Latest / Pod Therapy / #436: Rageful Resentment, Genetic Psych Meds, Work in Masters Program

Transcript

#436: Rageful Resentment, Genetic Psych Meds, Work in Masters Program · Pod Therapy

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  Speaker 1: Price is silver lining, is what I'm saying.
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  Speaker 1: Mental Health Awareness Month. And we've got some great questions
• 4:42
  Speaker 1: for today's show, starting with our longtime friend and therap
• 4:47
  Speaker 1: producer Tess, who we've been running a go fundme campaign
• 4:50
  Speaker 1: for because Tess didn't start the fire. And here's the
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: letter allegedly lazy. Yeah. Buckle up, y'all because this one
• 4:59
  Speaker 1: is a doozy. It's tests. Thank you so much for
• 5:02
  Speaker 1: reading my recent medication update. I come with more info
• 5:06
  Speaker 1: and also an update on some questions I'm processing after
• 5:10
  Speaker 1: a trauma read house fire. As you know by now,
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: Dustin and I have gone through a house fire. What
• 5:17
  Speaker 1: what The fire itself was contained to the basement where
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: we had tenants, but our space suffered heavy smoke damage.
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: One of our cats didn't make it out. The other
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: is still frightful and traumatized. The dog who was at
• 5:30
  Speaker 1: work with me couldn't care less. The fire department, dog
• 5:36
  Speaker 1: cats are upset? What is going on round here? Why
• 5:45
  Speaker 1: is Charlie so scared? One of the cats has gotten
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: really day, poor dog. The tenants who are all these skeletons,
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: the fire department.
• 5:57
  Speaker 4: You're giving dog's way too much credit, that's true. They
• 6:00
  Speaker 4: don't ask questions.
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: They're just there.
• 6:04
  Speaker 1: Until I know. The fire department did their investigation and
• 6:07
  Speaker 1: said the cause couldn't be determined, which essentially meant that
• 6:10
  Speaker 1: it could be any number of outside factors besides wiring
• 6:14
  Speaker 1: or cooking, et cetera. Our tenants, who are frankly lazy
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: parents who allow their kids to draw on walls, destroy
• 6:21
  Speaker 1: our backyard and scream for twenty three hours out of
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: the day, never contacted us, nor did they contact my dad,
• 6:28
  Speaker 1: who actually owns the house. Radio silence from them. Several
• 6:32
  Speaker 1: days after the fire, I had a friend of one
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: of our tenants reach out privately to let me know
• 6:37
  Speaker 1: what happened. The middle child of the tenants, who was
• 6:40
  Speaker 1: four was supposed to be napping, apparently had access to
• 6:44
  Speaker 1: a but tane jet lighter, and he let the mattress
• 6:47
  Speaker 1: cover on fire. I'll do it, folly.
• 6:50
  Speaker 2: Shit, Jesus.
• 6:55
  Speaker 1: Hush, Jesus Christ. When my dad finally was able to
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: reached the tenant, she did not volunteer. That information.
• 7:11
  Speaker 2: Popped right out there.
• 7:14
  Speaker 1: We've all been there, buddy, They have fil that now.
• 7:20
  Speaker 1: Directly after the fire, I immediately was in contact with
• 7:23
  Speaker 1: the insurance and restoration companies to allow us to gain
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: access to the house to retrieve whatever belongings we could.
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: They dragged their feet post investigation from the fire department.
• 7:32
  Speaker 1: They boarded up the house and put a fence around it.
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: Between that time and when I was finally able to
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: meet a representative at the house, we found that the
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: boarding had been pulled off and the house looted. I
• 7:44
  Speaker 1: insisted on twenty four to seven security until we could
• 7:47
  Speaker 1: get the rest of our belongings, and we were granted
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: seven days. We got in and recovered everything we could,
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: but many sentimental and collectible items were stolen. They took
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: their time. After totaling the prices of the stolen items,
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: it was nearly nine thousand, five hundred dollars, so in
• 8:04
  Speaker 1: addition to dealing with recovery of remaining belongings, I also
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: had to file a police report, and start calling around
• 8:11
  Speaker 1: to pawn shops to be on the lookout for our items.
• 8:14
  Speaker 1: That's the gist of the story. I could say more,
• 8:16
  Speaker 1: but this is getting along already. I feel violated, heartbroken, raged,
• 8:21
  Speaker 1: and everything in between. My question is, what are some
• 8:25
  Speaker 1: tips to release the huge amount of rage I'm carrying
• 8:29
  Speaker 1: towards the tenant who is showing no guilt or remorse
• 8:32
  Speaker 1: for the fact that she burned my home and killed
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: my cat. I can't explain the level of rage I feel.
• 8:39
  Speaker 1: It feels like it could consume me. Also, contrary to
• 8:43
  Speaker 1: what many think would be a trigger, I have no
• 8:45
  Speaker 1: particular issue with fire now since I wasn't witnessed to
• 8:49
  Speaker 1: the actual burning, that feels somewhat separate. What I am
• 8:53
  Speaker 1: triggered by is the violation of being looted and having
• 8:57
  Speaker 1: no real control over our home. All things that invade
• 9:01
  Speaker 1: my personal space are making me angry and frustrated. My
• 9:05
  Speaker 1: sister asked to use the trailer we're staying in for
• 9:07
  Speaker 1: a zoom call, and I said yes. But the next
• 9:10
  Speaker 1: two days she also used it without letting me know.
• 9:13
  Speaker 1: I'm irrationally upset about this. If she had just let
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: me know, I wouldn't have cared and said yes absolutely.
• 9:20
  Speaker 1: It's coming into what little space I now have and
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: recognizing that someone had been in there without my knowledge.
• 9:26
  Speaker 1: That's setting me off. What can I do to start
• 9:29
  Speaker 1: to release that? Lastly, a quick medication update. So the
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: firefighters saved Dustin's meds, but for some reason never got mine.
• 9:38
  Speaker 1: That meant I have to raw dog my switch from
• 9:41
  Speaker 1: Lexapro over to the well Buttrin prescription I had waiting
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: to be filled. After a rocky day or so while
• 9:48
  Speaker 1: my body adjusted, I felt surprisingly good on the Wellbutrin.
• 9:51
  Speaker 1: I'm not sure anyone has tested the limits of a
• 9:54
  Speaker 1: new med in such a way as I have, forcing
• 9:56
  Speaker 1: it to carry me through a fire trauma, but the
• 9:59
  Speaker 1: fact that I'm not not completely losing my mind is
• 10:01
  Speaker 1: a good indication that in normal times it will continue
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: to work well for me. As for the sexual side effects, well,
• 10:08
  Speaker 1: we haven't had we haven't had a lot of time
• 10:12
  Speaker 1: to test it. But on the first sexual test run
• 10:14
  Speaker 1: after nearly a year of false starts, I'm happy to
• 10:17
  Speaker 1: report I finally had liftoff. I'm cautiously optimistic that it
• 10:22
  Speaker 1: will continue to work for me and I will be
• 10:24
  Speaker 1: rid of side effects for good. I'm also once the
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: belongings part of the insurance and restoration is resolved, which
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: takes a lot of time and energy, going to be
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: looking into some trauma counseling, if only to scream and
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: rage to someone who is paid to hear it. Thanks
• 10:39
  Speaker 1: as always to you all, and thank you from the
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: bottom of my heart for your support, donations and sharing
• 10:45
  Speaker 1: our story. It means the world. Love you all sexually
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: with hopefully frequent orgasms.
• 10:52
  Speaker 2: Tests, Oh my goodness, tests has been through so much. Yeah,
• 10:58
  Speaker 2: it's a lot.
• 11:00
  Speaker 4: The fire is one thing, and then to be looted
• 11:03
  Speaker 4: on top.
• 11:04
  Speaker 2: Of it, Yes, like had like someone break into your
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: home or your car or anything like that.
• 11:11
  Speaker 3: Yeah, car, car break in. I remember cars really freaked
• 11:15
  Speaker 3: out by Yeah, it's like this weird sense like somebody
• 11:18
  Speaker 3: was in here.
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: They took my shit, so.
• 11:20
  Speaker 2: Like surprising how much it bothers you. And that's what
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: I thought of it first, because y'all remember the radios
• 11:27
  Speaker 2: would pop off the face plates. I had one of
• 11:32
  Speaker 2: those in college and working at the Christian Sports camp
• 11:36
  Speaker 2: over the summer. While I was in the parking lot. Yeah,
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: somebody broke into the car, took my whole radio, and
• 11:42
  Speaker 2: I remember just it was like I didn't expect to
• 11:44
  Speaker 2: feel so violated, but you're like they were in my space,
• 11:48
  Speaker 2: Like I can't imagine your home.
• 11:51
  Speaker 4: Yeah, there's something really personal about that, like yeah, yeah,
• 11:55
  Speaker 4: completely violated.
• 11:56
  Speaker 1: It's terrible.
• 11:57
  Speaker 4: And the other thing too, is like it's one thing
• 12:00
  Speaker 4: I think to be broken into, but then to be
• 12:04
  Speaker 4: looted after you've just been through a fire.
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's that's bad. On top of worse.
• 12:09
  Speaker 2: I'm already emotional regulated, and now.
• 12:11
  Speaker 4: That it kind of like I don't know people who
• 12:14
  Speaker 4: steal things off of other people's like porches, like the
• 12:17
  Speaker 4: porch pirates and stealing you know, Amazon boxes, and.
• 12:23
  Speaker 1: I do I a sri about that? Why because the
• 12:28
  Speaker 1: shopping are we going back? And you wanting to kill
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: half of humanity and thinking Thanos probably was right? But
• 12:34
  Speaker 1: go on, my mug, I don't know. It's actually a
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: pretty kick mug. Reread this letter and tell me I'm wrong. Yeah,
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: you're on the high ground, Like.
• 12:45
  Speaker 2: Go on, yeah, I imagine that you're it's her sister,
• 12:52
  Speaker 2: sister in law who's coming into the trailer. I think
• 12:55
  Speaker 2: it's your sister's coming into the trailer. Now I wonder
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: how much that is attached to again, just like that
• 13:01
  Speaker 2: violation of privacy and just feeling very vulnerable. I mean,
• 13:07
  Speaker 2: for sure I would have, you know, some kind of
• 13:11
  Speaker 2: conversation with your sister. I know that might feel a
• 13:14
  Speaker 2: little awkward because it sounds like you are you are utile,
• 13:18
  Speaker 2: You and Dustin are utilizing her like her goodwill. Yeah,
• 13:25
  Speaker 2: you know, and so it can be maybe feel hard
• 13:27
  Speaker 2: to set a boundary when you're like, oh, you're helping
• 13:29
  Speaker 2: me out, but here's that boundary. I think just sharing
• 13:33
  Speaker 2: your thoughts and feelings about it and how it affects
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: you might be helpful. And just saying, hey, do you
• 13:37
  Speaker 2: mind just giving me a heads up or asking before
• 13:40
  Speaker 2: use the space? That would mean a lot to me.
• 13:42
  Speaker 2: I'm still just kind of reeling after all of this loss.
• 13:46
  Speaker 2: But I don't know what kind of relationship you'll have
• 13:47
  Speaker 2: if that would help.
• 13:49
  Speaker 1: How do you guys feel about when when I travel,
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: which is rare, as everybody knows, I would much rather
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: stay in a hotel than stay with family, to stay
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: with friends, like I do not want to be in
• 14:00
  Speaker 1: their space, and in part because then I have no sovereignty,
• 14:05
  Speaker 1: like I have no guaranteed this is from my space,
• 14:08
  Speaker 1: Like stay out of it because it's their home and
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: they need to pop in and out of that that
• 14:12
  Speaker 1: room or that office and get things. And I just
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: don't like to be able to destroy a toilet without
• 14:18
  Speaker 1: feel as we've talked about, which is why you and
• 14:20
  Speaker 1: I can't do the hotel thing together because you know
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: of this stream. Yeah pretty much. Yeah, yeah, I know,
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: but I honestly that's a part of it too, Like
• 14:27
  Speaker 1: it just having access to a bathroom that like I
• 14:29
  Speaker 1: don't have to be afraid of, Like I don't know,
• 14:31
  Speaker 1: is everything tidy? Is everything correct? Like the people do
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: it in the bathroom. We're sitting on the towns man, right,
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: that's all we're doing. Obviously. I don't saying with people
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: in their bathrooms. People aren't doing when you because you'll
• 14:50
  Speaker 1: you'll you travel a bunch more obviously, and you we've
• 14:53
  Speaker 1: heard stories about, Yeah, lots of people that you'll hang
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: out with and when people come to town, they they'll
• 14:56
  Speaker 1: visit with you. You don't feel a little bit like, oh,
• 14:59
  Speaker 1: I just feel it she being in other people's space.
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: I'm walking through their kitchen, I'm helping myself to coffee,
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: you know, like doesn't it feel a little odd being
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: like sharing space with people, not having your own zone.
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: I don't know.
• 15:09
  Speaker 3: I mean most times when I stay with someone that
• 15:11
  Speaker 3: they'll have like an area, yeah, because if they don't
• 15:15
  Speaker 3: have that area, I'm probably not gonna stay with them.
• 15:17
  Speaker 2: Okay, you're sleeping on the couch, You're like.
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: Right, Oh, I'll get a hotel.
• 15:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's when I would get a hotel. Like you
• 15:23
  Speaker 1: obviously have like a whole wing, which is great. I
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: think that's that's ideal. But like most of the time
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: when you stay with people, you're just in their guest
• 15:29
  Speaker 1: bedroom or like you know, they're loft or something like that.
• 15:32
  Speaker 1: Like I just U that is the worst. If I
• 15:34
  Speaker 1: have like a bedroom in a bathroom, then I'm.
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: Fine, Yeah, oh, I feel there's just your own space
• 15:38
  Speaker 2: that's maybe not share a bathroom with their kids or yeah.
• 15:41
  Speaker 3: I don't want that, and I don't want to be
• 15:43
  Speaker 3: like in a public space. I don't want to be like, oh,
• 15:45
  Speaker 3: you can bed down on the couch in the living
• 15:47
  Speaker 3: room right now, Yeah, I won't do that.
• 15:50
  Speaker 1: I relate to tests in that way that like for
• 15:52
  Speaker 1: me and especially where she's at right now, where you
• 15:55
  Speaker 1: don't have your own sovereign space. Like it's one thing
• 15:58
  Speaker 1: if you're visiting a friend for a little while whatever,
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: or you're there, you're there to have fun and just
• 16:01
  Speaker 1: goof off. This is you trying to operate your life.
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: This is you trying to put your belonging somewhere, gather
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: your mail, figure, like, do business, do all the things
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: you have to do, and you're just in this like
• 16:11
  Speaker 1: borrowed space. That is so weird and like just I
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: don't know, what do you think about setting the boundary though?
• 16:17
  Speaker 1: What do you Yeah, I don't know if you can
• 16:20
  Speaker 1: because if sisters like can pop in, yeah, like it's
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: part of the house or whatever and just needs to
• 16:26
  Speaker 1: get stuff out of there.
• 16:27
  Speaker 2: But tad, she's fine, just like ask or just yea,
• 16:30
  Speaker 2: I think you should. So I feel like, yeah, you
• 16:33
  Speaker 2: can't keep someone.
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: Once you give somebody a zone and you're like, hey,
• 16:37
  Speaker 1: this is your space, I really think I probably need
• 16:41
  Speaker 1: to check with them before you go back in that space,
• 16:44
  Speaker 1: like a neighbor, right, yeah, I don't just want to
• 16:49
  Speaker 1: what happens if she's not home.
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: I know that's the thing.
• 16:52
  Speaker 1: It's her house. Yeah, it's got to be able to
• 16:55
  Speaker 1: be used.
• 16:55
  Speaker 4: I mean what I'm learning for myself in this situation
• 17:00
  Speaker 4: is that, like, how if you are helping somebody in
• 17:04
  Speaker 4: a situation like this where they have been taken advantage
• 17:07
  Speaker 4: of house fire and then they've been looted, understanding like
• 17:11
  Speaker 4: this person is going to be really sensitive to space.
• 17:15
  Speaker 2: That's a difference like yeah, versus someone just staying at
• 17:17
  Speaker 2: your house like for funies or something.
• 17:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 17:20
  Speaker 4: And I think, you know, if you know, if we
• 17:22
  Speaker 4: could talk to Tess's sister, I think that's what we
• 17:24
  Speaker 4: would say, is, hey, just you know, be mindful of that,
• 17:27
  Speaker 4: because this person's very vulnerable. They've been hurt, they've been attacked.
• 17:32
  Speaker 4: It was a very intimate attack that they just went through,
• 17:35
  Speaker 4: so maybe we need to be sensitive to that. It
• 17:38
  Speaker 4: would be tough, I think for Tests to tell her
• 17:41
  Speaker 4: that and set that boundary, because I think if coming
• 17:44
  Speaker 4: from Tests, unless she was really good at being able
• 17:48
  Speaker 4: to explain this and just say, hey, like, you know,
• 17:51
  Speaker 4: when you come in here, it bothers me. And here's
• 17:54
  Speaker 4: how I do if I was Tests is I would
• 17:56
  Speaker 4: put it on me and not so much my sister.
• 18:00
  Speaker 4: I would say, Hey, this is not about you. I
• 18:01
  Speaker 4: just want you to know that I'm very sensitive right
• 18:05
  Speaker 4: now to my space because this happened, and I know
• 18:08
  Speaker 4: this is your space, and thank you so much. It
• 18:10
  Speaker 4: would mean a lot to me if you could let
• 18:12
  Speaker 4: me know or give me a heads up or something,
• 18:14
  Speaker 4: and just because I'm really sensitive right now and I
• 18:17
  Speaker 4: feel very vulnerable. Yeah, you could set it like that,
• 18:20
  Speaker 4: but then you still gotta be careful because yeah, I.
• 18:24
  Speaker 3: Think you're walking into a landmine. Yeah yeah, I could see.
• 18:28
  Speaker 3: I mean, like best case scenario. Sister goes like, oh yeah, great, yeah,
• 18:34
  Speaker 3: worst case.
• 18:35
  Speaker 1: Every other case is not great.
• 18:39
  Speaker 2: Really, So I guess the difference to me is it
• 18:43
  Speaker 2: feels a little more out there if it weren't for
• 18:47
  Speaker 2: what Tests has been through.
• 18:49
  Speaker 3: I don't disagree with tests and this at all, and
• 18:52
  Speaker 3: saying like like this is upsetting if somebody like this
• 18:55
  Speaker 3: is the only space that I have right now and
• 18:57
  Speaker 3: it's upsetting when you come in. I don't disagree with
• 18:59
  Speaker 3: any of that. It's just the setting the boundary with
• 19:02
  Speaker 3: the sister, Like I'd hate to pile on a family
• 19:07
  Speaker 3: fight on to tests at this point, whenever when we
• 19:11
  Speaker 3: got all this other ship going.
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: On to it.
• 19:13
  Speaker 4: Yeah, it may not be worth it in that sense.
• 19:15
  Speaker 4: It may just be better to deal with it than.
• 19:17
  Speaker 3: Just accept like this isn't your space. You're you're hanging
• 19:19
  Speaker 3: out in this space because sh it's gone down, and
• 19:22
  Speaker 3: like you're working, because you're working to get back to
• 19:25
  Speaker 3: that normal scene, but you're but you're not there yet.
• 19:27
  Speaker 4: That is a good point because if it does go south,
• 19:29
  Speaker 4: then it's just adding one more thing that you have.
• 19:31
  Speaker 1: To deal and now you're just gonna fight hell to
• 19:33
  Speaker 1: die on, which I think circles over to test this
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: other question where she's asking us, I am carrying so much,
• 19:39
  Speaker 1: like so much rage and resentment at these people who
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: just let their like the parenting was so obviously poor.
• 19:46
  Speaker 1: They've shown such disregard. We lost a pet because of you,
• 19:50
  Speaker 1: Fox and like.
• 19:52
  Speaker 4: People at this point, right, well there they are because
• 19:57
  Speaker 4: there's no there's nothing, but.
• 19:59
  Speaker 1: The don't have like a right to come back and
• 20:01
  Speaker 1: like reinhabit the PA. Probably, I would imagine. I hope
• 20:05
  Speaker 1: it's just the restoration all by itself, but just the
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: fucking gal And like I I mean, I'm surprised, but
• 20:12
  Speaker 1: then I'm kind of not because I feel like if
• 20:14
  Speaker 1: I was the cause of a fire, I'd not really
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: be apologetic because I'm sure that is bad ideas legally,
• 20:21
  Speaker 1: like I don't know that I should be saying don't
• 20:25
  Speaker 1: say I'm sorry or you know, like are you okay?
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: You know, and like but you have to be really
• 20:29
  Speaker 1: careful and I you know, obviously that's that's a terrible
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: opinion on this, but like there's a part of me
• 20:34
  Speaker 1: that wouldn't be surprised at there being this way. But
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: I can appreciate where Tess is at, where it's like, God,
• 20:40
  Speaker 1: you destroyed my Yeah, So in a situation like this,
• 20:45
  Speaker 1: and I'm sure we all have stories in our lives
• 20:47
  Speaker 1: where we relate where like the other person did me wrong,
• 20:50
  Speaker 1: and they just show no remorse, no penitence, like nobody
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: gives a fuck, and I'm just sitting here cleaning up
• 20:55
  Speaker 1: the mess, and like how do I deal with that?
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: It is very hard to like release that resentment and
• 21:01
  Speaker 1: that trauma and that rage. And it's really hard because
• 21:04
  Speaker 1: there's this like unconcluded sense of injustice there where it's
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: like they deserve to be yelled at, they need to
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: be called out. I need to have a say, but
• 21:13
  Speaker 1: I can't like proactively do that. They're not gonna make
• 21:16
  Speaker 1: it right, and I'm still cleaning up the mess I'm
• 21:18
  Speaker 1: going on pond web sites to find my fucking family heirlooms.
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: Like that's a joke. Like that's incredible the amount of
• 21:26
  Speaker 1: rage that a person would feel in that situation. Jesus Christ,
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: I mean, what do you do about that? Like, what
• 21:32
  Speaker 1: do you do? You got to settle down? Do I know?
• 21:40
  Speaker 2: I know my go to is like, but.
• 21:46
  Speaker 1: I don't meditate, masturbait that's a big deal. Have more
• 21:54
  Speaker 1: sex access that? Yeah, I don't know how. I mean,
• 21:57
  Speaker 1: I've seen all these really beautiful like tea that talk
• 22:00
  Speaker 1: about like you release this stuff, you forgive not for
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: them but for us, that you're not carrying this like
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: constant reminder. But I feel like the only thing I've
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: ever seen, I've never seen anybody be able to do
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: that all at once. The best I've ever seen is
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: this small, like irrosive process. I was talking to a
• 22:17
  Speaker 1: client about this the other day, and we were comparing
• 22:19
  Speaker 1: it to like like pulling out little pieces of pebbles
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: and like dropping him out of your pocket, kind of
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: like Shawshank redemption, where like he's chiseling through everything and
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: like every days just letting a little bit of this
• 22:29
  Speaker 1: out through his like pant legs, and it's like this small,
• 22:32
  Speaker 1: like little bit by little bit, dustings and dustings, you
• 22:35
  Speaker 1: erode away that rage or that boulder of resentment in
• 22:38
  Speaker 1: your life. I just don't know that it all happens
• 22:41
  Speaker 1: at once, and maybe along the way all of a
• 22:43
  Speaker 1: sudden chunks start to fall off. But I think it's
• 22:45
  Speaker 1: a very slow process of just every day giving yourself
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: permission to feel something, doing some kind of like affirmative
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: maxim where you kind of like remind yourself, you know,
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: I am bigger than this tragedy. I'm going to move
• 22:56
  Speaker 1: beyond this. You know, Karma's a bitch that'll get back
• 22:59
  Speaker 1: to them. Like, I don't know, like what do y'all
• 23:01
  Speaker 1: do to move on from like resentment and rage? Hi Golf,
• 23:07
  Speaker 1: that's definitely right down. Yeah, yeah, it's worked so well. No,
• 23:14
  Speaker 1: I there is a point where.
• 23:17
  Speaker 4: I think, like, yeah, you do get to that piece
• 23:20
  Speaker 4: where you're ready to forgive, not for them, but to
• 23:23
  Speaker 4: let it go and so that you can.
• 23:24
  Speaker 1: Set it down. Yeah, that's the thing, But that takes time.
• 23:27
  Speaker 4: Like I don't think you're I think you kind of
• 23:29
  Speaker 4: have to just sit in the rage for a minute
• 23:32
  Speaker 4: before you get to a point I do like her
• 23:34
  Speaker 4: idea of just going to talk to somebody and just.
• 23:37
  Speaker 1: Vent to them.
• 23:38
  Speaker 4: Yeah, you know, hire a therapist, Yeah, and go in
• 23:41
  Speaker 4: there and just say, here's all the reasons why I
• 23:44
  Speaker 4: hate that kid.
• 23:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, I need a non judgmental space.
• 23:47
  Speaker 1: To be like this four year old. But here's the
• 23:50
  Speaker 1: I would do to this. Have you ever seen home
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: alone and all the things that they said they were
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: going to do? Murder a kid? Okay, we haven't discussed,
• 24:02
  Speaker 1: all right. I don't know what the laws are in Canada.
• 24:04
  Speaker 1: All right. You know what, I don't know when you
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: achieve personhood in Canada. I think it's later. It's abortioned
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: a little later. In think it's I think it's years.
• 24:12
  Speaker 1: How many months is that trimester? Okay, Whitney, how do
• 24:20
  Speaker 1: you how do you deal with rage and resentment over time?
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: Like how do you do forgiveness? Yeah?
• 24:24
  Speaker 2: I think you do have to start with just releasing
• 24:26
  Speaker 2: that rage. I mean sounds like you're maybe I saw
• 24:30
  Speaker 2: this on Discord, but you maybe are on a farm
• 24:32
  Speaker 2: or somewhere there's a lot ab outdoor space. Like I
• 24:35
  Speaker 2: would just go, you know, scream into the abyss. I
• 24:38
  Speaker 2: don't know, like throw rocks in some water, whatever feels
• 24:42
  Speaker 2: like someone else's house on fire.
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: We didn't consider that forward arsenate forward tests.
• 24:53
  Speaker 2: Apparently the buttane lighters undetectable. They don't know how that
• 24:59
  Speaker 2: started a fucking fire, marshals. But yeah, I think getting
• 25:04
  Speaker 2: some release for me. I cry over everything, so I
• 25:06
  Speaker 2: cry a bunch. So here's that. But after that, I
• 25:10
  Speaker 2: think when I realize things are just out of my control,
• 25:13
  Speaker 2: almost that acceptance of like, well I don't have I
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: don't have my family heirlomps anymore, I don't have those things,
• 25:21
  Speaker 2: and it still leaves kind of that hole in your heart,
• 25:24
  Speaker 2: but it's still gonna be upsetting. It's upsetting still, But
• 25:27
  Speaker 2: I think that just kind of accepting and just letting
• 25:30
  Speaker 2: yourself feel that is part of it, because you know,
• 25:32
  Speaker 2: just like all grief, there's denial, there's maybe I'll find it,
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: maybe there's this, And I think once you're just through that,
• 25:37
  Speaker 2: she's like, well, yeah, I'm probably never going to find
• 25:40
  Speaker 2: those things.
• 25:41
  Speaker 3: If you can, you might not be able to. But
• 25:42
  Speaker 3: if you can, after you kind of get things rolling,
• 25:45
  Speaker 3: if you get things set in motion and everything, you know,
• 25:47
  Speaker 3: house being rebuilt or whatever, it has to happen all
• 25:50
  Speaker 3: that kind of stuff. If you can get out of town,
• 25:52
  Speaker 3: Yeah you can take a fucking vacation while things are happening.
• 25:55
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Like that'd be nice. Yeah.
• 25:58
  Speaker 4: You know, with the loss of family heirlooms, the thing
• 26:01
  Speaker 4: I think about is like, if I lost something that
• 26:04
  Speaker 4: belonged to my grandmother and she's no longer alive, and
• 26:10
  Speaker 4: if I were to imagine myself like talking to my
• 26:13
  Speaker 4: grandma and just being like, Grandma, I'm so sorry I
• 26:16
  Speaker 4: lost this heirloom. I think my grandma would just say like, hey,
• 26:21
  Speaker 4: don't worry about it.
• 26:22
  Speaker 1: It's okay, it's.
• 26:24
  Speaker 4: Not that important. You're more important than the heirloom that
• 26:27
  Speaker 4: I left you, you know. And I think, you know,
• 26:30
  Speaker 4: that's probably what Tessa's family would say as well.
• 26:34
  Speaker 1: It's just like, hey, you know what, You're okay. You
• 26:37
  Speaker 1: survived this house fire. You're fine.
• 26:40
  Speaker 4: You're gonna get back to get you You're gonna get
• 26:41
  Speaker 4: your life back together. This thing's gone. It's fine. You
• 26:44
  Speaker 4: have the memory of this thing, you have their memory
• 26:46
  Speaker 4: of me.
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: You're gonna be all right.
• 26:48
  Speaker 3: Yeah, there's no way Nick's grandma would have said that.
• 26:50
  Speaker 3: I don't think so unpleasan grandma fucking hated Grandma. You
• 26:56
  Speaker 3: lost my ring.
• 27:00
  Speaker 1: I got that ring from an ovaltine, uh decoder contest.
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: Do you know how I got that ring? Through World
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: War Two?
• 27:14
  Speaker 2: A lot. I think the nature the nostalgic items are
• 27:22
  Speaker 2: the hardest, you know, like concert t shirts or I
• 27:26
  Speaker 2: know for me, like photos.
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: You know that photos are tough.
• 27:30
  Speaker 4: I remember there was a Oh it's so heartbreaking, but
• 27:33
  Speaker 4: there was when I lived in Iowa. A couple of
• 27:38
  Speaker 4: the members of the band that we played with, Uh,
• 27:42
  Speaker 4: they lived on an island basically on this river, and
• 27:46
  Speaker 4: the island the river overflowed. It's like a huge flood
• 27:51
  Speaker 4: year completely destroyed the entire island, destroyed their home, and
• 27:56
  Speaker 4: so we're like, okay, what can we do? How can
• 27:59
  Speaker 4: we open? So they brought over all of these pictures
• 28:02
  Speaker 4: that they went in and actually got out, and so
• 28:05
  Speaker 4: we took all of these photos and laid them out
• 28:08
  Speaker 4: in the basement on the floor to try to dry
• 28:10
  Speaker 4: them out, you know, and.
• 28:12
  Speaker 1: It was just so heartburn.
• 28:14
  Speaker 4: We saved a lot of them, but there are some
• 28:15
  Speaker 4: that you just completely destroyed, you know, because like river
• 28:18
  Speaker 4: water isn't clean water silts it's yeah, and it was bacteria.
• 28:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it was.
• 28:25
  Speaker 4: It was really hard to be able to, you know,
• 28:27
  Speaker 4: to see that and just be like, oh, these are
• 28:30
  Speaker 4: gone forever.
• 28:31
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, that's true. There are things that are just irreplaceable.
• 28:34
  Speaker 1: But don't put river water on it. That's definitely on
• 28:38
  Speaker 1: the not list. Yeah, yeah, you just got life coached. Yeah,
• 28:43
  Speaker 1: but I mean, it's it's just an awful tragedy. One
• 28:45
  Speaker 1: thing that you said, Whitney, that I thought, Yeah, you know,
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: that's a really important point is the stages of grief,
• 28:50
  Speaker 1: you know, and like treating this this trauma, this rage,
• 28:53
  Speaker 1: this anger and the entire life disruption, because I think
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: it's easy to forget that you're grieving because you're you're angry,
• 28:59
  Speaker 1: and it doesn't always feel like that's grief. And then
• 29:02
  Speaker 1: like you're still dealing with all this it doesn't feel
• 29:04
  Speaker 1: like it's a tragedy, but like it's a different kind
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: of feeling, but you really are grieving. And the way
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: that we see the stages of grief applying generally is
• 29:12
  Speaker 1: anytime a human goes through a significant life change, and
• 29:14
  Speaker 1: we've talked about this on the show. Even good things
• 29:17
  Speaker 1: often incur the seven stages of grief as some kind
• 29:20
  Speaker 1: of pattern of adjustment that humans go through even when
• 29:22
  Speaker 1: something's great in their life, it's a significant change. So
• 29:26
  Speaker 1: I think that that's gonna be a big part of
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: this too, until she finally does kind of reach a
• 29:30
  Speaker 1: place of acceptance, and the rage subsides and the depression
• 29:33
  Speaker 1: subsides like that'll come in time. But Tess, we're so
• 29:36
  Speaker 1: sorry to hear about this, but I really appreciate you
• 29:39
  Speaker 1: letting us all know what's been going on inside the Discord.
• 29:41
  Speaker 1: And also huge shout out to our wonderful community. I mean,
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: all the people that are involved in this show, the
• 29:47
  Speaker 1: people that are involved in ice Cream Social just rallied around.
• 29:51
  Speaker 2: Them, press have been a part of it.
• 29:53
  Speaker 1: Oh my god. Tons of money raised, tons of support
• 29:56
  Speaker 1: given people constantly in our yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, that's right.
• 30:00
  Speaker 1: That's right. Which we understand you've come into some money recently.
• 30:06
  Speaker 1: That's right, and we can we see how much it
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: is and it is mental health awareness. We come on
• 30:12
  Speaker 1: tests be a mench Oh, that's that's that's wonderful. That's
• 30:20
  Speaker 1: just the best. But yeah, shout out to the entire
• 30:23
  Speaker 1: community of supporters around the show and our very active
• 30:26
  Speaker 1: Discord people have just been loving on them so much.
• 30:29
  Speaker 1: Checking on them all the time, sharing their own stories,
• 30:32
  Speaker 1: and I just love that. I love that we actually
• 30:33
  Speaker 1: have a real community around this show. So thank you
• 30:36
  Speaker 1: Tess for keeping us in the loop at that. We're
• 30:37
  Speaker 1: wishing you well in a speedy recovery and hopefully that
• 30:41
  Speaker 1: your dog continues to be bored out of their mind
• 30:43
  Speaker 1: and not really caring about what's going on. We're gonna
• 30:46
  Speaker 1: take a quick break and when we come back, we're
• 30:47
  Speaker 1: talking about genetic testing and psychotropics. You're listening to pod therapy.
• 30:54
  Speaker 4: Today's episode is brought to you by Robert Brownie, Junior,
• 30:57
  Speaker 4: Mint Heylo Lansbury, Kevin Chamberlain, Ben's Stanley, Adam Hathaway, Dan
• 31:01
  Speaker 4: Martin Lives Hey Yo, Andrew laying Me, Chad Meg, and
• 31:04
  Speaker 4: Eka the Prince.
• 31:05
  Speaker 1: Would you like to sponsor the show?
• 31:07
  Speaker 4: You can become a therapy patre dot com slash therapy
• 31:11
  Speaker 4: all right. I do have some geography trivia left her
• 31:16
  Speaker 4: from last week, or I can read.
• 31:17
  Speaker 1: The room, so yeah, read the room while you're doing that.
• 31:21
  Speaker 1: I thought about I almost designed some trivia today, but
• 31:24
  Speaker 1: then I was busy doing other chores. I'm going to
• 31:28
  Speaker 1: I was a weekend. We're doing o I do the
• 31:35
  Speaker 1: alphabet and everything, but I was gonna make trivia about
• 31:41
  Speaker 1: Disney lyrics, and it was gonna be like which, like,
• 31:43
  Speaker 1: I don't know, fill in this lyric in the middle
• 31:45
  Speaker 1: of a Disney song, or like which of these lines
• 31:47
  Speaker 1: was really it? So every time that you've had to
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: do trivia, it's been about Disney.
• 31:52
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 31:52
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I have a very small array because the Whitney's
• 31:55
  Speaker 1: my only real competition, and like, I feel like I
• 31:57
  Speaker 1: can get her like most of the time, that's true,
• 32:00
  Speaker 1: Jacob surprised a few times. I think I carry that
• 32:04
  Speaker 1: is the category.
• 32:06
  Speaker 4: I think I've won the So uh from Emma, we
• 32:11
  Speaker 4: have bizarre history of sex and medicine. All right, all right,
• 32:15
  Speaker 4: all right, Jacob, We're gonna start with you there.
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: How bizarre? What condition did Victorian era physicians officially diagnose
• 32:26
  Speaker 1: in women presenting with anxiety, irritability, excessive emotion, and heaviness
• 32:32
  Speaker 1: in the abdomen and routinely treat through manual pelvic stimulation
• 32:36
  Speaker 1: performed in their medical offices.
• 32:39
  Speaker 3: Isn't it something like hysteria? Shoot from the hip, it's
• 32:43
  Speaker 3: something like that, I guess. Give me the options A
• 32:47
  Speaker 3: something like hysterias, uh A melancholy.
• 32:57
  Speaker 1: That's pretty good. I like melancholy.
• 33:00
  Speaker 4: Neuris neuris theorina B, neuris athena, neuros athena. See female hysteria.
• 33:12
  Speaker 4: Oh d colorous, Give me, give me that hysteria. I
• 33:17
  Speaker 4: want to correct.
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 33:20
  Speaker 4: The dreatment was considered entirely clinical and unremarkable. The vibrator
• 33:24
  Speaker 4: was later developed partially to reduce the time physicians spent
• 33:28
  Speaker 4: in this particular office procedure.
• 33:30
  Speaker 3: You know, technology is built for people to have to
• 33:34
  Speaker 3: do less work.
• 33:35
  Speaker 1: That's all it is. When people start bitching about.
• 33:37
  Speaker 4: Technology taking over for jobs, the vibrator.
• 33:41
  Speaker 1: It took some jobs. Man, a lot of health care
• 33:43
  Speaker 1: providers to jobs, all right, Whitney.
• 33:51
  Speaker 4: In the late eighteen hundreds and early nineteen hundreds, Lyesaw
• 33:55
  Speaker 4: was aggressively marketed to women. For what purpose?
• 33:58
  Speaker 3: Options got be Douche's gotta be a doucheing.
• 34:07
  Speaker 4: A A household disinfectant for kitchen surfaces. B treatment for
• 34:12
  Speaker 4: minor skin wounds and abrasions see a feminine hygiene and
• 34:16
  Speaker 4: contraceptive douche god uh D post surgical antiseptic rints.
• 34:24
  Speaker 1: I deserve points, you do?
• 34:26
  Speaker 2: I mean it cannot be fucking douche. God damn, I
• 34:32
  Speaker 2: don't want it to do that, so I don't even
• 34:34
  Speaker 2: want to guess that.
• 34:36
  Speaker 1: Think about you're right, doctor famously.
• 34:44
  Speaker 2: Fine, I'll use my lifeline and choose Jacobs. I'm gonna
• 34:49
  Speaker 2: listen to a man in here.
• 34:50
  Speaker 4: When it comes to early female diagnosis.
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: You listen to doctor.
• 34:54
  Speaker 2: J A man knows men all.
• 34:56
  Speaker 1: Rights, he knows.
• 34:59
  Speaker 2: Yes, that is.
• 35:04
  Speaker 4: God, It's all about doch.
• 35:12
  Speaker 1: That's the episode title. Good job. Yeah, I thought that
• 35:15
  Speaker 1: was our album man.
• 35:20
  Speaker 3: All right, Jim screen name of the chat rooms clean.
• 35:32
  Speaker 1: It's like it's like it's got a nozzle. It's definite.
• 35:38
  Speaker 4: The ads were genuinely, genuinely harrowing, implying that a woman's
• 35:43
  Speaker 4: marriage or collapse based on her use of this product.
• 35:47
  Speaker 1: Good good, I mean they were right, like.
• 35:49
  Speaker 2: That's true, like we lived through.
• 35:52
  Speaker 1: These times not easy, Yes, God damn. The whole thing
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: is about we live longer.
• 35:58
  Speaker 4: That's of course. Corrosive is a corrosive disinfectant. The FDA
• 36:03
  Speaker 4: eventually stepped in.
• 36:05
  Speaker 1: Okay, good job are okay, Yeah, he's the one, Jim. Yes.
• 36:12
  Speaker 4: Vin Vin Mariani a cocaine infused Bordeaux wine created in
• 36:18
  Speaker 4: eighteen sixty three. Became widely popular across Europe and America
• 36:23
  Speaker 4: and collected celebrity endorsements, which public figures figures written testimonial
• 36:30
  Speaker 4: was the most unexpected Island Boys.
• 36:36
  Speaker 1: I did not see it. It's so eloquent. Oh my
• 36:44
  Speaker 1: Bordello coke wine.
• 36:46
  Speaker 3: This Bordello coke wine has the legs of a nineteen
• 36:50
  Speaker 3: eighties super model.
• 36:53
  Speaker 1: So say I the Island.
• 36:55
  Speaker 4: Boys go ahead, okay, Queen Victoria, Florence Nightingale, presidentes Us Grant,
• 37:04
  Speaker 4: oh Jesus or Pope Leo the thirteenth, All right, I.
• 37:07
  Speaker 1: Ain't gonna be the Pope. I ain't gonna be the Queen.
• 37:09
  Speaker 1: I don't think they can do commercial endorsements. Ulysses Us
• 37:12
  Speaker 1: Grant notoriously was broke after his term or after being
• 37:17
  Speaker 1: the general, or both, and so he was doing all
• 37:19
  Speaker 1: sorts ship for money, so it's very possibly him. And
• 37:22
  Speaker 1: then the other one was Florence Nightingale, which sounds like
• 37:27
  Speaker 1: that would be better. Ulysses Us Grant was a huge
• 37:31
  Speaker 1: drinker too, cocaine infused wine in France. But Bordell, give
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: me Florence Knight, pick me up, give me Florence Nightingale. No,
• 37:41
  Speaker 1: I will not sh grant. No, No, the Pope.
• 37:49
  Speaker 2: The queen, I mean the Pope. I guess yes, yes, Hope.
• 37:57
  Speaker 4: Leo the thirteenth reportedly carried a hip flask of it
• 38:01
  Speaker 4: and awarded the creator a Vatican Gold medal. There's an
• 38:04
  Speaker 4: actual portrait of him alongside product.
• 38:07
  Speaker 1: Real quick, real quick. If that was today's pope, are
• 38:11
  Speaker 1: you a little closer, a little closer to Christianity? Can
• 38:13
  Speaker 1: we sell it? If the pope is endorsing coke.
• 38:15
  Speaker 4: Wine, no, I would have more respect. Okay, but that
• 38:22
  Speaker 4: doesn't mean that I would believe something that happened.
• 38:25
  Speaker 2: We don't need you to believe.
• 38:26
  Speaker 1: We don't need to believe. We just want the gross,
• 38:29
  Speaker 1: all right, ten percent of the gross you show up
• 38:31
  Speaker 1: on Sundays. We gave you some coked gross, not the
• 38:33
  Speaker 1: net net. We want the gross. All right, Fine, I'll settle.
• 38:38
  Speaker 1: I got one. You're welcome. I got you one, all right?
• 38:46
  Speaker 1: Did it for you, Chicago Pope. Let's get some alort.
• 38:50
  Speaker 1: That'll be that body of Christ. Genetic testing in psychotropics. Hey,
• 38:55
  Speaker 1: mental health experts. I've been I've been listening since the beginning,
• 39:00
  Speaker 1: but this is my first time writing in. You've brought
• 39:03
  Speaker 1: up a few times how finding the right SSRI or
• 39:06
  Speaker 1: psychotropic medication is often a frustrating try and see guessing game,
• 39:11
  Speaker 1: which got me wondering about something my company offers. Full disclosure,
• 39:15
  Speaker 1: I work for this company. It's called Myriad Genetics, but
• 39:19
  Speaker 1: I am strictly writing in as a fan of yours
• 39:21
  Speaker 1: and not speaking on their behalf. They have a test
• 39:24
  Speaker 1: called gene site, which, while it won't tell exactly which
• 39:30
  Speaker 1: psychotropic drug is the perfect fit, it analyzes your genetic
• 39:34
  Speaker 1: makeup to help narrow down which medications you might respond
• 39:37
  Speaker 1: to best or worst. I'm a novice on the clinical
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: side and have no experience with it either, as I
• 39:43
  Speaker 1: am in a different area of genetic testing, so I'd
• 39:47
  Speaker 1: love to hear your take. Do you have any firsthand
• 39:49
  Speaker 1: experience with pharmacogenomic tests like this? What are your educated
• 39:55
  Speaker 1: thoughts or opinions good or bad on using this testing
• 39:58
  Speaker 1: and such? If you weren't aware of this kind of testing,
• 40:01
  Speaker 1: maybe it's a helpful resource now. Either way, I'm leaving
• 40:04
  Speaker 1: the ball in your court and would love to hear
• 40:06
  Speaker 1: you talk about it however you wish. Again, I'm not
• 40:10
  Speaker 1: endorsing them or trying to make this commercial, but more
• 40:13
  Speaker 1: interested in your thoughts, experience. Feel free to remove the company,
• 40:17
  Speaker 1: your product name. Nope, Jim reads exactly what's on the
• 40:20
  Speaker 1: fucking page and whatever. Doesn't feel like you don't want
• 40:23
  Speaker 1: to promote them, No, we'll promote them. Send us money,
• 40:26
  Speaker 1: genetic test, We want to do it. Thank you. Love
• 40:28
  Speaker 1: the show, the extra Patreon content that has me laughing
• 40:32
  Speaker 1: to myself and I'm sure those around me who think
• 40:35
  Speaker 1: I'm clinically nuts love you. Cone and Scoops.
• 40:39
  Speaker 3: Thank you for not telling the people around you what
• 40:41
  Speaker 3: you're laughing at. Yeah, so that they might also enjoy it.
• 40:45
  Speaker 3: Appreciate that.
• 40:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, thanks for the supportent Scoops.
• 40:50
  Speaker 2: I had a friend who did this, okay, yeah, yeah,
• 40:54
  Speaker 2: they did not find it helpful.
• 40:55
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 40:57
  Speaker 2: The two medications that were said to be best for
• 41:00
  Speaker 2: them were it was a miss. Yeah, it was a miss,
• 41:03
  Speaker 2: and about not a bad reaction, but just.
• 41:05
  Speaker 1: Not effective psychotropic drugs. Does not seem like that would
• 41:11
  Speaker 1: be a thing. Yeah, that test.
• 41:14
  Speaker 2: Thing, it's a fun idea.
• 41:15
  Speaker 1: Like.
• 41:15
  Speaker 2: Hearing about it, initially I was like, oh, that's that
• 41:18
  Speaker 2: seems cool, like maybe, and then they were like.
• 41:20
  Speaker 3: No, I have a cousin that works in research in
• 41:24
  Speaker 3: clinical research for psychotropic drugs as a medical whatever, and
• 41:30
  Speaker 3: like it is fascinating, It is really fascinating stuff. But
• 41:33
  Speaker 3: I don't know I heard anything about that.
• 41:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, I'll throw a couple of pennies on
• 41:38
  Speaker 1: the pile here. So, like, first off, genetic testing for
• 41:41
  Speaker 1: drugs as a general concept is great, and like I'm
• 41:44
  Speaker 1: really excited for personalized medicine, especially for really difficult things
• 41:48
  Speaker 1: like cancer treatment, and like you know, some really high
• 41:51
  Speaker 1: end things. But your instinct is right, Jacob. Like, when
• 41:54
  Speaker 1: it comes to psychiatric stuff, there are so many variables
• 41:58
  Speaker 1: about whether different medicine will have an impact far beyond genetics.
• 42:03
  Speaker 1: Like genetics is one variable, but environment, diet, lifestyle, sleep,
• 42:08
  Speaker 1: other co occurring mental illnesses, substance use, exercise, like your
• 42:13
  Speaker 1: environments of life, the people in your life, your stressors,
• 42:16
  Speaker 1: your cortisol levels like your work. Everything has such a
• 42:20
  Speaker 1: unique effect and so it's almost impossible to predict what
• 42:25
  Speaker 1: medicine is going to actually be that helpful. And so
• 42:28
  Speaker 1: like when it comes to genetic testing for psychotropics, I
• 42:31
  Speaker 1: don't see it really expediting. Much like in the time
• 42:34
  Speaker 1: it takes for you to schedule a genetic exam, go
• 42:36
  Speaker 1: do the exam, most insurances don't want to pay for
• 42:39
  Speaker 1: it because they don't see it as a necessity at all.
• 42:42
  Speaker 1: They see it as investigational. And so when insurances see
• 42:45
  Speaker 1: things as investigational or exploratory, they can tag it such
• 42:48
  Speaker 1: and maybe Whitney can talk a little bit about this,
• 42:50
  Speaker 1: you know, having much more experience working for the bad guys.
• 42:53
  Speaker 1: But that does matter right to insurances that are like, yo,
• 42:55
  Speaker 1: are you on a fishing expedition here? Or are you
• 42:57
  Speaker 1: treating something?
• 42:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 42:58
  Speaker 1: You know, like like it and like okay, you know,
• 43:01
  Speaker 1: I can understand some of the argument of that, and
• 43:03
  Speaker 1: and arguably they won't often cover these. The tests can
• 43:07
  Speaker 1: range I think what I've seen from like three hundred
• 43:09
  Speaker 1: to three thousand, depending upon what they want to do.
• 43:12
  Speaker 1: I don't think it X. Yeah, there's always a guy
• 43:15
  Speaker 1: in Craigsli's do some gene Okay, two hundred and.
• 43:20
  Speaker 3: Fitty whatever whatever you think, that's a square deal, whatever,
• 43:24
  Speaker 3: whatever works for you.
• 43:25
  Speaker 1: Yeah, we now offered at patron dot com slash therapy.
• 43:27
  Speaker 1: We're happy to do it. So, yeah, just just spit
• 43:30
  Speaker 1: in a box and send lick the envelope closed, send
• 43:35
  Speaker 1: us too fitty first before spitting in the box. Get consent.
• 43:43
  Speaker 4: It's important, important that.
• 43:52
  Speaker 1: That was just chef's kiss. Don't forget about consent, consent.
• 43:58
  Speaker 1: We believe women. So anyway, I don't see it as
• 44:01
  Speaker 1: very valuable. There are some medicines that are kind of
• 44:04
  Speaker 1: this weight and see notoriously. Antipsychotics are one that's really
• 44:09
  Speaker 1: frustrating as people going through paranoid delusions, gizophrenia, hallucinations, they're
• 44:13
  Speaker 1: in a very vulnerable state and sometimes we have to
• 44:16
  Speaker 1: play with multiple antipsychotics before we find the exact dosage
• 44:20
  Speaker 1: and the right herbs and spices that are going to
• 44:21
  Speaker 1: match for them in those cases. If genetic testing can
• 44:25
  Speaker 1: expedite things, which I don't know that I've seen convincing
• 44:28
  Speaker 1: data that it really can, then I think there's a
• 44:31
  Speaker 1: lot of value to it. But honestly, the back and
• 44:33
  Speaker 1: forthing with SSRIs SNRIs, I don't think that's necessarily bad
• 44:38
  Speaker 1: because going through this iterative process of figuring out what's
• 44:42
  Speaker 1: not working is actually valuable to us because it evolves
• 44:46
  Speaker 1: with your treatment. You're also doing therapy, you're also doing
• 44:49
  Speaker 1: lifestyle change. All these variables get to coexist, and so
• 44:53
  Speaker 1: I don't necessarily think it's a bad thing, and there's
• 44:55
  Speaker 1: other diseases where it's like, Yo, we need an answer
• 44:58
  Speaker 1: right now. We need to cut out the ten middle
• 45:00
  Speaker 1: steps and get to the final one. I get that
• 45:03
  Speaker 1: mental health, I think, in my opinion, I think it's
• 45:05
  Speaker 1: way too convoluted to like land on one single answer
• 45:08
  Speaker 1: right away, and so it's always going to be this
• 45:11
  Speaker 1: process of just ask you this.
• 45:12
  Speaker 3: If if the mapping and all of this, you know,
• 45:16
  Speaker 3: if we're in a future where all of this is possible,
• 45:19
  Speaker 3: and because like genet testing and things like that seem
• 45:23
  Speaker 3: like right now where things are are going right, if
• 45:27
  Speaker 3: it is just a matter of you know, according to
• 45:30
  Speaker 3: the genet testing, according to whatever testing, Uh, the pH
• 45:33
  Speaker 3: in your brain is a little off. You take this
• 45:35
  Speaker 3: pill that's going to fix the pH in your brain. Well,
• 45:37
  Speaker 3: you got to douce your brain. That's how you fix
• 45:39
  Speaker 3: the pH thing.
• 45:40
  Speaker 1: You gotta get that lil douche in the brain. If
• 45:43
  Speaker 1: you're going to save the marriage, if you if you
• 45:45
  Speaker 1: care about your fucking partner, gen you need something made
• 45:48
  Speaker 1: by a man butt therapy. He's brought a woman by
• 45:51
  Speaker 1: male design products.
• 45:53
  Speaker 2: Brain douche, Buy it now, this one checks out brain. Yeah.
• 45:58
  Speaker 1: I just had a couple of ideas for this store anyway,
• 46:07
  Speaker 1: I mean Dicky Douce And.
• 46:15
  Speaker 3: Is there something to that though? Is there something to
• 46:17
  Speaker 3: saying like we want to get to this baseline and
• 46:20
  Speaker 3: then it's time to have conversations.
• 46:22
  Speaker 1: I think there is. I mean I don't. But that's again,
• 46:25
  Speaker 1: it's just so many variables with me. I mean we're talking.
• 46:27
  Speaker 1: I think we're talking science fiction at that point. I
• 46:29
  Speaker 1: think we are. Yeah, I mean we're just not there.
• 46:31
  Speaker 1: And then what's really tough too, about like the process
• 46:34
  Speaker 1: of psychiatric medication. It is all a little fuzzy, like
• 46:38
  Speaker 1: it's gotten way better. Like even if you look should
• 46:40
  Speaker 1: just smooth those pills out? They need to? Yeah, that's
• 46:43
  Speaker 1: so weird. It gets stuck in the back of your throat.
• 46:45
  Speaker 1: That's what she said. There it is there, it is.
• 46:49
  Speaker 1: But like even if you look at the process of
• 46:50
  Speaker 1: like how we designed antidepressants, like the very first ones
• 46:54
  Speaker 1: were so dangerous, like m aois like put people in
• 46:57
  Speaker 1: cardiac arrest if you had goddamn grapefruit juice. You know,
• 47:00
  Speaker 1: they were very, very dangerous, very blurry drugs. I shouldn't
• 47:03
  Speaker 1: be drinking great rug right now, you know. Then we
• 47:07
  Speaker 1: evolved into like tricyclics, and tricyclics were kind of like
• 47:11
  Speaker 1: a shotgun approach where they would address the problem of depression,
• 47:14
  Speaker 1: but they affect other things. And then we got to SSRIs,
• 47:17
  Speaker 1: which were much more like a rifle approach where we're
• 47:19
  Speaker 1: mostly hitting what we want to hit, there's very minimal
• 47:21
  Speaker 1: side effects. But even that we found that isn't always
• 47:24
  Speaker 1: working right. So now we have these atypicals like well bututrin,
• 47:26
  Speaker 1: and we have snriyes, and like you have to have
• 47:30
  Speaker 1: all these different iterations because there's so many different levers
• 47:33
  Speaker 1: in the brain. And I just don't know that we
• 47:35
  Speaker 1: have a genetic test that says bingo, here's the twenty
• 47:39
  Speaker 1: five different variables and like buttons to push in the brain,
• 47:42
  Speaker 1: this medicine will match. We just don't even have medicines
• 47:45
  Speaker 1: that clean that would match in that way. They're adjusting
• 47:48
  Speaker 1: like serotonin levels. That's just so ambiguous.
• 47:52
  Speaker 4: Do you think it's possible.
• 47:54
  Speaker 1: It's just not there yet my gamble on mental health,
• 47:59
  Speaker 1: I don't think at would be possible. I think they
• 48:01
  Speaker 1: can in a blurry way. Tell us our genetic show.
• 48:05
  Speaker 1: Our genetic data from you shows that people who have
• 48:08
  Speaker 1: your particular enzyme matches with these things tend to do
• 48:12
  Speaker 1: better with this. That's I think that'll be the best
• 48:15
  Speaker 1: they get.
• 48:16
  Speaker 4: Maybe aggregates, it would be a quicker way to get
• 48:20
  Speaker 4: to a quicker starting point.
• 48:22
  Speaker 3: Maybe what would you guess pure guests that out of
• 48:28
  Speaker 3: your range of patients, what percentage of those patients do
• 48:32
  Speaker 3: you think could possibly be cured for lack of a
• 48:36
  Speaker 3: better word, uh, chemically without without interaction with you, just
• 48:44
  Speaker 3: a just a pill or a shot or whatever.
• 48:46
  Speaker 1: Is there is there a measurable percentage? So what's what's
• 48:50
  Speaker 1: interesting is that the first line treatment for most anxiety
• 48:53
  Speaker 1: and depression is usually going to be medicine and so
• 48:55
  Speaker 1: and usually it's hard to get to a therapist, so
• 48:57
  Speaker 1: it's a lot easier to get to your family physician,
• 48:59
  Speaker 1: your primary and so the majority, at least of Americans
• 49:02
  Speaker 1: who experience their symptoms, the first checkpoint is going to
• 49:05
  Speaker 1: be their family practitioner.
• 49:06
  Speaker 3: I'll tell you what, I'm going to a new doctor tomorrow.
• 49:09
  Speaker 3: And I did all of the pre stuff today, filled
• 49:12
  Speaker 3: all the pre stuff, pages and pages of mental health questions,
• 49:18
  Speaker 3: so many mental health like more mental health questions than
• 49:21
  Speaker 3: like history of cancer. Wow, not even close.
• 49:26
  Speaker 1: Wow, that's interesting.
• 49:27
  Speaker 3: As we were like, do you have history of cancer? Yes,
• 49:30
  Speaker 3: and now the next ten minutes are going to be
• 49:32
  Speaker 3: discussing your mental health. Well, when you think about asking
• 49:35
  Speaker 3: you the same question in different directions and everything.
• 49:38
  Speaker 1: Well, you think about the history of healthcare that was nothing.
• 49:40
  Speaker 1: It was they were invisible to this, they never thought
• 49:42
  Speaker 1: about it, and now you see how advanced it's gotten
• 49:44
  Speaker 1: that they're like, no, this is a lot of what
• 49:46
  Speaker 1: we do now. And so a lot of the primary
• 49:48
  Speaker 1: docs that's the very first intervention. So by the time
• 49:51
  Speaker 1: they get to me, almost all the time, there has
• 49:54
  Speaker 1: already been some medication history. Witney. I don't know if
• 49:56
  Speaker 1: you've noticed that in your practice as well, that by
• 49:58
  Speaker 1: the time they finally get a hold of a therapist,
• 50:00
  Speaker 1: when you ask them have you ever tried meds? The
• 50:03
  Speaker 1: answer is usually yes, like at some point in their
• 50:05
  Speaker 1: career of mental health issues, they've tried something.
• 50:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I find and I'm trying to think on that,
• 50:12
  Speaker 2: but I find a lot more often I have clients
• 50:15
  Speaker 2: who are nervous about trying meds okay, and so they
• 50:19
  Speaker 2: are coming to me first and then saying like, these
• 50:22
  Speaker 2: are things I'm worried about, and I actually hear a
• 50:26
  Speaker 2: lot of misconceptions from those those clients, and so it's
• 50:29
  Speaker 2: great to be able to talk through that remind them
• 50:31
  Speaker 2: I'm not a doctor, but this is just information that
• 50:33
  Speaker 2: I know. I usually have referrals for like nurse practitioners
• 50:38
  Speaker 2: in psychiatry, and so I will refer them to the
• 50:42
  Speaker 2: few that I trust, and I remind them like, those
• 50:45
  Speaker 2: people are there to listen to your symptoms and do
• 50:48
  Speaker 2: their best to adjust for what's best for you. They're
• 50:51
  Speaker 2: not there to put you in a box or like
• 50:53
  Speaker 2: diagnose you with things. And so yeah, I think there's
• 50:57
  Speaker 2: just some fear on mental health sometimes with MEDICAI. And
• 51:00
  Speaker 2: the second thing I hear the most often is I'm
• 51:03
  Speaker 2: a fear of being on medications the rest.
• 51:05
  Speaker 1: Of my rest of my life. There's a lot of
• 51:08
  Speaker 1: misunderstanding about medication, which is I mean, the writer says, hey,
• 51:11
  Speaker 1: I appreciate that y'all bring this up on the show.
• 51:13
  Speaker 1: We address it Tessa's question. It was a follow up
• 51:16
  Speaker 1: to her medication discussions we've had, and I think it's
• 51:19
  Speaker 1: important that we normalize it. And I think that's why
• 51:21
  Speaker 1: on the show we try to say, like even things
• 51:23
  Speaker 1: like this genetic testing is a good idea. But even
• 51:25
  Speaker 1: the framing and the writer didn't mean to do this,
• 51:27
  Speaker 1: but even that topic and interjecting it implies that that
• 51:31
  Speaker 1: psychiatric mets are very high stakes, and so like we
• 51:33
  Speaker 1: better get genetic testing so we can get it right.
• 51:35
  Speaker 1: And it's like it's actually quite low stakes. Like the
• 51:37
  Speaker 1: stuff that we generally have now is very gentle SSRIs
• 51:42
  Speaker 1: are the tile and all of mental health, Like the
• 51:44
  Speaker 1: side effects are much lower. It's not the case that
• 51:47
  Speaker 1: people take these and get on them for the rest
• 51:49
  Speaker 1: of their lives. It is normal for people to have
• 51:52
  Speaker 1: an episode of care. With most medications, there are cases
• 51:56
  Speaker 1: where people are going to need medications permanently, and that
• 51:59
  Speaker 1: would be like, yeah, if you have bipolar disorder or
• 52:01
  Speaker 1: you have schizophreni araa psychosis, yeah, we can't therapy that,
• 52:04
  Speaker 1: Like you have to balance that out. If you have
• 52:07
  Speaker 1: a manic episode that is extremely dangerous to you, we
• 52:09
  Speaker 1: have to do something about that permanently. Also, by the way,
• 52:13
  Speaker 1: high cholesterol, I was.
• 52:14
  Speaker 2: Just gonna say, diabetes, you're.
• 52:16
  Speaker 1: Going to be on something for the rest of your life.
• 52:17
  Speaker 1: I'm going to be on something for the rest of
• 52:19
  Speaker 1: my life. Being on something for the rest of your
• 52:20
  Speaker 1: life is not that big a deal. I've been on
• 52:22
  Speaker 1: Flintstones's vitamin. It sounds I cannot quit.
• 52:25
  Speaker 4: It's tough to get off those. Yeah cholesterol, okay, yeah,
• 52:29
  Speaker 4: you're about that other thing. No, but that's going away.
• 52:33
  Speaker 1: Oh good for you? But oh good? Yeah okay, yeah, excellent. Yeah.
• 52:38
  Speaker 1: I had to hear that. Wonderful. I just can't believe
• 52:40
  Speaker 1: it was prehensile.
• 52:41
  Speaker 5: Yeah today this guy god dim, I don't know what
• 52:49
  Speaker 5: to do about it just fades back for the three.
• 52:53
  Speaker 1: So anyway, you know, yeah, I definitely agree with you
• 52:56
  Speaker 1: Whitney that a lot of people, I think, have this
• 52:58
  Speaker 1: general fear and a lot of people, by the time
• 53:01
  Speaker 1: they're seeing a mental health professional and outpatient, they've talked
• 53:04
  Speaker 1: about medicines with their doctor or been offered them or
• 53:06
  Speaker 1: have taken them. But you're right there. There's also a
• 53:09
  Speaker 1: lack of education about it, which is why on the
• 53:11
  Speaker 1: show we often want to normalize it. I want to
• 53:13
  Speaker 1: talk about it as something we see all the time,
• 53:14
  Speaker 1: people use all the time. We don't want anybody out
• 53:17
  Speaker 1: there to be afraid to do that, and so we
• 53:19
  Speaker 1: want you to talk to your physician. You know, we
• 53:20
  Speaker 1: want you to, But don't be surprised if they just say, yeah,
• 53:23
  Speaker 1: we're not gonna make you jump through thirty two hoops
• 53:25
  Speaker 1: and do genetics. Yeah, they're gonna be like try it.
• 53:28
  Speaker 1: You're gonna be like, well, shouldn't we figure out if
• 53:30
  Speaker 1: it works first? Like that's what we're gonna do. We're
• 53:31
  Speaker 1: gonna figure out if it works today, Like today's the
• 53:34
  Speaker 1: day we're just doing this. Yeah, And like some of
• 53:36
  Speaker 1: these meds do take three to four weeks, which the
• 53:38
  Speaker 1: writer's talking about is like that could be frustrating, And
• 53:41
  Speaker 1: so I get the theory of like, hey, let me
• 53:42
  Speaker 1: save myself a fucking month and take this test. I
• 53:45
  Speaker 1: just don't think the test produced that reliable of result
• 53:48
  Speaker 1: at this time. And for psychiatry, there's so many levers,
• 53:51
  Speaker 1: so many like things or variables in the equation. Man,
• 53:54
  Speaker 1: it's definitely where it's going. Ye. S J did one.
• 53:57
  Speaker 1: My wife did not.
• 53:59
  Speaker 3: I don't know if it was genetic, but some kind
• 54:01
  Speaker 3: of some kind of big tests that covered a whole
• 54:05
  Speaker 3: battery of different things, okay, and like most of it
• 54:09
  Speaker 3: was pretty solid.
• 54:10
  Speaker 1: I mean, I think there's huge value to just like
• 54:12
  Speaker 1: testing for sure. It's I think it's just all going
• 54:15
  Speaker 1: that way, yeah, which is good. Like this is it's
• 54:18
  Speaker 1: a great advent for science. But to your earlier question, Jacob,
• 54:21
  Speaker 1: do I think that we'll get there with psychiatry to
• 54:23
  Speaker 1: where we can pinpoint it, I'd be awfully surprised. Okay,
• 54:26
  Speaker 1: but a lot of it. Like even with a lot
• 54:28
  Speaker 1: of the meds we do in psychiatry, they do. I'm
• 54:30
  Speaker 1: not that guy, But like even those meds, we constantly
• 54:35
  Speaker 1: have to control for the placebo effect, right, and like
• 54:37
  Speaker 1: we have seen this amazing power of the placebo effect,
• 54:41
  Speaker 1: especially with psychiatry. We've noticed literally the color of the
• 54:44
  Speaker 1: pill matters, like you know, whether it's a liquid or
• 54:47
  Speaker 1: a solid, whether you inject it or not, Like all
• 54:50
  Speaker 1: of these things matter how often we make you take it.
• 54:52
  Speaker 1: Like the placebo effect is gigantic in mental health, and
• 54:56
  Speaker 1: it's actually an additive. It's a it's a feature, not
• 54:58
  Speaker 1: a bug. Like it's a really good thing because at
• 55:00
  Speaker 1: the end of the day, we want anything and everything
• 55:02
  Speaker 1: to ultimately organize for the person's success. But that's how
• 55:05
  Speaker 1: many variables there are. You can't genetic test for placebo
• 55:08
  Speaker 1: and like whether that's not with that food medicine, Yeah,
• 55:12
  Speaker 1: you can if you take the new pod therapy, genetic
• 55:14
  Speaker 1: test Patreon dot com, slash therapy. Yeah, do not click
• 55:19
  Speaker 1: on the Lysol douche. The brain douche sold separately, not
• 55:23
  Speaker 1: contingent and not available in Alaska. We're and take quick
• 55:26
  Speaker 1: break in when we come back, we're talking about how
• 55:29
  Speaker 1: to work full time and be a master's student. Fuck,
• 55:33
  Speaker 1: this better not be one of mine. You're listening to
• 55:35
  Speaker 1: pod therapy.
• 55:37
  Speaker 4: Today's episode is brought to you by Robert Brownie Junior
• 55:39
  Speaker 4: Men's Kayla Lansbury, Kevin Chamberlain, Ben Stanley, Adam Hathaway, Dan Martin,
• 55:44
  Speaker 4: Liz Hey, Yo, Andrew Lang, meet Chad meg and Inkle
• 55:48
  Speaker 4: of Prince And if you would like to sponsor the show,
• 55:50
  Speaker 4: you should do so. Become a therap producer Patreon dot com,
• 55:53
  Speaker 4: splash therapy.
• 55:54
  Speaker 1: I'm in the lead.
• 55:56
  Speaker 2: That's a life. Yeah, I don't think that's think I am.
• 56:00
  Speaker 2: I think you are too, Jacob from the Man.
• 56:06
  Speaker 4: Ancient Egyptian women, Uh, the fun is that.
• 56:13
  Speaker 1: That's that's Horsey. Horsey. Ancient Egyptian women, not cougars, sphinxes.
• 56:19
  Speaker 1: They're referred to as sphinxes, and god damn all right,
• 56:23
  Speaker 1: they don't make them like that anymore, Jacob. These women
• 56:25
  Speaker 1: know lion God. Now the women all be lyon and
• 56:33
  Speaker 1: that especially affects me because I believe women, yeah and
• 56:37
  Speaker 1: know how things are.
• 56:38
  Speaker 4: Okay, go ahead, okay, sound Egyptian women used pessies sure
• 56:47
  Speaker 4: made from which material as a documented contraceptive method recorded
• 56:53
  Speaker 4: in the con uh pypriss Pyrus God Risk. Yeah, that's
• 57:04
  Speaker 4: what it was, Patrick Up, I actually know this one.
• 57:08
  Speaker 4: Oh Okay, Yeah, I don't know any of the fucking
• 57:10
  Speaker 4: words in the question. Yeah, I know, I know the answer.
• 57:15
  Speaker 1: What was the question? What is the question?
• 57:17
  Speaker 4: Basically, these Egyptian use these Egyptian women use this as
• 57:21
  Speaker 4: contraceptive method.
• 57:22
  Speaker 2: Okay, what is material?
• 57:25
  Speaker 1: Uh, it's what is the substance?
• 57:27
  Speaker 4: Basically options the wrath of God might be on the list.
• 57:32
  Speaker 4: Might have been that bees wax and cedar oil.
• 57:36
  Speaker 1: Like that a lot. He didn't have any to do
• 57:39
  Speaker 1: with it.
• 57:41
  Speaker 4: Salt paste natron neatron salt paste, okay, Uh? A casia
• 57:47
  Speaker 4: gum and honey wow? Or crocodile dung.
• 57:51
  Speaker 1: I mean A and C sound awfully similar. Yeah. Crocodile
• 57:56
  Speaker 1: dung sounds like a winner to me, buddy. They have
• 57:58
  Speaker 1: those in Egypt. I mean, you know they were using
• 58:02
  Speaker 1: some crocodile dung. I don't know what was.
• 58:04
  Speaker 4: A bees wax and cedar oil? What was c natron
• 58:10
  Speaker 4: netron salt paste?
• 58:12
  Speaker 1: To pronounce tron? What was really good tequila? Oh?
• 58:15
  Speaker 4: Cum and honey?
• 58:20
  Speaker 1: And he sound awfully simle. Bees wax and honey are
• 58:22
  Speaker 1: a little different. He's wax, salt, crocodile dung or the
• 58:28
  Speaker 1: tron semicrobial? Yeah, dude, I like that one a lot. Oh, yeah,
• 58:33
  Speaker 1: that's true. That is anti microbial. Uh huh crocodile dung. Yes,
• 58:38
  Speaker 1: it is correct.
• 58:41
  Speaker 2: Head damn it all the ones. I don't want to
• 58:44
  Speaker 2: red harrings.
• 58:45
  Speaker 1: We caught you in a nice try. Good job buddy
• 58:48
  Speaker 1: allowing it. He is and he's earned it. This is
• 58:51
  Speaker 1: his show, This is his time. Let the man cook.
• 58:55
  Speaker 4: Uh okay, who's up winning right wing? The Nobel Prize
• 59:00
  Speaker 4: in Physiology or Medicine in nineteen forty nine was awarded
• 59:04
  Speaker 4: for the development of which procedure wyant would you like?
• 59:10
  Speaker 2: I do not know one?
• 59:12
  Speaker 1: Wow? Oh I missed nineteen forty fifty. That's the one
• 59:18
  Speaker 1: I always forget.
• 59:20
  Speaker 4: Uh A the first successful blood transfusion technique b electroconvulsive
• 59:26
  Speaker 4: therapy protocols see uh the prefrontal lobotomy or d insulin
• 59:32
  Speaker 4: shock therapy.
• 59:34
  Speaker 1: Whoa good more.
• 59:39
  Speaker 4: Poop like people, the first successful blood transfusion technique, electroconvulsive
• 59:48
  Speaker 4: therapy protocols, the prefrontal lobotomy or insulin shock therapy.
• 59:56
  Speaker 1: Going with E C T. Yeah ECT. No, Yeah, I
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 1: was gonna say, I think ECT was developed later, like
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 1: in the sixties and seventies, after the first medicine. Yeah,
• 1:00:07
  Speaker 1: lobotomy feels really fucking old, and it feels like it
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 1: could be back in that time. Give me the bottomy. Yes, yeah,
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 1: there lo bottomy, let's go. Uh.
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 4: Antonio IGOs won the Nobel for lobotomy. He was later
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 4: shot in the spine by a former patient.
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 1: Wow, which of one of the one of histories Wow
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 1: more pointed ironies. Fate you fickle bitch, can't work guns, jesus,
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 1: Oh my god. I mean the aim despite the lobotomy, though,
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 1: you got to give credit where credits they were aiming
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 1: for the head and the spy. All right, hit hysterical,
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 1: that's right, really hard, okay, Jim. Yes.
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 4: Before William Harvey correctly described blood circulation in sixteen twenty eight,
• 1:01:08
  Speaker 4: what did mainstream medical widely believe blood actually did in
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 4: the body.
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 2: Oh shit, Oh this is fine.
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 1: Oh it's gonna be like that humorous thing from the
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 1: Greek to give me options. Okay, options are.
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 2: Uh.
• 1:01:23
  Speaker 4: It flowed in a tidal pattern that ebbed and flowed
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 4: with the lunar cycle.
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 1: That feels good.
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 4: It was constantly produced by the liver and consumed by
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 4: the body, rather than circulating at all. It's separated into
• 1:01:35
  Speaker 4: two distinct types, atrial and venious, and never mixed or
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 4: d It drained slowly into the extremities and required physical
• 1:01:45
  Speaker 4: movement to return to the heart.
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 1: And oh my, oh gosh, all these are pretty Yeah,
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 1: that's hard, you know what, all things being equal, give
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 1: me the liver one. Maybe that's it.
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 4: It was constantly produced by the liver and consumed by
• 1:02:00
  Speaker 4: the blood body, rather than circulating at all. Yes, all right, right,
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 4: this is why blood letting made sense to if the
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 4: blood is constantly being produced and used up removing excess.
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 1: Is are we not doing blood letting anymore? Are we
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 1: doing the leeches thing? Though? Right? Are you doing blood
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 1: letting right now? Because you're kind of a bit We
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 1: were doing it before you got here.
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 2: I know, I thought I was doing it to my clients.
• 1:02:31
  Speaker 1: So this is what that religious movie night is about?
• 1:02:34
  Speaker 1: Got it really just readjusts everything? Okay? How to work
• 1:02:39
  Speaker 1: full time and be a master's student? Hey, Pod therapy friends.
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 1: I wrote in about this once, but maybe it got
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 1: eaten by the spam filter. It's pretty much exactly the title.
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 1: I want to do a master's program so I can
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 1: become a therapist, but I can't go without health insurance
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 1: due to meds my wife and I both take. Do
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 1: you think it's possible to work forty hours a week
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 1: and complete school and licensing? Additionally, I know you've talked
• 1:03:05
  Speaker 1: about it before, but what do you think the best
• 1:03:08
  Speaker 1: license to pursue is l C, s W, l M
• 1:03:12
  Speaker 1: F T or is the program so intense that I
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 1: won't be able to work full time? Thank you all
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 1: so much for what you do. I love the show
• 1:03:20
  Speaker 1: and look forward to it every week. It's such a
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 1: reservoir of information. Therapod Dylan, Dylan. The license you need
• 1:03:28
  Speaker 1: to go for is a trucker's license. That's I think
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 1: it's a Class C so you could drive the big rigs.
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 1: That's what you want because I mean getting paid.
• 1:03:40
  Speaker 2: I was gonna say, what's next licensure for you.
• 1:03:45
  Speaker 3: You don't have to keep working that other job, are you.
• 1:03:53
  Speaker 1: Or a job? Hey, Dylan, can we come work for you?
• 1:03:56
  Speaker 1: Are they hiring? Can we work for you? All right?
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 1: So what are yall thoughts? So?
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 4: First off, yes, we lose mail, okay, Yeah, so if
• 1:04:08
  Speaker 4: we haven't gotten to it in over six months, resend that. Yes,
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 4: it does happen the most the best license to pursue
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 4: l C.
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 1: S W. I think that's true.
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 4: And uh, can you work full time? Depends on the job.
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 2: And you as a person.
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 4: It is incredibly difficult to do, okay, because you not
• 1:04:32
  Speaker 4: only have your course work. And here's the thing, like
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 4: in graduate school. In your undergrad you cannot read the
• 1:04:39
  Speaker 4: material and show up for class and do just fine.
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 4: Graduate school you can't do that. No, you you gotta
• 1:04:46
  Speaker 4: you gotta know your stuff. You gotta know this stuff,
• 1:04:49
  Speaker 4: and you have to come with ideas and thoughts. So
• 1:04:52
  Speaker 4: that's going to be really important. So if you're a
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 4: fast reader, yeah you could probably do that. It's not
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 4: gonna be it's doable. They have though, is what type
• 1:05:00
  Speaker 4: of job you get? I had the best.
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 1: As you worked in grad school. I did full time.
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 4: It wasn't quite full time, but I was probably doing
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 4: thirty hours a week.
• 1:05:12
  Speaker 1: Okay, damn. Yeah.
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 4: I worked at a regional airport for a rental car company.
• 1:05:20
  Speaker 4: Best graduate school job.
• 1:05:22
  Speaker 2: Ever, how many people showed up?
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 4: Fucking nobody and I'm not dating any cars. No, there
• 1:05:28
  Speaker 4: was two rental car agent cars. There was two rental
• 1:05:31
  Speaker 4: car agencies. There was Hurts in Avas. Okay, I worked
• 1:05:35
  Speaker 4: for AVOs. We had one airline, two Hurts. You know
• 1:05:39
  Speaker 4: what you did. There was still real There was one
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 4: airline that flew into this airport. Wow, and it was
• 1:05:44
  Speaker 4: just it just flew flights from uh from Waterloo I
• 1:05:49
  Speaker 4: think it was to Minneapolis at the time, and it's
• 1:05:51
  Speaker 4: just back and forth.
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 1: I mean, they had to be losing money on you, right,
• 1:05:54
  Speaker 1: But here's the way this place was turned to profit.
• 1:05:56
  Speaker 1: Here's the thing.
• 1:05:56
  Speaker 4: There was a there was a flight that landed no
• 1:06:01
  Speaker 4: I think, yeah, I landed at five o'clock in the evening,
• 1:06:06
  Speaker 4: and then the next flight didn't land until ten thirty. Okay,
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 4: So from about six until nine to thirty, the place
• 1:06:15
  Speaker 4: was dead. Not only were there no customers or travelers,
• 1:06:20
  Speaker 4: the airline closed. They all went home. Hurts closed, they
• 1:06:25
  Speaker 4: all went home. We were the only ones that stayed open.
• 1:06:28
  Speaker 4: So I had it was myself. I had this entire Yeah,
• 1:06:33
  Speaker 4: I'm not kidding. I had the entire regional airport to myself.
• 1:06:37
  Speaker 4: I would bring my golf clubs and I made like
• 1:06:39
  Speaker 4: little putting areas like.
• 1:06:43
  Speaker 2: I was.
• 1:06:43
  Speaker 4: I was like I was chipping over the baggage carousels.
• 1:06:47
  Speaker 4: I could do whatever I wanted in this place. So
• 1:06:50
  Speaker 4: like in the summer, that's what I did. But during
• 1:06:53
  Speaker 4: the school year, like that was just it was it
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 4: was just time for me just to sit and study.
• 1:06:57
  Speaker 4: And I just basically got paid to sit and study.
• 1:06:59
  Speaker 1: When you so when you got to the postgraduate part
• 1:07:02
  Speaker 1: where you were you know, trying to get your hours
• 1:07:04
  Speaker 1: and all that stuff, you were working professional at that point,
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 1: so it wasn't like something where you were still working
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 1: like a corporate job or like a different industry once
• 1:07:13
  Speaker 1: you graduated. It was all in on the industry of
• 1:07:15
  Speaker 1: mental health. Once I graduated.
• 1:07:17
  Speaker 4: Yeah, once I got my master's yeah yeah, yeah, Like
• 1:07:19
  Speaker 4: did I continue at the rental car agency f with
• 1:07:22
  Speaker 4: a master's degree?
• 1:07:23
  Speaker 1: Well, I asked, because this is something I'm seeing actually
• 1:07:25
  Speaker 1: more and more, and this is a really good question.
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 1: So like and there's I think there's several good questions here,
• 1:07:29
  Speaker 1: but the one about like can you work and go
• 1:07:32
  Speaker 1: to school full time? I did you know, like I
• 1:07:34
  Speaker 1: was a school teacher. So like I was a school teacher.
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 1: I taught high school for eight years, and then the
• 1:07:39
  Speaker 1: last three of that I was in grad school. And
• 1:07:41
  Speaker 1: so it was every day, right I woke up, I
• 1:07:43
  Speaker 1: went and taught all my classes. Whenever I got into practice,
• 1:07:46
  Speaker 1: I'm an internship. I would go after work to clinics
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 1: where I would do my student internship hours. And I
• 1:07:52
  Speaker 1: work Saturdays and Sundays doing PSR for jsos and and
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 1: you know, foster kids and stuff like that. So I
• 1:07:57
  Speaker 1: was working seven days a week. It is not its
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 1: And like the joke among like a lot of master's
• 1:08:03
  Speaker 1: students and PhD students is like you become a borderline alcoholic,
• 1:08:06
  Speaker 1: like trying to like hold your shit together because you
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 1: are doing so much and you are working a free
• 1:08:10
  Speaker 1: job at some point in grad school a lot of
• 1:08:13
  Speaker 1: times like it's a full time or part time job
• 1:08:16
  Speaker 1: to get all your hours. But what I'm starting to
• 1:08:18
  Speaker 1: see with my students is not only are many of
• 1:08:21
  Speaker 1: them working and they have to, you know, many of
• 1:08:24
  Speaker 1: them through grad school. But even after graduation, they're having
• 1:08:29
  Speaker 1: to really like think about it because some of these
• 1:08:32
  Speaker 1: folks are in their late twenties, some of them are
• 1:08:34
  Speaker 1: in their thirties. They have a job, they have a career.
• 1:08:36
  Speaker 1: They're making some money. They're working in the hotel industry. Like,
• 1:08:39
  Speaker 1: they're making fine money. They're part got bills. Yeah, they
• 1:08:41
  Speaker 1: have bills, and they're making you know, decent adult money,
• 1:08:44
  Speaker 1: you know, working at whatever they were just doing. They
• 1:08:47
  Speaker 1: want to switch careers. They want to get into mental health,
• 1:08:49
  Speaker 1: and they're devastated to discover that, Like oftentimes the starting
• 1:08:52
  Speaker 1: salary in America for mental health is less than the
• 1:08:55
  Speaker 1: general manager.
• 1:08:56
  Speaker 2: Of the experience.
• 1:08:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, during your intern years, you're like fifty
• 1:08:59
  Speaker 1: that up to six them. And they're like, I'm currently
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 1: make eighty five thousand working at like in a corporation,
• 1:09:05
  Speaker 1: working a real job, and now I'm going to graduate
• 1:09:08
  Speaker 1: and take a huge pay cut for the honor of
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 1: getting into this profession that took me seven years to
• 1:09:14
  Speaker 1: earn the education to get into.
• 1:09:16
  Speaker 4: I'm sorry if there was any confusion. I was not
• 1:09:18
  Speaker 4: making eighty five grand at.
• 1:09:20
  Speaker 1: Dheah, Okay, I assume I want to make that in
• 1:09:24
  Speaker 1: case anybody got the wrong idea.
• 1:09:25
  Speaker 2: That's the Vegas thing.
• 1:09:28
  Speaker 1: But no, this is a re problem. And so like
• 1:09:30
  Speaker 1: I have a lot of students that struggle because they're like,
• 1:09:33
  Speaker 1: I want to enter this profession fully. I want to
• 1:09:35
  Speaker 1: earn my hours. I want to start my internship. But
• 1:09:38
  Speaker 1: like in Nevada, at least if you start an MFT
• 1:09:40
  Speaker 1: or a CPC internship, which are two specific licenses in Nevada,
• 1:09:44
  Speaker 1: along with other things like kelse'sw's you're on the clock.
• 1:09:46
  Speaker 1: I don't know how social work does it, but like
• 1:09:48
  Speaker 1: you have three years from when you start your internship
• 1:09:50
  Speaker 1: to complete it, and so you really have to be
• 1:09:53
  Speaker 1: diligent to like find a path where you're going to
• 1:09:55
  Speaker 1: get all these hours and you get paid for postgraduate
• 1:09:58
  Speaker 1: internship like it's a it's a real job. But for
• 1:10:00
  Speaker 1: a lot of them, they're like, I would have to
• 1:10:02
  Speaker 1: lose money to go do therapy every day to earn
• 1:10:05
  Speaker 1: these hours so that one day, in two or three
• 1:10:08
  Speaker 1: more years, I might finally enter this career fully. And
• 1:10:11
  Speaker 1: even then it has a ceiling, you know, like unless
• 1:10:13
  Speaker 1: you get into different lanes. If you're just a practicing
• 1:10:16
  Speaker 1: therapist for an agency or whatever, there's a ceiling to
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 1: how much money you can make because the insurance is
• 1:10:20
  Speaker 1: just no offense. Whitney criminally underpay all the providers, is
• 1:10:25
  Speaker 1: flagrantly violating parody laws.
• 1:10:26
  Speaker 2: They keep getting caught insurance company, Okay, we get it
• 1:10:36
  Speaker 2: on their eg So yeah, but like it is a
• 1:10:38
  Speaker 2: really complex process and it makes me sad.
• 1:10:40
  Speaker 1: And I was just talking to somebody about this other
• 1:10:42
  Speaker 1: day because some of my students are graduating, you know,
• 1:10:44
  Speaker 1: it's May, and like it's really sad because they're like, well,
• 1:10:47
  Speaker 1: do you know anybody that got their masters and never
• 1:10:49
  Speaker 1: got into the profession. And I'm like, tons of people
• 1:10:52
  Speaker 1: and I'm sure you both do too, like people who
• 1:10:54
  Speaker 1: got into the profession. Just know people got their masters
• 1:10:57
  Speaker 1: and didn't do it. Yeah, I mean I know tons
• 1:10:59
  Speaker 1: of people that got the masters. And I have people
• 1:11:02
  Speaker 1: that never stopped teaching in the district because they were
• 1:11:04
  Speaker 1: getting benefits and perrs and good money and they were like,
• 1:11:07
  Speaker 1: I'm not gonna throw away my nine month calendar and
• 1:11:10
  Speaker 1: like all this stuff to go work full time and
• 1:11:12
  Speaker 1: make the same money or you know, be less. So
• 1:11:14
  Speaker 1: is it is a really erratic industry. And unfortunately we
• 1:11:17
  Speaker 1: do see a lot of people asking this exact question
• 1:11:20
  Speaker 1: of like can I afford to stop working to go
• 1:11:23
  Speaker 1: to grad school because it's a very rigorous process, and
• 1:11:25
  Speaker 1: then post graduate, am I going to be able to
• 1:11:28
  Speaker 1: transition into this career fully in a way that like
• 1:11:31
  Speaker 1: I get insurance, I get benefits a lot of like
• 1:11:33
  Speaker 1: postgraduate new therapists are just contractors and it's very hard
• 1:11:37
  Speaker 1: for them to get like a salary, full time gig.
• 1:11:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, and definitely blame the insurance for a lot,
• 1:11:42
  Speaker 2: but I feel like the crime is that there are
• 1:11:45
  Speaker 2: agencies that are taking most of the money and paying
• 1:11:48
  Speaker 2: their therapisttions.
• 1:11:49
  Speaker 1: There's a problem with that too, but there's only so
• 1:11:51
  Speaker 1: much they can bill. And like in Nevada, like this
• 1:11:54
  Speaker 1: whole investigation just revealed that basically all the big insurances
• 1:11:57
  Speaker 1: in our state were just fundamentally kneecap being the reimbursements
• 1:12:01
  Speaker 1: by twenty five percent, just illegally breaking the parity law.
• 1:12:04
  Speaker 1: They're just not paying. And so it's like, oh, that's
• 1:12:06
  Speaker 1: why we can't afford to be in the profession, that's
• 1:12:08
  Speaker 1: why places are closing, And then like authorizations are being
• 1:12:10
  Speaker 1: denied and like anyway won't get in all the business
• 1:12:13
  Speaker 1: of it. But like writer. Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah, you
• 1:12:17
  Speaker 1: can do all the So Whitney, during grad school, what
• 1:12:19
  Speaker 1: did you do? Did you did you work? Did you
• 1:12:21
  Speaker 1: were you just a student? Because only fans wasn't around then,
• 1:12:25
  Speaker 1: so like how were you paying the otherwise?
• 1:12:27
  Speaker 2: Okay, tell us about the art life.
• 1:12:31
  Speaker 1: Only you too worked at an enterprise rental company?
• 1:12:35
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I definitely. I worked part time at an after
• 1:12:38
  Speaker 2: school program like at the YMCA. I was very lucky
• 1:12:44
  Speaker 2: that I had help from family and things like that.
• 1:12:46
  Speaker 2: I lived with a family member. I didn't have rent
• 1:12:49
  Speaker 2: things of that nature. I was right out of undergrad,
• 1:12:51
  Speaker 2: so I just went right into grad school.
• 1:12:52
  Speaker 4: And see that was Yeah, there was like in my
• 1:12:56
  Speaker 4: graduate class, there was ten of us, and it was
• 1:12:59
  Speaker 4: a mixture. I think like five of us came right
• 1:13:02
  Speaker 4: from undergrad and five had already been out working and
• 1:13:08
  Speaker 4: were coming back to get their masters. And so it
• 1:13:11
  Speaker 4: was interesting because there were benefits to.
• 1:13:14
  Speaker 2: Both yes, and sometimes people who'd been out on.
• 1:13:17
  Speaker 4: The road, Yeah, because they had that experience and like
• 1:13:20
  Speaker 4: they had the you know, they got the book smarts,
• 1:13:23
  Speaker 4: but then they could also say, yep, and here's what
• 1:13:26
  Speaker 4: this looks like in real life, and here's what the
• 1:13:28
  Speaker 4: book doesn't tell you, and like that was really helpful
• 1:13:31
  Speaker 4: to have that. But the downside is exactly what Dylan's
• 1:13:35
  Speaker 4: talking about. It's like they had a lot of obstacles,
• 1:13:38
  Speaker 4: you know. I mean I didn't have kids, I.
• 1:13:40
  Speaker 2: Didn't need.
• 1:13:45
  Speaker 4: And not to mention, but like maintaining a relationship through
• 1:13:48
  Speaker 4: graduate school is difficult. I remember myself and two of
• 1:13:52
  Speaker 4: my classmates were on a panel, uh talking to a
• 1:13:57
  Speaker 4: bunch of undergrads, and they were asking questions about like
• 1:14:00
  Speaker 4: graduate school and what can they expect and what's it like.
• 1:14:03
  Speaker 4: And somebody asked the question, well, I know, graduate school
• 1:14:07
  Speaker 4: is really really stressful, and you know, how is it
• 1:14:11
  Speaker 4: as far as like relationships maintaining relationships? And the three
• 1:14:15
  Speaker 4: of us just kind of looked at each other because
• 1:14:17
  Speaker 4: all three of us were going through a divorce at
• 1:14:19
  Speaker 4: the time.
• 1:14:20
  Speaker 2: Who's going to answer.
• 1:14:26
  Speaker 1: Or for three chosen it can be done. Yeah, No,
• 1:14:36
  Speaker 1: it's a very taxing thing, writer, So grad school is
• 1:14:39
  Speaker 1: very hard. As you were pointing out, Nick, it is
• 1:14:42
  Speaker 1: not like you're undergrad but this is something that the
• 1:14:45
  Speaker 1: majority of my students have jobs. I think the majority
• 1:14:48
  Speaker 1: of my students have full time or part time jobs,
• 1:14:51
  Speaker 1: and there are a lot of them that don't. But
• 1:14:54
  Speaker 1: I did it, and so it is possible to do.
• 1:14:57
  Speaker 1: It's definitely going to be taxing during the student in
• 1:15:00
  Speaker 1: ship phase. I think that's a real serious thing. And
• 1:15:02
  Speaker 1: then I'm glad that we are also bringing up the
• 1:15:04
  Speaker 1: post graduate phase because I think a lot of people
• 1:15:06
  Speaker 1: just think all I have to do is get to
• 1:15:08
  Speaker 1: graduation day and then hoorah, I'll jump into this industry
• 1:15:12
  Speaker 1: that desperately needs me. The world is crying out for
• 1:15:14
  Speaker 1: mental health help, and I'll be greeted with open arms.
• 1:15:16
  Speaker 1: And the truth is, the average nurse who graduates college
• 1:15:20
  Speaker 1: at twenty two is going to start with a higher
• 1:15:22
  Speaker 1: salary than the average counselor who got ten years of school.
• 1:15:25
  Speaker 1: Our seven years of school plus three more years of
• 1:15:28
  Speaker 1: postgraduate apprenticeship in order to enter the profession. So it
• 1:15:31
  Speaker 1: is still a profession that has a lot of growth
• 1:15:34
  Speaker 1: to do. We are still working on it nationally and regionally,
• 1:15:37
  Speaker 1: trying to get everything equitable, getting everything right. Also, it's
• 1:15:40
  Speaker 1: not the only healthcare profession going through its woes, right,
• 1:15:43
  Speaker 1: Like American healthcare system is just shitty. So not to
• 1:15:46
  Speaker 1: just overly do it about you know, behavioral health and
• 1:15:48
  Speaker 1: all that. There's a lot of problems and it's very complex,
• 1:15:52
  Speaker 1: but I want to circle around.
• 1:15:53
  Speaker 2: Oh go ahead, yeah, I was gonna Were you going
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 2: to circle back to the licenses there?
• 1:15:57
  Speaker 1: Yep?
• 1:15:57
  Speaker 2: Okay, go on.
• 1:15:58
  Speaker 1: This is the part where Whitney just gets a blow
• 1:16:00
  Speaker 1: job from all of us. So, yeah, social work wins.
• 1:16:02
  Speaker 1: But I want to explain why the air ball.
• 1:16:07
  Speaker 2: Just groom.
• 1:16:09
  Speaker 1: Don't have to choke on this shit. All right, So
• 1:16:11
  Speaker 1: the writer says lmft. So that's licensed marriage and family
• 1:16:14
  Speaker 1: therapists versus licensed clinical social workers. So just really quick,
• 1:16:18
  Speaker 1: because I think this is a good question. We have
• 1:16:19
  Speaker 1: a lot of people that listen to the show, like
• 1:16:21
  Speaker 1: this person, who are aspiring into the profession. Generally speaking,
• 1:16:25
  Speaker 1: the mental health professions are your PhDs, what we call
• 1:16:28
  Speaker 1: clinical psychologists or just psychologists. There's also a version of
• 1:16:31
  Speaker 1: that called the PSID. Same thing. Then you have, in
• 1:16:34
  Speaker 1: order of maturity, the psychologists are the ogs, after the psychiatrist,
• 1:16:38
  Speaker 1: the medical doctors. Then we have our older siblings, the
• 1:16:42
  Speaker 1: social workers, who are the next ones on the scene.
• 1:16:44
  Speaker 1: They get a master's in social work and after that
• 1:16:48
  Speaker 1: they can do multiple paths in social work. They don't
• 1:16:51
  Speaker 1: have to go full blown clinical, but if they do
• 1:16:54
  Speaker 1: as our friend Whitney did. They become a licensed clinical
• 1:16:56
  Speaker 1: social worker and that license carries a lot of weight
• 1:16:59
  Speaker 1: in and there's been a lot of equity building in
• 1:17:02
  Speaker 1: the last few decades between all the licenses, and so
• 1:17:05
  Speaker 1: today they're actually much more equitable than people realize because
• 1:17:08
  Speaker 1: for the longest time, only lcsw's could work with the
• 1:17:11
  Speaker 1: Department of Defense, could work with VA could take Medicare.
• 1:17:16
  Speaker 1: I mean, we could all take Medicaid in our states,
• 1:17:19
  Speaker 1: but only social workers could take Medicare. And so they
• 1:17:21
  Speaker 1: just had a lot better access. They were easier to
• 1:17:24
  Speaker 1: impanel with insurances. They're just universally known. They could easily
• 1:17:27
  Speaker 1: get jobs with hospitals. Yeah, their scopes were much broader
• 1:17:31
  Speaker 1: because they've been around forever and so like they just
• 1:17:34
  Speaker 1: had it all. And then when MFTs and then later counselors,
• 1:17:38
  Speaker 1: which yeah, in Nevada we call them clinical professional counselors.
• 1:17:41
  Speaker 1: A lot of other states call them just LPC's professional counselors, lmhcs,
• 1:17:45
  Speaker 1: licensed mental health counselors. They're all the same license, we
• 1:17:48
  Speaker 1: just labeled them differently. They were the youngest ones to
• 1:17:52
  Speaker 1: come around, and so they've been the latest ones to
• 1:17:54
  Speaker 1: get caught up. But now all the licenses are impaneled
• 1:17:58
  Speaker 1: if they want to be with medicare all the licenses
• 1:18:00
  Speaker 1: for the most part, can work with the military, the DoD.
• 1:18:03
  Speaker 1: I think social workers still have a really good end
• 1:18:05
  Speaker 1: with the VA, but they can hire externally. But social
• 1:18:08
  Speaker 1: workers still have a lot of benefits, and one of
• 1:18:10
  Speaker 1: the biggest ones is portability of the license. So like
• 1:18:13
  Speaker 1: if Whitney decided, fuck Nevada, I'm the hell out of here,
• 1:18:16
  Speaker 1: I'm going to Arizona, it would not be that hard
• 1:18:19
  Speaker 1: to move an LCSW from one state to another. Is
• 1:18:22
  Speaker 1: that your.
• 1:18:23
  Speaker 2: Experience depending on the state.
• 1:18:24
  Speaker 1: Okay it does? It depend on the state a little bit.
• 1:18:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah, are easier than others.
• 1:18:28
  Speaker 1: Okay, that's fair. The MFTs have a hard time of it.
• 1:18:31
  Speaker 1: So like they're working on something that's in licensed portability
• 1:18:35
  Speaker 1: right now, but their license like dynamics state to state
• 1:18:38
  Speaker 1: very wildly. Really, it's really really hard. Now the counselors
• 1:18:43
  Speaker 1: just passed the I forget what it's called, but it's
• 1:18:46
  Speaker 1: the Counselor Compact. And so now we have like almost
• 1:18:49
  Speaker 1: forty states in the compact, where I once this thing
• 1:18:52
  Speaker 1: in acts in Nevada, which is going to enact this summer.
• 1:18:54
  Speaker 1: I can apply for privilege to practice in Florida or
• 1:18:58
  Speaker 1: Pennsylvania and basically I don't have I get a license there.
• 1:19:01
  Speaker 1: I just get a pass, okay, And so we're all
• 1:19:03
  Speaker 1: part of the same like agreement, where like if they
• 1:19:05
  Speaker 1: want to practice in Nevada, they can ask for permission,
• 1:19:08
  Speaker 1: they can get a privilege, a pass to practice, and
• 1:19:09
  Speaker 1: they can do telehealth or they can move here if
• 1:19:11
  Speaker 1: they want, and they don't have to get a whole
• 1:19:12
  Speaker 1: another license. Whereas I think lcsw's have generally worked their
• 1:19:17
  Speaker 1: shit out across most states. I mean, you guys have
• 1:19:19
  Speaker 1: been around for so long, you have pretty universal standards,
• 1:19:23
  Speaker 1: Like I would think it's not impossible your your license
• 1:19:25
  Speaker 1: in multiple states as it is, aren't.
• 1:19:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I am. And even then the differences that mattered,
• 1:19:31
  Speaker 2: like being licensed to Nevada and Oregon. With Oregon, they're
• 1:19:35
  Speaker 2: very specific, like they're called oars and so it's basically
• 1:19:40
  Speaker 2: their rules, okay, follow and so it you have to
• 1:19:43
  Speaker 2: take a little mini test on these oars to apply
• 1:19:46
  Speaker 2: for their licensure. But usually, yeah, you have to pay
• 1:19:49
  Speaker 2: a fee. And I found that moving my license, my
• 1:19:52
  Speaker 2: master's level license from Texas to Nevada was pretty easy.
• 1:19:57
  Speaker 2: But I remember at that time they were like, oh,
• 1:19:59
  Speaker 2: it's only I mean what they told me, I guess,
• 1:20:01
  Speaker 2: or what I read or heard was that Texas has
• 1:20:04
  Speaker 2: higher standards than Nevada. So it's like that was an
• 1:20:07
  Speaker 2: easier way to go. Text Nevada now going to the.
• 1:20:09
  Speaker 1: Fifty first best state, proudly yeah, proudly.
• 1:20:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I know your friends to Adams, but that was
• 1:20:19
  Speaker 2: just the word on the street, so okay, yeah, So
• 1:20:22
  Speaker 2: I don't know. I haven't tried other states moving to those,
• 1:20:24
  Speaker 2: but I have friends that are lcsw's in their license
• 1:20:26
  Speaker 2: down Arizona or Okay, other places.
• 1:20:29
  Speaker 1: And do you do you hear just through like colleagues
• 1:20:32
  Speaker 1: and stuff that they they do experience problems trying to
• 1:20:35
  Speaker 1: move their licenses.
• 1:20:36
  Speaker 2: I wouldn't say problems. You just don't know what the
• 1:20:38
  Speaker 2: flow is going to be.
• 1:20:39
  Speaker 1: If there they're guarantee of like there's been an agreement
• 1:20:42
  Speaker 1: or something.
• 1:20:42
  Speaker 2: Right like for again, for example, in Oregon, you have
• 1:20:45
  Speaker 2: to take certain tests to be licensed there or have
• 1:20:48
  Speaker 2: different hours. So Oregon I have to do forty hours
• 1:20:51
  Speaker 2: annually of CUS and then are not annually but every
• 1:20:55
  Speaker 2: two years, and then uh oh you.
• 1:20:57
  Speaker 1: Have to do each state's requirements.
• 1:20:59
  Speaker 2: I do, but a lot of them over now, so
• 1:21:02
  Speaker 2: it's actually kind of nice. Yeah, but Nevada's thirty six,
• 1:21:05
  Speaker 2: so I have to do a few extra. It's just
• 1:21:07
  Speaker 2: stuff like that. I don't know. It's okay, not like hard,
• 1:21:10
  Speaker 2: not impossible, it's just different. You have to be aware
• 1:21:13
  Speaker 2: and they may not accept.
• 1:21:15
  Speaker 1: Accept your In the last legislative session in Nevada, they're
• 1:21:19
  Speaker 1: they're currently working on a social work compact as well.
• 1:21:21
  Speaker 1: So my understanding is that nationally, the Social Work Professional
• 1:21:25
  Speaker 1: Organization is advocating for a compact between all the states.
• 1:21:28
  Speaker 1: It's still kind of in its early development. I think
• 1:21:30
  Speaker 1: the counselors are kind of the first ones through the wall,
• 1:21:32
  Speaker 1: and social workers like, let's see what happens these idiots,
• 1:21:34
  Speaker 1: and so far we seem to be surviving. So like
• 1:21:36
  Speaker 1: all right, let's let's go. And but the MFTs have
• 1:21:38
  Speaker 1: sworn it off. They've they've come out as an a MFT.
• 1:21:41
  Speaker 2: Their own their own, their own lane. I'm like, what
• 1:21:44
  Speaker 2: are you doing?
• 1:21:45
  Speaker 1: Yeah, their things, they want licensed portability, and so they're
• 1:21:48
  Speaker 1: trying to get each state to kind of like just
• 1:21:50
  Speaker 1: consent to like one standard, like this is how all
• 1:21:53
  Speaker 1: but getting each state legislature to vote on changing their
• 1:21:57
  Speaker 1: entire licensing platform is a lot like versus just getting
• 1:22:00
  Speaker 1: them to opt into an agreement with other states in
• 1:22:03
  Speaker 1: which you can share therapists. Yeah.
• 1:22:05
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I also feel I just read I think I
• 1:22:07
  Speaker 2: was on Reddit. I was reading about the different licensures
• 1:22:10
  Speaker 2: and things like that. Most people their impression was that, yes,
• 1:22:15
  Speaker 2: everything you said about lcsw's and I mus dan obviously,
• 1:22:18
  Speaker 2: but they were saying that, you know, these other professions
• 1:22:23
  Speaker 2: or the other other licensures, LMFT and LPC's all of
• 1:22:27
  Speaker 2: that that they their lane is very much more clinical,
• 1:22:32
  Speaker 2: like it is therapy directed. And in my program. I
• 1:22:35
  Speaker 2: don't know if all social work master's programs are like this,
• 1:22:39
  Speaker 2: but you could kind of choose if you wanted to
• 1:22:42
  Speaker 2: do direct practice or macro level, okay, and so I did.
• 1:22:46
  Speaker 2: I chose direct practice, so I got more of that
• 1:22:48
  Speaker 2: that work with maybe one or two classes that were
• 1:22:51
  Speaker 2: macro level, which were awesome classes, like, oh my god,
• 1:22:53
  Speaker 2: I love them, but I just knew that was I
• 1:22:56
  Speaker 2: need to stay in my lane.
• 1:22:57
  Speaker 4: So there was I did the opposite, really, yeah, because
• 1:23:01
  Speaker 4: I went the macro route. Okay, So like a lot
• 1:23:03
  Speaker 4: of my graduate school.
• 1:23:04
  Speaker 2: The second one, you're doing kind of macro level work
• 1:23:08
  Speaker 2: there you.
• 1:23:08
  Speaker 4: Go kind of worked out, so like a lot of
• 1:23:10
  Speaker 4: this stuff that like, well, my cohort from the first
• 1:23:14
  Speaker 4: year all but no, actually I think I was the
• 1:23:17
  Speaker 4: only one from my cohort that went social administration. So
• 1:23:21
  Speaker 4: like the rest of them, they were all learning about
• 1:23:23
  Speaker 4: clinical theory and all that stuff. I was learning about
• 1:23:26
  Speaker 4: grant writing, fundraising, like political politics. I lost to pass, yeah,
• 1:23:35
  Speaker 4: like that, all of that stuff, and so that was
• 1:23:37
  Speaker 4: all the stuff that I was.
• 1:23:38
  Speaker 2: Oh, that's really cool. I will also say for anyone
• 1:23:41
  Speaker 2: out there, maybe I've said this before, but my undergrad
• 1:23:46
  Speaker 2: school they did not have a social work degree, so
• 1:23:50
  Speaker 2: I had to take the slightly over two years of
• 1:23:53
  Speaker 2: grad school. But my program in grad school, if I
• 1:23:56
  Speaker 2: would have had a social work undergrad it would have
• 1:23:59
  Speaker 2: only been one year. Yeah, So I just want to
• 1:24:01
  Speaker 2: throw that out there for like, if you have not gone,
• 1:24:04
  Speaker 2: I guess most people are done with.
• 1:24:06
  Speaker 4: That's a huge yeah, because my second year we got
• 1:24:09
  Speaker 4: we met up with that class got so like they
• 1:24:12
  Speaker 4: got their bs W, then they had to do a semester,
• 1:24:16
  Speaker 4: they did a summer semester, and then they joined us.
• 1:24:18
  Speaker 1: Yes, right after that.
• 1:24:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so it can save you money time.
• 1:24:22
  Speaker 1: That's great, And honestly, if it dumps out on an
• 1:24:24
  Speaker 1: LCSW path, that's fantastic. I mean, you can't go wrong.
• 1:24:28
  Speaker 1: Like so when people ask me, you know which license,
• 1:24:30
  Speaker 1: I always tell them you really can't go wrong with LCSW,
• 1:24:33
  Speaker 1: like you will. It's the gold ticket. You'll be welcome everywhere,
• 1:24:37
  Speaker 1: you can do business everywhere. It's generally indersted and accepted.
• 1:24:40
  Speaker 1: One of the only downsides that I've really seen with
• 1:24:43
  Speaker 1: social work is the title social work, like that just
• 1:24:47
  Speaker 1: I think it's still is a little confusing for the public.
• 1:24:50
  Speaker 1: You're social worker. Are you gonna come steal my kids?
• 1:24:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's exactly the connection. Always yeah, and you're like, yes.
• 1:24:55
  Speaker 1: I am, but not because you know you think that's
• 1:24:57
  Speaker 1: what I did. Incidentally, yeah, I do children.
• 1:25:00
  Speaker 4: But I mean, like we kind of talked about this
• 1:25:02
  Speaker 4: last week when we were talking about the d s M five,
• 1:25:05
  Speaker 4: Like read through the committees on a lot of social
• 1:25:08
  Speaker 4: a lot of l cs ws on that, like the
• 1:25:11
  Speaker 4: majority of clinical therapy that's happening right now is being
• 1:25:15
  Speaker 4: done by social workers. But you don't really think about
• 1:25:18
  Speaker 4: it that way. No, No, it's you just think therapists.
• 1:25:21
  Speaker 2: People don't know what the letters all mean.
• 1:25:23
  Speaker 1: They're like exactly, which is fun on this show that
• 1:25:26
  Speaker 1: we get to unpack all that.
• 1:25:27
  Speaker 4: You know, what other license is transferable across all fifty
• 1:25:31
  Speaker 4: states is the CDL.
• 1:25:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah you don't want to get that license. I mean
• 1:25:36
  Speaker 1: as a backup, get the cd L, get solid. You
• 1:25:39
  Speaker 1: can always do therapy in the truck. Yeah that's right. Yeah, fun,
• 1:25:43
  Speaker 1: fun little side note. I don't think I ever really talked about.
• 1:25:46
  Speaker 1: You know, there's somebody is doing that. I make you
• 1:25:52
  Speaker 1: feel better. He's in the handles names, the nicknames. Hey,
• 1:25:59
  Speaker 1: get so with it is. In Nevada this last legislative session,
• 1:26:06
  Speaker 1: there was a big beef between the MFTs, the CPCs,
• 1:26:10
  Speaker 1: and the psychologists. Okay, because the psychologists are kind of
• 1:26:13
  Speaker 1: the ogs. They've been around forever, and one of the
• 1:26:15
  Speaker 1: things they like to do is just metle in the
• 1:26:18
  Speaker 1: licenses of the other professions. And they've put specific restrictions
• 1:26:24
  Speaker 1: on CPCs and MFTs that they didn't dare do to
• 1:26:27
  Speaker 1: lcsw's And so now the CPCs and MFTs are trying
• 1:26:30
  Speaker 1: to get some of this language ripped out because we're like,
• 1:26:32
  Speaker 1: we didn't add this. Uh, these other people have no
• 1:26:35
  Speaker 1: right to do this. We will tell you what we're
• 1:26:37
  Speaker 1: competent to do and not to do, and in every
• 1:26:39
  Speaker 1: other state we don't have the stupid restriction, so we're
• 1:26:41
  Speaker 1: gonna remove it. It's a restriction on assessment which is
• 1:26:44
  Speaker 1: written in such an egregious way that by the letter
• 1:26:46
  Speaker 1: of the law, we shouldn't even been doing like suicide assessments.
• 1:26:49
  Speaker 1: Like it's silk. It just has to be violated. Yeah,
• 1:26:51
  Speaker 1: it's just absolutely dumb. And so we were we were
• 1:26:54
  Speaker 1: all rounding up like signing these petitions, and it was
• 1:26:56
  Speaker 1: really funny because you know, the MFTs and CPCs is
• 1:26:59
  Speaker 1: were like trying to fight this fight. We're like, man,
• 1:27:01
  Speaker 1: you know, how are we gonna you know, win this argument,
• 1:27:04
  Speaker 1: Like we do outnumber the psychologists, but they're powerful. They
• 1:27:08
  Speaker 1: have like a strong professional organization. And so we reached
• 1:27:11
  Speaker 1: out to the Social Workers of Nevada. There's like a
• 1:27:14
  Speaker 1: social work organization, and it was so funny to like
• 1:27:17
  Speaker 1: see the social workers because they were like fuck the psychologists,
• 1:27:20
  Speaker 1: Like they were so quickly on our side and we
• 1:27:23
  Speaker 1: will advocate. It was honestly, it was the cutest thing
• 1:27:26
  Speaker 1: because it really felt like a moment of like our
• 1:27:28
  Speaker 1: older sibling was like, who fucking touched you? Like kicking
• 1:27:31
  Speaker 1: the door open, And it was just really funny because
• 1:27:33
  Speaker 1: like as we were talking to the psychologists, we're like, yeah,
• 1:27:35
  Speaker 1: we noticed you guys never seem to fuck with the
• 1:27:37
  Speaker 1: social workers. What's up with that? It's like because they
• 1:27:39
  Speaker 1: were a hill of ants. There's thousands of them, Like
• 1:27:43
  Speaker 1: they will show up.
• 1:27:44
  Speaker 4: It's not just the you have to understand tho, It's
• 1:27:46
  Speaker 4: not just the numbers. It's the culture of a social
• 1:27:49
  Speaker 4: worker because like our whole profession was built.
• 1:27:52
  Speaker 1: Off of that. Yeah, Like that's where social work came from.
• 1:27:56
  Speaker 3: Their whole profession is being in your business, yeah, I mean,
• 1:28:00
  Speaker 3: and it came.
• 1:28:00
  Speaker 4: From grassroots efforts to like completely change policy and completely
• 1:28:06
  Speaker 4: change organizations, community organizing, like that's all social work.
• 1:28:10
  Speaker 1: I was so pleasantly surprised because, like I remember I
• 1:28:14
  Speaker 1: sent this email like on a lark and the people
• 1:28:16
  Speaker 1: working on the project, and you're like, the social workers
• 1:28:18
  Speaker 1: don't give a fuck, They're not even in this fight.
• 1:28:19
  Speaker 1: Why would they get involved at all? And I was like, look, yeah,
• 1:28:23
  Speaker 1: and I just send it and like they replied that
• 1:28:25
  Speaker 1: night like I send it like midnight and like by
• 1:28:28
  Speaker 1: the next morning my cell phone tell us where the
• 1:28:32
  Speaker 1: fight is, and I was like, Jesus Christ, So yeah,
• 1:28:35
  Speaker 1: I love me some social workers. They are always down
• 1:28:38
  Speaker 1: to get into the fight. But yeah, like these are
• 1:28:40
  Speaker 1: all great options, Dylan. And so the good news is,
• 1:28:43
  Speaker 1: if you feel called to this profession, it is possible
• 1:28:46
  Speaker 1: to enter it. It is possible to work a full
• 1:28:47
  Speaker 1: time job and enter the profession. I would just, you know,
• 1:28:50
  Speaker 1: very much, encourage you to sit down with your spouse,
• 1:28:53
  Speaker 1: do your family finances. I know we're making a lot
• 1:28:56
  Speaker 1: of jokes that like, it's not a very well compensated profession.
• 1:28:59
  Speaker 1: It's not comp and stated well enough for what is required.
• 1:29:02
  Speaker 1: If you can go get a four year bachelor's and
• 1:29:04
  Speaker 1: nursing degree and start at eighty five thousand dollars a year,
• 1:29:06
  Speaker 1: working three nights a week, that's great. If that's the standard.
• 1:29:11
  Speaker 1: It's not okay that people in mental health are going
• 1:29:14
  Speaker 1: to school for seven years, doing three years postgraduate and
• 1:29:18
  Speaker 1: making between fifty and seventy after that much work, right,
• 1:29:21
  Speaker 1: it's not appropriate they should be starting at six figures
• 1:29:23
  Speaker 1: without a break. It's just instantly, I agree they're being
• 1:29:26
  Speaker 1: paid too much. Yeah, that's that's the argument. So definitely
• 1:29:29
  Speaker 1: make sure and I always tell people this before they
• 1:29:31
  Speaker 1: enter the profession, sit down, do the math. Make sure
• 1:29:33
  Speaker 1: that you and your household have thought it through, that
• 1:29:36
  Speaker 1: you you've mapped it out genuinely. I think it's really
• 1:29:38
  Speaker 1: important that people actually sit down with the real data.
• 1:29:41
  Speaker 1: You can go to the Bureau of Labor Statistics. They
• 1:29:44
  Speaker 1: have a really good database. They usually low ball it
• 1:29:46
  Speaker 1: a little bit in my experience, but that is also
• 1:29:48
  Speaker 1: the lowest location quotient state in the country, which means
• 1:29:52
  Speaker 1: we're the fewest providers. So like I guess we probably
• 1:29:55
  Speaker 1: do get paid a little bit better than some of
• 1:29:57
  Speaker 1: our peers in other states. But look at it really carefully.
• 1:29:59
  Speaker 1: If the MA maths, I think it's a wonderful profession.
• 1:30:02
  Speaker 1: And also you don't have to make that median number.
• 1:30:06
  Speaker 1: Like if you're just gonna be a line therapist at
• 1:30:07
  Speaker 1: an agency, then yeah, you're probably where the BLS says
• 1:30:11
  Speaker 1: you are. But there's so many different lanes you can
• 1:30:13
  Speaker 1: get in. You can go work in insurance, and you know,
• 1:30:15
  Speaker 1: I teas Whitney a lot, but she's one of the
• 1:30:16
  Speaker 1: ones who does a good job with it, Like she's
• 1:30:18
  Speaker 1: trying to make sure that the patients that are part
• 1:30:20
  Speaker 1: of her panel are getting the care they need. She's
• 1:30:23
  Speaker 1: providing quality assurance. She's making sure the colleagues stay stranger
• 1:30:25
  Speaker 1: for everything that's right. Yes, yes, yes, yes, help them all.
• 1:30:29
  Speaker 1: But like that, she's the.
• 1:30:30
  Speaker 4: Only one that has the double approved stand that's yeah,
• 1:30:33
  Speaker 4: you'll put this people twice.
• 1:30:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I did, and I gave them a car, you know,
• 1:30:36
  Speaker 1: my social worker. Fuck, you put a little extra in
• 1:30:39
  Speaker 1: there for yourself. She adds tips to the authorizations. You
• 1:30:44
  Speaker 1: give them twenty percent. They did a really good job. Yeah,
• 1:30:47
  Speaker 1: the bread was on time. I really appreciated that. But yeah,
• 1:30:50
  Speaker 1: there's a lot of different lanes that you can go in,
• 1:30:51
  Speaker 1: whether that's private practice, working for the government as Nick does,
• 1:30:55
  Speaker 1: you know, like inspecting it. There's so many different like
• 1:30:58
  Speaker 1: lanes that you can get involved in that are just
• 1:31:00
  Speaker 1: the typical path. And I think that's important to keep
• 1:31:02
  Speaker 1: in mind too.
• 1:31:03
  Speaker 4: At the end of the day, if you're passionate about it,
• 1:31:05
  Speaker 4: you can make it work.
• 1:31:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's you know, like.
• 1:31:07
  Speaker 4: I I feel like I've been doing this now for
• 1:31:11
  Speaker 4: four years, but I've got my full time job. Yeah,
• 1:31:15
  Speaker 4: I've got mental fit, personal training, I've got the podcast. Yes,
• 1:31:19
  Speaker 4: and I stay busy every morning. I've got personal training
• 1:31:23
  Speaker 4: in the morning for at least one maybe two hours,
• 1:31:26
  Speaker 4: then I work my nine to five, then I go
• 1:31:27
  Speaker 4: back to the gym for two or three more sessions.
• 1:31:30
  Speaker 1: God damn. And I do that every day.
• 1:31:32
  Speaker 4: And it's like, but if it's something that you're into
• 1:31:35
  Speaker 4: and it's somebody like you can it's amazing what you
• 1:31:37
  Speaker 4: can really do.
• 1:31:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, right, yeah, you can do it well, the person
• 1:31:42
  Speaker 1: you live with, you can do it. Yeah, it's easy
• 1:31:44
  Speaker 1: when you hate everybody around you. You've been doing private
• 1:31:47
  Speaker 1: practice now for a long time, as long as I've
• 1:31:49
  Speaker 1: known you, I think you've always had private practice. You've
• 1:31:51
  Speaker 1: also worked with agencies. You used to work with Jso's.
• 1:31:54
  Speaker 1: You tell those stories all the time. You've worked in
• 1:31:56
  Speaker 1: the corporate side for the insurance, infrastructure and care delivery.
• 1:32:00
  Speaker 1: I think you've worked in hospitals as well, haven't you. No, okay,
• 1:32:03
  Speaker 1: not in impatient settings, no, okay. I mean there's a
• 1:32:07
  Speaker 1: lot of lanes, you know. I work in education too,
• 1:32:09
  Speaker 1: you know, and teach it.
• 1:32:10
  Speaker 2: So, I mean there's a lot of social workers. There's
• 1:32:12
  Speaker 2: all kinds of stuff. And yeah, you'll you'll find a
• 1:32:14
  Speaker 2: way because and maybe again that is just a social
• 1:32:17
  Speaker 2: work degree. I can't speak for other licensures, but there
• 1:32:21
  Speaker 2: are a lot of different options, and as you move
• 1:32:24
  Speaker 2: through your experience, you will meet people and they will
• 1:32:27
  Speaker 2: provide you with other opportunities. That's how I've gotten a
• 1:32:30
  Speaker 2: lot of mine. As somebody's like, hey, are you looking
• 1:32:32
  Speaker 2: for work? Are you looking for a job? You want
• 1:32:33
  Speaker 2: to do groups, you want to do individual my agency's
• 1:32:35
  Speaker 2: this might like you will be presented with set is true.
• 1:32:38
  Speaker 1: They're always hiring. That has always been true, Like there's
• 1:32:42
  Speaker 1: a cap on how much we're going to earn, but
• 1:32:44
  Speaker 1: like there's always jobs, and so that's really nice too.
• 1:32:47
  Speaker 2: And usually you can leverage like what are you making
• 1:32:49
  Speaker 2: before to.
• 1:32:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you can always climb the ladder. And then it's
• 1:32:52
  Speaker 1: what's really nice about this profession too, is you can
• 1:32:54
  Speaker 1: patch together multiple income streams and that's kind of fun
• 1:32:57
  Speaker 1: to be like, Okay, I'm not always doing one thing.
• 1:33:00
  Speaker 1: I do private practice on the side. I do this now,
• 1:33:02
  Speaker 1: like I, you know, consult with a company to help
• 1:33:05
  Speaker 1: them supervise their interns or whatever. Like that's really fun. So, Dylan,
• 1:33:09
  Speaker 1: I think it's a wonderful profession. Obviously, we do this
• 1:33:11
  Speaker 1: for the love of the game, but we also survive,
• 1:33:14
  Speaker 1: you know, and people can do that, and my students survive,
• 1:33:16
  Speaker 1: they go on to their careers. I just really want
• 1:33:19
  Speaker 1: people to come at this with their eyes wide open.
• 1:33:21
  Speaker 1: It's a very specific, you know, area and industry. It's
• 1:33:24
  Speaker 1: very specific careers. Doing your research, interviewing other therapists. I
• 1:33:28
  Speaker 1: don't know if y'all did that before you entered the profession,
• 1:33:30
  Speaker 1: but that was one of my big stop points. You
• 1:33:32
  Speaker 1: didn't do that before you became a life coach. No,
• 1:33:34
  Speaker 1: that was one of my big points before I went
• 1:33:36
  Speaker 1: into grad school. Is I went and found a couple
• 1:33:38
  Speaker 1: of therapists. I asked them if they'd have coffee with me,
• 1:33:40
  Speaker 1: and I had just a bunch of questions to just
• 1:33:42
  Speaker 1: ask them about their profession. I said, Hey, you don't
• 1:33:45
  Speaker 1: have to answer about money stuff, but I'd like to
• 1:33:47
  Speaker 1: ask and like, if you could just give me a
• 1:33:50
  Speaker 1: range I need to know before I enter your profession,
• 1:33:52
  Speaker 1: does this pay?
• 1:33:54
  Speaker 2: I have a story you just reminded me of from
• 1:33:57
  Speaker 2: grad school one of my professors, because I'm like, I
• 1:33:59
  Speaker 2: didn't do that in like, oh yeah, because all my
• 1:34:00
  Speaker 2: professors are not all the handful would be like they
• 1:34:03
  Speaker 2: would share about their private practice, you know, in our classes.
• 1:34:07
  Speaker 2: But I have this memory. I'm like, I swear I
• 1:34:09
  Speaker 2: didn't make this up right, It's not like a fever dream.
• 1:34:11
  Speaker 2: But one of our professors he was talking about, you know,
• 1:34:14
  Speaker 2: the monetary side, because I think a lot of us
• 1:34:16
  Speaker 2: have always been worried about getting paid less and being
• 1:34:19
  Speaker 2: a social worker and all of that, and knowing that
• 1:34:22
  Speaker 2: going to work for the county you'd make like twenty
• 1:34:24
  Speaker 2: k year back then, and so but he's like he
• 1:34:28
  Speaker 2: started bragging about like owning a Ferrari. He was like
• 1:34:32
  Speaker 2: in his sixties, and I was like, what, okay.
• 1:34:38
  Speaker 4: Uh spell Ferrari, yeah, because I think I don't know
• 1:34:43
  Speaker 4: if this is the Ferrari Ferrari.
• 1:34:55
  Speaker 2: I was like, as the kids say now, it was
• 1:34:57
  Speaker 2: very cringe at the time, but you're like what. And
• 1:35:00
  Speaker 2: then I'm also like, how did you do that? Because like,
• 1:35:02
  Speaker 2: I can't feel like you did that ethically here. If
• 1:35:06
  Speaker 2: something's happening there.
• 1:35:07
  Speaker 1: You probably not anyway, Dylan, I hope that you'll consider
• 1:35:11
  Speaker 1: the profession, but do the math first, make sure it
• 1:35:13
  Speaker 1: matches your life, or do the CDL thing. If you're
• 1:35:16
  Speaker 1: watching on YouTube, you can see all the extra things
• 1:35:18
  Speaker 1: that Jacob is doing where to take quick break and
• 1:35:20
  Speaker 1: when we come back, we are wrapping up the show.
• 1:35:22
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• 1:35:23
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  Speaker 1: I'm Nick, I'm Jim. Thanks and we'll see if your
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