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16 - Rebuilding Connection Through Masculine Containment (with Christian Honer) · Masculine Containment

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  Today on the Masculine Containment Podcast, I am honored to share some time, share some conversation with Christian Hohner, who was in our first Brotherhood Container.
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  Christian is a former professional athlete, an extraordinary human being.
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  I'm so excited and honored to talk to you today, Christian.
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  Thank you for coming on the podcast.
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  Thank you.
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  Alex, you are the man.
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  I'm so excited to chat and be here.
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  Like anytime, spend a time as Brothers for Life.
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  And so I'm just so thankful to be here and excited to chat, bro.
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  This is awesome.
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  Yeah, there's no question.
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  Brothers for Life.
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  So Christian, take us back to before you joined the brotherhood and tell us what was going on for you.
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  What was going on in your life?
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  be better in my marriage.
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  And I was like in so many arenas, like trying counseling.
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  We tried like probably three or four different like counselors for both of us.
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  And like also individual counselors and EMDR and a lot of different things.
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  But like, yeah, I was just at a place to where like, I feel like business was doing well, like health was doing well, everything else other than my relation with the Lord was doing well.
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  But like my marriage, I just was like so new into it.
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  And I so like didn't know like and so I think I was just at a
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  just like really struggling to like connect with my wife, like spiritually, emotionally, physically, like in any sort of way.
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  Like I was just like, how can like, and I felt like all these counseling sessions never really like helped me like really have a framework to know like, kind of what, what do I actually need to do?
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  What's my part in this?
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  And how can I like, you know, improve our connection?
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  And so, yeah, I feel like I was like a lot of despair really comes to mind.
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  I was just at a place where it's like, man, like, I feel like
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  I'm trying all these things.
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  Nothing's really working.
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  And like, I really want to connect with my wife in a more deeper level because I know it's so, it's like, it's what I like.
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  I know we've been connected at a deep level and like what's missing.
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  And so I was just at a place where, yeah, just trying to figure out how to find that connection again and how to like, yeah, that's kind of where I was at.
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  And it's just trying all these things.
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  Tell us what that lack of connection looked like for you.
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  Like, I know there's men out there who are having challenges in the relationship.
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  What was going on in yours?
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  Yeah, so a lot of the times that my wife would like any sort of conversations, I would be so reactive, so defensive, like so many, like, yeah, so many things would come up that like I just was, yeah, and we just...
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  Yeah, no real sex for a long period of time.
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  No real like, you know, spiritual like connection to where we're like diving into the word together.
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  Like, and it was just like, it felt like we were like roommates and just not, not living in incongruency and alignment like with each other.
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  And we were just like missing each other.
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  And like, yeah, even though we were like in it, like we were with our kids, present with our kids, but like not like being with each other.
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  Like, yeah, that's kind of what it was.
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  What does that feel like day to day, Christian?
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  It feels like, I mean, a lot of, I feel like failure.
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  I'm like, man, I'm failing as a husband or like, I'm like, you know, I'm not doing the best that I can.
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  And I'm like trying all these things, but like, yeah, it's not working.
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  The person that's like my best friend and my favorite person, like we're not like in sync.
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  And it just like is really, it's hard to deal with it.
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  And in fact, it impacts every other area of life.
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  What did it feel like in your body?
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  Like if you, because you, I know you're an athlete.
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  You feel yourself a lot, right?
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  For sure.
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  When you think back to that time of that, like feeling like roommates, what did it feel like?
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  And like, I think just so many times I was just like, this isn't what it's supposed to be like.
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  Like, this is just like miserable.
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  Like, and this is just like,
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  not what I know this beautiful thing to be marriage to be.
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  And I just like was, yeah, like, yeah, miserable would be a good, like, like being in that place to where like, wow, I'm not like in tune and in sync with the person that means the most to me.
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  And we're just going through life and we're doing these things with our kids and we're doing these things with, you know, business and going away with our life.
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  But like the thing that's the most meaningful is not.
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  So yeah,
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  What was it back then that you weren't saying out loud, Christian?
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  What was it that I wasn't saying out loud?
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  It probably was...
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  I feel like I was saying like, I want this emotional connection, all these things, but like I wasn't like, I didn't have, I was doing the wrong things.
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  And I feel like the things that I was doing weren't like getting the result like at all.
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  And it didn't feel like applicable.
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  Like we just had these conversations about these things and these counseling sessions and like it never went anywhere to like solve things or I had no way like X, Y, Z, if you do this, this is how it works or like a process or framework.
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  So I think that like, yeah.
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  So I think I just like,
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  I wasn't, I guess maybe I wasn't saying what I truly feel like I needed, like from these people, like the actual frameworks that would actually help me like call my nervous system so I can call my wife's nervous system and see like the physiology behind it of like so many different things.
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  So yeah.
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  So when you say you weren't saying what you needed from these people, you just mentioned it, but you guys tried a lot, right?
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  Like there was a lot of interventions.
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  Oh, yeah, for sure.
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  Yeah, we tried every which way.
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  I mean, we had three different counselors and for at least like six months each.
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  And like it just got worse almost like kind of thing because we never like.
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  Yeah, we just talked about things and never came to like it just was endless talking and like about feelings and all these things and nothing was like.
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  applicable to where like it would change things moving forward like it never felt like you know like it sounds like you were willing to do anything just like oh yeah and I was just like spinning my wheels feeling like I'm like okay I'm doing the counseling I'm doing this I'm doing that and it's just not moving the needle at all and I'm not getting any closer uh with my wife so yeah so take us back to um when you joined that original brotherhood container what made you join
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  Man, just like, I think, well, I first, when we have, before our call, I think I told you like the nervous system piece.
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  I'm like, that makes sense.
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  Like, I've never thought of it in a physiology sense.
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  And like, there's so much more to it.
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  And like, there's just like so many simple things.
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  And like, yeah, I was just like nervous system.
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  I'm a nerd about that.
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  Okay, I need to make sure that like, I'm able to be that calm for my wife's nervous system because she's in fight or flight.
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  She's in that.
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  So like, I think for me, when I saw like,
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  how like being at a certain level four out of 10 was like a childhood.
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  And I just like, it's like, wow, nervousism.
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  I connected the dots and I was just like, that makes so much sense.
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  I've been trying all these tactics and things, but like going back to the physiology of it all, like just like really it was like, I have to be involved.
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  And like, I have to, because I feel like this is the stuff that will actually improve and like the frameworks that I could actually like apply.
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  Like, so I think I got really excited because it made sense in my, in my head versus just talking about things.
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  you know, like in the counseling sense or anything else.
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  Prior to that, how do you think you were affecting your wife's nervous system in a negative way?
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  gosh, destroying it.
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  And like, I feel like I'm so thankful that I've learned it now, but I can't imagine like how long-term and how harmful that could be.
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  Yeah.
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  Just endless.
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  Like she brought something out, I'll bring something else up or like be really reactive or defensive.
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  I'd be automatically and like not be able to contain myself whatsoever and just like respond in like a very immature way that just like,
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  yeah, damaged her nervous system and made her feel like completely not safe and completely not seen and completely not heard.
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  Because anytime she would bring something up, I'd be talking about something else or reacting or defending or like doing some like whatever, like woo-ha to get like to not like so yeah, it's just like, yeah.
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  When you look back at those times of like reacting and defending, how does it make you like when you look back knowing what you know now, how do you feel about doing that stuff in the past?
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  Oh my gosh, yeah.
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  I feel absolutely like I, when I think about it, like I've really harmed my wife in the most prized possession that I have.
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  Like, and I've really like, you know, done damage in a really, so I think now looking at him, like, wow, like...
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  That's, that's a lot.
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  That's intense.
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  And yeah, it's like, it's crazy how unconscious or subconscious it can be to where you're like, might not even really recognize like how defensive and reactive you are, like you have been and like how impactful that has been.
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  So I think for me, it was just like, yeah, I've harmed and hurt and it made my wife feel completely not safe and completely not heard, you know, or seen.
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  So take us back to the moment.
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  Yeah, for sure.
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  Yeah.
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  Take us back to the moment when you realize that.
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  Like I remember for me realizing after Katie said, I don't feel seen, I don't feel hurt, I don't feel safe.
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  And if something doesn't change, I can't do this anymore.
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  And like when it finally landed that I was doing that, it took me like a few days to recover.
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  Take me back to when that landed for you.
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  What did it feel like?
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  Yeah.
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  When, yeah, when I knew it was up to me, I was just like, wow, I have harmed like this person that's so meaningful to me.
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  And like, I've got to.
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  yeah, I can't let this continue because I could see how harmful that is and how that like ruins so many marriages.
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  So like, I was just like, I cannot let this like continue.
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  I can't like when I'm, I gotta, I gotta do something different.
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  Like I can't continue to do like what I've been doing because it's just gonna only harm her, you know, more and more.
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  So what hesitations did you have about doing this work?
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  Did you have any?
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  Man, that's a good question.
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  Hesitations.
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  I feel like,
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  probably because I feel like none of the stuff that I've tried worked.
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  I was also like, okay, like I'm down to try it.
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  Like I felt good about it, but I think there was like some, like, like I know he's went through it and that's what I love about it.
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  Like you like going through it and then sharing through it.
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  But like, I'm also like, Oh, well, it worked for me.
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  I've tried all these things, you know, kind of thing.
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  I think there's still that, you know, still hesitation because you're like, I've tried all these things.
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  Like, why would this be the thing?
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  You know?
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  So I think that would be probably the main hesitation.
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  I was just, yeah, that probably would be, yeah.
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  Is there anything that almost stopped you?
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  No, I don't think so.
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  No, I was actually really excited about it.
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  I think after our conversation and just seeing the work that you were doing, I was really fired up about it, honestly.
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  I was like, this aligns.
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  This is something that I really need to change the trajectory of my family and my relationship with my wife, really, long-term, you know?
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  Yeah.
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  Yeah, that makes sense.
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  So let's jump into the work.
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  So what did you actually start doing differently once you joined the Brotherhood?
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  Like, what did that look like?
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  Yeah, I think one, like being seen and heard there and being able to like be there with other people that are in it, like that are willing to chat about it was super helpful because it's like I felt like, OK, like now I can, you know, more so fix it.
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  And then I think like adding the daily ceremony and and just the time in neutral and the
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  I would say, yeah.
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  And then having, really having the daily ceremony and like having that active containment and like knowing and being aware of it and breathing into it.
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  And like, yeah, I think so many little things like that, that like, I just like had no...
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  idea that that would make such an impact.
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  So yeah, I think like the daily ceremony, I would probably say, and the time in neutral would be the two probably main things that I think like, and just the community and brotherhood that we had to share and to be like, okay, like, and, and just really be seen and heard, I think was just absolutely massive to have, you know, every week.
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  I often tell men, hey, you're not alone.
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  And I think when you're struggling in your relationship, you feel so isolated and so alone.
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  What was it like to hear from other men that were having similar problems to you?
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  What did that do for you?
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  Yeah, I was freeing.
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  I was like, okay, now I feel like I can fix that and be around and I'll like share what's actually going on because they're dealing with it and they want to solve it like I do.
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  And like, yeah, we're all on the same page of like wanting to, you know, like build this relationship.
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  And so like, and just...
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  having that, and it reminds me of, like, martial arts or any sort of thing that you're all doing together, like, All Ships Rised, or it was, like, we were all trying to... Yeah, it was absolutely the most necessary piece.
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  I mean, they're all necessary pieces, but having that brotherhood, like...
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  unreal.
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  Yeah.
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  You brought up daily ceremony.
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  And just for context for everybody listening, that's a practice that we teach in the brotherhood.
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  After we teach regulation, after we do some other practices, it's sitting down with your spouse on a daily basis and understanding what's going on for her.
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  Take us back to those early ceremonies, Christian.
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  What was that like?
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  Oh man, I was like, I remember like, almost like clenching my fists and like, like reprogramming that reaction defensive, like consistent, like just to be like, all right, what else?
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  Just lay it in like, I would feel so attacked.
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  So it'd be really hard for me to just like, so, oh my gosh, it was like grinning bear.
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  Like, for sure.
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  It was just like, because literally like, oh, like I know I've done this for so long and I've got to change this neurotransmitter, whatever the heck is going on here, like to really like actually,
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  change this because I think like, yeah, just, yeah, that I think just, it was really hard, really hard because I never like gave my wife the space and like continued to ask.
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  So like, I think that just was really hard because most of the time I would react or defend.
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  So just like, yeah, the first couple of weeks was just,
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  Yeah, literally white knuckling grit and baring it and just breathing through it and focusing on like, how can I expand, contract my breath, light, low and slow, like just settle into the present moment, like not react.
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  Yeah.
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  What did doing that do for you?
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  What did it do for you?
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  And then I want to know what it did for her.
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  Hmm.
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  Yeah.
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  What it did for me is it just like.
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  it gave me the confidence and capability to settle in that moment and be there with her, like, and be comfortable in that and not to like fear it or reject it or like whatever may be.
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  I think it, yeah, it just gave me like an open pathway to like really, really, yeah, have that space to connect on a daily basis to where I feel that much more connected.
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  And that like,
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  Yeah, I just like saw fruits.
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  Like, not quickly, but like you could see, like I feel like in Cali, you're like 90 days into something, you're like, I want to see some fruits, you know, kind of thing.
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  But I feel like in a couple of weeks, like I felt like having that ceremony, like I really feel like for me, like, yeah, gave us more of that.
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  And then for her, it really just gave her a space to share and like be seen and heard that she's longed for from me.
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  And like, I think really gave her,
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  a lot of trust and a lot of like, just because she's noticed and seen the reactive and defensive for the time.
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  It's like, and it's like the testing piece to where it's like, is this something that he's just doing one day or is this something, you know, long-term?
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  So I think for her, it like, it probably, it changed the way that she could communicate with me, like, and how she could feel a lot more seen and heard and to be,
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  Like really to get, I feel like it gave us both like the connection that we both kind of ultimately desired, you know, from that consistency each and every day versus being together, but not really being together.
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  It gave us that time to just like share and be there, you know, and specifically for her.
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  And then, yeah.
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  One of the things that men tell me when I talk about, you know, active containment and sitting down with your wife and hearing her feelings and hearing what's really going on for her.
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  They're like, you know, I'm doing all the work.
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  What do I get out of this?
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  You know, how does this work for me?
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  How did it work for you?
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  What did you get out of it, Christian?
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  Yeah, I think it just gave me this.
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  confidence this like I could focus on myself and not like not like expect so much like from from my wife or things like I feel like it gave me like something that I could give and pursue and be intentional about on a daily basis.
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  that like made me feel like I'm leading and I'm guiding and I'm like, you know, being intentional about that.
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  Because I feel like without that, like I wasn't being intentional.
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  Like, you know, the shift, the shift doesn't know where it's going.
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  It's like, like, I feel like having that intentionality in our relationship.
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  Yeah, just gave me.
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  Yeah, my wife back and my life back with her, really.
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  But like that, that, that leadership role and just to like have that intentional time that I'm pursuing her in,
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  Yeah, throw all those things and defend and all those things that I once did before.
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  Yeah.
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  Yeah, in those spaces.
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  Yeah.
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  Yeah, you did so much work, Christian.
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  It's impressive.
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  So you kind of alluded to how, not alluded, you told us how your relationship was before.
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  Tell us what it's like now.
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  Yeah, it's absolutely amazing.
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  I mean, there's highs and lows no matter what, but it feels so much more secure.
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  I feel we both feel so much more seen and heard, and we both feel so much more, like, grounded in each other and pursuing each other and having, like, a real, like, relationship with each other before our kids.
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  Like, I feel like we really have something that, like...
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  Yeah, I truly wanted, but like I just didn't have the tools to have it.
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  So I feel like for me it's and for her, it's just having the relationship and not being united and being one rather than being roommates and being divided like completely, which is a completely different world, like completely.
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  Yeah.
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  Yeah.
• 18:18
  Yeah, that being roommates and being divided is so difficult.
• 18:21
  When you say that it's, you know, I appreciate you say there's highs and lows.
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  In the Brotherhood, we always say it's progress over perfection.
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  Nothing's perfect.
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  Exactly.
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  Yeah.
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  But I also tell men, like, once you understand containment, it doesn't really matter what comes up, you can get through it.
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  Do you have that feeling now?
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  Mm-hmm.
• 18:36
  Yes, absolutely.
• 18:37
  Yes.
• 18:38
  Like no matter the valleys, the highs, the lows, whatever, I feel like I have tools and frameworks to ground myself through those peaks and valleys for sure.
• 18:46
  Yeah, the tools.
• 18:46
  Yeah, absolutely.
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  And I can go back to them.
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  And I'm excited to get plugged into the next one, too.
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  I want to be involved with the next one because we had the smaller.
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  It'd be so it'd be so cool to be involved with everybody else.
• 18:55
  But yeah, I think that just consistency on it and staying plugged in just like any other habits and things that we're pursuing.
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  How do you handle situations now that used to trigger you, Christian?
• 19:10
  Wow, yeah.
• 19:11
  Yeah, like I can actually, yeah, I can actually be in it and talk about it without like, without harming someone else and without like,
• 19:30
  Yeah, being someone who I'm truly not and going into that, like that childhood, you know, space.
• 19:35
  I feel like, yeah.
• 19:38
  Has that changed your life?
• 19:44
  I mean, I think, yeah, just the.
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  Knowing that, like, whatever situation comes my way and like in any arena of the of like my priorities that like.
• 19:56
  Yeah, I can fight through it.
• 19:57
  And I can be, I love how Saul said it, just like being that like, that like calm through the storm.
• 20:05
  And just, I feel like in those like chaotic situations, even with my kids or like in any situation, I feel like I can just be grounded and go straight to my breath and like not react in a way that I would regret later on.
• 20:18
  And like any arena, like my relationship with the Lord and my relationship with my wife, relationship with my kids, even like to an extent in business and how, like, I just feel like,
• 20:28
  I can, yeah, I don't, I don't have to react and I don't have to.
• 20:33
  Yeah, there's that like pause in between it, you know, and it changes everything really when you have that.
• 20:39
  Yeah.
• 20:40
  You just mentioned, you know, you, you handle things in a way that you don't regret later on.
• 20:45
  Like, what was that like in the past when you handled something and then you look back and think like, why did I do that?
• 20:50
  Yeah.
• 20:51
  Yeah, the shame would eat me up and the guilt would eat me up.
• 20:54
  That was just like a huge cycle that I had to where it would just like I would just beat myself up.
• 20:58
  And it was just like, you know, for no reason.
• 21:01
  But like, I think.
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  Yeah, really, it really it really.
• 21:06
  Yeah, it really is harmful.
• 21:07
  Yeah.
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  And I think it's so easy as men to just like sit in that and soak in that and beat ourselves up.
• 21:12
  Like I hear that self-talk of a lot of people a lot of the times in no minute, like in myself, like it's just very easy to go there, you know.
• 21:20
  So what would your partner say is different about you now?
• 21:22
  What would your wife say?
• 21:24
  Oh my gosh.
• 21:25
  Like probably like I, I feel a lot more safe around him.
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  I can like, I can be, I can share the things that are actually on my mind.
• 21:33
  I don't have to like, you know, like feel like I have to hold back or whatever.
• 21:36
  And she would probably say, yeah, that she can actually like have a space to feel seen and heard each and every day because yeah.
• 21:46
  she's with two little ones, absolute chaos.
• 21:49
  So she would probably just be like, okay, I have like a place to go back that's not absolutely chaos.
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  And like, it's chaos with the kids.
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  Okay, now it's chaos to you.
• 21:55
  It's like, whoa.
• 21:56
  So like for her, maybe like that piece in the chaotic storm of like, yeah, mothering our two little ones that are, well, three and a year and a half.
• 22:06
  So I think for her, just like having that, just in the chaos of that to not have more chaos from me, you know, like, yeah.
• 22:16
  So Christian, I know you came into the brotherhood like really wanting to work on your relationship.
• 22:20
  Where else has understanding masculine containment, doing this work, having the practices, where else has it changed things in your life?
• 22:28
  Gosh, I feel like I'm a lot more intentional even in business and coaching and things to really like see it at a foundational level in so many different arenas.
• 22:35
  Like it gave me such a different perspective on like how holistic like a lot of these things are in so many areas.
• 22:40
  So I feel like in my coaching, in my like the webinars that I've done and like the, like I just feel like
• 22:48
  the tools and the things that I've learned and just like the, the piece of the nervous system just has given me a lot more capacity too, because I'm not fried and like fight or flight, you know, constantly.
• 22:58
  Um, which I think, and that even in, you know, parenting with the little ones and, you know, even, yeah.
• 23:05
  And, and yeah, I would say big time in that piece.
• 23:08
  So I would say, yeah, all those arenas, it's, it's very, yeah, very impactful.
• 23:14
  There's a lot of people coming towards the brotherhood that have kids.
• 23:17
  Can you just say a little bit more about how you think it's different for you now as a parent or how you show up different as a parent?
• 23:23
  Because I think that's just such an important area of life for us.
• 23:26
  It is.
• 23:26
  Yeah, it's so much.
• 23:27
  It really is.
• 23:28
  And I think, man, it's so easy to meet kids where they're at when we're in our own state.
• 23:32
  Like I know for so long, I'm like, wow, like how am I getting meeting them at their level?
• 23:35
  Like how how did I just get there?
• 23:37
  But it's like the physiology to where it's like where I'm not and I'm already in fight or flight and I'm not like, you know, containing myself.
• 23:44
  for me, like it's given me, yeah, just a lot more patience too, like that can't like, like with them and just to be able to connect with them on a deeper level, level rather than react in my way or feel like I need to, and just like, kind of let them let them like, yeah.
• 24:07
  And I think it's just developed more of a,
• 24:12
  Yeah, it just feels more intentional too when I'm like able to sit in that and like I'll notice how much more calm they are in whatever's ahead too.
• 24:20
  Their nervous system, like they're matching my, so I feel like in that same way with my wife to where like it's up to me.
• 24:27
  I'm the man, it's up to me.
• 24:28
  Like I need to make sure that, you know, and I think having this has really, yeah, just given me a presence and a patience with my kids that really I feel like
• 24:43
  is, is, is, it's, it's hard because we, again, like I said a little bit earlier, like where we would just go right into that childhood, right.
• 24:49
  And meet them where they're at.
• 24:50
  So yeah, that's been absolutely tremendous because I feel like in those chaotic moments, which happened very consistently with two little ones that are under three years old, it's like being able to hold that space and be in that space for everybody.
• 25:02
  Like my whole, my entire family, my two little ones and my wife.
• 25:04
  Um, but for them, I think it's, it just,
• 25:07
  I can just tell that they're not as reactive themselves once I've started to calm my nervous system.
• 25:13
  Yeah.
• 25:14
  Isn't it intense how when you calm things down, you start seeing the people around you calm down?
• 25:20
  Yeah, for sure.
• 25:21
  The noise and just like you like see it.
• 25:23
  Yeah, for sure.
• 25:23
  Yeah.
• 25:24
  It's pretty wild.
• 25:25
  It's like, okay, yeah, I can point at everybody else.
• 25:28
  But until I start with myself, then it's going to impact other people like in that way.
• 25:31
  Like, yeah, and you'll see it.
• 25:34
  Yeah.
• 25:34
  Yeah.
• 25:35
  What's that feeling like, like when you know you can calm the room?
• 25:40
  Yeah, it's freeing and it's freedom and it's knowing that whatever chaotic situations may come, that you can be that calm in that storm.
• 25:54
  however crazy and chaotic that moment may be, like, I feel like it just gives you that, like, it's like, it's kind of like, um, being like superhuman.
• 26:04
  My buddy in jujitsu is like, you become superhuman when you do that.
• 26:06
  I feel like you become superhuman when you like have control of your nervous system and you can like prime it and you can like, I mean, in so many areas, like to, to be the best athlete that you want to be, to be the best, like whatever, but it all really starts there.
• 26:18
  Like I think,
• 26:20
  You know, you brought up jujitsu, you brought up martial arts earlier, you're an athlete.
• 26:24
  I often share with men that practicing masculine containment is like learning a martial art.
• 26:28
  Like you get better at it every day if you lean into it.
• 26:32
  Can you share a little bit about that?
• 26:34
  Yeah.
• 26:35
  So my gosh, I had to remind myself and I did this in jujitsu.
• 26:37
  Like, this is the worst I'll ever be like right now.
• 26:40
  And like the first containment situation, I'm like, all right, all right, I'm going to just do the best that I can.
• 26:45
  Like, I just like, you know, like, and it's just like, if I'm doing the best that I can, okay, cool.
• 26:49
  But like, I think like, like, for me, like making sure that I'm able to control what I can control in that moment.
• 26:58
  And I think, yeah, yeah, that's interesting.
• 27:05
  So you're a coach, you know, you give advice often or you help people, maybe not give advice, but you help people.
• 27:12
  You show them how to move forward.
• 27:14
  There's a lot of men who are considering doing this work.
• 27:18
  What would you say to those men, Christian?
• 27:20
  oh my gosh, you have to get involved with whatever Alex is doing here because it's absolutely unreal.
• 27:24
  And the Lord's hands on it, it's divine.
• 27:26
  Like these people are the right people coming in and he's got the frameworks and like we can heal and restore like families and couples.
• 27:33
  And like, well, the work that you're doing is absolutely amazing.
• 27:35
  And every man needs to go through this.
• 27:37
  And like, they should go through it like as a young man between like 10 and 14, you know, like just like get this information that we need.
• 27:44
  Like that would like change the next generation because us as men, like...
• 27:47
  we lead the charge.
• 27:48
  And so like, absolutely get involved.
• 27:50
  Like you have to be involved.
• 27:51
  Like it's the coolest thing ever.
• 27:52
  The brotherhood, the people involved, like you can't not, like, I don't know what you're doing if you don't get involved because it's the best thing ever.
• 27:58
  And like, in order to develop a relationship and to like, honestly, I feel like so many people want, like men want that emotional side.
• 28:05
  And this is what will like give you the tools to actually like know what to do in those moments.
• 28:10
  And like, so many men need that.
• 28:11
  Like we can grin and bear a lot, but like to have that tool and to be able to know how to,
• 28:16
  make your wife and people around you feel safe and to have control of your nervous system, like we'll change.
• 28:21
  Yeah.
• 28:22
  It's the best spent time that you could spend.
• 28:23
  So yes, please.
• 28:25
  You have to Alex is the man.
• 28:28
  I appreciate you, Christian.
• 28:29
  I want to ask it in a different way and just maybe a men will hear it in a different way.
• 28:34
  If you think back to Christian before you were in this program and you can think of your prior self, what would you have said to yourself now that you know what you know?
• 28:44
  Yeah.
• 28:45
  Christian, like it's not all hope isn't gone.
• 28:48
  Like you might feel like they're like with how long you've been.
• 28:50
  Like it's not like even if it feels like too far gone, it's not like like I would say that because I feel like there's so many days that I was just like, oh, man, and I'm failing and I'm this and I'm that and I'm trying all these things and it's not working.
• 29:01
  So I would just like encourage myself in that.
• 29:03
  Like, hey, like you're doing the work and like fine.
• 29:06
  Yeah, you're you're fine.
• 29:09
  continue because you're going to find the right thing that will actually make the difference.
• 29:13
  And yeah, I would just tell them that like, you are capable and like, you can have that relationship that you do desire with your wife and you, you, you, you are responsible for that too.
• 29:24
  Because I feel like if like saying that, honestly, just making sure that I know that it's not, it's not up to her, it's up to me.
• 29:29
  And just, I think, yeah, I would say those things for sure.
• 29:38
  It has been an honor to work with you.
• 29:40
  It was an honor to have you in the first container.
• 29:42
  It was such an honor to watch your growth and to watch you apply these tactics, these strategies and like really, I mean, take them seriously is not strong enough.
• 29:50
  It's like you really just dove in headfirst and said, I'm going to do this and trust and you're just a massive inspiration for me.
• 29:59
  And I know the men you've talked to, you're a massive inspiration for them.
• 30:03
  So thank you for being here, Christian, and for sharing this time with me today, man.
• 30:07
  Thank you, Alex.
• 30:07
  You're the man.
• 30:08
  I appreciate you so much.
• 30:09
  And so thankful to be here and have this conversation and so excited to continue to see how you change men and families' lives with the brotherhood because it's going to do, yeah, it's going to really change a lot of trajectories of some families and lives.
• 30:21
  So, so, so stoked and so thankful to be here, brother.
• 30:24
  Thank you, man.
• 30:25
  If you are listening to this podcast and you relate to some of what Christian was saying, and maybe you're in that place where you have a disconnected relationship or you're feeling like roommates or maybe you're blowing up with your kids or any of the things that Christian brought up, go to thebrotherhoodsociety.com.
• 30:41
  And if we're in an interview process, sign up for the next interview.
• 30:44
  And if we're not, sign up for the wait list.
• 30:45
  We'll get some information out to you.
• 30:47
  I'd be honored to walk this path with you.
• 30:49
  and have you in the next brotherhood container.
• 30:51
  And Christian, I just want to sincerely say, man, I love you, brother.
• 30:54
  Absolutely brothers for life.
• 30:56
  Thank you so much for today.
• 30:57
  Thank you so much for the inspiration while we were working together and the inspiration that you continue to give me as I follow you on Instagram and watch all your successes and watch you and your family.
• 31:07
  You just, you look like a guy who's living life and loving everything, and it's so much fun to watch.
• 31:13
  And thank you for listening.
• 31:14
  Hit the subscribe button.
• 31:15
  Leave us a comment below.
• 31:17
  If you have a question, we'd love to answer it.
• 31:19
  Thank you, everybody.