Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / Nick Reiner Indicted Murder One, Tries to Crack Million Dollar Trust Fund

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Nick Reiner Indicted Murder One, Tries to Crack Million Dollar Trust Fund · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:00
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
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Speaker 2: NEPO baby Nick Reiner just indicted in the murders of
0:13
Speaker 2: his parents, famed director Rob Reiner and his own mother,
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Speaker 2: Michelle Singer Reiner. This as Nick Reiner, the thirty plus
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Speaker 2: year old NEPO baby, tries to crack into his multi
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Speaker 2: million dollar trust fund set up by the parents he
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Speaker 2: allegedly murdered. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. I
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Speaker 2: want to thank you for being with us. Thirty three
0:44
Speaker 2: year old NEPO baby Nick Reiner formally indicted in the
0:49
Speaker 2: murders of parents Rob and Michelle Reiner, with disturbing special
0:55
Speaker 2: circumstances added on this as he tries to crack into
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Speaker 2: a multimillion dollar trust fund set up by his murdered parents.
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Speaker 2: The indictment alleges aggravating circumstances. What are aggravating circumstances? They
1:13
Speaker 2: are charges in the indictment, special charges that could trigger
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Speaker 2: the death penalty. Not just any murder charge triggers the
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Speaker 2: death penalty. There must be aggravating or special circumstances here.
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Speaker 2: Special circumstances are multiple murders translation anything more than one
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Speaker 2: dead body, multiple murders and lying in wait lying in wait.
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Speaker 2: Why is that aggravating Because you didn't just pick up
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Speaker 2: a gun and pull the trigger. You lie coldly in wait,
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Speaker 2: waiting for your chance to kill, giving you time to
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Speaker 2: think over what you're doing. Also, it's alled he used
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Speaker 2: a knife as a deadly weapon. Another aggravating circumstance. In
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Speaker 2: this bill of indictment, the crimes quote involved great violence,
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Speaker 2: great bodily harm, threat of great bodily harm, or high
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Speaker 2: degree of cruelty, viciousness, or callousness. Also, the indictment calls
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Speaker 2: the victims particularly vulnerable. Why because their senior citizens in
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Speaker 2: their sleep in their own bed. As I often said
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Speaker 2: in court, your honor, may I refresh the witness's recollection translation.
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Speaker 2: This is what happened. Rob Reiner and his wife were murdered.
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Speaker 3: Their daughter came across the street that she lives right
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Speaker 3: across the road, and.
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Speaker 4: Then she finds their bodies. They had multiple stab wounds.
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Speaker 5: I got totally spun out on uppers. I think it
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Speaker 5: was coke and something else, and I was up for
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Speaker 5: days on end, and I started punching out different things
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Speaker 5: in my guest outs.
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Speaker 6: Like a frame, like what like a stuff.
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Speaker 5: I think I started with the TV, and then I
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Speaker 5: went over to the lamp, and then progressively I just
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Speaker 5: everything in the guest house got wrecked.
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Speaker 7: Our office will be filing charges against Nick Reiner, who
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Speaker 7: was accused of killing his parents, actor director Rob Reiner
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Speaker 7: and photographer producer Michelle Singer Reiner. These charges will be
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Speaker 7: two counts of first degree murder with a special circumstance
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Speaker 7: of multiple murders. He also fast is a special allegation
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Speaker 7: that he personally used a dangerous and deadly weapon, that
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Speaker 7: being a knife.
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Speaker 2: You are hearing the local district attorney, and earlier you
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Speaker 2: were hearing Rob Reiner, Michelle Reiner's son, Nick Reiner, describing
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Speaker 2: how he totally got spun out on uppers. I think
4:03
Speaker 2: I was on coke and something else. I was up
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Speaker 2: for days on end, had started punching out different.
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Speaker 4: Things in my guest house.
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Speaker 2: Let me just do a quick little correction right there,
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Speaker 2: Kilo Brantley joining us, a reporter at large dailymail dot Com.
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Speaker 4: It wasn't his guest house.
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Speaker 2: He was living on the largesse of his parents, Rob
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Speaker 2: and Michelle Reiner, and this wasn't the first time he
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Speaker 2: totally destroyed the guest house.
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Speaker 4: I mean the entitlement of this guy.
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Speaker 8: Is it true?
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Speaker 2: From what very different from what we first learned that
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Speaker 2: Rob and Michelle Singer Reiner were found their throats slit
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Speaker 2: in their own bed. Is that true, Kila Brantley.
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Speaker 9: That's exactly right, Nancy. It was around a Sunday at
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Speaker 9: three point thirty pm when their bodies were discovered. And
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Speaker 9: what we're now learning is that Rob and Michelle Reiner
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Speaker 9: had been dead in their bed for some hours. So
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Speaker 9: of course now the police are putting together a timeline
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Speaker 9: of when this could have happened. We know Saturday night
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Speaker 9: there was a fight with Nick and his parents at
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Speaker 9: a party at Conin O'Brien's house at Christmas party, and
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Speaker 9: by Sunday at three thirty pm they were found dead.
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Speaker 2: Guys in the last hours video has emerged of the
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Speaker 2: sun Nick Reiner. Now this is after he allegedly murders
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Speaker 2: both his parents in their sleep. Which are going to
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Speaker 2: circle back to Phillip Dubay about I mean, talk about
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Speaker 2: stalking and predating upon someone attacking your parents in the dark,
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Speaker 2: in their sleep when they can't fight back. After that,
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Speaker 2: and after he checks into a local hotel and cleans up,
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Speaker 2: he's spotted here. Let's take a look at Nick Reiner.
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Speaker 2: This is the latest happening. Now there he is. Wow,
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Speaker 2: he pet clean clothes. He has a Mac outfit.
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Speaker 4: Check it out. He's got on shoes without blood, new
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Speaker 4: pants without blood. He's got a backpack, a jacket against
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Speaker 4: the cold, a hat.
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Speaker 2: Let's keep watching this because I see him walk in,
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Speaker 2: fully aware of what's happening, going straight to the drink area.
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Speaker 2: He gets a drink, then he goes and stands in line. Yeah,
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Speaker 2: looks totally sane, doesn't he.
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Speaker 4: This is from CBS News.
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Speaker 2: By the way, Philip Dubay joining us a high profile
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Speaker 2: lawyer out of La County, former public defender. There's gonna
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Speaker 2: really be hard for his new high profile lawyer, Alan Jackson,
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Speaker 2: who represented Karen Reid, to argue mental defect because he
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Speaker 2: looks completely sane right there. He knew to pack. Could
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Speaker 2: you take him down please? He need to pack new clothes,
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Speaker 2: fresh clothes. What happened to the murder weapon?
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Speaker 4: Has it been hidden?
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Speaker 2: Did he know enough to hide or discard the murder
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Speaker 2: weapons so it will never be found?
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Speaker 4: What knife was that? What utensil did he use.
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Speaker 2: To stab his parents and slit their throats. He knows
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Speaker 2: how to go into a gas station.
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Speaker 4: He goes straight to what he wants, He gets it,
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Speaker 4: closes the fridge behind him, comes up to the line
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Speaker 4: and stands there patiently waiting to pay, pays for his food,
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Speaker 4: his drink. Wow, he looks just like you, Debay, going
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Speaker 4: into a gas station. You don't look crazy to me.
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Speaker 3: If you kill during the throes of psychosis, or if
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Speaker 3: you kill while under the influence of some type of
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Speaker 3: neth induced situation, like a form of methan psychosis, it
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Speaker 3: cannot form the basis of a Letho Devans. The jury
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Speaker 3: can factor it in and deciding whether or not he
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Speaker 3: had the intent to kill, but you're not going to
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Speaker 3: walk away from it. And I think what the evidence
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Speaker 3: will probably show is that at some point he was
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Speaker 3: going through some type of the drug induced euphoria, likely
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Speaker 3: for methamphetamine, and that it dissipated and he went to
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Speaker 3: what we call that meth or cocaine crash. And that's
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Speaker 3: why you're seeing him so calm afterwards.
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Speaker 4: Uh huh, uh huh.
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Speaker 2: Did you interview Nick Reiner and I learn all this
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Speaker 2: or you just guessing, you're just projecting he was on meth.
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Speaker 1: He was on coke.
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Speaker 2: Now he's in an uphooric downer, and he was a
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Speaker 2: psychosis at the time he murdered his parents.
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Speaker 4: You're just kind of extrapolating, is that right?
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Speaker 3: I am telling you he is a statistic He is
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Speaker 3: the mirror image of that homeless drug addicted population out
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Speaker 3: there that goes through that meth or cocai. It dissipates
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Speaker 3: and then they crash, and during that crash stage they
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Speaker 3: are cool.
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Speaker 2: You're saying the same thing again, Or am I caught
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Speaker 2: in a demonic echo chamber?
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Speaker 4: Are you making this all up? Did anybody tell you this?
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Speaker 2: Are you consil with a high profile lawyer and you
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Speaker 2: know this by some interview with a diffendant?
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Speaker 4: Or are you just spinning it out?
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Speaker 3: That's the one I am enriching you as to what
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Speaker 3: the likelihood is. That's really what's being okay.
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Speaker 4: So where did you get your information? If you could
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Speaker 4: reveal that.
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Speaker 3: I'll tell you what tipped me off that that's what
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Speaker 3: happened when he was arrested booked. They booked him into
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Speaker 3: the Twin Towers Correctional Facility rather than the men's County jail.
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Speaker 3: So what that and that is the largest psych hospital
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Speaker 3: in the United States within a jail system. It tells
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Speaker 3: me that at the point of the step.
9:38
Speaker 2: To stop, you must cut his mic because, for Pete's sake,
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Speaker 2: Paris Hilton was booked in the Twin Towers.
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Speaker 4: That means nothing to me. The fact that he's in
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Speaker 4: the Twins Town. You are spinning out like ru ruble
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Speaker 4: still skin.
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Speaker 2: You're taking mangy looking with Hay and you're turning it
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Speaker 2: into gold.
9:56
Speaker 4: But guess what that doesn't work with a veterin. Try
10:00
Speaker 4: a lawyer.
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Speaker 1: That would be me.
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Speaker 4: The live stop right here. You know nothing about his
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Speaker 4: mental state.
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Speaker 2: You know nothing about whether he was on speed, whether
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Speaker 2: it's on meth, whether he's on coke, much less.
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Speaker 4: The euphick.
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Speaker 2: Downer after bottom line, you know what, Why am I
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Speaker 2: asking a JD like myself mental health questions when I've
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Speaker 2: got doctor Bethany Marshall with me, renowned psycho analyst joining
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Speaker 2: us out of this jurisdiction along with Dubay, author of
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Speaker 2: deal Breakers.
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Speaker 4: You can see her.
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Speaker 2: On Peacock Now and find her at doctor Bethany Marshall
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Speaker 2: dot com. Doctor Bethany Philip Dubay is talking about statistics
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Speaker 2: and all trial lawyers know if they've ever tried a
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Speaker 2: case and they're not just a talking head, that statistics
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Speaker 2: are overwhelmingly disallowed as evidence at court.
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Speaker 4: So that's not happening now.
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Speaker 2: It doesn't matter if Rainer, as in the son Nick Reiner,
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Speaker 2: had been on meth. It doesn't matter if he's on coke.
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Speaker 2: It doesn't matter what he's on. Voluntary use of drugs
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Speaker 2: or alcohol not a defense, Bethany, I would like you
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Speaker 2: to look at your screen. We're gonna look at this
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Speaker 2: gas station video again. A lot of you may be
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Speaker 2: wondering why is this important? Because Alan Jackson has swooped
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Speaker 2: in the Karen Reid lawyer.
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Speaker 4: This is some CBS news, by the way, and I
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Speaker 4: already see, as Dubay said rightfully.
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Speaker 2: That they're gonna try a metal defense argument. Okay, but
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Speaker 2: look at this guy. This is a couple of hours
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Speaker 2: after he allegedly slits the throats of both of his parents.
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Speaker 2: You know why, because he just couldn't.
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Speaker 4: Take living in that multimillionaire home, that lifestyle he was
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Speaker 4: given on a silver platter on top of a Christmas tree.
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Speaker 10: You know, Nancy, I see somebody walking casually around the
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Speaker 10: mini march getting a drink show signs of drug abuse. Here,
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Speaker 10: he's not pacing, he's not agitated. He looks quite calm
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Speaker 10: to me. So instead of putting this in the drug
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Speaker 10: addiction category where somebody's on mess and there's overkill, which
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Speaker 10: I speculated to yesterday, what I'm going to say now
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Speaker 10: is that often with domestic homicide, when somebody successfully kills
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Speaker 10: a family member, there's an extraordinary relief phase afterwards. So
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Speaker 10: they will be quite calm. They will like go shopping.
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Speaker 10: They will I mean, like Casey Anthony, dance on the
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Speaker 10: stripper pole. They will go out and enjoy their lives. Now,
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Speaker 10: in terms of drug abuse, I've been looking at all
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Speaker 10: the interviews last night, Nancy, and one of the things
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Speaker 10: I noticed about this guy, Rob Reiner's son is he
12:47
Speaker 10: does a lot of what we call tongue thrusting, pushing
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Speaker 10: his tongue out as he's talking, which means that he
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Speaker 10: has tart of dyskenesia, which is a signed of antipsychotic.
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Speaker 11: Medication.
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Speaker 10: Meaning this guy was in the lap of luxury of
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Speaker 10: psychiatric care. He had the best psychiatrist, the best hospitalizations,
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Speaker 10: everything available to him. I see this as much more
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Speaker 10: psychological than something that is related to drug addiction.
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Speaker 2: I want to go to Rob Sheeter joining us, a
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Speaker 2: star of Naughty but Nice podcast, author of a brand
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Speaker 2: new book, It Started with a Whisper, which is a
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Speaker 2: big hit on Amazon now. You can find him at
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Speaker 2: robshooter dot substact dot com. Publicist to the stars, you know,
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Speaker 2: Rob Shoeter. I'm going to put you under the microscope
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Speaker 2: right now and do a lightning round.
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Speaker 4: Isn't it true? You know Nick Reiner? Isn't that true?
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Speaker 8: I've met Nick Ryder?
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Speaker 3: Yes?
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Speaker 2: So then simple answer, yes, And you have actually sat
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Speaker 2: down and had a meal with him?
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Speaker 4: Yes?
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Speaker 8: No, uh, coffee with him and I maybe a cross.
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Speaker 4: Ont that's not a yes, no, but whatever.
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Speaker 2: When you were with him, did he seem psychotic or
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Speaker 2: just a spoiled brad.
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Speaker 12: A spoiled brat. He felt entitled. He turned up late
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Speaker 12: from meeting that he arranged. I didn't range it. So
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Speaker 12: he wanted to meet with me in La and he
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Speaker 12: turned up late, kind of late late enough that you noticed,
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Speaker 12: not five ten minutes late late.
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Speaker 8: That bothered me. When he turned up, he was rude
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Speaker 8: to the staff, which is always a tell when you
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Speaker 8: turn up and you're rude to people.
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Speaker 12: I remember at one point they got his order wrong
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Speaker 12: and he blew off the handle really shockingly shockingly quick,
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Speaker 12: and then came back down and sat and talked. He
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Speaker 12: was arrogant, he was entitled, and he's sort of had
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Speaker 12: the sense of himself that was way bigger than the reality.
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Speaker 12: He believed that he was a major player in Hollywood,
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Speaker 12: the same way that he believed he trashed his guest house. No,
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Speaker 12: you are not a major player in Hollywood. Your parents are,
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Speaker 12: your dad is, and that ain't your guest has.
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Speaker 4: It's your dad's rob Why did he want to meet
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Speaker 4: with you? What did he want?
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Speaker 12: He was struggling. He wanted to be a really successful screenwriter.
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Speaker 12: He wanted to be famous. I think he desperately wanted
15:20
Speaker 12: to step out of his mom and dad and his
15:22
Speaker 12: grandpa's shadow. He was a lost guy, and he had
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Speaker 12: access to resources that the rest of us people struggling
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Speaker 12: in the entertainment business would absolutely, absolutely desire. He had
15:35
Speaker 12: phone numbers, he had emails, he had contacts. But unfortunately
15:39
Speaker 12: here he didn't have a lot of talent, and so
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Speaker 12: he had trouble squaring that and he was looking. He
15:45
Speaker 12: was looking for somebody to come along and turn him
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Speaker 12: into the next amazing screenwriter, which obviously I couldn't do,
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Speaker 12: and nobody else could do any he could do, and
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Speaker 12: he didn't have the gifts to do that.
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Speaker 2: Rob She You stated that he contacted you to meet
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Speaker 2: with him because he wanted to become a successful screenwriter.
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Speaker 4: What is your experience, Shooter as a screenwriter?
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Speaker 8: My experience is zero. I have never written a screenplay.
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Speaker 2: Okay, So what you're good at, what your forte is
16:16
Speaker 2: is you are a pr yuru. People from all around
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Speaker 2: the world come to you for pr help, public relations help,
16:23
Speaker 2: whether they're in a crisis or they just want to
16:25
Speaker 2: become famous for whatever reason. You've seen it all, from
16:29
Speaker 2: Brittany to Sean Combs, so many more. So, he didn't
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Speaker 2: come to you for help to become a screenwriter. He
16:36
Speaker 2: came to you because he wanted to be famous.
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Speaker 8: Yeah, there was no craft there.
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Speaker 12: He didn't come to me to learn the art of
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Speaker 12: becoming successful. He had no interest in learning his craft.
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Speaker 12: He had no interest in taking a screenwriting class, in
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Speaker 12: learning how to do this. He wanted to go straight
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Speaker 12: from zero to one hundred. And this is not that uncommoney.
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Speaker 12: It very rarely happens. But everybody wants to be famous,
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Speaker 12: everybody wants to be successful. Are you willing to put
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Speaker 12: in the work, the hours, the hours, the years, the years.
17:07
Speaker 12: I tell everybody that works with me for a little
17:10
Speaker 12: bit of success, it's going to take five till ten
17:12
Speaker 12: years of hard work.
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Speaker 8: He wasn't willing to do that. He wanted to go
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Speaker 8: straight from a zero to one hundred.
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Speaker 4: Well, how did he want you to make him famous?
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Speaker 4: What were you supposed to do?
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Speaker 12: He had no idea how I'd do it. He thought
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Speaker 12: I'd done it for other people. I explained to him,
17:27
Speaker 12: very very carefully that I had worked with a lot
17:29
Speaker 12: of lot of celebrities, but I hadn't turned anybody into
17:33
Speaker 12: a star who didn't do the work, and that everybody
17:37
Speaker 12: I worked with, from a Jennifer Lopez to a Jean
17:40
Speaker 12: bon Jovi, works their payloff. There's there's this thing, this
17:43
Speaker 12: this perception out there that you can become famous overnight
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Speaker 12: without doing the work, and it's just not true.
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Speaker 8: You have to do the work. He shows almost zero
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Speaker 8: interest in that.
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Speaker 12: I asked him if he if he had a screenplay,
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Speaker 12: show me your play, let me read it, let me
17:57
Speaker 12: see He hadn't even put together a sen and he
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Speaker 12: said me nothing.
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Speaker 4: Okay.
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Speaker 2: Does that change your opinion, doctor Bethany Marshall, what you
18:06
Speaker 2: were learning from Rob's shooter.
18:07
Speaker 4: Now we're getting to the very latest.
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Speaker 2: We know where he's being held right now, we know
18:12
Speaker 2: what his lawyer is up to. We have seen the
18:15
Speaker 2: very latest of videos and evidence. We have evidence from
18:18
Speaker 2: the hotel where he snuck into and literally blacked out
18:25
Speaker 2: the windows with sheets hiding out, where he cleaned up,
18:29
Speaker 2: leaving behind blood in the shower, his parents' blood before.
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Speaker 4: I get to that. This is a real insight for me,
18:37
Speaker 4: doctor Bethany Marshall.
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Speaker 2: I usually don't get to have this when I'm looking
18:43
Speaker 2: at a target. This changes a lot for me, this
18:47
Speaker 2: insight into Nick Reiner's mind.
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Speaker 4: Bethany, Yes, it changes a lot for me too.
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Speaker 10: I was fascinated by what Rob was saying because what
18:57
Speaker 10: I'm hearing is true entitlement. Entitlement is the expectation of
19:02
Speaker 10: reward without achievement. You want to be at the top
19:06
Speaker 10: of Mount Everest, but you don't want to work out high,
19:08
Speaker 10: get all the equipment, try to get yourself to the top.
19:11
Speaker 10: You just want to be magically helicopter there. And so
19:14
Speaker 10: people who have severe addictions, like obviously Nick did, they
19:19
Speaker 10: have to work really hard to surmount those addictions, right,
19:23
Speaker 10: They have to go to rehab, they have to surround
19:26
Speaker 10: themselves with a community that will hold them responsible. But
19:29
Speaker 10: if you're drug addicted and entitled, you are not going
19:33
Speaker 10: to put in the work to gain sobriety. Now, if
19:37
Speaker 10: you're living in a guest house with very rich, very talented,
19:42
Speaker 10: renowned parents, what you're going to see is a sack
19:46
Speaker 10: of gold on the other side of the driveway. And
19:49
Speaker 10: if yours, it doesn't belong to them anymore. Now it's yours.
19:52
Speaker 10: You should have it yourself, even though maybe you haven't
19:55
Speaker 10: done anything to earn it, right, maybe you haven't gone
19:58
Speaker 10: to Kna Brian's Christmas party and chatted people up and
20:03
Speaker 10: been kind and you know, taking pictures, shake hands or
20:08
Speaker 10: anything like that.
20:09
Speaker 11: You just think that it belongs to you.
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Speaker 10: And so what I hear is somebody who thinks he
20:14
Speaker 10: should be famous. He doesn't have the talent, he doesn't
20:16
Speaker 10: want to put in the work. He is building up
20:19
Speaker 10: this boiling resentment towards his parents who did put in
20:24
Speaker 10: the work, and his grandfather who did put in the
20:27
Speaker 10: work and envy, that green eyed monster envy. When you
20:31
Speaker 10: want something somebody else has and you don't feel you
20:33
Speaker 10: can get it for yourself, it causes the wish to
20:37
Speaker 10: destroy the object of your envy. And I think that's
20:40
Speaker 10: what we're seeing right now, is that he just he
20:43
Speaker 10: destroyed his parents, even though they gave him every benefit,
20:47
Speaker 10: every opportunity. He thought he could just skate in and
20:51
Speaker 10: you know, have lunch with our not even nice, you
20:55
Speaker 10: know person here, and that all of a sudden he
20:58
Speaker 10: would be famous.
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Speaker 4: It's the pattern.
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Speaker 10: I see it everywhere now. As we're talking about it tonight,
21:03
Speaker 10: as we go.
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Speaker 2: To air tonight, we are learning the district attorney there
21:07
Speaker 2: in LA has filed formal charges including illegal eagles if
21:13
Speaker 2: you caught this special circumstances, which means the death penalty
21:19
Speaker 2: is on the table.
21:20
Speaker 7: These charges carry a maximum sentence of life in prison
21:25
Speaker 7: without the possibility parole or the death penalty. No decision
21:30
Speaker 7: at this point has been made with respect to the
21:33
Speaker 7: death penalty. We have requested, and currently Nick Reiner is
21:38
Speaker 7: being held without bail. One of these special allegations is
21:41
Speaker 7: that the murder was committed with a deadly weapon or
21:44
Speaker 7: a knife as to where and how the weapon will
21:50
Speaker 7: be was located or will be located that will actually
21:54
Speaker 7: be evidence.
21:55
Speaker 2: While presenting court the murdyrs of Rob Reiner and wife
21:59
Speaker 2: Michelle Singer stabbed Dad, multiple stab ones.
22:03
Speaker 6: The injuries to the neck categorized as slash wings, both their.
22:07
Speaker 2: Throats slit arterial bleed is like a water SPRINKLRK.
22:11
Speaker 6: I can guarantee you, but this is a blood time.
22:16
Speaker 2: And in the last hours Nick Reiner, suspect number one
22:20
Speaker 2: in the murders of Rob Reiner and wife Michelle Singer.
22:23
Speaker 2: Reiner appears in court looking grim, wearing shackles and a
22:30
Speaker 2: suicide smock as he makes his very first court appearance
22:36
Speaker 2: in the murder cases Sidney Summer.
22:37
Speaker 4: What happened? What happened? Nancy?
22:40
Speaker 13: Essentially nothing. Alan Jackson tells the judge he's already spoken
22:43
Speaker 13: with the prosecution and they agree to postpone Reiner's arrangement
22:47
Speaker 13: until the new year, so they'll be back in court
22:49
Speaker 13: on January seventh.
22:51
Speaker 4: The judge asks Reiner.
22:52
Speaker 13: If he agrees to waive his right to a speedy arrangement,
22:55
Speaker 13: and Reiner meekly responds, yes, your honor. The only thing
22:59
Speaker 13: we really learned here is that Reiner is likely being
23:02
Speaker 13: held on suicide watch, evidenced by that barely visible blue.
23:06
Speaker 4: Smock so Sidney Sumner. They spoiled Bratt.
23:09
Speaker 2: Turn accused double killer said very little in court. He
23:14
Speaker 2: appeared behind glass, he was shackled. He did not enter
23:18
Speaker 2: a plea.
23:20
Speaker 13: Why Mister Jackson answered that for his client, telling the
23:24
Speaker 13: judge it's too early to enter a plea as he
23:27
Speaker 13: had just a few minutes with his client before this
23:29
Speaker 13: initial appearance. It seems the court is already on holiday mode,
23:34
Speaker 13: as both prosecutors and the judge quickly agreed to postpone
23:37
Speaker 13: until January seventh.
23:45
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
23:50
Speaker 2: As a formal indictment goes down against NEPO baby thirty
23:54
Speaker 2: three year old Nick Reiner, the son of famed director
23:59
Speaker 2: Rob Reiner and mom Michelle Singer Reiner.
24:03
Speaker 14: He is now fighting in court to get his mits
24:06
Speaker 14: on a huge inheritance left behind by his parents murdered
24:11
Speaker 14: in their twenty million dollar La mansion. He's fighting over
24:17
Speaker 14: a one point five million dollar trust fund. What does
24:23
Speaker 14: this mean?
24:25
Speaker 2: Sounds to me like Alan Jackson, the famous defense attorney,
24:29
Speaker 2: is circling the courthouse as soon as that money comes through.
24:34
Speaker 2: If it does, I guarantee you he'll be back on
24:36
Speaker 2: the case. Remember he dropped out after initially claiming he
24:40
Speaker 2: was representing Nick Reiner. He dropped out when I think
24:45
Speaker 2: the money dried up. Look, the man's got to pay
24:48
Speaker 2: his bills, right, So does this mean Jackson's back on
24:52
Speaker 2: the case. This is what happened when Jackson left, when
24:58
Speaker 2: he jumped ship. Once high profile lawyer Alan Jackson enters
25:04
Speaker 2: the scene. Jackson waives the right to a speedy arraignment,
25:07
Speaker 2: and it has been delayed. Remember a defense attorney's best friend, Delay, delay, delay,
25:15
Speaker 2: and so it has started.
25:17
Speaker 13: Well, I don't think we can be too hard on Jackson, yet,
25:20
Speaker 13: I'm not sure this delay can be categorized as unnecessary.
25:25
Speaker 13: We saw Jackson go into the courthouse less than forty
25:27
Speaker 13: five minutes before this arrangement, giving him just a few
25:30
Speaker 13: minutes to meet with Reiner and the prosecutors. I can't
25:33
Speaker 13: blame him for pushing back a plea to get a
25:36
Speaker 13: chance to actually sit down with Rener and get a
25:38
Speaker 13: better understanding of his story.
25:41
Speaker 2: The arrest of Rob Reiner and Michelle Singer, Reiner's son
25:44
Speaker 2: goes down in a public location, and eyewitnesses state that
25:49
Speaker 2: Nick Reiner, the defendant in this case, seemingly was acting
25:54
Speaker 2: like a quote ordinary guy.
25:56
Speaker 15: He was arrested in a public area in the Position
26:00
Speaker 15: Park area near the University of Southern California campus. He
26:03
Speaker 15: was approached by the officers and he was arrested without incident.
26:06
Speaker 15: There were no indications that there was no indication that
26:11
Speaker 15: he was going to resist or anything like that. He
26:12
Speaker 15: didn't flee or anything like that. He was taking into
26:14
Speaker 15: custody without issue, and he was transported to our police
26:19
Speaker 15: are courts.
26:20
Speaker 2: Calab Brantley joining US investigative reporter dailymail dot com, CALA,
26:25
Speaker 2: what happened? Tell me about how the arrest went down.
26:27
Speaker 9: Yeah, as you can see from those pictures and as
26:29
Speaker 9: was described by the officer, nick Reiner appeared very calm collected.
26:35
Speaker 9: He didn't put up a fight, and you can see
26:37
Speaker 9: in these pictures right here, you know, he put his
26:39
Speaker 9: arms behind his back. He was not arrest he was
26:42
Speaker 9: not resisting arrest. And it appears that he was in
26:44
Speaker 9: those same clothes that he was seen in that earlier
26:47
Speaker 9: surveillance footage that you showed, so he didn't have a
26:50
Speaker 9: change of clothes and he was taken away very easily.
26:53
Speaker 4: Tell me about what was found at the hotel.
26:56
Speaker 9: It was a horrific scene. Now, what we've learned is
26:59
Speaker 9: that there was blood everywhere. He's obviously changed his clothes.
27:03
Speaker 9: There was no blood on him as you saw there.
27:06
Speaker 9: And what they haven't found yet, or what they haven't
27:09
Speaker 9: disclosed that they've found yet, is a murder weapon. So
27:12
Speaker 9: obviously everyone's assuming that there was a knife that was
27:15
Speaker 9: used for those lacerations to his parents' throat, But we
27:18
Speaker 9: haven't learned yet if that has been found or if
27:20
Speaker 9: it was found in the hotel or at the crime scene.
27:23
Speaker 2: You're right, Cale Brantley, dailymail dot com. Take a listen
27:27
Speaker 2: to the LA district's attorney.
27:29
Speaker 7: One of these special allegations is that the murder was
27:31
Speaker 7: committed with a deadly weapon.
27:33
Speaker 8: Or a knife.
27:35
Speaker 7: As to where and how the weapon will be was
27:40
Speaker 7: located or will be located, that will actually be evidence.
27:44
Speaker 16: While presenting court.
27:45
Speaker 2: You see the local district attorney seemingly correcting himself, pausing
27:49
Speaker 2: there about the weapon, Well, it will be located, it
27:54
Speaker 2: was located. That tells me that the weapon has been discarded,
28:01
Speaker 2: much like in the Brian Coburger case. We found the
28:04
Speaker 2: knife hilt with the defendants DNA on it underneath one
28:09
Speaker 2: of the murder victims, but we never found the actual knife.
28:15
Speaker 4: Interesting joining me Scott Iiker, digital.
28:19
Speaker 2: Forensics expert, founding member of the FBI Cellular Analysis serve
28:23
Speaker 2: A Team FBI twenty two years and former homicide detective
28:30
Speaker 2: in Norfolk. Scott, thank you for being with us. I
28:34
Speaker 2: want to find that weapon, and after much analysis, I
28:38
Speaker 2: think the best way to find the weapon is to
28:42
Speaker 2: track Nick Reiner's sell phone.
28:45
Speaker 4: How do we do it?
28:47
Speaker 16: Oh, there are several different ways to do that. You've
28:49
Speaker 16: got all the different applications on the cell phone and
28:52
Speaker 16: the cellular connections that the cell phone makes all the
28:57
Speaker 16: time when it's on, so you can track the towers.
29:01
Speaker 16: You can get more detailed information from distance from the towers,
29:05
Speaker 16: and you might be able to get some information from
29:07
Speaker 16: the applications like Google, of Facebook, Instagram. All those provide
29:12
Speaker 16: some locational information, so you can track him historically from
29:17
Speaker 16: the house to the hotel and maybe or to where
29:21
Speaker 16: he was arrested, which was about, you know, twelve thirteen
29:25
Speaker 16: miles away, so there's a good amount of distance between
29:28
Speaker 16: those locations. So they got their work cut out to
29:32
Speaker 16: try to figure it out. But obviously they've got this video.
29:35
Speaker 16: They've gotten to a point they're putting a timeline together,
29:39
Speaker 16: and they're just going to chronologically go through each little
29:43
Speaker 16: step to see where they could figure out where he
29:45
Speaker 16: might have put that night, that.
29:46
Speaker 4: Gas station video from our friends at CBS.
29:49
Speaker 2: So Ke, I'm going to go out on a limb
29:50
Speaker 2: here and go back to Philip Dubay.
29:53
Speaker 4: He is actually a veteran trial lawyer.
29:55
Speaker 2: He's a defense attorney and he has been with the
29:58
Speaker 2: La County Public Defenders Office.
30:00
Speaker 4: What does that mean?
30:01
Speaker 2: They're on trial all the time, just like assistant district attorneys.
30:06
Speaker 4: There are thousands of cases to.
30:07
Speaker 2: Be handled, and you've got to go to trial or
30:10
Speaker 2: else you get fired. Very simply put, Philip Dubay, this
30:15
Speaker 2: guy may have been in the movie Maylleu. He's been
30:19
Speaker 2: around screenwriters, he's been around stars, He's been around plenty
30:22
Speaker 2: of who.
30:23
Speaker 4: Done It movies.
30:24
Speaker 2: But do you really think that he thought too He's
30:29
Speaker 2: only alleged to communities crimes, But would he have thought
30:32
Speaker 2: so deeply to think, oh, let me turn my phone
30:36
Speaker 2: off before I get rid of the murder weapon, let.
30:39
Speaker 4: Me put it on airplane mode. I don't think so.
30:42
Speaker 4: Remember one of.
30:44
Speaker 2: Our last suspects that put the phone on airplane mode?
30:48
Speaker 3: Oh?
30:48
Speaker 2: Yes, that would be very more few whose phone went
30:53
Speaker 2: on airplane mode around the time his wife was killed
30:58
Speaker 2: or went miss saying, so, Philip Dubai, do you really
31:02
Speaker 2: think he thought that deeply when he got rid of
31:06
Speaker 2: the weapon.
31:07
Speaker 3: No, and I'll tell you why. I can tell by
31:09
Speaker 3: the charges. The prosecution is not alleging that this was
31:13
Speaker 3: a planned, premeditated murder. The only reason why he's rising
31:17
Speaker 3: to the level of it being a special circumstance is
31:20
Speaker 3: because there were multiple victims. They're not even a llegend
31:23
Speaker 3: that he did it for financial gain, which certainly is
31:27
Speaker 3: the classic motive, particularly in the Hollywood. So what you
31:31
Speaker 3: really have here is somebody who is out of his mind,
31:34
Speaker 3: again likely due to psychosis, drugs, or maybe even an
31:38
Speaker 3: untreated personality disorder, who flew off the handle in a
31:42
Speaker 3: fit of rage for whatever reason and fled while still
31:46
Speaker 3: in that either drug induce psychosis or some type of
31:51
Speaker 3: mental health crisis. Does it excuse the behavior?
31:54
Speaker 2: Okay, you know what, City Sumner, that was all my
31:56
Speaker 2: fault because you never on the stand anyway, ask a
32:00
Speaker 2: witness a question that you don't already know the answer to.
32:04
Speaker 2: So I asked him Doby about the weapon and where
32:08
Speaker 2: it would have been discarded, and was the cell phone
32:11
Speaker 2: turned on or off at the time the weapon was discarded,
32:13
Speaker 2: and he goes back to his pretend drug psychosis theory.
32:17
Speaker 4: Sidney Sumner, let's get some facts.
32:19
Speaker 2: Joining me Sidney Sumner along with Kila Brandley, Daily Mail,
32:22
Speaker 2: Sidney Sumner, Crime Stories, investigative reporter. What exactly are the
32:27
Speaker 2: charges against Nick Reiner?
32:30
Speaker 4: We just heard the district attorney speaking. What are the charges?
32:34
Speaker 11: Well, Nick Reiner is charged with two counts of murder
32:38
Speaker 11: with the special circumstances of multiple murders because he killed
32:42
Speaker 11: two people at the same time, and that special circumstance
32:46
Speaker 11: of using a deadly weapon.
32:49
Speaker 2: Sidney, Aren't those murder charges first degree murder?
32:54
Speaker 4: Isn't that true?
32:56
Speaker 11: You're right, Nancy, they are first degree murder.
32:59
Speaker 4: And in this jurisdiction of California, murder one is murder
33:06
Speaker 4: with malice of forethought.
33:09
Speaker 2: That's what murder one is in California, Sidney exactly.
33:14
Speaker 11: So there is some assumption that this was premeditated in
33:18
Speaker 11: some degree.
33:19
Speaker 2: So when we hear Philip Dubay state that this is
33:22
Speaker 2: not uh, these are not charges that include intent.
33:29
Speaker 4: That's diametrically opposed to what the charges actually are. The
33:33
Speaker 4: charge is murder one. Again out on a limb, debay.
33:39
Speaker 2: Under the law, there is no specific time required to
33:42
Speaker 2: prove malice of forethought, or as we call.
33:45
Speaker 4: It, premeditation.
33:47
Speaker 2: Premeditation to commit an act can be formed in the
33:50
Speaker 2: blink of an eye, the twinkling of the moment.
33:52
Speaker 4: Isn't that true? Debay?
33:55
Speaker 3: Yes, it is.
33:58
Speaker 4: Okay.
33:58
Speaker 2: So when you say the charges do not include intent,
34:02
Speaker 2: that's actually not correct.
34:04
Speaker 4: This is a murder one charge, isn't it.
34:06
Speaker 3: Yes, No, I didn't say that it was not intentional.
34:10
Speaker 3: What I'm saying is it wasn't planned in pre media
34:12
Speaker 3: this you did?
34:13
Speaker 4: Didn't he say that? Control room? Didn't he just say that.
34:17
Speaker 4: They're saying, yes, you did just say that.
34:20
Speaker 3: Well, then I retract.
34:21
Speaker 4: We've got it on tape. Do I have to play
34:22
Speaker 4: it back for you for Pete's say, like the gas
34:24
Speaker 4: station video.
34:26
Speaker 3: Is absolutely an intentional act, but it was not planned
34:29
Speaker 3: and premeditated. In other words, it was further moment. There's
34:32
Speaker 3: a difference.
34:33
Speaker 4: Murder one is premeditated murder.
34:36
Speaker 2: I feel like I'm screaming at a lamppost.
34:40
Speaker 4: Yes, it is murder. One is with malice a forethought.
34:45
Speaker 3: Malice of wour thoughts standing alone does not necessarily mean premeditated.
34:49
Speaker 3: It's a separate element. I'm telling you.
34:52
Speaker 2: Okay, what do you think malice of four thought is?
34:54
Speaker 2: Because I'm looking up Black slaw dictionary right now, go ahead.
34:57
Speaker 2: I can't wait to hear this. What do you think
34:59
Speaker 2: malice a wourth thought?
35:00
Speaker 6: Is?
35:01
Speaker 3: Maliceo forethought? Is intentional killing? That's the bottom line. Either yes,
35:06
Speaker 3: that's right, into it is however, yes, that's right.
35:12
Speaker 4: It's intentional killing in you form intent, you have a plan.
35:19
Speaker 3: Not necessarily absolutely not.
35:25
Speaker 2: I'm wasting very valuable time arguing with you about what
35:30
Speaker 2: you just admitted these charges and correct me if I'm wrong.
35:33
Speaker 2: Killer Brantley uh joining us from dallymail dot com on
35:37
Speaker 2: this from the very very beginning, Kiler Brantley he Nick
35:41
Speaker 2: Reiner is charged with premeditated malice murder. That is what
35:47
Speaker 2: first degree murder is. He is also charged with felony murder.
35:53
Speaker 4: That's an alternative count.
35:55
Speaker 2: Which means you don't have intent. The state doesn't have
35:59
Speaker 2: to you had intent, but a death occurred very simply
36:05
Speaker 2: during the commission of a felony. In this case, that
36:08
Speaker 2: felony would clearly be aggravated.
36:10
Speaker 4: Assault with a NiFe.
36:12
Speaker 2: You don't have to have intent to prove felony murder,
36:15
Speaker 2: just that a death occurred during the commission of a felony.
36:19
Speaker 2: And a sentence for felony murder can be life without
36:23
Speaker 2: parole or death penalty.
36:25
Speaker 4: Again, tell me the charge is Keila Brantley.
36:30
Speaker 9: It's two first degree murdered charges. There's the special circumstance
36:35
Speaker 9: and the special weapon charge right there. And like you said,
36:39
Speaker 9: either life in prison without the possibility of parole or
36:43
Speaker 9: the death penalty.
36:44
Speaker 7: Nick Reiner will be then brought to court. He is
36:47
Speaker 7: going through medical clearance, something that everybody who goes who
36:51
Speaker 7: gets arrested and gets held in the Los Angeles County
36:54
Speaker 7: Sheriff's Department jail goes through. Once he is medically cleared,
36:58
Speaker 7: he will be brought to court to be a reigned
37:00
Speaker 7: on these charges. At that point he will answer a
37:03
Speaker 7: plea of guilty or not guilty.
37:06
Speaker 2: Kila Brantley joining us deallymail dot com. Why was he
37:09
Speaker 2: a no show in court?
37:11
Speaker 9: According to Reiner's lawyer, Alan Jackson, he wasn't medically cleared
37:15
Speaker 9: to appear in court. Now, we don't know exactly what
37:18
Speaker 9: that means, but as you heard there, that's something that's
37:20
Speaker 9: very standard. Everyone needs to get medically cleared. Now. This
37:24
Speaker 9: could be a psych evaluation, it could be a regular
37:28
Speaker 9: medical evaluation.
37:29
Speaker 4: We're still finding that out.
37:30
Speaker 2: It could be him refusing to put his clothes on.
37:33
Speaker 2: It could be him clinging to his bunk and refusing
37:37
Speaker 2: to go.
37:37
Speaker 4: We don't know what it is. Debay, what is the
37:40
Speaker 4: reason that he was not quote medically cleared? Don't make
37:46
Speaker 4: something up. Okay, he missed court, Why.
37:50
Speaker 3: I'm telling you. When he got booked, they brought him
37:52
Speaker 3: to the Twin Towers Correctional Facility and they put him
37:56
Speaker 3: in a medical unit. My hunch is, and is just
37:59
Speaker 3: based on my years of doing this stuff, that when
38:01
Speaker 3: they arrested him they felt he was a danger to
38:03
Speaker 3: himself or to others still, so they put him under
38:06
Speaker 3: What's my guess is they put him under what's called
38:09
Speaker 3: a fifty one to fifty status, where it's basically an
38:12
Speaker 3: involuntary hold for a minimum of seventy two hours unless
38:16
Speaker 3: and until he is cleared by a doctor, and that
38:18
Speaker 3: includes going to court. If he is still psychotic, he
38:22
Speaker 3: cannot be brought to court. So my hunch is that
38:25
Speaker 3: they needed to medicate him to therapeutic levels, at least
38:28
Speaker 3: in the short term, so he could be brought to
38:31
Speaker 3: court for the arraignment. If they need to extend the hold,
38:34
Speaker 3: they can do it, I believe up to two weeks.
38:37
Speaker 3: Anything beyond that they have to go into court, the
38:39
Speaker 3: Mental Health Court for an order extending the involuntary hold
38:44
Speaker 3: pending arraignment.
38:45
Speaker 2: To quelab Brantley, have you heard anything at all about
38:49
Speaker 2: him being in psychosis suicide watch?
38:53
Speaker 4: What do you know if anything about that?
38:56
Speaker 9: Not yet, we haven't heard anything about his current status.
38:58
Speaker 9: But what we have found out from family friends of
39:01
Speaker 9: the Rhiners, people who knew him his entire life, is
39:04
Speaker 9: that from an early age he appeared to be a
39:07
Speaker 9: difficult child through tantrums. One of the sources is quoted
39:12
Speaker 9: as saying he had anger in his eyes and at
39:14
Speaker 9: some point his father, Rob Reiner, would have to restrain
39:17
Speaker 9: him during these tantrums and that those tantrums really progressed
39:21
Speaker 9: into adulthood.
39:22
Speaker 2: Doctor Bethany Marshall, just because Nick Reiner has been booked
39:26
Speaker 2: into Twin Towers.
39:27
Speaker 4: That means nothing to me.
39:29
Speaker 2: Other people other celebrities have been there Cosby, Bill Cosby,
39:35
Speaker 2: OJ Simpson, al Capone, Ted Bundy, Birdman of Alcatraz, Bernie
39:41
Speaker 2: Madoff who worked the world's largest Ponzi scheme.
39:46
Speaker 4: He certainly wasn't crazy.
39:48
Speaker 2: He was brilliant, evil, but brilliant, and many many others.
39:53
Speaker 2: How debet is extrapolating because he went to Twin Towers
39:57
Speaker 2: must mean he's on a psychiatric hold. That doesn't make sense.
40:02
Speaker 2: What do you think is happening, Doctor Bethany, Another tantrum.
40:06
Speaker 10: Another tantrum out of an abundance of caution. They're going
40:09
Speaker 10: to make sure he doesn't want to harm himself or
40:11
Speaker 10: other people. But he's not a risk there. What I'm
40:14
Speaker 10: going to say is when you diagnose people, you can
40:17
Speaker 10: diagnose them on five axes. Access one is mental disorders.
40:22
Speaker 10: Access to is personality disorders. They're treating him like he
40:26
Speaker 10: has a mental disorder. But this, Nancy, this is personality driven.
40:30
Speaker 10: He had tantrums from the time he was very little.
40:33
Speaker 10: According to one report, when he was eleven years old,
40:38
Speaker 10: he had such a huge tantrum that his father had
40:42
Speaker 10: to put him in a big bear hug and hold
40:45
Speaker 10: him to help him regulate down into a normal state.
40:50
Speaker 10: Could it be that.
40:52
Speaker 4: Nick Bethany is Bethany?
40:55
Speaker 2: Can I tell you something pleased before you say one
40:58
Speaker 2: more word before we hear any more made up theories
41:02
Speaker 2: from Philip Dubay, And he wins a lot of cases
41:05
Speaker 2: on arguments just like this. By the way, Paris Hilton,
41:09
Speaker 2: who has since become quite the hero on various fronts
41:12
Speaker 2: and now is a married mom. Paris Hilton was put
41:16
Speaker 2: in the Twin Towers after violating.
41:20
Speaker 4: Probation from a dui.
41:22
Speaker 2: She was put there because she was quote claustrophobic, all right,
41:27
Speaker 2: So all of Dubay spinning out his theories that's not
41:34
Speaker 2: supported by the facts we know tonight. He just happened
41:36
Speaker 2: to be booked into Twin Towers. It's in that jurisdiction,
41:40
Speaker 2: So that really means nothing to me probatively at this juncture.
41:45
Speaker 2: But I do know he's hired a very high profile lawyer,
41:49
Speaker 2: Alan Jackson.
41:51
Speaker 1: We'll be back day to day.
41:52
Speaker 8: The bailiff has indicated that the Sheriff's.
41:54
Speaker 12: Department will take it on a day, day by day basis,
41:56
Speaker 12: and so Hopefully we'll be kid.
41:58
Speaker 2: Tomorrow from our friends at Fox News Digital Sidney Sumner.
42:03
Speaker 4: Who is paying for him?
42:07
Speaker 11: That is the million dollar question. I don't think his
42:10
Speaker 11: siblings are footing the bill, and I don't know what
42:13
Speaker 11: kind of funds he had access to that don't belong
42:16
Speaker 11: to his parents. So it's very unclear where Alan Jackson
42:20
Speaker 11: is going to get his paycheck from.
42:22
Speaker 2: Two special guests joining us now Doctor Kendall Crown's renowned
42:26
Speaker 2: chief medical examiner out of Terrant County, That's Fort Worth.
42:30
Speaker 2: He is an esteemed lecturer at the Burnett School of
42:32
Speaker 2: Medicine at TCU, and he's the star of a hit
42:35
Speaker 2: view podcast, Mayhem and the Morgue. But don't be fooled
42:40
Speaker 2: by his joviality on his podcast. He has conducted thousands
42:45
Speaker 2: and thousands of autopsies.
42:48
Speaker 4: Doctor Kendall Crowns, thank you for being with us. Dodgor Crowns.
42:52
Speaker 2: There's a big difference in stab wounds and the slicing
42:56
Speaker 2: of his parents' throats. What would the stab wounds to
43:01
Speaker 2: the body, not the slicing of the throats indicate to you?
43:07
Speaker 6: So stab wound is a wound that is actually long
43:11
Speaker 6: longer than it or the wound itself is shorter than
43:14
Speaker 6: it is deep, so as the knife enters into the skin,
43:18
Speaker 6: it leaves a wound that is very small, but the
43:21
Speaker 6: actual wound course is very deep. The wounds they're describing
43:25
Speaker 6: on the rhiners is a slashing wound or in sized
43:29
Speaker 6: wound that is longer than it is deep. So it's
43:32
Speaker 6: kind of a shallow wound that hits multiple organs or
43:36
Speaker 6: multiple vessels, but doesn't go very deep into the tissues.
43:40
Speaker 2: Well, let me understand something, doctor Kendall Crowns. Even though
43:45
Speaker 2: the slicing mession you just made doesn't have to be deep,
43:49
Speaker 2: in fact, it can be quite shallow. That would likely
43:53
Speaker 2: be the mortal wound.
43:55
Speaker 4: And why.
43:57
Speaker 6: So? The vessels are the structures in neck, proded ury,
44:02
Speaker 6: jugular vein, you're trachia. They're all very close to the surface,
44:06
Speaker 6: like millimeters or less than a quarter inch below your skin.
44:11
Speaker 6: You have these vital structures. You hit the croted archery,
44:14
Speaker 6: it's going to start spurting blood out, and it's going
44:17
Speaker 6: to be lots of blood coming out in a very
44:19
Speaker 6: short period of time. You'll be dead in minutes. If
44:21
Speaker 6: you just hit the jugular vein, it'll start oozing heavily,
44:25
Speaker 6: and again you'll be dead in minutes. You cut the
44:28
Speaker 6: cut the trachia, you're going to have trouble breathing. And
44:32
Speaker 6: when you cut the trachia, you'll also cut blood vessels.
44:34
Speaker 6: You'll get blood into your trachea. So when you're dying,
44:37
Speaker 6: you're sucking in blood and you're basically drowning in your
44:40
Speaker 6: own blood as you're bleeding to death.
44:42
Speaker 2: Doctor Kennel Crowns, we know that when their daughter Roamy
44:45
Speaker 2: arrived and called authorities.
44:49
Speaker 4: The fire department arrived and.
44:51
Speaker 2: They stated that the rhiners were already in full rigor.
44:56
Speaker 2: That tells me at approximate time of death.
44:59
Speaker 4: Could you explain so?
45:00
Speaker 6: Rigor mortis is the stiffening of the joints that occurs
45:04
Speaker 6: after you die. And what happens is is your muscles
45:08
Speaker 6: continue to use the things they use fro metabolism even
45:13
Speaker 6: after you die, and when they run out of these substances,
45:16
Speaker 6: they go into full contraction. And this can start occurring
45:20
Speaker 6: in about a half hour to an hour after death
45:23
Speaker 6: and gets to a maximum about twelve hours. So it
45:26
Speaker 6: starts in the small muscles first and then goes to
45:28
Speaker 6: the larger muscles. Throughout your body, So if you see
45:31
Speaker 6: full rigor, it could be about twelve hours, but it
45:35
Speaker 6: can be affected by activity, drug use, how much blood
45:39
Speaker 6: loss you've had, a number of other factors, how warm
45:41
Speaker 6: it is in the house, So using it as an
45:44
Speaker 6: exact time frame for the post wornum interval is difficult.
45:55
Speaker 1: Crime stores with Nancy Grace.
46:02
Speaker 2: Of course, all murder charges are serious, but when you
46:06
Speaker 2: are indicted on multiple murder charges with aggravating special circumstances,
46:12
Speaker 2: that means you're getting teed up to face the death penalty.
46:16
Speaker 2: Isn't it true that after a period of hours when
46:18
Speaker 2: someone is in rigor, the rigor breaks and their the
46:23
Speaker 2: deceased limbs become limber again.
46:27
Speaker 6: Yes, after the twelve hour interval. After the twelve hour
46:31
Speaker 6: interval of it setting up, you'll stay in full rigor
46:34
Speaker 6: for about ten to twelve hours, and after that it
46:38
Speaker 6: starts to subside and disappears over another twelve hours unless
46:43
Speaker 6: someone moves it and breaks the rigor up manually, and
46:46
Speaker 6: then it goes away completely. So you have about a
46:49
Speaker 6: twenty four hour window of full rigor before it disappears.
46:53
Speaker 4: Okay, is it twelve hours or twenty four hours?
46:55
Speaker 6: So twelve hours is set up ten to twelve hours
46:59
Speaker 6: after it sets up where it stays in place, and
47:02
Speaker 6: then after that it begins to subside over another twelve hours.
47:07
Speaker 4: Okay, doctor Kendall Crowns, what type of defensive wounds would
47:11
Speaker 4: you have expected to be found on the shell and
47:14
Speaker 4: Rob Reiner's bodies. We've heard nothing about defensive.
47:18
Speaker 2: Wounds such as blocking with the hands, the arms, even
47:22
Speaker 2: curling up in a fetal position and getting defensive wounds.
47:24
Speaker 4: On the knees or the legs. I've heard nothing about that.
47:27
Speaker 4: I've only heard about stabs we believe to the torso.
47:32
Speaker 6: So since they were in bed and may have been
47:34
Speaker 6: in sleep, they could have not even seen this coming
47:38
Speaker 6: and not had an opportunity to react. Since there's two individuals,
47:42
Speaker 6: at least one individual probably was awoken by the other
47:45
Speaker 6: individual being killed and may have had a chance to
47:48
Speaker 6: defend themselves. They usually defensive wounds is what you see
47:51
Speaker 6: as the individual trying to grab the knife and trying
47:54
Speaker 6: not to be stabbed, and you'll see slices or insized
47:57
Speaker 6: wounds across the fingers, across the pond with a hand,
48:01
Speaker 6: and then you'll see also in size wounds or stab
48:03
Speaker 6: wounds of the forearms as they're trying to block the
48:07
Speaker 6: block the knife of themselves. And again, like you said,
48:11
Speaker 6: you may pull up your legs even and you'll see
48:14
Speaker 6: stab wounds or in size wounds on the legs and feet.
48:16
Speaker 16: Do be able to just forget that Rob Reiner was
48:19
Speaker 16: on this list?
48:19
Speaker 4: Or what now he's dead?
48:22
Speaker 2: What the zany conspiracy theories have already started? Sidney Summer,
48:27
Speaker 2: a crime Stori's investigative reporter, I don't recall Rob Reiner's
48:30
Speaker 2: name being on the Epstein list, by the way.
48:32
Speaker 4: That's from at Hunter Montross on TikTok.
48:35
Speaker 11: Said, Well, the list that that user is standing in
48:39
Speaker 11: front of is not real. That is a faith list
48:42
Speaker 11: that has been circulating on social media. And Rob Reiner's
48:46
Speaker 11: name is on that fake list and circled. But there's
48:49
Speaker 11: no actual evidence supporting that he had any ties to
48:53
Speaker 11: Jeffrey Epstein.
48:54
Speaker 2: So sorry, Hunter, your Zenny conspiracy theory doesn't hold water.
48:58
Speaker 4: Rob Reiner was not on.
49:00
Speaker 2: The Epstein list for Pete's sake, but there's no lack
49:03
Speaker 2: of theories.
49:04
Speaker 4: Maybe Philip Dubay can use these as the defense listen.
49:08
Speaker 17: Rob had been working on a series called The spy
49:10
Speaker 17: and the asset. The series was going to be about
49:13
Speaker 17: Putin and Donald Trump, their upbringings, different ways they intersected,
49:17
Speaker 17: and in Rob's words, what happens to democracy as a
49:20
Speaker 17: result of this convergence, that relationship of Trump and Putin
49:24
Speaker 17: being explored and extrapolated and navigated is going to bring
49:28
Speaker 17: a whole lot of corruption up to the surface.
49:30
Speaker 2: Right that From at Studio A eight on TikTok to
49:34
Speaker 2: Scott Iiker joining us, who was a founding member of
49:38
Speaker 2: the FBI Cellular Analysis Survey Team. Scott, I think I'd
49:43
Speaker 2: rather rely not on zany conspiracy theories. I will leave
49:47
Speaker 2: that to our veterman trial lawyer, Philip Dubay Scott, I'd
49:51
Speaker 2: rather deal with hard facts.
49:54
Speaker 4: How difficult is.
49:55
Speaker 2: It going to be for me to trace Nick Reiners
50:00
Speaker 2: cell phone, where he went that night.
50:03
Speaker 4: Any credit card or atm use and what was it for?
50:10
Speaker 2: I need to track not only his phone, but where
50:14
Speaker 2: there was a delay. Even in the Alex Murdog case
50:17
Speaker 2: where Murdog murdered his wife Maggie and son Paul as
50:21
Speaker 2: he left the scene, I got from his well. Prosecutor
50:25
Speaker 2: Waters got from his NAV system where he slowed down
50:29
Speaker 2: and the NAV system showed Scott Iker him lowering the
50:33
Speaker 2: passenger side window electronically. That's where he threw out Maggie's
50:39
Speaker 2: cell phone. Then he let the window up, sped up
50:43
Speaker 2: and went and hit out at his mother's house, who
50:45
Speaker 2: had dementia and really could not say what time he
50:47
Speaker 2: got there.
50:48
Speaker 4: That said, that's what I'm looking for.
50:52
Speaker 2: You know, this guy didn't think deeply enough to turn
50:55
Speaker 2: his phone on airplane mode or turn it off when
50:58
Speaker 2: he discarded of the knife.
51:00
Speaker 4: So how am I going to find the knife?
51:05
Speaker 16: It sure does look like a crime of passion in
51:09
Speaker 16: those instances. A lot of times the suspects do not
51:13
Speaker 16: turn off their phones, don't think ahead like that. Once
51:17
Speaker 16: you get the identified identifying information about the suspect phone records,
51:25
Speaker 16: vehicle records, credit cards, it's really interesting how you can
51:30
Speaker 16: put a timeline together and kind of piece together all
51:34
Speaker 16: the things that happened before and after the crime.
51:37
Speaker 2: Hey, Scott Iiker, you and I have both marveled at
51:40
Speaker 2: the video montage put together by l E Law enforcement
51:44
Speaker 2: in the photos Dulo's case. They got him every which
51:49
Speaker 2: way but loose on video from ring.
51:52
Speaker 4: Doorbell cams to stop like cam.
51:55
Speaker 2: This is after his wife, Jennifer, the mother of his
51:57
Speaker 2: five children, was murdered. I'm thinking that this neighborhood is
52:02
Speaker 2: blanketed in ring, doorbell and stop like cam, you name it.
52:08
Speaker 2: I bet they can follow him almost everywhere he went,
52:11
Speaker 2: and if he took an uber or share a ride chair,
52:15
Speaker 2: there may be video in there that can help me
52:19
Speaker 2: track him and find the knife. That said, here's another
52:23
Speaker 2: zany theory.
52:23
Speaker 1: Listen up, do beey.
52:25
Speaker 17: Nick Reiner, who is allegedly the murderer in this case,
52:27
Speaker 17: the son of Robin Michelle, who killed both of his parents, allegedly,
52:31
Speaker 17: his name did not appear on Google trends really at all.
52:34
Speaker 17: Here's it in the United States, the United States, Nick Reiner,
52:37
Speaker 17: nothing nothing. This is showing starting yesterday fourteenth, So that
52:43
Speaker 17: was the United States. This is what happens when you
52:45
Speaker 17: look up the exact same query and only changed the
52:47
Speaker 17: geolocation to be tel Aviv instead of the United States.
52:51
Speaker 17: Nick Reiner, tel Aviv. Nothing nothing, nothing. Oh, look at
52:55
Speaker 17: that two bumps a couple months ago, last month. Interesting,
53:01
Speaker 17: all of a sudden bumps.
53:02
Speaker 2: I can from s Studio A eight on TikTok. I'm
53:07
Speaker 2: so debate. I guess she's arguing, you mayn't want to
53:09
Speaker 2: take notes to put this in with your drugs lycosis theory,
53:13
Speaker 2: that he what is actually a spy.
53:16
Speaker 4: She's mentioning tel Aviv. I don't know what that has
53:18
Speaker 4: to do with.
53:19
Speaker 2: Maybe he's an avatar, maybe he's a ghost, maybe he
53:22
Speaker 2: doesn't even exist.
53:23
Speaker 4: Then who's that sitting in the twin towers?
53:26
Speaker 3: I got to tell you, I think it's genius because
53:29
Speaker 3: if we're all honest, it forms the basis of the
53:31
Speaker 3: not guilty by reason of insanity defense. If he truly
53:35
Speaker 3: thinks that he's going to be beamed up by the
53:36
Speaker 3: Starship Enterprise, and he's got all kinds of wild imagining.
53:40
Speaker 4: Nobody said that.
53:41
Speaker 2: You said that, What else would he He just didn't
53:44
Speaker 2: have a Google profile, he had no social media profile.
53:47
Speaker 2: The fact that, and now you're claiming you've got another
53:50
Speaker 2: psychosis defense because he's not a social media.
53:54
Speaker 3: No, not because of that.
53:55
Speaker 4: Okay, good, I'm happy you said that. I couldn't be
53:58
Speaker 4: more happy.
54:00
Speaker 2: NEPO baby thirty three year old Nick Reiner, formerly indicted
54:06
Speaker 2: in the brutal stabbing deaths of his mother and father,
54:11
Speaker 2: Michelle and Rob Reiner. The facts are brutal we wait
54:18
Speaker 2: as justice unfolds Nancy Gray's crime story, signing off goodbye friend,