Latest / Simply Bitcoin / FORGET WALL ST: The Biggest Attack Is Coming From Within!! | EP 1459

Transcript

FORGET WALL ST: The Biggest Attack Is Coming From Within!! | EP 1459 · Simply Bitcoin

• 0:01
  The CEO of the world's largest Bitcoin exchange is currently
• 0:06
  sabotaging Bitcoin on Capitol Hill.
• 0:10
  Well, at least that's what the allegations are.
• 0:12
  And we all know that Coinbase hasn't been a friend of Bitcoin
• 0:16
  for many years now. But what they're being?
• 0:19
  Accused of today. Is potentially the worst offense
• 0:24
  they have ever made especially from a first principles Bitcoin
• 0:29
  is money perspective. If this is true, it is truly not
• 0:35
  a good look for Coinbase. So I'm going to start the saga
• 0:38
  where it initially started, which is from our boy Marty Bent
• 0:42
  from TFTC. And this is the initial tweet.
• 0:47
  It happened basically right when we went live on yesterday's show
• 0:50
  and then all of the backlash. So here's the initial tweet,
• 0:55
  the, you know, Ground Zero for this accusation, for this
• 1:00
  speculation. And here's Marty Bent and he
• 1:03
  goes, I'm hearing that despite all the efforts in lobbying for
• 1:06
  Bitcoin de minimis tax exemption, it's none other than
• 1:09
  Coinbase trying to nuke it behind the scenes to push stable
• 1:13
  coins only. Apparently they are telling
• 1:16
  legislators that quote, no one is using Bitcoin as money.
• 1:20
  A de minimis exemption for Bitcoin is a handout that will
• 1:24
  be DOA. So from our perspective as
• 1:29
  Bitcoiners, you guys heard me say this on the show a lot of
• 1:34
  times that, hey, if Trump really wants to go down as the de facto
• 1:40
  Bitcoin president, then what should happen is the elimination
• 1:45
  of capital gains. If that happened, I think
• 1:47
  Bitcoin adoption would go into OverDrive.
• 1:50
  It would go parabolic because then you could actually use
• 1:53
  Bitcoin and then people would realize, hey, this Bitcoin thing
• 1:56
  is better for payments. Oh, wait, this is better money.
• 1:59
  The elimination of capital gains on Bitcoin from our perspective,
• 2:03
  because we believe Bitcoin is money would be the ultimate game
• 2:07
  changer here because you could use it like you used a dollar.
• 2:12
  You don't have a capital gains tax or rather a capital gains
• 2:15
  loss on the dollar when you use it.
• 2:18
  We want, as the Bankers Association keep saying, as the
• 2:22
  banking lobby has has been saying in regards to the Clarity
• 2:25
  Act, we want the level playing field here.
• 2:28
  So this accusation coming from or Marty bat which I I do have
• 2:33
  some other tweets here from what he said, multiple sources is
• 2:38
  saying it looks like that Coinbase is currently in
• 2:42
  Washington, Washington, DC fighting the idea of Bitcoin is
• 2:45
  money. And remember Coinbase is one of
• 2:48
  the biggest influence in the quote UN quote crypto lobbying
• 2:52
  group. I've been showing you a lot of
• 2:54
  the, you know, the people that are going to these meetings,
• 2:58
  they the exchanges and the individuals behind the lobbying
• 3:02
  groups for crypto. And a lot of them, as I
• 3:05
  mentioned on the show, are a lot of these shit coin exchanges.
• 3:08
  Oh, wait, hold on. OK, I made it past the first few
• 3:10
  minutes. A lot of these shit coin
• 3:12
  exchanges and this. Is why I keep.
• 3:13
  Saying I'm really not that bullish on any favorable
• 3:19
  legislation coming out of Washington, DC because there's
• 3:24
  not enough bitcoiners in those rooms.
• 3:26
  Yes, technically, you know, they're bitcoiners, whatever,
• 3:30
  but they're not the hardcore type.
• 3:32
  I want to see the Piero shards or even Jack Dorsey there like I
• 3:36
  and he is, he put his hat in the ring on this one.
• 3:40
  I want to see real bitcoiners in these rooms because when you're
• 3:43
  crypto shit coin adjacent, you really have alternative motives,
• 3:49
  alternative incentives. And this could be the case.
• 3:52
  And this is where it leads me into Marty's next tweet, which
• 3:56
  really lays out the incentive structure here and why this
• 4:00
  potentially could be the reason for Coinbase actually fighting
• 4:05
  Bitcoin as money and fighting this de minimis tax on Bitcoin.
• 4:10
  And for you guys that don't know it, de minimis tax is basically
• 4:12
  saying, hey, if you use, you know, X amount, if you sell or
• 4:16
  use X amount of Bitcoin, then you don't have have a capital
• 4:19
  gains tax on it. It it's this idea that, hey, if
• 4:22
  we eliminate a little bit of it, a little bit of the tax on
• 4:25
  Bitcoin under a certain threshold, then maybe people
• 4:29
  will be allowed to use, maybe more people will use it.
• 4:32
  And as as much as I believe that we should go further than that,
• 4:36
  maybe I'm an extremist and I'm like, you know, I, I want to see
• 4:39
  it just completely gone. A small win is a small win.
• 4:43
  And maybe we ain't going to get the whole cake here, but we'll
• 4:47
  take a small win. Now it seems like we might not
• 4:50
  even get that small win here. So here is the further tweet
• 4:55
  from Marty Ben or TFTC. And he goes coin base again, is
• 4:58
  quietly lobbying to kill bitcoins de minimis tax
• 5:02
  exemption. The company reportedly told
• 5:04
  legislators, again, no one's using Bitcoin and that a Bitcoin
• 5:07
  de minimis exemption would be DOA.
• 5:09
  Basically, if we came as the Bitcoin lobbying group, as the
• 5:14
  Bitcoin industry and we start talking about the eliminations
• 5:17
  of capital gains, that essentially the legislator would
• 5:21
  throw this out and be like, this is not a a level playing field.
• 5:24
  This is never going to happen. You guys are dreaming.
• 5:26
  You guys are in fantasyland. Get this out of here or else
• 5:29
  nothing else is going to pass. That's the Coinbase kind of
• 5:33
  idea, or at least that is what Marty Bent is saying his sources
• 5:37
  are saying. Meanwhile, they're pushing for
• 5:40
  the exemption to apply the de minimis capital gains tax only
• 5:46
  to stablecoins, specifically regulated dollar peg stablecoins
• 5:50
  like USDC. Now on the surface, a very
• 5:55
  rudimentary surface level elementary look at this idea of
• 6:00
  hey, instead of a de minimis tax on Bitcoin, which I think should
• 6:06
  be further, we should do a de minimis tax on stable coins.
• 6:10
  Now, if you aren't as initiated, if you aren't a true Bitcoiner,
• 6:15
  maybe this makes sense to you. From my view though, and
• 6:19
  probably from your guys's view, if you're thinking about this
• 6:22
  like this, makes absolutely no sense.
• 6:25
  By definition, a stable coin is stable, therefore there is no
• 6:31
  capital gains. What do you mean an elimination
• 6:34
  of a de minimis tax or a elimination of a capital gains
• 6:38
  tax on a stable coin which is pegged to a dollar, which is
• 6:42
  supposed to be stable? Where's the gain?
• 6:44
  It it makes no sense though they're saying it may be, you
• 6:48
  know, elimination of a gains tax on the fees, what have you.
• 6:53
  It's like this is. Ludicrous.
• 6:55
  This is ridiculous. This is insane.
• 6:57
  It's it's. Damn near just playing
• 7:01
  stupidity. Anyways, going further obviously
• 7:04
  again another wrinkle here. USDC, that is the coin base
• 7:09
  stable coin. So it looks like they are trying
• 7:13
  to play games. To protect their Moat.
• 7:16
  So again, going further, Coinbase made $1.35 billion in
• 7:20
  stable coin revenue in 2025, up 48% year over year, almost
• 7:25
  entirely from interest earned on U.S.
• 7:27
  Treasuries held in the USDC reserves.
• 7:30
  Bloomberg estimates that number could search 7 times under the
• 7:33
  Genius Act. And every person who uses the
• 7:36
  USD for payments instead of Bitcoin is a person whose
• 7:39
  dollars are sitting in Coinbase's reserve pool,
• 7:42
  generating risk free yield for Coinbase.
• 7:46
  So again, this is the accusation being lightly.
• 7:51
  This is the speculation as to what the incentive structures
• 7:54
  here are and why it makes sense for Coinbase to say, yeah, you
• 8:00
  know, we actually don't really care about Bitcoin for money.
• 8:03
  We actually want stable coins to be proliferated because they
• 8:07
  make a shit ton of money off the yield from treasuries sitting in
• 8:12
  their USDC reserves. Of course, a de minimis
• 8:15
  exemption for Bitcoin will let people spend it freely for
• 8:18
  everyday purchases, which I mentioned.
• 8:20
  And that makes Bitcoin a direct competitor to USDC and
• 8:25
  stablecoins at large. Remember, the Genius Act
• 8:28
  basically proliferated stablecoins.
• 8:30
  There is this push in Washington for stablecoins first because
• 8:36
  it's it's not as edgy, it's not as far fetched of an idea as
• 8:42
  Bitcoin. It's like, oh, it's a, it's,
• 8:43
  it's digital money, it's a cryptocurrency, but it's pegged
• 8:46
  to the dollar. Therefore we can maintain dollar
• 8:48
  hedge of money, We can maintain dollar strength instead of fully
• 8:52
  embracing this alternative neutral, completely parallel
• 8:56
  system that is Bitcoin. Of course they want you locked
• 9:00
  into their centralized stablecoin ecosystem where they
• 9:04
  clip the yield on every $3 you park there, so.
• 9:07
  Now you're seeing the incentive structure, obviously, as I said
• 9:12
  and, and, and Marty's saying in this tweet.
• 9:16
  A de minimis tax on stable coins.
• 9:18
  Literally just. It makes no sense.
• 9:21
  It's pegged to the. Dollar, it's doesn't fluctuate,
• 9:23
  there is no gains. It's a doll.
• 9:25
  Like $1.00 is 1 stable coin. Like where's the gain here?
• 9:29
  It just, it just makes no sense. Now, of course, there's been a
• 9:32
  lot of conversations about what the de minimis tax.
• 9:35
  Actually should be for. A while there it was a little
• 9:39
  higher in the low thousands and it went to the 800, then it went
• 9:44
  to the 600 and the latest was $300 and I forget what the total
• 9:48
  year was, but it was it was like $1500 a year or something.
• 9:53
  So a de minimis tax on what 5? Transactions of $300.
• 9:57
  It's like it's not really using Bitcoin as money, all right?
• 10:01
  It just, it, I guess a win's a win on on that front.
• 10:05
  I guess it's president for something more.
• 10:07
  But that wouldn't, I don't think that would really move the
• 10:11
  needle. That's basically what I'm
• 10:13
  saying. OK, so here's the accusation.
• 10:16
  Now, I did watch Marty Bent's coverage of this and he didn't
• 10:20
  put it in tweet and he basically said, hey, the only reason I
• 10:26
  tweeted this out. Is because I got multiple
• 10:29
  confirmation from multiple sources that this was in fact
• 10:32
  going on. That behind the scenes in closed
• 10:34
  door meetings this is what Coinbase was doing.
• 10:37
  That they are fighting more for a quote de minimis tax on stable
• 10:42
  coins and really saying that no one uses Bitcoin Bitcoin isn't
• 10:47
  money you know we want without them saying it's like we want
• 10:51
  people parking their money with us because then we make money so
• 10:55
  it does sound like a Moat so that Coinbase could try to
• 10:59
  protect their business model when you.
• 11:02
  Think of it in this terms. You're like, it makes total
• 11:06
  sense for Coinbase to be doing this.
• 11:07
  Not saying I agree with it, but you can see the incentive
• 11:10
  structure, you can see the logic in it.
• 11:13
  Is it bad logic? Is it hurtful?
• 11:14
  For Bitcoin as money, I would say 100%.
• 11:17
  Now, as I said when I did the conversation with Tom Wongo,
• 11:24
  nothing is official until you get an official denial that it's
• 11:28
  an Otto von Bismarck quote. Until you get an official
• 11:32
  denial, then you know you're it's speculations and
• 11:38
  accusations. But we got an official denial,
• 11:42
  which starts to make me think that in fact, this is what's
• 11:47
  going on. And here are the official
• 11:49
  denials we have. Faria Faria Shahzad, who is the
• 11:56
  chief Policy Officer at Coinbase.
• 11:58
  He goes, this is a total lie. Marty Bent.
• 12:01
  We have never and will never lobby against Bitcoin.
• 12:06
  Ever. Excuse me.
• 12:09
  So first official denial quote tweets it.
• 12:13
  We aren't doing this. This is miss.
• 12:16
  This is misinformation, fake news.
• 12:19
  Then we got another one. We got Cara Calvert who also
• 12:23
  works at Coinbase and she goes TFTC is 100% false.
• 12:29
  Reporting. We strongly support both Senator
• 12:32
  Lummess's bill and the work in the House to create a de minimis
• 12:34
  exemption for all digital assets.
• 12:38
  OK, so second denial. And then we got an official
• 12:42
  denial coming from Brian Armstrong himself.
• 12:45
  And he goes, not sure where you're getting this
• 12:47
  misinformation quote, perhaps you can share, but it's totally
• 12:51
  false. I spent a bunch of time lobbying
• 12:53
  for Bitcoin de minimis tax exemption, and we'll continue
• 12:56
  doing so. It's obviously the right thing.
• 13:00
  So maybe they got caught with their pants down and now they're
• 13:04
  going to roll it back. And then this is where the
• 13:06
  conversation further spread into other corners and we got even
• 13:10
  and more confirmation from other people in the Bitcoin space that
• 13:14
  are also have some Privy to these conversations.
• 13:18
  Now here's the Marty Bent treat where he says I have sources
• 13:20
  that say otherwise, not you personally, but your team and or
• 13:24
  lobbyists are the ones that are lobbying against a de minimis
• 13:27
  tax on Bitcoin. Will you commit to walk away
• 13:30
  from the market structure bill if it doesn't include the de
• 13:32
  minimis exemption for Bitcoin like you did for stablecoin
• 13:36
  yield? So Marty, put them in a corner,
• 13:39
  put them, you know, put them in a chokehold here publicly.
• 13:42
  And ever since then, radio silence from the Coinbase team.
• 13:46
  Of course, this all played out last night.
• 13:48
  Scrolling through Twitter, scrolling through different
• 13:51
  responses. No response yet, which really
• 13:54
  leads into the idea of yeah. Maybe maybe it's true and and
• 14:02
  Parker Lewis says the same thing you know Coinbase's CEO, chief
• 14:06
  policy officer and VP of U.S. policy all came out and claimed
• 14:09
  a combination that this report was misinformation, totally
• 14:12
  false, a total lie and categorically false.
• 14:16
  Problem is it's. True.
• 14:18
  When TFTC, when Marty Bent stood by its reporting, they all went
• 14:22
  radio silent. That's where we currently are
• 14:27
  from the initial accusation to the Coinbase responses.
• 14:31
  But to add a little more fuel to this fire, we did get some other
• 14:35
  confirmations from people, like I said, that are actively
• 14:40
  lobbying for Bitcoin on Capitol Hill in Washington.
• 14:43
  DC, particularly the first one is from our boy Connor Brown who
• 14:49
  works now currently at the Bitcoin Policy Institute and he
• 14:52
  goes in response to Cara. He goes.
• 14:55
  Barry, thank you. Thankful to hear that, Cara.
• 14:56
  Of course, here is, you know she's saying the same thing.
• 15:00
  Categorically false. Don't take the bait.
• 15:02
  We are definitely not lobbying against Bitcoin.
• 15:05
  Coinbase has been advocating for diminished exception.
• 15:08
  For all digital assets in 2017, in fact, I was on the ground in
• 15:14
  DC pushing for that bill. And a decade later, I'm still on
• 15:17
  the ground lobbying for strong de minimis exemptions for all
• 15:20
  digital assets. As for stablecoins, frankly we
• 15:22
  shouldn't need a de minimis exemption.
• 15:24
  Stablecoins so they they agree we're.
• 15:26
  We're finally in some agreement. So Connor Brown again, very
• 15:29
  thankful to hear that. Will Coinbase join Bitcoin
• 15:31
  Policy in hosting a public roundtable with lawmakers this
• 15:34
  month to erase any confusion on this issue and make clear how
• 15:38
  important a Bitcoin de minimis tax is for the future payments
• 15:41
  infrastructure in America? But that's not where Connor
• 15:45
  stopped. He goes, of course, in response
• 15:49
  to this tweet by Marty. This is extremely concerning if
• 15:53
  true. I can confirm that over the past
• 15:56
  three months, there's been a strong shift on the hill to
• 15:58
  limiting the de minimis exemption to stable coins only.
• 16:02
  So he's in the meetings, He's hearing that idea.
• 16:05
  That's why he's putting his hat in the rink.
• 16:08
  Of course, Bitcoin Policy Institute, they'll continue to
• 16:11
  fight for Bitcoin. And then we got a couple more
• 16:15
  responses. This one is from Frank Korba,
• 16:18
  which if you guys remember was previously at Bitcoin Magazine.
• 16:22
  He was the one that was in the White House in with the, you
• 16:26
  know, official press pass in the White House for Bitcoiners.
• 16:30
  And Frank Korbigos my sources on this matter have also told me
• 16:34
  that one of the items in the Clarity Act that may be on the
• 16:36
  chopping block in exchange for Coinbase slash crypto industry
• 16:39
  getting interest on stable coins are the BRCA protections for
• 16:43
  developers, which was in the. Clarity act this, you know,
• 16:48
  bullet point saying that. We should protect open source
• 16:52
  developers. So now we're getting multiple
• 16:55
  confirmations that hey, OK, maybe they aren't necessarily
• 16:59
  fighting against a de minimis. Tax on Bitcoin, but they are
• 17:05
  willing to compromise on things that aren't that favorable for
• 17:08
  the Bitcoin industry at large in favor of them being allowed to
• 17:14
  get some stable coin yield. And remember the numbers they're
• 17:17
  making billions of dollars off dollars parked in their USDC
• 17:21
  stablecoin. Now remember when we were
• 17:25
  talking about the genius act a while ago how we were mentioning
• 17:29
  that of course the first thing they pushed through was the
• 17:32
  stablecoin yields or rather sorry, the stablecoin
• 17:35
  proliferation. Now you're starting to see why
• 17:39
  these crypto exchanges are so hell bent on stablecoins going
• 17:45
  in first is because they make a lot of money used on on
• 17:49
  stablecoin yields. That's why the clarity act has
• 17:53
  been held up is because of the quote stablecoin rewards, which
• 17:56
  is basically just yields not just from the company that
• 18:01
  issues the stablecoin, but so that the consumers can get some
• 18:04
  gains. So I don't know who you want to
• 18:09
  believe on this matter, but personally I've been saying for
• 18:14
  a while I'm not a big fan of Coinbase.
• 18:15
  It might be just because of my 2018 bear market roots where we
• 18:20
  all went Bitcoin only we all took an ideological stance and
• 18:24
  we realized like Coinbase is probably hurting Bitcoin more
• 18:28
  than benefiting it because of their shit coin casino.
• 18:31
  You just see the incentive structures are all off now.
• 18:35
  Like I said, Jack Dorsey did throw his hat in the rink here.
• 18:39
  Where is the Jack Dorsey tweet? Is it right here?
• 18:43
  Here we go. So again, Jack Dorsey, who of
• 18:47
  course has cash app, has bit key has has the block, you know,
• 18:53
  allowed Bitcoin payments on Square app recently.
• 18:57
  He is actively on the front lines and has been saying for a
• 19:00
  long time that Bitcoin needs to be used as money.
• 19:03
  Here his is his take and response.
• 19:05
  Hope this is true for de minimis as well.
• 19:07
  Brian Armstrong saying that they're not lobbying against
• 19:10
  Bitcoin. Obviously, hopefully they're not
• 19:12
  lobbying against the de minimis tax on Bitcoin.
• 19:15
  And did I bring up my buddy? Oh no, I didn't bring up
• 19:18
  Fernando's take, but you can see the dichotomy here.
• 19:23
  Coinbase, one of the largest exchanges in the world.
• 19:28
  Their incentive, their business structure is built on them
• 19:33
  profiting off of shit coin stable coin yields.
• 19:38
  They begrudgingly have Bitcoin on their platform.
• 19:41
  They were huge in advocating for Bitcoin cash during the fork
• 19:45
  wars. They haven't really been a
• 19:48
  friend to Bitcoin for a long time.
• 19:50
  Yes, when it's favorable for them, they will come out and
• 19:53
  say, oh, bitcoins great. At the very next sentence,
• 19:56
  they're talking about crypto. It's because they don't make
• 19:59
  money off Bitcoin. They make all of their money off
• 20:01
  selling shit coins and trash to their customers.
• 20:05
  They make all their money off the yields of USDC.
• 20:08
  And so here is the stark contrast.
• 20:10
  You're seeing Jack Dorsey, love him or hate him.
• 20:14
  I think he's really been doing a lot of good work for Bitcoin in
• 20:18
  the recent years. He has devoted his life to
• 20:20
  Bitcoin and and shouts out to Dante, he swears Jack Dorsey is
• 20:24
  is Satoshi I. I don't know about all that.
• 20:27
  But you can see the stark contrast.
• 20:28
  On the one hand, we're hearing rumors and speculations and
• 20:32
  accusations that Bryan Armstrong, CEO Coinbase, doesn't
• 20:38
  see Bitcoin as money. On the other hand, we have Jack
• 20:41
  Dorsey, whose whole Northstar is Bitcoin as money.
• 20:46
  Everything he's been doing in the recent years is advocating
• 20:50
  for Bitcoin being used as money. Obviously, Jack Dorsey isn't in
• 20:55
  the White House. He isn't a part of the lobbying
• 20:57
  groups. He's just building the products
• 20:59
  on the ground for customers, to protect customers, to
• 21:02
  incentivize people, or rather, building the infrastructure so
• 21:05
  that people can use Bitcoin as money every single day.
• 21:10
  We're starting to see in Bitcoin we're in like a multi front war
• 21:14
  here. There's the Wall Street attack
• 21:17
  on Bitcoin, where they're incentivizing you to give up
• 21:22
  your keys, take your Bitcoin into these Wall Street products,
• 21:27
  trying to acquire as much Bitcoin as possible,
• 21:29
  potentially, again, speculatively crashing the
• 21:33
  Bitcoin price so that they can scoop up Bitcoin on the cheap.
• 21:36
  And now we're seeing that maybe one of our own, maybe an insider
• 21:40
  from the crypto industry in quotes, is not doing what's in
• 21:47
  in our best favor of Bitcoin being used as money.
• 21:55
  Again, they've denied this allegation, but nothing is more
• 22:00
  official than an official denial.
• 22:03
  And maybe it's because I wouldn't be here without Marty
• 22:07
  Bent that I I tend to think that Marty isn't just talking hot air
• 22:13
  here. I think as he said, if you watch
• 22:16
  his video covering this story, he said, look, the only reason I
• 22:21
  felt comfortable tweeting this is because I got multiple
• 22:24
  confirmation from multiple sources that in fact, behind
• 22:27
  closed doors, that is what's happening.
• 22:30
  Now we're seeing from, you know, the CEO, the CPO, the policy
• 22:35
  officer, that they're officially denying this, that maybe, maybe
• 22:39
  it's not them that are doing it, but someone close to Coinbase is
• 22:44
  actively fighting Bitcoin as money.
• 22:47
  Now maybe they're just straight up bold faced, lying to all of
• 22:50
  us because they got caught again, like I said, with their
• 22:53
  hand in the cookie jar. But this is not a good luck for
• 22:59
  Coinbase, obviously for the Bitcoin industry.
• 23:03
  Now, I was talking with a friend earlier and he reminded me of
• 23:08
  when there was the meaning of the whole Bitcoin crypto
• 23:12
  industry in the White House, that anytime Brian Armstrong was
• 23:17
  talking towards Donald Trump, there was a very interesting
• 23:21
  moment there. He raised his hand and he said
• 23:23
  something to Trump or Trump basically asked, oh, I'm so
• 23:26
  happy for everyone to be here. This is historic.
• 23:28
  I forget what the name was when they all had that, like it
• 23:32
  wasn't a round table, but they had the dinner table.
• 23:34
  They did the press press release where it's like, oh, look, we
• 23:39
  did the executive order, Bitcoin strategic reserve.
• 23:41
  Look at all of us with all these industry people.
• 23:45
  And there was a certain moment where Brian Armstrong raised his
• 23:49
  hand because Trump was like, hey, does anyone want to talk?
• 23:53
  Say a question. And Brian Armstrong raised his
• 23:55
  hand, and you could physically see that Trump just completely
• 23:59
  ignored him. So why am I bringing that up?
• 24:03
  Because you could say that if that is the case.
• 24:08
  Especially considering that the Trump children are all in on
• 24:11
  Bitcoin. They very publicly said Bitcoin
• 24:14
  is money. They love this thing.
• 24:16
  Now, you could say there's political games being played,
• 24:19
  but they're fully invested in Bitcoin.
• 24:22
  I think they want to see it do well.
• 24:24
  They think it's going to $1,000,000.
• 24:28
  Maybe you could say there's a chance that they don't really
• 24:32
  like Brian Armstrong on Capitol Hill.
• 24:34
  Maybe it's just Congress that takes what Brian Armstrong is
• 24:38
  saying seriously. And maybe when this stuff
• 24:41
  happens or really comes to A to a point that whatever Brian
• 24:45
  Armstrong does, they really ignore it.
• 24:48
  But if he's part of the lobbying group, again, you got to
• 24:51
  remember, personnel is policy. So if Brian Armstrong is able to
• 24:55
  get to the personnel, they're the ones that are making the
• 24:58
  policy. And I know a lot of people don't
• 25:01
  think Trump necessarily reads everything, so some things could
• 25:04
  slip through. But when I was reminded of this,
• 25:08
  it's like, OK, maybe Brian Armstrong isn't as like doesn't
• 25:12
  have as much influence as all of us would like to say.
• 25:16
  So maybe there's some hope that they're trying to save some
• 25:19
  face. So if we, if we come back maybe
• 25:22
  next week or maybe over the weekend and we see that Brian
• 25:26
  Armstrong is totally willing to sit down with the Bitcoin Policy
• 25:29
  Institute, totally do a, a public roundtable with
• 25:34
  politicians and stand on the ground of yes, we want a de
• 25:38
  minimis tax on Bitcoin. Personally, I want to see more.
• 25:42
  I want to see just complete end of capital gains on not just
• 25:46
  Bitcoin. Personally, I, I stand with
• 25:49
  maybe the hard, more hardcore people, like just let's
• 25:52
  eliminate a period because that's a tax on saving, That's a
• 25:54
  tax on the productive people, the smart people making the
• 25:57
  smart choices. But I guess again, a win is a
• 26:00
  win, a small win is a win. And we got to set some precedent
• 26:04
  here. But man, looking at this,
• 26:08
  knowing Coinbase's history in Bitcoin, I think they got caught
• 26:14
  with their hand in the cookie jar and now they're trying to
• 26:16
  save face because they know how bad this actually is.
• 26:20
  What's the saying? You know, what you do in private
• 26:23
  will be made public. Maybe they thought they could
• 26:25
  get away with this in private and they never thought it was
• 26:28
  going to be public news, a public news story for everyone
• 26:31
  because maybe there's some form of Ndas or whatever they
• 26:34
  thought. There's no phones recording
• 26:36
  these conversations. They could say whatever they
• 26:37
  want. They're playing the Wall Street
• 26:40
  games of we want to maintain our regulatory melt.
• 26:44
  They want to maintain their business.
• 26:48
  They might have just got caught, is all I'm saying.
• 26:51
  Again, this is still part of the rumor mill.
• 26:54
  This is speculation. These are accusations.
• 26:58
  But we have three people that have been in these conversations
• 27:03
  on Capitol Hill saying I have multiple sources, each of them
• 27:07
  saying that this is in fact going on.
• 27:09
  Whether it's attacking de minimis tax on Bitcoin, whether
• 27:13
  it's attacking the caveat, the policy of protecting open source
• 27:18
  developers coming from Coinbase. They are not good actors in the
• 27:26
  space. At this point, if you're still
• 27:29
  using Coinbase, I can really say maybe only one of two reasons.
• 27:34
  One, you're just lazy. And two, you really just don't
• 27:36
  know what's going on. For better or worse, Coinbase
• 27:39
  does have the mindshare. They do have the, the PR that if
• 27:46
  you want to buy Bitcoin, you go to Coinbase.
• 27:48
  You know, they've been doing the Backstreet Boys commercials and
• 27:51
  you know, they're, they're getting the billboards on Wall
• 27:54
  Street. Well, you know, they got enough
• 27:56
  money to do the marketing aspects.
• 27:58
  So for a lot of people, there's still a connection between
• 28:01
  Bitcoin and crypto and Coinbase. And if you want to get Bitcoin,
• 28:03
  you go to Coinbase. At this point, no one should be
• 28:07
  recommending Coinbase. No one should be using Coinbase.
• 28:11
  If you really want to, if you really want to vote with your
• 28:14
  dollars, then the only thing these people will learn, whether
• 28:19
  it's a politician, whether it's the crypto exchanges, whether
• 28:22
  it's quote UN quote, some of the Bitcoin Ogs, you got to hit them
• 28:25
  where it hurts. And that is their pocketbook.
• 28:30
  So look, I tend to believe, Marty, I think this is probably
• 28:37
  more truthful than not. It's not a good look for
• 28:41
  Coinbase. We'll see what happens moving
• 28:45
  forward. Again, this is accusations,
• 28:48
  rumor mills going wild right now.
• 28:50
  It is slow news story right now. There's a slow news cycle.
• 28:54
  We're in the depths of the bear market.
• 28:56
  We don't know how bad things are going to get yet.
• 28:59
  Everyone's demoralized. People want something to talk
• 29:02
  about. I'll be a little lenient.
• 29:05
  That could be the case, but I don't think that's exactly
• 29:08
  what's going on. I think they got caught anyways,
• 29:14
  moving forward. Oh wait, actually, you know, I
• 29:17
  know you guys love memes, so let me put up a good meme here and I
• 29:24
  don't know who this guy is. Vexel, all right, hardcore
• 29:28
  bitcoiner. And he goes, if your Bitcoin is
• 29:30
  with these Bros, it's not your Bitcoin and it's a picture of
• 29:34
  Larry Fink and Brian Armstrong. So that's my take here.
• 29:40
  If you're buying the Black Rock ETF, if you're buying Bitcoin
• 29:44
  from Coinbase and you're leaving it on Coinbase, that is not your
• 29:48
  Bitcoin. You are sleeping with the enemy.
• 29:52
  OK, not even a spicy take. It's not even a spicy take at
• 29:56
  all. But hey, you know, you do what
• 29:59
  you want with your money as far as I'm concerned, but there's no
• 30:03
  one to blame if something goes horribly wrong but yourself.
• 30:09
  Don't buy the IBIT BlackRock ETF and if you have Bitcoin on
• 30:13
  Coinbase, get it off today or rather get it off this weekend.
• 30:19
  That's that's the take away here.
• 30:21
  All right, guys, so moving forward, there are some
• 30:25
  interesting conversations happening.
• 30:28
  One clip from CNBC, which is really leaning into what I've
• 30:34
  been saying about Bitcoin in regards to what has currently
• 30:38
  happened in the Middle East and how resilient has been.
• 30:41
  It might be showing us something of where we currently are in the
• 30:45
  story of Bitcoin, or rather what investors and people outside of
• 30:48
  Bitcoin are starting to maybe see and realize Bitcoin could be
• 30:55
  an alternative asset and alternative investment and
• 30:58
  further in alternative money. Now again, I mind reading, but
• 31:04
  I'm going to make the case that we are sort of seeing that
• 31:07
  happen in real time. And then going further, we got a
• 31:10
  huge, huge announcement coming out of the CFTC and SEC last
• 31:14
  night as well. And then I believe Mateo from
• 31:19
  Club Orange is coming on today, at least that's what my schedule
• 31:22
  says. So he should be here in a couple
• 31:24
  of minutes. On that note, let me hit the
• 31:26
  first commercial and we'll be right back.
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  se-ed.com store. Alrighty then guys, we are back
• 33:43
  and the current Bitcoin price is 70,270.
• 33:47
  We did get to a 69K low. I think the day's still on green
• 33:53
  if it's we're in the 70K. So hey, there's some life back
• 33:56
  in Bitcoin. Anyways, a 44.3% discount from
• 34:00
  all time high and the market cap, we are still above $1.4
• 34:05
  trillion, currently 1.41 and the block height is 940,417.
• 34:12
  OK, guys, like I said, I'm going to be making the case as I've
• 34:17
  been kind of making the last couple of days that what we're
• 34:21
  seeing currently in the Bitcoin price action considering what's
• 34:25
  going on globally, I think it's very resilient, it's very
• 34:28
  strong. And I don't know, I don't want
• 34:31
  to say this guy's watching, you know, simply Bitcoin, but I
• 34:36
  haven't heard a lot of people say this kind of theme, this
• 34:40
  kind of perspective. Actually I've seen a couple
• 34:42
  tweets, I brought them up obviously, but we might be
• 34:47
  seeing the tide shift around the perspective of Bitcoin.
• 34:53
  I know a lot of people still view Bitcoin as a risk on asset.
• 34:57
  We obviously believe otherwise. It's a risk off asset.
• 35:01
  Yes, it's been trading very closely to some equities, but in
• 35:06
  reality I think that's only in the short term.
• 35:09
  And this clip on CNBC is saying a lot of the same things.
• 35:14
  And when I was looking at this this morning and I was kind of
• 35:18
  thinking about a little bit, I think when you connect what
• 35:22
  we're seeing with stocks, with gold, with Bitcoin, I think
• 35:29
  there is a story to be told. So let me play the clip 1st and
• 35:33
  then I'll make the case for what I potentially think is going on.
• 35:39
  Look, military conflicts. We know the drill.
• 35:42
  It's oil's going to go back down and equities are going to go
• 35:46
  back up. That's what's going to happen.
• 35:48
  But number one, it's just sometimes hard to stay in your
• 35:51
  seat. And #2 mitigating volatility in
• 35:54
  a portfolio means a lot because you can get 8% a year with low
• 35:58
  volatility. Actually, you'll compound to
• 36:00
  more than 10% with lots of volatility.
• 36:03
  So having diversified assets means a lot.
• 36:06
  And so far in this conflict, actually, if you look at
• 36:09
  Bitcoin, it's up a little bit and equities are down.
• 36:13
  So the diversifying piece, I think, still stays intact as an
• 36:17
  important theme here. And that's what I think is
• 36:20
  important to focus on. So many folks have concluded
• 36:23
  that cryptocurrencies, Bitcoin, Ether, Solana, XRP, that they're
• 36:28
  just risk assets. But if you really run the
• 36:30
  numbers, you can see that not only do they have de minimis
• 36:34
  correlation with equities, but they also have extremely low
• 36:38
  correlation with gold and silver as an example.
• 36:42
  So I think the diversification story really holds in in this
• 36:45
  current environment. Now let's ignore the whole shit
• 36:48
  coin part. Obviously that's trash.
• 36:52
  This this guy is pro from pro shares, which has various ETFs.
• 36:57
  So I, I don't endorse that those shit coin aspect of this.
• 37:02
  But anyways, if you're looking at equities right now,
• 37:05
  specifically the S&P 500, NASDAQ, they've been on the
• 37:09
  decline for pretty much since the start of the year there.
• 37:13
  There's obviously been some volatility.
• 37:14
  It's not like a crazy decline. I believe I did the the charts
• 37:18
  this morning and it's roughly around like 5% on NASDAQ and the
• 37:24
  S&P 500. And then the Dow is down about
• 37:28
  7:00-ish percent. But we're seeing that, yes, gold
• 37:34
  and silver are down from their all time high.
• 37:37
  But if you're looking the trend of what equities are doing,
• 37:40
  specifically those indexes that I mentioned, they've kind of
• 37:44
  been, you know, a little toppy. They're rolling down and kind of
• 37:47
  trending downwards. But gold and arguably silver
• 37:52
  being in the conversation of precious metals and hard money,
• 37:55
  they've corrected, but they've been slowly grinding upwards.
• 38:00
  And that is the same kind of price action we've seen from
• 38:04
  Bitcoin. And so when you connect the idea
• 38:07
  of gold as our Big Brother in the hard money game and of
• 38:12
  course Bitcoin as in my opinion the pristine hard money, are we
• 38:18
  seeing? This may be realization as this
• 38:24
  clip was saying, that you probably want something that
• 38:28
  isn't correlated with the traditional financial system.
• 38:30
  You might want a neutral money, you might want something that is
• 38:34
  completely not dependent on the Fiat system.
• 38:38
  And if we continue to see gold and Bitcoin and I, I guess
• 38:42
  arguably as well silver continue to grind upwards, why we see
• 38:46
  equities go downwards. I'm not saying we're seeing a
• 38:49
  repricing and people selling their equities to get into
• 38:52
  Bitcoin, but we are seeing the greater conversation of people
• 38:56
  realizing that there needs to be a hard money alternative into
• 39:01
  your portfolios, into your investments.
• 39:03
  Now obviously, I don't think Bitcoin is an investment.
• 39:06
  I think it's the best money period.
• 39:08
  But are we starting to slowly see a trend of people waking up
• 39:12
  to the importance of hard money? That's kind of what I'm saying,
• 39:16
  especially in the face of a new global war or we're not in a
• 39:22
  war. It's an operation.
• 39:23
  It's a conflict. Though Pete Hegseth did say it
• 39:27
  was a war. Like there, there's no consensus
• 39:30
  on what is going on in the Middle East.
• 39:32
  Again, like is it a war or is it not a war?
• 39:35
  No one really knows. We're getting conflictive
• 39:37
  narratives on what is actually going on.
• 39:40
  I actually hit another tab. I don't know if you saw this
• 39:42
  last night, but Trump went out there and said we are had
• 39:48
  already won the war in the first hour.
• 39:51
  And then you're like, yeah, but like, we're two weeks in.
• 39:54
  So what have we been doing for two weeks if we've already run
• 39:56
  won the war? Now this morning he's like,
• 39:59
  yeah, we probably might be there for like another month.
• 40:02
  You're like, what? Like what the hell is going on?
• 40:06
  And then you see what's going on with energy.
• 40:08
  We did see a lot of Western nations announce that they were
• 40:12
  going to release some of their strategic oil reserves.
• 40:16
  Though it is a pale in the bucket compared to what happens
• 40:21
  if we see a prolonged close of the Strait of Hormuz.
• 40:27
  If this continues, if we do continue to see energy prices go
• 40:33
  higher, a shortage in oil, this, this could really cause a lot of
• 40:40
  damage that we, we, we could really be in a very bad place
• 40:45
  right now. And This is why I think we're
• 40:47
  potentially seeing that people are starting to wake up to this
• 40:51
  idea of like, I need some hard money.
• 40:52
  I need something completely outside of the system.
• 40:55
  I need a store of value. Now is it one of these things
• 41:00
  where it goes to gold and silver 1st and eventually Bitcoin?
• 41:03
  But again, I was really surprised last week when on
• 41:08
  Monday the markets open after the attack in Iran that Bitcoin
• 41:13
  didn't absolutely dump. I'm starting to get a little
• 41:16
  bullish that maybe bitcoins holding up very well.
• 41:19
  Maybe we're going to see a breakout very soon.
• 41:21
  Again, trolling because I'm not the biggest TA guy, but I've I'm
• 41:26
  a Wick off maxi right now. I I want to believe, I think
• 41:30
  it's, I think it's hanging on. I I think that's what's what's
• 41:33
  happening right now. OK, anyways guys, another
• 41:37
  commercial break and I do see Mateo is in the background.
• 41:40
  Mateo is in the building, so I will bring him in after this
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• 44:20
  Back. I'm going to I'm going to
• 44:21
  quickly cover this. Oh, OK, but Mateo is back.
• 44:24
  Mateo, I I saw you turned your camera off, so I'm like, OK, let
• 44:27
  me let me quickly cover this. But how you doing bro?
• 44:29
  How? How?
• 44:30
  Life been. What's up?
• 44:32
  Bro. Yeah, Yeah, man, it, it's been a
• 44:35
  minute here. Let me let me quickly cover this
• 44:37
  and then wait. We'll just start chatting.
• 44:40
  So guys, big news again. It is a lot of rhetoric, but the
• 44:47
  implication here is seemingly very favorable for the Bitcoin
• 44:52
  industry at large, at least the idea.
• 44:55
  We'll see what actually comes out of this, but this is an
• 44:58
  announcement. So we have Michael Selig, of
• 45:00
  course. He is the chairman of the CFTC,
• 45:03
  and he goes. The days of turf battles between
• 45:05
  the CFTC and the SEC are over. SEC Paul Atkins and I are
• 45:09
  working together. And today's memorandum of
• 45:11
  understanding solidifies our efforts to achieve our mutual
• 45:15
  goals of harmonization. Of course.
• 45:17
  Read more. Here's the official press
• 45:19
  release. I'm not going to read the whole
• 45:20
  thing. I'll read the intro and then
• 45:22
  I'll read the specific point about, you know, digital assets
• 45:25
  or cryptos. And he goes.
• 45:27
  The Commodities Future Trading Commission and the SEC today
• 45:30
  announced that they have entered into a Memorandum of
• 45:33
  understanding to guide coordination and collaboration
• 45:36
  between the two agents to support lawful innovation,
• 45:39
  uphold market integrity, and ensure investors and customers
• 45:42
  protection. The MOU reflects both agencies
• 45:46
  commitment to provide fair notice to market participants,
• 45:49
  respect individual liberty and foster lawful innovation with
• 45:52
  the minimum effective dose of regulation to enhance US
• 45:56
  competitiveness in finance. So hey, look again rhetoric,
• 46:00
  it's a press release, but seemingly a good thing.
• 46:05
  And I'll, I'll probably explain that a little bit.
• 46:07
  But anyways, here is what they support and it goes.
• 46:11
  The initiative will support coordination across the policy
• 46:13
  making, examination and enforcement functions of each
• 46:16
  agency, particularly for joint applications and shared policy
• 46:20
  efforts, including providing a fit for purpose regulatory
• 46:24
  framework for crypto assets and other emerging technologies.
• 46:27
  All these other ones you could say don't necessarily relate to
• 46:32
  Bitcoin. But the idea here is one of the
• 46:36
  things I've been saying on the show for a minute that in the
• 46:41
  past we've seen from the SEC and the CFTC that they would
• 46:46
  basically have two different definitions for what Bitcoin and
• 46:51
  quote, you know, cryptos are at large.
• 46:54
  And this announcement, it seems like we're going to get a
• 46:58
  definitive perspective of what Bitcoin is.
• 47:02
  Hopefully they go the, you know, CFTC route where Bitcoin is a
• 47:06
  digital commodity and preferably everything else is a security.
• 47:11
  That might be too much to ask, but for the for the longest time
• 47:15
  the SEC has has really treated Bitcoin or crypto assets as
• 47:19
  securities. Now hopefully if we do get some
• 47:23
  some good harmonization here, if we do get a overarching view of
• 47:28
  what Bitcoin is, this does bring in the idea of regulatory
• 47:32
  clarity. Preferably, like I said, they
• 47:34
  treat Bitcoin as a commodity. Preferably it'd get to Bitcoin
• 47:38
  as a money. But again, I, I think I might be
• 47:41
  asking a little too much here. I, I always seem to be on the
• 47:44
  extreme side of everything going on here, but maybe a small win
• 47:48
  is a win. I, I guess that's my short term
• 47:50
  pain for long term gain here. I'm repeating A win is a win, a
• 47:54
  small win is a win. So that's the big announcement.
• 47:57
  Again, it's an announcement. We'll see what actually gets
• 48:01
  pushed through or rather what they actually conclude.
• 48:04
  But this is this is some big news in regards to how we're
• 48:07
  going to see these agencies treat Bitcoin.
• 48:11
  We'll cover it when it officially launches, but in the
• 48:14
  meantime, at least we're aware of what's going on.
• 48:17
  Anyways, Mateo, we could, we could pivot from here.
• 48:20
  I just wanted to get that through, but man, or actually,
• 48:24
  do you want to hit on this? Do you, do you, do you have
• 48:26
  thoughts on this or, or we could just keep keep the conversation
• 48:29
  going somewhere else? So I have thought on the SEC.
• 48:34
  Well, I mean, it's my favorite institution in the world, so.
• 48:38
  I. Surely don't.
• 48:40
  No, man, I don't really. I'm not too worried about what
• 48:44
  the government thinks Bitcoin is, to be honest with you.
• 48:48
  It's at the end of the day, it's, you know, Bitcoin is what
• 48:50
  Bitcoiners think it shouldn't be.
• 48:54
  So I think it, it'd be easier, I guess for people that are
• 48:58
  knowing to be coined if the SEC says, oh, it's money or it's
• 49:02
  commodity. But personally, I'm not too
• 49:05
  worried about it to be honest with you.
• 49:07
  Yeah, I love that I I have. Definitely been on that train
• 49:14
  for a while. I think, you know, Niko, Niko is
• 49:17
  super big on on the politics stuff.
• 49:19
  And you know, I was listening to to bad advice.
• 49:22
  No, no, I'm trying like. Niko Niko is good advice.
• 49:26
  And so I, I definitely got caught up in, in the, the
• 49:29
  politics angle of Bitcoin and I definitely had to step back for
• 49:32
  a little bit and be like, what, what, what am I here for?
• 49:34
  I'm like, I'm here for Bitcoin. It's money.
• 49:38
  Maybe I'm I'm a hardcore bitcoiner.
• 49:40
  I know there's far and few of us still left here because everyone
• 49:43
  became a suit corner. Everyone started shilling the
• 49:47
  Bitcoin treasury companies and they made a bag all our friends
• 49:50
  that did it. They made some money and we were
• 49:52
  sitting here like damn, we should have been shilling them.
• 49:55
  What are we doing just telling people to buy Bitcoin and take
• 49:57
  it to self custody. Good thing we didn't though
• 50:00
  'cause it seems like the reputations maybe took a hit on
• 50:03
  that. But I agree, I think if I think
• 50:06
  if we get a point where people use Bitcoin, everything will
• 50:11
  kind of figure itself out. It's almost like what we saw, of
• 50:14
  course, with the Internet, I know it's a it's a trope at this
• 50:17
  point, but we saw in the past with new emerging technologies,
• 50:21
  they do try to regulate it. And then at a certain point,
• 50:23
  once everyone uses it, they realize they can't actually
• 50:26
  regulate this thing. So hopefully we get to that
• 50:29
  point. Hopefully enough people use
• 50:31
  Bitcoin. I, I guess that's the big hope.
• 50:33
  Actually, Matteo, I wanna, I wanna ask you this because I
• 50:36
  know you are a hardcore Bitcoiner.
• 50:39
  You're a hardcore Bitcoin is money person.
• 50:42
  And one of the fears that I've had in recent years is the fact
• 50:47
  that we aren't seeing people use Bitcoin or even caring about
• 50:51
  Bitcoin. And I'm like, I think the only
• 50:53
  failure that Bitcoin could have at this point, I don't think the
• 50:56
  network will necessarily die. It's just that people don't care
• 51:01
  about Bitcoin. So what's, what's your thoughts
• 51:02
  on this? Are you seeing that from your
• 51:04
  side? Obviously you're, you're a
• 51:06
  company that connects Bitcoiners.
• 51:07
  So maybe you're a little biased because now all I do is read the
• 51:11
  headlines and I'm like, I just don't feel like people care
• 51:14
  right now. But it could just be a bear.
• 51:16
  Market thing. I mean, yeah, I mean the stuff
• 51:20
  the bear market is not helping for now, right?
• 51:23
  This is a momentary thing. I mean, if you've been in
• 51:25
  Bitcoin 56710 years, 15 years and some people have been 15
• 51:31
  years in Bitcoin, I've been in Bitcoin 1718 years actually.
• 51:36
  So joking outside, you know, you know, it goes, there's a bull
• 51:41
  market, then there's a bear market.
• 51:44
  These four year cycles, one day it'll be over.
• 51:47
  We don't know. But yeah, I mean, that option if
• 51:52
  you look at yeah, so if you look at own chain, obviously fees,
• 51:56
  that's basically it's zero. So there's not much volume
• 51:59
  there. But this could also mean that
• 52:03
  Bitcoin has scaled to the Latin network, right?
• 52:05
  I mean, the Latin network is going parabolic.
• 52:07
  If you look at the measures on the Latin network, like we have
• 52:10
  a, you know, we have launched a wallet last year basically,
• 52:14
  yeah, one year and change and we have done 4 million transactions
• 52:20
  just us. So starting from zero, right.
• 52:24
  So I think the Latin Macroid's taking away a lot of activity
• 52:30
  from the layer one to layer 2, which is I should be anyway,
• 52:35
  right? We don't wanna you mean nobody
• 52:37
  wants to wait 10 minutes to get a coffee.
• 52:40
  So so, you know, I don't know if they own chain is reflective of
• 52:44
  what actually is going on in the Bitcoin ecosystem that much, you
• 52:48
  know, and also this ETF, you know, people now buy on the ETF.
• 52:52
  So there's no, you know, they can buy 1000 Bitcoin and do 0
• 52:56
  transaction on the, you know, on on the blockchain.
• 52:59
  There's a lot. Of, you know, it's definitely
• 53:01
  change, it's definitely mature. You know, the ecosystem is
• 53:04
  mature, right? Like a lot, especially since I
• 53:06
  got in in 20/17/2018 and now the banks are going to come in.
• 53:11
  Right now you're going to be able to get bitcoins from your
• 53:14
  Wells Fargo Citibank account. And you probably don't even know
• 53:17
  what is a blockchain, right? Or what is lighting like all
• 53:20
  these things that they are going to go in the background.
• 53:23
  I think, you know, if you ask me, how is Bitcoin going to win
• 53:28
  is when people don't even know what's the blockchain on the
• 53:32
  lighting. They just use Bitcoin from their
• 53:35
  checking account, from their credit card, whatever it is,
• 53:37
  right? I think that's when Bitcoin
• 53:39
  wins. Is that like it's everywhere and
• 53:42
  it just works, right? So that's kind of my that's kind
• 53:47
  of my thesis right now. And the bird market is a great
• 53:50
  time to build, as the saying goes.
• 53:53
  So we're building a lot of cool stuff at Club Orange and you
• 53:58
  know, we actually said on boarding merchants recently, I
• 54:01
  don't know if you saw my tweet about this pizza guy in Los
• 54:04
  Angeles. No, no I didn't.
• 54:06
  I'll pull it up right now though.
• 54:08
  Yeah, if you go on my account is the pin 1.
• 54:11
  So what happened is, you know, cash shop now shows you a map of
• 54:16
  merchants that accept Bitcoin through Square.
• 54:19
  Cuz now if you have Square, you can just click a button on your
• 54:24
  on your there you go. That's the tweet.
• 54:26
  So if you have Square, you can just accept Bitcoin with one
• 54:29
  click, which is amazing, and you can convert to Fiat.
• 54:34
  You can keep the Bitcoin or whatever you like.
• 54:36
  So on Cloud Orange we have a merchant section and so I'm
• 54:42
  like, let's go and find out these merchants around delay,
• 54:45
  let's drive around. You know, I got a friend on Club
• 54:48
  Orange. Let's just go drive around and
• 54:50
  talk to this merchant, right? And sign them up on Club Orange
• 54:52
  so they can find local big corners they can go and spend.
• 54:55
  Anyway, somebody told me, I went to a meet up a couple of weeks
• 54:59
  ago and somebody told me that this pizza guy that does 70%
• 55:04
  discount if you're paying Bitcoin, I'm like 7 zero.
• 55:08
  Yeah, yeah, 70. I'm like, OK, we got to meet
• 55:10
  this guy. So I drove, it's across town,
• 55:14
  which in LA is kind of like it takes 3 hours, right?
• 55:17
  I went to this place, the guy's not there.
• 55:20
  The manager has no idea how to take Bitcoin.
• 55:22
  I'm like, OK, great. That's why I give 70% discount
• 55:25
  because nobody can pay Bitcoin. So, you know, so I left the
• 55:30
  voicemail, I, I left the business card.
• 55:33
  So I just say, hey, you know, whenever you see your balls,
• 55:35
  just give it, give them this business card.
• 55:38
  Anyway, we went back home, you know, and then, and then the
• 55:41
  next day I wake up, you know, I checked my sign up and there is
• 55:45
  pizza Man, which is the name of the, the pizzeria.
• 55:49
  He got the founder membership, which is $500, which is the most
• 55:54
  expensive membership we have. And then somebody told me, Hey,
• 55:58
  did you meet the guy? It's it's there's a section.
• 56:01
  About Club Orange on his WI say I never spoke to the guy.
• 56:04
  But this guy just, you know, got the got the the founder merchant
• 56:09
  A membership and then he put a whole section about Club Orange
• 56:13
  on his website when it goes to pay with Bitcoin.
• 56:16
  And I'm like incredible, right? I mean, this is really how
• 56:20
  Bitcoin is like the grass root, like knocking on doors, getting
• 56:25
  people to accept Bitcoin. So anyway, so we met the guy I
• 56:29
  think, yeah, 2 days ago, super young guy, super very cool guy.
• 56:34
  And it's like, yeah, I'm doing the boxes.
• 56:37
  So now this guy's gonna the boxes for the pizza.
• 56:40
  That's deliveries. It's gonna put Bitcoin
• 56:43
  everywhere, the boxes, the QR code, it's like all in a
• 56:45
  Bitcoin. And so that's the reality on the
• 56:49
  ground right now. The price, it doesn't tell you
• 56:53
  that there is a pizza guy that gives 70% discount if you're
• 56:57
  paying Bitcoin and it's gonna put the Bitcoin log on all the
• 57:00
  pizza boxes, right? You don't see that on the price.
• 57:03
  So it's a long you need to lower your preference, opt.
• 57:09
  That's my advice. Lower your preference, but we're
• 57:14
  gonna get there. OK, all right.
• 57:17
  You know, I I feel like I get yelled at by Mateo every time
• 57:20
  you come on the show. It's either check my DMS on Club
• 57:25
  Orange or I guess now it's lower my time preference.
• 57:28
  OK, I heard you, Mateo. You know, I don't meet up with
• 57:32
  as many new Bitcoiners as you. I I meet up with the same
• 57:36
  Bitcoiners and we just complain about the same things
• 57:39
  constantly. So maybe I need to go meet up
• 57:41
  with new Bitcoiners. I'm like, I like my Bitcoin
• 57:44
  friends. They're nice and.
• 57:46
  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, there's always you're on.
• 57:48
  The you're on the other side. You know, there's always new big
• 57:51
  corners means true every block, every block there's a new big
• 57:56
  corner minted right. So I but you know, that's it's
• 58:01
  if you have big con friends, it's good to get, you know,
• 58:05
  especially during these, you know, these crashes 50% down.
• 58:08
  It's good to get conviction from from your big con rose.
• 58:13
  So I'm glad you're doing that. Yeah, I'm sorry.
• 58:17
  I'm I'm seeing I'm like, wait, someone's messaging me on orange
• 58:21
  pill app or sorry, sorry, club orange.
• 58:24
  I dude, I still have it in my head.
• 58:26
  I'm like someone just messaged me on club orange.
• 58:27
  What what's going on? Like, don't they know I'm on the
• 58:29
  show and they're like my tails up next let's go.
• 58:32
  So yeah, but I I do want to talk about the the lightning just in.
• 58:39
  General one of one of my really good friends.
• 58:42
  Justifer, he's at Ambos. I I really want to just give him
• 58:46
  a shout out and applause for what he's been building and I
• 58:50
  know the lightning network doesn't get as much coverage
• 58:52
  here on the show, but it, it really is truly incredible what
• 58:57
  is happening on lightning right now.
• 58:59
  It it's really becoming like the de facto layer 2 for Bitcoin and
• 59:05
  it's moving a lot of money. I know you for you guys that
• 59:08
  watch every day. I did cover the, what was it?
• 59:11
  The million dollar single lightning transaction that just
• 59:15
  happened like that was huge. And I, I keep seeing Jessifer,
• 59:19
  my boy Jessifer. Actually, he docks himself.
• 59:22
  It's Jesse. I think his last name is
• 59:24
  Schroeder. I know him as Jessifer forever.
• 59:27
  The the CEO of Ambos and the charts and numbers he's showing,
• 59:31
  he's like, guys, you guys are really underestimating where
• 59:35
  Lightning is and the amount of adoption and use through
• 59:39
  Lightning. He's like, it's here, it's
• 59:41
  finally here. And I guess it goes back to what
• 59:43
  you said, Mateo. You know, I think it's Bitcoin
• 59:45
  as we do get caught up because we're so obsessed with Bitcoin
• 59:48
  day in and day out. That was like, oh, you know,
• 59:51
  zooming back, I, I remember a lot of contention, a lot of
• 59:55
  rumors and speculations like, oh, Lightning's not going to
• 59:58
  work. It's dead, bro.
• 59:59
  Like why is no one using lightning?
• 1:00:02
  And here we are a couple years later and it's it's.
• 1:00:05
  Almost working exactly as design guys.
• 1:00:07
  It's almost like Bitcoin works exactly as designed.
• 1:00:12
  I can tell you a funny story about the Lighting Network if
• 1:00:14
  you want, Yeah. Yeah, go for it.
• 1:00:17
  Before we had the wallets, you know, and I didn't really
• 1:00:21
  understand the lighting network that well when I, when I
• 1:00:24
  launched Club Orange, which is back in 2020 anyway.
• 1:00:28
  So I got a guy on Club Orange that says, oh, you know, we
• 1:00:30
  should test the, we should test the Latin neck and see how many
• 1:00:35
  sats you can send. And so I'm like, OK, let me send
• 1:00:38
  you a million SAS. You send it back this.
• 1:00:40
  And so eventually we end up doing like a 20 million SAT
• 1:00:44
  transaction. I never met the guy.
• 1:00:47
  You know, he could have, you could have run away with the
• 1:00:49
  SAT. So obviously send it back and,
• 1:00:51
  and then and then, you know, then I go into like send the
• 1:00:54
  Latin neck and it's like, you know, if you have a channel with
• 1:00:57
  somebody with like 10 bitcoins, you can send 10 bitcoins, which
• 1:01:02
  is what 1 billion sets back and forth, back and forth, you know,
• 1:01:06
  infinite amount of time, no fees by the way.
• 1:01:10
  And so, yeah, I mean, the 1,000,000 transaction on
• 1:01:13
  lighting, it's, it's great. It's like what, 10 Bitcoin?
• 1:01:16
  Like 12 bitcoins now? You could do.
• 1:01:21
  You could do. AI think you could do a billion
• 1:01:23
  transaction on lighting as long as you have the channel with
• 1:01:26
  like, you know, 1000 bitcoins, whatever the number might be.
• 1:01:29
  Now there is really no limit because then I ask, you know,
• 1:01:33
  people like Jesse and other people that you know, they're
• 1:01:36
  like deep down and be in on the lines like, is that actually a
• 1:01:39
  limit? Of a biggest channel and they
• 1:01:42
  say technically there is no limit so you could do.
• 1:01:46
  A $1 billion transaction on the lighting?
• 1:01:50
  I think we need to ask. Sailor to do that.
• 1:01:55
  To see if it works like I'm sure.
• 1:01:58
  I'm. Sure, he has a.
• 1:01:59
  He has a square thousand big. Yeah, I'm sure he's got a
• 1:02:02
  billion sitting around that You can.
• 1:02:04
  He can totally just do that. Yeah, exactly.
• 1:02:07
  But yeah, I mean the lighting, it's, it's, I mean, I remember
• 1:02:11
  when I got into, you know, when I was, I was here when the
• 1:02:14
  lighting goes starting in 2018 and it was like 50% of the
• 1:02:19
  transactions would not go through.
• 1:02:21
  They said they would fail. And now it's like, I can't even
• 1:02:26
  remember last time I got A and I do, you know, we do a lot of
• 1:02:28
  transactions. You know, we get, you can buy
• 1:02:30
  membership online thing through Club Orange, you know, and we
• 1:02:34
  use, you know, different providers.
• 1:02:36
  But nobody is going to say, oh, I sent this out.
• 1:02:39
  So, you know, and they haven't got that in many, many years.
• 1:02:43
  Yeah. I mean, the lighting works, man.
• 1:02:45
  I don't know why people keep saying the lighting doesn't work
• 1:02:47
  or they say the lighting is not Bitcoin.
• 1:02:51
  I see those tweets sometimes. I don't know what's wrong with
• 1:02:54
  these people. Lighting is Bitcoin obviously
• 1:02:59
  and lighting works. It's gonna it's only gonna get
• 1:03:02
  bigger and better. And and that's where I mean
• 1:03:05
  again, that's where most of the activity of Bitcoin is gonna be
• 1:03:09
  long term. And then you have on chain for
• 1:03:12
  like, OK, you know, I need to send $10 million, right?
• 1:03:16
  I need to buy grocery in 100 years and you know, I need to
• 1:03:19
  buy, I need $1,000,000 of lighting of Bitcoin.
• 1:03:22
  So. But yeah, it's lightning.
• 1:03:25
  Works, man. Let's go the take away.
• 1:03:28
  Lightning works all. Right, let me do the last.
• 1:03:30
  Commercial and then we'll just chop it up about Club Orange,
• 1:03:33
  what you've been doing lately. Here we go guys.
• 1:03:36
  This is a quick one, so we'll be right back.
• 1:03:39
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• 1:04:12
  You can catch the latest buzz at Hive Digital Tech or at Hive
• 1:04:16
  digitaltech.com. All right, Mateo, actually, I, I
• 1:04:25
  do, I do want to talk about this message that I just got by
• 1:04:28
  Orange diet. I I literally thought it was
• 1:04:31
  going to be you messaging me and being like Opti check your DMS
• 1:04:35
  like I, I, I checked them. Mateo.
• 1:04:39
  It's just, it's not every week. I I I've moved it, I've moved it
• 1:04:42
  a little bit to probably like every month.
• 1:04:44
  So I I'm still doing my duties here.
• 1:04:47
  It's just there's a little, there's a little longer break.
• 1:04:49
  OK, I'm I'm still on it. But Mateo, I do want to talk
• 1:04:53
  about something else, which is about a lot of the meetups that
• 1:04:57
  that I've seen you post on your Twitter, of course, facilitated
• 1:05:01
  through Club Orange. And I'm not going to dox shocks
• 1:05:04
  the person, but one of our Twitter Zoomers did hang out
• 1:05:09
  with you recently. And we were all sitting there
• 1:05:12
  and we just saw, we looked at your Twitter account and you're
• 1:05:15
  like, ah, look at us. We're, you know, we're at a meet
• 1:05:17
  up. And we all like looking in our
• 1:05:19
  in our slack. We're like, yo, is that?
• 1:05:21
  Is that who we? Think it is.
• 1:05:23
  I'll tell you, I'll tell you off the show.
• 1:05:26
  But anyways, let's just talk about Club Orange.
• 1:05:28
  I know it's working. I know.
• 1:05:31
  OK, OK. He's a cool.
• 1:05:33
  Guy, he's, he's been helping us for a long time in, you know,
• 1:05:39
  like design things. And yeah, it's a great guy,
• 1:05:43
  great young guy. Yeah, yeah, yeah, we, we love
• 1:05:47
  the kid. He's he's really, he's really
• 1:05:49
  been, he's really been a, a hidden gem for us.
• 1:05:54
  So we're we're super hyped for him too.
• 1:05:55
  I've joined the team. But anyways.
• 1:05:59
  Mateo, it's been a minute, dude. You know, you always send me
• 1:06:01
  Brian and I love Brian. Brian, if you're listening, you
• 1:06:04
  know I love you, bro. I I love the energy.
• 1:06:06
  Me and him chop it up all the time.
• 1:06:08
  But it's been a minute, Mateo. So what?
• 1:06:10
  What have you been doing, man? What?
• 1:06:11
  What's what's new over there at Club Orange?
• 1:06:14
  Well, the name just to start, you know.
• 1:06:18
  Yeah. Can we talk?
• 1:06:19
  About that, what's with the rebrand bro?
• 1:06:22
  Yeah, so. So here's what happened.
• 1:06:27
  The number one reason why I've changed the name is because my
• 1:06:32
  wife told me that she came out with the name forever.
• 1:06:37
  And I'm like, this is not true. You didn't come out with the
• 1:06:39
  name. I'm like, you know what?
• 1:06:41
  I'm gonna change the name. No, I'm just, I'm just kidding.
• 1:06:45
  No, it's true that it's true that she she claimed to be the
• 1:06:49
  creator of Orange Flop, the name.
• 1:06:52
  But that's not really the number one reason.
• 1:06:54
  Maybe the number two reason? The number one reason why we
• 1:06:58
  changed the name is because, you know, you know, there's a couple
• 1:07:03
  of reason, but the, I guess the, the problem was that the name
• 1:07:11
  was getting misspelled in ways that it's hard to believe, but
• 1:07:16
  literally like I was one day I was in, I went to an accountant,
• 1:07:21
  You know, I'm Italian. Maybe my English is not good.
• 1:07:23
  I don't know. The guy is like native English,
• 1:07:26
  right speaker. And I say, OK, what's the name
• 1:07:29
  of the company? Orange peel up And he wrote and
• 1:07:33
  like this guy's in front of me, right Orange.
• 1:07:36
  Obviously you can't misspell orange, which is why we kept it.
• 1:07:40
  Peel was TILL like a farmer and then up, up, like up.
• 1:07:51
  And I'm like, are you? Kidding me?
• 1:07:52
  Show up is crazy. And it's like, and it's like,
• 1:07:57
  this was the most egregious misspelling, but people would
• 1:08:01
  misspell it. Orange peeled like PILLED orange
• 1:08:06
  peel, like you're peeling the orange.
• 1:08:10
  And so you know, it's hard. So it's hard enough to get
• 1:08:14
  people to download an app and if you have to tell them, hey, you
• 1:08:18
  wrote the name wrong, like writing again, it's gets even
• 1:08:21
  harder. And then there was like, you
• 1:08:23
  know, 3 words, 3 words companies, you know, products.
• 1:08:28
  They're not, there's no successful company that has
• 1:08:31
  three words. It's always like one word or
• 1:08:35
  maybe 2-3 words is really like, I couldn't find any.
• 1:08:41
  And then the last reason was the word peel for those that spell
• 1:08:48
  it right, PILL, it was a turn, you know, it was a turn down
• 1:08:53
  for, you know, a certain kind of people.
• 1:08:55
  You know, they didn't like the word peel.
• 1:08:57
  You know, it sounded like a pharmacy, right?
• 1:09:01
  And then, you know, so we said let's see if we can find a
• 1:09:04
  better name. So we started like bouncing
• 1:09:06
  around the DS I think the most. Clever idea that somebody gave
• 1:09:10
  me was. Keeping, by the way, the other
• 1:09:15
  thing was like, the name was so long that people would say OPA,
• 1:09:20
  OPA, right? They would abbreviate it.
• 1:09:23
  Yeah. Which obviously is kind of cool.
• 1:09:25
  But if you go on Google, if you go on the App Store and you type
• 1:09:28
  OPA, you're never going to find this.
• 1:09:31
  So when people abbreviate your name, it's usually not a good
• 1:09:35
  sign. So somebody gave us this great
• 1:09:39
  idea was like, OK, how about this?
• 1:09:42
  How about we call it orange people up.
• 1:09:46
  So he stays OPA, but he get rid of peel.
• 1:09:50
  That was very clever. But you know, eventually we
• 1:09:52
  landed on club orange, which is, you know, shorter.
• 1:09:57
  You can misspell a club orange. It it it keeps the name.
• 1:10:02
  It keeps the orange, which is, you know, which is kind of
• 1:10:04
  Bitcoin or like we love the color orange.
• 1:10:07
  There's some continuity from Orange pull up to Club Orange.
• 1:10:11
  So anyway, so we rebranded in November and then I found out
• 1:10:15
  there is a company in Ireland that does a soda called Club
• 1:10:18
  Orange. So that's great.
• 1:10:22
  So, but if you go in the App Store, if you type Club Orange,
• 1:10:25
  they don't have an app for the drink.
• 1:10:28
  So that's the reason why we brand it.
• 1:10:31
  I think it's I mean it is a better name.
• 1:10:34
  Like, you know, like if if the original name was club Orange,
• 1:10:38
  would nobody would ever say, well, you should change it to
• 1:10:41
  Orange pull out, you know, like that's how you know you got a
• 1:10:44
  better name. So new name, same mission, of
• 1:10:49
  course, you know, like connecting big corners.
• 1:10:51
  You know, you can find the vans, you can find merchants, you can
• 1:10:55
  find your wife. Somebody, I mean some, I don't
• 1:10:59
  know if you know this, but somebody did find the wife and
• 1:11:02
  then get this. They had a kid and they call it
• 1:11:06
  Mateo. That's crazy.
• 1:11:10
  That is wild. They should have called it
• 1:11:12
  orange peel. OPA.
• 1:11:17
  Not OPA. OPA OPA.
• 1:11:18
  Yeah, yeah, exactly. That's right.
• 1:11:21
  You know they mean by like Dad, why is my name you know their
• 1:11:24
  name? Well, Mateo, I know, I know
• 1:11:31
  every time you've come on the show for, for years now at this
• 1:11:35
  point, I would always tease you about it being you should just,
• 1:11:38
  it should just be a dating app, bro.
• 1:11:40
  Like, come on. And we would joke Everything's a
• 1:11:43
  dating app if you're using it correctly.
• 1:11:44
  So it shouts out to those two people 'cause they use the app
• 1:11:48
  correctly. And now I know you, you don't
• 1:11:50
  like that. But hey, everything's a dating
• 1:11:53
  app if you use it correctly. So Club Orange.
• 1:11:57
  Well. Honestly, look, hey hey, still
• 1:12:01
  occasionally go to the. Club, you know, you, you want to
• 1:12:03
  find your mate at the club. So it should be a it should be
• 1:12:05
  part of the branding. Maybe not your mate, maybe just
• 1:12:08
  like a night. But hey, do you know people do
• 1:12:11
  what they want to do? The the right you know the right
• 1:12:15
  thing is not everything is that is a dating app if you use it
• 1:12:18
  correctly. The Right Thing Everything is
• 1:12:20
  Dating is a dating app if you're good looking.
• 1:12:23
  Hey, bars, that's true. That's true.
• 1:12:25
  So. Which unfortunately cuts you
• 1:12:30
  off. Damn, that's true.
• 1:12:36
  That's why these, that's why all these apps.
• 1:12:38
  Aren't working for me. What's up with your girlfriend,
• 1:12:40
  Christine? Ah, dude, she's no, she's lost a
• 1:12:44
  plot. I think she's taking this break
• 1:12:47
  up really bad because they keep fighting Bitcoin.
• 1:12:50
  They keep trying to usher in the CBDC.
• 1:12:54
  You know they're not. Really doing a lot of good.
• 1:12:57
  Stuff over there they're yeah, they're, they're cooked.
• 1:13:01
  She's she's taking it really rough.
• 1:13:03
  They're. You need to save her.
• 1:13:05
  You need to just. You know, The thing is is I
• 1:13:07
  tried. I tried and didn't work out.
• 1:13:11
  I didn't even get a scarf out of the relationship.
• 1:13:13
  So like, I don't know what I was doing, OK?
• 1:13:16
  I was just, you know, I was blinded by it, was bonded by the
• 1:13:22
  silver fox. Niko would kill me.
• 1:13:26
  Niko would kill me. He's like, yeah, OK, what's it
• 1:13:28
  going on? OK.
• 1:13:29
  Anyways, anyways. Mateo, what?
• 1:13:31
  What actually? Can you tease anything you got
• 1:13:33
  anything in the books like any anything coming down the
• 1:13:35
  pipeline? Yeah, Yeah.
• 1:13:38
  Actually we have a huge thing coming down the pipeline.
• 1:13:42
  So the wallet, the wallet that we launched last year has done 4
• 1:13:47
  million transactions, like literally 97% of those
• 1:13:52
  translation is geozapping, which essentially is a zapping people
• 1:13:57
  based on the location, you know, because we have, you know, we
• 1:14:00
  have the approximate location of the user.
• 1:14:02
  So you can go on the wallet and type, you know, and type Iran
• 1:14:07
  and there will be nobody, but you know, you can type like
• 1:14:12
  Miami or you can type a city, a country, a continent.
• 1:14:16
  You can even type a distance ends up people, you know, based
• 1:14:20
  on the distance to you or the location.
• 1:14:23
  So anyway, we launched the wallet and you know, it's
• 1:14:27
  custodial. It's a custodial wallet, which
• 1:14:32
  has some advantages and some disadvantages.
• 1:14:35
  But I was in El Salvador in January for the Plum B.
• 1:14:41
  Were you guys there? I think Nico was there.
• 1:14:43
  Nico was there. Yeah, Nico popped in for a
• 1:14:45
  little bit. I, I don't leave the basement
• 1:14:48
  here, bro. I I can't leave the studio.
• 1:14:50
  I literally sleep on the other side of the camera now.
• 1:14:52
  Perfect. But I love it.
• 1:14:54
  You should do it. You should.
• 1:14:54
  You should do a 24/7 live stream of all.
• 1:14:57
  Dude I could I you, you really want me to lose my mind?
• 1:15:00
  Dude I I can barely do this one. I'm already losing my mind the
• 1:15:03
  24 hours. Live of OPS.
• 1:15:06
  I'd never come back. I would watch it.
• 1:15:11
  So anyway, so I was in El Salvador and I met Roy from
• 1:15:16
  Breeze. Great guy and he told me about
• 1:15:19
  this thing called Spark. I don't know if you heard about
• 1:15:23
  it last. Spark.
• 1:15:24
  Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's David Marcus, right?
• 1:15:26
  That's David. Marcus's.
• 1:15:27
  Company, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:15:28
  So they build this thing. It's kind of like a side chain
• 1:15:33
  where you can use lighting and you can give wallet to people
• 1:15:38
  without being custodial. And I'm not.
• 1:15:41
  Gonna go into the details because I don't even know this
• 1:15:43
  is myself but my developers do and I met but they.
• 1:15:48
  Tell me it's a good idea. They tell me it's a good.
• 1:15:50
  Idea, right? It's like, OK, yeah, we can make
• 1:15:52
  that work. No, I went actually, you know,
• 1:15:55
  Last Park is in LA. I'm in LA as well, so I went to
• 1:15:57
  meet them. A few weeks ago and so we
• 1:16:02
  actually today, literally before I jump on this beautiful live
• 1:16:07
  stream with you Opti I we did our first non custodial
• 1:16:11
  transaction on club Orange today.
• 1:16:15
  And so in a couple of weeks we're gonna migrate our wallet
• 1:16:19
  from custodial to South custodial, which means yeah,
• 1:16:23
  yeah. Which means you're gonna be able
• 1:16:25
  to download the wallet from Club Orange and import it on like
• 1:16:30
  whether Satoshi or other wallets.
• 1:16:33
  And but the cool things is that there is no changes in the app.
• 1:16:38
  Like you can do ZAP and you can ZAP people, you can pay
• 1:16:41
  invoices. Nothing is gonna change from the
• 1:16:45
  user perspective. But on the background, it's
• 1:16:48
  gonna be self custodial, which means it's better for us as a
• 1:16:54
  company. Obviously we don't wanna hold
• 1:16:56
  your funds and it's better for the user because obviously we're
• 1:17:02
  never gonna rug our user even if we could right now.
• 1:17:05
  But still, you know, it's better that you don't, you don't even
• 1:17:08
  have that opportunity. Yeah.
• 1:17:10
  And so, yeah, so that's the biggest.
• 1:17:12
  So that's what we're working right now.
• 1:17:14
  We're gonna announce it some somewhat somewhere in April,
• 1:17:19
  maybe April 1st. So yeah, April Fool's Day.
• 1:17:24
  That's a good day. It's, well, we've been doing a
• 1:17:27
  lot of April Fool's Day in June, I know.
• 1:17:31
  Forget a subset. Well, look, Mateo.
• 1:17:34
  You're going to. Officially announce it, but you
• 1:17:36
  kind of already officially announced it here on simply with
• 1:17:39
  us so we I don't want to steal your your.
• 1:17:42
  Announcement, we'll call this the announcement of an
• 1:17:45
  announcement. You know, we, we could, we can
• 1:17:47
  lean into the trend of that being in the Bitcoin space.
• 1:17:50
  But I do have one quick question here.
• 1:17:52
  You did say nothing's going to change.
• 1:17:54
  So from a user perspective, are they just going to have to like
• 1:17:59
  update their wallet and all their funds and everything's
• 1:18:02
  going to be there? They don't even have to do
• 1:18:04
  anything. It's it's it, man, it's so it's
• 1:18:07
  so amazing. So the way it's gonna work,
• 1:18:09
  right, let's get into the details.
• 1:18:11
  Let's let's put people to sleep because it's kind of time to
• 1:18:14
  sleep. Well anyway, no, the way it's
• 1:18:17
  gonna work, it's like technically, as far as I know.
• 1:18:22
  Well, it's basically when you you're gonna update the app,
• 1:18:26
  right? There's gonna be an update.
• 1:18:28
  You update the app, and then when you go to the wallet, we're
• 1:18:32
  gonna automatically create a wallet for you.
• 1:18:36
  But the seed phrase of the wallet is gonna only stay in the
• 1:18:41
  device, so we can't see the seed phrase.
• 1:18:45
  Now, as a user, you can download the seed phrase and you can put
• 1:18:49
  it somewhere else, or you don't have to do that.
• 1:18:52
  You can still use the wallet without downloading the seed
• 1:18:55
  phrase. The wallet would just work as it
• 1:18:57
  worked before. It basically gives you the
• 1:19:00
  option to download the wallet, but if you don't do it, you can
• 1:19:05
  use the wallet in a self custodial manner without you
• 1:19:08
  even knowing that it's a self custodial manner.
• 1:19:10
  Which honestly it's it's I should be right.
• 1:19:13
  You don't want to have people download this Sid phrase, write
• 1:19:16
  it down, put it in a safe box and then you can use the wallet,
• 1:19:22
  right? That's not a good way to.
• 1:19:25
  You know I mean. Really the reason why we built
• 1:19:29
  the wallet is because I was talking to people on Club Orange
• 1:19:33
  and I would say 80% of the user of Club Orange, which is
• 1:19:38
  payable, do you have to pay? So it's kind of like the Bitcoin
• 1:19:42
  maxi. They never use the Latin wallet.
• 1:19:46
  It's the Latin network. And I'm like, at some point I
• 1:19:51
  can't teach. Everybody about the.
• 1:19:52
  Latin network, you know, like we have now.
• 1:19:55
  We have almost 20,000 user and that's really the reason why we
• 1:19:58
  create the wallet, because then everybody can, you know, is on
• 1:20:01
  the Latin network without, you know, even knowing about it.
• 1:20:06
  And so, yeah, I mean, that's how it's gonna work.
• 1:20:08
  You update the app, we create the wallet for you.
• 1:20:11
  The seed phrase lives on your device.
• 1:20:15
  That means only you can see the seed phrase.
• 1:20:17
  And if you want, you can download it, upload it somewhere
• 1:20:22
  else, you can save it. You know, and then the other
• 1:20:24
  thing is like you know people, you know the balance is on club
• 1:20:27
  orange. It's not like you have one
• 1:20:28
  Bitcoin or or two or three. You know, you have maybe 10,000
• 1:20:32
  stats or 5000 stats or 100. You know, it's really like
• 1:20:36
  pocket change. And so you know if you delete
• 1:20:41
  the app, you know, just so you know if you delete once you go
• 1:20:44
  South custodial if you delete the app or if.
• 1:20:47
  You. Change device and you don't save
• 1:20:49
  the the seed phrase, you lose your.
• 1:20:52
  Stats. But it's, you know, maybe it's
• 1:20:55
  1000 times it doesn't SAT and but you know, we're going to
• 1:20:58
  make sure, you know, we obviously we're going to make
• 1:21:00
  sure we tell everybody. There's going to be tutorials.
• 1:21:03
  We're going to have Opti walking through every single one of you.
• 1:21:07
  They can call Opti on Club Orange.
• 1:21:10
  You can, you know, you can make calls on Club Orange now.
• 1:21:13
  OK, yeah, dude, come. Come on bro, don't.
• 1:21:17
  The call off to please. Do not.
• 1:21:20
  Yo, don't do that. Don't no, don't do that dude.
• 1:21:24
  Oh man bro. Yeah, it's gonna be.
• 1:21:28
  It's gonna be beautiful, man. It's gonna be damn Mateo now my
• 1:21:31
  phone's really gonna blow up. All right, My phone's on Do Not
• 1:21:34
  Disturb forever here on out so. Airplane mode.
• 1:21:37
  Yeah, airplane mode forever. OK, guys.
• 1:21:40
  Sheesh. Mateo, this is bro, what are you
• 1:21:44
  doing to me? I'm I'm already losing my mind.
• 1:21:46
  Don't let don't have everyone call me now.
• 1:21:48
  This is horrible. This is my nightmare.
• 1:21:50
  Happening in real time, I barely pick up my friends and family's
• 1:21:53
  calls. Dude, jeez, I know, but your
• 1:21:55
  Bitcoin friends, they work more than your very few friends.
• 1:21:59
  I mean, it's true, I do talk to my Bitcoin friends probably more
• 1:22:02
  than my family, which is probably not the best thing, but
• 1:22:05
  it is it's, it's literally a fact.
• 1:22:08
  But but tell you I do, I do have again, not to get too technical
• 1:22:12
  here, but for people that are currently using Orange Pill app
• 1:22:16
  and they have some sets there, again, the transition's going to
• 1:22:20
  be seamless for them. So they don't have to like send
• 1:22:22
  their lightning out and then send it back.
• 1:22:25
  In, it's just going to be as it was before.
• 1:22:28
  Yeah. So yeah, again, let's let's go
• 1:22:32
  even. Deeper into these details of the
• 1:22:34
  new wallet. What's gonna happen?
• 1:22:38
  You have a balance, you upload, you update the app, we create a
• 1:22:42
  wallet which is sub custodial for you.
• 1:22:45
  The seat phrase is on your device and you're gonna have an
• 1:22:48
  address, right? Like the address is gonna stay
• 1:22:50
  opti at cluborange.org. And then we take the balance of
• 1:22:55
  your custodial wallet, which obviously means we were holding
• 1:22:59
  this. As for you, we take that balance
• 1:23:01
  and we automatically send it to your sub custodial wallet.
• 1:23:05
  So literally there is nothing to do for the user, literally that
• 1:23:11
  we're just going to take the sats from your custodial wallet
• 1:23:15
  to your sub custodial wallet and then it's your wallet.
• 1:23:19
  That's amazing. That's awesome bro.
• 1:23:22
  Yes, that's that's cool. I I've seen a lot of, I forget
• 1:23:26
  which one it is, but I saw another recent huge announcement
• 1:23:30
  of another I think was it Wallet of Satoshi?
• 1:23:33
  That went to Spark or. Yes, yes, yes.
• 1:23:35
  Yeah, right. They're they're using the.
• 1:23:37
  First, yeah, they were the first to, I think adopt Spark, which
• 1:23:41
  is how they'll be able to come back to the US And so, yeah, I
• 1:23:47
  mean, that's a good point. You could then once it's that
• 1:23:50
  could start and get the seed phrase, you can take the seed
• 1:23:53
  phrase, go to Walter Satoshi and import the wallet there.
• 1:23:58
  And then you see the same balance on Walter Satoshi.
• 1:24:01
  And really, wow. Yes.
• 1:24:04
  And then you can send this out and every time you send this out
• 1:24:08
  from Club Orange or what's the sheet, the balance are gonna
• 1:24:11
  update automatically. OK.
• 1:24:15
  So it's gonna be very, I mean, it's the way it should be.
• 1:24:20
  It's the way it should be. Wow.
• 1:24:24
  It's Club Orange building the iPhone moment for Lightning
• 1:24:28
  here. I think that might be a stretch.
• 1:24:31
  I know, I know we're trying to get more people to use Bitcoin,
• 1:24:33
  but it seems like the the ease and convenience factor really
• 1:24:39
  goes into the conversation. We were talking about Lightning
• 1:24:41
  earlier. It, it does seem to have come a
• 1:24:44
  long way. Now you don't have to be a
• 1:24:47
  hardcore, you know, bitcoiner technical developer to get a
• 1:24:51
  lightning node up. I, I remember when the lightning
• 1:24:54
  torch happened. I forget what year it was, what
• 1:24:57
  like 2021 or something like that.
• 1:25:00
  I was so. Frustrated, I was trying to set
• 1:25:02
  up a a lightning node and I I could barely code, you know,
• 1:25:07
  like hello world like that's as far as my coding went, you know,
• 1:25:11
  and I was trying to set up a lightning node and I forget what
• 1:25:16
  something dropped. I think there was, I think, oh,
• 1:25:19
  actually it was Pierre Rochard's.
• 1:25:21
  He had that like script for a lightning note and I literally
• 1:25:24
  just like put in the script and it like did all the stuff for
• 1:25:27
  me. And so I was able to do the
• 1:25:29
  lightning torch so that that was good times.
• 1:25:32
  I I completely forgot how to do any of that.
• 1:25:35
  So I'm happy that lightning is now Hey, I just download an app
• 1:25:39
  and I start using Bitcoin because, you know, it's hard.
• 1:25:42
  It's hard having a 42 IQ in this world, but you know, I'm
• 1:25:45
  surviving. I'm I'm surviving here daily.
• 1:25:48
  I don't know how it's happening, but we're, we're making it
• 1:25:51
  day-to-day here, Mateo. But anyways, yeah, you know.
• 1:25:55
  But now with the eyes, now with the, you know, now with the
• 1:25:58
  eyes, it's it's you might be able to code more than a little
• 1:26:01
  world, I think. Yeah, maybe.
• 1:26:05
  Yeah, maybe. I don't know, I the AI stuff is
• 1:26:08
  I, I hear everyone with the claw bots.
• 1:26:11
  I don't know, I'm like, I'm like, dude, I do not need
• 1:26:14
  another hobby where I'm looking at the computer all day.
• 1:26:17
  I'm like, I I need to go outside.
• 1:26:19
  OK, I know it's like a one time thing, but I don't know that's
• 1:26:23
  that's that's above my IQ. Level anyways, rateo to wrap up
• 1:26:28
  the show any any other things you want to mention?
• 1:26:30
  Actually, let's just plug club orange real quick.
• 1:26:33
  Where can they find it? Can they reach out to you?
• 1:26:35
  You know all that good stuff. If they have some feedback, you
• 1:26:39
  know, let let's do the final plug and we'll wrap up today's
• 1:26:41
  show. Well, Club orange.org is the
• 1:26:45
  website and then App Store, you know, whatever fun you have, App
• 1:26:51
  Store, Google Play Store, you can get the APK file on the
• 1:26:58
  website. If you wanna download the binary
• 1:27:01
  file, Club Orange, you can reach me on Club Orange.
• 1:27:05
  Obviously it's my name and last name.
• 1:27:08
  You can also reach OPT on Club Orange.
• 1:27:11
  Very important. Yeah, yeah.
• 1:27:12
  But don't call me guys, please. I'll respond to the DMS. But bro
• 1:27:18
  if. I literally Mateo, if I get if I
• 1:27:20
  get phone calls, I'm going to crash out so hard.
• 1:27:23
  I'm going to I'm going to lose my mind.
• 1:27:25
  Oh man, DM me. Please no phone calls.
• 1:27:28
  I, for the love of God, please you can.
• 1:27:30
  Actually, actually. Maybe.
• 1:27:32
  Yeah, actually, maybe I need to do reverse psychology here.
• 1:27:35
  Yes, you know. Call me, definitely call me
• 1:27:40
  please. I really enjoy you calling me.
• 1:27:43
  I don't. I'm I'm dude, I'm going to get
• 1:27:45
  cooked. Damn.
• 1:27:46
  Oh man. And yeah, I mean, it's what is
• 1:27:50
  Cub Orange? It's a it's a way to meet bit
• 1:27:52
  corners. It's a social network, which
• 1:27:55
  means there is no media to scroll and get lost in time.
• 1:28:00
  You find bit corners, you meet them, you go to the, you know,
• 1:28:04
  we have the largest database of events in the world, 800 events,
• 1:28:09
  Bitcoin only events. We filtered them.
• 1:28:11
  We, you know, we verify their Bitcoin events.
• 1:28:14
  So basically you know you can find events anywhere you go.
• 1:28:17
  We now have merchants you can go and spend the SAT's.
• 1:28:22
  Which you should. Do by the way, instead of just,
• 1:28:25
  you know, hoarding them, just spend the SAT's buy and replace,
• 1:28:28
  you know, don't be join, you know, join the become part of
• 1:28:34
  the economy and and there's a wallet, you know, did we talk
• 1:28:37
  about the wallet or not? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:28:39
  Did we talk about the wallet? Yeah.
• 1:28:40
  No, I don't know. I don't think we did.
• 1:28:42
  Right. Cool it's a wallet it's a
• 1:28:46
  custodial soon anyway. Yeah it's it's kind of like, you
• 1:28:51
  know, it's the reason why I build this app, in case you
• 1:28:54
  wanted to know Opti, so I'm sure you did is because I was lonely,
• 1:29:00
  you know, I was a lonely bitcoiner.
• 1:29:02
  Nobody wanted to hear about Bitcoin, especially when it
• 1:29:05
  crash in 2022 from like 69 to 1716, whatever it was.
• 1:29:12
  And you know, I'm like, let's build an app to find big corners
• 1:29:16
  because there was no other way to find big corners.
• 1:29:18
  Twitter, you don't know where people are.
• 1:29:20
  And yeah, I went to a meet up in LA and I went to a meet up in LA
• 1:29:28
  and half of the people were not in Bitcoin.
• 1:29:31
  And I'm like, what a waste. Some.
• 1:29:34
  Yeah, I've done that. Yeah, you've done that.
• 1:29:36
  Yeah. In the early days like 2018 era,
• 1:29:39
  I went to like a Bitcoin meet up back home and I go and they're
• 1:29:43
  like talking about shit coins the whole time.
• 1:29:45
  I'm like, what the hell is going on here?
• 1:29:47
  Like this is garbage. It's wild.
• 1:29:49
  Yeah, yeah. And that's really where I got
• 1:29:50
  the idea. I'm like, I can't go to a meet
• 1:29:53
  up. People on Twitter, I don't know
• 1:29:55
  what they are. So there's you know, there
• 1:29:59
  wasn't a way to find local big cars.
• 1:30:00
  So that's that's that's the kind of the incipit of Club Orange.
• 1:30:07
  And it work. I mean it work.
• 1:30:09
  We have 19, I mean almost 20,000 members.
• 1:30:11
  Everybody has to pay. So we don't get the bots, which
• 1:30:15
  obviously is going to be a huge problem going forward.
• 1:30:17
  We don't get the sheet corners, we don't get this bombers, we
• 1:30:20
  don't get the scammers, we don't get people that don't want to
• 1:30:25
  reply to the EMS. So. Yo, bro, yo dude, I'm getting
• 1:30:33
  cooked. Here I'm getting cooked.
• 1:30:35
  Here I'm. Getting you're you're telling
• 1:30:36
  everyone to call me now and I'm getting put on blast.
• 1:30:41
  No, but you know, choking aside, the paywall is kind of like
• 1:30:45
  Bitcoin, you know, you if you want to use the network, you got
• 1:30:47
  to pay the fees, which you know, is very low, but one day might
• 1:30:51
  be higher and it's $3 a month, you know, it's very low, but you
• 1:30:54
  know, like we filter out the the noise.
• 1:30:56
  So it's very high signal. Everybody's super friendly.
• 1:30:59
  Everybody wants to meet and, you know, build a business or become
• 1:31:03
  friends. I mean, there are people going
• 1:31:04
  camping, people that have learned to fly on Club Orange.
• 1:31:09
  They just, there's a pilot that just teaching people to fly.
• 1:31:14
  It's you know, it's, it's, it's quite incredible.
• 1:31:17
  You know, it's quite incredible. Optus is going to have a busy
• 1:31:21
  day, it's going to have a busy month.
• 1:31:23
  So what do you? Mean dude, my life is now more
• 1:31:26
  busy than ever thanks to Mateo Oh.
• 1:31:29
  Man, So yeah, that's Kevorage. It's it's, it's about going
• 1:31:33
  outside instead of being online all the time and building these
• 1:31:37
  local communities around Bitcoin.
• 1:31:39
  That's that's what we do. Let's go, let's go.
• 1:31:42
  I do want to read a couple of questions or comments from
• 1:31:46
  Rumble. I I can't pull them up, but we
• 1:31:48
  have AJN 240750 He goes yes, I'm I think some words are gone.
• 1:31:56
  I'm going to find more retailers that accept Bitcoin.
• 1:32:00
  I I think he missed a couple words there.
• 1:32:01
  So you know, he loves that. And then we have Mr. Robot Zero
• 1:32:07
  and he goes, this is how Bitcoin wins self custody and
• 1:32:10
  transacting. Bitcoin is just as seamless as
• 1:32:12
  any Fiat transaction. So they love what you're doing,
• 1:32:16
  Mateo. So it's been a minute, man.
• 1:32:18
  I appreciate you coming on, even though you roasted me.
• 1:32:21
  And now I'm going to get phone calls.
• 1:32:23
  But it's all love, OK? It's all love, bro.
• 1:32:26
  So thank you so much for coming on today's show.
• 1:32:29
  On that note, guys, you already know the deal.
• 1:32:32
  We'll be back tomorrow roughly 12:40 PM Eastern Time for
• 1:32:38
  another show of Simply Bitcoin Live.
• 1:32:42
  Like Mateo said, get outside, get in public.
• 1:32:46
  You know, get off the computer. There's real people out there.
• 1:32:50
  Make sure you're stacking stats, eating good food, go touch some
• 1:32:54
  grass, guys, get a workout and get out, get a walk in.
• 1:32:56
  You know, let's make sure we're healthy and beautiful so that
• 1:32:59
  you can turn every app into a dating app.
• 1:33:02
  I know I can't, but it is what it is.
• 1:33:04
  You know, maybe you guys can. So Mateo, again, thank you so
• 1:33:08
  much everyone out there you. Already know we appreciate you.
• 1:33:11
  We love you guys. I'll see you tomorrow.
• 1:33:15
  Good night. Today's episode was brought to
• 1:33:17
  you by bitcoinwell.com, a Bitcoin only platform on a
• 1:33:20
  mission to enable financial independence.