Latest / A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast / Talks to Dylan Rees about his choice of The Stranger - In Memory Alone

Transcript

Talks to Dylan Rees about his choice of The Stranger - In Memory Alone · A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast

• 0:08
  There is someone at the door and I don't know them, stranger
• 0:15
  danger. There is someone at the store
• 0:19
  and I don't know them. Stranger danger.
• 0:25
  Welcome back to a hamster with a blood pen knife.
• 0:28
  The BBV commentary podcast. Yes, at least today.
• 0:34
  Hello. Who's that talking there?
• 0:36
  It's me, Dylan, BBV superfan. Do you realise this is the third
• 0:40
  day on the trot? People have had an episode
• 0:42
  published of you and me talking about BBV classics.
• 0:46
  Oh wow, what's wrong with them? What time to be alive?
• 0:49
  What time to be alive, what time for me, what time for us.
• 0:52
  We're sat. We've watched The Stranger all
• 0:54
  afternoon. I've come to your house in
• 0:56
  Eastbourne. Oh, am I seeing the beautiful
• 0:58
  sea front? Are we going to see a panto?
• 1:01
  It's nearly Christmas, what are we doing?
• 1:02
  We've sat in and we've watched The Stranger and I wouldn't have
• 1:05
  it any other way. What I was going to say,
• 1:07
  Cecilia, is there anything you'd rather be doing?
• 1:09
  Well, it involves Nicola O'Brien.
• 1:13
  OK, fair. Pretending to be a planet.
• 1:15
  Fair. Fair.
• 1:16
  No, there is nothing I would rather be doing than sat here
• 1:19
  with you watching this. You charmer, honestly, I can see
• 1:24
  why you've got so far in life. Can we now with now the charm
• 1:29
  and is out of the way. You and me, We've got to have an
• 1:33
  arm wrestle. We're having an arm wrestle.
• 1:35
  That's right. I'm going to bring up the two
• 1:37
  words that are going to call contentious between us.
• 1:41
  Oh God. Nicholas Briggs.
• 1:43
  My hero. Now I've got a feeling you think
• 1:47
  I I'm not keen on Nicholas. Bridge.
• 1:50
  Well, all you ever do is slag. Yeah.
• 1:53
  Well, I mean, I did say you read in the podcast that if I don't
• 1:56
  like what he's doing, I will say so.
• 1:59
  And I that is true. And sometimes I do exaggerate it
• 2:02
  for theatrical effects. Of course, yeah.
• 2:04
  Heard my in the time lash did you?
• 2:05
  I did, yes. Did you get through that?
• 2:07
  I got through it and I immediately went and did my
• 2:10
  episode where I I pulled Nicholas Briggs out of the time
• 2:14
  lash. You pulled him out.
• 2:16
  I pulled him off. Oh my God, no.
• 2:18
  Ever since then, he's had a smile.
• 2:20
  Lewis. Exactly.
• 2:22
  What I would like to say he. Modulated my ring 0.
• 2:26
  That is the best. That is the best euphemism I've
• 2:30
  heard on hamster ever. A well modulated ring.
• 2:35
  Excuse me, I think this is Nicholas Briggs at his creative
• 2:42
  peak, and it's the early days, and I think this is where he's
• 2:45
  got lots of ideas and he's finally found a platform where
• 2:50
  he can start doing. Things a training platform.
• 2:54
  Exactly that. This is a really tight script.
• 2:58
  I think, I mean Nick Briggs has said this himself about these
• 3:03
  films and the autumn films and other things that they did, but
• 3:07
  he was a frustrated film writer. That's what he wanted to do.
• 3:10
  He wanted to write big sci-fi films, but just his career never
• 3:14
  took him in that direction. I also think he's a very
• 3:18
  competent director and I know he didn't direct this.
• 3:21
  I think he probably had a bit of a hand in this.
• 3:23
  I know him at Bags had a contentious relationship.
• 3:26
  He's acting in this, he's written it, he's there.
• 3:28
  I bet he had some. I reckon there were some
• 3:31
  conversations, yeah, about how things might look better and
• 3:34
  Bags is only happy to because work with them on that.
• 3:37
  This has a lot of the atmosphere and good creative decisions I
• 3:43
  think that Autumn, the first Autumn video have, and that is
• 3:47
  it's a small setting, it's a small group of characters, so
• 3:50
  they can do it on a budget. Am I just fucking direct the
• 3:54
  hell out of it? Well, this wasn't the first
• 3:58
  script he wrote. He was commissioned to do
• 4:00
  something else, which he described as more Blade Runner
• 4:02
  esque. And bill bags went we can't
• 4:05
  possibly make this. OK.
• 4:08
  They really wanted to a. Sapphire and still knock off
• 4:11
  instead. What this actually is is adapted
• 4:14
  from his Audio Visual Play Conglomerate, but.
• 4:20
  Oh really? What the same premise?
• 4:21
  It's very basically the same premise like Briggs was like, I
• 4:26
  wrote that four years ago, I'm not going to do it again.
• 4:29
  So it's more thematic, I believe.
• 4:31
  And I think there is a train station in it and there's some
• 4:34
  memory loss. He also does that in the Nowhere
• 4:37
  place, I think for Big Finish as well.
• 4:39
  Super. Atmospheric story.
• 4:42
  So I mean never, never waste a good idea.
• 4:45
  Can't. I say something a bit
• 4:47
  controversial. Yeah, I think Nicholas Briggs is
• 4:50
  at his best when he's not writing Doctor Who.
• 4:53
  Like I think he can write Doctor Who, Don't get me wrong.
• 4:55
  I I think stories like Patient 0, Blue Forgotten Planet, I
• 4:59
  don't know, Lucy Miller to the death, the nowhere place that
• 5:03
  you mentioned. Dark eyes dark.
• 5:06
  Maybe, but I I absolutely think he can do.
• 5:09
  It the Dalek generation. Of.
• 5:16
  Actually speechless. Best selling book.
• 5:18
  The Dalek Generation. With amazing good brief reviews.
• 5:21
  Yeah. I've totally lost my train of
• 5:26
  thought. You prefer him when he he's not
• 5:28
  writing Doctor Who. I think he can go to the generic
• 5:31
  Doctor Who will like of, you know, people being interrogated,
• 5:36
  soldiers, freighters, things like, you know, and he just, he
• 5:41
  can churn that stuff out again and again and again.
• 5:43
  The sort of Orion mode. Yeah, and there is a lot of it.
• 5:47
  You know, we're in dorm. You know, I could keep going.
• 5:51
  When he's not writing Doctor Who, he's forced to be a little
• 5:54
  more creative. And I know you've said this is
• 5:57
  sort of Doctor Who. This is in no way like any
• 5:59
  Doctor Who I've ever seen before.
• 6:01
  It's, it's got a very simple premise.
• 6:04
  It's got some potent imagery in it, some really great ideas.
• 6:09
  I don't know. I just think he's on fire here.
• 6:12
  And I, I think, I think he's stimulated by the fact that he's
• 6:16
  not writing Doctor Who. Yeah, well, as we'll see, this
• 6:20
  is sort of an in universe reboot for the series.
• 6:25
  And then over the course of the next three plays, he takes it in
• 6:28
  a very different way because he's like, I don't want to write
• 6:31
  a Doctor Who RIP off. So he does something completely
• 6:34
  different with the characters after this.
• 6:36
  But it's like, it's like Dalek Empire.
• 6:38
  Yeah, I think Dalek Empire, all of those series are really
• 6:42
  accomplished. They've got some problems, but
• 6:43
  they are and they're original. Yeah, because he's got his own
• 6:47
  characters that he's created, and that's obviously the
• 6:50
  passion. There's passion in it.
• 6:52
  He didn't create the Daleks, but the Daleks are sort of a
• 6:54
  ciphers, the wrong word. But they're pretty much at that
• 6:58
  point because their TV appearances, they were kind of
• 7:01
  reduced to more sort of foot soldiers.
• 7:03
  He's really having fun making them benevolent, evil, cunning
• 7:07
  creatures, and they're more cunning than they are in
• 7:10
  particular. Generation.
• 7:12
  But although more cunning than they ever are in the classic
• 7:15
  series of Doctor Who when he's doing the Dalek universe.
• 7:18
  Don't you think they're kind of his now?
• 7:19
  The Daleks. Yeah, pretty much.
• 7:21
  And I do think he writes them fantastically.
• 7:24
  I want someone to know a picture of Tom Baker with Terry Nation
• 7:27
  behind him with his hands out. Yeah, I want then someone to
• 7:30
  superimpose Briggs behind Terry Nation with his hands out.
• 7:36
  You, you remember there was an interview with Rusty Davis where
• 7:39
  he said he actually regrets not getting Nicholas Briggs to write
• 7:43
  for his first run of Doctor Who. And I think he should have.
• 7:47
  I think he should have got him to write a really good Darling 2
• 7:50
  parter. He would have written like a a
• 7:53
  nuts and bolts Terry Nation style story that would have just
• 7:57
  flown if you'd given it someone like Joe Ahern to direct.
• 8:02
  Yeah, absolutely. But, you know, I don't think it
• 8:04
  would happen now. I don't think that's the
• 8:06
  direction the show is going in. My, my big issue with Nicholas
• 8:10
  Briggs, while we're talking about it, it's just that he's
• 8:13
  written so much, right? So you go from audio visuals
• 8:16
  right up to the current day. Yeah, he's probably written 200
• 8:21
  stories. I think he's probably written
• 8:22
  the most Doctor Who out of anybody do.
• 8:24
  Get exhausted like you run out of ideas.
• 8:27
  There are glimmers. I think you sorry sorry you
• 8:31
  covered one I think recently. Did you do the United latest?
• 8:36
  Yes, but it's not out. Yeah.
• 8:37
  Yeah, and that was a good script, I thought.
• 8:40
  But he doesn't, he only probably writes 1A year now because he he
• 8:42
  probably, he's probably aware of this himself, that he just
• 8:44
  doesn't have the stories to tell within the universe.
• 8:46
  I think there was a point where he was writing a lot, but also
• 8:50
  you don't know how much of that is Doctor Who fans on the
• 8:53
  Internet like to go, Nick Briggs's ego, whatever.
• 8:55
  Maybe it was just that they didn't have scripts ready like
• 8:58
  any other showrunner and he just had to go and write them
• 9:00
  himself. We never know what happens
• 9:01
  beyond the scenes. We just assume.
• 9:03
  Yeah, it's. You know, someone throwing their
• 9:05
  way out. It's some sort of ego benevolent
• 9:08
  bastard, but actually it's probably just like we've got.
• 9:10
  Like the drama? Yeah, but actually, maybe they
• 9:13
  just had a lot of slots to fill and the other scripts weren't
• 9:15
  What? Look, I was a single man once.
• 9:18
  I had a lot of slots to fill. And I hear you did it.
• 9:21
  Exactly. Sometimes they don't.
• 9:23
  They don't call me Nicholas Briggs and the Sheets for
• 9:25
  nothing. Really.
• 9:27
  Yeah. How many assholes have you?
• 9:29
  Exterminated. I am the Nick Briggs of sex in
• 9:32
  that I could do it quite well, but nothing too adventurous.
• 9:39
  Not quite generic. Nuts and bolts, Nuts and bolts.
• 9:43
  More nuts and bolts. Well, I'll tell you what on that
• 9:48
  note. If the DVDs got off, the telly's
• 9:51
  been. I've been talking so long, let
• 9:54
  me try and find the title menu again, you know?
• 9:59
  But no, just circling back though, it's just wonderful.
• 10:03
  It is really wonderful to watch something from early in his
• 10:06
  career where he's just so stipulated by what he's doing
• 10:11
  and his performance in this as well.
• 10:14
  What I thought was terrific, and I'm going to repeat what I said
• 10:17
  about Colin and Nicola, I think he's wasted.
• 10:20
  I think there was a role for him on television.
• 10:22
  Agreed. I would like to see, you know,
• 10:25
  Nick Briggs wrote some of that Channel 5 soap opera.
• 10:29
  So, so he got an opportunity in television, but he hated it so
• 10:32
  much. But there used to be a Channel 5
• 10:34
  soap opera called like, it was like a family thing.
• 10:37
  And he wrote some episodes of that.
• 10:38
  I'd like to see those and see what they were like.
• 10:40
  Can you find them please? I'll I'll see what I can do.
• 10:43
  That we can call that too hot for too hot for TV.
• 10:46
  So count us in. Come on.
• 10:48
  Right. Light up your DVDs at home,
• 10:50
  everybody, and we're going to watch your memory alone in
• 10:54
  54321. Go.
• 11:01
  You know, the first thing I'm going to say is, yeah, no jokes.
• 11:06
  This is seriously fucking good. It is if you were going to check
• 11:09
  out one. Strange.
• 11:10
  Story this is they've slightly pimped this up a bit so there's
• 11:13
  a new logo for the stranger there in CGI look at that the.
• 11:20
  The stranger letters shattering all over the screen.
• 11:23
  There are slightly spruced up special effects here and there
• 11:26
  in this one, and it's a shame you can't get the original
• 11:28
  version on DVD sort. Of seeing a screen here POV
• 11:32
  flying through space. Yeah, so it's the same shot in
• 11:36
  the original version, but it's animated rather than CGI.
• 11:41
  Tasty actually isn't. It yeah, that's great.
• 11:44
  I, I mean, I, I genuinely thought the direction in this
• 11:47
  was avant-garde in places. No, no, I'm not taking the poo.
• 11:51
  No, no, I agree. It's like.
• 11:53
  He has he has the Blake 7 robot. It's not that, but it looks like
• 11:58
  that Judger. Fuck me.
• 11:59
  He makes it look like it's hovering about the place
• 12:03
  convincingly. OK, Oh, look at.
• 12:07
  That now that's the original shot.
• 12:09
  Yeah. Lovely shot of the station at
• 12:11
  night in red with the titles. Above it, it's very assignment 2
• 12:16
  of sapphire and steel. I can't remember anything about,
• 12:18
  it's all. Sapphire train platform station.
• 12:20
  I just remember sapphire and steel being really atmospheric
• 12:24
  but really fucking long. I don't think I haven't.
• 12:25
  Finished it long and this isn't, this is very short.
• 12:29
  It's 42 minutes. It doesn't waste a second.
• 12:34
  Is that a new special? Effect.
• 12:35
  Yes, Oh my. God, I saw the old one and it
• 12:39
  was just inside the square light.
• 12:42
  Now it now it films the screen. My God, we're at Market Dylan,
• 12:48
  so seek alternative parcels. I often do now.
• 12:52
  There's a naked mannequin there. More on that later.
• 12:56
  I love that the uncanny valley thing the the mannequins start
• 13:00
  turning into Nicola O'Brien and Colin Baker.
• 13:02
  Yeah, we've all imagined a mannequin turning into Nicola
• 13:05
  O'Brien from time to time. All of this stuff and it's all
• 13:08
  done without dialogue, so the direction has to be on point.
• 13:12
  Tell the story and the music. 'S yeah, I think it's no, it's
• 13:17
  somebody. It's Harvey Summers.
• 13:19
  I think the music. Harvey Summers did all the early
• 13:21
  the first series of Beneath's and that music was great.
• 13:24
  So look at that. That looks great.
• 13:27
  The drudge are flying and you see.
• 13:29
  Yeah, that's brilliant. And I think the Drudge has got
• 13:34
  the voice of Nicholas Briggs, hasn't it?
• 13:36
  He's doing a sort of quirky computer.
• 13:39
  Voice All the other characters in this that aren't them are
• 13:42
  Nicholas are Nicholas Briggs. Do you know what I this is the
• 13:47
  highest possible compliment I could give to this.
• 13:50
  I will buy the DVD of this one. Wow.
• 13:52
  Because I don't want to watch that shaky copy next time.
• 13:55
  Look at that, the mannequin has turned into Nicola O'Brien.
• 13:58
  'S and the the editing there was great.
• 14:03
  Nick Briggs. He's doing his best, John
• 14:06
  Partway from Inferno voice. Oh, look how she look.
• 14:11
  Red gloves. She's doing a sort of Ramana
• 14:13
  from Horns of Nylon look. And once again, she is in
• 14:16
  appropriate clothing. Yeah.
• 14:18
  Where is this a real train platform roughly?
• 14:21
  I don't know whether it I don't. I think the sign might be new.
• 14:23
  It's fake, but yeah. Everybody for the tours will be
• 14:26
  meeting at roughly station, yeah.
• 14:28
  And you'll have your pack lunch on the train and we'll get that
• 14:32
  down to Southampton. Oh, we could put mannequins in
• 14:35
  every other seat and so everyone can sit next door.
• 14:38
  We're seeing the outside of this steam train.
• 14:40
  The thing that lets it down slightly is you can tell the
• 14:42
  steam train stuff is daytime. A lot of us when you see the
• 14:47
  exterior, but a code of a a mannequin reading a paper.
• 14:52
  And the camera just keeps lingering over these mannequins
• 14:54
  in a creepy way. Drudger comes in looks so good
• 15:00
  the. Sound effects are fabulous as
• 15:02
  well. And.
• 15:04
  I think I think the writer has to have a lot of faith in the
• 15:07
  director to pull this off. And the mannequin has turned
• 15:10
  into Colin Baker that. Was effortless that transition.
• 15:14
  He's wearing a suit and a bowler hat and.
• 15:17
  Now, this could have been our doctor.
• 15:21
  We've got a great voice, Roger, isn't he?
• 15:24
  Tickets, please. And so we're doing the sort of
• 15:29
  because they've lost their memory, haven't they?
• 15:30
  Yeah. So nobody really knows who they
• 15:32
  are. They've got to figure out who
• 15:33
  they are and what the mystery is and why they are where they are.
• 15:37
  And maybe a little bit later on we'll find out what the
• 15:42
  estrangement programme is, but you've got all that to come,
• 15:44
  John. The estrangement programme
• 15:48
  really is it about my family. It's.
• 15:52
  The next three films are just a. Biography of you I've seen
• 15:54
  they've slapped a filter over the the steam train and it's.
• 15:58
  Very light in the steam train considering it's night time.
• 16:03
  Just I just love the idea. I mean, I'd love a Doctor Who
• 16:06
  story. Just sit on a train platform,
• 16:08
  yeah. You know, absolutely couldn't do
• 16:12
  it now, though. No, you'd have to have cat nuns
• 16:16
  in there or something like that. Why do you always go to RTDI
• 16:22
  like Catnam? You could have dog people.
• 16:24
  Oh man, Nicholas Briggs in the bowler hat, right?
• 16:28
  He looks like the He looks so young, doesn't he?
• 16:31
  And his cardboard tie. Why has his cardboard tie been
• 16:34
  snipped in half? Because it's an approximation,
• 16:36
  it's sort of going that the the guy hasn't quite got everything
• 16:39
  right, like his glasses putting his eye through his glasses
• 16:42
  because he hasn't got any lenses.
• 16:44
  He so just to I'm going to reveal the twist as we go.
• 16:48
  All right, I think it's fine. So he's a hologram isn't he?
• 16:51
  Of the fella in the suit? Yeah, in the basement.
• 16:54
  He's come here to sort of recharge and recuperate because
• 16:57
  he's battle damaged. And it's he's, he's straight
• 17:00
  from the battlefield. And trust me, we will see that
• 17:02
  later. It's very grim and he goes
• 17:05
  somewhere where he's sort of got a fantasy to be as a like a, as
• 17:10
  a holiday destination. I'm not sure why a train
• 17:12
  platform is where he wants to go.
• 17:14
  On normality, it's normality is craving a normal life of commute
• 17:17
  to work. So why are the stranger Miss
• 17:20
  Brown here as mannequins? But they've been pulled into it,
• 17:24
  although again, you'll find out more in the teller game.
• 17:28
  It's really, really hard to play that sort of uncanny valley,
• 17:34
  creepy, not quite right person without it being comical or
• 17:38
  pony. And it's the decision he makes
• 17:40
  just to or someone's made to get his make up slightly off so you
• 17:45
  can tell he's wearing lipstick, but it's because it's supposed
• 17:48
  to be sort of unreal. I actually thought he looked
• 17:51
  really pretty and it's my man. He's going to shag Nick Briggs.
• 17:54
  I probably would at this point. Yeah, I'll stick with Nicola.
• 17:58
  All right, well we'll both have fun then, not.
• 18:00
  Quite. Oh, I just.
• 18:03
  God, I just won the 6th Doctor and Perry in a story as simple
• 18:08
  as this, as atmospheric as this. And I do.
• 18:13
  It's right here in front of me. Very true, it is a lovely place
• 18:20
  to shoot now. Weirdly, this was again shot at
• 18:24
  weekends, but they had a break due to Colin Baker's commitments
• 18:27
  and came back about three or four months later to to finish
• 18:29
  it. You couldn't tell they've
• 18:32
  they've got a continuity person at this point.
• 18:35
  You say it's all too light in there.
• 18:37
  But you could say it's sort of a void outside.
• 18:39
  Yeah, that is very true. If the train's shooting through
• 18:42
  the void, yeah, he's just. And he was super Doctor Ish in
• 18:46
  this as well, I thought. Yeah, he he gets to do lots of
• 18:50
  fiddling about with wires. Later on when he goes inside the
• 18:52
  machine and all the wires, he's gonna sacrifice himself.
• 18:56
  He's wonderful. Michael quite would have liked,
• 18:59
  actually, an older Colin Baker playing the Doctor.
• 19:01
  Yeah, I think he sort of looks more like the Doctor here than
• 19:05
  when he had that crazy blonde hair.
• 19:07
  Yeah, the the crazy blonde hair was a bit of a sight this step
• 19:10
  I. Think, Oh no, it's not going for
• 19:11
  the void, no. Maybe he is.
• 19:14
  The train has vanished in a puff of smoke.
• 19:19
  So is that stock footage of the train?
• 19:20
  No, they hire the train as part of they're in for real.
• 19:24
  Well, they're in like a heritage sort of site.
• 19:26
  So it's not like a functioning train station.
• 19:29
  That ain't cheap. It's not cheap now, but perhaps
• 19:32
  in the 90s before people had cottoned on to how much these
• 19:35
  things cost. They're a little bit.
• 19:39
  It is very nowhere places. They do sort of wander around an
• 19:43
  empty train for ages, but you know, you've got a good idea.
• 19:48
  Why not recycle it? And it's Colin.
• 19:51
  Is it Colin and Nicola in that as well?
• 19:53
  Colin and Maggie staples. It's like the only thing that
• 19:56
  could be possibly better than Colin and Nicola is Colin and
• 19:59
  Maggie. Colin said this was the best
• 20:01
  script of The Stranger on. I mean, it's the best of the
• 20:05
  three I've seen so far. Well, it's just because it keeps
• 20:09
  throwing weird images at you, right?
• 20:11
  And odd twist and it pays it all off.
• 20:15
  It's atmospheric as well, isn't it?
• 20:17
  And just there's there's a great scenes of Colin and Nicola
• 20:21
  working together in this one as well in a way that the other
• 20:25
  two, they're sort of separated quite a bit throughout them.
• 20:28
  Well, I kept seeing them her dressed like that, him dressed
• 20:31
  like that going. Oh yes.
• 20:34
  Yeah, just it feels more comfortable than garish and
• 20:39
  tits, doesn't it? This isn't my train, she said.
• 20:45
  Oh, it's beautiful, that guy I fucking love.
• 20:47
  Story set on trains. Yeah.
• 20:49
  Is that a boy thing or is that just?
• 20:50
  No, it's a boy. It's a it's a boy thing.
• 20:52
  As I get older, I'm like, oh, I could get a train set.
• 20:56
  I want a train set. Yeah, me too.
• 20:58
  I think I could put it round this rug and just have a train
• 21:01
  going round the room, but my. Uncle used to collect have a
• 21:07
  train set, like a big one that you had like you made like loads
• 21:10
  of stuff for. And I used to love going to the
• 21:12
  train set shop with them because they also sold Dapple figures
• 21:16
  because Dapple made train train. You did?
• 21:19
  Yeah. You could have got another
• 21:20
  Bonnie. Yeah, well, I did.
• 21:23
  How many bonnies you got? I've got the two, that's all you
• 21:25
  need, but when I was younger I had a few because that.
• 21:27
  Got me the tetrap for Christmas. What he he knows how to please
• 21:30
  you. Hello, that's all I've needed in
• 21:32
  life. No, I got the creeping fog
• 21:34
  coming in. Yeah.
• 21:36
  And remember I said to you earlier that less is more.
• 21:40
  Yeah, I think this feels more expensive for being more
• 21:44
  contained. Yeah, because it doesn't really
• 21:46
  overreach at any point. There's a point later on where
• 21:51
  I'm I have to talk about the lighting because what's that
• 21:54
  fellow's name again? Dick Cursor.
• 21:56
  Dick, you are incredibly good in.
• 21:58
  This one, Would you say you love Dick?
• 22:00
  I mean, look at that. Just that.
• 22:02
  Just the the, the creeping smoke that's lit from behind.
• 22:07
  That's very smart. Would I say that I love Dick?
• 22:10
  Oh, yes. Yes.
• 22:13
  Especially Dick's Dick. Yeah.
• 22:16
  Look at this point, you're like, what the fuck is going on?
• 22:18
  They don't know who they are. They're getting electric shocks.
• 22:22
  Trains are appearing out of nowhere.
• 22:24
  The station looks amazing. That bizarre man in the bowler
• 22:27
  hat who's not quite right. Who's not the guy from Myth
• 22:30
  Makers I? Think you might be there He is.
• 22:35
  Yeah, I know what he could have had a Turner's data in next
• 22:39
  generation, you know. Oh.
• 22:42
  We got some slight data. I barely knew her.
• 22:45
  Well done. They're awake, Sorry.
• 22:49
  Oh, what's that? Oh, we've had cancellations.
• 22:51
  Sorry, I want to know if roughly is a real place.
• 22:58
  I mean, it looks like it, yeah, but I.
• 23:00
  Don't know whether it's the sign they've put up or whether that
• 23:02
  is actually a station. Over the actual one.
• 23:05
  When we when we do the terror game in a few weeks time, TuneIn
• 23:08
  and I'll have an answer. For that, oh, thank you.
• 23:11
  I didn't think to comment out in the book.
• 23:13
  Did you say the terror game was the one where it all becomes the
• 23:15
  police? Procedural.
• 23:16
  I mean, in the terror game, you've got Louise Jameson.
• 23:19
  Oh really? Is she playing Patricia Haggard?
• 23:22
  No. She's playing somebody else.
• 23:24
  Haggard. They should have given her a
• 23:25
  better surname than that. And you get Nicholas Pegg do.
• 23:30
  You know what this felt like to me?
• 23:32
  Actually, this felt to me like a really grey high concept Star
• 23:38
  Trek episode, 40 minutes long and mystery at the start.
• 23:41
  And like, it feels different because it is.
• 23:43
  It's more sort of English in the atmospheric than Star Trek.
• 23:47
  You know, great moments for the regular cast and then a top
• 23:51
  notch conclusion. Yeah, now I get, Yeah.
• 23:55
  And I think they could have done just lots like this.
• 23:57
  Yeah. You know, instead of Safari and
• 24:00
  still you could have said the stranger and Miss Brown have
• 24:03
  been assigned. Next time they're going to be
• 24:07
  think of another isolated location.
• 24:09
  A phone box absorb a sauna. Oh God, no.
• 24:18
  Sophie Aldridge back A lighthouse maybe?
• 24:21
  A lighthouse, like The Hobbit of Fang Rock.
• 24:24
  Predictable. So once we go down the stairs,
• 24:26
  this downstairs bit, this is all below BBC Nottingham, where Bill
• 24:30
  Bags was working at the time, and it's actually the underneath
• 24:34
  of an old brewery. Well, it's well matched because
• 24:37
  I really can't tell they're not in the same place.
• 24:40
  And why wouldn't you like, yeah, all these dummies about the
• 24:45
  place. Oh, they're creepy.
• 24:50
  Very creepy. I don't like facsimile of human
• 24:52
  faces. Whatever Doctor Who does masks
• 24:55
  that are like that. That clown in Black Orchid, that
• 24:58
  clown face, the period. The robots and robots are deaf.
• 25:03
  And they just shot mannequins, but they're just like, it's
• 25:06
  weird that God. Look at that shot there.
• 25:09
  Yeah, a lovely silhouette of Nicola Bryant.
• 25:11
  Just with a simple spotlight, yeah.
• 25:15
  That's that's what you just did. Now it's Colin that screams, not
• 25:19
  Nicola. Yeah, Joe.
• 25:22
  I would have loved to unless she wouldn't have touched it with a
• 25:25
  bulge pulp because she had a career.
• 25:27
  I would love to have seen Bonnie do one of these.
• 25:30
  Oh yeah? Oh yeah.
• 25:31
  I wonder what you do with them? Just give her like a great role
• 25:34
  like like Nicola gets. You could have put her in zygom.
• 25:39
  But to be honest, she's probably in America at this point doing
• 25:42
  cats or something like that, you know?
• 25:44
  She was like, Doctor what? Well, she says in interviews,
• 25:48
  like she didn't think that anybody liked her in Doctor Who,
• 25:50
  so she just sort of put it behind her as like an 18 month
• 25:53
  gig. She did, and then.
• 25:54
  And and whatever you think about what has been, it is nice.
• 25:59
  Then she's reached peace with that for a big finish in the
• 26:02
  latest series because her return was greeted with huge
• 26:07
  enthusiasm. But also you've got to remember
• 26:09
  the people who didn't like Doctor Who's direction towards
• 26:13
  the end were the vocal group and fandom at that point.
• 26:17
  But there are a bunch of eight-year olds watching that.
• 26:20
  By the time she came back were 4550 years old and were like Oh
• 26:24
  my God, it's my companion. Do you know what's so weird to
• 26:28
  me? And it's, I mean, I, I do wonder
• 26:31
  if Doctor Who fans didn't like the McCoy.
• 26:34
  This is kind of what they wanted, a return to Hinchcliffe,
• 26:37
  you know, atmosphere, very serious, you know, strong
• 26:42
  science fiction. Cos there's less cartoony, less
• 26:44
  comic bookie, less 2000. Ade yeah, I think it is what
• 26:48
  they wanted and I think this is a direct reaction or there's a
• 26:50
  boom mica just up the top there. I'll Bill.
• 26:52
  You can change this. You can CGI so many things out
• 26:55
  of it, but you can't get rid of the boom.
• 26:57
  Oh no, there we go. He cut away.
• 27:00
  Good man. Yeah, look at them together.
• 27:04
  Fabulous. What's behind the metal door?
• 27:07
  But think about him in that stupid coat he normally wears
• 27:10
  and her in her tinfoil tit costume.
• 27:13
  You know what I mean? Like this just looks.
• 27:17
  This is kind of what I wanted. Oh man, what was that
• 27:23
  downstairs? Fucking hear something it.
• 27:25
  Could be Mark Rowland's Co host of I thought I'd say too well
• 27:30
  for TV. I was going to make a point then
• 27:33
  it's totally gone on my head. It was about Bonnie Langford,
• 27:35
  Sophie Aldrin and Nicola Bryan, you know at the time obviously
• 27:39
  Sophie was greeted with huge acclaim and Bonnie was a total
• 27:43
  embarrassment. Wasn't.
• 27:44
  She well, that was Ian Levine being.
• 27:47
  Things have shifted though, haven't they?
• 27:49
  Now? Bonnie's stories, then they've
• 27:53
  had a huge reappraisal and her character.
• 27:57
  And you know, ultimately she was the one that was in the 5th, she
• 27:59
  was the the link to the classic series in the 50th special, so.
• 28:03
  It's crazy, isn't it? Is Bonnie in the war between the
• 28:06
  land and the sea? Oh.
• 28:07
  I hope so. They're all in this.
• 28:09
  I just want lots of her. I do think Freeman is going to
• 28:12
  be in that, yeah. Something tells me they added
• 28:16
  her to that logo. Yeah, universe.
• 28:18
  Logo for a reason. I might make me watch it free,
• 28:21
  Mahaja members of that. Oh, you're not going to watch
• 28:23
  that, however. No, I'll I'll watch that.
• 28:25
  I just. I just Sea devils so boring,
• 28:27
  wrote one of next year's episodes.
• 28:30
  I would TuneIn to see what that car crash looked like.
• 28:35
  And the Hazel Burrows was the main guest star.
• 28:38
  I mean, sign me up. I don't really like the Sea
• 28:41
  Devils. No, I don't either, really.
• 28:43
  But the story was done like the Cylorians and the Sea Devils.
• 28:47
  I know people love them, but I they're just not.
• 28:50
  They're a bit too long and a bit too shoddy around the edges.
• 28:54
  I don't. Know potent idea yeah and I
• 28:56
  think I think they do it to death there yeah.
• 28:58
  So then when they come back for Warriors of the Deep, they're
• 29:00
  just soldiers. And then, oh, that dreadful 2
• 29:04
  parter in Series 5, I think that basically killed it dead.
• 29:08
  And then when she was, you know, the great detective on Baker
• 29:11
  Street, what's her name? Oh, Madame Vastra.
• 29:15
  Yeah. Oh, that was it.
• 29:16
  All interesting. If they've got a new story to
• 29:18
  tell, but it's not, it's going to be the you've messed up our
• 29:21
  planet. We want it back again, just with
• 29:23
  pollution. Anyway, we're not here to talk
• 29:26
  about the war between the bland and the sea.
• 29:28
  What they could do is in memory alone.
• 29:31
  Exactly. Well, Nick Briggs almost hit the
• 29:33
  stranger. Would you?
• 29:34
  This is the one, though, I think that, well, Nick, Nick Briggs
• 29:38
  and Connie Baker are very good friends.
• 29:40
  You know he'd only do it if he was acting well.
• 29:43
  There's that Blake 7 robot again.
• 29:44
  Actually, it's a good design I think as well.
• 29:46
  Isn't it just a bin? It looks retro.
• 29:49
  Yeah, you know, but it's like a bin with bits added to it.
• 29:52
  Do you? Remember Metal Mickey?
• 29:53
  I do, yeah. Yeah, he looks a bit like that
• 29:55
  M321. Just the collar's starting to
• 30:01
  figure it out. Now I see why he's imperfect.
• 30:03
  I think he might be a hologram. You know Dylan.
• 30:06
  He might be. Oh, there we go.
• 30:08
  He's just buffered. I feel like that sometimes,
• 30:11
  yeah. Me too.
• 30:14
  Slightly out of step with reality.
• 30:16
  Usually when I start watching Steven Moffett, Doctor Who,
• 30:19
  yeah. Well, of course.
• 30:21
  Nick, he just smack Colin Baker with his brolly.
• 30:25
  He's like, what's that? What's that?
• 30:28
  You don't want to be in Sirens at time.
• 30:32
  Well, I mean, it's a bit like I always get these two mixed up.
• 30:36
  Heaven sent. The hell bent, yeah.
• 30:38
  Yeah, it's a bit like that. There's a mystery behind the
• 30:41
  door. Doesn't know what, what, where
• 30:42
  he's going to get there. A.
• 30:44
  Constantly resetting environment.
• 30:47
  It is done in half the time and with less money. 9/10 Less
• 30:53
  smugness. Wow, wow.
• 30:55
  There you go. And better lines.
• 30:57
  Wow. Oh no, I think this script is
• 31:01
  better. Do you really?
• 31:03
  Genuinely wow, this is a great script.
• 31:05
  He turned the corner. Well-being Briggs, yeah, I think
• 31:10
  he can do it, just infrequently. I'm not talking about sex now.
• 31:15
  I'm sure he does do it infrequently.
• 31:18
  I've heard he's. Quite the goer.
• 31:22
  What I was going to say was if they had more money, I don't
• 31:28
  think this would. Apart from a few special effects
• 31:30
  shops, I don't think this you could do this necessarily
• 31:32
  better. No, because if you have more
• 31:34
  money you'd start be adding more characters, adding monsters,
• 31:38
  things like that, and before you know it, it becomes something
• 31:40
  completely different. But it's the only one of the
• 31:42
  three I would say that about because they have gone for this
• 31:45
  very economic approach. I don't, yeah.
• 31:48
  I don't think more money would necessarily make this a better
• 31:51
  story. Agreed.
• 31:53
  I can't believe that floating robot I don't look great.
• 31:55
  I mean, is it on a string? It must be.
• 31:58
  It's a bit like Nomad from Star Trek.
• 31:59
  Do you know who Nomad is? No.
• 32:01
  It was wonderful. He's flying all around the
• 32:03
  Starship Enterprise. You can see the strings in every
• 32:06
  scene, right? What's going on here now?
• 32:11
  The colours, Trying to figure out all of the mystery, isn't
• 32:13
  he? Yeah.
• 32:14
  But you know, by the end of the story, that was one thing that
• 32:16
  he doesn't really figure out. He's a stranger, does he?
• 32:18
  No, because it's an ongoing story.
• 32:20
  Oh, will this happen for a reason?
• 32:22
  Something to do with an arc? Yes, Dylan.
• 32:27
  You get the real answers as to what happened to him in the
• 32:30
  audio play the one with Elizabeth Slayden.
• 32:34
  I suggest you all skip over It's too hot for TV.
• 32:37
  I'll talk about that one that. Happens in between breach of the
• 32:40
  peace and the final one. I hear that Colin is quite good
• 32:43
  on audio, you know. He has been known to do the odd
• 32:46
  big finish. That people enjoy.
• 32:49
  I believe he only did a couple. Yeah.
• 32:51
  A couple of 100, yeah. Oh I found this really creepy.
• 32:57
  But now we're zooming into Nick Briggs, man.
• 32:59
  Oh, look at his molas. Get to the dentist, Nicholas
• 33:02
  Briggs. The dentist.
• 33:04
  That's another range of spin offs from.
• 33:08
  The orthodontist. Oh, Colin.
• 33:15
  Yeah, get away from him. You don't want to look in there.
• 33:18
  There's a thing about the He's not a coward in this, but he's
• 33:21
  inquisitive, the stranger. But he is like he's, he's not
• 33:26
  the brave hero at this point, like because he doesn't know
• 33:29
  what's going on. He's a little bit more cautious,
• 33:32
  I'd say. He's not the shrieking caladiers
• 33:35
  in parts of Twin Dilemma. But like the first one, it was
• 33:39
  Colin really underplaying it because he's in a bad place in
• 33:43
  his life. The second one, it was his
• 33:45
  chance to sort of be almost the romantic hero, the sensual hero.
• 33:51
  I don't know what you want to say.
• 33:52
  This one is, it's like business as usual, isn't it?
• 33:55
  He's the improviser, He's the person that's sort of is the
• 33:58
  detective. This is the one I love though,
• 34:02
  his depiction in there. So I just loved it.
• 34:07
  Nicholas Brexton, some crazy eye rolling in the background he's
• 34:11
  doing. A really great job.
• 34:13
  Yeah, well, he's got to be sort of still, but automated at the
• 34:16
  same time. That's kind of hard to do.
• 34:22
  And they stagger out as well. I think they he staggers out the
• 34:25
  information. That's what when we're talking
• 34:28
  about that terrible court book before.
• 34:31
  Hopefully that'll come out before this.
• 34:34
  If not, then never mind. But I said to you, you don't
• 34:36
  just dump all your exposition in one moment.
• 34:40
  You stagger it out throughout the story.
• 34:42
  And he does act brilliantly. He does.
• 34:44
  He keeps adding bits of information.
• 34:46
  And then in the end, he adds the final piece, which means it all
• 34:50
  comes together. Yeah.
• 34:53
  Gosh, I'm being very. Kind you are, you love Nicola.
• 34:55
  Saxon to me, I think. Why?
• 34:57
  Don't you just fucking marry him?
• 35:01
  No, he doesn't want to marry me, no.
• 35:05
  I, I this is the one. As a kid, I watched again and
• 35:08
  again and again and again. I've seen this.
• 35:10
  I can imagine. Hundreds of times probably.
• 35:14
  I'm surprised you weren't more taken with sapphire and steel
• 35:16
  then because. I'll I'll probably watch it at
• 35:19
  some point. I really like the big finish
• 35:20
  sapphire and steel They're. Fucking.
• 35:23
  But there's something about that 6 episodes, like 6 episode
• 35:26
  format for a lot of those sapphire and steels, isn't it?
• 35:28
  That's just a bit like it's a lot to deal with.
• 35:31
  When we hit that and finish big, I'm going to tap you up for that
• 35:34
  because they were I will so great.
• 35:36
  I will pop in for those and. Then we love David Warner, don't
• 35:39
  we? Yeah.
• 35:39
  We can't say enough nice things about him.
• 35:41
  He's brilliant. Susanna Harker, when she's not
• 35:43
  having it off with Paul McCann. Yeah, she's amazing in front of
• 35:46
  the microphone. Really good cast, really good
• 35:49
  stories, really creepy. Atmospheric.
• 35:51
  So many little things. Type 2 shots.
• 35:53
  Yeah, two of them. And it's so weird because this
• 35:57
  is the one story where they're not the stranger.
• 36:00
  And yeah, they're just so great together.
• 36:05
  Oh. It's just creepy.
• 36:07
  Isn't it? Yeah.
• 36:08
  Stop. Stop going to his mouth like
• 36:10
  that. Oh, he.
• 36:12
  Don't often say that. It's.
• 36:17
  True. I think I kept thinking this
• 36:22
  robot was like tickets please. So you must have your tickets
• 36:25
  from the greatest show in the Galaxy.
• 36:26
  Well, he does ask for tickets at the start, doesn't he?
• 36:28
  Yeah. Oh, Nicholas.
• 36:33
  Nicky B. It's true though, like in in
• 36:36
  Doctor Who, the new series, I really do think he's given some
• 36:42
  terrific vocal performances in Dalek in Resolution.
• 36:48
  You know, when he gets to play Daleks that aren't Daleks.
• 36:50
  Yeah. Ah, this is.
• 36:53
  Fabulous, the big monster. So what is it?
• 36:57
  A war suit. Yeah, it's like, but you're sort
• 37:00
  of linked to it. And I think he's been linked too
• 37:03
  long and he's been damaged and he's just a mess.
• 37:06
  And it's all sort of encased in wires.
• 37:08
  It's a bit like the controller from Bad Wolf.
• 37:10
  You know, I think that's probably where they got the
• 37:12
  idea. From the from this.
• 37:15
  You can actually trace all new who ideas back to the stranger.
• 37:20
  But even here it takes a little while before they say that
• 37:23
  Nicholas Briggs is a hologram of the soldier.
• 37:30
  But he's the doctors, the strangers, piercing it together.
• 37:36
  And it's one of those scripts that is always just a little bit
• 37:39
  ahead of me as well. I was trying to figure all this
• 37:42
  out as I went along. I hate it when I get it early
• 37:45
  before the character and I'm going, come on, will you catch
• 37:47
  up? They're a bit like a Cyberman.
• 37:50
  He does and he's got a hand that's holding a gun that you'll
• 37:55
  see it when he breaks loose the, the, the thing and it, it was a
• 38:00
  thing you could buy in the shops.
• 38:01
  We had one. It was like a metal robot arm
• 38:03
  with a gun attached to it and they've used it here.
• 38:07
  Oh sorry, I thought you meant it was merchandise from there.
• 38:10
  No, no, no, no. It was it.
• 38:12
  They just bought it in Toys-R-Us or something.
• 38:15
  A stranger merchandise Toys R. Us you get a drudger.
• 38:19
  Oh. Damn Drudger would have been
• 38:21
  popular. One of those flat ties that Nick
• 38:23
  Briggs is wearing. Oh, the Drudger's been
• 38:26
  completely destroyed. RIP.
• 38:28
  Oh, it does. What is that man?
• 38:33
  Man The the the the legs. I think, I think it's like they
• 38:37
  probably got them what they did with the Cybermen and get a
• 38:40
  flight suit and spray it. But I suppose there is a version
• 38:45
  of this you could do where as a Cyberman at the heart of it that
• 38:49
  had regained its humanity to a certain was fighting with it and
• 38:51
  it would work just as well. I think the only thing that lets
• 38:54
  it down is the helmet. When it's moving, it looks a bit
• 38:57
  cumbersome. About but.
• 38:59
  You're sort of shooting it in slow motion.
• 39:01
  The the light is still great so it it works.
• 39:04
  Are you often let down by a helmet?
• 39:06
  Very rarely. And I'm like, there was this one
• 39:08
  guy, right? No, seriously, it was sort of
• 39:11
  curved up. It was very odd.
• 39:14
  Nah, I'm going nowhere near me, mate.
• 39:17
  Oh, here we go. The suit's alive.
• 39:21
  Oh, oh, Colin Baker does great pain.
• 39:25
  Oh, dear. That's what happens when you
• 39:30
  don't Lube up. When the Time Team did Ultimate
• 39:40
  Foe. And can you remember when Colin
• 39:42
  Baker turned up? Do you remember that in Doctor
• 39:44
  Magazine? And he said then I love this
• 39:47
  script because it's doing sort of weird atmospheric things like
• 39:51
  sapphire and steel, and I really wish I'd had more of this during
• 39:55
  my time. No wonder he loved this script.
• 39:57
  Absolutely. But like.
• 40:04
  Now, So what we missed there is there was a version with three
• 40:07
  of the suits where it was a little flashback, which is
• 40:09
  obviously just a split screen, but it, you know, they're really
• 40:11
  trying, they're really thinking about things.
• 40:14
  How this is paced? Yeah.
• 40:16
  How this is edited, the close-ups, the two shots and all
• 40:20
  of that. I mean, probe went to diet.
• 40:22
  It had none of this. It was just somebody with a
• 40:25
  camera. It was all fucking long shots in
• 40:28
  forests and things. It was just terrible.
• 40:32
  Look at Nick Briggs with his gammy burnt face.
• 40:36
  That's pretty good. Who's doing the make up?
• 40:38
  It's not old Dorka is it? I don't.
• 40:39
  Know who it is? Dorka nezzer or a ditch.
• 40:43
  Like, I mean, I can handle this, but in a minute when the face
• 40:47
  starts melting and they've got these awful Jelly eyes that are
• 40:50
  falling about the place, I mean, it's revolting.
• 40:53
  Oh, they love a bit of gore. Look at that.
• 40:56
  Sort of got blood oozing out of his mouth.
• 41:03
  Oh, Miss Brown. You look radiant in that light.
• 41:09
  Oh. There we go.
• 41:09
  His body's melt. His face is melting.
• 41:12
  I mean he's always seem to have been bulging out of his face
• 41:16
  now, but there is a shot in a second.
• 41:19
  I think it flats up at the end. Look, look, look.
• 41:23
  Oh crap, that is horrible it. Is.
• 41:26
  Horrible someone's hands in there.
• 41:28
  Right. I had a really nice, subtle,
• 41:34
  creepy skull, yeah as well. Do you think they knew they were
• 41:39
  on something good with this one? I reckon so.
• 41:40
  And they were like, all right, let's really try and make this
• 41:43
  work. No.
• 41:47
  Oh balls. Yeah, now I was getting
• 41:50
  confusing. This is the.
• 41:51
  Repair. This is the repair program.
• 41:53
  Oh. It's bricks again, isn't it?
• 41:59
  Yeah. And given a totally different
• 42:01
  performance again. It's very red Dwarf, isn't it at
• 42:05
  this point? Nicholas Briggs, I'll salute.
• 42:10
  You excellent. I mean.
• 42:11
  Finally. It had to happen when we were.
• 42:15
  Together. Nick Briggs has finally just
• 42:17
  woken up and been like he's listened to every episode of
• 42:20
  this fucking thing. Like you just say something
• 42:22
  nice. He's finally been endorsed.
• 42:27
  Nick, all I'll say is go listen to my Creatures of Beauty
• 42:29
  episode, all right? Yeah, It's our new effect.
• 42:33
  The No. That's that's how it wasn't the
• 42:35
  original. It's pretty good, isn't it?
• 42:38
  It reminds me of it. You know the PR from Shakedown?
• 42:44
  Yeah, it's all affecting it. You squint.
• 42:47
  You can just see Caroline Ford on the rigging.
• 42:51
  I always can lives in my mind. Rent freaks.
• 42:54
  That's the gun that we used to have.
• 42:57
  Oh my God. And he's wearing a cricket glove
• 42:58
  like the Cyberman. Those are big boots as well.
• 43:01
  They look like ski boots or something.
• 43:02
  You consider yourself fortunate as a child to have been bought
• 43:06
  by your pair of stranger merchandise.
• 43:08
  Well, exactly, yeah. Now, now, this say it's like a
• 43:12
  war robot, isn't it? But he's dead inside, right?
• 43:16
  So it's just the suit? Yeah, but I mean, we've all been
• 43:19
  out with people that are dead inside.
• 43:23
  I can't really say that about my overall, you know, the amount of
• 43:27
  sexy dancers. He does, yeah.
• 43:30
  So the, because he's dead, the suit's just sort of an autopilot
• 43:35
  and it thinks there's a threat, which it there is, there's the
• 43:37
  fog. So he's just shooting everybody.
• 43:40
  Collins Literally there's 2 levels through this, isn't
• 43:42
  there? 1 is hurrah, This is the sort of
• 43:44
  thing I wanted to do. 2 He wants to fucking prove himself,
• 43:48
  doesn't he? He knows how at this point, how
• 43:52
  in esteem he is held by Doctor Who found.
• 43:55
  But at this point as well, all these actors were doing this
• 43:58
  because they genuinely thought Bill Bags was going somewhere,
• 44:01
  right? And they're actually like they
• 44:03
  might be cast in a big drama that he makes for the BBC or ITV
• 44:06
  wonder. As somebody who has studied bill
• 44:10
  bags a lot and you know, a lot of behind the scenes stuff and
• 44:13
  you've interviewed lots of people, yeah, was was there ever
• 44:18
  a possibility that he would have been a mover and a shaker?
• 44:21
  I think there is a possibility he would have had a fairly
• 44:25
  decent career in soaps and doing things like the Bill and stuff
• 44:30
  like that. I don't.
• 44:31
  Feel ambitious. Though no, it's just that we're
• 44:35
  looking at this and it is really well done, but it's also, you
• 44:40
  know, it's not the most cinematic sci-fi film you've
• 44:43
  ever seen. I think he, I think he had a
• 44:45
  good eye for shots at one point or maybe it was all his lighting
• 44:49
  cameraman, but. I mean, you recently watched the
• 44:53
  latest Alien film which was extremely cinematic.
• 44:58
  Was it as enjoyable as this? No, but I didn't like that film
• 45:01
  from it wasn't the direction that was the issue for me with
• 45:03
  that film. So but he.
• 45:08
  Oh. Little Peck on the cheek.
• 45:09
  It's brown. So the doctor's going to get in
• 45:13
  the software and sort it all out.
• 45:14
  Sorry, the stranger. This is very doctrine now
• 45:17
  though, and all the wires are around his body.
• 45:21
  He looks a bit like Clara Oswald when she was in that Dalek in
• 45:23
  Asylum of the Daleks. And he's going to put everything
• 45:28
  in its proper place. That's it.
• 45:29
  Pumping dry ice in backlit. Oh no, too much dry ice now.
• 45:35
  Suits vanished. So everything in this proper
• 45:37
  place. So Miss Brown will go back to
• 45:41
  where she comes from, and the stranger will go to wherever he
• 45:46
  was headed before he hooked up with Miss Brown.
• 45:49
  Oh. Is this the last time we see
• 45:51
  her? She's gone.
• 45:52
  Oh no, does she live a happy life?
• 45:55
  Do we know? Are you all fine that?
• 45:58
  Oh, they do tell you. Yeah.
• 46:00
  Oh, is it in a big pink heart? No like.
• 46:03
  In the ultimate phone, you've. Got it's all to do with the
• 46:06
  estrangement program. Estrangement program.
• 46:10
  You keep enticing me with this. I can't wait to find out what
• 46:13
  it's all about. I mean, when Luke Malloy tuned
• 46:16
  into the next one, he lost the will to live.
• 46:19
  But I really like it so. Well, you know, I consider you a
• 46:22
  man of sound judgement. I do have a theory though, you
• 46:26
  know that I don't think that Bags was without the talent at
• 46:31
  this point to take on ATV show. I do wonder if his personality
• 46:37
  perhaps got in his way and, you know, false promises and things
• 46:42
  like that, that, you know, I they say a lot of it is luck in
• 46:46
  television, but I think you kind of have to be something that
• 46:50
  people want. To work with, I mean, everybody
• 46:53
  that worked with him, writer wise said.
• 46:54
  He had very weird ideas about narrative and perhaps that is
• 47:01
  the sort of stuff that like maybe he was given a script for
• 47:03
  EastEnders or the builds I take a look at there's like, well,
• 47:06
  I'd like to do this. And they all went no.
• 47:08
  Like you can make things look pretty, but.
• 47:12
  Oh my God that the the helmet just sprung up as the survival
• 47:16
  suit was strangling the stranger and.
• 47:20
  Squirted loads of blood. Blood all over his.
• 47:24
  Back and right now it's looking more like a donor kebab in
• 47:26
  there, going back to Nicky Briggs, Nicky B.
• 47:30
  It doesn't even look like a pup. It looks so like, not like an
• 47:34
  actual pup. No, not a kinky pup.
• 47:36
  But you know, there's no king in The Stranger.
• 47:38
  Night what? Except for Sophie Aldrin in the
• 47:41
  last one. That's not king.
• 47:44
  It's a no sex scenes coming up in the last three.
• 47:46
  Oh yeah, it's all heavy bumming. From now on, great.
• 47:49
  There is, there is, there is actually a plot that involves
• 47:51
  pornography in the fifth one, but it's very well done.
• 47:55
  Have you been? I'm not even shitting you.
• 47:58
  I can't wait. You can do the porno specials.
• 48:04
  That and Doctor Screw. It it doesn't pay too very, it
• 48:08
  doesn't play too much into it. This was great.
• 48:10
  The camera pans out, they're back as dummies again, the
• 48:14
  smoke's pumping in the voice over, and then it just goes to
• 48:18
  the credits. It wastes no time with a coder
• 48:23
  because the story's reached its climax.
• 48:25
  It's brilliant. That's really great.
• 48:27
  Bravo. And sometimes you have to know
• 48:30
  when to stop. And I think he chose the right
• 48:33
  boy in he did. It might be his most.
• 48:35
  It might be my favorite Brig script.
• 48:38
  It's a fucking great. Script all of his scripts.
• 48:42
  Oh, Alistair Lock was in there. I see.
• 48:43
  I told you I'd be involved in there somewhere.
• 48:46
  Of course. A very talented man.
• 48:47
  Did you do the music? No, I thought, I'm pretty sure
• 48:50
  that was Harvey Summers. Although maybe Harvey.
• 48:52
  Yeah, the poster. Harvey Summers.
• 48:54
  Harvey, we salute you. It was a great score.
• 48:57
  Thanks, Harve. Can I ask you then you can.
• 48:59
  Was this your favorite of all the strangers?
• 49:02
  Yes, it is. It remains my favorite out of
• 49:05
  all six and I'm always happy to revisit.
• 49:12
  And I would probably it's this is the one I go back to.
• 49:15
  I haven't watched a lot of The Strangers in a long time, but
• 49:17
  this one I have seen in the last few years definitely.
• 49:20
  And is there a reason why? Because obviously we've had
• 49:25
  three stories now with a stranger of Miss Brown.
• 49:29
  Is there a reason why we go off in another direction now?
• 49:33
  Nick Briggs was uncomfortable about making knock off Doctor
• 49:37
  Who and wanted to change it. OK, we're looking.
• 49:40
  T script all the rest then yeah. And Briggs and bags, we're both
• 49:46
  looking for showreel pieces to try and get work in proper
• 49:48
  telly. So they're interested in writing
• 49:50
  different things. And you know, it's not that it's
• 49:53
  not sci-fi, it's very heavily sci-fi in these next three,
• 49:57
  although 1 is a lot lighter on the sci-fi, but they're just
• 50:01
  trying to do new and interesting things and some of it works and
• 50:05
  some of it doesn't. And then after Air Zone Solution
• 50:08
  which comes after this, that's when Nicola Bryant falls out
• 50:12
  with bags. So there was no danger of her
• 50:14
  coming back. I ever and Baker does eventually
• 50:17
  doesn't. He, yeah, but not, not for a
• 50:19
  good while. And even there's a lot of it's
• 50:24
  not like at the end of The Stranger, he just goes, well,
• 50:27
  fuck this guy. There is a point where he's
• 50:29
  going to do an audio a little bit down later down the line and
• 50:32
  then doesn't do it for whatever reason.
• 50:34
  People really start to. I think what happens is when it
• 50:38
  gets to doing the audios, he starts, you know, paying a lot
• 50:42
  less because they're selling a lot less and then everybody's
• 50:45
  happy they got paid for their first releases.
• 50:48
  It's when it comes to the DVD releases, the downloads, sort of
• 50:54
  in the early naughties, when you really when these things start
• 50:56
  to get re. So when Keith Barnfather re put
• 51:00
  out all hits catalogue, he renegotiated with everybody
• 51:04
  involved with them a small fee like they don't sell loads to to
• 51:08
  say I want to sell this again in a new format.
• 51:12
  Legal that you have to do that. It depends on your contract.
• 51:15
  Or is it like a gentleman's? No, I should do that.
• 51:18
  I mean you should do that, but here.
• 51:23
  So these have been re released but they're just.
• 51:24
  Yeah, exactly. Yeah.
• 51:26
  OK, well I can see what people are pissed then.
• 51:28
  And you might or, and if it's not that he's not paying anybody
• 51:32
  royalties and they may not, I don't know whether there were
• 51:34
  royalties in the contracts or not.
• 51:35
  But as far as they're concerned, he's been selling these films
• 51:39
  and audios and stuff for many years in different formats that
• 51:43
  they weren't originally supposed to be released in.
• 51:45
  And had he just, you know, gone, gone to them and said I'm doing
• 51:48
  this, you'll get a few quid, I don't think anybody would think
• 51:52
  worse of him. Although I think I think he did
• 51:54
  also not pay a few people towards the end of his
• 51:57
  productions, but. To summarise the work that we
• 52:01
  have done today, I just want to ask you, what's your main take
• 52:06
  away from this? Obviously I know you watch these
• 52:08
  at the time, you haven't watched these for a while.
• 52:10
  Where does this sort of fall with you now, The stranger?
• 52:13
  I think I, I really like to believe it's Doctor Who.
• 52:18
  I really. But then I know where the series
• 52:20
  goes, and I cannot reconcile that with Doctor Who in any way,
• 52:23
  shape or form. You can at this point.
• 52:24
  Yeah, this could be, you know, a little bit of memory loss, this
• 52:28
  that and the other and this is Doctor Who.
• 52:31
  So but it just, I just think it's fascinating.
• 52:35
  I think it's such a like and I can't think of an example of any
• 52:39
  other TV shows where this has happened.
• 52:42
  Because when Star Wars does it, they can pump serious money into
• 52:46
  There's been awesome things, you know?
• 52:48
  But this isn't a spin off, is it?
• 52:49
  We call it a spin off, but this is something completely separate
• 52:52
  technically. And the motive for doing it is
• 52:55
  so. Yeah, isn't it?
• 52:56
  It's not to continue, Doctor Who.
• 52:58
  It's like you said, it's to show what we can do in this format.
• 53:01
  Absolutely. And I think in the back of their
• 53:03
  minds, although they've never actually said this, I think they
• 53:05
  were hoping that maybe the BBC go these are the guys we want to
• 53:09
  make Doctor Who, the next generation of Doctor Who.
• 53:12
  What would that have looked like if it had looked like that?
• 53:15
  Last one, yeah, that's like it. Look, this is what we can do
• 53:18
  with five quids. But but but science fiction was
• 53:22
  so out of vogue at that time in the UK.
• 53:24
  Like the BBC didn't want anything to do with it.
• 53:28
  Don't. Swallow any sick when I say that
• 53:29
  it needed somebody like Rusty Davis, who'd always established
• 53:32
  themselves to say, Do you know what I want to do?
• 53:34
  Science fiction. Yeah, and even when you're like,
• 53:38
  you look at things like crime, traveller and bugs, they're set
• 53:41
  in the contemporary world. And when they are towards
• 53:45
  science fiction, the creator's got a slap.
• 53:48
  On the yeah, but it's it's it's covert science fiction and I
• 53:51
  know Crime Traveller is about time travel, but it's very
• 53:54
  loosely, Yeah, very loosely. It's like sci-fi is almost a
• 53:59
  plot point used in those things rather than look at our new
• 54:03
  exciting sci-fi show. Because for some reason sci-fi
• 54:06
  in this U sci-fi in the UK have become a joke of Doctor Who and
• 54:10
  Blake Seven. Look how cheap and shit they
• 54:11
  were. Bugs is more like James Bond
• 54:14
  with computers, you know, helicopter chases and explosions
• 54:17
  and things. You know, my, my biggest take
• 54:20
  away from this was one, don't have expectations or low ones,
• 54:25
  because I'm really surprised actually that the highest
• 54:28
  government I can throw at this series is what I've said several
• 54:32
  times throughout this is I think Colin and Nicola had a very
• 54:38
  strong TV role in them, which they prove in this.
• 54:42
  I think Briggs could have written scripts for television.
• 54:44
  Absolutely. And at this point I think Bags
• 54:46
  could have directed television with a bit of guidance.
• 54:49
  Absolutely. It's good stuff.
• 54:52
  It is good stuff. I've had a great time revisiting
• 54:55
  them and I mean I'll always watching Memory alone, but I
• 54:58
  enjoyed the other two as well. Well, we will return, probably
• 55:01
  not together on this so far. We will return to the stranger.
• 55:05
  We will the last three soon. How?
• 55:07
  Exciting. I'll just say thank you for
• 55:09
  coming all this way. You know it.
• 55:11
  Was my pleasure so. Bill Bagsey with me.
• 55:13
  Oh, I'm always up to do a bit of Bilbo the bastard bagging.
• 55:18
  OK there.