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Growing Without Losing the Personal Touch: Building a Financial Advice Business · Adeptli's Podcast

• 0:09
  SPEAKER_00: Hi, and welcome to the Adepli podcast.
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_00: At Adepli, we work alongside advisors and advice firms, providing hands-on technical, operational, and strategic support to help them deliver good advice and run stronger businesses.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_00: In this series, we explore the trends, challenges, and questions impacting financial advisors and advice firms across the UK with practical insight from people working at the heart of the industry.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_00: Clear thinking, real experience, and honest conversation.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_00: Let's get into it.
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_03: Today I'm joined by my fellow Adepti co-founder Dave, and we're welcoming back Alex Cow.
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_03: In the last episode, we talked about building trust with his clients, but today we're focusing more on the business behind it.
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_03: You'll probably remember Alex is the principal of his firm, and he now has a number of advisors and support staff and has recently opened a second office in Gloucestershire.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_03: He has plans for further growth, yet wasn't long ago he was sat in an academy programme having entered the profession for the first time.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_03: So, Alex, welcome back.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_03: Um, can you give us an idea of the scale of your practice?
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_03: Uh yes, of course, yeah.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it's this big.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_01: Um yeah, so as you mentioned, uh set up in the academy 11 years ago out of a bedroom on the keys and keyside wealth management, and very quickly moved into an office.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_01: Now there are this is really embarrassing, but I do actually have to cancel on the hand, uh, because we've got some new starters quickly.
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_01: There are six support staff today.
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_01: As of Tuesday, that'll be seven.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and advisors, we have got five live, two in Academy, and one that we're about to onboard who's already a qualified advisor, but we're gonna move into another area in the Gloucestershire.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_01: Uh secrets to come out later on, not in this podcast.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so there's gonna be 16 of us and an office dog.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_01: No, not an exclusive yet.
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_01: Just the one office dog.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_01: Just the one office dog, yeah.
• 2:20
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_01: Who on our website currently is described as head of security, but we're just about to change our website and he's going to uh heading for retirement because he's the laziest thing you've ever seen.
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_01: He can't even be bothered anymore.
• 2:31
  SPEAKER_01: So we're like, right, we're not giving him a job anymore.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, but you've talked to pension, yeah.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_03: Um so starting off in your bedroom out of the academy, was this always the plan?
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_03: Was it always an ambition to be a multi-office, multi-advisor firm?
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, uh definitely multi-advisor, or definitely a business.
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_01: I guess I didn't really think about the advisor piece, but definitely a business.
• 2:58
  SPEAKER_01: Um when I set up and I were down in London, I remember meeting with a marketing team, and you had some write on a little piece of paper.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_01: What's your company name?
• 3:07
  SPEAKER_01: And I said, Oh, it'll be Alex, uh, Keyside Wealth Management.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_01: Our brother sent me that.
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_01: We just talked about our brother, I won't bring him into this podcast too much.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_01: But he he sent he sent me the name, and probably some of his um spark was allowed me to argue back because when I gave that to SJP, they went, No, you can't have that.
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_01: You need to be called something like Alex Cow Financial Planning.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_01: And I my question was like, Why?
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_01: They're like, Oh, no one will know Keyside Wealth Management.
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_01: Ah, I was like, I'm pretty sure no one knows who Alex Kell is.
• 3:31
  SPEAKER_01: So, like, who really cares?
• 3:34
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but I went with that because I I never wanted my name above the door, really.
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_01: I don't need that kind of gravitas, couldn't care less.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_01: I just wanted to do something that was a bit different, so we stuck with a business name, quickly hired, um, probably after like six months, brought somebody in to support me.
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and yeah, always had the vision of we'd be growing something, probably not to what it is now, and I love what we've done, it's amazing.
• 3:57
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but definitely it was always a business of mine, not just me on my own.
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_03: And what's that growth looked like over the 10 years?
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_03: Is it something which has accelerated recently?
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_03: Has it been growth year on year?
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_03: What does it mean?
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_01: We've so touch words, I was just saying this.
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_01: This will be our 11th year of straight growth, if we get it right.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_01: Um, it's harder, the bigger you get, the harder that is to achieve.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_01: But I set out on my own.
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_01: Um girl I was dating at the time was in financial services, so she came and supported me early on.
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_01: Then we hired uh some admin staff uh and moved into a new office.
• 4:33
  SPEAKER_01: And then it was probably about 12 months after that I hired uh two other people, so we got to the point of being a bit busier, and the person uh Andrine's who supported me at first, then it also became an advisor.
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_01: So we switched into being quickly a two-advisor practice, three support staff.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, she stopped uh in the practice, and at that time I'd hired somebody else to be an advisor, and then quite quickly we had two more, so I think that would have been probably uh when was COVID 2019?
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_01: 1919, 2020.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_01: So around 2020, there would have been three other advisors coming in, so we would have been a team of four at that point.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_01: We then moved on back onto the keys because we weren't in the keys through COVID and quickly picked up yeah, support staff and just started growing a lot faster.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_01: And just naturally, we've grown through referrals.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_01: So, yeah, if you've got 10 clients and they refer you one client a year, the second you get to 100, that's 10 new clients.
• 5:27
  SPEAKER_01: So that's what's kind of made us grow quite quickly.
• 5:29
  SPEAKER_02: Do you still has there ever been a point when you fell out of love with doing it?
• 5:34
  SPEAKER_02: No, because you feel quite passionate about it.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_02: But has there ever been a point and you thought, do I want to carry on doing this?
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_01: No.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_01: I I honestly I love I I when people come to me and say they want to get into financial services.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_01: My explanation is you've got you look like it's the best job in the world, like you're lucky to be in it if you get it.
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_01: And this is like a big you know, we spoke about this on the last podcast, but uh I I I love the idea of living life, like just enjoy it.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_01: So I do it for myself, try and do it for the friends, family, mates, anything, like quite a social person.
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_01: It's either an enabler or an inhibitor, depending on how you think about money.
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_01: And I love the idea that I can be the enabler, like the ones that get people thinking about what they can do, and I thrive off it.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I I I genuinely love it.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_01: Uh don't get me wrong, I get stressed.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_01: The team will say I'm I can be quite an angry person.
• 6:24
  SPEAKER_02: I was gonna say, what if we asked the team, would they say they'd say that they would, and you know, they say they I won't say they say anger, I say they say passionate.
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_01: And like yesterday I was talking to Vic and she said to me, Um, I don't know how you kind of carry the weight of the job with the team and the clients because we all see it.
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_01: Like they'd obviously spoken on our on our conferences, we all see it, but I love it.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_01: Like I it kind of it's important to me that uh my purpose is seeing that success effectively.
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_01: So no, and if I fell out of love with it, I'd stop doing it uh uh in a heartbeat.
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_02: I just wouldn't do it because you shouldn't be in front of people if you don't because you don't think you would be able to bring that care and passion to the client and help them achieve what they want to achieve.
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_01: Not as a process job, no.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_01: I think I'd have to get out of the way and just let one of the guys do it because you're gonna slow them down, yeah, and and you're gonna slow your clients down, right?
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_01: If I if I'm sat opposite somebody who wants to do something in life and I'm tick boxing exercising it rather than doing it because I really want it to see it happen, I'm not the right person for the job, so I I just get out of the way.
• 7:26
  SPEAKER_01: But that's why I'm building what I'm building because I want like a I want to let uh I I want like a hundred-year business.
• 7:32
  SPEAKER_01: I'll be dead and gone, but I would love to think we've made an impact in the industry way more than caring about what goes in the bank or anything else.
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_01: My absolute objective is we are whatever tiny little bit of we're changing, we're just changing the the industry a little bit.
• 7:49
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_03: And you've we learned in the last podcast you've got some real strong beliefs about what a good advisor is, what an advisor should be doing, what they shouldn't be doing.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_03: How have you found that when you've been trying to grow the team?
• 8:03
  SPEAKER_03: Like you're it feels you're quite unique from some of the types of advisors we see.
• 8:09
  SPEAKER_03: How how do you find individuals who can replicate what you're looking to deliver for the industry?
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_01: Um I think mainly there's a bit of a people come to like I I say good people come to good people, but I don't mean that in like an arrogant way, but I think people who are similar to yourself, so most of us would like to think we're good people, uh whichever nature that takes.
• 8:36
  SPEAKER_01: So you're likely to have people that like that surround you.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, we've been approached by quite a few people to come and work with us, so they've obviously already seen what we're like and they feel the affinity that it feels like part of the way they want to work.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_01: We've interviewed a lot and turned a lot away because of they now don't necessarily have the same attributes that we want in a good financial advisor.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_01: Um I don't think we tend to get there quite quickly in an interview.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah.
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_02: But in attributes, are you talking capability, personality, fit for the team?
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_02: What are the attributes that you're saying in that scenario not the right fit?
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_01: Uh that's a good question.
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_01: I'd say two different things.
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_01: So we we rarely ever look at C Vs, but it sounds really bad.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_01: I want to know that someone's made the effort to put a C V together in a cover letter, but actually, the content of it, I I came out of my A levels with two E's and a U.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not fair because I just didn't enjoy school.
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_01: Um and I went and got my degree, I continued on to uni and got my degree, but I didn't enjoy that either, just got it because it's what you're meant to do.
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_01: So I've I've never been one to think the grade is the end of everything.
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_01: So effort, like we'll always look for like I think does this person look like somebody who's passionate and wants to work above.
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_01: I think I said it in the last podcast, like it's alright being like a six or a seven out of ten in regards to your effort.
• 9:56
  SPEAKER_01: But aim for the nine, yeah, but just for the crack.
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_01: Like, why wouldn't you?
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_01: If you're gonna do something, do it as best you can.
• 10:01
  SPEAKER_01: And I can't I cannot get my head around why that sounds so odd.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_01: Like, well, not not it doesn't sound odd, it doesn't sound odd to me at all, but I just think if you're gonna do something, just go full tilt it just because you should.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_01: If if it doesn't mean you it doesn't mean the outcome's gonna be a nine, but it certainly means the effort should be.
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I just don't and we all have our off days, so you can't be a nine all the time.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_01: But I I like to think that the people we've employed just get it, like they really want to make a positive difference and they go above and beyond doing the job.
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_01: Now, I love the people who just do the job.
• 10:35
  SPEAKER_01: There's nothing wrong with that either.
• 10:36
  SPEAKER_01: Just turn up and do the job, but even then, do it well, yeah.
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_01: It's not good enough, like just be better, but just do it the best you can.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_01: And then the second part I think is like the motivators.
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_01: Like, what is it that you want?
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_01: So if somebody comes to we work on a four-day week, if someone comes to my office and says, I see you go on work trips, you're a social bunch, you're uh working a four-day week, that really motivates me.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_01: Great! Like, if if I I wouldn't blame you wanting to work a four-day week instead of five, but own it, like be honest about it.
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_01: That's what I'm looking for in my career.
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but you can see it early.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, you know, I I anecdotally told a story early on about somebody who came to me and said, I want to be in financial services because it looks lucrative.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_01: Nobody's got an idea of how hard you work.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_01: I I certainly don't do a four-day week, put it that way, but the whole team do, like feed the family first and figure out yourself later on.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_01: But I quite I'm quite comfortable with that.
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_01: Like that, that that I'm happy with that.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_01: But for somebody to come into the industry and think I'm getting into it because it makes me money, then one, that ain't true.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_01: It isn't that lucrative.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_01: And two, you you just it's not a way to succeed and it's not something that motivates me.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_01: However, you could definitely run a really good financial service business that's driven by profit and still be a great financial advisor.
• 11:50
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not suggesting that doesn't exist, yeah.
• 11:52
  SPEAKER_01: I'm just saying the people we need around us need to have that same attitude as us because it's per like you're in it every day.
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_01: You've got to be working with people you enjoy.
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_01: I see, you know, my wife does work with me, but most people see their work colleagues more than they see the partner.
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_01: You want good people around you.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 12:09
  unknown: Yeah.
• 12:09
  SPEAKER_01: But you can't, I think you can spot it quickly.
• 12:11
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, touching on recruiting there, where where do you typically recruit from?
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_03: Obviously, you yourself come through a financial advice academy.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_03: Do you use that as a source of recruitment for yourself, or are you looking for more established advisors?
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_01: Uh any and all.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_01: Don't uh we don't necessarily look anywhere specifically, but we have found that about 80% of the team have all worked in hospitality at some point in their life.
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_01: Really?
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and now we kind of that's probably one thing that we would try and so I do careers talks uh with another lad in the office.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_01: We we go to the same school every year, and and we'd open that to any school that have us.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_01: I always try and encourage those, they're like 16, 17 year olds to say, get a job in a pub or a or a retail environment wherever you can, because you've got no controllers coming through the door, so you've got to be relatively quick thinking, depending on where you work.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_01: I worked at Toby Carberry, so we'd have all walks of life coming through.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_01: You might turn up to your shift and someone might not be there, so you've got to put a shift in, you've got a graft, it's typically long hours, so it just gives you a decent work ethic.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_01: And the people that come through, you know, there's all walks of life, so you've got to get to know how to engage and act with everyone.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_01: My mortgage administrator, Vic, when we put a job out, she messaged me because she worked at the same pub that I used to work at and went, I've got no idea about this, but I'd love to give it a go.
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, You're in.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_01: She's like, What?
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, You've got the job, doesn't matter.
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_01: Because she'd reached out and thought, I'm confident enough to have a go.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_01: I can teach her mortgages, I can't teach that attitude.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_01: So you're in.
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_01: Ad, uh, who's now my right-out man, I gave him some of the business, so he owns some of the business, was a qualified electrician.
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_01: He's a mate of mine, and he said, I just hate what I do.
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_01: But every time I see you and I ask you how your day's gone, you seem to be loving it.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_01: Can I come and have a look at your office?
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_01: He came in over Christmas week later, he packed up his van and he's now uh head power planner because you can educate him, but I can't give him the work ethic.
• 14:05
  SPEAKER_01: And and that's kind of been the way with all of them.
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_01: I've got two lads who are uh quite young lads.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_01: We we've kind of ingrained in them that so lift each other up, don't drag each other down, so they'll tell each other off, even though like they're in their 20s.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_01: It's brilliant.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_01: So it's yeah, I don't care.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_01: My current person does all my marketing work in an office administration job all her life.
• 14:23
  SPEAKER_01: She had no idea how to use Canva, no idea how to do marketing.
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_01: She's just learning.
• 14:28
  SPEAKER_01: And my bit I love is I'm seeing her grow as a person.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_01: Her bit she loves is she's been given the opportunity to grow as a person.
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_01: So it's a win-win for everyone.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_01: And then we just we uh again, that's not by design, it just so happens it's like how everything the dominoes are falling.
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_01: Alice, who also owns part of the business now with Adam, gave her a job.
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_01: She worked in admin in Shurik.
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_01: She came back to me and said, They've offered me more money, I think I'm gonna stay.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_01: And I picked up the phone to her on a Friday night and went, Whatever you do, I don't care if it's not come to me, do not stay in that job.
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_01: Because what they've just said to you is we can afford to pay you more.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_01: We've just never done it.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_01: But we've never done it.
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_01: And I said, and at some point you'll he you won't want to be there anyway, because you've already got half a foot out of the door.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_01: She came to us really nervous, went, Oh god, I'm gonna stay, I'm gonna come.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_01: She's come and work for us.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_01: She's now a shareholder, owns part of the business, leads all of my team, runs all the people, had to learn it, like completely upskilling her job.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_01: But like, how cool is that?
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_01: Like, it's amazing.
• 15:27
  SPEAKER_03: That's quite interesting there because you've got sounds like there's quite a few success stories of being able to bring people in from other industries, other professions into the industry.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_03: It's something we commonly hear it's a struggle to bring people into the industry.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_03: It's numbers of financial advisors are falling, or everyone's getting older.
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_03: Do you think there's something the industry could learn from the approach you're taking, or things the wider industry could do different to attract more advisors, but not just more advisors, more of the right kind of advisors?
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and the I think this is like goes back to that.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_01: How do you change?
• 16:06
  SPEAKER_01: Like, even if we're changing a really small part of it.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_01: From the outside world looking in, it is still, you know, like the the measure of like, oh, I'm cool and I'm a relaxed advisor, they don't wear a tie anymore.
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_01: So calm down, mate.
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_01: Like he a chap came to us when we're in Brunswick and he rang me up and said, Can I come in for a meeting?
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_01: I said, Yeah.
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_01: I said, but it is dressed down Friday, and he said, I've got to come because I'm moving to Spain.
• 16:31
  SPEAKER_01: I'm going out to Spain for three weeks, but I really need to see it.
• 16:33
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you can come in.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_01: He said, Oh, I might turn up a motorbike.
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_01: I said, Really apologise, but I'm in my casuals, it's a Friday, we don't have anyone in the office.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_01: And he said, I must be cut some kind of something head if I was taking my financial advice based on the clothes you wear.
• 16:47
  SPEAKER_01: And that sat with me and I thought, you know what?
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_01: Good point.
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_01: And I used to love wearing a suit, but I did it because the profession did it, not because I wanted to do it.
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_01: I quite like this.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_01: I turn up to work in this every day.
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_01: I genuinely own about 20 of these t-shirts because I'm so late.
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_01: I don't care what I look like, I just want to be comfortable.
• 17:06
  SPEAKER_01: If my clients are choosing me because I'm not wearing a suit, that's their hang up, not mine.
• 17:10
  SPEAKER_01: I'm still really good at my job.
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_01: Mark suspense's chinos and the£10 t-shirt.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_01: I said earlier in the last podcast, I'm a pretty simple guy.
• 17:18
  SPEAKER_02: Holiday and a beer.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, holiday and a beer.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_01: I don't need to spend all this money to look flash.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_01: If you don't, that doesn't make me credible because I've got smarter clothes or more expensive clothes.
• 17:27
  SPEAKER_02: I know that, I've seen your car.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, exactly.
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_01: But but but but that that comes back to the whole like until you until the whole industry looks different, you you are gonna alienate people.
• 17:37
  SPEAKER_01: I desperately want more women in our business, and I want it.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm I'm I can't hire on that basis because there's probably some HR rule that I don't understand.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_01: Liam's our head of HR.
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_01: Anyone who knows Liam, you're gonna understand.
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_01: Liam will know the rule.
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_01: Actually, Alice is our head of HR because I don't trust Liam with anything.
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_01: Not HR related, but I want it because they think differently.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_01: Like we this it's proven women and men think differently.
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_01: Um I want different opinions in the office.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_01: I want us to be the best rounded version we possibly can.
• 18:05
  SPEAKER_01: And it's really easy to find men who want to give financial advice a go.
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_01: It's not women, and that goes back to that, probably goes back to, and I'm stereotyping, but if I was a betting man, men are probably more comfortable taking risks, women aren't.
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_01: Women who are in career changes have probably got families and things that weigh more on their emotional decision to take a big leap of faith, whereas men probably feel a bit more free and easy to do it, so it there's a lot that's got to change, and I think that's the challenge, and I honestly don't know how to fix that one.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_01: Hopefully, we can do a little bit on it.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I've got somebody who we spoke to the other day who applied for a job.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_01: She sent us a video interview.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, You're in, don't care, don't we?
• 18:43
  SPEAKER_01: Don't need her a job.
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_01: I rang her up and said, I've got no job for you.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_01: What would you love to do if you could do anything?
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_01: She replied saying, I'd love to do something client-faced, and I was like, You'll definitely be our next academy person.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_01: Don't change your career, do everything you want to do, but you'll get a phone call off me one day and you'll make a decision whether you want to join us or not.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_01: And that will happen because she was fab.
• 19:02
  SPEAKER_01: And I've no idea how good she's at a job, but but her attitude's right, so I can train her on the job.
• 19:07
  SPEAKER_03: And then thinking more about as you've grown, how have you made sure that your clients feel they're getting the same standards which you've set, and that the rest of the team are delivering to the bar which you want to deliver to?
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_01: Uh we've got really good processes in place.
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_01: We've got really good measures in place to ensure that we all do the job in the same way.
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_01: So personality-wise, we do it differently.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_01: But whether you see me, you see Piers, Amelia, Liam, Steve, don't matter, you'll get the same welcome off the team, you'll get the same process to get booked into a meeting.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_01: We're using technology to to make it feel uh just standardized, but standardized so you do get a proper service.
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_01: We've made the office a nicer place to come for clients.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_01: Um as people again, I don't know how to answer it, but all of my team know what that what's expected, and I'm I'm either calm or like I'm a million miles an hour.
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_01: So if if it doesn't go if if if something slips, the guys don't want to deal, like they don't want to deal with me in that environment, and it's little stuff.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_01: But we had a conversation about why wouldn't we answer the phone to a client who's come to our door?
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_01: We've got a video phone, you've booked in like Dave, you've booked in for an 11 o'clock meeting, say, why wouldn't you answer the phone going, hi Dave?
• 20:34
  SPEAKER_01: Really good to see you coming up.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_01: We know you're coming in.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_01: Why would you answer the phone and go, hi uh buzz number one and come up to the top floor?
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_01: It's a tiny difference.
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_01: They know that will boil my blood.
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_01: But stuff that other people matter about that's not necessarily client surfacing, doesn't it so we've even taken the team out.
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_01: We did a day out where we took them to a spoons, a nice, slightly nicer place, and then we finished up with a really nice restaurant.
• 21:00
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, this is us guys, like the hospitality piece, like five-star service everywhere we go is what we should be doing.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_01: It's just ingrained in in them, and they still I think they just respect me enough that that's how we've always done it, so that's how we'll always do it.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_02: Like I said, delivery will be slightly different, won't it?
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_02: But if you've you've got to the point of wanting to standardize the expectation, your client, yeah, you you want your clients to say, as a client of Keyside, I know what I will get.
• 21:29
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, my advisor might vary, their styles and personalities will vary.
• 21:35
  SPEAKER_02: The advice they give me should vary because my circumstances are different.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_02: But I know I'll get that expectation.
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_02: I'll ring, they'll call me back, they'll reply to my emails.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_02: That's what your that sounds like.
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_01: That's what we're trying to do.
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and it's that like it sounds cold, but it's that process bit.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_02: It's yeah, and it and it's but process doesn't have to be cold.
• 21:51
  SPEAKER_02: No, yeah, it's not the words, that's what I mean.
• 21:53
  SPEAKER_01: The word does, but it's not, and it's it's little things like m probably 90% of our clients come to our office.
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_01: If you come to our Office and you you drop over an hour in a meeting, you'll get a knock on the door from the team, and it'll just be, Can I get any more drinks?
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_01: Can I get anything for you?
• 22:08
  SPEAKER_01: It it's normally the same people who make that knock, but the boys will do it if someone else is out, or if if Lucy's on the phone call, she'll nod one of the advisors, or I'll do it.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_01: Like it doesn't matter who it is, the client gets a service.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_01: So there's been plenty of times where I'm in the middle of something, there's no one available.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_01: I'll go knock on one of the doors when Liam's in a meeting.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_01: Can I get you guys some drinks?
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I'll have a cup of coffees.
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_01: I'll make them.
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_01: We're a team, so we work as a team all the time.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_01: I think that's luckily because we've grown from the ground up, that's just natural for us.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_01: We've just always done it that way.
• 22:42
  unknown: Yeah.
• 22:43
  SPEAKER_03: And that's I think something you is well publicised in advice businesses is especially founder-led businesses.
• 22:50
  SPEAKER_03: When the business grows and clients are passed off, there's often a dip in retention because that relationship with a person they've been used to for the last three, four, five years, however long it is, has gone.
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_03: Sounds like you probably haven't experienced that then with what you're talking about.
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_01: And but then again, from a commercial point of view, we haven't bought advisors in uh to deal with a problem we've purchased.
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_01: So in the industry, it's quite commonplace.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_01: You go and buy a financial advice practice where there's a retiring advisor, and then you find a junior advisor and you say go and service all those people.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah that commercially makes sense, that doesn't sit well with me emotionally, in the sense that as the delivery to the client or for the advisor, for the team both like well, everyone involved in that situation's getting a bit of a short end of the straw, there in my opinion.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_01: The exiting partner probably, or the exiting advisor, if they're still passionate about what they do, will absolutely care about every one of those people.
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 23:54
  SPEAKER_01: So they're gonna want to make sure they're being left in really good hands.
• 23:57
  SPEAKER_01: The purchasing firm not suggesting they've got bad intentions, uh trying to do something in regards to the the the economic of like build your business.
• 24:07
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, the new advisor is getting left uh with a whole client book where the trust is with somebody who probably looks and feels really different, age demographic, technology being used, how they were spoken to, how the meetings were held.
• 24:24
  SPEAKER_01: That client's getting like a wobble in every single area that they've never had from the the actual way the meeting's held to the relationship.
• 24:34
  SPEAKER_01: That's it just doesn't fit well.
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_01: So we've tried to be really clever about growing organically so that that's never had to change.
• 24:42
  SPEAKER_01: Now we have just done a business purchase, but we've been really clear with those clients of like how we're going to operate moving forward.
• 24:48
  SPEAKER_01: And if you if it's not for you, just don't make it for you because we think this is what it should look like.
• 24:55
  SPEAKER_01: If it doesn't suit you, no bad feeling, just go and find what you what go and find what you're used to.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_01: I I don't think that's that easy to do.
• 25:03
  SPEAKER_01: We we've we've just I'd I'd I'd stick to that way of doing stuff forever and a day if I can.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_01: We're good at keeping clients comfortable though.
• 25:12
  SPEAKER_01: So I think they've all had like they've had such a nice welcome to the firm.
• 25:15
  SPEAKER_01: They've had the the email from Lucy introducing them, then quickly Liam's been on the phone to them to say, I know you've spoken to Lucy, but let's get a meeting in.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_01: We've been out to see them all, we've asked them to come to the office, we've introduced ourselves properly.
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_01: We had one that had a bit of a wobble that I picked up the phone to and said, Look, we're really sorry we let you down on that.
• 25:31
  SPEAKER_01: I run the firm, that is not our standard.
• 25:33
  SPEAKER_01: You are a one-off, but you're right to complain, and we are going to put a process in place.
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_01: And we've always done that.
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_01: If a client says we've done something that we've unintentionally made a wobble on, we correct it and we go and tell the client that we've corrected it.
• 25:47
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so it's back to that personal care point.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_02: It's the expectation, it's the delivery, it's for them to feel.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I'll be gutted.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_02: You cared enough that it it was a problem, problems can be solved, but you cared enough to solve it.
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_02: And therefore, and we'll try and solve that.
• 26:04
  SPEAKER_02: That's what becomes like for you in the business.
• 26:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, but it's a pride thing.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_01: I'd be more gutted if a client left because we did something poorly or wrong than them leaving.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_01: Like, if someone rings me up and says I'm moving to Birmingham, I'd be like, Brilliant, give me a financial advisor, I'll give you all the detail, I'll have a chat with them, I'll get on the phone, let's hand everything over properly.
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_01: No issue.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_02: The move is right for you.
• 26:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
• 26:26
  SPEAKER_01: One of our clients moved over to a firm in Gloucester.
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_01: Uh husband was already there.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_01: Um, she was with us, they got married.
• 26:35
  SPEAKER_01: I said, You need to make a decision between the two, you've got to just join one firm.
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_01: This money's got to be spoken about it.
• 26:39
  SPEAKER_02: I guess back to your point before, isn't it?
• 26:41
  SPEAKER_02: I want to look at the whole money, so it's very difficult.
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_01: But it's really hard.
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_02: How do you manage that in a couple in that scenario?
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_01: So that firm called me up and went, right, what do you want to do?
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, Well, there's all the detail, off you go.
• 26:50
  SPEAKER_01: They're like, Well, is do you want any financial like uh compensation?
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_01: So, no, I've I'm I'm alright, I've we've looked after the client, she's a lovely lady, you're gonna have a great old time with it, off you go.
• 26:59
  SPEAKER_01: Like, life's too short to worry about that kind of stuff for me.
• 27:02
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, which you can't do with 100 clients, but yeah, just come on, like a bit of common sense in the industry.
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's not always there.
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_03: And you talk there that for the first time you've bought a business.
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_03: Um what was the thought process behind that and why why a change of strategy, I suppose.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_01: Um we could have done it years ago, but we weren't stable as a foundation as a business.
• 27:32
  SPEAKER_01: I feel really good about where we are.
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_01: I think we've always been really good, but there was a moment last year where I looked at the team and thought, you like know what you're doing.
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_01: Like this is mint.
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_01: I there's stuff that I'm never even getting involved with, and I don't you've changed stuff that I didn't even know we were going to change, but you've done it for the best.
• 27:49
  SPEAKER_01: And it's just yeah, that's all just going now.
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_01: Right people in the right seats in the right job.
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_01: And now that now that I'm there, I can go on my next mission, which is changing what financial advice should look like for people, and plugging them into it and saying, look, this is what great looks like, so we're going let's go and sweep up some firms.
• 28:07
  SPEAKER_01: Um, very quickly, when we put out the feelers to say we're looking to buy somewhere, we were approached to say, Do you want to have a look at us?
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_01: And the firm had no cash flow modeling, the clients weren't being seen in an office.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_01: They're not not suggesting there's anything wrong with the advice, it's going to different this is what we thought, this is what they had.
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_01: Because I'm so in belief of what we're doing is right, it was the dream.
• 28:31
  SPEAKER_01: Let's we've we've got all of these people that we can bring into what we think's right, that's our achievement.
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_01: The rest of it's don't matter to me, but that's the achievement we want to get out of it, and then coupled on top of that, Liam's been with me five years, Piers has been with me about three and a half years.
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_01: Um, we want to grow.
• 28:50
  SPEAKER_01: I don't really care too much about the future ownership of the business or sitting with me.
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_01: So a big part of what I'm trying to make sure is that Liam's future, Liam's boy's future, his partner's future is made, Piers' and his wife's future.
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_01: So over time, if I can grow the business and they can all take a cut of it, they're all you know benefit.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_01: Like it's we're all whatever day I come to retire, everyone who's helped me get there is going to get an absolute correct proportion of that check, like they should do, and and and that's what we're doing it for.
• 29:22
  SPEAKER_01: And and I think now I've got a belief that we can do enough that will generationally change some of those guys' lives from working in a pub, not knowing how to do the industry, to now being the person that is our specialist in mortgages, and she's amazing at it.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_01: Like, yeah, that's quite cool.
• 29:40
  SPEAKER_01: And if we can make that happen, I love it.
• 29:42
  SPEAKER_01: So that that was the other reason.
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_01: Like, it's hard to I needed something that I could pin Liam to.
• 29:47
  SPEAKER_01: So he runs my entire temporary office now, that's his.
• 29:50
  SPEAKER_01: Um, we're looking at setting up somewhere else, as I mentioned before.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_01: Good loosely.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_01: I know.
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I'd like to do the same for peers.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I'd like to make sure that Max and Ollie, our new guys coming in, can get their feet under the door, get a few years under it, and then maybe visualize that journey for them.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_01: And we're trying to build the mentoring system internally as well, where everyone benefits.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_01: There's a lot of stuff that we're doing just to keep this momentum we've got.
• 30:14
  SPEAKER_03: You've spoken a lot about offices and obviously just said that again, TepiOffice.
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_03: What you're not going to get him to break.
• 30:20
  SPEAKER_03: No, no, no.
• 30:21
  SPEAKER_03: I'm not trying to find out the next one.
• 30:23
  SPEAKER_03: And if he does, it'll be a good one.
• 30:25
  SPEAKER_03: It's another market time.
• 30:27
  SPEAKER_03: Um, what new challenges does that bring to you?
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_03: Because obviously you've been used to multi-advisors, but all one location to run.
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_03: Now you've got multiple locations to run.
• 30:38
  SPEAKER_01: What new challenges does that bring to you?
• 30:40
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not running them.
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_01: Trust in the fact that the other people are.
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_01: So And is that easy for you?
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it is now.
• 30:47
  SPEAKER_01: Like, um, we sat in the office, so Adam, me, Adam and Alice are uh uh the directors of the firm, Luce has now stepped into a bit more of an operational role.
• 30:56
  SPEAKER_01: She came in as an admin, and on her interview, we spoke about this the other day, she said to me, I've just realized my best skin is administration, so that's where I'm settling.
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna leave my job and come and do that for you.
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_01: She is way better than that.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_01: She just she just wasn't in the right work environment.
• 31:11
  SPEAKER_01: She's um like I we tell her, we have a rule in the office is if we ask you to do something, ask what's in it for me.
• 31:17
  SPEAKER_01: Because like that's what I would want my staff to do.
• 31:20
  SPEAKER_01: So if we say we're gonna move into this role, they should be going, well, where's my money?
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_01: Like, where's my pay?
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_01: Where's my time off?
• 31:24
  SPEAKER_01: Where's my if I'm doing this for the firm, what's my compensation for that?
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_01: Because that's how the world should work.
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_01: And I I am open to my team how good they are, because I don't care if they come and challenge me for a pay rise.
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_01: I think we pay fairly, and if we get it wrong, we'll we'll work on that, or move to a four-day week or give them the time off, whatever it is that motivates them, getting them their exams.
• 31:45
  SPEAKER_01: And the multi-office piece, I trust Liam to do all the right things by the client, maybe not wash and mug up, but I trust him to do all the other stuff.
• 31:55
  SPEAKER_01: Um I trust Ellis to have eyes on and just make sure that he's doing what he needs to do right in regards to just being responsive in the in the kind of forward-facing office role.
• 32:07
  SPEAKER_01: And I absolutely know internally from an operational side, the guys will keep them on railroads, they'll keep him on a great track.
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_01: They don't I an example the other day, if a client had emailed me and I was away for two days, and the email had been picked up responding with, dealt with, it was for a pension transfer because a lady had changed her job and she said, Oh, can you just have a look at this for me?
• 32:27
  SPEAKER_01: And we're like a third of the way through the process that wouldn't have never even started without me starting that process 18 months ago.
• 32:33
  SPEAKER_01: But the guys know what they're doing now.
• 32:36
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm really I am really, really confident with it, and that's why I'm kind of a bit fired up because I feel like we can get the snowball moving now and really take over and get get doing what we're doing well.
• 32:47
  SPEAKER_03: And it's it's quite nice to sit and listen to someone be positive about stuff for change.
• 32:52
  SPEAKER_03: We deal with a lot of firms who are struggling and we're going into almost firefight at times, and you talk so highly about your team, which is great.
• 33:02
  SPEAKER_03: How are you going to maintain that as you grow?
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_03: Because you're going to need more people, more good people.
• 33:08
  SPEAKER_03: Is that a worry for you that the people you've got now are so good that it might be hard to replicate this if you were to double or triple in size?
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_01: Uh I'll be naive not to say it's a concern from a cultural point of view, especially because of the things we do.
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_01: Like we have team days out, we have last year for a 10-year celebration, we said we go abroad, do like a little overseas conference.
• 33:31
  SPEAKER_01: And on that conference, we did some workshops.
• 33:33
  SPEAKER_01: And in one of the workshops, one of the boys said, when we said what's a measure of success look like, one of the lads said, Doing this every year.
• 33:39
  SPEAKER_01: So, like, right, let's see what see what we can do.
• 33:42
  SPEAKER_01: So when the four-day week came out, they said what success looks like ours is being efficient enough, we can do our job in four days.
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_01: That was in April.
• 33:50
  SPEAKER_01: By September, we were a four-day business, and by January we announced to them that we're going well, December, we announced we're going away again, and now I want to do it every year because it is what shapes our growth.
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_01: They are all trusted to give their opinion of the business.
• 34:03
  SPEAKER_01: That's everyone, your whole support staff, your advisors.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_01: Everybody comes.
• 34:08
  SPEAKER_01: 12 of us this year, 16 next, 20, 25, 30.
• 34:13
  SPEAKER_01: That's like it's not just hard to shape, it's like we sat on a table of 12.
• 34:17
  SPEAKER_01: Like there's 12 of us sat down, we're all within talking distance.
• 34:20
  SPEAKER_01: What happens when that's two tables of 12, and what are the two conversations that happen?
• 34:23
  SPEAKER_01: So there's a bit of we've got to get get our heads around that, but I I think we can do it.
• 34:27
  SPEAKER_01: I do, I do think we can keep it happening.
• 34:30
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then the second part of it's fire quickly.
• 34:33
  SPEAKER_01: Like I've I've what does your head of HR think about that?
• 34:38
  SPEAKER_01: Uh they're not overly happy with it.
• 34:42
  SPEAKER_01: So I have let go of four members of staff since we set the business up at the time when we were smaller, so quick turnover.
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, every one of them I'm still in contact with, every one of them is grateful of being let go of, and everyone understood why we made the decision.
• 35:01
  SPEAKER_01: Because the way we're we're all so passionate about the job, it's uncomfortable for them if they're not engaged in it.
• 35:06
  SPEAKER_01: So, so like it's a it's the right move to do, but five actually.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but not in touch with that one then.
• 35:14
  SPEAKER_01: No, we are.
• 35:15
  SPEAKER_01: Do you know what we're doing?
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_01: She's really she works in the state agency now, she's become really successful, she's just in the wrong job, and and her uh like I'll talk openly, her and Alice just butted heads, just wasn't the right relationship.
• 35:27
  SPEAKER_01: So we could never break that down because Alice was a manager and it was never gonna work.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_02: Um and it can be really difficult culturally, can't it, if you've got some of those challenges.
• 35:36
  SPEAKER_02: Like you said, you're talking about the culture of growth, and you're talking about building that trust in the team and having the faith that you can do those things, and it can be really difficult if you have it's not one person's fault, it but it can feel like that, can't it sometimes, but you can get to a situation where that one cog in the wheel is making a real friction, and and that's the whole like but they could just be in the wrong job and the wrong environment.
• 35:59
  SPEAKER_01: Like I watch her and I message her when I see her having like she works at the state agency.
• 36:03
  SPEAKER_01: I'll message her if she sells a decent, I'll be saying maze and like congratulations, keep going.
• 36:08
  SPEAKER_01: Like, they're always going to be an extension of the business because they helped us at some point in our careers.
• 36:12
  SPEAKER_02: You don't care about them and their direction, it's just probably more that I do for you.
• 36:16
  SPEAKER_01: And ironically, I think people stay in jobs where their boss knows their crap, they know their crap.
• 36:20
  SPEAKER_01: No one's happy, but no one's got the courage to actually just put their head above the parapet and go, This ain't working, is it?
• 36:26
  SPEAKER_01: Let's like what can we do to make your life better?
• 36:28
  SPEAKER_03: And it's probably felt more in a smaller organization.
• 36:31
  SPEAKER_03: If I look back to when we were running with someone else, a team of 150, when you have those clashes, you can just move pieces around the board a bit and play chess a little bit and manage them apart, can't you?
• 36:42
  SPEAKER_03: But when you've got the numbers you're talking about, you can't hide from it, can you?
• 36:46
  SPEAKER_01: No, it's gotta be right for everyone.
• 36:48
  SPEAKER_01: Like if you don't want to go where I'm trying to take the business, that's all right.
• 36:54
  SPEAKER_01: But I'm going that way.
• 36:55
  SPEAKER_01: Like that's where we're going, because it's you know, that's what I want to do.
• 36:58
  SPEAKER_01: Uh I don't think that I I just don't I probably haven't got the soft skills to understand why that's not the right thing to do, but I don't care enough.
• 37:07
  SPEAKER_01: Like, we're only here once, just do what you want to do and enjoy it.
• 37:09
  SPEAKER_01: But don't be in the way of everyone else who's trying, and and actually, our team are really trying to do something different and they get it.
• 37:15
  SPEAKER_01: So it's not fair to have a thorn in the side, like it's not fair for anyone.
• 37:19
  SPEAKER_03: And how how do you keep on top of what your advisors are actually doing with their clients?
• 37:27
  SPEAKER_03: Do you have a process for that?
• 37:29
  SPEAKER_03: Because obviously, you know what you want your culture to be, you know what you think good advice is, but you can't be in every client meeting.
• 37:36
  SPEAKER_03: So, what what gives you the reassurance that the advice team is where it needs to be?
• 37:42
  SPEAKER_01: Uh we talk a lot.
• 37:43
  SPEAKER_01: So we have 11 years I've been doing this.
• 37:47
  SPEAKER_01: Steve, probably 18, 19 years.
• 37:50
  SPEAKER_01: Um, Steve, who we we brought into the business and own for years, and he just got bored of being on his own and loved what we were doing culturally.
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then the rest, less than me.
• 37:59
  SPEAKER_01: We still share meetings, so we do actually still intently make sure every month there's crossovers of advice meetings, new meetings, presentation meetings, review meetings.
• 38:09
  SPEAKER_01: All the advisors do, because you can pick stuff up and you can learn.
• 38:13
  SPEAKER_01: We quite commonly will have conversations about advice that we're doing because I'm like a big believer of just speak out loud, sense check it.
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_01: And then at the top of the power planning uh gang is add.
• 38:24
  SPEAKER_01: Uh Adam does all of our just kind of oversees everything, but we also allow the phrase I used the other day in our team meeting, if and I think the team almost felt like it was slightly negative, but I said, You can't always we can't always be good, like we've got to just shine a light on some stuff that's not going perfectly well, and let's get better at it rather than hiding from it.
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_01: If you don't like something, I don't care age, demographic, whatever it is, you've got to be able to speak up about it.
• 38:51
  SPEAKER_01: So now they've always been like this, but I think we just needed just a bit of a reminder of it.
• 38:56
  SPEAKER_01: My youngest junior member staff who might have only been with me six months will come to me and go, I don't like the way you're doing that advice, and I think you need to just sense check X, Y, and Z.
• 39:05
  SPEAKER_01: And if I justify it, they're like, right, I get it now.
• 39:07
  SPEAKER_01: So they're not questioning whether we're right or wrong, they're just gonna understand.
• 39:12
  SPEAKER_01: And and they're they'll everyone will do that.
• 39:14
  SPEAKER_01: So across our office, there is no issue with us being called out and stuff, and that goes back to the kind of like, what's in it for me?
• 39:20
  SPEAKER_01: Is it my pride?
• 39:21
  SPEAKER_01: Am I doing the right thing?
• 39:23
  SPEAKER_01: One of my lads um last year missed a fun switch for a client, got to the next annual review, he'd realised he'd missed it.
• 39:32
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, we were about uh 1800 quid on the wrong side of it for the client.
• 39:36
  SPEAKER_01: Uh he came straight to me and said, I've spotted it, I've done it wrong.
• 39:39
  SPEAKER_01: What do I do?
• 39:40
  SPEAKER_01: I said, chill out.
• 39:41
  SPEAKER_01: I'll ring the client, rang the client, said, Look, we were 1800 quid on the wrong side of this.
• 39:45
  SPEAKER_01: We'll sort it out.
• 39:46
  SPEAKER_01: We paid out the client and made sure they were fine.
• 39:48
  SPEAKER_01: They did not care, they were just grateful that we pulled it up.
• 39:51
  SPEAKER_01: And what I didn't know, but in between all of his other work that he was doing, he went back and checked every single client, every single client that we were right.
• 39:58
  SPEAKER_01: He missed two others that he found.
• 40:01
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, we were on the right side of both of those.
• 40:03
  SPEAKER_01: We still rang the client and said, We didn't do your fun reswitch, you're not financially detrimented.
• 40:09
  SPEAKER_01: It is our fault.
• 40:10
  SPEAKER_01: This is what we've put in place to change it.
• 40:12
  SPEAKER_01: We won't make the same mistake again.
• 40:13
  SPEAKER_01: And we've now put really robust stuff to make that not change, but we should we think you should know.
• 40:17
  SPEAKER_01: And the client was like, I don't really care.
• 40:19
  SPEAKER_01: But it was a great lesson of like watching a 20, he would have been 21-year-old lads caring enough to go look and be confident enough to tell us, yeah.
• 40:27
  SPEAKER_01: Because you know, that goes wrong.
• 40:29
  SPEAKER_01: That goes wrong for five or six years, yeah.
• 40:31
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, or what you could have done is just switched it.
• 40:34
  SPEAKER_02: Because I'm not gonna remember every fun switch we've done for a client, or whether that was the one you've just talked about or one you should have done to our so it like they're they're really there.
• 40:42
  SPEAKER_01: We are in like that whole kind of cliche, but it's like it's a safe space, like do the right thing and nobody's gonna be bothered.
• 40:48
  SPEAKER_01: My only red rag to a bull is if you can't articulate why you made the decision.
• 40:53
  SPEAKER_01: So if you made a decision that's stupid, but you are stupid, and that that's how you came to that conclusion.
• 40:58
  SPEAKER_01: I'm alright with that.
• 40:59
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not alright when they haven't stupid, but I'm I'm not alright when they haven't even thought about it, if that makes sense.
• 41:04
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 41:04
  SPEAKER_01: We don't have any stupid people who work for us, but you at least think about what you're doing.
• 41:09
  SPEAKER_03: And then focusing on you for a bit, how has your role changed over the last 11 years in the business?
• 41:16
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so advising was my core job.
• 41:21
  SPEAKER_01: Even writing my own reports, booking my meetings, I was doing everything, so I was just a one-man business.
• 41:25
  SPEAKER_01: Quickly moved out of that because I hated the report writing, and it's not good use of an advisor's time, right?
• 41:30
  SPEAKER_01: If you're if you're if the advisor, why would you be sat in front of a desk typing stuff?
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_02: And it's probably not the bit you enjoy the most.
• 41:35
  SPEAKER_02: There's no passion from you writing down what you've just talked to the client.
• 41:39
  SPEAKER_03: Listening to you talk, the passion is clearly in the clients and the relationships.
• 41:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I can imagine a letter would take you four days to write because you have to and and also like, oh hello, I'm glad you had the holiday we've already spoken about.
• 41:50
  SPEAKER_01: Like the whole concept of half the reports we have to write out is nonsense, in my opinion, but that's an industry issue, and I'm we are hampered by that.
• 41:58
  SPEAKER_01: So I did I I went from doing it all to then handing over the bits that I didn't like, and then I probably had uh five or six years ago, me and Alice, we I like it was a bit of a joke, we're almost like siblings.
• 42:10
  SPEAKER_01: We'd get to the point in the office, like six or eight weeks in.
• 42:12
  SPEAKER_01: It's like we need to go for a beer, man, because we're gonna rip each other's head off.
• 42:15
  SPEAKER_01: We just butt it heads so badly, and then we go to the fountaining gloss to have a couple of beers, everything to calm down eight weeks later.
• 42:22
  SPEAKER_01: We'll be back again, and that was a realization of you need to know how people are as themselves to that that kind of personality trait.
• 42:31
  SPEAKER_01: We were just very different, but now we've really come to understand each other in that way.
• 42:35
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you probably need to start drinking, Dave.
• 42:40
  SPEAKER_01: You just need to drink more, and then I went back through the growth stage, so then it's like the hiring, the firing, the making sure people are right.
• 42:48
  SPEAKER_01: I kept hold of that role uh because of like the pride of the business and the I'm wanting to protect the team, yeah.
• 42:54
  SPEAKER_01: Protect everything, yeah, exactly.
• 42:56
  SPEAKER_01: And now, in the last 18 months, I've just had a like a realisation that they've they've been doing it already, like they're they're they're brilliant at what they do, and I completely trust them.
• 43:07
  SPEAKER_01: They still need a bit of a rocket to keep up at the pace that I like moving, but they're not doing anything wrong.
• 43:12
  SPEAKER_02: It's just doing a good job but slower than you'd like.
• 43:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 43:16
  SPEAKER_01: I we when we moved into our office, when we moved into Pillar and Lucy, um Addie and I were putting all the you know, we Tet Brie, we were painting it.
• 43:24
  SPEAKER_01: One of the new skills I've learned is how to paint the extra of the building.
• 43:27
  SPEAKER_01: Like we did all the decorating ourselves because we're still a small business.
• 43:30
  SPEAKER_01: When we moved into Pillar and Lucy, me and Liam, me and Adam were putting up the desks, and Alice turned up, she was on maternity at the time with four bottles of corona.
• 43:38
  SPEAKER_01: And um we cheersed them, sipped them, she walked off, she came back, she brought us another four.
• 43:43
  SPEAKER_01: And on the second bottle of beer, we'd finished putting the desk up, cheers them.
• 43:46
  SPEAKER_01: I said, What are we doing next?
• 43:48
  SPEAKER_01: And her face and the words that came out of her mouth next, basically saying, Can we just stop for a minute?
• 43:54
  SPEAKER_01: said it all, but I can't.
• 43:55
  SPEAKER_01: It's just not in my nature.
• 43:58
  SPEAKER_01: They're coming closer to my way of thinking.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm coming back close to theirs.
• 44:01
  SPEAKER_01: So huge changes, but right now I feel like we're we are a proper business.
• 44:09
  SPEAKER_01: And what I mean by that is right seats, right people in the right seats doing the right job for the client.
• 44:15
  SPEAKER_02: Have you stopped interviewing jobs?
• 44:18
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 44:19
  SPEAKER_02: Do you still do the interviewing?
• 44:20
  SPEAKER_01: Um depending on the role.
• 44:23
  SPEAKER_01: Right, okay.
• 44:23
  SPEAKER_01: So it's my the culture is always going to be driven by me.
• 44:29
  SPEAKER_01: Like that's always going to be the way.
• 44:30
  SPEAKER_01: So there's there's got to be a point where I understand who we're bringing in.
• 44:33
  SPEAKER_01: It'd be definitely for the team.
• 44:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 44:35
  SPEAKER_01: So first interviews, no, I'm alright with the guys, they know what we're trying to do.
• 44:39
  SPEAKER_01: If if they're saying I think we're going to take this person on, I'm I'm checking.
• 44:43
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 44:44
  SPEAKER_01: Definitely.
• 44:45
  SPEAKER_01: Advisors, I'm always going to interview that role.
• 44:49
  SPEAKER_01: That's the most forward-facing role there is.
• 44:51
  SPEAKER_02: And you want them to deliver your passion and care for that client's end goals.
• 44:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 44:58
  SPEAKER_01: And we just interviewed a woman this week.
• 45:01
  SPEAKER_01: Lovely, lovely lady.
• 45:02
  SPEAKER_01: Career change.
• 45:05
  SPEAKER_01: But when I got off the call, she didn't, she she didn't quite she was quite open to say she didn't really understand the BD part and didn't understand how to do the business development part, and she was quite nervous about it.
• 45:18
  SPEAKER_01: And ultimately, we're not in a place where I can train that.
• 45:20
  SPEAKER_01: Like where we are in the business right now, not that we wouldn't be in a different time, but right now I'm the wrong person for her.
• 45:26
  SPEAKER_01: So I could have gone greedy and gone, you know what, you've got all the attributes, I'll just let you flounder, but we'll keep your head above water long enough.
• 45:31
  SPEAKER_01: Or I can be honest and go, so shame, but but we're not in the right seat.
• 45:35
  SPEAKER_01: So I can make that judgment call.
• 45:36
  SPEAKER_01: Some of the other advisors might not be able to make it.
• 45:38
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 45:40
  SPEAKER_03: And if the business goes where you want it to over the next five, ten years, do you see that your role as an advisor maybe stopping and just running the business, or do you always want to keep anchored in the world?
• 45:51
  SPEAKER_01: I'm definitely keeping clients.
• 45:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 45:53
  SPEAKER_01: I'm I'm trying to shape it up that right people in the right seats, that that phrase again.
• 45:58
  SPEAKER_01: But I want to keep hold of uh I always want a core base of clients, but there's some that I've got now that there's too much good stuff that I know we're gonna get to.
• 46:09
  SPEAKER_01: I've got a bit, yeah, yeah.
• 46:10
  SPEAKER_01: I've got to be like I'd be I'd be gutted if I missed it.
• 46:12
  SPEAKER_01: And that is genuinely like clients who are talking about exiting for 20 million quid who are my age running amazing businesses, but it's also clients who are in their 70s and 80s that are still enjoying a bit of retirement.
• 46:26
  SPEAKER_01: I just love the the stories and the the generational extreme holiday that you said that they travelled in the right class, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 46:32
  SPEAKER_02: As they got to the point of feeling they could, yeah.
• 46:34
  SPEAKER_01: So it's not the money piece, it's the the exciting journey piece.
• 46:38
  SPEAKER_01: Like I love it.
• 46:39
  SPEAKER_01: And and there's some that I'm now passing over to for Ollie and Peers to look after that have been decided by personality, like which personality fits better.
• 46:50
  SPEAKER_01: Don't even I I can't, I wouldn't even know the numbers in regards to how much wealth we're managing for these people.
• 46:56
  SPEAKER_01: There they're still got exciting things that are going on, and some I'm gutted, absolutely gutted to be getting rid of.
• 47:02
  SPEAKER_01: In fact, all of them I've got to be getting rid of, but some that are really it's such a difficult decision, but I've got to make it.
• 47:08
  SPEAKER_01: We for me to help my team to be the best it can be, for me to help our clients get the best experience, all of them, not just my clients.
• 47:16
  SPEAKER_01: I need all the advisors to get that.
• 47:18
  SPEAKER_01: I need to still have a bit of a conductor stick and get things going to some extent.
• 47:22
  SPEAKER_01: But I'm never gonna not do the client-facing stuff.
• 47:25
  SPEAKER_03: Um if we were able to fast forward five years, where would you like everything to be?
• 47:32
  SPEAKER_01: I would love for pretty much anyone to think if I need financial advice, I should be using key sides.
• 47:40
  SPEAKER_01: And if you're not, you're an idiot.
• 47:44
  SPEAKER_02: Were you allowed to put that in your mission statement?
• 47:46
  SPEAKER_01: I wasn't allowed to put it.
• 47:47
  SPEAKER_01: But what just because it's so easy to say, but I know what we're doing.
• 47:52
  SPEAKER_01: I know there's loads of firms who are as good as us.
• 47:54
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not suggesting we're by the best.
• 47:56
  SPEAKER_01: I'm just saying, I also know there's loads that aren't doing it the way we're doing it.
• 48:03
  SPEAKER_01: The win for me would be when someone goes, I do know this is really bothering me, and it's something financially related.
• 48:10
  SPEAKER_01: Somebody in Gloucestershire goes, Go and have a chat with the guys at Keyside to see what they think.
• 48:14
  SPEAKER_01: Just that.
• 48:15
  SPEAKER_01: Just open the door and have a chat with us.
• 48:17
  SPEAKER_01: I'll be made up if you know, if you're in a room and you hear somebody else mutter our name, and I'm thinking, yes, that's nice, that's cool.
• 48:23
  SPEAKER_01: And and and that's what I want.
• 48:25
  SPEAKER_01: Not for me.
• 48:26
  SPEAKER_01: Um like I say, I'm not even really taking on many more clients.
• 48:29
  SPEAKER_01: I'm trying to make sure that the as the business grows, ultimately, we're a business, right?
• 48:33
  SPEAKER_01: We've got to make profit.
• 48:34
  SPEAKER_01: I'm trying to make sure that profit is distributed across a whole team so that they are all have skin in the game to to build it.
• 48:40
  SPEAKER_01: For example, the tech Brie, we've decided that um there's a I'm quite open about this, there's a proportion of the uh when clients are clients, they pay ongoing fees.
• 48:51
  SPEAKER_01: Um, the business is getting none of those ongoing fees in year one.
• 48:55
  SPEAKER_01: We are distributing the entire hundred percent of the ongoing fees from what we take on to what we grow to.
• 49:01
  SPEAKER_01: So what can we maintain?
• 49:02
  SPEAKER_01: So not the whole fees, obviously the the bit in between, is getting distributed to all our sports staff.
• 49:07
  SPEAKER_01: Because we want them to enjoy the experience of I'm gonna make those clients feel welcome, I'm gonna get them to enjoy it, I'm gonna spot opportunities where their advice can be better than it is to where it will be.
• 49:18
  SPEAKER_01: And that's the what's in it for me piece.
• 49:20
  SPEAKER_01: So we're always trying to grow where all of our clients benefit, and our clients will benefit if the team are happy because the team will be better at doing a better job, and that better job is therefore provided back out to the clients.
• 49:33
  SPEAKER_03: And do you think those next five years will include more business purchases?
• 49:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 49:40
  SPEAKER_01: Either purchases or like I I what did I say earlier on?
• 49:43
  SPEAKER_01: I it was a relatively aggressive like takeover, but um, yeah, my mission is to make sure that if you're getting financial advice, it's at the top of the game, and I genuinely believe we're doing it.
• 49:56
  SPEAKER_01: We're not gonna achieve what we do by osmosis, like we're gonna have to do some acquisitions, and the industry's aging quickly, so there's a prime opportunity whereby those who are getting tired and running out of steam, they've done all their work and they should be rewarded for all the stuff that they've done because they've played their part in this industry, the industry's changed, but what they did was just as good in a different space.
• 50:21
  SPEAKER_01: Um let us be the next chapter that go for it.
• 50:24
  SPEAKER_01: And if I can build a strong enough foundation, that means that Liam, Oli, Max and Amelia can be the next foundation, and then if they get it right and they follow what I've tried to set off, there'll be another load, and they'll be the and that's kind of yeah, where we're heading for.
• 50:37
  SPEAKER_01: But there's bound to be some acquisition in there, I think.
• 50:40
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 50:41
  SPEAKER_03: I suppose the whole MA mergers, acquisition, purchases is such a big thing in the industry at the moment, but everybody, especially in the IFA space, it seems to be very much a margin game economies of scale.
• 50:56
  SPEAKER_03: That doesn't sound what you're looking for.
• 50:59
  SPEAKER_03: No.
• 51:00
  SPEAKER_01: I I don't I like them now.
• 51:02
  SPEAKER_02: I was about you're about to say, I don't care.
• 51:06
  SPEAKER_02: I was so close on your so I got asked because you do care, but you care, it seems like you care about some different elements.
• 51:13
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, which is what I'm saying.
• 51:14
  SPEAKER_02: I absolutely care.
• 51:15
  SPEAKER_01: I absolutely care what we're trying to do.
• 51:17
  SPEAKER_01: It's what you're just doing.
• 51:20
  SPEAKER_01: Our accountant came and saw us and told us what our our net profit margin was.
• 51:24
  SPEAKER_01: And he said, Oh, you've been pretty good at kind of and it's unusual for when businesses grow that you can keep that net margin the same.
• 51:30
  SPEAKER_01: He was so he was like, I love it, like it's great.
• 51:33
  SPEAKER_01: I'm thinking, mate.
• 51:35
  SPEAKER_01: It's just important to him.
• 51:37
  SPEAKER_01: But what I do love, and I absolutely do love this, is we are doing it and we're staying efficient and we're doing it right because I've got pride in running a really good business.
• 51:47
  SPEAKER_01: The output I don't care about.
• 51:48
  SPEAKER_01: I don't care if it means we get more money or not.
• 51:50
  SPEAKER_01: I care about the fact that if we're doing something well, every part of it, whether it's marketing, whether it's how you operate the business, whether it's using the right tech, whether it's making sure the client's got a nice coffee mug to drink out of, to the tiniest little detail, I've got loads of pride in getting all that right.
• 52:04
  SPEAKER_01: So we probably will become a better business and more lucrative and all that as a byproduct of why we're doing it.
• 52:09
  SPEAKER_01: We're not doing it the other way around.
• 52:12
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I got asked once why I'm doing what I do, and I said, You're gonna hate the answer because they were trying to kind of find my motivate, you know, all that kind of I again.
• 52:22
  SPEAKER_01: I'm just about to speak out to HR is about to give you a call.
• 52:26
  SPEAKER_01: I know it's important, I know it's important to some people, but I'm pretty good at motivating myself, so I don't need I don't need somebody to look into my mind and give me all these lovely reasons for what's motivating me.
• 52:35
  SPEAKER_01: I'm all right, like I'll just get up and get on with it.
• 52:37
  SPEAKER_01: My answer was I'll just do it for the crack.
• 52:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and that then sounds like if you're a client, well, I hope he cares more than that.
• 52:44
  SPEAKER_01: I don't mean that I don't care, yeah.
• 52:47
  SPEAKER_01: I just don't need to care about some of those other people.
• 52:50
  SPEAKER_01: I'll give them they're gonna get the best of me no matter what.
• 52:52
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not trying to give them the best of me, I can't help it.
• 52:56
  SPEAKER_01: It drives people around me possibly, I'm all in anyway.
• 52:59
  SPEAKER_01: So it drives them mad that they're like, can we not just calm down a bit?
• 53:02
  SPEAKER_01: Like Riley said to me in the office, you know, if we dropped about half the stuff we could do, clients would still get an amazing service and more profitable.
• 53:09
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, Yeah, that's not the point, though, is it?
• 53:11
  SPEAKER_01: It's not.
• 53:12
  SPEAKER_01: Like I think what we do is important, and I'm and yeah, all in.
• 53:16
  SPEAKER_03: And I think that's so refreshing because you look at, especially in the wider industry, all of this acquisition activity going on, and the client is almost lost in all of it.
• 53:26
  SPEAKER_03: It is a margin play, it is economies of scale.
• 53:30
  SPEAKER_03: Their client becomes one of many, one-to-one relationships disappear out the wind.
• 53:35
  SPEAKER_03: To actually hear someone who's trying to grow a business and not do it in that way, and actually is still keeping the client experience and that local personal feel to it is actually quite refreshing.
• 53:47
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know what yeah.
• 53:48
  SPEAKER_02: I think it's it's I don't think unusual.
• 53:52
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know, it's difficult because you you you talk to lots of advisors, lots of good practices.
• 53:56
  SPEAKER_02: You've touched on it.
• 53:56
  SPEAKER_02: There are a lot of great businesses that give creation.
• 53:59
  SPEAKER_03: Oh yeah, that's not that's not to say everybody doing that.
• 54:02
  SPEAKER_03: I think it's but some of the more private equity-based ones, it is it becomes more of a shareholder.
• 54:07
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, I definitely think it's interesting and and refreshing to hear the my focus is running a great business that I have that pride in, that my team feel that way, my clients feel that way.
• 54:17
  SPEAKER_02: What I deliver is higher up my list than what I make.
• 54:21
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
• 54:21
  SPEAKER_01: Oh yeah, I think it's natural, it just comes, doesn't it?
• 54:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think that's probably quite it's not that other people don't feel that way, but I don't think you hear a lot of people talking about it.
• 54:31
  SPEAKER_02: Because maybe, like you said, industry-wise, you feel like you've got to wear a suit because you always wore a suit and you're saying, I don't want to.
• 54:37
  SPEAKER_02: And maybe industry-wise, there is a lot of we feel like I'll talk about how good my business is doing.
• 54:42
  SPEAKER_02: But actually, maybe the more important thing is how good do my clients feel about what I'm delivering, and it's it's that bit which is so small but yet so important, I think.
• 54:54
  SPEAKER_01: And I think and and like I'll take that back to my days at Toby Carrie.
• 54:59
  SPEAKER_01: I used to work at the carry when I was like 16 years old, and one of the things we used to do is Yorkshire pudding, yeah.
• 55:06
  SPEAKER_01: Toby Carrie, like and obviously you can't promote them, there's another place you get Sunday lunch away.
• 55:10
  SPEAKER_01: Um I wouldn't bother, just go to the car.
• 55:13
  SPEAKER_01: All the fancy anyway, love those guys as well.
• 55:15
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but one of the things you used to go and so we used to earn cash tips or 16 years old.
• 55:20
  SPEAKER_01: Cash tips decent at 16 years old, and they were pretty good in the carvery because the meal, two meals and two soft drinks was£12.90.
• 55:28
  SPEAKER_01: So people had changed, so£15 million cash.
• 55:30
  SPEAKER_01: So do a decent job.
• 55:32
  SPEAKER_01: £15 quid, they're just walking off, they've left Happy.
• 55:34
  SPEAKER_01: Did you know this?
• 55:34
  SPEAKER_01: This is a really interesting fact.
• 55:35
  SPEAKER_01: If you put a smiley face on a bill, um, they've done like studies to show that you get more tips than if you just leave the bill blank.
• 55:42
  SPEAKER_01: Anyway, I was always into business.
• 55:43
  SPEAKER_02: How many are you drawing on your suitability loads?
• 55:47
  SPEAKER_01: Well done.
• 55:47
  SPEAKER_01: Um but one of my bosses at the time overhired, so he always had more staff than he needed.
• 55:52
  SPEAKER_01: And I remember he got threatened with getting the sack and he said, guys, uh like we're on a bit of thinking, but the new manager comes in, do not let them reduce the numbers on these shifts.
• 56:00
  SPEAKER_01: And he turned the business from doing X amount of week to like a phenomenal number.
• 56:04
  SPEAKER_01: He it was unbelievable because when you came in, you weren't waiting 20 minutes for a table, you were sat down, like there was loads of it about, it was brilliant.
• 56:12
  SPEAKER_01: But at the beginning, he was running overhead on costs and under on what he was doing.
• 56:16
  SPEAKER_01: And then he taught us this thing where he said, Right, I need you to up your sales.
• 56:19
  SPEAKER_01: When you go to a table at the end of the meal, clear the plates away.
• 56:22
  SPEAKER_01: He didn't say that, sorry.
• 56:23
  SPEAKER_01: I'll rechange it.
• 56:24
  SPEAKER_01: He said, Clear the plates away.
• 56:25
  SPEAKER_01: And when you go back, instead of just giving them a menu, tell them what you'd have.
• 56:30
  SPEAKER_01: So don't ask them if they want to put in menu, give them one, and then tell them what you'd have.
• 56:34
  SPEAKER_01: So you'd walk over to the table and go, Do you know what?
• 56:37
  SPEAKER_01: If it were me, I'd bet you're absolutely stuffed.
• 56:39
  SPEAKER_01: But chocolate brownie is mint, you should definitely try it.
• 56:42
  SPEAKER_01: Just that one little thing.
• 56:44
  SPEAKER_01: And lo and behold, 50% of people would probably go, Yeah, go on then, I'll have one.
• 56:50
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, exactly.
• 56:51
  SPEAKER_01: But you're off.
• 56:52
  SPEAKER_01: But the point actually.
• 56:55
  SPEAKER_01: And this is why I say I said it wrong.
• 56:57
  SPEAKER_01: What he actually explained to us was I want people to have an amazing experience so they tell other people to come because that's what will make the business busier.
• 57:02
  SPEAKER_01: That's what give you guys more hours, which will increase your tips.
• 57:06
  SPEAKER_01: By default, we were also making more money, but he didn't position it as like this is a made to make more money.
• 57:12
  SPEAKER_01: Give a better experience, and everything else follows.
• 57:15
  SPEAKER_01: Because also, as a client, as a customer of the carvery, you'd come in, you'd actually have like a 16-year-old, 17-year-old lad or woman going, This is great.
• 57:22
  SPEAKER_01: They've asked me how my meal was, they've asked me if I want another drink, they've they've recommended a pudding.
• 57:27
  SPEAKER_01: You don't even get that in a decent restaurant nowadays.
• 57:29
  SPEAKER_01: We were doing that when you're paying five pounds for a Yorkshire's pudding of me.
• 57:32
  SPEAKER_01: Like it is none of this is rocket science, and I that's why I think there are loads of good businesses doing it.
• 57:38
  SPEAKER_01: I just think people lose their way through fear of like, am I gonna pay the bills and all the rest of it?
• 57:44
  SPEAKER_01: Actually, just chill out a little bit, get your happy place and stay there.
• 57:49
  SPEAKER_01: No, I'm still in cattle class when I fly to Vegas, but I'm alright.
• 57:53
  SPEAKER_01: You're going to Vegas, I'm going to Vegas every year, not with client funds.
• 57:59
  SPEAKER_03: Amazing.
• 58:00
  SPEAKER_03: Um, so to wrap up again, we'll do some quick fire questions, like we did before last time you were here.
• 58:07
  SPEAKER_03: What has been your best business decision since starting the business?
• 58:12
  SPEAKER_01: Taking on an office, definitely.
• 58:14
  SPEAKER_01: Just just because it made me feel prouder about having something that I had to arrive to and make it an environment that clients could come to.
• 58:24
  SPEAKER_03: And what's been your worst?
• 58:27
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, quick fire questions.
• 58:28
  SPEAKER_01: What's been my worst firing quickly?
• 58:32
  SPEAKER_01: That's been his best.
• 58:34
  SPEAKER_01: That um I don't know.
• 58:39
  SPEAKER_01: I I there's nothing I regret doing.
• 58:41
  SPEAKER_01: Not at all.
• 58:42
  SPEAKER_01: Um we could have definitely done things better because like that's just the nature of business, but there's nothing I regret really.
• 58:49
  SPEAKER_01: I don't I don't think I've made any I think I have.
• 58:52
  SPEAKER_01: I honestly don't think there's anything that I'm bothered about.
• 58:54
  SPEAKER_01: Because you own like I'll just own it.
• 58:56
  SPEAKER_01: Like if I mess something up, it's tough, isn't it?
• 59:01
  SPEAKER_01: I'm sure I've probably paid for like some stupid magazine that I think ten years on.
• 59:05
  SPEAKER_01: You're like, why did I just do that?
• 59:07
  SPEAKER_01: That could have been a team day out or something, but nothing really.
• 59:11
  SPEAKER_03: It's that uh the one we always joke about, the five-year phone contract for the business one of the businesses uh we've worked with in the past.
• 59:20
  SPEAKER_03: Uh what is more important for growth?
• 59:24
  SPEAKER_03: People, process, or what you're selling?
• 59:30
  SPEAKER_01: Process first and then people.
• 59:33
  SPEAKER_01: So process because if the foundations are wrong, don't matter how good the people are, someone's gonna get frustrated with not being able to work with it.
• 59:39
  SPEAKER_01: If everyone knows what they're doing, you know, if everyone knows what the goal is, you can put all the people in in uh on top of it, but definitely, and I learned that the hard way.
• 59:47
  SPEAKER_01: We had no processes, I was chaotic, and then Andrina was like, This ain't happening, yeah.
• 59:53
  SPEAKER_01: This sorted out, we did get it sorted out, and now and then we we then we stuck with it, and now, like I say, Lucy ah, unbelievable, and she is she's her words were I'm gonna admin, she she's a liar, she's great at processing stuff, and she brought us all up to speed.
• 1:00:11
  SPEAKER_01: And and like we've all learned stuff like Ellis, who was meant to be managing that department, realized actually Lucy's the one that can implement it better.
• 1:00:17
  SPEAKER_01: I still I can still manage, but Lucy's actually a better so the people bit's important, but having the processes to build upon is a no-brainer, in my opinion.
• 1:00:26
  SPEAKER_03: Is it harder to recruit for technical ability or cultural fit?
• 1:00:31
  SPEAKER_01: Cultural.
• 1:00:32
  SPEAKER_03: And for advisors who want to grow their firm, what is one thing you would encourage them to think about earlier?
• 1:00:40
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, don't try and keep up with the Joneses, live within your finances.
• 1:00:44
  SPEAKER_01: I I think the biggest problem is people slip into the I've never earned this kind of money, and then they're earned, and then and then that takes away the ability to reinvest.
• 1:00:53
  SPEAKER_01: So, again, I'm really open about this.
• 1:00:55
  SPEAKER_01: Until about, I reckon, five years ago, I definitely was not the highest paid person in my business.
• 1:01:02
  SPEAKER_01: Other people were earning more than me.
• 1:01:03
  SPEAKER_01: I was not taking money out.
• 1:01:04
  SPEAKER_01: I I was in reinvesting in myself and reinvesting the company, but I wasn't living off it, and I now have never changed.
• 1:01:09
  SPEAKER_01: I'm quite comfortable where I am.
• 1:01:10
  SPEAKER_01: So I think if you don't get carried away in your early years, you know, if you have a couple of bumpy years and you start spending that money, you know, the new car comes, you've got fancy stuff.
• 1:01:19
  SPEAKER_01: How do you ever get away from that?
• 1:01:21
  SPEAKER_01: If you keep reinvesting, you actually know your benchmark.
• 1:01:23
  SPEAKER_01: So we could have a really tough year.
• 1:01:26
  SPEAKER_01: I'm alright, the team will be alright, the business will be alright, the staff will be alright, the clients won't be wobbled.
• 1:01:31
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's really important because if if we were living on this like threshold of profit, we're risking everyone's or the clients as well.
• 1:01:39
  SPEAKER_01: Do you know what I mean?
• 1:01:39
  SPEAKER_01: If the business goes bust, we we don't we don't have to do that much to keep our item of water anymore because we've built something that that works in regards to the numbers we've done.
• 1:01:49
  SPEAKER_03: Brilliant.
• 1:01:50
  SPEAKER_03: Anything else from you, Dave?
• 1:01:52
  SPEAKER_03: No, thank you.
• 1:01:53
  unknown: Thank you.
• 1:01:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I think good.
• 1:01:54
  SPEAKER_01: I enjoyed it.
• 1:01:54
  SPEAKER_02: Really good, really good to uh have some different perspectives, and sometimes in the industry it can be quite a slog and some negativity, and it's nice and refreshing to talk about some different aspects.
• 1:02:06
  SPEAKER_01: I don't get me wrong, I think we say this sort of time, it ain't easy.
• 1:02:09
  SPEAKER_01: No, like you don't see we I said it in the last podcast about the swan thing.
• 1:02:13
  SPEAKER_01: It's not easy, but it's easier when you enjoy it.
• 1:02:18
  SPEAKER_01: And I love it.
• 1:02:19
  SPEAKER_02: Brilliant.
• 1:02:20
  SPEAKER_02: Keep on loving it.
• 1:02:22
  SPEAKER_03: Well, thank you both for today and Alex for coming back a second time, and we will see everyone else again soon.
• 1:02:28
  SPEAKER_03: Cheers, guys.
• 1:02:29
  SPEAKER_03: Bye.