Latest / NO FILTER / The Last Word With Lawrence O_Donnell - May 23 _ Audio Only(M4A_128K)

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The Last Word With Lawrence O_Donnell - May 23 _ Audio Only(M4A_128K) · NO FILTER

0:00
Speaker 1: Good evening from New York. I'm Michel Norris in for
0:03
Speaker 1: Laurence o'donald. If you want to know what being president
0:06
Speaker 1: is all about. For Donald Trump, the last twenty four
0:10
Speaker 1: hours have been very instructive, starting with a revealing new
0:13
Speaker 1: report from Rolling Stone. Sources with direct knowledge of the
0:17
Speaker 1: matter tell Rolling Stone that one of the lessons Trump
0:20
Speaker 1: took away from his previous stint in the White House
0:22
Speaker 1: is that he was wrong to leave a ton of
0:25
Speaker 1: money on the table as president. According to two people
0:28
Speaker 1: who have been in the room with him. In moments
0:30
Speaker 1: of casual banter, Trump has mentioned that it was stupid
0:34
Speaker 1: of other Republicans and advisors to persuade him, at least
0:38
Speaker 1: on occasion, to side with government ethesis who cautioned him
0:42
Speaker 1: from obliterating the line between public good and private game.
0:46
Speaker 1: That reporting coming on the same night that Donald Trump
0:49
Speaker 1: held what critics labeled a quote orgy of corruption, an
0:54
Speaker 1: exclusive dinner gala with the president at his golf club
0:57
Speaker 1: outside Washington for more than two hundred and twenty mostly
1:01
Speaker 1: anonymous and mostly foreign winners of a contest in which
1:05
Speaker 1: the objective was to pour the most cash into Trump's
1:09
Speaker 1: mean Coin cryptocurrency those winners had to navigate a gauntlet
1:14
Speaker 1: of protesters outside Trump's club in a light rain. The
1:18
Speaker 1: White House did not release any details on who the
1:20
Speaker 1: invities were, and at least one who wanted to remain
1:24
Speaker 1: anonymous wore a mask into the event along with their tuxedo.
1:28
Speaker 1: Attendees included former NBA star Lamar Odom, who posted about
1:32
Speaker 1: the event on social media while promoting his own Mean coin,
1:36
Speaker 1: and Justin's son, a Chinese born crypto billionaire whose company
1:41
Speaker 1: was under investigation by the Justice Department and the Treasury.
1:44
Speaker 1: He also faced a lawsuit by the SEC, but that
1:47
Speaker 1: suit was paused in February.
1:49
Speaker 2: After Donald Trump took office.
1:52
Speaker 1: Sun reportedly spent more than forty million dollars on Trump coins,
1:56
Speaker 1: making him the top donor at last night's gallup posted
2:00
Speaker 1: video from inside the ballroom, where a crowd of admirers.
2:03
Speaker 1: Admirers cheered on Trump, and while the White House insisted
2:07
Speaker 1: that Trump was attending as a guest on his personal time,
2:11
Speaker 1: he spoke.
2:11
Speaker 2: At a podium with the Presidential Seal.
2:16
Speaker 3: Who what a nice plush.
2:22
Speaker 4: Did you get to see the helicopters?
2:24
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, super.
2:26
Speaker 4: Coat, that's pretty good. I don't see a lot of
2:29
Speaker 4: window here. How do you like dislocation?
2:33
Speaker 3: It's great.
2:35
Speaker 1: Last night's winners paid an average of one point eight
2:39
Speaker 1: million dollars each to be there. According to the blockchain
2:42
Speaker 1: analytics firm Hanson Pumping and estimated three hundred and ninety
2:47
Speaker 1: four million dollars into Trump's cryptocurrency, and some emerge from
2:51
Speaker 1: that dinner Galla feeling like they didn't get their money's worth.
2:56
Speaker 5: Some guests left disappointed after Trump gave only brief at
3:00
Speaker 5: his Virginia golf club, repeating talking points about a US
3:03
Speaker 5: bitcoin reserve, then left without taking questions or photos.
3:07
Speaker 1: That wasn't the only report of unhappy invitees. Crypto podcaster
3:12
Speaker 1: Eleanor Tarrett posted a social media that two attendees told her,
3:17
Speaker 1: while the food was good, they were disappointed by the
3:19
Speaker 1: lack of meaningful interaction with the president. He just gave
3:23
Speaker 1: a few remarks and left, one said, but for those
3:26
Speaker 1: who paid the most, the party was still going on today.
3:29
Speaker 1: The top twenty five holders of trump coin who played,
3:32
Speaker 1: who paid an estimated one hundred eleven million dollars, according
3:36
Speaker 1: to crypto intel firm INCA Digital lined up outside the
3:39
Speaker 1: White House today for a private audience with Trump, and
3:42
Speaker 1: the top four Trump.
3:44
Speaker 2: Coin holders got a special Trump watch allegedly valued at
3:48
Speaker 2: one hundred thousand.
3:49
Speaker 1: Dollars, including Justin Sun, that top donor who had faced
3:54
Speaker 1: multiple federal investigations in lawsuits until Trump took office this year.
3:58
Speaker 1: But no one may be happy about last night than
4:01
Speaker 1: Donald Trump himself. Two Trump affiliated companies own eighty percent
4:05
Speaker 1: of his meme coin project.
4:07
Speaker 2: Those companies get a.
4:08
Speaker 1: Fee for every trade, and those fees have told to
4:11
Speaker 1: more than three hundred and twenty four million dollars since January,
4:16
Speaker 1: according to the research firm Chain Analysis. It's not known
4:20
Speaker 1: exactly how much goes to Trump personally, but it is
4:23
Speaker 1: likely more than any other president has ever made while
4:27
Speaker 1: serving offices. We are in new territory here. Ashwan sub
4:33
Speaker 1: Sanh is a senior political reporter at Rolling Stone. He
4:36
Speaker 1: was one of the reporters on that story about Trump's
4:38
Speaker 1: desire to cash in on the presidency, and he joins me, now,
4:41
Speaker 1: thanks so much for being with us on a Friday night.
4:44
Speaker 4: Thank you for having me.
4:46
Speaker 1: I want to begin by reading another piece of this
4:48
Speaker 1: story from you and your colleague Tim Dickinson. You write,
4:53
Speaker 1: Trump does not hold space in his mind for any
4:58
Speaker 1: distinction between his private in interest and the public interest.
5:01
Speaker 1: A deal is a deal, the President has said in
5:03
Speaker 1: the past, and several months according he said that several
5:07
Speaker 1: months ago, according to two of your sources. That's interesting.
5:12
Speaker 1: A deal is a deal. No distinction between being president
5:16
Speaker 1: for three hundred and thirty million Americans and being in
5:19
Speaker 1: business for himself.
5:21
Speaker 2: As I said, this is new territory. We've never seen
5:23
Speaker 2: anything like this before.
5:26
Speaker 6: You were saying at the top of this segment that
5:28
Speaker 6: critics have described that crypto Crump's summit as an orgy
5:34
Speaker 6: of corruption. I mean, there isn't really a more apt
5:38
Speaker 6: term than that to use to describe not just that
5:41
Speaker 6: one event, but what has been going on for the.
5:43
Speaker 4: Past few months after Donald Trump retook the White House.
5:47
Speaker 6: It's not just the crypto stuff having to do with
5:50
Speaker 6: this family business empire.
5:51
Speaker 4: It's the Katari government's sky palace that was gifted to him,
5:56
Speaker 4: he likes to say the government, but it'll be therefore
6:00
Speaker 4: potential private use via his Presidential Library Foundation once he's
6:03
Speaker 4: no longer leader of free world. And we could go
6:06
Speaker 4: on and on, and you have said multiple times that
6:09
Speaker 4: this is unturned territory. I don't think that that is
6:12
Speaker 4: something that can be thrilled into the American consciousness enough.
6:16
Speaker 4: If anything, it is being.
6:17
Speaker 7: Undersold right now in our politics, in our media about
6:21
Speaker 7: the level of corruption that Donald Trump and his business
6:26
Speaker 7: associates and his business empire and his family or.
6:31
Speaker 4: Perpetuating right now as they cash in over and over
6:35
Speaker 4: and over again on his holding of the office presidency.
6:38
Speaker 4: And the thing about it that is even worse than
6:42
Speaker 4: the first Trump term. And Trump's first term in office
6:45
Speaker 4: was by no means squeaky cleaning these maps. It was
6:48
Speaker 4: also staggeringly corrupt. He has somehow eclipsed even these sky
6:53
Speaker 4: high standards of that. And it's just so out in
6:56
Speaker 4: the open and so brazen. I'm running out polite words
7:00
Speaker 4: to use to describe it on the air now.
7:03
Speaker 1: So of course Democrats have been raising alarms about this,
7:07
Speaker 1: but you also talk to a lot of Republicans in
7:09
Speaker 1: the White House and on Capitol Hill. Are any of
7:11
Speaker 1: them expressing misgivings about this kind of behavior even in
7:15
Speaker 1: private if they don't want to be quoted on the record.
7:21
Speaker 4: Every once in a while, they might do the occasional
7:23
Speaker 4: pr manicuring.
7:25
Speaker 7: They might sigh a little bit on the phone or
7:28
Speaker 7: in person describing, Oh, I wish maybe.
7:31
Speaker 4: The president I say it wouldn't do this, But would
7:34
Speaker 4: it shock you or your viewers at all to hear
7:38
Speaker 4: that the Republican Party elite right now, which is a
7:41
Speaker 4: wholly owned subsidiary of trump Ism the moment, is just
7:45
Speaker 4: letting him get away with this, or in some cases
7:47
Speaker 4: they're just gleefully backing it. I mean, the standard on
7:53
Speaker 4: this is something very similar to what we reported on
7:55
Speaker 4: when we were asking Republicans in the administration and who
7:59
Speaker 4: have advice Trump for years on what is your legal
8:03
Speaker 4: standard for a second Trump presidency, particularly with regards to
8:07
Speaker 4: executive power, immigration, things like that. And there was one
8:10
Speaker 4: lawyer who was talking to who simply stated, the prevailing
8:14
Speaker 4: legal principle is that, I quote, what are you going
8:17
Speaker 4: to do with that? You can apply what are.
8:20
Speaker 6: You going to do about mentality to how he and
8:22
Speaker 6: his family and his lieutenants have been conducting themselves when
8:26
Speaker 6: it comes to not just defending the perpetuating his Gardangulan
8:30
Speaker 6: levels of corruption.
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Speaker 1: Right now, this is not Trump's only crypto venture. You
8:36
Speaker 1: write that this seems that all of them seem to
8:40
Speaker 1: be heavily supported by foreign capital, capital and the people
8:45
Speaker 1: who would normally investigate that the attorney general, Secretary of
8:50
Speaker 1: State seemed to be looking the other way.
8:54
Speaker 2: So where is any kind of you know, any kind.
9:00
Speaker 1: Of authority that would look over his shoulder, tap his
9:02
Speaker 1: shoulders say you've got to stop doing this. I mean,
9:04
Speaker 1: I guess that's what the lawyer was saying. Who's going
9:06
Speaker 1: to stop him from doing this?
9:10
Speaker 4: At least for the time being, particularly in a pre
9:15
Speaker 4: metrom's environment. There just isn't he there is.
9:20
Speaker 6: He is essentially going un checked on these matters because,
9:23
Speaker 6: at risk of repeating myself, the prevailing legal principle in
9:27
Speaker 6: this administration of what are you.
9:29
Speaker 4: Going to do about it? And also, not only is
9:33
Speaker 4: a twenty general Tamponi and people like that aggressively and
9:37
Speaker 4: intentsion looking the other way, but President Trump directs them
9:42
Speaker 4: on what to do. He's evaporated the supposed judicial and
9:46
Speaker 4: legal independent.
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Speaker 1: So, Aswin Soup saying, thank you very much for this
9:50
Speaker 1: report and good to be with you tonight.
9:52
Speaker 2: Thanks so much.
9:54
Speaker 4: Thank you.
9:55
Speaker 1: Senator Michael Bennett, Democrat of Colorado service on the Finance Committee,
9:59
Speaker 1: and he joins me now, Senator. This week before the
10:02
Speaker 1: Crypto gala, we were talking about the luxuries seven forty
10:05
Speaker 1: seven Trump officially accepted from Katar. How are you processing
10:10
Speaker 1: all of this and what are the legislative checks that
10:14
Speaker 1: might you might be able to use to try to
10:17
Speaker 1: bring him into line with the norms that we normally
10:19
Speaker 1: see with the president and any elected officials trying to
10:23
Speaker 1: avoid at least the appearance of this kind of corruption.
10:28
Speaker 8: Well, I mean here, obviously we know now for two
10:31
Speaker 8: presidencies that the more brazen it is, the more he
10:36
Speaker 8: likes it, because I think that he's using this to
10:39
Speaker 8: basically say I think I'm immune from anybody's oversight, and
10:45
Speaker 8: he's not. And I wrote a bill last week called
10:49
Speaker 8: the Stable Genius Actor would say that no president, no
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Speaker 8: member of a president's family, and no member of Congress
10:56
Speaker 8: should be able to issue cryptocurrency. And if they own cryptocurrency,
11:02
Speaker 8: they should put it in a blind trust so they
11:04
Speaker 8: don't influence the value of that while they're in office.
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Speaker 8: That seems like a pretty obvious thing that we should do.
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Speaker 8: And I think we should have a vote on the
11:13
Speaker 8: floor of the Senate when we get back from this recess,
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Speaker 8: and that'll give Democrats and Republicans the opportunity to say
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Speaker 8: whether they will endorse this kind of corruption, or given
11:23
Speaker 8: the opportunity to vote against it, that they'll take a
11:26
Speaker 8: vote against it. You know, it's one thing to say
11:28
Speaker 8: in private that you're disgusted with this behavior. It's important
11:32
Speaker 8: for this to come out in front of the American
11:35
Speaker 8: people so they can make a judgment about whether or
11:37
Speaker 8: not they're elected. Officials are willing to do the oversight
11:42
Speaker 8: that is required, and especially at a moment like this.
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Speaker 1: But in the Stable Genius Act, the bill that you've
11:49
Speaker 1: introduced to regulate this, Democrats are not in total agreement
11:53
Speaker 1: on this.
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Speaker 2: Are you surprised by that? And what are they going about?
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Speaker 8: I actually think that's a really important point. So my amendment,
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Speaker 8: which people can learn more about at Michael Bennett dot com,
12:05
Speaker 8: is called the Stable Genius Act. But you're right, there
12:09
Speaker 8: is an underlying bill that is called the Genius Act,
12:14
Speaker 8: and that is meant to regulate stable coins in the
12:18
Speaker 8: United States. And you're right there has been some disagreement
12:22
Speaker 8: in the Democratic Party about that. I don't believe we
12:24
Speaker 8: should pass that bill as long as Donald Trump is
12:29
Speaker 8: manipulating cryptocurrency around the world, as long as he is
12:33
Speaker 8: trying to jack up his family's valuations by billions of dollars,
12:39
Speaker 8: and yet that is at risk of actually passing the
12:43
Speaker 8: United States Senate in a week. So not only do
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Speaker 8: I think we should ban Donald Trump from issuing his coins,
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Speaker 8: I don't think that piece of legislation is anywhere near
12:54
Speaker 8: ready to have bipartisan support in the Senate.
12:58
Speaker 1: Now, pardon me for asking this, but sometimes when new
13:01
Speaker 1: technologies appear, whether it's you know, AI or even in
13:05
Speaker 1: issues like infertility treatments and new technologies that you know,
13:11
Speaker 1: there's not all kinds of advantages. There are times when
13:13
Speaker 1: the technology gets out ahead of the broader understanding in
13:17
Speaker 1: the places where laws are made. And is this one
13:19
Speaker 1: of the one example of that where the lawmakers are
13:22
Speaker 1: struggling not just to figure out how to legislate this,
13:24
Speaker 1: but to just understand the basic tenets of cryptocurrency.
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Speaker 8: I think that that is really important. Michelle. It's true,
13:35
Speaker 8: that's totally understandable. It's new technology. It takes people time
13:41
Speaker 8: to understand it in the Congress, and we should delay
13:44
Speaker 8: this so they do. But let me mention something else.
13:47
Speaker 8: I'm doing three more town halls over the next few days,
13:51
Speaker 8: and I guarantee you that those town halls are not
13:53
Speaker 8: going to be We've got hundreds of people signed up
13:56
Speaker 8: for it. They are not coming to talk about the
14:00
Speaker 8: the Stable Act that the Senate is coming to pass.
14:03
Speaker 8: They're coming to talk about the fact that they're losing
14:05
Speaker 8: their healthcare. They're coming to talk about the fact that
14:07
Speaker 8: their kids are losing their access to meals. They're coming
14:11
Speaker 8: to talk about how we need to fight this reconciliation package,
14:15
Speaker 8: and not only that, that we actually have to build
14:18
Speaker 8: a healthcare system in a modern education system in the
14:22
Speaker 8: United States of America. None of that has anything to
14:25
Speaker 8: do with the insanity that Donald Trump is pursuing at
14:30
Speaker 8: the moment. But we can't lose track of that, especially
14:33
Speaker 8: I would say as Democrats who lost the last election
14:37
Speaker 8: to Donald Trump, we've got to have a positive vision
14:40
Speaker 8: about healthcare, about education, about housing, about how we create
14:44
Speaker 8: an economy again, when it grows, it grows for everybody,
14:47
Speaker 8: not just the people at the very chop. In other words,
14:49
Speaker 8: we can't just survive the Trump presidency. We've got to
14:53
Speaker 8: come out on the other side in a way that
14:55
Speaker 8: the country's going to thrive. And in the meantime, we
14:58
Speaker 8: got to make sure that we old him accountable for
15:01
Speaker 8: the nonsense that he is putting the American people through.
15:05
Speaker 1: And as you note, a reconciliation bill is coming your
15:07
Speaker 1: way in the Senate that has provided tax breaks for
15:10
Speaker 1: the rich and serious cuts for those who are living
15:12
Speaker 1: on the other end of the economy.
15:14
Speaker 2: Senator Michael Bennett, thank you very much for being with us.
15:18
Speaker 2: Thank you for having me coming up as.
15:20
Speaker 1: Donald Trump once again escalates his attacks on Harvard. What
15:23
Speaker 1: does it mean for the future of one of the
15:25
Speaker 1: world's most renowned universities.
15:27
Speaker 2: Stay with us, that's next. Welcome back.
15:34
Speaker 1: The thousands of international students attending Harvard University can stay enrolled,
15:39
Speaker 1: at least for now, after yet another federal judge ruled
15:43
Speaker 1: against the Trump administration. Today, the US District Judge in
15:46
Speaker 1: Massachusetts temporarily blocking the administration from its move to ban
15:51
Speaker 1: Harvard from enrolling any foreign students. Yesterday, Secretary of Homeland
15:55
Speaker 1: Security Christy no I'm described the latest escalation against Harvard
15:59
Speaker 1: as a warning to all universities.
16:03
Speaker 9: I sent them a letter that said they will no
16:05
Speaker 9: longer be allowed to participate in this student exchange visitor program.
16:09
Speaker 9: And that's up to twenty seven percent of their enrolled students.
16:13
Speaker 9: There should be a warning to every other university to
16:15
Speaker 9: get your act together.
16:18
Speaker 1: Hillary Burns, a higher education reporter for the Boston Globe,
16:21
Speaker 1: has been covering the story, and she joins me, Now, Hillary,
16:24
Speaker 1: can you lay out what happened yesterday, why this is
16:27
Speaker 1: a critical issue for Harvard, and what mechanism were they
16:30
Speaker 1: trying to use to prevent Harvard from enrolling foreign students
16:34
Speaker 1: who come from foreign lands.
16:38
Speaker 10: Yes, So, yesterday we learned that the Department of Homeland
16:42
Speaker 10: Security was revoking Harvard's ability to enroll foreign students, which
16:46
Speaker 10: was shocking to the entire campus community, sent shockwaves through
16:51
Speaker 10: Cambridge and beyond. This is the latest escalation, as you
16:55
Speaker 10: pointed out, in the Trump administration's campaign to reshape the
16:59
Speaker 10: nation's all this university to align with its worldview.
17:05
Speaker 1: Normally, normally countries would hold up the university like Harvard,
17:11
Speaker 1: as you know, a point of pride. And in this case,
17:14
Speaker 1: the Trump administration gave Harvard no notice before announcing this
17:17
Speaker 1: ban yesterday and yet told them that this was supposed
17:20
Speaker 1: to take effect immediately. What did that mean, you know,
17:25
Speaker 1: for the students who are on campus for the programs
17:28
Speaker 1: that enroll large numbers of foreign students.
17:31
Speaker 2: How exactly would.
17:33
Speaker 1: This have happened if Harvard had decided to comply and
17:36
Speaker 1: they're not. We should just say they're using the language
17:38
Speaker 1: of war. They refused to surrender. But how ideally was
17:42
Speaker 1: this supposed to take place?
17:45
Speaker 10: Yes, the Harvard administration was going back and forth with
17:49
Speaker 10: the Department of Homeland Security for weeks over an extraordinary
17:52
Speaker 10: records request. They were asking for personal information about international students.
17:58
Speaker 10: They also wanted video footage of all protests at Harvard
18:02
Speaker 10: dating back for the last several years, and that was
18:05
Speaker 10: something Harvard says. They did respond to that record's request
18:09
Speaker 10: and they gave they handed over records. We don't know
18:13
Speaker 10: the extent to which to what was included in that,
18:17
Speaker 10: but we know it was inadequate for the Department of
18:20
Speaker 10: Homeland Security, and they moved forward and revoked international enrollment
18:26
Speaker 10: at Harvard, which again is just an extraordinary and shocking
18:29
Speaker 10: escalation in this battle between the Trump administration and Harvard
18:33
Speaker 10: that's been going on now since the Harvard administration sued
18:39
Speaker 10: the Trump administration in April, and they sued them again
18:42
Speaker 10: today this morning, and that's when a federal judge here
18:47
Speaker 10: in Boston did issue a temporary restraining order, so international
18:52
Speaker 10: students can stay.
18:54
Speaker 2: Yesterday, students were scrambling.
18:55
Speaker 10: It didn't know if they'd even be able to graduate
18:57
Speaker 10: next week. Carvard's commencement occurring next week, so there was a.
19:01
Speaker 2: Lot of confusion.
19:03
Speaker 10: But Harvard got to action quickly filing this lawsuit, and
19:06
Speaker 10: that restraining order did come through.
19:08
Speaker 1: So can you explain just a little bit more about
19:11
Speaker 1: the judge's order today? And this is you know, this
19:14
Speaker 1: is a very busy time on any college campus. They're
19:16
Speaker 1: preparing for graduation, students are getting ready to move out.
19:19
Speaker 1: International students, that's just generally complicated because of the distance
19:23
Speaker 1: they have to travel and the paperwork that they generally
19:25
Speaker 1: have to go through. So when the judge issued this ruling,
19:29
Speaker 1: is it a temporary stay?
19:30
Speaker 3: What is?
19:31
Speaker 1: I guess tell us a little bit more about the
19:32
Speaker 1: ruling and then what is the next step.
19:36
Speaker 10: So for now, international students who are already at rolled
19:40
Speaker 10: in Harvard can stay enrolled, they can stay in the country,
19:43
Speaker 10: and students who are planning to come for the fall semester,
19:47
Speaker 10: we'll be able to do so. But we don't know
19:49
Speaker 10: what kind of chilling effect this will have. Already, we've
19:53
Speaker 10: seen student visas being revoked across the country. Some of
19:56
Speaker 10: those have been reinstated, but still scholars are really concerned
20:00
Speaker 10: about the chilling effect that international students that are so
20:03
Speaker 10: important not only for the revenue of these universities but
20:06
Speaker 10: also the academic vitality their contributions to scientific research. They
20:13
Speaker 10: might say, I'm going to go elsewhere. I'm going to
20:15
Speaker 10: go to another country that has friendlier policies for me,
20:18
Speaker 10: and that I won't be nervous about, you know, getting
20:21
Speaker 10: a traffic ticket and getting detained, or having my university,
20:26
Speaker 10: you know, their ability to have host international students have
20:29
Speaker 10: that be revoked. So people are really worried that we're
20:32
Speaker 10: going to start to see international students choose other countries
20:36
Speaker 10: to enroll, which did happen during the first Trump administration
20:39
Speaker 10: as well.
20:40
Speaker 2: And I've got to let you go.
20:41
Speaker 1: But I'm not saying that other universities are trying to
20:43
Speaker 1: exploit this issue.
20:44
Speaker 2: But are they waiting with open arms?
20:46
Speaker 1: Are they starting to line up saying we'll take you
20:48
Speaker 1: if you can't stay in America.
20:51
Speaker 10: Yes, we're seeing that from French and Canadian institutions and
20:55
Speaker 10: perhaps in other parts of the country that are more
20:57
Speaker 10: aligned with the Trump administration as well.
20:59
Speaker 1: Really strong reporting on this, Hillary Burns, thanks so much.
21:02
Speaker 1: That's Hillary Burns of the Boston Globe. Still to come
21:05
Speaker 1: in the midst of graduation season, what is another Trump
21:08
Speaker 1: presidency really teaching America's future leaders?
21:12
Speaker 2: That's coming up?
21:17
Speaker 1: It is graduation season, and the current crop of young
21:21
Speaker 1: people walking across that stage this spring have grown up
21:24
Speaker 1: with Donald Trump as the commander in chief or the
21:27
Speaker 1: campaign a campaign, or denying his election loss for most
21:32
Speaker 1: of their lives, and so there is no doubt that
21:35
Speaker 1: he will leave a mark on a generation of young
21:37
Speaker 1: adults who have watched a man voted twice into office,
21:41
Speaker 1: smash norm stoke divisions, seek retribution, and ignore the Constitution
21:47
Speaker 1: and the rule of law.
21:49
Speaker 11: I've been freaking out a lot about this speech, honestly,
21:54
Speaker 11: and as I search my heart today in addressing you,
22:00
Speaker 11: my moral and political commitments guide me to say that
22:06
Speaker 11: the only thing that is appropriate to say in this
22:09
Speaker 11: time and to a group this large, is a recognition
22:16
Speaker 11: of the atrocities currently happening in Palestine.
22:19
Speaker 7: This world is yours now, and this world needs fixing.
22:24
Speaker 4: And I pray to Thy Heavens that you are the fixers.
22:28
Speaker 11: I call upon the class of twenty twenty five to
22:30
Speaker 11: withhold donations and continue advocating for disclosure and divestment.
22:35
Speaker 12: You've used disappointment to sharpen your convictions. You now know
22:40
Speaker 12: with more certainty what you believe in what you refuse
22:45
Speaker 12: to accept.
22:46
Speaker 13: We saw how policies that claim to optimize actually traumatize,
22:51
Speaker 13: and we saw how those in charge abandoned their obligation
22:54
Speaker 13: to defend free expression and to protect the people they
22:57
Speaker 13: pledged to serve.
22:59
Speaker 1: Young people people are always watching adults for guidance about
23:03
Speaker 1: guardrails and decorum, and what did they see Under Donald Trump?
23:07
Speaker 1: Adults cheered a man who made fun of people with disabilities.
23:11
Speaker 1: Adults look the other way when he talked about grabbing
23:13
Speaker 1: women by their private parts. Adults continue to accept and
23:17
Speaker 1: exalt a man who was twice impeached and convicted of
23:21
Speaker 1: thirty four felonies. Adults continued to support his agenda around immigration,
23:26
Speaker 1: even though it smashed constitutional notions of due process. Adults,
23:32
Speaker 1: even those who expressed reservations, supported his agenda to provide
23:35
Speaker 1: tax cuts to the rich and enact massive cuts and
23:39
Speaker 1: programs for the poor and the elderly. Not all adults,
23:43
Speaker 1: of course, but enough of them went to the voting
23:45
Speaker 1: booth to say all of this is condoned and acceptable.
23:49
Speaker 1: Even when the threats and the vows of retribution became
23:52
Speaker 1: more heated and more common, they returned him to office.
23:56
Speaker 1: And then those same adults remained silent by the admisministration
24:00
Speaker 1: lectured the nation about the need for merit based ideologies
24:04
Speaker 1: while appointing a litany of leaders who are manifestly underqualified
24:09
Speaker 1: for cabinet positions. At the same time, this administration dismantled
24:13
Speaker 1: DEI programs because diversity, equity and inclusion initiatives allegedly discriminate
24:19
Speaker 1: against white Americans, a claim made with no proof, all
24:23
Speaker 1: bombbast no facts. The kids who have grown up under
24:27
Speaker 1: Trump's shadow have inherited a world that is undeniably diverse.
24:30
Speaker 1: This young generation is the most diverse cohort America has
24:34
Speaker 1: ever produced. But they are walking into a world where
24:37
Speaker 1: the very word diversity has been demonized and weaponized to
24:42
Speaker 1: systematically cauterize the civil rights and human rights gains that
24:46
Speaker 1: should have been their true inheritance. Instead, what will they
24:50
Speaker 1: inherit from more than a decade of Trump's ascendancy and
24:53
Speaker 1: takeover of the Republican Party. Graduates marching across stages this
24:57
Speaker 1: spring are strutting into an unst certain job market and
25:01
Speaker 1: a tumultuous economy. They and their children and their aging
25:04
Speaker 1: baby boomer and Gen X parents are less likely to
25:07
Speaker 1: have solid health care or benefit from research based medical advancement.
25:12
Speaker 1: Let's remember that fifty five percent of higher education research is,
25:17
Speaker 1: or perhaps we should say was, funded by the federal government.
25:22
Speaker 1: This administration slash and burn and flail around a chainsaw
25:25
Speaker 1: approach to federal programs was ostensibly to cut waste.
25:30
Speaker 2: Fraud, and abuse.
25:31
Speaker 1: The real goal, however, was really about providing more tax
25:34
Speaker 1: cuts for ultra wealthy Americans. It has done little to
25:38
Speaker 1: guild the futures of everyday American kids. And even with
25:42
Speaker 1: all of this, Donald Trump made significant inroads with gen
25:45
Speaker 1: Z voters in the last election. There's been a lot
25:47
Speaker 1: of analysis on the gen Z voters who gravitated toward
25:51
Speaker 1: Donald Trump in the November election, but less so on
25:53
Speaker 1: the impact that his leadership has had on their psychices
25:57
Speaker 1: or their outlook in life. You wish the best for
26:01
Speaker 1: all graduates this year from universities, from trade schools, military academies,
26:05
Speaker 1: community colleges, and high schools. The hills may be steeper
26:09
Speaker 1: for some of you, but sometimes it's easier to find
26:11
Speaker 1: your stride when you're charging a hill. We hope you
26:14
Speaker 1: find your best selves, and we hope that the adults
26:17
Speaker 1: who are now running things find a way to give
26:19
Speaker 1: the so called Trump generation the opportunities in life that
26:24
Speaker 1: you all deserve.
26:30
Speaker 14: Let me also say that we firmly believe that our
26:33
Speaker 14: international students have the same rights to freedom of speech
26:38
Speaker 14: as everyone else, and they should not be targeted by
26:43
Speaker 14: the government for exercising that right.
26:47
Speaker 1: Students at Columbia University let their schools acting president know
26:51
Speaker 1: exactly how they felt during graduation proceedings earlier this week.
26:55
Speaker 1: They expressed dissatisfaction with the school's capitulation to the Trump administration,
26:59
Speaker 1: as well as the continued detention of student and lawful
27:03
Speaker 1: resident Mackmoud Khalil.
27:04
Speaker 2: Contrast that with the scene at Morehouse College in Atlanta.
27:07
Speaker 2: This week.
27:08
Speaker 1: The school decided to empower its student body by giving
27:11
Speaker 1: graduates the opportunity to introduce themselves and share their own
27:15
Speaker 1: accomplishment as they take the next step into their futures.
27:23
Speaker 1: Tresi McMillan connum is a professor at UNC Chapel Hill
27:27
Speaker 1: and an opinion columnist for The New York Times. She
27:29
Speaker 1: joins me, Now, I'm such a big fan of your work.
27:31
Speaker 1: I'm so glad you are with me for this conversation.
27:34
Speaker 1: In your experience as a professor, how have the Trump
27:37
Speaker 1: years shaped the way young people see the world?
27:44
Speaker 15: Pleasure to be here with you, by the way, Michelle,
27:45
Speaker 15: you look wonderful in the chair. By the way, listen,
27:49
Speaker 15: it was heartbreaking to me to hear you a little
27:50
Speaker 15: earlier called this the Trump generation, by the way, you know,
27:53
Speaker 15: I was of that moment where we were talking about
27:56
Speaker 15: the Obama generation and how we would have this generation
28:00
Speaker 15: of children who had never known in America without a
28:04
Speaker 15: black president and all the possibility that portended for our
28:09
Speaker 15: multi racial future. And to hear about a or to
28:14
Speaker 15: consider what a Trump generation will learn from us and
28:19
Speaker 15: as an analogue to what we hoped they'd learned about
28:22
Speaker 15: us from the Obama years, is a bit heartbreaking. When
28:28
Speaker 15: I talk to young people in particular, with keeping in
28:31
Speaker 15: mind that college students come in a wide range and varieties,
28:33
Speaker 15: but in young people in particular, there is this sense
28:37
Speaker 15: that we prepare them for in America that does not exist.
28:42
Speaker 15: So when we talk about how they are much more
28:45
Speaker 15: accepting of sexual minorities, for example, that didn't fall out
28:48
Speaker 15: of the sky.
28:49
Speaker 3: They came through K through twelve.
28:51
Speaker 15: Where they learned these lessons about how you treat other
28:54
Speaker 15: people and to be accepting and how we were supposed
28:58
Speaker 15: to treat people that were different from us, only to
29:01
Speaker 15: arrive in college and find out that not only was
29:05
Speaker 15: that not the reality, but the very things they have
29:08
Speaker 15: been taught to value now makes them targets in their
29:13
Speaker 15: own country, either because they are those people they embody
29:16
Speaker 15: those identities and those lived experiences, or because they sympathize
29:20
Speaker 15: or empathize with those people.
29:23
Speaker 3: So there's a sense of loss of trust, not.
29:27
Speaker 15: Just between generations, but I think between young people and
29:30
Speaker 15: what they think is possible for them in the United
29:33
Speaker 15: States of America, and frankly, that is heartbreaking.
29:36
Speaker 1: You know, every news cycle we're talking about the shattering
29:40
Speaker 1: of norms of one kind or another, and the word
29:43
Speaker 1: normal is always you know, it should be a laundrysetting.
29:46
Speaker 2: I mean it's not.
29:47
Speaker 1: You know, it's a word that you have to be
29:48
Speaker 1: careful when you're used because norms are always changing, but
29:51
Speaker 1: they're usually not getting shattered in this way. And so
29:53
Speaker 1: what may seem abnormal to people who remember a different
29:58
Speaker 1: standard and a different set of decorum, particular from the
30:00
Speaker 1: Oval Office or from the White House, is perhaps fairly
30:04
Speaker 1: normal to the young people who've grown up with Donald
30:08
Speaker 1: Trump has been president running for office president again, this
30:12
Speaker 1: has been the person that has held the highest office
30:15
Speaker 1: in the land or has been seeking that office for
30:18
Speaker 1: a very long time. What does that mean in terms
30:20
Speaker 1: of the norms or the ideas that they might have
30:23
Speaker 1: around what is acceptable and what is not acceptable, in
30:27
Speaker 1: terms of the way that they treat their fellow human beings,
30:30
Speaker 1: in terms of the way they see the world in themselves.
30:33
Speaker 15: We cannot overstate the importance that sort of like internet
30:38
Speaker 15: culture did to already sort of destabilizing the norms of
30:41
Speaker 15: what was acceptable discourse, who was an acceptable victim of
30:46
Speaker 15: targeted harassment, that kind of thing, and that had just
30:49
Speaker 15: been allowed to sort of simmer beneath the surface of
30:52
Speaker 15: our think our cultural awareness in this country. But in
30:55
Speaker 15: so many ways, Donald Trump embodies what for some of
30:58
Speaker 15: us was gamer Gate, or if you spend any time
31:02
Speaker 15: as sort of online communities, the sort of culture of
31:05
Speaker 15: using humor to get away with transgressing those norms that
31:09
Speaker 15: you talk about. Donald Trump takes that and he sort
31:12
Speaker 15: of levels this up to the legitimacy of the highest
31:16
Speaker 15: office in this country. And I think for a lot
31:19
Speaker 15: of young people what they see in that is that one,
31:23
Speaker 15: if you can get away with it, then it is normal,
31:26
Speaker 15: which I would point out is an absolute horrible way
31:29
Speaker 15: for social cohesion to work right, for us to cohere
31:34
Speaker 15: as a multiracial democracy, it takes a certain amount of
31:38
Speaker 15: risking failure and reaching out to one another. And Donald
31:42
Speaker 15: Trump embodying that there are no bounds to your bad
31:47
Speaker 15: behavior if you have enough power, enough wealth, enough state,
31:51
Speaker 15: is enough prestige to get away with it.
31:54
Speaker 3: That is a lesson that runs counter, by the.
31:56
Speaker 15: Way, to our idea of meritocracy, runs counter to our
32:00
Speaker 15: idea of ourselves as a compassionate nation. But it is
32:04
Speaker 15: hard to argue against the fact that he is winning
32:08
Speaker 15: with that type of behavior. And you know, we talk
32:11
Speaker 15: of when if for anyone who's ever raised children, and
32:14
Speaker 15: you've heard the you know, they don't hear what you say,
32:17
Speaker 15: they hear what you do.
32:19
Speaker 3: What you do, that's right.
32:21
Speaker 15: We can communicate these messages all day, but if we
32:24
Speaker 15: reward the behavior that allows you to ascend into the
32:28
Speaker 15: top of the political, economic, and cultural hierarchy of the
32:31
Speaker 15: United States of America, then that is what we are endorsing.
32:36
Speaker 15: When those norms are gone, this is something that troubles me.
32:39
Speaker 15: It is not easy to rebuild them, and that is
32:43
Speaker 15: something I'm not sure that young people understand. But then
32:46
Speaker 15: I'm not sure that the rest of us quite understand
32:48
Speaker 15: and appreciate that either.
32:49
Speaker 1: I am an optimist and I want to believe that
32:52
Speaker 1: the young people who are graduating this season are marching
32:55
Speaker 1: into a world of opportunity.
32:57
Speaker 2: What will it take to make that true?
33:00
Speaker 16: Oh?
33:00
Speaker 3: Well, one is going to take them.
33:03
Speaker 15: It's going to take them in partnership with whatever is
33:06
Speaker 15: left of our democratizing institution's higher education, a public service,
33:12
Speaker 15: our justice system, etc.
33:14
Speaker 3: It's going to.
33:15
Speaker 15: Take bringing them fully into the fold by the way politically, economically,
33:19
Speaker 15: and culturally.
33:20
Speaker 3: And I think that is true.
33:21
Speaker 15: It's always been true we need to do that for
33:23
Speaker 15: young people, but I think it is particularly true right
33:25
Speaker 15: now because they do not have something they are trying
33:29
Speaker 15: to get back to in the way that many of
33:31
Speaker 15: us are trying to return to a past. I think
33:35
Speaker 15: that their imagination for what's possible then is less constrained
33:41
Speaker 15: by what has already been.
33:43
Speaker 3: And I think we're going to need the.
33:44
Speaker 15: Power of their political imagination to build a sort of
33:47
Speaker 15: economic safety net that they deserve that we promise them
33:51
Speaker 15: and that we are now not able to deliver to them,
33:54
Speaker 15: and something that Donald Trump promises them that he can fix.
33:58
Speaker 15: We need a much better than to helping them build that,
34:01
Speaker 15: and we're going to need them because we need the
34:03
Speaker 15: political imagination.
34:05
Speaker 1: And one of the skills they're going to need is
34:07
Speaker 1: learning how to lead people who don't always agree with
34:09
Speaker 1: each other. That is not just a wishful thinking when
34:13
Speaker 1: it happens, it's usually is a skill, and we need
34:15
Speaker 1: to recognize that and elevate that. Tressy McMillan Cottam, thank
34:18
Speaker 1: you so much.
34:19
Speaker 2: For being with us. Thank you still ahead.
34:22
Speaker 1: She is an award winning human rights activist. So why
34:25
Speaker 1: is she currently in ice custody? That's coming up, stay
34:28
Speaker 1: with us. You may remember this story from Donald Trump's
34:36
Speaker 1: first term.
34:37
Speaker 2: An immigrant mother in.
34:39
Speaker 1: Colorado took sanctuary in a Denver church to avoid possible deportation.
34:44
Speaker 1: Jeanette Vizghro lived in that church's basement for months becoming
34:48
Speaker 1: a national symbol of humanitarian resistance against Trump's immigration crackdown.
34:53
Speaker 1: Last week, Jeanette Vizghea was named a recipient of the
34:56
Speaker 1: prestigious Robert F. Kennedy Award Robert F. Kennedy hum Writes
35:00
Speaker 1: award for working quote to tirelessly build coalitions at the
35:04
Speaker 1: intersection of different.
35:06
Speaker 2: Communities and causes.
35:08
Speaker 1: She learned about that recognition while she was behind bars
35:11
Speaker 1: at this ICE detention facility in Aurora, Colorado. Since she
35:16
Speaker 1: left her sanctuary at the church in twenty seventeen, Visgera
35:20
Speaker 1: has remained in the country as her immigration case proceeded.
35:23
Speaker 1: She has been in the US now for nearly thirty years,
35:27
Speaker 1: but in March, Ice agents arrested her while she was
35:30
Speaker 1: working at her job at a Target store, one agent
35:34
Speaker 1: telling her during the arrest, we finally got you. According
35:37
Speaker 1: to Visgera and her lawyer, she has been held in
35:41
Speaker 1: the ICE detention facility since then, her lawyer saying that
35:44
Speaker 1: she is being detained in retaliation for her immigration activism.
35:51
Speaker 1: Joining me now is the journalist who interviewed Jeanette Visgeira
35:54
Speaker 1: inside the ICE facility where she's now detained. Maria Heinahjosa
35:59
Speaker 1: is a Pulitzer As winner and the executive producer of
36:02
Speaker 1: Latino Usa. She is also an MSNBC contributor, and she
36:06
Speaker 1: joins me now here in the studio.
36:08
Speaker 2: Why is Jeanette viz Guerro so important?
36:11
Speaker 1: And what does this case say about where we're at
36:14
Speaker 1: right now in America with our immigration policy.
36:17
Speaker 16: Look, not every immigrant rights activist gets named. In twenty seventeen,
36:22
Speaker 16: as she was to the Time magazine one hundred Most
36:25
Speaker 16: Important People in the World. She was Jeanette Vizguerra is
36:29
Speaker 16: known across the country and in immigrant rights organizations and
36:32
Speaker 16: sanctuary organizations as a.
36:35
Speaker 2: Huge activist, and she is not quiet.
36:39
Speaker 16: So we're the only ones who were able to get
36:42
Speaker 16: inside this detention facility. And I told you, Michelle that
36:46
Speaker 16: I've been in maximum security men's prisons. You walk through
36:49
Speaker 16: two prison doors to get inside a maximum security men's prison.
36:53
Speaker 16: In this detention facility in Aurora, I had to walk
36:56
Speaker 16: through nine prison like doors in a facil where people
37:01
Speaker 16: overwhelmingly are not criminals except for their immigration status. She's
37:06
Speaker 16: important because she says she's being targeted not because of
37:09
Speaker 16: her immigration status, but because of what she says and
37:13
Speaker 16: what she does. She is calling herself Michelle a political prisoner.
37:17
Speaker 16: That's the first time that I've heard that in my
37:19
Speaker 16: more than thirty years reporting on this issue.
37:21
Speaker 1: Now, you asked missus Gerro whether she thought the Trump
37:24
Speaker 1: administration was targeting her, targeting her.
37:28
Speaker 2: For specific reasons. Should we take a listen to what
37:30
Speaker 2: she said?
37:31
Speaker 16: Let's do that.
37:34
Speaker 17: Jo porge yo mino mente novedaun algode trafico estoyaki as
37:50
Speaker 17: he says, borgueona persona contriente sinko feloniez stadi Casablanca.
38:04
Speaker 16: I mean, she basically said, I mean, that's why she
38:07
Speaker 16: feels that she's being targeted by this administration, because she
38:10
Speaker 16: will say something like that while she's in detention. She'll say,
38:13
Speaker 16: I'm here, but the president has been convicted of felonies.
38:17
Speaker 16: Why am I here? And why is he doing this
38:19
Speaker 16: to me? It's a really important case because of the
38:22
Speaker 16: fact that she is internationally known, I mean, being named
38:26
Speaker 16: the winner of the Robert F. Kennedy Human Rights Award
38:29
Speaker 16: doesn't come to just anyone. And so she is continuing
38:33
Speaker 16: to organize. Even within the detention facility. She is organizing,
38:37
Speaker 16: and so.
38:38
Speaker 1: There's surreal aspects to this because she's getting the RFK
38:41
Speaker 1: Award when RFK sun is part of the administration that
38:44
Speaker 1: she is willing to stand up to and willing to
38:48
Speaker 1: talk back to. Does does the winning of this award
38:53
Speaker 1: change the fundamentals of her case? Because it does place
38:57
Speaker 1: a spotlight on her. It will keep her in the
39:01
Speaker 1: spotlight to some degree. It's not why you were able
39:04
Speaker 1: to get in to see her. I mean that was
39:05
Speaker 1: more of a First Amendment issue. But does the change
39:08
Speaker 1: Does it change the fundamentals.
39:09
Speaker 2: Of the case, Michelle.
39:10
Speaker 16: It puts her right in the crosshairs of presidential politics
39:14
Speaker 16: in the United States of America. And Jeanette will just
39:17
Speaker 16: say to you, look, I'm a mom, I'm an activist,
39:20
Speaker 16: I'm fighting for justice. But right now being given the
39:24
Speaker 16: Robert F. Kennedy Human Rights Award when Robert F. Kennedy
39:28
Speaker 16: Junior is part of the Trump administration. I mean, she's
39:33
Speaker 16: given that award because of her work, but there's no
39:36
Speaker 16: way that you can't walk away from the fact that
39:37
Speaker 16: she is now in the crosshairs of this administration and
39:41
Speaker 16: its policies, specifically regarding women immigrants who are activists.
39:46
Speaker 2: With a big voice.
39:47
Speaker 1: So when asked to go deeper and talk a little
39:49
Speaker 1: bit about her feelings. Since you were able to interfere,
39:51
Speaker 1: Let's just listen a little bit more of this tape
39:53
Speaker 1: before I come back to.
39:56
Speaker 16: So what do you think the Trump administry gies in
40:01
Speaker 16: minsai kayos is tan mandad nationally munde.
40:09
Speaker 17: Is quos cursos. Vankara called caer persona no solomi a
40:18
Speaker 17: qualquer persona in comora Querremanda el mansag alosotrus activista Silkjo
40:25
Speaker 17: Kevana Sula's mismas consequences.
40:29
Speaker 2: Help us understand what's the road ahead for her.
40:34
Speaker 16: I mean it's complicated. It's complicated because all immigrant cases
40:38
Speaker 16: right now are very complicated. But there's a significant backlog,
40:43
Speaker 16: and there's a huge backlog. But Jenettezgera is known around
40:48
Speaker 16: the country and around the world, and people are watching,
40:51
Speaker 16: and what she is saying is she is saying that
40:53
Speaker 16: the conditions inside detention facilities have only gotten worse because
40:57
Speaker 16: she's been detained before, and she is saying there are
41:01
Speaker 16: human rights abuses that are happening inside these detention facilities.
41:04
Speaker 16: And then she's saying, look at me, there's no reason
41:07
Speaker 16: why me, as a mother should be here. And I'm
41:10
Speaker 16: telling you, Michelle, she will not be quiet. This is
41:14
Speaker 16: somebody who takes her activism very seriously.
41:17
Speaker 2: And I got to let you go.
41:18
Speaker 1: But that is perhaps one of the more interesting aspects
41:21
Speaker 1: of this is that she is in the spotlight now,
41:24
Speaker 1: but that may be giving the current administration an excuse
41:28
Speaker 1: to try to make an example of her.
41:29
Speaker 16: It's going to be a difficult, difficult case, but she's
41:33
Speaker 16: not going anywhere. And she even said if I end
41:36
Speaker 16: up in Mexico and something happens to me, if I'm deported,
41:40
Speaker 16: I will hold this administration responsible.
41:42
Speaker 2: Maria, thank you for your work. Thank you, thanks for
41:44
Speaker 2: coming in on Friday night.
41:47
Speaker 1: That is tonight's last word. Thank you for allowing me
41:51
Speaker 1: to sit in for Lauren. So Donald, I hope everyone
41:53
Speaker 1: has a great weekend.
41:54
Speaker 2: Stay safe.