Latest / The You Project / #1731 My Son Tommy - Tommy Jackett

Transcript

#1731 My Son Tommy - Tommy Jackett · The You Project

0:00
Speaker 1: Tommy Jacket, Welcome to the Bloody You Project.
0:03
Speaker 2: Hi, thanks for having me. Craig go oh.
0:06
Speaker 1: God, I've missed you. You and I have not spoken
0:09
Speaker 1: as in a conversation. We had a sixty seconds one
0:13
Speaker 1: a sixty second one earlier today, which wasn't It was
0:15
Speaker 1: like quick catch up and do you want to do
0:17
Speaker 1: a potty and tell me what you've been up to?
0:19
Speaker 1: And you went, nah, can't, it's a secret. Then you went, nah,
0:22
Speaker 1: I can, and then you went nah, I can't. I can,
0:24
Speaker 1: uh some of it, not all of it. So I'm curious.
0:28
Speaker 1: But in general terms, Hi, how are you?
0:33
Speaker 2: I'm great mate. This is a great time of year.
0:35
Speaker 2: Do you like? Do you like like the lead up
0:37
Speaker 2: to Chrissy New Year's I do? I do?
0:42
Speaker 1: I generally, I generally do, and I won't go into
0:45
Speaker 1: great details. A bit sad this year because a family
0:47
Speaker 1: friend is very very unwell, someone very close to our
0:50
Speaker 1: family and my family, so it's a bit sad. But
0:53
Speaker 1: in general terms, yeah, Chrissy is good. It's like everyone
0:57
Speaker 1: like the mood lightens and people take the foot off
1:02
Speaker 1: the gas a little bit. But it's an interesting time
1:05
Speaker 1: because for some people, isn't it interesting? That for some
1:08
Speaker 1: people it's a time of connection and fun and joy
1:12
Speaker 1: and love and giving and getting, and for some people
1:16
Speaker 1: it's a time of isolation and loneliness. And so, you know,
1:20
Speaker 1: without being a downer, yeah, it's it's an interesting time
1:24
Speaker 1: of the year because either way it's going to evoke
1:27
Speaker 1: certain feelings and emotions.
1:29
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I kind of do have that love
1:31
Speaker 2: hate with it because I enjoy the time and the
1:35
Speaker 2: sort of vibe of Australia around the Christmas you know,
1:38
Speaker 2: that end of December jan break. But then I also
1:42
Speaker 2: lose all momentum I've gathered from the year, and by
1:47
Speaker 2: the time I come back into work, I feel like
1:50
Speaker 2: I've you know, got no steam or I find that
1:54
Speaker 2: I find it hard to pick it back up, even
1:56
Speaker 2: though I have a bit of clarity around, you know,
2:00
Speaker 2: what I'm doing. But I also find momentum is so
2:04
Speaker 2: powerful from you know, midway through the year to the
2:08
Speaker 2: back end. And then yeah, it is quite disruptive in
2:12
Speaker 2: that way. So love hate, but more love than hate.
2:16
Speaker 1: Do you think you are? Like, how old are you now?
2:20
Speaker 2: I'm twenty two, you know.
2:23
Speaker 1: I forgot so you're thirty thirty six? Yeah, and I've
2:29
Speaker 1: known you since literally since you're a teenager, and you
2:33
Speaker 1: remind me of me in that you're better looking than me,
2:36
Speaker 1: and smarter than me and more creative than me. But
2:38
Speaker 1: other than that, other than that, you remind me of
2:41
Speaker 1: me in that it's like you never really wanted a
2:44
Speaker 1: real job. Like it's not that you didn't want to work.
2:47
Speaker 1: You wanted to work, but you didn't want a traditional
2:50
Speaker 1: Nothing wrong with traditional jobs or roles, but you know
2:53
Speaker 1: that nine to five, put on a suit, drive somewhere,
2:56
Speaker 1: do a job, leave that place, drive home. That's not
3:00
Speaker 1: really for you, and that's not really for me. But
3:03
Speaker 1: I feel like watching you over the years where this
3:05
Speaker 1: passion and creativity has intersected with making money and supporting
3:12
Speaker 1: your family and meeting people and travel, it's like this
3:17
Speaker 1: synergy now of a bunch of different things that just
3:23
Speaker 1: happens to make money. Does it feel like a job?
3:27
Speaker 2: Yeah, not really, because if it felt like a job,
3:30
Speaker 2: I wouldn't be doing it. I'd be doing something else.
3:34
Speaker 2: But in saying that, even though my life doesn't always
3:37
Speaker 2: you know, it doesn't necessarily feel like a job. And
3:40
Speaker 2: to be clear, that's probably what I've always had as
3:43
Speaker 2: a driver to work away from so that's been sort
3:48
Speaker 2: of anchored in wanting to find those things that don't
3:52
Speaker 2: feel like work or that aligns so much with the
3:56
Speaker 2: things that I'm passionate about so that they don't feel
3:58
Speaker 2: like that. But there's been a long time that I
4:01
Speaker 2: made no money, very little, not making you know, millions now,
4:07
Speaker 2: But I'm just I'm making more than I was when
4:09
Speaker 2: I first started out. And that's probably the challenges though.
4:12
Speaker 2: When people try and do things that are a passion
4:16
Speaker 2: you know that they really truly love, Converting it to
4:20
Speaker 2: some kind of monetary reward is tricky, but they still
4:26
Speaker 2: stick at it because it's so rewarding from a you know,
4:29
Speaker 2: values perspective.
4:31
Speaker 1: Could you give There'll be people listening today who've never
4:34
Speaker 1: met you because you haven't been on for a little while,
4:36
Speaker 1: and there'll be lots of people who know you a bit,
4:39
Speaker 1: and there'll be a few people who know you really well.
4:41
Speaker 1: But could you just tell people what you do? Like,
4:44
Speaker 1: give us a snapshot, Like you and I meet in
4:46
Speaker 1: a bar and I go mate sixty seconds or whatever.
4:50
Speaker 1: Tell me how you make money, what you do and
4:53
Speaker 1: how it works.
4:54
Speaker 2: Well, if I met you in a bar, I'd say, firstly,
4:56
Speaker 2: what are you doing in a bart And secondly, you're
4:58
Speaker 2: my father? How do you not know this stuff exactly exactly?
5:02
Speaker 1: I'm Tommy's cyber dad. Sorry, good dad, pseudo dad. But
5:06
Speaker 1: all right, pretend I'm a stranger.
5:10
Speaker 2: I mean, I struggled to say that, but if I
5:14
Speaker 2: was to sort of lean into that, because I would
5:16
Speaker 2: probably ask questions about them first before me. But what
5:19
Speaker 2: I do for a job is video production and podcast production.
5:23
Speaker 2: And I got into that through sort of being passionately
5:28
Speaker 2: into creating myself. So you know, I started out as
5:31
Speaker 2: a personal trainer. I didn't like that. I wanted to
5:34
Speaker 2: move towards something that I was more passionate about, which
5:37
Speaker 2: was media, the creation of content. And I ended up
5:42
Speaker 2: working in radio for two years, hosting a breakfast radio show,
5:46
Speaker 2: which then led to creating video content, which then led
5:50
Speaker 2: to creating my own video production and podcast production business.
5:54
Speaker 2: And so yeah, Ankor, and that has been always centered
5:58
Speaker 2: around that personal creation and then helping other people do
6:03
Speaker 2: that for them their brand.
6:05
Speaker 1: When you like, you've just been working on what is
6:10
Speaker 1: for you and would be for anyone in your line.
6:12
Speaker 1: Quite a big project which we'll talk about. I'm not
6:15
Speaker 1: sure how much we'll talk about it, but we'll talk
6:17
Speaker 1: about it at the end of it. When you do
6:20
Speaker 1: something really good, I feel like for you, of course,
6:25
Speaker 1: you've got to make money, pay the bills, you've got kids,
6:27
Speaker 1: you've got a family, you've got responsibilities, all that normal
6:29
Speaker 1: grown up stuff. So proud of you, but I feel
6:33
Speaker 1: like you're more interested in how good it is than
6:37
Speaker 1: how much it's going to make.
6:39
Speaker 2: Yeah, which I guess hopefully you can convert that to
6:44
Speaker 2: making you some money, and it also being how good
6:47
Speaker 2: is this? It can be both, yes, and I think
6:50
Speaker 2: you should. It's hard because then it's just a hobby
6:53
Speaker 2: if you can't get it to convert them to some
6:55
Speaker 2: kind of financial award.
6:58
Speaker 1: But what about what about the eye around like and
7:01
Speaker 1: this is you know, I coach a lot of would
7:04
Speaker 1: be speakers and people who are speakers and want to
7:08
Speaker 1: be speakers, And I guess Tiff is in that. Tiff
7:11
Speaker 1: who works with me who you know, well, she's in that,
7:15
Speaker 1: and we're always you know, for the last few years
7:16
Speaker 1: I've been coaching her in terms of opening the door
7:19
Speaker 1: to professional speaking and coaching and running groups and mentoring
7:24
Speaker 1: and how that works. And we talk a lot about
7:28
Speaker 1: the perception of value and the psychology of value. And
7:33
Speaker 1: there was a time when you would make a video
7:35
Speaker 1: for someone to promote their business and you would charge X,
7:40
Speaker 1: and then a while later you would charge five X.
7:43
Speaker 1: And now these days, I don't know what you charge,
7:45
Speaker 1: but maybe fifteen or twenty X, and which is understandable.
7:51
Speaker 1: Like there was a time when I was doing talks
7:52
Speaker 1: for fifty bucks, you know, and now it's up to
7:56
Speaker 1: sixty bucks, so I'm killing.
7:58
Speaker 2: It, you know.
8:00
Speaker 1: But that that kind of evolution of not only your
8:04
Speaker 1: own development and creative potential and you know, business acumen,
8:10
Speaker 1: but being confident enough to charge people a lot to
8:14
Speaker 1: do something and when they could get someone in inverted
8:17
Speaker 1: commas cheaper, how did you go with all of that?
8:21
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's such an evolution. You know, if you don't
8:25
Speaker 2: believe it at the start, you're not going as And
8:27
Speaker 2: if you don't believe you're worth more than what someone's
8:30
Speaker 2: willing to pay you, you're definitely not worth anymore. So
8:35
Speaker 2: you are worth the fifty bucks to talk. But I think, yeah,
8:39
Speaker 2: over time, the experience, you know, runs on the board
8:44
Speaker 2: confidence in your own abilities. Half the time I think
8:48
Speaker 2: creative industry and you know, these sort of self taught pursuits.
8:51
Speaker 2: A lot of people are self taught now, photographers, videographers,
8:56
Speaker 2: you know, podcasters. There is that level of confidence in
9:01
Speaker 2: what you do that sort of comes over time, so
9:05
Speaker 2: once you have done it for other people. But I
9:08
Speaker 2: don't know, maybe you probably know me in a perspective
9:11
Speaker 2: that I don't even know me seeing my level of
9:14
Speaker 2: confidence in what I'm doing, which I don't think I
9:17
Speaker 2: did have that early days. But I had the ability
9:22
Speaker 2: to push through that uncomfortable feeling of unsure and don't
9:28
Speaker 2: know my worth to where to being able to charge
9:31
Speaker 2: today good money for what I do.
9:35
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think for me it's like seeing you from
9:38
Speaker 1: the clumsy clearly talented and likable and charismatic and all
9:46
Speaker 1: of those things which you were. But it's kind of
9:50
Speaker 1: like reminds me of being at lots of sporting teams
9:53
Speaker 1: that I've worked with, AFL clubs, VFL clubs, National level
9:58
Speaker 1: Netball League clubs, where some it comes in and you're like,
10:02
Speaker 1: are this girl or this guy. They've got good genetics.
10:05
Speaker 1: They've got good genetics. They can run, fast, jump high,
10:07
Speaker 1: they can catch, they can throw, they can kick, they
10:10
Speaker 1: can handle, they've got good endurance, they've got, but they're
10:16
Speaker 1: a fair way away from being an elite player, you know,
10:20
Speaker 1: And that's kind of where you were, Like you had
10:22
Speaker 1: all the ingredients and all the potential and all the possibilities,
10:27
Speaker 1: But there are so many people that have that, but
10:30
Speaker 1: they don't then do the required work to turn that
10:36
Speaker 1: potential into a real world thing that is now valuable,
10:41
Speaker 1: that is now sought after, that is now in demand,
10:45
Speaker 1: that is now at a very high level. Like I
10:49
Speaker 1: always had the potential to be a reasonably good corporate
10:54
Speaker 1: slash professional speaker rights or whatever, but there was a
10:58
Speaker 1: lot of time where I didn't have the experience. I
11:00
Speaker 1: didn't have the skill, I didn't have the confidence, I
11:03
Speaker 1: didn't have the knowledge. Like, the potential was there, but
11:07
Speaker 1: potential is really just the stepping off point. Like for me,
11:12
Speaker 1: you're especially in the last I reckon four years, it
11:19
Speaker 1: seems like you've matured ten years. It's like you're a
11:23
Speaker 1: much more grown up. Like you were like a fucking
11:26
Speaker 1: twelve year old too, you're about thirty.
11:30
Speaker 2: Yeah, yes, what on now? I feel like an old
11:32
Speaker 2: thirty six year old.
11:34
Speaker 1: Yeah, you're like a fun twelve year but you were
11:37
Speaker 1: like a big kid. I'm still like that big kid.
11:40
Speaker 1: Sometimes I still have to rain my shit in and
11:43
Speaker 1: go all right, well, you know you're actually doing a
11:45
Speaker 1: big gig and you're talking at the wherever.
11:48
Speaker 2: You know, I want to always have like this huge
11:51
Speaker 2: leap in what they do. So it's like you obviously
11:54
Speaker 2: get runs on the board from doing the thing that
11:57
Speaker 2: you do and you slowly chip away. And maybe maybe
12:02
Speaker 2: not everyone actually has that progression when they are having
12:07
Speaker 2: just chipping away and having runs the because things come
12:10
Speaker 2: into play, like self esteem or self worth or just
12:14
Speaker 2: not being able to view themselves in a way that
12:18
Speaker 2: increases their value. So I get that that is also
12:21
Speaker 2: a reality, but I kind of always have just chipped away.
12:24
Speaker 2: So you know, the video projects or the podcast projects
12:27
Speaker 2: I work on today are quite they feel much easier
12:33
Speaker 2: than they would have five years ago because my skill
12:37
Speaker 2: my skill level has caught up and then the belief
12:41
Speaker 2: is sort of in myself and being able to do
12:43
Speaker 2: these kind of projects or work with big clients has
12:47
Speaker 2: also strengthened. And so it's it can only happen over time.
12:52
Speaker 2: It's unless you unless you have a big opportunity that
12:56
Speaker 2: allows you to take a huge lap. And for me,
13:00
Speaker 2: it was like doing the radio thing. I'd never done
13:03
Speaker 2: any kind of real tangible project or you know, being
13:08
Speaker 2: employed by somebody who was other than just making my
13:12
Speaker 2: own content, which is a very low barrier anyone can
13:16
Speaker 2: do it. But then when you you know, quotation marks
13:20
Speaker 2: get picked by somebody and they say, we think you're
13:24
Speaker 2: good enough on board, like you know, that is one
13:28
Speaker 2: way to sort of level up and feel really sort
13:32
Speaker 2: of insecure about it, but then be able to say, oh,
13:34
Speaker 2: they must think I'm good enough they gave me a job,
13:38
Speaker 2: and then and then, but then that was just that
13:41
Speaker 2: job was you know, two years of every day doing
13:44
Speaker 2: the thing, and so then you get just I got
13:47
Speaker 2: the opportunity to be able to hone my skill in
13:51
Speaker 2: this area, which yeah, that that helps you then progress,
13:55
Speaker 2: that's that that generates that momentum in your value.
14:00
Speaker 1: I think also you don't realize because you're you, and
14:03
Speaker 1: because you're with you every minute of every day, you
14:07
Speaker 1: don't see your own progression because it's like if I
14:12
Speaker 1: don't see you for a while, like I don't think
14:14
Speaker 1: you and I have sat down and had a coffee
14:16
Speaker 1: for months, four or five months, maybe.
14:19
Speaker 2: No, no, just before I left three it could be
14:21
Speaker 2: three months Jesus away for seven weeks, was it?
14:23
Speaker 1: I okay? But when I don't see you for an installment,
14:27
Speaker 1: like three months, four months, I noticed change. I noticed development,
14:31
Speaker 1: but you wouldn't notice it because you're you, right. And
14:34
Speaker 1: it's like the other day somebody was asking me about
14:39
Speaker 1: somebody wants to as does everyone start a podcast? And
14:43
Speaker 1: they're like, can you give me a three minute workshop
14:45
Speaker 1: on podcasting? And I just gave them literally that like
14:50
Speaker 1: pros cons, what to do, what not to do, what
14:52
Speaker 1: my thoughts, my peaks and trosts, what I did well,
14:56
Speaker 1: what I did terrible, blah blah blah blah, and I finished,
15:00
Speaker 1: and they're like, one, I never thought there was so
15:04
Speaker 1: much to it, and two like, oh my god, you
15:08
Speaker 1: know so much. And I'm like, I still feel clumsy
15:12
Speaker 1: on a podcast at times. And then I think, well,
15:15
Speaker 1: like when I think about all the stuff I did
15:18
Speaker 1: with you before the You project, the stuff we did,
15:21
Speaker 1: the stuff I did with Bianca and Francis, the stuff
15:24
Speaker 1: I did with the Australian Fitness podcast which was mine
15:26
Speaker 1: that I gave to Russell, blah blah blah. I've done,
15:30
Speaker 1: you know, just in my own I've done over two
15:32
Speaker 1: thousand shows, and then when you're all the other shows
15:35
Speaker 1: I've been on or episodes, I would say at least
15:37
Speaker 1: another five hundred, so that's two and I think, oh, yeah,
15:41
Speaker 1: I'm probably good at this, or I'm probably I've got
15:44
Speaker 1: some skill and some knowledge and some understanding of the
15:49
Speaker 1: you know, the science for one of the better term,
15:51
Speaker 1: the science of it all. But you never I never
15:53
Speaker 1: stop and think, shit, I'm good at this, and then
15:56
Speaker 1: somebody points out that you're actually fucking good at it,
15:59
Speaker 1: and you go, oh, am I here.
16:02
Speaker 2: Well, all the beauty of time allows you to then
16:04
Speaker 2: have sort of that tangible evidence to pull on that
16:08
Speaker 2: I have done this. And so the project that I've
16:11
Speaker 2: just been working on, a documentary traveling across America, where
16:15
Speaker 2: I was hosting it with my mate Josh, who I
16:18
Speaker 2: had the Daily talk show with which you were on
16:21
Speaker 2: many times, and we've both been on here. We hadn't
16:25
Speaker 2: been in front of camera together or doing anything podcast
16:29
Speaker 2: related in years, but not even thinking can we do
16:33
Speaker 2: that or not? We just stepped into the project knowing
16:37
Speaker 2: and for me, I'm only talking for me here, but
16:39
Speaker 2: I knew that we've done this so many times, thousands
16:43
Speaker 2: we've been you know, I've done thousands of episodes of
16:47
Speaker 2: podcasts in my time, including the radio stuff. It's like, yes, yes,
16:51
Speaker 2: and so. But if that was fifteen years ago, I
16:56
Speaker 2: would have been shitting myself, not knowing if I could
16:59
Speaker 2: do it. Do I have the skill set to be
17:02
Speaker 2: able to.
17:02
Speaker 1: Do I want to talk about your doco in a moment,
17:06
Speaker 1: But I remember years ago, early early days of Harper's
17:11
Speaker 1: and that's my Gym's everyone and I got interviewed for
17:15
Speaker 1: a few things. I got interviewed on radio sporadically, like
17:19
Speaker 1: four or five times a year, and I really enjoyed it.
17:22
Speaker 1: I got interviewed for a few mags and for the
17:25
Speaker 1: Herald Sun that I ended up writing for, and the
17:28
Speaker 1: radio stuff I really liked. And I thought, how do
17:30
Speaker 1: I get into radio? Not that I want to be
17:33
Speaker 1: a radio person, but and then a friend of mine said,
17:36
Speaker 1: why don't you do some community radio? And I'm like, well,
17:38
Speaker 1: I don't even know what that is. And basically it's
17:41
Speaker 1: it's it's a volunteer, as you know exactly. It's everything's
17:47
Speaker 1: the same except no one listens, so you know, you
17:50
Speaker 1: might have fifty or one hundred listeners, and it's not
17:53
Speaker 1: commercial and it's not paid, and there are they're not advertisers.
17:57
Speaker 1: What are they called sponsors, it's sponsors, Thank you sponsors.
18:01
Speaker 1: And but I did I did four years of a
18:05
Speaker 1: show by myself that fucking thirteen people listened to. But
18:09
Speaker 1: I got four years of training, like literally playing music,
18:14
Speaker 1: taking calls, you know, time checks, station id, weather checks,
18:20
Speaker 1: having conversations in and off of mic. But and so
18:24
Speaker 1: by the time I got to work at SCN, which
18:26
Speaker 1: was a few years later, I'd already done hundreds of
18:31
Speaker 1: hours of radio without the pressure. So so not all
18:36
Speaker 1: of it, but a lot of the development, the learning,
18:38
Speaker 1: the fuck ups, the understanding, you know that, the miles
18:44
Speaker 1: on the clock, I'd already got under my belt before
18:48
Speaker 1: I sat down in a proper studio where it really
18:52
Speaker 1: fucking matters, you know. So I'd played one hundred games
18:55
Speaker 1: before I played my first game, so to speak.
18:58
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, and there not everyone's willing to do that though,
19:02
Speaker 2: as in putting the time without any reward, and so yeah,
19:08
Speaker 2: that's the trouble. That's a challenge with people who want
19:11
Speaker 2: to get into doing podcasting nowadays is there's would they
19:16
Speaker 2: do it if someone said, Okay, here's money for you
19:18
Speaker 2: to show up and do this thing. But that's why, really,
19:22
Speaker 2: I think that's why there are so many great standout ones,
19:26
Speaker 2: because it's all off the back of someone having so
19:30
Speaker 2: that real drive to do it themselves.
19:33
Speaker 1: I think also, you know, the willingness to do something
19:37
Speaker 1: that you know you're not going to be good at
19:38
Speaker 1: initially and being okay with that and recognizing that the
19:42
Speaker 1: only way I get good at podcasting is by podcasting,
19:47
Speaker 1: just like I can't get good at running by not running. Yeah,
19:51
Speaker 1: I can't get strong without lifting, you know. And so
19:54
Speaker 1: you go, all right, well, I'm going to start a
19:56
Speaker 1: podcast and there's probably going to be somewhere between one
19:59
Speaker 1: and five people listening, and it's every chance it's going
20:03
Speaker 1: to be shit. Yeah, and it might be shit somewhere
20:06
Speaker 1: between shits and average for a long time. But the
20:09
Speaker 1: only way I can get through the shit an average
20:11
Speaker 1: phase is to do that. You know, This is how
20:15
Speaker 1: I get good is by acknowledging and being bad or
20:19
Speaker 1: not skilled or not competent at the start and then
20:23
Speaker 1: doing the work to get good. But people don't want
20:27
Speaker 1: that painful start.
20:28
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's painful, I get it.
20:33
Speaker 1: What's the average number of episodes that podcasters do, isn't
20:38
Speaker 1: It isn't the average podcast loves last seven or something episodes?
20:43
Speaker 2: Yeah, seven or eleven? I think the number. Maybe it's
20:47
Speaker 2: because I like seven eleven as a shop. That may
20:49
Speaker 2: be just coming to mind.
20:51
Speaker 1: I do remember we'll talk about your doco in a minute,
20:53
Speaker 1: and I know you don't have too much time. Do
20:56
Speaker 1: you have tool? It's twelve to twenty one? Now have
20:58
Speaker 1: you got to forty five or no?
21:00
Speaker 2: Yeah?
21:00
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, So I remember you did tell us there's
21:04
Speaker 1: so many cool things that you've done over the years
21:06
Speaker 1: that our listeners would know of. But remember you did
21:09
Speaker 1: the coffee the blind coffee test where I think that
21:14
Speaker 1: was you where you've got a seven eleven coffee and
21:16
Speaker 1: actual some Barista made coffees, like some five six dollar
21:21
Speaker 1: coffees and one dollar coffees.
21:23
Speaker 2: Or seven eleven coffees mainstream. Now, if you're not drinking it,
21:27
Speaker 2: what are you doing? No, But it's seen now as
21:32
Speaker 2: like it's just a part of everyone. I fear running
21:35
Speaker 2: late or just need a quick hit, you go to
21:37
Speaker 2: seven eleven. This is not a sponsorship deal. But I've
21:40
Speaker 2: been drinking seven eleven coffees from day one. And my
21:42
Speaker 2: point was in this test was that when it's a
21:47
Speaker 2: long black. Sure, there are some cafes that do like
21:50
Speaker 2: an exceptional tasting long black that do stand out amongst
21:55
Speaker 2: other long blacks, but when you are just having black coffee,
21:59
Speaker 2: can really tell the difference between something that's just shot
22:02
Speaker 2: out of a machine for a dollar inflation, now two bucks?
22:07
Speaker 2: Can you tell the difference between that and a barista
22:10
Speaker 2: made coffee? But that was on the that was on
22:12
Speaker 2: the podcast with Pete Shepherd. I got him to taste
22:16
Speaker 2: test the barista coffee from the cafe downstairs of the
22:20
Speaker 2: studio and the seven eleven coffee that I ran and got,
22:23
Speaker 2: and he chose the seven eleven coffee as the tasty one,
22:27
Speaker 2: which really which is yeah, I mean, it's it's that
22:30
Speaker 2: is hard, but yeah, that's it. I think it just
22:35
Speaker 2: shows that it really is just.
22:37
Speaker 1: I mean, taste is taste is subjective, of course, but
22:42
Speaker 1: every like most days, I train at four and then
22:45
Speaker 1: on my way home at five point fifteen, there's a
22:47
Speaker 1: seven to eleven fifty meters from the gym, which you know,
22:52
Speaker 1: and most days, especially if I've got to work, especially
22:55
Speaker 1: if I've got a six pm podcast, especially if I
22:57
Speaker 1: need to be a little bit of a stim on board.
23:01
Speaker 1: I get a seven eleven coffee and I have a
23:05
Speaker 1: fancy coffee every morning at the Hampton's and it's good.
23:10
Speaker 1: And I don't know if the seven eleven is as good,
23:12
Speaker 1: but to me, it's very much in the It's not
23:15
Speaker 1: like I'm drinking, you know, ness cafe out of a
23:18
Speaker 1: jar from the pantry. It's to me, it's it does
23:21
Speaker 1: the same job.
23:23
Speaker 2: Which one do you pick? Which coffee?
23:27
Speaker 1: Which coffee? I have a medium which is three bucks now,
23:29
Speaker 1: and I have a skinny flat white which is it's
23:33
Speaker 1: a double shot.
23:34
Speaker 2: I think, Okay, I like, what do you do? I've
23:37
Speaker 2: gone the piccolo now some of the machines are they're
23:41
Speaker 2: you know, they've upgraded.
23:43
Speaker 1: I didn't even know you could do a pick. So
23:45
Speaker 1: piccolo is like just a small amount of water and
23:48
Speaker 1: a single or a double shot.
23:50
Speaker 2: So it's just a shot of coffee and a little
23:52
Speaker 2: bit of milk. So it's like the cup it becomes
23:55
Speaker 2: half full, so it's just like a taste stronger.
23:59
Speaker 1: So it's like half the milk but the same cough caffeine.
24:02
Speaker 2: Yes, do you remember when I did that video going
24:05
Speaker 2: down the rabbit hole of seven to eleven where I
24:09
Speaker 2: worked out that a large would fit into a medium. Yeah,
24:16
Speaker 2: all right, it was a bit of an expose, or
24:21
Speaker 2: it was the medium fits into a small, and so
24:23
Speaker 2: there was just something there, which, in fairness, I can't
24:27
Speaker 2: even remember what I did, but I'd worked out that
24:29
Speaker 2: one of the bigger cups fits into a smaller cup
24:32
Speaker 2: and it's like the same amount of coffee, so you're
24:35
Speaker 2: basically better off just getting the small. But then I
24:40
Speaker 2: was on the project talking about that just being an
24:43
Speaker 2: absolute scally wag. But I looked into like where the
24:46
Speaker 2: coffee was roasted, found out it was out like out
24:51
Speaker 2: past Alfington area. So I went out to the plate
24:54
Speaker 2: like just yeah, it was a real time in a
24:59
Speaker 2: moment in time when that was just sort of coming
25:02
Speaker 2: becoming mainstream.
25:04
Speaker 1: Well, I mean it's still ground coffee beans, right, it's
25:07
Speaker 1: and it's like the thing about seven to eleven, like
25:10
Speaker 1: it or not, is that it's consistent, Like there's zero
25:16
Speaker 1: variation in my coffee. I know exactly what it's going
25:19
Speaker 1: to taste, like, exactly how hot it'll be and exactly
25:23
Speaker 1: how full the cup's going to be, no matter where
25:26
Speaker 1: I get it from or when. It's exactly the same
25:28
Speaker 1: every time.
25:29
Speaker 2: I paid six dollars yesterday in Brighton for a piccolo
25:33
Speaker 2: coffee and that's suck. I could not believe it. And
25:38
Speaker 2: at that point, like you just it was. I was
25:40
Speaker 2: having a meeting. I was like, oh, but I still
25:43
Speaker 2: got it. But it really annoyed me that I had
25:46
Speaker 2: to pay six dollars for something that's a dollar fifty
25:49
Speaker 2: and it definitely wasn't any better than a piccolo from
25:53
Speaker 2: seven to eleven.
25:54
Speaker 1: I'm going to get in trouble for saying this, but
25:56
Speaker 1: fuck it. Live on the edge, jumbo. Have you been
25:59
Speaker 1: to England?
26:00
Speaker 2: Yes?
26:02
Speaker 1: Have you had coffee in England?
26:05
Speaker 2: I was twenty eleven. It was trash when I was there, but.
26:10
Speaker 1: I was there about six years ago. I guess I
26:14
Speaker 1: did some work there and I've been there a few times.
26:16
Speaker 1: But last time I was there, the coffee was like
26:19
Speaker 1: four pounds, so like eight bucks, and it was it
26:24
Speaker 1: was lukewarm, it was weak, it was fucking terrible.
26:28
Speaker 2: Well, I think the coffee around the world, I think
26:31
Speaker 2: has got better. There has been this time. So I
26:35
Speaker 2: was in America for seven weeks recently, and America is
26:39
Speaker 2: always slammed for having shitty coffee. Well, they do it differently.
26:44
Speaker 2: It's all the just percolated, just coffee on black coffee.
26:48
Speaker 2: It's like closer to something like tea. You can drink
26:51
Speaker 2: like four cups of it without your head blowing up.
26:54
Speaker 2: Versus if you had four long blacks in Australia in
26:57
Speaker 2: a row, you'd be ye, you'd have a.
26:59
Speaker 1: Heart, you'd have chest pain.
27:01
Speaker 2: Yeah, yes, and so but across across America the coffee
27:06
Speaker 2: is so much better now, and so there is I
27:09
Speaker 2: think there has been a catch up in the last
27:13
Speaker 2: ten yeah, ten years.
27:15
Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, tell us about whatever you can. So
27:19
Speaker 1: you just got back from the States. You were doing
27:21
Speaker 1: a doco, correct what I get wrong? But you were
27:26
Speaker 1: making a doco for someone else, your production company, but
27:30
Speaker 1: someone was paying you to be there, so you weren't
27:33
Speaker 1: funding it. You were doing it for someone else with
27:37
Speaker 1: a view to potentially this being streamed on a big
27:42
Speaker 1: platform internationally. Is that right?
27:45
Speaker 2: Yeah, Well, to create anything, there's no linear path these days.
27:50
Speaker 2: Back in the day, you know, you'd get picked by
27:52
Speaker 2: a network or you know, you'd have an agent, and
27:55
Speaker 2: then you'd someone's creating something and it's usually a work
28:00
Speaker 2: that are funding it. And then so there's you know,
28:03
Speaker 2: lots of sort of red tape and then the thing
28:07
Speaker 2: gets created and distributed. Now you can there's a million
28:10
Speaker 2: ways to fund something. You can create it, you know, bootstrapped,
28:15
Speaker 2: you know, just with your time and then hopefully it
28:18
Speaker 2: gets picked up. So a lot of documentaries come out
28:21
Speaker 2: that way or a network, you know the old traditional path,
28:24
Speaker 2: or private equity, which is what we had funding a
28:27
Speaker 2: film that will then go on to a streaming platform.
28:31
Speaker 2: So you then sell it onto a streaming platform. So
28:33
Speaker 2: that's just the way we got to this project. But yeah,
28:37
Speaker 2: seven of us went to America to you know, seven
28:40
Speaker 2: Ossie Ossies went over to America and we spent a
28:45
Speaker 2: month driving across the country learning about gun culture within
28:51
Speaker 2: America through the lens of Australians. You know, it's very
28:54
Speaker 2: different in this country. I mean, have you ever seen
28:56
Speaker 2: have you ever seen a gun? I mean, you've got
28:59
Speaker 2: a shady pass, but have you ever seen like a
29:03
Speaker 2: gun with a criminal or something like that isn't on
29:06
Speaker 2: the hip of a police officer in your time? Have
29:09
Speaker 2: you seen?
29:09
Speaker 1: Have you only when I'm in the States, so I mean,
29:13
Speaker 1: but well no that's not true. I mean I grew up,
29:16
Speaker 1: I've shot guns, you know, because I grew up in
29:19
Speaker 1: the country. But back in the day, when you know,
29:22
Speaker 1: you would you would go, you know, rabbiting and all
29:26
Speaker 1: of that hunting. And I don't do it anymore. Everyone
29:28
Speaker 1: don't get mad at me. But back in the day.
29:30
Speaker 1: But that was a very long time ago, Like that
29:32
Speaker 1: was forty forty five years ago. That was pre port
29:36
Speaker 1: Arthur and all of those things. And it was it
29:39
Speaker 1: was less of a you know, like a talking point
29:44
Speaker 1: like it wasn't but generally you know, no, no, but
29:48
Speaker 1: in America. Yeah, like I've been in Texas and Mississippi
29:51
Speaker 1: and Louisiana, and like Texas is open carry as you
29:55
Speaker 1: know better than me, I'm sure, but but yeah, it's
29:58
Speaker 1: it's So how was it? How was the trip? Yeah?
30:02
Speaker 2: Unbelievable. So, I mean it was just the fact of
30:07
Speaker 2: having sort of a like their small team. It's quite
30:11
Speaker 2: a big team, but it's a small in the scale
30:14
Speaker 2: of documentaries or Hollywood field or anything. But yeah, so
30:18
Speaker 2: we started in.
30:20
Speaker 1: So just tell us what the seven were. So you
30:22
Speaker 1: and Joshua John of camera, but it also as a
30:26
Speaker 1: creatives and producers and.
30:28
Speaker 2: Yeah, we had two producers with us, two camera guys,
30:32
Speaker 2: A dop and an assistant cinematographer, and then we had
30:38
Speaker 2: a soundo who was managing all the microphones and labs.
30:42
Speaker 2: And so we started the trip in Los Angeles and
30:46
Speaker 2: we had this massive Ram twenty five hundred. We wanted
30:50
Speaker 2: to sort of lean into that American experience of having
30:55
Speaker 2: a big truck and you blend in quite well because
30:58
Speaker 2: everyone else has got them, and so.
31:01
Speaker 1: We got that's a great for my listeners, that's a great,
31:05
Speaker 1: gigantic big ut.
31:08
Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean it's a pickup truck. It's it can
31:11
Speaker 2: bloody transport a crane if you had to like this thing.
31:14
Speaker 2: We because the challenge with getting any kind of higher
31:20
Speaker 2: car is you know how they say it's going to
31:22
Speaker 2: be a Subaru or similar, and so we picked the
31:26
Speaker 2: biggest cars that would be like an F one f
31:30
Speaker 2: fifteen hundred, F one fifty sorry or similar, and somehow
31:34
Speaker 2: we lucked out. We got a Ram twenty five hundred.
31:37
Speaker 2: This thing is I'm six foot two, it's it's you know,
31:41
Speaker 2: standing at seven foot at the cabin. It's ginormous. And
31:44
Speaker 2: so we were so pumped that we got to have
31:48
Speaker 2: this thing for the full four weeks of driving and
31:53
Speaker 2: where it was next level. So we started in Los Angeles.
31:57
Speaker 2: In prior to going, we we had a bunch of
32:00
Speaker 2: sort of destinations or people we wanted to speak to,
32:04
Speaker 2: and then we spent a couple of weeks in Los
32:05
Speaker 2: Angeles working out who we could talk to, connecting up
32:09
Speaker 2: with people, and planning probably two weeks ahead on the
32:12
Speaker 2: road trip. So yeah, we got you know, as sort
32:16
Speaker 2: of bright eyed Aussie guys trying to understand what the
32:20
Speaker 2: gun cultures like. It's you're already thrust into it, even
32:23
Speaker 2: in some way like Los Angeles that's very liberal and
32:28
Speaker 2: you know, it's I guess, very strict on guns, but
32:34
Speaker 2: in respect to the other parts of the world, it's
32:37
Speaker 2: very you know, las in comparison. So you still can
32:41
Speaker 2: own a handgun, you still can own an ar fIF D,
32:45
Speaker 2: and there's you know, still so many of these things
32:47
Speaker 2: that to us is so foreign. And so within California
32:51
Speaker 2: before we even left, we'd met someone who had been
32:55
Speaker 2: shot at a mass shooting, one of the biggest mass
32:58
Speaker 2: shootings in American history. We did a Hollywood experience where
33:03
Speaker 2: I got shot with this blood exploding out the back,
33:07
Speaker 2: you know, like a Hollywood scene that we did. And
33:11
Speaker 2: then and then yeah, we moved on to Vegas, Utah, Colorado, Texas, Louisiana, Chicago, like,
33:20
Speaker 2: and so we worked our way across the country. But
33:23
Speaker 2: it's a very eye opening coming from this country and just.
33:29
Speaker 1: Did you yeah, I bet you met like did you
33:32
Speaker 1: meet any meet any characters where you're like, how does
33:36
Speaker 1: this person even exist? Like is like this guy's like
33:41
Speaker 1: something from a film?
33:43
Speaker 2: It is. The thing about America is there's so many
33:46
Speaker 2: of those types of people, and they absolutely love talking
33:50
Speaker 2: about what they're into. And so the fact that we
33:54
Speaker 2: were Rossie's, the fact that it was about guns, the
33:57
Speaker 2: Second Amendment, and the culture that exists in America around
34:01
Speaker 2: guns just meant that we were sort of drawn to
34:05
Speaker 2: these people. But the reality is, I think people could
34:08
Speaker 2: watch the documentary and think that we've you know, picked
34:11
Speaker 2: out only the people that said that they had a
34:15
Speaker 2: gun or said that they had a story, But genuinely,
34:19
Speaker 2: it was all the people we spoke to. There really
34:22
Speaker 2: wasn't many people that didn't have an experience around guns,
34:25
Speaker 2: didn't have a thought on it, a belief about it,
34:29
Speaker 2: or you know, had had a story from growing up.
34:31
Speaker 2: And so you know, we went to New Orleans and
34:37
Speaker 2: we spoke to three people. They all had a story.
34:38
Speaker 2: One guy had a gun in his bag, pulls out
34:40
Speaker 2: his handgun just in the main street, just unloads it. Yeah,
34:44
Speaker 2: give it here it is holding it. You know.
34:47
Speaker 1: We what was there? Sorry? What was their attitude around you?
34:52
Speaker 1: Because it's not like most Americans will never meet, especially
34:56
Speaker 1: a Tommy Jacket, They're never going to meet a seven
35:00
Speaker 1: Australians just on the other side of the world doing that.
35:04
Speaker 1: Were they receptive?
35:06
Speaker 2: Oh so receptive? So we discovered, you know that we
35:11
Speaker 2: just from a timing perspective, we had all of our
35:13
Speaker 2: dates were moving about because we hadn't started the trip yet,
35:17
Speaker 2: and it just so happened we'd booked our accommodation in
35:20
Speaker 2: Las Vegas, and we'd planned to sort of have our
35:23
Speaker 2: first experience shooting a gun as Australians in America in
35:28
Speaker 2: some way like Las Vegas, there's a machine gun experiences.
35:32
Speaker 2: It's like a gun tourism within that state of Nevada,
35:37
Speaker 2: and it just so happened we had the date booked
35:41
Speaker 2: at a machine gun experience was the same date of
35:44
Speaker 2: the biggest mass shooting in American history, which was the
35:47
Speaker 2: Route ninety one country music festival. Where Yeah, there was
35:53
Speaker 2: fifty something people killed by a guy who was up
35:58
Speaker 2: in a hotel room shooting down the crowd.
36:00
Speaker 1: I remember that. I remember that.
36:02
Speaker 2: And I found a woman online who lived in California,
36:07
Speaker 2: but she was there and she was shot three times
36:09
Speaker 2: in the face, in the back, in the arm, and
36:12
Speaker 2: she was a mother of two. And I connected with
36:15
Speaker 2: her and told her who we are, what we're doing,
36:18
Speaker 2: what we'd planned on doing, and how it's you know,
36:20
Speaker 2: our plans were changing based on understanding this, and we
36:23
Speaker 2: wanted to understand her story. And yeah, she just so
36:28
Speaker 2: she wrote back to me straight away and she was
36:30
Speaker 2: so open, and we went and had the producer and
36:33
Speaker 2: I went and had coffee with her in California, and
36:37
Speaker 2: that before we even started filming with her. But just
36:40
Speaker 2: she just wanted to meet us and make sure that
36:41
Speaker 2: we were legit. And she was the most beautiful person,
36:46
Speaker 2: just and ended up having a perspective that I didn't
36:50
Speaker 2: think one would have after being involved in something like that.
36:54
Speaker 2: So as Australian, you'd think she'd be anti gun. She
36:58
Speaker 2: would be very actually against it, and that wasn't her situation.
37:03
Speaker 2: She you know, grew up with guns in her family.
37:06
Speaker 2: Police officers. She understood she knows how to use guns,
37:09
Speaker 2: but she she doesn't. She understands people's rights and you know,
37:14
Speaker 2: beliefs around own gun ownership, which is obviously tied to
37:19
Speaker 2: the Second Amendment, the right to bear arms. And so yeah,
37:23
Speaker 2: she she you know, gave us this perspective that once
37:26
Speaker 2: she was shot, she felt like she was asked, oh,
37:29
Speaker 2: you're going to be that the now face of anti
37:33
Speaker 2: gun you know, you're going to be coming to the rallies.
37:35
Speaker 2: And she want nothing to do with that, you know.
37:39
Speaker 2: And so this is the nuance of the gun conversation
37:43
Speaker 2: in America is going in and as Australian with a
37:46
Speaker 2: perspective that we have just from the reality of what
37:51
Speaker 2: we face here or don't face because it's not something
37:55
Speaker 2: that's on our mind. It just sort of opened the
37:58
Speaker 2: door to so many of those perspectives that were surprising
38:02
Speaker 2: to us.
38:04
Speaker 1: Is there one thing and I mean, obviously we've all
38:07
Speaker 1: got our own I guess probably a lot of our
38:10
Speaker 1: listeners don't really think too much about guns, although some may.
38:14
Speaker 1: But what might we as Aussies find surprising, Like what
38:18
Speaker 1: you just said, that's surprising, but in terms of what
38:22
Speaker 1: you saw or what you became aware of or experienced.
38:26
Speaker 1: What would the average Australian find quite surprising in terms
38:29
Speaker 1: of what you know Now.
38:31
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean from my experience speaking to people, they're
38:35
Speaker 2: more on the side, not even on the side, they're
38:39
Speaker 2: more in the middle that they understand the rights. Americans
38:45
Speaker 2: have their belief on freedom and there's more people that
38:50
Speaker 2: see eye to eye on the subject. You know, a
38:53
Speaker 2: lot of gun owners don't agree with any of this
38:57
Speaker 2: pain that's been caused by them, and it's a very
39:00
Speaker 2: small minority that are actually doing those heinous things. But
39:05
Speaker 2: I mean, once you start understanding some of the statistics,
39:08
Speaker 2: like suicide from firearm is one of the biggest causes
39:13
Speaker 2: of death from firearms, so it's sixty percent makes up
39:16
Speaker 2: almost sixty percent of the gun deaths each year come
39:20
Speaker 2: from suicide. And so it's interesting when you hear about
39:24
Speaker 2: some of these statistics, how you understand the media portrays
39:30
Speaker 2: things in a certain way. And that's not to reduce
39:33
Speaker 2: the reality of mass shootings, school shootings, but they are
39:39
Speaker 2: such a small minority, small number within the number of
39:44
Speaker 2: these deaths per year. But obviously it's so triggering, and
39:49
Speaker 2: you know there's within the documentary. We're at a school
39:52
Speaker 2: learning about a whiteboard on a wall that folds out
39:56
Speaker 2: into a safe room for kids. And I've got kids.
39:59
Speaker 2: I'm crying the doco talking to this guy trying to
40:02
Speaker 2: understand this. And so we learned about this firsthand. You know,
40:05
Speaker 2: this thistle room that can hold up to sixty elementary
40:09
Speaker 2: school children. It's just heartbreaking, and so you know this
40:15
Speaker 2: there is the stark reality of what can happen with them,
40:20
Speaker 2: and then you sort of you know. So it's it
40:22
Speaker 2: is very nuanced, and this is what we're putting forward.
40:25
Speaker 2: It's not a hit piece on America. It's not pro gun,
40:30
Speaker 2: anti gum. We're trying to sort of tell this story,
40:33
Speaker 2: one that the media doesn't communicate and one that is
40:38
Speaker 2: very much the people being able to share their beliefs,
40:42
Speaker 2: their experience as Americans.
40:45
Speaker 1: Do you know who Tim Kennedy is? Yeah? You do,
40:47
Speaker 1: don't you?
40:47
Speaker 2: Yeah?
40:48
Speaker 1: Yeah, So Tim Kennedy, for those who don't know, is
40:50
Speaker 1: an ex soldier, Special Forces soldier, UFC fighter, you know,
40:57
Speaker 1: fill in the blank community things. But I heard somebody
41:01
Speaker 1: I can't remember who it was, but the context of
41:03
Speaker 1: the conversation was they were talking about banning guns and
41:06
Speaker 1: getting guns out of hands and all of that, and
41:08
Speaker 1: he teaches people how to shoot and he's a you know,
41:12
Speaker 1: sniper and all of that stuff. And he essentially said, yeah,
41:17
Speaker 1: the problem with that is that the bad guys are
41:19
Speaker 1: not handing their guns in. You know. That's the thing
41:23
Speaker 1: is Like, even if you say like, it feels like
41:26
Speaker 1: to me in America, like if you could remove all guns,
41:30
Speaker 1: if there was zero guns in America, then there could
41:33
Speaker 1: be zero deaths by gun, right, But you can't do that,
41:37
Speaker 1: Like it's past the point of no return, it seems,
41:40
Speaker 1: because even if they went right, it's illegal to have
41:43
Speaker 1: a gun. Well as if the bad guys in inverted
41:47
Speaker 1: commas are going to be given their gun. So what
41:50
Speaker 1: then you're doing is you're keeping all the bad guys
41:52
Speaker 1: armed and all the people, all the civilians who aren't
41:55
Speaker 1: bad guys, and they now can't protect themselves. And I'm
41:59
Speaker 1: with you, I'm deaf, not pro gun, and i know
42:01
Speaker 1: people are going to go, well, if there were no
42:03
Speaker 1: fucking guns, there'd be I get it, I get it.
42:05
Speaker 1: I'm with you. And in an ideal world that we
42:08
Speaker 1: do not live in, there would be zero guns. But
42:11
Speaker 1: that's not the world. We live in. But Australia has
42:14
Speaker 1: done a good job though.
42:16
Speaker 2: I mean, well, I mean that's that's so the reality
42:20
Speaker 2: is that I get to come home and live in
42:23
Speaker 2: a place like this. But when you when you go
42:26
Speaker 2: over there and you realize, okay, there's they're never going away,
42:32
Speaker 2: and you start to understand the belief system of a
42:35
Speaker 2: lot of Americans. You know, kids are brought up understanding
42:39
Speaker 2: the Second Amendment, how the country was founded, what firearms
42:43
Speaker 2: mean to you know, the history of America. It makes
42:47
Speaker 2: more sense of where they are at today. When you
42:51
Speaker 2: try and place the Australian lens on America's challenge or situation,
42:58
Speaker 2: it just it doesn't work. And so that's where my
43:01
Speaker 2: mind before going over there, I was, you know, very
43:04
Speaker 2: much of that understanding, just because I was coming from
43:07
Speaker 2: this place where you don't ever see guns. I mean sometimes, yeah,
43:11
Speaker 2: sure there are guns in this country. There's probably more
43:14
Speaker 2: than you think, but it's really not like to own
43:17
Speaker 2: one in this country, you need a license, it's registered,
43:20
Speaker 2: the cops know where it's registered too. Like, that's not
43:23
Speaker 2: the reality in America. So it yeah, it's very confusing
43:28
Speaker 2: to Australians and so hopefully the documentary allows people to
43:33
Speaker 2: have a greater insight into what it means to Americans.
43:39
Speaker 1: We're going to let you go soon, just quickly. I've
43:41
Speaker 1: got a couple of practical questions. So give or take?
43:45
Speaker 1: How much footage did you shoot? How many hours of
43:48
Speaker 1: film do you have from that trip?
43:50
Speaker 2: Do you reckon over one hundred hours? Over one hundred
43:54
Speaker 2: hours for sure?
43:55
Speaker 1: So out of that over one hundred hours of film
44:00
Speaker 1: that's got to be condensed into what length? Ninety Yeah,
44:06
Speaker 1: so you've got to give or take give or take
44:10
Speaker 1: ninety nine percent of what you filmed you won't use.
44:15
Speaker 2: Yeah, so you do?
44:17
Speaker 1: You just look at I'm going to give you two options,
44:21
Speaker 1: and you tell me if one of these is right
44:24
Speaker 1: or there's a third option. But to me, it seems
44:26
Speaker 1: like option A. We filmed all this, let's get all
44:29
Speaker 1: the amazing shit that we like, the this bit was amazing.
44:33
Speaker 1: This has got to be in. That lady was incredible,
44:35
Speaker 1: she's got to be in and then you fit a
44:38
Speaker 1: narrative around that. Or do you have a narrative and
44:41
Speaker 1: then just pick and choose the film you know, like
44:45
Speaker 1: without I don't mean like trying to be disingenuous, but
44:49
Speaker 1: how on earth do you figure out the storyline and
44:53
Speaker 1: what will be in and what won't be in.
44:55
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean there was a plan before we went away,
44:58
Speaker 2: and then there's the plan that sort of happen being
45:00
Speaker 2: along the way with the director's vision, and then you
45:05
Speaker 2: start to see that come together in an edit, and
45:07
Speaker 2: then that's where you can start shifting at a bunch
45:09
Speaker 2: so you can see what actually works. So there's the
45:13
Speaker 2: theoretical version of it, and then there's bring it together
45:16
Speaker 2: and seeing what's really strong, what isn't, what's a motive?
45:22
Speaker 2: You know, how you're balancing it out so it's not
45:25
Speaker 2: feeling like it's one side or the other. And so yeah,
45:28
Speaker 2: it is a it's an absolute puzzle that you're trying
45:32
Speaker 2: to work to and amplify the bits, you know, just
45:38
Speaker 2: amplify the story through different bits. But you start to
45:41
Speaker 2: see what sort of comes out from the themes, you know,
45:45
Speaker 2: what the big question is that's being answered. All these
45:47
Speaker 2: kind of things start to come out within the process.
45:51
Speaker 2: But it's like anything there's it is a process, and
45:54
Speaker 2: it is there are challenging bits.
45:59
Speaker 1: And I guess, yes, like I'm even thinking down to
46:03
Speaker 1: smaller than that. I bet you've already thought about what's
46:07
Speaker 1: going to be in the trailer or the trailers, because
46:10
Speaker 1: apart from the fact that you want to do it
46:12
Speaker 1: with integrity and you want to do something creative and
46:15
Speaker 1: insightful and real, you also want to get bums on seats.
46:20
Speaker 1: You also want to be back to our discussion earlier
46:22
Speaker 1: about Korea, you also want to produce something that's commercially successful, right, Yeah,
46:29
Speaker 1: So it's trying to bring all those elements together. Yeah.
46:32
Speaker 2: I mean, I think the old school approach to these
46:37
Speaker 2: kind of things, there would be a lot that you'd
46:39
Speaker 2: never see the light, that would never see the light.
46:44
Speaker 2: So I think, I don't know. Hopefully, at the end,
46:46
Speaker 2: you know, say it gets onto one of the big
46:48
Speaker 2: streaming platforms, there is a way that you can utilize
46:51
Speaker 2: a lot of the content that we did actually film.
46:54
Speaker 2: Think about gaining extra access by some kind of premium
47:01
Speaker 2: access to a documentary like think about all the docos
47:04
Speaker 2: you love, Think about how long the interviews would have been,
47:07
Speaker 2: and how good it would have been to listen to
47:09
Speaker 2: the whole interview, and so that would be amazing. That's
47:13
Speaker 2: what I think. As content like this evolves and streaming platforms,
47:20
Speaker 2: hopefully people can sort of pay a premium to get
47:23
Speaker 2: deeper into the stuff that never went to air, because
47:27
Speaker 2: there's a lot. There would be so much out there
47:29
Speaker 2: in great docos.
47:32
Speaker 1: Mate, you're a gun, You're an inspiration. The student has
47:35
Speaker 1: become the teacher. Look at you to fucking grown up,
47:38
Speaker 1: So proud of you. How do people I don't even know?
47:42
Speaker 1: Do you want people to find you and connect with
47:44
Speaker 1: you these days? Do we still do that? Do you
47:46
Speaker 1: still do that?
47:47
Speaker 2: Well, you can follow me on Instagram then maybe you'll
47:51
Speaker 2: see when the doco comes out. Tommy Jacket that's my handle.
47:56
Speaker 1: T j orright, mate, we'll say goodbye affair, but thanks
48:01
Speaker 1: for having the chat. It's been nice to catch up.
48:03
Speaker 1: When are we Are we going to see each other
48:04
Speaker 1: in in the three D version soon?
48:06
Speaker 2: Yeah? Mate, next week? Ah love your love you