Latest / Arrivals: A Birth Story Podcast / A bicornuate uterus, uterine irritability, and navigating pregnancy after fetal loss

Transcript

A bicornuate uterus, uterine irritability, and navigating pregnancy after fetal loss · Arrivals: A Birth Story Podcast

• Merelise Wilson: All right. You ready? Okay. ⁓ and welcome to the Arrivals podcast. I'm your host, Merelise Wilson and today I have Carolyn Donaldson with me. Hello. Hello. Hello. It's so good to see you. You too. It's been a really long time. I know. I know. I'm so glad you reached out about coming on. Yeah, I'm excited. I had a long time fascination with all things pregnancy and birth and have Definitely a unique story, so excited to be here. Same. I know. I don't know what it is. I mean, ever since I can really remember, I've just always been fascinated with pregnancy especially. Yeah. I feel like I was just really excited to be pregnant and see what that felt like. And then of course, then became a fascination with birth as well. Yeah, for Which is sustained, obviously. I don't know if. Did you ever listen to the Birth Hour podcast? No, I can't believe I don't listen to it. I know of it. Yeah. But I obviously. still being recorded. It might be. But it used to be like the institution, I feel like, of Birth Stories. And when I was pregnant with Ford, at least like the first half, I listened to like 100 episodes. I know. Well, and I didn't listen to that podcast, but I listened to so many other podcasts with Birth Stories in them. yes, I love it. Yeah. Oh. Well, speaking of Ford, you want to start with him? Sure. So yeah, I'll say first ⁓ for context. I have three kids. ⁓ all healthy and beautiful. ⁓ is seven. He's in first grade. Blair is four. And then my baby, Lila, is about to be one. So there's a lot of twists and turns to the story, but I want to go ahead and give the ending. ⁓ OK, Ford's ⁓ pregnancy birth was like ⁓ a looking back. All my babies are miracles. ⁓ He was also a guinea pig because there was a lot about my anatomy that we didn't know yet. So the first half of his pregnancy was pretty normal or very normal. I was young-ish. I was going to say you were kind of one of your first friends to have in our group of friends. I was 27, which I feel like is young-ish for our generation. So healthy, no risk factors, pretty much the whole all the blood tests, all those appointments for the first half. was just like check, check, check. Everything's good, growing well. ⁓ At our anatomy scan, the perinatologist found two issues. ⁓ Our practice, I go to Piedmont OB-GYN. ⁓ One your other guests, can't remember who, shout it out, my doctor, who's Dr. Combs, ⁓ who I I can't remember who it was. ⁓ And I was listening. was like, ⁓ I love her. ⁓ yeah, she plays a big part in my but my practice sends all of their 20 week scans to ⁓ perinatology as just like standard. ⁓ I think just to be, I don't know, extra cautious. ⁓ so it was my first time there, ⁓ but she found two ⁓ issues. One was a club foot, which I can come back to. And then a mass in his liver. We actually didn't know he was a boy at this time. We were going to wait until birth. So a mass in the liver. So ⁓ the mass was ⁓ sizable, but they couldn't really tell what it was. ⁓ It didn't a name or a label. And so the plan was basically to go get a fetal MRI at CHOA and then come back and they were going to just watch it. ⁓ And because they were seeing a club foot as well, which a club foot is not that big of a deal. It's basically like, you know, where the foot is turned in from the ankle. If a baby's born with a club foot, they just like wear braces. It's normally like resolved by the time they're walking. ⁓ So definitely not like life threatening in any ways. whenever there's two or more abnormalities, then they're kind of on high alert for a bigger thing that could be going on, a bigger like condition. ⁓ So because there were two abnormalities and because they didn't really know what this thing in the liver was, except for that it's like kind of big, we were like high risk from there on ⁓ so we got that MRI. ⁓ and immediately met with the radiologist, which was amazing because that's definitely not standard. And we could see like with our naked eye, the mass, that's what they kept calling it. It was like grape sized, which is pretty big for a little 20 week baby. Yes. Taking up a lot of his little abdomen. They not seeing blood flow, which was a good thing. ⁓ Blood flow would have been ⁓ like of a risk of like a tumor or something like that. so yeah, they just didn't know what it was ⁓ we're kind of like, we just need to watch it and see if it grows or changes. ⁓ the like worst case scenario would have been him having surgery after he was born. ⁓ but it was one of those things that like, I say this with all the sensitivity that people get ⁓ worse news and anatomy scans and ⁓ diagnoses, but because it didn't. have a name, it was so vague. There was nothing we could even Google. There was nothing to know, like, what are we going to expect here? And I think in the back of my mind, I was just afraid that it was just a symptom of something bigger going on that they just hadn't figured out yet. That was my kind of fear. ⁓ So that definitely colored the whole rest of our pregnancy in terms of ⁓ my mental state. ⁓ two later, we go back to the. ⁓ perinatal, just MFM. I'm going to say MFM because it's easier. It's easier and I'm a frequent flyer there, so I'm going to mention it a lot. the short story is they couldn't find it. It had basically resolved itself. The tech could only find it because she had the image from the anatomy scan to go off of, ⁓ there was barely even enough there to measure. ⁓ So it. had all but resolved itself, is a thing that happens sometimes. We all have things in our bodies that get resolved. And I think they caught it at a bad time, basically, at the anatomy scan. but the doctor, like the MFM, ⁓ and I understand why they're trained this way. And they only see high risk things. ⁓ they have to be incredibly conservative for liability reasons. And there was something wrong before. I I saw it with my own eye on the MRI. So I think I would have been tempted to think that they made a mistake, but because I had seen it, I knew that it was there and now it wasn't. ⁓ So they can never just say like, ⁓ you're good now. Like that's not in their vocabulary. Go on your merry way. Yes, that's not a thing. That's what I wanted. The whole pregnancy was for her to be like, everything's perfect. Your baby's going to be totally healthy. But they can't make those guarantees. And they were still seeing the club foot. So I was going back every two weeks. ⁓ The good thing was, because again, they had the two risk factors, ⁓ much every scan when I went back was a mini anatomy scan. They were looking at heart, brain, all the things. And everything else was checking out. So I was getting that reassurance that things were looking good. Is that why you couldn't really avoid finding out the gender? ⁓ So we were going to not find out till birth. ⁓ After I got my MRI and then when we came back for the next appointment and the tech, also the tech, her name was Casey, I loved her. She basically told us that she couldn't find the mass, which they're not really supposed to do. The MFMs are supposed to say all that. But we were just feeling giddy and so relieved about that. And even though the club foot was still there, we were like, who gives a shit about this club foot? We will deal with that. So we spontaneously were like, let's find out the gender. We were over surprises. We were like, we just want to know everything about this baby. So yes, at 22 weeks, we found out it was a boy. So yeah, we were going back every two weeks. Growth was looking good. Everything was, quote, good. But again, she never said, you're now fine. What she would always say is, things look great today. Let's come back in two weeks. So it was kind of like I would feel better and then would still spiral after a couple of days. It's a tough state to live in. It really was. Yeah. then ⁓ I got more and more pregnant, ⁓ physically was getting super uncomfortable. ⁓ pretty early, like 24, 26 weeks, he was breech. We could see on ultrasound. And I started having really bad back pain. ⁓ my theory was that he was sitting on my ⁓ ⁓ that's of how he looked. He kind of looked like he was sitting in a chair on ⁓ ultrasound. But I was just like uncomfortable all the time. It was hard to sit, hard to stand for long periods of time. And that's early to feel that way. Exactly. I wasn't even that big, but I was just uncomfortable. ⁓ And then I started having Braxton Hicks also very early ⁓ and I felt like they were like pretty intense. They weren't painful. ⁓ like contractions, know, but they were intense and tight. And I felt like they were kind of, I mean, I obviously had nothing to compare it to, but I felt like it was more, ⁓ more often and more intense than like what people talked about. at 30 weeks, I had a day where I felt like I had just had basically Braxton hits all day long. ⁓ And I wasn't really worried about that. I was in labor because every time I was getting these scans at the MFM, they were measuring my cervix. ⁓ via ultrasound, so it was long and closed. So I didn't really think I was in labor, but I was just like, this doesn't feel normal. So I went in and they did a ⁓ non-stress test, hooked me up, watched the baby for 30 minutes or whatever. ⁓ And the verdict was basically, yes, you're having contractions, but no, they're not productive. You're not dilating. ⁓ Prodromal labor, basically. Exactly. And they were like, This happens for some people. Some people have contractions for a long time before you give birth. Lucky you. Exactly. They're basically like, you're one of these unlucky people. So sorry. Basically call us if it gets a lot worse or feels a lot different. So I was like, great. So that was 30 weeks. ⁓ 32 weeks, ⁓ had my baby shower ⁓ my sister came in town. So we spent the night at my parents the night before the shower. ⁓ I remember I ended up sleeping that night in my dad's recliner because I could not get comfortable in any position in a bed. So I like barely slept, could barely sit slash stand through my shower. ⁓ so after the shower, my mom was like, I think you should go get checked again. Like this does not seem normal. But this was a Saturday. ⁓ obviously couldn't just go to my OB. So they sent me to labor and delivery. And this time I think they hooked me up and watched me for longer, maybe an hour or two. kind of same thing. Yes, you're having contractions. They're not productive. You're not dilated. Wait and see. Yeah, sorry. But I think because it was my second time and maybe because I was getting closer, I was getting farther along, also decided to check, to do a swab for fetal fibronectin. I haven't heard that. So it's a vaginal swab. Fetal fiber nectin is a protein that's like in ⁓ of the glue between your amniotic sac and your uterus. ⁓ if you're really in labor, ⁓ sac is pulling away from the uterus. So that protein would like start coming out. ⁓ they swab. ⁓ they're seeing that protein, then typically they say you have a higher chance of going to labor between seven and 14 days. OK. Is it anything similar to a mucus plug or is it totally separate? I don't know. I would think it's probably a similar like, you know, the material. The material related because it's like whatever's surrounding. But it's not something that you see with the naked eye. Yes. anyway, I was positive for that. But they give you a thousand caveats that there's like a lot of false positives. There's a lot of other reasons why you could have protein in your vagina. Great. So. It's funny, because looking back, I don't remember then being convinced that I was going to have an early baby. And maybe I should have. I don't know. Or also, maybe I forgot. I was positive for that. And so they said, to be extra safe, we can go ahead and give you the steroid shot for your baby's lungs to develop and all that, in case you do go into labor early. So I did get that at 32 weeks. OK, so then two weeks later, 34 weeks now. And I guess this whole time, are you still having Braxton Hicks? Yes, getting more and more uncomfortable. The night before this, I ⁓ up sleeping on ⁓ camping mattress that Nick pulled out of the attic because ⁓ of the beds in our house were working. I I was barely sleeping. Yeah, of I remember ⁓ just my standard pregnancy, towards the end of it, I wanted to sleep in. the recliner in the kids room. Because I was like, that is the most comfortable. was like, I could sleep in whatever position, but this sounds like next level. mean, sitting was by far the worst. I ended up working from home starting, I don't know, maybe 28 weeks or so because my boss saw me switching chairs every hour. And he was like, I think you're good. You can work from home. I was like, thank God. Really the only thing that felt good was taking a bath or like, lounging on the couch, but it's hard to sleep like that. So yeah, sleep was hard to come by. I was uncomfortable. And it was also August, so was hot as shit in Atlanta. I was just miserable. So I was 34 weeks and two days. It's a Saturday. We go to brunch with some friends that morning. And I can barely get through brunch. I'm like, switching spots with Nick, like moving from a chair to a booth. We'd ask a waitress for a pillow, or I asked waitress for a pillow, which is like so embarrassing. They had one, which was great. ⁓ But yeah, we could barely get through. So we get home and I basically have a mental breakdown. Understandable at this But was just bawling to Nick and was like, I just don't know if I can do this for six more weeks. Like I'm so uncomfortable. I'm not sleeping, which. LOL, because once you have a baby, you also don't sleep. It's all relative. But ⁓ I was like, it just feels like torture, not being able to sleep when you're not pregnant. ⁓ then I said the words out loud to him, which is like this weird intuition. ⁓ said, I feel like he doesn't have enough room, ⁓ ⁓ don't know where that thought came from. It sounded illogical coming out of my mouth. ⁓ anyway, so he's trying to calm me down. ⁓ like, OK, take a bath. And then we'll just sit on the couch all day, know, binge watch. It's so hot outside. We're not going to do anything like crank the AC. Exactly. So I did that. I took a bath and then ⁓ on the couch ⁓ I'll never forget it. I was wearing ⁓ shorts and just like a big t-shirt. So hot. My father-in-law had come over to drop something off. And so him and Nick were talking and I ⁓ them and yelled basically something's happening because I felt The only way I could describe it was like kind of like a release. And so I immediately stood up and my water broke a full gush, like just like the movies. I had shorts on, so there was nothing to like hold it back. It was like, you you poured a whole pitcher of lemonade on the mackerel rug. the amount of fluid. It is crazy. I mean, and it just kept coming. I know. It's like you think that at some point you run out, but it just keeps coming. It was wild. So obviously, I'm immediately panicked because I'm 34 weeks, two days. And so, oh, I'm sorry. No, go ahead. I was going to say, had there been discussions knowing that he'd been breech and you were having regular ultrasounds, were there discussions about scheduling a C-section or what was the plan there? Or not. I wasn't far enough along for them to schedule it, for it to actually be on the calendar yet. We had talked about potentially doing a CV to get him to flip. Oh, also, because my back pain was so bad, I was going to a chiropractor once or twice a week. I was doing spinning babies. I don't know if know what that is. To try and get him in the right position. Because I thought that was the cause of a lot of my discomfort, which maybe it was. But we'll get to the end of story. There's no way he could have flipped. I spit. Oh, my god. so much money at a chiropractor. So yeah, we had not got to the scheduling part yet, but I was very open to accepting that there was a good chance I was going to have a C-section. think, looking back, I think I was open to doing a CV or something to get him to try and flip, but honestly, we hadn't really got there yet. Yeah. Like before all of this, I would say I was definitely more open to a natural, potentially unmedicated. I'd listened to enough birth stories to know that there's no point in having a plan. So I didn't have a strong opinion. I wasn't going in being like, for sure want to go unmedicated. But the whole theory behind it made a lot of sense to me of being able to feel your body and recovery being better and all of that. Waterfall of intervention. Exactly. OK, so my water breaks. I'm panicking because it's early. And I don't know what, I have no idea what a 34 week baby looks like. I mean, I think I knew they survived most of the time. I don't know. was panicked. The feeling that I remember most is like, I wanted to undo. Oh God, I know exactly what you mean. Yeah. I told Nick it's kind of like when you get into a minor car wreck and you're just like, oh my God, I just want to rewind 10 seconds and not do that. Can I go back and sit on the couch and get in a different position and maybe this wouldn't have happened. I just wanted to take all the water and shove it back inside. Oh my God, I know exactly what you mean. Yeah. I was just like, don't know. I felt like, what can I do to kind of rewind. Right, if I just shut my eyes really tight, didn't happen. Because I knew enough about birth to know once your water breaks, you're having a baby. It's not like they can you're on some sort of clock. Exactly. So anyway, I'm freaking out. I don't really even remember this next little bit. But I remember we called Labor and Delivery. It's a Saturday. ⁓ My was on call, which was amazing. ⁓ And talked to me on the phone and said, we're going to have a baby today, and it's going to be great. ⁓ And that meant everything to me. Just her confidence. You feed off that energy. 100%. So we got in the car and started driving. I pretty much immediately started having contractions. were different from the ones I'd been having. So I was like, OK, this is real. And then also, anyone who's fully lost their water, the contractions are more intense because you have no padding. They also look intense from the outside. Nick was genuinely worried. Is that normal? was like, I don't know. Oh, it's so interesting. I don't remember ever looking at my belly. wish I had. Maybe it's more because my uterus is whack, which we'll get to. But there were times when it would go completely to one side or the other. It looks like an alien inside. was so weird. And it deflates so quickly. It's really weird. so yeah, I'm having contractions in the car. I have no idea if I timed them or any of that, because I'm just like totally out of body. but we're driving and I guess between contractions, Nick's trying to distract me. He's like, you know, it's kind of cool. I was thinking today's August 18th, eight 18. And I was like, oh, that's cool. And then I was like, wait, it's 18 18 so it's 2018. Oh, I was like, okay, that's a really cool birthday. This is a super experience But like I'll take whatever good side. Yeah. I was so as you know, I have a Ford as well. He's also August and I was I was wondering if they were the same date, but they're what is he? He's August 26. Okay, close. we get to the hospital get checked in they pretty much immediately scanned me because I had been at the MFM two days before on Thursday and he was breech then. So they had all that in their system or whatever. And so they do a quick scan. He's still breech. You're getting a C-section, which I'm thankful looking back that there was no gray area. It was just like, this is what we're doing. I think with the state I was in, it was good to just be like, I'm just following directions. I'm not here to, I don't think I was in a place to make decisions. So ⁓ was good. So they're getting me checked in. They have to ask you like 1,000 questions. And most people do this before, but I was too early. asked me all these questions. at one point, Nick tells the nurse what we were talking about in the car. like, oh, it's 81818. That's pretty cool. And she was like, yeah, we've delivered a lot of 81818 babies today, obviously. But she said we actually had a C-section this morning that we delivered at 818 AM. And this is, my water broke at 2.30. This is probably like four o'clock. And we're like, oh, maybe we can do at 8.18 PM. And she was like, I don't see why not. And she was like, baby's stable. I was in labor for sure and my water broke, but it wasn't like an emergency C-section. Baby was fine. And so she was like, they kind of have slots for the OR. So she was like, I think we have a 5.30. Maybe you can get the 7.30. And we were like, OK. which is so funny looking back, because we're in kind of scary situation, but we're like scheduling this baby like a pizza. I know, but I was talking to someone else recently and I feel like you gotta find those fun moments in any kind of birth, but especially with C-sections, there are perks to it. Totally. You can pick your baby's birthday. You can pick your baby's birth time. Go for it. Which I never thought about the time part before, but she was like, yeah, this morning they really wanted 818, so we just kind of hung out there for a few minutes and waited to pull him out. I was like, Wow. I love it. So yeah, this was like at 4 o'clock. And so she said, if you're going to go in at 7.30, ⁓ we would ⁓ to wait to do an epidural or not epidural, spinal cap. cap. Because if for some reason it wears off and then it's surgery time, ⁓ their last resort would be they'd have to put me under. And I knew I didn't want that. Yeah. So she was kind of like, ⁓ you manage? ⁓ can do ⁓ things until then if you need to. Right. I was like, yeah, I think, I don't know. Yeah, we'll see how it goes. Exactly. In this moment, I'm okay. So I had three or four hours of just laboring on my own with nothing, to be honest, I don't remember much of. I think I was just like kind of blacked out. And also like, I think you just forget these things on purpose. And you knew you had like an end time. Maybe. I always say that I think contractions and like going through all that would be so much easier if you knew exactly how long you had to do it for. I think that's probably true. So you knew you had an I knew that it was. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And again, I felt like I was just doing what I was told. I wasn't actively managing anything. I was just very much survival mode. Yeah. Do feel like you were a little mentally somewhere else? Oh, totally. I I don't really remember it, to be honest. Nick remembers more. And I have one picture of me standing against the wall. I don't even know who took it. I know if it was Nick or a nurse or whatever. So yeah, knew I didn't, I think they gave me one bag of IV fluids to flush things out, something, I don't know, something that they have to do. Then I didn't have any, I wasn't hooked up except for the baby being monitored. So I know I walked around a lot. I leaned on Nick, was just like breathing through it, I guess. So yeah, then it was 7.30, they wheeled me back, ⁓ had to do a spinal tap. Did they ever check to see how dilated you were? out of curiosity? I don't know. I don't remember. Surely they did. You I'm always so curious. I'm like, what if you were... I know you would think they... Well, I know they did with Blair. Because they kind of rushed me back. So maybe they checked when I first got there. They also had to verify that my water broke when I first got there, which it was very obvious. So maybe they checked then. I really don't remember. But I don't remember them checking along the way. Yeah. Maybe because they knew they had something and it would be obvious if he was falling out. I don't know. Yeah, I don't know. So got the spinal tap. And then once surgery started, that's when I felt like I started panicking a little bit because I was just like, just like was so anxious to see if he was OK. And I had ⁓ bad shakes ⁓ the anesthesia. ⁓ uncontrollable ⁓ teeth chattering, which is just like a weird. Yeah. You're like, can I get like a wooden spoon? Literally. And I'm not trying to do it. It's like such a, yeah. I'd never had any type of surgery or anything before. So that was definitely a first. ⁓ So anyway, they start and they kind of like call out as they're going. It's like we're cutting through the epidermis or I don't know all the terms. ⁓ And so when they get down to the last cut, which is to open my ⁓ doctor said something like, Wow. And then that's exactly what you want to know. But it was with a happy tone. It didn't sound scared, I will say. But then she goes, hey, dad, like talking to Nick. And she's like, if you are up for it, like you might want to see this. I've never, I've never seen this before. So he stood up and she ⁓ up my uterus ⁓ it's heart shaped. was it. Was he still inside your uterus at this He was still inside my uterus Oh my god, this is so wild. I you had this on video. This was also, I will say, I think this was around like 8, 10. So they were trying to kill a little time before 8, 18. So yeah, he stood up. They showed it to him. then don't remember if she said while we were in there, like, this is a bicornuate uterus. But I Nick telling me it's heart-shaped. Wow. I had no idea what that meant. And then she called a med student to come in and take a picture, which is the picture that I showed you. so cool. Because I guess she wanted to use it as a teaching moment. Yes. Are you in a textbook somewhere? you know? Probably. I don't know. I should have asked her. So yeah. Then there's- And I guess also we should say too for people, if you're wondering, a normal uterus is just like round. Right. Yeah. Well, when you're not pregnant, a normal uterus is like a triangle. Okay. Good to know. Inverted triangle, flat on the top. As you get more more pregnant, it basically turns into basically a circle. But mine is a very clear heart, like with a dip in the middle. So then they do the last cut, pull him out at 818. He cried right away. He was healthy. He was breathing on his own, which is a miracle. goodness for that steroid shot. Exactly. The steroid worked. He was five pounds, which is pretty big for 34-weeker. Yes. And he had no club foot. So there's a lot of, I'll come back to it, basically because he was 34 weeks, he had to go straight to the NICU. They do a bunch of extra checks or whatever. ⁓ So they brought him over to me. I wasn't able to hold him, but they brought him over to me while I was still open. And then Nick went with him to the NICU to watch them do all the things. And then they stitched me up and they ended up bringing him to me in recovery like two hours later or something like that. They have to do kind of more extensive checks than a regular newborn, I guess. So that is when my OB came into the recovery room and usually they just kind of debrief the thing, but she came and like basically gave me a whole lesson on what a bicornuate uterus is. and explained that it's very hard to detect once you're pregnant. It's much easier to detect when you're not pregnant. It ⁓ so much. Yeah. ⁓ it explained probably why he was breech. If you can like picture a heart, his head was up in one, ⁓ they it horn. ⁓ One, you ⁓ round of the heart. Like an ear almost. Yeah, an ⁓ So he probably couldn't have flipped if he tried. So preterm labor is much more common with bicornate uteruses because they do sort of run out of room, which is so weird that I felt that. Now there's intuition. So that explained one thing. ⁓ Bicornate uteruses also are very associated with what's called ⁓ uterine irritability, which is a hilarious term. ⁓ But it basically means uteruses that don't like being pregnant. And you're like, this sounds right. Yeah. I was like, I was extremely irritable. Right. I think we all have some level of irritability when we're pregnant. But like ⁓ early contraction, all of that is kind of associated with that. that made sense. And then the third thing is that because ⁓ the shape, And this is way over my head. This would be me trying to explain how Wi-Fi works or something. But ultrasounds are sound waves that are bouncing off things and guessing what the shape is, Sort of. That's my dumb way of explaining it. Sounds right to me. They're assuming the shape of a uterus when they're bouncing off. So the fact that the shape of my uterus was a different angle, especially the top and the bottom. That's more of a point. Yeah. It can kind of distort the angles. the club foot, they basically think was related to that. Wow. So interesting. So interesting. Anything about the mass? The mass? No, we don't think that was related to the bicornuate at all. They did do an ultrasound on him once he was born, I think, at like two days or something to make sure that there was nothing there. I think that was truly just something that we caught at a bad time. ⁓ Caused a lot of anxiety. No kidding. But yeah, mean, was ⁓ in all mostly a happy ending. He was in the NICU for 10 days, but he never needed breathing support or feeding support. He was just ⁓ bottle feeding from the beginning, basically. They just needed him to grow. Yeah. So he grew until we brought him home on Labor Day weekend. So it was like 10, 11 days. And then, yeah, he was happy and healthy. That's so wild. So are there any inherent risks with a bicornuate uterus other than potentially early delivery? did your doctor, I know it probably feels crazy to talk about a second pregnancy. We just had a baby. But did your OB tell you anything about? what to expect if you wanted to have another baby? She didn't right away. That's good. That's good. That's a good When we started, I think I had an annual, right around one fourth was like one. And so I was like, if we start thinking about it soon, yes, the risks are preterm labor for sure. And also once you have one preterm labor, you're inherently at risk for that, even if I didn't have a bicornuate uterus. And then also she said the other common ⁓ risk is infertility because it can be harder to implant. Interesting. And so she was like, obviously you didn't have that issue with Ford. We got pregnant pretty easily like second month or something. So she was like, that might not be a thing for you, but it wasn't ⁓ that ⁓ considered like a showstopper ⁓ that point. Did you ever do an ultrasound when you weren't pregnant to see what it looks like when you're not pregnant? Well, yes. But not before you're pregnant again. Not good timing. So yeah, it's funny because looking back, Nick and I have different perspectives on this, sometimes I'm like, should we have done more due diligence? But you just don't know what you don't know yet. And what I realize now is it is so rare that also a lot of these providers, it's not something they see all the time. So they don't have a lot of anecdotal evidence. ⁓ textbook evidence, which is just different. So it is. Yeah. Were there any bicornuate uterus Facebook groups that you joined or anything? You know it. Yes. I didn't right away. But later on in the journey. Yes, definitely. So there's people all over the world with with the it's basically a birth defect of mine. And people have different versions of it. So I don't know. It's hard to say if those groups are helpful or just cause more anxiety, but when you're grasping at straws. Yeah. It's nice to feel like you have a community. Yeah. For sure. ⁓ yeah, my recovery with Ford was really good. I mean, I had nothing to compare it to, ⁓ ⁓ think because I felt so bad being pregnant, it's funny because he had to ⁓ bottle fed for the first ⁓ least two weeks, maybe longer. ⁓ If you're before 36 weeks, they really don't want you nursing to burn that many calories. ⁓ I was pumping every three hours. And so the night after he was born, ⁓ some point we went to bed, I don't know. And then I had to wake up three hours later and pump. ⁓ I told Nick when I woke up after those three hours, this is the best I've slept in months, ⁓ is like so pathetic. It was only three hours long, but it was so true. was like, as soon as he was out, the back pain was gone. ⁓ that just un... comfortableness was like immediately resolved. So I think maybe it's just by comparison, like I was like, this C-section is fine. That's kind of a blessing. Like silver lining. I've heard other people say that you have ⁓ hyperemesis, you know, when they're sick throughout their whole pregnancy that having the baby is such a relief. Yeah. They'll take the deprivation and healing all day over the constant, you know, sickness or discomfort in your case. Yeah, I totally get it. Yeah, it's like as soon as he was out, like snapped your fingers. ⁓ So I feel like, and also he's in the NICU, which, you know, one silver lining of that is that you're not full time taking care of a newborn. So I could, you know, all I was doing was resting and pumping all day long. So maybe that helped. But I felt like literally at like a week, I felt pretty much back to normal. Okay. So this part, I'll give a trigger warning over this whole, whole part of the chapter. Okay. So, uh, my second pregnancy was beginning of 2020. Ford was about 18 months. And we went in for our first eight week appointment and there was no heartbeat. And so this was March 9th was our eight week appointment, which was days before the world was shutting down. So was a gosh. I didn't even think about that. Yeah. It was a really, really weird time. The whole vibe and even in the office was just like, everyone in healthcare at that time was just like on high alert. Yes. And so, you know, anyone who's had a loss, typically when it's early like this, they want you to come back to like confirm that there's still no growth and no heartbeat because, you know, there's always a chance that your dates were wrong or whatever. So we were supposed to come back a week later. By the time we came back, now the world has completely shut down. Nick can't come with me to the appointment and now they're not doing DNCs because they're clearing out the hospitals. So my only option was to take the pill and and pass at home. So we did that. at the time, that was so devastating. Plus, the world was ending. mean, it was a really weird time. imagine. I had a lot of anxiety ⁓ not dealing with what you were dealing with personally. can't imagine adding to that what you were going through. Yeah. was just a ⁓ out-of-body time. ⁓ But. Like looking back on our whole story, that piece kind of feels more just like a hiccup. But I want to just be sensitive. I think no matter when you lose a baby, everyone is completely, your feelings are completely valid about it. So we passed that at home. And then you're supposed to wait and get a cycle. And then I think maybe wait one more, something like that. So by the time we started trying again, it was May. We tried May, June, July, August, September, no luck. So, and that had not been the case with the miscarriage and with Ford. It was like within the first couple of months for sure. So I went to my doctor and said, hey, I remember you saying bicornate uteruses can be associated with infertility. know like, you know, you're supposed to try for a year or whatever, but you know, because I have this abnormality, like could we maybe like fast track this? And she was like, sure. I don't remember if she had to like pull any strings, but. So she referred me to a fertility specialist, ⁓ ⁓ reproductive endocrinologist. ⁓ ⁓ funny, my RE ⁓ my MFM ⁓ related. ⁓ wow. ⁓ their husbands are related. So they have the same name. So I can't even say their name because it would be confusing. so we went to see Those guys clearly have a type. Yeah, isn't that funny? So went to see her ⁓ and basically was like, gave us a whole plan of tests that I should do to check on hormones and things for why we might not be conceiving, but also imaging to get a better look at ⁓ my uterus from outside and from the inside, because there's a chance that there was scar tissue from the C-section. ⁓ There's also a chance that some ⁓ with uterine abnormalities have what's called a septum, which is like tissue more on the inside of the uterus. So she was like, we want to check out all these things, but you kind of have to wait till you get your period because you do them at different times in your cycle. It's very precise. It's like on day three, you can get this kind of ultrasound on whatever. So we had this plan. And then a week later, I found out I was pregnant. So we never went through with the plan or not yet. So this is our third pregnancy now. It was also pretty stressful from the beginning. And what point is it May? This is now October. of 2020. World is still in chaos. World is still in chaos. Yeah, Nick can't come to anything with me, which made it just feel more intense and more stressful. We got through the first ultrasound. There's heartbeats. So we felt better about that after having a loss. But then at 10 weeks, I had a really big bleed. I thought I was miscarrying for sure. But we went in and the baby was fine. I had a hematoma and then they could also see another bleed in my uterus. So they basically were like, don't be surprised if this happens again, which is horrible. so it did happen again, right after we went for our first trimester scan, 13 weeks. It happened on the way home. I was like, why couldn't this have happened on the way there? No, I'm going to turn back around. So that was just really scary I had so many things because Ford was early because I have this abnormality and because I had had a miscarriage. ⁓ was on the fast track for high risk. So I was ⁓ the MFM starting at 12 weeks every two weeks. At 16 weeks, ⁓ I positive for the AFP test that everyone does the AFP blood test at 16 weeks. ⁓ It's an indicator for spina bifida. ⁓ So tested positive for that. ⁓ happened ⁓ be at the MFM for my 18-week scan when I got the email from my OB. So I was like, well, this is good timing. So I went in and I said, hey, I just got this result. What can we do? And they basically said, OK, we can do an early anatomy scan. ⁓ with spina bifida, they're obviously looking at the spine, but there's also markers they can look for in the brain. And then AFP can also be associated with ⁓ issues. So they can look at like. Blood flow to the placenta, placenta accreta is like one of the things that would be a risk factor. So anyway, they basically went ahead and did kind of an early ultrasound. They were not seeing any indicators for the AFP issue. I had a really close friend who had a false positive AFP. It's also a very common false positive situation. I think because I had her in the back of my mind, I was just, and they were saying, you we're not seeing anything as of now. Again, they never say like everything's fine when they were saying as of right now, we don't have any concerns about this marker. So we were ⁓ of thinking that that wasn't going to be a thing. ⁓ I was also getting ⁓ shots every two weeks ⁓ of all my risk factors. It's kind of like ⁓ reviews on if it's ⁓ or not, but it's sort of one of those things doctors say like it can't hurt. And because it was COVID times, a nurse was coming to my house to give them to me so that I didn't have to go to the office because they were just trying to limit traffic. So she came to my house at 19 weeks, five days, ⁓ and gave me my shot. And she had told me before that starting at 20 weeks, she can start doing the Doppler as well during her visits. So this was 19 and 5. I was not quite 20. But I had just had a really anxious day, week, I don't know. And my anatomy scan wasn't until the next like Tuesday or Wednesday, so was still a few days away. so was like, I know I'm a little early, but do think you could do the Doppler? ⁓ ⁓ she was like, sure. She was the sweetest old lady. So she starts doing the Doppler, and it's like a minute, two minutes, and she just can't find the heartbeat. ⁓ And was the first time she had done it. ⁓ Plus, know that ⁓ I'm not that far along. It's not like. when you're at the end and they find it in three seconds, you ⁓ And I know I have a weird uterus. So I'm telling myself all these things of like, you know, just trying not to freak out. But then I am freaking out because it's now been like five minutes. I mean, her, ended up writing me a card later. I felt so bad for her. But ⁓ finally I'm like, okay, let's stop like. It's fine. I'm sure it's just a fluke. We'll do it again next time. But she left and I immediately called my OB and was like, can I come in tomorrow? This just happened and I just can't wait until the anatomy scan. They're like, sure. And so we come in and Nick was not supposed to come to any appointments with me, but he drove with me and we were like, worst case scenario, you'll sit in the parking lot and wait, but I'm going to make my case. And we go just to the, practice has like a separate ⁓ kind of like next door where they do ultrasounds. We go straight there and I basically say like, I, ⁓ couldn't find my baby's heartbeat yesterday. Like I need him to come. ⁓ so they brought him in through a back door so that no one would see him in the waiting room, which thank God. ⁓ and so yeah, they, ⁓ the tech doesn't ultrasound and within, I mean, two seconds, took zero time. ⁓ said, I wish I could show you something different, but you've lost your baby. and so we're in just complete shock because we had just had an appointment less than two weeks before where, you know, they checked everything under the sun and everything was fine. It just didn't make sense. were like, how is this happening? we had no answers ⁓ ⁓ we didn't really have time to worry about why. And we're just like kind of blacked out. they wanted me to deliver pretty quickly. ⁓ doctor came in and said, ⁓ not to be too graphic, but what they were seeing on ultrasound, looked like he had been dead for a while. Probably had died pretty much right after we had seen him ⁓ in that ultrasound. ⁓ so ⁓ it's been that long, then they start worrying about infection and things like that. So they wanted me to deliver that day. It was a Friday afternoon and we were kind of like, like, can we get our shit together? You know, need to figure out childcare. And so they're like, okay, you can come back at 7 a.m. They told me basically I had to deliver vaginally. I was too far along for a DNC. My immediate like instinct was like, can I just have a C-section and like, can you just knock me out? Like, but I guess I also, I wasn't far along enough for a C-section to where they, the incisions like wouldn't have lined up. Your uterus isn't in the same spot yet, you know, which makes sense. and all the risks like VBAC which sang in quotes, cause it's not obviously normal VBAC are they're much less because the baby's so small. like the risk of rupture is ⁓ ⁓ this is by far the safest. she of said something to the extent of like, I could make some calls if you really don't think you can do it. ⁓ But me that meant like, okay, that's clearly not, she's not recommending that. like, whatever, we'll figure it out. so we home that night. ⁓ Don't sleep all. Really go to the next. ⁓ go to the hospital the next morning and they, ⁓ my doctor, Dr. Combs was on call, another miracle, which I'm like so glad she was there that day. ⁓ So she ⁓ like kind of gives us like a plan of what it's going to look like. And I will say the care that we got that day from everyone there was absolutely amazing. Yeah, I obviously I wouldn't wish it on anyone to have to walk into labor and delivery and know that you're not bringing a baby home, everyone that we interacted with was like so sensitive. And, you know, I was terrified of a random person, like taking my blood pressure and saying congratulations or something like I would have just, that would have been the end. it was, they, ⁓ mean, I know they deal with stuff like this all the time, probably, but it was, ⁓ I very pleasantly surprised. And so she told us, ⁓ kind of the plan of how they were gonna induce and kind of all my different options. She said, like for pain management, she was like, you can have whatever you want. Give her the best stuff. Literally, she was like, if I could knock you out completely, I would, but unfortunately we're gonna need you to push. But she was like, literally, you can have whatever you want and as much as you want. And so she did say though, If we go with an epidural, there's just some extra monitoring that they have to do. ⁓ And so the quickest way for you to get out of here is to not do an epidural. Because ⁓ don't know, there's just ⁓ of you have to check things afterwards. And obviously, it takes time to wear off and all that. ⁓ And then she was kind of like, you're not pushing out a full-size baby. So in ⁓ of pain management. you can probably do other things without it being as painful to where you're dying for an epidural. ⁓ But obviously, you can also decide later. So I was like, yes, I want to get out of here as quick as humanly possible. So let's try. Let's go without it. I did immediately say, give me the fentanyl, ⁓ ⁓ did not have a good reaction to. ⁓ It worked for sure. Like I was not feeling pain, but well, that's not true. I was feeling pain, but I just didn't care, which is so weird. That was my experience with, with fentanyl as well. It is like, I mean, I haven't done a lot of drugs in my life, maybe that's what drugs are just like, but it was funny cause like I was having super intense contractions cause I'm on pitocin obviously, and they're more intense. And then I got the fentanyl and it was like, I was immediately chill and Nick was like, ⁓ so are you feeling better? I was like, No, but I just don't care anymore. I don't know. It's a weird experience. But it also made me super paranoid, super out of my body. I don't know. I was a mess. I was crying. I had a million things going on, obviously. yeah, once I was on it, I basically was like, I want this out. So at some point, I don't know if the nurses told me to or if I just like passed out, but I took a nap. I don't know if they were like, you're not making progress. Like you need to rest. And I also don't remember if they said that I need, I don't think I had to get to 10 centimeters. ⁓ yeah, I don't remember if they gave me a number to get to, but I think they were just kind of monitoring like they can sort of tell. So they told me to take a nap and, ⁓ Nick said right when I fell asleep, he had like texted our family. This was around like four. And kind of saying, I don't think we're making much progress. We might be here a while. And so I slept for like an hour, woke up at 5-ish, was completely lucid, which that's another weird thing. It's like as quickly as it comes on, then you're completely sober. And I told him, I think I need to to the bathroom. And so I'm trying to get out of bed, and I feel my water break, which I knew that feeling pretty well. And so before I make it to bathroom, I tell the nurse, like, I'm pretty sure my water just broke. And so she lifts up the sheet and is like, I think you're about to push. And so don't think I really need to go to bathroom. think I just didn't know what that feeling of pushing was. And so I pushed on that contraction and it didn't fully come out. And then the next contraction, came out. Before that was another thing the doctor talked about going into it. she was like, because of how long we think he's been ⁓ ⁓ is a chance that like, things will come out in pieces, ⁓ body and also the placenta. ⁓ if the placenta didn't come out fully, then there was a chance that they would have to go in ⁓ which I was just like, I did not want that. so his body and the placenta fully came out in one push, which was definitely like an answered prayer. Because there was no question that there were pieces or anything left behind. So that was good. So ⁓ that was around five-ish. So it ended up being, ⁓ think we started Pitocin at like 9 AM, so ⁓ or nine hours. My doctor immediately ⁓ took and ⁓ kind just did a basic check of if there were obvious causes of death. ⁓ which there were not. I don't think we found that out right then, but ⁓ looked at him right then. And then ⁓ I had decided before that I didn't ⁓ to see him because, ⁓ because I was afraid of what it was going to look like based on what they were saying on ultrasound, but mostly just because I couldn't handle it. was like, ⁓ yeah, shouldn't say I didn't want to see him. I didn't think I could handle seeing him. ⁓ But Nick did. And so he went with... They took him and Nick followed them. I don't know where they took them, but they went somewhere and he held him and got to spend time with him for a little bit. And then they came back and checked me. I didn't have any tears or anything, thank God. So they were like, we'll check your blood pressure in ⁓ hour or whatever. And then if everything's good, you can get out of here. ⁓ So that's what we did. And they did take his body for ⁓ an ⁓ and for like extensive genetic testing way more than like what they do when you're pregnant. Because we were just like, just at a loss of like, why, how did this happen? Like there's no reason, ⁓ nothing obvious anyway. ⁓ So yeah, we went home and started the long process of healing and grieving and just like what is happening, know, felt like our world completely got turned upside down. and it took eight weeks for his results to come back as autopsy and his genetic stuff. And it was all normal, which obviously in most cases that's good news, but I was devastated by that because I was like, want an answer, right? We wanted an answer. And I'm like, how can you tell me that you can have a perfectly normal, healthy baby that still dies? Like I couldn't deal with that. Because then I'm like, how am going to be pregnant again ever? How could I ever take that risk knowing that this is a possibility at any point? ⁓ Because again, we had gotten past when we'd had an early miscarriage, we'd gotten past the first trimester. All these things that you are kind of fake milestones, but they're still milestones in your brain. My sister had had a loss earlier that year around the 10 week mark. we felt like we were... ⁓ in the clear and then you're not. And that's just a really like, it'll change your whole perspective of what can happen. ⁓ So yeah, once we got his results, basically we were immediately like, okay, the next step of figuring out what's happening is to look at me. ⁓ So we went back to the RE and we were like, remember that plan we were supposed to do last year? And I had to wait till I get a period again before we could start anything. So it took a while. I gave birth to him on February 6th. And I don't think we started this process until like May-ish. I won't go through all the different things. ⁓ test under the sun I did, every type of image, ultrasound, ⁓ all things. ⁓ And ⁓ she that she should do what's called a hysteroscopy, which is like a colonoscopy, for your uterus. So it's like she goes, it's a surgery where you go into the uterus, but like with a little camera so that she can look around. And she was basically like, we know you have a bicornate uterus, but I want to take a better look on the inside and see what may be going on. And if there's anything that I can ⁓ on, I will while I'm in there. ⁓ they're like looking at. scar tissue potentially. She's like, if you have polyps or ⁓ ⁓ was kind of like an investigation. ⁓ let's try and figure out what's going on here. So ⁓ did that. This was, ⁓ think, early June. Are you under for this? Yes, I'm completely under. And so when I came out, ⁓ told us ⁓ ⁓ she went ⁓ not only obviously have bicornuate is from the outside. It looks like a heart from the outside. But from the inside, what she saw was down the middle of the point of the heart was a septum, which we knew was a potential risk. And it was coming almost the way down the middle, almost to the bottom point of the heart, if you will, ⁓ which ⁓ a lot of things also. That why Ford literally had only a half, because he really couldn't get the two halves of the heart were almost not connected. Right. And then she could also see ⁓ the baby that we lost, we named Harris. She could see where his placenta was implanted because I was only, you know, two or three months postpartum. ⁓ And it was right on the border of uterine wall and septum. And so septum tissue is not good tissue. It doesn't get the right blood flow or the right nutrients, all of that. So when she's telling us all this, and the best news of all is that a septum can be operated on. So she removed it while she was in there. And so she came out and she's telling us all of this of, you had this septum. We think this is where he was implanted. We've removed it. that was one of the first good days that we had had in a long time of finally we have an answer. Not only an answer, but an answer that something can be done about. A solution. Yeah. And so I just remember feeling so relieved from that. And then I think a few weeks later, they did a follow-up saline ultrasound. So the open cavity was more like two separate spaces. barely connected. So when they did a saline ultrasound, they're putting liquid. And so you can see where the liquid goes, and it barely could connect there. So she basically got rid of all of that so that it looked more like this, which is like open it it's not a circle, but it's a lot better. They have a lot more room. A lot more room. It almost doubles the space in your uterus. 100%. Yeah. So yeah, once we had that sort of dream, kind of felt like things are, I don't want to say resolved, because we definitely were still very, very cautious. It seemed much more promising. And she actually showed us a before and after of the two saline ultrasounds. And it made it very obvious of like, we're dealing with different anatomy now. Yeah. Because in that waiting period after Harris, before we really had answers, I mean, I was thinking we were probably going to do surrogacy. was like, of Facebook groups, was also joining a bunch of IVF Facebook groups because I was like, there's a chance we're going to have to make embryos and do a surrogate. We are going down every possible path. so we find felt at this point like, you know, it's probably safe to try. So that I think my surgery was in June. Again, you're supposed to wait ⁓ couple of cycles or whatever. And so we got pregnant right away in August. ⁓ It basically I was still seeing the RE, but I wasn't on any drugs or anything. But it's kind of like ⁓ just most prescriptive that you could be without. getting like assistance. Like I was getting blood taken every week, looking at my follicles. She would tell me exactly when I was ovulating, exactly when we should have sex, like all of that. But without any actual like assistance. ⁓ yeah, so we got pregnant that month. ⁓ that was Blair. ⁓ And made it to 38 weeks in two days. Did you find out with her if she was? Oh yes, we found out everything. At this point, were like, tell us. the surprises. Yes, tell us all the things. And did you feel now with the septum removed, was your pregnancy with her more comfortable? It's hard to say. I still had really bad back pain towards the end. even though she had more room, she was still in the same position as Ford. She was transverse breech, so sideways. I've heard a lot of times the babies just once one baby kind of carves out that route, it's really hard for another baby to. ⁓ But it's hard for me to separate the physical from the mental. ⁓ her pregnancy was ⁓ horrible. ⁓ whole nine months from the second I peed on a stick till literally I gave birth to her, ⁓ was just ⁓ shell of myself. I was so ⁓ with worry constantly. ⁓ we were high risk for ⁓ the reasons. ⁓ So I was getting appointments all the time, but I was like, you know, we'd get quote, good news, you know, reassurance in one appointment and I would feel good for like three seconds. And then I would immediately start worrying for the next one. I was like, I told Nick at one point, I was like, I think I know how drug addicts feel. Like as soon as you get that drug, need more. Like I just could never come out of that fear that like the other shoe was going to drop. I was like, I have. experience of like everything being fine and then it not. ⁓ The other thing with her pregnancy that made it even more anxiety filled was that she also had a high AFP. And even though Harris's high AFP had nothing to do probably with why we lost him, it was too close for comfort. I was like, I can't. we, you know, they kept checking all of the reasons that it could be high and everything was fine, but it just made me on such high alert of like, ⁓ no, now I'm just counting down for when something's going to happen. I imagine, I mean, I don't know if you would even call it a version of PTSD. ⁓ totally. And so I'm sure that word, that diagnosis, was triggering. ⁓ yeah. It's funny. I started going to therapy before Harris, which thank god, because I was already established. Yes, ⁓ she told me one time when I was pregnant with Blair, pregnancy trauma ⁓ is of the only forms of PTSD where the person ⁓ voluntarily signs up to re-experience it. Someone that goes to war in Afghanistan, they don't go vacation in Afghanistan. But people that have pregnancy trauma go back to the same doctors, the same hospital, the same rooms when they have the worst days of their life and go through it all over again. So that was definitely part of it. And I think it's just in your body. Your body remembers 100%. And I didn't feel good, like nauseous wise. took nausea. nausea medication, Dicligis, until the day she was born. Which again, that can have a mental component to it too, for sure. wasn't like, I didn't have an appetite and whatever. She was breached, so I was having back pain. Plus I was, between Ford being early and Harris I was convinced that like, I just needed to do nothing. Like I wouldn't even go for a walk. I didn't know, I did not do not even one form of exercise. Like I was grasping for things that I could control and I felt like the only thing I can do is do nothing. And so, ⁓ poor Nick, he really held us down that whole pregnancy. He took care of Ford, he cooked and cleaned. Like, ⁓ we working from home. ⁓ ⁓ we were both working from home so that made it a little easier. ⁓ ⁓ I was basically, lived on the couch for nine months and ⁓ thought once we got past where we lost Harris, that I would feel better. But I actually started feeling worse. Like the farther along I got, it was like the stakes are now higher. I like, if I were to now I'm, you 30 weeks, if I were to lose this baby now, I'll never recover. Like I'll never, you know, how could I come back from that? So it was like, as we got closer and closer, just got worse. And then I started ruminating over different things, know, cord wrapped around the neck, all, you know, every everything that could go wrong in pregnancy, I down every rabbit hole possible. And ⁓ was breached. And so I was pretty prepared for a C-section. I don't even remember entertaining a VBAC. ⁓ Just because- I'm sure you just wanted the ⁓ Exactly. low risk. Yeah. I would have been terrified of ⁓ for a VBAC and then ending up with a C-section anyway. Right. Right. So I was just like, let's just ⁓ of do the- easiest, most predictable thing. And towards the ⁓ I was going to the MFM, ⁓ think weekly. ⁓ ⁓ they were looking for any sign that because I was so much farther past where I delivered Ford, ⁓ now looking for any sign that like growth is slowing down, that my placenta might be kind of petering out. And so they're like, if growth is slowing down or fluids lower anything, like we're taking her like as soon as I think as soon as I hit 36 weeks. I would literally go to those appointments and like beg for two. I go, can I, can you wheel me? Cause I was just like, I needed to be done being pregnant. I felt bad. And I was just like, I'm not going to, ⁓ felt like I couldn't take a deep breath until this baby was out. ⁓ ⁓ kept growing. ⁓ so we got to 38 weeks. ⁓ I think they checked me at that appointment, like, ⁓ did a cervical check too, nothing. ⁓ so. ⁓ I'd only been to 34 before, so 38 felt, I felt massive and uncomfortable and I was just like, oh my God, how do people do this? People that go past their due date, oh my God, give them a trophy. So anyway, was 38 weeks, two days, we're going to bed and I'm in like, in between that almost asleep phase and I feel my water break in bed. Wow, you just really. I know. So I knew the feeling obviously and stood up and it fully comes out. And it's funny, this was April 28th when my water broke. Once we got to April 20th, well first of all, I thought I was gonna have a baby April 1st based on my history. So once we got to the 20s, had some dates that I liked better than others and I also planned my MFM appointments on dates that I liked, because I was like, if they send me to labor and delivery, I want it to be on a good day. I love it. I didn't want the 29th. And so my water breaks at like 1030 on the 28th. And Nick said one of the first things I said to him was like, do you think they can get her out in an hour? He was like, no. anyway, we go to the hospital. Very similar story to Ford within. ⁓ time I was timing contractions and they were like two minutes by the time we got to the hospital. ⁓ he dropped me off in part and I walked to labor and delivery. And I remember I had to stop a couple of times and I'm like in pajamas with a towel wrapped around me. ⁓ hot mess with water still dripping out. sure they see all kinds of crazy things. And I just remember pretty much as soon as I got in, I was like in the middle of contraction, they checked me and she was like, we need to get you to the OR. So I think I was like already seven or eight centimeters. two minutes. How was your pain at that point? That's pretty intense. By the time I started walking in, pretty intense. But it was the same thing. I remember standing in my kitchen, my brother-in-law came over to stay with Ford because it was ⁓ the night of the NFL draft. So we knew he would still be awake. Everyone else was asleep. So he came over and he, him and my sister had not had a baby yet. And so my water's broke and I am having a contraction and it looks like I have literally an egg in my stomach that's like going completely to the right. And he's like, is that normal? I was like, I don't know, but this is what happens to me. So yeah, I was in a lot of pain by the time we're getting checked in and stuff. Like I remember it being hard to like, answer the questions and stuff. Because again, my schedule date was at 39 weeks, so I hadn't done the blood. ⁓ They do a blood draw and all this stuff. You know what? I bet it's because your baby's a breach. I bet that's why your contractions look like that. I think so too. And the head is moving, and that's so much more distinct than just some little feet. That's probably true, especially on the top. Yes. And that's also why my water breaks so intensely. ⁓ Because the head is not at the bottom, like plugging it up. probably distributed better too. Exactly. Yeah, those little feces just poking. Yeah, it's just like it has it complete. It's like you just like cut it off almost. people with the head down, it almost like it's like you have a plug in the bathtub, you know? ⁓ Anyway, so you're getting blood worked up. I saw. Yeah, I was like, ⁓ bet that's I'm definitely having like super intense contractions, like barely talking through them. And then she checks and immediately just says, like, call the doctor. And so we wheeled back and she's born by 1 30. So we probably got to the hospital at 11 30. So I guess I labored for a while. I don't really remember, but, they got me into the room around one and then she was born at one 37. And, um, I wasn't really thinking about the C-section going into it. A lot of people say your second one is scarier because you like know what to expect more. But I think because I was in labor, You just can't think about anything. You don't have time. You're so distracted, which I think is good. But I remember once they started cutting, ⁓ ⁓ ⁓ once they start cutting, or once you're ⁓ the bed, they take the monitors off the baby. ⁓ while I was in triage, ⁓ the first room that you're in before you go back, ⁓ they're monitoring, so I'm hearing the heartbeat. with how anxious I was the whole pregnancy, I loved hearing that. ⁓ And I remember once they took that off and I knew it was kind of like countdown. I just felt like I was holding my breath. Like, okay, I just need her to be out. so yeah, she was born at 137. She was six pounds, 13 ounces. So way bigger, ⁓ healthy. got to hold her right away, which was very different. And I just felt ⁓ unstoppable. Like relief, ⁓ I mean, can't even tell you was like, Nick asked me the next morning, a few hours later, how do you feel? And I told him, I feel like I'm in college. And I turned in a 900 page essay. And I never have to think about that class again. Just the biggest weight off my shoulders. Talk about a drug high. cannot imagine the level of joy. Truly. ⁓ relief, which I guess there's a reason they say sweet relief. It was so. ⁓ I mean, plus I felt better. My back felt better. I mean, everything. was just like on cloud nine and, for months, truly I had the best postpartum with her. Um, obviously she wasn't a preemie. So like that was different. we didn't have to worry nearly as much about feedings and all of that. She was a good eater right away. and so, yeah, I just was like her whole, her whole babyhood. was like, You can't tell me anything. She didn't sleep through the night until like eight months, but I truly didn't care. was like, whatever. I soaked up every second with her. get that. get that. So yeah. So in it, it gave me this new confidence of like, okay, things are different because her whole pregnancy, you I had had three prior pregnancies. One was early and then two that didn't end well. So I was like, I do not have good examples. Why should I believe that this is going to be any different, you know? But then after her, I now had this other example of good. And so very immediately, I was like, ⁓ I could do this again. And was like, you are insane. So yeah, we were done. We were done after Blair. Nick was for sure done from the second she was born. I ⁓ like, I could do this again. But after. ⁓ few months, turned into a year, turned into two years, I was very much at peace with being done. He was just like, you you know what we've gone through and why would we roll the dice again? We have a boy, we have a girl, like everyone's healthy. Everyone's healthy. Like let's quit while we're ahead. ⁓ so eventually I definitely came to terms with that as well. ⁓ to be honest, even if I, if he wasn't part of the equation, I don't know that I would have had the guts to try again, just because I was like, I know what I'm like. in that state. So I just don't know that I would have been able to pull the trigger. It's so much pressure to decide to have another baby. really is. like, should I? I don't feel qualified to make that decision. so much about parenthood. I don't feel qualified. 100%. So, spoiler alert, we got pregnant anyway. Sometimes you don't decide. Yes, we didn't decide, which is the only way we would have had another baby. Yeah. so we were very shocked. ⁓ so from the beginning, it was a totally different experience because it wasn't planned. We didn't have to try. didn't have to ⁓ some doctors. Exactly. ⁓ so very early on, ⁓ kind of ⁓ like decided to change my perspective and be like, you know, ⁓ to sound like insensitive, but we're like, this is kind of like a bonus baby. Yeah. ⁓ no matter how this turns out, this is going to be my last pregnancy. Even if we were to lose this baby, we're going to be done. So I might as well try and maybe not enjoy it is the right word, but try and not stress over it because what's the point sort of. And I actually saw a different OB ⁓ I think, eight weeks or 10 weeks that I'd never, she was new to the practice. ⁓ So I'd never seen her before. And so she walks in and my chart's this thick. And so she's like, catch me up. And so I kind of go through everything. And we had just done my first scan, saw a heartbeat, whatever. And she was like, I know you have all this history or whatever, but your last pregnancy, just that pregnancy itself, was actually not high risk. You were high risk based on historical events. But you have had a... a surgery since then to change your anatomy. And then since that surgery, you've had a full term healthy baby with no risk factors. Her, you know, her herself, not based on what I'd gone through before. And so she was like, I don't see any reason why this pregnancy would need to be high risk. so, you know, you can kind of just follow standard protocol. and I was like, Not so fast. So we made compromise and I was like, okay, what if we go to MFM at 12 weeks and kind of see what she thinks, which in the back of my mind, I knew that doctor is so conservative and has followed me in every single pregnancy. So when we went there, she was like, I see what she's saying, but why don't we do four weeks? And I was like, And I do think there was actually a couple of times where I did six weeks, which for me was like... I mean, I had never gone that long without seeing a heartbeat or whatever. ⁓ mean, with Blair, this told you how mentally not normal I was. I bought a Doppler. I was going to ask you that. And I mean, you should look at my phone. You would be like, you need to go to an institution. I would not only do the Doppler almost every day, but I would take a video of it so that I could re-watch it and tell myself that it was real, convince myself. I mean, if I had 20 minutes where I wasn't feeling kicks or whatever, like, it was not normal. So for me, going six weeks without going to a doctor was like, you know, so brave. For what it's worth, I think that's very normal for what you went through. Yeah. don't think that's strange. Well, so yeah, the, her pregnancy had, was like the mo, the biggest sign that she was meant to be because it was so uneventful. There was not one red flag. There was not one thing that was wrong. Even with Ford and Blair, I failed the first gestational diabetes, but then passed the second. All of those things along the way, the standard things I passed on the first try, she was so clearly meant to be. I think early on I got this feeling that I think God is trying to give me a redemptive experience of what pregnancy could be like. And so I really tried to embrace that. I mean, I still went down some rabbit holes occasionally, but not nearly to the extent that I had previously and really did try to, quote, enjoy it. She also, like I said, was head down. She was my first baby that was head down. And I don't know if that's 100 % why or if my body had just stretched out or whatever, but I was so much more comfortable. I was still nauseous. ⁓ But the back pain, I did not have at all. We went to a Braves game with the kids when I was 38 weeks. And I walked a mile. So different. Whereas with Blair and Ford, I basically lived on the couch the last few months before delivery. So yeah, I felt good, had more energy, which ⁓ also a pleasant surprise for Nick. Because that was one of his biggest concerns about. me being pregnant again, and she's like, now we have two kids that I would be handling basically by myself. But it ended up being so different to where I wasn't putting myself on bed rest, which was part of it. So we had a scheduled C-section for 39 weeks. VBAC was out of the question because two C-sections and then my... Pematoma? Was that a... No, but my surgery, my uterine surgery. kind of counted as like, she was like, it's kind of like a half of a C-section. They don't want you to have. Yes. Even after two, most doctors won't let you do a VBAC, but she was like, you're kind of like two and a half. ⁓ So, honestly, that's what I needed to hear because ⁓ being head down, I think I would have been tempted as like a last ⁓ Just make it totally different. Yes. ⁓ ⁓ I think like ⁓ biggest fear would have been doing both, which I a lot of people do that and that sounds Recovering in two places is not fun. So it was kind of nice to just have it decided for me. But yeah, we're getting close to the end and the longest I'd ever made it pregnant was 38 weeks, two days. So once we're in the 37, 38, I'm thinking it's any day. I'm curb walking and it's so funny. was like, I've never tried to get a baby out before. This is a new experience. Everything is just always been trying to keep them in. But nothing. finally, we're getting two days before. And I'm like, I think she's going to stay in. This is weird. But I just had a feeling. And so I was like, it's a really bizarre thing to have a planned delivery. Obviously, that never happened to me before. I was going say, I think it's odd in general, but especially after you've had so much drama. yeah. And it's so funny because I only had two experiences of my water breaking and whatever. when that's all you've had, it's hard to imagine that it would change. So I'm like, no, my water is going to break and then, you know, it's going to be on a random day. Oh, leading up, I was like nesting like crazy. I was running around, which again, so different than past pregnancies. The day before her delivery date, Nick came home from work and he found me organizing our playing cards, like putting them in stacks, like by suits so that I could make sure there was 52. He's like, what is wrong with you? I was like, I just have to keep my hands busy. I'm not like. The fact that people go to sleep knowing they're going have a baby the next day, it's too much. You can't handle that. I know. But I will say the nice part is you can plan. We had childcare taken care of. My parents came and got the kids. We went to dinner the night before. I had a glass of wine. was like, this is so weird. Yeah. And then when we got there in the morning, the vibe is so different. It's just like, I mean... It's like you're going in for a brunch reservation. Everyone's so chill. There's no rush whatsoever. There was so much just sitting around and waiting. It's like, okay, we're gonna give you this IV and we'll be back in an hour. I was like, this is so weird. But again, I feel like it's just true to her whole pregnancy of just being like, yes, so calm, so peaceful. And so yeah, they took me back and she was born, I think my... appointment was at 9 30. She was born at like 10 20 something. Um, perfectly healthy. She, the two things that were different about her birth, one, I wasn't in labor. This is the only time I've ever not been in labor. And so she had a lot of fluid in her lungs, I guess. Yes. Yeah. Um, that usually babies get worked out during labor. Yeah. So they had to suck that out for, it kind of seemed like a while and she hated it. She was screaming her little head off. So they had to do that for like 10 minutes and then recheck her ⁓ or whatever after. ⁓ But she cried right away and they knew she was healthy. ⁓ ⁓ the ⁓ my Dr. Comes was not on call. She's the only one who, she's the only baby that she didn't deliver. It's really different in so many ways. ⁓ But did love this doctor too. But she said when- before she did the last incision, basically the front of my uterus, they call it like a uterine window. It's when you're so stretched out that it's almost like getting thin. She was like, it's not a true window. A true window is where it's like very clear. Translucent. Yeah, translucent. But she was like, was translucent enough where we could see the baby from the outside. Wow. So she sort of in so many words was like, you're not having any more kids, right? done time? Yeah. And I was like, yes, we are retired. She was like, you... It's not that you couldn't have any more kids, but if you did, we'd probably do a C-section earlier, like a 36 or 37, just to make sure you don't rupture. They typically don't want you to have, like after three C-sections, they start to get a little nervous, right? Yes, exactly. And there was even a risk, I can't remember if it's if you go past a certain time or if it had to do with her position, but there was a risk that they would have to do the traditional incision, which is up and down. that also has a higher risk of rupture. So if you get that for whatever reason, they really kind of want you to stop. ⁓ guess the sideways incision, I forget the name, is ⁓ and they can do it smaller or whatever. ⁓ a technical question. Yes. ⁓ So to Ford's birth, the picture showed me where your uterus is fully out of your body, ⁓ all the other C-section stories I've heard It doesn't sound like they take the uterus out. It sounds like they just kind of push on your belly and the baby pops up through the incision. Did they take yours out because? I think so. Okay. I think it was, I don't know if it was medically because she needed to like check it more, investigate more, or it was for a teaching moment or both. But yeah, and I should ask Nick if they did that with. Blair, but actually kind of don't think they did because I remember him saying with Blair, because she was breached just like Ford in the same position with her head kind of up in one ⁓ horn of the heart. They kind of had to like tug on her to come out. Do you remember feeling tugging with either ⁓ yeah. ⁓ yeah, I felt it. But I feel like if my uterus was out, I wouldn't have felt it as much. So I should ask him. But yeah, maybe Ford was the only one where they took it completely out because it was ⁓ obvious. ⁓ So fascinating. I know it is wild. So Lila came out. Yes. So she's out and happy and healthy. They stitched me up. got to hold her right away. How much did she weigh? She was only six pounds one ounce. It's so interesting how that works. she cooked the longest. So I was really hoping we were going to break seven pounds. I don't think she. seven with either of mine. Really? Yeah. I don't think she grew much the last little bit. I think I'd been to the MFM like a week before and she was already six pounds. So like she'd only gained. an ounce or something, which is funny because pretty much with all of them, or definitely with Ford and Blair, I had had an appointment within two days of them coming out and they were within an ounce or two of what they guess the size is, which I feel like lot of people, know, ultrasounds get a bad rap for those for sizing. I will say at an MFM, they're using different technology that's very accurate. So my experience besides the club foot. But we know why that happens. They're pretty reliable. They're usually a pretty good indicator of size. So yeah, I just think Lila didn't grow much at the end because I don't know. My uterus was petering out little bit. So yeah, they stitched me up and then I was good. Again, same. My recovery really with all three was pretty good. think I just don't do the best with pregnancy. So maybe it's just by comparison, I feel so much better. I think with all of them within, obviously it's hard to stand up and all that the first few days, but I really think compared to other stories I've heard, I've had an easy go of it in terms of getting back to normal. ⁓ that's good. Yeah. I feel like we all pay our dues one way or the other. Exactly. It's like, I'll take that. ⁓ Yeah. I had a question I was going to ask you and then it just escaped my mind. ⁓ okay. So now, so you have two girls. Yes. And you know that the bicorniate uterus is genetic. Yes. So are you going to get them pre-screened? At what age do you do it? Yeah. I haven't thought through what age, but I will definitely get them screened because now we know that it's much easier to see beforehand. Yeah. And it's hard to say of like, what's the point? I guess if it were to be extra severe, it's just knowledge is power. would know that going into a pregnancy. There's also a chance that it's not as severe. We know it runs in families, but it's not a guarantee by any means. My ⁓ ⁓ out that she has an arcuate uterus, which is similar to what my mom has, ⁓ is a much ⁓ less severe ⁓ It's heart-ish, I would say. It's like just a little dip at the top instead of a full, like coming fully in. So yeah, there's definitely a chance, it could be like me and my sister have different things. So even Blair and Lila could have different versions or they could have nothing. I wonder if the gene gets kind of like diluted as I have no clue. The generations continue. Yeah. It's very, very interesting. But yeah, I think it's just good for them at least to be aware of. mom, they saw that randomly ⁓ she had babies, but then she had three vaginal births and had no complications. And so you never know. Everyone's version is different. ⁓ Wow. I cannot thank you enough for sharing of your stories ⁓ with me and with our audience. And as you probably know, because you've listened to some episodes, I always ask people to describe ⁓ birth in three words. I forgot about this. I should been prepared. I feel like that's a lot to ask of you. You've had such different ⁓ births. OK, let me think. I really should have been prepared to listen to your podcast. prefer to catch people off guard. the first thing that's coming to mind is like. Instinctual, ⁓ anytime I've been in labor, there's something that just like takes over your body like it's very animalistic. Yes, you know, like totally agree. It's like and I don't even have ⁓ many memories of like the actual labor part. And I think that's because you're just like. So everything else is blocked out. Like it's just you and your body and you're just like Primal. Primal. Yes. Maybe that's the word. which is ⁓ cool. It's like, it's such a, it's something that you could never explain to anyone before you go through it. And then, ⁓ it's, it's just, you never, feel like maybe there's other ⁓ of situations in life that put you in that position, like ⁓ of fight or flight ish a little bit. But yeah, it's a very like, you can't think about anything else, is kind of cool. then I would say ⁓ ⁓ all of my births for sure are miraculous for a million ways. It's funny, tell the kids, ⁓ or and Blair hasn't had a birthday yet, but we always tell them their birth stories on their birthday. ⁓ And seven now, so like he's starting to, ⁓ we're to have more conversations about how it actually works. my sister, when my sister had her first, I was in the room with her. Oh, that's so And so he had only heard his story, which is very easy to tell a C-section birth story to a toddler, because it's like the doctor took you out of my tummy, which is 100 % true. So then he kind of was asking questions about my sister. And so we started the conversation of like, well, some people have babies differently. the last time we told it to him, We were having kind of a similar conversation and he was like, but then why do some people have C-sections? And I told him, was like, you know what, if I had you, you know, 200 years ago, we both probably would have died because you were in a position that you probably could have never turned around. And I know some people there are vaginal births, but I think with all of our factors, like it would have been, it would have been scary for sure. I'm like, thank God that was invented for. these situations, you know, and that we have that option. So in all the ways, miraculous. then I'll say ⁓ like life changing, ⁓ your life is so for me for sure, like divided into ⁓ and after, like no matter what, I have never, ⁓ and I had a baby at 34 weeks, so I definitely wasn't prepared, but I think even at 40, 41 weeks, you have no idea what's coming. There's this Sara Bareilles song that I always listen to on my kids' birthdays. We always get them donuts. So when I'm driving to get donuts at like 6 a.m., I listen to it and cry in my car. But there's a line that's like, I'll remember to say that we were both born today. Oh, I know. That got me. Yeah, it's so true. It's like I'm a... different person than I was yesterday, literally. And I think that's true every time. Like I'm who I was before you were born and after is different. So yeah, I can't think of anything else that's more life altering and like, yeah, world shattering. It's so true. It's, you know, I became a mom the first with my first son, but then the mom you are is when you have a second and third baby, it's different each time. You're a different person. Oh man. Oh my goodness. Well, thank you. Thank you. Thank you. I appreciate your perspective and your openness. And I know that so many women will appreciate you sharing all of your stories and just thank you. I hope I, again, I don't want to induce anxiety for anyone, but it's, Now that I know I'm done having babies, it's much easier for me to look at my journey kind of holistically and be able to see the big picture and I can see the hope, you know? And I hope that it does provide some hope for someone. It's funny, I just ran into a friend of a friend that had a baby at 34 weeks and her baby's still pretty little, like two or three months. was like, know, Ford was born at 34 weeks and she was like, oh my gosh, I totally forgot that. And she was like, what about others? And I was like, no, I made it till 38 and 39. And she was like, oh my gosh, I needed to hear that because I'm already like spiraling over how can I ever be pregnant again? So I feel like sometimes just hearing, you know, how things work out hopefully can maybe be helpful for someone. And I've heard even with other moms who have experienced loss. it's really hard to trust your body again as like consistently what I've heard. And you have two beautiful examples of your body doing it. Yes. Doing it. That was one thing after Harris, I remember Nick and I talking about is we were so thankful that we did have Ford. Cause I think if it was our first pregnancy, I would have been really deep down that hole of like, don't, I don't know that this is in the cards, you know? So the fact that it had worked once was like that little shred of hope to hold onto it and probably is what made us. brave enough to end up trying again. I think I'm going to give you a fourth word and it's hope. ⁓ I like that. Or hopeful, either one. Yes, I'll take that. Well, thank you. Yes. You've been listening to the Arrivals podcast. Until next time. Yay. ⁓ my goodness. ⁓ sorry. One second.