Latest / The MeatEater Podcast / Ep. 933: Ask Me Anything with Steven Rinella

Transcript

Ep. 933: Ask Me Anything with Steven Rinella · The MeatEater Podcast

• 0:04
  Speaker 1: Welcome to the news show, everybody. But this ain't your
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: normal news show.
• 0:07
  Speaker 2: What this is, is a, this is a ask me
• 0:10
  Speaker 2: and ask me anything thing. Cause we get, so through
• 0:15
  Speaker 2: the interview show, the meat eater podcast, the interview show
• 0:18
  Speaker 2: and the news show, um, and through all the books
• 0:21
  Speaker 2: we do and videos we make, we get all these questions, um,
• 0:25
  Speaker 2: from listeners like you or viewers like you were readers
• 0:29
  Speaker 2: like you, and we never have enough time to get
• 0:31
  Speaker 2: to them all. Um, so, um, Now and then in
• 0:34
  Speaker 2: different ways, we will try to tackle the problem of
• 0:37
  Speaker 2: just answering questions. And so we've gone to all the
• 0:41
  Speaker 2: normal places to get questions. I don't know, just questions
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: that come in over email. Questions in comment sections, questions
• 0:54
  Speaker 2: in reviews, just questions from all over the place. We
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: even solicited questions and questions came in. Pulled questions from,
• 1:01
  Speaker 2: like questions from Online debates and forums and things. And
• 1:06
  Speaker 2: we got a whole bunch. We're going to start with
• 1:08
  Speaker 2: the questions.
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: First question.
• 1:10
  Speaker 2: You're delivering these questions is our very own Nate Mason.
• 1:15
  Speaker 3: First question.
• 1:16
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 1:17
  Speaker 3: Do you still have that scat coffee table? If so,
• 1:21
  Speaker 3: what's your dream specimen to put in there?
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: I do not have and have not had for a
• 1:26
  Speaker 2: long time my scat coffee table.
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: What the question refers to is.
• 1:33
  Speaker 2: Some years ago, I had this big coffee table and
• 1:36
  Speaker 2: I put a lip around it and got a piece
• 1:37
  Speaker 2: of glass cut for it. And I painted it yellow,
• 1:40
  Speaker 2: like the national geographic binder yellow on the old magazines.
• 1:45
  Speaker 2: And I just filled it with every kind of animal
• 1:47
  Speaker 2: scale I could find. I had great specimens. I had
• 1:50
  Speaker 2: like a coyote that shat out a deer hoof. I
• 1:53
  Speaker 2: had all, just all kinds of stuff. Um, the problem
• 1:56
  Speaker 2: I found is even if you dried them and lacquered them,
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: they would still just corrode and just got hard to maintain. Um,
• 2:03
  Speaker 2: but like black bears eating grass, black bears eating pine nuts,
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: grizzlies eating grass, grizzlies eating pine nuts. The one specimen
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: that maybe would have had me keep it alive is
• 2:14
  Speaker 2: I was reading years ago, this, this biologist, I think
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: his name is Michael Faye. And he did this thing
• 2:20
  Speaker 2: called a mega transect where he did this big transect
• 2:22
  Speaker 2: across the Congo. And for a while he had this
• 2:25
  Speaker 2: journalist with him. And this journalist was talking about finding
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: a leopard. where the leopard had shat out a chimp's finger.
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: If I remember right. If I had that and found it,
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: it can't be like given to me. If I found that,
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: I would go make me a whole new scat table
• 2:51
  Speaker 2: and just put that in there. Got it. Be the
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: only thing in there.
• 2:56
  Speaker 3: Where did the scat table depart your life relative to
• 3:00
  Speaker 3: your current wife meeting you?
• 3:04
  Speaker 2: Long before it just became a logistics thing because i
• 3:07
  Speaker 2: used to just roam around like when i was starting
• 3:09
  Speaker 2: out as a young writer i didn't have a permanent
• 3:12
  Speaker 2: place of residence for the most part and so it
• 3:14
  Speaker 2: just became an issue of of the same reason i
• 3:18
  Speaker 2: never have like shoulder taxidermy done it's still from that
• 3:22
  Speaker 2: era of just being worried about things that were hard
• 3:26
  Speaker 2: to move and so it wasn't like It wasn't like
• 3:28
  Speaker 2: I burned it and had a ceremony. It was just
• 3:31
  Speaker 2: that it became hard to move, and I have no
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: idea where it winded up. I probably, almost certainly, it
• 3:36
  Speaker 2: went to a Goodwill. But I don't even remember doing it.
• 3:40
  Speaker 2: I'm sure I would have emptied it, shop-backed it out,
• 3:43
  Speaker 2: and brought it to a Goodwill.
• 3:44
  Speaker 1: I have no idea what happened to it. I'd love
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: to have it.
• 3:46
  Speaker 2: If anybody has it, I'll buy it back for what
• 3:49
  Speaker 2: you have into it. Matter of fact, I'll double what
• 3:54
  Speaker 2: you have into it.
• 3:55
  Speaker 1: If I can get it back. You'll know it's yellow
• 3:57
  Speaker 1: glass top. Got it.
• 4:00
  Speaker 3: Next question. Any regrets turning your passion into your career?
• 4:05
  Speaker 3: Did you have reservations when you started down this path?
• 4:09
  Speaker 1: No.
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: And I'm getting into the asker's head a little bit
• 4:14
  Speaker 2: when I guess. I'm guessing what they picture is that
• 4:18
  Speaker 2: they picture that my passion was outdoor stuff. hunting, fishing, trapping, whatever.
• 4:28
  Speaker 2: I'm guessing they're referring to that and not that my
• 4:30
  Speaker 2: passion was writing. So the thing I would ask myself,
• 4:36
  Speaker 2: and it's a reasonable question, is be like, what industry
• 4:38
  Speaker 2: are you in?
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: You know, and be like, I don't know. Am I
• 4:43
  Speaker 1: in the outdoor industry?
• 4:45
  Speaker 2: Sure, maybe.
• 4:46
  Speaker 1: Am I in the media business? Sure, maybe. Am I
• 4:50
  Speaker 1: a writer? Sure, maybe. Like, you know what I mean?
• 4:53
  Speaker 1: So what I'm guessing is they.
• 4:55
  Speaker 2: No one would say like, were you ever nervous about
• 4:58
  Speaker 2: turning your passion of writing into an occupation? Because in
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: my mind, being a writer means you make your money
• 5:05
  Speaker 2: from writing.
• 5:07
  Speaker 1: Probably meaning the outdoor stuff. No, not at all. I
• 5:10
  Speaker 1: get that question.
• 5:11
  Speaker 2: And I have people, my older half brother, Frank, he
• 5:13
  Speaker 2: was a big hunter and he became a big game
• 5:15
  Speaker 2: guide and he became a game warden. It ruined hunting
• 5:22
  Speaker 2: for him for many years. When he was a game warden,
• 5:26
  Speaker 2: what do you think he's doing on opening day? And
• 5:31
  Speaker 2: it was like he later realized I sort of thought
• 5:34
  Speaker 2: I was pursuing hunting as a thing, and I got
• 5:37
  Speaker 2: to where I wasn't. So it's a thing that happens.
• 5:42
  Speaker 2: I've never felt that way. I don't know what else.
• 5:44
  Speaker 2: I do know what else I'd be doing, and I'd
• 5:46
  Speaker 2: rather do this.
• 5:47
  Speaker 3: Well, that's the next question. If Meat Eater had never
• 5:49
  Speaker 3: happened and Riding didn't put food on the table, what
• 5:52
  Speaker 3: would you be doing for a living right now?
• 5:53
  Speaker 1: Well, that's two... Even that's two separate different things.
• 5:59
  Speaker 2: Had I not built Meat Eater, along with many other people,
• 6:05
  Speaker 2: had I not built Meat Eater, I'd be a writer.
• 6:07
  Speaker 2: If I hadn't become a writer, I'd probably have a tree.
• 6:11
  Speaker 2: I guess I'd probably wind up having my own tree service.
• 6:15
  Speaker 2: I'd probably run a tree service. If writing was.
• 6:19
  Speaker 1: Out, because that's what.
• 6:20
  Speaker 2: I was doing as I was becoming a writer and
• 6:23
  Speaker 2: I had a side gig, and my side gig became
• 6:26
  Speaker 2: less and less vital. It was tree work. So it's
• 6:32
  Speaker 2: so hard to say, but I got into true part
• 6:33
  Speaker 2: of getting in the tree work was, it was a
• 6:35
  Speaker 2: thing that you could move away from.
• 6:37
  Speaker 1: Meal for a long time.
• 6:39
  Speaker 2: I worked during the summer really hard and save money
• 6:43
  Speaker 2: so that I could trap all fall.
• 6:45
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 6:45
  Speaker 2: And getting into tree work, part of getting into tree
• 6:48
  Speaker 2: work was the, the nature of the industry allowed you
• 6:53
  Speaker 2: to have big chunks of time to hunt or whatever. Um,
• 6:56
  Speaker 2: and then when I was ending being in tree work, my,
• 7:00
  Speaker 2: the guy that owned the tree service that I worked
• 7:03
  Speaker 2: for was a writer who was also writing. So for
• 7:07
  Speaker 2: us to get done at noon or one was great.
• 7:09
  Speaker 2: Cause we'd go home, take a nap, wake up, have
• 7:13
  Speaker 2: a cup of coffee and do our writing deals in
• 7:16
  Speaker 2: separate places. And in the morning we'd get up and
• 7:19
  Speaker 2: do trees. It's also entangled, you know, but yeah, maybe,
• 7:24
  Speaker 2: maybe tree work. I was interested in millwright work for
• 7:27
  Speaker 2: a while, but probably tree work. Steve's Tree Service.
• 7:32
  Speaker 3: Were you guys doing big insurance jobs?
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: Man, we did it all.
• 7:36
  Speaker 2: We did city contracts. One year we did 300 Boulevard
• 7:41
  Speaker 2: Maples in the University District of Missoula. We'd also do
• 7:44
  Speaker 2: big removals, insurance work, hazard stuff, down stuff. pruning family
• 7:51
  Speaker 2: shade trees. We did everything.
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: Our specialty was stuff you couldn't get a bucket to.
• 7:55
  Speaker 2: Yep.
• 7:56
  Speaker 1: You climbed?
• 7:56
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I was a climber and our specialty was like
• 7:59
  Speaker 2: non-bucket work. So hard to get to stuff. But we'd
• 8:06
  Speaker 2: get a bucket if we needed it. Yeah.
• 8:09
  Speaker 3: We'll stop on the tree work stuff. But staying on
• 8:13
  Speaker 3: the book writing and career advice, someone wrote in, Given
• 8:18
  Speaker 3: current and future AI advances, would you consider a career
• 8:21
  Speaker 3: in writing obsolete? If someone has written for magazines and
• 8:25
  Speaker 3: a how-to book and wants to be a full-time writer
• 8:28
  Speaker 3: after retiring in five to ten years, has that window closed?
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: Depends. Huge depends.
• 8:35
  Speaker 2: If you're the kind of writer who generates... This is
• 8:39
  Speaker 2: an observation. This is a pre-AI observation from a writer
• 8:44
  Speaker 2: friend of mine. who would always laugh about that every
• 8:48
  Speaker 2: year in July or whatever, you'd see these articles in magazines,
• 8:53
  Speaker 2: these kind of listicles, we call them. And it would
• 8:55
  Speaker 2: be how to beat the heat this summer. And every
• 9:00
  Speaker 2: year it comes back. It's just a perpetual article. How
• 9:04
  Speaker 2: to beat the heat this summer or stuff like that.
• 9:08
  Speaker 2: If that's what you're writing, your world is tough. If
• 9:11
  Speaker 2: that's what you're writing, your world is tough. But the
• 9:13
  Speaker 2: thing to always keep in mind about AI, which I
• 9:15
  Speaker 2: think is interesting, is that AI can only draw from
• 9:19
  Speaker 2: what's in the internet, right? Like AI can't draw from
• 9:24
  Speaker 2: things that aren't in the internet. The moment after President
• 9:30
  Speaker 2: Trump was shot in the ear in Butler, Pennsylvania, like
• 9:33
  Speaker 2: in that moment, AI didn't know.
• 9:38
  Speaker 1: Who knew? Witnesses, right? And then it gets fed in
• 9:42
  Speaker 1: and now there's an AI version. But in the moment,
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: there's not. Breaking news will always be that way. Last night,
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: here's something that there will be no AI overview of.
• 9:56
  Speaker 1: AI could not write this article. Last night, yesterday in
• 9:59
  Speaker 1: the middle of the night. of the day, I had
• 10:01
  Speaker 1: to run a bear out of my garage. I'm in
• 10:04
  Speaker 1: my house, middle of the day, and I hear something
• 10:06
  Speaker 1: like crashing around in the garage, and I go out,
• 10:08
  Speaker 1: and there's a bear in there, and I run him out,
• 10:11
  Speaker 1: and all this little adventure happened. And then, later that day,
• 10:15
  Speaker 1: he's in my neighbor's garage. And I'm kind of.
• 10:19
  Speaker 2: get involved and involve myself in that. This doesn't exist.
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: This doesn't exist on the internet, right? So it depends
• 10:31
  Speaker 2: what kind of writer you are. It's bad for a
• 10:34
  Speaker 2: lot of kind of writers. It's not intimidating to me.
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: It's not intimidating to me because I deal largely in,
• 10:46
  Speaker 2: I deal a lot in things that haven't happened yet.
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: As they're happening.
• 10:50
  Speaker 2: And I deal a lot in things where they've already happened, but,
• 10:54
  Speaker 2: but I have a spin on it or I have
• 10:57
  Speaker 2: a take on it. That isn't going to be matched
• 11:00
  Speaker 2: by something as it currently exists. I can smell AI
• 11:04
  Speaker 2: writing a mile away. And not only that, it gets duped.
• 11:07
  Speaker 2: We keep talking about just doing something for fun is
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: just making fake legislation and then watching. And it'll be
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: 24 hours later, 36 hours later. fake legislation will be
• 11:18
  Speaker 2: in the AI overview, right? I've seen it happen with
• 11:21
  Speaker 2: fake wildlife news. It's in the AI overview. And you'd
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: be like, where'd it come from? It came from this
• 11:26
  Speaker 2: fake thing that was intentionally written to be fake. So no,
• 11:31
  Speaker 2: not for me. Like it doesn't intimidate me, but there's
• 11:33
  Speaker 2: some people I think you should be very afraid, you know?
• 11:36
  Speaker 2: Like if you write broadhead reviews, for instance, or sprinkler reviews,
• 11:46
  Speaker 2: that's the worst situation.
• 11:49
  Speaker 3: The folks I feel real bad for are food bloggers.
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: I don't know enough about that.
• 11:57
  Speaker 3: When I asked chat GPT, how many ads gives me
• 12:00
  Speaker 3: exactly what I need.
• 12:02
  Speaker 2: Oh, I understand.
• 12:04
  Speaker 3: Good. On the topic of AI, we at meat eater,
• 12:09
  Speaker 3: and this is, this is formed as a question. We
• 12:12
  Speaker 3: at MeatEater criticize the way data centers are being rolled
• 12:15
  Speaker 3: out and their impact on natural resources. Then we go
• 12:19
  Speaker 3: and run an AI ad. How do you think about
• 12:23
  Speaker 3: that conflict? It's even worse than this person thinks. Think
• 12:26
  Speaker 3: about it like this.
• 12:27
  Speaker 2: Not only is there an ad, think about we, a
• 12:30
  Speaker 2: couple years ago, went to Cornell to meet the people
• 12:35
  Speaker 2: who built the Bird App Merlin. And I use the
• 12:39
  Speaker 2: Bird App Merlin all the time. So we've, and I've
• 12:42
  Speaker 2: promoted it as one of my favorite apps.
• 12:46
  Speaker 1: Buddy, that's AI. Okay.
• 12:50
  Speaker 2: The other day we were out camping and we're troubleshooting, um,
• 12:54
  Speaker 2: a solar device, like an off grid solar device. Oh yeah.
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: And there's a component. I'm like, can't figure out what
• 13:02
  Speaker 2: the component does. How's it supposed to be configured? Through
• 13:07
  Speaker 2: a Starlink connection, we were able to go to chat,
• 13:10
  Speaker 2: take a photo of it, and through chat GPT, find
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: out not only what the component, but everything we need
• 13:16
  Speaker 2: to know about the component out in the woods.
• 13:18
  Speaker 1: And fixed. Okay.
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: It's not stoppable. What I think the argument is, is
• 13:26
  Speaker 2: the argument is, how are we going to do this?
• 13:29
  Speaker 2: How are we going to approach the infrastructure? Are we
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: going to approach it thoughtfully?
• 13:32
  Speaker 3: Okay.
• 13:34
  Speaker 1: And are the.
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: Users, the user base, the communities, the nation, are we
• 13:39
  Speaker 2: going to force these enterprises into doing things in a
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: way that might not be the most expedient, but might
• 13:46
  Speaker 2: be the most sustainable.
• 13:50
  Speaker 1: And long-term, most pragmatic approaches?
• 13:53
  Speaker 2: Meaning, maybe it's easier to go buy land, to go
• 13:58
  Speaker 2: buy grasslands, And there's a bunch of water being unused.
• 14:03
  Speaker 2: Maybe that's easier. Maybe that's more politically expedient, whatever, in
• 14:07
  Speaker 2: some region. Maybe the answer is to really focus heavily
• 14:12
  Speaker 2: on decayed industrial sites.
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: Okay?
• 14:18
  Speaker 2: Offline factories. They're pulling out coal-fired generator plants. Have been
• 14:24
  Speaker 2: pulling out, like the one where I grew up, the
• 14:26
  Speaker 2: coal-fired generator plant where I grew up is gone now.
• 14:30
  Speaker 2: Maybe it should be sites like that. Well, that's really expensive. Okay,
• 14:33
  Speaker 2: maybe that's the way it needs to go. So like,
• 14:35
  Speaker 2: you're not, AI is not going away. I'm not going
• 14:38
  Speaker 2: to stop. I'm going to use it. But I think
• 14:44
  Speaker 2: pressure needs to apply to get it to go the
• 14:46
  Speaker 2: right way. The same way I use oil, but at
• 14:48
  Speaker 2: times I've been critical of the oil industry and how
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: they approach their business. In terms of just like the
• 14:54
  Speaker 2: ad thing, a lot of that is exceedingly complicated and
• 15:02
  Speaker 2: what what is normally the case is when you use
• 15:04
  Speaker 2: platforms youtube wherever you distribute um you use platforms and
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: you don't have a lot of say over you don't
• 15:15
  Speaker 2: have a lot of say over what or virtual or
• 15:17
  Speaker 2: no say like over what's done if i'm a big
• 15:21
  Speaker 2: kirby or enthusiasm fan if i'm watching curb your enthusiasm
• 15:25
  Speaker 2: highlights on youtube and i see a youtube ad pop
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: up i don't think to myself oh larry david must
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: love this company he doesn't have anything to do with
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: it you have some say in what we call pe
• 15:38
  Speaker 2: so like personally endorsed ads on podcasts you have a
• 15:44
  Speaker 2: say in it and and i try to exert a
• 15:46
  Speaker 2: level of control and discipline about doing that then you
• 15:50
  Speaker 2: run into the question of um Doing the work I do,
• 15:56
  Speaker 2: making the products we make, it's expensive. It requires people.
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: It's like an occupation. People have to be paid. You
• 16:04
  Speaker 2: can't run, this doesn't run on goodwill. So we need
• 16:10
  Speaker 2: to be able to monetize the things or else they die, right?
• 16:14
  Speaker 1: So yeah, it's a constant debate.
• 16:16
  Speaker 2: And at times, I will, not at times, every week,
• 16:23
  Speaker 2: I turned down many ads that I don't feel comfortable
• 16:27
  Speaker 2: with every week and basically throw away, you know, big
• 16:34
  Speaker 2: chunks of money because I'm like, ah, I don't want
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: to do that. I can't do that. Yeah.
• 16:41
  Speaker 3: That tension gets to a question. Someone asked of what
• 16:47
  Speaker 3: does it actually look like practicing a land ethic when
• 16:50
  Speaker 3: you have the tension of those commercial interests? And the
• 16:57
  Speaker 3: commitment to conservation that you have, is it something at
• 17:00
  Speaker 3: meat eater scale today? Is it something concrete that you
• 17:03
  Speaker 3: give up or is it just a way we think
• 17:05
  Speaker 3: about doing business?
• 17:08
  Speaker 2: Man, it's so hard to say. It's hard to answer
• 17:11
  Speaker 2: because it occurs at so many levels. Like just take
• 17:13
  Speaker 2: like something like a very basic level would be that
• 17:18
  Speaker 2: within the meat eater family of brands, there is first light,
• 17:24
  Speaker 2: the technical, hunting and fishing apparel company. First light sits
• 17:28
  Speaker 2: within the meat eater family of brands. Um, they make camo. Okay.
• 17:33
  Speaker 2: Camo clothes. They, we make camo clothes. So 1% of
• 17:38
  Speaker 2: all camo sales go to conservation organizations. So you'd be like,
• 17:43
  Speaker 2: does it, you know, when they're saying like the cost,
• 17:48
  Speaker 2: it's a cost just right off the top. Right. But
• 17:53
  Speaker 2: I don't know. Maybe some people see that, maybe some
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: people see that and they're like, well, I want to
• 17:59
  Speaker 2: buy from them because they support these things. I don't
• 18:05
  Speaker 2: know how that balances out. Other things is, is I
• 18:09
  Speaker 2: build in, I try to build in a conservation ethic
• 18:13
  Speaker 2: and build in serious conversations into things to educate listeners
• 18:18
  Speaker 2: and viewers about things that matter to them, probably at a,
• 18:23
  Speaker 2: at a, at a, at times a personal cost. And
• 18:26
  Speaker 2: at times a cost to the private performance of our materials.
• 18:30
  Speaker 2: People hate when things like get political, but in my view,
• 18:36
  Speaker 2: everything is political like it or not fishing, hunting, national parks,
• 18:42
  Speaker 2: national forest.
• 18:43
  Speaker 1: They're political.
• 18:45
  Speaker 2: When, when, when, how many, when the minimum size of
• 18:49
  Speaker 2: a large mouth bass that you can keep goes from
• 18:51
  Speaker 2: 12 inches to 14 inches as happened when I was
• 18:54
  Speaker 2: growing up in Michigan. That is political because governors are
• 18:58
  Speaker 2: political figures. Governors get elected. Governors appoint people. Governors influence commissions.
• 19:03
  Speaker 2: Like there's no part of life that isn't political. Listeners,
• 19:07
  Speaker 2: viewers generally hate it, but I'm like, you have to
• 19:11
  Speaker 2: understand this kind of stuff. I try to bake in
• 19:16
  Speaker 2: like my operating thesis on videos and stuff is I
• 19:18
  Speaker 2: like to go like 80% entertainment, 20% like, like, conservation messaging.
• 19:24
  Speaker 2: I think a lot of people could do without it,
• 19:27
  Speaker 2: but I insist on doing it. If you came and
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: told me, if you were some kind of, if you
• 19:33
  Speaker 2: were really good at metrics and audience assessment, and you
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: came and said, listen, man, the whole conservation messaging thing
• 19:43
  Speaker 2: bores people, your material would all do better if it
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: wasn't in there. Your material would do better if you
• 19:48
  Speaker 2: never had political figures on because they're too divisive. Your
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: material would do better if you never pointed out ways
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: in which certain sections of the community might be behaving
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: in a way that brings down everybody else or whatever.
• 20:01
  Speaker 1: Don't do any of that.
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: I'd say I still feel like I have to do that.
• 20:05
  Speaker 2: I still feel like I have to do that because
• 20:06
  Speaker 2: I think it's important to do that.
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: So yeah, it's like.
• 20:11
  Speaker 2: Money, another thing is I serve on boards of conservation organizations,
• 20:23
  Speaker 2: which is a time thing. We donate huge amounts of
• 20:27
  Speaker 2: money to things. We raise money for things. We do
• 20:29
  Speaker 2: like our auction house of oddities and all kinds of
• 20:31
  Speaker 2: other fundraisers, our punt gun project, always to donate and
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: feed into conservation groups. It's just a lot. And then
• 20:37
  Speaker 2: there's always the feeling that you didn't get enough done.
• 20:40
  Speaker 2: I suffer from that all the time, the feeling you
• 20:42
  Speaker 2: didn't get enough done. And I think that is the,
• 20:44
  Speaker 2: that is the difference between like.com and.org.
• 20:47
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 20:47
  Speaker 2: Like I serve in a, in a sort of.com space,
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: you know? Uh, and I think that some people may
• 20:56
  Speaker 2: be drift toward.org or drift toward nonprofit work to alleviate
• 21:01
  Speaker 2: some of that tension, but nonprofit work wouldn't produce what
• 21:05
  Speaker 2: I produce.
• 21:07
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 21:10
  Speaker 1: All the history works.
• 21:10
  Speaker 2: We do you know i mean like yeah it's a
• 21:13
  Speaker 2: great question it's something i think about all the time
• 21:16
  Speaker 2: like i feel generally really good about where we're at
• 21:18
  Speaker 2: but i could feel better.
• 21:22
  Speaker 3: That raises a question on the political people that we
• 21:26
  Speaker 3: highlight or that we talk about in positive or negative
• 21:29
  Speaker 3: ways yeah and this is generated from the comment section
• 21:33
  Speaker 3: i think from spotify and a listener called our interview
• 21:37
  Speaker 3: with senator heinrich one of the best shows and says
• 21:40
  Speaker 3: sportsman must back politician who value wild places. And on
• 21:43
  Speaker 3: the same show and the five-star review on the same show,
• 21:46
  Speaker 3: you have a one-star review and says, uh, this listener
• 21:49
  Speaker 3: said the show has become about another elite lib and
• 21:52
  Speaker 3: he's quit over it. And you can't satisfy both. Who
• 21:56
  Speaker 3: do you think you're making the show for? Like, how
• 21:58
  Speaker 3: do you think about the tension from both sides?
• 22:02
  Speaker 2: I'm definitely not making the show for like Republicans and
• 22:04
  Speaker 2: I'm definitely not making it for Democrats.
• 22:08
  Speaker 3: No.
• 22:09
  Speaker 2: Um, if I have, I'm mindful of those two terms
• 22:18
  Speaker 2: and over time, anytime we have a political politician on, um,
• 22:25
  Speaker 2: people will just look at that, that single thing. And
• 22:28
  Speaker 2: they don't do with any awareness about the broader work
• 22:30
  Speaker 2: that we do or the long-term thing. And they'll, they'll
• 22:32
  Speaker 2: fixate on that. So I have a Republican on who
• 22:35
  Speaker 2: likes to hunt or works in conservation issues. Um, or
• 22:39
  Speaker 2: works against conservation issues, and I feel like people should
• 22:41
  Speaker 2: understand where this guy's coming from, people will see that
• 22:44
  Speaker 2: and it's like, oh, it's a Republican thing. They're not
• 22:47
  Speaker 2: aware that over the long stretch of time, it's very even.
• 22:52
  Speaker 2: It is very even across the Republican-Democrat political divide over
• 22:56
  Speaker 2: the long period of time.
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: It will remain so. It will remain so. No one
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: is interested in doing this.
• 23:07
  Speaker 2: But if you really went and looked at the partisan
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: thing over the history of the show, I pride on
• 23:13
  Speaker 2: how even it is.
• 23:16
  Speaker 1: So I'm aware. Who's it for? Who's the show? Who
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: am I making it for?
• 23:20
  Speaker 2: I want to make it that people can make informed decisions.
• 23:26
  Speaker 2: That people can make informed decisions about what's going on.
• 23:30
  Speaker 2: And so I'll bring on political figures. A thing I
• 23:34
  Speaker 2: don't do generally, I don't endorse. I grew, during the
• 23:45
  Speaker 2: Biden administration, I grew, in hindsight, no, not at all.
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: I grew very disillusioned.
• 23:57
  Speaker 2: With the Biden administration, particularly around how something that was
• 24:03
  Speaker 2: plainly in view for a long time him becoming senile.
• 24:10
  Speaker 2: And I don't hold it against him. Buddy, if you
• 24:14
  Speaker 2: don't die tragically and young, that's going to happen, okay? So, like,
• 24:19
  Speaker 2: the degree to which it was so apparent that it
• 24:22
  Speaker 2: was happening, and it was unclear who was calling the shots,
• 24:27
  Speaker 2: and then you had these people hiding that fact. I
• 24:31
  Speaker 2: grew very, very, very angry with the Biden administration, and
• 24:35
  Speaker 2: I would make Not even cracks.
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: I would like point it out.
• 24:39
  Speaker 2: Um, I think that led a lot of people to
• 24:42
  Speaker 2: think that I was in a certain place that I
• 24:44
  Speaker 2: wasn't politically necessarily, because that was to me like a,
• 24:49
  Speaker 2: like a fundamental sin of the political class was carrying
• 24:53
  Speaker 2: that on, um, for him to hand off for him to,
• 24:58
  Speaker 2: to prolong to the point where they were handing off
• 25:03
  Speaker 2: a nomination. instead of holding a primary, how intentional was that?
• 25:09
  Speaker 2: Like I was disillusioned with the Biden administration. So then
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: out of that came this narrative to like, oh, you know,
• 25:15
  Speaker 2: he's right wing of a till of the hunt. And
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: he turned around and like a day later, you have
• 25:20
  Speaker 2: a day later, you have a guy like Heinrich on
• 25:24
  Speaker 2: who I'm friends with and hunt with.
• 25:26
  Speaker 1: And I'm like, and I'm left, you know.
• 25:29
  Speaker 2: I'm left of AOC. Because no one wants to look
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: at the totality of anything. They just want to go
• 25:37
  Speaker 2: off some little thing. And the people bringing this up
• 25:39
  Speaker 2: are often haven't listened to the show. You typically look
• 25:43
  Speaker 2: and you're like, you saw a social media promo and
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: you don't know anything that was said. I see Rogan
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: go through this all the time. Like people judge Joe
• 25:52
  Speaker 2: Rogan on who he has on, not what is said.
• 25:56
  Speaker 2: And so I don't know, like I'm like a stop
• 26:00
  Speaker 2: doing what I do.
• 26:03
  Speaker 3: Let's go to another. Very heated topic. Crossbows. Why does
• 26:09
  Speaker 3: the crossbow draw so much ire inside the archery world?
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: I've thought about this a great deal.
• 26:14
  Speaker 2: And I'll take a crack at the crossbow.
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: Not a crack.
• 26:20
  Speaker 2: Like, well, funny I said it because you taking a
• 26:23
  Speaker 2: crack at something in our vernacular would be that you
• 26:25
  Speaker 2: shot something. This is the honest to God truth. It
• 26:29
  Speaker 2: surprises me because I haven't deliberately gone out to do it.
• 26:31
  Speaker 2: I've never shot a crossbow, which kind of blows my mind.
• 26:35
  Speaker 2: I've never fired a crossbow, and not because I've been
• 26:38
  Speaker 2: trying not to. I never watched the movie Titanic. And
• 26:43
  Speaker 2: at a point, I didn't watch it because I didn't
• 26:47
  Speaker 2: watch it. I wanted to be like someone that they
• 26:49
  Speaker 2: could study later. Same thing with Dirty Dancing. Never watched it.
• 26:54
  Speaker 2: And then now I make a point not to watch
• 26:56
  Speaker 2: it just to hold true on not watching it. because
• 26:59
  Speaker 2: I just want to preserve a mind that hasn't taken
• 27:02
  Speaker 2: in certain things. Crossbows, dude, never. But here's where they
• 27:06
  Speaker 2: get a rub. Here's why people don't like them. It's
• 27:07
  Speaker 2: because it's so hard to learn to shoot a bow.
• 27:14
  Speaker 2: It takes so much discipline to get good with a bow.
• 27:18
  Speaker 2: It's gotten a lot easier through technology, but it's hard
• 27:21
  Speaker 2: to shoot a bow. And so then there's a bow
• 27:25
  Speaker 2: that's like, bow like but not really a bow and
• 27:28
  Speaker 2: anybody can pick it up and be very accurate burns
• 27:31
  Speaker 2: the ass of people who've done it and then I
• 27:35
  Speaker 2: think another thing that really burned them is when they
• 27:37
  Speaker 2: started referring to bows as vertical bows.
• 27:41
  Speaker 1: Trying to like be like oh no no no it's just.
• 27:43
  Speaker 2: One's vertical and one's horizontal or something I think that
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: was a bad move but but if you're a crossbow
• 27:50
  Speaker 2: person why do you need archers to be happy about
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: it if that's what you like that's what you like
• 27:59
  Speaker 2: and people that point out like in this state we
• 28:01
  Speaker 2: have in montana we have no crossbow season some people
• 28:03
  Speaker 2: say we have no crossbow season that's just not true
• 28:07
  Speaker 2: you can hunt with your crossbow for the six week
• 28:10
  Speaker 2: general season you can absolutely hunt with your crossbow right
• 28:17
  Speaker 2: so um i don't know i don't think you need
• 28:21
  Speaker 2: people like i don't know why they want everyone to
• 28:23
  Speaker 2: like them so much um I like to do a
• 28:26
  Speaker 2: little trap and I don't need people to, to celebrate
• 28:31
  Speaker 2: kind of bears. You know, I don't need them to
• 28:35
  Speaker 2: love them. I like them. They're very effective. I don't
• 28:39
  Speaker 2: need you to love them. So stop worrying about it.
• 28:44
  Speaker 3: Another tool that drives a lot of controversy is a
• 28:49
  Speaker 3: live scope. Another listener wrote in and asked which tool
• 28:53
  Speaker 3: is more effective in its respective role. A spotting scope
• 28:57
  Speaker 3: or live scope?
• 29:00
  Speaker 2: Not even comparable. I mean, absolutely the live scope. A
• 29:06
  Speaker 2: live scope effectively seals the deal on fish.
• 29:10
  Speaker 3: Right?
• 29:11
  Speaker 2: I was out not too long ago out in a boat.
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: I've been fishing for three days without live scope. And
• 29:16
  Speaker 2: then I went out fishing with live scope for a day.
• 29:18
  Speaker 2: And to be able to fish big northerns and pull
• 29:22
  Speaker 2: up to a spot, determine if there's one there or not,
• 29:26
  Speaker 2: So now you just know that he's there. And then
• 29:28
  Speaker 2: when you present baits to figure out what he's responding
• 29:31
  Speaker 2: to or not responding to and knowing when to stop
• 29:34
  Speaker 2: because he's approaching it and knowing when he loses interest
• 29:37
  Speaker 2: and to agitate it. Um, it.
• 29:42
  Speaker 1: It is catching the fish.
• 29:44
  Speaker 2: The angler is, is important to catching the fish as
• 29:48
  Speaker 2: like the barb on a hook or something like live
• 29:50
  Speaker 2: scope is catching the fish. That would piss a lot
• 29:54
  Speaker 2: of LiveScope guys off, including very dear friends of mine
• 29:57
  Speaker 2: who love LiveScope. A spotting scope is like supplementary information.
• 30:02
  Speaker 2: I rarely even find something with a spotting scope. I
• 30:05
  Speaker 2: just scrutinize what I found with my binos with a
• 30:07
  Speaker 2: spotting scope. I don't view it as, like if I
• 30:11
  Speaker 2: left on a trip and I forgot my binos, I'm
• 30:15
  Speaker 2: going back. I don't care how far I got to
• 30:17
  Speaker 2: drive back. If I forget a spotting scope, I'd probably
• 30:20
  Speaker 2: be like, ah, all right. Let's keep going.
• 30:25
  Speaker 3: That sucks, but we're not turning back. So the live
• 30:28
  Speaker 3: scopes more akin to your binos than a spotter.
• 30:33
  Speaker 1: Not even then.
• 30:33
  Speaker 2: Wouldn't be close to binos. Wouldn't be close to binos.
• 30:37
  Speaker 2: It's just like, I've done it. I've been on boats.
• 30:45
  Speaker 1: It is fishing. The machine is doing the fishing. You
• 30:50
  Speaker 1: are a You're like a ride-along.
• 30:57
  Speaker 3: Well, let's ask a question about where you draw the
• 31:00
  Speaker 3: line on hunting. This comes from a guy who lives
• 31:03
  Speaker 3: on 10 rural acres full of hickories, walnuts, oaks, and
• 31:07
  Speaker 3: hundreds of squirrels. I shoot squirrels off my back deck.
• 31:10
  Speaker 3: Am I squirrel hunting?
• 31:11
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 31:11
  Speaker 3: Now apply that to deer over a pile of corn
• 31:14
  Speaker 3: in my backyard. Where's the line for you?
• 31:17
  Speaker 1: For me?
• 31:17
  Speaker 3: Um....
• 31:25
  Speaker 1: I've never, it's never come up for me. I don't
• 31:28
  Speaker 1: see it. It's not a line.
• 31:31
  Speaker 3: I don't know.
• 31:34
  Speaker 1: The dude, he's got 10 acres. He's got all.
• 31:36
  Speaker 2: These squirrels running around and he gets them off.
• 31:38
  Speaker 1: His back deck. Good for him. He's not, he's not
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: like breaking the law, you know?
• 31:43
  Speaker 2: Um, and if you, if you live in a state
• 31:46
  Speaker 2: where you can run bait and you run bait and
• 31:48
  Speaker 2: you get deer, um, great, you're not breaking a law.
• 31:54
  Speaker 2: If that's legal where you're legal and you have good
• 31:57
  Speaker 2: game management system and your game management system determines that
• 32:00
  Speaker 2: that's okay or you're baiting bears to bring bears in,
• 32:04
  Speaker 2: I don't feel that it makes it that they have
• 32:05
  Speaker 2: no avenue of escape. At the same time, if someone
• 32:10
  Speaker 2: raises livestock... And, and they go out to harvest, you know,
• 32:14
  Speaker 2: they go out to kill a hog. They've been fattening.
• 32:17
  Speaker 2: Do I think it's unethical because the hog couldn't get away? No,
• 32:20
  Speaker 2: but it's just, it's just different. Like they wouldn't think
• 32:22
  Speaker 2: of it as hunting. I don't think of it as hunting.
• 32:24
  Speaker 2: So I don't view it. Well, when, when it comes
• 32:31
  Speaker 2: to your own line, there's just things I could point
• 32:33
  Speaker 2: out that I haven't done and they're not appealing to me.
• 32:36
  Speaker 2: I haven't hunted high fence. I've never done high fence hunting.
• 32:40
  Speaker 2: It's not appealing to me. And that pisses people off.
• 32:43
  Speaker 1: Like if you don't do something, it pisses people off.
• 32:46
  Speaker 2: But what oftentimes happens is it pisses off people who
• 32:49
  Speaker 2: are kind of feeling sensitive about it. Or they feel
• 32:54
  Speaker 2: marginalized or they want like a broader level of acceptance
• 32:57
  Speaker 2: for something. So it would irritate people. But I've often
• 32:59
  Speaker 2: heard people go out of their way. Someone sent me
• 33:03
  Speaker 2: something recently where, where like, for instance, like Nugent was
• 33:07
  Speaker 2: on a podcast being somehow like broadcasting a message to me.
• 33:12
  Speaker 2: about that hunting in high fences is just as hard
• 33:15
  Speaker 2: as any, whatever. I don't know. I don't know why
• 33:17
  Speaker 2: it's upsetting. That's not appealing to me. And I know
• 33:21
  Speaker 2: people say like, well, it's some of these areas are
• 33:23
  Speaker 2: so big, you can still get away. It just, it's
• 33:25
  Speaker 2: just not fun. It's not, it's not like an enjoyable
• 33:28
  Speaker 2: thing to me.
• 33:30
  Speaker 1: I like things.
• 33:31
  Speaker 2: I like things that are challenging, but I also oftentimes
• 33:35
  Speaker 2: do hunts that aren't that challenging. you know, like going
• 33:38
  Speaker 2: out on September 15th, hunting squirrels in the beach woods. Um,
• 33:43
  Speaker 2: I know I'm getting squirrels. Any given squirrel out there
• 33:46
  Speaker 2: has an excellent chance of not getting killed of me,
• 33:49
  Speaker 2: not detecting it, of it getting away, but I'm going
• 33:52
  Speaker 2: to get something probably. Um, and you just kind of
• 33:55
  Speaker 2: go through life like that and pick like what you
• 33:58
  Speaker 2: want to go out of your way to do or not. Um,
• 34:01
  Speaker 2: but the biggest thing I tell people on this question
• 34:03
  Speaker 2: is this, people can pick this apart or just kind
• 34:09
  Speaker 2: of accept it at face value. What I'm trying to
• 34:11
  Speaker 2: say is following the regulations as laid out by your state,
• 34:19
  Speaker 2: as a hunter, as an angler, following the regulations is 98.5%.
• 34:23
  Speaker 2: We'll get you 98.5% there on the pathway to like
• 34:26
  Speaker 2: ethical or.
• 34:29
  Speaker 3: Higher.
• 34:37
  Speaker 2: My recommendation, like, don't break the rules. And if your
• 34:40
  Speaker 2: state has rules that don't make sense, take up the issue.
• 34:43
  Speaker 2: But like, stay true to the rules. Most of the rules,
• 34:46
  Speaker 2: there are exceptions. Most of the rules are coming from
• 34:48
  Speaker 2: a well-intentioned place. You want to be an ethical hunter?
• 34:50
  Speaker 2: You want to be an ethical fisherman? Start by, just
• 34:53
  Speaker 2: try to follow the rules. So we talked about things
• 34:59
  Speaker 2: that you're not interested in. Now let's talk about... What
• 35:02
  Speaker 2: am I not interested in?
• 35:03
  Speaker 3: Like, you're not interested in hunting high fence stuff. Personally, no,
• 35:06
  Speaker 3: it doesn't interest me. What are your top five bucket
• 35:09
  Speaker 3: list species that you are very interested in?
• 35:12
  Speaker 1: Man, years ago, I.
• 35:15
  Speaker 2: Was with some Amerindians and we were in Guyana and
• 35:17
  Speaker 2: we got a couple arrows into a tapir. I don't
• 35:22
  Speaker 2: want to get a tapir. I don't need to get
• 35:25
  Speaker 2: a tapir, but I want to be with some dudes
• 35:27
  Speaker 2: that get a tapir.
• 35:31
  Speaker 1: I would like to.
• 35:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah. That's a big one for me. Be with some
• 35:35
  Speaker 2: dudes to get a tape here. I'd like to, uh,
• 35:41
  Speaker 2: what else am I real keen on? Oh, a leopard.
• 35:45
  Speaker 2: I was in Africa a couple of summers ago and
• 35:47
  Speaker 2: we were hunting all kinds of super cool stuff. We
• 35:49
  Speaker 2: spent a lot of time talking about leopards and I
• 35:52
  Speaker 2: saw a leopard. Um, and right now in my mind,
• 35:57
  Speaker 2: I'm very hip, um, doing leopards, which I'll point out
• 36:02
  Speaker 2: is a, baited is a baited hunt you hang carcasses
• 36:07
  Speaker 2: up in trees or portions of carcasses up in trees
• 36:09
  Speaker 2: and try to get a leopard going real excited about
• 36:12
  Speaker 2: that real hip on that so watching some dudes get
• 36:15
  Speaker 2: a tapir and butcher it just a touch of tapir
• 36:17
  Speaker 2: for a minute and a leopard three more and I
• 36:21
  Speaker 2: wouldn't mind trying a capybara with some dudes that hunt
• 36:25
  Speaker 2: capybaras very situational.
• 36:29
  Speaker 3: You mentioned capercaillie the other day Oh, I forgot about that.
• 36:32
  Speaker 2: That's a big one for you. Oh, there's two for years.
• 36:35
  Speaker 2: We've been trying to line out a good Capricali hunt
• 36:37
  Speaker 2: in Northern Europe.
• 36:38
  Speaker 1: And then, um, and then.
• 36:41
  Speaker 2: The oscillated Turkey has been, it's been difficult.
• 36:46
  Speaker 1: I'm working a new lead now.
• 36:48
  Speaker 2: It's been difficult to find a, a reputable place to
• 36:56
  Speaker 2: go hunt oscillated. Turkey's not on ag, but to hunt
• 37:00
  Speaker 2: them in the, In the forest. So not ones that
• 37:03
  Speaker 2: are working ag fields, but like to go out in
• 37:05
  Speaker 2: the raw forest. I don't want to call it jungle,
• 37:09
  Speaker 2: but to go out into the jungle like stuff and hunt.
• 37:13
  Speaker 2: Oscillated turkeys out on native habitat has been hard to find,
• 37:17
  Speaker 2: but hopefully we're getting close.
• 37:20
  Speaker 3: What about fish species? What to catch?
• 37:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 37:23
  Speaker 3: Like what's on your bucket list for fish?
• 37:24
  Speaker 1: Big old she fish. Big old she fish.
• 37:29
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 37:31
  Speaker 2: Here's a good question that came in. Other than Africa, Mexico,
• 37:34
  Speaker 2: and Canada... Oh, and I want to shoot a dog-toothed
• 37:36
  Speaker 2: tuna with a spear gun. Got it.
• 37:41
  Speaker 3: Other than Africa, Mexico, and Canada, which country outside North
• 37:44
  Speaker 3: America would you most like to hunt?
• 37:47
  Speaker 1: Countries.
• 37:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I've spent time in, and I remain very, very
• 37:54
  Speaker 2: interested in spending time in the... Hunting in, fishing in
• 38:01
  Speaker 2: South America in the, particularly in the jungles. So the
• 38:06
  Speaker 2: Amazon basin surrounding areas like that, that kind of like
• 38:09
  Speaker 2: rainforest stuff, but then only like, I'm just interested in
• 38:13
  Speaker 2: doing that with native peoples who do that. Like, that's
• 38:17
  Speaker 2: what I'm interested in outside of those places or in
• 38:21
  Speaker 2: the far North, like in the Arctic hunting with hunting,
• 38:27
  Speaker 2: Marine mammals, whatever with. native hunters who have an ancestral
• 38:32
  Speaker 2: link to the pursuit. Like I don't need to be
• 38:35
  Speaker 2: the guy that pulls the trigger at all, but I just,
• 38:38
  Speaker 2: I like, I like to accompany and be there. Yeah.
• 38:43
  Speaker 3: A question from the email inbox. What's the most maligned
• 38:48
  Speaker 3: animal in North America. That's actually good eating.
• 38:53
  Speaker 2: The one I see people most routinely surprised by is
• 38:56
  Speaker 2: just squirrels firing away. And then it's kind of maligned by,
• 39:00
  Speaker 2: it's not so much maligned by hunters, but it's maligned
• 39:03
  Speaker 2: by just kind of the public, you know? It's like
• 39:06
  Speaker 2: people express like, ugh, squirrels, you know? But just everyone.
• 39:14
  Speaker 2: No one, I've never served like well-prepared, you know, like
• 39:20
  Speaker 2: well-prepared squirrel to anyone that is, I'm not kidding you,
• 39:24
  Speaker 2: to anyone that has ever had a negative reaction to it.
• 39:27
  Speaker 2: it is universally always, God, I can't believe how good
• 39:30
  Speaker 2: that is. Always. Always. And so, yeah, that's definitely it.
• 39:37
  Speaker 3: Someone wrote in, did a lot of you guys grow
• 39:40
  Speaker 3: up hunting squirrels with slingshots? Can we get a slingshot
• 39:42
  Speaker 3: squirrel hunting episode? No.
• 39:45
  Speaker 1: Yes and no. I don't picture making a squirrel hunt and.
• 39:50
  Speaker 2: I don't picture making a squirrel hunting episode about slingshots
• 39:54
  Speaker 2: because I'm not that interested in method of take stuff. Focusing,
• 40:03
  Speaker 2: for me, other guys I work with are into it,
• 40:06
  Speaker 2: but for me, focusing on method of take isn't a
• 40:11
  Speaker 2: big thing for me. It wouldn't be that, if I
• 40:16
  Speaker 2: love to film stuff about turkeys, someone found some novel
• 40:19
  Speaker 2: way to kill a turkey i wouldn't sort of be
• 40:22
  Speaker 2: like oh no no this is about killing a turkey
• 40:24
  Speaker 2: with this novel contraption i just don't view things that
• 40:29
  Speaker 2: way i bow hunt during bow season right but i
• 40:32
  Speaker 2: don't view it like i don't view it as weapon
• 40:35
  Speaker 2: centric weapon centric viewing i've met guys who have a
• 40:39
  Speaker 2: sort of check hunting checklist like i'd like to get
• 40:43
  Speaker 2: a deer with a pistol i'd like to get a
• 40:44
  Speaker 2: deer with a longbow i'd like to get a deer
• 40:46
  Speaker 2: or the crossbow and they just in their mind they're
• 40:48
  Speaker 2: just like mark like how many different ways can i
• 40:50
  Speaker 2: get a deer i'm not down on it i just
• 40:53
  Speaker 2: don't care when we were kids or one of our
• 40:56
  Speaker 2: buddies down the road his dad worked at a ball
• 40:58
  Speaker 2: bearing factory um what was that place called sealed power
• 41:05
  Speaker 2: and so we had never ending amounts of what we
• 41:07
  Speaker 2: called steelies back then ball bearings and steel marbles you
• 41:11
  Speaker 2: know for shooting marbles and um We were working on
• 41:14
  Speaker 2: this technology where we were thinking you could take basically
• 41:17
  Speaker 2: a bunch of like 25 caliber ball bearings and wrap
• 41:26
  Speaker 2: it in masking tape to make a little dense thing.
• 41:29
  Speaker 2: And we were working on a technology by which you
• 41:32
  Speaker 2: would hit a tree by a squirrel. And there'd be
• 41:36
  Speaker 2: such a violent eruption of ball bearings. coming out of
• 41:42
  Speaker 2: this masking tape case that you would thereby kill the squirrel.
• 41:47
  Speaker 3: Grape shot.
• 41:49
  Speaker 2: And we never got anywhere with it. I think maybe
• 41:57
  Speaker 2: I've gotten like a blue grouse with a wrist rocket
• 42:01
  Speaker 2: now and then, but no, I'm not a slingshot hunter.
• 42:04
  Speaker 1: He should look up a guy named Eddie Corona.
• 42:08
  Speaker 2: Eddie Corona.
• 42:09
  Speaker 3: That's a slingshot hunter.
• 42:09
  Speaker 2: I can't tell you any more. El Corona.
• 42:12
  Speaker 1: We call him El Jaguar. Look up that guy.
• 42:18
  Speaker 3: A couple listeners wrote in asking for the best tasting deer.
• 42:24
  Speaker 3: And the list is Axis, Columbia Blacktail, Sika Blacktail, Coos, cows,
• 42:30
  Speaker 3: mule deer, or white tail.
• 42:34
  Speaker 2: I don't know. It's like, there's such a high level
• 42:37
  Speaker 2: of subjectivity to this. I can say that, that, um,
• 42:42
  Speaker 2: let me tell you some, some sort of universally celebrated critters.
• 42:46
  Speaker 1: The axis deer.
• 42:47
  Speaker 2: If you talk to people that have, that have access
• 42:51
  Speaker 2: to a lot of cervids, ungulates, whatever, they tend to
• 42:56
  Speaker 2: point out that the axis deer is exceptional. Um, the,
• 43:02
  Speaker 2: the Sika deer. So not Sitka. but the Sika deer
• 43:09
  Speaker 2: among people who've had a lot of kind of wild
• 43:11
  Speaker 2: game is regarded as exceptional. I agree.
• 43:17
  Speaker 1: There aren't many, like the Sika, is that on his list?
• 43:20
  Speaker 2: Sika?
• 43:21
  Speaker 1: No, he didn't.
• 43:21
  Speaker 3: That's that little one that runs around Maryland.
• 43:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Listen, there aren't many, there aren't many like cervids
• 43:27
  Speaker 2: that you can take the front leg off a mature
• 43:31
  Speaker 2: male and put it in a pellet grill. And leave
• 43:38
  Speaker 2: it in there and have it be that you can
• 43:39
  Speaker 2: crumble it apart with your fingers. That don't happen. And
• 43:45
  Speaker 2: that happens with one of them suckers. Yeah, they're good.
• 43:48
  Speaker 3: All that stuff's good. All that stuff's great. Another guy
• 43:55
  Speaker 3: writes in, speaking of ungulates. When will Meat Eater do
• 43:58
  Speaker 3: a Northeast moose hunting episode? Ontario, Quebec, New Brunswick, Maine.
• 44:03
  Speaker 3: We want logging roads and clear cuts.
• 44:05
  Speaker 1: I understand, man. I understand. There's a couple of years
• 44:07
  Speaker 1: I'd put in for moose in Maine.
• 44:11
  Speaker 2: But the thing is, I kind of like, I'm kind
• 44:14
  Speaker 2: of nuts deep in the whole Alaska hunting moose up there.
• 44:18
  Speaker 1: And I like have where I like to go.
• 44:21
  Speaker 2: They're huge. You know, it's just like, it's like the
• 44:26
  Speaker 2: land of giants. I love being up there. And because
• 44:30
  Speaker 2: it happens at the same time of year, it's hard
• 44:32
  Speaker 2: to picture peeling off and going somewhere else because I
• 44:35
  Speaker 2: dig that so much. You know what I mean? I
• 44:38
  Speaker 2: love it. So I can't picture going over in another
• 44:43
  Speaker 2: direction to hunt moose. Maybe I will someday, but I just,
• 44:46
  Speaker 2: I just like, if I weigh in my head, like
• 44:48
  Speaker 2: go up and hunt, like in the interior, you know,
• 44:54
  Speaker 2: and how wild and beautiful that is, the interior of
• 44:56
  Speaker 2: Alaska or, or go, I'm just going to go that
• 45:01
  Speaker 2: way for now. It's not to hack on it. It's just,
• 45:04
  Speaker 2: that's what I'd like to do. That's right now. That's
• 45:07
  Speaker 2: where I want to be.
• 45:09
  Speaker 3: A guy asked, how beneficial has it been for MeatEater
• 45:12
  Speaker 3: and for you that your brother Danny is an Alaskan resident?
• 45:18
  Speaker 2: It's great in a handful of ways. Kind of the
• 45:22
  Speaker 2: most obvious one is... I.
• 45:27
  Speaker 1: Can go... And.
• 45:30
  Speaker 2: We've gone over the years four or five times. I
• 45:33
  Speaker 2: can go sheep hunting with him. So we've gone long before...
• 45:39
  Speaker 2: long before meat eater was ever a thing before it
• 45:42
  Speaker 2: was a show that we made or before I ever
• 45:45
  Speaker 2: came up with the name or anything, he and I were, would,
• 45:48
  Speaker 2: would go on sheep hunts together or also never written
• 45:51
  Speaker 2: about this is like, I.
• 45:53
  Speaker 1: Can go with him.
• 45:55
  Speaker 2: Let me back up. If you have what they call
• 45:59
  Speaker 2: a second, if you have a second degree kindred resident
• 46:02
  Speaker 2: of Alaska relative. Okay. So it's like cousin, husband, aunt, uncle, brother, sister, whatever.
• 46:11
  Speaker 2: There's four animals. The guiding restriction falls away. Mountain goat
• 46:20
  Speaker 2: in Alaska. Mountain goats, doll sheep, grizzlies. Maybe it's only three.
• 46:26
  Speaker 2: It's three, sorry. There are three species. Mountain goats, doll sheep,
• 46:32
  Speaker 2: and grizzlies slash brown bear. If you're a non-resident of Alaska,
• 46:36
  Speaker 2: you have a guide requirement. You have to get a
• 46:38
  Speaker 2: guide to hunt those things unless you have a relative there.
• 46:44
  Speaker 2: So if you have a relative there, they can serve
• 46:47
  Speaker 2: sort of like, they fill the role as a guide
• 46:50
  Speaker 2: in your eligible hunting.
• 46:51
  Speaker 1: There's complications to it.
• 46:52
  Speaker 2: Like over the years, they've kind of made it that,
• 46:55
  Speaker 2: like if I go with him and I get something,
• 46:57
  Speaker 2: that actually scratches off his tag. I got to have
• 47:01
  Speaker 2: my own tag, but it like scratches off his tag
• 47:03
  Speaker 2: in some instances. But over the years, I've been able
• 47:07
  Speaker 2: to go hunting goats and go hunting sheep with him.
• 47:10
  Speaker 2: And he has me like right there with me. And
• 47:12
  Speaker 2: I would have otherwise needed to hire a guide. And
• 47:14
  Speaker 2: I don't typically hire guides. Typically I do on some
• 47:18
  Speaker 2: kind of times, but typically don't. I just was, have
• 47:20
  Speaker 2: been able to go with him. So hugely beneficial.
• 47:24
  Speaker 3: Two questions that are two questions from Google autofill.
• 47:30
  Speaker 2: Hmm.
• 47:31
  Speaker 3: Do you do guided hunts and does your wife hunt?
• 47:35
  Speaker 1: I've never done.
• 47:36
  Speaker 2: I've never been licensed to guide. I've never done any guiding.
• 47:43
  Speaker 2: I sometimes will speak to my wife. I'll sometimes be
• 47:46
  Speaker 2: talking to my wife and I'll be saying something like, um,
• 47:52
  Speaker 2: would I ever do that? You know, I don't know.
• 47:54
  Speaker 2: I can't rule that out. That'd be way down the road.
• 47:58
  Speaker 2: It's hard to picture, but maybe, but no, I've never guided.
• 48:01
  Speaker 2: I've never done any guiding. Um, I feel like it's
• 48:04
  Speaker 2: like a little bit of a, um, I was gonna
• 48:10
  Speaker 2: say it's like a hole in my resume or something.
• 48:12
  Speaker 2: Cause a lot of the guys I work with have
• 48:13
  Speaker 2: been guides, you know, but not, I don't know if
• 48:15
  Speaker 2: that's true.
• 48:16
  Speaker 1: No, haven't my wife. No, my wife doesn't hunt, man.
• 48:19
  Speaker 1: She likes to in the right circumstances. She likes to fish.
• 48:23
  Speaker 2: I found this summer that she would rather, she has
• 48:26
  Speaker 2: much more fun fishing in the boat with my buddies
• 48:29
  Speaker 2: in it than being in my boat. She thinks my
• 48:31
  Speaker 2: boat puts off an anxious energy. No.
• 48:35
  Speaker 1: She says it just has an energy to it that
• 48:37
  Speaker 1: puts her off. The other day.
• 48:42
  Speaker 2: That's shocking. I was hiking with my wife and she
• 48:44
  Speaker 2: wanted to go up to this peak and we're coming
• 48:46
  Speaker 2: down and I'm trying to tell her like, you need to,
• 48:51
  Speaker 2: like the scree wants to float.
• 48:55
  Speaker 1: You're trying to stop on screen.
• 49:00
  Speaker 2: You need to learn just to let it go and
• 49:02
  Speaker 2: you go with it. And even this kind of thing
• 49:07
  Speaker 2: from me is off-putting to her. Any number of her
• 49:10
  Speaker 2: friends could say it and she'd be like, oh, that's
• 49:11
  Speaker 2: really interesting. It's just off-putting to her. She doesn't want
• 49:15
  Speaker 2: to hear about.
• 49:17
  Speaker 3: It from me that's why we go hunt cattails with
• 49:20
  Speaker 3: tony peterson cam doesn't want to disappoint tony.
• 49:24
  Speaker 2: So that does not do with honey but just like
• 49:27
  Speaker 2: an interesting dynamic that she like would she loves to
• 49:30
  Speaker 2: be she like like likes to go fishing at our
• 49:33
  Speaker 2: fish shack but would prefer to not be in my
• 49:35
  Speaker 2: boat on hunting no she's never she's When my daughter
• 49:39
  Speaker 2: was going through hunter safety, she thought about doing it
• 49:41
  Speaker 2: and was kind of thought it might be good, was
• 49:44
  Speaker 2: drawn to the idea of doing it with our daughter.
• 49:47
  Speaker 1: She didn't do it.
• 49:48
  Speaker 2: But it's funny because when we found out we were
• 49:50
  Speaker 2: having a girl, she was adamant. She's like, you don't,
• 49:54
  Speaker 2: you dare treat her any differently and you better take
• 49:56
  Speaker 2: her hunting. You know, and it's important to her that
• 49:58
  Speaker 2: she does it, but it's just, it's just not appealing
• 50:01
  Speaker 2: to her. You know, not appealing to her. It might
• 50:04
  Speaker 2: sometime down the road. And sometimes I'll get her, she'll
• 50:06
  Speaker 2: be in the right mood and she'll point out that
• 50:08
  Speaker 2: she'd like to check it out sometime. But usually through
• 50:11
  Speaker 2: the lens of with our kids, that she wants to
• 50:13
  Speaker 2: experience it with our kids. And this will be coming up.
• 50:19
  Speaker 2: She's actually already planning on going bear hunting with me
• 50:23
  Speaker 2: and our kids.
• 50:25
  Speaker 3: Up in Alaska?
• 50:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah, coming up. So that'll be different. I was surprised
• 50:29
  Speaker 2: by that.
• 50:32
  Speaker 3: There's another Alaska question. The recent request for generator suggestions
• 50:38
  Speaker 3: reminded a listener of episode 757 where you asked for
• 50:41
  Speaker 3: help with an electrical problem on the GE freezer, the
• 50:44
  Speaker 3: fish shack.
• 50:45
  Speaker 1: Did you ever get it resolved?
• 50:46
  Speaker 2: Yes. An engineer from GE reached out. We were able
• 50:50
  Speaker 2: to troubleshoot it. I was able to get the part
• 50:53
  Speaker 2: I needed and the part fixed the problem. So yes.
• 50:56
  Speaker 1: Excellent.
• 50:57
  Speaker 2: Big thanks to GE for that help there. It was
• 51:00
  Speaker 2: great to talk to an actual freezer guy, a pro
• 51:04
  Speaker 2: freezer guy.
• 51:07
  Speaker 3: Where do you land now on the argument that hunting
• 51:09
  Speaker 3: doesn't need more recruits?
• 51:14
  Speaker 2: That's a great question. It's something I struggle with all
• 51:17
  Speaker 2: the time because I even struggle like, what does the
• 51:19
  Speaker 2: word recruiting mean? Let me back up and start with
• 51:25
  Speaker 2: an observation. This is probably over-observed. If you go back
• 51:30
  Speaker 2: to 1950, think about this like this. If you go
• 51:32
  Speaker 2: back to 1950, in 1950, you had about 150 million
• 51:38
  Speaker 2: people in the country, 150 million Americans. Guess what percentage
• 51:40
  Speaker 2: hunted in 1950? 150 million Americans, 1950. Not percentage, but
• 51:49
  Speaker 2: guess the total, sorry, the total number. The total number was.
• 51:54
  Speaker 1: About 12 million.
• 51:57
  Speaker 2: About 12 million people hunted in 1950 with a population
• 52:00
  Speaker 2: of 150 million. We now have over twice the population.
• 52:05
  Speaker 2: And guess what? How many people hunt now? 15. So
• 52:10
  Speaker 2: you like double the American population and you barely creep
• 52:15
  Speaker 2: up the number. I haven't like got this totally sorted
• 52:19
  Speaker 2: out in my head, but I sort of feel like
• 52:20
  Speaker 2: there's like a carrying, I envision it that there's sort
• 52:23
  Speaker 2: of a carrying capacity of land. And it'll sort of
• 52:30
  Speaker 2: be met, always be met with some level of conflict,
• 52:32
  Speaker 2: some level of resource constraint. Um, to say that you're
• 52:40
  Speaker 2: going to like go out and recruit a hunter would
• 52:44
  Speaker 2: lead me to believe you're going to go out and
• 52:46
  Speaker 2: try to like convince people, I guess that you're going
• 52:51
  Speaker 2: to convince people that wouldn't otherwise want to hunt that
• 52:53
  Speaker 2: they should hunt. Like, I just can't see that that's necessary.
• 52:58
  Speaker 2: I am doing right now, I am mentoring a young hunter.
• 53:04
  Speaker 2: My older boy, one of his best friends is very
• 53:08
  Speaker 2: interested in hunting and comes from a not hunting family,
• 53:11
  Speaker 2: like a very not hunting family. And he's very interested
• 53:14
  Speaker 2: in hunting. I have, we have me and my boy
• 53:17
  Speaker 2: have really taken him under our wing and have walked
• 53:22
  Speaker 2: him through all the steps. Like he borrows our gear.
• 53:27
  Speaker 2: we've taught him everything and we walked him through the
• 53:29
  Speaker 2: permitting process and put him in for the apps. Like
• 53:31
  Speaker 2: we've like mentored him, but we mentored him as a
• 53:36
  Speaker 2: person that we enjoy and love. And here he wants
• 53:39
  Speaker 2: to do this thing and we're uniquely suited to help
• 53:41
  Speaker 2: him do it. And here's the biggest gift we gave him.
• 53:45
  Speaker 2: The biggest gift we could give him. I hate that word.
• 53:48
  Speaker 2: So like if he's listening, he knows who he was,
• 53:51
  Speaker 2: please understand. I do not view this as a gift
• 53:53
  Speaker 2: I'm giving you, but a thing that we are able
• 53:55
  Speaker 2: to provide is, Because, because we love this kid to death.
• 54:00
  Speaker 2: A thing we're able to provide is like places to go.
• 54:02
  Speaker 2: We bring him to our spots and he comes with us.
• 54:04
  Speaker 2: He has a standing invitation. If we're going somewhere, he
• 54:06
  Speaker 2: can come with, we're just hunting grouse with him. Like
• 54:08
  Speaker 2: he comes out with us. The problem with like formalized,
• 54:12
  Speaker 2: I view like a problem with formalized hunting, hunter recruitment
• 54:17
  Speaker 2: is it runs into like, well, where are they supposed
• 54:20
  Speaker 2: to go? you can go say to someone like, Hey,
• 54:25
  Speaker 2: I'll show you how to shoot a shotgun. I'll teach
• 54:27
  Speaker 2: you how to call a Turkey and whatever. But in
• 54:28
  Speaker 2: the end, like, where do they go? And that's why
• 54:32
  Speaker 2: a lot of those programs aren't successful in the longterm
• 54:35
  Speaker 2: is people will go. If you take them and you
• 54:37
  Speaker 2: have a place and they have a good chance of success.
• 54:40
  Speaker 2: But when you turn them back out off, I think
• 54:43
  Speaker 2: that there's like, they drop out. Why do they drop out?
• 54:46
  Speaker 2: Because it's not readily apparent where they go and going
• 54:48
  Speaker 2: and finding spots is hard. Um, And so they don't
• 54:53
  Speaker 2: do it, right? Which leads us to another question is like,
• 54:56
  Speaker 2: or another component of this that I wonder about all
• 55:00
  Speaker 2: the time is I guess the objective, if you look
• 55:04
  Speaker 2: at conservation organizations that have like a hunting recruitment component
• 55:07
  Speaker 2: to them, I guess the objective is in their mind,
• 55:11
  Speaker 2: the objective would be that they want to produce hunter conservationists.
• 55:16
  Speaker 2: So the pathway to do this would be to go
• 55:19
  Speaker 2: find people that don't hunt, get them into hunting and
• 55:25
  Speaker 2: then they get into hunting and then from there they
• 55:27
  Speaker 2: hopefully get into the conservation movement it feels to me
• 55:31
  Speaker 2: that it'd be far more efficient to why not let's
• 55:35
  Speaker 2: talk about the 15 million 14 million 15 million americans
• 55:39
  Speaker 2: that are are hunting and aren't involved in conservation like
• 55:43
  Speaker 2: that seems more practical and efficient.
• 55:46
  Speaker 1: Of an approach.
• 55:49
  Speaker 2: Like what about all these ones that aren't in the
• 55:51
  Speaker 2: conservation movement like The young man I'm mentoring, it will
• 55:55
  Speaker 2: come soon or I float this with him. I'm like,
• 56:00
  Speaker 2: now that you're doing this and you're into it with us,
• 56:02
  Speaker 2: it's time you look and say like, what do I
• 56:05
  Speaker 2: owe to it? Right.
• 56:07
  Speaker 1: And we'll get there and we'll do that.
• 56:09
  Speaker 2: But I didn't go offer to him to come along
• 56:13
  Speaker 2: with us in the first place with some like long-term
• 56:15
  Speaker 2: plan to build a conservationist. It just wasn't where I am.
• 56:19
  Speaker 2: So I don't, I don't think it's that efficient. If
• 56:21
  Speaker 2: I was, like when we do, like at our organization,
• 56:24
  Speaker 2: we do a lot of conservation spending. For me, the
• 56:27
  Speaker 2: best conservation spending or one of the best ways to
• 56:31
  Speaker 2: spend on conservation is around habitat, acquisition, saving habitat, improving habitat,
• 56:40
  Speaker 2: and also tied to conservation but a little different is
• 56:44
  Speaker 2: like access improvement. Creating places and space for people to
• 56:50
  Speaker 2: enjoy their activity.
• 56:51
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 56:52
  Speaker 2: For creating places in space for people to hunt, knowing
• 56:55
  Speaker 2: that those niches will be filled. You can't really point
• 56:59
  Speaker 2: to in the, in the country. You can't really go
• 57:01
  Speaker 2: like that. There's all these elk tags that are available
• 57:04
  Speaker 2: and no one got them that there's bighorn tags and
• 57:08
  Speaker 2: no one's even there to get the bighorn tag. Um,
• 57:12
  Speaker 2: because the carrying capacity is, is like full. So just
• 57:15
  Speaker 2: setting out with the specific intention of like talking people
• 57:20
  Speaker 2: into hunting.
• 57:21
  Speaker 1: That don't hunt for, for some payoff down the road.
• 57:25
  Speaker 2: I don't know. I just can't see it as an
• 57:30
  Speaker 2: effective way to get anywhere. Like I, like I not,
• 57:33
  Speaker 2: not to begrudge people that do it, like they should come.
• 57:36
  Speaker 2: I'd have someone on the podcast to explain it to me,
• 57:38
  Speaker 2: but it's not what keeps me up at night.
• 57:46
  Speaker 3: It's interesting. Cause that's a critique of meat eater is
• 57:49
  Speaker 3: that what, this organization brings in too many new hunters.
• 57:54
  Speaker 1: Like people see it and want to get into it? Sure, man.
• 57:57
  Speaker 1: When I think about, like, my grandpa.
• 58:04
  Speaker 2: Was a hunter. Well, both my grandparents. So I come
• 58:08
  Speaker 2: from hunters on both sides of the family. I'm speaking
• 58:10
  Speaker 2: of my maternal grandpa, Grandpa Glenn, my maternal grandfather. He
• 58:15
  Speaker 2: always had, he always subscribed to outdoor life sports afield
• 58:20
  Speaker 2: and field and stream and we didn't we didn't have
• 58:25
  Speaker 2: magazine subscriptions in my house for some reason but i
• 58:28
  Speaker 2: would go and he would give me all of his
• 58:30
  Speaker 2: magazines and i would read these magazines and i would
• 58:32
  Speaker 2: be like very inspired to do the things in those
• 58:36
  Speaker 2: magazines the first magazine i ever subscribed to was trapper
• 58:39
  Speaker 2: and predator caller and i would read trapper and predator
• 58:42
  Speaker 2: caller And I was like, man, I want to go
• 58:45
  Speaker 2: have like a trap line in Alaska. I want to
• 58:47
  Speaker 2: trap this. I want to trap that. So I'm like
• 58:48
  Speaker 2: taking in media. I would go to learn how to
• 58:51
  Speaker 2: do what I do. I would go and buy Tom
• 58:54
  Speaker 2: Miranda's videos. Um, I would buy, uh, um, John, the
• 59:02
  Speaker 2: other prominent trappers who Mike Marziata, I would buy all
• 59:05
  Speaker 2: of his books, you know, cause I wanted to study
• 59:07
  Speaker 2: and learn. So there's like a little bit of a continuum.
• 59:10
  Speaker 2: of the people that make books about hunting or make
• 59:15
  Speaker 2: videos about hunting. Like people are going to use that
• 59:17
  Speaker 2: resource to do the things they want to do. Theodore
• 59:20
  Speaker 2: Roosevelt wrote a hunting book. Was he a hunting influencer?
• 59:25
  Speaker 2: I don't know, but undoubtedly people read Roosevelt stuff and
• 59:27
  Speaker 2: got really into it. Aldo Leopold wrote sand County almanac.
• 59:31
  Speaker 2: Undoubtedly people read sand County almanac and got into it.
• 59:35
  Speaker 2: I really can't think of the digital space as somehow
• 59:37
  Speaker 2: being different where there's always been a draw of that.
• 59:41
  Speaker 2: You that hunting media inspires and educates fishing media, inspires
• 59:46
  Speaker 2: and educates always has always will. Even guys I know
• 59:51
  Speaker 2: that are like, like, I know a guy that is
• 59:54
  Speaker 2: just like dead set against hunting media, but it's so
• 59:56
  Speaker 2: funny because I know his background and I know that
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 2: he throughout his life moved to areas and would hunt
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 2: and fish places that people were already hunting and fishing.
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 2: And how would he learn to do that? Through hunting media.
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 2: So you look at his bookshelf, Dwight Shue, Cam Haines,
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 2: the Eastmans, right? He's watching these videos. He's reading this stuff.
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 2: But then later in hindsight, it's not put together. It's
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 2: like you learn to do what you did through media
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 2: products and trial and error. And you were inspired about
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 2: what's possible through these things. I remember when I was
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 2: a little kid, my dad brought home this video. He'd
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 2: got it from Michigan boat, some guys at Muskegon Bowman's.
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 1: And it was like this video about this dude named art.
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 2: And it was art with a, like some old timey
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 2: camera making all these like crazy videos out of Alaska.
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 2: I watched that shit and got excited about hunting in Alaska.
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 2: It just still goes on now. I don't know. I
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 2: can't picture that a writer or an artist or whatever
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 2: they are would somehow be like, I'm not going to
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 2: write about the things I'm interested in for fear that
• 1:01:07
  Speaker 2: people would want to do it. Take Sex and the
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 2: City and Girls, what that must have done to, I
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 2: don't know, did people want to move to Manhattan after
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 2: watching Sex and the City and Girls? Did housing costs
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 2: go up in Manhattan? Yes, probably. Could you, would you
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 2: like blame the person that wrote that stuff? It's tricky
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 2: to me. Another, like on the same criticism is like
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 2: that somehow if you go and write about things or
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 2: show things to people that they want to then go there,
• 1:01:35
  Speaker 2: I think, I don't know, like ultimately in a demographic sense,
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 2: how effective it is. Because like the number one place
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 2: we film in is Alaska, but Alaska's lost populations. And
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 2: their population has gotten older all through the time that
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 2: I've written about and filmed it.
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 1: So I feel like something more is going on.
• 1:01:52
  Speaker 2: We don't do a ton in Austin, but that's like
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 2: one of the fastest growing zip codes. Florida is a
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 2: really hot state. I think it's taxes. You know, I
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 2: don't think it's that we made a thing about Osceola turkeys.
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 2: So like, it just gets, it gets like confusing to me.
• 1:02:08
  Speaker 2: And I think that people tend to, when they're looking
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 2: at their woes, there's a tendency to look at the
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 2: things you're most familiar with. Like for me, I'd be like,
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 2: when Montana had a spasm of explosion that's slowing down now,
• 1:02:23
  Speaker 2: most sociologists point to COVID.
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 1: I would be like, is that show Yellowstone, right?
• 1:02:29
  Speaker 2: Like you just look and you kind of like lash
• 1:02:31
  Speaker 2: out at the things that you think are familiar.
• 1:02:36
  Speaker 3: We had a number of new or aspiring hunters write in,
• 1:02:39
  Speaker 3: and there's a two-part question that they generally posed. Etiquette
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 3: on someone... giving you their spots and then a one
• 1:02:48
  Speaker 3: to five list of how to start hunting.
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 1: Hold on.
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 2: The etiquette on what?
• 1:02:54
  Speaker 3: When someone shares with you a spot, lay out the
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 3: etiquette of you receiving that spot and then what you
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 3: do with it.
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 2: That's, I'm going to make a very long question. I'm
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 2: going to make a very long answer short and I'm
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 2: going to, talk about a thing that's become important to
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 2: me or like a way I think that people could
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 2: avoid these tensions.
• 1:03:19
  Speaker 1: Talk about it explicitly.
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 2: Set your expectations explicitly and proactively. If someone takes you
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 2: to a spot, say, thank you for taking me here.
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 2: This has been great. This is, and I don't want
• 1:03:40
  Speaker 2: to be awkward, but like, how would you like me
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 2: to handle this information? Right? I have friends, I have
• 1:03:48
  Speaker 2: friends call me up and they'll be like, man, um,
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 2: what would you think if I blank? I'll be like, yeah,
• 1:03:56
  Speaker 2: go ahead. You know, but it's like, just be like,
• 1:03:59
  Speaker 2: and I'd never had these before, but just be really
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 2: open about it. If you take someone somewhere, you could
• 1:04:05
  Speaker 2: even say to him, like, dude, let me warn you.
• 1:04:09
  Speaker 2: If I'm going to take you to this place, and
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 2: show you this specific fishing hole that I found. It's
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 2: really good like this time of year. And I like
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 2: to hit it with my kids and everything. If I'm
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 2: going to take you, I'm going to ask you, I'm
• 1:04:20
  Speaker 2: going to be like, hey man, don't hit the spot
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 2: without me. So maybe you shouldn't go with me because
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 2: you might find it on your own. And when you
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 2: find it on your own, it's going to be sweet
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 2: for you and you can hit it all the time.
• 1:04:30
  Speaker 2: But if I show you, then we're bound up in
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 2: this weird deal. So maybe don't even go because you'll
• 1:04:34
  Speaker 2: find it. And then it's yours because you found it.
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 2: Like I can't control that. In that respect, I could
• 1:04:44
  Speaker 2: go on about this area for a long time, but
• 1:04:47
  Speaker 2: I think being explicit with your expectations. I was hiking
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 2: with a friend of mine who was just visiting from
• 1:04:55
  Speaker 2: out of state. We were hiking around and we saw
• 1:04:58
  Speaker 2: something interesting. I said, man, you never saw that. He goes,
• 1:05:03
  Speaker 2: I don't know where I am anyway.
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 3: The second part of that question is, One to five.
• 1:05:12
  Speaker 3: You don't hunt and you want to get into it.
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 3: What are the steps?
• 1:05:18
  Speaker 1: I see a lot of people get really hung up on.
• 1:05:22
  Speaker 2: A lot of people get really hung up on this
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 2: overwhelming decision-making paralysis they have. They don't know where to start.
• 1:05:30
  Speaker 2: I guess you just start. Is being not successful that bad?
• 1:05:34
  Speaker 2: If being not successful... means you don't want to go.
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 2: So you're not going because you might be unsuccessful. It
• 1:05:44
  Speaker 2: probably is just not for you and like, I don't know,
• 1:05:46
  Speaker 2: don't go. If you're comfortable being unsuccessful, go, get on X,
• 1:05:53
  Speaker 2: look at on X and look for bits of public
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 2: land or access areas you can go into and just
• 1:05:57
  Speaker 2: go and try. If you don't have public areas, work
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 2: through your social network, work through your network at work.
• 1:06:05
  Speaker 2: work through your network at church, work through your network, whatever,
• 1:06:08
  Speaker 2: write letters, knock on doors, all the things that we
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 2: all do and get a place to go. And when
• 1:06:13
  Speaker 2: you get a place to go, get out and try it.
• 1:06:15
  Speaker 2: And meanwhile, watch YouTube videos, read books, listen to podcasts,
• 1:06:18
  Speaker 2: all that kind of stuff. But just like go and
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 2: stop worrying about that. You won't get something.
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 1: Who cares?
• 1:06:27
  Speaker 2: Just get, and you'll just land there. But if you
• 1:06:30
  Speaker 2: can't enjoy the journey, like screw it. It's, it's, it's,
• 1:06:34
  Speaker 2: it's a, For whoever's asking this, it is definitely a
• 1:06:37
  Speaker 2: recreational pursuit because they don't do it yet.
• 1:06:39
  Speaker 1: It's recreational. If you can't enjoy the journey, forget about it.
• 1:06:43
  Speaker 1: Just enjoy the journey.
• 1:06:45
  Speaker 2: Begin.
• 1:06:47
  Speaker 3: Whether a new hunter or an old hunter, what should
• 1:06:50
  Speaker 3: someone read to learn how whitetails move, what they eat,
• 1:06:52
  Speaker 3: and their patterns?
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 2: Man, at this point, I don't know that reading's the
• 1:06:57
  Speaker 2: best bet. There's so many... people out there that, um,
• 1:07:08
  Speaker 2: talk about and make good videos about and stuff like
• 1:07:12
  Speaker 2: how whitetails do what they do. Um, if you, if
• 1:07:15
  Speaker 2: you're looking at it from a hunting perspective, not from
• 1:07:17
  Speaker 2: like a biological perspective, but from a hunting perspective, there's
• 1:07:20
  Speaker 2: so much, there's so much stuff on, on, on YouTube
• 1:07:25
  Speaker 2: and others where guys explain stuff really well. I don't
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 2: know that if the strategy, if you just love literature,
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 2: then I don't, I don't, I don't know what to
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 2: tell you. Um, it's different than what I think he's asked.
• 1:07:37
  Speaker 2: I think he's at, he wants to learn like from
• 1:07:39
  Speaker 2: a pragmatic, like how to get whitetails approach. There's so
• 1:07:42
  Speaker 2: much good stuff on YouTube. Find someone that like talks
• 1:07:45
  Speaker 2: the way you talk and thinks the way you think and,
• 1:07:48
  Speaker 2: and kind of study them. Um, I work with you
• 1:07:52
  Speaker 2: guys like that do a lot of whitetail stuff, Mark
• 1:07:54
  Speaker 2: Canyon and Tony Peterson. And, um, I appreciate their perspective
• 1:07:58
  Speaker 2: on whitetails and the most vivid way to learn from
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 2: them is to watch the stuff they do. Because you
• 1:08:04
  Speaker 2: can see it all happening. And it's very educational. And
• 1:08:07
  Speaker 2: then you've got to spend time applying it. No two
• 1:08:10
  Speaker 2: places are the same. You've got to take all the
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 2: things you pick up and apply it.
• 1:08:15
  Speaker 3: A listener wrote in, if you could eat only one
• 1:08:18
  Speaker 3: wild game recipe from now on, what would it be?
• 1:08:22
  Speaker 2: It'd be that I would take whole muscled chunks of
• 1:08:27
  Speaker 2: mule deer and um rub them in salt and pepper,
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 2: and either sear them in a pan, and then stick
• 1:08:40
  Speaker 2: them into a 400 degree oven, or I would just
• 1:08:43
  Speaker 2: brush it with a little oil and put it into
• 1:08:45
  Speaker 2: a pellet grill, and cook it until it's 135 degrees,
• 1:08:50
  Speaker 2: and then take it out and let it sit there
• 1:08:52
  Speaker 2: for 8-10 minutes, and then slice it, cross grain, and
• 1:08:58
  Speaker 2: I could just live on that. I sometimes feel embarrassed
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 2: about how much of that we eat at my house
• 1:09:03
  Speaker 2: like from my wife's perspective but she doesn't complain because
• 1:09:07
  Speaker 2: she likes it and earlier you were talking about my
• 1:09:08
  Speaker 2: wife doesn't hunt one of the many things I like
• 1:09:10
  Speaker 2: about my wife is she eats more wild game this
• 1:09:12
  Speaker 2: is going to sound audacious my wife eats more wild
• 1:09:15
  Speaker 2: game than 99% of the hunters in this country because
• 1:09:18
  Speaker 2: she eats wild game every day you know.
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 3: A number of folks are interested in what the best
• 1:09:24
  Speaker 3: restaurant meal of your life is.
• 1:09:28
  Speaker 2: I've had some great ones and i tried to think
• 1:09:30
  Speaker 2: about that like just kind of cool things i've eaten
• 1:09:32
  Speaker 2: over time here and there but i think the best
• 1:09:36
  Speaker 2: this isn't going to come in any surprise to anybody
• 1:09:38
  Speaker 2: that follows our stuff i think the best replicable restaurant
• 1:09:45
  Speaker 2: experience to be had in America that I know about
• 1:09:48
  Speaker 2: is going to Jesse Griffith's Daidue. Meaning, repical meaning, like,
• 1:09:55
  Speaker 2: it's in a place people come through. It's in Austin, Texas.
• 1:09:58
  Speaker 1: It's expensive, but it's not ridiculous. You can get in.
• 1:10:02
  Speaker 2: It's not like you need to make a reservation years
• 1:10:04
  Speaker 2: in advance. Like, you can kind of go down there
• 1:10:06
  Speaker 2: and get in. And it's just, it's my favorite. It is,
• 1:10:09
  Speaker 2: in my mind, the best restaurant experience I can think of.
• 1:10:15
  Speaker 3: What's your go-to round?
• 1:10:16
  Speaker 1: You know, this has.
• 1:10:20
  Speaker 2: Become weirdly political.
• 1:10:22
  Speaker 4: Because this is always like, it's so funny. Maybe people
• 1:10:26
  Speaker 4: have always had all these opinions about people, you know,
• 1:10:29
  Speaker 4: like people get all riled up about your rounds and stuff.
• 1:10:36
  Speaker 2: I shoot, you know, I like to hunt moose. I
• 1:10:38
  Speaker 2: like to hunt elk, deer, whatever. I can just get
• 1:10:43
  Speaker 2: a lot done. can get a lot done very confidently
• 1:10:48
  Speaker 2: with a 300 wind mag. And I also shot it
• 1:10:51
  Speaker 2: enough that I understand part. I understand it. You know
• 1:10:56
  Speaker 2: what I mean? Like, like I understand the ballistics. I
• 1:10:59
  Speaker 2: understand its trajectory. I just understand it. So it becomes
• 1:11:02
  Speaker 2: that it becomes, you know, you don't guys like in, in,
• 1:11:06
  Speaker 2: in guys in the worlds of hunting and fishing will,
• 1:11:08
  Speaker 2: will sometimes be like, it just, it works for me.
• 1:11:10
  Speaker 2: You know, trappers too, like a trap or old, like
• 1:11:14
  Speaker 2: a certain thing, a certain way.
• 1:11:16
  Speaker 1: And guys be like, well, why do you use that?
• 1:11:17
  Speaker 2: I don't use it.
• 1:11:18
  Speaker 1: It just works for me.
• 1:11:20
  Speaker 2: It like, it fits into my, it fits into my repertoire.
• 1:11:25
  Speaker 2: 300 wind mag. It just works for me. Cause I'm
• 1:11:27
  Speaker 2: like very familiar with it. I don't have problems with it.
• 1:11:32
  Speaker 2: I don't like recoil doesn't bother me. Um, and it
• 1:11:37
  Speaker 2: just works for me, but that's not to say it's
• 1:11:38
  Speaker 2: the best for somebody else. It's just, to me, I
• 1:11:42
  Speaker 2: get it. And it's like, it's a function of age too.
• 1:11:44
  Speaker 2: There's all these new calibers come out all the time.
• 1:11:46
  Speaker 2: I lately I've been shooting a six, five PRC. I
• 1:11:49
  Speaker 2: don't even love it.
• 1:11:50
  Speaker 1: Love it.
• 1:11:51
  Speaker 2: But, um, it just, it just is very functional. It's
• 1:11:56
  Speaker 2: just like a very, uh, with 180 grain bullet, 300
• 1:12:02
  Speaker 2: wind mag. It's huge. But if I shoot a coos
• 1:12:05
  Speaker 2: deer with it, I don't feel that I have ruined
• 1:12:08
  Speaker 2: more meat than guys shooting other things.
• 1:12:11
  Speaker 1: It just doesn't.
• 1:12:12
  Speaker 2: You punch it back a few inches from the front shoulder.
• 1:12:15
  Speaker 2: It's got a hole like that. It kind of falls over.
• 1:12:18
  Speaker 2: It just works. It works.
• 1:12:25
  Speaker 3: A number of lefties and cross-eyed dominant folks wrote in,
• 1:12:29
  Speaker 3: and they wanted to know what your favorite lefty rifle
• 1:12:32
  Speaker 3: is over the year and a guesstimate of how many
• 1:12:35
  Speaker 3: animals you've shot with right-handed firearms.
• 1:12:38
  Speaker 1: I never.
• 1:12:39
  Speaker 2: I didn't... This is the God's honest truth. I didn't
• 1:12:43
  Speaker 2: own a left-handed firearm until I was in my 40s.
• 1:12:50
  Speaker 2: So everything up to then I shot with right-handed firearms.
• 1:12:55
  Speaker 2: When my dad figured out that I was left-eyed dominant
• 1:12:57
  Speaker 2: when I was very little, he had to go buy
• 1:13:00
  Speaker 2: me left-handed bows because it just doesn't work. Other than that,
• 1:13:07
  Speaker 2: it was just hand-me-downs. And I just shot right-handed when
• 1:13:12
  Speaker 2: I finally did start getting left-handed bolt guns. It took
• 1:13:14
  Speaker 2: me years to get comfortable throwing the bolt with my
• 1:13:16
  Speaker 2: left hand. I was so used to throwing the, I
• 1:13:20
  Speaker 2: was so used to, to, um, taking my hand off
• 1:13:25
  Speaker 2: the four forearm to come back and throw the bolt.
• 1:13:29
  Speaker 2: Took me a long time to get used to it. Uh,
• 1:13:33
  Speaker 2: then for a while I would get into like, I
• 1:13:35
  Speaker 2: would try to find shotguns. I remember, um, know i
• 1:13:40
  Speaker 2: tried to find shotguns like like side by sides or
• 1:13:44
  Speaker 2: like i think a browning bps had it where they
• 1:13:47
  Speaker 2: had a thumb safety just like you see on side
• 1:13:50
  Speaker 2: by sides and over and unders and i would look
• 1:13:53
  Speaker 2: for that a thumb safety so it wasn't like it
• 1:13:55
  Speaker 2: was left-handed it still had a right-handed can't if it
• 1:13:57
  Speaker 2: had a canted stock but you could just get it
• 1:14:00
  Speaker 2: with the thumb and and i still today don't care
• 1:14:03
  Speaker 2: like a shooting a semi-auto like a lot of semi-autos
• 1:14:06
  Speaker 2: um like I shoot a Beretta, like I got an
• 1:14:09
  Speaker 2: A400 and A300 Beretta, you can flip the safety. So
• 1:14:16
  Speaker 2: the shell still spits out across my face to the right,
• 1:14:19
  Speaker 2: but I don't even notice it. I don't care. It's
• 1:14:21
  Speaker 2: got an ambidextrous safety. So I used to remember like
• 1:14:24
  Speaker 2: when I had a, when I had a safety guard safety,
• 1:14:27
  Speaker 2: my poi is like ready to shoot. Like you're going
• 1:14:30
  Speaker 2: into the cattail marsh and you just saw a pheasant
• 1:14:32
  Speaker 2: run in there and you know, he's going to explode.
• 1:14:34
  Speaker 1: My position would be like this.
• 1:14:38
  Speaker 2: So my finger could be on, like I'd be like contorted.
• 1:14:41
  Speaker 2: So my fingers on the safety. Now you can just
• 1:14:43
  Speaker 2: switch that son of a bitch around and stand normal.
• 1:14:46
  Speaker 2: And it's a right-handed gun, but just has a left-hand safe.
• 1:14:49
  Speaker 2: That's all I really care about. And on bolts now,
• 1:14:51
  Speaker 2: I don't even think about it. I shoot left-handed bolts,
• 1:14:55
  Speaker 2: but if I'm shooting my kids right-handed bolts, I don't like,
• 1:14:58
  Speaker 2: I'm not like all flabbergasted about what to do.
• 1:15:03
  Speaker 3: On the note of safety, a listener wrote in about what,
• 1:15:07
  Speaker 3: get somebody cut from your camp for good from your
• 1:15:11
  Speaker 3: hunting crew. And have you ever been cut from a camp?
• 1:15:13
  Speaker 2: I don't know, man. Maybe I have. I never had
• 1:15:16
  Speaker 2: someone tell me I was, maybe I have been, um, well,
• 1:15:20
  Speaker 2: I don't know. Like, I think that getting cut from
• 1:15:24
  Speaker 2: camp would be no different than get big than getting
• 1:15:27
  Speaker 2: cut from coming over for dinner or something. I remember
• 1:15:32
  Speaker 2: years ago, I had a writer over my house and, um,
• 1:15:36
  Speaker 2: like a really good writer. came over to my house
• 1:15:38
  Speaker 2: for dinner, a guy, a person I admired. And when
• 1:15:41
  Speaker 2: he left, my wife said, that guy's not welcome back
• 1:15:44
  Speaker 2: in the house.
• 1:15:45
  Speaker 1: And, um, like if it was camp, he.
• 1:15:50
  Speaker 2: Wouldn't be coming, but you know, he wouldn't be coming
• 1:15:52
  Speaker 2: back either.
• 1:15:53
  Speaker 1: So I don't, I don't think it's, I don't think
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 1: it's different.
• 1:15:56
  Speaker 2: I guess like just dickishness or being like, you know,
• 1:16:00
  Speaker 2: being rude or being, um, just focused on one's own good. Not, not,
• 1:16:09
  Speaker 2: not teaming up, you know, like, well, I didn't catch
• 1:16:11
  Speaker 2: any of those fish today, so I'm not going to
• 1:16:12
  Speaker 2: clean fish, which I don't know, just like selfishness. I
• 1:16:15
  Speaker 2: don't know. The same things would make it that you
• 1:16:17
  Speaker 2: didn't want them over your house. I don't, I can't
• 1:16:19
  Speaker 2: think of versions that are like hunting specific unless someone would,
• 1:16:23
  Speaker 2: I guess I could. Someone's unsafe with firearm handling and
• 1:16:28
  Speaker 2: you address it with them. And that's another thing that
• 1:16:30
  Speaker 2: just has to be out in the open talked about,
• 1:16:34
  Speaker 2: which is uncomfortable, but I will say to people.
• 1:16:38
  Speaker 1: I appreciate that you.
• 1:16:40
  Speaker 2: Don't have a round chamber or whatever you got going
• 1:16:42
  Speaker 2: on there, but please, watch your muzzle.
• 1:16:47
  Speaker 1: If someone's like, hey, I'm going to do with my
• 1:16:49
  Speaker 1: muzzle what I will.
• 1:16:50
  Speaker 2: I don't know.
• 1:16:51
  Speaker 1: Do people do that?
• 1:16:52
  Speaker 2: If some guy said that, I'd be like, I don't
• 1:16:54
  Speaker 2: think we can camp together, man. But it doesn't come up.
• 1:16:58
  Speaker 2: It's just the normal garden variety dickishness, I guess, would
• 1:17:03
  Speaker 2: do it.
• 1:17:05
  Speaker 3: Do you think hunters are actually winning the public lands fight?
• 1:17:08
  Speaker 2: I don't know that you win it. I don't think
• 1:17:13
  Speaker 2: it can be one. I think that it would be much,
• 1:17:19
  Speaker 2: much worse, much, much worse without hunters. The reason I
• 1:17:27
  Speaker 2: say that is that when you go to do, and again,
• 1:17:33
  Speaker 2: people are like, oh, I don't like politics. Well, buddy,
• 1:17:35
  Speaker 2: Public land is political. National forests are political. Public land
• 1:17:42
  Speaker 2: is political. Most assaults on public land, not most, virtually
• 1:17:51
  Speaker 2: all assaults on public land, meaning people that want to
• 1:17:53
  Speaker 2: go sell off big blocks of public land or strip
• 1:17:58
  Speaker 2: away protections on big blocks of public land, like it
• 1:18:01
  Speaker 2: or not, come from the Republican side of the aisle, okay?
• 1:18:06
  Speaker 2: Assaults on firearms, assaults on hunting culture in general, come
• 1:18:13
  Speaker 2: from the Democrat side of the aisle. It's just how
• 1:18:17
  Speaker 2: it is. You can get pissed or you can just
• 1:18:18
  Speaker 2: accept that that's the truth. Hunters generally tend, politically, tend
• 1:18:26
  Speaker 2: centrist and tend right. When Republicans are going, not just
• 1:18:32
  Speaker 2: Republicans in general, when certain Republicans, and there are repeat
• 1:18:35
  Speaker 2: players that just spend their careers trying to assault public lands,
• 1:18:39
  Speaker 2: when they're doing their little deeds, they know, they've already
• 1:18:44
  Speaker 2: baked in, they understand where the pressure from the left
• 1:18:48
  Speaker 2: will come, and they don't care. and they already calculated
• 1:18:52
  Speaker 2: it in what surprises them is when a voting block
• 1:18:56
  Speaker 2: that they view to be friendly generally supportive generally favorable
• 1:19:03
  Speaker 2: impressions of when that voting block goes uh-uh that makes
• 1:19:08
  Speaker 2: them nervous Because most politicians, when you look at exit polls,
• 1:19:12
  Speaker 2: when you look.
• 1:19:12
  Speaker 1: At election results, all the politicians.
• 1:19:14
  Speaker 2: In America are sitting there on like 51-49 splits, 52-48 splits,
• 1:19:15
  Speaker 2: 49.5-50.5 splits. even in places they regard as safe, like
• 1:19:38
  Speaker 2: you could be regarded as safe on a four or
• 1:19:41
  Speaker 2: five point spread in this country, politically. Congressmen, senators, governors,
• 1:19:48
  Speaker 2: it's like no one is sitting out there like being
• 1:19:51
  Speaker 2: like 80% of the vote right here in the back.
• 1:19:53
  Speaker 2: It just doesn't happen anymore in American politics. So when
• 1:19:57
  Speaker 2: a politician is looking at They're looking at their 51-49 split.
• 1:20:03
  Speaker 1: And within that split.
• 1:20:05
  Speaker 2: They see that a bunch of that, those ones that
• 1:20:09
  Speaker 2: hover on that edge, when they're like, man, those guys
• 1:20:12
  Speaker 2: are pissed. That makes them nervous. So without Hunter blowback
• 1:20:19
  Speaker 2: about public land sell-offs, I think that they would have happened.
• 1:20:23
  Speaker 2: Because they already know that like Patagonia, not to discredit them,
• 1:20:28
  Speaker 2: they already know they'll be mad. They don't care, right?
• 1:20:33
  Speaker 2: Or certain organizations, they know. It's like when the ones
• 1:20:36
  Speaker 2: that they view are like friendly-ish, that makes them nervous.
• 1:20:42
  Speaker 2: So that little fraction of pushback, which might seem numerically inconsequential,
• 1:20:50
  Speaker 2: winds up being very important when they view what they're
• 1:20:52
  Speaker 2: working on. So it would be a lot worse if
• 1:20:57
  Speaker 2: it wasn't for them. I can't, but it's not a
• 1:20:59
  Speaker 2: thing you'll win. It's not a thing you'll win long-term.
• 1:21:05
  Speaker 2: To win it long-term, it would be somehow that there
• 1:21:11
  Speaker 2: was some... You're not going to win it. I was
• 1:21:16
  Speaker 2: going to lay out some wild-ass scenario of American politics
• 1:21:20
  Speaker 2: that isn't going to happen. You'll never win. It'd just
• 1:21:24
  Speaker 2: be the same fight over and over again until the
• 1:21:27
  Speaker 2: end of time. A few folks wrote in.
• 1:21:31
  Speaker 3: With the comment that you're one of the most influential
• 1:21:34
  Speaker 3: people in conservation, just the place that you sit. And
• 1:21:38
  Speaker 3: what are your thoughts about that? Do you, do you
• 1:21:40
  Speaker 3: think about it often? Do you spend too much of
• 1:21:42
  Speaker 3: your time thinking about broken generators?
• 1:21:45
  Speaker 1: Where do you land?
• 1:21:47
  Speaker 2: No, I, I, no, I don't think, I really don't
• 1:21:52
  Speaker 2: think about that. I don't think about it cause it's
• 1:21:54
  Speaker 2: not fun to think about. And I don't think about
• 1:21:56
  Speaker 2: it cause it's just not kind of, It's not how
• 1:22:04
  Speaker 2: I view the world. A thing I remember, if you'd
• 1:22:11
  Speaker 2: asked me when I was a kid, when I was
• 1:22:17
  Speaker 2: in high school and stuff, we were all already very, we,
• 1:22:23
  Speaker 2: my family, a lot of my friends, we were obsessed
• 1:22:26
  Speaker 2: with hunting and fishing. That was the main thing we
• 1:22:28
  Speaker 2: liked to go do. Our main recreational activity was hunting
• 1:22:32
  Speaker 2: and fishing. And we would look to people that celebrated
• 1:22:36
  Speaker 2: that lifestyle and be excited about them. I remember we'd
• 1:22:39
  Speaker 2: go to like Nugent's whiplash bash. Cause Nugent was this
• 1:22:42
  Speaker 2: like outspoken hunter and advocated for hunter's rights.
• 1:22:48
  Speaker 1: And so we were excited about him.
• 1:22:49
  Speaker 2: And so if you'd say like who, at that time,
• 1:22:52
  Speaker 2: if you just said, who's the most influential person in
• 1:22:55
  Speaker 2: that space, I would have perceived it being Nugent. Not
• 1:23:00
  Speaker 2: that he was, um, because he was a person that
• 1:23:05
  Speaker 2: guys like me looked up to. And there was this
• 1:23:06
  Speaker 2: whole Michigan component of it too, because he's like the
• 1:23:08
  Speaker 2: Motor City Madman. But you'd look up to it because
• 1:23:10
  Speaker 2: here's this guy celebrating and standing up for a thing
• 1:23:13
  Speaker 2: we do. You didn't get into it because Nugent got
• 1:23:16
  Speaker 2: into it, but once you were into it, you recognized
• 1:23:18
  Speaker 2: his enthusiasm. So if I have like an enthusiasm for
• 1:23:24
  Speaker 2: it that people enjoy and a perspective about it that
• 1:23:29
  Speaker 2: people like, like that's, really great. And it'd be, it'd
• 1:23:33
  Speaker 2: be obnoxious for me to say, I don't care because
• 1:23:38
  Speaker 2: if I was the only guy left on earth, I
• 1:23:40
  Speaker 2: wouldn't write books, right? I make the things I make
• 1:23:48
  Speaker 2: just like a painter makes painting. A writer makes books.
• 1:23:51
  Speaker 2: A guy that makes videos, makes videos. I make the
• 1:23:53
  Speaker 2: things I make because I want them to be seen.
• 1:23:57
  Speaker 2: I want to share my viewpoint. I would like to
• 1:24:01
  Speaker 2: influence opinion. I would love it if some political figure
• 1:24:09
  Speaker 2: became accustomed to listen to the viewpoints I express and
• 1:24:15
  Speaker 2: change their mind about something.
• 1:24:17
  Speaker 1: Or if a.
• 1:24:23
  Speaker 2: Kid like me who grows up hunting and fishing, like
• 1:24:27
  Speaker 2: I did, who is unaware of the conservation movement like
• 1:24:30
  Speaker 2: I was, and then someone brought that to light for me,
• 1:24:36
  Speaker 2: or I'm sorry, and I could bring that to light
• 1:24:40
  Speaker 2: for them the way discovering Aldo Leopold brought it to
• 1:24:43
  Speaker 2: light for me, I mean, that's absolutely phenomenal. But it's
• 1:24:46
  Speaker 2: not something I would spend time like actually pondering. I
• 1:24:55
  Speaker 2: think I am more distracted by broken generators. Right now,
• 1:25:01
  Speaker 2: to be absolutely honest with you, one of the main
• 1:25:02
  Speaker 2: things I'm thinking about is moving my raspberry patch. I
• 1:25:06
  Speaker 2: positioned it poorly. And that takes up a ton of
• 1:25:10
  Speaker 2: my mind space.
• 1:25:12
  Speaker 3: What are the considerations for your raspberry patch?
• 1:25:14
  Speaker 1: Man, I built it against a wall.
• 1:25:18
  Speaker 2: Of the house.
• 1:25:20
  Speaker 1: And it flourishes.
• 1:25:22
  Speaker 2: But you'd have to come through the wall to get
• 1:25:29
  Speaker 2: at the backside of it. It's caused huge problems. I
• 1:25:32
  Speaker 2: got to move it out from the wall. But you
• 1:25:34
  Speaker 2: know how raspberries are. They're tenacious. I'm not running to
• 1:25:36
  Speaker 2: go around spraying around broad-spectrum herbicides, but I got to
• 1:25:40
  Speaker 2: kill off that son of a bitch. And the other
• 1:25:42
  Speaker 2: problem with it is it's always wet and dank back there.
• 1:25:46
  Speaker 2: And even you can see on the wood, it's suffering
• 1:25:51
  Speaker 2: from not getting any air exposure. I got canned to
• 1:25:54
  Speaker 2: the thistle like a bastard growing back there you can't
• 1:25:57
  Speaker 2: get at. It's just a whole deal. I need to
• 1:26:00
  Speaker 2: move it out, contain it, trellis it, get at it
• 1:26:05
  Speaker 2: from both sides. That's what I'm thinking about right now.
• 1:26:10
  Speaker 2: Got it. I got a plan.
• 1:26:13
  Speaker 3: Excited to see it play out?
• 1:26:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I already talked to my fabricator buddy, Travis at
• 1:26:16
  Speaker 2: Barton Fabrication. He's on it too. He's aware.
• 1:26:18
  Speaker 3: Right. Readers, this is coming from comments on your books
• 1:26:24
  Speaker 3: as well as podcasts, but readers and listeners, comment on
• 1:26:29
  Speaker 3: your tangents, both very positively and very negatively. Some love it,
• 1:26:37
  Speaker 3: some hate it.
• 1:26:38
  Speaker 1: Thoughts?
• 1:26:39
  Speaker 2: Man, there are a lot of things that I would
• 1:26:41
  Speaker 2: hear and there are a lot of things I hear
• 1:26:45
  Speaker 2: and they get to me. Not giving accidentally making an
• 1:26:57
  Speaker 2: environment where a guest isn't able to get their opinion
• 1:27:00
  Speaker 2: out there because I've cut them off.
• 1:27:02
  Speaker 1: Like that hurts. Like, I don't want to do that.
• 1:27:06
  Speaker 2: Um, at the same time, I want to make sure
• 1:27:08
  Speaker 2: that the stuff has a flow to it and that
• 1:27:10
  Speaker 2: I can kind of get to a lot of places
• 1:27:13
  Speaker 2: I want to get to, but.
• 1:27:14
  Speaker 1: Like hearing that I'm like, man, I don't want to
• 1:27:15
  Speaker 1: be like that.
• 1:27:16
  Speaker 2: Do that.
• 1:27:16
  Speaker 1: Like I see that I get that.
• 1:27:19
  Speaker 2: I do it. I don't, I don't want to do that. Um,
• 1:27:23
  Speaker 2: and I'd be like, man, I need to work on
• 1:27:24
  Speaker 2: finding a way. Like, I don't like, I hate that.
• 1:27:28
  Speaker 2: I want to get the show to where I want
• 1:27:29
  Speaker 2: to get. I want to cover the subjects I want
• 1:27:31
  Speaker 2: to do. I want to bring out what I know
• 1:27:33
  Speaker 2: this guest has to say and not lose our two
• 1:27:36
  Speaker 2: hours or 90 minutes or 60 minutes on something. But
• 1:27:40
  Speaker 2: I need to like improve and be better. The tangent thing, like, dude,
• 1:27:44
  Speaker 2: I'm sorry. It's just how I think. Like, I wouldn't
• 1:27:49
  Speaker 2: be me if I, like, if I can't, Let me
• 1:27:55
  Speaker 2: put it this way. To me, they're not tangents. To me,
• 1:27:59
  Speaker 2: it feels like logical movement. To some people, read it
• 1:28:04
  Speaker 2: as tangents, but I can't correct it. It's just how
• 1:28:06
  Speaker 2: I view the world. Things make me think of things.
• 1:28:10
  Speaker 2: If they make me think of things, to me, it
• 1:28:13
  Speaker 2: just is connected. So no apologies. If you don't like tangents,
• 1:28:18
  Speaker 2: then I would just go read someone else. Go say,
• 1:28:21
  Speaker 2: go into your AI thing and say, give me some
• 1:28:24
  Speaker 2: shit with no tangents and see.
• 1:28:25
  Speaker 3: What it comes up with. Who's the most interesting person
• 1:28:31
  Speaker 3: in American history that nobody's written a good book about?
• 1:28:33
  Speaker 1: I can't tell you because I'm writing a book about him.
• 1:28:36
  Speaker 3: Second most interesting person that you wouldn't write about?
• 1:28:38
  Speaker 2: Let me tell you hot. I'm going to answer without
• 1:28:41
  Speaker 2: answering it. There was... No, I'm not going to get
• 1:28:47
  Speaker 2: into it. I was going to kind of like... There's
• 1:28:55
  Speaker 2: a person I'm writing a book about and I was
• 1:28:57
  Speaker 2: going to talk about the type of person. that there's
• 1:29:03
  Speaker 2: a bucket that he was in. If you bucketed people,
• 1:29:06
  Speaker 2: he was in a bucket. And I was going to
• 1:29:09
  Speaker 2: talk about the bucket. But if you knew about the bucket,
• 1:29:17
  Speaker 2: you'd be like, well, who would be in that bucket?
• 1:29:19
  Speaker 1: And you would so quickly hit on the thing that's.
• 1:29:26
  Speaker 2: In the bucket.
• 1:29:29
  Speaker 3: So let's not talk about the bucket. Let's talk about
• 1:29:32
  Speaker 3: the second person that you'll never write a book about,
• 1:29:35
  Speaker 3: or it falls out of your purview, but you're really
• 1:29:38
  Speaker 3: interested in.
• 1:29:38
  Speaker 2: I don't think I have one.
• 1:29:43
  Speaker 1: I don't know what you mean.
• 1:29:45
  Speaker 3: There's like not a Vietnam vet that you might not. Oh, anything,
• 1:29:49
  Speaker 3: anything in American history or George Washington's wife or something.
• 1:29:57
  Speaker 2: Here's what I throw out to a lot of writers.
• 1:29:59
  Speaker 2: When I, whenever I have a friend who's writing something
• 1:30:01
  Speaker 2: and they finish a book and I said, Hey, what
• 1:30:05
  Speaker 2: are you gonna do next? And then, um, and then
• 1:30:08
  Speaker 2: they're like, I don't know. I'm thinking about a lot
• 1:30:11
  Speaker 2: of things. I always go, you know, you ought to
• 1:30:13
  Speaker 2: write a book about, cause I know I'm not going
• 1:30:14
  Speaker 2: to get to it. There's this botanist named John Bradbury
• 1:30:19
  Speaker 2: and he comes out in the early 1800s to like
• 1:30:21
  Speaker 2: explore the West and do botany and, um, collect all
• 1:30:24
  Speaker 2: these examples and stuff. And he has this, uh, like
• 1:30:27
  Speaker 2: a protege with him. And to the best of my recollection,
• 1:30:32
  Speaker 2: I haven't read much about Bradbury lately. And he wrote
• 1:30:35
  Speaker 2: in his own journals and stuff. But Bradbury collects all
• 1:30:38
  Speaker 2: these botanical examples. And for whatever reason, his protege, I
• 1:30:41
  Speaker 2: can't remember the details, his protege goes back to Europe.
• 1:30:46
  Speaker 2: But Bradbury keeps having all this stuff happen that prevents
• 1:30:49
  Speaker 2: him from getting home. Like for a while, he gets
• 1:30:52
  Speaker 2: caught up. You know the New Madrid earthquake? Like, nope.
• 1:30:54
  Speaker 2: When they talk about rivers flowing backwards and stuff? Oh, yeah. Okay.
• 1:30:59
  Speaker 2: And it ties into, that's the crazy thing about this story,
• 1:31:02
  Speaker 2: it ties into Tecumseh, where Tecumseh the warrior had a
• 1:31:11
  Speaker 2: prophet brother, right? And they had this prophecy that they
• 1:31:14
  Speaker 2: were going to, Tecumseh's mission was he was going to
• 1:31:16
  Speaker 2: expel white people from North America. And he had this
• 1:31:19
  Speaker 2: prophet brother, and they were like, there will be this
• 1:31:21
  Speaker 2: big earthquake. And the earthquake happened. It was the New
• 1:31:23
  Speaker 2: Madrid Earthquake. And not only that, but it made rivers
• 1:31:26
  Speaker 2: flow backwards. The Mississippi flowed backwards for a minute. The
• 1:31:30
  Speaker 2: New Madrid fall, all this crazy shit. So Bradbury gets
• 1:31:34
  Speaker 2: like delayed by this. He gets delayed by the War
• 1:31:37
  Speaker 2: of 1812. And by the time he gets back home,
• 1:31:42
  Speaker 2: his protege has gone.
• 1:31:44
  Speaker 3: And published.
• 1:31:46
  Speaker 1: His findings.
• 1:31:49
  Speaker 2: And this is back when, now you think of going,
• 1:31:51
  Speaker 2: like if you're a European and you go to America, Like,
• 1:31:54
  Speaker 2: I'm going to go visit America. Okay, like, what are
• 1:31:55
  Speaker 2: you going on, two weeks? This is back when going
• 1:31:57
  Speaker 2: to visit America was like years.
• 1:32:03
  Speaker 1: That's an interesting dude.
• 1:32:07
  Speaker 3: When you read a book that has foreign language in
• 1:32:09
  Speaker 3: it that you don't understand, Spanish in the Border Trilogy,
• 1:32:13
  Speaker 3: do you translate it?
• 1:32:14
  Speaker 2: No, and it's obnoxious when writers do that. And it
• 1:32:17
  Speaker 2: tells a lot about who, like, if you read the
• 1:32:19
  Speaker 2: New Yorker magazine, like, New Yorker's magazine's got a lot
• 1:32:22
  Speaker 2: of great stuff in it, always has. They'll do like,
• 1:32:25
  Speaker 2: the writers there will be like, oh, I'm going to
• 1:32:27
  Speaker 2: put some sentences in French. It's so obnoxious. McCarthy, a
• 1:32:31
  Speaker 2: favorite writer of mine, has that whole Spanish thing. It's like,
• 1:32:36
  Speaker 2: what is that all about? Like, come on.
• 1:32:40
  Speaker 1: It's obnoxious.
• 1:32:41
  Speaker 2: It's obnoxious.
• 1:32:42
  Speaker 1: If I really....
• 1:32:46
  Speaker 2: It's obnoxious. The only way to handle it would be like,
• 1:32:48
  Speaker 2: I think that... You look at Brian Burrow and his book,
• 1:32:52
  Speaker 2: The Gunfighters. He talks about the last words ever spoken
• 1:32:59
  Speaker 2: to Billy the Kid, okay? They were spoken in Spanish.
• 1:33:08
  Speaker 2: But it's great to say, it's great for him to
• 1:33:11
  Speaker 2: be like, here's the last words that ever entered the
• 1:33:15
  Speaker 2: ear of Billy the Kid or whatever, right? but then
• 1:33:20
  Speaker 2: you got to say what the hell they mean in English.
• 1:33:21
  Speaker 2: You can't just leave it. Like no writer could be like,
• 1:33:23
  Speaker 2: here's the last thing he ever heard, which I think
• 1:33:25
  Speaker 2: is Kienes. Kienes. Um, don't leave people hanging, dude. Tell
• 1:33:33
  Speaker 2: me what the hell he said.
• 1:33:33
  Speaker 1: Who is it?
• 1:33:34
  Speaker 2: Who is it? Whatever the hell it was. I can't remember.
• 1:33:37
  Speaker 2: I think that was it.
• 1:33:39
  Speaker 3: What's the best sentence in American literature?
• 1:33:43
  Speaker 2: You know, it's hilarious. The other day we were somewhere
• 1:33:46
  Speaker 2: filming up and we were, We were up in Nunavut
• 1:33:50
  Speaker 2: with some whale hunters. And so Dirt, no, someone, yeah,
• 1:33:55
  Speaker 2: I think Dirt, our camera guy Dirt brought along, he
• 1:33:58
  Speaker 2: brought along Moby Dick, you know? And we're laughing about
• 1:34:01
  Speaker 2: how Moby Dick's the only book that everybody knows the
• 1:34:04
  Speaker 2: first sentence because it's three words, call me Ishmael. So
• 1:34:08
  Speaker 2: we're like, I was like, I see the book. I'm like, dude,
• 1:34:11
  Speaker 2: I can tell you the first sentence in that book.
• 1:34:12
  Speaker 2: And we're laughing like, if there's one book in America
• 1:34:15
  Speaker 2: that people know the first sentence of, it's Moby Dick
• 1:34:17
  Speaker 2: because it's call me Ishmael. It's sort of famous for
• 1:34:21
  Speaker 2: how simple it is. My favorite is when the dog
• 1:34:28
  Speaker 2: barks or growls her warning in the night, I question
• 1:34:34
  Speaker 2: whether it will be a stray cat, a skunk, a killer,
• 1:34:39
  Speaker 2: or a ghost. That's a fave of mine. Don't you
• 1:34:46
  Speaker 2: want to know where it came from?
• 1:34:47
  Speaker 3: I was going to let the listeners find out.
• 1:34:49
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 1:34:50
  Speaker 3: Feel free.
• 1:34:51
  Speaker 2: No. Find out.
• 1:34:54
  Speaker 3: A listener wrote in wondering if you got his gift,
• 1:34:57
  Speaker 3: an original hard copy screenplay of Apocalypse Now. Yeah.
• 1:35:01
  Speaker 2: I have it on my bookshelf in a very prominent location.
• 1:35:03
  Speaker 2: I can't believe I didn't reach out about this. Yes.
• 1:35:08
  Speaker 3: There you go. Dude.
• 1:35:09
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 1:35:11
  Speaker 3: Hey, we're going to go on a lightning round.
• 1:35:12
  Speaker 1: Favorite movie of all time.
• 1:35:14
  Speaker 2: Oh.
• 1:35:15
  Speaker 3: Rank your top three Vietnam movies.
• 1:35:20
  Speaker 2: I don't bucket Apocalypse Now as a Vietnam movie. It
• 1:35:23
  Speaker 2: transcends genre. Heart of Darkness. It transcends genre. Besides how
• 1:35:29
  Speaker 2: masterful it is, it's just masterful. I'm not alone here.
• 1:35:33
  Speaker 2: If you go ask film critics for a list of
• 1:35:34
  Speaker 2: the top 10 greatest movies of all time, it's going
• 1:35:36
  Speaker 2: to find its way onto everybody's list. What it is
• 1:35:39
  Speaker 2: it's about, and it becomes more relevant all the time,
• 1:35:43
  Speaker 2: is it's about total war. Why does America lose its con?
• 1:35:51
  Speaker 2: Like why after world war two, do we lose our conflicts?
• 1:35:58
  Speaker 2: And it's about total war, the moral of total war.
• 1:36:04
  Speaker 2: And it's about a person who Colonel Kurtz, um, him
• 1:36:11
  Speaker 2: realizing in Vietnam, here's what winning will look like. And
• 1:36:15
  Speaker 2: I'm going to do it.
• 1:36:16
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 1:36:17
  Speaker 2: In the madness of total war. And so it just
• 1:36:20
  Speaker 2: is like relevant and relevant and relevant and relevant. Our
• 1:36:24
  Speaker 2: current conflict in Iran, you want to understand it? Go
• 1:36:28
  Speaker 2: watch Apocalypse Now. Why are we losing there?
• 1:36:32
  Speaker 1: It's outlandish.
• 1:36:32
  Speaker 2: How are we losing there? Well, not comfortable with what
• 1:36:38
  Speaker 2: it takes to really win. And Kurtz was. Kurtz was.
• 1:36:47
  Speaker 3: Speaking of top threes, you can get rid of one
• 1:36:50
  Speaker 3: of the following, and the other two will remain forever.
• 1:36:54
  Speaker 2: Hogs. What now?
• 1:36:56
  Speaker 3: You can get rid of one of the following animals,
• 1:36:59
  Speaker 3: and the other two from this list will remain forever. Hogs,
• 1:37:04
  Speaker 3: Asian carp, or kudzu.
• 1:37:12
  Speaker 2: Not hogs. I can't say and here's the reason why
• 1:37:30
  Speaker 2: it's so tricky introducing pathogens and shit into water like
• 1:37:37
  Speaker 2: fish that exists alongside other fish are hard to target
• 1:37:44
  Speaker 2: we use rotenone to when you've got an overwhelming problem
• 1:37:48
  Speaker 2: you use rotenone but you're wiping the slate clean If
• 1:37:54
  Speaker 2: you get an invasive fish in a river system and
• 1:37:57
  Speaker 2: it gets so bad, right, that you're like, well, total war.
• 1:38:04
  Speaker 2: You got to get, you kill all the fish. And
• 1:38:08
  Speaker 2: then you start over. And it's very hard to do.
• 1:38:14
  Speaker 2: So I could see it. It's never going to be
• 1:38:17
  Speaker 2: that we're going to develop like some fish pathogen or something.
• 1:38:20
  Speaker 2: I shouldn't say never. It's so hard to picture that
• 1:38:22
  Speaker 2: we would develop some pathogen. some virus that we're convinced
• 1:38:27
  Speaker 2: will only target native carp We're going to dump barrels
• 1:38:30
  Speaker 2: of this shit into the river and all the non-native
• 1:38:33
  Speaker 2: carp are going to go belly up and float away
• 1:38:36
  Speaker 2: and all the other species are going to be sitting
• 1:38:37
  Speaker 2: there like, fine. So hard to picture. So if I
• 1:38:42
  Speaker 2: could take magic to remedy the problem, maybe I would
• 1:38:44
  Speaker 2: use magic. On the other hand, we have a terrestrial
• 1:38:49
  Speaker 2: like a land-based biodiversity crisis brought on by non-native vegetation
• 1:38:55
  Speaker 2: um but it picked but i view it a little
• 1:38:58
  Speaker 2: bit like i can just picture a world where some
• 1:39:03
  Speaker 2: genius comes up with a compound that can be spot
• 1:39:09
  Speaker 2: applied on kudzu and start getting kudzu under control so
• 1:39:14
  Speaker 2: maybe it wouldn't require matt it's just Pictures would be like,
• 1:39:18
  Speaker 2: will science find a fix for kudzu or non-native carp quicker?
• 1:39:24
  Speaker 1: I guess I would just bet on kudzu. But I
• 1:39:28
  Speaker 1: don't know why.
• 1:39:28
  Speaker 2: I'm not an expert in this. And so if I
• 1:39:31
  Speaker 2: could bet on them, then I'd have to use the
• 1:39:33
  Speaker 2: magic somewhere else. But it's just too, I'd have to
• 1:39:36
  Speaker 2: spend some time talking to people about that. Well, let's
• 1:39:38
  Speaker 2: say you can't, there's no scientific way to do it.
• 1:39:42
  Speaker 3: And you have a wand that can remove all of
• 1:39:45
  Speaker 3: the invasives that from the water systems like rivers, lakes,
• 1:39:49
  Speaker 3: whatever zebra mussels, catfish, or sorry, carp.
• 1:39:53
  Speaker 2: I'd hit that one.
• 1:39:54
  Speaker 3: Or all of the non-native plant species.
• 1:39:57
  Speaker 2: I'd do the water. Why is that? I don't know.
• 1:40:04
  Speaker 2: I love water and I love fish. And it's like,
• 1:40:06
  Speaker 2: there's like a, there's a looming biodiversity crisis in the
• 1:40:10
  Speaker 2: water from non-natives and also a risk of, of just
• 1:40:14
  Speaker 2: everything becoming kind of the same. Um, and you know,
• 1:40:19
  Speaker 2: and those Asian carp are going to not that the
• 1:40:22
  Speaker 2: great lakes aren't full of non-natives anyways.
• 1:40:24
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:40:24
  Speaker 2: I would just, I would, for me with what I'm
• 1:40:26
  Speaker 2: interested in and where I'm focused and where I feel
• 1:40:29
  Speaker 2: like I have a level of expertise, I would just
• 1:40:31
  Speaker 2: be like, I'm going to do, I'm going to blow
• 1:40:33
  Speaker 2: my wand shake on the water and do non-natives out
• 1:40:37
  Speaker 2: of the water. And that would mean when I do that,
• 1:40:41
  Speaker 2: I will draw the ire.
• 1:40:43
  Speaker 1: Of a great many.
• 1:40:46
  Speaker 2: Western fly fishermen who will no longer have their pet
• 1:40:51
  Speaker 2: rainbows and brown trouts. I feel like half of them
• 1:40:58
  Speaker 2: don't even know it. Non-natives. Rainbows, brown trouts, ain't natives
• 1:41:04
  Speaker 2: in this area and in many areas. So yeah, I'd
• 1:41:07
  Speaker 2: take on a lot of enemies. I'd take on a
• 1:41:09
  Speaker 2: ton of enemies, but I would do it. For the
• 1:41:13
  Speaker 2: greater good of America's waterways. You look at what's going
• 1:41:17
  Speaker 2: on right now in the Susitna system in Alaska with
• 1:41:20
  Speaker 2: Northern Pike invading the Susitna systems. It could potentially be
• 1:41:24
  Speaker 2: catastrophic for salmon.
• 1:41:28
  Speaker 3: Yeah. You can go back in time or you can
• 1:41:32
  Speaker 3: transport it here. One extinct animal that you'd like to hunt,
• 1:41:36
  Speaker 3: including dinosaurs.
• 1:41:39
  Speaker 2: Passenger pigeons, I guess.
• 1:41:40
  Speaker 1: Because it's so recent.
• 1:41:44
  Speaker 2: So recent.
• 1:41:45
  Speaker 1: And they should be here.
• 1:41:46
  Speaker 2: You know what I mean? They should be here. When
• 1:41:48
  Speaker 2: you get into stuff like mammoths or whatever, mammoths are
• 1:41:52
  Speaker 2: super cool. Wooly mammoths, but the verdict is out, you know, people,
• 1:41:58
  Speaker 2: it's so hotly debated, but we don't, we don't know
• 1:42:01
  Speaker 2: for certain that it was a human caused extinction. There's a,
• 1:42:05
  Speaker 2: there's a argument to be made that it was, and
• 1:42:08
  Speaker 2: there's like really good counter arguments that it was not,
• 1:42:12
  Speaker 2: that it was just, a thing that would have happened
• 1:42:14
  Speaker 2: even in the absence of humans. Passenger pigeons are like,
• 1:42:18
  Speaker 2: it's just, it's just people. People did it. And people
• 1:42:22
  Speaker 2: did it recently. People did it. They did it recent.
• 1:42:30
  Speaker 2: A thing that would be like a beloved game bird.
• 1:42:32
  Speaker 2: So yeah, that we would have somehow huntable populations of
• 1:42:36
  Speaker 2: passenger pigeons would be, would be spectacular.
• 1:42:39
  Speaker 3: Well, A few listeners want to know your take on
• 1:42:45
  Speaker 3: Sasquatch anatomy. Is it human style or more like a dog?
• 1:42:49
  Speaker 2: What do you mean?
• 1:42:53
  Speaker 3: It's reproductive parts.
• 1:42:55
  Speaker 1: Oh, it's Packer?
• 1:42:56
  Speaker 2: Yep. It's definitely like a dog, man. Yeah.
• 1:43:03
  Speaker 1: That's a great question. It's definitely like a lipstick. Lipstick stick.
• 1:43:07
  Speaker 2: 100%.
• 1:43:07
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:43:13
  Speaker 2: He's not running around with a big old hang down, dude.
• 1:43:15
  Speaker 2: It's like no one talks about that. A couple people
• 1:43:18
  Speaker 2: are wondering about it.
• 1:43:19
  Speaker 1: No, but I mean the people that run into him.
• 1:43:22
  Speaker 1: Like if you see, when you see a naked.
• 1:43:24
  Speaker 2: Dude running around, you know, it's like, it's just, it's
• 1:43:32
  Speaker 2: loud and proud. But it's just, there would be a
• 1:43:36
  Speaker 2: thing observed by Sasquatch observers.
• 1:43:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a lipstick.
• 1:43:40
  Speaker 3: Okay. What have you changed your mind about in the
• 1:43:44
  Speaker 3: last five years?
• 1:43:47
  Speaker 2: What haven't I changed my mind about in five years? Yeah,
• 1:43:51
  Speaker 2: I don't mean that. There's many things I haven't changed
• 1:43:53
  Speaker 2: my mind about in the last five years. I don't know,
• 1:43:56
  Speaker 2: I change my mind all the time. And I don't
• 1:43:58
  Speaker 2: think it changed your, people have an idea that changing
• 1:44:00
  Speaker 2: your mind is kind of like bad. You know, like
• 1:44:01
  Speaker 2: with politicians, you're always like, he's a flip-flopper, you know?
• 1:44:05
  Speaker 2: And when it's just, when you flip-flop for political expediency,
• 1:44:08
  Speaker 2: it's one thing, but if you have like an evolving
• 1:44:10
  Speaker 2: understanding of things, One of the things I tip on
• 1:44:14
  Speaker 2: all the time is I'm always like, who's worse? Are
• 1:44:18
  Speaker 2: Democrats worse for hunters and anglers or are Republicans worse
• 1:44:21
  Speaker 2: for hunters and anglers? That's the one I bounce on
• 1:44:24
  Speaker 2: all the time. And it has a lot to do
• 1:44:26
  Speaker 2: with what's going on in the moment. You know what
• 1:44:28
  Speaker 2: I mean? So if I look at areas where there's
• 1:44:30
  Speaker 2: a strong Democrat control, I look at erosion of hunter rights,
• 1:44:35
  Speaker 2: the way they kind of buckle to animal rights extremists,
• 1:44:39
  Speaker 2: the way they buckle to gun control people you know
• 1:44:43
  Speaker 2: i look at like i'm like ah sons of bitches
• 1:44:46
  Speaker 2: and then republicans are in and i look at the
• 1:44:49
  Speaker 2: way they strip land protections away and want to sell
• 1:44:51
  Speaker 2: public lands off and i'm like ah you sons of
• 1:44:53
  Speaker 2: bitches and and i just i bounce on stuff like
• 1:44:56
  Speaker 2: that um other we're talking about one day our day
• 1:45:00
  Speaker 2: man it wasn't in the last five years but we
• 1:45:02
  Speaker 2: were having a debate with young parents it'd be like
• 1:45:05
  Speaker 2: uh we're talking with some friends of ours who are
• 1:45:09
  Speaker 2: have a baby a baby baby And they're like, hey,
• 1:45:12
  Speaker 2: where did you guys land on spanking? And we talked
• 1:45:16
  Speaker 2: about our sort of evolution as parents on that issue
• 1:45:23
  Speaker 2: and where we ultimately landed on it and that it
• 1:45:26
  Speaker 2: involved a sort of changing perspective.
• 1:45:30
  Speaker 1: Something became kind of true that was other than we expected.
• 1:45:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I don't know. I guess life's just like that.
• 1:45:41
  Speaker 2: Life's just like that. And there are other bits like,
• 1:45:43
  Speaker 2: then there's other just kind of fun things. I used
• 1:45:47
  Speaker 2: to be adamant that humans killed off. We talked about
• 1:45:50
  Speaker 2: this a minute ago. I used to be adamant that
• 1:45:52
  Speaker 2: humans killed off mammoths. I was adamant that the first
• 1:45:56
  Speaker 2: Americans arrived.
• 1:46:00
  Speaker 1: Via land.
• 1:46:00
  Speaker 3: Okay.
• 1:46:02
  Speaker 2: Through a gap in the glaciers. Then I was like
• 1:46:05
  Speaker 2: adamant that they didn't kill off. mammoths and they maybe
• 1:46:08
  Speaker 2: arrived on a coastal route and then i like i
• 1:46:11
  Speaker 2: like bounce on that so everything from like little fun
• 1:46:14
  Speaker 2: things like that to um um mechanical broadheads versus fixed
• 1:46:21
  Speaker 2: i mean like like big things like politics and it's
• 1:46:25
  Speaker 2: just it's always i'm constantly changing my mind about shit
• 1:46:28
  Speaker 2: constantly change my mind about stuff.
• 1:46:31
  Speaker 3: Uh what are you most excited about in the next year.
• 1:46:40
  Speaker 2: If I think of like, when I think of excitement,
• 1:46:43
  Speaker 2: like big excitement stuff, all that, that, that really, for
• 1:46:48
  Speaker 2: me is, you know, I was kind of joking early
• 1:46:50
  Speaker 2: about raspberries, you know, um, kind of joking because I'm
• 1:46:55
  Speaker 2: fixated on my raspberry problem right now. But for me,
• 1:46:58
  Speaker 2: like in all honesty, like in all, like, and like
• 1:47:01
  Speaker 2: my big heart areas, my big mind areas, my stuff
• 1:47:06
  Speaker 2: is with like, I'm with my kids. I'm with that
• 1:47:09
  Speaker 2: journey of, of raising kids with my wife. Like that's,
• 1:47:16
  Speaker 2: that's like the one thing that I can't give on.
• 1:47:19
  Speaker 2: You know what I mean? Like everything, you can strip
• 1:47:21
  Speaker 2: every other aspect of my life away and I'd be
• 1:47:24
  Speaker 2: sad to see it go, but, but that would be
• 1:47:26
  Speaker 2: like unlivable, right?
• 1:47:28
  Speaker 1: It would, it would be literally unlivable.
• 1:47:31
  Speaker 2: Meaning if I didn't have them, I would not want to,
• 1:47:34
  Speaker 2: I wouldn't stick around to see the other half of life. So,
• 1:47:41
  Speaker 2: excitement is just seeing them come up, you know, seeing
• 1:47:45
  Speaker 2: them come up. It's the main thing. So to give
• 1:47:48
  Speaker 2: an honest answer, it's just like about their milestones. My boy,
• 1:47:53
  Speaker 2: he's dealing with a knee issue. Like, how is that
• 1:47:55
  Speaker 2: going to resolve? Like, that's what I'm excited about. All
• 1:47:57
  Speaker 2: these things.
• 1:47:59
  Speaker 3: That's all we had.
• 1:48:00
  Speaker 1: That's it?
• 1:48:01
  Speaker 3: Yep.
• 1:48:01
  Speaker 2: All right, there you go.
• 1:48:05
  Speaker 3: Thanks for writing in.
• 1:48:06
  Speaker 2: Ask me anything.
• 1:48:09
  Speaker 1: So I tell my kids, ask me anything.
• 1:48:10
  Speaker 3: If you got other questions, maybe we'll do this again.
• 1:48:12
  Speaker 3: Send them to the inbox. Put it in the comments.
• 1:48:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah, please.
• 1:48:17
  Speaker 2: Maybe in a couple years we'll get to them. But seriously,
• 1:48:20
  Speaker 2: thanks to everybody that did take time to write in
• 1:48:21
  Speaker 2: a question. I appreciate it.
• 1:48:23
  Speaker 1: Next week, news show back to normal.
• 1:48:28
  Speaker 3: Yes, sir.
• 1:48:29
  Speaker 1: All news, big and small, next week.
• 1:48:31
  Speaker 2: Thank you. Thank you.