Latest / Wicked and Grim: A True Crime Podcast / Corpsewood Manor - Part 1

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Corpsewood Manor - Part 1 · Wicked and Grim: A True Crime Podcast

• 0:07
  Speaker 1: Hidden deep in the mountains of northern Georgia, surrounded by
• 0:10
  Speaker 1: the dense forest and twisting dirt roads, there once stood
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: a strange, hand built brick manner that locals whispered about
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: for years. The isolated home was lit by candle light
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: instead of electricity, and decorated with gargoyles called artwork and
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: stained glass. Plus the narrowing, winding paths all around the property,
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: it all made it feel unreal. After dark, rumors spread
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: constantly about the people living there and the thing supposedly
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: happening inside the manner, turning the property into something that
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: felt more like a local legend than a real home
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: than In December of nineteen eighty two, investigators climbed a
• 0:50
  Speaker 1: muddy mountain road called Dead Horse Road, deep into the
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: woods and stepped inside that manner, only to discover one
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: of the most disturbing crime scenes date had ever seen.
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: This is the story of Corpse would Manner.
• 1:07
  Speaker 2: My name's Ben, I'm Nicole, and you're listening to Wicked
• 1:10
  Speaker 2: and Grim, a true crime.
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: Podcast following material more matial audience listener discretion.
• 1:42
  Speaker 2: I hope you're all having a better week than me
• 1:44
  Speaker 2: so far.
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: Nichole's grumpy today.
• 1:46
  Speaker 2: I am so grumpy and I wasn't when I woke up,
• 1:49
  Speaker 2: But it's just I don't know. I feel like some
• 1:52
  Speaker 2: people who start their morning and don't go on their
• 1:55
  Speaker 2: phone for like a long period of time probably do
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: better in life.
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: That's possible, well probable, probably, it's probably probable. Yeah, yeah,
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: that's a tongue twister. Say that ten times fast.
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: It's just funny. There's well this isn't funny, but there's
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: a lot of heavy shit going on in our city lately.
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: And then Ben was going around singing this song that
• 2:16
  Speaker 2: I didn't realize was actually a song. I thought he
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: was just making up a jam. How does it go?
• 2:20
  Speaker 2: It's only Tuesday?
• 2:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's that one from Tokyo Drift. It went viral
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: a little while ago, where the dudes like standing by
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: the car and stuff.
• 2:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: I was singing that song because it is only Tuesday
• 2:31
  Speaker 1: and Nicole is grumpy, so I thought it was pretty fitting.
• 2:34
  Speaker 2: And yesterday was a stat So I mean, I feel
• 2:37
  Speaker 2: like when you own your business sometimes you don't generally
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: get stats. I did work yesterday, but yeah, I'm like,
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: how is all this shit already happening? And They're like
• 2:45
  Speaker 2: the week just started like what is going on here?
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: But your song did help me.
• 2:49
  Speaker 1: It lightened the mood.
• 2:50
  Speaker 2: I'm glad they lightened the mood. It was kind of funny.
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: I want to have that song on my playlist now.
• 2:55
  Speaker 2: It's kind of good.
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: It's a good jam, it really is. I'm glad it
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: went viral a few months ago because it brought a
• 3:00
  Speaker 1: lot of people like to actually come and listen to
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: the song and it is really good. So go listen
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: to it, you guys, You'll like it.
• 3:08
  Speaker 2: It's good.
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, we have an interesting story today.
• 3:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it sure sounds like that.
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: And I'm telling you now, this is a two parter. Okay,
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: this is part one of the two part story of
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: the corpse Would Manner. So we got a bit of
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: set up, a lot of talking to do before we
• 3:26
  Speaker 1: actually get into the crime. This is probably going to
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: be nothing to do with the crime. In fact, next
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: part will be all about the crime that occurs. But
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: there's a lot to talk about before getting into it,
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: and that's what today is going to be all about.
• 3:37
  Speaker 2: There's a lot of set up, Hey.
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: A lot of setup, just like setting up over on
• 3:41
  Speaker 1: Patreon for things like exclusive episodes when you sign up,
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: and we have a lot of amazing people who signed up, like,
• 3:47
  Speaker 1: for sure, Taylor Ferby, Tara, Nicole Ferdig and Alison or Tease.
• 3:52
  Speaker 1: So thank you very much.
• 3:54
  Speaker 2: That's awesome. I actually need to put a little post
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: up on Patreon because I watched the Crash documentary on Netflix.
• 4:00
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, kend and I need some people to talk
• 4:03
  Speaker 2: to that about.
• 4:04
  Speaker 1: So that's the one with the girl hitting the brick
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: wall or whatever. Okay, I was wanting to watch it.
• 4:09
  Speaker 1: I can't believe you watched it without me.
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: Sorry.
• 4:11
  Speaker 1: Thanks, you should have told me.
• 4:13
  Speaker 2: I was just like, well, I need somebody to watch.
• 4:15
  Speaker 2: This is interesting, and now my whole feed is just
• 4:18
  Speaker 2: like the Crash. But there's other there's a few other
• 4:21
  Speaker 2: documentaries that people also recommended to watch because they said
• 4:24
  Speaker 2: Netflix kind of left a few important details out. So
• 4:28
  Speaker 2: maybe we can just watch one of those other ones.
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: I want to watch. Can let me watch Crash first, okay,
• 4:32
  Speaker 1: and then we can watch the others.
• 4:34
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: I did hear that when that documentary Crash came out,
• 4:37
  Speaker 1: the father of that daughter got unpaid leave from work.
• 4:41
  Speaker 1: He was just put on leave automatically, So I have
• 4:44
  Speaker 1: no idea what went on. What he said, what his
• 4:46
  Speaker 1: opinions were, whatever, But apparently, yeah, his work was not happy.
• 4:50
  Speaker 2: I guess, well, yeah, there's a lot of I know,
• 4:52
  Speaker 2: I wonder if all these are rumors or if they're legit.
• 4:56
  Speaker 2: But some posts that I did come across my feed today,
• 4:59
  Speaker 2: it's was basically like saying, recognizing the two victims, like the.
• 5:04
  Speaker 1: Two deceased, which is good.
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: Because everything out there isn't really about them when like this,
• 5:11
  Speaker 2: you know, should fully be about them.
• 5:13
  Speaker 1: M hm, Well, like I understand it should be about them,
• 5:16
  Speaker 1: and I fully agree, but it's hard to It's hard
• 5:19
  Speaker 1: when you have such an overshadowing story, you know. But anyways,
• 5:23
  Speaker 1: let's not get into that. We have a different story
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: to talk about today. Yeah, so the corpse would manner.
• 5:28
  Speaker 1: Are you ready for this story?
• 5:29
  Speaker 2: I am okay.
• 5:30
  Speaker 1: Like I said, part one, we're getting into details leading up.
• 5:34
  Speaker 1: So with that being said, let's get into this. The
• 5:38
  Speaker 1: mountains of North Georgia have a way of making the
• 5:41
  Speaker 1: rest of the world feel very far away. Once the
• 5:44
  Speaker 1: pavement disappears and the roads begin narrowing into dirt and gravel,
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: everything changes a little. The trees grow thicker, the silence deepens,
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  Speaker 1: and even During the day, sunlight struggles to fully reach
• 5:55
  Speaker 1: the forest floor beneath the canopy of pine and hardwood
• 5:58
  Speaker 1: stretching across the hillside. Then at night, the darkness there
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: feels even darker, very complete. There are no city lights
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  Speaker 1: bleeding into the sky, no traffic in the distance, no
• 6:10
  Speaker 1: constant hum of civilization, just the sound of wind moving
• 6:14
  Speaker 1: through branches somewhere unseen in the woods, with the occasional
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: cry of an animal hidden deep within. In winter, cold
• 6:21
  Speaker 1: fog settles low between the hills before sunrise, and as
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: rains turned the narrow paths into deep muck. The darkness
• 6:28
  Speaker 1: falls over the forest and it almost feels endless out there.
• 6:32
  Speaker 1: Miles from town, surrounded by the dense woods and winding
• 6:35
  Speaker 1: mountain roads, a person can begin to feel separated from
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  Speaker 1: the rest of the world almost entirely, and hidden deep
• 6:41
  Speaker 1: within those mountains. There once stood a strange brick manner,
• 6:45
  Speaker 1: unlike anything the region had ever seen. It was a
• 6:49
  Speaker 1: home that sat tucked away behind the trees, where most
• 6:53
  Speaker 1: passing strangers would never accidentally find it. The architecture alone
• 6:57
  Speaker 1: gave the property an appearance of something caught halfway between
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: a medieval castle and a dream or maybe a nightmare,
• 7:04
  Speaker 1: depending on who you'd ask. Locals whispered about the place constantly,
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: and most of the stories came from people who never
• 7:12
  Speaker 1: actually stepped foot on the property itself, but that hardly mattered,
• 7:16
  Speaker 1: because once a place begins to turn into a legend,
• 7:19
  Speaker 1: reality tends to find a way of bringing legends to life,
• 7:24
  Speaker 1: and by the mid nineteen seventies, someone by the name
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: of Charles Scudder had become deeply disillusioned with the world
• 7:31
  Speaker 1: around him. The cities felt louder than they usually do,
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: crime rates, in fact, were starting to climb, and neighborhoods
• 7:37
  Speaker 1: were changing, with modern life increasingly feeling artificial and exhausting
• 7:41
  Speaker 1: to Charles. He'd spent years working in academia, surrounding by
• 7:46
  Speaker 1: surrounded by students with laboratories, lectures, and institutional politics, but
• 7:51
  Speaker 1: the older he became, the more detached he felt from
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  Speaker 1: nearly all of it. Friends later described him as a
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: man who had grown tired of society itself. At first glance,
• 8:01
  Speaker 1: Charles did not seem like someone who had eventually abandoned
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: modern life to move into the mountains of North Georgia.
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: He was highly educated, intensely intellectual, and born in Wisconsin
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  Speaker 1: in nineteen twenty six, and Charles there spent most of
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: his early life immersed in science, language, arts, and philosophy.
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  Speaker 1: Over the years, he studied zoology, chemistry, pharmacology, and multiple languages,
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  Speaker 1: developing a very broad academic background that impressed almost everyone
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: who met him. He was often described as brilliant, theatrical, opinionated,
• 8:37
  Speaker 1: and even eccentric in equal measure. Charles loved conversation, and
• 8:43
  Speaker 1: he rarely thought he thought in any sort of simple terms.
• 8:46
  Speaker 1: To say the least, he could spend hours discussing things
• 8:49
  Speaker 1: on a very wide spectrum, such as you know, psychology, religion, science, literature, politics, philosophy,
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  Speaker 1: all without losing any energy about it at all. The
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: same time, he also enjoyed provoking people, both intellectually and socially.
• 9:05
  Speaker 1: At least. Friends recalled that he liked challenging many social
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  Speaker 1: norms and deliberately made conservative or judgmental people uncomfortable just
• 9:15
  Speaker 1: to see how they would react.
• 9:18
  Speaker 2: Now.
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  Speaker 1: Early on in his life, Charles had tried to build
• 9:21
  Speaker 1: something resembling a conventional future, the same sort of goal
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: as we all tend to have. He married and had children,
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  Speaker 1: eventually raising a family with his second wife Borda Bunting,
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  Speaker 1: the daughter of British poet Basil Bunting, and together they
• 9:35
  Speaker 1: had four children, Saul, Furnace, Gideon, and Ahab. But over
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  Speaker 1: time his personal life became increasingly strained. One of the
• 9:44
  Speaker 1: most painful moments, in fact, came with the death of
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  Speaker 1: his youngest son, Ahab. Now the exact circumstances surrounding Ahab's
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: death were rarely openly discussed by those close to Charles,
• 9:55
  Speaker 1: but everyone agreed that the loss affected him profoundly. His
• 10:00
  Speaker 1: friends described a very noticeable and emotional shift After that,
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  Speaker 1: His marriage deteriorated, and Charles seemed to withdraw further from
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  Speaker 1: any sort of traditional family life and social expectations. By
• 10:11
  Speaker 1: nineteen fifty nine, he had moved to Chicago and enrolled
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  Speaker 1: in Loyola University's Strich School of Medicine. He earned a
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  Speaker 1: doctorate in pharmacology in nineteen sixty four and eventually became
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: a professor at that very university. There, he was very
• 10:29
  Speaker 1: well respected. He published academic work, taught students, and became
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: involved in research tied to psychology, behavior, and pharmacology alike.
• 10:39
  Speaker 1: But outside the classroom, though Charles increasingly embraced a lifestyle
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: that many people around him found unusual. He filled his
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: home with antiques, salvaged furniture, strange artwork, candles, and occult imagery. Honestly,
• 10:53
  Speaker 1: by today's standard, that doesn't sound so bad. But you know,
• 10:55
  Speaker 1: upcycling and being into occult stuff, that's pretty normal. However,
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: in the nineteen sixties that's a very different place and era,
• 11:03
  Speaker 1: so it was a little bit odd. Then he painted
• 11:06
  Speaker 1: things like elaborate paintings, all many of which were provocative
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: or having to do with the occult. He had become
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: fascinated with symbolism, philosophy, alternative belief systems, and visitors later
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: described his Chicago home as bizarre but unforgettable, almost like
• 11:25
  Speaker 1: walking into a theatrical set designed by someone who wanted
• 11:28
  Speaker 1: every object to spark a conversation, something which I honestly love.
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  Speaker 2: He sounds super interesting to me.
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: He does. But one of the most misunderstood aspects of
• 11:39
  Speaker 1: Charles's life involved his interest in Satanism. During the nineteen seventies,
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  Speaker 1: Charles became associated with the Church of Satan in this
• 11:49
  Speaker 1: particular one was founded by Anton Levey to outsiders, especially
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: during these years where fear surrounding occult activity was rapidly
• 11:58
  Speaker 1: growing in America. The Satanist immediately triggered images of violent
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: cults black magic rituals. But the philosophy Charles followed was
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: far different from that version that many people imagined. Levey
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: and Satanism, the particular one he was interested in, was
• 12:16
  Speaker 1: largely atheistic and symbolic. Like many Satanism religions, are followers
• 12:22
  Speaker 1: generally don't actually believe in a literal, supernatural Satan. Instead,
• 12:27
  Speaker 1: Satan represents rebellion, personal freedom, self indulgence, and rejection of
• 12:34
  Speaker 1: rigid religious authority. The fact Satan was put at the
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: helm of that religion is more of an ironic symbol
• 12:40
  Speaker 1: than anything at all having to do with evil, and
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: for Charles, the philosophy aligned naturally with his growing resentment
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: towards conformity and social expectations. Now, at this point, Charles's
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: sexuality had changed and he was living as a gay man,
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: and this was during a period where homosexuality still bill
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: carried enormous stigma. The appeal of openly rejecting society's judgment
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: it felt liberating to him, and so Charles formally joined
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: the Church of Satan and corresponded directly with Anton Levy himself.
• 13:15
  Speaker 1: He subscribed to the cloven hoof the organization's newsletter and
• 13:19
  Speaker 1: openly identified with the movement's ideas. Now, at the same time,
• 13:24
  Speaker 1: Charles still held a very deep fascination with the human mind,
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: as he always had. His academic work explored psychology meaning behavior,
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: and several later accounts connected him to research involving LSD
• 13:38
  Speaker 1: and altered states of consciousness during his years at the university.
• 13:43
  Speaker 1: Now exactly how involved he was in those projects remained
• 13:46
  Speaker 1: somewhat unclear and very debated, but there is little doubt
• 13:50
  Speaker 1: that Charles viewed the human mind as something endlessly fascinating
• 13:54
  Speaker 1: and worth exploring. And honestly, I think many of us
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: who enjoyed the True Crime job can agree and appreciate
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: that wholeheartedly. Now, whether dark or not, trying to understand
• 14:05
  Speaker 1: a human mind, it's nothing less than extraordinary to say.
• 14:10
  Speaker 2: Now.
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: Outside of his work, however, his dissatisfaction with modern life
• 14:14
  Speaker 1: only continued growing. Chicago in the nineteen sixties and nineteen
• 14:18
  Speaker 1: seventies was changing rapidly, with the crime rate and violence
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: only increasing, and it disturbed Charles deeply, especially after his
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: father reportedly suffered severe injuries during a mugging. That incident
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: deeply affected Charles, and it reinforced his belief that modern
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: society was becoming hostile, shallow, and very dangerous.
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: Good god, I'm like, I hear you. Yeah, that was
• 14:47
  Speaker 2: why I was so grommy, for.
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: That's exactly what you were talking about this morning is
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: many of those same aspects.
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so this is so interesting to me. Wow. Yeah.
• 14:56
  Speaker 1: So it was a struggle then and it's a struggle
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: now and many people can relate.
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: Now, during the mid nineteen seventies, both Charles's parents died
• 15:05
  Speaker 1: within a relatively short period of time. Now, their deaths
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: left him with an inheritance large enough to finally pursue
• 15:12
  Speaker 1: an idea he had apparently been planning and imagining for years. See,
• 15:17
  Speaker 1: Charles no longer wanted to simply complain about society from
• 15:20
  Speaker 1: inside the city. He wanted to leave it behind entirely.
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: He dreamed of finding land so isolated that he would
• 15:29
  Speaker 1: never see or hear from neighbors unless he chose to.
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: And that's not me saying this and writing, that's me
• 15:35
  Speaker 1: saying how he actually wanted to find land. He didn't
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: even want to see or hear from neighbors unless he
• 15:41
  Speaker 1: chose to. He wanted silence, privacy, and complete freedom to
• 15:47
  Speaker 1: live according to his own rules without interference from the
• 15:50
  Speaker 1: outside world. And honestly, I can relate to Charles a
• 15:53
  Speaker 1: lot if I'm being honest.
• 15:54
  Speaker 2: Well, yeah, I'm just like, yeah, you do this man, right,
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: It's like firing me up.
• 15:59
  Speaker 1: I like it. Well, how many people are dream nowadays
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: of just going and building a house out in the
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: woods and just farming and creating their own little place
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: of heaven.
• 16:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah, off the grid, and just kind of doing your
• 16:11
  Speaker 2: own thing.
• 16:11
  Speaker 1: And that's exactly what he wants to do. Now by
• 16:14
  Speaker 1: this point in his life, there was actually already someone
• 16:17
  Speaker 1: beside him who shared that dream, and that man was
• 16:20
  Speaker 1: Joseph Joey Odom. Now, Joey came from a very different
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: world than Charles did, and the contrast between the two
• 16:28
  Speaker 1: men even became something nearly everyone noticed after meeting them.
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: Charles often came across as intense, very intellectual, and theatrical,
• 16:37
  Speaker 1: while Joey was usually described as softer spoken, more approachable,
• 16:41
  Speaker 1: and far more grounded. Friends even said the two balance
• 16:44
  Speaker 1: each other's out in ways that made their relationship work.
• 16:47
  Speaker 1: Like two opposites are ying and yang. Joey was born
• 16:51
  Speaker 1: in Georgia in nineteen forty six and grew up in
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: a much rougher environment than Charles ever had. Money was limited,
• 16:59
  Speaker 1: opportunities were few, and much of his life revolved around
• 17:02
  Speaker 1: simply getting by. He worked various jobs over the years,
• 17:06
  Speaker 1: particularly in kitchens and domestic work, eventually becoming known as
• 17:09
  Speaker 1: a skilled cook and someone naturally suited to taking care
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: of the home now. At some point during adulthood, Joey
• 17:17
  Speaker 1: suffered a serious automobile accident that reportedly left him with
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: a traumatic brain injury. Several people close to him later
• 17:24
  Speaker 1: believed that that accident changed aspects of his personality as
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: well as his behavior. Some accounts even suggested that Joey
• 17:32
  Speaker 1: occasionally described vivid dreams, strange experiences, or intense emotional episodes
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: after that crash. Still, despite the hardships in his life,
• 17:42
  Speaker 1: many people described him as warm and deeply caring. He
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: didn't dominate conversations the way that Charles often did, and
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: while Charles enjoyed debating very various topics in academia for
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: hours at a time, Joey tended to focus more on
• 17:57
  Speaker 1: practical things like his cooking, gardening, maintaining property, and making
• 18:02
  Speaker 1: visitors feel welcome at their home. Now, the exact details
• 18:06
  Speaker 1: of how Joey and Charles first met somewhat vary depending
• 18:10
  Speaker 1: on the sources you read, but the relationship quickly became serious,
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: and despite their differences in age of about twenty years
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: their difference in personality and background, the relationship lasted. By
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: the nineteen seventies, the two men were living together openly
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: in Chicago, something that carried risks during that time, because
• 18:28
  Speaker 1: homosexuality remained heavily stigmatized across much of the United States,
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: and openly gay couples often faced harsh harassment, discrimination, or
• 18:37
  Speaker 1: even violence toward them. Charles in particular, seemed increasingly unwilling
• 18:42
  Speaker 1: to hide who he was simply to satisfy the expectations
• 18:46
  Speaker 1: of other people. But together the pair built a life
• 18:50
  Speaker 1: that already existed far outside conventional social norms. Their Chicago
• 18:55
  Speaker 1: home became filled with unusual things, and Charles embraced the
• 18:59
  Speaker 1: bizarre atmosphere openly, while Joey helped manage the daily life
• 19:02
  Speaker 1: surrounding it. Over time, the couple also developed a small
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: social circle made up largely of people who accepted unconventional
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: lifestyles and ideas. Gathering at the house often involved long conversations, drinking, music, philosophy,
• 19:17
  Speaker 1: discussions about religion, sexuality, and personal freedom. Charles especially seemed
• 19:22
  Speaker 1: drawn towards people who rejected traditional expectations or lived outside
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: mainstream society. But at the same time, however, the world
• 19:31
  Speaker 1: outside increasingly exhausted him. The older Charles became, the more
• 19:37
  Speaker 1: openly he talked about leaving modern society behind completely. And
• 19:40
  Speaker 1: unlike many people who might have dismissed Charles's ideas as
• 19:44
  Speaker 1: unrealistic fantasy, Joey appeared willing to go wherever Charles wanted
• 19:49
  Speaker 1: to build a new life, and by nineteen seventy six,
• 19:53
  Speaker 1: Charles was ready to leave Chicago behind for good. After
• 19:56
  Speaker 1: years of growing frustrated within the city life, it had
• 20:00
  Speaker 1: all pushed Charles towards an idea, and that inheritance from
• 20:03
  Speaker 1: his parents passing away well it finally gave him the
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: opportunity to chase it, and Charles began searching for land
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: that was remote enough to offer total privacy. He wanted
• 20:15
  Speaker 1: isolation in the most literal sense possible. The property needed
• 20:19
  Speaker 1: to feel remote from modern society, entirely, and eventually he
• 20:23
  Speaker 1: found what he was searching for in the mountains of
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: Chattahooga County, Georgia. Now that land sat deep within heavily
• 20:31
  Speaker 1: wooded terrain near Somerville and the Chattahoochee National Forest, and
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: reaching the property required traveling along narrow mountain roads that
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: twisted through dense forest and steep hillsides. Even in daylight,
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: the area felt very isolated, and at night the roads
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: became almost completely swallowed by the darkness. For Charles, this
• 20:52
  Speaker 1: was perfect, and in January of nineteen seventy seven, Charles
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: was about fifty and Joey was about thirty, and together
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: they left. They left Chicago and made the long drive
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: south to begin their new life. Their arrival happened during
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: a brutal winter storm that blanketed the mountains in snow
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: and ice, and according to later accounts, the pair reached
• 21:14
  Speaker 1: the property in the middle of that snowy blizzard. The
• 21:18
  Speaker 1: area was undeveloped and rugged, to say the least, and
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: there was no house waiting for them when they arrived,
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: just no utilities, just no modern infrastructure there ready standing.
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: It was just land, and for a while Charles and
• 21:32
  Speaker 1: Joey lived in tents and out of their vehicle while
• 21:35
  Speaker 1: they began working on the property, and soon they came
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: up with a name. They called it Corpsewood. According to
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: a local legend, the pair encountered a rotting body of
• 21:46
  Speaker 1: a dead horse as well, somewhere along the mountain road
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: leading towards the property. Now Charles, who had a dark
• 21:53
  Speaker 1: sense of humor, enjoyed and enjoyed dramatic imagery. He allegedly
• 21:57
  Speaker 1: began referring to the road leading up to the property
• 22:01
  Speaker 1: as dead Horse Road. Then before long, the property itself
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: became known as corpse would manner.
• 22:07
  Speaker 2: It's so interesting. So there was just it was just
• 22:10
  Speaker 2: land that they bought. Yeah, nothing there whatsoever.
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: They found land, the perfect place and nothing more.
• 22:17
  Speaker 2: Okay, but gosh, mother nature really gave them a warm welcome,
• 22:21
  Speaker 2: because that would be kind of I feel like a
• 22:24
  Speaker 2: moment where you're, holy shit, what did we just do?
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: Probably terrified, you know, intimidated, probably to say the least,
• 22:32
  Speaker 1: because you arrive, you're okay, we're here at the property.
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: Now what Yeah, well we hunkered down and survived this blizzard.
• 22:40
  Speaker 2: Oh okay, that sounds a little.
• 22:42
  Speaker 1: Daunting, definitely. But now this name corpse would manner. It
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: was eerie enough that it would later help fuel decades
• 22:50
  Speaker 1: of rumor and folklore surrounding the property. By the time,
• 22:53
  Speaker 1: it seemed to simply just amuse Charles like almost like
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: it was like funny, but I love it and it
• 22:58
  Speaker 1: has to be named that sort of thing. But it
• 23:01
  Speaker 1: was certainly something that before the house was even built,
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: it cemented the property's future and the legend that will
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: be surrounding it.
• 23:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah, the feel of it. Yeah.
• 23:13
  Speaker 1: Now, when it came to building the manor itself, it
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: was an enormous undertaking. Imagine being up in the middle
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: of nowhere and you're building a mannor, and rather than
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: hiring contractors to construct the traditional home, Charles and Joey
• 23:26
  Speaker 1: actually decided to build much of the property themselves. Now,
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: sources differ slightly on the exact figure, but most accounts
• 23:33
  Speaker 1: estimate that the pair hand made roughly forty five thousand
• 23:38
  Speaker 1: bricks over the course of the construction of this home.
• 23:41
  Speaker 2: Jeez, how could they just do that? Though? I feel
• 23:44
  Speaker 2: like they would need some help. How do they just
• 23:46
  Speaker 2: know how to build a manor?
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: I don't know, but they learned well. Charles is certainly
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: well educated, and he's very capable of researching finding the
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: right information. I don't think will be very difficult for him.
• 23:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I guess this was his main focus task at hand.
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Now, the process took years of labor and transformed
• 24:04
  Speaker 1: the mountain side into something unlike anything else in the region,
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: and Charles personally designed much of the manor himself. The
• 24:12
  Speaker 1: architecture reflected his fascination with symbolism, unconventional designs, and of course,
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: theatrical atmosphere. So instead of sharp angular corners and right
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: angles with ordinary layouts, many sections of the house featured
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: curved walls because Charles believed curves created a more natural
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: flow and symbolically repelled negative energy too. The structure eventually
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: included some towers with stained glass and unusual sculptures with
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: occult artwork, antique furniture, and decorative gargoyles positioned through the property,
• 24:46
  Speaker 1: and one of the Manner's most recognizable features was the
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: drawbridge leading towards parts of the grounds near the gazebo area.
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: Visitors arriving at the property experienced something surreal when they
• 24:59
  Speaker 1: went b because hidden deep in the Georgia Mountains, they
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: were arriving at a place that looked like a strange
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: handmade castle illuminated by candles and lanterns rather than electricity,
• 25:12
  Speaker 1: and that was by design because electricity was something Charles
• 25:16
  Speaker 1: intentionally rejected, meaning there was no power grid connected to
• 25:21
  Speaker 1: corpsewood manner whatsoever. Heat came from wood burning stoves, lights
• 25:25
  Speaker 1: came from candles in the lanterns, and food preservation relied
• 25:29
  Speaker 1: partly in underground cooling systems rather than conventional refrigeration. And
• 25:34
  Speaker 1: so the couple worked constantly to make the manner self sufficient.
• 25:38
  Speaker 2: They really went all all in, like totally.
• 25:41
  Speaker 1: Next level, one hundred percent, and that's exactly what they wanted,
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: or at the very least what Charles wanted, and you
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: know he was supported by a very good partner, no kidding.
• 25:49
  Speaker 2: Now.
• 25:49
  Speaker 1: Together they planted gardens, raised chickens, produced honey, made homemade
• 25:54
  Speaker 1: muscadine wine, and built systems designed to support long term isolation.
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: Up of their manner, Joey focused on handling much of
• 26:01
  Speaker 1: the practical day to day maintenance, while Charles focused heavily
• 26:04
  Speaker 1: on the design, the writing and art that would go
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: into the home and the architecture and philosophy is all
• 26:10
  Speaker 1: that sort of stuff. And that side of Charles stood
• 26:14
  Speaker 1: out in the manner more than you might think. For example,
• 26:17
  Speaker 1: a stained glass image of Boffomett was placed to decorate
• 26:21
  Speaker 1: part of the manner. Now for reference, Boffomett is a
• 26:25
  Speaker 1: goat headed figure who represents the reconciliation of opposites, universal balance,
• 26:30
  Speaker 1: and esoteric knowledge. He's often mistaken for a demon or satan,
• 26:35
  Speaker 1: but he's certainly not.
• 26:36
  Speaker 2: That.
• 26:37
  Speaker 1: Other cult imagery and strange artwork appeared throughout the house too.
• 26:42
  Speaker 1: One sign near the property reportedly warned visitors to quote
• 26:45
  Speaker 1: beware of the thing, which was a reference to the
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: Adams family that Charles found quite amusing.
• 26:52
  Speaker 2: He is quite a sense of humor, and he just
• 26:54
  Speaker 2: doesn't give a shit what anyone thinks.
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: For sure. And I think the best word to describe
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: him is a centric Yeah.
• 27:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but I mean I love that they're just making
• 27:03
  Speaker 2: this place like a little oasis for themselves.
• 27:06
  Speaker 1: Oh definitely. But it's funny that you're kind of talking
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: about Charles and his humor and that the next sentence
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: I literally have written is he seemed fully aware that
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: the manner's appearance would unsettle some people, and there are
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: many indications he enjoyed that reaction.
• 27:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I wouldn't think anything else. Yeah, he probably thought that.
• 27:26
  Speaker 2: He just loved that the weirder people thought he was
• 27:28
  Speaker 2: probably the better.
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: It seemed like that.
• 27:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. Now.
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: At the same time, though, Corpsewood was not simply designed
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: to shock outsiders and get a reaction. For Charles and Joey,
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: the manner was freedom. The property allowed them to live
• 27:41
  Speaker 1: openly as a gay couple, far away from the social
• 27:44
  Speaker 1: pressures that they had experienced elsewhere. They could host guests,
• 27:48
  Speaker 1: They could create art, drink wine, discuss philosophy, build a
• 27:52
  Speaker 1: life entirely according to their own values, without worrying about
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: neighbors or institutions in interfering with them. Friends who came
• 28:00
  Speaker 1: over enjoyed evenings filled with candlelight, music, conversation, homemade foond
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: in an atmosphere unlike anywhere else they had ever experienced.
• 28:11
  Speaker 1: The isolation gave Corpsewood a strange a strange beauty that
• 28:15
  Speaker 1: many visitors could never forget. But outside the property itself,
• 28:19
  Speaker 1: the rumors had already started growing. To many locals around Somerville.
• 28:24
  Speaker 1: The isolated castle hidden in the woods did not look
• 28:28
  Speaker 1: peaceful or artistic. It looked and sounded dangerous. See As
• 28:34
  Speaker 1: the years passed, Corpsewood Manor slowly became one of the
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: most talked about properties in Chattahooga County. People who had
• 28:42
  Speaker 1: never even seen the man Are first hand seemed to
• 28:45
  Speaker 1: know stories about it. The property was often described almost
• 28:48
  Speaker 1: like something out of a Gothic novel, a strange, small
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: brick castle hidden deep in the woods, occupied by two
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: openly gay men who called themselves Satanists and lived almost
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: entirely by candlelight. But the reality of the daily life
• 29:04
  Speaker 1: at Corpsewood was often far quieter than the rumors surrounding it.
• 29:08
  Speaker 1: Charles and Joey settled into routines built around their self sufficiency.
• 29:12
  Speaker 1: Much of their time revolved around maintaining the property that
• 29:15
  Speaker 1: they'd spent years constructing by hand. Gardens needed tending, animals
• 29:20
  Speaker 1: needed care, Repairs constantly had to be made, and nearly
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: every part of their daily life required work because the
• 29:26
  Speaker 1: manner operated without most modern conveniences. Charles, of course, also
• 29:31
  Speaker 1: enjoyed performance and provocation, and he understood the effect Corpsewood
• 29:36
  Speaker 1: had on people. The candles, the gargoyles, stained glass, toccult artwork,
• 29:41
  Speaker 1: and all of it all contributed to the manner's unsettling reputation,
• 29:46
  Speaker 1: and Charles rarely seemed interested in softening that image. In
• 29:50
  Speaker 1: many ways, he seemed to enjoy watching outsiders react nervously
• 29:53
  Speaker 1: to the property, but of course, despite the story surrounding
• 29:56
  Speaker 1: the manor, the home itself was welcoming rather than threatening.
• 30:00
  Speaker 1: In fact, were offered homemade wine after arriving. Charles would
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: even play the Heart played into the night if he
• 30:06
  Speaker 1: wasn't discussing philosophy. Some visitors stayed overnight, while others returned
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: repeatedly because they found the manner fascinating and unlike anything
• 30:15
  Speaker 1: they've ever experienced, and at least one wedding was held
• 30:18
  Speaker 1: on the property, with Charles providing heart music during the ceremony.
• 30:22
  Speaker 1: For people accepted into the couple's social circle, Corpsewood felt
• 30:27
  Speaker 1: less like a sinister cult compound and more like an
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: isolated artistic retreats built by two men creating their own
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: life on their own terms. But outside that mountain, the
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: rumors continued to spread in rural Georgia during the late
• 30:43
  Speaker 1: nineteen seventies and nineteen eighties. Openly gay men already attracted
• 30:48
  Speaker 1: suspicion in many communities, but the fact that Charles openly
• 30:51
  Speaker 1: identified as a Satanist and filled his property with all
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: This imagery only intensified those fears, and the stories about
• 31:00
  Speaker 1: strange gatherings, drugs, sex, and rituals circulated constantly through Somerville
• 31:06
  Speaker 1: and the surrounding areas.
• 31:08
  Speaker 2: Oh I don't like that, just like let them be,
• 31:11
  Speaker 2: let them live their life out there.
• 31:14
  Speaker 1: Teenagers soon dared each other to go drive up Dead
• 31:17
  Speaker 1: Horse Road at night. Parents warned their children to stay
• 31:20
  Speaker 1: away from the property, and church groups whispered about devil
• 31:23
  Speaker 1: worship in the mountains. And because the early years of
• 31:27
  Speaker 1: Satanic panic were beginning to spread across America during that
• 31:30
  Speaker 1: same period, many people were already primed to believe the
• 31:34
  Speaker 1: worst TV specials, new stories, and churches increasingly warned about
• 31:38
  Speaker 1: hidden Satanic cults supposedly operating across the country, with heavy
• 31:43
  Speaker 1: metal music, horror films, role playing games like Dungeons and Dragons,
• 31:47
  Speaker 1: with alternative religions and unconventional lifestyles, all becoming targets of
• 31:52
  Speaker 1: the growing paranoia and fear. And corpse would manner fit
• 31:57
  Speaker 1: perfectly like the Last Peace and a puzzle into those
• 32:01
  Speaker 1: anxieties to all the outsiders. The property already looked exactly
• 32:06
  Speaker 1: like the kind of place where terrible things should happen,
• 32:10
  Speaker 1: so very few people bothered separating rumor from reality. Simply
• 32:14
  Speaker 1: being different in that environment was often enough to make
• 32:17
  Speaker 1: someone dangerous in the public's imagination. But while much of
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: the gossip surrounding Corpsewood was exaggerated, there was one part
• 32:26
  Speaker 1: of the property that became especially famous.
• 32:29
  Speaker 2: See.
• 32:30
  Speaker 1: Hidden away from the main manner stood a separate building
• 32:33
  Speaker 1: that locals eventually began referring to simply as the Pink Room. Originally,
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: the structure had been built as a large three story
• 32:43
  Speaker 1: chicken coop or chicken house however you want to say it,
• 32:47
  Speaker 1: and over time, however, Charles and Joey converted part of
• 32:51
  Speaker 1: the building into a separate social space away from the
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: manor itself. The room was said to be very dimly lit,
• 32:58
  Speaker 1: of course, with no electricity, and it was decorated with mattresses, candles, artwork, mirrors,
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: and various pieces of sexual and occult themed material. The
• 33:07
  Speaker 1: atmosphere was very unconventional and intentionally provocative, as Charles liked it.
• 33:12
  Speaker 1: Pornographic magazines and bondage related items were reportedly present inside
• 33:16
  Speaker 1: that room, and some guests later acknowledged that consensual sexual
• 33:21
  Speaker 1: encounters between adults occasionally took place there too, But at
• 33:25
  Speaker 1: the same time, separating fact from rumor became increasingly difficult
• 33:29
  Speaker 1: as stories of the Pink Room spread beyond people who
• 33:33
  Speaker 1: had actually visited there.
• 33:35
  Speaker 2: I was hoping that you were going to describe like
• 33:36
  Speaker 2: the most epic chicken coop. Ever, I almost feel like
• 33:40
  Speaker 2: a little disappointed. It still sounds, I guess, kind of cool, maybe,
• 33:44
  Speaker 2: but I was really looking forward to this chicken coopy
• 33:48
  Speaker 2: like next level.
• 33:49
  Speaker 1: I think it probably was at one point, but then
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: they converted it to have their little social room. It
• 33:53
  Speaker 1: was probably too big or something like that. Who knows.
• 33:56
  Speaker 2: Well, it just disappointed me here, I just relax.
• 33:59
  Speaker 1: I'm sure. I'm sure it was a great chicken coop
• 34:01
  Speaker 1: with just a chill out room up top where occasionally
• 34:04
  Speaker 1: some adult activities took place. Now, over the years, local
• 34:09
  Speaker 1: gossip transformed this pink room into something far more extreme,
• 34:13
  Speaker 1: far more extreme than the reality of what it likely was.
• 34:16
  Speaker 1: Stories circulated about massive orgies, rituals, black magic ceremonies, and
• 34:22
  Speaker 1: gatherings involving prominent local figures who were secretly visiting the
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: manor after dark. Some rumors even became so elaborate that
• 34:31
  Speaker 1: people claimed politicians and high profile businessmen or law enforcement
• 34:36
  Speaker 1: officers had appeared at Corpsewood and later wanted any evidence
• 34:39
  Speaker 1: of their visits destroyed, but very little of those claims
• 34:43
  Speaker 1: were ever substantiated. One reason the speculation grew so aggressively
• 34:48
  Speaker 1: involved a guest book reportedly kept at the property, and
• 34:51
  Speaker 1: according to several accounts, visitors to the pink room sometimes
• 34:55
  Speaker 1: signed their names or documented different encounters there in that book. However,
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: if there ever was a book, it apparently disappeared and
• 35:03
  Speaker 1: was never officially recovered, and this missing guest book became
• 35:07
  Speaker 1: one of the most central mysteries surrounding the property. People
• 35:11
  Speaker 1: began speculating that respected members of the community had wanted
• 35:15
  Speaker 1: that book to disappear because it had information in their names,
• 35:18
  Speaker 1: and so it disappeared intentionally. Whether those theories were true
• 35:24
  Speaker 1: remain impossible to fully determine, but the rumors alone helped
• 35:27
  Speaker 1: transform Corpsewood from a strange local property into something much
• 35:31
  Speaker 1: larger in the public's imagination. Still, drugs also became part
• 35:36
  Speaker 1: of the growing mythology surrounding the manner. Investigators and later
• 35:39
  Speaker 1: sources confirmed LSD existed at Corpsewood, and as I mentioned earlier,
• 35:45
  Speaker 1: several people who knew Charles claimed he occasionally experimented with
• 35:49
  Speaker 1: hallucinogens or discussed altered states of consciousness very openly. Over time,
• 35:54
  Speaker 1: this detail became heavily distorted, though, stories eventually circulated claiming
• 35:59
  Speaker 1: Charles possessed enormous quantities of LSD connected to old government
• 36:04
  Speaker 1: experiments from his years at Loila University. While some of
• 36:08
  Speaker 1: those aspects of those claims may have been loosely rooted
• 36:12
  Speaker 1: in truth, many versions became very sensationalized as the legends
• 36:15
  Speaker 1: surrounding Corpsewood just kept growing. All in all, Corpse would
• 36:19
  Speaker 1: manner looked exactly like the kind of place everyone had
• 36:23
  Speaker 1: feared at the time. There was an isolated castle hidden
• 36:26
  Speaker 1: in the woods, occupied by openly gay men who displayed
• 36:29
  Speaker 1: satanic imagery, hosted unusual gatherings, used drugs, and rejected any
• 36:34
  Speaker 1: sort of traditional social norms. And unfortunately for Charles and Joey,
• 36:38
  Speaker 1: all these rumors surrounding Corpsewood continued to grow faster and faster,
• 36:44
  Speaker 1: until eventually those stories reached the ears of a troubled
• 36:48
  Speaker 1: local teenager named Kenneth Avery Brock. Now. By the early
• 36:54
  Speaker 1: nineteen eighties, Kenneth was already drifting through life filled with
• 36:58
  Speaker 1: excessive alcohol, drugs, and petty crime. Mind you, he was
• 37:02
  Speaker 1: only seventeen years old at the time, but many people
• 37:04
  Speaker 1: who later described him painted the picture of someone who
• 37:07
  Speaker 1: had grown up fast and in all the wrong ways.
• 37:11
  Speaker 1: See Kenneth came from a deeply troubled background, shaped by poverty, neglect, violence,
• 37:17
  Speaker 1: and heavy dysfunction. Several sources later described his childhood as
• 37:21
  Speaker 1: chaotic and abusive, with alcoholism and instability playing major roles
• 37:26
  Speaker 1: inside his home. He was described as immature and highly impressionable.
• 37:31
  Speaker 1: He was not someone who appeared confident or fully in
• 37:34
  Speaker 1: control of himself, and many accounts betrayed him being insecure,
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: emotionally volatile, and easily influenced by stronger personalities around him.
• 37:44
  Speaker 1: Kenneth spent most of his teenage years hunting, drinking, experimenting
• 37:48
  Speaker 1: with drugs, and spending time around other troubled youth in
• 37:52
  Speaker 1: the rural community surrounding Summerville. Those traits would become extremely
• 37:56
  Speaker 1: important later once he grew closer to someone named to
• 38:00
  Speaker 1: Tony West, someone we'll get into soon now. Kenneth first
• 38:05
  Speaker 1: became aware of Corpsewood the same way many local teenagers did.
• 38:10
  Speaker 1: Through all the rumors stories about the strange hidden castle
• 38:13
  Speaker 1: in the woods circulated constantly through the area. People talked
• 38:17
  Speaker 1: about evil devil worshippers living the mountains with bizarre parties,
• 38:21
  Speaker 1: drug sex, occult rituals. We've talked about it all, and
• 38:24
  Speaker 1: teenagers heard these stories and challenge one another to go
• 38:28
  Speaker 1: drive up Dead Horse Road at night to see if
• 38:30
  Speaker 1: they can catch a glimpse of the manner lit by
• 38:32
  Speaker 1: camp light. Now eventually Kenneth made direct contact with Charles
• 38:37
  Speaker 1: and Joey. Accounts differ slightly on exactly how the meeting
• 38:42
  Speaker 1: had happened, but most sources suggest Kenneth encountered the couple
• 38:45
  Speaker 1: while hunting or wandering the woods near the property, and
• 38:49
  Speaker 1: unlike many landowners in the rural Georgia who might have
• 38:52
  Speaker 1: immediately chased the trespasser away, Charles and Joey welcomed him.
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: That's who they were after all. That openness was very
• 38:59
  Speaker 1: tip in Corpsewood. They were friendly, they were welcoming, and
• 39:04
  Speaker 1: guests were frequently offered wine, food, conversation, and invitations to
• 39:08
  Speaker 1: even stay longer. And soon after this, Kenneth became one
• 39:12
  Speaker 1: of the younger local visitors who came to Corpsewood repeatedly.
• 39:16
  Speaker 1: At first, those visits appeared relatively casual. Kenneth had some
• 39:20
  Speaker 1: wine with the couple, explored the property, and became increasingly
• 39:23
  Speaker 1: familiar with the manner itself. For someone raised in poverty
• 39:28
  Speaker 1: and instability, Corpsewood probably felt unlike anything he'd ever experienced before.
• 39:34
  Speaker 1: The candles, the artwork, the architecture, the entire atmosphere of
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: total freedom created a world completely removed from ordinary life
• 39:44
  Speaker 1: in rural Georgia, something almost plucked from the pages of
• 39:48
  Speaker 1: a novel. However, over time, the relationship between Kenneth and
• 39:52
  Speaker 1: the men at Corpsewood became a little more complicated. Several
• 39:58
  Speaker 1: later accounts suggested Kenneth participated in some sexual encounters on
• 40:03
  Speaker 1: the property, though the exact details became difficult to fully
• 40:06
  Speaker 1: separate from later rumors, contradictory statements, and courtroom testimonies. But
• 40:11
  Speaker 1: what does appear consistent across multiple sources is that Kenneth
• 40:15
  Speaker 1: continued returning to Corpsewood, even after later claiming he felt
• 40:20
  Speaker 1: uncomfortable or conflicted about what occurred there. Now that contradiction
• 40:26
  Speaker 1: would eventually become an important part of the story. Some
• 40:30
  Speaker 1: people later believe Kenneth willingly participated in what happened at
• 40:34
  Speaker 1: the manor and only turned hostile afterwards because of the
• 40:38
  Speaker 1: shame or fear surrounding his own actions, but others believed
• 40:42
  Speaker 1: he felt manipulated or emotionally overwhelmed by experiences he did
• 40:47
  Speaker 1: not fully understand. But whatever the case, at the same time,
• 40:52
  Speaker 1: another idea had started taking hold in Kenneth's mind during
• 40:56
  Speaker 1: his visits to the property.
• 40:58
  Speaker 2: I just have to say really quickly, he was pretty young, right,
• 41:01
  Speaker 2: wasn't he like seventeen correct, So I guess it have
• 41:05
  Speaker 2: to kind of remember his age. But I also think
• 41:07
  Speaker 2: it's so interesting all these rumors and how this place seems.
• 41:12
  Speaker 2: I don't know, people have kind of described it as
• 41:14
  Speaker 2: like scary and you know, you don't go there sort
• 41:17
  Speaker 2: of thing. But then these people encounter someone you know,
• 41:21
  Speaker 2: near their property hunting and they're like as friendly as
• 41:23
  Speaker 2: can be to them. Yeah, it just seems like almost
• 41:26
  Speaker 2: polar opposite to what you may expect.
• 41:28
  Speaker 1: Well, that's the thing. We're so subscribed to an idea
• 41:32
  Speaker 1: that different is dangerous and different isn't doesn't mean dangerous,
• 41:36
  Speaker 1: Like if you walk down a street late at night
• 41:39
  Speaker 1: and you encounter a big, burly bikerman with big leather
• 41:44
  Speaker 1: vest tattoos all over him. He's six', too almost three hundred.
• 41:47
  Speaker 1: Pounds you assume the worst of that man because he's
• 41:50
  Speaker 1: a big bikerman out at, night, right that. Bikerman that
• 41:55
  Speaker 1: same guy could be you know, what recovering alcoholic in
• 41:59
  Speaker 1: ten years, so and he could have done a toy,
• 42:01
  Speaker 1: run and he could have been on his bike with
• 42:03
  Speaker 1: his buddies a week ago delivering toys to a local children's.
• 42:06
  Speaker 2: Hospital or, yeah he could be like a complete Like
• 42:08
  Speaker 2: Teddy bear.
• 42:09
  Speaker 1: Exactly but we assume the worst because it's different than
• 42:12
  Speaker 1: what we. Know you go and see some skinny punk
• 42:16
  Speaker 1: kid with a mohawk and bright orange pants and he's
• 42:19
  Speaker 1: listening to some heavy. Music, well he's literally looks. Scary
• 42:23
  Speaker 1: he's got a chain hanging from his. Hip that doesn't mean.
• 42:25
  Speaker 2: Anything, yeah he could be the nicest person, around.
• 42:28
  Speaker 1: Right maybe he's helping at a local animal. Shelter maybe
• 42:31
  Speaker 1: he's planning to go to university and become a. Veterinarian
• 42:34
  Speaker 1: you don't. Know and then we see people like Ted
• 42:37
  Speaker 1: bundy who charm all these individuals who are so handsome
• 42:42
  Speaker 1: and people love him and he's a fucking. Murderer, yeah BUT.
• 42:47
  Speaker 2: I MEAN i do have to say, too these RUMORS
• 42:49
  Speaker 2: i feel like are kind of Putting charles And joey
• 42:53
  Speaker 2: in a bit of a dangerous position as. Well they,
• 42:56
  Speaker 2: Are so it's very interesting just like listening to this
• 43:00
  Speaker 2: in the build up and wondering what the hell is
• 43:02
  Speaker 2: going to?
• 43:02
  Speaker 1: Happen well With kenneth though specifically when he was spending time,
• 43:08
  Speaker 1: there it's not so much the rumors that really influenced.
• 43:11
  Speaker 1: Him it was more so being at the property, himself
• 43:15
  Speaker 1: because he soon became convinced That charles And joey were
• 43:18
  Speaker 1: very wealthy because of the property that they. Had, okay
• 43:22
  Speaker 1: so From kenneth's, perspective Like Corpsewood manor looked very valuable
• 43:26
  Speaker 1: right and rich in a way that was very difficult
• 43:28
  Speaker 1: for him to ignore because right in front of him
• 43:30
  Speaker 1: it's an isolated brick castle and it contains, antiques stained glass,
• 43:35
  Speaker 1: ARTWORK i, mean hand painted. Artwork you got different, furniture,
• 43:38
  Speaker 1: sculptures shelves filled with expensive looking, possessions and then to
• 43:42
  Speaker 1: top it, Off charles also occasionally gave gifts to visitors as,
• 43:45
  Speaker 1: well like one of the first things they had when
• 43:47
  Speaker 1: they stepped in the door was a glass of.
• 43:48
  Speaker 2: Wine, yeah but they put a lot of effort and
• 43:51
  Speaker 2: time into all of, that, Right so it wasn't necessarily
• 43:53
  Speaker 2: that they were. Wealthy it's just. Time and then they
• 43:56
  Speaker 2: used the money they had to create this.
• 44:00
  Speaker 1: Exactly So kenneth interpreted all this as evidence like that
• 44:03
  Speaker 1: they must be hiding large sums of. Money because he
• 44:06
  Speaker 1: came from, poverty he didn't understand that the hard work paid.
• 44:09
  Speaker 1: Off he didn't understand they had a bit of inheritance
• 44:11
  Speaker 1: to start them. Off he didn't understand the labor going into.
• 44:14
  Speaker 1: It and that's the. Reality much of the value At
• 44:18
  Speaker 1: corpsewood came from years of, labor, craftsmanship salvaged antiques that
• 44:22
  Speaker 1: they you know, what, upcycled and things that they'd done.
• 44:26
  Speaker 1: Themselves it's not hidden wealth or. Cash, yeah there was
• 44:30
  Speaker 1: a cash, startup but that only got it. Started it's
• 44:34
  Speaker 1: maintained because of hard, work, labor and. Love But kenneth
• 44:38
  Speaker 1: didn't he didn't understand that. Though that's the. Thing he
• 44:40
  Speaker 1: only saw an isolated older couple in a strange looking
• 44:44
  Speaker 1: castle filled with, valuables and thus there must be money as,
• 44:47
  Speaker 1: well and eventually he began talking about it with another
• 44:51
  Speaker 1: man Named Tony. West and If kenneth was someone who
• 44:55
  Speaker 1: brought recklessness and instability into a, situation Then tony he
• 45:00
  Speaker 1: he brought something much. Darker people who later looked into
• 45:03
  Speaker 1: The corpsewood case often came away with the impression That
• 45:06
  Speaker 1: tony was the far more dangerous one of the. Two
• 45:09
  Speaker 1: kenneth was, young, impulsive, insecure and easily, influenced But, tony
• 45:13
  Speaker 1: on the other, hand he already carried a long history
• 45:15
  Speaker 1: of violence long before he ever heard the Name Corpsewood
• 45:19
  Speaker 1: Manner Samuel Tony west grew up surrounded by. Dysfunction accounts
• 45:26
  Speaker 1: Describing tony's childhood painted a very grim, picture filled with, abuse,
• 45:31
  Speaker 1: alcoholism and emotional. Neglect violence appeared throughout much of his early,
• 45:36
  Speaker 1: life and several later sources Suggest tony struggled with serious
• 45:40
  Speaker 1: psychological problems from a very young. Age one of the
• 45:43
  Speaker 1: earliest incidents connected to him remained especially. Disturbing you, see
• 45:48
  Speaker 1: while he was still, Young tony accidentally shot and killed
• 45:51
  Speaker 1: his two year old, nephew and the tragedy reportedly had
• 45:55
  Speaker 1: a very profound impact on, him and following the, Shooting
• 45:58
  Speaker 1: tony spent time at a mental, institution though there is
• 46:02
  Speaker 1: little indication the treatment that he received there did anything
• 46:06
  Speaker 1: to really stabilize him or had any sort of meaningful.
• 46:09
  Speaker 1: Impact as he grew, older life became increasingly more. Chaotic
• 46:14
  Speaker 1: tony developed a reputation for heavy, drinking volatile, behavior and criminal,
• 46:18
  Speaker 1: activity and by the early nineteen, Eighties tony had a
• 46:21
  Speaker 1: reputation among many of the people who knew him as
• 46:23
  Speaker 1: someone capable of very serious, violence and the alcohol and
• 46:27
  Speaker 1: drug use only intensified those. Tendencies Now tony frequently drank,
• 46:32
  Speaker 1: heavily but he also loved to abuse, inhalance particularly aerosol
• 46:37
  Speaker 1: chemicals locals referred to as Tutelou. Now substances reportedly left
• 46:42
  Speaker 1: Both tony And kenneth heavily impaired for long stretches of,
• 46:46
  Speaker 1: time contributing to, paranoia impulsive, thinking and a lot of
• 46:50
  Speaker 1: emotional instability between the. Two the relationship between the two
• 46:55
  Speaker 1: quickly amplified the worst parts of both of. Them tony
• 46:59
  Speaker 1: was older and more experienced with violence and criminal, behavior
• 47:02
  Speaker 1: While kenneth was eager for approval and easily. Influenced the
• 47:07
  Speaker 1: two bonded over, drinking, drugs petty, crime and a general
• 47:10
  Speaker 1: resentment towards the world that was surrounding, them and over,
• 47:13
  Speaker 1: Time kenneth began telling stories To tony about this strange
• 47:17
  Speaker 1: manner that was hidden deep in the mountain side outside Of.
• 47:20
  Speaker 1: Somerville he described the isolated, property the, antiques the unusual,
• 47:25
  Speaker 1: artwork and the older couple living. Alone he also told
• 47:29
  Speaker 1: tales of the many rumors Surrounding, corpsewood including stories about, satanism, sex,
• 47:34
  Speaker 1: drugs and supposed hidden wealth within and with it, All
• 47:38
  Speaker 1: tony became fascinated almost. Immediately to, him the property represented an,
• 47:44
  Speaker 1: opportunity a wealthy place isolated in the, woods far from
• 47:48
  Speaker 1: neighbors or police. Response the more the two of them
• 47:51
  Speaker 1: talked about the manner while drinking and getting high off,
• 47:53
  Speaker 1: inhalins the more the idea of robbing the property started
• 47:57
  Speaker 1: to shift from fantasy into something alone little more. Serious
• 48:02
  Speaker 1: the pair actually began to discuss where a manner like
• 48:05
  Speaker 1: this would have, money where it might be, hidden And
• 48:08
  Speaker 1: kenneth was convinced the couple kept cash hidden directly on
• 48:11
  Speaker 1: the property rather than relying on banks or traditional. Systems
• 48:15
  Speaker 1: since there was no electricity or modern infrastructure, there it
• 48:18
  Speaker 1: only made sense to him that this was the, case
• 48:21
  Speaker 1: and so he described the manner almost like a hidden
• 48:24
  Speaker 1: treasure just waiting to be. Taken there are also signs
• 48:29
  Speaker 1: that resentment and emotional conflict were becoming mixed into the,
• 48:32
  Speaker 1: situation as well as a bit alluded to a little bit,
• 48:34
  Speaker 1: earlier and so what may have initially started as reckless
• 48:38
  Speaker 1: conversation between two intoxicated men daydreaming about taking a hidden
• 48:42
  Speaker 1: treasure gradually involved into active. Planning the pair eventually borrowed
• 48:48
  Speaker 1: a twenty two Caliber Remington's speedmaster rifle From kenneth's mother
• 48:53
  Speaker 1: and began discussing how they were going to approach the,
• 48:56
  Speaker 1: property and a few days before everything, Unfolded kenneth And
• 49:02
  Speaker 1: tony reportedly even made an earlier attempt to carry out a.
• 49:06
  Speaker 1: Robbery On december, tenth nineteen eighty, two the pair headed Towards,
• 49:11
  Speaker 1: corpsewood armed with the rifle and intended to Confront charles And.
• 49:15
  Speaker 1: Joey now exactly why the attempt failed remains somewhat. Unclear
• 49:21
  Speaker 1: some accounts suggests they lost their nerve before, arriving while
• 49:23
  Speaker 1: others indicate circumstances simply didn't align up with the way
• 49:27
  Speaker 1: that they. Expected but whatever the, reason they turned back
• 49:30
  Speaker 1: without carrying out through the. Plan, now that failed attempt
• 49:34
  Speaker 1: could have ended the story entirely right then and, there but,
• 49:38
  Speaker 1: instead the two men returned to, drinking getting, high and
• 49:41
  Speaker 1: discussing the manner almost obsessively over the following, days and
• 49:45
  Speaker 1: any hesitation that might have existed during the first attempt gradually.
• 49:49
  Speaker 1: Disappeared so by the Time december twelfth, arrived the robbery
• 49:53
  Speaker 1: no longer existed only as. Fantasy it was an intent
• 49:56
  Speaker 1: that was ready to burst into fruition and hidden deep
• 50:00
  Speaker 1: in the. Mountains charles And joey had no idea that
• 50:02
  Speaker 1: two young men were stalking their home and preparing to
• 50:06
  Speaker 1: come armed and. Uninvited and that's where we're going to
• 50:11
  Speaker 1: end today's.
• 50:12
  Speaker 2: Episode oh holy friggin'. Shit.
• 50:20
  Speaker 1: YEAH i like how you tried to refrain yourself from,
• 50:22
  Speaker 1: cursing but it just spilled.
• 50:24
  Speaker 2: Out, Anyways, Okay, Well i'm finding this story incredibly. Interesting
• 50:27
  Speaker 2: there's so many aspects of it That i'm just like.
• 50:30
  Speaker 2: Loving but it's also the build up was so, intense
• 50:33
  Speaker 2: and you, know you, know like shit is going to
• 50:36
  Speaker 2: go down obviously because this is like a true crime,
• 50:38
  Speaker 2: podcast and my heart just already. Hurts a little because of,
• 50:43
  Speaker 2: This And i've already even said in this they seem
• 50:46
  Speaker 2: like how how they're they positioned themselves could potentially be
• 50:49
  Speaker 2: a bit dangerous to. Them and here we fucking. GO
• 50:52
  Speaker 2: i guess, yep so that's how we're ending. It here
• 50:56
  Speaker 2: we fucking, go and we'll. See we'll talk to you
• 50:58
  Speaker 2: on when Or?
• 50:59
  Speaker 1: Friday, Yeah.
• 51:00
  Speaker 2: Wednesday that would be so, nice wouldn't.
• 51:01
  Speaker 1: It, yeah it would, Be but unfortunately not the. Case
• 51:03
  Speaker 1: you gotta wait Till friday when part two comes. Out
• 51:06
  Speaker 1: i'm glad THAT i built the tension enough for you
• 51:08
  Speaker 1: in this. STORY i, mean it kind of honestly builds,
• 51:11
  Speaker 1: itself If i'm being. Honest it was pretty easy to
• 51:13
  Speaker 1: do because that's just the. Story but, YEAH i WHEN
• 51:17
  Speaker 1: i started researching this, one it found a special place
• 51:22
  Speaker 1: in my true crime catalog of stories in my, brain
• 51:25
  Speaker 1: AND i think it's forever going to be in the
• 51:27
  Speaker 1: top because it's a wild, story but also because the,
• 51:30
  Speaker 1: home the life these two, people it sounds incredible and.
• 51:34
  Speaker 2: Amazing it does what they have, said like they created
• 51:37
  Speaker 2: a little oasis for themselves that so many people dream,
• 51:40
  Speaker 2: of and they did.
• 51:41
  Speaker 1: It but because of how we discuss things that are,
• 51:44
  Speaker 1: different are feared that turned on? Them and, well well
• 51:49
  Speaker 1: we'll discuss the rest in part. Two, yeah but thank
• 51:52
  Speaker 1: you for being. Here we'll talk to you in part,
• 51:54
  Speaker 1: two which is This, friday coming up only in a
• 51:56
  Speaker 1: couple of. Days and if you're listening to this later,
• 51:58
  Speaker 1: on well part two is probably out, now BUT i.
• 52:00
  Speaker 1: Digress we're going to talk all about it then and until,
• 52:03
  Speaker 1: then stay.
• 52:05
  Speaker 2: Wicked ab