Latest / Clear Admit MBA Admissions Podcast / MBA Wire Taps 354—Low GPA, LATAM. Low GPA, strong GMAT. London Business School vs Fuqua.

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MBA Wire Taps 354—Low GPA, LATAM. Low GPA, strong GMAT. London Business School vs Fuqua. · Clear Admit MBA Admissions Podcast

• 0:16
  Speaker A: Welcome to the clear admit MBA admissions podcast. I'm Graham Richmond, and this is your wiretaps for Monday, May 27, 2024. I'm joined by Alex Brown from Cornwall, England. Alex, how are things going this week?
• 0:28
  Speaker B: Very good. Thank you, Graham.
• 0:29
  Speaker A: So, yeah, I guess. Well, one thing we didn't talk about is that last week when we recorded, I was in Chicago, but we hadn't done all the events and things that clear admitted organizes. Big NBA fair. And so I just wanted to let everyone know in case you were curious. It went really well. We had a lot of fun. Crazy story, Alex. There were a couple of candidates, at least, that I ran into that came from far away to come to the event. Somebody from Vancouver, somebody from LA. So it was like a destination type event. We drew some people from far and wide, and obviously a ton of people from Chicago, which was great.
• 1:06
  Speaker B: Yeah, no, that's absolutely brilliant. And like you say, it's a big milestone in the history of clear admit. It's our first in person event, and I think, judging by our meeting yesterday, we might be planning a similar event next year.
• 1:20
  Speaker A: So.
• 1:21
  Speaker B: Absolutely fantastic.
• 1:22
  Speaker A: Yeah, it was really a lot of fun. And I do stay tuned. If you're a regular listener of the show, I think we're gonna have some audio from the panels that we did at the event. I need to get the sign off from the panelists, because I don't want to publish anything without their permission. But we did record audio from these sessions. We did. And they were sessions about, like, how to, you know, how to apply to business school admissions tips and, you know, even some stuff about, like, return on investment. Why get an MBA? And we had great panelists. I mean, there were a whole bunch of schools that took part. So I've got the audio. We're working on that with Dennis, our producer. And. Yeah. So stay tuned. There may be some bonus content coming into the feed here shortly.
• 2:00
  Speaker B: I put you on the spot, Graeme. Anything you learned from these panels or anything that surprised you?
• 2:06
  Speaker A: I mean, yeah, I did learn that. Well, I learned a lot about strategy consulting because we did a panel with a guy from Bain who's the head of recruiting in Chicago for Bain, and it just was interesting to learn. So, for example, they do look at a test. If you have a test score, and you did well, like, on one of the standardized tests, the guy was like, put it on your resume, like, let us know about it. And so they don't require it, but they will look. And that does imply to me that having a strong score on the test is not a bad thing because we often talk about that. So there's another thing. If you're doing waivers, you don't have that to then submit if you want to go MBB or something. So I don't know. That was just kind of an interesting tidbit. Otherwise, I mean, gosh.
• 2:48
  Speaker B: Yeah. Did the schools talk about waivers?
• 2:52
  Speaker A: We talked about it a little bit. Although, frankly, the panel that I did where we talked about academics, I think there was maybe only one school on the panel that allowed for waivers. So it's not consistent. Right. Some schools don't have it and some schools do. There was a lot of discussion about how this was interesting, actually. There was discussion around how sometimes something that's really outsized, great in one area could influence something that's not so great in another. And what I mean by that is I'd always thought, well, with academics, you need, if you have a great GMAT and a great GPA, you tick that box. If you don't, you need to take steps academically to show strength. But I can't remember who it was. One of the panels was talking about how, look, sometimes somebody's academic profile may not be amazing, but if they have insane work experience and started a company or lots of promotions, that can kind of, you can gain points there and make up for it a bit. And so I'd always come from the space of, like, well, to make up on academics, you need to do academic related stuff. So I don't know what you think about that, Alex. It was just kind of interesting.
• 3:59
  Speaker B: Yeah. I mean, I can understand that perspective, but I also understand our perspective. If your weakness is in a particular area, how to fix it most directly is focus on that particular area.
• 4:11
  Speaker A: Right. So, yeah, no, I think that's probably an extreme case.
• 4:16
  Speaker B: Yeah, I guess my point is, I think both arguments stand. They're not mutually exclusive.
• 4:20
  Speaker A: Yeah, that's fair. So, anyways, we had a great time. Stay tuned for some audio and maybe additional podcast episodes as a result. But, Alex, what's going on right now? Because you were telling me before we came on air that there's still some admissions activity that we've got happening in the weeks ahead here.
• 4:37
  Speaker B: Yeah. For those that are in college targeting deferred enrolment, Wharton is releasing its interview decisions next week. I think Harvard, too, either next week or the week after. And we also have a couple of final decision releases, one from McDonough and one from Johnson for their regular rounds. So there is still some activity. And quite frankly, Graham, and again, we discussed this a little bit in our meeting yesterday, we're still seeing activity from waitlist folks. Yeah, probably a bit more so than I would have anticipated or year on year as it relates to last year. So those that are still on the waitlist, I don't think it's over yet.
• 5:25
  Speaker A: I agree. Yeah. Lots of movement. So yeah, it's just interesting to see that. And, oh, another thing I forgot to mention is that this Wednesday we're doing another event. So I've been in the kind of the fog of travels and stuff, but we're doing a virtual event this Wednesday, May 29 at noon Eastern. And that's an application overview event, which is we sit down with schools and talk about their application process. And so we've got Carnegie Mellon, Columbia, Wharton, InSead and LBs joining us this Wednesday. You can sign up at bit ly Caspringwebinars. And we're doing one that's going to be the last one in this series. It was actually a series of three. But I do want to mention that in the summer, I think in July, we do what we call our essay insights series, where we get really into the kind of nitty gritty of writing essays and talking again with guests from schools. So admissions directors from all the top schools, and I think Mike on our team has been working on that series, and I think it's already booked out or very close. So we're gonna have a lot of schools this summer as we do, I think, three or four of those events. So stay tuned for more on that.
• 6:31
  Speaker B: Very good.
• 6:32
  Speaker A: Over on the website, we did an admissions tip about background checks. This is, you know, schools like to verify the information as you, you know, if you're gonna matriculate, they will run a background check on you. A lot of these top schools do. And they hire a third party service. Sometimes they pass that cost along to you as part of your matriculation, circulation, and they'll check your employment date, salary, they may check in with your recommenders, verify your transcripts, all that stuff. So we have a tip on how to manage that process and how it works in case that's worrying to some. The main thing I want to just convey is that if they find an anomaly, it's not as though you're automatically rejected. Usually they'll come to you and say, hey, this date seems different, or this figure isn't the same. Can you just explain? And so they're not trying to kick you out or anything, but they do check this stuff. It's important to know that. I think it's also important for people who are listening to the show who are going to be applying to know that you gotta be honest in your applications, because when you get in, they usually verify some of this stuff.
• 7:34
  Speaker B: Yeah, no, absolutely. And it's all about intent. So as long as there was no intent to mislead, you're gonna be absolutely fine.
• 7:42
  Speaker A: Exactly. We continue with our real human series. We caught up with Jordan, who went to Duke, graduated in 22, and works at Pfizer as a senior manager. Jordan is from Wakarusa, Indiana, which I had not heard of, but I just wanted to say Wakarusa on the podcast and had been working in nonprofit and higher ed prior to business school and ended up doing like, a marketing rotation program at Pfizer before kind of landing in the senior manager role. Cause again, graduating in 22. They've been a couple years now employed there. And we asked Jordan, what's one thing you would absolutely do again as part of the job search? And I thought this was a really interesting point. Jordan says, make real connections to people, not just transactional ones. Getting to know a person as a person and not just as a reference for a role helps you understand the motivations of people working at that company and whether or not it's a good fit. So, Alex, I think that's really well said and great advice.
• 8:42
  Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely brilliant. So, you know, how many connections are you gonna make during your business school experience? I mean, obviously, you've got the opportunity for a huge network, but those who are. Who are going to be those meaningful relationships that you cultivate and, you know, I know personally, I wasn't at Wharton. I worked there. But even, you know, for myself, I mean, you went to Wharton, I'm still working for you. Elliot went to war. Now still working for Elliot. All my other jobs are because of folks that I met at Wharton.
• 9:17
  Speaker A: Yeah, that's a good point.
• 9:18
  Speaker B: So it's absolutely, absolutely vital.
• 9:21
  Speaker A: Yeah. So, anyway, great advice from Jordan. We also caught up with Martina, who's a Columbia grad, works at Amazon as a senior product manager in their generative AI guild. I guess that's like their generative AI division. Martina is actually from upper Derby, Pa. So shout out to the Philly suburbs there. Worked in entertainment and health tech before business school. And we asked Martina, what's one thing you would absolutely do again as part of the job search? And this was kind of interesting. Martina says, fuel your moonshot with networking. So moonshot, meaning your dream job with networking and interview prep, whether it's banking consulting or mama, which, by the way, I guess, is the new acronym for Meta. Apple, Microsoft, Amazon and Alphabet. I hadn't, hadn't heard that, but. Or something just more bespoke. Make sure that your moonshot job is your top priority. Hit the ground running once you're on campus by setting up coffee chats, volunteering to host industry events as a member of relevant career clubs, and unearthing as many interview prep resources as possible. Do not, I repeat, do not try to recruit for banking, consulting and big tech all at once. Vision, passion and tenacity applied to a single industry will pay dividends in the interview process. So, Alex, we always say that, like going to business school with kind of a plan, you can't do it all.
• 10:42
  Speaker B: Yeah, I can't believe someone from upper Derby skipped Wharton to go to Columbia.
• 10:46
  Speaker A: Yeah, well, so in her defense, I think she was living in New York before business school and stayed in New York to go there. But yeah, that was a thought I had. I was wondering about that. And then last but not least, we caught up with Noah, who went to booth and graduated in 23 and works at Xbox, I guess. And the job title is growth and content demand. Noah hails from Montreal and Houston, I guess had lived in both places before business school and had done corporate finance at ExxonMobil as well as brand finance at Nestle before attending Booth. We asked why Booth like, what factors led you to Booth and Noah? She gave us three reasons, she said. First, Booth is renowned for its focus on data and analytics across every discipline, including in marketing and strategy. Second, the booth community. I spoke to several students and alumni during the application process and took note of how deeply ingrained the pay it forward mentality is at Booth. And lastly, it's Chicago. There are few cities in the world that can compete with Chicago's food scene architecture and down to earth culture. As a photographer and deep admirer of Vivian Mayer's work and a city walker, living in Chicago has been a dream come true. So I thought that was kind of interesting to hear, especially because I was just in Chicago. And I will say it is a giant city. I mean, it's a great city and I'd been there just once or twice in the past on short trips, but it was really interesting. I noted this kind of down to earth culture that Noah describes. Like, the people are nice, which is kind of unusual in a big city.
• 12:24
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 12:24
  Speaker A: So I don't know. I don't know what you think about London comparatively, but I guess, and I don't know, people in London are pretty nice.
• 12:29
  Speaker B: Yeah. I mean, I'm a huge fan of London, but, no, that's really good to hear.
• 12:34
  Speaker A: So, lots of positive things to say about Booth. A couple more things then we can get into our candidates. The first is that UCLA Anderson published their career report, and it's a little bit later. I mean, most of these we're covering on the podcast back at the beginning of the year, I guess, is when they often come out late fall, early, or early winter. But I'll give you the numbers, Alex, and let you react. So they had a median starting salary of 153,000. That's up from 145. 87% of those seeking jobs had an offer within three months of graduation. That figure was a bit higher last year. It was 94%. In terms of the industry placements, 27% to consulting, that's up from 23, 25% to tech, that's down from 34. About 14% went into financial service, that's up a couple points. Consumer products, 9%. Entertainment and media, 8%. Those are very similar to last year. And then for the regional placements with UCLA Anderson grads, 70.8% landed in California, 8.6% went to the northeast, 5.2% landed on the west coast, excluding California, and then 3.4% to the midwest. Same figure for the southwest, 3.5% to the mid Atlantic and 1.9% to the south. Most of these figures are unchanged, although the northeast was up from, like, 5.5% previously to 8.6% this year. So a little bit of a gain there. And they actually went down a bit on California placements from close to 74% down to 70.8. So that. There you have it. Any thoughts on the UCLA Anderson stats?
• 14:18
  Speaker B: Why is it so late?
• 14:19
  Speaker A: I don't know, actually. Why? Yeah, I don't know. I actually. And in their defense, I need to check with our team if it was us or them, because I presume it just wasn't available and that they. I think they published some basic facts and figures early on, but we don't run our stories until we've got all the data, and so we were probably waiting on it. Yeah.
• 14:38
  Speaker B: Because I thought. I thought Columbia got penalized for being.
• 14:41
  Speaker A: Late this year or people were complaining. I know. Yeah. So, so.
• 14:46
  Speaker B: But, yeah, no, the actual data itself is impressive, as always, for these top schools. And. And it's. It's quite clear, if you want to be on the west coast, then the west coast schools are by far and away great options for you. So if 80 some percent of folks stay on the west coast post MBA, you know, if you're using the MBA to get to the west coast. It makes perfect sense. And obviously, a lot of those folks will be from the west coast in the first place. I always wonder about that. It'd be great for these career reports to tease out how many candidates they moved to certain regions rather than returning them to. To the same region.
• 15:33
  Speaker A: Great point.
• 15:33
  Speaker B: I'd love to know that distinction.
• 15:35
  Speaker A: Yeah, that'd be fascinating. Yeah. To see. And even I think some schools do talk about triple jumps, like, so they'll. They. I feel like I can't remember which school it was talked about, what percentage of candidates had changed industry, function and geography. Yeah, that's kind of interesting, too. One last tidbit before we move on to our candidates. Students from Duke Fuqua won a $22,000 prize with the US Department of Energy. There was a competition, and the team that, from Fuqua that won this competition put in a kind of state of the art power generation dispatch tool, which I guess essentially it was an innovative approach that they developed to electric power distribution and how the grid is managed and stuff. So they came up with some cool way of doing this that netted them over $20,000 in prize money. So that's kind of nice to see business school students tackling real world problems.
• 16:30
  Speaker B: Yeah. No, it's brilliant. And especially in such an important sector as climate.
• 16:36
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 16:36
  Speaker B: And power generation and stuff like that. And as we talked about again before we came on our grave, they've got to be looking at tide. Tide is reliable versus wind and solar. So obviously, if you're in Duke Fuqua, you're probably not so focused on tide. But I got the sea about a month, you know, a quarter of a mile from my house. And it boggles my mind how we've not figured out how to capture the energy that the tide presents.
• 17:04
  Speaker A: Yeah, well, I mean, we have, but it's not yet in place in a lot of places. Right? It is. Yeah. It's in the works, I think, but. Yeah, no, but you're right. And it's just interesting to see candidates kind of working on these types of problems and. Yeah. So, as always, if you want to write to Alex and I just write to infolereadmit.com, comma, use the subject line wiretaps. But Alex, let's move on. We have a few candidates to discuss, as always. So should we get into our discussion on that front?
• 17:29
  Speaker B: Let's kick on.
• 17:30
  Speaker A: All right, so this is wiretaps. Candidate number one. Our first candidate is looking to start in the fall of 25 and has eight schools on the target list. Those schools are Columbia, Duke, HEC, Paris, Ese in Spain, London Business School, Kellogg, NYU and UCLA Anderson. They worked in social impact and education prior to business school, and they are looking to get into construction consulting or maybe consumer goods or maybe nonprofit. They seem a little undecided on their post NBA target industry. Their GMAT score was a 710. They have a 6.3 GPA. I believe that's out of ten. And it's. They attended undergrad in Latin America, so I don't know which country, but it's a different scale. They have six years of work experience and they would love to land in either the US, the UK or France after business school. And they mentioned that they're very social impact oriented with a lot of examples of extracurricular and volunteer work in that domain. Actually, their first full time job was at a social impact fund. And then they've had kind of a solid career working with marketing and branding, mostly in the education sector. And two of the companies they've worked for are Nasdaq listed. They claim they have strong leadership skills. They've been leading people for more than four years now in their roles at work. And they mentioned they have a recommender who's a Columbia MBA grad and kind of marketing director at their current employer. And this person also is kind of their career mentor. They say that their undergraduate GPA, that 6.3 is their main concern and that they intend to take MBA math and maybe even give another shot at that GMAT, which was a 710 to improve the Quant score. They wonder if they are aiming too high. What say you, Alex?
• 19:22
  Speaker B: Yeah, the interesting thing about this candidate is this broad sort of geographic desire. They don't mind if they end up in America, the UK, or France. Or France. That presents a challenge, because then it's like, all right, what program should we target? We got to target the best in Europe, the best in, in the US, and not only are they targeting the best in the US, but they're targeting, you know, west coast schools, east coast schools and so on and so forth. So. So that does present a little bit of a challenge. But I like their school choice. I think it's perfectly fine. Again, the worry here is going to be the slightly lower academic profile relative to top candidates applying to these programs. And it looks like they've got really good professional experience and volunteer experience. And as you talked about earlier on the show, Graham, you know, maybe the ADCOM is going to look very favorably on their professional experience. That might help them a little bit on the numbers, but again, I wouldn't rely on that. I would rely on the fact that they really need to figure out what's the best strategy to mitigate their lower GPA relative to the pool and so forth. I'm assuming, although they've got a decent GMAT score, especially for the region, they've got a decent GMAT score. I'm assuming it's slightly light on the quant side because they've talked about retaking the GMAT. If they do retake it, get a slightly higher quant score and get an overall higher GMAT score, that would be fantastic. If they take MBA math in conjunction. I mean, some of it might depend. Why is this GPA relatively low? So what is the context that surrounds the GPA? Is it because they were first to college, took a little while to settle in? Did they have to work during their undergrad, which distracted them a little bit? Were they overly busy? Was there a maturity issue? So it'd be good to know what caused the slightly lower GPA. But mitigating that combination of, well, mitigating the GPA to the extent that they can, seems to be the area that they have most potential impact. I think. I like everything else, they seem like a really interesting person, good person, lots of volunteer work, lots of leadership and so forth. I assume they're applying to Columbia because they said that they've got a. Their recommender is a Columbia MbA. So make sure they apply in the first round for Columbia. But yeah, I think there's a lot to like Graham, they've got to sort out the GPA issue.
• 22:23
  Speaker A: Yeah, I agree. I mean, one of the factors that going to be potentially challenging is that if they take the GMAT again, it's going to be the newer version of the GMAT. So that may require some new prep work because they may be used to the old format because we've now moved into, I believe only the newer version of the test is available. So they've got to think through that and get ready the GPA. Yeah, I would love to have context. I would just love to know, is this like the best school in their home country? And were they in the top 20% of their classes, even with a low GPA? Or did they, like you say, were there extenuating circumstances? Did they have to work or have some personal struggles during one of the years? But the rest of the years are great. So, yeah, just be better to have that context. I think the school selection is okay. I mean, there's a broad base of schools in terms of admissions difficulty. But as you point out, there's also this really broad geography. And I do wonder, in an ideal world, they would decide like, oh, I want to be in the US, or I want to be in the UK or France, because I don't know. It's a wide net to be casting. And I think similarly, they don't fully know what their post NBA goals are. And so if they could spend some time reflecting on that, that may help sort of crystallize where the best place is for them to go. And I would say if they want to be in the UK, France or the US, then maybe they need more than one school in some of those markets. They have more than one in the US, but they only have one school in each of France and the UK. So insead would be another one to think about in France. In the UK, there's obviously Oxford and Cambridge and Imperial Manchester. There are plenty of schools. So they need to think about that. But in a. I do agree with you. The main thing is shoring up the academic profile. And I would take MBA, math or even business fundamentals from GMAC to do that. And then, yeah, if they can get a better score on the test, why not? But otherwise, yeah, interesting candidate, as you say, lots alike. And they have this kind of education tech background. I just want better goals and maybe a little more focus and. Yeah, we'll see how it goes for them. But they have time. They're already working on everything, so that's great.
• 24:30
  Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 24:31
  Speaker A: All right, so let's thank. I want to thank them for their post. Let's move on, though, and talk about wiretaps. Candidate number two, our second candidate this week has eight schools on the target list and wants to start school in the fall of 25. It says 24 here, but I think they mean 25. They've got Berkeley, Columbia, Duke, Michigan, Kellogg, Stern, Chicago and UCLA Anderson on their target list. They have been working in marketing and advertising, and they want to move out into consulting or maybe consumer goods after business school. They took the GMAT recently and got a 695, which is the new version of the test. And for those of you keeping school score at home, that's sort of the equivalent to like a 750 on the old GMAT exam. So very high GMAT score. Their GPA is a 3.0 out of four. They've got five years of work experience. They are located in the US, and they mentioned that they are an american white male, age 27, and they just wondered if we had any input. They said that they had an undergrad in marketing from a decent school, that they have a low GPA 3.0, and they don't really have a great excuse for it. They mentioned they have some D's in classes like film, but got A's in classes like accounting and economics. They did work anywhere from 25 to 40 hours per week every semester to pay for school. They're wondering if that's relevant. And they mentioned they think they could get even higher on the GMAT if we think that's something they could should work on. And they also sort of talked a little bit in their notes about they've done some good extracurriculars and stuff, and they did have to deal with a layoff in their career, though, and they kind of mentioned that. And that led to them kind of jumping roles into kind of new industry. And they just kind of also have this fear about letters of recommendation. Given that the current job, which was this new job they took after getting laid off, it's been like less than a year, and they're sort of worried about how do I ask my boss when I haven't been there for a full year yet? And they're wondering, does that mean, should I just wait a year to apply to school, or what should I do about that? So, Alex, do you want to weigh in on that and also just give your overall assessment of this person's profile?
• 26:51
  Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, I think I'll talk about the rack in a minute. In terms of their overall profile, there's a lot to like here. They've had to overcome a little bit of adversity in terms of their career. So how they articulate that and manage that will be interesting. Obviously, their GMAts says they're really intelligent. Their GPA doesn't. So there's that sort of bit of a disconnect there. So this looks to be someone that, when they have the motivation to do well, can do very well because they are very smart. So the key is to make the ad con.com comfortable that they are motivated and they will do well academically in the program, and they won't flake out on classes just because they don't find them particularly stimulating or interesting or related to their goals or whatever it might be. How do they convince the outcome of that? Well, one is obviously they had to pay for their college, so they can talk a little bit about that. But all this other stuff that they did at college, and I think they did quite a lot of activity, can sort of illustrate that actually other stuff was more important. Than my academics. So that particular message isn't always good. So, you know, obviously doing that other stuff can be very good, but I think it might behoove them to just go do MBA math or something, blow it out of the water, show them that they're now really committed to academics. That to me is their biggest potential downfall is this 3.0 gpA. So it's a tremendous GMAT. I mean, they say if they retook it they get a higher score. I mean it's already a crazy high score. So I think they might get a bit more wrong way out of doing an additional class or MBA math or something in that regard. So, you know, what about their rec? I think their concern, Graeme, is they haven't been in their new role long enough to build the relationship with their recommender to get that really strong recommendation. So if they are developing a positive relationship with their. With their potential recommender, I would really encourage them to sit down, talk to them, get their feedback, see what they think and so forth. Other than that, should they be looking at another recommender? Possibly. If they've got to pick two anyway, they've got to find someone else too. And this can be challenging for, for some candidates. Right. How to get two strong recommendations that are. That if they're not completely current, they've maintained relationships with since they work closely together. So if it's a recommender from a previous employer, that's perfectly fine, but better if they've managed to sort of continue somewhat of a relationship.
• 30:05
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 30:06
  Speaker B: And so forth. But I think that if they work with this current recommender, they could probably get a really valuable recommendation from them if it has been up to a year or whatever it might be.
• 30:22
  Speaker A: Yeah, I agree. I think if I were this candidate, the main thing I would do is I would write an optional essay that explains the 3.0. And what I would say about the 3.0 is that I was working 25 to 40 hours a week to pay for college, that I was still maybe lacking some maturity and I was more focused on some subjects than others. And ideally maybe there's an upward trend in the GPA. We don't know that, but that would be a nice thing to add in if it's the case. And then I would just indicate that it was a learning experience and that they also were very involved in school. I mean, they listed a bunch of activities including they ran like a radio show, we had the marketing club and so they were busy between that and work. So I think just owning that is going to be important, and then test score is great. Obviously, I would not retake the test like you suggest. I would do something more classroom oriented or virtual classroom oriented, whether it's MBA, math, business, fundamentals, HBS, core, whatever it is, show that you have kind of current academic chops beyond just the test score. So I would do that. And then. Yeah, with the Recs. I mean, they could get recs from their former recommenders as long as. As you say, they're kind of still in touch and that person knows their trajectory and where they're heading, where they've been. So I'm not as worried about that part. But I don't think they need to necessarily wait. I mean, they have five years of experience. It sounds like they've just gone through this sort of challenging thing where they were laid off. And so I would recommend they get off to the NBA and get their career on that kind of upward trajectory. But I think there's a lot to like. I mean, the GPA is a big hurdle, but the best thing you can do when you have a low GPA is have a great test score, and they've got that.
• 31:58
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 31:58
  Speaker A: So, anyway, yeah, I think. And they have a range of schools on the list, so I think they might land somewhere from. From this group. So, yeah, I think sort of full steam ahead, but take some outside coursework to show current academic chops.
• 32:11
  Speaker B: Yeah, but it's not even, to me, current academic chops. It's commitment.
• 32:14
  Speaker A: Yeah, that, too.
• 32:15
  Speaker B: Motivation.
• 32:16
  Speaker A: Yeah, that's a good point.
• 32:17
  Speaker B: Because at the end of the day, they've got the academic chops. Right. You can't get their score on the GMAT, presumably, without having that.
• 32:25
  Speaker A: Yes.
• 32:26
  Speaker B: And it gets back to this idea that they. They committed a lot to this radio show. Right. Which is great. But, you know, someone a bit more cynical could say, all right, you enjoyed doing a radio show a lot more than you enjoy going to classes. Where's your motivation? So that, to me, is. Is the crux of the matter. They've got to show motivation.
• 32:47
  Speaker A: Yeah, I agree. That's fair. So just devoting that time would be smart, and it'll send the right signal. So, anyway, I do want to thank them for sharing their profile. Interesting stuff. And hopefully our advice helps them as they forge that path over the next couple of months. Let's move on and talk about wiretaps. Candidate number three. So our last candidate for this week is, again, a decision decision wire. Comes from a decision wire entry that you picked, and this person applied to Cambridge, Carnegie Mellon, Duke, Georgetown, lbs. Michigan, Kellogg Stern and USC Marshall. And they ultimately were admitted to Cambridge where they were given a 10,000 pound scholarship. They were also accepted at Carnegie Mellon with $100,000 scholarship. They got into Duke, Georgetown, lbs and USC. None of those with money. And they're going to be starting school this fall. And they don't seem like they know exactly what they want to do because they mentioned post MBA consulting, venture capital, private equity, maybe family business or entrepreneurship. So they, you know, and they did list some companies like the MBB type companies and some PE shops, but they don't really know. The GRE score was a 317. They had a 3.87 undergraduate GPA. This candidate is located in Utah. And they mentioned in the notes that they just got off the Fuqua waitlist and that for them it's really coming down to LBS or Fuqua. And they feel like there are pros and cons to both. They mentioned they're open to staying in Europe after the NBA for a while, but they want to come back to the US at some point. They think that London offers a lot of advantages compared to at Durham. And it seems from employment reports that LBS does better at MBB placements and that private equity is possible in London. So that's kind of where they sit. I think you actually had a little bit of dialogue with them, Alex. And I know that. I know what it was. Our famed anonymous poster 10646, who's a regular contributor to our community, weighed in on the decisions with a really good kind of assessment of this. But what do you make of this? I mean, they've. They've narrowed it down to LBs or Duke. Should they even be considering the 100,000 from Carnegie Mellon Tepper?
• 35:08
  Speaker B: I think they should go to Duke.
• 35:09
  Speaker A: Okay. And why?
• 35:11
  Speaker B: Well, I think the hundred grand at Tep is actually quite attractive too. For sure. I mean, I think. I'm a huge fan of London business school. Right. I think, you know, being in London, at London business School can open up lots of opportunities and so forth, perhaps more so than being in Durham and at Duke. But if you in the long run want to be in the US, the pathway to that is going to be much more secure and less risky, as it were going through a us based MBA program. So. So yeah, do going to lbs may open up very different opportunities and they might be opportunities that completely change the life plan of the candidate. We talked again, we talked about this before we came on air. So if they're open to having their whole life plan shifted from having such a very different experience then lbs may well be a really interesting opportunity. And it's not to say that LBS can't get them back to the US. I'm not saying that at all. But Duke is definitely the more reliable, less risky pathway and building up that network in the US and so on and so forth. So if they're slightly risk averse, I think Duke. But yeah, I think your point earlier though, in terms of what about tepper with 100 grand? So that would be even more of a sort of risk averse type approach. Right. But yeah, I'm pretty. I think Duke sort of hits the middle ground here for this candidate.
• 37:05
  Speaker A: Yeah, I tend to agree. I mean, I will say the MBB stats, I want them to take that with a grain of salt because I believe that LBS counts people who are sponsored and returning in their totals and Duke does not. So you need to make sure you're discounting that in. I think both programs could get them to MBB, is what I'm trying to say. And I don't think there's a big difference in that respect. But I do think that the MBB placements from lbs are more likely to be in the UK or on the continent, perhaps. And so, yeah, this is a vastly different path. I mean, their class would be far more international if they're at LBS, and so it'll create a network and a lifestyle that would be very different than staying in the states and such. But if they want to be in the States long term, you can't really beat the Duke brand. LbS is going to have less of a brand in the US. So I tend to agree with you that that's probably the safest path, even though it'd be very exciting to go to London for a couple of years. And as I said, it would change the sort of experience that they have. And so another thing that you and I talked about before we came on air, it was just that they could go to Fuqua and then maybe do a semester exchange or something. I don't know if they have one with lbs, but there may be other places to go if they want an international experience for a semester. So in any event, this is an interesting dilemma. And it's hard because I think this person probably was thinking, I'm lbs all the way. And then they just found out they got enough the waitlist at Duke. So that changes things. But in any event, I wish them the best of luck. It does sound like a. It's a nice problem to have, as we always say, so best of luck to them. I appreciate them sharing the dilemma with us. And Alex, we ran a little long this week, but lots of great stuff that we tackled. And, yeah, I'm feeling rested and ready now that I got that trip to Chicago behind me and all the fun stuff out there. But let's do it again next week if you're willing.
• 38:55
  Speaker B: Very good. Great job. Stay safe, everyone. Take care.