to build a marriage.
11:44
[SPEAKER_00]: And with time, as it is a melting together and you have this, what we would like to think of as a divine set of blueprints.
11:52
[SPEAKER_00]: that has been uniquely made for you and then you add in a special in this child and you can just throw out that blueprint at that point and because those things that you were hoping for, it's just not going to happen and that's of course tragically is where many special these parents bail out.
12:13
[SPEAKER_00]: one or two of the parents say I didn't sign up for this and this is that what I expected life to be like, I didn't want to be married to something like this.
12:21
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's because now what we have here are statistically at this point, 80, 80% or more marriages are ending in divorce because of a special needs situation.
12:33
[SPEAKER_01]: And if not always the husband who leaves, a lot of plans
12:41
[SPEAKER_00]: And just the bill is going to be anything and he just really can be anything from something that's present at birth or to be required to turn an accident or an aging is another factor that contributes to can be labeled disabled.
12:56
[SPEAKER_00]: We both sit his father had Alzheimer's, my mother had advanced faster to mention.
13:00
[SPEAKER_00]: We can tell you that.
13:02
[SPEAKER_00]: We're looking at them, but we're looking at Joey.
13:04
[SPEAKER_00]: And there's the thing, care that we had to give to them is what we do for Joey.
13:10
[SPEAKER_00]: And, of course, unfortunately, what that brings to you is I won in three households in the United States have a disabled person in their home at that point.
13:20
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, what I was reading that in your book, that statistics, I was like,
13:25
[SPEAKER_02]: This impacts a lot of people, yes, more than we know or think about it there.
13:31
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
13:31
[SPEAKER_02]: Absolutely.
13:32
[SPEAKER_00]: And that was really one of the primary motivators for writing a book was that you can find books on swigled policy, you can find books on altus and you can find books on just by the way, other disability you can think of.
13:44
[SPEAKER_00]: There was nothing really that focused on the special needs parent.
13:49
[SPEAKER_00]: And as far as work concern, we've had the privilege and opportunity to speak in front of a lot of
13:56
[SPEAKER_00]: audiences and groups that are a special to these parents and we can just tell you that in an option, these are heroes, these people sitting in those chairs or whatever and then you add sometimes a single parent that has to deal with this issue and you think how do they do and and then you think of the fact that sometimes these people try to do that without the
14:25
[SPEAKER_00]: And so what we wanted to do was we wanted to basically to come alongside of special needs parents and help them as much as possible.
14:34
[SPEAKER_00]: Especially on these parents, families with special needs when the biggest factors stressors in their life is that they isolate.
14:44
[SPEAKER_00]: And social isolation is one of the things that we want to try to reduce that.
14:48
[SPEAKER_00]: and we wanted to help to create a sense of community as much as we could through system, but I can tell you in our book we have so much resources available for people of that.
15:00
[SPEAKER_00]: We have just learned over the years because we needed that.
15:04
[SPEAKER_00]: And so we just incorporated that into this book.
15:07
[SPEAKER_00]: So that's the reason, primary reason for the book is that we wanted to trust that audience, that some, most of the time, does not talk about, and that's parents.
15:17
[SPEAKER_02]: And that's why I wanted to have you on the podcast.
15:19
[SPEAKER_01]: Because I know there is a group of moms out there who are not experiencing the emptiness the way everyone else and can I just add that most people don't recognize that they just know that we have Joey and so our emptiness experience is one that we can't just pick up and go for dinner with our friends we can't just pick up and go away for a weekend or for vacation we get to do that and not complaining.
15:49
[SPEAKER_01]: However, what it takes to do that is pretty a lot.
15:54
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a lot of getting someone to care for that child, that adult child, it's making sure they have other medications.
16:01
[SPEAKER_01]: And if they're in a program who's taking them, who's bringing them, if they're in some kind of a work force, that's maybe supervised by people who was
16:10
[SPEAKER_01]: caring for their delivery and return from home and to work or whatever what and you know what happens when people actually get on board and help you do that there are maze at what you do because now it's on their plate and we people have no idea.
16:25
[SPEAKER_01]: People have no idea what you guys go through every day, every day, every day, every day, every day.
16:31
[SPEAKER_01]: And along with that, you had also mentioned just emotionally things that we have gone through.
16:36
[SPEAKER_01]: This will kind of tie in with a couple of things are like capacity.
16:40
[SPEAKER_01]: The reason then at our age that we're doing what we do is because we've worked at the capacity to be able to do this.
16:47
[SPEAKER_01]: So people will say, I could never do what you do.
16:50
[SPEAKER_01]: Guess what?
16:51
[SPEAKER_01]: We couldn't either.
16:52
[SPEAKER_01]: So for over time we learned and of course we love our sons so we're going to do whatever we can to care for him and give him the best life that we possibly can we want to do that.
17:05
[SPEAKER_01]: But capacity is something that has to be filled and so that's what we've learned.
17:09
[SPEAKER_01]: We've learned what do we have to fill ourselves with?
17:12
[SPEAKER_01]: It's the Lord for us.
17:13
[SPEAKER_01]: We ask the Lord Holy Spirit give us what we need this moment this day and let me also say, Life isn't perfect here.
17:20
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not we're not perfect our marriages perfect no one moved it we're not but we've learned a dance that's working for us and it's taken years to her fact it's not perfect it's getting there it's getting better every day but also things like emotionally the endurance that you have to work on to be able to do what you do every day what I do for myself
17:44
[SPEAKER_01]: Joe and I in, or Joe does for himself, we do for our son.
17:48
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, he can walk.
17:49
[SPEAKER_01]: He can talk a little bit.
17:51
[SPEAKER_01]: He can feed himself.
17:52
[SPEAKER_01]: He considered a table and eat it.
17:54
[SPEAKER_01]: And he has a very nice table manners because we really didn't get that.
17:57
[SPEAKER_01]: And we're not.
17:58
[SPEAKER_01]: We don't feel like we can't take him out because he would be.
18:01
[SPEAKER_01]: So everybody would be watching him.
18:03
[SPEAKER_01]: But it's all those things took much more to find than anything with our girls.
18:07
[SPEAKER_01]: Our, you know, things come naturally with children.
18:09
[SPEAKER_01]: Many things for
18:13
[SPEAKER_01]: So we've learned we've taken the time to learn those things, capacity, endurance, resilience, flexibility, all those things.
18:21
[SPEAKER_01]: And our girls, we are so proud of them.
18:24
[SPEAKER_01]: We often say, we didn't raise our girls, Joey raised all of us because the girls are so giving, so caring.
18:33
[SPEAKER_01]: And we love how they're raising their children and we look at that and we just think and actually one of the girls said the reason our family worked together well as a team was because none of us always got our way.
18:47
[SPEAKER_00]: And there's that's so good.
18:49
[SPEAKER_01]: It is is and it's true because at every any given time the girls could possibly be going to a choir concert or an orchestra concert that they were a part of and Joey could be having a huge meltdown and then we'd have to divide and conquer and figure out how do we get that in there and then get Joey whatever and then get him there.
19:08
[SPEAKER_01]: Let's see, and join all those things, but sometimes he'd be right smack in the middle of it.
19:13
[SPEAKER_01]: And you have to deal with that.
19:15
[SPEAKER_01]: You can't just put of six foot four.
19:17
[SPEAKER_01]: He sits before.
19:18
[SPEAKER_02]: He sits before, oh my goodness.
19:21
[SPEAKER_01]: We should have out of that with the other civility.
19:25
[SPEAKER_01]: But he's six foot four.
19:26
[SPEAKER_01]: You can't just put him in a car seat, like a tree rod and say, when you, when we get there, we'll deal with that.
19:30
[SPEAKER_01]: He goes.
19:31
[SPEAKER_01]: So there's a lot of different emotional things that go into raising a child, any child, but when you have a special needs child, you are doing, we call it like Groundhog Day.
19:41
[SPEAKER_01]: It's the same thing over and over and over every day until they catch what you're trying to teach them and sometimes they don't.
19:49
[SPEAKER_01]: They don't.
19:49
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
19:50
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think that you really described that well, it's a dance set you perfect with time.
19:55
[SPEAKER_02]: Yes, I love that.
19:56
[SPEAKER_02]: I love that.
19:58
[SPEAKER_02]: It's perfect.
19:59
[SPEAKER_00]: It is really good and that's just for us.
20:02
[SPEAKER_00]: But then we can incorporate our girls into that and to that journey.
20:07
[SPEAKER_00]: And we teach them early on that they are a very important part.
20:12
[SPEAKER_00]: of the team.
20:13
[SPEAKER_00]: Of course, they have to know.
20:14
[SPEAKER_00]: Team TEAM is together each accomplishes more.
20:19
[SPEAKER_00]: And they recognize that they are a valued member of the team.
20:24
[SPEAKER_00]: And we've always included them in everything.
20:26
[SPEAKER_00]: We try to as much as possible.
20:28
[SPEAKER_00]: We encode them and that.
20:30
[SPEAKER_00]: And then when you expand that even more, we are strong advocates for incorporating what we call a constellation of mentors.
20:39
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
20:40
[SPEAKER_00]: You try to incorporate into your life.
20:43
[SPEAKER_00]: People who are upward mentors and then people who are downwood mentors and they, that you would mentor.
20:49
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that you have already mentored and
20:51
[SPEAKER_00]: have a relationship with.
20:53
[SPEAKER_00]: And then you have your peer mentors for your close friends.
20:56
[SPEAKER_00]: And that is a process to get to that point.
21:00
[SPEAKER_00]: But we tell folks as much as possible, that is something worth doing for yourself to in order to get through these challenges of a special day's race and special day's child is that it's good to have a support system around you and the
21:20
[SPEAKER_00]: is really an incredible valuable asset.
21:23
[SPEAKER_00]: And city can tell you more about that, that team support.
21:27
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's just the idea of teachers, it's even bus drivers, people who who help you work on the child's IEP, which is an educational plan.
21:37
[SPEAKER_01]: There's so many people that are in the life of a child with special needs, so many more than in a child who is typically developing.
21:48
[SPEAKER_01]: And we have some friends that have two daughters with a hundred percent care, one hundred percent care in every way.
21:57
[SPEAKER_01]: And they have a team of people that come to their home daily.
22:00
[SPEAKER_01]: So in a situation like that, your life isn't your own, your home, your own, your ties it's your own.
22:06
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think that's one of the things a lot of people don't recognize and speaking of the emptiness, it's not like we get to sleep in just because we feel like it or go to the distance.
22:16
[SPEAKER_01]: We still have to have that pattern or that rhythm, rhythm, that's good.
22:21
[SPEAKER_01]: Of what we need to do that allows our family to work well together.
22:25
[SPEAKER_01]: And, you know what we're grateful to that our daughters, they really embrace and understand Joey and so that their kids, the older kids who are 16 to 13, they got this, they know Joey.
22:45
[SPEAKER_01]: But when they are playing around and it's too much for Joey, Joey looks for a place we where can I go?
22:52
[SPEAKER_01]: That's a little quiet.
22:54
[SPEAKER_01]: So we always have a place for him that he can watch a movie or do something that he enjoys.
22:59
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, that's good.
23:00
[SPEAKER_02]: Let's get back to the empty nest and okay.
23:02
[SPEAKER_02]: Emperors can be so painful when friends are traveling, downsizing or enjoying a traditional emptiness.
23:08
[SPEAKER_02]: How compared it's guard their hearts from resentment and discouragement.
23:14
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, that's a hard one.
23:16
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll, it's a hard one because especially when they say things and they know that you have a son who is 45 years old and with you every moment of the day, he doesn't program that he goes to, but otherwise if he's not there, he's with us every moment of the day and they don't recognize it or they don't many times people will say, how's Joey doing?
23:39
[SPEAKER_01]: I could say,
23:41
[SPEAKER_01]: I handful if times that people ever say, how are you doing?
23:46
[SPEAKER_01]: How are you doing?
23:48
[SPEAKER_01]: And sometimes we're not doing well.
23:50
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll be honest with you youth.
23:52
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.
23:52
[SPEAKER_01]: There have been times where people say, and we traveled and had wonderful travels.
23:57
[SPEAKER_01]: So this is not a complaint, but maybe just something for listeners to really
24:02
[SPEAKER_01]: pay attention to when you're asking questions or having conversations.
24:05
[SPEAKER_01]: But when I'm with the group of people and they're all talking about and we traveled here and we traveled there and then we did this and we did that and I'm thinking to myself and I'm still toileting my child.
24:17
[SPEAKER_01]: You have a whole.
24:17
[SPEAKER_01]: We don't talk about that a lot because it's not a very interesting conversation for most people and most people are going to be at the control of that.
24:24
[SPEAKER_01]: But think of my two friends whose children are 100% care, two daughters, they have to do everything.
24:31
[SPEAKER_01]: They're still changing diapers.
24:32
[SPEAKER_01]: They're not changing a diaper on a two-year-old or a one-year-old.
24:36
[SPEAKER_01]: So, picture it.
24:37
[SPEAKER_01]: Picture then.
24:38
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think other people go there.
24:40
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's all.
24:41
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't even think I would have gone there if I didn't have Joey.
24:44
[SPEAKER_01]: But now that you're listening, whoever's listening, and then...
24:47
[SPEAKER_01]: do recognize what the person who is not ever going to get an empty nest is doing every day that is very different than you.
24:55
[SPEAKER_01]: And maybe, first of all I'd say, maybe get them this book so that they could just have a moment that would say, oh my goodness, my friend cared so much about me, that they thought to get me this book about parenting.
25:08
[SPEAKER_01]: And then I would say, first before you give it, lightly read it, just be real gentle, so definitely look like a well-red flick.
25:15
[SPEAKER_01]: Read it and then give it to them.
25:18
[SPEAKER_01]: And then maybe because we have a lot of hints and helps in there of what you can do as a friend to them.
25:24
[SPEAKER_01]: Hopefully you do to make their life a little easier.
25:26
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm not saying take over or say, I'll take your child for a week.
25:32
[SPEAKER_01]: What little things will you do that will bless the parent who is doing this every single day?
25:38
[SPEAKER_02]: So what I hear you saying is that you would love it if someone said, how are you doing?
25:45
[SPEAKER_01]: That's right.
25:46
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, you're sitting having coffee with friends.
25:48
[SPEAKER_01]: That was someone said, and what you guys doing.
25:50
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
25:52
[SPEAKER_01]: And actually, specifically, Erin from Joey, the special needs, because a lot of times we will ask people, how are you doing?
26:00
[SPEAKER_01]: But very rarely, I really can say almost without fail, almost no one has ever asked us that, actually.
26:07
[SPEAKER_01]: How are you doing?
26:08
[SPEAKER_01]: Kirit for Joey for 45 years.
26:10
[SPEAKER_01]: And we have, first of all, we have some wonderful for him and family.
26:15
[SPEAKER_01]: Welcome, Joey.
26:16
[SPEAKER_01]: We can take him anywhere.
26:17
[SPEAKER_01]: We want to go with them.
26:18
[SPEAKER_01]: They can stand him and then we also know our limitations if they would invite us to do something.
26:24
[SPEAKER_01]: We're not going to maybe do certain things because it would affect the trip or the day or the moment and we're not going to ruin that.
26:32
[SPEAKER_01]: And we know it at night because we've had some pretty pretty amazing vacations that have been ruined by a fly in the room.
26:38
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, I mean, go pick something really simple.
26:41
[SPEAKER_01]: But but I would also say there are people in our lives that know us very well and they could easily say if you would like to go just go grab a dinner, we could watch a game a baseball or football game with Joey.
26:53
[SPEAKER_01]: Give them dinner and you know get out myself for a miss and most people do not make that offer.
27:00
[SPEAKER_01]: We had a few who have but most people you can almost tell they don't want to make that offer.
27:05
[SPEAKER_02]: They're afraid maybe they're afraid.
27:08
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't know.
27:09
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, I think yes, some would be, but people who know us well in what Joey's care involves, we would never give them a situation where they're going to have to do something.
27:20
[SPEAKER_01]: We would probably have Joey already for bad.
27:23
[SPEAKER_02]: ready.
27:24
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, ready to go to bed.
27:26
[SPEAKER_01]: He can even go upstairs and put himself to bed.
27:28
[SPEAKER_01]: The lights are on the CD players on everything's on, but he's it.
27:32
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so it's not like people couldn't do it.
27:36
[SPEAKER_01]: I just think some people might be
27:41
[SPEAKER_01]: unaware of what it might take.
27:42
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, no, we're gracious, Sarah.
27:44
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, she is.
27:47
[SPEAKER_00]: Here's the reality and it is that we've had people and we're talking leadership on our church like elders.
27:53
[SPEAKER_00]: Basically, we'll say to us, I'm afraid to ask because that might put a responsibility on me that I don't want to do.
28:00
[SPEAKER_02]: Gosh, you know.
28:01
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's a more of a reality is that, or sometimes you'll get the passive questions coming from people.
28:08
[SPEAKER_00]: Let me know if you eat anything.
28:10
[SPEAKER_02]: the worst.
28:12
[SPEAKER_00]: We're not going to respond to that, be honest.
28:14
[SPEAKER_00]: Remember, if someone says, hey, listen, I'm going to the store.
28:18
[SPEAKER_00]: Can I pick anything up for you?
28:19
[SPEAKER_00]: Some bulk bread, whatever.
28:21
[SPEAKER_00]: We'll be, I can be there at five o'clock.
28:22
[SPEAKER_00]: What do you think?
28:23
[SPEAKER_00]: And we would always say, yeah, that'd be awesome.
28:26
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you.
28:26
[SPEAKER_00]: We love that.
28:27
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think sometimes when a couple or families in the situation where they do need help and someone says, let me know how I can help.
28:35
[SPEAKER_01]: One thing we've done, some people have said, if you need us to watch Joey or this or that, let us know.
28:42
[SPEAKER_01]: And I say to them, I'm putting your name on a list.
28:44
[SPEAKER_01]: And I have a list.
28:46
[SPEAKER_01]: And that way, and actually a bunch of bears in the emergency.
28:49
[SPEAKER_01]: And there was recently a couple of years ago now in emergency, where I wound up having
28:53
[SPEAKER_01]: A serious illness for a telling and we had to rush to the hospital and we were able to call one of our friends We left the door soap and then we said here's what we need you to do and she could come over and do it because What are we gonna do with Joey?
29:08
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm on the way to the ER.
29:09
[SPEAKER_01]: So When you have one or two of those friends to even be able to say I'm gonna put your name on a list and I will call you and then call that if you need yeah
29:19
[SPEAKER_01]: But then you might need to have a little preparation to let them know some of the quirks they might not know that happen in your home because of your child.
29:28
[SPEAKER_01]: And actually, here's just an example too.
29:31
[SPEAKER_01]: And this should be not only the empty nest families that also families who are caring for a child with special needs.
29:39
[SPEAKER_01]: Years ago we were speaking at family life.
29:42
[SPEAKER_01]: and there was six people in front of us, we were at our speaker table in there.
29:47
[SPEAKER_01]: Three or four couples, young kids said they were young kids.
29:50
[SPEAKER_01]: They had young children and they came up to us and they said, oh my gosh, we have a friend that has a son that sounds just like your Joey.
29:58
[SPEAKER_01]: at which they could come here.
29:59
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't hesitate, and I said they could come here, but it would take all six or eight of you to say, let's go handle pajama party at their house.
30:09
[SPEAKER_01]: Teach us how to take care of him.
30:11
[SPEAKER_01]: Teach us what you need us to do, and we will for a weekend come and do what you do alone.
30:16
[SPEAKER_01]: Us six or eight will come and take care of this child so you can get to go.
30:21
[SPEAKER_01]: It's going to take an effort, it's going to take sacrifice, it's going to take surrender on your part to go do with these people surrender every single day.
30:34
[SPEAKER_02]: That's a good illustration, goodness.
30:36
[SPEAKER_02]: Am I myself box now?
30:39
[SPEAKER_02]: Hey mama, if your house feels too quiet and your heart feels too heavy after launching your child, I've created the guide just for you.
30:48
[SPEAKER_02]: It's called journaling through transitional grief.
30:52
[SPEAKER_02]: A gentle, faith-filled resource to help you process the deep of motions of letting go.
30:58
[SPEAKER_02]: Inside, you'll find six reflection questions that will help you name your feelings and invite God into the grief and experience his comfort in the middle of change.
31:08
[SPEAKER_02]: Remember, transitional grief is only a season and God is leading you toward peace, purpose, and joy.
31:16
[SPEAKER_02]: You can grab your free copy at the link in the show notes.
31:22
[SPEAKER_01]: Cindy, I want to circle back then to how do you handle that resentment?
31:26
[SPEAKER_01]: Do you go to God with it?
31:27
[SPEAKER_01]: How do you guys deal with it?
31:29
[SPEAKER_01]: Actually, I feel like Jo and I are able to really talk about this together well, and that is a blessing.
31:35
[SPEAKER_01]: Perhaps for the sickle parent who was empty nest and has their child, I would say if you have a good friend, be able to talk to that friend and share it.
31:44
[SPEAKER_01]: Share the realities of it.
31:46
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not going to share this reality with every single person I come across because first of I would have no friends.
31:52
[SPEAKER_01]: I did that, right?
31:53
[SPEAKER_01]: People don't want to hear all this things.
31:55
[SPEAKER_01]: But I have one dear friend who really does understand.
31:58
[SPEAKER_01]: She has a brother who has special needs that she has care of her brother, not in her home, but it's still a lot of work.
32:05
[SPEAKER_01]: And so I would just say, find someone certainly.
32:09
[SPEAKER_01]: asked the Lord to heal your heart of it.
32:12
[SPEAKER_01]: But also there is a reality of being able to share about it.
32:16
[SPEAKER_01]: And so Joe and I will talk about it.
32:18
[SPEAKER_01]: And some time one time Joey been relaying in bed when he puts his arm around me and he says, Do you even believe this is our life?
32:25
[SPEAKER_01]: And Joey had been up three times and he comes downstairs and he comes over the bed and he goes, I love you.
32:31
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, you kind of love us that, right?
32:34
[SPEAKER_01]: But it's also 330 in the morning.
32:36
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
32:37
[SPEAKER_01]: And so I would say have a good friend or two that you can really rely on and talk to.
32:45
[SPEAKER_01]: And I don't know that Joe really shares much with Guy friends, but I know he has one or two that he could and he and I always have conversations because we don't want to be that person who is
32:56
[SPEAKER_01]: Always Debbie down her and like life is not rough like it's hard.
33:00
[SPEAKER_01]: There's no doubt about it Let me say there's also a lot of joy.
33:03
[SPEAKER_01]: Joey is a great guy But he'll have a meltdown and that's not great.
33:08
[SPEAKER_01]: So what are you looking for in life and how are you?
33:11
[SPEAKER_01]: patterning at the more that you feed into the resentment of at the more you're going to be resent Well, so fine ends in life that you can find joy in I as I only say try to find a silver lining
33:25
[SPEAKER_00]: You got to be looking for that for sure, you know.
33:27
[SPEAKER_01]: You've got to chase it.
33:28
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
33:29
[SPEAKER_01]: You know.
33:29
[SPEAKER_00]: Embracing the season.
33:30
[SPEAKER_00]: We talked about the importance of just recognizing that there are changes of seasons in everyone's life.
33:36
[SPEAKER_00]: And there have been times when I've taught my son and did bad for my 40 year old six foot four son.
33:41
[SPEAKER_00]: And I still talk to him in bed at night.
33:43
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think how sad that none of my friends get to do this with their children.
33:47
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
33:48
[SPEAKER_00]: a week at the D then.
33:50
[SPEAKER_00]: And so we try to look for the silver lining and there as you just have to look for it.
33:54
[SPEAKER_00]: And but it's it's important that for your health that number one, this relationship here is the most important relationship to help treat your stress on it child.
34:06
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's stronger this relationship is the more likely that your child is going to be and on a good footing with
34:19
[SPEAKER_00]: To share with people and there isn't a lot of people with insurance with who would be wanted to listen to us And yeah, after a big issue right there and and I would say one of the cities close to France I was just shit this one example on one day city and her were on a phone and Cindy says I need to I got to get going.
34:38
[SPEAKER_00]: I think Joe and a shower and there was like a pause on the phone You give Joey shower
34:47
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, I've been doing that for the last 40s on the years and you know, I had no idea that you did this was a close friend right while this is really impactful here because you have to understand these people aren't asking question.
35:02
[SPEAKER_01]: They're not curious about our life.
35:04
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, if we were trapped with them all around the world, they would probably have more interest in that than to know what we do every day.
35:11
[SPEAKER_01]: And to go a step further in terms of the emptiness, a thought to is, our girls have both said that they would take Joey some day.
35:18
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's wonderful because they can divide and conquer what they want to go someplace the other can take Joey such a thing that I would want to say about that to is as someone with the emptiness.
35:32
[SPEAKER_01]: It's going to look different.
35:34
[SPEAKER_01]: So you've got to make that plan.
35:35
[SPEAKER_01]: There's there's has plans because life is life and someday we are going to be here and the reality becomes clearer and clearer, the older that we get.
35:45
[SPEAKER_02]: That's right.
35:47
[SPEAKER_02]: Okay, our last question for the mom listening today who feels exhausted and wonders if the season will ever get easier.
35:54
[SPEAKER_02]: What hope would you want to
36:02
[SPEAKER_01]: I think Joey's getting slower as we go along.
36:04
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's the good thing.
36:05
[SPEAKER_01]: We don't feel like we have to run so much.
36:07
[SPEAKER_01]: But I think in the parenting journey, there is so much hope.
36:11
[SPEAKER_01]: First of all, there's joy to be found.
36:13
[SPEAKER_01]: And you might need to look for it.
36:15
[SPEAKER_01]: And so when you find that or even when you find little things that you enjoy doing, learn how to break that up into little things.
36:23
[SPEAKER_01]: Let me just give an example.
36:25
[SPEAKER_01]: If you like to, or you want to try.
36:27
[SPEAKER_01]: So you want to try doing watercolor painting.
36:30
[SPEAKER_01]: You don't have a professional, just go have fun, take a class.
36:33
[SPEAKER_01]: If you are married, can your spouse help dividing conquer by taking over the household responsibilities for you to get out and do that or same for a husband, can a wife say, go out and play golf for the day or meet a friend, because if you don't get those little inputs to the joy in your day, it's going to get really hard in the net resentment that you talked about is going to happen.
36:57
[SPEAKER_01]: And so I think there's a lot to be said about Divide a Conqueror, so then should you not just one of you is home watching the child who is now an adult for 45-50 or more years.
37:08
[SPEAKER_01]: Divide a Conqueror, let each of you get a piece of life that you can hang on to that you think this is really enjoyable for me.
37:16
[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe it's reading a book or meeting a friend for lunch or something, but figure out what it is experimental a little bit and then hone in on that and truly get a moment to enjoy it.
37:27
[SPEAKER_00]: As is the case with any marriage, one of the major factors that causes these two conflicts is some unrealistic expectations between each other and then you add it in this variable of a special needs child and you better learn real quick to develop some realistic expectations because if you keep pushing against that one life will get real real bad real quick.
37:53
[SPEAKER_00]: and someone will be allowed on that.
37:55
[SPEAKER_00]: And so, you have to, and it really, in the big picture of things, lots of all about learning contentment, and being content in whatever situation might find in yourself and, and we even as far as social needs, we feel that God has brought us to a point of contentment of realizing that this is what we have been given.
38:16
[SPEAKER_00]: And that God made Joe just the way he wanted them.
38:20
[SPEAKER_00]: And when I was told that when Joey was nine months old or a year, an elder came to our home, and he knew that we were struggling here.
38:29
[SPEAKER_00]: And when he made that comment to me, to us, that be assured that God made Joe just the way he wanted it.
38:36
[SPEAKER_00]: I'll be too happy with that.
38:37
[SPEAKER_00]: But I would say confidently now, I think both Cindy and I would say that if God came to us right now and said, I'm going to heal Joey, we would say, thank you, but no thank you guy.
38:49
[SPEAKER_00]: We're happy with the way Joey is right now.
38:52
[SPEAKER_00]: If you can give that blessing to a young man, a madad who just are getting that diagnosis, that would be great.
38:58
[SPEAKER_00]: But we're happy with Joey right now.
39:00
[SPEAKER_01]: And at time of life in our culture, we're disposing of life is really easy because it's not going to be convenient to care for a child.
39:07
[SPEAKER_01]: And with special needs, I would just say you're missing a blessing.
39:10
[SPEAKER_01]: You're missing a blessing.
39:12
[SPEAKER_02]: That's beautiful.
39:13
[SPEAKER_02]: Cindy and Jo, I just want to thank you for joining me today for just shining a light on a topic.
39:19
[SPEAKER_02]: We don't cover very often.
39:21
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.
39:22
[SPEAKER_02]: What I hear you saying is you would just appreciate being seed seen you appreciate people taking interest in you offering little ways to help have the courage to say, hey, can I show up for a couple hours when watch football with Joey will you guys go on a date?
39:39
[SPEAKER_02]: That's wonderful.
39:41
[SPEAKER_02]: So I want to, I want to ask, can you tell my listeners where they can grab your book, this special needs parrot?
39:46
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, so you can grab the book really anywhere that sells books, but moody publishing is who published it so through moody is one, or cindyforenie.com.
39:56
[SPEAKER_01]: We have books that we can also send out and those would be the two ways, but Amazon, anywhere you get books.
40:02
[SPEAKER_02]: Awesome.
40:03
[SPEAKER_02]: I believe those links in the show notes.
40:05
[SPEAKER_02]: And Mama, if you're parenting journey, looks different than you expected.
40:09
[SPEAKER_02]: I hope today's conversation reminds you that God sees you.
40:12
[SPEAKER_02]: He sees the sacrifices no one else notices.
40:15
[SPEAKER_02]: The prayers you prayed for years and the love.
40:18
[SPEAKER_02]: that you pour out day after day.
40:20
[SPEAKER_02]: Here's your coaching tip of the week.
40:22
[SPEAKER_02]: In each episode, I will give you one actionable step to improve your life.
40:26
[SPEAKER_02]: Remember, you can't change everything, but you can take one step to be better.
40:30
[SPEAKER_02]: This week, I want you to think of a mom you know, who has a special needs child, and I just want you to reach out to her.
40:43
[SPEAKER_02]: Say, hey, can we come over for a cup of coffee and just show some interest in her?
40:48
[SPEAKER_02]: Ask her about her life.
40:49
[SPEAKER_02]: That's all you have to do.
40:51
[SPEAKER_02]: And that would be such a blessing to her.
40:54
[SPEAKER_02]: Lama, remember that your story may not look like someone else's empty nest, but God is still writing a beautiful story through your faithfulness.
41:03
[SPEAKER_02]: If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to share this conversation with a friend who can use the same encouragement.
41:08
[SPEAKER_02]: Just find that little share button and send it on over.
41:12
[SPEAKER_02]: Grace and peace, Lama.
41:13
[SPEAKER_02]: You've got this and God's got you.
41:16
[SPEAKER_02]: Thank you so much for spending time with me on the Midlife Mama Podcast.
41:20
[SPEAKER_02]: My hope is that you leave each episode feeling encouraged, grounded, and clearer.
41:25
[SPEAKER_02]: Clearer about what you're feeling, what God may be stirring in you, and how to move forward in the season of the empty nest.
41:31
[SPEAKER_02]: Through these conversations, I'm not just sharing stories.
41:35
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm coaching you.
41:36
[SPEAKER_02]: Helping you name what's happening beneath the service, service, challenging the thoughts that keep you stuck and take intentional steps toward peace and confidence as a midlife mom.
41:46
[SPEAKER_02]: If you're ready to go deeper and want personalized coaching support, I invite you to apply for coaching.
41:53
[SPEAKER_02]: Coaching is a focused one-on-one space where we work together to gain clarity, process emotions, and discern what God is calling you to in this next chapter.
42:02
[SPEAKER_02]: You'll find the application linked in the show notes and let's stay connected.
42:07
[SPEAKER_02]: You can find me on Instagram at PHinkleman.
42:10
[SPEAKER_02]: that's P-H-E-N-K-E-L-M-A-N, or on Facebook at Pamela Hinguman, and Dynast Coach.
42:17
[SPEAKER_02]: You don't have to figure out the season alone, Mama.
42:21
[SPEAKER_02]: Support and direction are possible, and I'm here when you're ready.