Latest / 360 with Katie Woolf / AFP Forensic Operations Team Annie Lam, who was involved in the Bali Bombings hopes to inspire others to pursue a career in forensic science

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AFP Forensic Operations Team Annie Lam, who was involved in the Bali Bombings hopes to inspire others to pursue a career in forensic science · 360 with Katie Woolf

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  Speaker 1: It is indeed National Science Week, and we know that
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  Speaker 1: chances are if you've been asked to imagine an engineer
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: or a scientist forty years ago, it's highly likely you
• 0:10
  Speaker 1: wouldn't have pitched a woman.
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  Speaker 2: But times and.
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  Speaker 1: Stereotype stereotypes, I should say I'm most definitely changing and
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  Speaker 1: today Australian women working in science and making enormous achievements.
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  Speaker 1: And this year's National Science Week is aiming to inspire
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  Speaker 1: even more women and girls to get involved in science now.
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  Speaker 1: Annie Lamb is a forensic scientist who heads up the
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  Speaker 1: AFP's Forensic Operations Team in Canberra Now.
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  Speaker 2: In two thousand and two, she was one of the forensic.
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  Speaker 1: Specialists which was deployed to Indonesia in the aftermath of
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  Speaker 1: the Balley bombings looking for clues which would help identify
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  Speaker 1: and lead to the arrest of the suspects. And I'm
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  Speaker 1: very pleased to say that Annie Lamb joins me on
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  Speaker 1: the line right now.
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  Speaker 2: Good morning to you.
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  Speaker 3: Annie, Hi there, thanks for having me, Thank.
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  Speaker 2: You so much for joining us. Annie.
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  Speaker 1: What is it about science, and in particular forensic science
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  Speaker 1: that first got your hooked?
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  Speaker 3: So I'm a bit of a problem solver, So That's
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  Speaker 3: why I gravitated towards science and maths in particular, because
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  Speaker 3: you know, I find if you have a problem, if
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  Speaker 3: you do the research or follow a formula, you generally
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  Speaker 3: get the question the answers that you want. And forensic
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  Speaker 3: science is the application of science to the law. So
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  Speaker 3: using science to solve crimes, and that ticks all the
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  Speaker 3: boxes for me.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, right now.
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  Speaker 1: Obviously, you know, one of the things that a lot
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  Speaker 1: of our listeners will be very familiar with was the
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  Speaker 1: Barley bombings, and that is because we're so our proximity
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  Speaker 1: obviously to Bali, but also because our National Critical Care
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  Speaker 1: and Trauma Response Center, well, the team there was created
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  Speaker 1: after the Barley bombings, so some of our wonderful medical
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  Speaker 1: staff were deployed and you indeed were deployed pretty quickly
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  Speaker 1: to Bali to those bombing sites into thousand and two.
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  Speaker 1: As a young forensic scientist, what was that like for you?
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  Speaker 3: Oh, yes, you know, so I was the two thousand
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  Speaker 3: and two I was a crime scene investigator based in
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  Speaker 3: the Act. So my crime scene role was was you know,
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  Speaker 3: pretty much going to a lot of the burglary crimes
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  Speaker 3: here and you know, stolen cars and things like that.
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  Speaker 3: So you know, when I got the call up to
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  Speaker 3: deploy to Bali, it was obviously was it was a
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  Speaker 3: really chance to perform this role that you know, it's
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  Speaker 3: obviously quite significant because we deployed with all our equipment
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  Speaker 3: and we're working as a big team, big forensic team
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  Speaker 3: now because you know, we're doing the same thing, we're
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  Speaker 3: processing a crime scene, but now we're working alongside lots
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  Speaker 3: of technical specialists you know, bomb scene examiners and chemists
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  Speaker 3: well to gather the evidence and clues. It really was
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  Speaker 3: quite significant for me because it was a real learning
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  Speaker 3: experience as well.
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  Speaker 2: I bet it was.
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  Speaker 1: It's you know, it would have been unbelievable really traveling
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  Speaker 1: across to Bali and knowing, you know, like how how
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  Speaker 1: tragic that situation had been for so many Australian families
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  Speaker 1: and how important that work was that you had to
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  Speaker 1: get underway and do. Yeah.
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  Speaker 3: Absolutely, I mean, you know, day to day there were
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  Speaker 3: a lot of tasks and you know, the team at
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  Speaker 3: one point over there, I would say it was up
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  Speaker 3: to one hundred of us. We all had had different roles,
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  Speaker 3: but we all had the roles based on daily taskings.
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  Speaker 3: We'd have our team leaders that manage these. So you know,
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  Speaker 3: if you were needed at the bomb scene that day,
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  Speaker 3: you would help out there. You have your role there
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  Speaker 3: at the maw Tree, you know, at the local police
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  Speaker 3: station to assist them with their examinations. So it really
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  Speaker 3: was a well oiled machine, you know, to make sure
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  Speaker 3: everything was done and had to be done.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, what would.
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  Speaker 1: You consider the most sort of significant forensic moment in
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  Speaker 1: that investigation?
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  Speaker 3: Yes, so you know, obviously we had the primary crime scenes.
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  Speaker 3: We had those, you know, the bomb scenes, sit we
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  Speaker 3: had to get the evidence and the clues to say, well,
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  Speaker 3: what happened here, you know, what was the device you know,
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  Speaker 3: in Patty's bar and in Sari and the US consulate.
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  Speaker 3: But what was most significant for me was my involvement
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  Speaker 3: in the secondary crime scenes. So so these are the
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  Speaker 3: scenes where all the suspects we're using the premises where
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  Speaker 3: they're used to to plan these meetings. They use these
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  Speaker 3: rooms to get together to you know, talk about how
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  Speaker 3: they were going to you know, do the attack and
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  Speaker 3: build the build the i DS, the devices. So you know,
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  Speaker 3: it was a real significant breakthrough when we were able
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  Speaker 3: to follow the investigation team and then get all these
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  Speaker 3: evidence to kind of get all the pieces together and
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  Speaker 3: form a brief about exactly who was involved and what happened.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, how I mean, how has that lo? How has
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  Speaker 2: that whole.
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  Speaker 1: Incident and working on over there in BALI sort of
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  Speaker 1: shaped your career then, you know, following on from.
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  Speaker 4: That, Yeah, it was you know, as I said, it
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  Speaker 4: was a real learning experience and it really showed me,
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  Speaker 4: you know, the scope of what we can be involved
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  Speaker 4: in it in working in forensic science.
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  Speaker 3: You know, with AFP in particular, we have such a
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  Speaker 3: broad remit. You know, we support Act policing in community policing,
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  Speaker 3: but we have national investigations and then we also have
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  Speaker 3: you know, the you know, to protect Australians off shore,
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  Speaker 3: so you know, deploying overseas. So it really made me
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  Speaker 3: relize what a big team effort it is. And you know,
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  Speaker 3: and since then, obviously we've grown to have a lot
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  Speaker 3: more of the technical specialists, you know, the digital forensics
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  Speaker 3: and forensic intelligence teams, and working together is really quite
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  Speaker 3: an achievement and it's you know, it's different every day
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  Speaker 3: and yeah, I enjoy it.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, I bet you do.
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  Speaker 1: And you know, honestly, it's not one of those like
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  Speaker 1: I suppose from the outset, and it's probably the wrong
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  Speaker 1: you know, it's the wrong view for a.
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  Speaker 2: Lot of us to have.
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  Speaker 1: But you don't really think, like when you think of
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  Speaker 1: the AFP, you don't really think about the science behind it.
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  Speaker 1: You don't think about forensic science. But it is such
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  Speaker 1: a critical and important role.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah.
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  Speaker 3: Absolutely, you know, i'd say we're probably in the shadows
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  Speaker 3: of the front line. You know, we're always supporting the
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  Speaker 3: front line, and you know what's really important is that
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  Speaker 3: the you know, we have the frontline police to attend first,
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  Speaker 3: you know, to make sure you know, primarily that the
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  Speaker 3: scene is safe, that everyone else is safe, and then
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  Speaker 3: we come in, you know, to do the investigation to
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  Speaker 3: the crime scene. Also, some of our work I think
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  Speaker 3: goes on for quite a long time, you know, a
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  Speaker 3: few months in the lab and then you know, after
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  Speaker 3: that we kind of move on to different things. But yeah,
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  Speaker 3: the work goes on in the background. So no, you
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  Speaker 3: don't get a lot of that unless I guess if
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  Speaker 3: you follow it in the courtroom.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, and when you decided, like when you first started
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  Speaker 1: studying science and you know, when you were younger, did
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  Speaker 1: you ever imagine that you'd end up working in forensic
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  Speaker 1: science for the AFP.
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  Speaker 3: I look, I actually have to say it was probably
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  Speaker 3: a bit of luck. You know. When I was leading
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  Speaker 3: high school and trying to find something in science, you know,
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  Speaker 3: I read about forensic science and thought, okah, you know,
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  Speaker 3: that sounds pretty interesting. And then during university I had
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  Speaker 3: the opportunity to actually do my honest projects with the AFP.
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  Speaker 3: So that really then puts the idea in my head
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  Speaker 3: that you know, going into law enforcement is where I
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  Speaker 3: want to be. And the lucky is that, you know,
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  Speaker 3: at the end of my course, the AFP was recruiting
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  Speaker 3: and here I am.
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  Speaker 1: How wonderful And of course it is National Science Week
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  Speaker 1: and I know that there is a real push as
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  Speaker 1: part of National Science work this week to really try
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  Speaker 1: to inspire even more women and girls to get involved
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  Speaker 1: in science.
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  Speaker 2: How do you reckon we can do that?
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  Speaker 3: I think we really need to kind of start looking
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  Speaker 3: outside box, you know, just just buss some of those
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  Speaker 3: stereotypes of the myths of the nerdy type. You know,
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  Speaker 3: science doesn't have to be someone you know, in a
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  Speaker 3: lab coat in a lab, even though they are very
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  Speaker 3: critical roles. But if that's not for you, and you know,
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  Speaker 3: you like the traveling, or you'd like the problem solving,
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  Speaker 3: or you like working in the team environments. You know,
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  Speaker 3: look outside. You know, forensic science, we do have a
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  Speaker 3: lot of discipline. We're still working with biologist fingerprint experts,
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  Speaker 3: but we're you know, constantly expanding. We need to work
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  Speaker 3: collaboratively and you know, if there's a lot of like
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  Speaker 3: minded people here working forensics and just yeah, so if
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  Speaker 3: you if you've got those attributes, absolutely go and have
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  Speaker 3: a look.
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  Speaker 2: Oh good on you, Annie.
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  Speaker 1: It's lovely to speak to you this morning, and and
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  Speaker 1: so insightful. I reckon it's a wonderful profession, you know,
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  Speaker 1: for for our young girls to be to be looking
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  Speaker 1: at and and it sounds as though it's taken you
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  Speaker 1: around the world and to some incredibly interesting jobs.
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  Speaker 3: Absolutely, thank you for the chart.
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  Speaker 2: Thanks Sanny, I really appreciate it.