Latest / Financial Planner Life Podcast / What happens after the St James's Place Academy? My 3rd year as a Financial Planner | Natasha Percy-Baxter

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What happens after the St James's Place Academy? My 3rd year as a Financial Planner | Natasha Percy-Baxter · Financial Planner Life Podcast

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: And today on the Financial Planner Live podcast, I'm joined by Natasha Percy-Baxter for a second time.
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Natasha is a full circle moment for me because she originally reached out on the podcast to ask me questions about a career in financial advice.
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: Fast forward three years.
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: She's now running her own partner practice.
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: She's been on the podcast before.
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: She was a top episode, and today she's going to talk about what it's like being a partner of St James' Pace.
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: There's three key takeaways that we're going to learn today.
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: We're going to look at networking, we're going to look at client meetings and we're going to look about online presence.
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: This is a fantastic episode.
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: I hope you enjoy it, natasha.
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: Welcome back to the Financial Planner Live podcast.
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: How are you?
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: I'm good thanks.
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: How are you?
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: I'm amazing.
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: Thank you, so pleased to have you back.
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: Always a pleasure to meet you.
• 0:54
  Speaker 2: Loving the reunion.
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: Loving the reunion again?
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely so.
• 0:58
  Speaker 1: For those that don't know, natasha first reached out to me when you were a listener of the Financial Planner Live podcast and you were considering a career within the financial planning profession.
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: So you picked the phone up, didn't you?
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: You reached out to me, you asked me a load of questions, you brought your notebook along you're super organized I gave you some advice and you finally ended up joining the Financial Advisor Academy at St James's Place and a few months later you appeared on my podcast.
• 1:24
  Speaker 1: Yes, so it was kind of like a full circle moment really, and it was proof that what I'm doing around the financial plan of life is to attract new people to the profession.
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: And it worked.
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: And that episode itself was so good that it was our number one downloaded episode.
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: So well done.
• 1:41
  Speaker 2: Thank you very much.
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: No pressure on episode two, but a lot's changed since then.
• 1:46
  Speaker 1: You've gone through the academy, so, nisasha, tell us a little bit about what's going on now then in your life and in your career.
• 1:52
  Speaker 2: Exactly so.
• 1:53
  Speaker 2: I did the academy.
• 1:54
  Speaker 2: That was about six months and I am now just over two years into running my own practice.
• 1:59
  Speaker 2: So last year has been quite busy compared to the first year, I will say that, and I've got a couple of key things I wanted to focus on today in terms of what has been kind of priorities, I guess, for me, and that would probably be networking, online presence and client meetings.
• 2:16
  Speaker 1: Fantastic.
• 2:16
  Speaker 1: So these are some of the three key takeaways that you think are valuable to our listeners, for example.
• 2:21
  Speaker 1: But the main things, really, that you've taken from over the last, say, year and a half in your experience and things that you think you focused on that have done really well, yeah exactly.
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: I think they're kind of key things to be aware of when you're starting out as well.
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: So the networking online presence is for gaining the clients, and then it's well, what do you do next as well?
• 2:38
  Speaker 2: So then the client meetings as well, and that's something I've definitely been working on over the last two years, and by no means an expert, but I think it'd be nice to share what I've learned so far.
• 2:47
  Speaker 1: Fantastic.
• 2:47
  Speaker 1: Well, let's jump straight in then.
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: Let's look at the first one networking.
• 2:49
  Speaker 1: So you're a bit of a socialite.
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: You've actually done about 120 networking events within a couple of years, yes, which is about 118 more than me in my life.
• 3:00
  Speaker 1: So well done thank you so.
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: I'm definitely going to learn something from this, so let's fire into that.
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: Then with networking, because not everyone's comfortable going out and meeting people are we talking about networking online.
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: Are we talking about networking face-to-face?
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: Give us a bit of an overview then break down networking for us then as a key learning area so both.
• 3:19
  Speaker 2: First of all, so it is online, but it is also in person.
• 3:22
  Speaker 2: I've definitely learned over time.
• 3:24
  Speaker 2: I prefer in person.
• 3:25
  Speaker 2: That works a lot better for me.
• 3:26
  Speaker 2: Online's great, but if you're in a group zoom, as in there's multiple people it's very hard to either have one-on-one conversations, which is where I'm more natural, and it's also hard as someone speaking to join in the conversation because you tend to cut out that person's audio.
• 3:40
  Speaker 2: So it's being aware of that.
• 3:42
  Speaker 2: But if it's online networking where there's breakout rooms those I love I think that's really great and I've gained a lot from being able to do that.
• 3:48
  Speaker 2: So again, it's being aware of what type of networking it is.
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: But in person I think it's a lot easier to just go up to someone, start a conversation, have a bit of a chat, and that's definitely an area where I feel like I've learned quite a lot over the last two years.
• 4:00
  Speaker 2: I think at the start it can be very daunting and that's probably something I would say to everyone is don't expect to be great from the get-go with anything.
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: Just throw yourself out there.
• 4:12
  Speaker 2: You know, learn as you go.
• 4:13
  Speaker 2: Basically, I think that's literally what this job is, um, but the more I've been to the more I have a better understanding of what works for me and how I like to approach it as well let's start at the beginning, then.
• 4:23
  Speaker 1: So if someone's thinking about doing a networking event as a financial planner or a financial advisor, should they go to any old networking event?
• 4:31
  Speaker 2: So I say no off the bat.
• 4:33
  Speaker 2: I'd say what's definitely worked.
• 4:35
  Speaker 2: The best for me is finding a network where it's linked to your passions, because then when you go along you know you're going to have something in common with the people that you're talking to.
• 4:43
  Speaker 2: I have been to networking events where there's nothing in common and it can be a lot harder to get conversation going.
• 4:49
  Speaker 2: It's possible, but I think it's a lot easier if you go somewhere where you've already got that passion.
• 4:54
  Speaker 2: Anyone who knows me know my biggest passion is England rugby.
• 4:57
  Speaker 2: So I like to go to a lot of networking events around rugby and around sport and I know then that I can start these conversations quite easily.
• 5:05
  Speaker 2: Again.
• 5:05
  Speaker 2: I get really into the rugby, so I'll be doing the stats, I'll be doing games I mean World Cup, I'll probably watch 90% of the games.
• 5:12
  Speaker 2: So there's a lot of conversations that happen naturally and I think it really helps to build that rapport with the people there before going into a conversation around what you do and how you can potentially help them.
• 5:21
  Speaker 2: It's kind of having that foundation there first.
• 5:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 5:24
  Speaker 1: So have you been to some networking events?
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: Where is that sort of trial and error?
• 5:26
  Speaker 1: Is that you've been to networking events where perhaps you didn't quite know the subject matter, the experience of the people in the rooms?
• 5:32
  Speaker 1: Did you?
• 5:32
  Speaker 1: Did you find yourself sort of on the peripheral, really looking in and not feeling like you had the confidence to jump into a conversation because you didn't have the background or knowledge or experience to really lead a conversation?
• 5:42
  Speaker 2: exactly, yeah, it's more, you're there listening and I think then you have that kind of persona as well of someone who's potentially unsure of themselves, and it's a lot harder to break into a conversation because people are very much in the conversation, they know what they're talking about and you're kind of, yeah, exactly standing on the peripheral, being like, okay, I can listen, but I don't feel like I'm really enter the conversation as such, and that can make it quite a hard experience let's talk about entering the conversation then.
• 6:04
  Speaker 1: So we break this down and make it really simple.
• 6:07
  Speaker 1: Okay, what advice would you give somebody when it comes to actually introducing yourself?
• 6:11
  Speaker 1: Let's look at the first 10 seconds when you meet somebody.
• 6:13
  Speaker 1: How important is that?
• 6:14
  Speaker 2: so really important and I've definitely shifted my approach with this.
• 6:18
  Speaker 2: Originally I was focused on talking about myself and kind of sharing a little bit and also trying to get to know them.
• 6:24
  Speaker 2: I now completely just want to get to know them.
• 6:26
  Speaker 2: At the beginning I don't say anything about myself, even if they direct questions at me, obviously beyond saying your name, because otherwise that'd be a bit weird.
• 6:32
  Speaker 2: Um, but beyond that, someone asks me, what do I do?
• 6:34
  Speaker 2: I instantly throw it straight back and I say, actually I'd rather talk about you first, what do you do?
• 6:38
  Speaker 2: So it helps to get a good understanding of who they are.
• 6:40
  Speaker 2: It helps, if you go to events where there might be other sjp partners, you don't start giving your elevator pitch when they don't need to hear it.
• 6:46
  Speaker 2: Um, and I think it's better because then you get to know them and you're showing an interest.
• 6:50
  Speaker 2: And I got into this because I enjoy learning about other people.
• 6:53
  Speaker 2: So, yeah, it's really nice to kind of figure out a bit about them first before I reveal, or reveal before I say anything about me and what I do.
• 7:00
  Speaker 2: So what sort of questions you ask.
• 7:02
  Speaker 2: So it'll be things like yeah, so what?
• 7:04
  Speaker 2: What brought you here today is always a great one trying to understand why someone came there.
• 7:07
  Speaker 2: Um, it might be things like you know, how you know.
• 7:12
  Speaker 2: Simple ones are things like how was your weekend, how's your week?
• 7:14
  Speaker 2: All those are kind of like a bit kind of like easygoing, um.
• 7:17
  Speaker 2: But depending on time of year, there might be other stuff.
• 7:19
  Speaker 2: So if I'm going to quite financially focused ones, it might be oh, have you seen the budget?
• 7:23
  Speaker 2: Have you seen these kind of things?
• 7:24
  Speaker 2: What's relevant in terms of timing?
• 7:25
  Speaker 2: But then, yeah, again, if it's a sport one, it might just be like oh, you know who's your favorite team, what do you watch, kind of thing.
• 7:31
  Speaker 2: So again, it's about preparing for the session.
• 7:34
  Speaker 2: So some things.
• 7:35
  Speaker 2: You might have general questions.
• 7:36
  Speaker 1: Other times you might have more prepared questions specifically for the event you're going to and the type of other people who might be there I think once you get somebody talking as well, it's quite easy to get them to carry on, and the more you get them to carry on, the more you learn about them and the more trust is gained.
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: We all know.
• 7:50
  Speaker 1: Talking and listening, you know, is a fantastic way to release oxytocin.
• 7:54
  Speaker 1: It makes you feel good.
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: It's the love drug so the more you talk, the more you listen, the more you engage, the more you smile, the more you nod, the more you feel good.
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: That person with you builds a deeper relationship.
• 8:03
  Speaker 1: It's power of talking and listening.
• 8:04
  Speaker 1: It's amazing.
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: I love the way that you push it back on them.
• 8:07
  Speaker 1: No, no, no, tell me about you first.
• 8:09
  Speaker 1: I think it's really difficult to actually go.
• 8:10
  Speaker 1: No one's gonna turn around and go.
• 8:12
  Speaker 1: No, no, no, I want to hear about you first.
• 8:13
  Speaker 1: And that sounds like someone from sjp's probably been trained the same way.
• 8:16
  Speaker 1: I can imagine you both going back and forth yeah, exactly, no, no, no, I insist that'll be a funny conversation.
• 8:22
  Speaker 1: So let's just get back to these networking events then.
• 8:24
  Speaker 1: So you know you've gone out, you found loads of networking events.
• 8:26
  Speaker 1: How do you find them?
• 8:27
  Speaker 1: Where do you, you know, is there a little, is there a little sort of rolodex of all these networking events in london that you're invited to do?
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: How do you find where these networking events are and how do you kind of organize yourself to get there?
• 8:37
  Speaker 2: again, I think it's a bit of a process to figure out what works for you.
• 8:39
  Speaker 2: So things I've done in the past are like Eventbrite lists, a lot of things and you can type in passions and see what comes up and areas as well.
• 8:47
  Speaker 2: I like quite a few kind of like publications, so magazines, and they run events throughout the year.
• 8:53
  Speaker 2: So like Harper's Bazaar is a magazine I've done stuff with before in the past and I've been to their events as well so I now follow, I get their newsletter so I can see they did like a Bazaar at Work partnership with Albright last year so they had multiple things.
• 9:09
  Speaker 2: So again it's kind of tapping into what you like anyway and see if they do any events or something similar.
• 9:11
  Speaker 2: Um, and again, I think it's just talking to people as well.
• 9:13
  Speaker 2: Whenever I go to a networking event now, I'm always like are there any other networks you're part of?
• 9:17
  Speaker 2: Any other events coming up that you'd recommend?
• 9:19
  Speaker 2: And it's really lovely to get recommendations from people you've met.
• 9:22
  Speaker 2: Even if nothing happens in terms of business, you're getting a better understanding of what other events are out there that you can start attending and building kind of an understanding of when it comes to the events themselves and you're thinking, oh, I'm about to go off to an event later.
• 9:35
  Speaker 1: Do you sort of have a game plan?
• 9:36
  Speaker 1: Do you prepare yourself in any way?
• 9:38
  Speaker 2: so the way I like to think about it is it's good to be prepared, but I wouldn't have expectations.
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: So you don't want to go in there thinking it's good to be prepared, but I wouldn't have expectations.
• 9:43
  Speaker 2: So you don't want to go in there thinking it's going to be a certain event.
• 9:45
  Speaker 2: It might be very different.
• 9:46
  Speaker 2: I've been to some events where I thought it'd be a lot of open conversations and it's been more like friends meeting up for a drink.
• 9:51
  Speaker 2: Bit different and other networks I've been to and it's very open and everyone's just like come on, join our if you have a list before, potentially, of who's going to be there.
• 10:13
  Speaker 2: Not all events do that, but some do.
• 10:14
  Speaker 2: So it can be helpful to be like okay, I want to have conversations with these people, um, and I think it's just good to kind of have a like what, what am I here for?
• 10:22
  Speaker 2: As well as reminding yourself of that.
• 10:23
  Speaker 2: So what's my why?
• 10:24
  Speaker 2: Um, and being a lot better as well, having that kind of like end of the conversation, whether that's like this has been great, can I get your details?
• 10:31
  Speaker 2: Or it might be just be like it's been lovely to meet you, I need to go get a drink or I need to go chat to someone else or something like that.
• 10:37
  Speaker 2: So also having a way to exit a conversation, I think is just as important having a way to enter a conversation.
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: That's really uncomfortable because once I get going and I start talking to somebody, I could be talking to someone.
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: That's like just what I'm like.
• 10:48
  Speaker 1: I could be talking to someone for 45 minutes and in reality there's probably nothing that we can do but the fact that we're just engaged in conversation.
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: So I suppose knowing when to shut up and when to cut that out, so you can go and talk to some other people and hopefully they can't see you across the room sort of moving around, they're obviously not interested in me.
• 11:05
  Speaker 2: Exactly like oh awkward, damn it.
• 11:06
  Speaker 2: They just didn't want to talk to me anymore, fine.
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: So when I did go to networking events and someone asked me what I did for a living, and I might say I'm a recruitment consultant, I don't think I ever said that.
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: I think I said something like I'm a talent acquisition manager or something along those lines, but the look in their eyes was like you know God, I'm talking to a recruiter.
• 11:21
  Speaker 2: I've got a phone call coming in.
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, sorry, they did Natasha Percy Baxter and left.
• 11:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I've got to get a drink when you say that you're a financial advisor, you're a financial planner, and you introduce yourself.
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: What reaction do you tend to get?
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: No-transcript, like you, I'm so glad you're here today.
• 11:53
  Speaker 2: Can we have a follow-up coffee?
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: I can't really chat tonight, but I want to talk more, you know, to you and about what my kind of life situation and things are so really mixed can be like a massive opener to some people.
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: And I think it's always good to talk about it.
• 12:08
  Speaker 2: Because the other thing I've really learned over time is, even if the person opposite you isn't potentially a client, they might know someone who could become a client.
• 12:16
  Speaker 2: So it's really good to have that.
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: And I actually had that earlier this month.
• 12:20
  Speaker 2: I had someone saying she met me in an event, uh, last year, and she's now referred someone to me and so it's having those conversations, not thinking the end goal is this person has to be my client.
• 12:29
  Speaker 2: It's just and again, I'm not someone who kind of approaches it like that.
• 12:33
  Speaker 2: Anyway, that feels a bit too transactional for my kind of liking, but it's just being like let me tell you what I do.
• 12:39
  Speaker 2: It might not be right for you, but you might know someone it could be a friend, a, a family member who this could help.
• 12:45
  Speaker 2: So I'd like to share a bit more about what I do, and I always like to have different ways of presenting it.
• 12:49
  Speaker 2: I remember when I applied to the academy I talked about being you know, do you want to suit this off the rack or do you want one that's made by a tailor?
• 12:55
  Speaker 2: Because I'm the tailor, I'm going to tailor a plan that suits you and I'm going felt a bit cheesy, so it took me a while to actually go out and say it to people.
• 13:02
  Speaker 2: But it's having different ways of presenting what you do that people can engage with, rather than just I'm a wealth manager, I can help you with x, y and z, and that kind of can feel a bit too kind of like boring, not that engaging.
• 13:15
  Speaker 2: it's about how do you make it engaging for the person opposite do you find bringing sort of emotion into it and oh, totally, and even like stories as well, just being like I recently had a client that was going through this, based on what that person's age or life stage might be, and they could be like oh, I can totally relate to that, I just had a family member who went through that, or I just had one of my friends going through that, and so it can be really helpful to explain it.
• 13:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly in terms of actual lived experience and what emotions come with that I love what you said earlier about if you can actually access the list of people that are going to that networking event, or maybe some of the presenters or whatever it might well be, you can prepare perhaps some stories.
• 13:49
  Speaker 1: You can prepare some testimonials or examples of what you've done and for others or things that are going on in the market.
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: You know conversation pieces, you know and you kind of seek those individuals out.
• 14:00
  Speaker 1: What's great about networking events?
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: Usually someone's got a label on with their name, isn't they?
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: so you can kind of yeah everyone's looking around trying to find that person.
• 14:06
  Speaker 1: So, with St James's Place, you were in the academy.
• 14:09
  Speaker 1: Now in that academy, did they give you much support or training or ideas around how to present at networking events?
• 14:16
  Speaker 2: um, I actually just got asked recently to speak about networking, uh, to SJP academics.
• 14:22
  Speaker 2: I want to say, and that was really great, and I was part of a panel with two other women and we were sharing our lived experiences.
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: We all have very different approaches.
• 14:30
  Speaker 2: One was very much networking for her was groups, so same group going back month to month and building that kind of relationship there.
• 14:36
  Speaker 2: My version of networking is more like one-off events, or I'm a member of probably two groups and that's it.
• 14:43
  Speaker 2: So it's having different ways of approaching networking and being able to share different things during the academy.
• 14:49
  Speaker 2: I think they, you know, said it was great, we should go out, we should network and it's a good way to build your client base.
• 14:54
  Speaker 2: Um, I don't know if there was much more guidance around that.
• 14:57
  Speaker 2: It might have changed since um, but it was very much like that's a positive way of finding new clients well you know your 120 good quality networking events you've been to.
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: Has it been a success?
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: so I think it's quite interesting.
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: I've been asked previously to analyze it and I was like I'm too early to analyze.
• 15:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I want to still get more data before I start analyzing it, but I've definitely learned over time what does and doesn't work.
• 15:22
  Speaker 2: So I was part of a monthly lunch meetup and I ended up leaving after, I think, about six meetings.
• 15:29
  Speaker 2: I was just like this isn't for me.
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: This isn't my style of networking.
• 15:32
  Speaker 2: I much rather go into a room of strangers, which probably might be the more daunting version, but that works so much better for me and I prefer that.
• 15:39
  Speaker 2: So I think it is good to assess and think what works for me, what doesn't.
• 15:43
  Speaker 2: Don't say no to anything.
• 15:44
  Speaker 2: I think it's worth trying everything.
• 15:46
  Speaker 2: I'm always talking about bbq be braver, quicker which they talk about in the academy.
• 15:49
  Speaker 2: So try lots of different things before deciding what makes the best kind of like networking experience for you.
• 15:55
  Speaker 2: But yes, I think it's definitely worked for me in the sense of just building that confidence, getting my name out there, building that kind of reputation, I guess.
• 16:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah so sometimes you have to pay your way to get into networking events, so any of them cost money.
• 16:08
  Speaker 1: I know a lot of them.
• 16:10
  Speaker 1: You mentioned the lunch club one or the breakfast club ones.
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: I remember I went to a few and you had to stand up and pitch who you were and all of that.
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: But you also had to talk about the amount of leads that you've passed to somebody else within the networking group and they were quite specific about not having too many of the same types of people within there.
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: The idea was to pass business to each other, but there was a payment.
• 16:27
  Speaker 1: There was a monthly cost of actually going to get my breakfast and to sit with these people and hopefully pick up some business, but I always had to turn up to the table with some leads for other people as well and had to talk about it.
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: Have you found that sometimes these network events you go to, are there ones out there that seem like they're a bit like money spinners?
• 16:48
  Speaker 2: And there that seem like they're a bit like money spinners and they're kind of promising you the earth of coming in and there's loads of opportunity, but it's going to cost you.
• 16:51
  Speaker 2: So I've not personally had experience with that.
• 16:52
  Speaker 2: I think there are probably ones out there because it would make sense, because they're like right, I can get away with it.
• 16:55
  Speaker 2: I might as well give it a go.
• 16:56
  Speaker 2: But again, I think reputation is so important that if they start doing that and especially as sjp is quite a strong community, once you tap into it, you're going to know quite quickly if there are people doing that.
• 17:07
  Speaker 2: Because if you reach out to people you know sjp and say I'm considering joining this network because they don't have any experience with it, you're probably going to get quite a good collective knowledge of what's good and what's potentially a scam.
• 17:19
  Speaker 2: So that's something that's quite good about.
• 17:21
  Speaker 2: Being part of sjp is being like I just want to feel out before I join something or commit to it.
• 17:25
  Speaker 2: What do we think?
• 17:26
  Speaker 1: tried and tested pathway, so you're leaning into the network of partners to ask their advice about networking events.
• 17:31
  Speaker 1: To me, though, don't they go.
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: Well, mind your own business, because I'm there.
• 17:35
  Speaker 2: I mean, that is the other thing I'm like.
• 17:37
  Speaker 2: Of course someone reached out to me.
• 17:38
  Speaker 2: I think I'd be happy giving the level I'm giving now, but I don't know if I'd necessarily say the exact members.
• 17:43
  Speaker 2: I've like networking joints, networking groups.
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: I've joined because I like them and I like the fact that I'm not the only wealth manager.
• 17:51
  Speaker 2: I know that from the ones I'm part of.
• 17:52
  Speaker 2: But I've got my own take on things and so I'm very much like I don't want to necessarily like bring many more wealth managers into the group.
• 17:59
  Speaker 2: So yes, I think people might be protected to a certain extent if they're really good, good networks be part of.
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: But I think at the same time, if they joined one and it wasn't positive, they'd be comfortable sharing that kind of information.
• 18:11
  Speaker 2: But again, I think it is you know, trying and testing it what works for someone might not work for another person because we're all different personality types and again, I'm I'm know that I'm much more prefer a one-on-one to something like this today, as opposed to being in a massive room full of people.
• 18:27
  Speaker 2: So the networking groups I go to, I also like to know roughly what the kind of size is, and I think somewhere between 20 and 50 people suits me.
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: I've been to events where there's like hundreds up to thousands of people.
• 18:38
  Speaker 2: Not really my style, it's a bit too overwhelming.
• 18:41
  Speaker 2: Something that's a bit smaller, where you can go around the room and meet different people, but if you need to just like have a bit of quiet time as well, that's possible.
• 18:50
  Speaker 2: So again, it's trialing different things and seeing what works for you.
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: Day one going to networking events.
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: I remember when we very first spoke on the telephone I talked about business development within financial planning and I've always been somebody to be honest about what an advisor joining the profession needs to actually do to self-generate business what works, what doesn't work.
• 19:11
  Speaker 1: You weren't massively confident, were you?
• 19:13
  Speaker 1: You didn't come from a job where you're on the phone day in, day out trying to generate business and you struggled to even pick.
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: You're like I'm picking up.
• 19:19
  Speaker 1: Picking up the telephone.
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: For me is quite nerve-wracking to go out and do all those networking events.
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: What did you?
• 19:24
  Speaker 1: What did you do to build that confidence?
• 19:26
  Speaker 1: And if someone's thinking the same thing, if I go to a networking event it's going to be full of other financial planners.
• 19:30
  Speaker 1: They're all going to be so more experienced than me, the people there are.
• 19:33
  Speaker 1: The imposter syndrome creeps in.
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: What advice would you give to those people?
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: I think, again, it's tapping into the fact you're not going to be great from day one.
• 19:47
  Speaker 2: Yes, I definitely not a group environment person, person in terms of a big group, so I wouldn't say I'm an extrovert.
• 19:50
  Speaker 2: I am a extroverted introvert.
• 19:50
  Speaker 2: Um, in the sense I like going to networking groups, but I still need time to like.
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: My energy comes back when I'm by myself, basically.
• 19:56
  Speaker 2: So I think it's not doing too many at once because if you are like me, that would be very draining.
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: I think with me, it was about gaining the confidence and, yes, even picking up the phone felt quite intimidating and outside of my comfort zone, but it's, the more you do something, the more comfortable it becomes.
• 20:13
  Speaker 2: Um, so, yes, definitely, even picking up the phone at the beginning was quite a daunting experience.
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: And going to my first networking groups, I felt very intimidated.
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: Um, I'm very lucky that I have a very supportive husband and I'd be texting him throughout the networking event, being like I think I'm going to come home.
• 20:29
  Speaker 2: I'm not really sure this is for me um, and he'd be there.
• 20:32
  Speaker 2: Being like, if you want to leave, just leave, but give it 10 more minutes.
• 20:35
  Speaker 2: You never know what might happen.
• 20:37
  Speaker 2: Um, and so, having whether that's a friend or someone else you might be able to just text and just get the jitters and the nerves out with, and then be like, okay, do you know what?
• 20:46
  Speaker 2: Yes, what's the worst that can happen?
• 20:47
  Speaker 2: Take a breath, go back into the room, be like I'm just going to try and talk to one person here, so it might even be like sliding down your ambitions for the session.
• 20:55
  Speaker 2: Be like, okay, talk to one person, see what happens and build it from there, and then next time you might be I'm going to talk to two people today and next time I'd be like I'm going to talk to quite a few different people.
• 21:06
  Speaker 2: I'm going to get better at entering conversation.
• 21:08
  Speaker 2: I'm going to get better at exiting conversation.
• 21:09
  Speaker 2: So, set yourself little challenges and take it as like an experience that you can learn and you can grow from fantastic.
• 21:16
  Speaker 1: Get comfortable with being uncomfortable, setting those small goals and having a big fill in the corner on the telephone.
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: Give you that support.
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: We all need support.
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: I text my wife every now and then when I'm having a bad day.
• 21:26
  Speaker 1: I need some bloody support and she's at the end of the phone just going go for it.
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: All you want to hear is someone say come on, go for it.
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: I love that.
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: Stay for 10 more minutes, because at 10 more minutes you never know might be the conversation that leads you to something quite special.
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: Have you found also that going to networking events?
• 21:41
  Speaker 1: Obviously it builds your confidence.
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: It great.
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: It builds your communication skills.
• 21:44
  Speaker 1: It builds your presentation skills.
• 21:46
  Speaker 1: Have you seen that transfer into everyday life?
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: So all of a sudden life becomes a networking event I guess.
• 21:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it's one of those like, as you push yourself outside your comfort zone, your comfort zone grows.
• 21:59
  Speaker 2: So it's one of those like, if you did the same thing every day, lived, uh, in the same place and never really kind of like pushed yourself outside your comfort zone, you're gonna have a very small comfort zone.
• 22:09
  Speaker 2: But yes, if you push yourself outside of it by going to networking events, speaking to people you've never spoken to before, doing things you've never done before which, if you're entering a new career or trying something out, is going to be the case the more you do it, the more you kind of reiterate to your brain this is okay, I can try it, I can see what happens, I'm either going to do well or I'm going to learn from it.
• 22:31
  Speaker 2: And I think, having those experiences and giving yourself that kind of reassurance of let's just see what happens, you are going to gain experience.
• 22:41
  Speaker 2: Not experience, you're going to gain that kind of confidence, and that's going to apply to every other area of your life, because your brain's thinking okay, I tried, it wasn't too bad.
• 22:48
  Speaker 2: It either was like, yeah, that was great, I can do that again, or it's like I didn't quite like that.
• 22:53
  Speaker 2: But if we had a different approach?
• 22:54
  Speaker 2: We'll see if that kind of works for me and I can take that somewhere else.
• 22:58
  Speaker 2: So I definitely think it ripples into other aspects of your life the more you push yourself outside your comfort zone it's the compound effects, right?
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: you know, if you go to more networking events, you're only ever going to get better.
• 23:09
  Speaker 1: You speak to more people, you're only going to get.
• 23:11
  Speaker 1: You're only going to get better.
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: So it's only ever going to lead you to more opportunities.
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: If you're willing to put yourself out of that comfort zone on a consistent basis in the compound effect, it will happen.
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: It's exactly the same as social media.
• 23:21
  Speaker 1: If you post once a month against, you know, posting every day or three times a week, you're going to see a hell of a better return on it if you can do it and you're consistent with it.
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: And I think it's exactly the same with going to these networking events and face-to-face.
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: And I have been doing more of face-to-face over the last year.
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: You know I building the financial plan of life.
• 23:38
  Speaker 1: It was social media led, podcasty led.
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: It was webcam based and I was meeting people over face to face on webcams.
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: But now I'm stepping outside of behind the computer and I'm even going to presenting.
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: I was at the cisi event, uh, presented to loads of people about a career within financial planning.
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: I was petrified.
• 23:52
  Speaker 1: People like why are you petrified saying you're sam from a financial plan of life.
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: You're talking to people all day long, but it's a different skill set and it's a different environment and my body and my brain wasn't used to it.
• 24:02
  Speaker 1: So I had to prepare for it.
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: You know, I wrote a script, I went to the printers, I got some cards with financial plan of life on the back and I had it all on there.
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: It was all color coded.
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: Preparation is massively important, you know, if you're going to feel uncomfortable, yeah, you can go in and get stuck in, but just give yourself a bit of preparation because, at the end of the things also as well is I think it's massively important.
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: When you go to these networking events, you can see so many people.
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: You have some fantastic conversations, right.
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: What are you doing about keeping in contact with those people?
• 24:30
  Speaker 2: So that's definitely an area of improvement for me.
• 24:32
  Speaker 2: Again, as someone who loves the process, I'm quite surprised I don't have as much as a process when it comes to actual follow-up afterwards.
• 24:40
  Speaker 2: I definitely want to have something in place where I reach out afterwards and say, like it was lovely to meet you.
• 24:45
  Speaker 2: I definitely think if you go to an event where you meet a lot of people I had this over the summer last year and I should have taken the advice we're talking about now is to follow up afterwards with them and be like it was so lovely to meet at this event, because I think that's another thing.
• 24:58
  Speaker 2: If you end up adding a lot of people on LinkedIn, it can be quite hard to keep track of where did I meet that person?
• 25:03
  Speaker 2: What is our connection again?
• 25:05
  Speaker 2: So I think if you just follow up and say, oh, it was lovely to meet you at this particular network event last night, it'd be great to go for a coffee, continue our conversation, it's such an easy way to keep the conversation going and remind yourself oh, yes, I met them at this event.
• 25:20
  Speaker 2: So even if they take a while to come back to you or they book something in, it's helpful to have that kind of audit trail, I guess, of how I met them, what the conversation was and where that led.
• 25:30
  Speaker 1: One thing you mentioned there LinkedIn actually and it's such a great way to be able to keep in contact with people.
• 25:35
  Speaker 1: So if you're looking at that list before you go, then you can look on LinkedIn first of all and build a list.
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: You might even do an introduction message before you actually go.
• 25:41
  Speaker 1: But I think a lot of people, when they look at linkedin in respect of the tool to be able to follow up with people, they're using like the basic free version you said it's quite difficult to organize things on linkedin.
• 25:54
  Speaker 1: Yep, pay for sales navigator okay, so sales navigator, you bring that up.
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: There's so much deep information that you can get from that person as well where they work, who they work with, how much type of people that, how those type of people earn average earnings within that profession.
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: There's loads of real sort of pinpointed data that you can get that will help you in your preparation for when you end up going for a meeting with that individual.
• 26:18
  Speaker 1: But what you can also do is categorize in it so you can create projects and keep a track of those individuals, so you're not just using linkedin and don't use linkedin as an instagram and well you you get on well with instagram.
• 26:31
  Speaker 1: We'll talk about that in a minute.
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: Uh, an oran coil, who had on the podcast, has done amazing on instagram, right?
• 26:36
  Speaker 1: What I'm saying is don't add all your mates on it.
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: Add the people professional network on it that you want to connect with and in sales navigator, you can deep dive on those.
• 26:45
  Speaker 1: You can categorize those and it won't cost you a great deal of money on a monthly basis.
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: But also it allows you to in-mail them as well.
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: So if you don't have to send a connection request, you can just message them straight or it could be somebody that you think well, actually I remember speaking to that person, but I really wanted to speak to that person and I overheard something.
• 27:01
  Speaker 1: Now you might send a them a connection request and say I was at a networking event, I didn't get the chance to speak to you.
• 27:06
  Speaker 1: Can we connect?
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: Well, you could just send an email.
• 27:08
  Speaker 1: I was at a networking event and what you said I was eavesdropping and what you said was fantastic.
• 27:13
  Speaker 1: Could I have a meeting with you?
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: Someone's more inclined to open an email than they are a connection request?
• 27:17
  Speaker 1: Because you can have 150 connection requests unopened and people like recruits is trying to get you to yes so using linkedin in conjunction with networking, I think's really, really important in respect to the follow-up.
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: So do you ask for details from them when you're with them?
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: Is that the sort of thing that you do?
• 27:35
  Speaker 2: so, again, that's been a learn for me personally.
• 27:38
  Speaker 2: At the beginning I was like, oh, I'll grab them before the end, I'll make sure we have that chance to get each other's details.
• 27:43
  Speaker 2: And after going to quite a few networking events where we all left really quickly or they were in mid-conversation with someone else and it felt too rude to say anything, I realized, okay, I need to perfect basically my way of gathering this information.
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: So now, before someone leaves, I always say can we connect somehow?
• 28:00
  Speaker 2: I offer yes.
• 28:02
  Speaker 2: As you mentioned earlier, I like Instagram, so I offer both.
• 28:03
  Speaker 2: I say we can connect on LinkedIn or Instagram, whatever you prefer.
• 28:07
  Speaker 2: I do love the fact with LinkedIn, if you go on the search bar, you've got that QR code and it just makes it so much easier than having a business card where it's very much like oh, I'll give you my business card, and then you have had that before and you give quite a few out and you go oh, I gave out like 15 business cards today.
• 28:22
  Speaker 2: I had a great day.
• 28:23
  Speaker 2: You hear nothing.
• 28:24
  Speaker 2: You're like oh, okay, again.
• 28:26
  Speaker 2: Lesson learned that puts the ball in their court and sometimes that can be a bit too much.
• 28:30
  Speaker 2: So either exchange business cards or, just for me.
• 28:33
  Speaker 2: I go straight to LinkedIn now, unless I did learn.
• 28:36
  Speaker 2: Actually, uh, just beforemas I was at an event that was uh, under the floor, basically it's a couple of levels down, was in the basement of a hotel, no signal, so note yourself.
• 28:46
  Speaker 2: Always good to have a backup, so do take some business cards just in case.
• 28:49
  Speaker 2: But usually linkedin works and I find that's easiest way of connecting.
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: Do you use linkedin qr code?
• 28:56
  Speaker 2: exactly does that work quite well, because I've never done that oh love it use it all the time, especially when you use it with someone who doesn't know it.
• 29:01
  Speaker 2: It makes you seem like a magician.
• 29:03
  Speaker 2: You're like, oh my gosh, did you know?
• 29:04
  Speaker 2: It's like, wow, that's so cool a conversation piece as well.
• 29:07
  Speaker 1: I guess if you become quite astute and quite well known within the networking circle and you also know all the networking events, I suppose one of the great ways to kind of build a friendship quite quickly is to say look, there's a great networking event going on wednesday.
• 29:17
  Speaker 1: Do you want to come with me?
• 29:18
  Speaker 2: can I get you a?
• 29:19
  Speaker 1: ticket, or can you know?
• 29:20
  Speaker 1: You can come along to this one with me if you like.
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: We can have a bit more of a chat.
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: There's some really interesting people that you'd like to meet.
• 29:25
  Speaker 1: Um, I suppose the idea is that when people think about networking, they're going to rock up and they're going to win a client every single time.
• 29:30
  Speaker 1: Right, but the reality there as well.
• 29:31
  Speaker 1: But let's talk about the introducer element to it.
• 29:33
  Speaker 1: So you touched on it earlier.
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: Have you picked up some really interesting introducers to widen your network of opportunities to cross refer?
• 29:50
  Speaker 2: So in a way, yes, I've definitely approached it in the sense that if I meet someone, they can either directly become a client.
• 29:58
  Speaker 2: Sense that if I meet someone, they can either directly become a client, and that's amazing.
• 30:02
  Speaker 2: They might not be a client, but they might know someone who could be a direct client and that might be a family member, it could be a colleague, or there's someone who works in a field that actually might lead to quite a lot of referrals.
• 30:12
  Speaker 2: So I've been building up my board is how I like to talk about it.
• 30:15
  Speaker 2: So that's a mixture of professional connections.
• 30:18
  Speaker 2: So it's accountants, it's lawyers, I've got an art dealer, I've got a tailor, so a mixture of different trades as well.
• 30:24
  Speaker 2: So traditional, not so traditional, but I called them my board because they are there.
• 30:29
  Speaker 2: If a client needs that level of expertise, I've got someone else I can refer them to and that's not my area, for example, a lawyer or a tailor, um, but also for them.
• 30:38
  Speaker 2: They then got this financial advisor that they have a client who's looking for something in my area.
• 30:44
  Speaker 2: They can then pass it to me.
• 30:46
  Speaker 2: So they're, as I would say, the introducers.
• 30:47
  Speaker 2: They're there to be like okay, great, I've got that connection I can pass something on to you and I think it really helps as well is to have a way to introduce yourself that they can then use with the clients as well to take it to that next step.
• 30:59
  Speaker 2: So instead of just saying like great, pass people my way, they might not know what's the best way of approaching that.
• 31:05
  Speaker 2: So I now have, and again I tailor it to the individual, but I'll have a couple of sentences to say this is Natasha, she does this, this is her kind of background.
• 31:13
  Speaker 2: You can see her reviews on this platform.
• 31:14
  Speaker 2: So it's taking that hurdle out of that process and making it easier for people to introduce you to others yeah, love it, fantastic.
• 31:23
  Speaker 1: Let's talk about linkedin, then, because that's that's.
• 31:25
  Speaker 1: You're talking about face-to-face networking, right, um, it's getting out there just putting on a nice suit, doing your makeup, getting in a taxi.
• 31:33
  Speaker 1: It's maybe buying a few drinks.
• 31:35
  Speaker 1: It's a bit of an expense attached to going out to networking events on a regular basis.
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: Right, there is an investment from a cost perspective and time perspective.
• 31:43
  Speaker 1: Yes, um, but there is also networking online.
• 31:46
  Speaker 1: We talked about that earlier.
• 31:47
  Speaker 1: Some of the ones that are like in um, okay, community based ones, maybe group chats.
• 31:51
  Speaker 1: Just briefly talk about those ones how you know, like, how good are they really?
• 31:59
  Speaker 2: so I've got one that I joined that actually started uh beginning of last year, so they've been going for about a year now and that, for me, has been fantastic, because I actually started following the woman who started it before, just before she launched this online network, and she uh is really lovely.
• 32:17
  Speaker 2: Whenever I join one, she's always asking how I'm doing and points out that I'm the only financial advisor in the group, so if anyone has any financial questions, she instantly sends them my way.
• 32:25
  Speaker 2: So from that perspective, that's been amazing, because then I know that's my kind of network.
• 32:30
  Speaker 2: Effectively, no one else is ever going to be allowed into it, and and to have the person who runs it being such a big advocate for me is huge.
• 32:38
  Speaker 2: So that, for me, is a very precious network and I really appreciate uh being a part of that and the way that they treat me.
• 32:44
  Speaker 2: Um, I've got another network that's like a hybrid, I guess, so they have in-person events and you can go along to that, but they started doing um zoom sessions, I think, monthly, and I've joined one or two so far.
• 32:55
  Speaker 2: Um still trying to figure that one out, uh, in terms of, you know, is it worth the time?
• 33:01
  Speaker 2: What could potentially come from it.
• 33:02
  Speaker 2: Um, so I'm not entirely sure on that one yet, but again I think it's that thing of trying things, see what works and what doesn't.
• 33:09
  Speaker 2: So the first 100 love it, try and go to as many events I can.
• 33:12
  Speaker 2: That they do.
• 33:13
  Speaker 2: And that's all online so far, um.
• 33:15
  Speaker 2: Second one, tbc.
• 33:17
  Speaker 2: We'll see how that one goes.
• 33:18
  Speaker 2: But again I think it's it's trying, it is seeing what works.
• 33:21
  Speaker 2: Yes, as you said, it's a lot easier.
• 33:23
  Speaker 2: I don't have to travel anywhere.
• 33:24
  Speaker 2: I'm going to buy drinks.
• 33:25
  Speaker 2: It is cheaper, it is less time spent on it, but you still need to know it's worth what you're giving to it effectively yeah, absolutely.
• 33:37
  Speaker 1: There's one called the dura society, isn't there is?
• 33:39
  Speaker 2: that yes, with lottie leaf.
• 33:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, leaf, she's lottie kent originally, I think.
• 33:43
  Speaker 2: Oh, maybe no lottie leaf.
• 33:45
  Speaker 1: Okay, I think maybe I know a lottie lottie kent, maybe that all looks quite interesting, doesn't it what she's done with that, that kind of almost premium connection list and you touched on that earlier about things like having an art dealer as an introducer- that the art dealer.
• 34:03
  Speaker 1: I did meet one of her events yeah, yeah, how do you find that then?
• 34:06
  Speaker 1: Because obviously you can go to these different events and you can actually pick up some quite well-known people within specific areas and they've got, you know, quite a large following or a community in themselves.
• 34:13
  Speaker 1: And it's that kind of thinking out the side of the box and not just thinking accountants or solicitors.
• 34:18
  Speaker 1: It's thinking, well, who else can I connect with that might deal with the type of clients that would need financial advice from someone like yourself, or financial planning right, hopefully high net worth people I was gonna say I'm smiling because I know I've got this in one of my notebooks from, I think, from around the time we first started talking.
• 34:35
  Speaker 2: It was like what is pbwm in?
• 34:37
  Speaker 2: Like the future?
• 34:38
  Speaker 2: This is before I joined the academy, so it's me still trying to spitball what I could be in the industry, and one of them was you know who would I want as connections that, yeah, I could potentially have as useful things for my clients.
• 34:50
  Speaker 2: And it was a real mixture because I didn't know back then what we're seeing as traditional professional connections as we know them.
• 34:56
  Speaker 2: So, yeah, you've got the accountants and the lawyers are kind of the typical ones everyone thinks of, but I had on mine, yeah, exactly, the art advisor.
• 35:02
  Speaker 2: I wanted someone connected to schools because I thought, you know, getting children to secondary school could be quite a complicated affair in terms of figuring out where to go, what the costs, all the other things consider, and I have actually got someone, uh, on my board for that as well.
• 35:15
  Speaker 2: So, yeah, it's trying to think beyond what's the the typical that a lot of people go for, taking a different approach, what, yeah, exactly, would my clients like that I could then go out there, meet with them and have them on my board effectively so, as and when a client needs something.
• 35:31
  Speaker 2: I've proactively got that relationship and that's something I really wanted to tap into as a proactiveness and I say this to all the ones I've met I want to meet you now.
• 35:39
  Speaker 2: I don't necessarily need you now in terms of my clients, but I'd like to know as and when a client does need you.
• 35:45
  Speaker 1: We've already built up a relationship and I trust you and I'd be comfortable referring you it's really good as well, because those kind of art dealers and they tend to be on social media as well, so you're trying to find people that are influential in the real world but also do have an interest and a reliance upon using social media and art is visual, right, so people are going to want to follow an art dealer, or an art dealer is going to want to be noticed online.
• 36:11
  Speaker 1: So, from a connection basis and being able to piggyback, market with them and partner up in some form or some capacity so she can talk to your audience and you can talk to her audience or his whoever it is um is a really vital way to to kind of get yourself out there, and it kind of leads us into the subject now, really, um, of your second key takeaway so, which is online presence, right, yes, so let's talk a little bit about that.
• 36:35
  Speaker 1: So why is that one of your sort of vital key takeaways from your first couple of years, then?
• 36:39
  Speaker 2: so, again going back to kind of the notebook and what my kind of initial thoughts were, I always thought online presence was important because, unlike a dentist or a mechanic, a wealth manager isn't necessarily someone people automatically seek out.
• 36:54
  Speaker 2: So I thought, okay, I need to create an online brand or an online reputation so people want to connect with me, as opposed to being like, oh, do I have to work with a financial advisor?
• 37:04
  Speaker 2: Aren't they like just car salesmen, but for money?
• 37:07
  Speaker 2: You know it's like how do you kind of shift the reputation?
• 37:11
  Speaker 2: I was very aware coming into it and we had to do SWOT analysis with SJP and I was like this industry does not have the best of reputations.
• 37:18
  Speaker 2: I'm having to go against that individually as well as the whole industry thinking how do we tackle that?
• 37:24
  Speaker 2: And so I need to have a strong online presence to try and overcome that.
• 37:28
  Speaker 2: So it was more broad, I guess, as opposed to just you know, I want to look great online.
• 37:35
  Speaker 2: It was like how do I change the story around wealth managers and what we're like?
• 37:39
  Speaker 2: And you know there are other jokes like what is a traditional wealth manager?
• 37:42
  Speaker 2: Yes, it is like a 57 year old man, fine, but it's showing that there are other people online.
• 37:48
  Speaker 2: So I think, for me again, I'm still kind of figuring out how I portray myself online.
• 37:53
  Speaker 2: I did post earlier this year that I want to start doing more videos where I talk about things.
• 37:57
  Speaker 2: I've only done one video so far.
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: That is definitely.
• 38:01
  Speaker 2: Let's talk about comfort zones.
• 38:02
  Speaker 2: That's still outside my comfort zone and I need a bit of mental space, I think, before I can fully engage with doing that more regularly.
• 38:09
  Speaker 2: But it's something I want to put out there as an intention.
• 38:11
  Speaker 2: I want to start doing that.
• 38:13
  Speaker 2: I want to have more kind of conversations with my community, and that's generally how I see it is the idea of I'm building a connection with people.
• 38:25
  Speaker 2: Yes, it's online, but I don't think that changes the fact that you're creating these connections with people to try and educate them, guide them.
• 38:28
  Speaker 2: You know, provide a different viewpoint on what having a better relationship with your finances can look like, and so I quite like the fact that I'm always like it's about being engaging with your finances.
• 38:38
  Speaker 2: It's about wanting to have those conversations as opposed to fighting it and being like, no, I don't want to look at my finances until I really have to.
• 38:45
  Speaker 2: I don't want to be the dentist where you're only going once you've got, you know, your tooth decaying and it's about to fall out, I want people to come in saying, no, I want to have great teeth, how do I achieve that?
• 38:53
  Speaker 2: From the get go.
• 38:54
  Speaker 2: So I'm always saying it's all about the journey, not the destination.
• 38:57
  Speaker 2: So it's having an online presence isn't necessarily means to an end, but it's just showing there's different wealth managers out there.
• 39:05
  Speaker 2: We have different approaches.
• 39:06
  Speaker 2: We are trying to make it engaging.
• 39:07
  Speaker 2: We are trying to make it more understandable and fun and kind of showing that online is an easier way of showing it.
• 39:14
  Speaker 1: I'm a massive advocate of building an online personal brand because it's worked for me.
• 39:20
  Speaker 1: Building an online personal brand came first for me and then face to face came second, so that was mine, but it took years to get myself to a point where I was recognizable, and now I'm massively recognizable.
• 39:36
  Speaker 2: Exactly Stopped in the street.
• 39:38
  Speaker 2: I'm kind of a big deal.
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah, everyone knows me Well.
• 39:42
  Speaker 1: Well, that's what I think anyway, but that's what you've got to tell yourself as well.
• 39:44
  Speaker 2: to build that confidence.
• 39:45
  Speaker 1: Right you do have to tell yourself sometimes that you know the old motto fake it till you make it right.
• 39:49
  Speaker 1: So and that kind of gets you through posting content.
• 39:52
  Speaker 1: You've got to get past that point of like.
• 39:53
  Speaker 1: Oh god, I feel really scared to do this, like you're saying about the post you did a couple of weeks ago, and then you don't do another one because you're sort of telling yourself it's too hard, it's too this and the other, and the aim of the game is whip your phone out, say something into it, put the subtitles on it and whip it down.
• 40:08
  Speaker 1: And I used to time myself how quickly can I get a social post out?
• 40:12
  Speaker 1: And also, I was aware all the time of like when I was thinking about things I'd be like that's a great social post.
• 40:17
  Speaker 1: So I'd post it and often the thing that came to me like an idea or a thought, I would just put it straight out and I used to get a return on it instantly.
• 40:27
  Speaker 1: The ones where I sat and thought about it and tried to script it and really overthought the whole process might got no engagement and I'm like that time wasted on it.
• 40:36
  Speaker 1: You should really listen to the podcast I recorded with Oren Coyle from St James's Place.
• 40:41
  Speaker 1: He's over in Northern Ireland.
• 40:42
  Speaker 1: He's got like 16,000 followers on Instagram and we go into it.
• 40:46
  Speaker 1: We go into his journey and he's the same.
• 40:48
  Speaker 1: You know, two or three years has taken him, really has taken him a long time through trial and error and building that online personal brand.
• 40:59
  Speaker 1: He had to do it because it was COVID.
• 41:01
  Speaker 1: You know he had no choice, but it wasn't easy and he didn't win every single time.
• 41:08
  Speaker 1: But one thing he will say is it's consistency.
• 41:10
  Speaker 1: One of the things I picked up from him as well, it's making them aware of what they're missing out on.
• 41:14
  Speaker 1: So a tax post, for instance, someone who's a business owner could be missing out on a tax.
• 41:20
  Speaker 1: Advanced vantage, like maybe having life cover through their business and saving money on that, for instance, is a great way to save money and protect yourself and your families.
• 41:29
  Speaker 1: But not a lot of people know that who run businesses because they're so busy running their businesses.
• 41:33
  Speaker 2: So create something that gives the opportunity for that person to recognize that they're missing out on something totally, and I think people respond a lot more to loss than gain and that's been shown in studies is if you have investments and they grow 10 or they go down 10, people feel the fact that it goes down by 10 so much more than it ever.
• 41:53
  Speaker 2: Feel that 10 game, regardless of when it happens in the journey.
• 41:55
  Speaker 2: And I think, yeah, exactly the idea of the FOMO, basically the you know you missed out on something.
• 42:00
  Speaker 2: And again, it might be things people don't know, like you said, they're missing out on and just by highlighting it, they're like oh okay, I wasn't aware of that.
• 42:07
  Speaker 2: No, I know I'm missing out.
• 42:08
  Speaker 2: I had that strong reaction to it.
• 42:10
  Speaker 2: I need to now do something about it.
• 42:11
  Speaker 2: And it's creating those strong reactions to be like I need to then take action.
• 42:15
  Speaker 1: Yeah, also as well, I think.
• 42:16
  Speaker 1: I think people get overwhelmed by numbers as well, like how many followers you've got you.
• 42:20
  Speaker 1: You know, I'm obviously not going to make it online because the financial advisor over there has got 16 000 right.
• 42:25
  Speaker 1: It's not about that.
• 42:26
  Speaker 1: It's about making sure that the people that are following you are relevant and the people you follow are relevant and that you're liking and you're engaging, that people are seeing you.
• 42:35
  Speaker 1: It's not a massive numbers game.
• 42:37
  Speaker 1: You can be super duper niche on it.
• 42:38
  Speaker 1: So if you are niching down on art dealers, find art dealers.
• 42:41
  Speaker 1: You're going out and you're networking with art dealers add your art dealers and get them to follow you on instagram.
• 42:46
  Speaker 1: Use linkedin.
• 42:47
  Speaker 1: You'll be able to find them all on linkedin super easy, and not just the ones that you want to connect with, but also ones that are in the wider network, because you can specifically target, based on job title, for instance.
• 42:58
  Speaker 1: So, using social media to be really niche and really specific on who you're trying to find and then engage with those types of individuals that's where I think it can be really beneficial, not just I'm going to put something out and hope something lands and comes with me.
• 43:11
  Speaker 1: You've got to be quite matter of fact about it.
• 43:13
  Speaker 1: You've got to be quite targeted and you can do that on an organic basis.
• 43:16
  Speaker 1: You don't have to do it on a paid basis, you can do it on an organic basis.
• 43:18
  Speaker 1: You don't have to do it on a paid basis, you can do it on an organic basis, naturally.
• 43:20
  Speaker 1: I mean, if we take a look at LinkedIn, for example right, and it's a platform that recruitment companies use all the time.
• 43:26
  Speaker 1: Recruiters make loads of money on LinkedIn.
• 43:29
  Speaker 1: Right, I don't see many financial planners using it, yet.
• 43:33
  Speaker 1: All your clients are on there.
• 43:35
  Speaker 1: You can specifically target people based on job title.
• 43:39
  Speaker 1: All your introducers are on there.
• 43:41
  Speaker 1: You can cast.
• 43:41
  Speaker 1: You can specifically target people based on job title.
• 43:42
  Speaker 1: All your introducers are on there.
• 43:43
  Speaker 1: There's loads of groups on there.
• 43:44
  Speaker 1: The platform isn't a recruitment platform anymore.
• 43:47
  Speaker 1: It's a networking platform.
• 43:49
  Speaker 1: It's.
• 43:49
  Speaker 1: You know that the ties come off and people are relaxing on there a bit more, so you can show a little bit more about your personal brand and educate people, because it's very much an education platform as well.
• 43:58
  Speaker 1: I did a great podcast with paulo forsberg, who's like a bit of a linkedin expert, and we've partnered and we're offering financial planners the ability for us to take over their actual profiles, work with them to specifically understand exactly who their niche clients actually are, and we go out and specifically target those individuals with not like robo text or, you know, chat gpt.
• 44:26
  Speaker 1: We're talking like really well crafted messages that are getting results and diary booking straight into the diary.
• 44:33
  Speaker 1: So you've got really good quality clients.
• 44:35
  Speaker 1: Now, somebody starting out in their career might not be able to afford a service like that, but something like LinkedIn, you can send 100 connection quests a week.
• 44:44
  Speaker 1: 100 connection quests If you go to your networking event, right, yes, and do you send out 100 business cards in a day?
• 44:53
  Speaker 2: Definitely not no, so that's what it's like.
• 44:54
  Speaker 1: So that's what it's like.
• 44:55
  Speaker 1: So you could literally connect with your solicitors, your accountants, your art dealers, your professional football players, your football coaches or agents, or whoever it is that you think that your niche target audience or your niche client that you're looking to go for.
• 45:11
  Speaker 1: You can find those people on there and you can introduce yourself to them and you can send a connection request.
• 45:15
  Speaker 1: So, following something as simple as the 20-10-5 methodology, right.
• 45:19
  Speaker 1: So every day, be consistent 20 new connection requests.
• 45:23
  Speaker 1: Be consistent 10 messages, send 10 messages.
• 45:26
  Speaker 1: So ones that connected yesterday, send them 10 messages, five comments or interactions.
• 45:32
  Speaker 1: So, if you do that every single day for the next year, natasha, right.
• 45:37
  Speaker 1: Challenge Challenge day for the next year.
• 45:42
  Speaker 1: Natasha right challenge challenge.
• 45:43
  Speaker 1: I promise you, if you're targeted with it, you are going to get results.
• 45:46
  Speaker 2: It's as simple as that.
• 45:47
  Speaker 1: It will work like the sound of that and your audience will grow and you'll post and dedicate yourself to post and say three times a week, right, you're doing on instagram anyway.
• 45:55
  Speaker 1: Just repurpose it and put it on linkedin.
• 45:56
  Speaker 1: You know it's a simple way to do it start looking at linkedin.
• 46:00
  Speaker 1: And financial planners need to start looking at linkedin as networking on steroids.
• 46:04
  Speaker 1: Go to your networking face-to-face events, right, but use linkedin, build those connections, send those messages, interact with their posts, because you start to get seen who is this natasha commented on my posts and all that typical type of stuff.
• 46:17
  Speaker 1: And if you use things like linkedin navigator, sales navigator you can even see whether or not that person has been online.
• 46:23
  Speaker 1: So if they haven't been online for a year, why bother?
• 46:26
  Speaker 1: Why send them a message?
• 46:28
  Speaker 1: So if you know that they're active, it will tell you they're active.
• 46:30
  Speaker 1: It'll tell you loads of information about them as well, and there's loads of things that you can do like a lead system and you can.
• 46:35
  Speaker 1: You can process it through like a lead system how you would interact and you could comment on their posts, and it'll bring up.
• 46:39
  Speaker 1: You can start to follow certain types of people and it will recommend the post that you should comment on interesting yeah, it's like you would love it yeah
• 46:48
  Speaker 1: you would absolutely love it.
• 46:49
  Speaker 1: So invest in.
• 46:50
  Speaker 1: I would say invest in like I don't know how much it is like sales navigator these days it's like 69 quid a month or something like that.
• 46:55
  Speaker 1: You can get like for 50 off at the moment.
• 46:57
  Speaker 1: I'd invest in it, I'd do some training in it because you're so out active out there anyone the face-to-face, just to see what you can also do online.
• 47:06
  Speaker 1: And all of a sudden, when you're online and you're going face-to-face, people start to recognize you totally, it feeds into each other yeah, london essentially is quite small in the networking scene.
• 47:14
  Speaker 1: Right, it's kind of cool.
• 47:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah, talk to us about instagram then.
• 47:18
  Speaker 1: So do you post on instagram?
• 47:20
  Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, so you get out there and you use instagram.
• 47:23
  Speaker 1: Is that like your platform of choice then?
• 47:25
  Speaker 2: yes, I definitely say of all the platforms, linkedin and instagram, my two favorites.
• 47:29
  Speaker 2: Linkedin linkedin I do treat is more educational and so that's more kind of like financial is what I tend to post.
• 47:36
  Speaker 2: Instagram is a lot more kind of like in the life of a wealth manager because I find them easier posts to create.
• 47:43
  Speaker 2: So it'll be.
• 47:44
  Speaker 2: Oh, I haven't posted in a week.
• 47:45
  Speaker 2: Ok, well, last week I was at this event and that event and I had a coffee meeting here and I also went and spoke at this event.
• 47:51
  Speaker 2: Let me try and make one of those into a post.
• 47:53
  Speaker 2: So I find it a lot easier to be like this is what I'm up to, and also easier to be like this is what I'm up to.
• 47:57
  Speaker 2: And also I think it's quite helpful to get an insight into what life is as a wealth manager for both people potentially wanting to become a wealth manager, but also for clients.
• 48:04
  Speaker 2: It's also kind of like well, what you know?
• 48:06
  Speaker 2: Lifting the curtain, what do you do?
• 48:08
  Speaker 2: What is this you know, involved in this?
• 48:09
  Speaker 2: Um, I definitely think I could be more tailored we're talking about tailoring earlier with my approach and how I go about it and I do not have a.
• 48:17
  Speaker 2: That is again on my to-do list is create a strategy.
• 48:20
  Speaker 2: As someone who loves process, it is very unusual that I don't have something for this, but I think, again, I've taken the approach of I want to try things, I want to see what works.
• 48:28
  Speaker 2: I definitely, yes, as I mentioned that I want to do more videos, create more things out.
• 48:33
  Speaker 2: There will be financial education, because I think that's being done.
• 48:36
  Speaker 2: I think a lot more people are creating financial education and I don't necessarily want to like enter fully that market, but I think the odd thing would be helpful and again, for me it's creating that community.
• 48:47
  Speaker 2: Like you said, it's not necessarily about how many followers I have, it's about followers who want to engage.
• 48:51
  Speaker 2: So that's something I do at the moment is I post every Monday and Friday, and it's nothing to do with finance.
• 48:56
  Speaker 2: It's literally like Monday I try and pick an inspirational video or something a bit crazy, so it could be someone parachuting off a giant rock or trying to like skateboard off something, something a bit fun like that, and it's always happy Monday, hope you have a great week.
• 49:10
  Speaker 2: So it's kind of encouraging, because that's naturally who I am as a person.
• 49:14
  Speaker 2: I like to encourage other people and then Friday is always like happy Friday, we made it through the week and that will be like a beautiful sunset or you know something really peaceful or calming or or a big party.
• 49:24
  Speaker 2: If I'm like, yeah, it's gonna be a party weekend, I'm gonna put that on my instagram.
• 49:28
  Speaker 2: Nothing to do with finance at all, but I have been to networking events.
• 49:31
  Speaker 2: People have come up to me and said, oh, I know you because your instagram posts on mondays and fridays.
• 49:35
  Speaker 2: So I'm now becoming a little bit I'm still not known I would never say I'm known, but a little bit known for doing this.
• 49:40
  Speaker 2: And it's nothing to do with finance, but it's to do with authenticity.
• 49:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I love it.
• 49:44
  Speaker 2: It's easy to do, totally makes sense for me and I think people relate to it.
• 49:49
  Speaker 2: They're like, yes, monday suck.
• 49:50
  Speaker 2: Give me something to get me through it relatability isn't be yourself totally be your life.
• 50:07
  Speaker 1: Your life.
• 50:08
  Speaker 1: You are lifestyle focused.
• 50:09
  Speaker 1: You're out and about, you're doing things, and that's what I love about natasha percy baxter.
• 50:12
  Speaker 1: If I think about natasha percy baxter, I think about a buzzing round town, going to the, you know, having a glass of wine here and chatting to that person.
• 50:18
  Speaker 1: And that was what it was like when I came up and met you in for your graduation.
• 50:21
  Speaker 1: Yeah, made a drink, didn't we?
• 50:22
  Speaker 1: It felt fun and you're here, there and everywhere, and you're busy and you're interesting.
• 50:27
  Speaker 1: I think that's exactly how you should portray yourself.
• 50:29
  Speaker 1: You need to lean in to who you actually are, because as soon as you lean into exactly who you are, people relate to you.
• 50:35
  Speaker 1: People go I like Natasha, I want to be Natasha's friend, she's like me or she's doing things that I'd like to do.
• 50:41
  Speaker 1: So don't try to kind of feel like I've got to educate people all the time.
• 50:44
  Speaker 1: It's like like no, people just want someone they can relate to.
• 50:52
  Speaker 1: They relate to you.
• 50:53
  Speaker 1: Then they will buy from you.
• 50:54
  Speaker 1: You know that's massive, it's a massive part of it.
• 50:55
  Speaker 1: So like authenticity, being yourself unapologetically is so, is so important.
• 50:57
  Speaker 1: And transfer that to linkedin.
• 50:58
  Speaker 1: You said something about I like to keep linkedin.
• 51:00
  Speaker 1: It's like you know, prim and proper, I'll put my put my suit on.
• 51:02
  Speaker 1: For linkedin instagram I'll wear a t-shirt.
• 51:04
  Speaker 1: You know it's like no, just be yourself on on linkedin is crying out for someone to stand out who's being themselves.
• 51:11
  Speaker 1: That's, that's how you win on linkedin is be yourself, show who you actually are.
• 51:19
  Speaker 1: Loosen the tie a little bit and show exactly who you are.
• 51:22
  Speaker 1: You are relatable.
• 51:23
  Speaker 1: And again, remember, most of the people that are on linkedin right are business owners or they're working in companies.
• 51:30
  Speaker 1: Right, it's kind of business focused, yeah.
• 51:32
  Speaker 1: So loosen the tie a little bit, right, but talk about some of the things you're up to that might benefit your audience of accountants yes, yeah yeah, talk to talk to the people who will get you in front of the right people.
• 51:44
  Speaker 1: A b2c to me is it's hard graft.
• 51:47
  Speaker 1: B2b is fun.
• 51:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah, like switching it up and going b2b.
• 51:52
  Speaker 1: That's so much more fun.
• 51:53
  Speaker 1: Right and the purse strings man, they're they get, they get opened far easier than somebody you know.
• 52:00
  Speaker 1: B2c.
• 52:00
  Speaker 1: You sit in there kind of like, well you know, I'd rather just watch 100 hours of the free content you're providing.
• 52:05
  Speaker 1: Work it out for myself.
• 52:06
  Speaker 1: You know, people who are in businesses tend to be a bit more open to the fact that, ah right, natasha can come and do a wellness session with my staff or something along those lines, and that's a great approach, isn't it?
• 52:16
  Speaker 1: And you can use that on like LinkedIn and all that kind of stuff.
• 52:18
  Speaker 2: That's definitely something I'm leaning into this year is the idea of going we can do for your staff, and it's great because, especially post COVID, companies are still struggling to sometimes get employees back into actual office spaces and it's great to be able to be like let's have a session altogether.
• 52:36
  Speaker 2: And here's a way that I can make finances easy to understand, because auto enrollment and workplaces everyone signed up for a pension.
• 52:42
  Speaker 2: Talk to people about their pensions no idea, I know I have one.
• 52:45
  Speaker 2: How's out their pensions?
• 52:49
  Speaker 2: No idea, I know I have one.
• 52:50
  Speaker 2: How's invested?
• 52:50
  Speaker 2: No idea, you know.
• 52:50
  Speaker 2: What do you want out of it?
• 52:51
  Speaker 2: I don't know what income I need.
• 52:52
  Speaker 2: So it's having, yeah, exactly, businesses being like oh great, I can give that extra value to the people who work for me by bringing someone in to have those conversations.
• 52:58
  Speaker 2: That's definitely something I'm leaning a bit more into this year fabulous long form content works really well.
• 53:03
  Speaker 1: As well are you getting yourself on podcasts?
• 53:05
  Speaker 2: I mean bar you, not really, I'm single-handedly promoting you, Sasha.
• 53:10
  Speaker 2: I know it's fantastic.
• 53:13
  Speaker 1: I mean, podcasts are a fantastic way to piggyback again off of somebody's audience.
• 53:15
  Speaker 1: So, if you're a financial expert, it's like, well, what podcasts can I go on where they might want a financial expert?
• 53:22
  Speaker 1: So, if you've got a podcast that's dedicated to, I don't know, relationship problems right, relationship problems create money problems.
• 53:30
  Speaker 1: You know marriage breakups, that kind of thing, right.
• 53:32
  Speaker 1: So there's someone talking about wellness it's a great opportunity to jump on and talk about financial wellness.
• 53:37
  Speaker 1: There's so many different opportunities to be able to get yourself into podcasts, and one thing I would sort of say to you is have a look at all the different podcasts that are out there who might well be talking to the audience that you want to engage with.
• 53:48
  Speaker 1: Think outside of financial podcasts and think, think more towards people that aren't financial but you coming on and doing a simple conversation about the basics of finance would really benefit their audience.
• 54:01
  Speaker 1: So if you've got like a pt or something like that, right.
• 54:03
  Speaker 1: So a personal trainer, their audience may be massive.
• 54:07
  Speaker 2: Right, they never talk about financial fitness, but you could yeah, as you're saying this, I'm like I have a pilates teacher who teaches me online.
• 54:16
  Speaker 2: She's been off the last six months or so.
• 54:18
  Speaker 2: She had twins.
• 54:18
  Speaker 2: I'm like I might send this to her, so she's listening.
• 54:21
  Speaker 2: I'll pass it, of course, and be like what can we do together?
• 54:24
  Speaker 1: same as like mental health ones as well.
• 54:25
  Speaker 1: You know mental health and money go hand in hand.
• 54:27
  Speaker 1: You know, and things are good and obviously the podcasts that are aimed at women are you finding from a networking perspective and personal brand perspective, and are you finding being a female in the financial planning profession challenging, or you know there's an opportunity there for you?
• 54:42
  Speaker 2: oh, both, I think it's like the first answer comes to my mind.
• 54:44
  Speaker 2: So again, uh, so in terms of like, clients can be interesting, I definitely find you work with people you find relatable.
• 54:53
  Speaker 2: So I do have a lot of women who like working with me because I understand certain things that potentially, like an older or younger male wealth manager might not take into account.
• 55:02
  Speaker 2: So especially things around children, that aspect, things around children, that aspect, um, but in terms of networking, I do go to some that are female only because, again, I really like the idea of trying to have those conversations around money.
• 55:14
  Speaker 2: And I find when I have spoken at companies I have asked around the room who here talks about finance with their other half.
• 55:20
  Speaker 2: And I do remember speaking at one and, uh, one of the women in the room said she knew her husband was part of a whatsapp group with all his male friends and they chatted about money a lot in there.
• 55:28
  Speaker 2: And I said, well, one, are you in the group?
• 55:30
  Speaker 2: And two, do you have your own version?
• 55:31
  Speaker 2: And she said no to both.
• 55:32
  Speaker 2: So I'm very aware that most of the men I know are comfortable having financial conversations, but they tend to be with other men.
• 55:38
  Speaker 2: So I like being part of female networks, to be like, let's level it out, let's try and have conversations.
• 55:44
  Speaker 2: It's not about men shouldn't be having the conversations.
• 55:46
  Speaker 2: Fantastic, I love that, men having those conversations, but let's try and get more women having those conversations as well.
• 55:52
  Speaker 2: And I think I'm someone who, you know, I like a mixture.
• 55:56
  Speaker 2: I've never been someone.
• 55:57
  Speaker 2: What do I say?
• 55:58
  Speaker 2: I say I like, uh, routine, but I don't like repetition.
• 56:00
  Speaker 2: So I couldn't just be part of women's groups forever, because I think I like to have a bit of a mix-up.
• 56:06
  Speaker 2: So I'm not saying I go to events where it's just men as well, because that'd be weird.
• 56:09
  Speaker 2: I don't want to be the only one woman in the room either, but it's nice to be a mixture.
• 56:13
  Speaker 2: So some events are just women, some events are like 50 50.
• 56:16
  Speaker 2: Some events might be especially with rugby that might be that I'm one of like three women in the room out of a hundred, but absolutely fine.
• 56:23
  Speaker 2: Again, I played rugby at school and things like this.
• 56:25
  Speaker 2: So I'm very much used to being in a space that has a lot of men in it.
• 56:28
  Speaker 2: I'm very comfortable with that, but I quite like the variety.
• 56:31
  Speaker 2: So I'm not any one thing, it's a mixture.
• 56:34
  Speaker 1: Not hanging your hat on being a female advisor, for instance.
• 56:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I've seen them out there in fair play.
• 56:38
  Speaker 1: They're hanging their hat on it.
• 56:40
  Speaker 1: They're niching themselves down.
• 56:41
  Speaker 1: There is a massive shift in respect of wealth going over to women and it makes sense, but I think it does narrow you down a little bit and limits your opportunities to open up into other areas.
• 56:53
  Speaker 1: There is one sjp advisor I'm hoping to get on the podcast.
• 56:55
  Speaker 1: Actually she deals with millionaire, so divorcees of millionaire ceos yes, I think I know who you mean.
• 57:01
  Speaker 2: I think I've been following her on instagram, yeah, I thought that was really cool yeah I'm looking forward to hearing her story because her background wasn't one of wealth.
• 57:11
  Speaker 1: So for her to be advising women who are divorcing, ceos who earn over a million how niche is that I know I remember seeing it and being like, wow, that is a very clear market that you're targeting fantastic.
• 57:24
  Speaker 2: Because I think again, if you're that clear, it's so easy for people to then find you.
• 57:28
  Speaker 2: We talk about online reputation things.
• 57:29
  Speaker 2: Everyone's gonna be like, oh, she's the go-to person for it fantastic.
• 57:32
  Speaker 2: You've got to be really happy with that being your client base as well.
• 57:35
  Speaker 2: Forever to be that niched with it and I guess the longer you're in it, the more experience, the more you like it that would just never suit me.
• 57:41
  Speaker 1: I like the fact each of my clients is different and they're their own little challenge and thing you like the variety exactly yeah, that kind of approach from her would be like super niche in the sense, but it's also super high network where it's high net worth.
• 57:51
  Speaker 1: Yes, and that's where it could be super high net worth, I suppose, a million plus.
• 57:54
  Speaker 1: You never know what you know.
• 57:55
  Speaker 1: Never know what you might be picking up there.
• 57:57
  Speaker 1: Very interesting now.
• 57:58
  Speaker 1: I like seeing all the different, diverse ways that people are going out now and looking to engage and win clients and you know fantastic.
• 58:06
  Speaker 1: Thanks for sharing about your personal brand.
• 58:08
  Speaker 1: Thanks for sharing about the networking side.
• 58:09
  Speaker 1: So let's move on to your third key takeaway from your last year or so now as a SJP partner.
• 58:15
  Speaker 1: What would that be?
• 58:16
  Speaker 2: So it'd be client meetings because I think once you've done the networking and once you've done the online presence and again work in progress for me right now but once you've kind of worked on them, the kind of worked on them, the idea is at least the clients, and then it's really helpful to be like okay, let's make sure that part of what I'm doing is strong as well.
• 58:36
  Speaker 2: So again, we've talked about before.
• 58:37
  Speaker 2: I like a process.
• 58:38
  Speaker 2: So when I was on the academy I ended up writing a 15 page document of everything I thought I needed to know going into a meeting, everything from what kind of documents I should be taking to how best to present them, alternative ways of presenting them.
• 58:47
  Speaker 2: Again, because people process information in different ways.
• 58:50
  Speaker 2: Some people just want the facts, some people want to put into a story, other people want a visual element that goes with it.
• 58:55
  Speaker 2: So I fully like documented how I could go about doing this.
• 59:00
  Speaker 2: And my academy manager at the time was like that's fantastic, you're not going to take a 15 page document into a client meeting.
• 59:05
  Speaker 2: So by the end of that week I've made a one page bullet points.
• 59:08
  Speaker 2: So it's very much like okay, if we're going to discuss protection, here's the key things I should be thinking about.
• 59:12
  Speaker 2: Uh, we call it twig twig abio.
• 59:14
  Speaker 2: Whoever's watching this they've done it recently they'll remember exactly what I, what it is, and I probably said it slightly wrong, but it's all the different things you should be thinking about in terms of like, uh, like, what's the term for tw waiver of premium, et cetera, et cetera.
• 59:28
  Speaker 2: And so it was like how do I get that all on one document so it's ready for when I go into client meetings, especially when you're starting out, it can be quite nerve wracking.
• 59:36
  Speaker 2: There's a lot to think about, everything from like how am I sitting?
• 59:39
  Speaker 2: How am I presenting?
• 59:40
  Speaker 2: Am I speaking too fast?
• 59:41
  Speaker 2: Am I speaking too slow?
• 59:42
  Speaker 2: On the academy they talked about you a dog or a cat, and I love cats.
• 59:46
  Speaker 2: I thought I was a cat.
• 59:47
  Speaker 2: I am not a cat.
• 59:48
  Speaker 2: A cat is someone who's very symmetrical.
• 59:49
  Speaker 2: They're very matter-of-fact.
• 59:50
  Speaker 2: They don't nod, they don't smile.
• 59:51
  Speaker 2: We're both dogs.
• 59:53
  Speaker 1: I can tell you're smiling at me.
• 59:54
  Speaker 1: I'm a nodding dog.
• 59:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, I'm a dog.
• 59:55
  Speaker 2: Tell me, I'm a dog.
• 59:56
  Speaker 2: These things, let alone what you're actually meant to be covering in a meeting with a client.
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 2: So there's so many things to be thinking about and taking in.
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 2: So I found it really helpful to have this list of bullet points and even now, if it's been a while since I've done a meeting with a particular type of client, I can go back and be like oh, this is how I would present SJP or myself or how I go about the meeting, as opposed to if I did it with someone who's very familiar with me and wants a different approach what about the meeting itself?
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 1: and like a kind of script to follow, like a process to follow?
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 1: Um, do you ever do anything like like that?
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 1: Just to kind of keep you on track and based on, say, different scenarios that might come up within the meeting so, exactly so.
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 2: That's what I'm talking about is that kind of that bullet point exactly of having all these different things.
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 2: I have a notebook I take with me so I can put my notes directly into it, and I always put a couple of questions at the top of what I'm going to ask them at the start of the meeting.
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 2: Um, and then I have a couple of other points, if there's something else I want to flag.
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 2: So, for example, you've mentioned you're a certain age.
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 2: Have you thought about this?
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 2: Or you're earning a certain amount.
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 2: Have you thought about 60 tax or something like that?
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 2: So there might be the odd extra bullet point I put in there to remind myself to have that conversation around it.
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 1: Um, yeah, I think it's always helpful to have little reminders what about other things you would prepare yourself for when it comes to those meetings or anything sort of standout preparation, when it you're a very somebody, you're a prepper I am, you'd be on a prepper show, wouldn't you?
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 1: Yes, extreme preppers with natasha percy baxter.
• 1:01:23
  Speaker 1: Exactly what else do you do to prepare yourself to make sure you go in there and absolutely knock it dead and you know the end of the day.
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 1: You want to try and convert your first meetings, don't you?
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 1: You want them to go somewhere and I think, um, preparation is key.
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 1: So what, yeah, what other things are you doing?
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 1: What are you thinking about?
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 2: I do remember the first time I didn't have 100% conversion rate from meetings and that really had knocked me.
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 2: And then, obviously I was told by my personal sjp.
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 2: They were like you were never going to have a hundred percent conversion rate, like no one has that, and I was like, yeah, but I had it for so long, it was so tough to lose that.
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 2: Um.
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 2: So again, not, don't hold yourself to too high a standard, um, but I think it's about you know, giving yourself that preparation.
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 2: So, yes, we just talked about the bullet points, but I I like to have space either side of the meeting, so I like to go in there, really know who I'm talking to.
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 2: So I don't like to go back to back to back, because I think I would then be like who am I talking to?
• 1:02:08
  Speaker 2: Who are they?
• 1:02:09
  Speaker 2: What's their background?
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 2: How did they meet me?
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 2: That would be too intimidating for me.
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 2: I like to have at least half an hour breathing space before a meeting to be like okay, and I always get them now to complete a questionnaire beforehand so I have their details to hand, so I can be like okay, this is their name, this is their kind of like family situation.
• 1:02:25
  Speaker 2: They're married, they have kids.
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 2: They don't have kids.
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 2: They don't have someone else.
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 2: They, you know, live with their siblings if it's particularly young client or something like this.
• 1:02:33
  Speaker 2: So I know what kind of approach to take when I'm having the meeting.
• 1:02:39
  Speaker 2: Again, it's talking about networking earlier.
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 2: It's being prepared but not honestly having the expectations.
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 2: They might be a very different client to what you expected, especially if they've been referred to you and you've not met them before.
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 2: But it's about making sure that you go in there ready to, kind of like, lead the meeting.
• 1:02:54
  Speaker 2: So I always have an agenda as well, because I think it's helpful for us both to see what's going to happen in this meeting, because clients, if they've not met with a wealth manager before, don't necessarily know what to expect and it can be quite intimidating.
• 1:03:05
  Speaker 2: So it's putting yourself in their shoes.
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 2: What would I like and I do that all the time I go what would I like if I was in that person's shoes and I'd like to know what are we talking about today?
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 2: How are we going to go about it?
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 2: What should I be taking away from today if someone brings a notebook?
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 2: I always and I have been told this in my feedback sessions I give a lot of positive confirmation.
• 1:03:23
  Speaker 2: So if someone has a notebook, I'll be like I'm so glad you brought a notebook.
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 2: If they came with something prepared, I'm like fantastic job, you did that and I didn't realize I do it.
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 2: It's a natural part of who I am, so that's authentically who I am.
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 2: But they were like you give a lot of positive like confirmations if they do things and I was like, well, yeah, obviously it's fantastic they're doing that.
• 1:03:41
  Speaker 2: I don't want them to come in here and feel like I'm judging them or you know they should be of a higher level or something.
• 1:03:46
  Speaker 2: I want them to feel like it's comfortable, it's intimidating, talking about money.
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 2: I want to remove that kind of judgment and that fear around discussing it.
• 1:03:55
  Speaker 1: Have you found, going to these client meetings, that a client will often come along with a sense of anxiety about it or a preconception of what might happen, or even an ego and an intellectual pride perhaps?
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 2: Definitely.
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 2: I mean I've had all aspects, so I've definitely had clients come in thinking they know a lot more than I do.
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 2: And it's about testing me um, that was a fun one because I found a massive blind spot they didn't have.
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 2: So again, it's it's having that confidence.
• 1:04:20
  Speaker 2: You are the expert.
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 2: There is a reason why you're sat there and I have had those meetings where I'm like, oh my gosh, I wasn for that.
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 2: You know, they really tested me on a certain you know aspect.
• 1:04:30
  Speaker 2: That could be GDPR, it could be investment, it could be anything, but you're never going to be prepared for every single question that's going to come your way.
• 1:04:39
  Speaker 2: So it's knowing how to respond to it.
• 1:04:41
  Speaker 2: It can either be say as much as you feel comfortable talking about at that point, or it could just be like, let's talk about that another time.
• 1:04:48
  Speaker 2: I want to focus on this today.
• 1:04:49
  Speaker 2: Or do you know what?
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 2: I don't want to give you an answer that I'm not comfortable giving.
• 1:04:52
  Speaker 2: Let me make a note.
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 2: I'll research that.
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 2: I'll come back to you.
• 1:04:55
  Speaker 2: I think it's so much better to be honest and that's how I approach it.
• 1:04:59
  Speaker 2: You know all my conversations is if I don't know it, I'm going to give you as much information as I can around the subject matter.
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 2: But beyond that I'll make a note and I will generally go away and I'll find it, but I might not have that to hand.
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 1: How about meetings within your first couple of months?
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 1: I mean, how realistic is it to see loads of people when you're just starting out as a financial planner on your own?
• 1:05:21
  Speaker 1: Is it tough?
• 1:05:22
  Speaker 2: I think so.
• 1:05:23
  Speaker 2: Yes, we got taught in our academy intake that it was meant to be nine clients in 90 days and the only people I knew who achieved that was a small amount of the people who joined a practice, so they were automatically given that number of clients.
• 1:05:35
  Speaker 2: For most other people it's difficult, because I know people who've like put as many meetings as they can in the diary and they are back to back.
• 1:05:44
  Speaker 2: They are like right, I'm seeing every single person can.
• 1:05:46
  Speaker 2: And then what happened was they had so many meetings they had to then type up all the notes, because when you tend to be starting out, especially with your own practice, you don't have that support around you.
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 2: They then spent so long typing up the notes they didn't get back to the people in the timeline they had given.
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 2: So then they had clients potentially being like well, I don't want to sign up with you now because you promised one thing and you've not delivered on it.
• 1:06:06
  Speaker 2: What else might you not deliver on?
• 1:06:08
  Speaker 2: Or do you know what?
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 2: Actually upside, now is not a good time, so they start getting cold feet.
• 1:06:12
  Speaker 2: So I definitely took a slower approach from the get-go.
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 2: I knew I wanted to to deliver what I was saying to my clients I could and yeah, I definitely did not do nine clients in 90.
• 1:06:24
  Speaker 2: I saw a lot of, but I realized it takes so much longer to get them on as a client, whether that's because it's a difficult case.
• 1:06:33
  Speaker 2: So, for example, pension transfers, it can take months just to get any information out to the providers.
• 1:06:39
  Speaker 1: Or, for some people, if they've not had a financial advisor before, you're doing a lot of conversations around guiding them through things and reassurance and so they might just need that extra bit of time before they sign up with you so I think it's really important that you said that and I think, um, I speak to a lot of people who start out in the financial planning world and they start out as financial planners and they're kind of kicking themselves around how much business they they may not have developed based on their expectation of what they thought themselves as well, what they could do.
• 1:07:08
  Speaker 1: It's not just about you know, people set targets, people set ambitious targets and they want people to do well.
• 1:07:12
  Speaker 1: Um, and a lot of that is also to drive you into engagement is to get you out there actually in front of clients, and that's the bit I think you may not have done nine in 90 days, but you got yourself out there and that you're going to benefit from not in 90 days, maybe over the next, you know, years.
• 1:07:28
  Speaker 1: You'll see the benefit of those, that energy and that effort that you put in from day one.
• 1:07:32
  Speaker 1: So you kind of will reap the rewards for that.
• 1:07:34
  Speaker 1: But there are a lot of people that I speak to year one and not just in James's place, actually this is across the board.
• 1:07:39
  Speaker 1: I spoke to somebody quite recently in another wealth management firm I won't name them but yeah, I struggled, struggled, but yeah, I struggled, struggled in year one, you know, found it difficult, found it difficult to get out there, and I think there has to be this open conversation.
• 1:07:53
  Speaker 1: Actually, it isn't actually easy, it's actually really hard and you're demonstrating that by all the bloody energy and the effort you're putting in and getting out there and seeing people, and one of the things you touched on there, as well as time, isn't it?
• 1:07:59
  Speaker 1: You know there's only so much time and, um, people just let themselves kind of have a little bit of a break and sort of fully understand the fact that it will come, but it will come maybe a bit later on.
• 1:08:10
  Speaker 1: That doesn't mean you don't put 110% energy and effort and get yourself out there, because you never know what opportunity might present itself and sometimes it's grain work.
• 1:08:20
  Speaker 1: You're beginning, you know you're beginning to be heard, you're beginning to be seen, and that person you might have met in that 90 days might come back to you in a year and go.
• 1:08:30
  Speaker 1: I remember natasha, and that's actually how you getting on.
• 1:08:31
  Speaker 1: I see you're doing really, really well now.
• 1:08:32
  Speaker 1: I follow you on social media or whatever.
• 1:08:34
  Speaker 1: So what you want, you might benefit from that a bit later on I say, or even longer.
• 1:08:38
  Speaker 2: I know people I've met for coffees and for lunches and they're like I want to work with you.
• 1:08:41
  Speaker 2: It's just not a good time, personal circumstances, work circumstances, and so, yeah, it's not expecting a quick turnaround for some.
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 2: For some it is, yeah, really quick, really easy, great, they're brilliant.
• 1:08:51
  Speaker 2: But for other people, you know they're in it and they reassure me every now and then they're like I'm still thinking of you, like I still want to do this.
• 1:08:57
  Speaker 2: It's just not quite right yet and that's been what I've been doing it for just over two years, like for some of them it is pretty much two years, yeah, and they're like I know we're going to work together at some point.
• 1:09:06
  Speaker 2: It's just not happened.
• 1:09:07
  Speaker 2: So it's reassuring people because someone says not now.
• 1:09:10
  Speaker 2: That's not always a no.
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 2: For some it might be, but for some it's generally now is not a good time, but I know as and when I'm ready, you're the person I want to come to love it.
• 1:09:18
  Speaker 1: What about referrals?
• 1:09:19
  Speaker 1: Do you ask for referrals when you're in those meetings?
• 1:09:21
  Speaker 2: so that's definitely something I'm also like honing in on um.
• 1:09:25
  Speaker 2: I've done extra workshops with sjp around referrals because I wanted to build up my knowledge and confidence in this area.
• 1:09:32
  Speaker 2: Um, so I now know not to ask do you know anybody?
• 1:09:35
  Speaker 2: Because anybody is a word.
• 1:09:37
  Speaker 2: Everyone just goes mine shutters down no, I have no idea what you're talking about.
• 1:09:40
  Speaker 2: So it's better to be specific, and I do so.
• 1:09:43
  Speaker 2: I'm now like how about your siblings, because I know you have siblings, or how about your colleagues, because I know you just started a new job, or all these things.
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 2: And I think it's also helpful to do it at a time when they're open to want to refer to you.
• 1:09:55
  Speaker 2: So I plant the seed in my first meeting and I say like I'm looking to build my business through referrals and it'd be great, you know down the line, if you know anyone who could benefit from what I do.
• 1:10:05
  Speaker 2: If you make the introduction, sometimes your case, they'd be like you know I already have someone, I just need to check with them first.
• 1:10:10
  Speaker 2: But most of the time they're like okay, I'm taking in as part of our conversation, but it's not my focus for the first meeting and then, as and when I present a solution and we put it in place.
• 1:10:20
  Speaker 2: That's when I'm really kind of follow up, being like we had this conversation before.
• 1:10:23
  Speaker 2: It'd be really good to get a sense of who you know who I can also help who's in a similar situation and then follow up on it as well, because I think a lot of people might have good intentions but our time's being pulled in so many directions.
• 1:10:34
  Speaker 2: You know we have so many demands on us.
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 2: It can be so easy to be like that wasn't top of my priority list.
• 1:10:40
  Speaker 2: It was top of ours, but it's not top of theirs.
• 1:10:42
  Speaker 2: So it's feeling comfortable with chasing people and being like I know we talked about this.
• 1:10:47
  Speaker 2: I know you have so many other things going on right now, but it'd be really great if you can do this.
• 1:10:51
  Speaker 2: And again, it taps into what I was saying earlier about removing that hurdle of introducing you.
• 1:10:55
  Speaker 2: So I now have an email introduction to for them to forward on to a friend or a colleague, to be like here's the information you might want to know about that person also, like I could call that breadcrumbing.
• 1:11:05
  Speaker 1: So like, let's say, for some you say you want something from somebody, or you want to do some business with somebody, or you want referrals from them, or you want to make them as a client.
• 1:11:12
  Speaker 1: It's just about kind of touching base with them.
• 1:11:13
  Speaker 1: There's always a reason to get in contact with something, right?
• 1:11:17
  Speaker 1: So if you see something on the news, an article, and it reminds you of that person, or it's just going to be beneficial and useful to anybody.
• 1:11:24
  Speaker 1: Oh, hey, chris, how you doing?
• 1:11:29
  Speaker 1: I thought of you today.
• 1:11:29
  Speaker 1: Here's an article that I think you'll find really interesting.
• 1:11:32
  Speaker 1: And, by the way, are you still interested in passing some referrals across to me?
• 1:11:34
  Speaker 1: Or are you interested in meeting up for that drink?
• 1:11:36
  Speaker 1: Or would you like to discuss how we can, how we can work in partnership?
• 1:11:39
  Speaker 1: And I think it's about like touching base, keeping it.
• 1:11:42
  Speaker 1: And I think, referrals, like you know, you might get one straight away, um, but again, if you don't ask, you don't get.
• 1:11:48
  Speaker 1: If you always ask, you're gonna get.
• 1:11:51
  Speaker 1: So again, 10 meetings or whatever, always asking every single one.
• 1:11:54
  Speaker 1: You might get one straight away, you might want to get one later.
• 1:11:56
  Speaker 1: I always, you know, berate people for not asking for referrals.
• 1:11:59
  Speaker 1: It does my head in.
• 1:12:00
  Speaker 1: You know, in my business it's like you know, if you're a recruitment consultant, for example, you really need to be saying this is how we build our business, because as a candidate of ours, for instance, you are getting a free deal here, you know.
• 1:12:13
  Speaker 1: So how you can pay me back is by introducing me to some people that you think might want to use my services works really really well.
• 1:12:22
  Speaker 1: I used to headhunt people from banks.
• 1:12:23
  Speaker 1: I used to phone them up.
• 1:12:25
  Speaker 1: This is back when, like you didn't really have linkedin, I'd phone them up.
• 1:12:27
  Speaker 1: I actually phoned up.
• 1:12:29
  Speaker 1: I phoned up and headhunted a guy called sam oaks.
• 1:12:31
  Speaker 1: It's so weird, what's your name?
• 1:12:33
  Speaker 1: He's like sam.
• 1:12:34
  Speaker 1: I was like surname oaks, I was like what?
• 1:12:36
  Speaker 1: Anyway, I used to love headhunting people.
• 1:12:37
  Speaker 1: I used to like recruit for banks, for customer advisors, into the likes of nat west bank and um.
• 1:12:43
  Speaker 1: So I used to phone up and I used to say you, you know, I said pretend to be a customer.
• 1:12:47
  Speaker 1: I would phone Carphone Warehouse because those people are really good at face-to-face selling and obviously customer advisors have to sell insurance, bank accounts and all that sort of stuff.
• 1:12:55
  Speaker 1: So I used to phone them up.
• 1:12:57
  Speaker 1: Get one of them on the phone, get past the manager if it picked up, you know.
• 1:12:59
  Speaker 1: Anyway, get talking to one of them.
• 1:13:14
  Speaker 1: Sell.
• 1:13:15
  Speaker 1: The dream of the game for me was to say have you got any colleagues of yours right now like you?
• 1:13:19
  Speaker 1: You think they'd be good, and you end up getting two or three names straight away.
• 1:13:23
  Speaker 1: So you're always asking for those referrals.
• 1:13:24
  Speaker 1: Increases your chances also doing some business in the future.
• 1:13:27
  Speaker 1: I know that analogy recruitment based, but it's the same across the board, right?
• 1:13:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah, just always be asking and it's about timing, like you said, you get somebody at the right time and they will give you that information.
• 1:13:36
  Speaker 1: I love your positive.
• 1:13:37
  Speaker 1: What was it called again Positive about the notebook?
• 1:13:41
  Speaker 1: You see their notebook and what's that called?
• 1:13:43
  Speaker 2: again Positive confirmation Positive confirmation.
• 1:13:45
  Speaker 2: What's that?
• 1:13:45
  Speaker 1: called again.
• 1:13:45
  Speaker 1: Positive confirmation, positive confirmation.
• 1:13:47
  Speaker 1: You do do that a lot, don't you?
• 1:13:48
  Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, yeah I think it's cool.
• 1:13:50
  Speaker 1: It does make people feel good Positive confirmation.
• 1:13:52
  Speaker 1: I'm going to do more of that.
• 1:13:53
  Speaker 1: I wonder if I'd do it myself.
• 1:13:56
  Speaker 2: It's something that I wasn't aware of.
• 1:14:00
  Speaker 1: I had to have someone watching me to pick up on it, so that's why it's quite helpful to have like if you're getting, like, some soft skills, practical skills and experiences along as you're going along the way as well, but you're not just left on your own right.
• 1:14:24
  Speaker 1: There's a gene, they G.
• 1:14:25
  Speaker 1: They call it G&D manager.
• 1:14:26
  Speaker 1: So I love feedback.
• 1:14:29
  Speaker 1: What about you?
• 1:14:30
  Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, I definitely like.
• 1:14:32
  Speaker 2: I've always loved it.
• 1:14:32
  Speaker 2: That's going to sound so cool, but even when I was at boarding school I used to, and that's why my friends are listening to this.
• 1:14:39
  Speaker 2: They're going to crack up right now, but every term I'd like to sit down, like in our boarding school, in the bedroom and we'd like done homework, probably be going to bed and everyone probably be ready to go to sleep and I'd be like guys, let's go around the room, let's say you know one thing that person's doing really well, something they could work on and something you really like about that person.
• 1:14:56
  Speaker 2: So it's, you know, kind of a nice sandwich, yeah.
• 1:14:59
  Speaker 2: And sometimes they'd be like, oh, you're ridiculous.
• 1:15:01
  Speaker 2: But I think who go?
• 1:15:03
  Speaker 2: Do you know what?
• 1:15:04
  Speaker 2: You're great at this?
• 1:15:05
  Speaker 2: You could be better at this, like you have, and I've no idea as my friends.
• 1:15:10
  Speaker 2: But things could be like you're not the most patient person, maybe work on that or um, you have a way of approaching people that might come across as this.
• 1:15:17
  Speaker 2: I know it's not because I know you and I know what you're like, but people who don't know you might not be aware of that.
• 1:15:23
  Speaker 2: So I definitely have always liked feedback in the right time.
• 1:15:27
  Speaker 2: I've definitely had feedback where I'm not having a great day and I'm like I'm not ready to hear this today, like today is not the day for it.
• 1:15:32
  Speaker 2: They're like too late spoke to and you're like, damn it, I'm not in the right mindset.
• 1:15:35
  Speaker 2: So I think you have to be in the right mindset for framework for feedback.
• 1:15:38
  Speaker 2: But I definitely appreciate that with SJP is the fact of having someone who sits in on meetings and for me it was the reassurance as well of knowing I want to do, you know, the best I can by my clients.
• 1:15:50
  Speaker 2: I'm new to this.
• 1:15:51
  Speaker 2: I'm, you know, appreciate and that's the fact.
• 1:15:53
  Speaker 2: I'm being honest with my clients.
• 1:15:54
  Speaker 2: I'm new to this.
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 2: That's why I have someone else sitting in to make me better and that's why I still do it now.
• 1:16:00
  Speaker 2: I was speaking at a academy event last year and someone said isn't it like awkward asking someone to sit in on the meeting?
• 1:16:07
  Speaker 2: It makes you look really inexperienced.
• 1:16:09
  Speaker 2: And I said I think everything's about how you position it, and I do position it with clients, as I want to be better at this job.
• 1:16:15
  Speaker 2: I want to keep learning until there's nothing left to learn.
• 1:16:18
  Speaker 2: You know, I don't think that's ever going to be a point.
• 1:16:20
  Speaker 2: I think there's always going to be something to learn and that's why I need someone else sitting in on this meeting and if it's zoom, it might just be there a black screen watching it.
• 1:16:28
  Speaker 2: If it's in person, they'll be sat in the room part of it, and I always check first.
• 1:16:31
  Speaker 2: I would never force it on a client, but I think it's so helpful to have someone who catches the things that you might not be aware of.
• 1:16:38
  Speaker 2: And from the people I've worked with sjp they know that I I like that sandwich.
• 1:16:43
  Speaker 2: So I'm like if there's learns, can we put it in the middle?
• 1:16:45
  Speaker 2: So I start the feedback happy and I end the feedback happy and I'm more open to hearing what are the things I need to be working on?
• 1:16:52
  Speaker 2: So again, it's having that self-awareness and that's something I've always worked on is self-awareness what do, what works for me, what do I like?
• 1:16:59
  Speaker 2: And then having someone who's open to approach me in that similar way and be like yeah, you opened really well, this was great, this stuff we could work on, and I feel really fortunate.
• 1:17:08
  Speaker 2: I'm at a point now where they said like it's not vital stuff at the beginning it is.
• 1:17:11
  Speaker 2: It's like oh, you didn't cover these regulatory aspects, or you really need to check with the client about something, something, whereas now they're very much like this is just to get to that next level.
• 1:17:21
  Speaker 2: We're really happy that you've got all the regulatory aspects and you're doing a great meeting.
• 1:17:24
  Speaker 2: Here's how you can make it that little bit better, and so I love the fact that I've had so much feedback now that it's just taking me to that next level where the, rather than being something to worry about, it's like yes, I can keep growing, keep learning, and I love that my clients most of them, are open to that part of the process as well do you ever ask your clients for feedback as well?
• 1:17:46
  Speaker 2: oh my gosh, I've just started doing it and I really like it.
• 1:17:48
  Speaker 2: And it's so funny because, as you can probably tell, I don't like silences.
• 1:17:52
  Speaker 2: I like to just like make sure they're filled properly.
• 1:17:55
  Speaker 2: And so I now have to be a lot more kind of stricter with myself at the end to be like how have you found today because originally I'd be like was today helpful, yes or no question super helpful.
• 1:18:06
  Speaker 2: I didn't have a single person who was like no, I was like simple, yeah, they liked it.
• 1:18:10
  Speaker 2: And sometimes I've had clients, when they see me making my notes, even laugh, going do you just give yourself a tick?
• 1:18:14
  Speaker 2: I'm like, yeah, I gave myself a tick.
• 1:18:15
  Speaker 2: You said helpful, I've ticked the helpful box and process.
• 1:18:18
  Speaker 2: I like to have my little things laid out and they can see it.
• 1:18:19
  Speaker 2: But now I do an open-ended question and I go how did you find today?
• 1:18:24
  Speaker 2: And with the clients I've seen quite a few times they're now like cool, and I'm just like I'm just gonna sit there in silence, I'm gonna wait for you to add a little bit more.
• 1:18:32
  Speaker 2: And they're like oh, you need more.
• 1:18:33
  Speaker 2: And I'm like yeah, I'm not gonna leave it at that.
• 1:18:36
  Speaker 2: And they're like okay, yes, I liked.
• 1:18:38
  Speaker 2: You know I liked it, or they might go to a bit more detail.
• 1:18:40
  Speaker 2: Be like this really worked for me.
• 1:18:42
  Speaker 2: I like the way you presented that aspect to me.
• 1:18:44
  Speaker 2: Um, a lot of my all my clients know that.
• 1:18:47
  Speaker 2: Again, I'm all about removing the jargon and I really like the fact that, yes, I have an opportunity now at the end to get that feedback from them.
• 1:18:55
  Speaker 2: So hopefully, if I ever had a client who didn't like the way I do things, they would raise it with me and we can have a further conversation around it.
• 1:19:02
  Speaker 2: But for most clients it's like reassurance, I guess, of a that I'm doing a good job, but b, they're having the opportunity to talk to me about it as well fantastic, so feedback's massively important for you.
• 1:19:14
  Speaker 1: It's a great learning tool, right totally yeah amazing St James's Place partnership, right?
• 1:19:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I've got to ask you the question.
• 1:19:21
  Speaker 1: You've been there a while now.
• 1:19:23
  Speaker 1: Yes, what does the word partnership mean to you?
• 1:19:25
  Speaker 2: I think partnership to me is community.
• 1:19:29
  Speaker 2: I'll be very clear with that.
• 1:19:30
  Speaker 2: I think some companies say, oh, we're a family, and that's always been a bit jarring.
• 1:19:34
  Speaker 2: Personally, I'm like no, we're not family, we're a workplace.
• 1:19:37
  Speaker 2: But community that fits a lot more and that's what I feel like I get at sjp and especially because I've worked at other places before, I know again that self-actualization what works for me and what doesn't SJP works really well for who I am as a person, because I really like the sense of there's this amazing community that I can reach out to.
• 1:19:57
  Speaker 2: So I'm very aware that I probably know max 10% of the about SJP employees and partners that are out there, but I'm keen to meet more and to reach out to more and for everyone I have met, whether that be at networking events SJP puts on for us or like, for example, tomorrow we've got the ACM.
• 1:20:15
  Speaker 2: It's so wonderful to meet other people and reach out and be like hey, I'm new, I'm still figuring things out, can we go for a coffee?
• 1:20:21
  Speaker 2: I'd love to know how you approach a certain type of product or client or something that's happened in the market, anything, and everyone I've reached out to so far has been happy to jump on a 10-minute call, go for a coffee, maybe go for a lunch, and I think there's so much experience and wisdom and knowledge there that can be tapped into.
• 1:20:38
  Speaker 2: I really appreciate people giving their time to share that how accessible is it?
• 1:20:43
  Speaker 1: because you can sit there in your, in your worries, for example, or a thought going around in your head, but how quickly can you access really important information that gets you over a hurdle or moves you forward, or educates you on a piece of technical, technical knowledge that you you're really unsure of?
• 1:21:02
  Speaker 1: How quick can you access that information?
• 1:21:04
  Speaker 2: I say pretty much instantly, both in the sense of like the technical aspect.
• 1:21:08
  Speaker 2: That's again, something I really appreciate with sjp is having technical teams, and I'm using them a lot at the moment because I'm going through quite a few complicated clients, and so I really appreciate the fact they're different.
• 1:21:18
  Speaker 2: Uh, cool, I'm gonna say call centers.
• 1:21:21
  Speaker 2: That sounds terrible, but like teams, I can call to have the conversations and be like okay, we've got this tax aspect, can I double check it with you?
• 1:21:27
  Speaker 2: Or we've got a really complicated pension.
• 1:21:29
  Speaker 2: Can I just double check what I've done or double check the calculations or something like that.
• 1:21:33
  Speaker 2: I really appreciate having that.
• 1:21:34
  Speaker 2: But beyond the like technical aspect, it's so lovely to have I'm in a couple of different WhatsApp groups as well, so it's firing out to other partners as well and being like has anyone ever encountered this?
• 1:21:45
  Speaker 2: How would you go about a certain situation?
• 1:21:47
  Speaker 2: Has this part of the internet just gone down, or is that just me?
• 1:21:50
  Speaker 2: You know all these different aspects.
• 1:21:51
  Speaker 2: It's so reassuring to be like there's someone I can reach out to and if it's really urgent, I'll probably put on all whatsapp groups at the same time, and some of them have overlapping people and they'll be like oh, she clearly needs an answer like asap, and I'm like, yes, I really do.
• 1:22:03
  Speaker 2: I'm about to have a meeting with a client and I'm not sure about this, um, but yeah, for me that's just invaluable.
• 1:22:09
  Speaker 2: Part of sjp is having that and knowing that there's someone out there who potentially knows an answer or knows how to go about getting an answer you seem to value that totally okay, if we look at an aspect of it that I'm now new to.
• 1:22:26
  Speaker 1: Actually, when I was speaking to you, pre-podcast and also G the G&D managers, it's like having a coach, right.
• 1:22:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:22:34
  Speaker 1: But not everybody likes being coached, or not everybody knows how to be coached.
• 1:22:38
  Speaker 1: How do you get the most out of your coach?
• 1:22:44
  Speaker 2: Good question.
• 1:22:44
  Speaker 2: I think it's definitely how you approach it.
• 1:22:47
  Speaker 2: Again, self-actualization I know what works for me.
• 1:22:50
  Speaker 2: I know that I like regular contact, so I've made it very clear I want to check in every other week might not be big things, but it's just like gives me an opportunity to talk about anything.
• 1:23:01
  Speaker 2: Um, and I like the fact again of like let's not make it all critical, like if it is, it hasn't been the case so far, touch wood.
• 1:23:05
  Speaker 2: But if it is that I could be like like, let's not make it all critical, like if it is, it hasn't been the case so far, touch wood.
• 1:23:10
  Speaker 2: But if it is that I could be like, okay, let's put some nice things in there.
• 1:23:13
  Speaker 2: So I don't like have a massive drop in confidence, because I think confidence is something you have to protect.
• 1:23:18
  Speaker 2: Doing this, it is very scary at times because you're pushing yourself outside your comfort zone.
• 1:23:23
  Speaker 2: You want to make sure you're doing the best job you can and especially when you're starting out, there's so much to take on board.
• 1:23:29
  Speaker 2: It can suddenly feel quite overwhelming, and I've definitely experienced overwhelm last year after doing my BSP and I've said I needed a lot more guidance suddenly than I did before and my G&D manager has been so fantastic.
• 1:23:41
  Speaker 2: He's got a new peer group set up that I'm joining to talk about the things that I was raising.
• 1:23:45
  Speaker 2: So I think it's really useful.
• 1:23:48
  Speaker 2: But I think to get the most out of it you need to know what you need from it, so it's not like a one size fits all.
• 1:23:54
  Speaker 2: I know some people who might have a much more hands-off approach, but they just know if they had a question they could call that person up.
• 1:24:00
  Speaker 2: And it might be we speak every six weeks, but I know if I need a phone call I can make a phone call, whereas I know I like a regular check-in how's it going?
• 1:24:10
  Speaker 1: it's going okay.
• 1:24:10
  Speaker 1: What about things like on-demand learning, though?
• 1:24:12
  Speaker 1: If you can't get hold of your coach, for example, they're obviously quite busy, um, but they're obviously looking after a number of partners you've already told us look, you need to catch up with somebody.
• 1:24:20
  Speaker 1: If you need to touch base with somebody, you pretty much got it instant, so it's amazing being able to talk to somebody.
• 1:24:25
  Speaker 1: What about those times when you might not want to talk to somebody?
• 1:24:28
  Speaker 1: You might just want to educate yourself on a topic, topic of um, I don't know.
• 1:24:32
  Speaker 1: You want deep dive into something, right?
• 1:24:34
  Speaker 1: So you can't take up an hour's time on the telephone with somebody, for instance, right?
• 1:24:37
  Speaker 1: Do you get much on the on demand type content?
• 1:24:39
  Speaker 1: Is there a portal where you can go in?
• 1:24:41
  Speaker 2: there's a little learning center yes, so we have sjp house, which is our online learning, so it's got modules on there that you have to complete from like a regulatory aspect, so that could be like anti-money laundering, but it's got everything else you could possibly want on there.
• 1:24:55
  Speaker 2: So I always laugh with clients.
• 1:24:57
  Speaker 2: I've done 90 exams so far.
• 1:24:59
  Speaker 2: Six of those have been external.
• 1:25:00
  Speaker 2: The other 84 have been with SJP because there's so much online guidance.
• 1:25:05
  Speaker 2: So I tap into that quite a lot.
• 1:25:07
  Speaker 1: Fantastic, Brilliant.
• 1:25:08
  Speaker 1: Okay, so you just mentioned BSP.
• 1:25:10
  Speaker 1: Just give us a bit of an overview of that what that was.
• 1:25:22
  Speaker 2: So BSP is the buying and selling of practices within SJP.
• 1:25:23
  Speaker 2: For me it was a way of growing, so you've got organic growth, which is going out and meeting people, having clients.
• 1:25:26
  Speaker 2: Bsp is you're buying someone else's book of clients.
• 1:25:29
  Speaker 2: It could be a partial or it could be a full.
• 1:25:32
  Speaker 2: In my case, as far as I'm aware, it was the majority of that person's clients and I think it's definitely going through an interesting stage at the moment and there's been quite a few conversations around that.
• 1:25:42
  Speaker 2: I mentioned earlier about saying to my G&D manager I wanted help.
• 1:25:45
  Speaker 2: It was around the bsp.
• 1:25:48
  Speaker 2: I felt very overwhelmed.
• 1:25:49
  Speaker 2: There was actually quite a lot of work that came with it that I hadn't anticipated or hadn't been talked about much um, and he's now, uh, set up or been part of setting up these bsp peer groups that I'm soon joining.
• 1:26:00
  Speaker 2: So I'm really interested to get something out of that.
• 1:26:03
  Speaker 2: So, again, that's what I mean.
• 1:26:04
  Speaker 2: I've never been worked or, yeah, been partnered up or worked with a company that offers the level of support or response that I get from sjp when I do raise things.
• 1:26:14
  Speaker 2: So bsp is interesting.
• 1:26:16
  Speaker 2: I feel like I'm glad I did it.
• 1:26:17
  Speaker 2: There's definitely a lot of learns and I again.
• 1:26:19
  Speaker 2: I've reached out to quite a few people sjp who've been through it themselves to be like how did you find it?
• 1:26:24
  Speaker 2: What did you experience?
• 1:26:26
  Speaker 2: Every single person's had their own interesting experiences with it and I think it's great that we're now getting a chance to to share those and learn from each other I don't think any kind of practice buyout scenario is easy um.
• 1:26:39
  Speaker 1: So it is great that you've got an ability to lean into a network of people that have gone through it and you can have those learned experiences and learn from it.
• 1:26:45
  Speaker 1: I know people who've done it within sjp a couple of times and the first is very different from the second, you know.
• 1:26:51
  Speaker 1: So I think it's one of those things where it's great to have it.
• 1:26:53
  Speaker 1: It's a huge opportunity for a new advisor to actually go out organically build clients but also to grow through acquiring client banks and sjp obviously help along the way into doing that.
• 1:27:01
  Speaker 1: So overall experience around the training development what natasha percy baxter needs to feel supported do you feel supported?
• 1:27:09
  Speaker 2: definitely I know.
• 1:27:10
  Speaker 2: When I graduated last year, they gave us a little notebook and it said you're doing this for yourself, not by yourself, and I I genuinely believe that.
• 1:27:18
  Speaker 2: Again, I'm all about authenticity and I do feel the SJP.
• 1:27:21
  Speaker 2: I've got that support in the sense of what I need from them, and I feel very fortunate to be part of both the SJP employees so like my G&D manager but also the partners.
• 1:27:33
  Speaker 2: So I've got lots of partner friends now who I love.
• 1:27:36
  Speaker 2: If I'm going in the office I'll be like you around, let's grab a lunch, you know, let's catch up.
• 1:27:39
  Speaker 2: So it's building that real community again, like I said earlier, and I think that's such a precious thing because when you're running your own practice, it can be quite lonely.
• 1:27:47
  Speaker 2: You're doing it all yourself, you know, and I love that.
• 1:27:50
  Speaker 2: I love the fact I've got the freedom to work with clients I want, approach it how I want, but I'm not alone.
• 1:27:57
  Speaker 2: I've got people at the end of the phone or, you know, half an hour ride across London to go have a chat with how are you doing?
• 1:28:03
  Speaker 2: Let's check in.
• 1:28:04
  Speaker 2: So you know you've got that support there throughout the journey.
• 1:28:08
  Speaker 1: Doing it for yourself, not by yourself.
• 1:28:10
  Speaker 1: Yes, I love that and, natasha, on that note, we're going to end the conversation there.
• 1:28:15
  Speaker 1: Thank you so much for joining me today on the Financial Planner Live podcast to give us an update on your career at St James' Place.
• 1:28:20
  Speaker 1: It sounds like it's going great guns.
• 1:28:21
  Speaker 1: I'm really looking forward to getting you in the podcast again, maybe in a year or so's time, to hear about the next chapter in your financial planning career.
• 1:28:30
  Speaker 2: Sounds great.
• 1:28:31
  Speaker 2: Thanks, Sam Thanks.