Latest / Worldview Matters With David Fiorazo / Caleb Collier: Wars, Antisemitism, Zionism, And Secularism

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Caleb Collier: Wars, Antisemitism, Zionism, And Secularism · Worldview Matters With David Fiorazo

• 0:00
  Welcome to World View Matters, discussing controversial issues, discerning current events,
• 0:10
  defending biblical Christianity.
• 0:13
  No topic, off limits.
• 0:16
  And now, here's your host, David Firazzo.
• 0:19
  Hey, friends, thank you so much for tuning in.
• 0:22
  We appreciate you guys.
• 0:24
  Thanks for sharing the podcast.
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  I'm excited to talk about some more very important and relevant topics and have some great discussions
• 0:32
  and a whole another week of shows.
• 0:33
  So I want to bring in our guest today, Caleb Collier, the website, church and state media,
• 0:39
  church and state.media has got a great podcast.
• 0:43
  You can find that on rumble as well, church and state 1776.
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  And on Facebook, church and state, go ahead and like that page.
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  We'll talk about some great things today.
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  It's very interesting topics too with what's going on in the world.
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  Caleb, brother, good to see you again.
• 1:02
  Yes, David, thank you for having me on.
• 1:03
  It's a pleasure.
• 1:04
  Yeah, I watch you sometimes on rumble, other times on NRB.
• 1:10
  And just share with our audience that maybe might not be familiar with you.
• 1:15
  Some of the guests and some of the recent topics you've tackled on church and state.
• 1:19
  Yeah, no, I appreciate the opportunity.
• 1:22
  I'm a former politician and I've worked for a number of different political organizations.
• 1:26
  So I've been in the thick of it in the political theater and I've been a podcaster since 2017.
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  And we've had some amazing guests.
• 1:34
  We've had Vody Bachum and Eric Trump, General Flynn, Dinesh D'Souza,
• 1:39
  just had Dr. Gary Chapman.
• 1:40
  So we've had a bunch of different people that have been on the show and you can actually go to
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  church and state.media and go through all of the different guests and you can just hit their
• 1:48
  pictures and most of them are linked to those episodes.
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  And we just got awarded the top 80 best Christian political podcasts,
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  according to MillionPodcast.com.
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  So it's been a journey, it's been fun.
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  So how long have you been doing your podcast again?
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  Since 2017, I was a city councilman and I got knocked out for being too conservative, too
• 2:13
  libertarian and yeah, like a week later, I got offered a talk radio spot.
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  So I've been doing it ever since.
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  Awesome. Now what state was that where you were running and you held a position?
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  So I live in one of the worst states as far as personal liberty goes and that's Washington state.
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  Oh my goodness.
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  Okay. Well, another friend of the podcast, Heidi St. John is up there in the Northeast,
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  northwest, I should say.
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  So you have had, I told you this last time, you've had some heavy hitters
• 2:42
  on your show and it's just amazing the caliber of guests you have.
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  So I was blessed to be on.
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  I don't know what I was doing on your show, but after I saw the run down, look at all the,
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  I mean, some of those guests, my goodness.
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  But you've been at it for longer.
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  So I guess I've got to continue working.
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  So a lot going on in the world, we have so many things that you and I were emailing back and
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  forth on talking about what is Zionism.
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  We're going to define that in the past year or year and a half.
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  We've had to define Christian nationalism.
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  We had to start with what is nationalism and then what does it mean with Christian nationalism?
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  I mean, it's really interesting.
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  So as we were talking before we got on with some of the
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  preachers and pastors and churches, we've got to define the terms now and explain what is
• 3:34
  biblical Christianity and what is maybe a counterfeit.
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  You want to comment on that briefly before we jump into Israel and Iran and other topics?
• 3:45
  Yeah, no, I appreciate the opportunity there.
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  There's a lot of terms that are getting thrown out there.
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  And words truly have meaning and we need to do the research into them.
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  Traditionally, we look at the left and if they don't like what we're saying,
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  they call us a bunch of different things.
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  You know, your racist, your homophobia, your xenophobia, what not.
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  But they like to do that to put us back on our heels because the initial response for most people
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  is going to be, I'm not that and then you try to defend yourself.
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  But if you recognize what they're doing and how they're trying to gaslight you,
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  then you can be effective.
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  Well, the same principle applies to even Christians and conservatives.
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  Oftentimes, if you are just pursuing the truth, you might get called something rather negative.
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  And so that's been my journey as of late.
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  I love the truth.
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  I want to learn the truth.
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  I may be wrong on things, but I'm going to keep diving in.
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  I'm going to keep asking hard questions.
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  And so I think that's really the discussion we're going to be having today.
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  Yeah, one of the things that really bothers me is sometimes we take friendly fire
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  from believers.
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  You think the attacks would come from outside,
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  evangelical Christianity or just the faith.
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  But oftentimes it's people that just believe something a little differently than you or
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  and it's just it's just sad.
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  But anyway, Caleb, so I want to remind people this is pre-recorded and we're recording this
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  toward the end of June.
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  And by the time this airs, who knows what's going to happen worldwide and even in our own nation.
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  But let's talk about what's going on with Israel and Iran, the cease fire.
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  Just your take overall on how things are going and what's happened in the last just several days.
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  I think the biggest point in all of this is that we are engaging in bad foreign policy here
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  in the United States. Are friendly fathers told us free trade with all and entanglements with none.
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  And yet we continue to push this agenda that were the world's police that we're going to engage
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  in regime changes that all under the guise of democracy, which I know you hate that word as much
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  as I do. And unfortunately when it comes to the nation's state of Israel, the vast majority of
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  Christians have this mentality of we got to support them no matter what. And it stems from this idea
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  that their gods chosen people and that they can do no wrong. You know, I'm very libertarian.
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  I come myself a biblitarian. But why do we have to always go and aid Israel and truly if we
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  really want to be honest with things, if we want Israel to be successful and to be, you know,
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  have peace, then just leave them alone. Like, why are we so arrogant as Americans to believe that
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  they need our help with everything? They don't let them prosper on their own.
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  So I will say Israel is a secular nation. And we read in the Old Testament Bible prophecy,
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  two thirds will be saved, right? Two thirds will come to Messiah and truly be saved at some point,
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  but that's later on down the road. So we should support them. But when you're talking about
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  getting involved in wars and battles, so what are your thoughts on the recent actions that
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  the administration took in Iran to try to, you know, take out some of those nuclear sites?
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  That really wasn't, well, I guess it is aiding Israel because that's their fight,
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  but Iran is a threat to the entire world. So how do you see that Caleb?
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  You know, it's sad because I think John McCain's ghost is quite literally dancing right now.
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  He's so excited. We've been told since, you know, that probably the late 90s, early 2000s
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  that Iran was this close to getting a nuclear bomb. And I'm tired of that rhetoric, you know,
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  I'm reminded of George W. Bush and weapons of mass destruction. Well, those didn't turn out.
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  We didn't find those in Iraq. And we have this long history of going in in toppling regimes.
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  Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, Egypt. I mean, we do it over and over and over again, supposedly once again,
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  to promote democracy. And it never goes out or never turns out very well for us. And even
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  when I ran, when we look at it in the history, our fingerprints as Americans are all over
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  that initial regime change. The United States toppled the Shah and replaced it with what we
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  currently have. And now we're upset about it. You know, look, I'm not for nuclear weapons. I
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  don't think that we should be, you know, have these nation states all over the world having these
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  and somebody ready to push the button. But that being said, is it beneficial for the United States
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  to get involved in another war? We're still trying to clean up Ukraine and Russia and that's not
• 8:31
  going very well for us. Well, you know, I will say we had nothing to do with the start of that.
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  However, if President Trump was in office, then I mean, this all speculation whether that would
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  have started or not, whether Putin would have invaded Ukraine. But let's just say for argument's
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  sake that I ran, I mean, we see some pictures and some videos of what they have underground and
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  what they're working on. What if they were getting closer? You know what I mean? I mean, what should
• 9:00
  we just back off and see what happens? Or I guess it was taking a chance, taking a risk.
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  And I guess it was successful from that standpoint that we didn't lose any lives from the pilots
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  and all that. So at what point do you draw the line and say, yeah, we don't want to be involved
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  in another war. And we don't want to police the world and be involved in these other battles.
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  But this is a very real threat. You know, I mean, I don't know if I'm being redundant or not.
• 9:31
  No, no, I definitely get what you're saying there. There's other ways to bring about a change
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  in the world. And for me, you know, it's more of the people of Iran who are greatly oppressed.
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  I'm no fan of the Iranian government and the Sharia law and everything that they live under.
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  But remember, we did create that. If we look at what the Shah was building up the middle class,
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  there's a lot of freedoms there. We didn't like that. And so we replaced him. So if we want to
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  push, we can use information warfare to push for more of a natural, more organic uprising from
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  the people of Iran, I think that's probably the preferable way to go. And it's definitely more
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  of the liberty mindset that we're supposed to have as Americans. If Iran had the nuclear weapon,
• 10:23
  we had undisputable proof that that had occurred, I probably would be willing to have the
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  discussion of, okay, preemptive strike to ensure that they don't launch that to really anywhere in
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  the world. Did you see undisputable proof? That's kind of difficult, right?
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  In reality, it is. So yeah, I mean, I don't want to make it minimize. It's like a chess game,
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  almost, but I don't want to minimize. It's a very volatile situation because we don't know exactly
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  where things are. But anyway, so what's your overall take on the US military?
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  Yeah. I mean, you were in the army, right?
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  Marine Corps. Marine Corps, that's right.
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  Yes. So I served in the Marine Corps and I served, I was in the Marine Corps during 9-11.
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  And, you know, I initially bought the whole thing like terrorists, you know, some have been
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  lawdened. And it wasn't until after I got out when I started, well, wait a minute, they were
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  sawed a radians in Miami and Afghanistan and Iraq now. So overall, the United States military,
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  obviously, we've got some issues with the Biden policies and Obama as well, where we had most
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  of the high-ranking brass that was replaced, you know, with the America first military people were
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  replaced with people that were socialist. And so we've got a lot of problems in the military.
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  We've seen the videos of army soldiers walking in high heels and whatnot. There's some problems
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  there. That being said, most of the military and the veterans, there's some of the greatest people
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  out there. Yeah, they love America. Many of them are Christians as well. And they don't necessarily
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  understand that most of these skirmishes that we involve ourselves in are because of the bankers.
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  And by the way, you just recently did an episode podcast on that, didn't you? I saw a very,
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  was it over on Rumble? Or on your Facebook page, you said something very interesting. You said
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  the world bankers are behind every conflict. I don't want to get too far off topic,
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  but that's fascinating to me, explain that briefly. Yeah. So there's a long history of the world
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  bankers and it goes all the way back. If we're just talking about America, it goes all the way
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  back to our foundation. George Washington started the first national bank, but it was actually
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  designed to expire. I believe memory serves me correctly. It was like 30 years and then it would
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  expire and would be the people who'd get to vote if this continued. Obviously, they needed money
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  for the Revolutionary War, and that was the solution. Interestingly enough, the year that it
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  expired was 1811. And what happened right after that, the War of 1812. And that was all by design
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  to try to push Andrew Jackson at that time to accept a world bank. And before that, you know,
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  it was more the local or the national banks. And we get a war, of course, out of it. When we
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  look at the Civil War, actually, it was, once again, it was pushing that the world banks were
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  actually supporting the Southern colonies or states at that point. And their idea was to basically
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  break it up. Every state was sovereign in the South. And they wanted kind of almost like a European
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  model to where every single state would be free and independent and every one of them would have a
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  world bank. Now it was the, actually, the French and the English were supporting the South.
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  And actually, Russia came to our aid, which didn't have a world bank at that point. And came to
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  the aid of Lincoln and it's kind of forgotten history. But in large part, we owe the continuation
• 14:02
  of the United States to the Russians. And actually, interestingly enough, that's the reason we own
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  Alaska. Because after, after we won after the Civil War was won by the North, Johnson at that
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  point, he had a, he had a bill to pay. It was like $7.2 million. And the, the constitution would
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  allow them to just give money to this foreign entity. And so they arranged for the purchase of Alaska,
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  which was considered rather useless. And that's why we have it. It's, it's definitely never even
• 14:29
  no. We don't talk about that. Wow. That is just so fascinating. I mean, you had me when you were
• 14:35
  explaining what happened between 1811 and 1812. To me, that's, that's very interesting. But we've
• 14:40
  got to take a brief pause where we're with Caleb Collier. The website is church and state.media.
• 14:47
  Right back on World View Matters. Today's show is brought to you by Harbinger's Daily.
• 14:52
  World news biblically understood. Stay informed at Harbinger's Daily dot com.
• 14:58
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• 15:43
  take a deep breath there. All right, back to Caleb Collier. Okay, brother, we need to jump into
• 15:49
  the difference between anti-semitism and anti-zionism. And I think we need to define both. So
• 15:56
  because people maybe have different understandings of what these are. So where do you want to start?
• 16:01
  Yeah, I think that's a great way to set the table there. Because as we were talking
• 16:06
  to earlier, this is a word that gets thrown out. And in fact, I don't know if you saw this,
• 16:10
  but Mark Levin actually said that all white people are inherently anti-semitic. And Mark Levin's
• 16:15
  one of those guys that is pushing for this war him and Lindsey Graham. And I think they have a
• 16:20
  Ouija board. They're talking to John McCain. But and remember, I mean, this is a guy as well.
• 16:26
  Sorry, I've got an odd sense of humor. But I mean, remember, you know, Mark Levin is a guy that's
• 16:31
  pushing for the convention of states. So I think he's showing his true character here that he
• 16:36
  he's calling all of us anti-semitic. And that's because he wants this war with Iran. He's a war
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  hawk. Now anti-semitism is any racism really is just an idiotic, antiquated idea. And you and I
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  as Christians, we know that every single person doesn't matter what color you are, you're created
• 16:57
  in God's own image. And then if you're a Christian, you're our brother and sister. So this
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  this false flat, it's one of those pejorative terms that they like to throw at us to try to
• 17:07
  get us to be controllable. Now, when you look at anti-zionism, that's a whole different matter
• 17:13
  entirely. And that is more of a concern with the secular state of Israel as you stated and some
• 17:20
  of their policies. And if you have a better definition, jump in here and let me know.
• 17:26
  Well, I do want to mention as far as anti-semitism goes, I think we really needed to clarify and
• 17:32
  define that when we saw what happened after October 7, 2 years ago, and then most people were shocked
• 17:39
  to see what was happening right here in our own land on college campuses. And what happens when
• 17:47
  you go through the machine of the K through 12, as Alex Newman would call it, government brainwash
• 17:53
  camps, and you end up being social justice activists and with this anti-Christian ideology or
• 17:59
  anti-biblical, anti-Judeo-Christian ideology, you saw what happens on college campuses. So I will
• 18:05
  just say that I believe that anti-semitism is demonic because it's a spiritual battle underneath
• 18:12
  what we're seeing on the surface everywhere. But it's a demonic, irrational hatred of the Jews,
• 18:19
  and it shows itself in word deed actions words thoughts actions and words. And that's what we
• 18:27
  saw in the college campuses because irrational. Some may be I want to say most. Some college kids,
• 18:34
  they don't even know how to explain why they are for Hamas or why they were protesting. They just
• 18:40
  knew the talking points. They knew that ideology. They knew they were supposed to be against Christians
• 18:45
  and against Jews, and it's a very dangerous. And now I think maybe volatile. And one more thing,
• 18:51
  I want you to comment on this just because the Trump administration and Trump is coming up with
• 18:55
  some great executive orders. I love getting DEI out of there. But these things are so deeply
• 19:01
  entrenched at the university level and in education that it's going to take so much more. And it starts
• 19:08
  by raising awareness. Go ahead, share your thoughts Caleb. I mean, you're absolutely right. I've
• 19:13
  actually for a long time stated that we as a nation are more divided than we've ever been. And I
• 19:18
  mean, including the Civil War. And I say that because both sides of the North and the South were
• 19:22
  Christians predominantly during that time. What we currently see in the United States is as you
• 19:27
  described it, this hypersecular leftists, the love socialism, loves communism, hates Christianity,
• 19:34
  hates Jews. And as you said, they really have no talking points. A lot of the people that you see
• 19:39
  out on the street are paid agitators. And that's through the funding of people like George Soros,
• 19:45
  Bill Gates, World Economic Forum. They have the cash inflow to actually pay these agitators to come
• 19:51
  out in the streets. And that's why you'll see in so many of these interviews, you know, why are
• 19:54
  you out here? Well, just fascism. Well, what is fascism? You're a fascist. Okay.
• 20:04
  They really don't know what they're talking about. Exactly. Exactly. And isn't that sad, though,
• 20:08
  that someone can be so convinced that they have to stand for a certain, I don't know, principal
• 20:13
  ideology or worldview. And they can't define it or defend it. That's a little scary because there's
• 20:19
  so much ignorance. I guess we shouldn't be surprised. But how much of that, I know we're really kind
• 20:24
  of off topic. How much of that goes back to the education system in America? I mean, social media
• 20:31
  doesn't help. And modern technology, but the education system, right? It breeds ignorance.
• 20:38
  And by design, as you mentioned, Alex Newman before, but you know, the crimes of our educator's
• 20:43
  book is phenomenal. I highly recommend it to everyone to read, to understand what they did,
• 20:48
  with Dewey and Horseman. This was designed. It was designed off the Prussian system to make us
• 20:55
  to where we were controllable once again. And so I encourage every Christian parent to have
• 21:00
  their kids in a private school system. And I love, you know, what you guys are doing over there.
• 21:06
  Because that's a great option for you guys. But every single church should have a private school.
• 21:12
  There should be homeschool co-ops, get them out of public education. Otherwise, you're going to
• 21:15
  end up with what you see on television that you're literally throwing the remote at.
• 21:19
  Yes. Oh my goodness. And whenever we see a man on the street interviews,
• 21:24
  do you remember Jay Leno? I might be dating myself, but Jay Leno used to go to graduation ceremonies.
• 21:31
  And he would ask a basic, maybe a high school graduate to name the three branches of government
• 21:37
  or the vice president or something. And they could, it's just so embarrassing. But that's why American
• 21:45
  education has fallen so much. The US is on the bottom. Anyway, we're off top. We're back. Okay,
• 21:50
  Zionism. We've got five minutes left Caleb. So the political movement of Zionism, let's talk about
• 21:58
  this briefly. Yeah. So you can kind of trace it back to Darby and Scofield. And we were talking a
• 22:04
  little bit about this before we started the show. But the Scofield Bible is really kind of what
• 22:09
  started the whole dispensationalism, the Zionism and even replacement theology, which is once again,
• 22:16
  one of those pejorative terms that is thrown out at people who are seeking truth.
• 22:19
  Scofield was a rather interesting individual. This guy was a fraudster. He was a lawyer.
• 22:25
  He fought for the South as a 17-year-old lad about his age.
• 22:29
  Ultimately, left his wife in Kansas and moved down to Texas where he became the pastor of a rather
• 22:35
  small church. And then on a nowhere, also, and he comes into all this money, writes this Scofield
• 22:41
  Bible, which really pushed for this Zionist movement. And the Oxford Press picked it up and it
• 22:48
  was placed in most churches throughout the world, especially in America. And so this is where we
• 22:54
  get this idea that we have to support Israel no matter what. Now, the Bible talks about, and I'm
• 23:01
  going to go to Galatians, Galatians 3.7, actually. It says, and I'll quote, therefore, be sure that it
• 23:06
  is those who are of faith, who are sons of Abraham. You see, this idea goes all the way back to
• 23:12
  Genesis where we have this, everybody's familiar with it, that he will bless those who bless you
• 23:18
  and curse those who curse you. And we've taken that and applied that to the modern nation of Israel.
• 23:24
  But nobody really finishes that statement in Genesis because it continues on that through
• 23:29
  his seed, the whole world will be blessed. Well, that's Christ Jesus. And even continuing
• 23:33
  down towards the latter part of Galatians 3, everybody's familiar with this one as well. There's
• 23:38
  no Greek, there's no Jew, there's no slave, there's no freeman, there's no man, there's no woman,
• 23:43
  it's just all of you are united in Christ Jesus. So what we actually see, and we can address for
• 23:49
  replacement theology in just a minute here, but what we can actually see is anyone who believes in
• 23:54
  Christ Jesus is God's chosen people. Interesting. So let's talk about briefly. We're running
• 24:00
  on a time we have discussed that on this podcast before you have as well replacement theology. It is
• 24:05
  dangerous. I don't believe the church has replaced Israel and I don't think most of our viewers do.
• 24:12
  Maybe for the newer listeners or viewers that might not be familiar with that, can you explain
• 24:17
  that briefly Caleb? Yeah, so replacement theology came about really in the 20th century.
• 24:24
  Up to that point, most of the church, and certainly the early church fathers, like Justin
• 24:29
  Martyr, actually talked about where the church was, that the old covenant had passed away,
• 24:35
  and now it was those who believed in Christ Jesus. And going back to Galatians again, the law
• 24:41
  was a curse. The early Jewish people had to live under this because we were corrupted through
• 24:48
  original sin. But Christ came to fulfill that. He literally took on the curse because the Bible says
• 24:53
  anyone who hung from a tree was cursed. So Jesus literally took that curse and did away with it,
• 25:00
  he fulfilled that law, and now through grace we are his children. And replacement theology is
• 25:07
  is this once again that pejorative term that a lot of Christians like to use against people to
• 25:12
  say, Oh, well, you just you believe in replacement theology. You don't believe that there's a special
• 25:16
  place for the Jews. I'm not saying that whatsoever. And if we go to eschatology and revelation
• 25:21
  specifically, we know that there are 144,000 Jewish people from all the tribes that are set apart.
• 25:29
  So clearly Israel has a place in God's plans. My point in all of this is we don't have to support
• 25:38
  Israel no matter what they do, just simply because we believe, well, they're God's chosen people.
• 25:45
  I'm God's chosen people. You're God's chosen people, David, because we believe in Christ Jesus.
• 25:50
  Yes. And I, you know, I'm not disagreeing with you, but I just do want to emphasize we do support
• 25:56
  God's chosen people, but we don't elevate them as no, like you said, no matter what they do,
• 26:03
  because sometimes they make decisions that maybe we would disagree with. It's very interesting
• 26:08
  though conversation, because there are some, I guess you would call Christian Zionists
• 26:15
  some evangelicals, meaning no matter what Israel does, we need to support them. And I don't
• 26:21
  believe that's true either. You wrap it up for us. Yeah, I think that's the point, right? Is the
• 26:28
  main point? We don't have to support them no matter what. I mean, I've been to Israel. I don't
• 26:32
  know if you've been there. It's a very secular state. I mean, we had Bruce Jenner, who was a
• 26:37
  bunker down because he was in Tel Aviv. Well, he was over there for a gay pride parade. Okay,
• 26:42
  so when we look at it and the policies and even really the people groups of Israel, you know,
• 26:48
  the orthodox Jews are an extreme minority in Israel. Most of the nation is secular. The
• 26:53
  messianic Jews, I mean, they're a fraction of the percentage of the Jewish people there.
• 26:59
  And yet we applaud when we see Palestinians that are killed or even Iranians, we have to remember
• 27:04
  there's a lot of Christians in both of those countries. And as Christians, as believers,
• 27:09
  and even as people who love individual liberty, we shouldn't celebrate the death of individuals
• 27:16
  no matter who they are. Amen, brother. I wish we could continue this conversation because there's
• 27:20
  so many variables to it when you went on this topic. But one, thank you for coming on Caleb and
• 27:26
  mentioned the website again, churchnstate.media. Lord willing to be continued, brother.
• 27:32
  Yeah, thank you again. It was a great conversation. Yeah, thanks for your time. Yeah, and friends,
• 27:36
  we've got to talk about this because I mean, I hear a lot of people just blindly say, yes, support
• 27:41
  them no matter what. And okay, let's define the terms. Let's talk about what's Christian, what's
• 27:48
  secular. And pray for the messianic Jews over there. Pray for the gospel to spread over in Israel.
• 27:54
  They really need it. And so do we in America. You know, we need to look at us too. Anyway,
• 27:59
  God bless you friends. And as always, keep speaking the truth about things that matter.