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What I've Learnt - Layne Beachley · WHAT I'VE LEARNT

0:01
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1:02
SPEAKER_00: Meanwhile, we have a sporting legend that we're about to feature on the podcast, and I'm super excited.
1:11
SPEAKER_00: Lock up Laney's surfboard.
1:13
SPEAKER_00: It's a distraction from her studies.
1:15
SPEAKER_00: It'll amount to nothing.
1:17
SPEAKER_00: Well, that's what her school report card said.
1:20
SPEAKER_00: The eight-time surfing world champion reflects on a device she didn't take.
1:25
SPEAKER_00: Widely regarded as one of the most successful surfers in history, Lane Beachley, the only surfer male or female to claim six consecutive world titles.
1:35
SPEAKER_00: She is a champion of surfing, giving back, growth, authenticity, and well-being.
1:41
SPEAKER_00: The legendary Australian surfer has carved a stellar surfing career.
1:45
SPEAKER_00: Well, now she's helping others find their mojo with her Awake Academy, focusing on teaching them how to find their passion, carve their path, and paddle their own canoe.
1:56
SPEAKER_00: While acknowledging how the pandemic has had a devastating impact on the lives of many, Lane did say that she's been able to see the silver lining.
2:04
SPEAKER_00: Well, COVID's been a tough time for a lot of people, she says, but it's been an absolute blessing for me and allowed me to reset.
2:10
SPEAKER_00: Before March, we were all gung-ho, and we never really considered stopping to reflect on the quality of our lives, the nature of our relationships, and the quality of our health and well-being.
2:21
SPEAKER_00: Well, one of the strongest high-profile couples, Lane Beachley, calls husband Kirk Ben Gilly of in Excess Fame, the love of my life, and values connection, reflection, and recalibration above all.
2:33
SPEAKER_00: Well, Laney joins me on the What I've Learnt podcast to discuss her winning mindset, how disappointments can be your greatest lesson, and to ignore those who tell you it's impossible.
2:45
SPEAKER_00: Her mantra, tell 'em, just watch me.
2:50
unknown: Go make some noise, but I am.
2:52
SPEAKER_00: So, Lane Beachley, welcome to the What I've Learnt podcast.
2:55
SPEAKER_00: I'm so thrilled to have you here.
2:58
SPEAKER_01: Thanks, Deb.
2:59
SPEAKER_01: It's great to be here with you.
3:00
SPEAKER_00: Now, there's so much to unpack here, but I'd like to start.
3:04
SPEAKER_00: There's so much.
3:05
SPEAKER_00: You and I could just go on.
3:07
SPEAKER_00: But I have a lot of baggage.
3:09
SPEAKER_00: Don't we all, don't we all?
3:11
SPEAKER_00: Trust me.
3:12
SPEAKER_00: That's the interesting part of our lives.
3:14
SPEAKER_00: That's true.
3:15
SPEAKER_00: Let's let's start about, you know, you write about winning four world titles in a state of total fear and also in a state of love.
3:23
SPEAKER_00: Well, I'm intrigued.
3:24
SPEAKER_00: You talk about this great dichotomy, and I'm like, this, oh, I like this person.
3:29
SPEAKER_00: I like this.
3:31
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so the premise is that I'm a seven times world champion.
3:35
SPEAKER_01: I'm the only athlete in the world to have won six consecutive world titles, but five of them were won in a state of fear, and only two of them are one in a state of love.
3:42
SPEAKER_01: And those two were my book-ended world titles, so numbers one and number seven.
3:47
SPEAKER_01: And the world titles that I won out of fear were essentially the best way to explain the difference is that I was coming from a place of fear when I was totally focused on nothing but outcome.
4:01
SPEAKER_01: So I was very extrinsically motivated.
4:04
SPEAKER_01: I was very, I was detached from process and more focused on Yeah, just the outcome.
4:10
SPEAKER_01: So so I I lost the joy in it.
4:13
SPEAKER_01: It became a matter of at all costs.
4:15
SPEAKER_01: I had this winning mentality that I had to win at all costs.
4:18
SPEAKER_01: And so every challenge and setbat and obstacle became something that was not on the way, it was actually in the way.
4:25
SPEAKER_01: So the roller coaster ride was quite dramatic.
4:28
SPEAKER_01: I was up the highs of euphoria and then the deepest dark states of despair and depression when I lost.
4:34
SPEAKER_01: So, and there was nothing in between.
4:36
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, sort of like a great big wave, really, that you've been trying to ride.
4:40
SPEAKER_00: And I think when I look at your history, and I'm really interested in this, I mean, just to give our listeners a little insight, if they don't already know, you were born to a young single mother and adopted by the Beachleys who lived in Sydney's Manley.
4:52
SPEAKER_00: You then sadly lost your adopted mother, Valerie, who died six years later.
4:57
SPEAKER_00: So you were largely raised by a family friend.
4:59
SPEAKER_00: Correct me if that's but that's my understanding.
5:02
SPEAKER_00: Well, that's a pretty incredible template and journey to start.
5:08
SPEAKER_00: How do you think that shaped you and impacted you?
5:11
SPEAKER_00: Because I'm sure, you know, it was very difficult losing your mother and subsequently learning that you're an adopted child.
5:16
SPEAKER_00: There are a lot of lessons here.
5:18
SPEAKER_00: Do you think that's what's made you want to ride these waves, big ones and small ones?
5:23
SPEAKER_01: The struggle is real, Deborah.
5:27
SPEAKER_01: Look, we are all shaped by our the conditions of our life.
5:31
SPEAKER_01: And, you know, Ben Crow often says it's not our conditions, it's our decisions that shape our lives.
5:36
SPEAKER_01: And I subscribe to that because yes, I had a pretty tumultuous upbringing and a pretty tumultuous childhood, and I've had my fair endured my fair share of loss.
5:45
SPEAKER_01: You know, I lost my adopted mother when I was six years of age.
5:49
SPEAKER_01: My dad decided to tell me I was adopted when I was eight, which was pretty much the catalyst moment that determined that I had to become a world champion at something.
5:56
SPEAKER_01: It was also the catalyst moment that I adopted the mentality or the belief that I'm worthless.
6:01
SPEAKER_01: And then to fight against that has been a lifelong journey.
6:05
SPEAKER_01: My dad then remarried when I was in my early 20s.
6:08
SPEAKER_01: We lost her to breast cancer when I was 30.
6:10
SPEAKER_01: My mother, my biological mother came into my life when I was 27, and I lost her at 47 when she uh, well, I was 47 when she uh lost her battle with ovarian cancer.
6:20
SPEAKER_01: So I've endured my fair share of loss, and look, I feel like it's definitely impacted me in in both positive and negative ways.
6:27
SPEAKER_01: And I've made the most of it, you know.
6:29
SPEAKER_01: A lot of success.
6:31
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, a lot of successful people have come from pretty tumultuous and challenging upbringings, and a lot of the biggest misfits in the world have come from very easy silver spoon kind of silver platter kind of upbringings.
6:42
SPEAKER_01: It's it just comes down to how you perceive and and how you believe, and then what you want to achieve.
6:47
SPEAKER_01: And I had decided I wanted to become a world champion athlete, and so I was very fortunate that I had something to channel my sadness, my anger, my uh competitive spirit, my tenacity.
6:59
SPEAKER_01: I had something to channel that into.
7:01
SPEAKER_00: Well, you certainly did that.
7:02
SPEAKER_00: I mean, you shone as a surfer at Manly, and by the age of 15 were competing and succeeding against women and men.
7:08
SPEAKER_00: Do you believe in destiny and serendipity?
7:11
SPEAKER_00: I mean, do you your life could have been very different as you've just outlined?
7:15
SPEAKER_00: What an extraordinary story.
7:17
SPEAKER_00: And it's really what you do with that pain and where you channel it.
7:22
SPEAKER_00: Do you believe in that notion of fate and destiny?
7:25
SPEAKER_00: Because you certainly had many twists and turns, as we all do.
7:28
SPEAKER_01: Yes, to a degree.
7:30
SPEAKER_01: I do.
7:30
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
7:30
SPEAKER_01: I believe that, you know, there's sometimes I look out into the world and I think, you know, our path has been laid for us.
7:38
SPEAKER_01: Now it's just a matter of us just stepping up and stepping into it and living our lives.
7:43
SPEAKER_01: And I feel very fortunate that I was adopted into the Beach Loving family with the last name Beachley and became a world champion surfer and ended up competing with Beachley as my name.
7:53
SPEAKER_01: And of course, a lot of people say, Did you change your name?
7:55
SPEAKER_01: It's like, as if I would change my last name to Beachley and then become a pro surfer.
7:59
SPEAKER_01: So look, I believe in fate, I believe in destiny.
8:02
SPEAKER_01: I also believe in choice.
8:04
SPEAKER_01: And I believe that choice determines our destiny, not chance.
8:07
SPEAKER_01: A lot of us rely on chance to determine our lives, the quality of our lives.
8:10
SPEAKER_01: So I've made a lot of bad choices and I've made a lot of great choices.
8:14
SPEAKER_01: And those poor choices uh taught me a lot about myself.
8:19
SPEAKER_01: I often say if you're not winning, you're learning, unless you're defined by what you do, and then you're losing all the time.
8:24
SPEAKER_01: And then you're in a victimized mentality, and then it's everyone else's fault.
8:27
SPEAKER_01: Believe me, I've been there.
8:28
SPEAKER_01: I know that mentality.
8:29
SPEAKER_01: I've won five world titles in that state.
8:31
SPEAKER_01: So it doesn't mean you can't succeed as a victim.
8:33
SPEAKER_01: It just means it's not as fun.
8:35
SPEAKER_00: And also clearly, you've had mentors and people that have inspired you along the journey and made sure that whatever journey you're on, you must be a good listener somewhere along the line, even if you're and and to some degree defiant and determined to just ignore the naysayers.
8:50
SPEAKER_00: And let's be honest, the surf world is not the easiest one to crack, especially as a woman, but we'll we'll touch on that.
8:57
SPEAKER_00: I mean, so you've taken those tools and you've listened and you've learned.
9:02
SPEAKER_00: So who are some of the people that held your hand along the way?
9:05
SPEAKER_01: That yeah, I was very fortunate that I I learned very early on that your tribe affects your vibe.
9:12
SPEAKER_01: And your vibe is that the truth.
9:14
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and your vibe attracts your tribe.
9:16
SPEAKER_01: So it's a matter of, you know, if if you like the person that you are, then have a look around you and you'll be literally uh absorbing and molding yourself or emanating behaviors of people that you love and respect and admire.
9:29
SPEAKER_01: And and I surrounded myself with people who are older than me because I felt like the people who are my age didn't respect me or understand me, and I wanted to learn fast.
9:38
SPEAKER_01: And I know that if I surround myself with experts, I save myself a lot of time.
9:42
SPEAKER_01: So I surrounded myself with world champions.
9:44
SPEAKER_01: So I had a lot of people, fortunately, growing up on the northern beaches of Sydney, I was surrounded by world champions from many disciplines in many sports.
9:52
SPEAKER_01: Um, there's a lot of people, especially men, who held my hand metaphorically throughout my life.
9:57
SPEAKER_01: Um, starting with my dad, of course, and my older brother Jason.
10:00
SPEAKER_01: Then some of my first employees, Guy Leach, Doug Lees, and then some of the young women that I used to compete against.
10:06
SPEAKER_01: So Jodie Holmes, or now Jodie Wilmot, and her mum Lynn.
10:09
SPEAKER_01: And then, you know, you got all the characters like Squid and Twizzle, and and then you've got like the world champions like Wendy, Pam, Barton, Tom, Martin, uh, and then my rot my post my personal trainer, RS, and my surf coach Steve, and my surfboard shaper.
10:25
SPEAKER_01: And like I was surrounded by uh a bunch of people who I referred to as my dream team.
10:31
SPEAKER_01: They elevated me, they nurtured me, they believed in me more than I believed in myself, and they supported me through thick and thin.
10:37
SPEAKER_01: When I was up, they were up with me, and when I was down, they came down with me as well.
10:40
SPEAKER_01: They they took the time to empathize and understand, and they supported me unconditionally, and they're still in my dream team today.
10:47
SPEAKER_00: So, really, it takes a village to raise a child, and in a sense, you created your own village and your own tribe.
10:53
SPEAKER_00: And I love that, and the community and the sense that because it does feel very lonely and very hard sometimes, and the fact that you can actually turn right, turn left, and find other people that actually have the knowledge that you don't have, but you have to be open to that, and that's part of your whole mindset, which I love, which is very much part of your awake academy philosophy, which we'll get to.
11:13
SPEAKER_00: You have a lot of dedication and resilience.
11:16
SPEAKER_00: Tell me, is it nature or nurture, do you think?
11:18
SPEAKER_01: Uh, combo.
11:20
SPEAKER_01: Let's sit on the fence of nature and nurture, shall we?
11:23
SPEAKER_01: I mean, you have to you have to have some level of talent, some level of commitment and discipline and determination and tenacity and resilience and all those things.
11:32
SPEAKER_01: And they're they're nature and nurture, because um, you know, it would have been very easy for me to crawl into a hole and never come back out of one based on some of the things that I endured as a child and some of the setbacks, some of the criticism, some of the fear.
11:48
SPEAKER_01: You know, it was uh yeah, it was an opportunity for me to either to motivate or exterminate.
11:56
SPEAKER_01: Um, and uh and I I chose the the motivation to really drive myself to become the best in the world at something, and it was because I desperately needed to, because I had wrapped my sense of self-worth and identity are wrapped around what I did.
12:13
SPEAKER_01: And so, therefore, if I failed, I was a failure.
12:16
SPEAKER_01: And so I didn't like feeling like that.
12:19
SPEAKER_01: So that intrinsic motivation, that drive to become the best in the world literally stemmed from feeling that worthlessness.
12:26
SPEAKER_01: And then, like I said, as you said, you know, it takes a village to raise a child.
12:30
SPEAKER_01: I surrounded myself with a village of people who were very supportive and encouraging that could basically knock that mentality out of me.
12:36
SPEAKER_01: But there were there were days when I go into self-sabotage mode.
12:39
SPEAKER_01: There still are, I'm a human being.
12:40
SPEAKER_01: But having that clarity of vision and then having that dream team and then taking those actions daily, that's my model for sustained success.
12:47
SPEAKER_01: If you know what you want and you know what you're going after and you know why you're going after it, then you can ask the right questions.
12:52
SPEAKER_01: And if you've got that mentality when you don't believe you know it all, and then you surround yourself with people who can shortcut that success for you, then you're yeah, you're halfway there.
13:01
SPEAKER_00: So, what would you say to somebody listening to you?
13:03
SPEAKER_00: Like, obviously, many people suffer from sort of, well, there's depression, but there's also that sort of crippling anxiety, which can be quite paralyzing when you're trying to climb that mountain or, you know, ride that wave or whatever it is that you're trying to do.
13:16
SPEAKER_00: Do you think that inner dialogue is something that you've learned to master?
13:19
SPEAKER_00: I mean, that is like a form of meditation where you actually develop that skill set.
13:23
SPEAKER_00: And is that something you've worked at really hard to really master it?
13:27
SPEAKER_00: It's almost like a skill in itself, isn't it?
13:29
SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
13:30
SPEAKER_01: And I dedicated a lot of time to doing that because uh I started to tune into it and realized how loud and debilitating and just and it's a real distraction.
13:41
SPEAKER_01: And uh look, there's some people that don't have any inner dialogue.
13:44
SPEAKER_01: I mean, what a blissful state to live in.
13:46
SPEAKER_01: That you're just not even aware of the fact that we all have 50 to 70,000 thoughts a day.
13:50
SPEAKER_01: And I wonder how many of those thoughts I have that actually serve me.
13:53
SPEAKER_01: Because there's days when I'm in self-sabotage mode and everything's a struggle and it's painful, and I'm in suffering, and I'm and I'm and I'm relishing in it.
14:01
SPEAKER_01: And and then there's days when I'm in success mode where anything's effortless and easy and graceful and fun, and and I stopped trusting in that because I expect that I've got to go back into survival sooner or later.
14:11
SPEAKER_01: So being consistent with my thought pattern therefore creates a much level playing field and much more consistency throughout my whole life.
14:19
SPEAKER_01: And I realized that it wasn't the coaches or the judges or my peers or my equipment.
14:26
SPEAKER_01: It wasn't everything outside of me that was dictating the terms of my life to me.
14:30
SPEAKER_01: It was going on between my ears.
14:31
SPEAKER_01: It was a six inches by tweaking my ears.
14:33
SPEAKER_01: So I wasn't the best surfer in the water, but I certainly had the greatest mental aptitude.
14:37
SPEAKER_01: And that was my competitive advantage for the majority of my career.
14:41
SPEAKER_00: Well, actually, it's interesting because a lot of the tennis players talk in those terms as well.
14:45
SPEAKER_00: It's a mind game as much as a physical game, and that's something that you really mastered.
14:49
SPEAKER_00: The other thing that really resonated for me was I love that as a female athlete, you don't make it all about being female, um, even though you're in a in the surfing world and one that is often male dominated.
15:01
SPEAKER_00: And to be honest, it's often very sexualized.
15:04
SPEAKER_00: And it's something that you seem to have navigated really well.
15:09
SPEAKER_00: Were there challenging moments that came from a sense of that gender-based inequality, or you know, there must be some extraordinary stories, I have no doubt, behind the scenes that you had to navigate.
15:18
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it was a sexist, chauvinistic, homophobic, misogynistic shit show.
15:24
SPEAKER_01: And that was just the 90s.
15:27
SPEAKER_00: Oh, I love that.
15:29
SPEAKER_00: I mean, I have those visions, you know, of the surf world back in the 90s.
15:33
SPEAKER_01: Oh gosh.
15:34
SPEAKER_01: Have you seen Girls Can't Surf, the documentary?
15:36
SPEAKER_01: Yes, I have actually.
15:37
SPEAKER_01: So that's a bit of an expose of what we were dealing with.
15:41
SPEAKER_01: So yeah, it was very challenging.
15:44
SPEAKER_01: And I feel that what gave me the advantage early on is I had a very clear vision about who I am and what I wanted to be and how I wanted to be it.
15:52
SPEAKER_01: I also recognized the power of my words and the power of my actions, identifying the role models that I had around me and therefore what role model I wanted to be.
16:01
SPEAKER_01: And I took that very seriously.
16:03
SPEAKER_01: So I was not very easily persuaded.
16:06
SPEAKER_01: And that prevented me from succumbing to peer group pressure and taking drugs and drinking excessively and you know, all the things that I knew were going to sabotage my career.
16:17
SPEAKER_01: I was, it was very easy for me to say no to.
16:19
SPEAKER_01: You're quite single-minded.
16:20
SPEAKER_01: I was very maniacally focused, yeah.
16:22
SPEAKER_01: But there was there were some challenges, um, especially as the industry started to embrace women surfing, and therefore we felt like we had to conform to fit in to deserve the support of the industry, because it had been a male-dominated industry for its whole life.
16:36
SPEAKER_01: So for now women to be considered part of that puzzle was uh puzzling for all of us because uh the industry didn't believe in us, they didn't value us, we were misrepresented, devalued.
16:47
SPEAKER_01: And then it got to a point where we all felt pressured to look a certain way and act a certain way to earn the right to be represented in that way.
16:55
SPEAKER_01: And a lot of girls had eating disorders, a lot of women got boob jobs, um, I got liposuction, like we all felt like we had to look a certain way in and parade around in bikinis to therefore obviously encourage other women to feel comfortable enough to do the same thing.
17:13
SPEAKER_01: And so it was just a fallacy, you know, if we're all feeling like we don't fit in, yet we're being told that we kind of did.
17:20
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and it's and it is sort of like now if you look like even with the Olympics and you look at all the the netballs, everybody's challenging the way they have to dress, right?
17:28
SPEAKER_00: As part of sport.
17:29
SPEAKER_00: So that's now evolving.
17:32
SPEAKER_00: But for you, the other thing that was really tied to that was the sponsorships.
17:37
SPEAKER_00: Like it was like, you know, the big sponsorships that would be like, okay, we're gonna support you, we're gonna, you know, we're gonna back you, but you just need to wear our bikinis and you need to be in like 10 photo shoots, you know, in a surf magazine or whatever.
17:49
SPEAKER_00: There was all of that.
17:50
SPEAKER_00: So it was also really tied to the financial and the support that you get.
17:55
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, how you look will then determine whether you are supported or not.
17:58
SPEAKER_01: And then also how you behave and what value you add.
18:00
SPEAKER_01: I mean, it was it was multifaceted, multi-layered.
18:03
SPEAKER_01: But at the end of the day, the industry truly believed in the endorsement deals provided to the men, but didn't really truly believe in the value women brought.
18:12
SPEAKER_01: And that was reflected in just my relationship with my sponsor, where they said basically, Lane, you know what?
18:19
SPEAKER_01: We pay this guy three times more than you, even though he's a one times world champion and you're a six times consecutive world champion, but he earns more three times more than you because he deserves it because he sells board shorts.
18:29
SPEAKER_01: You don't sell bikinis.
18:31
SPEAKER_01: It's outrageous.
18:32
SPEAKER_00: It is so outrageous that you just can't believe that.
18:35
SPEAKER_00: And so do you think it's changing?
18:37
SPEAKER_00: And do you think it is changing and has to change, obviously?
18:40
SPEAKER_01: Well, it has to change, and it is changing.
18:42
SPEAKER_01: And it's look, you started this conversation by saying, I've never really played the female card, and that's true, I haven't.
18:48
SPEAKER_01: Playing the female victim doesn't get us anywhere.
18:51
SPEAKER_01: Banding with females and standing up for what we fight for what we believe in and fighting continuously for what we believe in and communicating clearly about what we want and why it's necessary, that is what needs to happen.
19:03
SPEAKER_01: So we can't have this conversation with just women in the room when there's men making the decisions.
19:07
SPEAKER_01: We have to include the guys in the conversation and we have to clearly articulate the improvements, but also the cost, and then negotiate or or at least create a strategy towards creating these changes because it's one thing to ask for change, but then you've actually got to create a yeah, you gotta create the change and you've got to create a mutually beneficial pathway so it's not too disruptive.
19:35
SPEAKER_01: Uh, and it's something that everyone can wrap their arms around and agree on and therefore work towards.
19:39
SPEAKER_00: And do you feel that you're getting that support?
19:41
SPEAKER_00: Or the, I mean, you'd be very much Well, I'm not no.
19:46
SPEAKER_00: No, I mean after all these years, I mean, you would have to be the beacon of what you would think would be driving change because you are seeing, and and the thing, and just those stats that you just gave me are just so incredibly overwhelming, aren't they?
20:01
SPEAKER_00: That that was the case and it was accepted.
20:03
SPEAKER_00: But as the boardrooms and everything else is changing, let's hope we see some shift in the surf world for the next year.
20:10
SPEAKER_01: Let's hope so, because Ripcurl have just appointed a female CEO who's my one of my best friends, who actually, um, when she was 21, started working for me as my PA and has since gone on to be the first appointed female CEO of a surf industry company.
20:26
SPEAKER_00: Whoa, where that is exciting.
20:29
SPEAKER_01: 2021.
20:30
SPEAKER_01: So the fact is that we have to make a big deal out of that is great, but also really disappointing that we have to make a big deal out of that.
20:37
SPEAKER_00: And that it's taken so long.
20:39
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's yeah, it's mind-boggling.
20:42
SPEAKER_01: But that's what we're up against.
20:43
SPEAKER_01: We're up a very we're st it's still very chauvinistic, misogynistic, sexist industry that's slowly but surely embracing change.
20:52
SPEAKER_01: Um, but then the whole world needs to do that.
20:54
SPEAKER_01: It's not just surfing.
20:56
SPEAKER_01: I know every industry in the world is suffering from the a similar fate, and and it's great that we have these discussions, but where's the strategy?
21:03
SPEAKER_01: What are we doing?
21:04
SPEAKER_01: I I don't believe in quotas, but if if it's going to take a quota to instigate the change, then perhaps we need to utilize them in certain industries in certain times.
21:14
SPEAKER_01: Because um, if we've got the old guys in the same positions protecting the other guys in the same positions, and they're protecting the other guys, like there's all these unconscious biases that when a new position comes up, they just look for the lowest hanging fruit, and the majority of it are women.
21:29
SPEAKER_01: I mean, are men, sorry.
21:30
SPEAKER_01: The majority of the lowest hanging fruit are men, so they just go with the men.
21:33
SPEAKER_01: Just eat.
21:34
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
21:34
SPEAKER_01: And sometimes you've got to dig a little deeper.
21:36
SPEAKER_01: It is shifting.
21:37
SPEAKER_01: I like what Flight Centre do, you know.
21:38
SPEAKER_01: If there's a job role that comes up and they specify that the same amount of women have to apply for the job as men, and if they can't find the the women, then they go looking for them.
21:48
SPEAKER_00: And that's what they've all got.
21:49
SPEAKER_00: I mean, it's got it.
21:50
SPEAKER_00: I can see it is definitely changing, but I agree with you, you know, to celebrate that great appointment of your friend in that role.
21:58
SPEAKER_00: Yes, it's a great thing, but the fact it's taken So long, and that we have to celebrate it as if it's an aberration rather than something that it would just be part of normal process.
22:07
SPEAKER_00: But let's hope that the next generation of surfers and women get to be seen in a different way.
22:13
SPEAKER_01: I don't think that I mean Yeah, it comes down to the individuals, though, doesn't it?
22:17
SPEAKER_01: It comes down to the role that they want to play.
22:20
SPEAKER_01: And we're seeing women come on the tour who are bold, who are beautiful, who are strong.
22:25
SPEAKER_01: People like Tyler Wright, for example, who's willing to make a stand on things that matter to her, whether it's gay and equal rights or whether it's, you know, Black Lives Matter movements.
22:34
SPEAKER_01: Like she is a force to be reckoned with and she wants to make a difference.
22:37
SPEAKER_01: She wants to leave a legacy, a legacy.
22:39
SPEAKER_01: And her legacy is all about like creating a more safe and equal and inclusive environment for people to enter the world of surfing.
22:45
SPEAKER_01: All of our values emanate from voids.
22:48
SPEAKER_01: So if you feel like there's something missing in your life, use that to you to then put your voice behind that and start to agitate for that change and to make that difference.
22:58
SPEAKER_01: Because we're all born to make a difference.
23:00
SPEAKER_01: We're all born to leave a mark.
23:01
SPEAKER_01: And if we're waiting for someone else to do it, then it's not going to happen.
23:04
SPEAKER_01: So we um I'm seeing this agitation.
23:07
SPEAKER_01: I'm seeing this change, especially in surfing.
23:09
SPEAKER_01: And I'm really proud of the movement.
23:12
SPEAKER_01: I'm really proud that the industry are starting to wake up.
23:14
SPEAKER_01: I'm proud of the fact that the governing body wholeheartedly believes in women's surfing.
23:18
SPEAKER_01: And I'm proud that the athletes are utilizing their voices to instigate and agitate change.
23:24
SPEAKER_00: I'll tell you what I interviewed was Putcha Light.
23:26
SPEAKER_00: She's a great, she was so impressive.
23:30
SPEAKER_00: So impressive.
23:31
SPEAKER_00: And she's an example of sort of another generation, and she's obviously using that to drive climate change and a whole lot of other issues.
23:37
SPEAKER_00: So that was great, and that gave me a real insight.
23:39
SPEAKER_00: And she's young, but boy, she got she's got some real power.
23:42
SPEAKER_01: Young but powerful.
23:43
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, very much.
23:44
SPEAKER_01: She's fantastic.
23:45
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
23:49
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23:57
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24:02
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24:43
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24:51
SPEAKER_00: So that was impressive.
24:52
SPEAKER_00: So just on another note, well, I'm now I'm taking a bit of a punt here, but I'm assuming you're an NXS fan.
24:59
SPEAKER_00: I don't want to just jump the gun, right?
25:01
SPEAKER_00: Like, so you just put me straight.
25:04
SPEAKER_00: But it's just um how did you meet Kirk and how has music connected with your surfing?
25:10
SPEAKER_00: I mean, you both clearly require huge discipline, huge energy, um, but also a lot of focused time to hone your skills and each respective skill set.
25:19
SPEAKER_00: What is it that connects you two?
25:21
SPEAKER_00: And tell me how you met, because I want to know that story.
25:24
SPEAKER_01: Well, those things connect us, that mutual understanding and admiration for each other's skills, that uh absolute unwavering commitment to improve and to be the best in the world, because that's what we both achieved, to commit ourselves to a passion, to prove the naysayers and the critics wrong, to go and be uh what we're born to be and leave an indelible mark on this world.
25:47
SPEAKER_01: That's what connects us.
25:48
SPEAKER_01: Uh, and of course, my love of in Excess is definitely one of those strong most of connection as well.
25:54
SPEAKER_01: The first concert I ever went to as a 14-year-old was in Excess.
25:57
SPEAKER_01: So I was very familiar with who Kirk Pengili is.
26:00
SPEAKER_01: And uh John Stevens, who is the former frontman of uh Noise Works and In Excess, yeah, he set us up on a blind date thinking that we would get along, which we didn't.
26:10
SPEAKER_00: You didn't get along.
26:11
SPEAKER_00: I mean, John, I've interviewed him on the podcast.
26:13
SPEAKER_00: I love John, and he's actually a good friend, he's gorgeous, and I never knew that till this moment that he set you two up and you didn't connect.
26:22
SPEAKER_01: Tell me well, there was no connection, there was no chemistry.
26:27
SPEAKER_01: We really were both out, we were both meeting each other through the obligation that we'd made a deal with John that yes, we'd go on a date.
26:34
SPEAKER_01: Okay, John, you see something, we don't.
26:36
SPEAKER_01: He's he saw the fact that Kirk really loved to laugh and laugh at himself and laugh at life, and he knew that about me too, because I don't like taking myself seriously, and I don't really gravitate towards people who take themselves very seriously either.
26:48
SPEAKER_01: So uh that I tend to agitate them because I don't take them seriously enough.
26:52
SPEAKER_01: And Kirk is um he's a lover of life, but he's nocturnal and I'm dayturnal.
26:56
SPEAKER_01: He drinks white wine, I drink red wine, he loves beer, I'm allergic to beer.
27:00
SPEAKER_01: He hates the sand, he hates the sun, I love the beach, you know, there was just no chemistry, no connection.
27:06
SPEAKER_01: Yet we persevered, and I took Kirk on a f on a date um at a 10, I took him 10 pin bowling at DY RSL.
27:13
SPEAKER_01: If you must ask, yes, I'm a classy broad.
27:15
SPEAKER_01: You are so romantic.
27:17
SPEAKER_00: Very romantic.
27:18
SPEAKER_01: So romantic.
27:19
SPEAKER_01: It had to involve competition of some description for me to be at least a bit interested in uh participating on this.
27:26
SPEAKER_01: And then I took him to a restaurant in DY.
27:28
SPEAKER_01: And um halfway through dinner, I went to the bathroom looking for a window to climb out of.
27:32
SPEAKER_01: I was that bored.
27:33
SPEAKER_01: There was nothing going on.
27:34
SPEAKER_01: And Kirk was thinking, while I'm in the bathroom, if I put money on the table and do a runner, do you think she'll notice?
27:39
SPEAKER_01: And I came out of the bathroom, he was still there, and I was bitterly disappointed, if you must know, because I thought, oh come on, I've given you enough time to split, dude.
27:46
SPEAKER_01: Let's let's get real.
27:47
SPEAKER_01: But the owner of the restaurant recognized that things weren't going well, gave us a bottle of lemon cello, and that got the party started.
27:53
SPEAKER_01: We finished that bottle, and then at our wedding in 2008, we uh 2010, sorry, um, we uh we toasted with lemoncello because if it wasn't for lemoncello, we certainly wouldn't have stayed together.
28:04
SPEAKER_00: Oh my god, I love that story.
28:06
SPEAKER_00: It is just incredible.
28:07
SPEAKER_00: And also, you've been together, is it 10 years?
28:09
SPEAKER_00: How long have you been married?
28:10
SPEAKER_00: Quite a long time.
28:11
SPEAKER_01: We've been married 11 years, and we've been together 19.
28:13
SPEAKER_00: Quite extraordinary.
28:14
SPEAKER_00: And it goes to show, once again, the importance of perseverance.
28:19
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
28:19
SPEAKER_00: And lemoncello.
28:21
SPEAKER_00: And lemoncello.
28:24
SPEAKER_00: And it sounds as if you two have actually, but you're right, I I assumed that the connection was very much based on your commitment and your sense of like doing things really, really well, and you both uh, you know, are masters of your craft.
28:36
SPEAKER_01: So things got I reckon the I reckon the common denominator the common theme or the common denominator that keeps the glue really tight between the two of us is our sense of humor.
28:45
SPEAKER_00: Is he funny?
28:46
SPEAKER_01: That's yeah, he is he's funny and he's cheeky, and he's just he's very loving and very kind, very sensitive, um, and just you know the most supportive person in my life.
29:00
SPEAKER_01: I'm just so grateful for his patience and his yeah, his ability to be my devil's advocate at the same time as being my biggest supporter.
29:08
SPEAKER_00: And so what have you learned from him?
29:09
SPEAKER_00: What has he taught you?
29:10
SPEAKER_00: He sounds like he's one of the people that you've learned the most from.
29:13
SPEAKER_01: He's taught me patience.
29:14
SPEAKER_01: He certainly taught me that.
29:16
SPEAKER_01: Uh he's taught me to pick up after myself because I'm quite disorganized.
29:21
SPEAKER_01: He's taught me, gosh, he's taught me so many different things.
29:25
SPEAKER_01: He's taught me how to be a lot more organized, a lot more structured, um, how to plan.
29:30
SPEAKER_01: He's taught me how to respect time.
29:33
SPEAKER_01: He's taught me the importance of managing my health and vitality.
29:37
SPEAKER_01: I mean, he's so inspiring.
29:39
SPEAKER_01: He's got so much vitality at 62 years of age, and he's so energetic.
29:43
SPEAKER_01: He's yeah, and he's taught me what unconditional love truly is.
29:46
SPEAKER_00: And what do you think that you've taught him?
29:49
SPEAKER_01: Patience, uh how to be more spontaneous, uh, how to tolerate mess.
29:57
SPEAKER_01: What else have I taught Kirk?
29:59
SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
29:59
SPEAKER_00: I'd have to ask him.
30:01
SPEAKER_00: But in some ways, it's maybe that sort of the inverted commas messiness that you talk about, inverted commas disorganization, maybe that's because you've had to be so structured.
30:10
SPEAKER_00: And so what I mean is you've had to be so disciplined at every other level that maybe you just sometimes needed to just go, you know, I just need to let go.
30:20
SPEAKER_00: I mean it's so common with people that are particularly that excel to that degree.
30:24
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, not with him.
30:25
SPEAKER_01: He's very structured, very regimented.
30:28
SPEAKER_01: I've got just piles of stuff everywhere, but they're clean piles, but they just, you know.
30:32
SPEAKER_01: Very you know, yang.
30:34
SPEAKER_01: It sounds like it's working.
30:35
SPEAKER_01: We are, and I just priority, I prioritize other things, you know.
30:38
SPEAKER_01: If I've got stuff that needs doing and the surf's good, I'd much rather go surfing.
30:42
SPEAKER_01: So I'm like, I'll just leave that there and I'll deal with it another day.
30:45
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I actually get that.
30:46
SPEAKER_00: I actually get it.
30:48
SPEAKER_00: So tell me what's next for you.
30:50
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, priorities.
30:50
SPEAKER_00: Tell me what's next for you and talk to me about the Awake Academy because it's really very inspiring.
30:55
SPEAKER_00: And also the you've got a new course that you're launching.
30:59
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, of course.
31:00
SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
31:00
SPEAKER_01: So what's next for me is continuously well continuing to evolve.
31:06
SPEAKER_01: You know, I I really love to share lessons and I really love to learn myself because then I can shortcut the struggle and teach people what to do.
31:14
SPEAKER_01: So they don't have to read all the books I read, I can just condense them.
31:17
SPEAKER_01: Or they can cheat and go on blinkist, and then they get the same thing, but maybe not the uh life experience that comes with it.
31:23
SPEAKER_01: Um but awake academy is all about cultivating connection, growth, and happiness in humanity.
31:28
SPEAKER_01: And we house uh online, it's a self-empowerment platform with online courses, and the course that's on there at the moment is called Own Your Truth, and that's a self-paced seven-round online course to help people wake up and own their shit and trust in love.
31:41
SPEAKER_01: It's all about helping people detach from fear and bring back the fun, find their flow, bring more happiness and joy and enlightenment and awakening to the to their lives.
31:50
SPEAKER_01: So it's literally my life lessons distilled into seven rounds.
31:55
SPEAKER_01: Well, my 40 years of life lessons.
31:57
SPEAKER_00: Well, I actually had a look at it and I was actually following you because I um separate to obviously my research for the interview, but I I really love the way that you like you pop those lessons up.
32:06
SPEAKER_00: And somebody like yourself, I think it's really important also for people to see that you know, you can have great success, but you still have to do the hard work internally and learn those lessons and be somewhat spiritual in the way.
32:21
SPEAKER_00: Like you can go surfing and you are amazing at what you do.
32:24
SPEAKER_00: And obviously that's very physical.
32:26
SPEAKER_00: So it's hard for someone to imagine that you would ever have a down day because you're like, oh, I can just go to the beach and I can go out into the ocean and I can ride that wave.
32:34
SPEAKER_00: But I think that's part of what I found you've imparted through this Awake Academy.
32:39
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, thank you.
32:41
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, because the ocean is my biggest teacher, it does uh teach me a lot about myself on a day-to-day basis.
32:48
SPEAKER_01: And the thing about control freaks, which I am one, is the ocean is the one place where I truly learn to surrender.
32:56
SPEAKER_01: It's a poor, it's a force so powerful and so unpredictable.
33:01
SPEAKER_01: And it teaches me to just release these control freak factors that I have around my life, and I just have to surrender and go with the flow and adapt to what's ever going on out there.
33:12
SPEAKER_01: And sometimes, sometimes I paddle out with expectations.
33:15
SPEAKER_01: Nearly every day I paddled out there with expectations and quite often they're never met.
33:19
SPEAKER_01: And I can choose to be angry and upset and disappointed because disappointment is always the result of unmet expectations, or I can just choose to be more accepting because that is the end of all suffering and go, okay, it just wasn't my day today, or you know, my body feels a bit sore today.
33:36
SPEAKER_01: So everything, everything that goes on in our lives is essentially a feedback mechanism.
33:42
SPEAKER_01: It's an opportunity for us to go, hmm, what is that?
33:45
SPEAKER_01: Like, why is that happening?
33:47
SPEAKER_01: What did I how do I how do I want to respond to that?
33:50
SPEAKER_01: And if we are that conscious in our day-to-day lives, then it's literally comes down to our decisions, not our conditions, that proves the quality that determines the quality of our lives.
34:01
SPEAKER_01: So I'm just very introspective.
34:04
SPEAKER_01: I'm always reading, watching, listening, learning.
34:06
SPEAKER_01: Um, my mirror is also my greatest teacher.
34:09
SPEAKER_01: Kirk is also a very good teacher.
34:11
SPEAKER_01: These conversations are great, great tools for me because we all teach what we need to learn.
34:15
SPEAKER_01: So I'm always listening.
34:16
SPEAKER_01: Like he said at the start, I'm a good listener.
34:18
SPEAKER_01: And yes, I love to listen.
34:20
SPEAKER_01: And that's why we're born with two ears and one tongue.
34:23
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely love that.
34:24
SPEAKER_00: And all of that resonates with me so much.
34:26
SPEAKER_00: And that's really how this podcast started, what I've learned.
34:29
SPEAKER_00: Because interviewing and listening to you like this, and all my listeners who are going to hear this, it's very inspiring, but it's also really comforting.
34:36
SPEAKER_00: There's a wonderful way that you impart your lessons that makes, well, certainly makes me, but I can imagine my listeners would feel very comforted by that because the universality of the experience is very much, you know, like I love that notion that you go out into the ocean with expectations.
34:55
SPEAKER_00: I gather those expectations are not that you not just about riding the wave, but about whatever's going on in your life.
35:02
SPEAKER_01: And that you know it's a combination for sure.
35:04
SPEAKER_00: And that you that relinquishing is part of the healing to accept that, well, things are not going to always go the way you want.
35:12
SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
35:13
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
35:14
SPEAKER_01: And that's the one advantage of being a surfer is that things very rarely go the way that you want them to.
35:20
SPEAKER_01: So you have to adapt.
35:22
SPEAKER_01: Or you don't come out angry all the time.
35:27
SPEAKER_00: Well, I'm so, so pleased to have had this wonderful chat with you.
35:32
SPEAKER_00: I've learned a lot just in the time that we've spent, and I look forward to actually jumping onto your Awake Academy and uh tapping some of those resources because I think you're very inspirational, and I want to thank you for your time.
35:45
SPEAKER_01: You're welcome.
35:45
SPEAKER_01: Thank you, Deborah, and thank you for sharing all these lessons with your listeners, and thank you to everyone for listening.
35:50
SPEAKER_01: It's been great talking with you.
35:51
SPEAKER_01: Pleasure.
35:58
SPEAKER_00: Thanks so much for listening.
35:59
SPEAKER_00: The What I've Learned podcast will now be coming to you weekly, with new episodes released every Tuesday.
36:06
SPEAKER_00: I'm blessed to have so many wonderful guests coming on the show.
36:09
SPEAKER_00: So check out my What I've Learned Instagram for updates.
36:12
SPEAKER_00: Meanwhile, stay tuned, kind, and curious.
36:16
SPEAKER_00: Love death.