Latest / PNW Haunts & Homicides / Meshay Melendez & Layla Stewart: Deadly Domestic Violence Tragedy | Vancouver, WA

Transcript

Meshay Melendez & Layla Stewart: Deadly Domestic Violence Tragedy | Vancouver, WA · PNW Haunts & Homicides

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: It isn't just a true crime story. It's a timeline
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: of heartbreak, a story of a mother, a daughter, and
• 0:10
  Speaker 1: a system that seemed to have every opportunity to prevent
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: their deaths and didn't. What happened to them is horrifying,
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: But what's equally chilling is how much could have been prevented.
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: We tell ourselves that we have systems in place to
• 0:30
  Speaker 1: help prevent these tragedies in our communities.
• 0:39
  Speaker 2: Hey, Cassie, Hey Caitlin, Hi, creepy people.
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: Hey, this is PNW Hans and Homicides, where we chat
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: about true crime, also haunted stuff, you know, kind of
• 0:56
  Speaker 1: whatever we're feeling. Comes Saturday at about three o'clock. Fully, shit, wow,
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: any who's all in where in the Pacific Northwest?
• 1:06
  Speaker 2: It's the PNW. If you're nasty, so you gotta tell
• 1:10
  Speaker 2: them what the PNW means. I just won't know.
• 1:12
  Speaker 3: They just they how could they not go through the
• 1:15
  Speaker 3: whole episode and just get to the end and learn
• 1:17
  Speaker 3: nothing and they'll just be like the whole time, I
• 1:19
  Speaker 3: was like, what does PNW even mean?
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's honestly, it's it's one of the greater issues
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: facing facing, facing, facing our nation. Two day, our country,
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: our country. Forget about those deportations. It's the pay and.
• 1:38
  Speaker 2: W That's what's on everyone's mind.
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: I just really want to know what that stands for.
• 1:44
  Speaker 3: Killing God, you gotta stop getting so motherfucking political.
• 1:49
  Speaker 1: Honestly, it's probably not going to stop.
• 1:53
  Speaker 2: Please you. Just you be you.
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: It's almost like we actually spend a lot of time
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: and money creating the show, and then the content that
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: you consume from it is free, so you know, it's.
• 2:09
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• 2:11
  Speaker 3: Yeah, he's right, and then you get add free you
• 2:14
  Speaker 3: and then because technically they're not free, because you do
• 2:17
  Speaker 3: pay for them with your ear holes by listening to
• 2:19
  Speaker 3: other ads. That's true, It's true, and that is a
• 2:22
  Speaker 3: hell of approach to. Let me tell you, I want
• 2:25
  Speaker 3: to give us real money.
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: Yeah, as someone who just paid the price for YouTube
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: videos of pronunciations for the most random things earlier today, honestly.
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we pay YouTube a lot of money with our ears.
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: Are your holes? Oh boy? Oh bullieve?
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: Well, anyways, so I guess should we? Oh we we
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: forgot the one thing.
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: What do we know?
• 2:53
  Speaker 3: At the end of our episodes, we do a little
• 2:55
  Speaker 3: tear out the end of our episode for a little
• 2:57
  Speaker 3: deeper insight into our topic.
• 2:59
  Speaker 1: Are you ready to get into a story?
• 3:02
  Speaker 2: I guess so. Okay, great, I'm here. That makes one
• 3:06
  Speaker 2: of us. Well, hopefully you guys are ready. You're here too.
• 3:10
  Speaker 2: We're all in this together. Let's go.
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: Oh boy, did you know that the city of Portland
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: hasn't recorded a single homicide this month? And as we
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: record this, it is April.
• 3:22
  Speaker 2: I did not know that.
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: Well, that's as of April twenty first this year. Anyway,
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: So April twenty sixth, twenty twenty five, at threeh eight
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: pm in the month of March, seven people were killed
• 3:38
  Speaker 1: in Portland, a total of ten so far for the
• 3:42
  Speaker 1: calendar year. Last summer, our neighboring state to the north
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: was reporting a downward trend sort of the state of Washington,
• 3:51
  Speaker 1: not Canada. Just to be clear, they are not actually
• 3:55
  Speaker 1: a state. As a recording, they are still very much
• 3:59
  Speaker 1: a nation independent from the US.
• 4:02
  Speaker 3: Round of applause. Anyway, round of applause. Okay, it is
• 4:08
  Speaker 3: and always will be the Gulf of Mexico.
• 4:12
  Speaker 1: I was literally thinking the same thing. Weird, yeah, okay.
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: The Washington Association of Sheriffs and Police Chiefs published its
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: annual data on crimes reported statewide for twenty twenty three.
• 4:27
  Speaker 1: Their report revealed that there were a total of three
• 4:31
  Speaker 1: hundred and seventy six murders recorded throughout the state of
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: Washington last year three three seventy seven, three hundred and
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: seventy six.
• 4:40
  Speaker 3: Why you just said it seventy seven. But still it's
• 4:46
  Speaker 3: like like one a day, over oneed how many days
• 4:49
  Speaker 3: were there in a year, three hundred and sixty five, Yes,
• 4:52
  Speaker 3: like over one a day though, that's just crazy.
• 4:55
  Speaker 2: Yep.
• 4:55
  Speaker 1: This represented a five point eight percent drop from the
• 4:59
  Speaker 1: pre year, which seems positive until compared to another statistic.
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: It also represents an eighty one point one percent increase
• 5:10
  Speaker 1: over figures dating back to twenty nineteen. So eighty one
• 5:16
  Speaker 1: zero point one percent increase reported in twenty twenty three
• 5:20
  Speaker 1: compared to twenty nineteen.
• 5:22
  Speaker 2: Wow, what is happening?
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: Well, I think there's one thing that was happening in
• 5:28
  Speaker 1: that span that explains a lot. Oh am, I like
• 5:31
  Speaker 1: forgetting something big, the great Panini.
• 5:34
  Speaker 2: Uh oh well.
• 5:36
  Speaker 3: Duh okay, Cassie, I just like try to put that
• 5:39
  Speaker 3: out of my head.
• 5:40
  Speaker 1: Yes, because as we know, twenty twenty was in fact
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: the longest decade ever.
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: Uh horrific and sad and yeah, yeah.
• 5:49
  Speaker 1: And when I say twenty twenty, I don't mean the
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: decade twenty twenty to future date twenty thirty. I mean
• 5:57
  Speaker 1: twenty twenty the year. The standalone year felt like an
• 6:03
  Speaker 1: entire decade.
• 6:05
  Speaker 2: Was this an increase in murders though, or just yests
• 6:08
  Speaker 2: in general?
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: But like this is what this is, homicide.
• 6:11
  Speaker 2: People will be COVID murdering out there.
• 6:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah, well think about it. Shelter in place, which was
• 6:19
  Speaker 1: very necessary. But if you are living with someone who
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: is violent, that was one of those.
• 6:25
  Speaker 2: Like really tough things about it. Yeah.
• 6:29
  Speaker 1: Violent offenses rose steadily in twenty twenty and hit their
• 6:32
  Speaker 1: peak in twenty twenty two in terms of violent crime overall.
• 6:37
  Speaker 1: The month where these so called crimes against persons occurred
• 6:41
  Speaker 1: was May, right around the corner, May the fourth be
• 6:45
  Speaker 1: with you. Oh, I've always heard April showers bring May flowers,
• 6:51
  Speaker 1: but apparently that's not all. Notably, February was the month
• 6:57
  Speaker 1: where such crimes were the least frequent times day. I
• 7:01
  Speaker 1: guess I just assume that winter kind of like you know,
• 7:05
  Speaker 1: the summer heat brings out the worst and a lot
• 7:08
  Speaker 1: of people. It's all included in a super non murdery
• 7:12
  Speaker 1: way in my case.
• 7:13
  Speaker 2: But no, everyone's just feeling the low. But Valentine's Day?
• 7:18
  Speaker 2: Is it? I do have a question.
• 7:20
  Speaker 3: Is it just because there's like a couple of days
• 7:22
  Speaker 3: missing that makes it the least could be?
• 7:25
  Speaker 2: Could be?
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: I think that's a very valid point, to be honest.
• 7:28
  Speaker 2: Those couple of days, anything could happen, you know. Yeah.
• 7:31
  Speaker 1: I skimmed over quite a few sections of this report
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: and it breaks down a lot of different statistics related
• 7:42
  Speaker 1: to crime. Obviously, that's the whole point in the state
• 7:46
  Speaker 1: of Washington for twenty twenty three, and it's very interesting
• 7:50
  Speaker 1: to see the data points. Certainly, I don't know. I
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: have thoughts and feelings, obviously, you do.
• 7:58
  Speaker 2: I know, it's weird.
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: It's like, that's why I have this fucking microphone or something.
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: I don't know, who knows. Why are we here today?
• 8:06
  Speaker 1: We're covering a story that's as devastating as it is
• 8:09
  Speaker 1: important to tell. It's a case that highlights what happens
• 8:12
  Speaker 1: when warning signs are ignored and victims fall through the
• 8:16
  Speaker 1: cracks of a system meant to protect them. It's the
• 8:20
  Speaker 1: kind of story that makes you want to sit with
• 8:22
  Speaker 1: the weight of it for a minute, a moment, maybe
• 8:25
  Speaker 1: just the one, because it's pretty heavy. We'll be walking
• 8:30
  Speaker 1: through the lives and tragic deaths of Miche Melendez and
• 8:36
  Speaker 1: her seven year old daughter, Lailah Stewart Layelah Leayla.
• 8:42
  Speaker 2: I love that name.
• 8:43
  Speaker 1: I know this is not an easy story, but it's
• 8:47
  Speaker 1: one that matters, and I think I hope that everybody
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: know this applies to every story that I talk about.
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: But it isn't just a true crime story. It's a
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: timeline of heartbreak, a story of a mother, a daughter,
• 9:06
  Speaker 1: and a system that seemed to have every opportunity to
• 9:10
  Speaker 1: prevent their deaths and didn't. What happened to them is horrifying,
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: but what's equally chilling is how much could have been prevented.
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: We tell ourselves that we have systems in place to
• 9:26
  Speaker 1: help prevent these tragedies in our communities. Let's start at
• 9:31
  Speaker 1: the beginning. Miche Melendez was twenty seven. She was a mother,
• 9:36
  Speaker 1: a daughter, and a friend. Lailah Stewart was bright, funny,
• 9:42
  Speaker 1: with her whole life ahead of her. I mean she
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: was seven years old, so literally her whole life ahead
• 9:49
  Speaker 1: of her.
• 9:50
  Speaker 2: I feel like seven's like a fun age.
• 9:52
  Speaker 3: They start to get like their own little personality, like
• 9:55
  Speaker 3: for real.
• 9:56
  Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, And she definitely seemed like she had a
• 10:00
  Speaker 1: really fun personality. The morning of March twelfth, twenty twenty three,
• 10:08
  Speaker 1: was the last time Miche and Layla were seen alive
• 10:11
  Speaker 1: before both vanished. The last person they were seen with
• 10:15
  Speaker 1: was Kirkland C.
• 10:17
  Speaker 2: Warren, a man that.
• 10:19
  Speaker 1: Michee had a complicated relationship with. They stopped by a
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: friend's house on Northeast Lewett Loop. That friend told police
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: that Warren dropped Layla off there temporarily before leaving again.
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: When they came back about three hours later, Mischee well,
• 10:38
  Speaker 1: she was passed out in the front passenger seat of
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: Warren's Dodge Charger. At least that's what he said. The
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: friend said she looked unconscious. It was a brief interaction.
• 10:52
  Speaker 1: Warren just went into the home, picked up Layla, and
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: then drove off, and that was the last time anyone
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: saw either of them.
• 11:01
  Speaker 2: I feel like you should be going to a hospital
• 11:03
  Speaker 2: if someone is unconscious in your car.
• 11:05
  Speaker 1: No, the consensus was that he was just trying to
• 11:08
  Speaker 1: pass it off, like, oh, she's just like hungover, Okay,
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: That's that was the the vibe.
• 11:16
  Speaker 3: She was just passed out. Okay, I'm thinking like like fate,
• 11:20
  Speaker 3: like she's out episode, yeah, and you're just like picking
• 11:24
  Speaker 3: up the dot like no, like go to the hospital, right, Okay, Okay,
• 11:28
  Speaker 3: if she's just like passed out from drinking or something, right,
• 11:32
  Speaker 3: not as concerning, but this is still concerning. Yeah, I
• 11:37
  Speaker 3: would say, yeah, pretty early in the morning for yeah, yeah.
• 11:42
  Speaker 2: Well, well I've been drunk in the morning.
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: I mean, sure, who hasn't Probably people that don't drink.
• 11:48
  Speaker 1: But you know, now here's what you need to know
• 11:51
  Speaker 1: about Kirkland C.
• 11:53
  Speaker 2: Warren.
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: Other than that, I developed a nickname for him, and
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: I don't think it's particularly clever, but I had fun
• 12:05
  Speaker 1: with it.
• 12:05
  Speaker 2: I can't wait to hear it.
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: Soggi hot dog Kirkland.
• 12:10
  Speaker 3: Do they have soggy hot dogs? Well, what's it called
• 12:13
  Speaker 3: cost Costco?
• 12:15
  Speaker 1: No, he's a soggy hot dog.
• 12:18
  Speaker 3: I would never get a hot dog there. It's all
• 12:20
  Speaker 3: eat chicken bake. What do you go there for a chicken? Baan?
• 12:23
  Speaker 2: Are you getting a hot who's getting a hot dog?
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: Who are you? Yeah?
• 12:27
  Speaker 1: Anyways, he was a man with a documented history of violence,
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: a pending murder charge in Arkansas.
• 12:36
  Speaker 3: In Arkansas, so he moved. Sure did, Yeah, I wonder why? Yeah,
• 12:41
  Speaker 3: you know it's weird. Wait can you if they're what, are.
• 12:45
  Speaker 2: You allowed to leave the state? Question? Doesn't it? Yeah?
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: It's almost like, don't we have systems in place for this?
• 12:53
  Speaker 2: I have questions? Uh huh yeah, I bet. Yeah.
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: Also, there was an active no content order from the court.
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: This didn't come out of nowhere. This started years ago.
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: November twenty seventh, twenty seventeen, Warren shot Curtis Urkhart in
• 13:12
  Speaker 1: the head with a twenty two caliber pistol. He later
• 13:15
  Speaker 1: admitted to the shooting, telling police it was self defense.
• 13:19
  Speaker 1: He dumped the body in a ditch on December twelfth.
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: He was arrested on December thirteenth. He posted bond and
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: walked free.
• 13:29
  Speaker 3: I can't get the words out because I'm just so
• 13:32
  Speaker 3: very confused.
• 13:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 13:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah, So it turns out you actually can very easily
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: jump bond and moved to a different state when they
• 13:46
  Speaker 1: let you out on bond.
• 13:47
  Speaker 3: But murder, murder, you killing, and you dumped a body, see,
• 13:54
  Speaker 3: which he.
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: Actually had admitted to. He's like, never denied that I
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: killed the guy, never denied that I tampered with the
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: forensic evidence related to the corpse. I'm just saying it's
• 14:09
  Speaker 1: self defense.
• 14:10
  Speaker 3: I feel like it can be self defense, but like
• 14:13
  Speaker 3: it can't be both, Like this is one of those
• 14:16
  Speaker 3: things where two things can't be true, Like you can't
• 14:19
  Speaker 3: try to cover up your self defense murder. Like if
• 14:22
  Speaker 3: it's self defense, you call the fucking police and be like,
• 14:24
  Speaker 3: I can't kill someone.
• 14:26
  Speaker 2: Great, No, it looks really bad and how bad? How
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: do you? How do you? How do you let them out? Yeah?
• 14:32
  Speaker 1: I feel like maybe in that situation, like, ah, maybe
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: we hold on to him for a minute, just.
• 14:37
  Speaker 2: You know, get up him in our pause.
• 14:39
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: Fast forward to Vancouver, Washington in twenty twenty, so this
• 14:45
  Speaker 1: is literally three years later. He shouldn't be there, He
• 14:48
  Speaker 1: shouldn't even be there. No, he sure shouldn't, and yet
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: here we are. In twenty twenty. Warren was investigated for
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: possessing a stolen firearm, which doesn't seem like a red
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: flag for somebody who already has been murder charges.
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: He was arrested for this. Investigated.
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: Investigated, Okay, investigated is the is the word that all
• 15:11
  Speaker 1: of my source material used.
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: I hear words wrong sometimes, sorry.
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: Guys, no, no, And I think sometimes in your brain you
• 15:18
  Speaker 1: go investigated, and then you think, like, well, surely they.
• 15:21
  Speaker 3: Rest well, surely because he's he's murdered somebody and he
• 15:25
  Speaker 3: has a cot.
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: Don't call me surely? Uh Okay. In twenty twenty one,
• 15:32
  Speaker 1: he lied on a firearm application stating that he wasn't
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: under indictment. We already know he was getting back to
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: twenty twenty three, getting back to twenty twenty three, which
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: is the future from you know, the present future. Yeah,
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: you know, the present future. He was facing active domestic
• 15:53
  Speaker 1: violence charges stemming from a shooting at Miche's apartment back
• 15:58
  Speaker 1: in December.
• 15:59
  Speaker 2: Whoa.
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: It took until February for law enforcement to corroborate her
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: story with other witnesses, But later that same month, Miche recants.
• 16:10
  Speaker 3: Oh, no, he got his little meaty claws into it,
• 16:16
  Speaker 3: didn't he. M H.
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: I think that feels safe to assume, and actually I
• 16:22
  Speaker 1: don't really even have to assume. She says she made
• 16:26
  Speaker 1: it up, blaming mental health and drug issues, and at
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: this point she pleads for Warren not to be arrested.
• 16:36
  Speaker 1: Investigators note the shift as suspicih, and despite her protest,
• 16:42
  Speaker 1: Warren was arrested March second.
• 16:45
  Speaker 2: Well that's good at least m h yep.
• 16:49
  Speaker 1: March third, he appears in court facing domestic violence, assault,
• 16:53
  Speaker 1: drive by shooting, harassment, and possession of a stolen firearm.
• 16:58
  Speaker 1: A risk assessment gives him thirty one on a scale
• 17:02
  Speaker 1: that only goes to eighteen. It's actually it's it's gonna
• 17:06
  Speaker 1: get worse. So I don't know whether to let you
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: process or how does that even happen? Though, if it's
• 17:13
  Speaker 1: only gonna stay.
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: Right, I think it books the question.
• 17:16
  Speaker 1: It's confusing and scales horseshit. Yeah, I didn't want the salmon.
• 17:24
  Speaker 1: Prosecutors say he is an extreme risk to Miche. They
• 17:31
  Speaker 1: ask for one hundred thousand dollars bail and it's granted
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: and no contact order is issued. On the very same
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: day he's released, Warren calls Miche twice from jail.
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: What's no contact made from jail? You're still okay?
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: Honestly, as infuriating as that is, it's like, great, stay stupid.
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: This will be used in a court of law. Right later,
• 18:02
  Speaker 1: he says, there is no way I'm going back to Arkansas.
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: I mean I wouldn't come back there either, but you
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: know other places, sure, No, But I think it's important
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: that He specifically said, there's no way I'm going back
• 18:17
  Speaker 1: to Arkansas, which you know, if if the call was
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: monitored in real time, that would have been like what
• 18:28
  Speaker 1: what about Arkansas?
• 18:29
  Speaker 3: But because I killed someone there and they want to,
• 18:32
  Speaker 3: you know, put me on trial for it. But yeah,
• 18:35
  Speaker 3: for some reason they let me out.
• 18:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Warren didn't want to go back to Arkansas, not
• 18:41
  Speaker 1: even a little in jail house phone calls too. Miche
• 18:44
  Speaker 1: he blamed her for his problems, demanded she figure out
• 18:50
  Speaker 1: how to get the domestic violence charges dropped, and made
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: it clear he was spiraling. And he posts bail and
• 18:59
  Speaker 1: is released March sixth. March sixth, this is three days later. Wow, wow,
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: Warren appears in court again for violating the no contact order.
• 19:11
  Speaker 1: Police ask for GPS monitoring. The judge sets ten thousand
• 19:16
  Speaker 1: dollars bail and approves the monitor but it's never applied.
• 19:21
  Speaker 1: Why which is why all of my source material states
• 19:26
  Speaker 1: with such disdain that this man was not under GPS monitoring.
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: March seventh, the case is dismissed, and March eighth, he
• 19:37
  Speaker 1: walks free again.
• 19:39
  Speaker 3: Like I just don't understand how this could happen multiple
• 19:44
  Speaker 3: times to somebody. I mean it's happened before. But yeah, yeah,
• 19:48
  Speaker 3: like I just don't get it.
• 19:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it continues to not make sense, the math not mathing.
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: You know what else doesn't make sense? My fuck? Wineglasses empty? Well,
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: mine's almost empty too.
• 20:05
  Speaker 1: All of this feels ominous in light of the fact
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: that no one had seen or heard from Mische and
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: Layla recently and such a short time after his release.
• 20:16
  Speaker 2: I'm scared for them.
• 20:18
  Speaker 1: I mean, you already know ultimately how this ends, and
• 20:22
  Speaker 1: it's still kind of like what's gonna happen.
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: Sometimes I like to pretend I don't know what's gonna
• 20:28
  Speaker 2: happen in the end, and I just like to live
• 20:30
  Speaker 2: in the moment.
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: M hm uh, Okay, Well, the following moments are moments
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: that you may feel less like inhabiting, Okay, days past.
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: It was Miche's mother that reported the missing on March eighteenth,
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: six days after they disappeared and just ten days after
• 20:52
  Speaker 1: Warren was released. That same day, she found Mische's car
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: parked near the Lewet Loop home of their friend that's
• 21:02
  Speaker 1: less than a mile from the apartment that she shared
• 21:05
  Speaker 1: with her seven year old daughter in the Springfield Meadows Complex.
• 21:12
  Speaker 2: All I don't know why that sounds so cute.
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: In a Springfield film, Meadows, Can I hold out to that,
• 21:20
  Speaker 1: just like for a second longer? Inside their apartment empty
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: except for their dog, doggy, Doggy.
• 21:28
  Speaker 2: I think doggie was okay, okay, Yeah, don't.
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: I don't have a lot of additional information about the dog.
• 21:36
  Speaker 3: I just have to because doggie. I hope the doggie
• 21:39
  Speaker 3: was okay.
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think the doggy was okay. The very next day,
• 21:42
  Speaker 1: March nineteenth, Warren was arrested at his own home on
• 21:47
  Speaker 1: Northeast one hundred and ninth Avenue. Police charged him with
• 21:51
  Speaker 1: multiple offenses, tampering with a witness, violating no contact orders,
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: and more. But when investigators searched his Dodge charger, they
• 22:01
  Speaker 1: found something much.
• 22:03
  Speaker 2: Worse, worse than a Dodge charger.
• 22:07
  Speaker 1: I think, I think, yes, worse than a Dodge charger.
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: But the contents were also worse.
• 22:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: In the front and back seats there was blood twenty
• 22:19
  Speaker 1: two caliber shell casings. They also recovered children's clothing that
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: matched what Layla had last been seen wearing, and Missche's
• 22:29
  Speaker 1: purse with her id still inside. I don't like the clothing, Nope,
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: and you're gonna like it. A lot less some additional
• 22:38
  Speaker 1: details about our timeline. March eleventh, Mischee, Layla, and Warren
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: stay at a friend's home. Early the next morning, the
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: friend sees Mischee passed out in the passenger seat, So
• 22:51
  Speaker 1: this is the day they went missing. That morning, she
• 22:56
  Speaker 1: is unclothed from the waist down.
• 22:58
  Speaker 2: Did the front know or yep?
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: The friend this is their reporting.
• 23:03
  Speaker 3: Okay, wow, that would be like hm hmm, well like
• 23:07
  Speaker 3: to see which is odd.
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: But as we know, Warren collects Layla and they drive off.
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: The following day is later identified as the date that
• 23:18
  Speaker 1: the mother and daughter went missing. Just the day before,
• 23:21
  Speaker 1: Miche's mother reports her daughter and grandchild missing because they
• 23:25
  Speaker 1: missed a regularly scheduled video call, and Arkansas judge provokes
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: Warren's bond in the twenty seventeen case.
• 23:33
  Speaker 2: Holy shit, so.
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: He's just literally been running wild across the countryside for
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: literal years.
• 23:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah, why did Arkansas do that?
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: Uh?
• 23:45
  Speaker 2: Unclear? Okay, oh my god, did they hear about that?
• 23:48
  Speaker 2: Like how did they hear about this? But I'm wait point.
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: There was like cooperation between law enforcement of Arkansas and
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: the state of Washington.
• 24:00
  Speaker 2: Oh wow, I don't.
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: Know at the exact point where those dots were connected.
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: But uh, I have to assume that feels like maybe.
• 24:11
  Speaker 3: Well that's great, Like I feel like that's really good
• 24:14
  Speaker 3: for them to be in contact about this man.
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: I mean, granted, Miche and Layla hadn't officially been reported
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: missing at that point.
• 24:24
  Speaker 2: This is the day before they are reported missing.
• 24:26
  Speaker 3: Right, But he got into some shenanigans before that, that's correct, Yes,
• 24:32
  Speaker 3: not good shenanigans.
• 24:34
  Speaker 1: No, someone does not have the luck of the Irish,
• 24:39
  Speaker 1: and I'm glad he doesn't deserve any leprechaun magic.
• 24:43
  Speaker 2: No, he doesn't, not at all.
• 24:46
  Speaker 1: When law enforcement performs a wellness check on the eighteenth,
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: there's no sign of them. They're like weird, so they're
• 24:54
  Speaker 1: like being reported missing and the wellness check says, oh oopsies,
• 24:59
  Speaker 1: they may actually be Tot's missing missing. This next part
• 25:04
  Speaker 1: really drives home some upsetting facts. First, is this man Hudini.
• 25:11
  Speaker 1: He is constantly being released seemingly by magic. Make it
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: makes sense?
• 25:19
  Speaker 2: Who is this?
• 25:21
  Speaker 1: On March twentieth, prosecutors ask for either no bail or
• 25:26
  Speaker 1: for five hundred thousand dollars.
• 25:28
  Speaker 2: Man, this whole money and bail thing more you talk.
• 25:33
  Speaker 3: About it, it's pretty upsetting the more I don't like it.
• 25:38
  Speaker 1: And while I would really love to go diving down
• 25:42
  Speaker 1: the rabbit hole that is, you know, the classiest system
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: of oppression so predominant in our legal system, I'm going
• 25:52
  Speaker 1: to keep on moving.
• 25:53
  Speaker 2: It's just obvious. I feel like you don't even need
• 25:55
  Speaker 2: to No, it's just obvious. No, I feel like you.
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah, if you don't inherently understand how people are being
• 26:02
  Speaker 1: penalized for being poor by being ultimately driven further into poverty,
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: then I have to assume that you're walking around like anyways,
• 26:18
  Speaker 1: the judge postpones that hearing, you know, the bail one.
• 26:24
  Speaker 1: At the hearing the following day, the prosecutors up their
• 26:27
  Speaker 1: ask for bail to a million dollars and request GPS monitoring,
• 26:34
  Speaker 1: And you want to know, what.
• 26:35
  Speaker 2: Did he actually get it this time? It's granted? Oh wow.
• 26:39
  Speaker 2: I feel like it's maybe a little just too late,
• 26:43
  Speaker 2: a little.
• 26:43
  Speaker 1: Tool, and it's not even I just feel like GPS monitoring.
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: People totally misunderstand that is again like the jailhouse phone calls.
• 26:54
  Speaker 1: That's not like being monitored in real time. It's not
• 26:58
  Speaker 1: like dysturbia.
• 27:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, I.
• 27:02
  Speaker 3: Kind of always wonder how that works, because I'm like,
• 27:05
  Speaker 3: no one's like manning the phones twenty four to.
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: Seven, Like no, I mean, and every jurisdiction can potentially
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: be a little bit different in terms of how they
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: handle that administratively and just like from an operational side
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: of things. But again, not how that works, right, Like.
• 27:23
  Speaker 2: You don't leave the zone and an alarm goes off
• 27:25
  Speaker 2: and then the police coming at.
• 27:27
  Speaker 1: You, just like what and their response time is never
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: going to be three minutes or less for something like that.
• 27:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: Then on the morning of March twenty second, a passerby
• 27:41
  Speaker 1: walking down a private road near Southeast Wooding and Sunset
• 27:45
  Speaker 1: View in wash Shugle made a nine one one call.
• 27:50
  Speaker 1: They thought they saw what looked like two life sized
• 27:53
  Speaker 1: mannequins at the bottom of a steep embankment lodged in
• 27:58
  Speaker 1: thick brush near Gibbons Creek. It wasn't mannequins. It's never mannequins.
• 28:06
  Speaker 1: I mean, I think there was that one time where
• 28:07
  Speaker 1: it was a mannequin and that was like, you know,
• 28:10
  Speaker 1: on the side of the highway and that was really
• 28:13
  Speaker 1: messed up. But it's just not that it was Mische
• 28:17
  Speaker 1: and Leila their bodies partially unclothed, bore the marks of
• 28:23
  Speaker 1: multiple gunshot wounds, suspected to have been fired from a
• 28:27
  Speaker 1: twenty two caliber firearm that their autopsies would later confirm
• 28:34
  Speaker 1: as the cause of death. Miche's was a close range
• 28:38
  Speaker 1: contact wound is a different way of saying essentially execution style,
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: while Layla had been shot twice, which begs the question,
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: why are you double tapping a seven year old? And
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: I think I think we have the answer.
• 28:57
  Speaker 2: I don't.
• 28:59
  Speaker 1: Also, horrifyingly, lab results would ultimately confirm Warren's DNA was
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: present on Layla's body.
• 29:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I kind of feel like I knew that was coming,
• 29:09
  Speaker 2: but I don't. I don't.
• 29:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, this is a situation where some sort of sexual
• 29:20
  Speaker 1: violence occurred to a minor, and there are not a
• 29:26
  Speaker 1: lot of details available about that because she's a minor.
• 29:33
  Speaker 2: I'm okay with that. I don't need the details. No,
• 29:36
  Speaker 2: nobody wants that.
• 29:37
  Speaker 1: But ultimately, I hope that this reads to everyone that
• 29:44
  Speaker 1: may encounter this man in the future. I hope that
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: reads as he raped a little girl.
• 29:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's how that's how it sounds.
• 29:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, sure does. I don't need the details. Following this discovery,
• 30:00
  Speaker 1: when detectives asked him whether he thought their bodies had
• 30:03
  Speaker 1: been found. Warren said I don't know, before adding I
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: hope not. Well sounds non committal, right, I mean that
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: could be something that you say, like, I mean, I
• 30:16
  Speaker 1: don't know.
• 30:17
  Speaker 2: I hope not. Yeah, like I hope there were no bodies.
• 30:20
  Speaker 2: I hope they're alive. Uh huh. Yeah.
• 30:23
  Speaker 1: However, I'm going to guess based on tone and a
• 30:27
  Speaker 1: lot of other contexts that I have not not how
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: they were reading that. Also this however, when he was
• 30:36
  Speaker 1: shown aerial photos of the site where the bodies were discovered,
• 30:41
  Speaker 1: he ended the interview and requested an attorney. Why makes
• 30:46
  Speaker 1: a question? Yeah, almost like oh shit, like.
• 30:50
  Speaker 2: They know where they're at.
• 30:51
  Speaker 3: Yes, Oh, that's like a dead giveaway because they at
• 30:54
  Speaker 3: that time they haven't found.
• 30:55
  Speaker 1: Them yet, right, No, or they had aerial photos of
• 31:00
  Speaker 1: where the bodies were found.
• 31:02
  Speaker 2: Oh okay, okay, okay.
• 31:03
  Speaker 1: And this is one of those classic situations of like
• 31:06
  Speaker 1: they're like, we're going to go in cold and we're
• 31:09
  Speaker 1: going to give him a little piece. I see, we're
• 31:13
  Speaker 1: not going to let him know. And and maybe they
• 31:16
  Speaker 1: didn't know, maybe it wasn't fully confirmed yet. They go
• 31:20
  Speaker 1: in and they are like, Okay, we're going to see
• 31:23
  Speaker 1: how he reacts.
• 31:24
  Speaker 3: Right, because he didn't know that they knew that, he
• 31:28
  Speaker 3: knew that they knew, right.
• 31:30
  Speaker 1: It's you know, no, I mean it's honestly, they want
• 31:33
  Speaker 1: to see how a suspect reacts to certain information because organically,
• 31:38
  Speaker 1: like your reaction is going to say a lot about
• 31:41
  Speaker 1: what you know, there's so many implications.
• 31:44
  Speaker 2: So he did the wrong thing, but sure did the
• 31:47
  Speaker 2: right thing.
• 31:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah, No, I mean, like stay stupid, you know.
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 31:52
  Speaker 3: Oh man, wow, them tricksy, them tricksy cops trick some
• 31:57
  Speaker 3: times a tricksy.
• 32:01
  Speaker 1: According to court documents, Warren would later tell police that
• 32:05
  Speaker 1: he and Miche got into an argument over his second
• 32:09
  Speaker 1: cell phone and that she accidentally shot Layla twice before
• 32:16
  Speaker 1: turning the gun on herself. Because, of course, if you
• 32:18
  Speaker 1: killed your own child totally by accident in the middle
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: of a heated argument, of course, what else would you do?
• 32:25
  Speaker 1: You would just shoot yourself in the.
• 32:26
  Speaker 2: Right, right, right right.
• 32:28
  Speaker 1: But also, and I can see the question on your face,
• 32:32
  Speaker 1: I can see it all over your face. Hole, which
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: is why my next sentence is, why would a man
• 32:38
  Speaker 1: have a second cell phone?
• 32:40
  Speaker 2: You might be tempted to ask Oh, I didn't need
• 32:42
  Speaker 2: to ask why he has a second Do you need
• 32:45
  Speaker 2: to ask why?
• 32:46
  Speaker 1: I don't know? I mean, I actually there are I
• 32:49
  Speaker 1: don't want to say it's not exactly a plethora, but
• 32:53
  Speaker 1: I can think of a few reasons.
• 32:55
  Speaker 3: Other bitches or drug deals. What's the other reason? Very smart,
• 32:59
  Speaker 3: like there's two choices?
• 33:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah? Yeah.
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: Did I forget to mention that this whole ass time
• 33:07
  Speaker 1: Warren has actually been married. He has a whole ass wife.
• 33:11
  Speaker 2: Kirkland, What the fuck you're married? Yeah? Does she live
• 33:18
  Speaker 2: in Arkansas? Nope? Oh?
• 33:20
  Speaker 1: I well, actually I don't know. No one cares. The
• 33:24
  Speaker 1: only other thing we're gonna learn about her is coming
• 33:27
  Speaker 1: up shortly.
• 33:29
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 33:29
  Speaker 1: So, speaking of degrees of shitball, his version of events
• 33:35
  Speaker 1: was that miche was the one holding the twenty two
• 33:37
  Speaker 1: pistol he gave her for protection, and that he was
• 33:42
  Speaker 1: under the influence of weed, mushrooms, and cocaine at the time.
• 33:46
  Speaker 1: Oh feels like a super weird combo.
• 33:50
  Speaker 2: If sounds like a party, I mean.
• 33:54
  Speaker 1: The entirety of a party in one man's system.
• 33:58
  Speaker 2: But it's like he couldn't decide. He's like I was
• 34:01
  Speaker 2: on this and this and this, like you couldn't just
• 34:03
  Speaker 2: be no.
• 34:03
  Speaker 1: I mean I think sometimes people are just like, oh yeah,
• 34:06
  Speaker 1: the multiplier effect. Yeah, and they're like, oh yeah, then
• 34:10
  Speaker 1: I'll totally you know, this is how I get off.
• 34:12
  Speaker 1: Scott Freeze tell them I was like pumped full of
• 34:15
  Speaker 1: all kinds of drugs and then it's fine. And it's like,
• 34:20
  Speaker 1: I don't think you understand the legal definition of like culpability.
• 34:27
  Speaker 3: Like does he think because I'm on so many of
• 34:29
  Speaker 3: these drugs, I can't shoot a gun like.
• 34:33
  Speaker 1: Or that is somehow you're less responsible. So it's like
• 34:36
  Speaker 1: I feel like for a lot of these situations, it
• 34:39
  Speaker 1: seems like they think that makes them less culpable.
• 34:43
  Speaker 2: I don't know, maybe pick a different drug like meth
• 34:46
  Speaker 2: or what's the one.
• 34:47
  Speaker 3: That people that somebody is the one that you like
• 34:50
  Speaker 3: eat people's faces off?
• 34:51
  Speaker 2: Oh that's bad salts. I don't know what that is,
• 34:55
  Speaker 2: say that one. I don't know. One.
• 34:57
  Speaker 1: ECP is the one where like there was such a
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: moral panic about it because people were like jumping off roofs,
• 35:05
  Speaker 1: and there have been instances where allegedly people have become
• 35:11
  Speaker 1: really aggressive.
• 35:13
  Speaker 3: Do your research, dude, weed trooms and coke. I mean,
• 35:17
  Speaker 3: maybe the coke, I don't know, but like.
• 35:19
  Speaker 2: Yeah, pick a different drug. Yeah, I don't know.
• 35:22
  Speaker 1: I'm just saying I don't because it's obviously not true.
• 35:25
  Speaker 1: It also really doesn't matter because all three of those
• 35:28
  Speaker 1: still wouldn't.
• 35:29
  Speaker 2: It doesn't, It doesn't. Fuck you still did it?
• 35:31
  Speaker 3: Yeah?
• 35:31
  Speaker 2: Yeah, No.
• 35:32
  Speaker 1: Here's the thing is, even if they believe that nonsense,
• 35:36
  Speaker 1: I mean, now you just copped to, you know, being
• 35:38
  Speaker 1: under the influence, which really is neither here nor there.
• 35:42
  Speaker 1: He said he tried to overdose but threw the pills up,
• 35:46
  Speaker 1: which which one of these is pills, I'm sorry, and
• 35:50
  Speaker 1: instead fled to his wife's house, which makes me believe
• 35:54
  Speaker 1: she did not reside in Arkansas, where he hid for
• 35:59
  Speaker 1: a few days. As for his wife, Monette Tyler Warren,
• 36:04
  Speaker 1: she was later convicted of embezzling twenty four five hundred
• 36:08
  Speaker 1: dollars from her credit union where she worked. That's it, yeah,
• 36:13
  Speaker 1: And I will say, I know, my girl game higher.
• 36:18
  Speaker 2: You know, if you're gonna get caught, is not.
• 36:23
  Speaker 1: Even going to cover your legal face. I don't know,
• 36:27
  Speaker 1: I don't know how much.
• 36:28
  Speaker 2: We don't do crime, but like also, if you're going
• 36:30
  Speaker 2: to do crime, you know what I mean?
• 36:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah, kind of like wow, was it worth it? That
• 36:38
  Speaker 1: was a rhetorical question, because no, no, nor okay. So
• 36:43
  Speaker 1: this is the part that I actually kind of hate,
• 36:45
  Speaker 1: and I remember seeing this in real time. I remember
• 36:49
  Speaker 1: seeing and it's harder to find kind of some of
• 36:53
  Speaker 1: the icky sentiment now, but there were some. There was
• 36:59
  Speaker 1: some chattering. It was a little bit like a reddit.
• 37:02
  Speaker 1: Oh okay, it was a little bit like a subreddit
• 37:06
  Speaker 1: for a minute there about this, because prosecutors say the
• 37:12
  Speaker 1: money was transferred to an account controlled by Miche, allegedly
• 37:17
  Speaker 1: at Warren's direction. So essentially what happened is like kind
• 37:24
  Speaker 1: of early days. There was speculation at certain points about like,
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: oh is this some sort of conspiracy and like oh okay,
• 37:34
  Speaker 1: even that classic just super gross kind of narrative forming
• 37:40
  Speaker 1: about like oh, well, she's just a person of color
• 37:44
  Speaker 1: who like stole, So like she's less dead now her
• 37:47
  Speaker 1: and her child don't matter because they may or may
• 37:52
  Speaker 1: not have been involved in some sort of a criminal act, which,
• 37:56
  Speaker 1: by the way, let's just say so so clearly that
• 38:03
  Speaker 1: even if she had been the mastermind of it, not
• 38:07
  Speaker 1: less dead. This is a child. Also, she is so
• 38:13
  Speaker 1: clearly a victim of an abusive relationship. Do you think
• 38:19
  Speaker 1: that was her choice.
• 38:21
  Speaker 3: Right, he's contacting her from prison with a no contact order, like.
• 38:26
  Speaker 2: And some of this stuff.
• 38:27
  Speaker 1: I get why these points are brought up, and why
• 38:31
  Speaker 1: you know, before we know maybe that they're dead, before
• 38:35
  Speaker 1: we know all of the backstory. You might go, ooh,
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: that doesn't look good. Yeah, But in hindsight, I'm like, Okay,
• 38:45
  Speaker 1: let's pretend it's Gabby for a minute, right, Yeah, what
• 38:49
  Speaker 1: do you think that reads like?
• 38:50
  Speaker 2: In her case?
• 38:52
  Speaker 1: I just I struggle. I struggle with the framing in
• 38:56
  Speaker 1: this situation because I haven't come right out and said it.
• 39:00
  Speaker 1: But Miche Melendez was a person of color, as was
• 39:05
  Speaker 1: her daughter, obviously, and I don't I don't like the
• 39:10
  Speaker 1: characterization in some instances, yeah, related to a crime that
• 39:18
  Speaker 1: somebody else was committing. I mean, to be clear, there's
• 39:22
  Speaker 1: no money for her to then, you know, be the
• 39:26
  Speaker 1: receiver of without somebody else having embezzled it.
• 39:30
  Speaker 3: Right, And like did she like obviously I don't know
• 39:32
  Speaker 3: if we know, but like, did she even know about
• 39:35
  Speaker 3: this or was it just put in her name?
• 39:37
  Speaker 1: It's hard to say.
• 39:38
  Speaker 2: It's hard to say.
• 39:39
  Speaker 1: I don't know that that was ever determined. And again
• 39:42
  Speaker 1: she did who fucking cares not less dead.
• 39:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, not less dead. Maybe that's the T shirt I want. Yeah.
• 39:52
  Speaker 1: Police officially charged Warren with two counts of first degree
• 39:56
  Speaker 1: murder on March thirty first, which is a a pretty
• 40:00
  Speaker 1: quick turnaround. I was gonna say, wait a minute, Mart,
• 40:04
  Speaker 1: it's we're still still in March.
• 40:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 40:07
  Speaker 1: In April, the prosecution stated they would pursue aggravated murder
• 40:14
  Speaker 1: punishable by life without parole, but this case never made
• 40:18
  Speaker 1: it to trial.
• 40:21
  Speaker 2: Excuse me, yeah, which.
• 40:23
  Speaker 1: Is actually it's one of the few positive surprises. Maybe
• 40:29
  Speaker 1: months later, in September, just days before the trial, Warren
• 40:34
  Speaker 1: changed his plea to guilty, well sort of, for the
• 40:38
  Speaker 1: second degree murder for mache an aggravated murder of Leila.
• 40:44
  Speaker 1: He entered an alfred plea for first degree child molestation.
• 40:51
  Speaker 1: For anyone unfamiliar with the term, and alfred plea essentially
• 40:54
  Speaker 1: allows a defendant to maintain their innocence but assert that
• 40:59
  Speaker 1: the state has enough evidence to obtain a conviction.
• 41:03
  Speaker 3: I know I've heard the term before, and I don't
• 41:05
  Speaker 3: know where. I don't know if it was from you or.
• 41:08
  Speaker 1: I think probably one of the better known examples of
• 41:13
  Speaker 1: sort of this strategy, at least legally not at all.
• 41:19
  Speaker 1: The same situation, obviously is in the West Memphis three.
• 41:25
  Speaker 2: Okay, so.
• 41:27
  Speaker 1: Super, in my opinion, not a guilty person, but someone
• 41:34
  Speaker 1: who has ultimately decided that I just don't want to
• 41:38
  Speaker 1: die in prison.
• 41:40
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I think.
• 41:44
  Speaker 1: In this case, I'm not sure that the finer points
• 41:46
  Speaker 1: of an Alfred plea would matter much to his potential
• 41:51
  Speaker 1: new roommates. But I can see why that strategy might
• 41:55
  Speaker 1: have made sense for someone facing the charges in potential
• 41:59
  Speaker 1: sentence that he was. Again, Super, don't think his new
• 42:04
  Speaker 1: roommates are gonna be swayed by the fact that it
• 42:08
  Speaker 1: was an Alfred plea.
• 42:09
  Speaker 2: I think I kind of forgot about that. Yeah, I
• 42:12
  Speaker 2: think it's the thing.
• 42:13
  Speaker 1: I think if they know what you were charged with,
• 42:17
  Speaker 1: good luck with that. At sentencing, the courtroom was packed. Family,
• 42:22
  Speaker 1: friends and supporters wearing shirts with Miche and Laylah's photos
• 42:28
  Speaker 1: were present. The judge said, the air in this courtroom
• 42:32
  Speaker 1: hangs heavy with the imponderable suffering of the family and
• 42:36
  Speaker 1: friends of the victims. Warren declined to speak, and he showed,
• 42:42
  Speaker 1: I mean really no emotion as he was led away.
• 42:46
  Speaker 1: Every single photo of this man is stone fucking cold.
• 42:52
  Speaker 3: I don't know that i'd want to see like anything else,
• 42:55
  Speaker 3: because it's like it would feel like disingenuous, almost like
• 42:59
  Speaker 3: you've killed this person. So I don't want to see
• 43:00
  Speaker 3: fucking emotion from you.
• 43:02
  Speaker 2: I don't know. Yeah, I don't know. There's no good
• 43:04
  Speaker 2: way to see that.
• 43:06
  Speaker 1: I guess no, But I think it really cements that
• 43:11
  Speaker 1: I just don't think that there's remorse.
• 43:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 43:14
  Speaker 1: Officer Tanya Wolstein read family statements. Layla's last moments were
• 43:21
  Speaker 1: filled with fear and suffering that no child should experience,
• 43:28
  Speaker 1: so she also read statements at at a vigil for
• 43:35
  Speaker 1: both of them. I felt like seeing the photos of
• 43:40
  Speaker 1: her at the vigil, it was really hard to see
• 43:44
  Speaker 1: someone who I'm sure you know through the course of
• 43:46
  Speaker 1: this investigation. You know, it's like she feels like she
• 43:50
  Speaker 1: knows them, But to see pictures from the vigil, it
• 43:54
  Speaker 1: was just such a it's hard to even put into words.
• 43:57
  Speaker 1: You could just really see how deeply affected people were
• 44:03
  Speaker 1: by this case. And there were so many people showing
• 44:06
  Speaker 1: up to these to the vigil, and you know in
• 44:10
  Speaker 1: the courtroom that it's like they don't know them personally,
• 44:14
  Speaker 1: but the impact of this case. Laylah's father Javonte Stewart said,
• 44:21
  Speaker 1: the impacts of their death have left me and others
• 44:24
  Speaker 1: here today struggling to find a way forward, and the
• 44:28
  Speaker 1: grief is something I carry with me every moment of
• 44:31
  Speaker 1: my life. This case had touched a lot of lives,
• 44:35
  Speaker 1: people that knew the victims, and like I said, I
• 44:39
  Speaker 1: mean many that hadn't. In twenty twenty two, the CDC
• 44:44
  Speaker 1: reported that over half of female homicide victims were killed
• 44:48
  Speaker 1: by current or former partners, over half over half. And
• 44:54
  Speaker 1: this is where we get the phrase it's always the husband.
• 44:59
  Speaker 2: That's what I was thinking and husband did.
• 45:02
  Speaker 1: And according to the National Network to End Domestic Violence,
• 45:07
  Speaker 1: one in three women killed by intimate partners had reached
• 45:11
  Speaker 1: out to police or services beforehand. That breaks my heart.
• 45:16
  Speaker 1: This wasn't a system error. This was a system pattern.
• 45:21
  Speaker 1: And as much as there were things that we can
• 45:25
  Speaker 1: all point to and say this is the part of
• 45:28
  Speaker 1: the system that we hate and we don't understand and
• 45:31
  Speaker 1: it needs to be better, ultimately we can't really lay
• 45:35
  Speaker 1: this at the feet of the system either, because for
• 45:40
  Speaker 1: all the things that we have in place to try
• 45:43
  Speaker 1: to prevent these things, there are just probably always going
• 45:48
  Speaker 1: to be people that do things like this also related
• 45:54
  Speaker 1: to the murder that occurred in Arkansas on April twenty third,
• 46:03
  Speaker 1: twenty twenty three. A fugitive warrant for his arrest was issued,
• 46:10
  Speaker 1: which as I was writing this, this particular part of
• 46:16
  Speaker 1: the story, it was on April twenty third, twenty twenty five.
• 46:25
  Speaker 3: What.
• 46:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And I'd.
• 46:27
  Speaker 1: Already spent a good chunk of time on this case.
• 46:32
  Speaker 1: But I was like, Oh, that's fucking spooky.
• 46:36
  Speaker 2: That is so weird.
• 46:39
  Speaker 1: Looking at this like through the month of April and
• 46:44
  Speaker 1: seeing all of these parallels to like months just very
• 46:48
  Speaker 1: recently gone by, and then also finding stuff that related
• 46:54
  Speaker 1: to like the crime stats from the report related to
• 46:59
  Speaker 1: Bebyruh and May, and it just felt like it was
• 47:03
  Speaker 1: like this like chunk of time in recent history. It
• 47:09
  Speaker 1: was like everything felt like, oh my god, this is
• 47:12
  Speaker 1: like two years to the day later, the whole timeline.
• 47:19
  Speaker 2: Oooh spooky. I don't know.
• 47:23
  Speaker 3: It gave me chills. And this is only April. What
• 47:26
  Speaker 3: what's today twenty April twenty six.
• 47:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 47:29
  Speaker 1: I don't really have an eloquent way to end this.
• 47:35
  Speaker 1: I'm going to read this next statement and then we'll
• 47:40
  Speaker 1: move on to something that feels a little less heavy, Well,
• 47:43
  Speaker 1: we'll do our tiro. If you or someone you know
• 47:46
  Speaker 1: is experiencing domestic violence, please don't wait. Help us available.
• 47:52
  Speaker 1: You can call the National Domestic Violence Hotline at one
• 47:56
  Speaker 1: eight hundred seven nine to nine safe that's seven two
• 48:00
  Speaker 1: three three, text start to eight eight seven eight eight,
• 48:05
  Speaker 1: or visit the hotline dot org for twenty four to
• 48:08
  Speaker 1: seven confidential support. You are not alone and you deserve
• 48:12
  Speaker 1: to be safe.
• 48:14
  Speaker 2: I don't know why that.
• 48:16
  Speaker 1: Like really fucks me up.
• 48:17
  Speaker 2: It does.
• 48:18
  Speaker 3: It's the whole time though you're that you're saying that,
• 48:21
  Speaker 3: I'm thinking, like there are some people who can't even
• 48:25
  Speaker 3: do that, Like they don't even feel safe enough to
• 48:27
  Speaker 3: do that, or they're so like watched that they can't
• 48:31
  Speaker 3: text a line or fucking like call a hot line
• 48:34
  Speaker 3: or something like.
• 48:34
  Speaker 2: It's yeah, and it's so scary.
• 48:37
  Speaker 1: We've talked about cases where you know where that is
• 48:41
  Speaker 1: the situation, and I think it's always really hard with
• 48:47
  Speaker 1: cases that involve domestic violence because people don't understand sometimes
• 48:52
  Speaker 1: how coeresive and controlling and manipulative those situations be.
• 49:01
  Speaker 3: And they just it's not like they just like spring
• 49:03
  Speaker 3: on you either, they like now row on you, and
• 49:05
  Speaker 3: they to where you're like, you don't even realize half
• 49:08
  Speaker 3: the time, like what's happening? You don't really realize it.
• 49:13
  Speaker 1: No, it's the pots slowly heating up before it's boiling, right.
• 49:20
  Speaker 1: I think we'll probably try to put that in the show.
• 49:23
  Speaker 2: Notes as well.
• 49:24
  Speaker 3: Well.
• 49:25
  Speaker 2: Should we do some harrow? I think we should. Okay,
• 49:36
  Speaker 2: all yours, My energy is in there. Okay, she is
• 49:41
  Speaker 2: shuffling the deck. I won't tell you.
• 49:44
  Speaker 3: What she just did off camera. Her hair is a
• 49:47
  Speaker 3: beautiful rose gold. Last time, you were like, her hair
• 49:53
  Speaker 3: is a beautiful chestnut.
• 49:57
  Speaker 2: To me because I was like, describe what I'm you're
• 50:00
  Speaker 2: read that sounds like it was great. I loved it.
• 50:08
  Speaker 3: We get this one all the time. Oh my goodness, Okay,
• 50:12
  Speaker 3: seven of swords I forget. Okay for some people who
• 50:16
  Speaker 3: may not listen all the time. We are using our
• 50:18
  Speaker 3: P and W deck, which is not a traditional tarot deck,
• 50:22
  Speaker 3: so the imagery is a little bit different on it,
• 50:24
  Speaker 3: and I feel like sometimes we just kind of start
• 50:26
  Speaker 3: talking about it and we don't say, like, hey, this
• 50:29
  Speaker 3: is the P and W the way we're using. Because
• 50:32
  Speaker 3: we also have a YouTube now which shows our altar
• 50:34
  Speaker 3: and everything and the cards we're using, So sometimes we
• 50:38
  Speaker 3: just kind of assume you can see it and then
• 50:40
  Speaker 3: we don't explain what's going on.
• 50:43
  Speaker 1: Listen, if you want to know what's going on, then
• 50:45
  Speaker 1: I we're sorry.
• 50:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we faking don't know what's happening. Ever, I don't know.
• 50:53
  Speaker 1: So seven of swords. Our keywords are uncertainty, illusion, impetuousness, stealth, cunning,
• 51:06
  Speaker 1: and strategy.
• 51:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's got that little fox on it. So that's
• 51:10
  Speaker 2: like the weasel. So I always called a fox, it's
• 51:14
  Speaker 2: a weasel.
• 51:14
  Speaker 1: It does kind of look like a fox at a glance, though.
• 51:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 51:18
  Speaker 3: The weasels stealing eggs out of a robin's nest such
• 51:22
  Speaker 3: a dick move.
• 51:23
  Speaker 2: Which is like kind of like what he did a
• 51:26
  Speaker 2: little bit. Yeah. Yeah.
• 51:27
  Speaker 1: The imagery for me baby a baby from a nest
• 51:32
  Speaker 1: basically great. Literally Okay. Some decks, including the Writer, Weaight Smith, Aquarian,
• 51:40
  Speaker 1: and Gilded Tarot, show a man carrying carrying away five swords,
• 51:46
  Speaker 1: leaving two stuck in the ground beside him behind him.
• 51:51
  Speaker 1: Excuse me, wow, reading is hard. When this card appears,
• 51:56
  Speaker 1: it suggests you're facing a challenge or problem and must
• 51:59
  Speaker 1: you caution to overcome potential danger. The Upright seven suggests
• 52:06
  Speaker 1: a tricky situation in which things are not completely clear.
• 52:10
  Speaker 1: You may be formulating a plan but don't have all
• 52:13
  Speaker 1: the information you need, or the plan may be risky
• 52:17
  Speaker 1: and could backfire. This card can represent surreptitious action and
• 52:23
  Speaker 1: advises diplomacy. I feel like in this situation that really
• 52:30
  Speaker 1: what is diplomacy. I mean, it's kind of like trying
• 52:33
  Speaker 1: to make peace and trying to be I mean, trying
• 52:37
  Speaker 1: to be a peacemaker. But the surreptitious action that's what
• 52:43
  Speaker 1: gets me, because it's like, how can you adequately be
• 52:48
  Speaker 1: the peacemaker in a situation where people are behaving in
• 52:53
  Speaker 1: ways that are underhanded, that are manipulative.
• 52:59
  Speaker 2: You can't. I mean you can try, you can try.
• 53:03
  Speaker 1: In a reading about money, the seven warns that you
• 53:06
  Speaker 1: probably shouldn't go ahead with a financial idea or investment
• 53:10
  Speaker 1: you're considering, like embezzlement. Oh, perhaps the risks are too
• 53:17
  Speaker 1: high or the deal may be shaky or shady.
• 53:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah, like embezzlement twenty four twenty four hundred thousand, twenty
• 53:26
  Speaker 2: four thousand.
• 53:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah, twenty four thousand, five hundred.
• 53:31
  Speaker 2: While and fifty six. Oh my god, Sands.
• 53:39
  Speaker 1: If the reading is about your job, this card says,
• 53:42
  Speaker 1: don't engage indirect confrontation, work behind the scenes to get results.
• 53:50
  Speaker 1: The upright seven can also indicate restlessness. Perhaps your job
• 53:55
  Speaker 1: lacks the diversity or stimulation you desire. Consider making a
• 54:01
  Speaker 1: in a reading about love your advice to seek compromise
• 54:04
  Speaker 1: and use diplomacy rather than arguing with a partner. But
• 54:09
  Speaker 1: don't just go along to get along.
• 54:12
  Speaker 3: Oh wow, that was for sure. When she took back
• 54:18
  Speaker 3: her statement about that, was it a shooting, like he
• 54:21
  Speaker 3: like shot somebody or something?
• 54:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it was.
• 54:24
  Speaker 1: Well, I mean, it's unclear to me, at least in
• 54:28
  Speaker 1: my research, what exactly or who exactly he may have
• 54:33
  Speaker 1: been firing upon. But given the fact that he was
• 54:38
  Speaker 1: charged for essentially what amounts to like drive.
• 54:42
  Speaker 2: By Oh Jesus, I don't know.
• 54:47
  Speaker 1: And to be honest, I don't know that it adds
• 54:50
  Speaker 1: a lot of value to the case, which should be
• 54:53
  Speaker 1: centered on the victims. That I was like, listen, I
• 54:58
  Speaker 1: can pull at this thread, but it's not about that. Yeah,
• 55:02
  Speaker 1: and it doesn't work, It doesn't change.
• 55:06
  Speaker 3: But a totally like reminds me of that. How she
• 55:08
  Speaker 3: like re recount recounted her statement, is that what ThEC
• 55:12
  Speaker 3: recan't Yeah, that's not the right word.
• 55:14
  Speaker 2: Recanted her statement.
• 55:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah, recounting is like almost like recollection. Yeah, yeah, there's
• 55:21
  Speaker 1: similar words leave me alone. They are I mean the
• 55:24
  Speaker 1: they sound alike. Sometimes this card shows leaving a relationship
• 55:32
  Speaker 1: that doesn't meet your intellectual or spiritual needs.
• 55:36
  Speaker 2: I don't think he met any of her needs. Oh
• 55:39
  Speaker 2: my god.
• 55:40
  Speaker 1: Extra excerpt is uh, focus, be focused and thorough in
• 55:45
  Speaker 1: planning your strategy. As Barbara Moore writes in The Gilded Tarot, companion,
• 55:52
  Speaker 1: be on guard or one of those sorts he left
• 55:56
  Speaker 1: behind will find its way into his Oh right.
• 56:04
  Speaker 3: And he basically like he left enough evidence to get
• 56:08
  Speaker 3: himself convicted.
• 56:10
  Speaker 2: Yep. Wow.
• 56:12
  Speaker 1: And do you know, Okay, listen, maybe this is irresponsible
• 56:16
  Speaker 1: to actually vocalize, but I will say, leaving behind the
• 56:24
  Speaker 1: forensic evidence that leads to an Alfred plea for what
• 56:30
  Speaker 1: you did to a child, that's one way to get shanked.
• 56:36
  Speaker 1: He's not dead yet, though, is he Nope? Not to
• 56:41
  Speaker 1: my knowledge. I feel like that would have made the news.
• 56:46
  Speaker 1: There's one more extra excerpt. Okay, his holiness, the fourteenth
• 56:53
  Speaker 1: Dalai Lama tragedy should be utilized as a source of strength,
• 57:00
  Speaker 1: no matter what sort of difficulties, how painful experience is.
• 57:05
  Speaker 1: If we lose our hope, that's our real disaster.
• 57:11
  Speaker 2: I feel like that's just like really hits just in
• 57:15
  Speaker 2: general right now for the world.
• 57:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I feel like talking about this through the lens
• 57:23
  Speaker 1: of you know, the political landscape recently and thinking about
• 57:29
  Speaker 1: how quickly certain populations, basically anyone who's not white, cis male,
• 57:37
  Speaker 1: could be set back essentially fifty five years.
• 57:41
  Speaker 2: That's just a really important sentiment right now.
• 57:45
  Speaker 3: I know I've read the little interpretation from the book
• 57:50
  Speaker 3: that comes with the PNW deck. Let me just see,
• 57:53
  Speaker 3: because you never know, even though you've read something a
• 57:56
  Speaker 3: thousand times, like there still could be like a part
• 57:58
  Speaker 3: or a word that just totally This is why we
• 58:02
  Speaker 3: pull the same card all the time because we have
• 58:04
  Speaker 3: the same type of theme. Maybe. I mean, if the
• 58:08
  Speaker 3: shoe fits Cinderella, so it's an Olympic short tailed weasel,
• 58:14
  Speaker 3: so that's isn't like Olympic Olympia associated yeah with like Washington. Yeah, ooh,
• 58:19
  Speaker 3: we did. We have read this so recently. Listen, everybody's
• 58:23
  Speaker 3: got to eat.
• 58:24
  Speaker 2: And I feel like when we were talking about this,
• 58:26
  Speaker 2: we were kind of talking about the same sort.
• 58:28
  Speaker 1: Of themes I'm in who would have sunk?
• 58:30
  Speaker 3: Right?
• 58:33
  Speaker 2: It ain't my fault.
• 58:34
  Speaker 3: Mom and Papa Robin decided to fly off at the
• 58:37
  Speaker 3: same time. Oh god, See, I wouldn't call that a
• 58:41
  Speaker 3: wise decision. I know they're not gonna want to hear this,
• 58:44
  Speaker 3: but when you think about it, this one's on them.
• 58:48
  Speaker 2: Look at how nature works.
• 58:50
  Speaker 3: It's opportunistic, and I know an opportunity when I see it.
• 58:55
  Speaker 3: That's like typical fucking oh god, abusive manipulator.
• 59:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah shit.
• 59:01
  Speaker 3: Anyway, if I didn't swipe these eggs, somebody else would have.
• 59:05
  Speaker 3: Anybody could have been waiting in the leaves, still in
• 59:07
  Speaker 3: silent as death, watching that nest all afternoon and still
• 59:12
  Speaker 3: in silent as death.
• 59:13
  Speaker 2: It's just oh, I hate it.
• 59:16
  Speaker 3: Anybody could have deftly climbed the tallest tree, swung out
• 59:20
  Speaker 3: on the rickety bough, and dive neatly into the nest
• 59:24
  Speaker 3: cup without so much as scuffing a single delicious egg.
• 59:28
  Speaker 3: I mean, eggs in this economy, don't be stuffing that
• 59:32
  Speaker 3: bitches them bitches. So what if I got there first?
• 59:35
  Speaker 3: Don't blame me for playing a game and winning. What
• 59:38
  Speaker 3: do you want me to do?
• 59:39
  Speaker 2: Starve? So it just like you let me out of jail,
• 59:43
  Speaker 2: like that's your fault.
• 59:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean and yes, yes and no, yes,
• 59:49
  Speaker 1: yes and no.
• 59:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah. It's really yucky and I hate it. I know,
• 59:57
  Speaker 2: having creepy last day. We'll see you next Tuesday. Scrambled
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 2: eggs anyone? Goal for it?
• 1:00:23
  Speaker 1: Nya Ham, you missed my hilarious sports and joint.
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 2: What did you say? You said go for it?
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah, because when you said go for it, it sounds
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 1: like goal for it.
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 2: And I was so I.
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 1: Said goal for it, like goal like a like a goalie. Yeah,
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 1: And I was like, goal for it. Maya Ham, I
• 1:00:45
  Speaker 1: don't know what that means.
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 3: She's a soccer player. Oh I don't soccer. I barely
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 3: know her. I am a dad on the inside. Okay,
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 3: oh my gos