Latest / WCHS Network Podcasts / 07/02/2026 Ask the Lawyer with Harvey and Tom Peyton

Transcript

07/02/2026 Ask the Lawyer with Harvey and Tom Peyton · WCHS Network Podcasts

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  Speaker 1: The views and opinions expressed on this program do not
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  Speaker 1: necessarily reflect the views and opinions of five ad WHS
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  Speaker 1: it's employees or WVRC Media.
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  Speaker 2: Of course, oh created equal.
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  Speaker 1: When last, come here to Katie can Rocks. And once
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  Speaker 1: again this morning, there's no reason to fight the law.
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  Speaker 1: You can put the law one year side. This morning
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  Speaker 1: we have in studio with this this morning. It is
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  Speaker 1: the Payton Law Firm, and for I think the second
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  Speaker 1: time in our history, we have Harvey and Tom in
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  Speaker 1: studio with us this morning. Harvey, good morning, welcome back.
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  Speaker 2: Well, it's good to be back, dude. It's uh, actually
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  Speaker 2: I have I've been on a little bit of a leave.
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  Speaker 2: I didn't say much about it before a laugh, But
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  Speaker 2: like three weeks ago, yesterday I was up at the
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  Speaker 2: Cleveland clinic for a h I had a scan and
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  Speaker 2: found out that I had an a ornic and here
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  Speaker 2: is I'm on the root of the order right above
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  Speaker 2: my heart and the valve is a little out of whack.
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  Speaker 2: So I spent last Wednesday under the night, or Wednesday
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  Speaker 2: three weeks ago under the knife up in Cleveland, and
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  Speaker 2: everything went well. I mean, I've got a new scar,
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  Speaker 2: but other than that and gain them back a little strength.
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  Speaker 2: I don't think I've lost any vigor ready to get
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  Speaker 2: back in the saddle. So I told Tom yesterday, well,
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  Speaker 2: let's just ride up together and then I can go
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  Speaker 2: back to the office and check the emails and be
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  Speaker 2: back in gear. Not fully in gear, because it takes
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  Speaker 2: a while to get your strength back. You have to
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  Speaker 2: be under anesthesia four hours for this procedure, and that
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  Speaker 2: just SAPs you a bit. But here we are. But
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  Speaker 2: the good thing about it is within the hospitality, just
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  Speaker 2: away from the news cycle and every outside influence, because
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  Speaker 2: all you do is sleep, so that nurses can wake
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  Speaker 2: you up every two hours around the clock to ask
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  Speaker 2: you if you're okay, then tell you to get some sleep.
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  Speaker 2: So butnay, it's good to be back. And of course,
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  Speaker 2: following the following the happenings, particularly with the United States
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  Speaker 2: Supreme Court, and Tom and I talk about that and
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  Speaker 2: follow that pretty closely to see there are some cases
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  Speaker 2: that are meaningful. There was a search case, GEO Fence case, right, Tom.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, Thomas here too. Welcome, Welcome back.
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  Speaker 3: Tom. No, probably is kind of a chauffe today. I think.
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  Speaker 1: Lots of like you guys are talking about lots of
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  Speaker 1: things going on. Of course, you can put the power
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  Speaker 1: of painting on your side. This morning, Tom and Harvey
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  Speaker 1: will have some things that they're going to talk about,
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  Speaker 1: but you can control the conversation as well. If you
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  Speaker 1: out more information online Payton Low p E Y T
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  Speaker 1: O N. Peyton Law Firm dot com. We'll give you
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  Speaker 1: more information as the morning goes along here this morning, Yeah.
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  Speaker 4: Hopefully we get some calls or texts. We'd like to
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  Speaker 4: take questions, but if you've got an issue that you
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  Speaker 3: And our office.
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  Speaker 4: Numbers pretty easy to remember. Three zero four seven five
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  Speaker 4: five five five five six. Of course, you can stop
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  Speaker 4: by the office anytime, and uh, you know, we're not
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  Speaker 4: always available to come out and talk to you, but
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  Speaker 4: our staff is always there between eight and five anytime
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  Speaker 4: during the day at twenty to one First Avenue, which
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  Speaker 4: is I said some of their days and I didn't
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  Speaker 4: know where that was, but First Avenue is the main
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  Speaker 4: drag through night trip, so and streets are all numbered,
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  Speaker 4: so you just drive till you get to the corner
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  Speaker 4: of twenty eighth Street and and.
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  Speaker 3: We're right there. But glad to be back today.
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  Speaker 4: There's been a not a whole lot on a well
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  Speaker 4: kind of a local level dovetails into the US Supreme
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  Speaker 4: Court since the State of West Virginia had a case there.
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  Speaker 4: But uh, you just get these there's always kind of
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  Speaker 4: a I wouldn't say a flood, but a flurry of
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  Speaker 4: uh decisions towards end of the term in the spring
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  Speaker 4: for the US Supreme Court. And one thing you can
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  Speaker 4: say about the I think the Trump administration is they've
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  Speaker 4: they've pushed the limit on on some provisions under the
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  Speaker 4: law that you you know, you kind of think are
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  Speaker 4: well established, pushed the envelope, I guess you would say.
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  Speaker 3: So.
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  Speaker 4: We got a flood of decisions now in the last
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  Speaker 4: week or two that are pretty uh significant. I think
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  Speaker 4: the one that of course connects back to West Virginia,
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  Speaker 4: which is the uh, you know, we passed the one
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  Speaker 4: three or four years ago past the I forget what
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  Speaker 4: it's called Keep Girls Sports Safe Act or something like that,
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  Speaker 4: which in essence, uh removed from the s s a
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  Speaker 4: C discretion about boys and girls sports and whether a
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  Speaker 4: transgender person could play in on the girls team, and
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  Speaker 4: and the SSAC had a rule that was kind of
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  Speaker 4: like a per case analysis about competitiveness and that kind
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  Speaker 4: of thing. But then the legislature past the law saying,
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  Speaker 4: in essence, it's based on biological sex and you can't
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  Speaker 4: let biological sex boy play in girls' sports.
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  Speaker 3: And it it.
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  Speaker 4: That was then challenged here locally in the US District Court.
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  Speaker 4: I think Judge Goodwin had it, who actually granted a
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  Speaker 4: priminary injunction, which normally indicates it's a good clue, a
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  Speaker 4: strong clue on how the ultimate case will turn out,
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  Speaker 4: because he granted an injunction letting this letting the transgender
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  Speaker 4: girl go ahead and compete in sports, but then when
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  Speaker 4: it came for a final decision, he he changed his
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  Speaker 4: ruling or made a final ruleing that was opposite and
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  Speaker 4: said that the statute that our legislature passed was constitutional,
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  Speaker 4: past constitutional muster and didn't violate Title nine. That was
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  Speaker 4: then appealed to the four Circuit that reversed Judge Goodwin
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  Speaker 4: and said no, that law is unconstitutional. I think they
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  Speaker 4: also said it violated Title nine statute, and of course
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  Speaker 4: it got appealed to the US Supreme Court. I believe
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  Speaker 4: an opinion written by Justice Kavanaugh last week said no,
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  Speaker 4: that that statute is constitutional. So now that's the law
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  Speaker 4: in West Virginia, and these types of statutes are are legal,
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  Speaker 4: and so the I guess the ramification if I don't
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  Speaker 4: think there's much of a ramification. I think mostly this
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  Speaker 4: was a legislation that was pushed for political reasons. I mean,
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  Speaker 4: I'm only aware of one transgender person where there was
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  Speaker 4: any controversy as far as girls and boys sports and Virginia,
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  Speaker 4: and I thought the s SAC's rule was pretty good
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  Speaker 4: because in a state as small as ours, where there's
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  Speaker 4: I don't know, it could be one to three students
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  Speaker 4: just whatever applied to you actually could do a case
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  Speaker 4: case by case analysis. But in the grand scheme of things,
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  Speaker 4: essentially the majority at the US Supreme Court said, well,
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  Speaker 4: that's that's not realistic on a kind of a global level.
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  Speaker 4: So it's black and white type statute is constitutional, and
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  Speaker 4: so that's that's the law going forward.
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  Speaker 3: I don't I know that the the girl that was.
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  Speaker 4: Named as a party in that case, I think just
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  Speaker 4: one she won the shot put at the state event,
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  Speaker 4: I think, I don't she didn't win in any other
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  Speaker 4: events that she was competing in. So I don't know
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  Speaker 4: if that will stand now or what will happen with that.
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  Speaker 4: Probably just leave it alone. But that statute that was
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  Speaker 4: overturned by the Four Circuit is now back in place,
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  Speaker 4: and so we follow the standard set by the legislature
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  Speaker 4: going forward, which should be pretty black and white. I mean,
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  Speaker 4: you have some biologue complicated, you know, anatomy issues with
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  Speaker 4: some folks, a very small majority about how determining under
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  Speaker 4: somebody what sex they are at birth. There's medical conditions
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  Speaker 4: there that can release anatomical conditions that can make a difference.
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  Speaker 4: But beyond that, I think it probably will be fairly
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  Speaker 4: black and white going forward.
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  Speaker 1: My question about this, and then there may I'll be
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  Speaker 1: an answer that you guys have on this, because it's
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  Speaker 1: going to be how it's implemented on the other end.
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  Speaker 1: But some of the things that I've seen and have
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  Speaker 1: seen in response to this would be, for example, what
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  Speaker 1: triggers a investigation and can it be used like a weapon?
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  Speaker 1: You know, you have somebody be you sure that's a
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  Speaker 1: little girl? We better get a test. I mean, what's
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  Speaker 1: the what's the barrier to keep that from happening to
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  Speaker 1: virtually anyone? You lose a tournament and then you go
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  Speaker 1: in and you start saying, well, I think that that
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  Speaker 1: team was full of transgender girls. We better investigate all
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  Speaker 1: the little kids. Those are the things that I worry about, because,
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  Speaker 1: as you know, I guess we'll see what happens with this,
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  Speaker 1: but uh, it doesn't seem that that measured minds usually
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  Speaker 1: are the ones that that instigate these things. And I'm
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  Speaker 1: just a little concerned about what's gonna happen to just
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  Speaker 1: regular kids that compete, well, maybe minorities that people aren't
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  Speaker 1: used through something along those lines. There's been some some
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  Speaker 1: like you look at the Olympic level where they do
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  Speaker 1: these types of things that's used weaponized. You know, they
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  Speaker 1: take what's obviously biological women who were born that way,
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  Speaker 1: and they're in controversy in other states just because of
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  Speaker 1: how they present themselves. So that's the thing that that
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  Speaker 1: I think we have to be aware of here in
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  Speaker 1: this thing.
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  Speaker 4: That's my opinion anyway, right, Yeah, and we'll see how
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  Speaker 4: how it plays out, but I think it'll be you know,
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  Speaker 4: normally you know, check up a Burth certificate will resolve
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  Speaker 4: the issue. We should and but you're right in that,
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  Speaker 4: you know, not to diminish either high school or middle
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  Speaker 4: school sports or or that kind of thing or some
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  Speaker 4: it has gender dysphoria and you know, diagnosed legitimate medical condition.
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  Speaker 4: The percentage of folks that are affected by this, at
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  Speaker 4: least the participants that are transgenderous so small that it's
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  Speaker 4: not insignificant, but in proportion to what we've seen politically,
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  Speaker 4: Like I mean, I think Governor Morsey had his his
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  Speaker 4: ad like cocked or ready to go, because within ten
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  Speaker 4: seconds I think of the ruling coming out publicly, he
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  Speaker 4: already was touting how he saved boys' sports and keeping.
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  Speaker 4: And I think almost universally you'll find of course you'll
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  Speaker 4: find far left folks or on this issue, but I
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  Speaker 4: mean almost universally, at least in West Virginia. I mean,
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  Speaker 4: I think everybody agrees that, you know, somebody who is
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  Speaker 4: a biological male, that you know, has those traits of
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  Speaker 4: a male, should not be competing against girls.
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  Speaker 3: In real sports.
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  Speaker 4: I mean, it gets if you, you know, if you
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  Speaker 4: try and be fair and you have somebody that's had
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  Speaker 4: puberty blockers and they're effeminate and they don't you know,
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  Speaker 4: they can't. They're not running faster, jumping higher, or stronger
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  Speaker 4: necessarily than any other girls of the same age, you
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  Speaker 4: kind of you feel for that person.
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  Speaker 3: But otherwise, just.
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  Speaker 4: Traditional males that competing in girls sports, I think most
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  Speaker 4: all of us, most reasonab people would agree that's that's
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  Speaker 4: not appropriate and should be regulated. But now there won't
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  Speaker 4: really be a balancing test on fairness anymore. It'll just
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  Speaker 4: be black and white, which should be you know, I
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  Speaker 4: think we'll maybe alleviate some of the concerns you expressed
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  Speaker 4: because It really should just be a black and white analysis.
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  Speaker 4: Although I mean, you have controversies about where on birth
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  Speaker 4: certificates sometimes, but you have a biological female who's stronger
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  Speaker 4: than a lot of men, which happens all the time,
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  Speaker 4: and so then you're gonna get a You're gonna get
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  Speaker 4: accusations there needs to be investigation or whether this is
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  Speaker 4: really a biological female or not. I think ninety nine
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  Speaker 4: point nine percent of time it'll just be an official
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  Speaker 4: birth certificate check and.
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  Speaker 3: Done.
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  Speaker 4: So it should be easier, more of a bright line rule,
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  Speaker 4: I think going forward, whether you like the ruling or not.
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  Speaker 2: One of the things about the decision, it was six
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  Speaker 2: to three, which is a sort of a you know,
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  Speaker 2: it's a philosophical breakdown between Kagan and Jackson Sotomayor, who
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  Speaker 2: are viewed as the liberal wing of the Supreme Court
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  Speaker 2: versus the other John Roberts Court members, which could subject
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  Speaker 2: the Court to some criticism for partisanship. But I think
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  Speaker 2: one of the important things to remember or to note
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  Speaker 2: about this decision is that all night and there were
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  Speaker 2: those justices who dissented from the ultimate decision in the
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  Speaker 2: case concurred in part all of the justice was all
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  Speaker 2: nine agreed that this did not violate Title nine, Title
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  Speaker 2: nine of the Civil Rights Act, which was written specifically
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  Speaker 2: in a binary sense and therefore applying the level of
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  Speaker 2: scrutiny that's required, this statue did not violate that period.
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  Speaker 2: So there wasn't that great, big gap. It wasn't just
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  Speaker 2: a knee jerk liberal conservative ruling. What Kavanaugh said essentially
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  Speaker 2: what Tom saying, Well, it's a bright line. It's it's
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  Speaker 2: only subject to intermediate scrutiny, not enhanced scrutiny, because this
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  Speaker 2: is not an essential constitutional right. You don't need a
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  Speaker 2: compelling state interest. All you need is a reasonable relation
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  Speaker 2: to a state interest, which is determined as valid. What
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  Speaker 2: Justice so do my or said in dissent, in which
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  Speaker 2: Jackson and Kagan concurred, was, well, wait a minute. We
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  Speaker 2: dissent because we think this case should go back to
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  Speaker 2: the district court. And while Justice Kavanaugh says, we know
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  Speaker 2: we can't we can't reduce this to individual concern if
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  Speaker 2: it involves a fundamental constitution right, we probably can, but
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  Speaker 2: we don't have any evidence. Why don't we send it
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  Speaker 2: back to the district court and let the district court
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  Speaker 2: take testimony about the science involved. The biology involved, the
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  Speaker 2: maturity involved, and treatments that are involved. How we would
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  Speaker 2: distinguish this and see what the evidence is, then revisit
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  Speaker 2: the case period. I mean, it wasn't I hate to
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  Speaker 2: see the court disparied so much about the split between
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  Speaker 2: the justices when in this case they were really I
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  Speaker 2: mean the divergence was the ability of the six more
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  Speaker 2: conservative justices is to say, well, look, this is a
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  Speaker 2: bright line test. But that happens all the time. I
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  Speaker 2: when you discriminate all the time in making bright line tests,
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  Speaker 2: as opposed to the three other justices who said, well,
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  Speaker 2: this may well be a denial of equal protection, but
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  Speaker 2: we don't have enough evidence to rule on that. So
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  Speaker 2: that's my that's my take on It's almost like the well,
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  Speaker 2: it's not like the citizenship case. The citizenship case, births
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  Speaker 2: birthright citizenship. We interpreting the first sentence of the fourteenth
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  Speaker 2: Amendment to the US Constitution. There were two votes Alito
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  Speaker 2: and Roberts that you just simply counted upon. They just blindly.
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  Speaker 2: In my estimation, I read it all. Well, they're just
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  Speaker 2: times have changed and we're flooded with with.
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  Speaker 3: Birth tourists.
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  Speaker 2: I think there's no evidence of that that it's any
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  Speaker 2: significant degree. Kavanaughs said, well, I think it's birthright. Citizenship
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  Speaker 2: is insured, but could be changed by Congress, as they
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  Speaker 2: did in the Immigration Act in nineteen fifty one, adopting
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  Speaker 2: the four member class at the Supreme Court held in
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  Speaker 2: the eighteen nineties case for the person from China, while
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  Speaker 2: the other five justices said, well, you know, when it
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  Speaker 2: says all persons born or naturalized and within the United
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  Speaker 2: States and so to the jurisdiction are of our citizens,
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  Speaker 2: that's pretty plain. And that's what Roberts said, and the
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  Speaker 2: other Amy Commy Barrett. It seems plain on its face,
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  Speaker 2: and that's the law of the land now. I mean.
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  Speaker 2: The President then immediately came out and said, well, Congress
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  Speaker 2: will fix this. Well, they won't if you're worried about
• 16:51
  Speaker 2: If you're really worried about birthright tourism, then amend the
• 16:59
  Speaker 2: statue she's regarding immigration and citizenship or the regulation so
• 17:05
  Speaker 2: that you can screen people who want to enter the
• 17:08
  Speaker 2: country for a state of gestation. If you're within ninety
• 17:13
  Speaker 2: days of delivery, you can't come in. That's the extent
• 17:16
  Speaker 2: of a visitors visa, and that addresses that problem. That's
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  Speaker 2: not really, which tells you that's not really the underlying
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: reason for the desire to abolish birth right citizenship. The
• 17:31
  Speaker 2: underlying reason is, to my mind, a nefarious reason. Persons
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  Speaker 2: who children who were innocently born in this country by
• 17:41
  Speaker 2: people who had come here seeking a better life, but
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: got here without formal process. My mother, Anne Thompson Peyton,
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  Speaker 2: became a citizen in the United States at her birth
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  Speaker 2: in Raleigh, in a cold camp in West Virginia. That's
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  Speaker 2: how she became a citizen. Her mother and father were
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  Speaker 2: subjects of the British Crown at the time they came
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  Speaker 2: here from Scotland in nineteen twenty one. My grandmother never
• 18:07
  Speaker 2: attained citizenship. She simply was a legal resident. My grandfather did.
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  Speaker 2: But you know, birthright citizenship is an important part of
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  Speaker 2: the American dream and the American ideal, and so I
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  Speaker 2: think the decision is good. People say, well, it was
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  Speaker 2: too close for comfort, but it is. It's a five
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  Speaker 2: to four if I can give you some credit for that.
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  Speaker 2: I remember a show that we did in twenty twenty five.
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  Speaker 2: I think when this first started coming up, we knew
• 18:32
  Speaker 2: it was going to go to the Supreme Court. You
• 18:33
  Speaker 2: took a show where you walked through how the argument
• 18:36
  Speaker 2: was going to be made against birthright citizenship, and you
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  Speaker 2: even predicted you wouldn't be surprised to see if I
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  Speaker 2: four decision on it, and that it wasn't as tight
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  Speaker 2: as you thought it would be. I thought it was
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  Speaker 2: the time that you did a really great job of
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  Speaker 2: walking through that. And I've seen a lot of law
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  Speaker 2: fair types comment on this at the same time and
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  Speaker 2: be outraged like there's just no way that they could
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  Speaker 2: get here and this is just which.
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  Speaker 1: It may well be. But you were able to kind
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  Speaker 1: of suss out like, look that I may not agree
• 18:58
  Speaker 1: with this path, but this is what they're going to say,
• 19:00
  Speaker 1: and this is how they're going to arrive to that conclusion.
• 19:02
  Speaker 1: And that's basically what happened. Yeah, I mean that was
• 19:05
  Speaker 1: very instructive when you did that last year and not
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: have always had that in my pocket. And when that
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: decision came out, I was like, man, Harvey kind of
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: talked about this.
• 19:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean it was to me it was playing
• 19:16
  Speaker 2: on its face, but the argument would be a contrast
• 19:19
  Speaker 2: to the a strict interpretation of the fourteenth Amendment because
• 19:23
  Speaker 2: it's as subject to the jurisdiction thereof well, when that
• 19:27
  Speaker 2: arose for the Supreme Court to decide in the eighteen nineties,
• 19:32
  Speaker 2: who's not subject to the jurisdics in the United States
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: American Indians wasn't until nineteen twenty one with the Indian
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: Citizenship Act that members of the Indian nations were made
• 19:41
  Speaker 2: citizens of the United States by Congress. And they were
• 19:45
  Speaker 2: actually when the Fourteenth Amendment was enacted in eighteen sixty eight.
• 19:48
  Speaker 2: Many of the nations in the West Indian names were
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: war with the United States. Witness this is also the
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: anniversary of the Battle of Greasy Grass or the Little
• 19:59
  Speaker 2: Big Worn people on ships within the jurisdics in the
• 20:05
  Speaker 2: United States, but foreign flagships who were foreign individuals. They're
• 20:11
  Speaker 2: children born aboard even though they're in the United States,
• 20:13
  Speaker 2: but they're in New York Harbor. The people who were
• 20:19
  Speaker 2: children born to people who were citizens of countries or
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: with the United States, or in the States that were
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: in insurrection against the United States, or diplomatic children people
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: who were here is diplomats. We are not subject to
• 20:37
  Speaker 2: the Russian ambassadory. We can't arrest the Russian ambassador and
• 20:40
  Speaker 2: convict him of spying.
• 20:42
  Speaker 3: I mean, you could.
• 20:43
  Speaker 2: Catch him handing money to CIA and in exchange for
• 20:47
  Speaker 2: a packet of documents, but he can't be convicted of
• 20:52
  Speaker 2: an offense within the United States. He can be expelled,
• 20:55
  Speaker 2: but he's not subject to the jurisdics in the United States.
• 20:58
  Speaker 2: I mean, you've got diplomats and Washington, DC walk around
• 21:01
  Speaker 2: with hundreds of thousands of dollars in barking tickets because
• 21:04
  Speaker 2: you can't prosecute them. So, I mean, I thought that,
• 21:08
  Speaker 2: and could that change to say that someone who crosses
• 21:11
  Speaker 2: the border enters the United States, not an asylum seeker,
• 21:16
  Speaker 2: not someone who's here on an expired visitor's visa, but
• 21:19
  Speaker 2: who simply crosses the waters of the Rio Grande surreptitiously
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: at night, it's not subject to the jurisdiction, although you
• 21:28
  Speaker 2: could say that that's not true. We arrest them if
• 21:31
  Speaker 2: they get passed a certain distance from the border, they're
• 21:35
  Speaker 2: not subject to media immediate expulsion. So it was pretty
• 21:39
  Speaker 2: plain to me what the arguments were going to be.
• 21:40
  Speaker 2: But I had confidence in I think it Roberts, Comy
• 21:44
  Speaker 2: Barrett and the other three that we were going to
• 21:47
  Speaker 2: have a bare minimum five four to sustain the birthright citizenship.
• 21:53
  Speaker 2: And that's what we had actually six to three. But
• 21:57
  Speaker 2: Kavanaugh did not say, or of courses did not say
• 21:59
  Speaker 2: it was based on the fourteenth Amendment. It was based
• 22:02
  Speaker 2: upon an Act of Congress that did not include, you know,
• 22:07
  Speaker 2: the children of folks illegally in the country within that
• 22:10
  Speaker 2: closed class of people who are quote not subject to
• 22:12
  Speaker 2: the jurisdiction. So there we get. I'm glad it was.
• 22:15
  Speaker 2: I'm glad you remembered that, Coop. I forgot about it. Yeah,
• 22:17
  Speaker 2: I remember to I. I've always kind of carried that
• 22:19
  Speaker 2: one around with me. We're kind of just the Tom
• 22:22
  Speaker 2: and Harvey are here this morning from the Payton Law Firm.
• 22:24
  Speaker 2: You're welcome to call in with your questions as well,
• 22:26
  Speaker 2: not only about the topics that we're touching on a
• 22:28
  Speaker 2: national basis, but of course we have tons of stuff
• 22:30
  Speaker 2: legally or maybe in your own home. Maybe you're looking
• 22:32
  Speaker 2: to put the power painting on your side. You have
• 22:33
  Speaker 2: some questions this morning, give us a call. We still
• 22:35
  Speaker 2: have fifteen minutes left on the air. We'll go ahead
• 22:36
  Speaker 2: and take our break right now. When we come back,
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: plenty of time for your phone calls and also your
• 22:39
  Speaker 2: text messages. Three are four non three five fives, zear
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: zero eight. That is the text line. Threes are four
• 22:44
  Speaker 2: non three five five zero zero eight our phone number
• 22:46
  Speaker 2: as always. Threes are A four three four five fifty
• 22:48
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• 22:50
  Speaker 2: fifty eight fifty eight. We'll take a break and be
• 22:51
  Speaker 2: backward after this. You're listening to ask the lawyer with
• 22:54
  Speaker 2: Harvey and Tom Payton from the Payton Law Firm on
• 22:57
  Speaker 2: five ADWCCHS the Voice of Charleston.
• 22:58
  Speaker 5: Why do so many West Virginians choose the Peyton Law
• 23:01
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• 23:04
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• 23:22
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• 23:34
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• 23:42
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• 23:55
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• 24:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's about fourteen minutes. It's up the top of
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• 24:27
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• 24:28
  Speaker 1: Peyton Law Firm dot com.
• 24:30
  Speaker 4: Hey, we heard country rids there and we heard it
• 24:32
  Speaker 4: last night. That was I keep getting good publicity from countries,
• 24:36
  Speaker 4: right West Virginia.
• 24:36
  Speaker 3: So they did you watch the World Cup game last night?
• 24:38
  Speaker 1: I watched the highlights of well the game, I watched it,
• 24:41
  Speaker 1: and the uh so at the end, silly red card.
• 24:44
  Speaker 4: Yeah, well, I don't know, probably with a red card.
• 24:48
  Speaker 4: That's one of our top goal scorers got a red card,
• 24:51
  Speaker 4: which is equivalent to an ejection in a basketball football game.
• 24:54
  Speaker 4: You have to sit out the next game, which is
• 24:56
  Speaker 4: really too bad. But uh and then we had to
• 24:59
  Speaker 4: play thirty minutes. When you get kicked out in soccer
• 25:02
  Speaker 4: on a red card, you don't get to replace the player.
• 25:05
  Speaker 4: So we played a man down. You know, imagine playing
• 25:08
  Speaker 4: basketball four verse five, but we want to nil. And
• 25:13
  Speaker 4: then you know, there's some milling around for a few
• 25:16
  Speaker 4: minutes after the final whistle blows and the players are
• 25:19
  Speaker 4: shaking hands and whatnot, or the opposing team was kind
• 25:23
  Speaker 4: of crying since they lost. But then the announcers on
• 25:27
  Speaker 4: the they're in person, said let's turn it back over
• 25:30
  Speaker 4: to the studio.
• 25:31
  Speaker 3: Here's Hannah.
• 25:32
  Speaker 4: And then right about the time they did that, they
• 25:33
  Speaker 4: started playing country Roads in the background. Hannah got on
• 25:36
  Speaker 4: and said, wait a minute, they just started playing country
• 25:40
  Speaker 4: Roads in the stadium, and it's just gotten so popular.
• 25:42
  Speaker 4: So they just kind of like the Mountaineer basketball game,
• 25:46
  Speaker 4: they just instead of going back to the studio, they
• 25:48
  Speaker 4: didn't go back to the studio.
• 25:49
  Speaker 3: They said wait, and so.
• 25:50
  Speaker 4: Then they they played the whole Of course, the players
• 25:54
  Speaker 4: US men's national team, they you know, they don't do
• 25:57
  Speaker 4: what the Mountaineers do and put their arms around each
• 25:58
  Speaker 4: other and sing the song. We're singing the song, but
• 26:01
  Speaker 4: the whole stadium was and they just sat there without
• 26:04
  Speaker 4: any commentary and played the whole song from the beginning
• 26:07
  Speaker 4: to the end. And uh, it just really good publicity
• 26:10
  Speaker 4: for US. I think it's going to help help our
• 26:14
  Speaker 4: promote our w in our state and in general.
• 26:17
  Speaker 1: Somehow, gaining status is like a patriotic song, you know,
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: more more so than anything else, especially the gaining status that.
• 26:22
  Speaker 4: It's got a lot of international appeal, and so a
• 26:24
  Speaker 4: lot of people know it that aren't from the US,
• 26:28
  Speaker 4: but they the US men's national team has just adopted
• 26:31
  Speaker 4: it as their victory song, and uh, let's hope they
• 26:35
  Speaker 4: keep winning.
• 26:35
  Speaker 1: I think I've mentioned on the air before, but one
• 26:37
  Speaker 1: of the most surreal experiences of my life is I'm
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: one of nearly deserted desert were a western beach in
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: Ecuador where there's hardly anybody around, and I'm staying in
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: a hostel. When I wake up in the morning, it's
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: sweltering hot. There's a group of people outside just playing
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: on the beach. And what do I hear strumming? But
• 26:54
  Speaker 1: Country Roads? And and I go up to the people,
• 26:57
  Speaker 1: make good friends with the locals. There are locals that
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: are there that that seeing. The only two songs that
• 27:01
  Speaker 1: they knew in English was Country Roads and Dust and
• 27:03
  Speaker 1: the Wind from Kansas, and they just played them over
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: and over and over again. But they love the Country Roads.
• 27:08
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 27:09
  Speaker 4: And I know, you know, soccer is not as popular
• 27:11
  Speaker 4: here as it is and uh, or not as popular
• 27:13
  Speaker 4: as football or traditional sports, but worldwide it's significantly more
• 27:18
  Speaker 4: popular than any other sport. And I don't know what
• 27:20
  Speaker 4: the viewership was, but uh, it was great publicity. Hey,
• 27:23
  Speaker 4: we got a call coming in.
• 27:24
  Speaker 1: They we have a call this coming in here. Towards
• 27:25
  Speaker 1: the end of the show, I call it overhead. What's
• 27:27
  Speaker 1: your first name?
• 27:28
  Speaker 7: Bob?
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: Hey, Bob, what's it? What's going on this morning?
• 27:31
  Speaker 7: You're talking about Country Roads? So it reminded me of
• 27:36
  Speaker 7: a story. My son works in a and he travels
• 27:42
  Speaker 7: worldwide and he spends a lot of time in Dublin, Ireland,
• 27:47
  Speaker 7: and about three months ago he finished in Dublin. Then
• 27:52
  Speaker 7: he was catching a flight to Vienna, Austria, and the
• 27:57
  Speaker 7: cab driver picked him up take him to the airport.
• 28:02
  Speaker 7: He got in the cab and the guy turned out
• 28:07
  Speaker 7: to be a Polish fellow who had left Poland fifty
• 28:15
  Speaker 7: years earlier to escape communism. So he asked my son
• 28:22
  Speaker 7: if he cared if he played country music. My son
• 28:26
  Speaker 7: said no, He turned the radio on. They played a
• 28:29
  Speaker 7: couple of songs and Country Roads came on the radio,
• 28:34
  Speaker 7: and the guy reached down and turned the volume up
• 28:39
  Speaker 7: and he said, that is my favorite song in all
• 28:43
  Speaker 7: the world because it is it's about yearning to go home.
• 28:49
  Speaker 7: And he said, even after fifty years, he yearned to
• 28:53
  Speaker 7: go home to Poland, and Country Roads was his favorite
• 28:59
  Speaker 7: song in all the world. My son then informed him
• 29:03
  Speaker 7: that he was from West Virginia. So when he informed
• 29:09
  Speaker 7: the guy he was from West Virginia, he said, the
• 29:13
  Speaker 7: guy just about want bunkers over riding with someone from
• 29:17
  Speaker 7: West Virginia playing Country Roads. Just throw that out, thank you.
• 29:22
  Speaker 1: Thanks well, I appreciate that that's a great story everywhere.
• 29:25
  Speaker 4: Yeah, you know, and most of us that travel some
• 29:30
  Speaker 4: have stories like that.
• 29:31
  Speaker 3: You know.
• 29:31
  Speaker 4: It's just one of those. But yeah, and a lot
• 29:35
  Speaker 4: of the US soccer players are men. Are one of
• 29:39
  Speaker 4: our best players, you know, he's born and raised in Germany.
• 29:42
  Speaker 4: Thought it was a service. And so but once you
• 29:47
  Speaker 4: play for a real game, for the senior the main
• 29:51
  Speaker 4: team for the for your country, you can't switch. You're
• 29:54
  Speaker 4: always you can pick if you're dual citizenship, but you're
• 29:56
  Speaker 4: always on the team that you start playing for.
• 29:59
  Speaker 1: So that kind of codifies what we do here in
• 30:02
  Speaker 1: West Virginia, which is if you drive through the state,
• 30:03
  Speaker 1: we claim you you're ours man. All right.
• 30:07
  Speaker 4: But it was back to the Supreme Court. One of
• 30:13
  Speaker 4: the one things that one of the things that was
• 30:15
  Speaker 4: a case that had some interest maybe if you care
• 30:20
  Speaker 4: about privacy, was a case about geofencing. Yeah. So what
• 30:25
  Speaker 4: had happened in that case somebody had robbed a credit
• 30:29
  Speaker 4: union or a bank, something like that, and so the
• 30:32
  Speaker 4: government law enforcement like issues warrants and they serve him
• 30:36
  Speaker 4: on I think it was Google in this case. It
• 30:38
  Speaker 4: may have served them on Apple or something as well.
• 30:40
  Speaker 4: But and you know, when you use your phone, I know,
• 30:45
  Speaker 4: because I've had cases where there's been data downloads and
• 30:48
  Speaker 4: location pings and things. You know, a lot of programs
• 30:51
  Speaker 4: running in your background on your phone or other electronic device.
• 30:55
  Speaker 4: And if almost everybody has a Google account, a Gmail,
• 30:59
  Speaker 4: you just I don't use it for my primary email,
• 31:01
  Speaker 4: but I have to have it for all the different
• 31:03
  Speaker 4: things that I do, calendar and.
• 31:06
  Speaker 3: Otherwise maps maps, Yes, and so they.
• 31:12
  Speaker 4: Service search warnt on Google and basically do a geofence,
• 31:15
  Speaker 4: meaning you know, certain geographic area. They want all the
• 31:23
  Speaker 4: data as far as location and use and that kind
• 31:27
  Speaker 4: of thing. And obviously that brings in and then they
• 31:32
  Speaker 4: once they get that data, they try and you know,
• 31:34
  Speaker 4: find a suspect process of elimination. They they they actually
• 31:38
  Speaker 4: in this case kept issuing I think subsequent warrants for
• 31:41
  Speaker 4: more and more detailed information naturally that encompasses a lot
• 31:46
  Speaker 4: of individuals, uh, information that have nothing to do with
• 31:50
  Speaker 4: the robbery at a credit union in this case, Actually
• 31:52
  Speaker 4: they used it, I believe. I'm not sure if it
• 31:55
  Speaker 4: was the lynch pin that found, but they located the
• 31:59
  Speaker 4: person a suspect and went to the house and hope
• 32:03
  Speaker 4: there he is and had you know, so much US
• 32:07
  Speaker 4: currency that it matched the what was stolen from the
• 32:09
  Speaker 4: credit union, but that was challenged under the Fourth Amendment
• 32:16
  Speaker 4: as an unreasonable.
• 32:17
  Speaker 3: Search and seizure, and the Supreme Court found that.
• 32:23
  Speaker 4: Citizens do have an expectation of privacy, uh for information
• 32:28
  Speaker 4: that Google has. That was one of the issues of Well,
• 32:30
  Speaker 4: government argues, well, when you subscribe to Google, you waive these.
• 32:35
  Speaker 3: Type of privacy rights.
• 32:37
  Speaker 4: And the Supreme Court said, no, that's not true, and
• 32:40
  Speaker 4: I think found it was just overly broad. You gotta
• 32:43
  Speaker 4: have a more particularized probable cause to get a search warrant.
• 32:49
  Speaker 3: So they.
• 32:51
  Speaker 4: Anyway, they found that that type of search was unconstitutional.
• 32:55
  Speaker 3: So you know, the.
• 32:57
  Speaker 4: Government will not be geo fencing and and well that
• 33:01
  Speaker 4: they can, but it'll be illegal and they won't bet
• 33:03
  Speaker 4: to use any of the information they gather from it
• 33:05
  Speaker 4: to prosecute someone. Uh So, no, no more geo fencing
• 33:09
  Speaker 4: and just balk warrant requests for all data from Google
• 33:13
  Speaker 4: other third party electronic providers. Now they can still you know,
• 33:20
  Speaker 4: if it was if they had a suspect and had
• 33:23
  Speaker 4: some particular facts that are aimed at that person, I
• 33:27
  Speaker 4: think the warrant will be good. I mean, they could
• 33:30
  Speaker 4: subpoena or serve a warrant on Google about person a
• 33:34
  Speaker 4: and get their data.
• 33:38
  Speaker 3: But yeah, you can.
• 33:38
  Speaker 4: Nowadays, the State police lab has a whole you know,
• 33:43
  Speaker 4: multiple employees just for downloading it off the phone. I've
• 33:47
  Speaker 4: had a few cases where that's been involved, and you'd
• 33:49
  Speaker 4: be surprised. Hardly anything's ever really permanently deleted from your phone.
• 33:54
  Speaker 1: The government can purchase data too, right from the data
• 33:56
  Speaker 1: brokers that collect this stuff.
• 33:57
  Speaker 4: I think I think they can probablyably do that. And
• 34:01
  Speaker 4: that's not that's not that's how they circumvent. Yeah, so
• 34:05
  Speaker 4: it's it's one way to maybe circumvent that. But I
• 34:09
  Speaker 4: think Google would market safeguarding that, not selling off data.
• 34:15
  Speaker 4: But yeah, there's whole as you know, I mean, there's
• 34:17
  Speaker 4: whole firms that basically serve the media and marketing industry
• 34:20
  Speaker 4: that selluh whether in essence leads UH in a very
• 34:25
  Speaker 4: complicated computer based scenario.
• 34:27
  Speaker 1: Facebook just announced that on top of all the data
• 34:30
  Speaker 1: they collect on you, that they're also now purchasing that
• 34:32
  Speaker 1: same third party data that like other entities can buy,
• 34:35
  Speaker 1: and they're including that into your account digital fingerprint so
• 34:38
  Speaker 1: they can surface you more relevant ads, is what they say.
• 34:41
  Speaker 1: But imagine now what that storehouse of information that Facebook
• 34:44
  Speaker 1: has is they have their information and the information they're purchasing,
• 34:46
  Speaker 1: and then they get subpoened.
• 34:48
  Speaker 3: Right, I don't know.
• 34:49
  Speaker 4: Yeah, the whole I mean AI and that there's privacy issues.
• 34:56
  Speaker 4: Government should have seen this coming and we should have
• 34:57
  Speaker 4: a whole massive regulatory scheme to govern all this going forward.
• 35:02
  Speaker 4: And government's reactionary generally, So we'll see how that plays
• 35:06
  Speaker 4: out in the future. But yeah, I mean AI's it's
• 35:10
  Speaker 4: tough to decipher and figure out what's real and what's not,
• 35:14
  Speaker 4: and it's not really regulated in any reasonable way yet.
• 35:20
  Speaker 3: It will be.
• 35:20
  Speaker 4: Because somebody will be harmed significantly, probably somebody politically connected.
• 35:25
  Speaker 4: Then there'll be some act that passes and hopefully get
• 35:28
  Speaker 4: some regulations on it.
• 35:30
  Speaker 1: And interesting stuff. Wrapping up a conversation with Tom and A.
• 35:33
  Speaker 1: Harvey Payton this morning on the Paton Law Firm. More
• 35:35
  Speaker 1: information online. It's Payton Law Firm dot com. Payton Lawfirm
• 35:38
  Speaker 1: dot com. That's pey t and you can find the
• 35:40
  Speaker 1: pathon law Firm online. And also therefore number three or
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: four seven, five, five fifty five fifty six threes are
• 35:45
  Speaker 1: four seven, five, five fifty five fifty six. If you
• 35:47
  Speaker 1: go to the website, you can you can contact the
• 35:49
  Speaker 1: Payton Law Firm and leave an email message. I know
• 35:51
  Speaker 1: Harvey and Tom make a point to respond to those
• 35:53
  Speaker 1: whenever they can, and it's a good way to get
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: a hold of the patent law firm.
• 35:58
  Speaker 2: It is, indeed, And you know, before we leave the
• 36:00
  Speaker 2: year today, I would like to you know, as I
• 36:03
  Speaker 2: mentioned when we started the show, I had a fairly
• 36:08
  Speaker 2: significant medical event. I had open heart surgery. I mean,
• 36:11
  Speaker 2: you know, they put you to sleep and they open
• 36:13
  Speaker 2: your chest and stop your heart, and you know, I
• 36:17
  Speaker 2: came through this really, really well. But you know, when
• 36:21
  Speaker 2: I check my Facebook account, I see that any number
• 36:24
  Speaker 2: of people like my nineteen sixty seven Saint Alban's ASCO classmates,
• 36:29
  Speaker 2: former clients, people who listened on the radio, express thoughts
• 36:33
  Speaker 2: and prayers which really lifted me up while I was
• 36:36
  Speaker 2: in the hospital. And I appreciate it and thank you
• 36:39
  Speaker 2: all for it very much. And I've got to if
• 36:41
  Speaker 2: I can last through this and next surgery, I've got
• 36:43
  Speaker 2: more fiction to be done. I will be fifty years
• 36:47
  Speaker 2: in Nitro next May, and I'm going to make that
• 36:49
  Speaker 2: We're going to have a fifty year celebration to the
• 36:53
  Speaker 2: Peyton Law Firm in Nitro, West Virginia, will be one
• 36:55
  Speaker 2: of the oldest businesses in town.
• 36:57
  Speaker 1: The half century Celebration. Half Century celebrates Hot no m
• 37:00
  Speaker 1: I have free hot Noll, Gotta have West Virginia dogs
• 37:04
  Speaker 1: A right. Yeah, that's Harvey and Harvey and Tom Payton
• 37:06
  Speaker 1: from the Pathon Law Froom in Nitro, West Virginia. Payton
• 37:09
  Speaker 1: Lawfirm dot com. Payton Lawfirm dot com three zer a
• 37:11
  Speaker 1: four seven five five fifty five fifty six seven five
• 37:13
  Speaker 1: five fifty five fifty six. Harvey, glad to see you
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: back here, thanks for coming in.
• 37:17
  Speaker 2: Good to be back.
• 37:17
  Speaker 1: And Tom, good to see you as well. Yep, we'll
• 37:19
  Speaker 1: see you next week. We'll see you next week. Thank
• 37:21
  Speaker 1: you so much for tuning in today. Dave Allen Show
• 37:23
  Speaker 1: is up next. I'll be back this afternoon at three
• 37:24
  Speaker 1: oh six with Dave Weekly one Metro News Hotline. Have
• 37:27
  Speaker 1: a gret day, everyone, listening to your Voice of Charleston.
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: We are five eighty w c HS.
• 37:34
  Speaker 5: W c HSAI W two four three d r F
• 37:37
  Speaker 5: M Charleston W two eight three HU Coross Lanes, a
• 37:39
  Speaker 5: WVRC media station.
• 37:43
  Speaker 1: We're proud to live here too.