Latest / Glovisor Podcast / Ep. 49: You’re Making Money—So Why Are You Still Broke? - Brandon Neely
Transcript
- Joe: Most people chase income. Builders chase structure. And that's where real wealth comes from. Welcome to the Glovisor Podcast, where we explore business growth, communication, and personal development through real conversations with people that make an impact. Our guest is a real estate investor, author, and entrepreneur who helps business owners and investors build durable wealth through. Better cash flow and financial systems. As a profit first professional and bank of yourself professional, he brings real world experience from operating businesses and navigating deals, not just theory. Through Counterflow, he focuses on simplifying money decisions and helping operators create financial structures that support long term stability, flexibility, and growth. Globisor welcomes Brandon Neely. Brandon Neely: Hey Joe, thank thanks so much for having me. I am excited because man, I my my finances personally have been tested and it's been I just showed you prior to the to the like pre-call here. and I'm even more excited about the work that I do because seriously, man, running a business, as you know, doing anything in real estate, man, the world is changing fast. Things happen, we get punched in the face sometimes, or all kinds of other things that happen. And to have the right people in place, the right soundboards, people like you, here sharing, those things matter. And I'm I'm just excited to be here and build that relationship with you. Joe: Yeah, looking forward to learning more about you and to hear more about your tests, your big test that you just had recently. so Brandon let's start off with tell us a little bit more about what you do. Brandon Neely: I wanna take you back to a way back machine. I used to own a brick and mortar coffee shop. the coffee shop was called Overflow. and it was really an amazing, I'd I'd say my MBA of learning how to be a business owner. when you go into business, f at least if if you weren't raised into it. You kind of are naive, right? You you're like, it's gonna happen. I'm gonna make a lot of money in three months, and everybody's gonna love my stuff. And then you realize that your best friends aren't gonna buy your thing or show up. and you have to go actually market to people that you don't know and build a whole business like you know, that way. And so so learning the school hard knocks with overflow, but we actually had a flood. in our business and we were pregnant and we were like well we can't do the things that we thought we could do having a baby it's kind of illegal to have a baby behind the coffee bar and we need to make a change and and we had learned about the financial system and the financial systems we had put in place prior to the sort of business really helped us to be able to sell the business, not close it. And so then we start set out on this journey in the financial world, not knowing that there's a lot of opinions about finance and about money. And most of them are actually lies and people things that people say that are actually not real true. They just are repeated over and over and over again, right? So much so that people think they're true, right? And especially as business owners, having access to money, being able to protect your greatest investment, which is you, led us to create what we now call counterflow. and so now we just help people build the financial architecture to withstand the things that life's gonna throw at us. And I don't know about you, Joe, but life's been throwing all kinds of weird things at us all the time. even if you haven't imp been impacted by a flood. I mean, we've had inflation, we've had I don't know, even aliens happen. right? Just weird things. And I'm like, how do we withstand that as a business? And how do we build and keep going and build an empire when things shift so fast? Joe: Everything seems to be shifting it much faster Brandon Neely: Mm-hmm. Joe: now than it did, let's just say twenty, thirty years ago. And Brandon Neely: Yeah. Joe: would assume, you know, it has a lot to do with the internet and AI now. Everything's getting faster and faster. but can you share with us a little bit more about Counterflow? Brandon Neely: Yeah, so counterflow really came from this idea when I again when I started the business, we were last to get paid, right? And so last to get paid, we were doing the typical system of cash flow. And basically at the bottom is when you finally the the business owner makes makes the money, right? We take the biggest risk, no make anything. we we Put money into other people's businesses. We want a rate of return or dividends. And then we say, wait, my my stocks didn't work. But yet we don't give dividends from our own business, right? And so there's this idea of profit first that came around. If you're not familiar with profit first, basically it's Mike McAllowitz wrote this book in the premises, profit. comes first. What you put first matters, right? And then you reverse architect it. Not the other way around where you have your staff, you have your taxes, you have some people don't have taxes in the right order either. and then they wonder why they're broke because they forgot that they owe that money. but put the right order and then we're able to do the right things. And what our former business realized and learned is hey This isn't actually helping us be healthy, profitable, even making a good return. We need to maybe sell this business. And so that was one aspect, cash flow. And then the other was this infinite banking idea of making sure that I am protecting my greatest asset, me, but still have access to the money to be able to take advantage of opportunities or. be able to have access in case of calamity. Joe: So can you tell us a little bit more about this infinite bank? Brandon Neely: infinite banking is really a foundational tool. I I believe that most people's finances and why we're seeing such challenges in our world economically is we've flipped our foundation upside down. So we're told invest in other people's businesses, do all this other stuff, and people have been investing in Tesla stock or whatever. I don't know, whatever it is. It doesn't matter what it is. But but we don't have a good foundation, right? And so in essence, what infinite banking is is a properly designed whole life policy that I have access to. Think of it like buying a house. have you ever bought a house before? Joe: Yes. Brandon Neely: So when you buy a house, right, you you then make a payment and some of it goes to the mortgage. principal and some of it goes to interest, right? And then over time, excuse me, over time, you can take that principle and do what they call a home equity line credit, right? And borrow from that asset to fix up your kitchen. I don't know, something like that. People understand that all the time. Well, infinite banking Is in essence really is protecting and buying it a house, except you're the house, right? And as you make payments, you are the house, you are the greatest asset, you're protecting you. And if I'm putting in money into this, I then have an access to capital money that I can borrow from, and I'm borrowing from the insurance company. to then use it to buy other assets. So put in, let's say, for example, $400 right after that payment clears, I could probably access a good $250 right away. Right. At a lower interest than what even the the market is for real estate right now. That's in essence a really simple infinite banking. There's so much more to it. There's videos, there's podcasts. people be like, you can't do that. You that's that's not possible, but it's in essence, I that's what I've done. That's how I was able to sell my business. I use that to pay off higher interest debt and just be able to overcome bigger obstacles. Joe: While the money's sitting at the insurance company's account, is it earning interest? Brandon Neely: Yeah, it is growing and it is building. There's actually dividends as you put into the policy. It will continue to build and compound. And what's really cool is even if I borrow from it, and this is why you work with somebody that actually knows what they're doing, not just somebody who has an insurance license, is you got the right companies. I use policies that are able to grow even as I borrowed against it, as I've used the money. from the policy, it'll still grow as if I never touched it. Isn't that crazy? Like there's there's companies that allow that. And so that's making sure you have the right company along with the right structure. Joe: so it offsets the interest you're paying when you pull the money out as a loan to invest. Brandon Neely: Yeah. I mean again, you wanna think through strategically, because I'm borrowing it at maybe five percent simple interest and it's growing and there's still cost of with any business, there's a cost of starting the business, right? Anybody that starts a business knows there's a cost of capital, right? And so we have to make sure we're doing the right numbers. But as I'm using it, I'm thinking through even buying a car. What's the interest rate? If it's 2.99, whatever, I don't know what the rates are. but how are they making money? And so the more and more that I get this mantra in my head and in my clients' heads is don't do what the banks tell you to do, do what the banks do. Understand how the flow of money is working, and I whiteboard it as I use a policy, maybe, or I use the bank's money, depending again on. What's the terms, right? And so I want to have options, not restrictions. Joe: So now you bring the money back after you're done with Brandon Neely: Mm-hmm. Joe: your investment. What happens to the money? Now it sits as a regular life insurance. Brandon Neely: Yeah. So think of it if you have that house, right? Paid-off house. Well, you could use that again, right? but you in essence, when you sell the house, you don't get what you had. It's that equity there. You get the house, right? Whatever the value of that house is. And so if I retire to heaven, that's kind of the way I say die, right? then whatever loan you had. Will be subtracted from the death benefit. Almost like a house, right? So if you have that house and you have a loan, they're not going to give you the house value. They're going to subtract and say, Well, you had this out. Here's what you get. Similar idea. And so Nelson Nash, the founder of Infinite Banking, says, you know, don't steal the peas from your own grocery store. He was an old older man. so he, you know, did the grocery store analogies, meaning You if you own grocery store, you're not gonna just take your products, you're gonna pay it back to then use it for the next thing, the next opportunity, hopefully. Or there might be other things that happen. Like right now, is it better to use a policy loan at 5% simple or take the bank's money? Well, the interest rates on a house or or real estate property is high. higher than it was three years ago. Right. So I might, depending, use my policy to buy an asset and then pay myself back versus the other way around. I I don't know, just depends. Joe: if you can get us on the same page, can you explain to us look what simple interest is in comparison to how a bank would charge us interest Brandon Neely: Yeah, most people don't know this actually. And I wish it was taught in school. if you go to your credit card statement, most people don't know the interest rate on their credit card, right? And they're like, how come I never get it paid off? Right. So simple interest annualized at the end of the year means if it's a hundred thousand and it's five percent simple, right? That's five thousand dollars cost of capital that year. That that made, right? So if it's mm 2.99 annualized and how they front load the interest, they might front load it, right? Meaning they put all the interest of that fifty thousand dollar car on the front end, right? That's possible. and they might say, Well, we're gonna do all the interest first, right? So then you never feel you feel like you'd never got ahead, even on a low interest, theoretically, right? or if it's twenty percent and they are adding that in monthly, that's gonna have a problem. it's g you're gonna feel like you never can get ahead. Right. And and then With banks, the challenge is they they never actually show you these kind of things. They're really hard to find. Your bank statements, even on your 401ks, right? How's it actually working? You can't figure it out. And you're wondering, well, I thought I was doing all this, right? But but it's hard to calculate. And so simple is better than compounding interest. Joe: Now is there a minimum amount to get one of these infinite banking accounts started? Brandon Neely: Yeah, I like to think and it's very different than and I don't use IUL. there's a lot of people who are using Nelson's Nash's book and saying, well, you can do the same thing with what they call an infinite or an index universal life policy. I use a whole life policy that is properly designed, that doesn't have any gotchas in the contract. but I think a good amount is you need to be saving. regularly. and that's the problem in our world is we we don't know how to save. And so that's why I have a a different strategy of how I save. But a good amount is about four hundred dollars is is a good starting point. But I have c clients that have been putting in hundred thousand a year. Right. And really the what I like to think about is I I go back to again, the profit first model. What you put first matters, right? And I don't know if you're a person of faith, but there's a there's a law of the first fruits, right? tithe model. so the tithe model is 10% goes to God, right? And so the profit first model, I think about it more like the 10, 10, 10 savings rule. 20% of my income, 10% for long term, 10% for medium term, and then 10% for short term. I then reverse architect. I now, and I'm not talking about investments, I'm not talking about what you put in a 401k. I'm talking access, right? So if I'm doing that and I'm saving 20% of my income personal, that's a good number that I might have into a policy. Never set a dollar amount. I'm reverse architecting, and then we're living within our means. Joe: Interesting. so now going back to counterflow, is that Brandon Neely: Mm-hmm. Joe: intended for small business, medium sized businesses, or large businesses? Brandon Neely: Yeah, I think it's about understanding again the flow of money. I think it's for both individuals and business owners. I think that the financial system, in essence, and why we call it, it's all in the name, right? Counterflow is saying all the systems are built to extract. Right. Even our 401k, we're like, I got a big rate of return. But yet. We don't show the money because I know how math works, right? And so we need to understand how's that flow of money? How are people extracting and taking money from Wall Street to real estate? And so we understand that percentage, both personal and business, and in the end, hopefully we become the Rockefellers, right? That's that's the idea. But you have to start somewhere, right? And so Building that in, building those systems will help you become a large business. Right. And it just gets more complicated, complex as you have a bigger business. But it's more of understanding the architecture, right? And if if a business owner understands and has the right advisors, the right architecture, they can build bigger empires, right? Joe: Now if one of our listeners wanted to work with you, what would that journey look like? Brandon Neely: Yeah. well the first thing is I'm not gonna just say, well, let me just run an illustration and do all this. I'm gonna go and ask you lots of questions. when you know you listen to Dave Ramsey or other people and they they have all these assumptions about you. Well, here's the thing: most financial decisions, the answer is it depends, right? what are taxes? How do taxes impact your real estate? How does this impact? And you have to understand the web, the complexity of all of this stuff, right? and so we're the financial people, but you have to understand the legal people, the the LLC side. and so as clients come to me, I'm asking them, What are their goals? Right? because their goals Should directly correlate with what they're doing financially. Right. Oftentimes people have these goals and what they're doing doesn't actually correlate to what they want. Right. And so we have to understand what are the goals? I want to have financial freedom. I want to be able to do this. But we're doing the direct opposite of that. And so I'm asking dreams, goals, assets, liabilities, why are you putting in To your 401k, even though you want to be a business owner and you're you're putting in 10% when they only match three, and you want to be financially free by the time you're 40, but you lock it up into something that you can't access till you're 60. Why are you doing that? And they're like, I don't know, that's a great question. And I'm like, Well, maybe you should do this. And maybe if you put it through a policy and you know real estate. You now have access and you can do a 50% return on investment because you know how to turn that into more money, right? Because it's not about rate of return. It's about understanding again who you are to then turn that money from a one dollar into two dollars, right? That's what Warren Buffett does. He understands his strength and then he has other people around him that helps him. But He's really good at what he does. So I want to help people understand what's really good at what they do and how do we use the cash flow to amplify that. Joe: No, can you share a client success story of someone's worked with you in the past? Brandon Neely: Yeah, I've had a couple, some that I've been able to turn around, some money that comes into them, and and but they have a lot of debt. Right. And so I've been able to structure real estate because I have connections with real estate investor mortgage people, structure it to help them get get rid of high interest debt. To be able to take off faster, right? Because it's a lot of tailwind or or front wind that's stopping them, right? That that's happening a lot. especially with inflation. We have one major catastrophe and then all of a sudden we can't get ahead. I mean, I just had one three weeks ago or two weeks, I don't know. But I'm able to overcome it faster because of the foundation I set. So I wanna I've seen that with lots of my clients where I've been able to help them get rid of high interest debt and amplify their business and grow their real estate empire because this is just one part of it, right? Joe: Now who's the ideal person that you think that should be contacting you right now? Brandon Neely: I think it's the people that know how to make money. They're in the business of making money, but they wonder what where is it all going? why am I working so hard and I just seem like it's not I'm not it's not there. I don't I don't have it. Right. I'm in the business of keeping money, right? there's a there's a lot of people who help you sell more and do more. but but if you if you are able to bring in a lot, but your bottom bucket is leaking like a lot, that's a problem. Right. And so those people that can make money and know how to maybe they don't have a good system. I can help them understand how to keep it, both personally and business-wise. Those those are the people that I like. If you're just saying, well, I need to have a system, but I don't want to make money. Well, I can't turn that in if you if you don't have a system to even save. Right. now I can't stop, you know, if if you're you're making a lot of money and you're spending it with a credit card and you know, all kinds of other things that you can't stop. There's an addiction there. I can't stop that, right? But I can help prevent it and maybe change habits. Joe: Now if listeners remember only one thing from your episode, what would you want that message to be? Brandon Neely: don't abdicate that responsibility of the finances. Too many people to say, I have a I have a financial guy. they do all that stuff for me. I don't understand the numbers, so I'm not gonna do it. every, every one of us, I don't care whether you make a little money or a lot of money, every one of us is in the banking business. Every one of us. Every one of us has. A business, even if it's the household, right? We need to make more and keep more. And that's where profit is happening, right? We're able to use it to buy other things, even if it's a personal side, right? it's a business model. The problem is when people are saying, well, I want to, I still want that car or that thing. And they say, well, I deserve it because we watched a commercial. And then they they go into debt because you know somebody said on the television show, I deserve it to keep up with the Joneses. And they wonder why they're broke. I'm like, well, because you don't understand how money works. and so if we understand the flow, that's why it's counter flow. then we can make better decisions. But do not, do not abdicate your responsibility to understand the flow and the cash flow. Joe: Now that's great advice because I hear that all nearly every single day that I don't know. My money guy handles that. And so that's great Brandon Neely: Yep. Joe: advice. where can our audience connect with you, learn more about your work and continue this conversation. Brandon Neely: if you go to Counterflow Cornerstones, Counterflow Cornerstones.com slash brand end, that's where you can schedule a call with me directly. we have Counterflow Cornerstones is like our our foundational business, right? But we have live counterflow, where it's that philosophy. and you can understand more. You know, Amanda has counterflow. live counterflow.substack more that philosophy thing because I've learned that most people seriously we are sleepwalking through life. We we are sleepwalking even in our own businesses, we're trying to make it and hustle, but we say, well I don't know that. So we we give it up. We say, well that's that's for somebody else. I I wasn't good at math. So I'm not even gonna worry about it. I'm like, well no, you should actually understand. And so I'm not that great at math, but I know how to read a you know profit and lost. and I'm like, well, if it's red, that's not good. Right. And a lot of a lot of people don't even know that, right? And I'm like, hmm, are you making money or not? And and so understanding that, and so go to Counterflow Cornerstones, look up Brandon Neely Counterflow, you'll find me everywhere, hopefully. Joe: Now Brandon, thank you so much for joining us. We appreciate your time and the value you shared. Brandon Neely: Thanks, Joe. And I didn't even get to tell you all the craziness of of the flood, but I know my finances were tested and my foundation is solid and I'm excited for what's coming because man, if if I can share the story, it's it's gonna be amazing. Joe: When you contact Brandon, make sure you ask him about a flood. Thanks everyone for listening. If this episode inspired you, share it with someone that needs it. And don't forget to follow the Glovisor podcast for more conversations that make an impact. Till the next time.