Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / HEAR KILLER DAD CHRIS WATTS TINDER DATE: Watts juggles office sex and rape fantasy Tinder date, then murders pregnant wife and two baby girls

Transcript

HEAR KILLER DAD CHRIS WATTS TINDER DATE: Watts juggles office sex and rape fantasy Tinder date, then murders pregnant wife and two baby girls · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:01
Speaker 1: Oh no, it's not Santa, it's Nancy Grace. Are you
0:04
Speaker 1: trying to find the perfect gift for a parent or
0:06
Speaker 1: an expecting parent, Please do not give them another onesie.
0:10
Speaker 1: Don't do it, and not another plastic toy is going
0:14
Speaker 1: to end up in the trash being or the garage
0:16
Speaker 1: or sent to Goodwill this holiday season. Give them something
0:21
Speaker 1: that really matters, and what matters more than protecting their child.
0:26
Speaker 1: I sat down with the smartest people in the world
0:29
Speaker 1: that I know when it comes to child safety, finding
0:32
Speaker 1: missing children, and fighting back against predators, and what I
0:38
Speaker 1: learned is so critical and the information so powerful and important.
0:43
Speaker 1: I want you to have it. I want them as
0:46
Speaker 1: parents to have it. Go to crimestops here dot com
0:51
Speaker 1: for a five part series with action information that you
0:55
Speaker 1: can use to change your life and protect your child.
0:58
Speaker 1: Because I I've done it myself based on what they
1:02
Speaker 1: have told me. Give that as a gift, not another onesie.
1:06
Speaker 1: Please find out how to protect your child out and
1:10
Speaker 1: about at the mall, at the store, at the grocery store,
1:13
Speaker 1: in parking lots, in parking decks, at your home, in
1:18
Speaker 1: your neighborhood. Find out about protection regarding babysitters nanny's daycare,
1:26
Speaker 1: even protection online. It's the very best gift you can
1:31
Speaker 1: give any parent. Go to crimestops here dot com and
1:35
Speaker 1: join the Justice Nation crime stops here dot com Crime
1:47
Speaker 1: stories with Nancy Grace. My daddy is that he guess what, girls,
1:59
Speaker 1: Mommy has a baby in her belly. Are you guys excited? Yes,
2:11
Speaker 1: guess guess when you want to see what happens. They
2:15
Speaker 1: were always hugging or holding hands or kissing me. They
2:19
Speaker 1: have they have the perfect thing. Bella celeust you're out there,
2:25
Speaker 1: just just come back, like if somebody has her, please
2:29
Speaker 1: bring her back. In the last hours, killer Dad Chris
2:33
Speaker 1: Watts transferred to a maximum security Wisconsin prison known for
2:38
Speaker 1: housing serial killers, and for good reason, Chris Watts, who
2:45
Speaker 1: has play guilty in the murder, changed that to Chris Watts,
2:50
Speaker 1: suspected in the murders of his wife and two little girls,
2:54
Speaker 1: Bella and Celeste. Now has women crawling out of the woodwork.
3:00
Speaker 1: When I met him on tender and that when we
3:01
Speaker 1: had a relationship, I was shopping for wedding dresses. As
3:05
Speaker 1: we learned damning evidence from the autopsy report of his wife, Shenan,
3:10
Speaker 1: I mean as he Grace this is crime Stories. Thank
3:13
Speaker 1: you for being with us. Straight out to Alexis terres Chuck,
3:17
Speaker 1: investigative reporter with Radar online dot Com. Alexis terres Chuck,
3:22
Speaker 1: what's the latest. So in the dark of Mount Chris
3:26
Speaker 1: Wats was moved from his prison in Colorado all the
3:29
Speaker 1: way across the country to a prison in Wisconsin. He
3:33
Speaker 1: was moved because of safety reasons. He is such a
3:36
Speaker 1: threat that they had to move him out of the
3:38
Speaker 1: Colorado prison. People know about him and he is such
3:41
Speaker 1: a target on his back that they moved him. But
3:44
Speaker 1: they have moved him to the Dodge Correctional facility in
3:48
Speaker 1: prison that is known for housing the worst furial killers
3:51
Speaker 1: in the country. This is where they put the hardened criminals,
3:55
Speaker 1: the people who've committed the most heinous crimes in our
3:57
Speaker 1: whole country together and that's where christ is now. Well.
4:02
Speaker 1: Cheryl McCollum joining me, director of the Cold Case Research
4:05
Speaker 1: Institute and also crime scene investigator. Cheryl, is there anything
4:12
Speaker 1: worse than what we are learning from the twenty five
4:17
Speaker 1: pages of autopsy reports that you can read at crime
4:20
Speaker 1: online dot Com in their entirety, I mean, Cheryl McCollum,
4:25
Speaker 1: Shenane Watts was fifteen weeks pregnant at the time she
4:28
Speaker 1: was murdered, and her body revealed shocking information to me. Anyway,
4:35
Speaker 1: even I who have been present for countless autopsies and
4:39
Speaker 1: I never even blinked, denied or looked away crime scenes
4:43
Speaker 1: that literally stunk the works. But when I read that
4:48
Speaker 1: autopsy report, it almost made me six. Cheryl, and you
4:51
Speaker 1: know what I'm talking about. Let me be really clear,
4:55
Speaker 1: there is nowhere they can move him. He's going to
5:00
Speaker 1: be safe. He has a target so clear. They're waiting
5:05
Speaker 1: for him in Wisconsin, they would wait on him in
5:09
Speaker 1: Idaho or Kansas or Florida. Hold on, just a moment,
5:12
Speaker 1: Jackie Howard in the studio, please quit cheering silently and
5:15
Speaker 1: mouth and yeah, yeah, yeah, you do the Whoop side.
5:18
Speaker 1: You know, Cheryl, I hear you talking. But come on,
5:21
Speaker 1: jail house justice. I've only heard of it actually happening
5:24
Speaker 1: in three cases. One was Catholic priests where Whoops ran
5:28
Speaker 1: into one of his molestation victims that had grown up
5:31
Speaker 1: and committed a CRIMEO was in jail, he got killed,
5:34
Speaker 1: the priest did. Jeffrey Dahmer was killed in prison. And
5:39
Speaker 1: there was just recently one other but if you're counting
5:42
Speaker 1: on jailhouse justice, Okay, don't hold your breath, Cheryl, Nancy,
5:46
Speaker 1: there's a creed among criminals. And you know this better
5:49
Speaker 1: than any I do. Know that you vote women or children,
5:53
Speaker 1: they're not going to forgive you ever. And just like
5:57
Speaker 1: you just mentioned these people that you mentioned, these three
6:01
Speaker 1: hurt innocent people, These weren't people that even on the
6:06
Speaker 1: street people felt like, hey there are some street justice.
6:09
Speaker 1: This person killed your brothers, so you can kill them.
6:12
Speaker 1: This isn't the case. He killed three children. Well, I
6:16
Speaker 1: hate to point out to you that a large percentage
6:19
Speaker 1: of people behind bars, Cheryl McCollum. I know you're the
6:23
Speaker 1: director of the Cold Case Research Institute and all that,
6:26
Speaker 1: and I'm very impressed, but let me just point out
6:30
Speaker 1: to just enjoy reigning on your parade for a moment,
6:33
Speaker 1: that about half the people men behind bars are there
6:35
Speaker 1: for hurting women or children. Oh did that just mess
6:39
Speaker 1: up your whole your whole argument? Not at all, Not
6:42
Speaker 1: at all, because I'm talking about you just cannot admit defeat,
6:45
Speaker 1: go ahead hard to criminals that creed for real criminals. Now,
6:50
Speaker 1: I'm talking about like mafia gang members. They leave women
6:54
Speaker 1: and children out of it. I'm not talking about the
6:56
Speaker 1: punks that are gonna, you know, hurt the poor child.
6:59
Speaker 1: I'm not talking about priest because that priest is not
7:01
Speaker 1: a hardened criminals like street level. I'm gonna get retribution
7:07
Speaker 1: for these children that you heard. I'm talking about real criminals,
7:11
Speaker 1: I mean, certified right on in your face. I'm a
7:15
Speaker 1: criminals being a criminal. I'm talking about that guy he's
7:18
Speaker 1: waiting on Chris Watts. I promise, Cheryl, what did you
7:21
Speaker 1: find to be the most disturbing aspect of the autopsy
7:25
Speaker 1: reports on Shenan Watts? Nancy? Every single line told his
7:31
Speaker 1: story of what he did to her in such great
7:35
Speaker 1: details that I believe he's gonna make the right choice
7:41
Speaker 1: when he does admits to everything and doesn't go to
7:44
Speaker 1: TA Okay, you know what I had to do when
7:46
Speaker 1: I first started trying cases. I'm gonna say this to you.
7:50
Speaker 1: Ashley Wilcott, Atlanta judge lawyer. You can find her at
7:54
Speaker 1: Ashley Wilcott dot com and child Crime Watched on Facebook. Ashley,
8:00
Speaker 1: I learned at my first trial, and then I learned
8:04
Speaker 1: it over and over again before it was finally ingrained
8:06
Speaker 1: in me. No matter how off putting the evidence is.
8:12
Speaker 1: You cannot turn away from the evidence. You have to
8:15
Speaker 1: look at the jury in the eye, show no sign
8:19
Speaker 1: of revulsion, nothing, and you have to tell them the facts.
8:22
Speaker 1: And in this case, the autopsy report reveals that Shenan
8:27
Speaker 1: Watts baby boy, Nico, she delivered him. The baby was
8:34
Speaker 1: in her underwear. Nico was born because of a prolapsed
8:40
Speaker 1: uterus that happened when Chris Watts was beating her and
8:46
Speaker 1: murdering her. They found the unborn child in her underwear,
8:52
Speaker 1: according to the autopsy report. And I had to still
8:56
Speaker 1: practice doing that, so I practiced on Jackie here in
8:59
Speaker 1: this study. I want to said it because that is
9:03
Speaker 1: the fact. That's the reality, and we cannot turn away
9:09
Speaker 1: from it, no matter how off putting and personally revolts
9:14
Speaker 1: of it is, because that is the truth. And I
9:19
Speaker 1: will have to say this case, the truth hurts. And
9:21
Speaker 1: that's why I believe in our justice system. As a judge, Nancy,
9:24
Speaker 1: you have to put the evidence before the jury. The
9:28
Speaker 1: jury is going to be revolted, but the truth is
9:31
Speaker 1: the truth. That's exactly what happened to that mother, and
9:35
Speaker 1: the autopsy reports are equally as horrific. In my mind
9:39
Speaker 1: as to what happened to those children defensive wounds on
9:43
Speaker 1: one of these small children. The juries cannot make a
9:46
Speaker 1: decision without having every shred of evidence in front of them,
9:49
Speaker 1: no matter how hard it is for a court or
9:51
Speaker 1: a prosecutor to present it to the jury. That's their job.
9:55
Speaker 1: They have to hear those horrible facts because it's what happened. Well,
10:00
Speaker 1: we keep hearing from Cheryl McCullum that there's gonna be
10:03
Speaker 1: jailhouse justice when Chris Wattson gets settled into his new
10:07
Speaker 1: digs at the max security Wisconsin prison. But here's one
10:12
Speaker 1: lady that had a perfect reason for a retribution. She'd
10:17
Speaker 1: listen to. One lady Chris watts was dating, and I'm
10:20
Speaker 1: putting that euphemistically dating off tender. After they exchanged a
10:24
Speaker 1: few flirty text messages, Amanda agreed to meet Chris Wattson
10:27
Speaker 1: person for the first time here in this shopping center.
10:30
Speaker 1: They parked somewhere over here, and then Chris bought Amanda
10:33
Speaker 1: a coffee from this Starbucks before they decided to head
10:36
Speaker 1: to her place to watch a movie. That movie was
10:39
Speaker 1: the psychological thriller Shutter Island. Leonardo Dicabrio plays a husband
10:43
Speaker 1: who murders his wife because she killed their children. Where
10:47
Speaker 1: the kids did the movie inspire Watts to falsely claim
10:51
Speaker 1: that he killed his wife, Shenan in a rage because
10:53
Speaker 1: she strangled the little girls. Kind of eerie, Yeah, almost
11:00
Speaker 1: like a premonition. Right at this point, we have been
11:03
Speaker 1: able to recover of a body that we're quite certain
11:07
Speaker 1: is Chanan Watts body. We have a strong reason to
11:12
Speaker 1: believe that we know where the bodies of the children.
11:15
Speaker 1: Aren't being the loving Chris that he normally was. He
11:18
Speaker 1: wasn't touching or hugging or doing stuff like that, and
11:21
Speaker 1: he wasn't being as attentive to the girls as he
11:23
Speaker 1: normally is. We're not promised tomorrow, do you know? We're
11:27
Speaker 1: not promised anything but to be able to enjoy our
11:30
Speaker 1: children and m every crazy moment. It can be super crazy.
11:38
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna lie. My kids are are crazy, but
11:42
Speaker 1: I love them and I love the fact that I
11:44
Speaker 1: can be there for them. I need to see everybody again.
11:46
Speaker 1: This house is not complete without anybody. Here's black. You
11:53
Speaker 1: are hearing a montage bringing us up to date in
11:56
Speaker 1: the latest and Chris Watts the killer Dad. It was
11:59
Speaker 1: just been moved to a maximum security facility in Wisconsin.
12:03
Speaker 1: Back to Cheryl McCollum, director of the cole Case Research Institute.
12:06
Speaker 1: You know, it's very rare for a prison prisoner convicted
12:10
Speaker 1: on a state offense to be moved out of state.
12:14
Speaker 1: It is the jailhouse term is called a bus rise.
12:19
Speaker 1: So they do it in the dark night, They do
12:21
Speaker 1: it very quickly. They don't do a lot of talking
12:23
Speaker 1: about it beforehand, so they try to get him moved
12:26
Speaker 1: before any incident happened. This tells me that they knew
12:29
Speaker 1: good and well that he was in danger, extreme danger.
12:33
Speaker 1: I want you to take a listen to our friend
12:34
Speaker 1: an Insight edition that you just heard Stephen Faban and
12:38
Speaker 1: he's talking with Chris Watch's one Time Tender Date. Now,
12:43
Speaker 1: this is all happening during the marriage and also while
12:47
Speaker 1: he was dating Nick let me just say dating Nicole
12:50
Speaker 1: Castinger Nicole Kestinger as well. These are two of the
12:54
Speaker 1: women that we know of he was sleeping with while
12:57
Speaker 1: he was married to Shenan. This is while she was
13:00
Speaker 1: ushing around trying to buy self help books to put
13:02
Speaker 1: their marriage back together. I'll come back to you on
13:04
Speaker 1: that with me. Doctor Brian Russell, psychologist, lawyer, host of
13:08
Speaker 1: investigation discoveries, hit series Fatal Vows. Self help books didn't
13:14
Speaker 1: help this case because all along Chris Watts had murderous intentions.
13:18
Speaker 1: I mean, take a listen to the Tender Lover and
13:22
Speaker 1: Inside edition Stephen Fabian. That night, Amanda says they had
13:26
Speaker 1: their first sexual encounter. He was very rough. I would
13:30
Speaker 1: say very rough. And you know, the best way I
13:34
Speaker 1: can grab it is as he's almost zoned out into
13:36
Speaker 1: a different person. Did he ever choke you or ask
13:39
Speaker 1: to choke you? That? He did place his hand around
13:42
Speaker 1: my neck and I am quickly kind of it freaked
13:46
Speaker 1: me out soundly. He was very forceful, verseful. Is that
13:51
Speaker 1: terrifying to you now, knowing that that's how he admitted
13:55
Speaker 1: to killing his wife choking her. He had his hands
13:58
Speaker 1: on your neck? Yeah, okay too, Alexa's trestchoke writer online
14:04
Speaker 1: dot Com. That was his tender Let me just say
14:07
Speaker 1: date with air quotes. WHOA. They had one cup of
14:10
Speaker 1: coffee at a Chick fil at That's all it took,
14:14
Speaker 1: and then they're having sex and he put his hands
14:17
Speaker 1: on her neck. I'm telling you this is my one
14:18
Speaker 1: of my mini mottos. You put out a hand you'll
14:22
Speaker 1: pull back a nub okay. So obviously she did not
14:26
Speaker 1: have the same credo. What was that one cup of
14:30
Speaker 1: coffee from Chick fil A? And they're in the sack?
14:32
Speaker 1: What was a cup of coffee cost at Chick fil a? Anyway?
14:34
Speaker 1: Dollar They met on Tinder, which is a dating app,
14:37
Speaker 1: which is totally per sex. That's exactly what the app is.
14:40
Speaker 1: So I'm surprised he even bought a cup of coffee
14:43
Speaker 1: in Chick fil at because it's really just about hooking up.
14:45
Speaker 1: So they go back to her place. She said that
14:48
Speaker 1: they acted out a rape of fantasy. So this guy
14:51
Speaker 1: was getting really violent in the months leading up to
14:55
Speaker 1: his arrest for murdering his children and his wife. And
14:58
Speaker 1: the thing is about his wife. When they found her,
15:02
Speaker 1: she was only in a T shirt, abra and her underwear,
15:06
Speaker 1: and she had given birth to this baby in a
15:09
Speaker 1: dirt grave. He had no regard for her life or
15:13
Speaker 1: the life of that more baby that he so desperately wanted.
15:16
Speaker 1: He had told her he wanted a third child. She
15:19
Speaker 1: had a lot of health problems. She struggled with health
15:22
Speaker 1: problems for years. So having these children was a miracle,
15:26
Speaker 1: an absolute miracle. That's what her family said, and she
15:28
Speaker 1: didn't one more kid. She had two perfectly healthy, beautiful children.
15:31
Speaker 1: He convinced her he wanted more kids because it would
15:34
Speaker 1: make their marriage even happier and more complete. She loved that.
15:37
Speaker 1: She loved the idea of more baby. She has them,
15:39
Speaker 1: and then he murders her while she's pregnant, dumps her
15:42
Speaker 1: body in this dirt grave. It only took him twenty
15:45
Speaker 1: minutes to dig a two foot grave for a woman
15:48
Speaker 1: who was over five feet tall. Two twenty minutes. That's it.
15:54
Speaker 1: I want to follow up on something you just said
15:56
Speaker 1: about her overcoming all of her health problems because he
16:00
Speaker 1: wanted baby number three. Listen to Chananne Wats his parents
16:04
Speaker 1: speaking out on twenty twenty. Her dream was to help
16:07
Speaker 1: her into her family. How do you describe your daughter
16:12
Speaker 1: the guys we're here from the boat today. Oh, he's
16:16
Speaker 1: out there trying to help people. She was fun, full
16:19
Speaker 1: of life. She did so many things. She had her
16:21
Speaker 1: hand and everything. She was amazing. Love you guys, have
16:25
Speaker 1: a great day. She never gave up. She had a
16:29
Speaker 1: vision board. What was on that vision board to make
16:32
Speaker 1: sure her Charon had everything they are needed. She was
16:35
Speaker 1: a good soul She was very open on Facebook. I
16:39
Speaker 1: saw a lot of her life, hers life. I am
16:42
Speaker 1: so excited. I'm thriving with you. I am confident, I
16:46
Speaker 1: am torment, and I'm successful. She seemed to have the
16:49
Speaker 1: perfect life she did. Did you believe that she was happy? Absolutely? Absolutely,
16:58
Speaker 1: she was extremely happy. You were hearing NaN's parents speaking out,
17:02
Speaker 1: and they were also touching on all the risks of
17:06
Speaker 1: pregnancy when you have serious lupus, which she did. The
17:11
Speaker 1: children just miracles. And during all of this, Watts is
17:15
Speaker 1: sneaking around with his tender date. Listen. The relationship lasted
17:20
Speaker 1: several weeks until Watts began seeing another woman, co worker,
17:23
Speaker 1: Nicole Cassinger. The next time Amanda saw Watts, he was
17:28
Speaker 1: in the headlines for killing his wife and kids. She
17:31
Speaker 1: still can't believe she dated him. It made me feel betrayed.
17:35
Speaker 1: It made me feel nasty, It made me feel dirty.
17:39
Speaker 1: He had a wife at home, pregnant, two daughters at home.
17:45
Speaker 1: I know how that hurts. I wouldn't do that. Wow. Okay,
17:51
Speaker 1: so we know that the tender date was happening. We
17:54
Speaker 1: know that she was pregnant after battling lupus, still battling
17:59
Speaker 1: loop to doctor Brian Russell, psychologist, lawyer, post of IDs
18:04
Speaker 1: hit series Fatal Vows Doctor Bryant, I mean, I don't
18:07
Speaker 1: get it. You jump in the sack with somebody after
18:12
Speaker 1: a cup of coffee at Chick fil A and the
18:14
Speaker 1: guy acts out a rape fantasy, and I assume she
18:19
Speaker 1: knew he was married, but it was then him dating
18:23
Speaker 1: another woman two timing or not once but twice with
18:28
Speaker 1: his wife and a co worker. That's what broke it off.
18:31
Speaker 1: A cup of coffee would have done it for me. Well, yeah,
18:33
Speaker 1: I mean, I think when you combine what you see
18:36
Speaker 1: happening here with this tender date with what obviously happened
18:40
Speaker 1: in his marriage, there's an incredibly important lesson for people
18:45
Speaker 1: here because you look and see how quickly this tender
18:48
Speaker 1: date jumped into bed with him. And here you have
18:52
Speaker 1: this his wife, by all accounts, wonderful woman, wonderful mother,
18:58
Speaker 1: who clearly didn't know or didn't see the signs that
19:03
Speaker 1: were there because he was always this He didn't just
19:06
Speaker 1: become this way. He was this way for a long time.
19:08
Speaker 1: And she's marrying him and having these kids with them
19:11
Speaker 1: and everything and doesn't realize how much danger they're all in,
19:14
Speaker 1: and so you know. The lesson is if if you
19:17
Speaker 1: can be married to somebody and not realize how much
19:21
Speaker 1: danger you're in, then you know you're you're putting yourself
19:26
Speaker 1: in a very risky situation in many ways when you
19:29
Speaker 1: just hop right in so quickly like that. I mean, Russell.
19:34
Speaker 1: Please do not get me wrong. I'm not judging. I
19:38
Speaker 1: don't care cats and dogs sleeping together. I could not
19:43
Speaker 1: care less who is sleeping with who. I don't care
19:48
Speaker 1: what sex you are, I don't care. It's as all
19:51
Speaker 1: your business. If you're cheating on your wife, that's on
19:55
Speaker 1: you and whoever you're cheating with, or vice versa. But
19:58
Speaker 1: what I am saying is is this isn't about just
20:02
Speaker 1: cheating or tender or how quickly you sleep with somebody.
20:06
Speaker 1: I'm talking about murder. I'm talking about Shenan Watts buried
20:12
Speaker 1: in a shallow grave in her t shirt and underwear
20:15
Speaker 1: and giving birth to her baby because her husband has
20:20
Speaker 1: beaten her and murdered her. That's what I'm talking about. Hi,
20:29
Speaker 1: Nancy Grace here, have you ever googled yourself, your neighbors,
20:32
Speaker 1: somebody at work a crush? Fifty seven percent of Americans
20:36
Speaker 1: admitt keeping an eye on their own online reputation. Forty
20:40
Speaker 1: six admit to using the Internet to look up somebody
20:43
Speaker 1: from their past. But Google and Facebook the tip of
20:47
Speaker 1: the iceberg when it comes to finding personal information. There's
20:50
Speaker 1: an innovative new website called truth Finder. It's now revealing
20:54
Speaker 1: the full scoop on millions of Americans. Truthfinder can search
20:58
Speaker 1: through hundreds of millions of public records in a matter
21:02
Speaker 1: of minutes. Members can literally begin searching in seconds for
21:06
Speaker 1: sensitive data like criminal traffic arrest records. Before you bring
21:11
Speaker 1: someone new into your life and around the people you
21:14
Speaker 1: care for your children, consider using Truthfinder. What you find
21:20
Speaker 1: may astound you. Go to truthfinder dot com forward slash
21:23
Speaker 1: Nancy right away to start searching truthfinder dot com forward
21:28
Speaker 1: slash Nancy truthfinder dot com forward slash Nancy. Find the
21:35
Speaker 1: truth Clime stories with Nancy Grace. Can you seem like
21:45
Speaker 1: the genuine guy? You know? I mean he was funny
21:48
Speaker 1: and he was charming. Things were not how I would
21:52
Speaker 1: things that they were supposed to be. I guess the
21:54
Speaker 1: front door was locked differently than it normally was. I
21:57
Speaker 1: had my son to look in the garage to see
21:59
Speaker 1: if her was there, and it was there, which was
22:01
Speaker 1: really peculiar because Shanan doesn't go places without her car.
22:04
Speaker 1: I came home and it was like I walked into
22:07
Speaker 1: a ghost town. Like everything. She wasn't here, kids weren't here.
22:11
Speaker 1: It was like it was just they were here and
22:13
Speaker 1: then they were gone. Oh he's out there trying to
22:14
Speaker 1: help people. She was fun, full of life. She did
22:17
Speaker 1: so many things, shut her in and everything. She was amazing.
22:21
Speaker 1: Love you guys, have a great day. Shann Watts murdered
22:25
Speaker 1: by her husband, Chris Watts, as well as their two
22:28
Speaker 1: little baby girls, Bella and Celeste, and baby Nico. Nico
22:32
Speaker 1: was born spontaneously as Chris Watts had beat and murdered
22:36
Speaker 1: his wife Shanan in the last hours. He has been
22:39
Speaker 1: secretly moved to a maximum security facility in Wisconsin across
22:43
Speaker 1: state borders, which is highly highly unusual. Joining me, Alexis
22:48
Speaker 1: to Rezchuk, investigator, journalists with Radar Online dot Com. Joe
22:51
Speaker 1: Scott Morgan, Professor forensics, author of a brand new book,
22:55
Speaker 1: The Blood Beneath My Feet on Amazon, Professor Expel State University.
23:01
Speaker 1: Just got welcome, Ellen Colorin Joining me right now, journalists
23:05
Speaker 1: with Crime online dot Com. Ellen, what can you tell
23:08
Speaker 1: me about what's pretending to call local hospitals looking for Chanan? Oh?
23:15
Speaker 1: Does it ever end with this guy? That's right, Nancy.
23:18
Speaker 1: On the day that Shannon and her girls were first
23:21
Speaker 1: reported missing, the police came to the home, called by
23:23
Speaker 1: a friend, not Chris, and said, yes, guys, if you
23:26
Speaker 1: want to start calling hospitals all we're doing other investigative work,
23:29
Speaker 1: why don't you do that. The call logs show that
23:31
Speaker 1: Chris made four calls to Vocal hospitals, but the officer
23:35
Speaker 1: who was investigating and saw the length of those calls
23:38
Speaker 1: thought they seemed suspicious. He was only on the each
23:40
Speaker 1: call for sixty seconds or less, so the officer called us.
23:44
Speaker 1: Oh wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait wait. I'm so happy.
23:50
Speaker 1: If you can be happy at a moment like this,
23:53
Speaker 1: you know what. I just love it, asked Wilcott. When
23:56
Speaker 1: a criminal outsmarts himself, okay, when the dog catches, actually
24:00
Speaker 1: catches to steal, then what do you do? Okay? So
24:03
Speaker 1: he trying to cover up the murders, the three murders
24:06
Speaker 1: I consider to be four, including baby Nico who was
24:10
Speaker 1: found in NaN's underwear. At the time her body was
24:12
Speaker 1: recovered Ashley, he called the hospitals to act like he
24:17
Speaker 1: was checking around, but he was only on sixty seconds.
24:20
Speaker 1: You know, you always get put on hold at a
24:22
Speaker 1: hospital while they're searching to try to find the person
24:25
Speaker 1: you deal with, like three or four minutes to muse
24:27
Speaker 1: that before you find out anything. Listen, here's what's good
24:31
Speaker 1: news in our criminal justice system. News at Criminals are
24:34
Speaker 1: not always smart, or in the alternative, they think they're
24:37
Speaker 1: super smart and they're gonna outsmart, but that's how cases
24:40
Speaker 1: are solved. And thank god he made that stupid, stupid
24:44
Speaker 1: decision to say sixty seconds and I checked check for
24:46
Speaker 1: my family, Ellen Killaura and with me at crime online
24:49
Speaker 1: dot com where you can read the full twenty five
24:51
Speaker 1: pages of autopsy report. We managed to get our mits
24:54
Speaker 1: on Eka, I interrupted you just to pontificate a moment
24:57
Speaker 1: about this idiot. I'm gonna have to go to a
24:59
Speaker 1: shrink on this on aka doctor Brian Russell. Oh what
25:02
Speaker 1: a tangled web we weave when first we practice to deceive,
25:06
Speaker 1: you know, growing up and making you never actually finished
25:08
Speaker 1: the sentence. You just say the first half and everybody goes, yeah,
25:11
Speaker 1: whatever the old saying may be. But this guy just
25:14
Speaker 1: made it worse. And all of his attempts to cover
25:17
Speaker 1: it up just made it worse and worse and worse. Yeah. Absolutely,
25:20
Speaker 1: and I think that it absolutely is the case that
25:24
Speaker 1: these people like this guy tend to overestimate how clever
25:28
Speaker 1: and intelligent they are and how able they're going to
25:31
Speaker 1: be to fool everybody. And I totally agree, Thank god
25:35
Speaker 1: that's the case, because a lot of cases would be
25:37
Speaker 1: unsolved today if these people were really as smart as
25:39
Speaker 1: they think they are. Back to you, aka, you were
25:42
Speaker 1: telling me about how they tried they found out he
25:45
Speaker 1: had tricked himself by covering his tracks in this case. Yeah,
25:50
Speaker 1: the police officer took call the hospital himself to see
25:53
Speaker 1: how long it would take to find out information about
25:55
Speaker 1: a patient, and it took much much longer than the
25:57
Speaker 1: calls that Chris Watch supportedly needs. The police officer called
26:00
Speaker 1: it a trail of concocted deceit. But there was one
26:03
Speaker 1: way that Chris Watts wasn't able to cover his trail,
26:06
Speaker 1: and that's because Shannon's best friend Nicole Do immediately that
26:10
Speaker 1: something had to have been wrong, and she called police
26:12
Speaker 1: that morning when Sannan missed a doctor's appointment. Because she
26:16
Speaker 1: called police, that's how they were able to get to
26:18
Speaker 1: the home and know that Sannon had left very important
26:21
Speaker 1: personal belongings behind, personal belongings. But I suspect Chris Wats
26:25
Speaker 1: probably would have tried to get rid of the first
26:27
Speaker 1: chance he got, but he didn't get that chance. You know,
26:30
Speaker 1: the tracks he left behind are incredible, Ellen, colorin joining
26:36
Speaker 1: us from Crime online dot Com and the revelation he
26:41
Speaker 1: called several hospitals to pretend he was checking up on
26:44
Speaker 1: Shenani Sy she was in one of the hospitals. It
26:46
Speaker 1: reminds me so much as Scott Peterson and his fake
26:50
Speaker 1: please to bring Lacy home. You know, there's an entry
26:54
Speaker 1: also in the discovery documents, Ellen, that Stacey Nicole Kessinger
26:58
Speaker 1: did an online sir for Shenan Watts September one, twenty seventeen.
27:04
Speaker 1: Isn't that before she got involved with Chris Watts secure
27:08
Speaker 1: her dad. That's right, Nancy, that's several months before she
27:11
Speaker 1: would have been aware of Chris Watts or Shannon Watch,
27:15
Speaker 1: several months before the affair started. So, as you can understand,
27:17
Speaker 1: when we saw that entry in the discovery document, we
27:20
Speaker 1: thought that was very, very significant. And after days, weeks
27:24
Speaker 1: even of calls to try and clarify what that is
27:28
Speaker 1: all about. Why is Nicole Castinger searching for Shannon Watts
27:31
Speaker 1: almost a year before the affair it starts. They've told
27:35
Speaker 1: us that that was an error, and that's a pretty
27:37
Speaker 1: big error. I think that's a huge error. And then
27:40
Speaker 1: after that search, before she got involved in i A
27:43
Speaker 1: sleeping with Chris Watts, she looked at both Shanan Watts
27:48
Speaker 1: and Chris Watts and this is a co marker, right,
27:52
Speaker 1: That's right, that's Nicole Castinger. Now, now that we know
27:54
Speaker 1: that there was a major, significant error in that report,
27:57
Speaker 1: we are still waiting on confirmation for world conscient County
28:00
Speaker 1: District Attorney's office, she confirm other entries in the report
28:03
Speaker 1: that suggests Nicole Cassenger was aware of Chris Watson shan
28:07
Speaker 1: On Watts before she said she was. We need confirmations.
28:10
Speaker 1: Wait a minute, Wait a minute, Alexis arrestwriter online dot com.
28:13
Speaker 1: Isn't it true that what nerve Chris Watts actually takes
28:18
Speaker 1: the girlfriend, the mistress, Nicole Cassenger to their home and
28:23
Speaker 1: Nan Watts had the home plastered with photos of her
28:26
Speaker 1: and him and one he's kissing her pregnant tummy. That photo,
28:30
Speaker 1: I mean you couldn't go in there without knowing he
28:32
Speaker 1: was married with children. No, and the house hasn't everything
28:36
Speaker 1: in touch that you could imagine. It has all of
28:39
Speaker 1: her personal belongings that all the children thinks. This is
28:42
Speaker 1: not a home that is one of them has moved out,
28:45
Speaker 1: or that the marriage is over. This is a home
28:47
Speaker 1: with an intact, a happy family. And yes, she was there,
28:50
Speaker 1: and she even rode in the car the Alexis. But
28:53
Speaker 1: Sanan worked so hard for she was so successful at
28:56
Speaker 1: her job that she had an eight hundred dollars a
28:58
Speaker 1: month car allowance. And that's why she was able to
29:01
Speaker 1: drive this luxury vehicle. Because she was such a hard
29:03
Speaker 1: worker and she was so successful. This is what she
29:05
Speaker 1: was given. And Chris didn't even care about that. He
29:07
Speaker 1: drove that car on his gates with this mistress, the
29:10
Speaker 1: mistress that he was out with the night before he
29:13
Speaker 1: killed his wife and daughters. They went out to a dinner.
29:16
Speaker 1: He spent sixty two dollars, and she had said he
29:18
Speaker 1: never paid with anything other than gift cards. They always
29:22
Speaker 1: had a bunch of gift cards at work, and so
29:24
Speaker 1: he always used those. But this time he used his
29:27
Speaker 1: credit card, and the credit card charge popped up immediately.
29:30
Speaker 1: His wife, who again was asked him working working so
29:33
Speaker 1: hard to provide for his family gainst the alert and says,
29:35
Speaker 1: oh my god, sixty two dollars, that is not an
29:38
Speaker 1: amount of money a that we can afford her be
29:40
Speaker 1: that one person should have for dinner. So she asked
29:44
Speaker 1: him about it, and he lied, and he said, oh,
29:46
Speaker 1: I had salmon and beer. She was so suspicious of
29:49
Speaker 1: her husband. She and her friends they looked up the
29:51
Speaker 1: restaurant menu online. A salmon and a beer was not
29:54
Speaker 1: sixty two dollars. She knew in her heart that he
29:57
Speaker 1: was cheating on her. I don't know if she knew
29:59
Speaker 1: that woman had been in her home, the home that
30:02
Speaker 1: she spent years decorating and making a home for their girls,
30:05
Speaker 1: and if someone had been in the car, the car
30:07
Speaker 1: that she was out of town working to make money for.
30:10
Speaker 1: And this is what he did. He threw it in
30:12
Speaker 1: her face. And this is what twenty four hours before
30:16
Speaker 1: he ended up murdering her in her own home, the
30:18
Speaker 1: home or the mistress had been. Alexis Ruschek, I think
30:20
Speaker 1: they should have tried this guy and put you on
30:22
Speaker 1: the stand to summarize like that, because you put a,
30:25
Speaker 1: I would be calling women in the box in the
30:26
Speaker 1: jury box, and they here he's usually her Alexis and
30:30
Speaker 1: bringing his mistress to their home and having sex with
30:34
Speaker 1: her right there in front of the family photos. He
30:36
Speaker 1: would totally get the death penalty. She's a wonderful person,
30:40
Speaker 1: and she knew I was married. Yes, and that's where
30:42
Speaker 1: we're going through dishes. Yes, since and that's what to that.
30:45
Speaker 1: You know we're going to get us. You know at
30:47
Speaker 1: the end that you're going to get separated. Like once
30:48
Speaker 1: I figured out what that was, I didn't know what
30:50
Speaker 1: that was going to be, id no idea. I was like,
30:53
Speaker 1: you know, I saw her, took my breath away, and
30:56
Speaker 1: I never thought any one of years that could happen.
31:00
Speaker 1: How do you think I'm a figure? But it was anyboy,
31:06
Speaker 1: anybody him all that time. Christmas on your fault. No, No,
31:11
Speaker 1: I'm just I'm I know you want to take care
31:15
Speaker 1: of her, because it's because you're typing takes care of women.
31:18
Speaker 1: You are hearing killer Dad Chris Watts admitting his affair
31:23
Speaker 1: with Nicole Kessenger, his coworker. She is not a suspect.
31:27
Speaker 1: She is not a person of interest at all in
31:30
Speaker 1: his case, although I'm sure police looked long and hard
31:34
Speaker 1: at her as being part of it, but she was
31:36
Speaker 1: not part of this case. Joining me right now. Professor
31:39
Speaker 1: forresis Jackson State University and author of Blood Beneath My
31:43
Speaker 1: Feet Joseph Scott Morgan, Joe Scott, you've read the twenty
31:46
Speaker 1: five pages of autopsy. I want to hear your impressions,
31:51
Speaker 1: because people see things differently. But what did it mean
31:54
Speaker 1: to you that she was wearing just her underwear, her bra,
31:58
Speaker 1: her short sleeved shirt when she was dumb in that
32:01
Speaker 1: shallow grave on What it means to me, Nancy, is
32:04
Speaker 1: the fact that you know he had you know, early
32:07
Speaker 1: on he had talked about how there was some kind
32:09
Speaker 1: of marital dispute and this sort of thing. Upon her
32:11
Speaker 1: rival back home. In my opinion, based upon the way
32:14
Speaker 1: she was dressed, she nan was taken unaware. It's my
32:17
Speaker 1: opinion that she was reposed in bed, sleeping, completely relaxed.
32:24
Speaker 1: She's probably laying on her side. Let's keep in mind
32:26
Speaker 1: she's pregnant and that's why. And my thought is she's
32:29
Speaker 1: probably laying on her left side. I think that he
32:31
Speaker 1: may have approached her from her right rear, She's got
32:35
Speaker 1: a focal area of hemorrhage, a large focal area of
32:38
Speaker 1: hemorrhage on the right aspect of her neck. I think
32:40
Speaker 1: he slowly wrapped his hands around her neck and he
32:43
Speaker 1: choked her out right there. She's very tired, Nancy. She's
32:46
Speaker 1: been traveling, she's pregnant. I know all of the women
32:49
Speaker 1: in the audience that have been pregnant. You know about exhaustion,
32:52
Speaker 1: and she's been beat to death emotionally, you know, over
32:56
Speaker 1: this thing. Completely asleep and he didn't even have to
32:59
Speaker 1: apply in the pressure to create PATIKII. There was no
33:02
Speaker 1: evidence of that. The only trauma that she had was
33:06
Speaker 1: actually to her neck in that particular area. But he
33:09
Speaker 1: used the amount of pressure to take her life while
33:12
Speaker 1: she was sleeping. It just hurts me so much to
33:15
Speaker 1: hear this, and to hear about her actually spontaneously vaginally
33:20
Speaker 1: delivering the baby in the midst of all this. She
33:24
Speaker 1: had a prolapsed uterus, it revealed in the autopsy report.
33:27
Speaker 1: Did you see that, Jo Scott Morgan? Yeah? I did.
33:29
Speaker 1: And I think that maybe a lot of people at
33:32
Speaker 1: home don't understand this. And I'll try to keep it
33:34
Speaker 1: just I'll try to keep it within good measure. Just
33:37
Speaker 1: understand that when our bodies, and all of our bodies do,
33:41
Speaker 1: when we begin to decompose, the muscle tension in our
33:44
Speaker 1: body is not the way it once was. And the
33:46
Speaker 1: reason her uterus prolapsed, essentially kind of turned inside out,
33:51
Speaker 1: is that as a result of the decomposition, the muscle
33:53
Speaker 1: tension released and Nico, this little baby, was spontaneously delivered,
33:59
Speaker 1: of course deceased. This is commonly referred to as coffin birth.
34:04
Speaker 1: I think that this was experienced or we you know,
34:07
Speaker 1: you reflected on Scott Peterson a little while ago, and
34:10
Speaker 1: the same thing, if I remember correctly, had happened relative
34:13
Speaker 1: to Lacy. And this is not something that is uncommon.
34:16
Speaker 1: It is something that we see with women that are
34:20
Speaker 1: pregnant at the time of their death, after they've been
34:22
Speaker 1: down for a period of time. But it really drives
34:25
Speaker 1: it really drives home the point here, you know, to
34:28
Speaker 1: doctor Brian Russell, psychologist and a lawyer, a host of
34:30
Speaker 1: id's fatal vows, I've got to ask you. I've been
34:34
Speaker 1: watching over and over at video of the Monster Family
34:38
Speaker 1: killer Chris Watts. It's of him after he gets rid
34:43
Speaker 1: of the bodies he drives up to a convenience store
34:47
Speaker 1: and kind of flirty with a blinde cashier and orders
34:50
Speaker 1: a breakfast burrito, walks out just you know, no big deal.
34:54
Speaker 1: He buried his wife and child stuff as children down
34:56
Speaker 1: those oil canisters whose openings were about eight inches wide.
35:00
Speaker 1: We've been told dingoes and enjoys the breakfast burrito. Well,
35:03
Speaker 1: I think that the comparison that Joe Scott made and
35:06
Speaker 1: I know you made this earlier as well, to the
35:08
Speaker 1: lazy Peter Scott Peterson and Lazy Peterson case is a
35:13
Speaker 1: good one for three important reasons. One is, both cases
35:16
Speaker 1: illustrate the incredible entitlement that is at the core of
35:20
Speaker 1: the personality of the sociopath. I should be able to
35:23
Speaker 1: have whatever I want, no matter who I have to
35:25
Speaker 1: hurt to get it. Secondly, it appalls me and I
35:30
Speaker 1: think maybe you as well, that the babies in these
35:33
Speaker 1: cases are not considered murder victims. And the third thing is,
35:38
Speaker 1: you know, the lesson in this for anybody who is
35:41
Speaker 1: out there meeting people on an Internet app or site
35:46
Speaker 1: and immediately going to bed with those people, the danger
35:49
Speaker 1: that you could be putting yourself in you can't underestimate
35:52
Speaker 1: because it could be somebody who is capable of doing
35:56
Speaker 1: this kind of stuff, and if their wives, who lived
35:59
Speaker 1: under the same roofs with them, didn't see it. You're
36:01
Speaker 1: crazy to think that you're going to see the danger
36:04
Speaker 1: in one cup of coffee with the person too. Ash
36:07
Speaker 1: Wilcott even I'll judge lawyer. You can find her at
36:10
Speaker 1: Ashley Wilcott dot com. Wait in, Ashley, Listen, here's my
36:13
Speaker 1: issue with Tinder in any of these apps. You're crazy
36:15
Speaker 1: to think. I completely agree with the respect of doctor.
36:18
Speaker 1: You're crazy to think you're gonna know after one cup
36:20
Speaker 1: of coffee. But listen, it's not worth the risk if
36:23
Speaker 1: you're out there on something like Tinder. No judging. I
36:25
Speaker 1: don't care what you do, who you do it with,
36:27
Speaker 1: what your choices are. You've just got to be smart
36:30
Speaker 1: about it. And the second she heard he had kids,
36:34
Speaker 1: she said something to the effect of, oh, I thought
36:36
Speaker 1: it was cute. Cute. It's a whole other host of
36:40
Speaker 1: things that you need to think about in protecting yourself
36:43
Speaker 1: emotionally and physically and being smart about whatever decisions you
36:48
Speaker 1: choose to make too. Alan Khalaurain Crime online dot Com
36:51
Speaker 1: investigative reporter, What can you tell me about reports that
36:56
Speaker 1: very disturbing photo shows stained clothing Shanne Watts was wearing
37:00
Speaker 1: and she was murdered and buried in the shallow grave
37:02
Speaker 1: by her husband. It did not match what she was wearing.
37:05
Speaker 1: And the final picture of her alive, and that photo
37:08
Speaker 1: was taken when she was boarding a flight home to Colorado.
37:11
Speaker 1: This is her going home, having just bought all these
37:14
Speaker 1: self help books to try and repair their marriage. What
37:17
Speaker 1: are you telling about the clothing issue, Ellen, Oh, that's right, Nancy.
37:20
Speaker 1: She was about wearing the same clothing that she was
37:23
Speaker 1: wearing at her last photograph, which is not long before
37:25
Speaker 1: her murder. I would have to agree with Joseph Scott
37:27
Speaker 1: Morgan that she had gotten ready for bet she was there.
37:31
Speaker 1: These were probably her pagamas she was prently. I think
37:33
Speaker 1: you're right. I think you're both right, Ellen, alexis urete shut.
37:37
Speaker 1: It just breaks my heart thinking of her out buying
37:39
Speaker 1: those self help books while he's cooking up with women
37:42
Speaker 1: on tender and playing out rape fantasies and juggling a
37:46
Speaker 1: mistress at work, and the Lord only knows what else,
37:48
Speaker 1: and she's out trying to book a cheap sexy getaway
37:52
Speaker 1: for the weekend to repair their marriage and buying self
37:54
Speaker 1: help books. Alexis and you know its the weekend away.
37:58
Speaker 1: She got a babysitter for the weekend away so that
38:00
Speaker 1: they could have a romantic getaway. That babysitter is the
38:03
Speaker 1: same babysitter that he on Saturday night, he told that
38:06
Speaker 1: babysitter they're family friends, a babysitter and babysitter's dad. He said,
38:10
Speaker 1: I want a raffle at work. I want some free
38:13
Speaker 1: Rockies ticket to go to the baseball game, and I'm
38:16
Speaker 1: gonna go with my coworkers. So if your daughter could babysit,
38:19
Speaker 1: that would be great. So she comes that she babysits.
38:21
Speaker 1: He did not go anywhere near that Rockies game. He
38:24
Speaker 1: went out with his mistress. He went to dinner and
38:25
Speaker 1: went hubsex with her. And then the next day he
38:29
Speaker 1: goes to the babysitter's house because it's her. There's a
38:32
Speaker 1: little birthday party for the girls, and he's still lying
38:34
Speaker 1: about everything he did. But this guy lied to everybody
38:38
Speaker 1: around him. And that was on Sunday. So the night
38:41
Speaker 1: before he's been at out with the mistress, his wife
38:44
Speaker 1: has out of town working. The next day he starts planning.
38:48
Speaker 1: He starts telling people cover for the murders. We wait
38:52
Speaker 1: as justice unfolds for killer Dad Chris Watson, that Wisconsin facility,
38:57
Speaker 1: Nancy Grace crime story, signing off goodbye you