Latest / Hurdle with Emily Abbate / 342. How To Love Better: On Finding Grace, Healing & Motivation In Your Relationships With Diego 'Yung Pueblo' Perez

Transcript

342. How To Love Better: On Finding Grace, Healing & Motivation In Your Relationships With Diego 'Yung Pueblo' Perez · Hurdle with Emily Abbate

0:00
Speaker 1: If you don't have patience, you can build it. If
0:01
Speaker 1: you don't have compassion, you can build it. If you
0:03
Speaker 1: don't have peace, you can build it.
0:20
Speaker 2: Good morning, good afternoon, Good evening. Emily Body here. You
0:24
Speaker 2: are listening to episode three hundred and forty two of Hurdle,
0:28
Speaker 2: a wellness focused podcast where we talk to inspirational people
0:31
Speaker 2: about everything from their highest ties and toughest moments to
0:34
Speaker 2: essential tips on how to live a healthier, happier, more
0:38
Speaker 2: motivated life. We all go through our fair share of hurdles.
0:42
Speaker 2: My goal through these discussions is to empower you to
0:45
Speaker 2: better navigate yours and move with intention, so that you
0:48
Speaker 2: can stride towards your own big potential and of course
0:52
Speaker 2: have some fun along the way. We are in the
0:57
Speaker 2: season of love, my friends. One of the pieces of
0:59
Speaker 2: feedback that came in through your messages and your emails
1:03
Speaker 2: last week was that you love hearing about.
1:06
Speaker 3: All aspects of wellness.
1:08
Speaker 2: You are a holistic human, so as much as you
1:11
Speaker 2: love the athlete interviews, you also love tips and tricks
1:15
Speaker 2: from qualified experts, and that is exactly what I am
1:20
Speaker 2: bringing you over the next few weeks. Today's conversation is
1:23
Speaker 2: with the one and only Diego Perez. Many of you
1:26
Speaker 2: know him as Young Pueblo, and in the spirit, like
1:29
Speaker 2: I said, of love, we are talking about his best
1:33
Speaker 2: practice tips for your relationships. Diego has a new book
1:38
Speaker 2: coming out this month. It's called How to Love Better,
1:42
Speaker 2: and that's exactly what our conversation is about. We are
1:45
Speaker 2: talking not only about how to love better in terms
1:48
Speaker 2: of partnership, whether you are single or attached, but also
1:52
Speaker 2: how to love yourself better too. I know that a
1:55
Speaker 2: lot of people roll their eyes when we get to
1:58
Speaker 2: Valentine's Day each year, whether you are single or attached.
2:03
Speaker 3: I hear you.
2:04
Speaker 2: I know, Hallmark holiday, but it is a good time
2:08
Speaker 2: for us to remember the importance of loving well and
2:12
Speaker 2: how having love in your life can impact your overall
2:16
Speaker 2: well being. In today's episode, Diego gives me the takeaways
2:21
Speaker 2: that he has from his eight years of marriage thus far.
2:25
Speaker 2: We also talk about his green and red flags or
2:28
Speaker 2: dating and give a nod to the concept that at
2:31
Speaker 2: the base of everything that we do, love is there,
2:35
Speaker 2: and so it is up to each and every one
2:37
Speaker 2: of us as individuals to decide how we want to love,
2:41
Speaker 2: to decide how.
2:42
Speaker 3: We view love.
2:43
Speaker 2: Knowing that our individual perspective shapes our reality. I love
2:49
Speaker 2: this conversation. I could talk to Diego all day. He
2:51
Speaker 2: is so calming.
2:53
Speaker 3: Again.
2:53
Speaker 2: His book is coming out this month. It is called
2:56
Speaker 2: how to Love Better, and I'm going to link it
2:59
Speaker 2: in the show notes. Make sure if you're not yet
3:02
Speaker 2: following along with Hurdle over on social you do that.
3:04
Speaker 2: It's over at Hurdle podcast over on Instagram. We also
3:07
Speaker 2: have a new daily subscriber channel in there. Each day
3:12
Speaker 2: we're throwing in an inspirational quote as well as a
3:15
Speaker 2: thought prompt to get your wheels turning first thing in
3:20
Speaker 2: the morning.
3:21
Speaker 3: Plus, Also, if you're not yet a.
3:23
Speaker 2: Subscriber to the Weekly Hurdle newsletter, it's our substack that
3:28
Speaker 2: comes out every single Friday with so much of the
3:30
Speaker 2: same inspiration and motivation you love from Hurdle directly in
3:34
Speaker 2: your inbox. And the best part is that it is
3:37
Speaker 2: absolutely free. Now you will see that there is an
3:40
Speaker 2: option to become a supporter of the newsletter. I encourage you,
3:45
Speaker 2: if you love the Weekly Hurdle, think about becoming a
3:48
Speaker 2: paid subscriber this week.
3:50
Speaker 3: With that, let's get to it. Let's get it's a
3:53
Speaker 3: hurdling today.
4:00
Speaker 2: I am sitting down with Diego Perez. He is known
4:03
Speaker 2: to many as Young Pueblo. He's a number one New
4:06
Speaker 2: York Times bestselling author. He's got a new book coming out.
4:08
Speaker 2: It's called How to Love Better, out next month.
4:12
Speaker 3: How are we doing.
4:13
Speaker 1: I'm doing really well and I'm so happy that we
4:15
Speaker 1: get to chat. Thank you for having me on again.
4:18
Speaker 2: Oh of course, it's a no brainer, especially right now.
4:22
Speaker 2: You know, it's the time of love, Valentine's Day on
4:24
Speaker 2: the horizon. We're thinking about self love, we're thinking about
4:28
Speaker 2: love with other people.
4:29
Speaker 3: How is love, would you.
4:31
Speaker 2: Say, most resounding in your life right now?
4:36
Speaker 1: Oh? My gosh, It's resounding in all the small little moments. Honestly,
4:41
Speaker 1: It's like these moments where like my wife and I
4:45
Speaker 1: we just right before it came on, we just sat
4:47
Speaker 1: together to meditate for an hour, and then we finished
4:50
Speaker 1: meditating and she turns over and she just looks at
4:52
Speaker 1: me and just goes, I love you. And it's like
4:55
Speaker 1: these tiny little things that keep building on that active care.
5:00
Speaker 3: Active care.
5:01
Speaker 2: And I love the sentiment of articulating, paying attention to
5:05
Speaker 2: noticing the small things, because it's not always going to
5:08
Speaker 2: show up every day way right, No.
5:12
Speaker 1: I think that's one of the big problems that we're
5:14
Speaker 1: facing as a society is like this idea of love
5:18
Speaker 1: as constant excitement and fun and we're chasing this high.
5:23
Speaker 1: But in reality, I think love is going to have
5:26
Speaker 1: ups and downs, just as it does, you know, when
5:29
Speaker 1: you're on your own individual journey, Like every day is
5:31
Speaker 1: not going to be a good day. And I think
5:33
Speaker 1: we get scared of that. We get scared of the
5:35
Speaker 1: down moments, and rightfully so, because we don't want to,
5:38
Speaker 1: you know, end up in a super toxic or hurtful situation.
5:42
Speaker 1: But you know, a lot of healthy relationships also have
5:45
Speaker 1: down moments and that's.
5:46
Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, including healthy relationships with ourselves, right And I
5:51
Speaker 2: think that the ability and the recognition that we are
5:55
Speaker 2: capable of finding small moments of joy, small moments of
5:59
Speaker 2: love kind of like meeting yourself with where you're at totally.
6:03
Speaker 1: I think that's like one of the biggest things too.
6:05
Speaker 1: It's like understanding that the skills that you build to
6:10
Speaker 1: meet yourself where you're at and to be able to
6:13
Speaker 1: appreciate the sort of you know, your own emotional range
6:17
Speaker 1: and like when you're literally feeling yourself going from happiness
6:21
Speaker 1: to feeling a little tougher inside or feeling lighter inside.
6:25
Speaker 1: You being able to hold space for your own emotions.
6:28
Speaker 1: That's that direct compassion that you can then give to
6:31
Speaker 1: your partner, because if you can't face your own emotions,
6:34
Speaker 1: you're definitely not going to be able to face theirs.
6:36
Speaker 2: There are so many, so many benefits to love, feeling love.
6:42
Speaker 2: When you feel love and cared for, it boosts your
6:44
Speaker 2: immune system. It reduces the chance of things like catching
6:47
Speaker 2: a cold. But bigger than that, love releases high levels
6:51
Speaker 2: of dopamine. And so essentially what that means is it's
6:54
Speaker 2: getting the rewards system within your body going, similar to
6:58
Speaker 2: a euphoria that you could get from extras like drugs
7:01
Speaker 2: or alcohol. So really love is the basis for allowing
7:07
Speaker 2: you to feel better in your body.
7:09
Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's and it's really important because I think
7:12
Speaker 1: a lot of times when people who have been single
7:16
Speaker 1: for a while and are really craving a relationship, they're
7:19
Speaker 1: sort of unconsciously postponing their happiness and postponing that really
7:25
Speaker 1: active self love that can awaken that dopamine and make
7:28
Speaker 1: you more vibrant on the inside, whether you're with someone
7:31
Speaker 1: or not. And that's something that I'm always trying to
7:33
Speaker 1: tell people. It's like, just don't postpone your happiness, like,
7:37
Speaker 1: because even when you're in a good relationship, if you
7:41
Speaker 1: don't have that awareness over your own perception and your
7:44
Speaker 1: own reaction, you can miss out on the deepest joy
7:48
Speaker 1: and the sort of the deepest like sense of care
7:51
Speaker 1: that you can get from a relationship because you have
7:54
Speaker 1: something to work on within yourself. So whether you're by
7:57
Speaker 1: yourself or another person, like, you have to activate your
8:00
Speaker 1: happiness on your own.
8:01
Speaker 2: Yeah, So what I'm hearing you say is you might
8:03
Speaker 2: not be in a relationship with other people or another person,
8:07
Speaker 2: but you have a foundational, important relationship all of the time,
8:11
Speaker 2: and that relationship is with yourself.
8:13
Speaker 1: Absolutely, You're always in relationship with yourself. That that's like
8:17
Speaker 1: you're you know, you're never going to be able to
8:19
Speaker 1: really fully escape yourself. You may try, you know, you
8:22
Speaker 1: may keep like scrolling watching TV, but ultimately there are
8:26
Speaker 1: going to be quiet moments where you have to face
8:28
Speaker 1: yourself and you might as well be able to embrace
8:31
Speaker 1: that with love and compassion as opposed to a version. Yeah.
8:35
Speaker 2: Yeah, Now, before we keep going on this, I've got
8:38
Speaker 2: to know what was the inspiration to focus on this
8:41
Speaker 2: specific topic for this new book.
8:44
Speaker 1: The inspiration was really like it came from like direct experience,
8:49
Speaker 1: like I was when I started meditating and going to
8:52
Speaker 1: these longer meditation retreats. I went in for my own
8:55
Speaker 1: personal healing, like I went in because I knew that
8:57
Speaker 1: I had big things to deal with, that I had
8:59
Speaker 1: to overcome sadness, overcome anxiety, and not let them become,
9:04
Speaker 1: you know, not let them be so dominant over my life,
9:08
Speaker 1: because they were like taking over my life. And when
9:12
Speaker 1: I started meditating, I was shocked because, Okay, one, I
9:17
Speaker 1: was definitely feeling better and I could feel that my
9:19
Speaker 1: mind was lighter. But I started immediately noticing that even
9:23
Speaker 1: though I went in for my own healing, it started
9:26
Speaker 1: elevating all of my relationships. I started noticing right away,
9:29
Speaker 1: like when I was meditating, that my relationships were really superficial,
9:33
Speaker 1: you know, with my wife, my girlfriend at the time
9:37
Speaker 1: and my now wife, with my parents, with my friends,
9:39
Speaker 1: like everything was very surface level. And that was because
9:42
Speaker 1: I was afraid of myself, so I couldn't really offer
9:45
Speaker 1: vulnerability to help deepen a connection. And as I started
9:48
Speaker 1: changing through meditating, I was like, wait, like there is
9:51
Speaker 1: a deep relationship here between your personal growth and how
9:55
Speaker 1: you can show up in you know, with the people
9:58
Speaker 1: that you love.
10:00
Speaker 2: That's really interesting is you acknowledging that you were with
10:04
Speaker 2: your now wife then girlfriend before doing some of this work.
10:08
Speaker 2: And I think that there's a challenge for many which
10:11
Speaker 2: is this inability to grow with a partner or a
10:17
Speaker 2: feeling that they are incapable of growing with a partner.
10:20
Speaker 2: It's like, I have to do all of this work
10:22
Speaker 2: before I'm prepared for the relationship. Why do you think
10:26
Speaker 2: that your relationship withstood that growth period and how did
10:30
Speaker 2: it make the two of you better?
10:32
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a great question. I think you know a
10:35
Speaker 1: lot of people they want to enter into a relationship
10:38
Speaker 1: with someone who like really has all their stuff together,
10:41
Speaker 1: like really has you know, has gone to therapy, has
10:44
Speaker 1: like helped themselves. But the reality is like you can
10:47
Speaker 1: be someone who really deeply cares about your personal growth
10:50
Speaker 1: and you still will have a ton of stuff to
10:52
Speaker 1: work on. It's just such a long journey because none
10:55
Speaker 1: of us are perfect. That's just the reality of it
10:57
Speaker 1: is that we can try our best, but there are
11:00
Speaker 1: still going to be gaps and blocks and things we
11:02
Speaker 1: need to learn, especially when you are in relationship with
11:06
Speaker 1: somebody like I can love you. And this is what
11:08
Speaker 1: my wife and I went through where I felt the
11:11
Speaker 1: love for her, she felt the love for me, but
11:13
Speaker 1: we did not know how to care for each other
11:15
Speaker 1: because we didn't have enough self awareness to see ourselves.
11:19
Speaker 1: We didn't have enough emotional maturity to be able to
11:22
Speaker 1: hold each other's emotions as we were going through arguments.
11:25
Speaker 1: We didn't have this sort of emotional skill set to
11:28
Speaker 1: be able to really, you know, love each other well.
11:31
Speaker 1: And we had to learn that over time. And I
11:34
Speaker 1: think honestly what kept us together was that we tried
11:37
Speaker 1: to be a part. Like there were moments where we
11:39
Speaker 1: would break up come back together, and we didn't really
11:43
Speaker 1: know how to like have a nourishing relationship, but we
11:47
Speaker 1: did know we wanted to be together, and we were
11:49
Speaker 1: fortunate that we at the moment when we were really
11:51
Speaker 1: at a crossroads, meditation came into our lives and we
11:54
Speaker 1: started noticing that, oh, we're like handling our arguments a
11:58
Speaker 1: little bit differently, We're projecting less onto each other. We're
12:02
Speaker 1: much more vocal about the moments when our emotions change,
12:06
Speaker 1: so that we're informing each other well, and we were
12:09
Speaker 1: just like, you know, gleeful. We were so happy. We're like, wow,
12:12
Speaker 1: this is this is amazing that that we you know,
12:16
Speaker 1: can care for each other better now.
12:18
Speaker 2: Yeah, and it's truly special that you and your partner
12:21
Speaker 2: had a mutual interest in this work right in this
12:26
Speaker 2: personal betterment getting involved in meditation. For some that may
12:31
Speaker 2: see a bit of a disconnect with that, is there
12:34
Speaker 2: a future for them to move forward together or not?
12:38
Speaker 1: No, totally, they can totally move forward together. I see
12:41
Speaker 1: this happen a lot where people both care about their
12:45
Speaker 1: personal growth, but the way that they go about their
12:49
Speaker 1: growth is different. And I think that's something that we
12:52
Speaker 1: have to be okay with Because you may have a
12:54
Speaker 1: great partner and you may have so many things that
12:58
Speaker 1: are so deeply aligned. Doesn't mean that you're going to
13:01
Speaker 1: grow in the same way. That doesn't mean that you're
13:03
Speaker 1: going to grow at the same speed. Like you know,
13:06
Speaker 1: your partner may have a better time with listening than
13:10
Speaker 1: you do, or they may have more patience than you do,
13:13
Speaker 1: and you are realizing your lack in patients or listening
13:16
Speaker 1: and you have to develop it over time. But you're
13:18
Speaker 1: just not going to be like lockstep moving at the
13:21
Speaker 1: same speed. And I've just seen a lot of great
13:24
Speaker 1: relationships where you know, one person meditates, or another person
13:28
Speaker 1: you know has a really serious therapy practice, or one
13:31
Speaker 1: person meditates in the other it's just really into like
13:34
Speaker 1: being in nature, or you know, just has something where
13:37
Speaker 1: they're like actively not running away from their emotions. And
13:42
Speaker 1: you'll see the commonality, like when you're in nature and
13:44
Speaker 1: you're like allowing yourself to be there without a podcast,
13:47
Speaker 1: or you're creating art, or you're journaling, or you know,
13:51
Speaker 1: going to therapy, meditating a lot of these things, what
13:54
Speaker 1: they have in common is that they're just helping you
13:57
Speaker 1: be with yourself. And I think that's that's where the
14:00
Speaker 1: power comes from.
14:01
Speaker 2: So foundationally, the only thing that's important is truly that
14:04
Speaker 2: both of you have a desire to be better. It
14:07
Speaker 2: doesn't mean that you need to do the same things
14:09
Speaker 2: on that quest. You can be on parallel paths as
14:13
Speaker 2: long as at the end of the path you come
14:14
Speaker 2: back together to acknowledge that importance.
14:17
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think if both of you have the emotional
14:20
Speaker 1: resilience to be accountable to yourselves and recognize when you're
14:25
Speaker 1: making mistakes, and you have the fortitude to repair them.
14:29
Speaker 1: Then you're going to be golden because we all go
14:32
Speaker 1: into relationships with some form of pass hurt, some unconscious behavior,
14:38
Speaker 1: you know, something where we could know ourselves better and
14:42
Speaker 1: act better. But that is long, slow evolution, and I
14:48
Speaker 1: think it's okay to you know, that's the reality of.
14:50
Speaker 3: Life now, before we go any further.
14:53
Speaker 2: There are people that are certainly they have their interest
14:55
Speaker 2: piqued by what we're talking about, but foundationally maybe they're
14:59
Speaker 2: a little bit u familiar with you and a little
15:01
Speaker 2: unsure of why am I listening to this man about
15:05
Speaker 2: love advice right now?
15:06
Speaker 3: So tell us a little bit.
15:08
Speaker 2: Why is it that you are now looked to as
15:11
Speaker 2: an expert when it comes to these topics.
15:14
Speaker 1: Yeah, the key thing is like look to as an expert.
15:16
Speaker 1: I don't know if I consider myself an expert. I
15:18
Speaker 1: really think to myself as a as a student. I'm
15:21
Speaker 1: not like a guru or anything like that. I'm just
15:24
Speaker 1: someone who's here along, you know, walking the journey like
15:28
Speaker 1: everybody else. I think the only thing that I've taken
15:32
Speaker 1: seriously is my own personal development, and I've put so
15:36
Speaker 1: many hours, Like literally, I did a account the other
15:40
Speaker 1: day where I think I've meditated somewhere between twelve and
15:44
Speaker 1: thirteen thousand hours, and like that's you know, it's a
15:48
Speaker 1: good amount of time, but doesn't necessarily reflect wisdom. It
15:51
Speaker 1: more so reflects like effort, like time putting into cultivating myself,
15:55
Speaker 1: because when you meditate, especially in the tradition that I'm
15:58
Speaker 1: a part of, really developing these three qualities where it's
16:02
Speaker 1: self awareness, non reaction, and compassion, and these are things
16:05
Speaker 1: that the mind has, but you need to cultivate them.
16:07
Speaker 1: You need to make them stronger so that they help
16:10
Speaker 1: you make better decisions in your life. And I think
16:13
Speaker 1: in some ways, you know that, you know, my own
16:16
Speaker 1: sort of pursuit of personal development has just helped me understand,
16:21
Speaker 1: you know, how to change my behaviors for the better
16:24
Speaker 1: and show up as a more genuine version of myself
16:27
Speaker 1: as opposed to just repeating the past over and over again.
16:30
Speaker 1: And then I've reflected you know, through the writing, through
16:33
Speaker 1: sharing on Instagram and built up of an audience of
16:36
Speaker 1: about you know, like four point five million people, and
16:39
Speaker 1: it's great. I really think of myself as someone who's
16:42
Speaker 1: just reflecting with you. So, like all the things that
16:45
Speaker 1: I write the books, like whether you agree or not
16:47
Speaker 1: with what I'm saying. I'm hoping that it at least
16:51
Speaker 1: helps you reflect so that you can build your own
16:52
Speaker 1: self awareness.
16:54
Speaker 2: Yeah, I have a deep appreciation for the acknowledgement of
16:58
Speaker 2: this concept that you are still a student.
17:01
Speaker 3: And also you've put in a lot of work.
17:04
Speaker 2: Right, we talk about how you get stronger, it's by
17:07
Speaker 2: putting in the reps. Right, how does a muscle get stronger?
17:10
Speaker 2: You give it something to push up against. How does
17:12
Speaker 2: your will get stronger? It's by you also giving it
17:15
Speaker 2: something to push up against within your meditation practice totally.
17:20
Speaker 1: And you know the value of training, you know better
17:22
Speaker 1: than I do. Like training is so important, Like you
17:24
Speaker 1: don't just like go outside and run a marathon. You
17:27
Speaker 1: have to train the mind and the same way that
17:29
Speaker 1: you train the body. And we're so accustomed to training
17:32
Speaker 1: the body. But I think that's something that we're learning
17:35
Speaker 1: as a culture that if you don't have patience, you
17:38
Speaker 1: can build it. If you don't have compassion, you can
17:39
Speaker 1: build it. If you don't have peace, you can build it.
17:42
Speaker 1: It's not just that happiness is a framework or a
17:46
Speaker 1: perception that you just force upon yourself. You train it,
17:49
Speaker 1: you develop it over time, by teaching yourself how to
17:52
Speaker 1: be less attached, by teaching yourself to let go to
17:55
Speaker 1: embrace in permanence. And these are things that you learn
17:58
Speaker 1: over time.
17:59
Speaker 3: How do you combat the victim mindset?
18:02
Speaker 2: Because someone hears what you just said, they're like, compassion
18:06
Speaker 2: you can build it self, appreciation, you can build it,
18:09
Speaker 2: et cetera. There might be a certain level of frustration
18:12
Speaker 2: in this I'm in the same cycle. I can't get
18:15
Speaker 2: out of it, all of this negative self talk. How
18:18
Speaker 2: do you fight against the victim mindset to get to
18:22
Speaker 2: a place where you truly believe in that unlock that
18:25
Speaker 2: you can build the emotions, the feelings, the life that
18:28
Speaker 2: you desire.
18:30
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think bringing yourself back to the present moment
18:32
Speaker 1: is huge because we get so caught up in the
18:35
Speaker 1: down moment sometimes that we absolutely forget all the amazing
18:41
Speaker 1: things that we can be grateful for. We literally get
18:43
Speaker 1: lost in the negativity, and that happens a lot. But
18:48
Speaker 1: bringing yourself back to gratitude, bringing yourself back to embracing impermanence,
18:52
Speaker 1: like bring yourself back to just understanding that your actions
18:57
Speaker 1: are extraordinarily powerful and it's only your actions that will
19:01
Speaker 1: like literally bring you out of the mud, like pull
19:03
Speaker 1: you out into a new version of yourself. Because you know,
19:06
Speaker 1: people who listen to this podcast, people who are reading
19:09
Speaker 1: you know, self help books, even your therapists. Like people
19:12
Speaker 1: can inform you and give you good information, but only
19:15
Speaker 1: you can act on it to really start creating a
19:17
Speaker 1: new chapter in your life. And I think that's you know, like,
19:20
Speaker 1: I've had so many people who've inspired me, but they
19:23
Speaker 1: didn't meditate for me. They like I had to do
19:26
Speaker 1: that myself. Like, you know, these things where we have
19:28
Speaker 1: to pull ourselves out, there's this powerful moment where we
19:32
Speaker 1: really can activate our strong determination and put our foot
19:36
Speaker 1: down and say, you know what, I'm going to give
19:38
Speaker 1: this goal a bunch of my effort and I'm not
19:41
Speaker 1: going to let other people stop me. And I think
19:43
Speaker 1: we all have that capacity.
19:45
Speaker 2: Yeah, And honestly, sometimes motivation can go out the window, right,
19:50
Speaker 2: So that's why the desire for action, the opportunity to
19:55
Speaker 2: just take that first step and keep stepping forward. There
19:59
Speaker 2: needs to be a foundational level of appreciation for the
20:02
Speaker 2: fact that I can do this. I just have to
20:05
Speaker 2: get out there and put in that effort.
20:07
Speaker 1: Yeah, you would be surprised what you can accomplish, and
20:10
Speaker 1: a lot of times, like, it's really just about setting
20:14
Speaker 1: yourself up for tiny victories so that you can build momentum,
20:19
Speaker 1: because you can reach your goal and it's easier to
20:22
Speaker 1: reach it with momentum. And the best way is to
20:24
Speaker 1: just feed yourself tiny victories by doing something small every day.
20:28
Speaker 1: And I remember, like, you know, when I first started writing,
20:31
Speaker 1: like I didn't know how to write, Like it was
20:34
Speaker 1: something that I felt like, oh, let me reflect and
20:37
Speaker 1: share things openly. But by you know, writing one little
20:40
Speaker 1: poem a day, writing, you know, sharing one thought a
20:43
Speaker 1: day on Instagram, like, things will build over time and
20:47
Speaker 1: then you'll have, you know, like a writing career. But
20:49
Speaker 1: you can bring that to like anything that you want
20:52
Speaker 1: in your life, where you're just setting yourself for small,
20:55
Speaker 1: tiny victories.
20:56
Speaker 3: Small tiny victories.
20:57
Speaker 2: And again this circles back to our beginning conversation about
21:01
Speaker 2: taking notice of the good in your life, even if
21:03
Speaker 2: it is small instances.
21:05
Speaker 3: Of joy or love.
21:06
Speaker 2: Right now, I thought a lot about what we could
21:09
Speaker 2: talk about today, And I obviously have listeners that are
21:13
Speaker 2: in all different places of their journey with self, of
21:18
Speaker 2: their journey with others, whether it be women that are
21:21
Speaker 2: single or attached or married or divorced, or whatever the
21:24
Speaker 2: case may be. And one of the things I really
21:26
Speaker 2: appreciated within your book that you started to reference a
21:29
Speaker 2: little bit in our conversation thus far were the lessons
21:33
Speaker 2: that you've learned from your marriage. Thus far, you articulate
21:37
Speaker 2: eight of them. And what I think is so beautiful
21:39
Speaker 2: is that these lessons aren't solely applicable to being in
21:44
Speaker 2: a relationship. These are lessons that you can really bring
21:47
Speaker 2: to all aspects of your life. The first lesson that
21:50
Speaker 2: you articulate is that connection on its own is not enough.
21:54
Speaker 2: Why is it important to have a bigger sense of
21:57
Speaker 2: what's going on within the relationship besides the magnetic attraction
22:01
Speaker 2: that you experienced at the beginning.
22:03
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean you find this a lot that you
22:06
Speaker 1: know connection and that magnetic attraction may be there, and
22:10
Speaker 1: you may feel that for a number of different people,
22:13
Speaker 1: But is there enough to actually build a home together?
22:17
Speaker 1: Is there enough to design a life that feels really fruitful?
22:21
Speaker 1: And oftentimes people don't even get past the magnetic attraction
22:25
Speaker 1: part because they are too shy or culturally we've like
22:30
Speaker 1: taught ourselves to be KOI and to like not be
22:33
Speaker 1: direct about what we feel for another person, like if literally,
22:36
Speaker 1: if you don't tell them like how you feel and
22:39
Speaker 1: that you're serious, like your feelings are serious for them,
22:42
Speaker 1: then you won't even have the opportunity to know if
22:45
Speaker 1: you can build a relationship. So we get lost often
22:49
Speaker 1: in that you know, exciting feeling of connection, But you
22:52
Speaker 1: need so much more than that. You need emotional maturity,
22:55
Speaker 1: you need self awareness, You need the ability to really
22:58
Speaker 1: embrace your growth wherever you are your journey, even if
23:01
Speaker 1: it's a relationship that you are so excited about and
23:06
Speaker 1: the other person may care about growth, and then that
23:09
Speaker 1: starts coming into your life and you're like, oh right,
23:11
Speaker 1: there's value and growth. Let me start embracing my growth
23:14
Speaker 1: so that I can you know, literally take charge of
23:17
Speaker 1: my evolution. People can start wherever. And I think, you know,
23:22
Speaker 1: knowing how much I care about my wife and knowing
23:26
Speaker 1: how in the beginning of our relationship, I didn't do
23:28
Speaker 1: a good job taking care of for happiness and supporting
23:30
Speaker 1: our happiness. To me now it's like, well, this is
23:33
Speaker 1: another reason why I keep doubling down on my personal
23:36
Speaker 1: growth is because I see a direct connection between me
23:39
Speaker 1: growing and the harmony that I can add to our relationship.
23:43
Speaker 2: What I also appreciate here is the acceptance or acknowledgement
23:47
Speaker 2: of something that you could be doing better.
23:50
Speaker 3: When I tell you the amount.
23:52
Speaker 2: Of relationships, whether they just be friendship, splotonic or something
23:56
Speaker 2: more than that, that falter or skip because one person
24:02
Speaker 2: feels as though it's not their responsibility to apologize.
24:06
Speaker 3: I would be here for a long time.
24:09
Speaker 1: I know, I know, And it's really hard because like
24:11
Speaker 1: because of our perceptions that you can even be really
24:14
Speaker 1: well intentioned and just say the wrong thing at the
24:16
Speaker 1: wrong time without any ill will, and like there's still
24:20
Speaker 1: maybe the need to apologize for that and like, oh,
24:23
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, like I didn't need to hurt your feelings
24:24
Speaker 1: at all. But there's also the mixture of like recognizing
24:30
Speaker 1: that there are definitely going to be moments where you
24:32
Speaker 1: need to apologize, and then there are going to be
24:34
Speaker 1: other moments where actually there wasn't even a need for
24:38
Speaker 1: an argument to happen. What really happened was a lack
24:40
Speaker 1: of communication around how your emotions were changing through the day.
24:45
Speaker 1: And this is something that like a system that my
24:47
Speaker 1: wife and I set up where we try our best
24:50
Speaker 1: to multiple times a day just let each other know,
24:52
Speaker 1: like when we're feeling down, when we're feeling good, or
24:56
Speaker 1: you know, whatever emotions moving through. And that has been
25:00
Speaker 1: so helpful because whenever I know that she doesn't feel good,
25:04
Speaker 1: that's my opportunity to step up and try to take
25:07
Speaker 1: things off her plate and to just make sure that
25:09
Speaker 1: I'm moving gently around her and the same thing for her.
25:13
Speaker 1: And I think that's like so valuable to just communicate
25:17
Speaker 1: when we don't feel good, because then we don't allow
25:20
Speaker 1: the mind the opportunity to try to blame, to try
25:23
Speaker 1: to figure out, like, oh, how can I make this
25:25
Speaker 1: feeling that I don't like your fault? And the mind
25:28
Speaker 1: will try to do that unless you're aware of it.
25:31
Speaker 2: Yeah, And you call this process an emotional temperature check.
25:35
Speaker 2: For someone that's interested in incorporating emotional temperature checks in
25:41
Speaker 2: their relationships, where do you even begin?
25:43
Speaker 3: And does it even need to be that complicated?
25:45
Speaker 1: No, it doesn't need to be complicated at all. It
25:47
Speaker 1: begins when you wake up. You wake up and you're
25:49
Speaker 1: just check in with yourself and then you let your
25:51
Speaker 1: partner know, like, oh, I don't feel that good today.
25:55
Speaker 1: You know, I think the first things I said to
25:56
Speaker 1: my wife when I woke up. I was like, ooh,
25:58
Speaker 1: I don't I don't know if I don't know, if
25:59
Speaker 1: my bodies fighting something like I felt this heaviness, you know,
26:03
Speaker 1: And she was like, great, you know. Good, it's good
26:08
Speaker 1: to know, and vice versa. Like we tell each other
26:10
Speaker 1: where we are, and then there's another point in the
26:12
Speaker 1: middle of the day, like in the early afternoon, where
26:15
Speaker 1: we tell each other again, and this becomes like it's
26:18
Speaker 1: not like we have to sit down and talk about it.
26:20
Speaker 1: It's very casual. It's just like I'm letting you know
26:24
Speaker 1: so that I can know and you can know where
26:26
Speaker 1: I'm standing right now in my own emotional range. And
26:29
Speaker 1: the information it's so simple, but the information is so helpful.
26:32
Speaker 2: Yeah, and it sounds helpful. And I can also see
26:36
Speaker 2: the inverse for someone who may be listening and thinking
26:39
Speaker 2: this sounds exhausting.
26:41
Speaker 1: I know, because you don't want to make it too formal.
26:43
Speaker 1: It's not like, oh, like we have to do this
26:46
Speaker 1: and this is like part of our routine. It's like
26:48
Speaker 1: make it as easy as possible for yourself to just
26:52
Speaker 1: like voice, because there are times where we're moving through
26:55
Speaker 1: the day and we because of the demands of the day,
27:00
Speaker 1: the day and the responsibilities we have. We are really
27:04
Speaker 1: pushing ourselves to feel good when we actually don't, and
27:08
Speaker 1: that ends up creating not as good results in terms
27:12
Speaker 1: of like not just your work or like, you know,
27:14
Speaker 1: the way that you're interacting with your partner.
27:16
Speaker 2: Yeah, another lesson that you list from your eight years
27:19
Speaker 2: of marriage is the necessity to individually understand your emotional
27:24
Speaker 2: history and behavioral patterns. We chatted a little bit about
27:27
Speaker 2: this earlier, but talk to me a little bit about
27:29
Speaker 2: why it is important to have that foundational understanding of
27:33
Speaker 2: where you're at to meet your partner in your relationship.
27:37
Speaker 1: I mean, we all carry this really vast emotional history.
27:41
Speaker 1: Like whether you've experienced trauma or not, you have absolutely
27:46
Speaker 1: had hard moments. You've experienced hurt, you've experienced some sort
27:51
Speaker 1: of loss, and those strong moments, those big reactions, they
27:55
Speaker 1: leave an imprint on the mind and they affect the
27:58
Speaker 1: way that you not only perceive the present, where you
28:02
Speaker 1: will literally have a lens of the past that you
28:06
Speaker 1: have to try your best to see through to be
28:09
Speaker 1: able to see the present. And that makes engaging with
28:13
Speaker 1: reality as it is quite challenging, and that also makes
28:16
Speaker 1: engaging with your partner challenging. So realizing that we all
28:20
Speaker 1: come with this heavy conditioning from the past, that means
28:23
Speaker 1: that we all have some you know, you can call
28:25
Speaker 1: it healing or you can call it growth, but we
28:27
Speaker 1: all have some work to do on ourselves. And that's
28:30
Speaker 1: what really helps, you know, understand that, Okay, we're simultaneously imperfect.
28:35
Speaker 1: We have this past that wants us to react in
28:38
Speaker 1: the same way over and over again, which usually manifest
28:41
Speaker 1: in a defensive manner. But we're going to do our
28:44
Speaker 1: best to not be dominated by the pass and just
28:46
Speaker 1: show up in a caring way in the present.
28:48
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's easy to liken this too again the pathway
28:53
Speaker 2: of an athlete or physical performance. Right, If you every
28:58
Speaker 2: day try to show up and go one hundred percent
29:00
Speaker 2: without time to recover your muscles or give your body
29:04
Speaker 2: what it needs, then eventually you'll show up and you'll
29:08
Speaker 2: be giving ninety five ninety eighty five, eighty seventy forty thirty.
29:14
Speaker 3: Dead at zero.
29:15
Speaker 1: Right.
29:15
Speaker 2: And so to take the time to give your body
29:18
Speaker 2: what it truly needs, both physically and mentally, then enables
29:23
Speaker 2: you to show up how you truly wish to in
29:26
Speaker 2: a continuous capacity.
29:28
Speaker 1: Oh my, gosh, you're like literally speaking to my life
29:31
Speaker 1: right now. I've been doing so much running and I
29:35
Speaker 1: was training and I would only take like a day off,
29:39
Speaker 1: and then there was once where I was like, okay,
29:41
Speaker 1: I really have to take two days off, and my goodness,
29:44
Speaker 1: the way my body bounced back after like giving myself
29:47
Speaker 1: the extra rest.
29:47
Speaker 2: But isn't it so funny that in the act of
29:50
Speaker 2: taking the time off you feel as though you are
29:53
Speaker 2: doing something wrong. It's like, oh, yeah, well, I'm not
29:56
Speaker 2: running today, so I must be messing up.
29:58
Speaker 3: Like I'm lacking, et cetera.
30:00
Speaker 2: But when you realize what happens in the periods of
30:03
Speaker 2: recovery that then enable and empower you to show up
30:06
Speaker 2: how you want to show up two days later, then
30:09
Speaker 2: you're like, Okay, I get it now, I know.
30:11
Speaker 1: And this is exactly what we were talking about in
30:13
Speaker 1: the beginning of the our convo, right where we're like
30:16
Speaker 1: attached to not only high levels of excitement, but high
30:19
Speaker 1: levels of performance and that you know, you can see
30:23
Speaker 1: that on the individual level, but you can also see
30:25
Speaker 1: that on the relationship level, or where we want the
30:27
Speaker 1: highest height of harmony all the time, the highest height
30:30
Speaker 1: of good communication and it's just not going to be
30:33
Speaker 1: like that all the time. And when we stop fighting
30:36
Speaker 1: the tough moments and we allow them to arise, because
30:39
Speaker 1: usually they're a rising, so that you can overcome some
30:44
Speaker 1: type of block, something that you know, if you were
30:48
Speaker 1: able to face it and understand it together, you can
30:52
Speaker 1: resolve it so that you can deepen your connection.
30:58
Speaker 2: Taking a break from today's episod so to give some
31:00
Speaker 2: love to Friend of the Show Receipts. Receipts is a
31:04
Speaker 2: new platform that rewards you for working out. The app
31:08
Speaker 2: taps directly into your fitness tracker like Garmin, Cooros, Apple Watch,
31:12
Speaker 2: Aura or Whoop and rewards you with points for minutes
31:15
Speaker 2: of elevated heart rate during activities. You can start streaks,
31:19
Speaker 2: set goals, and compete on leaderboards and in challenges. Points
31:24
Speaker 2: may be redeemed for give cards to brands or for.
31:27
Speaker 3: Other exclusive perks.
31:28
Speaker 2: I just took a look at my app and I
31:30
Speaker 2: have the opportunity to get gift cards to places like Nike,
31:34
Speaker 2: Fury or Lululemon just because I took the time to
31:39
Speaker 2: invest in myself.
31:40
Speaker 3: That's pretty awesome.
31:41
Speaker 2: Head on over to hurdle dot receipts dot x Y
31:45
Speaker 2: z Again, that is h u r d l E
31:48
Speaker 2: dot r e c e I p t s dot
31:51
Speaker 2: x y z today to download the app and start
31:55
Speaker 2: having fun immediately. Again, that is receipts dot x y
32:00
Speaker 2: z code hurdle to download today. Now. Another lesson that
33:22
Speaker 2: you learned is let each other evolve. That can be
33:27
Speaker 2: a little difficult as well, right, because maybe you like
33:29
Speaker 2: things as they are right now, how do you embrace
33:34
Speaker 2: this evolution?
33:35
Speaker 1: I love that honesty of yours. I think it's just
33:39
Speaker 1: we have to work with the universe and not against it.
33:42
Speaker 1: And the reality is that everything is always changing, right,
33:46
Speaker 1: Everything is changing at the atomic, the biological level, the
33:50
Speaker 1: cosmological level, and that means that we are changing, like
33:53
Speaker 1: we're changing human beings. And when you take that to
33:57
Speaker 1: your personal life, that means that whenever you met your
34:00
Speaker 1: partner and you initially had that magnetic attraction towards them,
34:04
Speaker 1: that person is literally in the past, like that person
34:07
Speaker 1: doesn't exist anymore. So the person that you're seeing now
34:11
Speaker 1: does spring from that initial moment, but they're not exactly
34:15
Speaker 1: the same. Their preferences are going to evolve over time.
34:18
Speaker 1: How you know, especially if you've been together for decades,
34:20
Speaker 1: the way they look is going to change over time,
34:22
Speaker 1: and I think it's actually beautiful to appreciate the fact
34:28
Speaker 1: that growth and change, like it's change is going to happen,
34:31
Speaker 1: so you may as well use it to your benefit
34:33
Speaker 1: and use it for your growth. But don't think of
34:36
Speaker 1: yourself at these as these like two static beings like
34:39
Speaker 1: in your mind. Instead envision yourselves as two rivers that
34:44
Speaker 1: are choosing to flow alongside each other. That feels much
34:48
Speaker 1: more appropriate and honestly, much more realistic, because you're going
34:52
Speaker 1: to change, and I think it's good, like it allows
34:55
Speaker 1: that that curiosity and that interest to get your partner
34:58
Speaker 1: to get to know them over and over again. It's
35:00
Speaker 1: always going to be there because they're They're just not
35:02
Speaker 1: going to be the same.
35:04
Speaker 2: And candidly, you probably don't want them to stay the same.
35:08
Speaker 2: I mean, I know that there are moments in any
35:11
Speaker 2: relationship where you feel as though you're holding on to
35:14
Speaker 2: something that was from years, months, weeks, whatever it is ago, right,
35:20
Speaker 2: and I've been there, I understand. But the reality is
35:24
Speaker 2: that as the world changed, like you said, we change,
35:27
Speaker 2: and so you want someone that is evolving and growing
35:31
Speaker 2: with time, just as you want to evolve.
35:34
Speaker 1: And grow with time totally. And you imagine if you're, like,
35:37
Speaker 1: you know, in a long relationship and the person that
35:40
Speaker 1: you're with is still acting like they're twenty five, you know,
35:45
Speaker 1: when you're like forty, and it's like you're going to change.
35:49
Speaker 1: And I think that's just honestly, and really I enjoy
35:53
Speaker 1: that aspect of relationship and even with friendships, even with
35:55
Speaker 1: my parents, Like even my parents like who they were
35:58
Speaker 1: when they were raising me, Like they're just such different
36:01
Speaker 1: human beings now, and I think that's awesome because we're
36:06
Speaker 1: evolving together and like that always sparks this like newness
36:11
Speaker 1: and conversation where like tell me your thoughts, Like tell
36:14
Speaker 1: me what you're thinking about X, Y and Z this
36:17
Speaker 1: political moment or this TV show or whatever it is,
36:20
Speaker 1: because their views are not always going to be exactly
36:23
Speaker 1: the same and I could learn something from them.
36:25
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's really interesting when you segue into having an
36:28
Speaker 2: adult relationship with your parents.
36:31
Speaker 3: Versus when you had when you were younger.
36:34
Speaker 1: Right, yeah, I know, being like almost peers with them,
36:38
Speaker 1: except like they're always your parents. But it is really
36:41
Speaker 1: strange and it's funny because even with my dad, we
36:44
Speaker 1: were celebrating his birthday the other day, and I'm talking
36:46
Speaker 1: to my wife and I'm like, he's my boy, Like
36:49
Speaker 1: I just love this guy, you know, he's my boy,
36:51
Speaker 1: Like I.
36:54
Speaker 3: Oh, dad, Dad.
36:57
Speaker 2: I was thinking as we were saying here about like
37:00
Speaker 2: you don't want to be with someone that's acting like
37:02
Speaker 2: they're twenty five when you're forty, and then kind of
37:05
Speaker 2: bringing it into this lens of personal growth and personal development, right,
37:09
Speaker 2: because I think that that is a really interesting point
37:12
Speaker 2: to make about where someone might be on their own
37:14
Speaker 2: individual journey. If you are still looking at things through
37:18
Speaker 2: the lens of being twenty five when you were in
37:20
Speaker 2: your mid thirties, that's problematic. It's blatant disregard to your
37:26
Speaker 2: own evolution.
37:29
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I think it's very like I also want
37:31
Speaker 1: to parse it right where I think it is really
37:35
Speaker 1: important to maintain like a youthful curiosity with the world
37:40
Speaker 1: where you want to be humble and you want to
37:42
Speaker 1: learn and you want to absorb and just like you know,
37:45
Speaker 1: have a deep understanding that you don't know everything. But
37:48
Speaker 1: at the same time, like times change, and I remember
37:53
Speaker 1: the person who I was when I was in college
37:56
Speaker 1: versus someone who, you know, when I was in my
37:59
Speaker 1: mid twenties living in New York City to who I
38:02
Speaker 1: am now, you know, in my mid thirties, Like it
38:05
Speaker 1: feels like there is just more and more responsibility coming
38:11
Speaker 1: on my plate, where Like who I was for my
38:14
Speaker 1: family when I was in my mid twenties is just
38:16
Speaker 1: so different for who I am now in my mid thirties,
38:19
Speaker 1: and I'm you know, helping like oversee the family, helping
38:23
Speaker 1: with family decisions and things like that. And I think
38:27
Speaker 1: stepping into that type of sort of personal responsibility also
38:32
Speaker 1: is the same skill that you'll need to be able
38:37
Speaker 1: to accept the responsibility of a relationship. So as you mature,
38:41
Speaker 1: it's like, yeah, like I really I really care for
38:43
Speaker 1: my partner and I'm not just going to like you know,
38:47
Speaker 1: ghost them or bounce, you know, like I'm going to
38:49
Speaker 1: be there to do my best to fulfill the commitments
38:52
Speaker 1: that we agreed upon.
38:53
Speaker 2: And this really circles the next thing that you've learned
38:57
Speaker 2: in your eight years of marriage, which is that the
38:59
Speaker 2: truth brings you closer together acknowledging what is foundationally, whether
39:04
Speaker 2: you're talking about personal development, a problem you're trying to
39:08
Speaker 2: solve with your job, or a dynamic within your relationship.
39:12
Speaker 2: That truth and meeting yourself with where you're at is
39:14
Speaker 2: absolutely critical.
39:17
Speaker 1: It's so important. It's really valuable to understand that dishonesty
39:23
Speaker 1: creates distance, and that can be between you and yourself.
39:28
Speaker 1: If you're dishonest with yourself, then you're developing distance. You're
39:31
Speaker 1: literally disconnecting from yourself. If you are being dishonest with
39:35
Speaker 1: your partner, then that's creating a big gulf of space
39:38
Speaker 1: between the two of you. So I think doubling down
39:42
Speaker 1: on honesty even when it's difficult, Even when being honest
39:45
Speaker 1: is going to require hard conversations afterwards, and it's going
39:48
Speaker 1: to require forgiveness resolution, it still is valuable to move
39:54
Speaker 1: forward with honesty because then you have the opportunity for
39:58
Speaker 1: the deepest connection possible.
40:00
Speaker 2: The hard conversations foundationally, they can be scary for many.
40:04
Speaker 2: Is there an approach or a framework that you recommend
40:09
Speaker 2: for individuals to sit down and have some of these
40:12
Speaker 2: difficult conversations.
40:14
Speaker 1: When you're moving into a conversation, you want to do
40:18
Speaker 1: your best to strive for understanding as opposed to winning.
40:23
Speaker 1: I think this is like a key error that a
40:25
Speaker 1: lot of us make because of our sort of like survivalist,
40:28
Speaker 1: defensive natures where we go into an argument and we're
40:32
Speaker 1: trying to win. We're trying to dominate the narrative. We're
40:34
Speaker 1: trying to make sure that we have no blame and
40:37
Speaker 1: that it's all the other person's fault. But when you're
40:39
Speaker 1: both trying to win the argument, you're actually both losing.
40:43
Speaker 1: And even if one person relents and one person dominates
40:46
Speaker 1: the narrative, it still becomes a situation where you're trying
40:50
Speaker 1: to gain power over another. It's a much better and
40:54
Speaker 1: much more efficient tactic to try to understand each other.
40:58
Speaker 1: If you're having an argument, take time to listen to
41:02
Speaker 1: each other selflessly, to really be able to step outside
41:07
Speaker 1: of your own perspective, and as your partner gives you
41:09
Speaker 1: their perspective, you're doing your best to not think about
41:13
Speaker 1: what you want to say to them, but you're just
41:14
Speaker 1: trying to receive to fully try to understand where they're
41:18
Speaker 1: coming from. And then they should give you that same
41:20
Speaker 1: opportunity to tell your story and how this series of
41:24
Speaker 1: events moved for you. And you'll see that as you
41:29
Speaker 1: listen to each other's stories and you can better sense
41:34
Speaker 1: like where they're coming from, and that understanding grows that
41:37
Speaker 1: it's easier for that tension to just melt away. And
41:41
Speaker 1: I love what tik not Hans said. He wrote, once
41:44
Speaker 1: love is understanding, and I really feel like it's just
41:49
Speaker 1: it could not be more true. You know, when you
41:51
Speaker 1: fully understand someone, you don't have a feeling to fight them.
41:56
Speaker 3: Yeah.
41:56
Speaker 2: I really appreciate these sentiments, and I loved what you
41:59
Speaker 2: wrote about this in the book on the different strategies
42:02
Speaker 2: that you use to communicate during a disagreement. Another one
42:05
Speaker 2: that you articulated was remembering that your partner.
42:09
Speaker 3: Is not your enemy.
42:10
Speaker 2: Have our conversation on the defense, but if you walk
42:13
Speaker 2: into it with an understanding that the goal is for
42:17
Speaker 2: you too to be okay and whole, then you get
42:20
Speaker 2: a little bit more neutral and where your footing is totally.
42:23
Speaker 1: We fall into survivalist tactics so quickly, and we forget
42:29
Speaker 1: that the person that we're arguing with, like is not
42:32
Speaker 1: only the love of our life, it's our best friend,
42:34
Speaker 1: it's your really cool roommate. It's like, you know, you
42:37
Speaker 1: love this person is amazing, and you're totally forgetting that
42:41
Speaker 1: because you're in the heat of the moment and checking
42:44
Speaker 1: in with yourself and reminding yourself, like, oh, Wait, this
42:46
Speaker 1: is actually someone very dear to me and we're having
42:50
Speaker 1: a disagreement. But let's talk about it with calmness, Let's
42:54
Speaker 1: talk about it with clarity. Let me try my best
42:56
Speaker 1: to make sure that I I am speaking my truth
43:03
Speaker 1: while simultaneously doing my part to resolve this argument as
43:08
Speaker 1: opposed to just making it worse and worse.
43:10
Speaker 2: Yeah, and this, just like the lessons that we spoke
43:13
Speaker 2: about from your marriage, these recommendations are also so applicable
43:18
Speaker 2: beyond the conversations that you might have with a partner
43:21
Speaker 2: or even yourself. Right when I talk or think about
43:24
Speaker 2: the most successful conversations emails ways that I have conducted
43:31
Speaker 2: business over the last eight years of being a solopreneur.
43:36
Speaker 2: Approaching a conversation knowing that the victory is not winning,
43:41
Speaker 2: but the understanding is changed, the way that I am
43:44
Speaker 2: able to operate.
43:46
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, I know it's and I'm with you
43:48
Speaker 1: like it. When it started dawning on me, like how
43:51
Speaker 1: unskillful it was to try to win everything, but instead
43:54
Speaker 1: to try to understand and build bonds. That's made me,
43:58
Speaker 1: you know, whenever I'm now people who have very different
44:02
Speaker 1: views than what I have. Instead of wanting to argue.
44:08
Speaker 1: My new default is to say tell me more, right,
44:13
Speaker 1: like tell me more like, explain to me more like
44:15
Speaker 1: how you're getting to this point, because it's out of
44:18
Speaker 1: sheer curiosity, like I don't you know, even if I
44:21
Speaker 1: don't agree, I'm so curious about how you got there.
44:25
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I mean it makes me think of, for instance,
44:28
Speaker 2: if there's a brand that reaches out to me and
44:31
Speaker 2: wants to do an event and then two weeks later
44:34
Speaker 2: the event is off the table and it's not of
44:35
Speaker 2: their interest. It could be understandable that someone in my
44:39
Speaker 2: physician may get frustrated, feel insecure, wonder is it something
44:44
Speaker 2: to do with me? But then instead of acting on
44:48
Speaker 2: those thoughts and perhaps the feelings that they trigger, I
44:51
Speaker 2: come with that approach of understanding and simply ask questions.
44:56
Speaker 2: I will be in a better situation moving forward because
44:59
Speaker 2: that means that that relationship is not off of the table,
45:02
Speaker 2: and that is something that takes the reps, as you
45:05
Speaker 2: so eloquently put before, to get to a place where
45:08
Speaker 2: that is the default, where the understanding is the default.
45:13
Speaker 1: I love that so much too, because you're pointing at
45:15
Speaker 1: this thing where it's like it's like quietly pleasurable to
45:19
Speaker 1: just burn a bridge, and it's just like as opposed
45:22
Speaker 1: to just like, you know, being the bigger person. Let
45:25
Speaker 1: me try to be understanding, let me try to figure
45:27
Speaker 1: out how can we like work together in the future.
45:29
Speaker 1: But I love that you're pointing that out.
45:32
Speaker 3: It is quietly pleasurable to burn the bridge. But in
45:36
Speaker 3: the long term, let me tell you, it's better not to,
45:38
Speaker 3: better not to. It's definitely better. It's definitely better not
45:42
Speaker 3: to now.
45:43
Speaker 2: Of course, I would be remiss if we didn't talk
45:45
Speaker 2: a little bit about dating, something you cover very well
45:49
Speaker 2: in the book. One of the things that I really
45:51
Speaker 2: appreciated in the book was the way that you articulate
45:54
Speaker 2: the different red and green flags when it comes to dating,
45:58
Speaker 2: and again applicable both Yeah, within dating as well as
46:01
Speaker 2: relationships beyond those.
46:03
Speaker 3: That are romantic.
46:04
Speaker 2: Some of the red flags all go through them pretending
46:07
Speaker 2: to know everything. It's hard to learn anything about them
46:10
Speaker 2: not being honest with themselves, no accountability, and making things
46:15
Speaker 2: good for themselves, but not you. The making things good
46:19
Speaker 2: for themselves and not you. Let's talk about that.
46:23
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think, even especially if that's how something is starting,
46:27
Speaker 1: you know that there isn't like already the beginnings of
46:30
Speaker 1: care where it's like, you know, what's an ideal place
46:33
Speaker 1: for the two of us to meet for the both
46:35
Speaker 1: of us, or you know, what do you want to eat?
46:37
Speaker 1: Or you know, just making sure that both people are
46:41
Speaker 1: feeling seen from the beginning. That's one of the loveliest questions,
46:45
Speaker 1: like even from friends, is this good for you? Like
46:48
Speaker 1: do you do you like this restaurant that we picked?
46:50
Speaker 1: Do you like you know? Our like our plan? Do
46:52
Speaker 1: you feel good about it? Because then it's like you're
46:56
Speaker 1: you know, you're both just like openly just naming. Okay,
47:00
Speaker 1: we can step forward together, and you need those type
47:03
Speaker 1: of little check ins to just see if people are
47:05
Speaker 1: on the same page.
47:06
Speaker 3: Check ins are a through line of this conversation.
47:09
Speaker 2: Something else that I listed, it's hard to learn anything
47:11
Speaker 2: about them. I feel like this is something that's very
47:14
Speaker 2: important to stress because oftentimes you can get into a
47:19
Speaker 2: situation with someone where you think you really like them,
47:23
Speaker 2: but then you ask yourself, what do I even know
47:26
Speaker 2: about them? And realize that it's the idea of this
47:30
Speaker 2: person and not so much the person themselves.
47:34
Speaker 3: What do you do when you get to that place?
47:37
Speaker 1: You know, it's really interesting because you want to try
47:41
Speaker 1: to find these moments where you are both sort of
47:47
Speaker 1: equally asking and answering questions about yourselves so that you're
47:51
Speaker 1: painting a fuller and fuller picture. And if it's too
47:56
Speaker 1: one sided where only one person is asking all the
47:58
Speaker 1: questions or well, you know, like you don't want to
48:02
Speaker 1: fall into that type of situation because then you may
48:06
Speaker 1: just like, if you're the person who always asks the questions,
48:09
Speaker 1: you may be hiding behind the questions because you don't
48:12
Speaker 1: want to talk about yourself. So finding that equal balance
48:17
Speaker 1: playing field is just going to make it so that
48:20
Speaker 1: there's less and less of a mystery there, because you
48:22
Speaker 1: don't want to be building a relationship with a mystery.
48:25
Speaker 1: You want to you know, you eventually want to meet
48:27
Speaker 1: their friends. You want to know what they do for work.
48:30
Speaker 1: You want to have clarity so that you are building
48:34
Speaker 1: a realistic mental map of their life and seeing if
48:38
Speaker 1: these mental maps can come together and interlock, because you
48:42
Speaker 1: have your own idea of your own life, but do
48:44
Speaker 1: they really fit together.
48:46
Speaker 2: I appreciate this also in the context of friendships. Right
48:49
Speaker 2: if you're in a friendship and you're realizing that it
48:53
Speaker 2: is heavily weighted on one person situation versus the other.
48:58
Speaker 2: Then you have to be realistic about what's the purpose
49:02
Speaker 2: of this relationship in your life, because not every friendship
49:07
Speaker 2: is going to necessarily be fifty to fifty. But you
49:10
Speaker 2: do have to ask yourself what am I seeking and
49:13
Speaker 2: what feels good for insert your name here.
49:17
Speaker 1: I know, and a lot of times you need to
49:19
Speaker 1: kind of check in with yourself and see if, like,
49:21
Speaker 1: is this a relationship that's you know, good for my
49:24
Speaker 1: nervous system, like it does it actually feel good to
49:28
Speaker 1: be around this new friend? Like can I really put
49:30
Speaker 1: my guard down? Can I be myself? Do are they
49:33
Speaker 1: like expecting me to be a very specific version of myself?
49:36
Speaker 1: Or can I just be however I feel? And that's
49:39
Speaker 1: when you really know, like cause I think sometimes like
49:42
Speaker 1: you don't want to expect every single friendship of yours
49:46
Speaker 1: to be the deepest friendship ever, right, Like, not everyone's
49:50
Speaker 1: going to be your best friend. And sometimes you have
49:52
Speaker 1: like lighter connections where people that you enjoy hanging out
49:56
Speaker 1: with and you're truthful with them. But then there are
49:58
Speaker 1: other people who you can like fully be yourself with
50:02
Speaker 1: and show them a wide range of your character. And
50:06
Speaker 1: I think in those really special instances. You know that
50:10
Speaker 1: someone is really important to you when you can feel
50:15
Speaker 1: the immediate relaxation when you're in their presence.
50:18
Speaker 3: Oh, it's so true.
50:19
Speaker 2: And I also feel as though there's an importance of
50:25
Speaker 2: being okay with having those different types of relationships in
50:31
Speaker 2: different times of your life. You might be in a
50:36
Speaker 2: season right now where you really only want to spend
50:41
Speaker 2: time appreciate those really deep, I can let my guard
50:46
Speaker 2: down relationships. That doesn't mean that other people aren't important,
50:51
Speaker 2: it's just that right now, those types of less deep,
50:55
Speaker 2: more surface level connections aren't the kind of connections that
50:59
Speaker 2: you're seeking or that you feel like really serve you totally.
51:02
Speaker 1: And you'll find too that oftentimes you end up, like
51:06
Speaker 1: I keep seeing that in my own life, where I
51:08
Speaker 1: end up developing newer friendships with people who I have
51:13
Speaker 1: something to learn from, you know, where where it's like
51:16
Speaker 1: they either they I know, my wife and I are
51:18
Speaker 1: moving into this chapter where we might have kids, and
51:20
Speaker 1: we've been really thinking about it. So I've been you know,
51:23
Speaker 1: around around more dads, like you know, people who are
51:26
Speaker 1: around my age, and and just like asking them mad
51:29
Speaker 1: questions like what's it, because it's it's like, who knows
51:33
Speaker 1: what the future will hold for us, But it's interesting
51:36
Speaker 1: how friendships will just connect you with people that will
51:41
Speaker 1: give you a little peek into what your future evolution
51:44
Speaker 1: might look like.
51:45
Speaker 3: M what other questions are you asking the dads diego?
51:50
Speaker 1: Can they manage?
51:52
Speaker 3: How do they do it?
51:53
Speaker 1: I know, I know, it looks like chaos.
51:56
Speaker 3: It looks like chaos.
51:57
Speaker 2: It's some of the green flags that you address in
52:00
Speaker 2: the book when it comes to dating listening with calm enjoyment.
52:05
Speaker 2: I could list these, but I need to start with
52:07
Speaker 2: the calm enjoyment and marinate on that because I think
52:09
Speaker 2: that is such a beautiful way to put the goodness
52:13
Speaker 2: that can come from a conversation that two people are
52:17
Speaker 2: truly present in.
52:19
Speaker 1: I know, I know, I think. And it's hard because everybody,
52:24
Speaker 1: like not everybody, but I would say like ninety percent
52:26
Speaker 1: of people like love talking about themselves, right, And sometimes
52:31
Speaker 1: you're in a conversation and like you can feel the
52:35
Speaker 1: craving to talk about yourself. And that's why this sort
52:40
Speaker 1: of line about calm enjoyment, to listen with common enjoyment,
52:43
Speaker 1: where you are equally interested to just hear this person's story,
52:49
Speaker 1: to just hear where they're coming from and you get
52:51
Speaker 1: joy from listening to them. That's a really good sign
52:55
Speaker 1: because they're so interesting to you and so not just magnetic,
53:00
Speaker 1: but that you feel like they're well rounded in that like, wow,
53:04
Speaker 1: they're really peaking your curiosity to me, that's like, that's
53:07
Speaker 1: that's a great sign.
53:08
Speaker 3: It's such a good sign.
53:09
Speaker 2: And when I think about the individuals in my life
53:12
Speaker 2: that I would say truly listen actively and with that
53:17
Speaker 2: sense of calm enjoyment, I would also draw a parallel
53:21
Speaker 2: to the fact that they are really invested in their
53:27
Speaker 2: own personal betterment, they also are people that are no
53:31
Speaker 2: strangers to things like meditation and breath work and going
53:34
Speaker 2: within and so this really resonates with me.
53:38
Speaker 1: Yeah, and you like, like we mentioned before, I mean
53:42
Speaker 1: the presence that you develop with yourself, like to be
53:45
Speaker 1: with yourself, to be able to like literally be okay
53:48
Speaker 1: with closing your eyes and just feeling what's happening inside
53:52
Speaker 1: of you and knowing your own history. That builds that
53:56
Speaker 1: quality that you can then you know, give to another
54:00
Speaker 1: person and be able to listen to them, to be
54:02
Speaker 1: able to really hold space for them while they're sharing
54:05
Speaker 1: their journey with you. These two things are very intrinsically connected.
54:10
Speaker 3: Definitely.
54:10
Speaker 2: You also highlight kind of along the same vein here
54:13
Speaker 2: the energy is reciprocal willingness to be vulnerable. I love
54:18
Speaker 2: this one. They feel joy when you're happy. It seems
54:22
Speaker 2: like such a simple thing, right, that the people around
54:26
Speaker 2: you will be happy for you when you're happy.
54:29
Speaker 3: But it isn't so easy in practice.
54:32
Speaker 1: Why is that, I think because of craving. Honestly, craving
54:37
Speaker 1: is really hard, and I think that's one of the
54:39
Speaker 1: big things that I've noticed in myself that I have
54:42
Speaker 1: been actively working on for years, is when I see
54:47
Speaker 1: the success of another this is not a time to
54:51
Speaker 1: feel jealousy. This is a time to feel sympathetic joy
54:55
Speaker 1: for them. You know, they've worked hard, they got to
54:58
Speaker 1: this point, they're having a fantastic moment, and celebrate them,
55:01
Speaker 1: be happy for them. And you find the same thing
55:05
Speaker 1: in you know, friendships where one person may be excelling,
55:10
Speaker 1: you know, in their home life or romantic life, or
55:13
Speaker 1: their work life, and you may feel the pangs of jealousy,
55:16
Speaker 1: but you know that the connection between these two people
55:20
Speaker 1: is so deep. When you see your best friend and
55:23
Speaker 1: they're having a big victory and you don't feel any jealousy. Instead,
55:27
Speaker 1: you just feel joy for them. You're like, wow, this
55:29
Speaker 1: is so amazing. And simultaneously, in romantic relationships, you know,
55:34
Speaker 1: you don't want to be in competition with your partner.
55:36
Speaker 1: You want to celebrate them because they're awesome.
55:38
Speaker 3: Yeah.
55:39
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's so important and certainly something that I've navigated personally.
55:44
Speaker 2: I'm sure that you have as well at times. And
55:46
Speaker 2: so for those that may see this within their relationships, again,
55:50
Speaker 2: whether they be platonic or otherwise, is there a way
55:54
Speaker 2: to articulate that that happiness would be really important to you?
56:00
Speaker 1: I think it's I think, you know, being honest and
56:03
Speaker 1: open and just saying like, I would love to have
56:06
Speaker 1: a partner that feels a lot of sympathetic joy. You know,
56:09
Speaker 1: I want to be able to celebrate them when they
56:11
Speaker 1: have victories, and I would like for them to be
56:14
Speaker 1: able to celebrate me too. I think being open like that,
56:17
Speaker 1: you know, you're putting your cars on the table, And
56:19
Speaker 1: I feel like this's this sort of next wave of
56:21
Speaker 1: relationships over the coming years, it's going to be much
56:24
Speaker 1: more about being direct, being clear, like how do this
56:27
Speaker 1: is how I want my happiness to be supported? And
56:30
Speaker 1: this is what I can offer to you, and you know,
56:33
Speaker 1: there being no mystery there.
56:35
Speaker 2: Yeah, the last green flag that you articulate. They are
56:38
Speaker 2: actively working on developing new qualities. Why is that important
56:43
Speaker 2: in any relationship?
56:46
Speaker 1: I think that's one of the coolest things. Is like
56:49
Speaker 1: when you come across a new friend or you're dating
56:52
Speaker 1: or just like interacting with someone and as soon as
56:56
Speaker 1: you start going a little deep and you're like, what
56:57
Speaker 1: are you working on? You know, like internally, like what
57:00
Speaker 1: what's like been sort of taking your mind? Where what
57:02
Speaker 1: are you putting your energy into? And I love hearing
57:05
Speaker 1: when you know people are just like, I'm working on,
57:09
Speaker 1: you know, being more self aware. I'm working on, you know,
57:12
Speaker 1: trying not to react. I'm really working on pausing right now.
57:15
Speaker 1: And when you know, especially if you're dating and you're
57:20
Speaker 1: actively looking for a partner and asking them like, what
57:22
Speaker 1: are you working on internally and they give you an
57:25
Speaker 1: answer that's meaningful and real, that shows you that this
57:29
Speaker 1: is an individual who of course they're not perfect, but
57:32
Speaker 1: at least they have the strength to grow. Like that
57:36
Speaker 1: is enough.
57:37
Speaker 3: Yeah, It's definitely enough.
57:39
Speaker 1: You know.
57:39
Speaker 2: We're recording this close to the top of twenty twenty
57:42
Speaker 2: five and something that I often converse about with friends, peers, colleagues,
57:47
Speaker 2: whomever at this time of year is what the word
57:50
Speaker 2: is for the year? What is the intention that you're setting?
57:54
Speaker 2: What is it that you want to walk through the
57:56
Speaker 2: next twelve months with? I ask this question to you
58:01
Speaker 2: reflecting on what you just said, knowing that every one
58:03
Speaker 2: of us, regardless of how much work that you've put in,
58:06
Speaker 2: has something that they're interested in cultivating, evolving, nurturing.
58:11
Speaker 3: So do you go, what's your word for twenty twenty five?
58:13
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, can I Can I slam two of
58:15
Speaker 1: them together?
58:16
Speaker 3: Please?
58:17
Speaker 1: So, as you was thinking, I'm I think I'm trying
58:19
Speaker 1: to develop like healthy resilience, Like I want to have
58:23
Speaker 1: reserves of healthy energy, so that you know, as I'm traveling,
58:28
Speaker 1: as I'm like moving about the world and just like
58:31
Speaker 1: working and whatnot, that I don't feel depleted. Like I
58:34
Speaker 1: don't want to feel like I'm dragging myself from one
58:37
Speaker 1: you know, work objective to another. I want to feel
58:40
Speaker 1: like I'm strong in my body. I've been working all
58:43
Speaker 1: these years on my mind and it's you know, I'm
58:47
Speaker 1: going to continue working on it for the rest of
58:48
Speaker 1: my life. But I can feel the focus now turning
58:52
Speaker 1: into my body and wanting to really just strengthen it.
58:55
Speaker 2: So what I'm hearing you say is that you believe
58:58
Speaker 2: the tool that will help you develop healthy resilience is physical.
59:05
Speaker 2: In investing in your body, you will get to a
59:07
Speaker 2: place where you feel as though you can continually show
59:10
Speaker 2: up with those reserves that you're after.
59:12
Speaker 1: Absolutely, And I think it started first as mental, like
59:16
Speaker 1: I had to work on my mind. I had to
59:18
Speaker 1: work on my sadness, my anxiety. I had to work
59:20
Speaker 1: on like you know, building non reaction and compassion. And
59:24
Speaker 1: now I feel the lightness of mind that I can
59:27
Speaker 1: really like turn attention to my body and be like, okay,
59:30
Speaker 1: how can we get stronger?
59:31
Speaker 2: I love to hear that. I'm so excited for everything
59:34
Speaker 2: that you're doing right now. What's to come for you?
59:37
Speaker 2: As you sit here? What would you say you're most
59:40
Speaker 2: excited about?
59:41
Speaker 1: Looking forward for this coming year? The tour that I'm
59:46
Speaker 1: going to do that goes along with how to Love Better.
59:48
Speaker 1: I think it's going to be really cool, Like I'm
59:50
Speaker 1: going to do some new cities that I haven't been
59:51
Speaker 1: to before or done events in like Austin and Boulder,
59:55
Speaker 1: Colorado and I also have this twenty day meditation course
59:59
Speaker 1: lined up after the tour and after the book launch
1:00:01
Speaker 1: that I'm super excited about. I can't wait to go
1:00:04
Speaker 1: meditate for twenty days.
1:00:06
Speaker 3: Your excitement is contagious. I know.
1:00:08
Speaker 2: In our last conversation we talked foundationally about ways that
1:00:12
Speaker 2: someone can begin integrating a meditation practice into their routine.
1:00:16
Speaker 2: So I'll make sure to link that in the show notes.
1:00:18
Speaker 2: But thank you so much for your time today. For
1:00:21
Speaker 2: those that aren't following along with you just yet, how
1:00:24
Speaker 2: do they keep up with you?
1:00:25
Speaker 3: Remind them where they can get the book? Give me
1:00:27
Speaker 3: all the details.
1:00:28
Speaker 1: Yeah, sure, so you can get How to Love Better
1:00:31
Speaker 1: on Amazon. You can get it at Barnes and Nobles
1:00:33
Speaker 1: any bookstore. And you can follow me along on Instagram
1:00:38
Speaker 1: at Young Pueblo, Yung Underscore pu e Blo. And my
1:00:43
Speaker 1: new favorite place to write is also substack Young Pueblot
1:00:47
Speaker 1: substack dot com.
1:00:48
Speaker 3: I love it. I love a substack.
1:00:50
Speaker 2: I'm over at Emilybody and at Hurdle Podcast another Hurdle concred.
1:00:55
Speaker 3: Catch you guys next time
1:01:02
Speaker 1: To