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Transcript

The Reformation's Effect: On The Church · The Reformatory

• 0:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: What do you got for me?
• 0:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know what to do, but I don't know what to do, but I don't know what to do, but I don't know what to do, but I don't know what to do, but I don't know what to do, but I don't know what to do, but I don't know what to do, but I don't know what to do, but I don't know what to do, but I don't know what to do, but I don't know what to do, but I don't know what to do, but I don't know what to do, but I don't know what to do, but I don't know what to do, but I don't know what to do, but I don't know what to do, but I don't know what to do, but I don't know what to do, but I don't know what to do, but I don't know what to do, but I don't know what to do, but I don't know what to do
• 0:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: As long as I'm not for me, we could have had the benediction right there, that was so good.
• 0:36
  [SPEAKER_05]: What's going on everyone and welcome to the Reformatory, the podcast for the local church and by the local church.
• 0:41
  [SPEAKER_05]: We are your local churchman.
• 0:43
  [SPEAKER_05]: My name is Josh and I'm here as always with the captain.
• 0:48
  [SPEAKER_05]: Jack Barry, Jack, my friend, happy Reformation Month.
• 0:52
  [SPEAKER_05]: How is your Reformation Month fairings, sir?
• 0:56
  [SPEAKER_03]: Uh, I don't know if the NSA is listening to what we're talking about, but now I'm getting more of these cringe Roman Catholic videos trying to, I sent Josh one earlier of like, this guy trying to use Daniel to predict the Roman Catholic Church's reign.
• 1:14
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm like, give me a break.
• 1:16
  [SPEAKER_03]: Get out of here.
• 1:17
  [SPEAKER_05]: Definitely rough.
• 1:18
  [SPEAKER_05]: Definitely rough.
• 1:19
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 1:19
  [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, rough stuff rough stuff.
• 1:24
  [SPEAKER_05]: some some foolish papacy going on in this month, but this is why this is why we celebrate Jack, my man.
• 1:32
  [SPEAKER_05]: I am
• 1:35
  [SPEAKER_05]: I'm so much distracted this episode because at the time of this recording, we're at the bottom of the fifth of the Mariners versus the Toronto Blue Jays game two and we're tied.
• 1:47
  [SPEAKER_05]: So I'm going to exercise discipline and get through this episode.
• 1:55
  [SPEAKER_05]: But, uh,
• 1:56
  [SPEAKER_05]: But just so you know, my heart is here, but my head is completely somewhere else.
• 2:06
  [SPEAKER_05]: So I'm going to try it.
• 2:06
  [SPEAKER_05]: I'm going to try to unite the two.
• 2:08
  [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, um, we got a couple shout outs.
• 2:10
  [SPEAKER_05]: Uh, one one patron.
• 2:12
  [SPEAKER_05]: and then a one-one personal for me, but Jack, let's do the patron first.
• 2:16
  [SPEAKER_05]: I've got a shoutout.
• 2:17
  [SPEAKER_05]: We have to hollow the the name in the halls of the podcast.
• 2:22
  [SPEAKER_05]: One Jeff Perry.
• 2:24
  [SPEAKER_05]: Jeff has joined the ranks of the pod luck.
• 2:31
  [SPEAKER_05]: He has he has seen it fit to support the reformatory with his hard earned.
• 2:36
  [SPEAKER_05]: five dollar holla and we do not take that for granted.
• 2:39
  [SPEAKER_05]: Jeff is a good dude.
• 2:42
  [SPEAKER_05]: He's a good follow over on the Twitter.
• 2:45
  [SPEAKER_05]: And Jack, I don't know if you've been on the Twitter recently, but good follows are hard to come by over there.
• 2:51
  [SPEAKER_05]: It's very good.
• 2:52
  [SPEAKER_05]: I've been doing a lot of
• 2:58
  [SPEAKER_05]: We'll get more and we'll get more into that.
• 3:00
  [SPEAKER_05]: I'm sure over on the pod luck, but a lot of people telling on themselves.
• 3:04
  [SPEAKER_05]: I'll just leave it at that.
• 3:06
  [SPEAKER_05]: But Jeff Perry is one of the good ones.
• 3:09
  [SPEAKER_05]: And he has joined the reformatory pod luck, which makes him one of the great ones.
• 3:15
  [SPEAKER_05]: And Jeff, we thank you.
• 3:17
  [SPEAKER_05]: And as we have promised, sir, your name has been Hallowed.
• 3:21
  [SPEAKER_05]: Hallowed.
• 3:23
  [SPEAKER_05]: Hallowed through the halls of the
• 3:25
  [SPEAKER_05]: And, uh, ladies and gentlemen, if you want to join Jeff getting on that sweet reformatory all access goodness, uh, head on over there.
• 3:35
  [SPEAKER_05]: I'm telling you there's good stuff.
• 3:36
  [SPEAKER_05]: There's good stuff over there.
• 3:37
  [SPEAKER_05]: We appreciate everyone that is there.
• 3:40
  [SPEAKER_05]: Uh, Jack second shout out is somewhat of a personal one.
• 3:43
  [SPEAKER_05]: I got a shout out one of my elders.
• 3:44
  [SPEAKER_05]: I got a shout out pastor Andrew, uh, for, uh, he so something
• 3:52
  [SPEAKER_05]: He's, he has the gift of giving like his like if you're gonna if you're gonna you know buy into the whole love language thing right his love language is giving gifts which is great because mine is receiving them so it's a we're a perfect pair right but for but for uh it's October so it's past it's past appreciation month right um and he got me
• 4:20
  [SPEAKER_05]: It's one of my top top five top five cigars of all time.
• 4:24
  [SPEAKER_05]: It is the tabernacle.
• 4:26
  [SPEAKER_05]: Havana seed.
• 4:27
  [SPEAKER_05]: Come on.
• 4:28
  [SPEAKER_05]: Focus.
• 4:29
  [SPEAKER_05]: Focus.
• 4:30
  [SPEAKER_05]: There it is.
• 4:31
  [SPEAKER_05]: A little bit.
• 4:31
  [SPEAKER_05]: The tabernacle.
• 4:33
  [SPEAKER_05]: Havana seed.
• 4:34
  [SPEAKER_05]: I absolutely love this stick.
• 4:37
  [SPEAKER_05]: This is one of the best sticks in my opinion for the money.
• 4:41
  [SPEAKER_05]: And true.
• 4:43
  [SPEAKER_05]: He got me one.
• 4:44
  [SPEAKER_05]: And I'm saving this.
• 4:45
  [SPEAKER_05]: I'm saving this for
• 4:48
  [SPEAKER_05]: Well, Lord willing, I'm saving this for the game that sent the Mariners to the World Series.
• 4:53
  [SPEAKER_05]: So I'm, but I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, my head, I'm bringing my head back, I promise, I promise, I'm gonna bring it back, but Jack, we have, we have some cool stuff to talk about today, but first, as always, it's time for everyone's favorite segment.
• 5:09
  [SPEAKER_05]: Don't forget to eat your Instant Grams Papest Edition.
• 5:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: And know the time you've all been waiting for.
• 5:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: The ordinary broadcast presents Don't forget to eat your instant grains.
• 5:21
  [SPEAKER_04]: With your host, Josh Loftus and Jack Barry.
• 5:24
  [SPEAKER_04]: And remember kids, it's not heresy if you'll believe it hard enough.
• 5:30
  [SPEAKER_05]: This is don't forget to eat your instant grams and remember kids.
• 5:33
  [SPEAKER_05]: It's not heresy.
• 5:34
  [SPEAKER_05]: If you believe it hard enough, that's what the Pope says.
• 5:38
  [SPEAKER_04]: It's time to get into some some some some papers trickery.
• 5:48
  [SPEAKER_05]: some some some some papers the shenanigans here my man in honor of reformation month our instant grams have been papers themed and it's been it's been a lot of fun but Jack I've got one for you here this this priest is is really really wanting us he he wants to introduce us to a very
• 6:15
  [SPEAKER_05]: Let's just say, out there, relic.
• 6:19
  [SPEAKER_05]: All right, I'm just gonna play it for you here.
• 6:23
  [SPEAKER_00]: Hey, have you ever seen one of these before?
• 6:25
  [SPEAKER_00]: This is called the brown scapular of our Lady of Mount Carmel.
• 6:30
  [SPEAKER_00]: And I don't know why it's so zoomed in.
• 6:33
  [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know what's happening here, but it's very zoomed in.
• 6:35
  [SPEAKER_05]: But we're gonna, I don't know what happened, but we're having tech.
• 6:40
  [SPEAKER_00]: Hey, have you ever seen one of these before?
• 6:42
  [SPEAKER_00]: We're going with it.
• 6:43
  [SPEAKER_00]: This is called the brown scapular of our Lady of Mount Carmel.
• 6:47
  [SPEAKER_00]: And it goes back to the 1200s when Mother Mary appeared to St.
• 6:50
  [SPEAKER_00]: Simon Stock, the Superior of the Carmelite Order, and gave him the scapular as a way of protection.
• 6:56
  [SPEAKER_00]: It's like a piece of her own mantle upon him, and then she encouraged him to spread the devotion far and wide.
• 7:02
  [SPEAKER_00]: And what's amazing is that there's a promise attached to those who wear the scapular.
• 7:07
  [SPEAKER_00]: And the promise is this, that the Saturday after you die,
• 7:10
  [SPEAKER_00]: mother Mary will go to purgatory and bring you to heaven herself.
• 7:15
  [SPEAKER_00]: But it's not magic.
• 7:15
  [SPEAKER_00]: It's not superstitions.
• 7:16
  [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
• 7:17
  [SPEAKER_00]: There's three conditions.
• 7:18
  [SPEAKER_00]: The first there's three conditions.
• 7:20
  [SPEAKER_00]: Check promises.
• 7:22
  [SPEAKER_05]: It's not magic.
• 7:23
  [SPEAKER_03]: I turn my brain off.
• 7:28
  [SPEAKER_05]: The narrator comes out of the thing.
• 7:29
  [SPEAKER_03]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:29
  [SPEAKER_03]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:30
  [SPEAKER_03]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:31
  [SPEAKER_03]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:31
  [SPEAKER_05]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:31
  [SPEAKER_05]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:32
  [SPEAKER_05]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:33
  [SPEAKER_05]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:33
  [SPEAKER_05]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:34
  [SPEAKER_05]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:34
  [SPEAKER_05]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:35
  [SPEAKER_05]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:35
  [SPEAKER_05]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:36
  [SPEAKER_05]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:36
  [SPEAKER_05]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:37
  [SPEAKER_05]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:37
  [SPEAKER_05]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:38
  [SPEAKER_05]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:38
  [SPEAKER_05]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:39
  [SPEAKER_05]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:40
  [SPEAKER_00]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:41
  [SPEAKER_00]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:41
  [SPEAKER_00]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:42
  [SPEAKER_00]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:43
  [SPEAKER_00]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:43
  [SPEAKER_00]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:44
  [SPEAKER_00]: It wasn't fact.
• 7:45
  [SPEAKER_00]: I'm out.
• 7:46
  [SPEAKER_03]: Can't do it.
• 7:47
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 7:47
  [SPEAKER_03]: Game over.
• 7:48
  [SPEAKER_03]: Nope.
• 7:50
  [SPEAKER_03]: Can't be burned in that purgatory place.
• 7:52
  [SPEAKER_03]: I guess Mary ain't coming from my soul.
• 7:54
  [SPEAKER_03]: No.
• 7:54
  [SPEAKER_03]: No.
• 7:55
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 7:55
  [SPEAKER_03]: Nope.
• 7:56
  [SPEAKER_03]: Game over.
• 7:59
  [SPEAKER_05]: Gross.
• 8:00
  [SPEAKER_05]: All right.
• 8:01
  [SPEAKER_05]: Boom.
• 8:01
  [SPEAKER_05]: Boom.
• 8:02
  [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
• 8:02
  [SPEAKER_05]: All right.
• 8:02
  [SPEAKER_05]: Self gross.
• 8:03
  [SPEAKER_05]: Self burn.
• 8:04
  [SPEAKER_05]: Those are red.
• 8:09
  [SPEAKER_00]: You have to pray with devotion to mother Mary regularly.
• 8:13
  [SPEAKER_05]: That's no, that's not home, man.
• 8:15
  [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know what's harder.
• 8:18
  [SPEAKER_05]: That's rough.
• 8:19
  [SPEAKER_05]: We're over two right now.
• 8:21
  [SPEAKER_05]: We're over two.
• 8:23
  [SPEAKER_05]: Hopefully just like the blue jays are going to be at the end of the day.
• 8:26
  [SPEAKER_05]: I'm sorry, I promise my head, I'm getting it back, I promise.
• 8:29
  [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, let's hear the third one regularly.
• 8:32
  [SPEAKER_00]: And also engage in regular pinnons, like fasting, for example.
• 8:37
  [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, not penance, I mean, fasting is fine, fasting is good, not for penance, though.
• 8:43
  [SPEAKER_05]: So, I'm calling it word for discipline.
• 8:45
  [SPEAKER_00]: I'm calling it word for discipline.
• 8:46
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, word for discipline.
• 8:46
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, word for discipline.
• 8:47
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, word for discipline.
• 8:48
  [SPEAKER_00]: And you fulfill the three conditions, then Mother Mary will bring you to heaven herself.
• 8:53
  [SPEAKER_00]: John Paul II would say that just like every mother, once her child to be well-dressed, Mother Mary is no different, she wants us to be well-dressed with the brown scapular.
• 9:05
  [SPEAKER_05]: So I don't want to be the brown scapular sounds I don't want to be like this kids program brown scapular sounds odd I'm just going to say that I'll let you guys I'll let you fill it in however you want
• 9:20
  [SPEAKER_05]: but the brown scapular just sounds like if I don't want anything to do with it, right?
• 9:25
  [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know what it is, I don't care what it is.
• 9:28
  [SPEAKER_05]: I don't want anything to do with that.
• 9:31
  [SPEAKER_05]: So, Jack, so that was, if that wasn't bad enough, I'm gonna introduce you now to a priest.
• 9:39
  [SPEAKER_05]: That's really into anime.
• 9:41
  [SPEAKER_05]: Oh God, particularly this one show.
• 9:44
  [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I know you know the Catholics in their anime man.
• 9:47
  [SPEAKER_05]: They're a big into it.
• 9:48
  [SPEAKER_05]: Particularly this one show that that he he finds a way to integrate it into his sermon.
• 9:53
  [SPEAKER_05]: This one show called kpop demon hunters.
• 9:58
  [SPEAKER_05]: Oh my gosh.
• 9:59
  [SPEAKER_02]: Now, if you know anything about kpop demon hunters, the soundtrack is.
• 10:04
  [SPEAKER_05]: Again, I don't know why all of these videos are so zoomed in.
• 10:07
  [SPEAKER_05]: We're having technical difficulties today.
• 10:09
  [SPEAKER_05]: So for those that are watching on the YouTube, I'm sorry.
• 10:12
  [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know what's going on, but for audio, it's not going to make a difference.
• 10:16
  [SPEAKER_05]: So anyway, let's continue here.
• 10:19
  [SPEAKER_02]: Hey, about K-pop demon hunters.
• 10:21
  [SPEAKER_02]: The soundtrack is off the charts.
• 10:25
  [SPEAKER_02]: In terms of like top 10 songs in North America, for them are from K-pop demon hunters.
• 10:33
  [SPEAKER_02]: And the best song is a song called Golden, and E.J., she wrote that song, and she sings it.
• 10:41
  [SPEAKER_02]: And when that song hit number one, she said, I got so emotional.
• 10:47
  [SPEAKER_02]: I matched myself talking to my leather and all self.
• 10:51
  [SPEAKER_02]: And I said to her, something in Korean, and...
• 10:57
  [SPEAKER_05]: Dude, he's breaking up over this, like he's, he's, he's, he loves, are he loves about an anime pop demon hunters, he loves it.
• 11:07
  [SPEAKER_02]: All right, how it translates his, he did so well.
• 11:15
  [SPEAKER_02]: You were so hard.
• 11:18
  [SPEAKER_02]: Good job.
• 11:20
  [SPEAKER_02]: Good job.
• 11:23
  [SPEAKER_04]: I'm sorry.
• 11:23
  [SPEAKER_04]: I feel bad.
• 11:25
  [SPEAKER_04]: I should I shouldn't pick this bitch.
• 11:28
  [SPEAKER_04]: I shouldn't have picked this video.
• 11:29
  [SPEAKER_04]: I let's hit feel What is he talking about what is he talking about what is what is going like I'm really trying to understand I don't get the point.
• 11:45
  [SPEAKER_05]: I don't get the point.
• 11:46
  [SPEAKER_05]: It's now.
• 11:48
  [SPEAKER_05]: Let's let's finish.
• 11:48
  [SPEAKER_05]: Maybe it'll become clear.
• 11:50
  [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know
• 11:51
  [SPEAKER_02]: And her point was like, you know, so many times, whether we're talking about us or other people, it's always like the next thing, you know?
• 11:58
  [SPEAKER_02]: What's the next thing?
• 11:58
  [SPEAKER_02]: What's the next thing?
• 11:59
  [SPEAKER_02]: What's the next thing?
• 12:00
  [SPEAKER_02]: We've been done for me lately, but sometimes we need to pause and just kind of say, you know what?
• 12:05
  [SPEAKER_02]: Good job.
• 12:10
  [SPEAKER_04]: It did not become clear.
• 12:11
  [SPEAKER_04]: It did not become clear.
• 12:13
  [SPEAKER_05]: I'm more confused now.
• 12:14
  [SPEAKER_05]: I'm more confused now than I was before the K-pop demon hunter illustration started.
• 12:21
  [SPEAKER_05]: Wow.
• 12:22
  [SPEAKER_05]: You know what?
• 12:22
  [SPEAKER_05]: Unbelievable.
• 12:23
  [SPEAKER_05]: This, uh, man, I don't want, I feel, but I don't want to rip on it too bad.
• 12:29
  [SPEAKER_05]: That's just, that's weird, dude.
• 12:31
  [SPEAKER_05]: I'm sorry.
• 12:33
  [SPEAKER_05]: True.
• 12:33
  [SPEAKER_05]: Now it is.
• 12:34
  [SPEAKER_05]: I'm sorry.
• 12:35
  [SPEAKER_05]: I've got a thing.
• 12:36
  [SPEAKER_05]: Look, here's the thing.
• 12:37
  [SPEAKER_05]: I understand.
• 12:39
  [SPEAKER_05]: There is a subculture of grown men out there that like anime, right?
• 12:43
  [SPEAKER_05]: I'm, I, as a concept, I don't have a problem with it because like, it's, at the end of the day, it's, it's cartoons.
• 12:51
  [SPEAKER_05]: Like, I have like, I enjoyed, you know, you know, X-Men and then the Justice League.
• 12:57
  [SPEAKER_05]: Like, I think that's cool, right?
• 12:59
  [SPEAKER_05]: It's just a different version of that.
• 13:01
  [SPEAKER_05]: I understand, but there's just something,
• 13:04
  [SPEAKER_05]: up to trying to pull the demographic.
• 13:07
  [SPEAKER_03]: I, yeah, I think it's out of a flipping anime song.
• 13:11
  [SPEAKER_03]: Come on, guys.
• 13:12
  [SPEAKER_05]: I'm having trouble.
• 13:14
  [SPEAKER_05]: I'm having trouble.
• 13:15
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm having trouble.
• 13:16
  [SPEAKER_05]: I'm having trouble.
• 13:17
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 13:18
  [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
• 13:18
  [SPEAKER_05]: I'm having trouble.
• 13:19
  [SPEAKER_03]: Anyway.
• 13:20
  [SPEAKER_05]: So that's what you're doing.
• 13:21
  [SPEAKER_05]: Man, I don't know.
• 13:24
  [SPEAKER_05]: So that is the Instagrams, the Instagrams for the day, the hand, we thank you all for sending us those.
• 13:31
  [SPEAKER_05]: We appreciate it.
• 13:34
  [SPEAKER_05]: actually some more substantial stuff here, and we're talking about the reformation, its reformation month, baby, and specifically the effects of the reformation.
• 13:46
  [SPEAKER_05]: So we've talked about the Reformation's effects on culture, right?
• 13:50
  [SPEAKER_05]: The greater society that we live in, we see the societal effects that the Reformation brought.
• 13:55
  [SPEAKER_05]: That was a cool up.
• 13:56
  [SPEAKER_05]: Last week we talked about the effects on scripture, right?
• 13:59
  [SPEAKER_05]: And how the beauty of scripture was revealed once again was renewed, was dug up from the ashes and given to the people, right?
• 14:12
  [SPEAKER_05]: And we're kind of working our way out and in, right?
• 14:16
  [SPEAKER_05]: This week we're talking about the effects that the Reformation had on the church and how even to this day, we are still enjoying the effects, the benefits and the wonderful things that came out of the Reformation, the wonderful freedoms that came out of the Reformation when it comes specifically to the local church.
• 14:42
  [SPEAKER_05]: Jack, I've got kind of three things in my head as I kind of work through, I know you and I matched up on some of them.
• 14:51
  [SPEAKER_05]: So I'm just going to go with the first one here because you and I are going to talk about this one.
• 14:57
  [SPEAKER_05]: One of the great benefits that came out of the Reformation in regard specifically to the local church is that it restored the autonomy of the local church.
• 15:09
  [SPEAKER_05]: The local church is autonomy which is something that especially us reform baptists.
• 15:14
  [SPEAKER_05]: take very, very seriously and are very, very thankful for it.
• 15:18
  [SPEAKER_05]: So the church, it was no longer after the reformation happened, was no longer bound by the authority of Rome, right?
• 15:28
  [SPEAKER_05]: There were no longer bound by papal authority.
• 15:31
  [SPEAKER_05]: The rules that would come down, the traditions that the Roman Catholic Church was bound to,
• 15:38
  [SPEAKER_05]: There was finally able to be freedom, freedom of expression, and I would say not the common way, but I would say a biblical way, being able to express freely the truths of Scripture without obviously being bound by tradition or whatever the papal authority had.
• 16:00
  [SPEAKER_05]: And the local church was finally able to be a true local church because now their authority was not held in Rome, but their authority was held in Scripture in the breathed out words of God and we're still experiencing the benefits of that today and praise the Lord for that.
• 16:26
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I mean, big stuff when it comes to that is just, you know, this has been a theme in our series, but going back to the original, the original structure of the church as seen in scripture.
• 16:41
  [SPEAKER_03]: you don't have, I even look this up just to double check on how many leadership spots there were, or leadership tiers until you got to the laypeople in the Catholic Church.
• 16:55
  [SPEAKER_03]: But you have the Pope.
• 16:56
  [SPEAKER_03]: Then you have the Cardinals or the College of Cardinals, which is kind of like his Possey that Alexa, and then you got Archbishop's then you got Bishops, then you got priests, then you got Deacans, then you got the lay people.
• 17:13
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 17:14
  [SPEAKER_03]: So you have six layers of
• 17:17
  [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, pretty much from Deacon on is not really, I mean, you could use the word Bishop interchangeably, you know, Episcopause with Pastor or with Elder to be quite honest.
• 17:32
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's just the semantics of language, I think, to be quite honest.
• 17:36
  [SPEAKER_03]: But it's not a way in which that's supposed to go forward.
• 17:40
  [SPEAKER_03]: that it creates this administrative role within the church.
• 17:44
  [SPEAKER_03]: So, yeah, you can have Presbyter Episcopause, same difference.
• 17:50
  [SPEAKER_03]: But unfortunately, history shows us that man does not take cannot hold intention language.
• 17:58
  [SPEAKER_03]: Thus, he makes two different roles for them, right?
• 18:01
  [SPEAKER_03]: Sure.
• 18:08
  [SPEAKER_03]: five, yeah, you have five offices that really like, I mean, what we see in the New Testament is elders.
• 18:16
  [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, if you really want to go to Acts, at that point, you had apostles.
• 18:21
  [SPEAKER_03]: Sure.
• 18:21
  [SPEAKER_03]: So the apostles are carrying on, carrying on the teaching of Jesus, right?
• 18:25
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yep.
• 18:26
  [SPEAKER_03]: And then you have, then you have your elders or your pastors, elder pastors, and then you have deacons.
• 18:34
  [SPEAKER_03]: And then you have members of a local church.
• 18:37
  [SPEAKER_03]: Um, so yeah, it's just the way in which the reformation not only changed that dynamic, but the dynamic that the people should be integral to the way in which they're being built up.
• 18:54
  [SPEAKER_03]: I feel like during the reformation, I feel like Martin Luther really tried to retrieve the fact that the
• 19:07
  [SPEAKER_03]: was capable of understanding things.
• 19:09
  [SPEAKER_03]: It wasn't just Martin Luther.
• 19:10
  [SPEAKER_03]: It was also, I mean, William Tindale, who we talked about last episode.
• 19:17
  [SPEAKER_03]: He was really championing this idea where he goes, I will make this Bible and he was telling this to a priest, too, by the way.
• 19:25
  [SPEAKER_03]: He goes, I will make the Bible in English.
• 19:28
  [SPEAKER_03]: I will translate to English.
• 19:30
  [SPEAKER_03]: And I will have some poor peasant boy who's five years old, no more scripture than the King of England well.
• 19:37
  [SPEAKER_06]: Oh, dude, that is what the fuck I'm talking about.
• 19:40
  [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, yeah, yeah, one of the most savage quotes to come out of the Reformation is taking, I mean, and what a shocking thought, right, that this peasant boy,
• 19:53
  [SPEAKER_05]: would be able to have access to the same breathed out words of God, then the priest.
• 20:01
  [SPEAKER_05]: And the reformation said, yes, that's the point of this.
• 20:07
  [SPEAKER_05]: That's the point of having the word of God is your authority is that it's for everybody, right?
• 20:12
  [SPEAKER_05]: It's not limited to one group of people.
• 20:14
  [SPEAKER_05]: So love it, love it.
• 20:18
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so I mean, I don't know, seeing, uh, yeah, he goes, his, his quote in his phrase when he was talking to a priest, the priest was telling him to work can't.
• 20:30
  [SPEAKER_03]: And he goes, I will cause a boy that drive at the plow shall know more of the scripture than, then, then dow dots and now dots, uh, the king of England as well, too.
• 20:43
  [SPEAKER_03]: So.
• 20:44
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, telling a priest that Protestant will protest that kids will know more scripture than years pretty savage one day.
• 20:53
  [SPEAKER_03]: I love that.
• 20:55
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so I think so I think the ways in which not only the leadership structure, I think what Luther was trying to go back to and the in in scripture, what we see, right?
• 21:06
  [SPEAKER_03]: So you have
• 21:07
  [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, apostles are no more.
• 21:09
  [SPEAKER_03]: So what you really have in the local church is pastors, elders, and decans, and members, right?
• 21:14
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yep.
• 21:15
  [SPEAKER_03]: And I think that you don't have the member language, but you have the congregation or the congregate language.
• 21:21
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 21:22
  [SPEAKER_03]: That's probably being used in the Reformation.
• 21:24
  [SPEAKER_03]: Um, but I think another part of it, too, is really the structure in which the pre-sid and the leaders of the Catholic Church are just not being held accountable at all.
• 21:35
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 21:35
  [SPEAKER_03]: Um, so the structure, so it's funny because during Luther's time, even before Luther's time, and then just slightly before Luther's time and then into it,
• 21:46
  [SPEAKER_03]: You had some really crazy stuff happen.
• 21:49
  [SPEAKER_03]: You have this period in which the papacy actually moves from Rome to this place called Avignon in France, called the Babylonian captivity for like 77 years.
• 22:01
  [SPEAKER_03]: And you have just a bunch of French popes and then they move it back to Rome and then you have a Roman Pope finally after that.
• 22:06
  [SPEAKER_03]: But then you have a period where you have technically three popes who are vying for power in three different cities.
• 22:13
  [SPEAKER_03]: So that's all like ridiculous.
• 22:18
  [SPEAKER_03]: First, the other parts that really I think are issues are the moral failings of the leaders of the church at the time.
• 22:28
  [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, which which then which which not to cut you off, but that gets him to my second point perfectly as a perfect segue is that so we talked about that it it brought back the autonomy of the local church right the authority is now resting Not in Rome, but in the local churches and the second point is that it brought back the understanding of what a biblical
• 22:49
  [SPEAKER_05]: pastor slash elder it's right so yes that second continue your thought I just said yeah it's for the AI notes dude you know the AI cuts cuts it up right we we got it we got to take it easy on AI these days so yeah I mean you had a ton of moral failings in the Catholic you did yes you had Simony Simony is the buying so this
• 23:18
  [SPEAKER_03]: like the power of the Holy Spirit from Peter.
• 23:21
  [SPEAKER_03]: And he gets rebuked for that.
• 23:25
  [SPEAKER_03]: So Simony is a way in which you're buying an office or you're buying a position of power.
• 23:32
  [SPEAKER_03]: So coupled with that is greed.
• 23:34
  [SPEAKER_03]: That's happening a lot in the Catholic Church.
• 23:38
  [SPEAKER_03]: mainly mind you like I think that most of Germany and the Netherlands and probably around like Northern Italy is experiencing most of this so from previous episodes past I don't think this is a 100% thing that's happening across the board but it's enough to basically drive you crazy.
• 23:59
  [SPEAKER_03]: Sure like it's to the point where it's bad and it's to the point too where this idea of pre-spying cell of it that's a joke.
• 24:08
  [SPEAKER_03]: to even where you have what's called a conki buying tax, to where if the priest can't be sell a bit, he basically pays the secret tax to like his, I'm assuming his archbishop or his bishop and she's a living girlfriend for him.
• 24:27
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 24:28
  [SPEAKER_03]: And you're basically at that point living a double life.
• 24:30
  [SPEAKER_03]: So you're lying.
• 24:32
  [SPEAKER_03]: So that's completely undergrown, underroading every structural foundation that you have in the Catholic Church as well, too.
• 24:40
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 24:40
  [SPEAKER_03]: Um, and I think the other one, gosh, what were my other notes on this as well, too.
• 24:48
  [SPEAKER_03]: You also have a like pluralism.
• 24:51
  [SPEAKER_03]: So you hold multiple offices.
• 24:53
  [SPEAKER_03]: So you just don't have maybe
• 24:56
  [SPEAKER_03]: But then you're also, um, you know, this is well, too, like you may hold not only the priesthood, but maybe you're holding a civic office as well, or maybe you're holding another office in the church too.
• 25:10
  [SPEAKER_03]: And then there's also what we call absenteeism where people aren't doing enough things.
• 25:15
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like you're a priest and you don't hold mass or you're bishop and you don't go out and do things that you should.
• 25:21
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 25:23
  [SPEAKER_03]: So yeah, there's a ton of moral failings.
• 25:26
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think when what Luther's saying to basically lead them to the point where it's like,
• 25:31
  [SPEAKER_03]: You guys really don't care about the church.
• 25:36
  [SPEAKER_03]: You care about yourselves, you care about power, you care about your proximity to power, and you care about your office and your title.
• 25:43
  [SPEAKER_03]: You don't care about what Jesus cares about, which is
• 25:48
  [SPEAKER_03]: the church, the his people being shepherded and stewarded and built up for the sake of ministry.
• 25:55
  [SPEAKER_03]: And I think that's where you see him really start to clash with the church.
• 26:01
  [SPEAKER_05]: Well, I mean, that's that's what will happen.
• 26:04
  [SPEAKER_05]: in any system that's set up the way that that system was set up right if you're if you are in a system and look we see this in certain denominations in our churches today or or certain churches today that have you know certain types of polity versus others is
• 26:20
  [SPEAKER_05]: you know, this is why local church polity matters is because there are some policies that offer more safety than others.
• 26:28
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 26:28
  [SPEAKER_05]: Right.
• 26:29
  [SPEAKER_05]: And when you are in a system, like the Catholic church was where the leaders of the church hold all of the cards.
• 26:42
  [SPEAKER_05]: And even more so than we have today where those that are in the church, the leaders of the church were the only ones that could read Scripture.
• 26:54
  [SPEAKER_05]: They're the only ones that have the authority to read and to know what God said and to give that to the people.
• 27:03
  [SPEAKER_05]: So of course, the deck is stacked against the congregants and you're going to have abuse, you're going to have corruption and it's going to be systematic until that cycle is broken and that's what the reformation did is it broke that cycle.
• 27:18
  [SPEAKER_05]: And now what you have is a reorienting, right, a reformation, a reformer of what it means to be a leader in the local church.
• 27:29
  [SPEAKER_05]: And one of those, one of the main things is that it took the emphasis,
• 27:35
  [SPEAKER_05]: of the mediator off of the priest, and put it on to Christ.
• 27:45
  [SPEAKER_05]: So now you don't have a priest that's in the role of a mediator between the people.
• 27:50
  [SPEAKER_05]: It's understood that our mediation comes from Christ.
• 27:53
  [SPEAKER_05]: right and a Christ is the only good and right mediator for His people, right?
• 28:01
  [SPEAKER_05]: So there is no more need for mediation when it comes to the priest, right?
• 28:07
  [SPEAKER_05]: It puts the emphasis back on preaching the Word of God and not the papal authority.
• 28:13
  [SPEAKER_05]: And what the people are finally receiving is the Word of God preached to them in their own language, understood in their own language, able to be applied realistically in their lives.
• 28:26
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 28:27
  [SPEAKER_05]: And that divide is no longer there.
• 28:29
  [SPEAKER_05]: You're no longer having the Word of God infected and contaminated.
• 28:35
  [SPEAKER_05]: with papal tradition.
• 28:38
  [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
• 28:38
  [SPEAKER_05]: So the pastor is finally able to take the role of the one that proclaims the Word of God, the one that shepherds the people, defends the flock, cares for the souls of the people.
• 28:53
  [SPEAKER_05]: and it's back to what a pastor and an elder was always supposed to be that the Catholic church distorted and changed, right, and got backwards.
• 29:05
  [SPEAKER_05]: So it brought back the understanding of a biblical pastor and what a biblical pastor is and what they are supposed to do, right?
• 29:13
  [SPEAKER_05]: Uh, third and finally.
• 29:15
  [SPEAKER_05]: Most importantly, is when it comes to the Reformation's effect on the local churches, it brought back a focus on the gospel within the church.
• 29:25
  [SPEAKER_05]: We're no longer primarily focusing on penance.
• 29:30
  [SPEAKER_05]: Tradition, purgatory, right, a law and gospel that had no distinction whatsoever.
• 29:41
  [SPEAKER_05]: Your works were your righteousness, right?
• 29:45
  [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
• 29:48
  [SPEAKER_05]: It's no longer a focus on those things, but finally,
• 29:52
  [SPEAKER_05]: Right.
• 29:53
  [SPEAKER_05]: We have reformed the church and brought the understanding back to the roots of Christianity, true Christianity, biblical Christianity.
• 30:03
  [SPEAKER_05]: That's not tainted or contaminated with papal traditions.
• 30:07
  [SPEAKER_05]: Grace is finally grace.
• 30:09
  [SPEAKER_05]: The law is finally the law.
• 30:11
  [SPEAKER_05]: Right, and salvation comes by grace through faith alone.
• 30:18
  [SPEAKER_05]: And people now within the congregation for the first time in their lives can experience the true freedom that comes from a correct understanding of the gospel, the yoke is tear it off.
• 30:31
  [SPEAKER_05]: The weight is removed and they're finally able to walk as Christians that are free and not weighed down by the weight.
• 30:41
  [SPEAKER_05]: of the law that the Roman Catholic understanding of the gospel just pressed their face into that dirt.
• 30:50
  [SPEAKER_05]: So it it brought back a focus and an understanding and recovered the true gospel and the church in that day was blessed by it and we are blessed by it today and that we know Jack and I both
• 31:10
  [SPEAKER_05]: what a blessing it is to go to the Lord's day and hear the gospel wherever you are in Scripture, you are reminded, yes, if you're sin, but of Christ's righteousness and that righteousness is being imputed to you.
• 31:26
  [SPEAKER_05]: That's what the Reformation recovered and that's why the Reformation is so good for the local church.
• 31:31
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, exactly.
• 31:33
  [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, no, without we can talk all day about the structures and how the reformation changed the structure, but the driving force behind the reformation was the fact that the gospel is being
• 31:48
  [SPEAKER_03]: rediscovered and reintroduced to people who have no clue what that means.
• 31:52
  [SPEAKER_03]: Right.
• 31:52
  [SPEAKER_03]: Let's be honest.
• 31:54
  [SPEAKER_03]: They all they know is tradition.
• 31:56
  [SPEAKER_03]: All they know is is relics.
• 32:01
  [SPEAKER_03]: All they know is a system, a consensus.
• 32:06
  [SPEAKER_03]: a consensual of a system.
• 32:08
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's not even doctrine.
• 32:10
  [SPEAKER_03]: Justification is not, they don't have a standard doctrine for justification or sanctification.
• 32:17
  [SPEAKER_03]: It is a consensus, guys.
• 32:20
  [SPEAKER_03]: That's the scary part that I think.
• 32:24
  [SPEAKER_03]: I always go back to this after looking over some videos on the reformation.
• 32:28
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's like the fact that the Catholic Church didn't have a doctor in to go after means it's primed to be ripped off the hosers.
• 32:38
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like the doors need to be ripped off the hinges because of that.
• 32:40
  [SPEAKER_03]: So absolutely.
• 32:42
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I mean, the gospel is that center drive.
• 32:46
  [SPEAKER_03]: And I feel like in Luther's day too, here's the thing.
• 32:51
  [SPEAKER_03]: In Luther's Day, you could surmise his theology about who God is.
• 32:57
  [SPEAKER_03]: through the gospel in this little sentence that I know a couple of theologians have said, which is you as a believer are accepted now.
• 33:06
  [SPEAKER_03]: And that you don't have to perform these ridiculous, you know, whoops of works and of penance in order to get into the kingdom of God or to get yourself right with God.
• 33:19
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 33:20
  [SPEAKER_03]: God is coming to you and saying you are accepted because of what I have done.
• 33:25
  [SPEAKER_03]: and you don't have to perform any more that way.
• 33:28
  [SPEAKER_03]: Now, our works good for us, yeah, absolutely.
• 33:32
  [SPEAKER_03]: It shows us that our faith is not dead, but it's not in the ways in which catholicism took them, which is a removing of sin, removing of these things, a constant hamster wheel,
• 33:46
  [SPEAKER_03]: of penance, of contrition, of confession, of penance, and constantly over and over again, in this hamster wheel of getting right in the state of grace.
• 33:58
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 33:58
  [SPEAKER_03]: So that's done away with.
• 34:01
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think that is the remarkable thing that really changes the structure of the church, really, absolutely.
• 34:06
  [SPEAKER_03]: Is you get rid of that and people are finally free.
• 34:08
  [SPEAKER_03]: People finally feel freedom in Jesus.
• 34:14
  [SPEAKER_03]: because we got rid of man-made, you know, man-made stuff.
• 34:18
  [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, yeah, yeah, and it's, and that, that simple change, right, hairline, though, some people might think it is, is the crux of it, right?
• 34:29
  [SPEAKER_05]: Do my works contribute to my salvation, or are they the result of my salvation, right?
• 34:38
  [SPEAKER_05]: the answer is huge.
• 34:41
  [SPEAKER_05]: And the answer is going to result in whether or not I live a life of joy or a life of turmoil.
• 34:50
  [SPEAKER_05]: Right?
• 34:50
  [SPEAKER_05]: Because if you say your works contribute to your salvation, it's going to be a constant question.
• 34:57
  [SPEAKER_05]: Well, how much?
• 34:59
  [SPEAKER_05]: How do I know I'm doing enough?
• 35:00
  [SPEAKER_05]: right, and that was obviously Martin Luther's problem, right?
• 35:03
  [SPEAKER_05]: And that's why the Reformation started is because there's no hope, like the Roman Catholic understanding of salvation brings no hope or assurance to one salvation.
• 35:15
  [SPEAKER_05]: It doesn't.
• 35:17
  [SPEAKER_05]: It's not built in the system of their understanding of salvation, and that's why the reformation needed to happen is because the gospel brings hope, that's what it does.
• 35:28
  [SPEAKER_05]: It's good news, and a gospel that requires me to work in order that I might be saved is not good news, that's bad news.
• 35:39
  [SPEAKER_05]: right and that that is it's so good for the church to finally know and to finally understand a true gospel because of the joy that you now have in serving in your local church, the joy you have in preaching, the joy you have in confessing your sins knowing that they are forgiven.
• 35:58
  [SPEAKER_05]: It affects everything and that's what makes the Reformation so good and so great.
• 36:06
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think that's all she wrote, Josh.
• 36:07
  [SPEAKER_05]: I think that's all she wrote, man.
• 36:09
  [SPEAKER_05]: Well, why don't you get us out of here?
• 36:10
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• 36:15
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• 36:23
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• 36:27
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• 36:49
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• 37:01
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