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Synesthesia - Seeing Colors from Numbers and Shapes · I Hate Talking

• 0:29
  I Hate Talking: Welcome to episode 42 of I Hate Talking.
• 0:33
  I Hate Talking: Hi everyone.
• 0:34
  I Hate Talking: And most likely with this particular episode, we will hit a new milestone with the number of downloads that we have achieved, or in other words, the number of listens that we have achieved.
• 0:46
  I Hate Talking: So shout out to all our consistent and loyal listeners out there that have listened to our particular podcast, as well as those that have shared it.
• 0:57
  I Hate Talking: Maybe this is an episode that you will share, maybe it won't be.
• 1:00
  I Hate Talking: We'll see.
• 1:01
  I Hate Talking: Yeah, thanks so much.
• 1:02
  I Hate Talking: We really Adam and I really have a lot of fun just spending this time together doing this, and also, um, we really like interacting with you all and we really appreciate you.
• 1:13
  I Hate Talking: Precisely.
• 1:15
  I Hate Talking: So, we will again follow the normal format of our show for this particular milestone, and that will be to start with a word or phrase of the episode.
• 1:27
  I Hate Talking: And today's word or phrase is synethesia.
• 1:30
  I Hate Talking: It's a hard word.
• 1:33
  I Hate Talking: If you can't tell, also, I'm sick, so my voice might feel like it probably sounds off.
• 1:40
  I Hate Talking: So I'm not even gonna try to say the word cause on a normal day, that would be harder for me.
• 1:45
  I Hate Talking: And today, having this cold, it's gonna be worse.
• 1:49
  I Hate Talking: And we've been teasing this particular word or phrase of the episode and the topic as well, since our episode that dropped on November 21st, 2024, which was episode 34.
• 2:05
  I Hate Talking: Wow, like over 2 months then.
• 2:09
  I Hate Talking: That is true.
• 2:10
  I Hate Talking: Has it been part of your mental load?
• 2:12
  I Hate Talking: Only when you mention it.
• 2:15
  I Hate Talking: And when we're going through our weekly or like family schedule or plans, you'll mention it occasionally, and I'll be, I'll get to it.
• 2:24
  I Hate Talking: I'll get to it.
• 2:25
  I Hate Talking: But now, I don't think about it until you bring it up.
• 2:27
  I Hate Talking: Yeah, I suppose we just need to put it in our cello list so that it is not part of our mental load -- or my mental load anyway because -- has it been part of -- your mental load -- if it if it's not written down.
• 2:39
  I Hate Talking: And there's sort of maybe a breaking point where I expect to get to something by a certain time period that I will just make it part of my mental checklist rather than actually writing it down, but it's been too long and I should have written it down, but it has been part of my mental load that along with keto and sourdough.
• 3:01
  I Hate Talking: And there's probably some other topic that I'm forgetting.
• 3:04
  I Hate Talking: OK, well, can I play devil's advocate and maybe it's not that, maybe it's because it wasn't part of my mental load, cause I've literally only think about it when you mention it, so you are carrying that mental load instead of me.
• 3:18
  I Hate Talking: I suppose so, but I also think it has something to do with the fact that you don't particularly care if we get to that topic.
• 3:26
  I Hate Talking: I, I think it's great and I want to talk about it, but Guys, I'm sorry, my voice.
• 3:33
  I Hate Talking: I want to talk about it, but it's not the end all be all.
• 3:37
  I Hate Talking: It's not like when I know I have a deadline to sign the kids up for their sport and the deadline before it gets filled.
• 3:47
  I Hate Talking: Like that is urgent for me.
• 3:50
  I Hate Talking: This isn't.
• 3:51
  I Hate Talking: I suppose so, but maybe we lost a listener that was waiting for the synesthesia episode, and then we never got it in the last 8 episodes, and now they don't listen anymore.
• 4:00
  I Hate Talking: Well, then it just wasn't destiny for them.
• 4:02
  I Hate Talking: So we also have a purple drink in honor of our Syneheia episode.
• 4:10
  I Hate Talking: Last time it was also a purple beer, which last time it was the wicked weed pernicious IPA.
• 4:16
  I Hate Talking: This is a different purple IPA.
• 4:18
  I Hate Talking: I don't feel like purple is a common beer color, is it?
• 4:23
  I Hate Talking: Apparently it is because this is Sierra Nevada's cryo Fresh torpedo, wet hop IPA.
• 4:33
  I Hate Talking: Well, that sounds delicious.
• 4:35
  I Hate Talking: Good job.
• 4:35
  I Hate Talking: Enjoy.
• 4:36
  I Hate Talking: So that is in honor of the favorite color discussion that we had as part of the Synethesia teaser.
• 4:44
  I Hate Talking: So now we'll get to finally our word or phrase of the episode, synethesia.
• 4:50
  I Hate Talking: Excellent.
• 4:51
  I Hate Talking: So it does have a root word that probably most people are familiar with.
• 4:57
  I Hate Talking: Sin, which is meaning from the Greek together.
• 5:02
  I Hate Talking: So we actually even used this in some of our previous episodes when we talked about synonyms, words that sound the same.
• 5:10
  I Hate Talking: So that is the root word sin together, and then I think we were actually pronouncing it correctly in our episode on November 21st and then I think we found some other resources that actually had the incorrect word synthesia, which is not what we're talking about, we're talking about syneesia.
• 5:34
  I Hate Talking: And because there's the E in between the synaia.
• 5:40
  I Hate Talking: Correct.
• 5:40
  I Hate Talking: Oh I said I wasn't gonna say the word, and I think I did.
• 5:44
  I Hate Talking: -- I think -- he did it.
• 5:45
  I Hate Talking: I just got got in my head for a while there, I'm good.
• 5:47
  I Hate Talking: So, the synesthesia may be familiar with that latter part of the word, the second part of the word, anesthesia, where there is some sort of dulling of the senses through some sort of medical procedure.
• 6:06
  I Hate Talking: Which also comes from the Greek, anesthesia and which means without and a thesis, which means.
• 6:16
  I Hate Talking: Sensation, a thesis is a sensation and the and is without, so when you have anesthesia applied, you don't have any more sensation.
• 6:26
  I Hate Talking: So this word of the day.
• 6:29
  I Hate Talking: Exactly.
• 6:30
  I Hate Talking: synesthesia then means that you have combined sensations for a particular input within your senses.
• 6:40
  I Hate Talking: So it's like the opposite for sure.
• 6:42
  I Hate Talking: So anesthesia means it stops the sensations.
• 6:46
  I Hate Talking: That's why you have it when you have pain or surgeries.
• 6:49
  I Hate Talking: Synesthesia would be having excessive almost, or multiple.
• 6:56
  I Hate Talking: Precisely, yes, that's right.
• 6:59
  I Hate Talking: Right.
• 6:59
  I Hate Talking: Now it's also interesting to note that the word thesis in the English comes from the Greek, and that has a completely different meaning and root word where you are putting something forth.
• 7:15
  I Hate Talking: So when you have a thesis statement, you are making or proclaiming or putting something forth that you are claiming as truth.
• 7:24
  I Hate Talking: Whereas this word, synethesia has long E sound and means sensation.
• 7:33
  I Hate Talking: So upon some further research that I did upon this because they are both Greek root words.
• 7:40
  I Hate Talking: In terms of a thesis for sensation and thesis for putting something forth, can't potentially say this is 100% true because we are not Greek speakers, is that the word thesis would have actually been pronounced thesis.
• 7:57
  I Hate Talking: During the Greek period.
• 8:00
  I Hate Talking: I Correct.
• 8:04
  I Hate Talking: Wow, we're just getting so much information here.
• 8:06
  I Hate Talking: We do have a lot of information on this podcast, you can tell us whether it is helpful or not.
• 8:12
  I Hate Talking: On that note, one of our kids was doing a rough draft of a report, and I was helping him.
• 8:20
  I Hate Talking: I checked it and was helping him check it for errors.
• 8:25
  I Hate Talking: I asked him like, what's this word?
• 8:27
  I Hate Talking: He goes, I was trying to write in Old English.
• 8:30
  I Hate Talking: So he was writing as if he was a character in like the 1800s, and which is super clever, and I love that about him.
• 8:40
  I Hate Talking: And I was like, what's this word?
• 8:42
  I Hate Talking: And he's like, It's the word the.
• 8:45
  I Hate Talking: And he spelled it T H E A U.
• 8:49
  I Hate Talking: like um he's like, oh, I forget.
• 8:54
  I Hate Talking: Should we just do T A H E and then hopefully they'll read it the proper way.
• 8:59
  I Hate Talking: Yeah He was trying to get his point across that it was old English.
• 9:05
  I Hate Talking: English.
• 9:05
  I Hate Talking: He was afraid they were going to read it as the he wanted them to read it as the.
• 9:10
  I Hate Talking: Well, the theses and Es are important in King James, and we do have an IV and ESV, so perhaps another topic for another day on Bible translations.
• 9:21
  I Hate Talking: Yeah.
• 9:22
  I Hate Talking: Oh, that's been a hot topic in our house, so we should.
• 9:25
  I Hate Talking: But right now we're talking about the thing that's been on your mental load for 2 months.
• 9:31
  I Hate Talking: Synesthesia, so.
• 9:34
  I Hate Talking: We've talked about the root words, sin that means with or together and the athesia, which means sensation, so multiple sensations.
• 9:45
  I Hate Talking: In the modern English, and really this actually became a word even in the modern English within the last perhaps 4 decades or so, is that synesthesia is a perceptual phenomenon where stimulation of one sense triggers involuntary experiences in another.
• 10:06
  I Hate Talking: So this means that when you hear music or perhaps a particular note played that you will see a color, or that when you look at a number, that you will see that in some sort of color.
• 10:22
  I Hate Talking: And experience multiple senses at once, even though there is typically only one input sense being stimulated.
• 10:32
  I Hate Talking: So, this, according to various research, and again, this is actually relatively new in the realm of psychological research because it really is only within the past 40 years that this has been studied.
• 10:47
  I Hate Talking: is that it is present in 2 to 4% of the population.
• 10:53
  I Hate Talking: It's Typically more seen within women.
• 10:58
  I Hate Talking: And there are more common variants where the common variants are numbers and auditory tones produce colors.
• 11:10
  I Hate Talking: Yeah.
• 11:12
  I Hate Talking: So, I guess, um, in the research I did, it talks about, this was definitely referenced in the early 1900s as well, but it really was only researched and kind of formated more recently, you said in the 40 years.
• 11:28
  I Hate Talking: But I did my own personal research here at our home base with our child that we suspect has this, but also, um, like you said, it's 2 to 4% of the population, and there's a slight marker that it's hereditary, but it's not definite or always the case, which obviously, when you see 2 to 4%.
• 11:54
  I Hate Talking: That's a hard population to pin down.
• 11:57
  I Hate Talking: That's true.
• 11:58
  I Hate Talking: And part of the reason that this has not been well documented is actually because of sort of the methods used for psychological research in the past is that the psychological research did not really rely on the reporting of the patient themselves.
• 12:19
  I Hate Talking: So they would basically need to actually study this within like a controlled experiment or Some form of measured scientific experiment and they did not really rely on the actual input from the person that they are studying.
• 12:37
  I Hate Talking: So a person may actually report that they saw colors of a number.
• 12:43
  I Hate Talking: But that would be particularly discounted because you couldn't really measure it.
• 12:48
  I Hate Talking: Whereas with some of the modern day things that we can do with neuroscience and measuring actual brain activity, as well as just the fact that we rely more on the reported effects and experiences of people, that this has gained traction in terms of the research that has been done.
• 13:11
  I Hate Talking: Again, quote unquote recently, but more within the 4 decades or so leading up to this point.
• 13:16
  I Hate Talking: Right.
• 13:17
  I Hate Talking: And also, for those who may or may not have this, the research shows that either you're born with it possibly, or you develop it in early childhood.
• 13:28
  I Hate Talking: It's rare that you develop this as an adult.
• 13:31
  I Hate Talking: It happens, I guess there's cases, but it's very, very uncommon.
• 13:36
  I Hate Talking: So like for me in my dreams, and one day maybe we'll talk about this sleep thing I have.
• 13:43
  I Hate Talking: I did not know people did not dream like I do, and most of our kids now cause they tell me stories too, and I figured it out.
• 13:52
  I Hate Talking: But I did not know until I went to college and started taking psychology courses that people don't dream like I do.
• 13:59
  I Hate Talking: Like this is what I know, this is normal.
• 14:03
  I Hate Talking: So I think a lot of individuals maybe have possibly, this is just my theory, I'm not.
• 14:11
  I Hate Talking: A professional in any sense, but like in my head, I'm thinking, if this is what you've known since early childhood, This isn't something necessarily to bring up.
• 14:23
  I Hate Talking: Like, I didn't talk to people about like my dreams and how I can change them and control them, cause that, I just thought everyone did it.
• 14:33
  I Hate Talking: Like, this is just life.
• 14:34
  I Hate Talking: So if you see these, if you make these connections with colors and sounds or numbers and colors or whatever.
• 14:42
  I Hate Talking: Maybe you just think this is just how life is, and you don't report it or talk to the doctor about it, cause that's life.
• 14:50
  I Hate Talking: That is very true.
• 14:52
  I Hate Talking: I think that actually has a name when you are experiencing life and you just assume that everybody else experiences.
• 15:00
  I Hate Talking: I think it's actually one of the words that's not an English word that is like one of the words in the top 10 other languages, words that like define experience, so maybe we'll find that.
• 15:11
  I Hate Talking: Adam's new mental load word.
• 15:15
  I Hate Talking: You're gonna think about this until we talk about it.
• 15:17
  I Hate Talking: Well, I'm gonna go research what that's actually called and mark it down.
• 15:20
  I Hate Talking: And then also for those that are wondering about the dream state that you're describing where you potentially can control your own dream, that would be called lucid dreaming.
• 15:31
  I Hate Talking: But back to synethesia.
• 15:34
  I Hate Talking: So there also, like you said, is a indication that it happens hereditary and also within young children, you don't really develop this as a an adult.
• 15:48
  I Hate Talking: But there's also some overlap potentially with the autism spectrum condition where people on the spectrum would have some of the synesesia.
• 16:01
  I Hate Talking: And there's a variety of different styles of synesthesia and they have their own names.
• 16:08
  I Hate Talking: We've already described some of the ones with the fact that you would see colors with either reading numbers or hearing sounds, but there's actually ones that are associated with auditory tactile where you hear a sound and actually feel physical things or mere touch where you are touching something and feel touch somewhere else within your body.
• 16:32
  I Hate Talking: So there are a whole host of different synesthesia experiences where those senses overlap one from the other or even multiple or the same sense where you are experiencing those things.
• 16:49
  I Hate Talking: I also think that perhaps young children.
• 16:54
  I Hate Talking: Have this.
• 16:56
  I Hate Talking: And that As a society, we.
• 17:00
  I Hate Talking: Teach this out of their experience.
• 17:04
  I Hate Talking: So, for example, this is again going to rely somewhat on my own experience is that I seem to recall when I was a small child.
• 17:15
  I Hate Talking: That I would have shapes associated with numbers.
• 17:19
  I Hate Talking: And that would be something that falls within the synesthesia category.
• 17:23
  I Hate Talking: And I still retain some of this to this very day, where I will be able to look at a formula or set of numbers and Sort of feel if it is correct or not.
• 17:38
  I Hate Talking: So this actually happened just this very week.
• 17:42
  I Hate Talking: OK, tell me that what happened?
• 17:43
  I Hate Talking: So there was a formula, a set of 4 numbers added together that resulted in a total.
• 17:51
  I Hate Talking: These numbers were 136, 25, and 9.
• 17:56
  I Hate Talking: And the total given was 150, and I knew that was wrong by just looking at it.
• 18:03
  I Hate Talking: I did not calculate it.
• 18:04
  I Hate Talking: I did not do any sort of mental calculation in my mind to add those numbers together.
• 18:09
  I Hate Talking: I just knew that 150 was incorrect because they were not, they didn't, they didn't fit.
• 18:15
  I Hate Talking: That's a good, yes, that's a good way of saying it because I do see it, I think, roughly as a shape.
• 18:21
  I Hate Talking: OK.
• 18:21
  I Hate Talking: And I knew it was wrong.
• 18:23
  I Hate Talking: So I didn't know exactly what was wrong with it.
• 18:25
  I Hate Talking: I didn't know if it was too high or too low.
• 18:28
  I Hate Talking: But I knew it was incorrect.
• 18:30
  I Hate Talking: And then I can do the mental calculation to add up all those numbers and arrive at the correct result of 152.
• 18:38
  I Hate Talking: But I had to do the extra steps.
• 18:40
  I Hate Talking: I feel like as a child.
• 18:42
  I Hate Talking: That I could just look at it and know that it was 152 and I wouldn't have to actually do the mental calculations.
• 18:49
  I Hate Talking: So I still retain some of that ability today that I can look at something and know whether it's right or not.
• 18:56
  I Hate Talking: And I do spend a bit of my time at my vocation and job looking at spreadsheets.
• 19:02
  I Hate Talking: And I also have the same experience to some degree.
• 19:06
  I Hate Talking: In that as well, where, you know, if there's a formula that is incorrect within the spreadsheet and results in something that is the wrong result that I'll be able just to look at it and tell that it's wrong.
• 19:18
  I Hate Talking: And again, not know exactly why it's wrong or even necessarily what direction it is wrong, if it's too high, too low, whatever the case may be.
• 19:27
  I Hate Talking: But I just know that it is incorrect.
• 19:30
  I Hate Talking: Do you remember in your head right now, thinking back to earlier this week?
• 19:35
  I Hate Talking: Do you have a figure like a not number figure, but like a Shape in your head that you can think of.
• 19:43
  I Hate Talking: Cause when you're talking, I'm like, OK, there's like a rectangle here and a triangle that fits over it.
• 19:48
  I Hate Talking: Now they're 3 dimensional, maybe 4 dimensional shapes.
• 19:53
  I Hate Talking: They can't even picture that.
• 19:55
  I Hate Talking: They're definitively not two dimensional, OK.
• 19:59
  I Hate Talking: Huh, so, can you give any more definition of like what you are picturing?
• 20:04
  I Hate Talking: Or if you can't, that's fine too.
• 20:06
  I Hate Talking: Now, see, and I think this is where it has been trained out of me because of the routine mathematical procedure that is normal within elementary school that you do the addition, subtraction, long division, multiplication, and you get very good at times tables and things of that nature.
• 20:26
  I Hate Talking: But that if you hadn't been trained, and this actually I think is part of Einstein's experience perhaps, where he was like super gifted as a child, maybe I'm thinking of Edison, one of those two, Einstein or Edison, we'll start with the.
• 20:42
  I Hate Talking: That they were like super gifted as a child.
• 20:48
  I Hate Talking: Mathematically, and then they went to school and we're still really, really good at math.
• 20:53
  I Hate Talking: They lost this like intrinsic ability of just looking at numbers and knowing what things were.
• 21:01
  I Hate Talking: Einstein was sent home because they thought he was developmentally incapable of learning.
• 21:07
  I Hate Talking: I think I'm pretty sure it was Einstein.
• 21:10
  I Hate Talking: I'm pretty sure that's that that anecdote is about.
• 21:13
  I Hate Talking: Yeah, the famous story of Einstein is that his mom was told he's too dumb.
• 21:19
  I Hate Talking: He can't come here anymore, and so she started homeschooling him.
• 21:22
  I Hate Talking: And then obviously he's who he is.
• 21:25
  I Hate Talking: We can talk about that sometime, cause maybe that's not true, but that's like the lore that I hear in the homeschool world.
• 21:31
  I Hate Talking: OK, so I'm so interested.
• 21:35
  I Hate Talking: You do not know what happened today in our home, and I love hearing this about you.
• 21:40
  I Hate Talking: And I want to talk about this specifically because it affects us.
• 21:46
  I Hate Talking: And maybe y'all listening, that matters to what You all obviously want to hear what affects you.
• 21:53
  I Hate Talking: When I was doing some research on this, because I didn't want to come in completely naive, like, oh, I remember hearing this 20 years ago.
• 22:02
  I Hate Talking: I wanted to know what I was talking about.
• 22:05
  I Hate Talking: I talked to our child that we suspect has this.
• 22:08
  I Hate Talking: And I realized that he hasn't mentioned it in a while.
• 22:13
  I Hate Talking: And so I asked him like, hey, do you still see colors when you talk about numbers?
• 22:21
  I Hate Talking: And he asked like, what am I talking about?
• 22:24
  I Hate Talking: And I was like, well, when you're younger, you used to say like, 2 was the color red.
• 22:30
  I Hate Talking: And his words verbatim were.
• 22:33
  I Hate Talking: I don't do that anymore.
• 22:35
  I Hate Talking: But 2 is yellow.
• 22:37
  I Hate Talking: And I thought that was really interesting.
• 22:41
  I Hate Talking: His sibling butted in.
• 22:43
  I Hate Talking: And I was like, no, 2.
• 22:46
  I Hate Talking: I, you said a different color.
• 22:49
  I Hate Talking: And then this first child said, 1 is red, 2 is yellow, 3 is blue, and then just continued on with this conversation.
• 23:01
  I Hate Talking: And I just thought it was interesting that he said, I don't do that anymore.
• 23:06
  I Hate Talking: But then he was able to quickly correct me on the facts.
• 23:10
  I Hate Talking: So I think that does lend some support to the fact that modern day teaching of mathematical concepts drives this out of people and that this may be some sort of intrinsic ability that humans have that gives them greater capacity and control over mathematical function and other things that they have to think through because Again, this actually can be associated with words or sounds or touch that in our modern day instructional style that it actually drives out this ability and you use sort of your cognition to do The calculations rather than whatever this extra ability is.
• 24:03
  I Hate Talking: Right, so that's what I want to talk about.
• 24:05
  I Hate Talking: I thought it was crazy interesting hearing him say that.
• 24:09
  I Hate Talking: So, matter of fact and quick, and then hearing you recollect this strange memory from almost 40 years ago.
• 24:18
  I Hate Talking: So my question to you is like, how do we stop this?
• 24:22
  I Hate Talking: Cause I can see a benefit in it.
• 24:24
  I Hate Talking: We haven't told him he's wrong.
• 24:27
  I Hate Talking: In fact, when he was younger and I'd hear him say it.
• 24:31
  I Hate Talking: There's a TV show called Number Blocks.
• 24:34
  I Hate Talking: So at first I thought maybe he was referencing that.
• 24:37
  I Hate Talking: But the colors didn't line up.
• 24:39
  I Hate Talking: And I asked him, and he's like, they get it wrong.
• 24:42
  I Hate Talking: Like that was his answer.
• 24:44
  I Hate Talking: They get those colors wrong.
• 24:46
  I Hate Talking: And I was like, well, I guess he really has this, cause I have met one other legitimate person I know for sure.
• 24:53
  I Hate Talking: In college that have this, they were really into it, and this was like, very obvious in their life.
• 25:00
  I Hate Talking: He's not calling back to this TV show we watch a lot.
• 25:04
  I Hate Talking: He said they'd get it wrong.
• 25:06
  I Hate Talking: They're not those colors.
• 25:08
  I Hate Talking: And even when our other child corrected him.
• 25:12
  I Hate Talking: And he corrected him back.
• 25:14
  I Hate Talking: I went back and looked in number blocks, the TV show.
• 25:19
  I Hate Talking: Her 2nd child was referencing the number block's colors.
• 25:25
  I Hate Talking: And this child was correcting him.
• 25:28
  I Hate Talking: Which makes me think, oh, that one remembers the number blocks TV show.
• 25:33
  I Hate Talking: And this child was like, no, they get it wrong, that's not the colors.
• 25:37
  I Hate Talking: But I do not ever want him to think he's wrong by thinking that.
• 25:42
  I Hate Talking: So by his callous answer of just like, I don't do that anymore.
• 25:46
  I Hate Talking: We didn't tell him that's weird.
• 25:49
  I Hate Talking: I mean, that's horrible.
• 25:51
  I Hate Talking: If you all do that, it's not weird.
• 25:53
  I Hate Talking: But like, we didn't say those words.
• 25:54
  I Hate Talking: We didn't tell him that's not normal, that 96% of the population doesn't do that.
• 26:01
  I Hate Talking: We did not tell him anything.
• 26:04
  I Hate Talking: We just kind of, in our parenting, we kind of like ask questions, but also just kind of leave it open-ended.
• 26:11
  I Hate Talking: Unless we have a strong opinion on something.
• 26:14
  I Hate Talking: So I wonder where he's getting that.
• 26:18
  I Hate Talking: Are we putting that into him that he's wrong by thinking that?
• 26:22
  I Hate Talking: Or why does he quote unquote, not do that anymore?
• 26:25
  I Hate Talking: Well, I think in terms of calculating numbers through either shapes or color combinations.
• 26:34
  I Hate Talking: So addition, multiplication.
• 26:37
  I Hate Talking: Subtraction, division, which really division is subtraction in many, many times over and same thing for multiplication just being addition multiple times over and over.
• 26:51
  I Hate Talking: That Maybe because the majority of the population does not have that ability or just because that is what we have decided is the right way to do things as a society is to actually do the calculations and add the numbers together and not just look at the numbers and see that the blue number plus the red number equals the purple number or that the number shaped like.
• 27:22
  I Hate Talking: Such and such, plus the number.
• 27:24
  I Hate Talking: Sad like such and such.
• 27:26
  I Hate Talking: Looks like this shape, which is equivalent to this number.
• 27:30
  I Hate Talking: That that is not repeatable.
• 27:34
  I Hate Talking: Or experimental in nature where it can be repeated over and over again that we discount those things.
• 27:42
  I Hate Talking: Should I encourage this in him or how should I approach it from then on?
• 27:48
  I Hate Talking: Yeah, I think you have to live in the.
• 27:52
  I Hate Talking: 96% world.
• 27:54
  I Hate Talking: If you have some sort of special ability where you're in the 4% or less that.
• 28:00
  I Hate Talking: That may not be recognized by the majority and you just need to.
• 28:06
  I Hate Talking: Do what the majority does, but Still retained perhaps some of that ability.
• 28:13
  I Hate Talking: That sets you apart or.
• 28:16
  I Hate Talking: Makes you special, but it's not really necessarily.
• 28:21
  I Hate Talking: The primary Method of anything.
• 28:26
  I Hate Talking: So now looking back.
• 28:29
  I Hate Talking: Do you think that math or problems or anything like that would be easier for you if you honed in On those shape number problems, or does it not really matter?
• 28:43
  I Hate Talking: So I think for precise math.
• 28:46
  I Hate Talking: And maybe that's also a difference is that you have to do the calculations to arrive at a very specific number.
• 28:54
  I Hate Talking: With decimal places and things of that nature that maybe synethesia in terms of colors and shapes of numbers would get you.
• 29:04
  I Hate Talking: The 3 as pi, but in the scientific world that we live in.
• 29:09
  I Hate Talking: Where we need to go to 3.14 or beyond.
• 29:14
  I Hate Talking: That synethesia will not serve you in that particular instance, and you need to know the exact calculations.
• 29:22
  I Hate Talking: What does that mean with our, with pie with our kids, different kid.
• 29:27
  I Hate Talking: Oh, we have so many kids.
• 29:29
  I Hate Talking: But when they were telling you, they were stressed out about pie, and you were like 3.14 is good enough.
• 29:37
  I Hate Talking: Just that'll get you through life, don't worry.
• 29:39
  I Hate Talking: Do you remember that?
• 29:41
  I Hate Talking: I do, yes, and that does get people through most of life.
• 29:45
  I Hate Talking: You really only need to know how many digits of pi.
• 29:48
  I Hate Talking: Really, in the antiquated world, 3 got them through most of the things that they needed to do.
• 29:56
  I Hate Talking: So unless you're designing the next space shuttle or something, I think 3.14 is gonna serve you very well.
• 30:02
  I Hate Talking: OK, this is super niche.
• 30:04
  I Hate Talking: For the few people that know me in childhood, but I will say it cause you're listening.
• 30:12
  I Hate Talking: I know some of you are.
• 30:13
  I Hate Talking: There's a time.
• 30:14
  I Hate Talking: Have you ever heard this story of summer camp?
• 30:17
  I Hate Talking: I was at summer camp with my church people, and we had one kid who's extremely intelligent.
• 30:23
  I Hate Talking: Is this in the Death Valley camp or a different one?
• 30:25
  I Hate Talking: Oh, a different one.
• 30:27
  I Hate Talking: Good question though.
• 30:28
  I Hate Talking: This is a much smaller, very precise camp.
• 30:31
  I Hate Talking: I didn't know you could get smaller than Death Valley.
• 30:34
  I Hate Talking: No, Death Valley is the hottest.
• 30:36
  I Hate Talking: Oh my goodness, the hottest.
• 30:39
  I Hate Talking: Oh my goodness, don't get me started.
• 30:41
  I Hate Talking: -- The hottest camp all around -- come to Death Valley.
• 30:45
  I Hate Talking: -- Death Valley -- they really say that when they advertise it, the hottest summer camp around.
• 30:50
  I Hate Talking: I don't know.
• 30:50
  I Hate Talking: I didn't see the ad I did not see advertisements.
• 30:53
  I Hate Talking: My parents just sent me there, but it is the hottest place on earth, and we had to go there in August, in the hottest month of the year.
• 31:03
  I Hate Talking: And have to wear full clothing, like no shorts or anything cause that's immodest.
• 31:09
  I Hate Talking: Anyways, well, we can talk about that another time.
• 31:12
  I Hate Talking: It's amazing.
• 31:13
  I Hate Talking: I love my time there.
• 31:14
  I Hate Talking: I really did.
• 31:15
  I Hate Talking: And that's not satire.
• 31:16
  I Hate Talking: I loved it.
• 31:17
  I Hate Talking: I wouldn't probably send my kids there, but I loved my experience.
• 31:21
  I Hate Talking: This camp, they had a talent show, and we had this kid at our church that was so smart, probably one of the still, still to this day, one of the smartest people I personally know.
• 31:32
  I Hate Talking: He memorized high to, I don't know, 100 and something digits.
• 31:38
  I Hate Talking: He stood up there and said it all.
• 31:41
  I Hate Talking: And it, it takes a long time.
• 31:44
  I Hate Talking: So then we all get up and we do this extremely long, unexciting dance as a group.
• 31:52
  I Hate Talking: It was not good.
• 31:54
  I Hate Talking: But it was very choreographed and all that.
• 31:58
  I Hate Talking: And then we could tell the crowd was getting very bored of it.
• 32:02
  I Hate Talking: And so then we had him stand up and start at pie again, and the audible groan from the audience was hilarious.
• 32:11
  I Hate Talking: But it was all planned.
• 32:13
  I Hate Talking: We knew that would happen.
• 32:15
  I Hate Talking: But it's still, I can still hear it, feel it.
• 32:18
  I Hate Talking: Uh, it's a big lore part of the people I grew up with and I love it.
• 32:24
  I Hate Talking: But yes, so pie, so you're saying that syneheia would get you to 3, would get you to the closest number.
• 32:33
  I Hate Talking: And you can figure it out from there.
• 32:35
  I Hate Talking: If you don't know i to the 100th digit, that's OK.
• 32:39
  I Hate Talking: You can figure it out once you get there.
• 32:41
  I Hate Talking: I have never memorized pie nor no pie.
• 32:46
  I Hate Talking: I would be curious to know if the person that was reciting pie saw Pie as colors and was actually using that as a way methodology to recall the numerical values.
• 32:59
  I Hate Talking: All right, let's see who knows how many pies cause he's told me.
• 33:03
  I Hate Talking: Ready?
• 33:03
  I Hate Talking: Let's do it together.
• 33:04
  I Hate Talking: -- 3.41 -- I beat you there.
• 33:09
  I Hate Talking: Let's let's do it again.
• 33:11
  I Hate Talking: Restart 3.141516379.
• 33:20
  I Hate Talking: Well there you go.
• 33:22
  I Hate Talking: You can design the rocket.
• 33:24
  I Hate Talking: There's not really in modern day a lot of use of circles.
• 33:28
  I Hate Talking: Everything is squares and rectangles.
• 33:30
  I Hate Talking: What color's a rectangle?
• 33:32
  I Hate Talking: What color is rectangle?
• 33:35
  I Hate Talking: A square is like a dark, deep blue, and a rectangle is like a light blue.
• 33:40
  I Hate Talking: OK, that's not what our child said.
• 33:43
  I Hate Talking: See, and that is also the reason that synethesia has been discounted for so long is that people have different colors for different numbers and shapes.
• 33:52
  I Hate Talking: So because there is no consistency, they just think it's Bunk.
• 33:57
  I Hate Talking: Right, like, you're just making stuff up.
• 33:58
  I Hate Talking: Yeah.
• 33:59
  I Hate Talking: When I asked that, they were like, why are you asking?
• 34:01
  I Hate Talking: And I was like, I don't know, and I quickly summarized all this.
• 34:05
  I Hate Talking: I was like, like, what color is the triangle?
• 34:07
  I Hate Talking: And without blinking, he said, yellow.
• 34:11
  I Hate Talking: Well, that's interesting cause I was thinking yellow because I don't know if I really like triangles, and we still haven't found the sweater, but triangles and that sweater and the yellow color are just off-putting to me.
• 34:23
  I Hate Talking: What do you mean a sweater?
• 34:25
  I Hate Talking: Well, clearly you don't listen to our podcast because we talked about the putrid yellow sweater that you would wear and I would hate and other people loved.
• 34:35
  I Hate Talking: My favorite, yes, my favorite but I got compliments on all the time.
• 34:40
  I Hate Talking: Y'all, my birthday is coming up.
• 34:43
  I Hate Talking: And I'm a big celebration person.
• 34:47
  I Hate Talking: No matter who you are, like, I love to celebrate everybody for existing, no matter anyone.
• 34:55
  I Hate Talking: So, I also love to celebrate my existence.
• 34:59
  I Hate Talking: And I was looking for a new sweater, cause it's winter.
• 35:04
  I Hate Talking: And every sweater I liked was yellow.
• 35:09
  I Hate Talking: And I withheld buying it, cause I know you hate it so much.
• 35:13
  I Hate Talking: But they're so cute and they look so good on me.
• 35:17
  I Hate Talking: Perhaps so.
• 35:19
  I Hate Talking: We still have not found the yellow sweater, so maybe you got rid of it.
• 35:23
  I Hate Talking: -- I know you did -- actually.
• 35:24
  I Hate Talking: -- I listened to it's -- not a sweater.
• 35:26
  I Hate Talking: It's a t-shirt, by the way.
• 35:28
  I Hate Talking: I listened.
• 35:28
  I Hate Talking: Oh well, that makes sense.
• 35:29
  I Hate Talking: It was a shirt.
• 35:30
  I Hate Talking: That's why I was confused.
• 35:31
  I Hate Talking: It's a shirt, a short sleeve shirt, and you got rid of it.
• 35:34
  I Hate Talking: -- I know -- you did.
• 35:35
  I Hate Talking: Our listeners can go back and listen to episode 34 just like I did tonight.
• 35:40
  I Hate Talking: And you said that you got rid of it in that episode.
• 35:44
  I Hate Talking: Um, maybe I did, but I shouldn't though.
• 35:48
  I Hate Talking: You should just get over it and accept it's my color.
• 35:51
  I Hate Talking: So, there you go.
• 35:54
  I Hate Talking: Triangles and yellow, not my favorite.
• 35:56
  I Hate Talking: I like blue squares.
• 36:00
  I Hate Talking: And Numbers that are shaped like -- shapes that I can't describe in -- blue.
• 36:07
  I Hate Talking: Yeah, but also purple and gray and.
• 36:11
  I Hate Talking: Circles are acceptable.
• 36:14
  I Hate Talking: I've never thought about this before, but instantly when you were talking, -- like -- people ask what your favorite color is, like, why don't you ask what your favorite shape is.
• 36:22
  I Hate Talking: Can we, can we start that, be like, hi, my name is Steph.
• 36:27
  I Hate Talking: What's your favorite shape?
• 36:29
  I Hate Talking: I think we should.
• 36:30
  I Hate Talking: That is so weird.
• 36:32
  I Hate Talking: When you were talking though, I instantly was like my brain flashed a circle and purple.
• 36:39
  I Hate Talking: So I guess purple and, but not purple, OK y'all, not purple lilac.
• 36:45
  I Hate Talking: I recently heard someone talking and lilac is the color I like.
• 36:49
  I Hate Talking: Don't be sending me -- purple -- purple.
• 36:52
  I Hate Talking: We said lavender last time, so lilac is more lilac.
• 36:56
  I Hate Talking: Yes, I learned the difference.
• 36:59
  I Hate Talking: lilac is what I like.
• 37:01
  I Hate Talking: I like circles and lilac, and you like squares and blue?
• 37:06
  I Hate Talking: What did you say?
• 37:07
  I Hate Talking: I think I like squares which are blue.
• 37:10
  I Hate Talking: -- But I like they're -- not squares.
• 37:14
  I Hate Talking: I don't know.
• 37:15
  I Hate Talking: That's just what I see.
• 37:16
  I Hate Talking: And then I like gray, but also like we talked about last time and even to some degree this time I like purple.
• 37:22
  I Hate Talking: But do you like purple purple?
• 37:24
  I Hate Talking: -- Like this is purple -- torpedo IPA that's, yeah, like the royal purple.
• 37:29
  I Hate Talking: Yes, -- you like royal purple -- sort of the background of our podcast.
• 37:33
  I Hate Talking: Yes, purple.
• 37:34
  I Hate Talking: And you like square.
• 37:36
  I Hate Talking: I don't think I like squares cause it's too sharp on the edges.
• 37:39
  I Hate Talking: Did you do look around it, so when you get your nails done.
• 37:43
  I Hate Talking: Well, that has never happened.
• 37:46
  I Hate Talking: Well, but if you did, they'll ask you square or rounded.
• 37:51
  I Hate Talking: And then you'll If you're my generation say square, and then they'll say rounded square, and you say yes.
• 37:59
  I Hate Talking: And that's like a square.
• 38:01
  I Hate Talking: But then the edges are off, so it's not pokey.
• 38:05
  I Hate Talking: Do you like that kind of square?
• 38:07
  I Hate Talking: Or do you like Pokey Square?
• 38:09
  I Hate Talking: I don't know.
• 38:11
  I Hate Talking: Do you enjoy this sharp edge, 90 degree, so you like 90 degree squares.
• 38:20
  I Hate Talking: Or look at look he's looking at right now, two edges are rounded.
• 38:27
  I Hate Talking: Which 2 and then 2 are 90 degree, which do you, which are you drawn to?
• 38:33
  I Hate Talking: Mm, maybe in between there, I would, I would like rounded with like a 5 degree rounding.
• 38:42
  I Hate Talking: This is too rounded for you?
• 38:44
  I Hate Talking: Yes.
• 38:45
  I Hate Talking: I don't know how we're gonna keep all this.
• 38:48
  I Hate Talking: We're going way off topic.
• 38:50
  I Hate Talking: We're a podcast and talked about very visual things.
• 38:54
  I Hate Talking: I'll put it in our Instagram.
• 38:56
  I Hate Talking: You can come look and now we have YouTube too, so YouTube.
• 38:59
  I Hate Talking: We can put it on YouTube.
• 39:00
  I Hate Talking: You can watch our podcast logo while you're listening.
• 39:04
  I Hate Talking: -- Maybe -- one day we'll have TikTok, not banned it anymore.
• 39:07
  I Hate Talking: I doubt it.
• 39:08
  I Hate Talking: So, from your friends that I hate talking, until next time, remember, it is only through talking that we begin the journey to understanding.