Latest / The Mark Driscoll Show / Candace Owens CROSSES the Line with Criminal Claim About TPUSA | The Mark Driscoll Show | Ep 08

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Candace Owens CROSSES the Line with Criminal Claim About TPUSA | The Mark Driscoll Show | Ep 08 · The Mark Driscoll Show

0:01
Well, howdy and welcome back to the Mark Driscoll Show where we
0:04
look at faith, culture and the craziness of the week through a
0:06
biblical lens. Today's episode is packed from
0:09
Candace Owens Challenge to pastors.
0:11
Hopefully we passed a University of Oklahoma student failed for
0:15
citing the Bible and answering. We're also answering your
0:19
questions about how Christians should tackle the holidays.
0:21
Pastor Mark's ready to bring the heat with God's Word.
0:23
Buckle up, it'll be a good one. Candace Owens, She's like, man,
0:48
she's just the Jezebel we can't get away from lately.
0:51
She had a lot of fun stuff to say this week.
0:55
She's really starting to attack pastors and get into the
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Christian lane, I think adjacent to the Charlie Kirk world.
1:03
And she had a challenge on Saturday going into the weekend,
1:06
pastor challenge. Tomorrow is Sunday.
1:09
I challenge you to get through an entire sermon without
1:13
mentioning me or Tucker Carlson. I nailed it.
1:16
You nailed it. Nailed Land of the Dismount,
1:19
yeah. She's she's like pretty self.
1:25
Yeah, her husband literally needs to get her in and get a
1:28
psych eval. And I say that not, you know,
1:30
mean spirited. Like honestly, like if I was
1:33
your pastor and you were in my church, I'd be like, please get
1:37
her in for a psych about and cancel your Internet
1:39
subscription. Like just give us all a favor.
1:43
Do us, do us all a solid. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
1:46
She's, she's getting pretty crazy.
1:49
And then I'm not even sure Tucker Carlson wants to be
1:52
looped in with her as much as she's she's aligning with.
1:55
But then today it took a bit of a turn.
1:58
She tweeted this or read it to you?
2:03
I received information last night to put the final pieces
2:06
together for me. I now can say with full
2:08
confidence I believe Charlie Kirk was betrayed by the
2:11
leadership of Turning Point USA and some very and some of the
2:15
very people who eulogized him on stage.
2:18
Yes, I will be naming names and providing evidence for my claims
2:21
and I'm making a personal plea to every well meaning person who
2:24
donated to this God forsaken organization to request a
2:27
refund. You were lied to and leadership
2:30
new. First of all, if that is true,
2:35
call the FBI, call the police, because you're talking about a
2:39
murder and a murder should be reported to the authorities, not
2:46
used as click bait to advance your podcast.
2:51
And if you really do care about somebody that you would call a
2:53
departed friend, you would do all that you can to preserve an
2:58
INTEGRIS investigation, not build your platform #2 if you
3:03
have any evidence that should be handed over to the authorities
3:08
so that you're not obstructing the pursuit of justice and A and
3:12
A and a decent case, for God's sakes.
3:15
In addition, this is if not true, this is a crime because
3:21
now you are obstructing business.
3:23
If you have given money to the organization, probably TPUSA
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faith, which is a charitable faith-based organization, please
3:30
ask for a refund. Now you're obstructing nonprofit
3:34
charitable business. That is a crime.
3:36
Now, I'm not a lawyer, but if I was a lawyer, I would say,
3:40
please give me this case because this is, this is an intent to
3:44
obstruct a nonprofit business. And so if not true, now you're
3:48
into now you're into criminal activity.
3:50
Now we're not just into, here's my opinion.
3:53
Now we're into illegal activity, criminal activity into and to
3:59
just overtly say that people in an organization that he founded
4:02
and were his friends murdered him or were complicit in the
4:07
murder of him, that is that is a wildly horrific claim to make.
4:13
And so without sharing too much inside information, I mean
4:18
Andrew Colvin, who runs the show in Charlie's absence and was the
4:22
Co host when he was in college. I was his pastor and baptized
4:26
him. We've stayed in, you know, minor
4:29
contact over the years, in recent.
4:30
You changed your kids diapers, He told me Sunday school.
4:33
He was. Yeah, he was in the nursery.
4:35
He was in the nursery and so and we've, we've, we've gotten a
4:38
more recent contact in recent years.
4:40
He loves Jesus. He's a devout Christian.
4:43
He's a husband and father. He is devastated at the loss of
4:48
his brother and friend, absolutely devastated.
4:52
And it and he and others are, Erica included, are trying to
4:57
lead an organization of people who absolutely loved Charlie.
5:03
Knowing Charlie personally, I can tell you off camera, off
5:08
stage, he was a wonderfully enjoyable human being.
5:14
He had a pastor's heart. He genuinely cared about people.
5:17
He was gregarious, he was brilliant.
5:21
He was a quick start mind. He was a one and a generation
5:24
leader. He's irreplaceable.
5:27
He was genuinely likable. Like I personally loved him.
5:34
I have shed a bucket of tears. I miss him.
5:39
I liked him. Like if he wasn't Charlie
5:41
freaking Kirk, I would still have a beer, shoot pool and hang
5:45
out with him. He was just a great guy.
5:47
So the people who were around him, a lot of them, they didn't
5:51
join the organization when it was it at Zenith.
5:54
They were there early on when everybody was broke and grinding
5:58
and working hard and you know how to dream.
6:01
And so they grew up together and they grew up in the organization
6:05
together. And in some regard, they're like
6:08
cousins or brothers and sisters. And, and so for these people who
6:12
they care deeply and they, they love.
6:14
I mean, we went there after Charlie died and we, we prayed
6:18
over some of the staff and handed out Bibles.
6:20
And they're at their desk and they're, they're weeping and
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they're processing in their mourning and, and they're in
6:26
shock and, and they're dealing with all of this.
6:28
I mean, I've been, you know, behind the curtain.
6:30
I've been in, in the office. And then to hear like, and you
6:34
guys weren't, I mean, it's like, it's so sick.
6:37
It's so cruel, it's so unkind, it's so uncharitable.
6:42
It's so untrue. And if true, it's so
6:45
inappropriate for it to be dealt with in this way.
6:49
And if if true, why? Like there There hasn't risen up
6:53
this figurehead of turning point that took over this giant
6:57
organization. They're trying to figure it out.
6:59
They're a bunch of godly people. The the ones you you reference
7:03
are godly men and women and they're trying to figure it out
7:07
there. There isn't somebody that just
7:08
stepped in, grabbed the mic and is this powerful influential
7:11
leader. Why would this plot play out
7:15
like it doesn't make any sense. It makes sense that some demonic
7:18
trans kid took a shot, didn't realize what he was doing and
7:23
was demonically influenced and took out the once in a
7:25
generation later. That makes way more sense than
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his organization that was changing America take to
7:32
cannibalize itself. Well, so he's the leader.
7:34
So he's the one who is pulling the organization forward.
7:38
He's the unifying factor. He's the income generator, he's
7:43
the platform builder. Like he's building the platform
7:46
that you're all standing on and providing the revenue that
7:50
you're all feeding your family. By paying your mortgage.
7:53
And it's like this, this, this, this, this is insanity.
7:56
But for me, I, I look at it pastorally, this, this is my
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30th year as a senior pastor. These are human beings that are
8:05
devastated. They are still in grieving and
8:08
mourning. They are still working and
8:11
grinding and processing. And what they're dealing with
8:14
right now, they're getting ready for Amfest here in Phoenix,
8:19
which is a massive event, minus their founder and leader and
8:26
brother. And they are still grieving and
8:29
processing. They're going to have to deal
8:31
with massive media issues and massive security issues.
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And it's the holidays and, and they're overwhelmed with work
8:39
and they're still in the midst of grief and to say things like
8:43
this and to do things like this and then to create sort of a, a
8:47
conspiratorial, you know, spirit around them of craziness.
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It's like these are human beings with spouses and kids and lives
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and, and some of them now they've got very serious
9:00
personal security issues going into the biggest event they've
9:05
ever had and the Christmas season.
9:07
Yeah, and she's adding to that and it I mean, it actually looks
9:11
like her attack is very directed at Andrew Clovet, who is your
9:14
friend. He tweeted at a lying lips are
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an abomination of the Lord, but those who act faithfully are in
9:20
his delight. She immediately retweeted that
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and said you'll be hoisted by the Scripture.
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And I'll just go on the record. I know him.
9:31
He's great and without oversharing, overstating.
9:37
As a pastor, if you're going to say something like that for a
9:41
man that I know, you better bring a boatload of evidence.
9:48
And if it is true, you better bring it to the FBI.
9:51
And if it is not true, they should lawyer up and you should
9:56
lose the ability to ever say anything publicly again for the
10:00
rest of your life because all you are is a person with a
10:05
mental disorder and a microphone.
10:07
And, and for you, you there, there's been some attacks on you
10:10
in your life, true or false, she very much could bring safety
10:15
issues, security issues, legitimate problems to Andrew's
10:21
family. To to members of the
10:22
organization, not only potentially already has, because
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when you're crazy and you point at someone and say they
10:32
murdered, you know this person that you love.
10:35
Other crazy people believe that and they act upon that.
10:40
And now you're taking safety away from a family that is
10:44
innocent while you sit home behind a microphone cashing
10:50
checks for disobeying one of the 10 commandments and being a liar
10:55
and saying I'm a Christian. And it's like, stand before
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Jesus and give an account for all of that so that.
11:04
There has to be spiritual behind this for her.
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This this is this is evil. And if it is true, even the way
11:11
it is being handled is evil. Yeah.
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So if if it's wrong, it's evil. If it's right, the way it's
11:17
being handled is evil. Yeah.
11:18
So either way, it's evil. Yeah, yeah, yeah, she, she
11:23
really does seem to be obsessed. And I think a lot of pastors are
11:27
are right to rebuke her, and many have.
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Yeah, and and this is our show. This isn't my pulpit.
11:33
Yep. You know, I'm not in the pulpit.
11:35
I'm teaching the Bible to help the people and point to Jesus.
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I mean, that's that's what the pulpit is.
11:40
This isn't the pulpit. The Mark Driscoll show.
11:43
Yeah, yeah, yeah. So like, and so, you know, this
11:45
is something different, but for those Christians, it's like just
11:48
focus on the gospel and be like, no, teach the Bible.
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The Bible talks about everything and Jesus is here.
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He's Lord over everything, which means you get to talk about
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anything that his lordship is over.
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And since his lordship is over everyone and everything, you can
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talk about anything and anyone that is under the Lordship of
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Christ, period. Awesome.
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Well, thank you for that Pastor Mark and thank you for
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addressing it head on. I know you don't mind head on
12:16
collisions so. Yeah, well, it's just our
12:20
families had lies, safety issues, public slander and
12:25
attacks. And it just pains me when
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children heading into Christmas maybe don't have a sense of
12:35
safety in their own home because someone who claims to be a
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Christian is lying about their father at at a personal level,
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that profoundly bothers me. Yeah, I, I agree.
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And I think she's, yeah, I think there's some weird jealousy with
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Erica. And I I mean, I don't know.
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There's an obsession that is unhealthy.
12:56
Yeah, I think, I think there's a jealousy in a believe that she
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maybe should be in a place that she's not in right now and it's
13:04
disgusting. So thank you for addressing
13:07
that. Well, before we jump back into
13:10
the Mark Driscoll show, I wanted to give a shout out to our new
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Faith to learn more and thank you for partnering with our
14:36
show. The war with Venezuela or what
14:39
would be a perceived war? I'm not sure we're at war.
14:42
Man, if we're, I told you, man, if we're betting I'm putting my
14:45
money on America, I think the US versus Venezuela.
14:50
I like our odds. I think they're good.
14:52
It's like a military drill. It is, it is, it is, it's, it's
14:56
definitely, it's a preseason game.
14:58
It's a tune up. So what's the debate?
15:02
What's the big controversy? I think there's a lot of
15:05
Christians. Should we be seeking
15:09
peacemaking? We are, we are Blowing up
15:12
terrorists just increases the peace.
15:16
It really does. It really does.
15:17
Yeah. The more terrorists you blow up,
15:19
the more peaceful the world becomes.
15:20
Yeah, what is just war? What are Christians allowed to
15:24
do? Do in the name of self-defense?
15:27
People are just, Christians are just asking questions about, I
15:30
think, I don't know, I feel like you can watch a video of a a
15:34
boat getting blown up and being like, well, those people are
15:36
victims. They're not victims.
15:37
No, they're terrorists. They're narco terrorists.
15:40
They're bringing drugs into a nation with the intent of
15:45
funding terrorist activities and killing or addicting American
15:51
citizens. So the end game needs to be
15:54
stopped. And so, yeah, when all this said
15:57
and done, you know, terrorism today includes addicting and
16:02
killing Americans. And anybody who's had a loved
16:06
one that becomes addicted or dies knows that this is a a
16:12
deep, this is a deep evil in American Society, and it needs
16:15
to be stopped. And so by by making a public
16:18
example of those who are narco terrorists, you're sending an
16:22
incredibly strong message. And that is you're putting your
16:26
life at risk if you're going to do this kind of evil.
16:29
Evil doesn't stop itself. So it needs to be stopped.
16:31
And when it's stopped in a public way, it discourages
16:35
others from attempting to do evil.
16:38
There is something called the just war theory for Christians.
16:41
And so, you know, those who want to look it up and look at the
16:44
the markers of just work and debate that.
16:48
But but when all is said and done, you can't look at a couple
16:50
of guys in a boat getting blown up and say that it is a it is a
16:55
bad thing or an unjust thing. Especially if you're someone
16:59
that is a pro-choice and you have no problem aborting babies
17:03
because you're not watching it. The only thing that causes
17:06
people consternation on this is they're getting to see it.
17:09
Well, getting to see it is discouraging others from copying
17:12
and doing. It Yeah, yeah, yeah.
17:15
What is the What does the Bible say about war?
17:18
Well, the Bible says thou shalt not murder.
17:20
It doesn't say thou shalt not kill.
17:22
And there is a massive difference between killing and
17:25
murder. You know, murder is taking
17:29
innocent life. And sometimes the Bible requires
17:32
us to kill to stop those who would murder.
17:36
And so sometimes killing is what is required to stop murder.
17:39
If you're a terrorist, if you're an invader for an invader,
17:43
you're a narco terrorist, we have to kill you so you can't
17:46
murder. And so sometimes killing is, you
17:49
know, necessary to stop murder, which is a Gray or evil.
17:53
And so, you know, when when the government decides to end the
17:58
life of people that are going to end innocent life, what they're
18:02
doing is a noble and good thing because they're taking guilty
18:05
life to preserve innocent. And a lot of people will say we
18:08
need to be about peace, peace, peace.
18:09
And Jesus is the Prince of peace.
18:12
He is. And if you read the storyline of
18:13
the Bible, the way that Shalom or peace comes, Jesus returns as
18:18
a warrior. He comes, as you know, the King
18:22
of kings, Lord of Lords. He's riding a White Horse,
18:25
faithful and true. He comes of the sword to avenge
18:28
the nation's and there there is blood that is shed.
18:33
This is the storyline of Revelation.
18:35
And so Jesus in the end is going to return and he's going to
18:37
slaughter his enemies and then usher in peace.
18:41
And so the way that peace comes is through defeat of evil.
18:45
And so those who would say we just need peace, great, then get
18:48
it like Jesus by destroying and defeating evil doers, that that
18:53
literally is how peace comes according to the Bible in the
18:56
example of Jesus. Yeah, everyone's really bothered
18:58
by Pete Hedges. Hedges.
19:02
Yeah, he's he's kind of mocking and being funny a little bit
19:07
about this. I don't know.
19:09
We see, we see in the Bible where God wipes out people
19:12
groups. You're like Old Testament.
19:14
It's like, oh, done. So I don't know, I think I don't
19:19
think we fully understand justice.
19:20
I think we're seeing justice being executed on.
19:24
And I think it's a little uncomfortable, like it's making
19:26
Christians uncomfortable, but it feels closer to how justice is
19:30
actually handled, right? Yeah, and, and if you are a
19:33
person who has sympathy or empathy or compassion for narco
19:38
terrorists, you need to go to Costco and get yourself a soul
19:42
for Christmas. Yeah, Yeah, because there's
19:46
something broken in you. Like I I have compassion for
19:49
women, children, orphans, narco terrorists, Not so much.
19:55
Yeah, it's a weird thing when the Christians defending the
19:57
narco. Yeah, when the Christians are
19:58
like, Oh my gosh, they blew up the narco terrorists.
20:01
It's like, thank you. Yeah, and they're mad that he's
20:06
joking that he needs to. He's, I guess there's some
20:09
controversy that he said they should be using a bigger missile
20:12
because there was like a couple survivors.
20:15
He doesn't want to process them. I mean, well, I can't believe
20:18
anything you read in the media. I mean, if it's in the media,
20:21
it's probably not true. For sure, for sure.
20:26
Yeah. So, so your your view is that we
20:28
probably aren't going to war with Venezuela?
20:30
We're not going to war with Venezuela.
20:32
We don't need to go to war with Venezuela.
20:35
We are telling Venezuela, hey, narco, terrorism is not welcome.
20:40
And we're sending a message to Mexico and China, who are the
20:43
really big bad actors. And we are, we are advocating
20:49
peace through strength. And this is like if you move
20:52
into a neighborhood where there's a bunch of bad kids, and
20:56
if one kid comes up and picks a fight with you and you punch him
20:59
in the nose, the other kids realize, hey, that's not the kid
21:02
in the neighborhood you want to pick on.
21:04
And if if you're the Big Brother in the house, this is how you
21:07
protect your brothers and sisters, you have the first
21:10
fight so you don't have to have all the other fights.
21:13
Yep, 100%. I think, I think we are becoming
21:18
a bit of a bit of a sheriff. People are taking a serious
21:20
again and I think it makes people uncomfortable, but that's
21:24
why they're not called to lead the nation and be the secretary
21:27
of war. So I would honor our governing
21:30
authorities and trust them to do what is right and they're
21:33
accountable for the Lord. And based on what we can tell,
21:37
even Pete is submitting to the King of Kings.
21:41
He loves Jesus, he's praying about these things.
21:43
And you know, what really upsets me is not blowing up narco
21:46
terrorists, but how we how we exited Afghanistan.
21:50
That's what bothers me. Next one up, University of
21:54
Oklahoma. The people that are supposed to
21:56
be the most tolerant again are the least tolerant of all.
22:00
At the University of Oklahoma, a student was recently failed on
22:03
an essay assignment about gender after quoting the Bible as part
22:06
of their argument. Not hate speech, not a threat,
22:09
not name calling, just scripture, just the Christian
22:11
worldview. Just a student giving the
22:13
professor exactly what the assignment asked for, an
22:16
explanation of their perspective on gender.
22:20
Yeah, this blew up. I think a student got 0 out of
22:23
25 and it was a Christian girl as I remember the story, and
22:29
just said there was 2 genders, male, female, binary gender
22:33
category. And this is where it used to be.
22:40
You send your kid to college, spend a lot of money so that
22:43
they could get a degree, and then have a modicum of
22:47
credibility in the marketplace to get a job that would lead to
22:50
a career that would generate enough revenue to provide for a
22:53
family and a future. Well, today, a lot of what you
22:57
get in the university we now know is not education, it's
23:01
indoctrination, and it's not preparation for a career.
23:05
Like, arguing over gender doesn't prepare you to generate
23:09
any revenue. There's like, there's nobody in
23:12
the world that is going to pay you to be a, you know, an expert
23:15
on pronouns. There's no job that it.
23:17
It's a requirement. No, no, it's just nonsense and
23:21
it it's just foolishness. And so you know #1 as a parent,
23:25
you've got to really do your due diligence if you're a Christian
23:28
and ask, is college worth it for my kid?
23:31
And am I sending them to a college that their faithfulness
23:34
to Christianity would cause them to not even be able to graduate
23:38
from this college? You know, I mean, in this case,
23:42
I believe the Bible. Then you flunk.
23:44
Well, OK then this means all the money that I am paying leaves me
23:49
one of two options. I deny Christ so that I can
23:54
graduate, or I am faithful to Christ and I just set a pile of
23:59
money on fire and I don't graduate.
24:01
Well, this is a double bind. It's a lose lose.
24:05
And so, you know, for a lot of families now you got to be
24:07
asking the question like, why are we sending our child to
24:10
college? And what college if we are
24:12
sending them, are we sending them to and do they hate our God
24:15
and hate our values? And it's really, I mean, it
24:20
really is tragic that it is come to this because truth.
24:25
So Christians believe in something called the
24:27
correspondence theory of truth. This is a philosophical idea.
24:31
Truth is that which corresponds to reality.
24:34
And if you believe something that doesn't correspond to
24:37
reality, it's not true. So like, I could tell you, you
24:40
know, this is a pink minotaur and it's not because it doesn't
24:45
correspond to reality. I could tell you that I'm an
24:47
Asian woman and I'm not because it doesn't correspond with
24:51
reality. And so, you know, even the
24:53
atheist, like Richard Dawkins have said, when it comes to
24:56
biology, it's pretty obvious there's only two genders.
25:00
And So what we're not talking about are facts.
25:03
What we're talking about are feelings.
25:07
And so when you start basing reality not based upon external
25:11
facts, but people's internal feelings, now what you've lost
25:15
sight of is reality. And now you're into the realm of
25:18
mental health, you know, And so if if people feel things, so you
25:23
heard people say like I'm a man trapped in a woman's body.
25:26
Well, what that means is you don't have a problem with your
25:29
body. You have a problem with your
25:30
mind. Your body is fine.
25:33
You have a mental health issue. And so you can either, you know,
25:37
change your body or you could change your mind.
25:40
And, you know, when it comes to universities, they have now
25:43
decided that mental illness is something that is going to be
25:46
championed. And so are, you know, are we
25:49
encouraging mental illness? Yes, we are.
25:53
And as a Christian parent, the question is how much of that do
25:56
you want to fund and how much of that do you want to subject your
26:00
child to? And at what point does a
26:04
Christian have a right to say, hey, if we're going to do
26:07
diversity, equity and inclusion in addition to LBGTQIA, can we
26:14
get in the alphabet soup? See Christian, Is there a place
26:18
for those who are Bible based believers?
26:21
And the answer is no, DEI doesn't include Christian, and
26:27
the alphabet soup has no place for C.
26:30
Yeah, and you saw the professor was trans.
26:33
I didn't know that, but of course they are.
26:34
Yeah, of course they are. Yeah, I the way this is a little
26:39
bit taking a sidestep, talking with Ashley, the way I convinced
26:44
her on homeschool. Do you want to send your child
26:48
to spend the most time at some government school or even if
26:53
private schools are good? But think about who's teaching
26:56
your child. It's usually a middle-aged
26:58
female who's liberal and probably single and she's
27:03
probably making 40 to $60,000 a year.
27:05
There's some great teachers. So caveat with that.
27:08
There are some great God loving teachers out there, but for the
27:11
majority they are single women that lean left and they don't
27:15
make a lot of money. Do I want my son spending the
27:18
majority of his time for years with those type of people?
27:22
They're going to turn them into something.
27:24
So everyone's shocked when their kids come back from college a
27:26
liberal. Well, if you send them to
27:29
elementary, middle, high school with a bunch of liberals and
27:32
then you send them to college where these people are supposed
27:34
to be varsity to teach you, no, they're not varsity.
27:37
They're they're a bunch of losers that couldn't do a field.
27:41
So they went and taught those who can't do teach.
27:44
I went to an entrepreneurship college at Point Loma.
27:46
Point Loma has gone very woke recently.
27:48
You sent me an article on it. It's it's wild.
27:51
They're actually kicking out a Turning Point faith chapter at
27:57
their school. But I had an entrepreneurship
28:00
degree there and the professor just failed 10 businesses and
28:03
then started teaching. Like that's not a guy I want to
28:05
learn from. No successful entrepreneurs
28:07
going to go teach school. Maybe in there when they've got
28:10
a lot of Gray hair, they would, but a lot of these people they
28:13
can't do so they teach and they're very liberal and then
28:16
they want to teach all your kids and then pass or fail them on
28:18
gender because they pull the Bible and they're like, no, I
28:21
disagree with that. And so this kids going to have a
28:23
really hard time making it through college if they want to
28:25
hold to their values or they're just going to change their
28:27
values because why is it it's not worth it to make it through
28:30
college or to hold to my values and then get flunked out.
28:34
I'm just going to cave to whatever they want me to say to
28:38
put put your kids in a really hard spot.
28:39
If you push them to go to college and then they go to a
28:41
State College and this is what they got.
28:44
Well, this is in Oklahoma, which is about as bright red as it
28:47
gets. Well, that and too, when kids
28:50
are growing up, they tend to think that adults know what
28:53
they're talking about in a right.
28:55
And then you reach a certain point where you realize adults
28:59
don't know what they're talking about.
29:00
But, but usually that's somewhere in your mid to late
29:03
20s or 30s, you know, and usually in your until you're,
29:08
you know, mid 20s. So most college kids and most
29:11
high school kids generally, they still think that adults know
29:14
what they're talking about. The whole time your kids brains
29:16
are being formed all the way up till they're like 26 that you're
29:19
outsourcing who's you're surrounding them with.
29:22
Well, you don't know. You've never had a cup.
29:24
Not, not you. But these, you don't.
29:26
You've never had a cup of coffee with these professors.
29:28
And they're teaching your kids. And so they're the older, wiser
29:32
people. And so, yeah, I think parents
29:35
should be very careful on whether or not they send their
29:37
kids to college far away. I think there's a new study that
29:40
recently came out that the most successful kids stay in their
29:43
hometown and go to college. Yeah, keep the family
29:47
relationship and dynamics intact.
29:49
And also, too, if you're going to go to college, have an end
29:51
game with a a job. Yeah, you know, you're like,
29:54
well, what are you going to what job?
29:56
Like, I don't know what's I don't know.
29:59
Well, you need to know because you're setting money on fire.
30:01
I think the best thing a young person can do is take a gap
30:04
year, do an internship. Go go.
30:06
Actually do that. Go do something.
30:08
Go surf somewhere. Figure out what God's calling
30:11
you to before you jump into college and just figure it out.
30:15
Or go to a trade school, You know, go into what you know,
30:19
Charlie Kirk called the muscular class, you know, go, go get a
30:22
trade. And often times the trades, they
30:25
will pay you to get certified for the trades.
30:28
You're actually not going into debt.
30:30
And you can actually go into the trades and make a six figure
30:33
income, provide for a family and have job security as opposed to
30:38
a psychology degree, a sociology degree, or an ethnomusicology
30:42
degree which will get you cuts in the unemployment line but not
30:45
a viable income. Yeah, and I think young people
30:48
aren't realizing how little a degree matters now, far more
30:52
matters. How you interview, what job
30:54
skills you have, where you volunteered.
30:56
I've hired over 100 people in the last five years.
30:59
And I've. I'm not looking for a college
31:02
degree in some roles that makes sense.
31:05
Specific roles like an accounting role or something
31:07
like that. It could be helpful.
31:08
But very few times in my life did you get a Bachelor of Arts,
31:12
crate front of a line like it. It really doesn't matter.
31:16
Get started earlier. Getting a job.
31:18
Yeah. Character, work ethic and proven
31:22
ability to move up in an organization because of
31:25
productivity and value. That's the long term play.
31:29
Yep, A. 100% we'll be praying for the Yeah, that's for
31:34
University of Oklahoma. Glad they stood up for their
31:37
values and. But to get a 0 out of 25, I
31:42
mean, you know, like nothing. That's hard.
31:45
Usually in college if you put your name on the paper you get
31:48
more than 0. Totally.
31:51
Yeah, I think that's a yeah. And I it's, it's a good thing it
31:55
got national news. Yeah, it's an example.
31:58
It's an example, so praise God for that.
32:00
Yeah, it it stinks for them so. It's Giving Tuesday here at Real
32:05
Faith. We're asking you to give a very
32:08
generous year end gift. Every dollar you give will be
32:12
matched thanks to generous ministry partners up to
32:16
$500,000. That'll help us get non woke
32:21
Bible teaching out to the world. Pastor Landon, you and the team
32:24
have had an incredible year. How many people have we reached
32:28
and what is God doing and how can we multiply it?
32:31
Just this year it's 300 million people reach with the gospel and
32:34
we just get the craziest, most awesome stories every single
32:38
week from people in small towns where there there are no
32:40
churches or we had a 98 year old get saved the other day that
32:44
survived Nazi Germany and then get saved at 98 now.
32:48
So just really, really cool to hear all the incredible
32:51
testimonies. We have a a good solid team here
32:54
in Scottsdale getting the Bible teaching out and we are grateful
32:58
for all them. We're building headquarters.
32:59
We're trying to get that finished.
33:00
We're trying to fund that. And really it's just going to be
33:03
setting our foundation for the next season to reach more and
33:06
more people with the gospel and courageous Bible teaching.
33:09
So we have we are almost there guys.
33:11
We need you to stand tall, step up, help us join the mission
33:15
because you guys may just be, you may be working a job, but
33:18
this is the way you get involved in this ministry.
33:20
We consider you a partner in the ministry, doing it alongside us.
33:24
When you support us, when you jump in and fund it, it is like
33:28
you're here yourself. So we are grateful.
33:30
We are thankful. And yeah, just thank you for
33:32
considering it. All right, Pastor Mark Christmas
33:35
segment we're just looking at budgeting unity of vision for a
33:41
couple holidays are stressful, lots of conflict.
33:44
You just wrote a book, fixed your family system heading into
33:47
the holidays because a lot of people are.
33:49
It's one in four people are estranged from a loved one or
33:52
semi loved one. Extended family member.
33:55
Yeah, love. Loved one and if you, if you're
34:01
not estranged from anyone, you're probably the problem.
34:05
But yeah, just just wanted to talk about Christmas as as we
34:08
head into it. Yeah.
34:10
Well, during the holiday season, it can be hard, obviously,
34:13
because there is this expectation that everybody's
34:17
going to get together. And so like in the book Fix Your
34:20
Family System and the workbook, we talked about enmeshment,
34:24
where everybody sticks together even if it's unhealthy,
34:27
dysfunctional. There's no boundaries between
34:30
the families cut off where, you know, you don't have any
34:33
relationship, you're not talking, you're not together.
34:36
And then differentiation, which is the ideal.
34:38
And that is like, you get married, you got your family,
34:41
they get married, they get their family and then the families get
34:44
together for the holidays. But the families honor one
34:46
another and they figure out like, OK, how do we get our
34:49
families together in a way that all the families are considered
34:52
in the families, you know, they get along, they get together.
34:56
And we're, we're considerate of all the families for the, for
35:01
the holiday season. 1 of the things that comes up as well.
35:05
And we're seeing it in the reporting for a lot of the
35:08
couples, especially the young couples this year, things cost
35:11
more money, expenses are really high, budgets are really tight.
35:17
A lot of families, but especially a lot of young
35:19
families with young children like you, with Cowboy Andy, he's
35:23
awesome. A lot of the families are
35:25
feeling the pinch for the holidays and sometimes it causes
35:28
strain for the couples on, you know, how much to spend for the
35:32
holidays and and how to really make great memories with the
35:36
kid. So how would you explain that
35:40
for the young couples that have got the little kids, maybe money
35:44
is tight, but they do want to make awesome family memories for
35:48
the holidays and they want to be generous toward their kid.
35:50
I think, yeah, I, I think it's a great question.
35:53
I think your kids will very rarely remember an item.
36:00
They will not remember something materialistic, but they'll have
36:03
memories of events and fun quality time.
36:07
And the thing you have when you're broke and young is a lot
36:10
of time. So there's so many free
36:12
Christmas activities. It's so cheap to go make hot
36:15
chocolate and walk around the neighborhood of Christmas
36:17
lights. I know Ashley, that's some of
36:19
her favorite memories with you is hot cocoa and Christmas
36:22
lights. And I think we buy into the lie
36:24
that we need to spend a lot of money around the holidays to
36:26
make memories. You don't.
36:28
And it's pretty easy with kids. Everything is exciting and fun.
36:31
There's thrift stores, there's all kinds of things.
36:33
You can get awesome stuff for your kids.
36:36
And then for gifts outside of your kids, I think you need to
36:40
be a lot more thoughtful and meaningful.
36:42
And that can be a really nice card to your parents, I think.
36:46
Or hey, go take that friend out to lunch for Christmas rather
36:50
than a gift. Like quality time, I think means
36:52
a lot more in this world than we we let on.
36:56
And as a young couple, you have a lot more time than you do
36:59
money. And nobody's expecting you to
37:02
take on debt to do all these things to make Christmas happen.
37:05
Because very, I don't remember what I got last Christmas.
37:08
Like, sorry, you guys got me something.
37:10
It was probably great, but I remember Christmas, the time
37:12
together. And I think most people are like
37:14
that. I was looking up stats. 28% of
37:18
young couples are still paying off the debt from last Christmas
37:22
that like you should not go into debt for Christmas like that is
37:26
it might mean something to you because you feel like money.
37:28
You need to be generous on money. 28% of you still being in
37:31
debt from last Christmas. Don't buy any gifts this year.
37:35
Actually my brother and it was sweet of him at the time he was
37:39
like 18 or 19, he really wanted to get gifts for the family.
37:42
He went and got a credit card and bought every $100.00 gift
37:46
cards to like a restaurant or something but he went into debt
37:51
to. Do it and it.
37:52
Was a good heart, but none of us needed him to do that.
37:55
If if you would have just wrote a nice note, that would have
37:57
meant a ton. And I think we buy into the lie
38:00
of consumerism that we need to spend a lot of money.
38:02
That means something meant something to us.
38:05
I think young couples should be very careful on spending money.
38:08
Definitely don't go into debt. We talked about the 50 year
38:11
mortgage and a lot of people got upset about that.
38:13
That's debt that helps you build a legacy.
38:16
Christmas gifts and overspending money you don't have.
38:18
That is not that you should be going into.
38:20
You have plenty of other ways to give good gifts.
38:23
And if it's your spouse and you're tight on money, hey, let,
38:27
let's, let's go do something together.
38:29
Let's, let's go for a long walk and talk about what we're
38:31
grateful of about each other to each other.
38:34
That'll mean a lot. Start.
38:35
Start meaningful traditions. I don't think money is tied to
38:39
meaningfulness around the holidays.
38:41
Yeah. And.
38:42
I mean, I'll be honest, like as a as a dad with grown kids, the
38:46
greatest Christmas present would be a long letter.
38:50
I would keep that and read it over and over and over, you
38:55
know, time, going to breakfast, going to lunch, going for a
38:58
walk. I mean, and and yeah, as your
39:03
kids get older gifts, I mean, I can buy myself whatever I want,
39:08
you know, but it's the time and the memories and and just just
39:13
as a a thought to kids, remember what you repeat.
39:19
So like, as you're building your traditions, if there's something
39:22
you do repeatedly for even a holiday, they'll remember that
39:26
as adults who like when you mentioned it with Ashley, your
39:30
wife or oldest daughter. When the kids were little, we
39:33
would put them all in their pyjamas.
39:35
We get them all hot cocoa. We'd put them all in the car and
39:38
I get all the classic Christmas music, Bing Crosby and all that.
39:41
And there were certain neighborhoods that had the
39:42
awesome holiday lights. We'd roll the windows down, we
39:46
drive through and we go see all the Christmas lights.
39:48
And that was holiday. Those were one of the holiday
39:52
traditions. We did it every year.
39:54
And then what you're building is anticipation.
39:58
And part of the fun is the anticipation and they know what
40:02
to expect and they're looking forward to it.
40:04
And then you're you're stacking memory upon memory.
40:08
And you're right, those are the things that they.
40:11
Remember, I mean, and like there's certain things, like we
40:14
took some great international trips and there's some memories
40:16
there. But some of the kids, we got the
40:18
whole countries and they don't remember them totally, but they
40:20
remember the hot chocolate that we had seven years in a row.
40:23
Yeah, I, I think, I think. We, we're, we're sold a lie
40:27
through ads, commercials, all that stuff right now on buy this
40:30
that shows love, buy this that that shows you care.
40:33
I, I don't think it's about buying or spending money.
40:35
That's not what Christmas is about.
40:37
Christmas is about quality time, memories and traditions.
40:40
And you don't have to spend any money to do that.
40:42
And so I would caution the young couple to to think about it.
40:46
Don't just fall prey to what all the ads on your phone say you
40:51
should be doing for the holidays.
40:53
Get a unified vision with your spouse and think through what do
40:57
we want our kids to remember? And we're really doing that.
41:00
And last night we decorated for Christmas.
41:02
We blasted a a Christmas movie. Indy went and turned the record
41:06
player on with Christmas music, too.
41:09
We had cookies. He really wasn't helpful, but it
41:11
was really fun. And we put up ornaments
41:14
everywhere and he did race cars and a joyful environment.
41:18
A kid will remember. I can't remember 1 toy I got
41:21
growing up. So I think yeah, I would not
41:25
equate money to love, especially around the holidays.
41:28
Cool. Yeah, I think that's great.
41:29
I think it's building the. Memories.
41:31
The the last thing I will say just as a a thought, get as many
41:35
photos and get as many videos as you can during the holidays
41:38
because it moves fast. And then it's really fun to
41:41
revisit them. And then when the kids get
41:44
older, like couple years ago for Christmas, I went through and I
41:48
took all the photos and videos of their childhood and I gave it
41:51
to them and now they get to watch those photos and videos
41:55
with their kids. So now, you know, the grandkids
41:58
get to see their mom and dad when they were little, and their
42:01
spouses get to see them before they met.
42:03
And so capture the memories now. And in 20 or 30 years, they're
42:07
going to share them with their family.
42:09
And. And that honestly is really
42:12
super fun. Yeah.
42:13
It's, it's a blast. And.
42:15
Indy loves Indy, loves his Mama, loves his grandpa, and then
42:18
loves I. I think he's like trying to
42:20
grasp the concept that she was your little girl.
42:23
And yeah, he doesn't fully get that, but he's trying.
42:26
He's trying. Awesome.
42:28
Well, the holidays will be a blast.
42:30
It's my favorite time of the year.
42:32
All right, next one, your favorite time of the year.
42:35
Time to talk about Christianity Today.
42:38
All right, so Christianity Today, the old flagship founded
42:43
by Billy Graham himself, has announced a new CEO doctor
42:47
Pastor Nicole Martin. CT has always branded themselves
42:52
as the middle Rd. for evangelicals, but Martin's
42:55
background, her public comments, and her theological position
42:58
signal something very different from what Billy Graham and Karl
43:00
Henry originally built. She pastors in a politically
43:04
aggressive, progressive AME church.
43:07
She publicly lamented Democrat election losses.
43:11
Like Kamala, she advocates for women's ordination and
43:14
ecclesiastical leadership. And during her time at the
43:17
American Bible Society, the organization went through major
43:20
turbulent CEO turnover, board upheaval, deficits and a shift
43:24
towards trauma healing work rather than Bible engagement.
43:27
So where is Christianity Today headed?
43:30
Yeah, so this is so. Evangelicalism sadly, has gone
43:37
soft woke to woke that that's it.
43:41
So the hard woke with an evangelicalism is compromised on
43:46
issues of inerrancy of scripture.
43:48
They have gone soft on issues of binary gender, marriage for one
43:54
man, one woman, issues of sexuality and transgenderism.
43:59
There's an there's an orbit of woke, we call them woke issues
44:04
that evangelicalism has either gone hard woke on, meaning
44:07
they've just caved, or soft woke, meaning they won't talk
44:11
about or they talk about in such a nuanced way that it's total
44:15
fog. There's not clarity as to where
44:18
they stand theologically. So Christianity Today is one of
44:24
those historic flagship institutions that helped create,
44:30
define, defend evangelicalism. There's been other schools,
44:35
publishing houses within any movement.
44:39
There's Bible translations, there's publishing houses,
44:42
there's magazines, there's colleges and universities,
44:46
there's seminaries, there's conferences, there's radio
44:51
programs and platforms. There's certain, there's a
44:55
certain ecosystem of content contributors that both define
45:01
and defend what is and is not the boundaries and the, the
45:07
guardrails for evangelicalism. And so, so the Billy Graham was
45:14
kind of the the godfather and, and he was the senior leader of
45:17
evangelicalism. And what really drove him
45:21
obviously is he is in a van. He was an evangelist, and an
45:24
evangelist is repenting of sin. And someone who's woke or soft
45:29
woke, they're not an evangelist because they don't preach
45:33
repentance of sin. They preach tolerance of sin and
45:36
they lose sight of calling out repentance of sin in the name of
45:40
empathy or compassion, which really isn't loving you.
45:44
You don't love someone and you don't really have compassion for
45:47
them unless you call them the repent of sin.
45:50
Because the best thing for them is not for you to tolerate their
45:53
sin, but for them to repent of their sin so that they can be
45:57
right with God. And So what we're seeing in
46:00
evangelicalism is a slide both to the left and to the South.
46:04
We're seeing it in the denominations, we're seeing it
46:07
in the networks, We're seeing it in the publishing houses, we're
46:11
seeing it in the conferences, we're seeing it in the colleges
46:14
and universities. We're seeing it in the
46:15
seminaries. It is a, it is a, it is a slow
46:19
avalanche to the South and to the left.
46:23
And so evangelicalism is, is running to the place of
46:29
irrelevance. It is, if not at the end of its
46:35
relevance, it is nearing the end of its relevance.
46:39
And it needs to be replaced either by a reformation where it
46:45
gets cleaned up, or a new wineskin where we move on to
46:51
something that is more pure to the gospel and less corrupted
46:57
by, by donor dollars and by Democratic operatives.
47:04
And so with Christianity Today. They they actually in my not
47:11
just my opinion in the the lawyers they wanted to take the
47:14
case, committed crimes against me for extended period of time,
47:18
libel, slander, defamation, untruths, horrific attacks.
47:24
Some things are partly true, some things are maybe it's true,
47:29
most of which are completely altogether untrue.
47:31
And I won't even give them the dignity of a response because
47:35
they're so reprehensible and deplorable.
47:37
And when we stand before the Lord Jesus Christ, I will have a
47:40
very good day and they will have a very bad day.
47:44
And I, I have the Longview of things and a very clear
47:46
conscience and, and Christianity Today has, has now publicly lost
47:57
sight of what it means to be distinctively Christian because
48:05
Billy Graham founded it. And today that same institution
48:11
despises Franklin Graham, his son, who is preaching the same
48:16
gospel and running the same organization.
48:20
And the person now running it, I don't know them personally.
48:25
It is not a personal attack. This is not any bitterness, but
48:29
they are a trustee on the board of Fuller Seminary.
48:33
Fuller Seminary is completely apostate and woke and Fuller
48:39
Seminary a while ago dropped inerrancy of Scripture.
48:43
One of the Co founders of Christianity Today in addition
48:47
to Billy Graham's Karl Henry. Karl Henry wrote a series called
48:52
Revelation and Authority where he's talking about the
48:55
perfection and authority and inerrancy of Scripture.
48:58
That was a bedrock principle for both Billy Graham and Karl
49:02
Henry, and that was a bedrock for Christianity Today.
49:05
Fuller Seminary fully denied it a while ago and it's been a full
49:10
erosion at Fuller Seminary. If you just go to Fuller
49:13
Seminary's website today, they've got all their pronouns
49:18
and they're LGBTQIA and they're trans pro and they're pro gay.
49:23
And one of their professors, because he has a gay son, has
49:28
made the argument, tried to make the most cogent, credible
49:33
biblical air quotes argument for homosexuality within
49:39
evangelicalism, trying to weaponize the Bible to support
49:43
homosexuality. And if you want to know why
49:46
that's a bad idea, just read Romans one sober and you'll come
49:52
to the right conclusion. It's an abomination.
49:55
And so all of that is Fuller Seminary.
49:57
If you're a trustee on the board of that school, that means that
50:01
you have authority over it and you're blessing it.
50:05
Like, there is not a possibility that I could even walk onto the
50:11
campus of Fuller Seminary without triggering security.
50:16
That's true. Like they would call security.
50:19
Like Mark Driscoll is here, something bad is probably going
50:23
to happen because we should go do that.
50:27
That'd be a fun video. You walking around liberal,
50:31
Christian liberal. Christian universities just with
50:34
the camera crew, but nothing else, just.
50:36
Reading Romans 1. Just reading Romans, one guys
50:40
write that you write that the. Latest good idea?
50:44
Because you're, you're either prophetic or you're pathetic.
50:48
And these schools are pathetic. They are not prophetic.
50:51
And and so the result of it ultimately becomes they have
50:56
denied the full authority and perfection of the Word of God.
51:01
And so this isn't personal, this is biblical.
51:04
And when you deny the full authority of the Word of God and
51:09
you edit what God has said on issues regarding sex, marriage,
51:13
and gender, at that point you have gone apostate.
51:17
You have abandoned the faith that was once for all delivered
51:21
unto the Saints. And you are someone who has you
51:26
have compromised to the degree that you no longer have any
51:30
credibility. And so where is Christianity?
51:34
I think Megan Bastian has done a great job out of Daily Wire
51:37
showing that it is run by Democratic operatives.
51:41
I think she has shown that they've made people that have
51:46
been on the board there at Christianity have made some.
51:49
I think it's 300 campaign contributions, 0 to Republicans,
51:55
zero. They took a lot of government
51:57
money. They.
51:58
Took over $1,000,000. From the USAID fund and then
52:03
they came out and said don't vote or vote for Kamala Harris
52:08
being funded by the Biden administration.
52:12
This is called a hireling in the Old Testament.
52:15
It's called a whore. It's called a whore and it, it
52:20
means you can pay me and I'll do whatever you want.
52:25
And it's like, no, the church is supposed to be a bride and a
52:29
bride is faithful to the groom and isn't for sale.
52:33
And so, you know, what we're seeing now is evangelical
52:38
institutions are being overtaken by dollars and by people that
52:43
have progressive ideologies. They want to get into board
52:47
seats so that they can either change the messaging going out
52:52
to evangelical voters, or they can encourage evangelicals to
52:56
not vote or be politically activated or to become
53:01
progressive and liberal. And so I don't know this woman,
53:05
but she did lament the loss of Kamala Harris in the last
53:09
election. And we know for a fact, just
53:12
because of their public stance that the leadership of
53:16
Christianity is pretty much all Democrats and pro Kamala Harris
53:20
and and the Harris Walsh campaign.
53:22
So a watershed issue for evangelicals should be life.
53:28
And the Harris Waltz campaign was the most pro death ticket in
53:34
the history of the United States of America.
53:38
And it is absolutely pro abortion to a degree and and
53:46
late term abortion to a degree that we have never seen in the
53:49
history of the nation. And so to me this is
53:54
unspeakable. It is despicable, it is
53:56
reprehensible. And in light of the trajectory
54:00
of Christianity, it is inevitable.
54:03
Yep, I I totally agree. What would Billy Graham say to
54:08
Russell Moore? I have no.
54:11
Idea. I think you should ask Franklin
54:13
because I think the best person that would know what Billy would
54:18
think today, what Billy would say today, what Billy would want
54:21
today would be Franklin and he said in 20. 19 There that that
54:26
was when the world kind of shifted from neutral to
54:29
negative, negative world with the Trump administration.
54:33
Frank that Franklin Graham said that the magazine betrayed his
54:37
father and betrayed everything his father worked for.
54:40
So yeah, if they need a president.
54:44
I would say Franklin Graham would be a great candidate.
54:46
He would be. He absolutely would be.
54:48
Yeah, I appreciate Franklin. I honor Franklin.
54:54
He is true to the gospel of Jesus Christ and he is a
54:58
compassionate Christian who is preaching good news and doing
55:01
good deeds. And he is the kind of man who is
55:05
a good representative of the gospel of Jesus Christ and he is
55:09
caring forth the values of his father.
55:12
And as a father, a son like that is a son to be proud of and and
55:18
what they are doing to the legacy of his father.
55:21
It is damnable. Billy Graham is a wonderful man.
55:25
I had the honor of meeting him on a few occasions.
55:28
I don't. We have a minute.
55:30
Did I ever tell you my Billy Graham story?
55:32
You did. But you haven't told them.
55:33
OK. So I was.
55:35
A brand new Christian I was God spoke to me and said Mary Grace
55:40
preach the Bible, train men, plant churches.
55:42
I was a brand new Christian. I was working as a bellman,
55:46
shuttle driver, concierge at a Marriott Hotel, making money
55:51
just, you know, during the summer and during the the
55:54
holiday breaks. And, you know, I'm schlepping
55:58
bags and running around to Marriott and there's this old
56:01
guy sitting in a restaurant. They get a Minnesota Twins ball
56:05
cap on and he's reading a newspaper with some big glasses
56:07
on. And I thought, Dang, that looks
56:10
like Billy Graham. That looks like Billy Graham.
56:13
I was like, surely Billy Graham can't be in Seattle, WA at the
56:16
Marriott. No security, nobody around.
56:19
So I walk up and I was like, excuse me, Sir, can I ask you a
56:23
question? He's like, yeah.
56:24
And I heard his voice. I was like, I think, I think
56:28
that's Billy Graham. I said, are you Billy Graham?
56:32
He said, yes, I am. I was like, there's nobody here.
56:36
Like it's just me and Billy Graham.
56:39
He's having breakfast at the Marriott.
56:41
And I heard, I later found out, I think he was a 5 Diamond
56:43
member. So the Marriott family gave a
56:46
lifetime membership to a certain number of people that they could
56:50
stay at any Marriott in the world as long as they wanted, as
56:52
many rooms as they needed at no charge.
56:54
That's great. So he had, I think another one
56:59
of his kids and his grandkids live nearby.
57:02
And so he said, well, who are you?
57:05
I was like, well, I'm, I'm Mark and he's like, well, tell me
57:08
about yourself. And he actually cared.
57:09
And I was like, this is wild. I was like, well, I'm a new
57:13
Christian. God just saved me and he's
57:15
called me into ministry. And thank you, Doctor Graham.
57:18
I don't want to bother you. I love you.
57:19
And I'm just kind of stumbling over my words.
57:21
I'm kind of in awe. And he's like, oh, you're called
57:24
into ministry. I said, yeah, he's like, well,
57:26
tell me about that. So I told him about my call and
57:30
he said, he said, I promise I'll be praying for you that God
57:33
anoints you to preach the gospel.
57:34
I was like, well, thank you, doctor.
57:36
I'm like, I'm shocked. I'm like, and so I'm, I'm
57:38
staying there talking to him. We talked for a while, and then
57:42
other people in the restaurant and other coworkers recognize
57:45
it's Billy Graham. Next thing I know, there's a
57:49
bunch of people coming around like, I'm so sorry, Doctor
57:51
Graham, now I've drawn attention to you.
57:54
A lot of people want to meet with you.
57:57
I'm sorry. And he's like, no, it's OK.
57:59
He sat there for a couple of hours, so cool.
58:05
He prayed over housekeepers. That's awesome.
58:10
He had he. Had employees that were totally
58:13
not Christians taking the Gideon's Bible and wanting him
58:16
to sign them and he's telling them where to start reading it.
58:20
He gave them Bible reading assignments.
58:22
We had people that were guests at the hotel bringing their kids
58:26
up and putting them on Billy Graham's lap like he was Santa
58:29
Claus. And he was.
58:31
This was before cell phones and everything, and he's praying
58:33
over them. Billy Graham sat there, no
58:36
security for a couple of hours, no cameras, no media.
58:42
He was sharing the gospel with my employees, my, my Co workers,
58:47
my Co employees and I I had to drive the shuttle to the airport
58:51
because every 15 minutes we had to go pick people up.
58:54
And I'm bringing bags in. Billy's still there.
58:57
Billy's still going. Billy's stop praying for people.
59:00
Billy's still leading people to Christ.
59:03
So I'm like a couple of hours. I'm like, this is Billy Graham.
59:07
Yeah, so cool. And I saw him later, before he
59:10
died. I, I flew out and I got to meet
59:12
him before he died at the, at his, you know, at the Billy
59:15
Graham headquarters. But I'll close with this.
59:17
So the, the guy who was running the shift at the Marriott was a
59:24
he was the running the front desk, a flamboyantly anti
59:30
Christian gay guy. Perfect.
59:33
Loving this. And.
59:36
He was like, I love Billy. He was like, Billy was such a
59:42
good man. He was so loving and so genuine
59:45
and so kind and was so available.
59:48
He's like, you don't really got me thinking about Jesus because
59:52
if Billy believes in Jesus, just seeing who he really is, he like
59:57
he was starting to win everybody over.
1:00:00
So cool. I was like.
1:00:01
Incredible. That's Billy.
1:00:03
Yeah, that's incredible. That's Billy.
1:00:05
I love it. So I not like I knew Billy, but
1:00:07
my 1 intersection with Billy Graham in my life as a young
1:00:11
man, it was it was one of the most memorable days of my whole
1:00:17
life. Yeah, it it probably shaped how
1:00:19
you did. Ministry the next 30 years,
1:00:21
yeah. And when he said he, he.
1:00:23
He promised he was going to pray for me in an anointing.
1:00:27
You got to believe that guy, yeah.
1:00:28
Absolutely. Well, it's the Christmas season,
1:00:32
and here at the Mark Driscoll Show, we want to remind you that
1:00:36
our God came into the world and he gave us himself as the
1:00:41
greatest gift that's ever been given.
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And that reminds us that everything that we have is a
1:00:46
gift from our God and He entrusts all to us to steward,
1:00:51
to invest, to make the most of. And so as we are considering the
1:00:56
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1:00:59
given us during this holiday season, we want to help you be a
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1:02:27
Happy holidays. Merry Christmas the AI
1:02:30
Christian. Song top of the charts Wild.
1:02:33
Feels like it'd be a little concerning.
1:02:35
For all. Christians soulless being
1:02:38
technology, writing a worship song that somehow made at the
1:02:42
top of the chart. So we're going to play a clip of
1:02:44
that and then we'll wrap up. Lord, I'm tired.
1:03:32
charts faster mark. It's well, at least I think he'd
1:03:34
lived. In Lucy.
1:03:35
Sounds like a man that's. True and so so this is the weird
1:03:40
world we're going into. So that's not a real person.
1:03:42
No, that's like that's some some doesn't have feet.
1:03:46
His tired feet. Yeah, no, his tired feet doesn't
1:03:49
have. Any feet never worked.
1:03:50
Yeah, never worked. He's.
1:03:52
A he's. A.
1:03:53
He's a, he's an AI creation. And the, the, the personality,
1:03:57
the persona, the music, it's all fictitious.
1:04:00
It's all AI created. And it was top of the Christian
1:04:03
worship charts this week, which is wild, maybe because everybody
1:04:08
just wanted to hear what an AI song sounded like.
1:04:10
I don't know. But here's, here's all the
1:04:13
questions you got to ask like #1 can some, can something without
1:04:19
a soul worship God? No, no.
1:04:24
So you know, it says that, you know, God took out him and
1:04:27
breathed life into him. So he has a soul, that only
1:04:31
human beings have a soul. And the soul is the deepest,
1:04:33
purest part of who we are. Even when our body dies, Paul
1:04:36
says to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord.
1:04:39
So the soul is the deepest part of who we are.
1:04:41
And it's, it's the, it's the most enduring aspect of our
1:04:45
humanity. Well, you can't worship God
1:04:47
without a soul. And so you, you can't worship
1:04:50
God without a soul. So now you've got you've got
1:04:53
technology creating worship songs where people with the soul
1:04:57
are supposed to worship God, but they're worshipping God with
1:05:02
being led by something that doesn't have a soul.
1:05:06
Now you've got the possibility of the demonic overtaking
1:05:12
artificial intelligence and which is probably pretty hard
1:05:17
for it to overtake. Not at all and creating.
1:05:19
Counterfeit worship and bad theology.
1:05:22
Because people listen to a sermon that they love a few
1:05:25
times. They listen to a song they love
1:05:27
hundreds or thousands of times. Like your favorite song is way
1:05:31
more stuck in your head than your favorite sermon or your
1:05:34
favorite book. And so your music is really,
1:05:37
really, really sticky. And then you start to think
1:05:40
about this is this is where my weird brain goes, think about
1:05:45
like robotics. So let's say now robotics gets
1:05:51
to the point where you can create this guy and he like he's
1:05:55
a functioning, you know, looks like a human being and he can
1:05:58
sing and he can go on tour and he doesn't get tired and, and he
1:06:02
can perform well. Now you can create a hundred of
1:06:05
these guys and he can do shows simultaneously leading worship.
1:06:09
Maybe this guy, maybe this guy actually, I just thought of
1:06:12
this. We create 10,000 of these guys
1:06:15
and a church can hire him to be the worship leader.
1:06:18
Oh gosh, hey, you're looking for a guy.
1:06:20
It's. Hard to find a It's hard to find
1:06:22
a worship guy. This guy's not going to go get
1:06:25
somebody pregnant. He's he.
1:06:28
He doesn't need to get you. Just buy him.
1:06:29
He doesn't need to get paid now you're pro AI.
1:06:34
He's he's, he's. Going to show up for work on
1:06:35
time. He's never going to be hungover.
1:06:37
I think we had a soft spot with Pastor Mark.
1:06:39
We're going to six services. At Trinity Church, this guy,
1:06:43
you, you can work them day and night when you're not working
1:06:46
them, like like a Waymo car, you can rent them out to another
1:06:50
church and generate more income. Like all of a sudden, like I'm
1:06:55
creating a business model. So now what?
1:06:59
Here's what I'm telling all you creatives, you better find a
1:07:02
backup gig because I think you just, you're head toward the
1:07:04
unemployment line. So now what?
1:07:07
You, you could end up literally with this being the replacement
1:07:11
for the entire worship department of the entire church,
1:07:16
maybe. And terrifying and no soul
1:07:19
terrifying. You don't have to pay.
1:07:21
Any CCL license? For songs, yeah, you don't have
1:07:26
to pay the band. You, you don't have to do any
1:07:29
sound checks, nothing. So.
1:07:33
For the Christian, OK, I'll, I don't like that song principle
1:07:40
and it confuses me because there's no depth of emotion that
1:07:43
he's like, he is, he's never experienced any of those things.
1:07:46
It has never experienced any of those things.
1:07:49
For the Christian, it's like, oh, I mean, I like that song.
1:07:51
I'm just going to listen to it like it.
1:07:53
It doesn't matter. Would you say that it matters or
1:07:57
doesn't matter? Would you listen to that?
1:08:00
No, I wouldn't. I to me.
1:08:02
Anything that is Christian needs to come from someone with a soul
1:08:07
that has the Holy Spirit. And unless you have a soul
1:08:12
that's regenerated by the Holy Spirit, what you're doing is not
1:08:16
Christian and it's not worship. It's not going to be long until
1:08:20
we have. An AI preacher, like, hey,
1:08:22
listen to all the best sermons, blah, blah, blah, blah.
1:08:25
All right, create sermons going forward.
1:08:27
That's not like, hard technology to create.
1:08:29
So like, this is a gateway to many things.
1:08:32
Oh yeah. And it's terrifying.
1:08:35
Will you put AI? With robotics and demonic, and I
1:08:44
mean, you could be, you could be resurrecting dead cult leaders,
1:08:48
you could be bringing back dead Pagan religions.
1:08:53
I mean it, it's wild to think about.
1:08:56
But yeah, I mean, you've even got people now that are, you
1:09:00
know, asking Jesus questions on AI and it's, I mean it.
1:09:04
If I'm the demonic, I'm loving the advancement in technology
1:09:09
because if people are gullible or naive enough to think that
1:09:13
this is neutral, then they are very vulnerable to the father of
1:09:16
lies. To me, it's terrifying.
1:09:19
Yeah. It is terrifying, I.
1:09:21
I think there's yeah. And the Pentecostals would say
1:09:24
that music there, there's like with the rhythm and cadence,
1:09:28
everything like they're there can be demonic a lot going on
1:09:32
there. So it is terrifying.
1:09:34
I would avoid it like the plague, not allowing my children
1:09:36
to watch it because it just leads to so many other things.
1:09:40
And it's going to be a door into the church being taken over by
1:09:43
AI and all kinds of things. And we can't hide from it
1:09:46
because it's coming. But we need to be very aware and
1:09:50
not just a sheep just listening and partaking in this stuff so
1:09:54
well. Thank you, Pastor Mark for
1:09:56
today's show. Thank you guys for all tuning
1:09:58
in. It is giving Tuesday.
1:10:00
If you guys appreciate Pastor Mark's ministry, head over to
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realfaith.com/partner. We have a matching gift just
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that ends at midnight. If you guys want to jump in, it
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would mean the world to us. We are so grateful you tuned in
1:10:13
again. And if there's any topics you
1:10:15
want to make sure we hit at some point, drop them in the comments
1:10:18
until next week. Thanks guys.