Latest / Finding New Waters / Navigating Recovery and Renewal with Amanda Marino

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Navigating Recovery and Renewal with Amanda Marino · Finding New Waters

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If you're clean and sober today and there's some funky idea you
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have in your head and there's something you haven't told
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anyone, you need to tell at least one person what's really
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going on. The the thoughts.
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The thing doesn't have to be the whole wide world, doesn't have
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to be a group. That it it could be whoever you
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feel safe and you could tell this person this thing and this
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person this thing. So there's no right and wrong
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way to do it. Just make sure you talk about
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the things that you need to come out that's that's going out to
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people that are struggling for families or for anyone that's
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searching Like if you can and you do have the resources,
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family coaching, family therapy, wrap around services, case
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management. We don't want to be at next
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level recovery Associates. We don't want to be a Band-Aid.
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Our goal is to create lasting change within the in the
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individual, the family system, or in the corporate space.
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Good afternoon, My name is Graham Durge and I'm the Founder
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and CEO of New Waters Recovery in Raleigh, NC.
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Welcome to our weekly podcast, Finding New Waters.
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Our goal in creating Finding New Waters is to provide a resource
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for families to help navigate the complexities of supporting a
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loved 1, struggling with substance use or mental health.
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When we find ourselves in crisis due to one of these issues, most
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people have no idea where to turn.
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We hope to shed some light on to what is off in the darkest hour
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for many families. All right, guys.
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Thank you for joining us for another episode of Finding New
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Waters. And today we have Erica Cooney,
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our one of our primary therapists here at New Waters
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Recovery, who is a licensed marriage and family therapist.
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And then our guest on the show is Amanda Marino and she is the
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Co founder of Next Level Recovery Associates.
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Amanda, thank you so much for taking some time to to hang out
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with us today. Thank you both so much for
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having me. It's such an honor and humbling
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always to be asked to do things like this.
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Absolutely. So I thought we could start off.
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If you're open to it, maybe just tell us a little bit about you
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and what kind of brought you to the field and what do you like?
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What have been your experiences? Well, I like when I speak at a
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like a Congress in the event, I say there's like 2 versions of
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me, right? So there's me.
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There's Amanda, the Co founder. The you know, I started a a
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nonprofit for women to go back and back to school in recovery
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and had that going for years. I decided to fill a gap in my
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community that really needed to happen like the before, during
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and after piece. And there's a lot of people that
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are doing it out there. And when I worked for a number
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of people as a contractor, like, I did all the work that that my
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team does, like I've done companioning.
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I've done all of it, and I think it gives me a different
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perspective and I want to continue to evolve and try new
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ways to meet people where they are and to try to make and
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create lasting change. So that's what our company is
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all about. I had this idea.
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I had a full time cushy job and I told my ex-husband I said I
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can't make it to Christmas. I need to leave my job and start
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now and I was already building it up on the side.
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So by the time I left in August I couldn't really make it even
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close to December. I opened up my business and
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quickly saw that I needed a Co founder and that's when I, you
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know, got that direct hit on a run for a spiritual hit of it
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has to be Blake and we started in January of 2020 and we've
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been extremely, you know, fruitful and abundant since
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then. That's great.
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That's great. And then who the other side of
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me is? No, go ahead.
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The the other side of me is I'm a mom.
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You know, I have a an almost 18 year old son who was 18 months
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old when I got clean and sober. He'll be 18 on the 18th.
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This this month I have an 11 year old daughter.
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You know, I'm a single mom, a homeowner.
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I love to be active. I love to adventure, I love to
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travel and I just love to live life to the fullest and and be
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happy and free. So that's who I really AM.
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I love that. I love that, yeah.
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I'm a I'm a father myself. And yeah, I mean that's we have
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to balance that, right? I mean, as much as I love the
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work that I do and the people that we get to help, I mean like
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you know, being a parent and doing those things is is amazing
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for sure. Can you tell us a little bit
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about next level recovery? So I know you mentioned sober
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companion, I know you guys also do an intervention work, case
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management, things like that. So why don't you tell us a
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little bit about, you know, what does Next Level recovery do.
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So we are a boutique concierge, you know, programming that is
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designed. You know, once we do an
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assessment with an individual and a family that we create a
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custom plan for so it can be before treatment.
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We start working with them during treatment and after or we
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can do all of the above. And sometimes it's in place of
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so if somebody's been to so many treatments and they their
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struggle is like applying what their aftercare plan is or
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applying what they've learned into the real life, we can kind
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of hand hold them right. Our coaches and our companions
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can hand hold them and then like titrate down on how we do that
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because we don't want to coddle and be codependent.
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But I'll tell you, a lot of the people we're dealing with today,
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the, I think it's after the COVID thing.
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It made it worse like they're terrified to to like take this
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sheet of like an aftercare paper and and and take those action
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steps by themselves. So they're scared to get jobs.
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They're, you know, they're, they're scared to rekindle with
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their family. And so we saw a need in our
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community. Like, there's a lot of people
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that do this all over the country.
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But in South Florida, there was really nobody doing what we did,
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like as a hub. There's people that had like
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maybe a main office in New York or LA or or or Kala or just
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different places. But there was like, I'm from
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here and Blake's from here. So we work here in South
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Florida, but we also work a lot in New York, a lot in Texas, a
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lot in California and overseas, you know in the in Europe and as
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well as South America. We have a Latin team, a Spanish
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speaking team as well. So we're just constantly trying
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to improve the way that we all do this.
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And we feel like it's our responsibility as people that
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have a pretty strong social media presence to help remove
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stigma, to help educate people, to help people not feel alone.
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Because it's a lot less intimidating to send a direct
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message to somebody than it is to pick up the phone.
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And I've had a lot of like attorneys and professionals over
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the years on LinkedIn that they've never told anyone
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they're super high functioning. Right.
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And they send a message, you know, like, hey I need help, but
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I don't want anyone to know. I don't want to lose my and I
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try to tell them like you're not going to lose your license, but
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they don't believe me. Right.
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So we've tried to really and we continue continually evolve,
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right. We're all we're meeting about
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our clients every week and we're always trying to do better.
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That's awesome. So what does that look like for
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a client when a client reaches out?
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I know you mentioned it could be before treatment or after, but
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like if a client that's in in potential need of your services,
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they reach out to you and kind of what does that process look
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like? Well, since we've grown, we now
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have a couple people in place. So myself and Blake, our focus
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is overseeing the whole company and overseeing every case.
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We no longer take on our own clients, just there was no way
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to travel the country this year and for Blake to start his
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doctorate program for us to continue at the capacity we were
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right. So we took a long time to get
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our select hand selected. We can select everyone that
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works for us. We don't have a large list of
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contractors. We know everybody that's on our
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our list of people that we use and we know them and what
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they're, what makes them tick, what they're going to client
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clients are going to align with. So, so Sarah who was a nurse,
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she does all of our first screenings and she's our team
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and family manager. So everything starts and begins
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with either Sarah or Danielle. Sarah Frias or Danielle Moldean
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and Danielle is our clinical outreach.
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Danielle went to school, got her bachelor's in psychology and
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then her master's in special education and then decided I
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don't want to do, I don't want to teach this.
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And so then she started working for a another company for a a
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while And then when she came to me, I'm like, Oh my God, look at
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you would have. She's like I never thought I'd
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ever use my degree and look like this is, this is special and
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you're teaching and you're in the psychology piece.
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So we have found these like there's a video, I don't know if
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you checked out my Instagram, but there's a video I made the
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other day which like literally melts my heart.
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It was an idea I had that says where each team member at this
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lunch would say I am next level, I am next level, I am next
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level. And so it goes through all of
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that and then it shows the end. Our videographer did like
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everybody saying it at the same time, oh, that's cool level.
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And like, I'm not on it and Blake's on it because we're big
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on like lifting up our team. We want to highlight them and
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make it more about them than it is about us these days, because
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they're the magic. Yeah, absolutely.
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Completely agree. You know, I would say, you know,
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obviously at New Waters, I mean we do detox, we do assessments
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and everybody is an outbound referral, right.
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So, you know, working with the families, with the client on the
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front end to help them, you know, make the decision to come
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into treatment. But then we're just kind of the
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starting point, right. So you know what you're talking
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about. Just kind of the idea of, like
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sober companionship, case management, even sometimes
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interventions on the front end. We we definitely see the value
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in those types of services. And you know, I could speak for
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hours about this, but you know since everybody is an outbound
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referral, obviously people are at different places in their
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level of motivation for change or to take that next step in
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their recovery. And then we also see
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unfortunately with the disease of addiction, we just see a lot
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of recidivism of the word that I'm looking for that I can't
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find right now. You know what you mean?
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You know what I'm saying? I would try to say it, but then
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I'm gonna butcher it too. So.
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We'll just move past that, right.
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So she'll say it. She'll say it.
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Right, there we go, there we go. So we wanna obviously all of us,
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I think, right, We wanna lower that.
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We wanna see people be successful, take that first step
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and be able to see progress as they move forward.
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And that is 1 service. I think that a lot of time is
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very valuable in helping people reach that goal that a lot of
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people just don't take advantage of, is that, you know, for maybe
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different reasons and maybe you could speak to this, but, you
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know, maybe feeling like, you know, they can do it on their
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own, right? Or they're just not being
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willing to ask for that additional layer of help, help.
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Or to think, you know, to be in the mindset that if I just do
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detox and residential, I should be cured and fine.
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But a lot of times having someone that can be there as a
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resource and provide additional support and accountability can
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just be such a huge help in this process.
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Yeah, well, I'm going to kind of backtrack cause a few things
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that you said come up. So the first thing is like, you
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know, doing what the services you do detox and residential,
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right. So your admissions team and like
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your, you know, intake staff and your, you know, detox therapist
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noticed on the front end that this family is like a way is
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definitely needs your family program but is way too much.
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They're lighting your phone up. They don't understand, they're
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not educated. We're called often then to kind
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of step in and then we support and we're a third party voice of
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whatever your clinical recommendations are.
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So now they have two different organizations that have no
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association with each other except for their trusted
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partners giving this name messaging, right.
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So that's one way where providers will call us and be
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like Amanda. Like we need you guys to like we
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still, we have a family coach, we have a psychiatrist, we have
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a psychologist, we have a dietitian and then we have
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coaches and, you know, companions that are are are
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specialties to everything. And then on the back end, you
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know, people go home and sometimes they go home to their
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house still with who knows what in it still, right, Like are
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there, is there paraphernalia, is there stashes?
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Like we go, we do this thing where we'll go home with people,
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clean up their house, like get them settled, start doing
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implementing that plan, making sure they make their first few
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therapist appointments. They're making meetings, you
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know, they're meeting people. They're not isolating because
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that's the easiest and most common thing to do.
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And especially if there's no, like we had a couple clients
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recently that were that came in themselves, right?
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And there was no family involvement.
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But I quickly saw like we need to have somebody in the family
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for support and for backup, right?
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If it's just like an adult male or adult female that comes to us
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and wants services, we still need somebody else for their
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protection to be involved, right?
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And so we we do clinical staffings every single week and
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we look at OK, what's working, what's not, is this the right
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coach for the person. Do we need to change something
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maybe change therapists? Like we go through all that
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stuff with our psychologists and and usually the people that come
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to us. This is not their first go
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around, unfortunately. I wish someone called me on
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their first go around. Often times the adolescents I I
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deal with it. But it's not their first problem
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experience, right? I would love for some a family
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to call me with their kids 17 years old and like us to give
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them the support and education them to have family therapy,
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family coaching. You know, have a companion coach
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that could take their kid out a few days a week and then learn
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how to, you know, live life and and some of those skills that
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those with the substance use disorder miss along the way.
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Absolutely. Yeah, absolutely.
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So we were chatting a little bit before we started the episode,
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and you were talking about just this idea of like stigma.
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And you know, I think, you know, along the same lines of the
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conversation we're having, like those barriers or those things
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that keep people from moving forward or, you know, reduce
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their level of motivation or, you know, maybe sometimes keep
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them stuck in patterns of thought and behavior.
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I wonder if you wanted to maybe just just chime in a little bit
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about that. What are your thoughts on stigma
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and maybe how that's causing some issues for people?
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Well, I know, you know, like I was 10 years ago, I was like one
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of the first people that talked about being in recovery from
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LinkedIn on LinkedIn. And like I would get these like
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I'm talking 100,000 comment kind of posts and I was like scared
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to do it And then I did it. But I realized, wow, like I'm
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making an impact here. Like people are seeing this put
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together woman and Oh no, she couldn't be a drug addict.
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And like, I want to show that, hey, like what you see today
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isn't what walked in the door 16 years ago, but this is what can
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happen. And like, you know, I have
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people say, well you shouldn't say all these things, but, you
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know, there's always the, the chimers and the association like
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you shouldn't, you know, set people's standards too high and
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let them not meet up. Like just because you graduated
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college and you did all this stuff doesn't mean every.
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OK, well you know what I'm just letting him know it's possible
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like from a girl that thought she was too stupid and too
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damaged and broken to met and messed up to get this thing, too
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not smart enough to go back to college and all the things I've
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been able to accomplish in spite of all myself defeating beliefs.
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So I've. I've utilized things like that
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to try to break stigma, right where it's the the person that
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suffers with with, you know, it's usually complex things.
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You know, nowadays it's way more than just dual diagnosis, right?
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There's so many pieces and like, it's OK, like we all hurt, we're
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all going through something. And what's really been fueled up
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in me lately is this whole black and white mentality.
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I'll let you chime in before I dig into that 'cause I'm going
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to go down the raft. Well, I'm interested exactly
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where you're going with that. So black and white, I mean I
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have my own thoughts but I'm wondering what do you, what do
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you mean by that, right. I mean, I yeah, I mean I
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immediately what jumps up for me is I think, you know, just kind
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of working in this field for a long time now.
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I mean there's kind of this old school way of thinking about
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things and and it's I think it is really important that people
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start. I mean it's nice to see that
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there are, there is some movement that is very needed,
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but I think a lot of people are really stuck in the past still
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unfortunately. Can I jump in real quick?
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If I can? I am in this field for almost 20
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years now and I am a trauma therapist.
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I am a joke when I'm here and say, you know, I've done a lot
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of trauma work. My entire career has been in
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trauma. I just happen to be at a detox
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center now. And so the component that I'm
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bringing to new waters is this trauma way of thinking and every
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behavior serves a purpose. It started somewhere and it's
17:05
was helpful at one point. And now it's no longer helpful.
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Let's figure out why. And let's figure out this new
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skill that you can develop so that you can move forward and
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everything is data. It's all it is, is data.
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That's how I start to phrase things with our clients.
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And when we were talking before the episode, I was really
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digging what you're saying. So I can't wait for everyone
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else to hear what you're saying because I think this is where we
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need to go in this field. Well, thank you for the work you
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do. I have been in trauma therapy
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since age 7. I'm 42, so that's a very long
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time of in and out. I've now been with my current
17:42
therapist for 3 1/2 years. That's one piece to anyone in
17:46
this field is have a therapist. Yes, absolutely.
17:49
Like, I'm taking myself on a personal retreat to Costa Rica
17:53
in December by myself, friends and nothing.
17:57
So I'm really big on on all of that as professionals, right?
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Like we have to do our own work. Because what good if I'm broken
18:06
in a mess? You know, I'm at night and I am
18:08
a broken mess sometimes, right? But I I TuneIn and figure out
18:11
what I need. Do I need more rest?
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Do I need to take time off? You know, so the black and white
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thing and and I'm the first one to to take ownership that I was
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born and raised in my personal recovery in a very black and
18:25
white methodology. And I preach that if you didn't
18:28
do what I did, you weren't doing it right.
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And you were going to die. And I like firmly, I I I mean
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and I maybe I needed that for a time of my recovery.
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I needed it to be that black and white for me to stay safe.
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But there was like, there's been countless situations that I look
18:48
back at and wish that I had been more educated and more open
18:51
minded. Like I recently I did.
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I've had a slew of weekends of nonprofit events.
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I had like a pickle ballpark tournament for charity that I we
18:59
bought. We we did.
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Then I went to Fort Myers, the West Coast of Florida to speak
19:03
for my best friend's dad. My best friend died of an
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overdose in 2016, Kim 2016. Kim Kinkle and her dad Al and I
19:12
are still really close, and I had started my nonprofit in her
19:15
name that sent Women in recovery to college and that bizzled out
19:19
and it was a dark, ugly experience.
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Non profit is a business. It's not, it's not fun and games
19:26
until when you get into the business, you know?
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And I kind of got my heart broken in that experience.
19:31
But now Kim's dad a few years ago started an RCO recovery
19:37
community organization in Fort Myers called Kimmy's Recovery
19:39
Zone. And I got the honor to go be
19:41
their keynote speaker this year. And one of the things I shared
19:45
was if I would have been educated the way I am now, I
19:48
would have been able to support Kim in a different way.
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And I think she'd still be alive in today's recovery.
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Lance, right? Because I didn't understand why
19:56
would you stay on something when you want to be sober?
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You know, and I think a lot of people are are that way.
20:01
And our experience and our. We can't do that as
20:05
professionals like we we can't. Oh, and I'll meet someone else,
20:09
a friend, a client's and anybody with so much love.
20:13
But to undo it in myself and give myself the grace has been
20:17
the hardest, right? So I keep getting these women in
20:23
my life with long term recovery that feel like they're not doing
20:28
it right or they're not doing it good enough because it didn't
20:30
look like the way it once did. And if you're waking up every
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day and, like, you're trying to take care of yourself, you're
20:39
trying to be a better person. You know you're going to therapy
20:43
or you're taking, doing self-care things.
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You're making meetings when you can.
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Like, I think that that's all incredible.
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And I want to honor people that are hard on themselves, that
20:55
like, I'm not doing enough because, like, maybe there's a
20:58
person in the rooms that maybe is telling you that you're not
21:01
doing an opposite. I got someone tried to bully me
21:03
the other night, and I'm like, I'm not the one.
21:05
I was at a 8:30 meeting and they were like, we'll see you at the
21:07
7:00 AM. I go, the hell you won't.
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I'll be sleeping. If I'm going to a 8:30 PM
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meeting and I'm going to be going out to dinner, I'm.
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I know myself. I need rest.
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You're not going to bully me. What would you have done for
21:18
your hit or what would you have done for your.
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And I'm like, that is so not relevant to me.
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Like you go bring that shit to somebody else.
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You know so. But there's not a lot of people
21:26
that feel strong enough in that like in their conviction and
21:29
know who they are. So I see their.
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I see how we can do better, you know.
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I see how we can do better and how we can meet more with
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compassion, love over like conviction and crucifixion and
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shame, shaming people like it's it's it's taking people out the
21:49
door and they're scared to come back.
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It is, especially when people are already coming in with so
21:55
much shame to begin with. I'm I'm with you, Amanda.
21:59
I think you know, why in the world would we try and add to
22:02
that? Because I think a lot of what
22:04
you're saying and I think we we do see this, right, is all we're
22:07
doing is just adding to that shame, right?
22:09
We're adding to that shame. We're adding to that, you know,
22:12
not feeling good enough, not going to be able to make it.
22:15
All those things that that person is struggling with
22:17
anyway, and they were just kind of, you know, validating that
22:20
for them, right? We're furthering the cycle.
22:22
We're. Not breaking the cycle.
22:23
And that's the whole purpose of what we're trying to do is break
22:26
those cycles and let's move forward and find where we can
22:30
find that inner peace that we're looking for, that self love that
22:32
you keep talking about. Amanda.
22:34
Yeah, it's about peace and freedom and like being happy
22:38
with like who in the mirror. And we're one organization that
22:42
we decided some years back that like I will take a client on
22:46
that says to me, hey, I want to. I think I want to.
22:49
I don't want to admit I'm an alcoholic.
22:51
I don't want to talk about that like, but I want to explore my
22:53
relationship with alcohol. I will take that woman on or
22:57
man, I will take them just because they don't want them to
22:59
be completely sober. I'm not going to turn them away
23:02
because this is giving me an opportunity for them to figure
23:06
this out themselves, right. I will.
23:08
We'll take on clients that you know want to try to continue to
23:12
smoke pot. Like we will try to you know
23:14
fill their time with good things and have the therapy and the
23:16
medication and and kind of like come up with a way that like
23:20
we're not making it. So it's like an all day thing,
23:22
right? Like if they are doing it, maybe
23:24
they're just doing it at night as to where they're doing it all
23:26
day because they had nothing going on and nothing to do and
23:29
no goals and no focus. So we're I know there's other
23:32
organizations that if someone's not willing to commit to
23:35
complete abstinence that people won't work with them.
23:39
And I I will take people if they're willing to get better
23:42
and like you know, in many programs it's like a desire,
23:45
right. So if someone has a desire for
23:47
improvement and puts in some work, I'm willing to work with
23:51
them. And you know of course it's if
23:53
it's safe but usually these are like high functional people that
23:55
like aren't convinced that you know they can fix themselves and
23:59
they can figure it out and they're going to find.
24:01
But let's, let's, let's undo that.
24:04
You know, let's let them figure that out for themselves.
24:05
I don't want to tell you what you are and you aren't.
24:08
You need to tell yourself that. Because I think that's where the
24:11
power comes from anyway, right. I mean it's, it's all fine and
24:13
dandy to sit back and share your clinical, you know, opinion with
24:17
someone, right. But if if they have to come to
24:20
believe these things for their self, right, they have to come
24:22
to develop a desire to want to change in the ways that they are
24:26
going to find value, right. And that I think that at the end
24:29
of the day that's the only thing that's important and that's the
24:31
only thing that's going to be effective, right.
24:34
I want to see more people live. I see more people make it and if
24:38
they're alive there's a chance and if there's progress that's
24:42
beautiful. If it's not perfect and it's
24:45
kind of ugly sometimes that's OK.
24:47
If there's you know if there's or I I'm going to not use like I
24:50
had to I changed. I spoke for a a women's program
24:53
with moms and kids the other night like a pretty, you know,
24:56
state funded like you know, ankle bracelets like all that
24:59
stuff. This one girl was like, I'm a
25:00
chronic relapser and I was like I I reached out out to her after
25:03
I go. Let's change that narrative,
25:05
love. Let's change it to your chronic
25:06
recovery seeker. You know 'cause that your art
25:09
and you're just beating yourself up for how many times you've
25:12
been in and out and that that's right there alone is going to
25:14
make you feel shameful. You know and as a mom, forget
25:17
it. We've we feel way more shame
25:19
when we're an addiction. As a mother.
25:21
It's brutal. Yeah, the it's it's heavy stuff.
25:28
But it's like, I'm not scared to put this out there.
25:32
I'm not scared to have someone chat.
25:34
Like I put a video. Another thing I put a video up
25:37
of I went to a therapist friend's birthday dinner the
25:40
other night and it was all went with, you know, the women that
25:43
the three of us that were left over and went out dancing for
25:45
1/2 hour. We were all in recovery.
25:47
We went to this funny little place in Palm Beach Island.
25:49
Are you down here 'cause I saw you had a 561 number.
25:52
No, I'd lived in in Palm Beach County for like 16 years.
25:55
So you know like cucina, Do you know cucina?
25:58
Like very familiar. So I went to cucina for like 1/2
26:00
hour and I had this video where I took and I'm I was walking
26:03
through the wine cellar area of this restaurant in Palm Beach
26:05
and I was just realized like how cool is it that like I probably
26:09
wouldn't even have noticed this but I was like waiting for
26:11
somebody in the bathroom. So I like videoed me walking to
26:13
the wine cellar and I was like, I can go anywhere on my recovery
26:16
and I can feel safe as long as I'm spiritually fit and I'm with
26:19
the right people. And of course someone's like you
26:21
shouldn't be, you know, put teetering on your recovery.
26:24
You're, you know, you're asking for it.
26:26
And I'm like, no, I don't like, I don't live like that.
26:28
That's not how it is for me. Like if I did feel comfortable,
26:31
like I have a boyfriend who drinks.
26:32
If I don't feel comfortable that day, I won't go hang out with
26:35
his friends if they're drinking. And then there's other times
26:39
where I don't care at all. And like, I was there to dance,
26:41
I was there for a good meal. Like, those are the things that
26:43
brought me there. I'm not going to live for me.
26:45
I don't judge. If someone else isn't
26:47
comfortable with that, that's up to them.
26:49
I'm not going to live in a box, but I'm also not going to go to
26:51
like a dive bar or like, you know, there's certain places I'm
26:55
not going to put myself, you know, But I want to go to a nice
26:58
restaurant because I want to go to.
26:59
I want to dance. I was a hip hop dancer
27:00
professionally. So, like, I love that.
27:03
That's awesome. I think it's important for all
27:06
us to remember, right we're all on our own journey and what
27:09
works for one person is not going to work for somebody else.
27:12
And we all have our own way of getting to where we need to be.
27:16
And we all need to have some sort of faith that will get to
27:19
where we need to be and the freedom to choose to get to
27:22
where we need to be Right and not feel.
27:24
Because the more we constrict, the more we're going to fight
27:28
back in a way and rebel because. Most people in recovery are
27:31
like, Nope, you ain't going to tell me what to do, right?
27:34
And so it's just making sure everyone has a freedom to
27:37
choose. And when they feel that freedom,
27:39
you'll be amazed where people will go.
27:41
Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.
27:43
It's like I feel like there's a delicate balance with like the
27:46
freedom but like also certain some like non negotiables,
27:49
right? Like like you know commitment to
27:52
your to your personal growth. Like staying.
27:55
Like you know freedom to like we want our clients input.
27:58
We want to know what they like, what they connect with, what's
28:01
working for them. Like we want them to have a say
28:03
in their care because if they have a say in their care they're
28:05
much more apt to take it much more serious and like don't feel
28:10
like they're just being like you still have this day tell me what
28:12
to do and I really don't like it.
28:15
Tell me I can't do something and then I'm going to show you how
28:18
great I can do it. It's just it's just in my being,
28:22
even though all the work I've done, it's just still in there.
28:25
Right. It's about having boundaries,
28:26
right? Because the more it's about
28:28
boundaries, allow us to know the freedom we can have.
28:31
I think that was one of the most important things I've ever
28:33
learned. Absolutely, absolutely.
28:36
And then like, you know, kind of just on that to to add to like
28:39
the kind of way that we do things.
28:40
So there's this big, you know, thing that's been going on a
28:43
long time. I was in an adolescent program,
28:45
ATC model. Very abusive, very awful.
28:49
And so there's this thing that still goes on in this country,
28:51
the whole like, snatch and grab adolescence in the middle of the
28:54
night and do transports. Like we don't do that.
28:56
OK. So like, how we we do maybe
28:59
there's some cases that it's needed.
29:00
I'm just very for it as a traumatized teen who was sent to
29:05
a traumatizing program that did the opposite of what I needed
29:09
to. Like if I, you know the programs
29:12
that are around today are such so much more loving and hear the
29:15
kids and call the parents out and they're just it just wasn't
29:17
like that back then. But we, you know a teenager's
29:20
family calls us and if it's just like some behavioral and some
29:23
problematic using it's nothing that's dangerous that like needs
29:26
detox or anything. We will tell the family, let's
29:28
set up a meeting. We're all we're going to come by
29:30
like if there's an older sibling like let's include everybody and
29:34
come. And by that time once we've dug
29:36
in with the family, we know what's going on.
29:38
We have a plan proposal like, listen, we want you to do this
29:41
for 2-3 weeks, like, you know, meet up with a coach, go to a
29:45
therapist, go to psychiatrist. Like have this.
29:48
This time you come in the house like you don't do and let them
29:50
have a say and they're, you know what they want to say, 'cause
29:53
they always have something to say too.
29:54
And hear them out. And then when we tell them
29:57
treatments on the table that if these things don't work, we're
30:01
coming back to get you and we're taking you to residential
30:03
treatment. Anytime we come back, they go
30:06
willing because they've proven to themselves, but they can't.
30:10
They can't fit this way. And let me tell you, we don't
30:13
have kids blow up and we're not traumatizing kids.
30:16
Right. And treating them as humans.
30:19
Which is huge. Yeah, absolutely.
30:21
That's all I wanted. That's all I wanted as a broken,
30:24
abused teenager was somebody to hear me and understand me and
30:28
like, love me where I was at. I hated myself.
30:32
Absolutely, Yeah. And like you said, I mean,
30:35
they're, thank goodness, right that there's.
30:38
Has been for a number of years and there seems to be some some
30:40
movement especially in the adolescent treatment and things
30:43
like that. The word things are moving in
30:44
more of a, you know, loving direction and meeting kits where
30:47
they are. But you still do hear of these
30:49
programs that do these like you were saying like these snatch
30:52
and grab things. I think, I think some of the
30:54
wilderness programs still kind of do operate like that.
30:56
And like it's, yeah, I've been called and asked for it and I
31:00
told them absolutely not. We my team does not do that.
31:04
I'm not putting my team in that situation.
31:06
That's traumatizing. And I'm not putting a kid in
31:09
that situation from somebody who was physically abused, sexually
31:12
abused. My sister was kidnapped and
31:13
married. Like, I am not putting some
31:15
other kid through that shit. I'm not doing it.
31:17
Absolutely, completely agree with you Amanda.
31:21
One thing I wanted to touch base on, I know we're kind of getting
31:23
close to the end of our time here but I know that you you did
31:27
a show in the past but I think you have not if you want not not
31:29
sure if you want to do a plug for that or anything but you
31:31
have a show that you've been working on.
31:34
We can you tell us a little bit about that?
31:37
Well there's a little like the little story that leads up to,
31:39
but it's not super long. I'm not alone.
31:42
Thank God. So I was in acting and modeling
31:45
from ages 4 to 22. I started like runway did
31:49
commercials print work hip hop videos dance and concerts for
31:52
like Britney Spears Kid Rock. I danced for Ricky Cool and
31:55
Sugar Red like all these famous kit like I did a performance for
31:58
Kiss in Jamaica for something. But anyway, so all these I I had
32:02
this whole, like, you know, for me my using wasn't all awful.
32:06
I had a lot of fun. And so I my last audition I went
32:11
to in my addiction, I completely was like up from the night
32:15
before and completely embarrassed myself.
32:16
And it was something I was really shameful about.
32:18
Like, I had all of this opportunity and all of this
32:21
talent and I like, ruined it with so many people in that
32:24
field. And I had a dream when I came
32:28
into recovery of being back in on screen and being in an
32:32
entertainment of some kind of sorts and giving back and being
32:35
a woman of substance, not objectified for being a young,
32:38
good looking, you know, flawless body, 18 year old, but for being
32:42
like a woman of substance, right.
32:45
And and I came in, I was 200 lbs and I had a face full of acne.
32:48
I was 230 actually. I didn't even look like myself
32:51
when I came into recovery, but I worked really hard and I I
32:54
remember manifesting 14 years ago that I wanted to be on the
32:57
show Intervention and I I got, I did a few auditions for it over
33:03
the years with during the COVID time and then the did I I'm
33:07
trained in, you know, gaming addiction, gaming disorder and
33:11
and social media addiction. So I got called for that show
33:14
and I worked the season doing that show and it was like my toe
33:17
in the water. It was kind of a take spin off
33:18
of Intervention, but a little different 'cause you're dealing
33:21
with different kind of cases. I got to work with three women
33:24
on that and that's out on A&E. That's been, it's on On demand,
33:27
you can find it. I had a friend tell me she was
33:29
watching it the other day to educate her boyfriend on mental
33:32
health and and then I just finished a month ago, I did my
33:38
last out of three episodes for Intervention.
33:41
That's coming up in on A&E and also is streaming I think on
33:45
Netflix and Hulu. I got to be the Intervention
33:48
professional for three episodes of it and working with some
33:54
individuals that were in horrific situations.
33:58
I was in, you know, Memphis, New Hampshire and like Weaverville,
34:04
CA, which is like a very big math place.
34:06
So some places that like, I mean Memphis don't go.
34:10
I thought it was going to be like Nashville.
34:11
I got really. And I was like, this is not
34:14
total. You're not in Nashville anymore.
34:16
It was scary. It was scary.
34:18
We had bodyguards and stuff like that.
34:19
Like it was, it was like top five dangerous, most dangerous
34:22
cities right now. And like, they almost pulled.
34:25
They almost pulled it. But I got to make an impact in
34:29
these people's lives and people that could never have afforded
34:32
treatment, living in under bridges, living in trap houses,
34:36
like the amount of trap houses and kids living in them and the
34:40
stuff that's going on literally all over our country.
34:43
I think like I knew it, you know, but when you see it, it's
34:48
it's it's on another level like we think this stuff goes on only
34:52
in 3rd world countries and no it is going on in a city near you
34:57
everywhere and the Child Protective Services can't keep
35:00
up with this stuff like. So working on that show for me
35:05
because I work with mostly very, you know, high profile, like you
35:10
know, people in entertainment high, you know, high wealth net
35:14
worth families because they are very complex and have a lot
35:19
more, you know, they have a lot of things going on that they
35:21
need additional support. So what's very interesting to me
35:25
is that they're so different ends of the spectrum.
35:29
The person living in the bridge or under in the travel process
35:32
has no access or no idea about any resources and then they
35:35
individual that has access to everything, right.
35:38
And they both still struggle the same and and so it was really
35:43
good for me to see what I saw. I have like passion to create
35:48
change in that area. Don't know what it looks like
35:50
yet, but I don't think that we should have this going on all
35:54
over our country and kids should be, you know, going through the
35:57
situations I was in, seeing drugs at a young age, having
36:00
abuse, you know, and that's just going on everywhere.
36:03
And they came. There's like an area of Memphis
36:05
my friend told me they won't even go in, find the ones
36:08
called. It's that scary.
36:09
Like what's happening here? Like we're seeing like all this
36:12
horrible stuff that's going on overseas and it's, it's hideous
36:15
and awful. I can't even turn the news on.
36:18
But there is that going on, literally in a neighborhood near
36:23
all of us, all the time. And it.
36:27
It is. It's awful.
36:28
It's hope there. There is hope.
36:31
There's hope for the ones that have it all and and don't want
36:34
it because they have it all and it's hard to give them bottom
36:36
lines. And then the ones that don't
36:38
have access to resources. Like, if anyone calls me, like
36:41
even when we were filming the show, there was a girl that
36:45
popped up that I can't say too much because it's not out yet.
36:48
But there was a girl that popped up that wasn't part of the show
36:50
that like, I even offered help to because I didn't want to
36:53
leave her. I was like, hey, here's my
36:55
number. Like, I know that you're not
36:56
part of this, but like, I don't want to leave you here.
36:58
So if you want help, I'll find you something.
37:00
Call me, you know, and I'll do my best.
37:03
You know, not everyone can is is a Next Level Recovery Associates
37:07
client. But like anyone that calls me
37:09
for anything, our team will always make sure that they have
37:12
some kind of plan or path or phone numbers to call that can
37:17
meet their needs. Absolutely.
37:19
That's amazing. I'll definitely, I I'm looking
37:22
forward to watching the episode. So I'll, I'll keep my eye out
37:25
for that, Amanda. I mean, listen, I'll tell you,
37:28
if anyone has a preconceived notion in our industry of the
37:31
show, it is the most caring, wonderful production team ever.
37:37
Like they were crying. They were crying when the things
37:40
were going down. They were so compassionate and
37:43
kind and non judgmental when they were, you know, filming
37:46
certain things. And I mean, I was blown away by
37:50
the love and what they didn't know they would ask us and they
37:53
never pretended like it was their area of expertise.
37:55
And I just had the utmost respect for all of the team, the
37:58
camera crew, the sound people, the producers.
38:01
Like. They were just like, they're
38:03
like part of my extended family now too.
38:05
Like, I love them. That's awesome.
38:08
That is amazing. Yeah.
38:09
Thank you for sharing that with us.
38:12
Well, Amanda, thank you for spending some time with us,
38:16
taking some time out of your busy schedule to to chat with
38:18
myself and Erica, I always kind of like to wrap these up.
38:22
So you know, I think that the big thing is for the podcast is
38:25
to make it available for, you know, education purposes and
38:27
resources for families or people that are kind of currently
38:30
struggling and kind of exploring what that option may look like.
38:33
Obviously some professionals watch it as well.
38:36
But if you had to kind of leave the audience with one idea or
38:38
one thing I know not to put you on the spot, like what would be
38:41
that one thing that you would say, OK, go for it?
38:44
Well, there's, there's two things.
38:46
So of course there's never one thing with me.
38:48
So one thing for people that are struggling and addiction that
38:53
like maybe have been in and out always.
38:55
If you're clean and sober today and there's some funky idea you
38:59
have in your head and there's something you haven't told
39:01
anyone, you need to tell at least one person what's really
39:05
going on. The the thoughts.
39:07
The thing doesn't have to be the whole wide world, doesn't have
39:10
to be a group that it it could be whoever you feel safe and you
39:13
could tell this person this thing and this person this
39:15
thing. So there's no right and wrong
39:16
way to do it. Just make sure you talk about
39:18
the things that you need to come out that's that's going out to
39:21
people that are struggling for families or for anyone that's
39:25
searching Like if you can and you do have the resources,
39:29
family coaching, family therapy, wrap around services, case
39:32
management, you it. We don't want to be at next
39:36
level Recovery Associates. We don't want to be a Band-Aid.
39:38
Our goal is to create lasting change within in the individual,
39:42
the family system or in the corporate space.
39:45
So you know, do it right and do it right the first time.
39:48
Don't go on Google. Ask a trusted professional that
39:52
you know or somebody that's been through it before.
39:54
Word of mouth, you're going to get the best.
39:57
You know, it just terrifies me when I hear, you know, families
40:00
search on Google and and be current.
40:02
Because what a program used to be two years ago, it could have
40:06
been sold and changed and gutted and have new staff.
40:08
So be, you know, people like us who tour programs all the time
40:12
are up to date with what's what and what's current.
40:15
So you know, the more help the better.
40:20
The longer term this support and oversight, the better.
40:23
Rates of of living a long, happy, beautiful life.
40:25
It's like, if you're going to do this, do it right and do it all
40:29
the way. Words of wisdom.
40:32
Or if you've done it 10, or if you've done it 10 times this
40:35
time, dude, let's do it right, you know, and make it the last
40:37
time. Because, you know, sometimes the
40:38
people that come to us are just like, so done that they don't
40:41
believe anything's going to work.
40:43
Just don't give up hope. There's hope for everyone.
40:47
There you go. I love that.
40:48
Thank you, Amanda. Appreciate it, Erica.
40:51
Thank you. Thank you.
40:53
Thank you for having me. And it was really great to meet
40:55
you and I look forward to following you on IG.
40:59
Yeah, definitely. And I'd like, you know, I've
41:01
known Graham and Chloe a very long time since they lived down
41:04
here. So, you know, I know there's
41:07
been some talk of of myself or someone from my team coming up
41:10
to see you guys. So I'd love to thank you for the
41:12
work you're doing and thank you for doing trauma work for 20
41:15
years. That means you have to do extra
41:16
self-care like I do. You know, sometimes these please
41:19
expect us to know the answers to everything, and sometimes we
41:22
don't know the answers, and that's OK.
41:25
Absolutely. Very good.
41:28
Thank you both.