Latest / Adventures in Adversity: an inspirational podcast / Ep. 77: Amber’s story - Losing her son Kyle to fentanyl, recovering from abuse, & finding healing

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Ep. 77: Amber’s story - Losing her son Kyle to fentanyl, recovering from abuse, & finding healing · Adventures in Adversity: an inspirational podcast

• 0:01
  Welcome back. This will be episode 77 of
• 0:05
  Adventures and adversity. I am so grateful to be here
• 0:09
  again with another wonderful person and I know we are going
• 0:14
  to learn a ton from her story today.
• 0:16
  And I, if you're new to this podcast, before I introduce my
• 0:21
  guest, this podcast, Adventures and Adversity is been going
• 0:26
  about two years now. And, and really what it's all
• 0:28
  about at the end of the day is I am grateful to bring on real
• 0:33
  people who tell their true stories about overcoming how
• 0:39
  they have overcame adversity in their life and really just
• 0:43
  trying, trying our best to turn those things into an adventure,
• 0:47
  to heal, to cope. And I think most importantly to
• 0:50
  build community because as my guest for the episode that's
• 0:54
  going Live Today said community is not necessarily your zip code
• 0:57
  and where you live. It can be a community through a
• 1:00
  podcast through through this. So anyway, if you're new, you
• 1:04
  got the spiel. If you've already been here, you
• 1:06
  already knew that. So with that, I just wanted to
• 1:08
  introduce and thank you Amber for joining today.
• 1:14
  Hi, thank you for having me. I'm really, I feel really
• 1:17
  grateful for having this opportunity to tell some of my
• 1:20
  story. And I think there's healing and
• 1:25
  telling your story. I think there's healing for of
• 1:27
  course, first yourself, but for others.
• 1:30
  And I think that my story can have a big impact to help others
• 1:34
  through their own struggles and just life.
• 1:38
  Life is hard. Life is hard.
• 1:40
  Yeah. So, so yeah, I'm here.
• 1:44
  I am. And and I'm ready to tell my
• 1:46
  story. I'm, I'm and I'm so grateful and
• 1:49
  everybody has a story. And then when I'm lucky enough
• 1:52
  to get somebody to sit down with me and like actually take the
• 1:56
  time out of their schedule to say, hey, I want to share
• 1:59
  something with, I just don't take it for granted at all,
• 2:02
  ever. And so I just wanted to
• 2:06
  officially welcome you to what I love to call the Adventures in
• 2:09
  adversity family of guests that we are.
• 2:12
  I think we're at like you will be my 53rd guest.
• 2:16
  So you are not alone in your adversity, but you are certainly
• 2:20
  courageous. And I'm just honored that you
• 2:22
  that you chose this podcast to Share your story.
• 2:25
  Absolutely, yeah. And so we got connected via
• 2:28
  Instagram, via some content that brought us together, right?
• 2:33
  Right. I believe I was just scrolling
• 2:35
  through reels and came across your podcast and I decided, you
• 2:39
  know, let me let me message this lady and see if see if she
• 2:42
  responds. I don't know.
• 2:44
  And you did, and here we are. And that's literally the beauty
• 2:47
  of it, right? Like I, I everyone has a story
• 2:51
  and I'm so glad that, you know, when I'm creating this stuff,
• 2:54
  I'm like, I hope this resonates with someone.
• 2:56
  When it does, I always, I just now you get like chills.
• 2:59
  You're like one person. Like that's enough.
• 3:03
  That's all. Like I enjoy creating it and
• 3:05
  it's healing for me. Like each one, each thing is
• 3:08
  literally very cathartic. However, when someone actually
• 3:11
  is like that, I'm like, OK, connection is like a real thing.
• 3:15
  It really, really brings people together.
• 3:18
  So wanted to thank you for that. And I am just gonna stop talking
• 3:22
  now. And, and really the best part of
• 3:24
  the show is, is when I stop talking and people just tell
• 3:27
  their stories. So Amber, you can start wherever
• 3:30
  you'd like. Maybe like just whatever point
• 3:35
  in your life feels good to start telling your story.
• 3:37
  We are all ears. OK.
• 3:40
  Sounds good. Yeah, well, I guess I think I'll
• 3:43
  start by saying for a very long time, I, I built my identity
• 3:47
  around being a mom, just mom. I was just mom and I became a
• 3:52
  mom at 16. So I had my son very young.
• 3:57
  And my son actually he turned 31 last August, but in November he
• 4:02
  passed away. So he sorry this is hard.
• 4:08
  Don't take your time and be there time and I'm so sorry.
• 4:10
  Yeah, he, my son struggled with addiction since high school and
• 4:17
  he, he had a really hard life, a really hard life.
• 4:21
  And a lot of his struggles were how he grew up and, and the
• 4:29
  things that, that, you know, he, he went through.
• 4:34
  And so I'll back it up a little bit.
• 4:36
  I grew up with two parents in the home.
• 4:39
  My parents were and still are married, but very dysfunctional,
• 4:43
  very, very toxic. Still today, to this day, I have
• 4:46
  to protect myself when I'm around my parents or, or limit
• 4:49
  that time, rather. I'm ready, I'm, I'm there to
• 4:52
  repair things, but they're not there.
• 4:54
  And I don't know that they'll ever get there.
• 4:55
  But I've done my part and I, I still have to work through some
• 4:58
  things. So I, I, I just have to protect
• 5:01
  myself and that in that sense. So I grew up, like I said, mom
• 5:05
  and dad in the house. My dad alcoholic.
• 5:08
  He still drinks to this day. My mom's has struggled with
• 5:12
  mental health issues since I can remember.
• 5:14
  She's been mostly I remember her as being depressed when I was
• 5:19
  little laying on the couch. She was very, now that I am
• 5:24
  older and I think about things, I can see that there was some
• 5:27
  things in her own, in herself that there was like maybe a
• 5:30
  jealousy or I'm, I'm kind of learning that maybe there's some
• 5:36
  narcissistic traits with her too.
• 5:38
  And because I have been through narcissistic marriages, really
• 5:44
  bad, really bad marriages. And so then I'm putting the
• 5:46
  pieces together. I'm like, wait a minute, maybe
• 5:48
  my mom was there too. She was part of that, you know?
• 5:51
  So anyhow, so I had my son at 16.
• 5:56
  I ended up marrying his dad. He was in, he went one in the
• 6:00
  military. So he had he was getting
• 6:02
  stationed in Hawaii. So in order for us to be
• 6:04
  together, we had to get married. So my parents signed off on it
• 6:08
  and I was 17. OK.
• 6:10
  And I went, lived in Hawaii for a little while with my son, and
• 6:14
  that was terrible. He ended up getting, I believe,
• 6:18
  dishonorably discharged for just the things that we went through
• 6:21
  during that time. And so I came back to California
• 6:25
  where I'm, I'm still in California, came back to
• 6:27
  California, live with my parents for a little bit.
• 6:29
  But then I got, you know, determined to do it on my own.
• 6:32
  I was 17. I moved out.
• 6:34
  I had my own place, credit card, you know, gas cards.
• 6:38
  I was doing well. I was paying my bills.
• 6:40
  I was going to school, you know, had a baby.
• 6:44
  And then I met my second husband and I met him on the sidewalk
• 6:54
  walking out of my house. A friend and I, we're going to
• 6:57
  see if someone could purchase alcohol for us.
• 6:59
  We were underage, of course. And he comes walking across the
• 7:02
  street. We Long story short, we started
• 7:04
  talking and we were together for 20 years.
• 7:08
  OK, so yeah, a long time meet. People everywhere.
• 7:12
  Yeah, yeah, but it wasn't off to a good start.
• 7:15
  It wasn't off to a good start, yes.
• 7:17
  He was buying alcohol for us at Underage.
• 7:20
  Yeah, so. Yeah.
• 7:21
  So anyhow, we stayed together and then at 19, I had a
• 7:28
  daughter, so my second child at 19.
• 7:32
  And as our relationship with her dad, you know, it was it was
• 7:41
  horrible. It was just awful drinking, you
• 7:46
  know, alcohol, drugs. He was abusive mentally,
• 7:53
  emotionally, financially, it was, it was awful.
• 7:56
  There was, you know, cheating and just all the things,
• 8:00
  anything you can imagine it was, it happened.
• 8:04
  And I, I'm not perfect. I nobody had my own struggles
• 8:08
  and I did and I still do. And you know, I'm, I'm trying to
• 8:12
  do the best I can. So I I drank and I drank pretty
• 8:17
  much our entire marriage except for the times that I was
• 8:20
  pregnant and after my daughter at 19, I ended up having two
• 8:24
  more kids with the same man. OK.
• 8:27
  And so I had four kids by the time I was 24.
• 8:31
  So it was, it was crazy. Yeah, it was.
• 8:35
  It was wild. Just just being so young and
• 8:38
  inexperienced and just a young mom.
• 8:40
  And I was in survival the whole time.
• 8:42
  Just. Going.
• 8:44
  You because of your you. You hadn't even dealt with your
• 8:48
  own. Yeah.
• 8:50
  Exactly at a young age. So I just, you know, I, I buried
• 8:55
  my everything with alcohol. Yep.
• 8:59
  You know and I but I loved my family, you know and I I try to
• 9:03
  keep us together and come on, we can fix this.
• 9:05
  We can fix this. Look, don't get fatter.
• 9:07
  We went to. Church we good attitude to have.
• 9:10
  Yeah. I mean, I tried.
• 9:11
  I mean I tried. My family was everything.
• 9:13
  Yeah. But the abuse, the abuse, you
• 9:16
  can't fix the abuse. Right, right.
• 9:19
  That only that other person can want.
• 9:21
  They need to want to. So and they need to stop abusing
• 9:24
  you. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 9:27
  And like I said, we both, you know, we, we went to church here
• 9:30
  and there and we were in certain recovery groups at church.
• 9:36
  And I think, I mean, it just was not, it was not meant to be.
• 9:38
  It was not. It was just so toxic, so awful.
• 9:42
  Yeah, you can't. Just not the soul.
• 9:44
  Your souls were not meant to be together.
• 9:47
  Absolutely not. So back up a little bit to when
• 9:51
  I had first met my three children, their their father,
• 9:54
  when I had met him, like I said, I had a son already.
• 9:59
  My mom had there was a point when he was about not quite two
• 10:04
  years old. So he was he was talking, but
• 10:07
  you know, 2 year old, you know, they Babble and yeah, yeah,
• 10:09
  yeah, yeah. So my mom came, came to me and
• 10:15
  told me she thought that there were some abuse going on with my
• 10:20
  children's father, the other children.
• 10:22
  And, you know, I'm here. I'm 17 years old.
• 10:27
  I'm, you know, this isn't making excuses or anything like that.
• 10:30
  It is what it is. Yeah.
• 10:33
  And so she, and at the time, even even though I was young and
• 10:37
  inexperienced and, and whatnot, I knew my mom was not stable,
• 10:41
  you know, so she had told me that or she, she came at me kind
• 10:46
  of crazy. And you know, I think so and so
• 10:52
  is abusing my son and this and that.
• 10:54
  And I, I called the police. I did what I thought I was
• 10:58
  supposed to do. That seems like a reaction
• 11:00
  that's normal to me. Yeah, yeah.
• 11:02
  There was nothing that was told that, you know, they, there was
• 11:06
  no evidence. There was nothing.
• 11:08
  So he and I had gotten back together and then we had three
• 11:11
  kids together. So I carried that for a long
• 11:16
  time till today just thinking, you know, oh gosh, what if?
• 11:21
  But then my, you know, I'm thinking my mom is, you know,
• 11:23
  she's crazy and you know all the things and.
• 11:28
  Totally. Yeah, so I, I just, I kind of, I
• 11:31
  kind of put it back there, but you know, I, I kind of, it was
• 11:35
  there. So I I kept my eyes open if that
• 11:37
  makes sense. I will say you called the police
• 11:40
  and I think that was the right thing to do.
• 11:42
  And that is, you know what I'm saying?
• 11:45
  Like I know looking back, but that that that seems like a
• 11:49
  very, very, that's what I would do as a mother.
• 11:53
  And then there's a certain point, you know what I'm saying?
• 11:56
  Like just acknowledge that that was the right, the right step.
• 11:59
  Right. Yeah, yeah.
• 12:00
  And then so we had kids together and we had beautiful family.
• 12:05
  Yeah. Everywhere where we would go, we
• 12:09
  would, you know, go out to dinner and the waitress would
• 12:12
  Oh, you guys have such a beautiful family and you know,
• 12:15
  all the things and we my kids were in sports.
• 12:18
  My kids. We did like 8 sports at a time
• 12:21
  and you know with all my. Kids, the typical life, right?
• 12:24
  Football, cheerleading, softball, baseball, all the
• 12:28
  things. Yep.
• 12:29
  And it was go, go, go. Constant.
• 12:32
  I mean, there's no time to breathe, you know, during this
• 12:35
  time, I'm trying to push everything down.
• 12:38
  I'm drinking, you know, I got the kids all their sports and
• 12:41
  everything's, you know, they're, we're back home.
• 12:44
  They've had dinner, they're in bed.
• 12:45
  And then totally. Yeah, so I actually this New
• 12:52
  Year's, I have five years sober. That's.
• 12:55
  Amazing. Yeah.
• 12:56
  Congratulations. Thank you.
• 12:58
  Yeah, five years is a big. Every year's a big deal, but
• 13:00
  yeah. It's a big deal, but five years
• 13:02
  is like that's that's a solid commitment and that's amazing.
• 13:06
  Yes, and I completely just, I believe that God took that that
• 13:11
  desire from me completely away. I have absolutely desire
• 13:14
  nothing. I just got full body pills when
• 13:16
  you said that because another one of my guests said the
• 13:19
  similar thing where the desire is gone and he's like, and he's
• 13:24
  like telling people you can get there.
• 13:26
  And I'm like, oh wow. Yeah, and, you know, I've
• 13:30
  everybody's, everybody's different, you know, but I, I
• 13:33
  have friends. I know people you know
• 13:35
  throughout my life that really struggle with it still after a
• 13:39
  year or. Five years.
• 13:40
  They started drinking after 10 years.
• 13:42
  I just thank God I have 0 desire.
• 13:45
  Nothing. You're grateful that it's, yes,
• 13:47
  you've fought that battle and you've slayed that and God
• 13:49
  helped you slay that. Like, that's beautiful.
• 13:52
  Well, congratulations, I'll keep saying that.
• 13:54
  That's amazing. Thank you.
• 13:55
  Yeah. So anyhow, excuse me, but we
• 13:59
  had, you know, it was it was a my life with my, my family, with
• 14:06
  my kids and my ex. Everything, you know, was the
• 14:11
  perfect, perfect white picket fence family.
• 14:15
  I had people come up to me. I have a friend.
• 14:18
  She was actually a one of the girls cheerleading coaches.
• 14:21
  And so she was a little older than them them, but younger than
• 14:24
  me, of course. And she we're we're like family
• 14:27
  now. But she she would always say,
• 14:29
  you know, I want a family just like yours.
• 14:31
  And I'm like, no, you don't. No, you don't.
• 14:34
  You have no idea what's going on behind closed doors and you
• 14:36
  really don't. You know, those those families
• 14:39
  that look perfect, you know, sadly a lot of them are not.
• 14:44
  So anyhow, yeah, so 2015 is when things really blew up with he
• 14:54
  and I. And it was actually my birthday
• 14:58
  and my son had a yeah, my son had a football tournament in Las
• 15:03
  Vegas and my his dad had driven him down there to to go to the
• 15:08
  tournament. And I was going to meet them,
• 15:10
  fly out the next day because I had to think I was working.
• 15:13
  So I get a phone call from my son, and he says, mom, I need to
• 15:17
  go to practice. But Dad's passed out naked on
• 15:21
  the bed at the hotel. And I said, OK, because I wasn't
• 15:26
  there yet. And so I called him, one of the
• 15:28
  other coaches. I said, can you pick him up,
• 15:29
  please? Can you take him to practice?
• 15:31
  Yeah, No problem. Yeah.
• 15:33
  And after all the, you know, the cheating and all the things, it
• 15:36
  was like, oh, here we go again. And so it was my birthday.
• 15:39
  I go down there. I was still drinking, but I
• 15:43
  checked into the hotel. I got a different hotel room and
• 15:46
  was like, well, it's my birthday and I'm in Las Vegas, so I just
• 15:49
  went down to the hotel bar and sat there thinking that my
• 15:51
  husband was going to come join me.
• 15:53
  He didn't. Yeah.
• 15:55
  Yeah, so come to find out, he was upstairs partying with all
• 15:58
  the parents and the people that I assumed he was cheating with
• 16:01
  and all the things he never came down South.
• 16:05
  Sadly. I, I, I was humiliated.
• 16:08
  Absolutely. Because there's, you know, all
• 16:09
  these parents upstairs in the room, but they, they kind of
• 16:12
  know that we're a mess. But it's like, it's something
• 16:15
  you're like, now it's really that one.
• 16:17
  And yeah, now it's yeah. Yeah, well, we had, we had, I
• 16:20
  had, you know, kicked him out before and it didn't stick.
• 16:23
  But this time it's stuck. And so I had to tell my son.
• 16:26
  He was, I believe 12 or 13 at the time.
• 16:28
  I told him I said, I'm sorry, but I, I'm not going to make it
• 16:31
  to your football tournament. And I flew back home the next
• 16:34
  morning. So I just.
• 16:35
  You said just that's. What happened?
• 16:37
  You have to get it. Yeah, that's just yeah.
• 16:40
  Yeah, So I came home, packed his personal things, put him by the
• 16:44
  door and he left and stayed in a trailer for a little while and
• 16:49
  it stuck. And so we divorced and did not
• 16:52
  get back together. It was a very ugly divorce.
• 16:55
  Very I myself, you know, everything came crashing down
• 16:58
  and I was still drinking. I didn't want to drink anymore.
• 17:02
  I was working on sobriety. But the pain, the pain is so.
• 17:06
  But you were probably still, you couldn't cope at the time,
• 17:09
  right? Yeah, yeah.
• 17:10
  Yeah, yeah. And so on top of that, I have, I
• 17:14
  have these four kids at home still and they're all teenagers.
• 17:17
  And I'm struggling myself with just trying to stay about my
• 17:23
  head above water. Every day, yeah.
• 17:24
  Every day, yeah. Yeah, so and when I had, I was a
• 17:27
  stay at home mom for years. And so I'd gone back to work
• 17:32
  when my youngest was, he's in first grade.
• 17:36
  So I went back to, to work full time and you know, I, the job
• 17:41
  that I had at the time, I was making $14.25 an hour and he
• 17:46
  took off and he really just acted like we never existed.
• 17:50
  He abandoned the kids. And I mean, it was awful.
• 17:54
  It was awful just watching how things went down and how, how he
• 17:58
  treated, you know, understandably, you know, me and
• 18:00
  him, but his kids, he, he really abandoned his kids at that time
• 18:05
  and he, he began building a family with someone else and her
• 18:08
  kids and all that stuff. And it was just the things he
• 18:12
  posted on social media about his new family.
• 18:16
  And it was just awful. And you know, I wasn't because I
• 18:20
  wasn't healed yet. I wasn't there to really support
• 18:23
  my kids. And so I, I, I did some things
• 18:26
  that were stupid, you know, things that were, I look back
• 18:29
  now and like just awful. When you had been abused, it's a
• 18:35
  very tough climb. You're abused and then abandoned
• 18:40
  and then having to adjust. That's extremely probably one of
• 18:44
  the hardest things in the world to do.
• 18:46
  Yeah, losing, you know, divorce, divorce is awful.
• 18:50
  It's awful. I mean for anybody that's ever
• 18:53
  been through it. And you know, when you have a, a
• 18:56
  whole family and, and kids in it and teenagers at that, it's
• 19:00
  just, it's awful. It's the worst thing ever, you
• 19:04
  know, so, so I, I, I was really, you know, proud of myself that,
• 19:12
  that I went from making, you know, I was an entry level
• 19:17
  employee and I worked my way up from, from an instructor working
• 19:21
  with people with disabilities. Amazing.
• 19:23
  And so I I worked my way up and became program manager at the
• 19:29
  day program where I work. That's fantastic.
• 19:32
  All all while going through a divorce and I don't know how I
• 19:34
  did that. I have no idea.
• 19:35
  I look back now like, wow. So I'm I'm really, really proud
• 19:40
  of my accomplishments and you. Did be and the fact that I, I
• 19:44
  have a special place in my heart for anyone with a disability or
• 19:48
  anything. I'm just it's like a such a
• 19:52
  beautiful community of people and like people who help them.
• 19:55
  It's just like, that must have been extremely challenging, but
• 19:58
  it must have been sort of a reminder of like the goodness in
• 20:02
  people when you're going through all that, right?
• 20:06
  And. I'll tell you what I mean.
• 20:08
  It's, it's really cool when you look back how you know, in the
• 20:12
  moment, it's like, why, why God, why?
• 20:16
  Then you look back and you're like, oh, OK, that's why then,
• 20:19
  you know, and I walked right into this day program working
• 20:22
  with people with disabilities. It taught me so much patience,
• 20:25
  so much just I just absolutely love working, doing what I do.
• 20:31
  I really do. It's just very rewarding.
• 20:34
  So I was placed there for a reason.
• 20:36
  And yeah, so I, I, like I said, I I can work myself, my way up
• 20:42
  to program manager. Amidst the chaos of your life,
• 20:46
  still you just yeah. Yeah, yeah.
• 20:51
  And like I said, I I did some things that I'm not proud of
• 20:55
  while going through the divorce. Looking back over the years,
• 20:58
  times I had been, I had drank. There was a time and this, this
• 21:01
  is one of my biggest embarrassments, I guess.
• 21:04
  I don't know what you call it, but.
• 21:05
  We all have them. We all have them, yeah.
• 21:08
  It was my daughter's 13th birthday.
• 21:10
  She was having a sleepover at the house and I started
• 21:15
  drinking. X was drinking, some of the
• 21:19
  parents were over of the kids and all the parents went home,
• 21:22
  had a sleepover while he and I got into an argument about him
• 21:26
  driving while drinking and I ended up punching him in the
• 21:35
  face. And it was, it was really kind
• 21:41
  of silly how it all went down. I went in the house and I called
• 21:45
  the police on myself. Basically it was, it was just I
• 21:49
  was, I was a mess. I called the police and said I
• 21:55
  was I was more angry about him drinking and driving and because
• 22:00
  I had there was years of him drinking and driving when we
• 22:05
  were my daughter was I was probably 19 or 20.
• 22:10
  He was in a car accident and the girl died while he was, he was
• 22:15
  drinking and driving and she she was in the car with him and he
• 22:18
  was with another girl. So it was like.
• 22:20
  That's a huge. Yeah, Yeah.
• 22:22
  So I had that, you know, and he was in jail for a while and he
• 22:26
  was, you know, all the things. And I was dealing with two kids
• 22:29
  at the time. And then he got out of jail in
• 22:31
  our program and we tried to work things out, whatever.
• 22:35
  But that was that was one of the hardest things with the day on
• 22:40
  my, my daughter's 13th birthday. So I called the police and he,
• 22:46
  the police came, they come in and they said, are there, are
• 22:48
  there any firearms, you know, this and that.
• 22:50
  And I said, yeah, he has firearms upstairs.
• 22:53
  They pulled me out to the front, front lawn.
• 22:55
  And mind you, my daughter and her friends are upstairs in her
• 22:57
  bedroom having a sleepover. And so I go out front to talk to
• 23:02
  the police. And next thing I know, my hands
• 23:04
  are going behind my back and I'm like, what are you doing?
• 23:08
  You know, in my mind, my, I'm intoxicated, but in my mind I'm
• 23:13
  thinking, why are you, What are you doing?
• 23:15
  Like this is the guy that keeps drinking and driving over and
• 23:17
  over and over over again. Well, the alcohol didn't put
• 23:22
  that together quite right for me.
• 23:23
  So I went to jail. He went with me.
• 23:25
  He just went for to sober up and then I was charged or I was
• 23:31
  booked and then he he ended up bailing me out so and dropping
• 23:36
  charges. Thank goodness, because that
• 23:38
  would have been a felony. So that was one of my lowest.
• 23:41
  You didn't get good that he didn't get in the car.
• 23:44
  Yeah, you didn't get. In the car and prevented that.
• 23:46
  I just want to note that, but I understand that that how it
• 23:50
  turned out was not your intention and like that it's
• 23:54
  thank you for being vulnerable and sharing that.
• 23:57
  I don't take it lightly that you know it.
• 24:01
  It's very difficult to share your most vulnerable days that
• 24:04
  you regret. But I, I appreciate it and I
• 24:08
  know that people listening and I myself immediately have a day or
• 24:13
  two like that that come to mind in my own life.
• 24:16
  But I wish I could just do that whole one over.
• 24:18
  Yeah, yeah, right. And I think, I think a lot of,
• 24:22
  well, of course, it's there was damage between my daughter and
• 24:25
  I, you know, that was one of the times that I screwed up and that
• 24:30
  I'm trying to fix now. So anyhow, I like I said, that
• 24:36
  was one of the lowest moments of my life.
• 24:37
  And he dropped the charges. I had a training order for two
• 24:40
  weeks. I had to live with a friend for
• 24:42
  two weeks, couldn't see my kids. It was, it was awful.
• 24:45
  So anyhow, I come back home and, you know, we got back to life as
• 24:49
  as usual. And so Fast forward, you know,
• 24:54
  back to our divorce and I'm, I'm struggling.
• 25:01
  I'm he's not paying child support.
• 25:04
  He might pay some here and there and then.
• 25:06
  It's all on. Yes, right.
• 25:09
  Yeah. So during this time, my oldest
• 25:12
  son, you know, he's struggling with addiction.
• 25:14
  So I have that on top of it. And, you know, I'm trying to
• 25:17
  save my son. I'm trying to help him get into
• 25:19
  programs, rehab programs, doing what I can to help to try to
• 25:25
  save my son, too. And he was on the streets.
• 25:30
  And as time went on, he was on the streets more and more.
• 25:33
  You know, first he would stay with a friend and, you know,
• 25:35
  he's staying with this person for a little while.
• 25:38
  Yeah. So then he, we got to the point
• 25:41
  where he he was homeless in San Francisco, in the Tenderloin
• 25:44
  District district. And for anybody that knows what
• 25:46
  that is, it is one of the most awful places on earth.
• 25:51
  I lived in the city for 10 years.
• 25:52
  I know the Tenderloin. Not quite that whole time.
• 25:55
  It was he was down there for about 3 years, but he would
• 25:58
  bounce back and forth a little bit.
• 25:59
  But yeah, he, he was homeless in San Francisco for about 2 1/2
• 26:04
  years. But this whole time, you know,
• 26:07
  since he was about 15 years old until he passed away last year,
• 26:12
  it was it was awful. He was in and out of the
• 26:16
  hospital. You know, he went from mostly
• 26:19
  started with pills in high school and then he progressed to
• 26:24
  heroin and then the famous fentanyl.
• 26:27
  He that's what that's what took him.
• 26:30
  It destroyed. I watched it destroy his body.
• 26:32
  There are, you know, pictures that I have of him that are just
• 26:37
  no mother should ever have to see, nobody should ever have to
• 26:40
  see. But I watched his body
• 26:41
  deteriorate, especially over that time that since he was in
• 26:45
  high school. But the last about four years
• 26:48
  from from now, four years back, just his body like, you know, he
• 26:54
  lost weight, obviously the bruises and the brakes.
• 26:59
  He ended up knocking his two front teeth out just, and he had
• 27:02
  a gorgeous smile, so handsome. Just, it was just seeing those
• 27:06
  things and going to the hospital and it's awful.
• 27:10
  It was awful. It was awful.
• 27:14
  But you know, so this, this whole time, this last, you know,
• 27:18
  10 years or so, I've been trying to work on myself and I've, I've
• 27:22
  been in counseling. I'm not sure if you're familiar
• 27:25
  with Celebrate Recovery Through Churches.
• 27:27
  OK, Yeah. I've gone through that.
• 27:30
  I did the 9-9 months program so I'm here.
• 27:33
  I'm sober now and that's great. And all that about.
• 27:36
  Well, it was 2019 and I had, you know, my kids, Dad, we were
• 27:40
  divorced and I was dating again. Yeah.
• 27:43
  And so I I met a man online, like a dating app, and we
• 27:49
  connected right away. And, you know, he was this man
• 27:52
  of God and he went to church and he read his Bible and he was
• 27:57
  just everything that I wanted. I was like, OK, you're like.
• 27:59
  Here it is. Yeah, here it is.
• 28:01
  I I've got, you know, someone that Yeah, yeah.
• 28:04
  He asked me to marry him. We got married in 2020.
• 28:09
  And so here I am on my third marriage, 3rd and final.
• 28:14
  Trust me, that's OK. That's OK.
• 28:17
  So, you know, as time went on, I mean, everything was great.
• 28:21
  My kids loved him. My youngest daughter, you know,
• 28:24
  her dad had taken off and she's like, oh, I have a new dad kind
• 28:28
  of a thing. You know, she was teenager and
• 28:31
  and almost 18 and everything, but there was someone that.
• 28:34
  Yeah. So I we got married and about
• 28:40
  probably about a year after our marriage, we got married, I
• 28:45
  started noticing some things, like, I mean, he's just, he's
• 28:48
  not himself. And he's like a completely
• 28:50
  different person. Things are changing and he
• 28:52
  starts doing things. And I called him out on it.
• 28:54
  I said, you know what? That's abusive.
• 28:56
  That's abusive. Yeah, I'm not, I'm not doing
• 28:58
  this. And as soon as I called him out
• 29:02
  and I called him a narcissist. Oh yeah, they freak out.
• 29:07
  Everything blew up. He, he, he was evil.
• 29:10
  He was, I mean, absolute. I believe that.
• 29:14
  I do believe that they are like demonic.
• 29:18
  Absolutely, absolutely. I saw the black eyes.
• 29:21
  Yeah, they it's a different look and I've seen it as well.
• 29:24
  Yes, Yep. I'm so sorry.
• 29:26
  Yeah. So he as we're going, this this
• 29:30
  is this is just crazy. This part of my life that, you
• 29:34
  know, here, I saw it. I, I, I met this man and, and
• 29:38
  we're I, I married him for crying out loud, you know, it's
• 29:42
  my third marriage and I was like, this is it, you know, I'm
• 29:44
  doing this again and I really love this man.
• 29:48
  I really, I trusted him with everything I had, you know,
• 29:52
  because I, I came from a 20 year abusive marriage that, you know,
• 29:56
  I thought, here we go. I.
• 29:57
  I can reckon this, yeah, yeah. So we something told me to check
• 30:06
  his phone and he was struggling with a porn addiction when we
• 30:11
  first got together and I knew this and now looking back I'm
• 30:13
  like hell look at that red flag. But, you know, you're probably
• 30:17
  like, hey, like everyone. Yeah.
• 30:20
  No, I. Well, you know what?
• 30:22
  Because I have. Shit.
• 30:24
  Right. Yeah, because I wanted to.
• 30:26
  I wanted to. Well, I was trying to quit
• 30:28
  drinking at the time. We all.
• 30:30
  I'm like, you know what? We all have struggles.
• 30:32
  Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I'm like, well, we can get on
• 30:34
  board together and we can do this.
• 30:35
  Together. And here I thought we were were
• 30:37
  and I had quit drinking, excuse me, not long after we got
• 30:41
  married and thought he was on the wagon too.
• 30:45
  And anyhow, in 2000, October of 20/3/2023, something told me,
• 30:51
  you know, something's not right. And he had gotten a new job and
• 30:53
  he kept talking about this girl, this woman at work.
• 30:56
  And I'm like, why does he keep bringing her name up right?
• 30:59
  And someone told me to check his phone.
• 31:00
  Well, sure enough, I found all kinds of stuff on his phone and
• 31:04
  it was TikTok videos that he was had saved inappropriate videos.
• 31:09
  The next morning I called him out on it and I said he woke me
• 31:13
  up and and I said, you want to tell me about your TikTok girls?
• 31:17
  And he just, he froze. And I said, how long has this
• 31:24
  been going on? Thinking, you know, maybe he
• 31:27
  fell off the wagon a couple weeks ago or something.
• 31:30
  He said a year and a half. And I said, OK, And looking
• 31:34
  back, I don't think he ever stopped looking at pornography.
• 31:39
  I really don't. Just the severity of where I'm
• 31:42
  leading this to. Yeah, I I don't think he ever
• 31:45
  stopped. So I convinced you because he's
• 31:49
  probably very convincing. Oh yeah.
• 31:52
  I mean, why would you believe him if you trusted him and
• 31:55
  you're on this journey together? You know what I mean?
• 31:56
  Right. I absolutely trusted him with
• 31:58
  everything I had. I really did, you know?
• 32:01
  So that just shattered my world again.
• 32:03
  I was like, are you kidding me? So I moved all my stuff upstairs
• 32:08
  to the different bedroom, trying to figure out what the heck I'm
• 32:11
  going to do. I'm trying to at this point.
• 32:15
  I ended up getting a different job because during all this
• 32:18
  time, the stress of that marriage was just a lot and I
• 32:23
  ended up kind of having a nervous breakdown.
• 32:25
  Oh yeah, you have one when you're with a narcissist at some
• 32:29
  point because you really, your body can't function anymore.
• 32:32
  It happened to me, yes. So I I know.
• 32:36
  And you know, it, it was crazy. It's crazy how everything works
• 32:38
  out. But I'm, I'm looking at
• 32:40
  everything and I'm starting to get depressed and I'm laying on
• 32:42
  the couch and I'm, I'm having all these symptoms and I'm
• 32:46
  putting things together. I'm like, my mom has had all
• 32:49
  these symptoms for a long time. I'm like, I'm not going to end
• 32:52
  up like her. I just thought about your mom
• 32:54
  when you saw the couch like. Yep.
• 32:56
  But you don't want to go down that road, you remember.
• 32:58
  Were you thinking that? So I started doing all this
• 33:00
  research on, I mean, I had done a lot of research on narcissists
• 33:05
  with my kids, dad and all that. But I really, I'm like, this is
• 33:09
  the second time I'm in the situation that with a narcissist
• 33:14
  and then it's awful. I had to figure things out.
• 33:19
  I'm like, I, I, I got to figure this out and I'm not, I'm not
• 33:21
  going to do this again for one. So I got to fix me or do what I
• 33:25
  need to do to make sure I don't end up in this situation again.
• 33:28
  Yeah. So I, you know, took a deep dive
• 33:32
  down just all the things narcissist and trying to heal
• 33:36
  from it and figure things out. So I had a different job and I'm
• 33:39
  I'm trying to save up money. Excuse me trying to save up
• 33:42
  money for to move out to figure this out.
• 33:45
  And I just I couldn't save enough money to move out
• 33:47
  quickly, you know, and I'm kind of moving things around the
• 33:50
  house, kind of separating our things.
• 33:52
  And I find this journal and I hope, you know, I was like, oh,
• 33:54
  this isn't mine. So let me let me separate.
• 33:56
  So I kind of opened it and it opened up to a page where he was
• 33:59
  confessing that he had molested someone years ago.
• 34:02
  And I'm like, what is it like? I'm just in shock.
• 34:04
  Like not only I mean, it just kept going deeper and deeper.
• 34:07
  And I called my friend and I said, I said, what is this?
• 34:12
  And we're trying to figure it out.
• 34:13
  Like what, what is this? You know, And I wanted to be
• 34:16
  careful because at this point it was, it was a little scary
• 34:19
  living with him because he, he's special.
• 34:22
  He's very special in the sense that he's scary.
• 34:25
  He's very scary. Psychological abuse.
• 34:28
  My my kids dad didn't necessarily do the psychological
• 34:32
  thing, but this one did. And it was it was bad.
• 34:37
  He turned. He turned my kids against me.
• 34:40
  Yeah, they're very skilled psychologically master
• 34:44
  manipulator. Yeah, he had a horrible
• 34:47
  childhood, you know, and it makes sense.
• 34:49
  I mean, I know all these things now, but.
• 34:52
  You don't know it when you're going through.
• 34:53
  You don't even know what a nurse like.
• 34:55
  Even if you do, you're like, no, like, yeah, the depth of it is
• 34:59
  beyond comprehension until you're out of it.
• 35:02
  Yeah. And, you know, I feel sorry for
• 35:04
  the little boy, for the things that he went through, but I
• 35:07
  don't feel sorry for the grown man that he is that is
• 35:10
  continuing to abuse people. You know, at some point you got
• 35:15
  to take accountability and say I need to fix myself before I
• 35:17
  damage someone else. Exactly.
• 35:19
  You know, so and he's in another relationship now and she has no
• 35:22
  idea, you know, and it's, it's really sad, but I, I, you know,
• 35:27
  it's not my business anymore. I can't control.
• 35:29
  It they move on, they move on and then they create a whole new
• 35:33
  like shared fantasy and then like you're the crazy one.
• 35:36
  It's like a playbook. It's.
• 35:38
  A playbook, yeah, Yep. So like I said, he was really
• 35:41
  close with with my daughter, my youngest daughter at the time.
• 35:44
  Well, she's now 24. So they got really close.
• 35:48
  And now looking back, I'm creeped out by it, but that's
• 35:52
  there's nothing I can do about it.
• 35:53
  Do about it. And he ended up I ended up
• 35:57
  confronting him. It took about I was like a week
• 36:00
  or two of my friend and I just trying to figure this out.
• 36:03
  Like, what is this? Yeah.
• 36:05
  So I texted him one day. He was at work.
• 36:06
  I said, do you want to tell me the real reason that you were
• 36:09
  in? It was a juvenile hall type
• 36:11
  situation when he was younger. He said, we'll talk when I get
• 36:13
  home. I said, OK.
• 36:15
  So he comes in and we sit down at the kitchen table and he
• 36:18
  proceeds to tell me that he molested A2 year old when he was
• 36:22
  a teenager. And I just my jaw dropped and he
• 36:25
  starts, you know, kind of telling the details of I said
• 36:27
  stop. I like I didn't want that in my
• 36:29
  head. You're like, I don't.
• 36:30
  Oh. I heard enough.
• 36:32
  I heard that you did it. That's all I needed to hear.
• 36:33
  I don't tell me anymore. And so I stopped it right there.
• 36:36
  And and that's what happened. He he was a convicted child
• 36:40
  predator. And I don't think he's healed.
• 36:43
  I don't think he's moved on. I don't or, you know, not moved
• 36:46
  on, but he's still in that. He's still in whatever he's in.
• 36:51
  He's never not and all that. There's no, there's no like
• 36:57
  quest for redemption in his in his life.
• 36:59
  Like he's not turning to God or anything.
• 37:02
  Well, he pretends to, I mean, you know, and, and sadly, that's
• 37:05
  what a lot of narcissists do is they, they get really good at
• 37:09
  knowing the Bible. They get really good at.
• 37:11
  And they use it. Pretending Yep.
• 37:14
  And he was that guy. I mean, he was, he knew
• 37:16
  everybody in church. He, he, you know, all the
• 37:19
  things, all the things. And so I, I mean, I was just, I
• 37:22
  was just devastated. I was just like, are you kidding
• 37:25
  me? I'm this, we're doing this
• 37:26
  again, you know, meaning myself. Yeah.
• 37:30
  He had as we were splitting up and as we were, you know, going
• 37:34
  through the things we're still living together.
• 37:36
  I get we had gotten into an argument and he calls me the
• 37:40
  name of the woman that I suspected him cheating with at
• 37:43
  work and to my face my friend was on the phone and he he's
• 37:46
  doing it purposely and he's calling me her name and I'm just
• 37:49
  like what is going on right now? Taunting you like a child?
• 37:54
  Yeah, yeah. So I, you know, emotions are
• 37:59
  crazy sometimes. I do.
• 38:01
  Know I I had which a lot of people would do I look this
• 38:07
  woman's I looked this woman up. I found a phone number which I
• 38:11
  had for months. I had the phone number, but he
• 38:13
  called me her name and I I blew I blew a gasket.
• 38:18
  I called her. Of course.
• 38:20
  She didn't answer, but I left a voicemail, a very professional
• 38:24
  voicemail, you know, now give me a call.
• 38:25
  And it really it was like, I want to talk to this woman.
• 38:27
  Are you having an affair with my husband?
• 38:29
  Well, she, she never called back, but about a month later I
• 38:34
  get a knock at the door and he had just moved out.
• 38:37
  I think like the weekend before. So I get a knock at the door and
• 38:41
  I look at my Ring camera and it's a sheriff.
• 38:44
  And I said it's probably him serving me some kind of papers.
• 38:47
  I had already filed for divorce, but I thought it was some kind
• 38:49
  of something coming back at me. I opened the front door and he
• 38:53
  said Amber and I said yes. And he goes, I have a
• 38:56
  restraining order for you. I said what?
• 38:59
  A restraining order for what? This woman put a restraining
• 39:02
  order on me, which now looking back, the county that granted
• 39:06
  this restraining order did it. He had no reason to grant that
• 39:09
  restraining order by looking at the laws.
• 39:11
  I I broke everything down. Oh yeah.
• 39:13
  That restraining order should not have been, well, it was, it
• 39:15
  was set in motion. Of course, we had to go to
• 39:18
  court. But so I, I, you know, and I
• 39:20
  have firearms myself. And so they, my firearms were
• 39:23
  taken and he had just moved, moved out and I didn't know what
• 39:27
  this guy was capable of. I didn't know if he was, I
• 39:30
  didn't know who he was. Well, no.
• 39:32
  They'd live a double life. Yeah, they live a double life.
• 39:36
  So here he knows that my firearms were just taken and I
• 39:39
  I'm just I'm living here by myself.
• 39:41
  I got my dog and I I just I that was one of another low points in
• 39:48
  my life where I was like, what is going Oh my God, you know,
• 39:52
  and this absolutely the universe.
• 39:55
  This was, this was God's way of saying you didn't fix, you
• 39:59
  didn't heal and fix from your marriage, from your previous
• 40:02
  marriage with your children's father.
• 40:04
  I'm going to give you another relationship like that.
• 40:06
  You're going to get it this time.
• 40:07
  And I did, and I definitely have done a lot more work.
• 40:12
  On. Myself and healing and learning
• 40:18
  about narcissists and really deep dive and it's it's deep,
• 40:23
  it's evil. Those are the forces of this
• 40:26
  world that we are really dealing with.
• 40:28
  You know those demons are on earth walking amongst us, and
• 40:34
  unless you have ever been through it, you, you, you just
• 40:36
  don't know. You don't.
• 40:38
  It's a club you don't want to be in as a narcissistic abuse
• 40:42
  survivor. When I interviewed Sam victim
• 40:46
  Sam back, Sam Backman, he was like, you want it.
• 40:49
  Don't call yourself a victim. Call yourself a an abuse
• 40:52
  survivor. And it's something that changes
• 40:55
  you forever. You never look at any.
• 40:58
  I don't know about how you feel, but like whenever I meet someone
• 41:01
  new, like I used to be extremely open.
• 41:05
  Like, I mean, I'm open with my guests.
• 41:06
  My guests are like my but like when I'm meeting someone new
• 41:09
  like in the in my neighborhood, I'm I'm I'm scanning like I am.
• 41:13
  How is my nervous? I mean I'm like wow, I never
• 41:15
  used to be like this but I guess I guess I might I'm on high
• 41:20
  narcissist alert 24/7. Like if you're giving me red
• 41:24
  flags, I am like but never before.
• 41:28
  I would be like Aww right? I can help with that or I could
• 41:32
  you know it's fine. That's the part of it is unless
• 41:36
  you're healed inside yourself, you're going to be attracted to
• 41:39
  those people. They will devour you.
• 41:42
  You're gonna try to fix them and and I feel bad for them, you
• 41:45
  know, and thought you went through such as a horrible
• 41:48
  childhood and let me let me fix you and you know, and until you
• 41:53
  really go through that and then you.
• 41:55
  Well, I like I said, I I repeated the pattern, yes, and I
• 41:58
  went through it again. Yep.
• 42:01
  It was five years of absolute, well, not the entire time, but
• 42:05
  the last couple years was just absolute awful.
• 42:08
  We ended up the woman and I, you know, I went to court to try to
• 42:14
  get this thing dropped, which I did.
• 42:16
  It was dropped. Yeah.
• 42:19
  And come to find out, she's a married woman.
• 42:21
  And I think she did the refraining order, so I wouldn't
• 42:23
  contact her husband. And I mean, it all makes sense.
• 42:27
  But yeah, so you know, last, let's see.
• 42:33
  Well, 2024 especially was a big healing journey for me.
• 42:41
  I just, I isolated myself on purpose just because I needed to
• 42:46
  be obviously not dating anybody, but just alone and find out who
• 42:51
  I was because like I said, I, I was a mom for, since I was 16
• 42:54
  years old. And I mean, I'm still alone, but
• 42:59
  that's all I did was raise kids. And then once I have this empty
• 43:03
  nest thing going on and all my kids are grown up and moved
• 43:05
  away, I'm like, who the hell am I?
• 43:08
  What do I like to do? You know?
• 43:12
  So 2024 was, was a big year of he had moved out.
• 43:17
  Well, actually he moved out in July of 24.
• 43:21
  So the rest of 24 and then 25, just really working on myself
• 43:27
  and sitting in solitude thinking and processing and doing all the
• 43:33
  things and healing from my childhood and all the things.
• 43:37
  So, and like I said, during this time, this whole time I'm back
• 43:41
  and forth to San Francisco, to the hospitals, you know, going
• 43:46
  through all this with my son. And then on top of that, my
• 43:49
  husband used going through doing all this stuff and it was awful.
• 43:53
  My nervous system was an absolute wreck.
• 43:56
  I was, there was a couple times I, I contemplated suicide.
• 44:01
  I it was, it was awful. It was awful.
• 44:05
  And. So sorry.
• 44:07
  He was so good that he there was a couple of friends that I've
• 44:12
  been friends for almost 20 years.
• 44:14
  And she had, he had her thinking like, is Amber OK?
• 44:17
  Is her mental health OK? Well, it was him.
• 44:20
  It was him the whole time. And unfortunately my kids are,
• 44:24
  they don't see that. They see me as crazy because I
• 44:30
  stand up for myself. I say hell no.
• 44:32
  I, I'm not quiet about things. I tell my truth.
• 44:35
  I, you know, all the things and they, they experience things
• 44:38
  from a different perspective. So of course I don't expect them
• 44:41
  to see things my way. But I'm estranged from 2 of my
• 44:46
  kids now. So it's, I mean, they're, we
• 44:48
  have a little bit of communication, but it's, it's
• 44:51
  not a kind of relationship at all.
• 44:53
  So that's, and it breaks my heart.
• 44:54
  And I have a brand new granddaughter that I can't see
• 44:59
  right now. I mean, they live on the East
• 45:00
  Coast, but you know, it's just, it's awful.
• 45:03
  It sucks. Well, and it and it doesn't mean
• 45:06
  that that it's going to be that way forever because I feel that.
• 45:11
  And again, it is extremely difficult where you're going
• 45:14
  through. And I know Roseanne in episode
• 45:16
  70 said the same thing. She's like, literally when she
• 45:19
  fully shared her truth, they had said that's not what, how we
• 45:24
  experienced it or even as much as like mom, that didn't happen.
• 45:28
  And she's like, I'm sorry, but it did.
• 45:32
  And she doesn't want to it to be true, but it's true.
• 45:36
  And she's like, I have to be a woman now.
• 45:39
  And I'm she's it's part of her healing journey.
• 45:41
  And as somebody who I just want you to know, like as a
• 45:44
  narcissistic abuse survivor, sharing your truth is like you
• 45:49
  have to, you have to. And like, if people don't, can't
• 45:53
  accept it, like the alternative is you slowly die inside.
• 45:58
  That's what I mean. And then you personally wanted
• 46:01
  end your life. Like I was there.
• 46:03
  I've I have an episode about it. I'm like, you just don't
• 46:05
  understand what this kind of abuse does to you and why you
• 46:08
  have to Share your story. I do, I get it.
• 46:12
  And then then in time, as you know, like, they'll come around.
• 46:17
  Yeah. And you pray that you know.
• 46:19
  I I just, I hope so. I hope so.
• 46:22
  Yeah. You know, it's, but you know, at
• 46:25
  the same time I have, I have to, I have to move on with my life
• 46:29
  and I have to do what I have to do to heal, to tell my story and
• 46:33
  just get it out there, you know, And I just pray that they come
• 46:37
  back around, you know? It's when you're when what I'm
• 46:40
  learning with God, and you've mentioned God a few times, like
• 46:43
  I you when you you're doing your work on yourself.
• 46:47
  And part of that healing is telling your story and opening
• 46:51
  up about the ugly truth, which a lot of us have.
• 46:54
  And the rest, once you're honest with God and honest with the
• 46:59
  world, I feel that something shifts where God, the rest is
• 47:03
  between them and God. Like you've done your part by
• 47:06
  being honest with God, honest with yourself.
• 47:09
  And in telling your story, you are telling all of it.
• 47:11
  You are really like, here's where I went wrong.
• 47:13
  Here's where I wish I could do this.
• 47:15
  Here's where I was proud of myself because we're all human.
• 47:18
  And I just like commend you for having the courage to say this
• 47:22
  is, this is who I am. This is what I went through.
• 47:25
  This is how I'm healing. And I do know that God does work
• 47:29
  all things for good. I'm, I'm seeing that over and
• 47:32
  over. It might not be in the short
• 47:34
  immediate term, but you know. Yeah, yeah.
• 47:37
  And it, you know, this, this is another kind of blow to, to, to,
• 47:44
  to, to everything. It's just so, like I said, my
• 47:46
  son passed away the beginning of November 2025, last year.
• 47:51
  And that kind of brought us together, You know, my kids,
• 47:54
  because they came to my daughter from the East Coast.
• 47:57
  She came out here, of course, with her family, her baby and
• 48:01
  her husband. And, and then so my three, my 3
• 48:06
  kids, like we, you know, I don't know, we call it bonded, but you
• 48:09
  know, we, we saw each other because we hadn't seen each
• 48:12
  other in a long time, you know, and there was, there was a lot
• 48:16
  of hurt there. And so I got to see my
• 48:18
  granddaughter and, you know, she was here and she's hanging out
• 48:21
  at the house. And it was just that part, being
• 48:26
  able to see her and hold her and she's, well, she's 10 months old
• 48:31
  now, but I mean, she was like 7-8 months old at the time.
• 48:35
  And you know, when you have a baby right in front of you, it's
• 48:38
  just takes everything away, you know, So I'm going through
• 48:42
  grieving my son. And that was the only thing
• 48:44
  getting me through. I mean, really it was just, you
• 48:47
  know, so I had my granddaughter and so we're all working through
• 48:51
  things. And I mean, not working through
• 48:52
  it. We weren't talking about things,
• 48:53
  but we were, we were, you know, that's all that's what I all I
• 48:57
  could ask for at that time. And it made me, it made my heart
• 49:00
  so happy that we could be together even under those
• 49:04
  circumstances. So anyhow, so we had my son's
• 49:07
  service and during the service one of my son's friends comes up
• 49:11
  to me and he goes, can I talk to you?
• 49:13
  He said sure. And we go in backroom and he
• 49:19
  proceeds to tell me, he said we would not be here today if it
• 49:24
  wasn't for your ex-husband. Your son is dead because of him.
• 49:28
  And I just, I was like, he, he wanted, he want to go beat him
• 49:31
  up right then and there and because of things that my son
• 49:34
  had told him. And I said, please don't do that
• 49:36
  here. This is my son's service.
• 49:37
  We're not doing any of that here.
• 49:39
  But he was angry. And that was, I went about a
• 49:41
  week and a half just holding on to that.
• 49:43
  I ended up telling my kids, you know, they're adults.
• 49:46
  And, you know, it's just something that that I I've been
• 49:49
  holding on to for years. Yeah.
• 49:53
  Sibling I like, I mean, yeah. So I mean, this is their dad
• 49:57
  that we're talking about here, right?
• 49:59
  I'm during the divorce, I had mentioned some things about
• 50:06
  about him possibly abusing my son that their grandma had said
• 50:09
  years back. But then that kind of just went
• 50:12
  to, you know, to the back burner or whatever.
• 50:15
  But during the service, you know, this guy comes up to me
• 50:20
  and tells me this. And then a week and a half
• 50:22
  later, I, I end up telling my kids and it blew up in my face.
• 50:26
  I, I, I, I, I don't know, I mean, but at the same time, the
• 50:31
  truth has to come out. What what what it does?
• 50:33
  Saying like the truth is the truth.
• 50:35
  Like there's nothing. You can't argue with the the
• 50:37
  truth. The truth.
• 50:39
  Yeah, yeah. So I had them all three on
• 50:42
  FaceTime and you know, I'm, I, I tell them what this man told me
• 50:47
  about the brother. And so, you know, now I'm
• 50:52
  accused of not protecting my children when they were young.
• 50:56
  And so now I can't be around my granddaughter.
• 51:00
  So, and that's absolutely not, you know, they, they won't
• 51:06
  really even give me the opportunity to talk and explain
• 51:09
  things. So that's, that's really hard.
• 51:11
  So I'm just like over here with all this information that I feel
• 51:14
  like I want to tell them not, not that I would tell all the
• 51:18
  details, but like, can I have a chance to explain my side of the
• 51:22
  story, you know, and I think that, you know, this is kind of
• 51:26
  a way to do that. Yes, yes.
• 51:30
  But I just, it's, it's not fair, you know what I mean?
• 51:33
  It's just not fair. And it's, I'm not the bad guy
• 51:36
  here, you know? And I, I, so now, you know,
• 51:40
  being estranged now again from my kids again and my
• 51:44
  granddaughter, you know, so it's, it's been hard, it's been
• 51:47
  really hard. But in looking at things, you
• 51:50
  know, looking at the big picture and everything of what I've gone
• 51:53
  through and just since my, my son passed, I mean, I've had,
• 51:56
  I've been off work pretty much since he passed.
• 51:59
  And I, you know, had to go on disability because it's just to
• 52:02
  run a day program and have all these people in your face all
• 52:05
  day long. And I have a high responsibility
• 52:07
  job and you need to. Process.
• 52:09
  You need to. I couldn't.
• 52:11
  So I'm on disability still and I took a cross country road trip
• 52:16
  the let's see, I think I left the 13th of December and part of
• 52:20
  that was just to to get just to drive just to I have the time
• 52:25
  off. Let me go see the country.
• 52:26
  Right. There's a lot of places to see,
• 52:28
  yeah. So like I said, my my daughter
• 52:31
  lives in the East Coast. I'm trying to like trying to
• 52:35
  kind of repair things, but I don't want to talk too much.
• 52:39
  And so I texted her and I had some toys here for the baby.
• 52:43
  I said, hey, I'm doing a cross country road trip.
• 52:45
  Mind if I drop them off? Well, she never responded.
• 52:48
  Then I'm almost there. I'm 4 hours from her house and
• 52:52
  she told me I couldn't come to her house.
• 52:53
  Yeah, I drove all the way there and I'm just like, it was
• 52:57
  another shot to the heart, you know, like, OK, I mean, I didn't
• 53:00
  do that trip just to come and bring her the things.
• 53:02
  I just, I did it for myself just to just to go, just to breathe,
• 53:06
  you know. So I turned around and I started
• 53:09
  driving back towards California and I had my maps set to I have
• 53:14
  a friend that lives in Las Vegas.
• 53:15
  I was going to see her on the way back.
• 53:17
  And at this point I'm, I'm, I'm sad, I'm, I'm bummed out.
• 53:22
  I drove all this way and I was just, I was getting really
• 53:25
  discouraged and thinking I was going to, I was going to do a
• 53:31
  like on Instagram or, or some, some kind of social media like,
• 53:34
  hey, follow my journey, you know, and, and have the camera
• 53:36
  and just, you know, and I ended up each stopping like, OK, I
• 53:39
  didn't start at this time. Didn't start.
• 53:41
  And I think it just wasn't the right time.
• 53:43
  But so I'm driving back and my map starts taking me like I
• 53:49
  guess more north and I start going through Missouri, Kansas,
• 53:55
  all that. And I was like, well, I guess
• 53:56
  I'll just go up towards this way and go down towards Las Vegas.
• 53:59
  Yeah, and it takes me through Colorado, so I'm back up a
• 54:06
  little bit. My son was a die hard
• 54:10
  Philadelphia Eagles fan. OK, football.
• 54:13
  And I've just, I've been drawn to just how spirit works and
• 54:19
  just drawn to eagles, right? Like just eagles on my trip.
• 54:23
  I see it's on the back of big rigs.
• 54:25
  I see the word eagle. I see a picture of an eagle.
• 54:28
  I see a store called Eagle something.
• 54:30
  I mean, just eagles everywhere. So that was cool.
• 54:34
  Well, I get to Colorado, going through the Rocky Mountains,
• 54:37
  like somewhere up in there, and I start seeing Eagle River,
• 54:41
  Eagle Corridor, Eagle Lake, Eagle, all these eagle things.
• 54:44
  I'm like, holy cow, just it was an amazing, beautiful
• 54:48
  experience. Like I know my sense.
• 54:50
  You feel his spirit is still here.
• 54:53
  Absolutely. And I would do that trip 100
• 54:57
  times to go through that experience again.
• 54:59
  And yeah. And the next thing I know, I'm
• 55:01
  driving through Eagle Co. Like, what are the odds out of
• 55:04
  all the cities in the United States I drive through Eagle Co?
• 55:07
  Like, come on, it's. A cool reassurance to have that
• 55:11
  like when you're trying to make sense of all this and you, I
• 55:15
  know that feeling when you're like, there's no way and that
• 55:17
  you feel something, you feel a presence and you feel it and
• 55:20
  it's like very comfortable. There was so much healing in
• 55:23
  that drive. I mean, I don't know if you've
• 55:26
  ever driven across the United States, but holy cow, it's far.
• 55:30
  It. Is insane.
• 55:33
  So I had a lot of time to listen to podcasts.
• 55:35
  I had a lot of time to. Think I had time?
• 55:37
  To cry a lot of time to all the things and that is why I went on
• 55:42
  that trip so I could be brought through that that area and just
• 55:47
  absolutely confirm that when people pass their spirits still
• 55:53
  with us, it really is I mean we just we we transform to a
• 55:58
  different being. You know, our physical body is
• 56:00
  not here, but he is absolutely here and I there's no denying
• 56:04
  that you know, I talk to him every day.
• 56:06
  I say good morning to him. You know, I say goodnight and,
• 56:09
  and I, I tell him to give me a sign and oh, here's another
• 56:12
  eagle or, you know, just whatever.
• 56:15
  And it's, it's pretty, it was a pretty magical experience, I
• 56:18
  will say. I'm so glad you took that time
• 56:20
  to do that and like it's AI think it's really like connected
• 56:25
  way because obviously you're grieving and and you you're
• 56:28
  trying to rebuild your life for kind of figure out life while
• 56:34
  you're grieving and it's beautiful.
• 56:35
  That like it sounds like you are taking steps so that you can
• 56:41
  take care of yourself while you're grieving, which is so
• 56:46
  glad you took disability because honestly, when you're healing
• 56:50
  from anything right, especially this, you need you need to take
• 56:53
  time. Yeah, yeah.
• 56:58
  Again, I'm like, so I'm so incredibly sorry for your loss.
• 57:02
  I know, I know that knowing, knowing and feeling his spirit
• 57:07
  is so reassuring and so wonderful.
• 57:11
  It's just as a mother, it's something that's, you know,
• 57:15
  extremely difficult. And I know you're taking it day
• 57:17
  by day and that's all you can do, right?
• 57:19
  You know, And, and those, those confirmations and those moments,
• 57:25
  I have had so many of them that and as I get closer to God, I'm
• 57:30
  having more and they're more like, whoa, I'm like, whoa, did
• 57:33
  that really just happened? Like there's no way.
• 57:36
  Wait, I just prayed about that 10 minutes ago.
• 57:39
  Like what, you know what I mean? Yep, It's and I also want to say
• 57:46
  thank you for sharing that you got to dark moments because as a
• 57:51
  parent, as a person, it's not always easy to share that you,
• 57:56
  you got to the end of your rope where you're like, you know,
• 57:59
  maybe I don't really want to fucking do this anymore.
• 58:02
  And I, I've said that and I remember the first time I said
• 58:05
  it on my podcast, I was like, Oh my God, I just shared that.
• 58:07
  And I'm like, yeah, cuz it was, cuz it happened.
• 58:10
  And I really almost did. And I really know that pain can
• 58:14
  feel so bad sometimes that you're just like, I can't bear
• 58:17
  this, but I don't know about you.
• 58:18
  When I've been in those moments, that's when I feel what I now
• 58:22
  know was God, I didn't know at the time when I was sitting in
• 58:25
  this room being like, yeah, I'm done.
• 58:28
  After like the last narcissist thing.
• 58:30
  I was like then I felt, it's not, I didn't hear a voice.
• 58:35
  I didn't none of that. It was just this feeling of like
• 58:39
  knowing that it was not time and I could and I it's just that's
• 58:43
  when God, I feel like touched me in some way.
• 58:45
  And then I began the journey back to like, figuring out what
• 58:48
  that was. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 58:51
  And I know you know, I still. Life is a journey and we never
• 58:55
  come to the end. We just keep going and but.
• 58:59
  Being able to. Share my story and I mean this
• 59:03
  is only a snippet of 48 years, you know, but being able to
• 59:09
  share my story, I know that it helps others because other
• 59:15
  people's stories have helped helped me and tremendously.
• 59:19
  I mean, they could I could be watching a podcast and just a
• 59:22
  little piece and it's like what clicks for you or something the.
• 59:27
  Way the way you said something, somebody listening, it's going
• 59:32
  to be like, wait, what? Or somebody who's struggling
• 59:36
  with addiction or somebody who is struggling with whatever
• 59:40
  they're struggling with. Like we cannot.
• 59:43
  The worst is when you literally are in your room knowing like
• 59:47
  you feel like you're the only one in that moment and it's just
• 59:50
  not true. And I think or we are like very
• 59:54
  candid on these podcasts, The more the less shame there is
• 59:58
  around getting to a point where you if you ever get to that
• 1:00:01
  point, you can be like, wait, that podcast ladies, both of
• 1:00:05
  them said that they got to that point and wait.
• 1:00:09
  Maybe I can do that. I don't know how hell I'm going
• 1:00:12
  to do it, but I heard even the most together people are brought
• 1:00:16
  to their knees by life. Yep, Yep.
• 1:00:21
  Well, and I look at, you know, I have five years sober and 10
• 1:00:26
  years ago, I would never have thought that was possible.
• 1:00:29
  Just was in my, of it, you know, and here I am five years.
• 1:00:33
  That's a long time. Five years without a drink is a
• 1:00:36
  long time. You know, when I had one year,
• 1:00:38
  it was like, OK, got a year. That's, that's huge.
• 1:00:40
  But now I'm, I'm five years in and healing is possible.
• 1:00:45
  Healing is, it's achievable for anyone, you know, And, and I
• 1:00:49
  know how hard it is. I know how, what a struggle it
• 1:00:52
  was four years to because I, I didn't just one day wake up and
• 1:00:55
  go, I don't want to drink anymore.
• 1:00:57
  You know, I, I was struggling, trying to quit drinking and
• 1:01:00
  trying to cope with life and yeah.
• 1:01:04
  The the more, the more vulnerable you are.
• 1:01:07
  I feel that God sends the strength and sends the resources
• 1:01:13
  in some way. It doesn't mean that everybody
• 1:01:16
  you want is going to be like in alignment with you, but like God
• 1:01:18
  will be like, hey, I will send you enough strength and enough
• 1:01:22
  people. Doesn't mean everyone's going
• 1:01:24
  to, you know, everyone, everything you want's going to
• 1:01:25
  happen, but I'll get you through.
• 1:01:28
  Can I ask you how to like are you talking to a therapist
• 1:01:34
  today? What is your, are you praying?
• 1:01:36
  What is your do you feel supported?
• 1:01:39
  Do you have an outlet like in this moment and for your
• 1:01:42
  grieving? Like do you feel like you have?
• 1:01:45
  How are you? How are you?
• 1:01:47
  Yeah, I've, like I said, I've been off and on with therapy for
• 1:01:52
  years. Which?
• 1:01:52
  Is a beautiful thing. Yeah, I love therapy and I I
• 1:01:56
  don't currently have a therapist.
• 1:01:58
  I'm talking. To you, yeah.
• 1:02:00
  But I, I have amazing friends that have stepped up and, and,
• 1:02:04
  and really been there and being able to, I mean, I meditate just
• 1:02:09
  really getting to know like spirituality is, is huge for me.
• 1:02:14
  And being able to connect with nature really is a huge, huge
• 1:02:21
  part for me Being, I mean, I'll go out and sit in my backyard
• 1:02:25
  and I live kind of out in the country and just sitting there
• 1:02:29
  and just soaking in the sounds of the birds and connecting to,
• 1:02:35
  you know, this really, I really got more connected when my son
• 1:02:40
  passed with being more spiritual and looking for those signs in
• 1:02:45
  nature. And holy cow, they are there.
• 1:02:48
  They are there. And we just, we don't tune into
• 1:02:50
  it because we're so distracted by the noise of life and our
• 1:02:54
  cell phones and, you know, just everything life is heavy.
• 1:02:58
  And we don't, we don't take the time to quiet the noise and
• 1:03:03
  listen to what nature and God is trying to tell us, you know?
• 1:03:07
  Love, love sitting out in the backyard to literally that with
• 1:03:11
  a cup of coffee sitting out there.
• 1:03:12
  I, I, I it's a treasured part of my day whenever I can eat.
• 1:03:16
  No, and it's not like every if I get in a routine where I'm like,
• 1:03:19
  wow, I got it 3 mornings in a row.
• 1:03:21
  It's great. But like, sitting out there,
• 1:03:24
  there's something about the birds.
• 1:03:27
  Yeah. And they've done research that,
• 1:03:29
  like, our nervous systems are programmed to like when birds
• 1:03:33
  were are chirping, that means, like, a predator isn't nearby.
• 1:03:36
  Like, I'm like, oh, that makes sense.
• 1:03:39
  I've gotten rid of all the predators in my life.
• 1:03:41
  Yes, that's. Why the birds are Birds didn't
• 1:03:43
  chirp for a few years there for both of us, did they?
• 1:03:46
  And now? You know what's crazy about
• 1:03:49
  that? Sorry to interrupt.
• 1:03:51
  OK. When I was with my ex recent ex,
• 1:03:55
  we had spiders with spiders around our house.
• 1:03:59
  When he moved out the spiders didn't come.
• 1:04:02
  It was very strange. And I because I, I tune into
• 1:04:05
  nature, I turn into the bucks and the everything.
• 1:04:08
  And. It's and you know what?
• 1:04:09
  He always wanted to have a pest control.
• 1:04:11
  I don't know if he knew something I don't know, but he
• 1:04:15
  the spiders don't come. I mean, I see 1 here and there,
• 1:04:17
  but not like they were before. And it's crazy because I do not
• 1:04:20
  like spiders. No, and I'm AI am a huge
• 1:04:23
  believer in like I it's happened too many times, like even
• 1:04:28
  literally the week after I went on this retreat where I
• 1:04:31
  basically, you know, tried to in my mind, forgive the narcissist
• 1:04:35
  up at this cross and I'm like bawling and you know, everyone's
• 1:04:38
  like, you know, it was one of those where I was like, wow,
• 1:04:41
  I'll never forget this day in my life.
• 1:04:43
  Yes, in the best way. So the next couple days I'm
• 1:04:46
  sitting at my computer right here and I'm looking out the
• 1:04:47
  window and this dove flies down and I'm like, and then it flies
• 1:04:52
  down every day that week. And I'm like, are you?
• 1:04:56
  I'm like, no, I've I never. And then now like now doves are
• 1:05:00
  like part of and I'm like, but there were no doves before and
• 1:05:03
  there was no, I'm like, yeah, OK, yeah, I'm a dove person now.
• 1:05:08
  Everyone's like, I'm like where whereas before I didn't.
• 1:05:10
  I was like, oh, doves are cool. But now I'm like doves are doves
• 1:05:13
  are my thing. Yeah, I've really dived into
• 1:05:16
  like, I mean, I'll be sitting outside and I'll see a a
• 1:05:21
  Hummingbird. I have a Hummingbird friend that
• 1:05:22
  that Outback and and when you really look that stuff up and
• 1:05:26
  spiritual meaning to seeing those things, we're so just
• 1:05:30
  humanity is so disconnected. From nature trying to like,
• 1:05:34
  knock you over. Yeah, yeah.
• 1:05:36
  And I've always been drawn to like Native American indigenous
• 1:05:41
  culture. And that's what they do.
• 1:05:44
  That's that's that's them, that's their culture is they're
• 1:05:47
  so connected to nature. And, you know, maybe not so much
• 1:05:51
  these days, but going back ancient times, like they were
• 1:05:55
  connected to nature. And so when I see a, a bird or a
• 1:05:59
  bug or I look it up like, OK, what's this mean?
• 1:06:01
  You know, and, and the, the part with the eagle with my son is so
• 1:06:09
  my son wore glasses since he was like 3 years old and he had
• 1:06:12
  really bad vision. And now he is able to soar and
• 1:06:16
  he has eagle eye vision. So he's, I just love that, you
• 1:06:20
  know? What?
• 1:06:21
  Yeah. And you know what?
• 1:06:22
  I He is free. He is out of pain.
• 1:06:29
  Yeah, I know life is very painful.
• 1:06:32
  And obviously that's not it's not something you plan for or
• 1:06:36
  want. But when you look at if you're a
• 1:06:39
  believer, which I am, I know that this is not the end.
• 1:06:43
  And like energy and spirit energy cannot be created or
• 1:06:48
  destroyed. It can only be transferred,
• 1:06:50
  right? Like if you look at all the
• 1:06:51
  research and then you get if you, if you, if you don't
• 1:06:55
  believe in God, and then you have these God moments and then
• 1:06:58
  they start, they keep happening again and again.
• 1:07:01
  And then you read the science and then you put it all together
• 1:07:03
  and you go, holy shit, we're going to see them again.
• 1:07:08
  Yep, we. Will we will.
• 1:07:10
  I know we will. And it and then while we're
• 1:07:13
  here, what I'm learning through talking to guests who have gone
• 1:07:16
  through tragedy and my own stuff while we're here, feeling the
• 1:07:21
  pain and the despair. They just talked about Psalms
• 1:07:24
  today in church and like, lamentations of pain.
• 1:07:28
  But then we come together in community to like, feel it and
• 1:07:32
  help bear it while we're down here.
• 1:07:34
  Do you know what I mean, 'cause it's like, all we can do is is
• 1:07:38
  share it and then come together. Because like, where we're going
• 1:07:42
  is gonna be freeing from all of the pain.
• 1:07:44
  Right. It will.
• 1:07:46
  Right. Yeah.
• 1:07:48
  And it's a beautiful image to think about.
• 1:07:52
  And your son too. And I want to make sure we talk
• 1:07:55
  about, you have to tell me your favorite things about him.
• 1:07:59
  We got to fun. Yes, we got to.
• 1:08:00
  We got to give some some core, core fun things about him too.
• 1:08:05
  So he die hard football fan like you said, Philadelphia Eagles
• 1:08:09
  he. Loves football.
• 1:08:11
  Yeah, and he played football. Since he was seven years old,
• 1:08:14
  OK, 10th grade and it's funny. He was so funny.
• 1:08:20
  I mean, he, he, he had jokes, he had jokes.
• 1:08:23
  He, he was so funny and he was one of the most just kind.
• 1:08:29
  He had the kindest heart. That's why So I think he, my
• 1:08:32
  friend says that he, he took the 18 month version of 18 month
• 1:08:36
  course on earth just because he had such a ginormous heart that
• 1:08:42
  he didn't fit in this world. This world is ugly, you know,
• 1:08:45
  and he, he came here to accomplish his mission.
• 1:08:50
  And I believe that that part of it is to help me heal and help
• 1:08:54
  me help me discover, you know, put myself 1st.
• 1:09:02
  And, and it's, I mean, it's, I could go way deeper into it, but
• 1:09:08
  you know, I always put everyone else first and I was depleted,
• 1:09:11
  completely depleted. And, and I, I, the last year
• 1:09:18
  that my son was alive, four months for those months, he
• 1:09:21
  actually stayed with me. He was very sick.
• 1:09:24
  But I know God gave me that that time with.
• 1:09:27
  That time with him? Yeah, yeah, and it but it showed
• 1:09:31
  me during that time, you know, I need to put myself 1st.
• 1:09:34
  And even though my son, you know, he was he was addicted.
• 1:09:38
  He he showed me that I have to put myself first because I'm,
• 1:09:43
  I'm, I'm going to drown. I'm going to drown, you know.
• 1:09:46
  But yeah, he was. He was so protective over his
• 1:09:49
  siblings, you know, he was the oldest and he was such a good
• 1:09:52
  Big Brother, you know, him and my youngest son.
• 1:09:54
  Yeah. Probably share the the tightest
• 1:09:56
  bond. Yeah.
• 1:09:58
  And video games, they love to play video games together when
• 1:10:01
  they were younger and so helpful, he would, he, he would,
• 1:10:05
  he'd give you the shirt off his back.
• 1:10:06
  And that's the thing, you know, that's, that's what's, you know,
• 1:10:08
  a sad part of his story is living on the streets.
• 1:10:11
  He got taken advantage of, I'm sure, so much because he was
• 1:10:14
  such a giving person. And he was very, very trusting,
• 1:10:18
  you know, and in that, in that world, in that life, you can't
• 1:10:22
  trust anybody, right, You know. And so anyhow, he, yeah, he was,
• 1:10:26
  he was just such a sweet boy. Such a sweet boy.
• 1:10:30
  Yeah. Well.
• 1:10:31
  I, I know that you sharing those things about him and it's just
• 1:10:36
  like a reminder too, that like people who have passed, if we,
• 1:10:42
  if we're asking for the signs, if we're looking for the signs
• 1:10:44
  and looking for the connection, they're always there, you know,
• 1:10:48
  but I think it's also beautiful that he's teaching you to pour
• 1:10:51
  into yourself because especially if you're empathic, you'll run
• 1:10:57
  out, you'll just run out. And so it's actually a beautiful
• 1:11:00
  thing because then you can end up loving on more people and
• 1:11:03
  when your strength is back and when you feel you can go do what
• 1:11:07
  you've been doing, which is, but you also need time to cocoon a
• 1:11:11
  bit and right, take care of yourself after this, you know?
• 1:11:16
  Yeah. And I don't know if you know
• 1:11:18
  anything about or, or you've heard of numerology.
• 1:11:24
  So there's, there's a big, I'm kind of, I don't even want to
• 1:11:28
  say new to it, but it's just stumbled upon things.
• 1:11:32
  And I'm like, whoa, whoa, whoa, yeah, you know, there's a lot of
• 1:11:37
  things. 2025 is the year of completion in numerology.
• 1:11:43
  It's #9 and I couldn't take that forward with me.
• 1:11:46
  You know, my son was, it was his time, it was his time.
• 1:11:50
  And it's, it's, it's time for me to move forward, do some more
• 1:11:55
  healing and, and tell my story. And, and, but that part he
• 1:12:00
  couldn't, he couldn't come with me because I would still be
• 1:12:02
  struggling and still trying to save him, you know, So he
• 1:12:08
  definitely, you know, I, I just see how everything worked
• 1:12:11
  together, even though it's absolutely just brutal losing a
• 1:12:15
  child. I also see the beauty in it too.
• 1:12:19
  And I know that there's a community that is around you,
• 1:12:22
  not only, like you said, your friends and the people that love
• 1:12:25
  you, but you're now part of a community.
• 1:12:28
  The, and I mean this wholeheartedly, like I may say
• 1:12:31
  with all seriousness that you're in the adventures university
• 1:12:35
  family community. And I, I'm so like it.
• 1:12:38
  It makes me, it's a family that I am honored and grateful to be
• 1:12:43
  creating of like survivors of people who are not only
• 1:12:47
  surviving, but like want to tell their story because they know
• 1:12:51
  that they've been the one just wanting to hear someone say that
• 1:12:57
  they're not alone. And then and then maybe some
• 1:12:59
  advice on how I can get through this thing that seems
• 1:13:01
  unbearable. And you're showing that every
• 1:13:04
  moment, especially now by coming on this podcast.
• 1:13:07
  I thank you and I know that a lot of people out there are
• 1:13:12
  going to be nodding their head and yeah, thinking about your
• 1:13:16
  story. Yeah, yeah.
• 1:13:18
  Well, I appreciate you, you know, taking your time out of
• 1:13:21
  your day and talking with me and, you know.
• 1:13:25
  And I, we can go on and on. I always, I, I feel like I would
• 1:13:29
  love to just keep in touch and see how your story evolves.
• 1:13:34
  And I know you're going to give back to the community in ways
• 1:13:38
  you probably can't even see yet. You know?
• 1:13:40
  Like, this whole new chapter for you is like gonna be an
• 1:13:44
  incredible rebirth, you know? And I already see, I mean, I, I
• 1:13:49
  manifested this years ago. I, I've, I've talked about I'm
• 1:13:53
  gonna write a book about this someday.
• 1:13:54
  And, and I've already started writing a book.
• 1:13:56
  And I mean, it's in the very beginning stages, but I started
• 1:14:00
  writing and yeah. That's how they all well, how
• 1:14:03
  about this? You need to come back on when
• 1:14:06
  you have something to show me, which could be any part like
• 1:14:10
  like you could, you could come on part way through the journey,
• 1:14:13
  or you can come on when it's published.
• 1:14:15
  You just message me and because again, you're in the family now.
• 1:14:19
  Yeah, well, I think that's great because, you know, even coming
• 1:14:23
  halfway through on me writing a book is encourages others to
• 1:14:26
  start their book, you know? It's a beautiful thing.
• 1:14:30
  Yeah, it's. Beautiful.
• 1:14:32
  Yeah, absolutely. And I and I, I just, I know
• 1:14:35
  that, I know my journey doesn't Start Stop here.
• 1:14:38
  I've got more to tell, more to more to share, more to more to
• 1:14:44
  share, to to help others through this, through what they're going
• 1:14:47
  through. Yeah, absolutely.
• 1:14:51
  Well, I want to thank you Amber so much and I'm going to put,
• 1:14:55
  I'll put your information in the show notes.
• 1:14:58
  And I know that there's going to be a lot of our guests.
• 1:15:01
  We form a community where I start to see that other guests
• 1:15:05
  are following new guests. And then I'm like, I'm going to
• 1:15:08
  do a panel with two of my guests that have now connected.
• 1:15:10
  It's like. I love it.
• 1:15:12
  Yeah, we. All have common experiences.
• 1:15:15
  And so I I can't wait to see how we can collaborate again in the
• 1:15:20
  future just to keep like, building community.
• 1:15:22
  For sure. Absolutely.
• 1:15:24
  I love it. Amazing.
• 1:15:25
  Well, I hear your little dog. He's ready to go out.
• 1:15:28
  Yeah. She's like, please.
• 1:15:32
  Well, thank you, Amber. And we will talk soon.
• 1:15:36
  OK. Sounds good.
• 1:15:36
  Thank you again. Have a good one.
• 1:15:38
  Bye bye.