Latest / Pete Vs Anxiety!!!!! / Recovery Starts With Truth

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Recovery Starts With Truth · Pete Vs Anxiety!!!!!

• Pete: Ever wish you had someone to talk to anytime, anywhere, matter what you're going through? Meet PsychPAL, your 24-7 AI companion, designed to help you process your thoughts, calm your mind, and keep you moving forward. Chat anytime during a panic attack on a restless night or just when you need to vent. Prefer talking instead of typing? Try voice journaling. PsychPAL listens, transcribes, and truly understands. You can even upload screenshots of tough conversations, and it'll help you unpack how they made you feel. PsychPAL keeps life organized, too. It can add appointments to your calendar, track your mood, and even summarize your sessions for your therapist so you'll never lose progress. Plus, built-in crisis resources are always just one click away. It's a privacy-first, constantly evolving, made to complement your professional care, not replace it. Ready to try it out? Head over to the link in this episode and use my code, Pete, at checkout to get 20 % off your first month subscription to PsychPAL. PsychPAL, because your mind deserves a companion too. There we go. I think that's the one I like. We got it. We got it. Boom. peter: but Pete: went to doing like pre-recordings. Well, Keith, we're at the part of the interview where I'm gonna ask you those two questions. All right, Amanda Landes: that I had been kind of like since head for a while about about writing the story because Mia Mason: you are not the only one that experiences thoughts, Pete "mental Health Champ": Well, Dr. Erica, before we start wrapping up, I'm going to ask you Pete "mental health champ": Peter for exciting before get started today, guys. Let's give a shout-out to my partners over at PsychPal. Link will be in the bio. You guys know as always, seven-day free trial, 20% off your first month if you like. just use PD at checkout. With that being said, my guest today is an author, speaker, transformational recovery expert who has devoted his life to help people break free from addiction and reclaim their futures. Please welcome in the author of God Doesn't Relapse, Sex, Drugs, and the Life That Almost Killed Me. The one, the only Matt Grace. Matt, thank you so much for being here, man. Matt Grace: Pete, thanks for having me. It's a it's an honor. Pete "mental health champ": So Matt, we gotta get into w the a little bit about yourself and then we definitely need to talk about the title of this book, man, because I'm telling you right Matt Grace: Okay. Pete "mental health champ": now it's already got me attention. Matt Grace: Yeah, do you want me to Pete "mental health champ": Go ahead, tell tell everybody about yourself, man. Yeah, this is your shark, man. Give it to him, buddy. Matt Grace: Sure. I mean, so got it. I so I wrote the book for three reasons. One to for parents who have a hard time enabling their kids and specifically with drugs and alcohol, but it doesn't have to be it doesn't have to be drugs and alcohol either. It can Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Matt Grace: enabling can take many forms. the second is to inspire people to do more service work and volunteer work. And the third obviously is is God, the the a relationship with God or a higher power and it doesn't have to be my journey or my definition. So I I know that a lot of people today who are looking to get clean and sober have a hard time intertwining God with their program. And that's why service can be your higher power. That's really like if I could sum up my book in one sentence, it could be that, you know, you don't have to believe in God to do something nice for somebody. Right? You don't have to believe Pete "mental health champ": Very true. Matt Grace: in God to take someone to a meeting Loan someone a little bit of money. You don't want to become their banker, but do doing something nice for somebody. And I wrote the book because I spent 10,000 hours working with families across the country. And the reason why I stepped away, one was burnout, but the second was I wanted to reach a broader audience. And because most of the ancillary services in the mental health space are very expensive, specifically with addiction. And you know, insurance doesn't cover the costs that as a for a sober coach or for an interventionist or for some therapists, right? And some treat and some medicine. And so I wanted to reach a broader audience and because I believe that I was spared to give back. a lot of my friends are dead and I don't think I was I don't think I'm here by accident. And so it and I I've had a crazy life, right? I I I was expelled from two preschools. by the time I was six years old, the school therapist told my parents that she thought I would end up in prison or be a career criminal by six. Pete "mental health champ": Geez. Matt Grace: By nine. and and and in all fairness, I was telling am I allowed to swear? Okay, I I know it's not Pete "mental health champ": Yeah, go ahead. Say whatever you need to man, you're good. Matt Grace: respectful. but by the time I was six, I was telling my teachers to go fuck themselves. Pete "mental health champ": Yeah. Matt Grace: So yeah, you know, they were c they were concerned as as they should have been. but I think a lot of people will say, Well, geez, where did my parents fail me? And my parents made a lot of mistakes, but I want to be very clear that I own my life, I own my recovery. what I say is that this book, specifically to my father, it's not an indictment of his failure. It's a testimony to what happens when you love someone too much. So it's important to understand the distinction. A lot of people get stuck in blaming, and listen, we've all had trauma, but a lot of people get stuck in their trauma. And they hate their parents or they hate certain people. But most people do the best that they can, even if they make really bad mistakes along the way, which is where my p my parents fall into that category. Now, by the age of nine, I was sent to a therapist, right? Because my behavior was unruly, not at home, but in school. And I started crying and I said, Dad, what's wrong with me? And he said, I don't know, but I think I found someone who might know. And so unfortunately, I was sent to a therapist for nine years, three times a week, every Tuesday, Wednesday, and Thursday. Okay. That means I missed out on a lot of sports, a lot of activities. And in the first session, keep in mind I'm nine, he said, Matt, do you know why you're here? And I said, Not really. I mean, I kind of knew. And he said, Well, you have an Oedipal complex and You want to have sex with your mom and castrate your father. So anybody who's listening, let that seep in for a second, that that I'm a nine-year-old boy. And that was Pete "mental health champ": What? Matt Grace: his BS Freudian, which which if you talk to therapists about that diagnosis, it's absurd. and so what I did was I started, I said, no, I I don't want to have sex with my mom. And he kept saying that I did. And then I have physically assaulted him every session. From nine to thirteen. So that's four years. Every Tuesday, Wednesday, and Thursday, he would open the door, close it. I would kick him and hit him as hard as I could, throw things at him. He would put me in a bear hug and then ask me if I let you go, are you willing to stop? That's what went on for the first four years. And so people say, Well, why didn't you well, we know why he didn't tell my parents, because he's a crook. and my dad definitely paid for his college kids' education. Pete "mental health champ": Yeah. Matt Grace: but When you're nine, I didn't know any better. I just thought that this was what therapy was was that I come in and I try to beat my therapist up. And it's just shocking, right? Like and then Pete "mental health champ": Yeah. yeah. Matt Grace: it didn't get better. So then I just started sleeping throughout the sessions. And in order for time, I'll expedite the there's there's just so much so many stories in the book, but my behavior got worse. Pete "mental health champ": Yeah. Matt Grace: Everybody in my family outside of my parents in went to interview him, said that we don't like him at all, but my parents were steadfast in their decision. And, you know, my parents got divorced. I stayed with my father, which was kind of unusual. Usually you stay with your mom in the house and the father leaves. It was the exact opposite. and then my house became the party house. Now I did drugs for the first time when I was 16 years old. And I it was a a summer day in June and my best friend who's now dead crushed a pill of Ritalin and said, Grace, get over here and snort this. So without any hesitation, I did it and that was it. And any any addict who's ever put something up their nose, they're really the only ones that can understand what that's like. And what Pete "mental health champ": Yeah. Matt Grace: I said in my book is it was amphetamine bliss, a gift from the gods. And that was it. That was I was off to the races. And I said to myself, if I could feel like this every day for the rest of my life, this is what I was looking for. Now it's important to differentiate that yes, I had trauma, but a lot of the time clinicians in the treatment center industry and the addiction space put too much emphasis on trauma and not enough emphasis on family history and also that you know what, it just felt good. Pete "mental health champ": Yeah. Matt Grace: Right. Like my brain is just wired differently. And because a lot of people would probably snort that and say, I don't, you know, does nothing for me or made me sick or whatever. My grandmother was an alcoholic, her three siblings were an alcoholic, and my great grandfather was an alcoholic. So I was predestined to, you know, whether my parents got divorced or not, right? That's that was the the treat the program, the treatment plan that the treatment center that I went to put in place. when I was 18, right? It was a four month inpatient plan, but I'll I'll I'll come back to that. Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Matt Grace: And then so that same summer, my father and I decided to, well, my father was asked to film a documentary at the h at Auschwitz, the concentration Pete "mental health champ": really. Matt Grace: camp in Poland. We took four Holocaust survivors back to the camps, one of which one was one of whom was a twin. Right. And it was experimented on by Dr. Joseph Mengela. And I think you can imagine what it would be like to go back to that place knowing that your whole family was murdered there. So after we filmed there for the day, we go back to the hotel and my father thought it was a good idea to buy me a prostitute. And you know, one of my clips, one of my social media clips says Auschwitz for breakfast, prostitutes for dinner. And you know, you think about all the times. First of all, it's not appropriate, right? For for a father Pete "mental health champ": Yeah. Yeah, agree. Matt Grace: to and I lot that was how I lost my virginity. and you know, one of the things that I'm very passionate about is that I'm not upset with my dad because like I said, my dad wanted to be my friend, not my father. And sixteen year old boys need fathers. and they need boundaries and some discipline, appropriate discipline. And Pete "mental health champ": Yeah. Matt Grace: so my father just did the best that he could. And, you know, he introduced me to gambling and prostitution. But it's not like he woke up and was like, let's see how I can ruin this kid's life. Right. He just thought we were Pete "mental health champ": Yeah, yeah. Matt Grace: gonna have a good time. And he didn't know that I was gonna that normalizing prostitution would become a problem for me, like pornography and and gambling. And so Listen, I had it was 13 years, right? I started at 16. I didn't get clean till t till I was twenty-nine. Wrecked cars, wrecked jobs, lying, stealing, manipulating. you know, I was a TV reporter. I was I showed up to work drunk and high-end OxyContin one morning and OD'd in the newsroom. Started vomiting everywhere, including on my boss's Pete "mental health champ": Okay. Matt Grace: shoes, and they tried to pick me up. and move me outside because I was it was like the exorcist. I mean, it was just like and I it was I had acute alcohol poisoning and my respiratory system was starting to collapse from the combination of the of the oxies and the alcohol. And so there's just a million stories like that and for for time's sake, you know, people can buy the book, but I've had a crazy life, spoiled, selfish, entitled, Every job that I had, my father protected me from being fired. I would show up to work intoxicated. My boss on many occasions would say, What's in that orange juice bottle? And I would say, Don't worry about it. Right. And how how many people can say that to their boss? Not many, right? They would, they would, Pete "mental health champ": Yeah, true. Very true. Matt Grace: you know, most people would be fired, right? That's the appropriate response. But I was entitled and Just to give a people of a frame of mind of what I was like, my grandfather, whom I never met, product of the Great Depression, worked two jobs in the 20s that netted him $3 a week. And he's he's started, co founded an ad agency in Michigan and was extremely creative, extremely hardworking, dedicated to to put food on the table for his family. I went to work in the mailroom. This is like, you know. a long time down the road. And the whole goal of the mailroom was to receive mentoring from the creative department in the ad agency. And that's where people started. You start in the mailroom, you work on your craft, and then if you're good enough, you get called up, right? And then Pete "mental health champ": Yeah. Matt Grace: you start writing commercials. Well one day at two o'clock in the afternoon, I decided to pick up the phone in the mailroom and call one of the most successful creative minds in the country. who was like second in command, I think, in the creative department. And I said, I'm done working in the mailroom. I want a promotion right now. And they tried to give me one. And so I talk about how, first of all, that I was when I got sober and I developed a God consciousness in my life, how embarrassing that must have been if my grandfather was watching down. And I if I do get to heaven, what I would say is the first person who I owe an amends to is him. Because I I embarrassed myself, my name. yes, I have a disease and I'm an alcoholic, but that's no excuse to behave like that. and employ you know, with employers or women that I used or just you know, I mean I was a a selfish person. And so I wanna jump jump ahead to where do have a question? Yeah. Pete "mental health champ": So, so Matt, real quick, I want to ask you though, what was that defining moment though? Like that moment you realize that I just want to get help. Because you know, when it comes to addiction, it's hard. It's hard to help people that don't want to get sober. You can't force them. So what was that moment that you were just like, you know what? I need to do something about this. It's a problem. Matt Grace: Yeah, so I went through multiple treatment centers, right? Drug court, probation, in the system at a very young age. not the juvenile system, because my dad of real quickly before I get to that point, I almost killed someone on a field trip. I threw something out of a school bus Pete "mental health champ": okay. Matt Grace: and it cracked this lady's windshield. And they followed the bus until it exited the off ramp and cornered the bus in. And so My father paid her twenty five thousand dollars not to press charges. And so I said if I was an an underprivileged kid, maybe black or Hispanic or whomever, even white, right? not coming from privilege, I probably would have ended up in juvenile hall because my father, to try to scare me, set up a day in court with a circuit court judge, which was his friend, and I watched other kids get sent to juvenile hall all day. And and that's when I realized that privilege means power. Right. That that that my father was gonna rescue me no matter what I did. And as long as I didn't kill someone, he was gonna buy my way out of any problem that I had. And he tried and he paid people to do my homework in high school and in college. I mean, it was such a a serious level of enabling. I just wanted to throw that in there. Now the moment the moment that I got sober was a a result from my mother saving my life. I was twenty nine years old, living at home. working at the ad agency and my mom said there's two rules one if you are not gonna be home you have to call so this is before iPhones Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Matt Grace: and the second is no drugs no booze in the house if I find them you're gone so I disappeared on a three day crack and alcohol binge and When I came home, it was a Saturday at eleven thirty in the morning, October second, two thousand four. I weighed a hundred and twenty-nine pounds. I'm six feet tall. And my mom said, my God, and then started sobbing. And then she collected herself and said, If you're gonna die, it's not gonna be in this house. Get out, I'm changing the locks. And so let me tell you why that's important. That was the first time that I knew she was serious about. Well, that was the first time that she stuck to a boundary, right? And so that was the dichotomy that I face working with families. My mom knew who I was from an early age. My father wanted to sweep addiction under the rug. That's the problem. Everybody wants to ask me about what was the shame like being an addict? It's the families that have more shame than the addicts themselves. Pete "mental health champ": Yeah. Matt Grace: That's why it people aren't getting better because you have families like my father who are sweeping the addiction under the rug. And then you have someone like my mom who's trying to hold me accountable, that my father just keeps pushing, keeps running over the barriers that she puts in place. That's the biggest problem right now, I think. So I knew she was serious. she said, if you promise me that you go to a meeting, right? If I smell one iota of booze, one little thing, you're gone. Like she she I begged her not to throw me into the street. I went to a meeting. I had I heard what I have heard for ever since I was 18. Have you tried getting down on your knees and praying? And so it's important for any listener who's not an addict to understand pain is the greatest motivator. Right? I mean, I OD'd, I was arrested, I was stealing people's identity, I I was in a bad way, vomiting all the time, showing up to work drunk, vomiting, wrecking cars. But after every catastrophic event, I was still drinking two hours later. So pain, deep-rooted spiritual pain, is the greatest gift and the greatest motivator that you can ever have. The consequences, right, were uns were insufficient to bring me to my knees. So I had to be at the right place at the right time. I went to this meeting, which became my home group, and surrounded myself with a group of men. Who had balance in their life, who had integrity and character, and seemed reasonably happy. I wanted to kill myself. And so they said it again. And someone can say something a thousand times, but it's maybe it's 1000 and one when you hear it differently Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Matt Grace: or when you're ready to accept it. And I said, What do I have to lose? I want to die anyway. And so on October 3rd, 2004, 6:30 in the morning, I got on my knees. The room was dark. I had an AR-15 sitting next to me. And I said, God, if you don't show yourself, I'm gonna blow my head off. And the room lit up with a white light that lasted for twenty five minutes. The obsession to use was lifted from me instantaneously. And I mean it's it's just, you know, sometimes I don't like sharing that experience because then people will say, Well, where's my white light? And you don't have to have that kind of experience to get sober because most people don't have that kind of shift, right? And so Pete "mental health champ": No, Matt, I agree with you there 100%, really quick. my religious moment was was two months before I started even doing the show. I had met a preacher that had come into where I was working, he was talking to me. And he knew I had a distaste for religion because the way it was presented to me. So my like my white moment was like after I, you know, did what I did and accepted faith, things just started changing. Like, like I couldn't explain it to anybody. That was my moment because it was just like things started getting clarified. You know, this show came to mind. You know, like I was sitting there thinking one day after doing a men's mental health episode for another podcast I was doing, and I was like, you know what, I want to do something different. I feel like I need to do more. And all of a sudden it just hit me. It's like, how do you explain that? Exactly. Because I talked to him every single day and it it just made my day even better. And know, you know, this coming from me versus where I was before, I would have laughed at myself. But now I'm like, I I believe it. Listen, I have my own version of white light moment. You know what I mean? Like, we don't have to experience the same way you do. They get the same effect, you know what I'm saying? Like he's he's always listening, he's always you talk to him, you know, things like that. That was just for you. That was your moment. Like everybody can't expect experience the same thing, though, you know, because mine was different than yours. But things were changing. Like, like nothing was going right for me at that point. And everything went different. As soon as I accepted, you know, faith, that's it, man. And everything just changed for me. And then, you know, and I don't force it on anybody. I just tell them about it. Like, you know, listen, I've been there, I know what it's like. Like, That was my white moment. It was like that moment I started feeling it. Things started changing for me. Things started coming to me. Different ideas came to me. You know, and had had these dreams where I was like, someone was talking to me, but I couldn't figure out who it was. You know what I mean? It was something that was talking to me. But you know, I listened to them and look where I'm at now. I've got three hundred plus episodes of this show and I'm continuing to go and I love every minute of it because it's so great. But had I not listened and I listened to the other person telling me, don't do it, I wouldn't be sitting here. Matt Grace: Yes. And so getting back to that spiritual experience that I had, it's important to note that while I was yeah, I had that experience, I Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Matt Grace: was going to meetings every day. I got involved in service so that my parents could see that I was adhering to a strict routine. And that's something that's extremely important, either for even for people who don't want to pray, Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Matt Grace: A routine is essential for an addict or an alcoholic. And so my parents needed to see a demonstration, not just words. And so that's why my mom didn't throw me out. I got a sponsor. I worked the 12 steps. Now my book is not religious and it's not directed. I talk about how my journey, but service and prayer can be incorporated in any program. And so that's why I'm I'm trying to To reach the people who might struggle with spirituality. And right, because now there's Dharma recovery, there is smart recovery, there is celebrate recovery, which is Christ-based from churches. And so Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Yeah. Matt Grace: my message is I I don't I don't want to hear any excuses. I don't care where you go, what program it is, be the best you can be in that program. Right. I'm not a mouthpiece for any program. I'm just a I'm just so passionate about. How service and volunteer work changed my life, gave me purpose, and molded my life because I can afford to do a lot of things that most other people can't do. And I think that what happens is people just look at someone else's house and someone else's, you know, they might have more money. If I only went from 50 grand a year to 75 grand a year, and I'm I'm a capitalist and I'm not saying that people shouldn't aspire to have money, but money will not Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Matt Grace: fill your spirit. after my father passed away, I went and I bought my dream car, which was a Porsche 9-11. I bought Pete "mental health champ": Nice. Matt Grace: watches, I bought clothes, I joined a golf club, I bought a house, I redecorated the house, right? So it's I'm doing all these things that society says that you should have. And I'm not against those things, but my mentor said, There's nothing wrong with liking nice things as long as I own them and they don't own me. And then I had to look at, What was the motive for the car? What was the motive for the club? What's the motive for the watch? Am I really a watch enthusiast? And one of my favorite guys, Gary Vaynerchuk, who is a massive following in the social media space, he says, Why are you driving a BMW? He's like, 97% of the people who buy it want to look good versus the 3% who really know anything about the brand. Right? If you ask most people about a brand that they're driving or associated with. They won't even know the story. Because it's all about being an imposter, right? I I had to impress upon people that and and now at 51, you know, I realized that eight months after I bought that car, it did absolutely nothing for me. And I started volunteering at this place that changed my life in the city of Detroit. It's it was a home For young teenage girls that were sex trafficked and abused by family. Now, these are the worst of the worst stories. Right? These, these, there is evil in the world. And Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Matt Grace: so what why I'm so passionate about services, anybody who's listening, and even if you're middle class or lower middle class, like if if you know, if you're not concerned where your next meal is coming from, like a lot of these people don't have a place to live. They have to choose between gas and groceries. I've never had that problem. And so what service work does is it gives you perspective. And I think a lot of people lack perspective of how truly blessed they are. Right? If you have a roof over your head, if you have food, if you have shelter, you know, if you have a job. And so a lot of there's a lot of self-pity, morass. sadness and I think that the the the most cost effective way, right? I'm not against medication, but service Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Matt Grace: work is free. Right. If if you're not someone who has a lot of resources and you're not feeling well, then go find a service position. It can be at a nursing home. It can be at a V the VFW, right? It can be at one of these shelters. And what it does is it it makes me grateful for the problems that I have. And so that's why I I live and die by service. Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Matt Grace: even now, my mom died two months ago and I'm I'm gutted and extremely depressed. But I get up and I keep going and I keep doing service because that's what will truly alleviate now grief. I want to see a therapist and a grief counselor, so I'm not Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Matt Grace: dismissing that, but you can't live in your grief counselor's office, right? That's one hour a day. So when I'm stuck in my head, what can I do? And I promise people, even people with bipolar disorder, right? I'm I'm a big fan of this guy. He severely, severely depressed, on medication, hard to get it right all the time. And he kept drinking. And so I said to my former mentor, why don't you get him a service position? That's what really helped me. And he got a service position at a Tuesday night meeting and a Sunday night meeting. And he's been sober for six years. And we both attribute that to his service work, right? His disposition changed dramatically. That's important to note that even someone who was bipolar, he started smiling more and started becoming more engaging, right? That wasn't the medicine, that was his spirit. Right? Medication can treat the brain, but the spirit needs to be treated by something else. Right? And so you know, for that first year, I think there's different levels of addiction now, right? Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Matt Grace: And so not everybody's like I was who could barely function. I mean, I I had to drink in the morning to stop from shaking. And today you have a partner at a law firm, right? He's he's still a partner, he's still married, has the kids, the house, the club, whatever they're successful in their career. Alcohol is still a problem. But they're not on death's door like I was. Pete "mental health champ": Yeah. Matt Grace: Right? There's a difference in the men in the 30s, they called these guys, they were scraping these guys off the sidewalk. They were called last gaspers. Okay, gasping for like one breath left. That that's what I identify as. And so when I speak, I tell the people who are at these state funded treatment centers that are. these guys have been institutionalized, face tattoos. everybody has given up on them. And I tell them, you guys need to put more effort into your recovery than the guy who still has a cushy job. And and and I th and I say, Do you want do you get that? Right? You can't be the person who just half asses recovery because Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Matt Grace: the the way that you were using drugs and alcohol is going to kill you. Right. And it's not life and death for everybody. And that's where my passion comes in is that you have a lot of people who aren't gonna die and did it one way, who are then telling someone else, you can do it my way, but they're not turning tricks in the street and they don't have an abusive pimp and they're not using heroin, they're not using Ivy heroin, right? They're they're going to the local store to pick up a a fifth. Pete "mental health champ": Yeah. Matt Grace: And so you have to be careful what kind of advice you're giving. it just depends on the person's path and the person's journey. And Pete "mental health champ": Yeah. Matt Grace: so my mom saved my life and and and this is this is incredible because my mom as I said, my mom passed away and I was as Pete "mental health champ": Yeah. Matt Grace: I was cleaning out her independent living apartment, I found a letter that she had written to my father thirty years ago. Actually she she typed it, and it was incredible. It just, and that's what I said in one of my socials. I said, parents, listen to this letter. This is why I wrote my book. It just completely validated what I was saying for my own family. And the letter was essentially to my dad, you only hear what Matt wants you to hear. You he he failed out of school. He lost all his allowance gambling. He's calling 1-800 sex line numbers. Now I'm really dating myself. Pete "mental health champ": Yeah. Matt Grace: you know, running up my phone bill. He is lying, manipulating, stealing, and you only see what you want to see. And I don't think we should keep supporting him financially because it's tantamount to putting drugs in his hands that will kill him. And she was basically pleading with him to set the same kind of boundaries that she wanted, right? Because they were divorced. So Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Matt Grace: I didn't have one unified message. You had two people that Well, one who was bitter because my father lost a landmark legal case, which is now it changed the law in the state. My parents' divorce lasted ten years. It went it went to the Michigan State Supreme Court and it changed that's now case law. And so my father was bitter and he didn't want to listen to what my mom had to say, but here was a letter that demonstrated my mom knew exactly who her son was. Right. And that's one of the things that I say is that parents Parents want to hear the truth until it's about their kids. And then it falls on deaf ears. And so that is that's just what I that's what I see today. That's what I saw 30 years ago, 15 years ago, is that you have not everybody's on board in the same family. Pete "mental health champ": Yeah. Matt Grace: And the family, if there's any parents that are listening to this, one of the gold standard families that I worked with. And actually in the book they wrote a testimonial and used their real name, which is which Pete "mental health champ": okay. Matt Grace: is pretty big. one of the wealthier families in the country. And the father was a Wharton grad and a Harvard grad. And he came to me and he said, Matt, what do I do? And I you know how many times I've heard that? Not many. Because Pete "mental health champ": Yeah. Matt Grace: people's ego get in the way. And you give them advice and then they don't listen. Now I beg this family, I said, please go do your own therapy. And they did. They went to one family session, just the two of them, every week for a full year. And then on every other week, I believe they had a family session with their son, who was my client. And the family wasn't even speaking. Well, I should say the father and son were not speaking. They were only communicating via email. because it was just too explosive when they were would speak to each other. And so what this allowed the family to do was to acknowledge the problem, not be embarrassed, set boundaries, and to learn how to communicate, right? Because our families, nobody pushes our buttons like family members, right? You don't have to be an alcoholic to even experience that. And so Pete "mental health champ": Yeah, true. Matt Grace: so that's often a problem. Someone comes home from treatment. The family says, I thought you were fixed. Right. How how insulting and degrading to say to someone Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Matt Grace: who's struggling with you know, a life and death problem. And it's like, no, no, I thought you were fixed, right? Like you have your own work to do. And so that is that's my book really is I want I want to help people get sober, but I really want to help families because the families don't know what to do. Pete "mental health champ": Yeah, exactly. Matt Grace: And and out of the 10,000 hours. That I worked trying to help these families, very few of them could implement the most simple boundaries. And when they did, then they would take them away. And then they would just repeat in the same vicious cycle over and over and over again. And so I want to be very clear that there's a lot of people on social media that, well, you throwing someone out is cruel. And I don't advocate for that in the first first try. But what about 13 years, right? Does Pete "mental health champ": Yeah. Matt Grace: my family not have the right to live a peaceful life without me trying to hijack them with my lies and my net my manipulation and and my well well I have a disease? Yeah, that's not an excuse. There's people who are diabetic, right? Everybody has something. Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Matt Grace: And you're either a survivor or a victim. And so I think that the only reason why I'm alive is because I knew how to be honest. If you can't be honest, there's no launching pad. Pete "mental health champ": Yeah. Matt Grace: And so the people who I know who are dead just they they thought they're fooling us, but they're fooling themselves, right? And that's the one unique thing about addiction is that one addict, it's hard for one addict to BS another. Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Matt Grace: because you you you already know the tricks. So you know, that's what I'm passionate about is helping families and using my own family as An example of what not to do, right? Like Pete "mental health champ": Yeah. Yeah. I think it's great, Matt. I really do. I think it's I think it's good the perspective you're coming from though is using your own experience and that with that makes it relatable to a lot of people because you can tell people, I've been there, I've been an addict, my family's been through this, these are the things we did to make things easier, you know? And I I love it, man. I think it's great what you're doing. Matt Grace: A lot of people can't handle the truth anymore. I think i Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Matt Grace: I've been sober, I'm coming up on twenty two years. There's even been a shift Pete "mental health champ": Awesome. Matt Grace: in recovery. paraprofessionals or you know, any of the the ancillary services that take on a client, they're afraid Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Matt Grace: to confront them because they don't want to lose the client. Pete "mental health champ": Yeah. Matt Grace: And and treatment centers really aren't incentivized to keep you clean, right? It's it's just a revolving door. And I've I've only known a couple of people that have been asked not to come back to treatment, spending half a million dollars. Right. I think, I think Betty Ford was one of them. This guy spent half a million dollars and they said no more. but most of the time, you know, they're gonna welcome you back because it's about filling those beds. Pete "mental health champ": Yeah. Matt Grace: And so I'm trying to give practicality to people who don't have access to all these. fancy treatment centers or even I'm listen, if you want to stop using, you can get sober at the Salvation Army or you can get sober at Hazelden. Right. And and so one of the things that I'm really passionate about is that there's a message, well, you should leave your hometown and go to a new environment. Well, most people can't just pick up. They have one or two jobs, right? Detroit Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Matt Grace: is a blue-collar town. And you can't just pick up and move. And so how are those people staying sober being surrounded by crack and prostitution and alcohol stores, liquor stores? It's because they developed a routine. And they developed a deep-rooted faith in God. And one example that I like to give is I'll never forget this. I was 19, I was the only white person at a black NA meeting in the city of Detroit. And this man said that he early in his recovery, he had to ride a bike to meetings, and he'd have to ride it past the liquor store where he used to buy liquor. And the crack house where he used to smoke crack. And and he said, Only by the grace of God was was I able to right. So that's a guy who cannot leave his environment. And it was so powerful, I'll never forget it. It gave me hope, even though I wasn't done using at the time. If that guy can do it and who lives in a a dangerous neighborhood and lives around crime and prostitution and all these things, Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Matt Grace: and he's not triggered by it, then anybody else should be able to as well. Pete "mental health champ": Yeah. Yeah, no, I agree. Well, Matt, first I want to say I'm sorry about your mom. I know she passed away. So, you know, sending nothing but the best to you, man. I know you're, you know, grief's a hard thing. So hopefully, you know, you get through it great, man. I love what you're doing. But we're at that part of the interview where we're gonna ask those two questions to you, okay? So the first one's a bit of a fun one, Matt. So this one I I borrowed from a friend of mine. I loved it so much. so the question to you is if your mental health had a song, what would you say that song would be? Matt Grace: I'm sorry, repeat that. Pete "mental health champ": What if your mental health had a song, what would you say that Matt Grace: yeah. Pete "mental health champ": song would be? This is a fun one. Matt Grace: Yes, 100% limp biscuit. give me something. Give me something to break. One hundred percent. Now you you Pete "mental health champ": my god, yes. Yes. Yes. Matt coming in with the limp basket. Matt Grace: you have to understand that my friends and I caused at least six figures, if not more, in property damage. Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Matt Grace: And so I I like breaking things. I'm 51 Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Matt Grace: years old. I still think about when I drive by someone's house that I want to smash their pumpkin or I want to throw eggs at their house. Yes. I'm I'm I'm a man in progress. Don't hate me, please. Yeah, so definitely Limp Biscuit. Pete "mental health champ": Yeah. At least you're honest, you know what I mean? That's that's the cool thing about you, Matt, though, is that you're very honest about it though. You're like, Yeah, these are thoughts that go through my head, man, but I'm I'm just human at the end of the day, so don't hate me for that. Matt Grace: Dude, when that song comes on, I wanna break something. Every day I'll probably be Pete "mental health champ": Me. Matt Grace: a hundred if I live to a hundred and that song comes on, I'm gonna wanna break something in the nursing home. Pete "mental health champ": No my kid, yes. That's great, Matt. That's a great answer too, man. Like, I was didn't even see that one coming. I was like, man, as soon as you said Limp Biscan, I'm like, let's go, Matt. Come on, give it to us. And you're like, well like break stuff. I'm like, all right, okay, all right, so But Matt, we're on the last question of this interview. And by the way, thank you so much for coming, man. It was a pleasure having you. I look forward to checking out the book. Guys, I am telling you, you have to go read this book because he is just telling us little bits of the things that went on. There is plenty more to find out. so the last question to you, the reason I started this podcast is that if you could break the stigma about mental health. Now you can use addiction if you like instead. just something you want people to stop believing, you hear them say every single day. Matt Grace: You know what changed my life and this just wasn't with addiction. I had as a kid, I think we can all relate, you go to a city, maybe w you're on vacation, New York City, and you see someone who's schizophrenic, and you you don't really understand what that is. And I was so dismissive. I think that the awareness needs to be that these people who have my heart goes out to people who have suffered from schizophrenia and bipolar disorder. That's a whole nother level. Listen, I'm grateful for alcoholism and that's all that's all that I have. that you Don't judge someone on the other side of eight mile, obviously I'm in Detroit, until you've walked a day in their shoes. and and and you know these a lot there these people these that's what I got my bachelor's degree and I they're they're shuffled around from the street to prison, they're not getting the right help. And my heart goes out to those people and the and the medication that they have to take is Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Matt Grace: is jarring, right? It it's it it they they hate it. And so that's I pray to God every morning. That's the first thing I say. Please look out for someone in the street who's suffering from schizophrenia. And you know what? And as obnoxious as I was, you know, 30 years ago, I would have said, look at that bum. Pete "mental health champ": Mm-hmm. Matt Grace: Right? That's that's what's missing. There's a disconnect on what's going on on every city's other side of Eight Mile. So before you judge someone and throw a stone, you go live on the street. Pete "mental health champ": I love it. Matt, thank you so much for coming and hanging out. It was a pleasure having you, man. I I really enjoyed everything that we were telling us about the book. I am looking forward to reading this thing. Matt, before we start wrapping up though, did you want to let no read where they can find you? Any social media sites or websites you want? Guys, I will definitely note any other ones that weren't listed that we'll have for Matt. That way you guys can reach out and heck, even buy his book. Matt, so where would you like them to find you? Matt Grace: So my socials are Matt Saving Grace. My website is www.matgrace.com and my book is available on Amazon. Also Barnes Pete "mental health champ": Awesome. Matt Grace: and Noble's books a million. but I yeah, my social, I've gotten was it six million views? Six million views in the past ninety days. Pete "mental health champ": There you go, Matt. That's what's up. I like that. That's awesome, man. Matt Grace: And it's I think it's because I'm so raw and honest about my story. Pete "mental health champ": I I think it is too, man. I really do. I like the fact you're just so real about everything. And, you know, you're only giving us a taste of what's in that book that has even more to say, you know? So it's it definitely appeals to a lot of people. People like the real honesty. That's why this show does so well too. Is a lot of people like the real honesty that, you know, we just have open conversations here. Nobody gets judged because everybody has a story, man. You know, and at the end of the day, it's You know, everybody's sorry should be heard, you know what I'm saying? So, Matt, thank you so much again. I appreciate you coming in, man. If you write another book of any sort, Matt, you are more than welcome to come in, man. I want you to hit me up because I want you to come back and talk to me. And I enjoyed having you. Matt Grace: I'm gonna call it break some break some shit. That's an that's Pete "mental health champ": Yes, there you go. Break a I'm gonna break some shit or something. Yes, I love it, man. Definitely Matt Grace: Yeah. Pete "mental health champ": listen. If if you make it happen, you hit me up because you're more than welcome to come back here. 100% would love to have you come back on the show, man. It'd be it was great. Having you guys. And with that being said, we're gonna wrap up this episode of Pete for Anxiety. You where to find me? I'm Pete for Anxiety. I'm on TikTok all the way down to Facebook, Instagram. I'm everywhere you can find your podcast friends at, even at Pete for SanxietyPod.com. guys, and as always, say it cost nothing, absolutely not to be kind to somebody. One kind act you can do can save some life, or hell you can make their day. I'm Pete for Sanxiety sign off saying, Don't ask how your day is the day. Say, hey, how's your mental health?