Latest / The Right Time with Bomani Jones / Domonique Foxworth on MLBPA's SHOCKING Scandal, Jesse Jackson's death, The KD Files | 02.18

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Domonique Foxworth on MLBPA's SHOCKING Scandal, Jesse Jackson's death, The KD Files | 02.18 · The Right Time with Bomani Jones

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the right time. A wave original.
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: My name is Beaumont Jones. Thanks for listening wherever you
• 0:11
  Speaker 1: get your podcast. Thanks for watching us on YouTube. Subscribe, like,
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: rate us, review us, give us five stars. You only
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: give us four stars. I'm inclined to believe you are
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: a hater. It is that time of week where we
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: have a guest join us. But like, I feel like
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: I got on two left shoes when I say that
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: because it is Hump.
• 0:30
  Speaker 2: Days with Dominique Fosworth.
• 0:32
  Speaker 3: I love it.
• 0:33
  Speaker 4: I'm happy to be here any day. I feel like
• 0:35
  Speaker 4: I talk to you so much away from the show now.
• 0:37
  Speaker 4: I don't miss doing the show as much as I should.
• 0:40
  Speaker 4: But then when I get here and you start it,
• 0:42
  Speaker 4: I get excited.
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: I was about to say, that.
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: Last part was starting to hurt my feelings just a
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: little bit.
• 0:46
  Speaker 2: And then it's like, all right, you landed the play, baby.
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: You brought it back around.
• 0:50
  Speaker 4: You know, when the lights come on, it's something different.
• 0:52
  Speaker 4: It's like you can play in the park. But with
• 0:55
  Speaker 4: a game day, it's a little bit more fun.
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: No, I'm saying you are absolutely 100% correct. My theory,
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: of course, is that's why you should do the show
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: more often. However, different discussion for a different day. I
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: want to start off. We're going to get to Kevin
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: Durant and his situation, and we're going to talk about
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: Jesse Jackson in a little bit. But on Tuesday, a
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: story dropped that led to a question that I had
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: never considered in my life, right?
• 1:23
  Speaker 3: And so.
• 1:25
  Speaker 1: The story is Tony Clark, who played baseball for a
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: very long time, who's also like 6'8. That has nothing
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: to do with anything, but he scored 40 points a
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: game in high school in basketball.
• 1:36
  Speaker 3: Now, he's an imposing person. I think it matters.
• 1:39
  Speaker 4: When you see him, it's the bald head, the white beard,
• 1:42
  Speaker 4: and he's 6'8. Yes.
• 1:43
  Speaker 3: He's an impressive dude to be around. Oh, that's right.
• 1:45
  Speaker 2: I keep forgetting. You are a union man.
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: So this is not a stranger to you. I met him.
• 1:51
  Speaker 1: We did the Bob Costas. We was doing the show
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: with Bob Costas.
• 1:53
  Speaker 3: Oh, yeah.
• 1:54
  Speaker 2: And I met him there.
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: So anyway, Tony had been... Is ensnared the right word?
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: Are we far enough for this to be ensnared? There's
• 2:03
  Speaker 1: an investigation that I don't fully understand, but.
• 2:08
  Speaker 2: All you need to know about it.
• 2:09
  Speaker 1: Is in, I mean, he runs a union and there's
• 2:13
  Speaker 1: a claim that he has used this union to enrich himself, right?
• 2:17
  Speaker 1: You can look up the particulars. That's not really, it's
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: not as important as we thought it was 24 hours ago.
• 2:22
  Speaker 1: And this is what I mean. So word had come
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: out that he would be resigning because of something, right?
• 2:29
  Speaker 1: And so we've known about this investigation. It's also got
• 2:33
  Speaker 1: the NFLPA involved. And so I think there was an
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: assumption that, from some people that this is what ultimately
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: did him in was this scandal involving financial malfeasance, right?
• 2:47
  Speaker 1: Then we found out, no, it was because of an
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: inappropriate relationship at the workplace with his sister-in-law who worked.
• 3:02
  Speaker 2: At the union.
• 3:04
  Speaker 1: And that led to this question. And I saw people
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: ask this on Twitter. I don't want to pretend like
• 3:09
  Speaker 1: I made this up myself. You know, it's very important
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: to me that you guys know I'm not stealing from you.
• 3:13
  Speaker 3: But I saw it.
• 3:15
  Speaker 2: What is worse?
• 3:18
  Speaker 1: If sister-in-law means your brother's wife? Or if sister-in-law means
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: your wife's sister?
• 3:26
  Speaker 2: Which one is worse? I vote B.
• 3:31
  Speaker 3: Your wife's sister. You think your wife's sister is worse? Absolutely.
• 3:35
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 3:37
  Speaker 4: My instinct is to go the other way because at
• 3:41
  Speaker 4: least my defense is I got brand loyalty. I like
• 3:51
  Speaker 4: the vehicles that GM makes, man. I just wanted to
• 3:57
  Speaker 4: try out a different GM, my dog.
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: You've been pushing the Accord, but that Civic was calling you.
• 4:07
  Speaker 2: Is that what you're saying?
• 4:08
  Speaker 4: That's what I see, man.
• 4:10
  Speaker 3: Sometimes I got little small parking spaces in the street.
• 4:12
  Speaker 3: I got to navigate, see what this other thing doing.
• 4:15
  Speaker 3: I got to carry some stuff.
• 4:17
  Speaker 1: You want the five series and the three, huh?
• 4:19
  Speaker 2: You want the six and the drop top?
• 4:22
  Speaker 3: Okay.
• 4:23
  Speaker 2: Why not?
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: No, this is my thing about the wife-sister is that
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: makes your kids hate you even more.
• 4:32
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 4:33
  Speaker 4: I guess my argument was, one, about setting up an
• 4:36
  Speaker 4: opportunity to make that quality joke, but the other argument
• 4:39
  Speaker 4: is you only have offended one person.
• 4:43
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 4:44
  Speaker 4: Whereas the other way, you've offended two people. But I
• 4:49
  Speaker 4: guess if you throw the kids into it, but I
• 4:50
  Speaker 4: guess the kids gonna be mad no matter what, right?
• 4:53
  Speaker 2: Well, but yeah.
• 4:56
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 4:57
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you're right.
• 4:58
  Speaker 4: Because I can call my brother and be like, man,
• 5:02
  Speaker 4: I really messed up.
• 5:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 5:05
  Speaker 3: But if I'm with my brother's wife, then who I'm... Well, I.
• 5:11
  Speaker 1: Think the problem we're having with this relative scale that
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: we're trying to.
• 5:15
  Speaker 2: Establish, right? That is, what hurts more?
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: If you were to take an axe and go halfway
• 5:26
  Speaker 1: through my arm or all the way through my arm?
• 5:31
  Speaker 2: I think it probably feels the same.
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: Right? Like, it may be a little more jarring seeing
• 5:37
  Speaker 1: that you don't have an arm, but just the feeling,
• 5:40
  Speaker 1: the pain is close.
• 5:41
  Speaker 2: Enough to being the same that it's not really going
• 5:44
  Speaker 2: to matter. It's the bigger loss, obviously, if his wife's
• 5:48
  Speaker 2: sister for Mrs. Clark, because now she ain't got nobody. Yeah.
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: You know, like, I hope you got other siblings if
• 5:55
  Speaker 1: it's the case there.
• 5:57
  Speaker 4: I mean, when something like, obviously, things like this happen,
• 6:01
  Speaker 4: it's not completely unheard of, but I always go back
• 6:06
  Speaker 4: to the quieter moments that aren't reported on or discussed.
• 6:10
  Speaker 4: It's like, how do you find this out? Who sent
• 6:15
  Speaker 4: the feeler out there? Who sent that trial balloon out there?
• 6:19
  Speaker 4: It was like, hey, I really like the way that
• 6:22
  Speaker 4: beard is sparkling. Who is the one that says it?
• 6:26
  Speaker 4: And then how do you respond to it? That's the
• 6:27
  Speaker 4: part because- I don't know. I feel like, especially like
• 6:31
  Speaker 4: as guys, we're kind of notorious for not being able
• 6:34
  Speaker 4: to pick up on hints that are being dropped. I
• 6:37
  Speaker 4: feel like I would have missed those hints, not only
• 6:39
  Speaker 4: because we're oblivious to that stuff, but also because I
• 6:43
  Speaker 4: don't expect it to come from there, right?
• 6:46
  Speaker 3: And I wouldn't have the gumption to shoot it.
• 6:51
  Speaker 1: Even if there, let's say the gumption is present, all
• 6:55
  Speaker 1: of those things, right? Not one of you stopped and
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: said to yourself, hey, hey, hey, this is the worst
• 7:05
  Speaker 1: idea you've ever had, right? Like not a single person
• 7:09
  Speaker 1: looked at this here and identified.
• 7:12
  Speaker 2: Not like this, not like this. It cannot be like this.
• 7:16
  Speaker 4: No.
• 7:17
  Speaker 2: Nobody did this. And by the way, this is before
• 7:21
  Speaker 2: we add in the office part.
• 7:23
  Speaker 1: We're just talking about the general regular life situation.
• 7:29
  Speaker 2: What a horrific idea.
• 7:32
  Speaker 3: What came first?
• 7:33
  Speaker 4: Did you think like, of course, this is all, none
• 7:35
  Speaker 4: of this has been like, well, I don't want to
• 7:38
  Speaker 4: get your podcast in trouble, but like the, the investigation
• 7:41
  Speaker 4: is still underway for the, um, The financial stuff.
• 7:44
  Speaker 5: Yes.
• 7:45
  Speaker 3: I guess this other stuff seems like pretty solid.
• 7:47
  Speaker 4: But my question is, what came first, the job or
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  Speaker 4: because my guess is he because he's hired other people
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  Speaker 4: in his family.
• 8:00
  Speaker 3: Yes, he has.
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: And that, by the way, has come up.
• 8:02
  Speaker 4: Man, unions, man, they they are a place that have
• 8:06
  Speaker 4: some nonsense happening.
• 8:07
  Speaker 3: But that aside.
• 8:09
  Speaker 4: What came first? I'm assuming the job came first and
• 8:12
  Speaker 4: then just being around each other. Or it's completely possible
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  Speaker 4: to be like laying up in bed like, Tony, I
• 8:19
  Speaker 4: need a job. Or I need some money. How are
• 8:22
  Speaker 4: you going to get me some money in a way
• 8:24
  Speaker 4: that don't seem crazy? Right.
• 8:26
  Speaker 1: But that's exactly what I was trying to figure out
• 8:28
  Speaker 1: was did it start off with, hey, I think you
• 8:30
  Speaker 1: might be qualified for this job that just came open
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  Speaker 1: at my office.
• 8:34
  Speaker 2: Or was it, oh, you need some bread? I got you.
• 8:39
  Speaker 1: Or was it, in order to keep you quiet, I
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: think I need to give you this job?
• 8:44
  Speaker 2: Because one thing I also think that people who be
• 8:46
  Speaker 2: getting down at.
• 8:47
  Speaker 1: The job don't realize is a BJ Chicago kid line
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: from the Anderson-Pack joint.
• 8:54
  Speaker 2: She swear she.
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: Low-key, but everybody know, right? Everybody that's doing this thing
• 8:59
  Speaker 1: at the office, they all think nobody knows it, right? Like,
• 9:04
  Speaker 1: did you watch, I don't know if you were much
• 9:06
  Speaker 1: of a law and order person, right? But for years,
• 9:09
  Speaker 1: there was the running thing with Jack McCoy and Claire
• 9:11
  Speaker 1: Kincaid having a thing at the office, but it was
• 9:14
  Speaker 1: never explicitly stated. that they had the thing at the office.
• 9:18
  Speaker 1: Nobody ever said the word, but you just see a
• 9:20
  Speaker 1: whole lot of them walking in the office together in
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: the morning.
• 9:24
  Speaker 2: Right?
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: Like all these things that were assigned to the viewer
• 9:27
  Speaker 1: that this was going on, and the regular office.
• 9:31
  Speaker 2: Is the exact same way.
• 9:34
  Speaker 1: Somebody knows, and once one person knows, everybody's going to know.
• 9:39
  Speaker 3: That's how it works. We aren't as good at hiding
• 9:43
  Speaker 3: things as we think. And I know that, of course.
• 9:45
  Speaker 2: Well, also, Ian, people are nosier than you'll ever imagine.
• 9:50
  Speaker 3: And work can be boring.
• 9:52
  Speaker 4: And whether it's true or not, if there is a
• 9:55
  Speaker 4: little hint of something, what are we going to talk about?
• 9:58
  Speaker 3: We're going to talk about that.
• 9:59
  Speaker 4: And I know that, of course, you can have platonic
• 10:01
  Speaker 4: relationships and you can have friends at work that whatever.
• 10:05
  Speaker 3: But you always eating lunch together.
• 10:08
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 10:09
  Speaker 5: Right.
• 10:09
  Speaker 3: Always walking together.
• 10:11
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 10:13
  Speaker 1: And no one ever uses the nonsensical phrase work husband
• 10:17
  Speaker 1: or work wife, right? Like if you throw that one
• 10:20
  Speaker 1: out there, people might be like, oh, okay, this has
• 10:22
  Speaker 1: been established, right?
• 10:24
  Speaker 2: Everybody knows about it.
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: But if you're not giving it that cutesy name, nope,
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: y'all just do it.
• 10:30
  Speaker 3: That is pretty funny.
• 10:31
  Speaker 5: You're right.
• 10:31
  Speaker 4: If you throw that out there, it's like a misdirect. Like, oh, no,
• 10:34
  Speaker 4: we all together because that's how we do it. We
• 10:36
  Speaker 4: work husband, work wife. But if you don't do that,
• 10:39
  Speaker 4: it's probably because maybe you're a little too close to be,
• 10:43
  Speaker 4: to be playing with monikers like that.
• 10:46
  Speaker 2: Everybody knows. And oh my God.
• 10:50
  Speaker 1: Like it's so anyway, they did an investigation. They were
• 10:53
  Speaker 1: doing an investigation about the money stuff. And somehow this
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: came up in the investigation and they were like, cool,
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: we can go ahead and get this over with right now. Right.
• 11:01
  Speaker 2: Let's just, let's just go ahead, have this conversation.
• 11:04
  Speaker 1: And now you are out of here and now you
• 11:06
  Speaker 1: got to go home and be like, I lost my
• 11:08
  Speaker 1: job today.
• 11:13
  Speaker 2: And your sister lost her job today. And, you.
• 11:21
  Speaker 1: Know, I wanted to be the one to tell you
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: before anybody else did.
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: But you're going to read some things in the newspaper.
• 11:29
  Speaker 2: And baby... They lies. They all lies. Like, you just
• 11:34
  Speaker 2: got to ride that part out, right?
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: Just like, you know they've been trying to take a
• 11:41
  Speaker 1: brother down for 13 years.
• 11:42
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 11:43
  Speaker 4: I mean, you got to ride that out. But I
• 11:45
  Speaker 4: assume that there is like, they said that there were messages.
• 11:49
  Speaker 4: Those messages are going to be, my guess is those
• 11:51
  Speaker 4: messages are going to be hard to deny.
• 11:54
  Speaker 2: They will be hard to deny, but that lie is.
• 11:58
  Speaker 2: That lie will continue.
• 11:59
  Speaker 3: That got to be strong. I don't know what.
• 12:05
  Speaker 4: The I mean, I'm in like a defensive mood this morning,
• 12:09
  Speaker 4: as you could probably tell from our group chat conversation.
• 12:11
  Speaker 3: So if I were hired to be his.
• 12:14
  Speaker 4: Defense attorney in this situation, I would point to the fact.
• 12:18
  Speaker 4: that the proximity was so close that it suggests that
• 12:22
  Speaker 4: I ain't really want to do this. Like, if I
• 12:25
  Speaker 4: wanted to do this, I'd be in the streets. I
• 12:27
  Speaker 4: had this, that, and other.
• 12:28
  Speaker 3: Like, I slipped and fell in it. Yeah, yeah.
• 12:32
  Speaker 1: Or, I mean, would you be so audacious as to say,
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: you know, she looks a lot like you?
• 12:39
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm shooting all the shots, man.
• 12:41
  Speaker 4: As his defense attorney, I'm rolling all the defenses that
• 12:45
  Speaker 4: I possibly can. First, we start with the obvious one. Nah,
• 12:49
  Speaker 4: they lying on me, man. They planted them messages.
• 12:52
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: Well, there are two things that we don't know here.
• 12:56
  Speaker 2: We don't know anything about their marriage.
• 12:58
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: And we don't know anything about their sisterhood.
• 13:04
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 13:04
  Speaker 2: This could be part of a long tradition. This could
• 13:08
  Speaker 2: be revenge.
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: This could be anything. I know enough about this world.
• 13:19
  Speaker 1: It is entirely possible that the wife has made peace
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: with the Tony Clark of it all, and it's the
• 13:24
  Speaker 1: sister that she's never going to speak to again.
• 13:26
  Speaker 2: People do that one all the time.
• 13:30
  Speaker 4: It could be a ton of different things. I'm going
• 13:32
  Speaker 4: to hope. that they had an understanding and an arrangement.
• 13:36
  Speaker 4: That's what I'm going to hope. We ain't heard nothing otherwise.
• 13:38
  Speaker 3: It can't be that.
• 13:39
  Speaker 2: Arrangement, though.
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: I ain't never heard of an arrangement that didn't have
• 13:46
  Speaker 1: an unspoken, but not my sister.
• 13:49
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I agree with you. But I said hope. You
• 13:52
  Speaker 4: don't imagine that there's somebody, there's some.
• 13:55
  Speaker 3: Group out there. I could Google it. I'm sure there's some. Oh, yeah,
• 13:58
  Speaker 3: I don't want to Google it.
• 13:58
  Speaker 4: I'll probably come up with a bunch of worse things
• 14:00
  Speaker 4: than I'm looking for.
• 14:03
  Speaker 3: On my search history, but it's far-fetched.
• 14:06
  Speaker 4: It's probably not worth considering, but I threw it out
• 14:08
  Speaker 4: there as a possibility that it's like, yeah, we cool
• 14:11
  Speaker 4: with it.
• 14:12
  Speaker 5: Yeah, oh my god.
• 14:14
  Speaker 2: This is... And it's the sister-in-law.
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: I haven't seen it definitively said that it's wife-sister. I've
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: been told it was wife-sister. And we're just mapping out
• 14:23
  Speaker 1: that scenario. Brother's wife is just not nearly as much
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: fun to explore or to consider.
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: It's... I can't believe this. In front of everybody, Dominique.
• 14:37
  Speaker 2: That's bad, man.
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: That was tough. And he was in a tough... I
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: didn't realize he'd had that job for that long. But
• 14:43
  Speaker 1: he was in a tough situation because his predecessor was
• 14:45
  Speaker 1: a beloved man who just had a brain tumor and died.
• 14:50
  Speaker 2: And so they went with Clark.
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: And look, this isn't... The union heads are often black
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: in the black sports. Right? Like this one, you know
• 14:59
  Speaker 1: it's a bunch of people that couldn't wait to take
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: him down. I would hate to see the group chats
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: that involve the words, try to tell you.
• 15:08
  Speaker 4: We'll see what happens. I know they have an intern
• 15:11
  Speaker 4: right now. We'll see what happens at their next election
• 15:15
  Speaker 4: when they bring somebody new in. The thing is, unions
• 15:19
  Speaker 4: are a, it's like a social movement organization. And there
• 15:23
  Speaker 4: are some things about particular groups that, find it, I
• 15:28
  Speaker 4: think a little bit more natural to find themselves in
• 15:31
  Speaker 4: those social movement organizations. I think that plays something that
• 15:35
  Speaker 4: plays some role in the reason why you're right about
• 15:37
  Speaker 4: the black sports thing, but plenty of black athletes follow
• 15:41
  Speaker 4: white coaches and they're white people in places. I don't
• 15:44
  Speaker 4: necessarily think that the black athletes are, or having black
• 15:48
  Speaker 4: athletes is the driving force. I often think that it's
• 15:51
  Speaker 4: like the mindset when, when you're like building a union,
• 15:55
  Speaker 4: if you have like the proper mindset, perspective, it is
• 15:58
  Speaker 4: like a social movement. It's organizing a disenfranchised group, right?
• 16:04
  Speaker 2: Well, I want to be clear.
• 16:06
  Speaker 1: I did not mean to imply that the driving force
• 16:11
  Speaker 1: for the black union heads is the black membership. What
• 16:14
  Speaker 1: I was implying is that having a white membership does not,
• 16:20
  Speaker 1: it's a bumpier road to black leadership in that regard.
• 16:27
  Speaker 3: I think that's fair.
• 16:28
  Speaker 4: But yeah, I mean, ultimately is when you, if you
• 16:32
  Speaker 4: get the opportunity to talk to the, to talk to
• 16:34
  Speaker 4: the guys, it's the people, the person who you believe
• 16:37
  Speaker 4: you can follow, which is, yeah. I mean, that could
• 16:39
  Speaker 4: be anybody, but you're right. Like the, the membership I
• 16:42
  Speaker 4: think is a little bit more open to, uh, black
• 16:45
  Speaker 4: leadership when the membership is black.
• 16:46
  Speaker 3: That's fair.
• 16:47
  Speaker 1: But I also think this is, this is a little
• 16:49
  Speaker 1: trickier on the baseball side because I mean, I, This
• 16:53
  Speaker 1: has always been what I've read and understood, and I
• 16:55
  Speaker 1: will trust you to verify or not, but historically speaking,
• 16:58
  Speaker 1: the gold standard for American unions has been the.
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: Major League Baseball Players Association.
• 17:03
  Speaker 1: They went out time after time after time and won
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: every single time, basically until the 21st century. Even the
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: strike of 94, they came out more winners than they
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: had losers. Now we're in a.
• 17:16
  Speaker 2: Time where nationally.
• 17:19
  Speaker 1: you know, the way that we view unions as a
• 17:20
  Speaker 1: country is like union membership has fallen to some, I
• 17:24
  Speaker 1: think something like 6% or something like this, some incredibly
• 17:27
  Speaker 1: low number. The assault on unions by associating them with
• 17:30
  Speaker 1: communism and everything else from the capitalist industrialist side, it won.
• 17:35
  Speaker 2: They battered them.
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: And the baseball union, the steroid thing kind of broke
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: it to a degree. Like they wound up at an
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: impasse with their membership in part because they couldn't quite
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: figure out how they wanted to feel together about the steroids.
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: From there, the owners got to take more and more.
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: They reached this place where revenues explode in baseball. Wage
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: growth has not, just like the rest of America, has
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: not ticked up in any place. We see these years
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: where everybody gets offered the same free agent contract.
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: All of these things have happened.
• 18:06
  Speaker 1: And now this union that I don't want to say
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: is teetering, that feels a little unfair, but they're coming
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: up with a CBA negotiation where a lockout is expected
• 18:15
  Speaker 1: to take place.
• 18:17
  Speaker 2: And this dude does this, right?
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: And I don't ever want to be the guy to
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: be like, that's why they don't trust y'all because it's
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: not why they don't trust y'all. And by y'all, I
• 18:26
  Speaker 1: mean unions, just to be clear. However, this is not
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: why they do trust y'all.
• 18:31
  Speaker 4: I think your point about the, like, deterioration of, like,
• 18:34
  Speaker 4: union support, and it's not a mistake. Like, it's a
• 18:37
  Speaker 4: concerted effort. And when you talk to certain unions, of course,
• 18:42
  Speaker 4: hold on to, like, the fundamental core ideals of what
• 18:45
  Speaker 4: it means to be a union.
• 18:46
  Speaker 3: But also like you.
• 18:47
  Speaker 4: Talk to some unions and you hear them speaking the
• 18:50
  Speaker 4: language of the ownership class. And like you saw it
• 18:54
  Speaker 4: in the last executive director for the NFL PA, they
• 18:57
  Speaker 4: go hire somebody who is from that world.
• 19:00
  Speaker 3: And doesn't fundamentally understand what it means to be a
• 19:03
  Speaker 3: part of a union.
• 19:04
  Speaker 4: And they try and try to build up their union
• 19:08
  Speaker 4: in the same model as like the corporate structure. And
• 19:11
  Speaker 4: they believe that, That what we need to do to
• 19:14
  Speaker 4: compete is to be more like them. We can't beat
• 19:17
  Speaker 4: them at being them. And that's why I said it's
• 19:20
  Speaker 4: like a social organization. It's about collective power. And I
• 19:24
  Speaker 4: think the reason why some of this stuff is so
• 19:26
  Speaker 4: hurtful is because all you really have is your legacy
• 19:31
  Speaker 4: and your responsibility to the people before you and the
• 19:34
  Speaker 4: people who come after you. If you have scandal and nonsense,
• 19:38
  Speaker 4: you know what ends up happening is the people in
• 19:41
  Speaker 4: the union feel less and less like a part of
• 19:43
  Speaker 4: the union and feel like the union is something separate
• 19:45
  Speaker 4: from who they are.
• 19:47
  Speaker 3: And in that case, when shit gets hard, if you're
• 19:50
  Speaker 3: with family, you'll stand.
• 19:51
  Speaker 4: You'll survive a lockout if you are standing with your
• 19:54
  Speaker 4: family and you believe that what I'm doing is fighting
• 19:57
  Speaker 4: for the future generation and protecting the sacrifices made by
• 20:01
  Speaker 4: the previous generation. But if you turn the union into
• 20:03
  Speaker 4: some corporate bullshit, when it gets hard, everybody's.
• 20:07
  Speaker 3: Going to be like, oh, whatever. I got to get mine.
• 20:10
  Speaker 4: Let's sign this deal. Oh, we're going back a couple
• 20:12
  Speaker 4: percentage points. It sucks, but let's sign this deal because
• 20:16
  Speaker 4: I got to get this money. And every successive group
• 20:19
  Speaker 4: Does the same thing until we get to a place
• 20:22
  Speaker 4: where shit is so bad that people come together again
• 20:25
  Speaker 4: and say, we got to fight to get our shit back.
• 20:28
  Speaker 4: You could just fight right now and never have to
• 20:30
  Speaker 4: get to that point. Sorry about my little soapbox.
• 20:32
  Speaker 3: No, no, no.
• 20:33
  Speaker 1: But it's but it's important because it's very important to understand.
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: And everything I think everything that you said was 100
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: percent correct, because it was always interesting seeing how Marvin Miller,
• 20:42
  Speaker 1: the first president of the Baseball Players Association, would talk
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: about every successful movement. He's just all like, eh, it's
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: gone soft, right? Because this thing is we fight on everything.
• 20:52
  Speaker 1: This is what you have to do. And when nobody
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: that I know of, accused Marvin Miller of doing, is
• 20:56
  Speaker 1: getting over on that union, right? The truth is the
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: union has to be more noble than the other side
• 21:04
  Speaker 1: because the other side is not bound by a.
• 21:07
  Speaker 2: Principle, right?
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: The union has to be grounded in a shared ethos, right?
• 21:14
  Speaker 1: It has to be grounded in, in a shared belief
• 21:17
  Speaker 1: and the person that is in charge of the union,
• 21:20
  Speaker 1: it is imperative that that person be upright and moral, right?
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: Because it is imperative and it becomes very, it's very
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: important because any failing in that regard and the whole
• 21:32
  Speaker 1: thing falls apart. And the only way that you can
• 21:35
  Speaker 1: truly and properly sell yourself to run a union or
• 21:38
  Speaker 1: to be in those positions in a union is to say,
• 21:41
  Speaker 1: I'm doing this for y'all. And it makes it even
• 21:44
  Speaker 1: more heartbreaking, no matter what the accusation of malfeasance is,
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: no matter what the transgression, especially if it's legit.
• 21:51
  Speaker 2: Like once they find out that you got your hand
• 21:53
  Speaker 2: in the pot, man, come on, dog.
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: Right? Like, like, it affects your membership in a much
• 22:00
  Speaker 1: different way and it affects everything much larger. And that
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: is why when you are at the top and you
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: get caught, it's so much worse than.
• 22:10
  Speaker 2: When it is the other people.
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: Because for you, it is not about you, right? We
• 22:14
  Speaker 1: understand it's about them over there. On this, it is
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: never about you.
• 22:20
  Speaker 4: And I'd put in there the dynamic that makes it
• 22:23
  Speaker 4: a little bit more difficult for sports unions is, is
• 22:26
  Speaker 4: a disproportionately young membership, which also doesn't have a whole
• 22:33
  Speaker 4: bunch of like professional, like traditionally professional experience.
• 22:38
  Speaker 3: But they do have a huge responsibility.
• 22:41
  Speaker 4: And like the history of like successful union actions in general,
• 22:47
  Speaker 4: like outside of the court, it comes from like the
• 22:50
  Speaker 4: actual members being the leadership, And it's really hard when
• 22:55
  Speaker 4: you're doing just fine and money's coming in and you're
• 22:58
  Speaker 4: worried about your next contract to get your hands dirty.
• 23:02
  Speaker 4: I think that's the challenging thing for the modern sports unions.
• 23:06
  Speaker 4: And I'm not someone who would argue that making more
• 23:08
  Speaker 4: money is bad, but as the money gets better, the
• 23:12
  Speaker 4: players become less engaged. And as the players become less engaged,
• 23:16
  Speaker 4: you understand that they're going to be.
• 23:18
  Speaker 3: Less likely to sacrifice.
• 23:20
  Speaker 4: Because while the executive director of the union is like
• 23:23
  Speaker 4: considered the head of the union. No union ever works
• 23:27
  Speaker 4: unless it's the members and all other like professional unions
• 23:30
  Speaker 4: are different. Like often you work in, you work and
• 23:33
  Speaker 4: you exist in this professional union for decades. You understand
• 23:38
  Speaker 4: everything that goes on in there and you take responsibility.
• 23:41
  Speaker 4: You have your whole 20s and 30s to figure this
• 23:45
  Speaker 4: out because the guys who are working in your industry
• 23:49
  Speaker 4: that are in their mid 30s to 40s to 50s,
• 23:52
  Speaker 4: they know they've been here.
• 23:53
  Speaker 3: They fighting.
• 23:54
  Speaker 4: And you don't have that in sports, particularly football, where
• 23:57
  Speaker 4: it's like, all right, you got till 24 to figure
• 24:01
  Speaker 4: this shit out because when you're 27, you're going to
• 24:03
  Speaker 4: be the president of the union. Or when you're 30,
• 24:06
  Speaker 4: you're going to be on the executive committee of the union.
• 24:09
  Speaker 4: And then you'll have someone who is the executive director
• 24:12
  Speaker 4: who is making the decisions, which I get it, but
• 24:16
  Speaker 4: I don't ever think that's healthy for a union. The
• 24:19
  Speaker 4: decisions have to be made by the people who are
• 24:22
  Speaker 4: going to, like, We're going to experience the.
• 24:25
  Speaker 3: Results of the decision.
• 24:26
  Speaker 2: All right. And coming up next, I'm going to land
• 24:29
  Speaker 2: a plane on this.
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: Uh-oh.
• 24:31
  Speaker 2: Ask me how. Ask me how. Don't ask me. Just
• 24:34
  Speaker 2: stick around.
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• 25:53
  Speaker 2: We're back with Dominique Foxworth.
• 25:55
  Speaker 1: I was making the point earlier about if you're going
• 26:01
  Speaker 1: to be up top in one of these organizations like
• 26:05
  Speaker 1: a union, it's got to be about the union. It
• 26:10
  Speaker 1: can't be about you. That's how this goes. The trick
• 26:14
  Speaker 1: bag with that is, of course, it takes a pretty
• 26:17
  Speaker 1: significant ego to be the person who decides that you're
• 26:21
  Speaker 1: going to lead a union. And look, we were talking
• 26:24
  Speaker 1: about this with Tony Clark, the early Tony Clark, big
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: old 6'8 dude, you know, Major League Baseball player. He
• 26:30
  Speaker 1: rich before he showed up. That ain't nobody with no
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: shortage of ego, okay? Like, that's how that's going to go.
• 26:35
  Speaker 1: But the guy that's going to be in charge, you're
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: not going to get that person generally without there being
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: some measure of ego. And that almost always becomes counterproductive
• 26:46
  Speaker 1: to the larger aims of what that person is doing.
• 26:49
  Speaker 2: And that brings us to Jesse Jackson.
• 26:53
  Speaker 3: Well done.
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: Right? Because look, Jesse Jackson died on Tuesday morning. You
• 27:03
  Speaker 1: said you'd never been in a room with Jesse, right?
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: Jesse a bad motherfucker, man. Sometimes, and there's some people,
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: that's the only way to put it. When I did
• 27:11
  Speaker 1: the reading with Howard, or the fireside chat with Howard
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: for his book at the Jackie Robinson Foundation, and I
• 27:17
  Speaker 1: heard a gasp, and I was talking about Paul Robinson,
• 27:19
  Speaker 1: and I was just like, look, man, that's a bad
• 27:20
  Speaker 1: motherfucker right there.
• 27:22
  Speaker 2: Look, man. That's the only if you guys, you don't
• 27:26
  Speaker 2: understand what I'm talking about here.
• 27:27
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 27:27
  Speaker 2: Some people that just simply fits that description.
• 27:31
  Speaker 1: And the thing with Jesse was what makes Jesse interesting
• 27:35
  Speaker 1: to me is Jesse comes in as the younger man. Right.
• 27:40
  Speaker 1: with that whole crew over there with Dr. King and
• 27:43
  Speaker 1: Abernathy and all those dudes, right? He's the younger cat
• 27:46
  Speaker 1: and he is also by far cooler than everybody else
• 27:49
  Speaker 1: in the crew, right? Like he's pulling up with the
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: leather jacket and the sweaters and.
• 27:54
  Speaker 2: Just like, he's that guy. He is absolutely next. And
• 28:01
  Speaker 2: he knew it at every turn.
• 28:04
  Speaker 1: And it's a great quote here from Stanley Crouch that
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: was used in the New York Times obituary. And I'll
• 28:15
  Speaker 1: paraphrase it because I can't find it right now, but
• 28:16
  Speaker 1: I'll paraphrase it. He said, Jesse was ultimately doomed by
• 28:20
  Speaker 1: his need to mythologize himself, right? At every turn, there
• 28:25
  Speaker 1: was a decision that what he was going to do
• 28:30
  Speaker 1: is to create the.
• 28:31
  Speaker 2: Legend of his life, right?
• 28:35
  Speaker 1: He also managed to live a legendary life, right? Like
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: I don't, I think people need to understand that a
• 28:43
  Speaker 1: lot of you don't know that much about.
• 28:46
  Speaker 2: The good of Jesse.
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: And some of that is because of his own goals,
• 28:50
  Speaker 1: but also because There was work done to do it
• 28:53
  Speaker 1: that way, right? He was the last of the titans
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: of the civil rights movement. We don't pay enough homage
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: to his runs for president in the 80s, right?
• 29:04
  Speaker 2: Talking to Ta-Nehisi about this. This is very important.
• 29:08
  Speaker 1: Jesse Jackson is one of the biggest reasons Obama could
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: have won in 08 because his campaign in 88, after
• 29:16
  Speaker 1: it was done and Dukakis needed to bring his supporters
• 29:19
  Speaker 1: into the fold, the trade Jesse made was OK, but
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: you guys have to change the way that you do
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: primaries instead of them being winner take all. There's got
• 29:26
  Speaker 1: to be some proportional distribution of the delegates, which is
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: what made it possible for Obama to win in 08.
• 29:31
  Speaker 1: Like this isn't just a Jesse Jackson walk so Obama
• 29:34
  Speaker 1: could run kind of situation.
• 29:36
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 29:37
  Speaker 2: Jesse is. Tangibly.
• 29:40
  Speaker 1: Responsible for what happened later on top of the Jesse ran.
• 29:44
  Speaker 1: So Jesse walk so that Obama could run situation.
• 29:49
  Speaker 3: You have, I think that's all very well said.
• 29:52
  Speaker 4: And I think the, this relates to sports in so
• 29:56
  Speaker 4: many ways where it's like the, the history of, is
• 30:00
  Speaker 4: always kind of like so much colored by whether you
• 30:05
  Speaker 4: won or lost. And I think there's an underappreciation for
• 30:09
  Speaker 4: the progress made. And one of my friends from school
• 30:13
  Speaker 4: would say this all the time. He's incredibly smart guy,
• 30:16
  Speaker 4: a lot of really advanced, impressive degrees. And he wouldn't
• 30:20
  Speaker 4: go to class and he wouldn't study and he would
• 30:23
  Speaker 4: get the equivalent of a B and then someone else
• 30:26
  Speaker 4: will work their ass off and get an A and
• 30:28
  Speaker 4: he'd be like, Well, the distance I traveled this morning
• 30:32
  Speaker 4: to when we had the test and the grade that
• 30:34
  Speaker 4: I got was much more impressive.
• 30:36
  Speaker 3: It's not a perfect corollary to.
• 30:38
  Speaker 4: What Jesse has done, but like the distance that Jesse
• 30:41
  Speaker 4: traveled and the environment in which he fought, the things
• 30:45
  Speaker 4: that he accomplished, like you could argue, despite the fact
• 30:48
  Speaker 4: that it's not going to there's not the W for
• 30:50
  Speaker 4: win is not going to be next to his name.
• 30:53
  Speaker 4: you could make the argument that that was just as
• 30:55
  Speaker 4: or more valuable than any other real success. Because in
• 30:59
  Speaker 4: a time when there's a significant backlash, to have somebody
• 31:03
  Speaker 4: who's willing to fight that backlash. And of course, you're
• 31:06
  Speaker 4: not winning the fight against the backlash. But you are
• 31:09
  Speaker 4: giving somebody, it's the equivalent of forcing them to punt
• 31:13
  Speaker 4: at midfield. You're giving yourself a better field position. You're
• 31:17
  Speaker 4: giving the next generation a better field position than they
• 31:20
  Speaker 4: would have otherwise. But nobody is going to write a
• 31:23
  Speaker 4: piece the next day of the game about the third
• 31:26
  Speaker 4: down stop in the middle of the third quarter. You're
• 31:28
  Speaker 4: going to write the piece about the touchdown scored on
• 31:30
  Speaker 4: the subsequent drive. And I think there's something to be
• 31:34
  Speaker 4: said for breaking up that pass on third and six.
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: I think there's also the biggest thing with Jesse that
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: I think can easily be lost by people who were
• 31:42
  Speaker 1: but so aware of him is that he has been
• 31:45
  Speaker 1: perhaps the most impactful advocate for the broader working class
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: of America that there has been. Like this is not,
• 31:54
  Speaker 1: Jesse's work was not simply.
• 31:55
  Speaker 2: The work of black people.
• 31:57
  Speaker 1: It was a broad, like the idea of the rainbow
• 31:59
  Speaker 1: coalition was a, it's much more in line with the
• 32:02
  Speaker 1: Fred Hampton type of situation or as much as anybody else, right?
• 32:07
  Speaker 2: Same Chicago sort of roots.
• 32:08
  Speaker 1: It's very similar to the Harold Washington coalition of 1983
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: that you put together, but it is working class, people
• 32:15
  Speaker 1: of all races and stripes, right? Fighting for them, like
• 32:19
  Speaker 1: Operation Breadbasket, okay? Operation Push. It eventually became that Wall
• 32:24
  Speaker 1: Street project, which is where it got a little weird
• 32:26
  Speaker 1: for Jesse, because that's when you started having cronyism of
• 32:30
  Speaker 1: concerns and everything else is when it went over there.
• 32:32
  Speaker 1: Jesse's argument was, this is the next frontier of the fight.
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: We got to be over there too. But once you
• 32:37
  Speaker 1: go playing, once you start playing them reindeer games, right,
• 32:40
  Speaker 1: you know, it's real easy for people to get caught
• 32:42
  Speaker 1: up in that. But the idea that Jesse was the
• 32:44
  Speaker 1: fighting man for the working class, The 1988 campaign for
• 32:48
  Speaker 1: Jesse Jackson is in large part the template of the
• 32:50
  Speaker 1: Bernie Sanders campaigns that you saw later. If you go
• 32:53
  Speaker 1: back and look at what he was talking about in 88,
• 32:56
  Speaker 1: a lot of it sticks through. And he was going
• 32:57
  Speaker 1: out and winning. Like he won primaries in 88, making
• 33:02
  Speaker 1: that happen. Now, you know, America ain't what America don't
• 33:04
  Speaker 1: live is raps. What a little show, man. Michael Dukakis
• 33:08
  Speaker 1: was like this big. Ain't no way in the world
• 33:10
  Speaker 1: in America, man, this big run against a man this
• 33:13
  Speaker 1: big and a man this big wins.
• 33:15
  Speaker 2: That's just not how we do things ordinarily, right?
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: Like basically, long of the short, being white is like
• 33:21
  Speaker 1: being a foot taller than you really are.
• 33:25
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 33:26
  Speaker 4: The impact, and I, so the funny thing is when
• 33:30
  Speaker 4: you get older and read and learn more about it,
• 33:33
  Speaker 4: like I feel like growing up, the Rainbow Coalition was,
• 33:37
  Speaker 4: And Jesse Jackson's run was almost kind of a joke.
• 33:41
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 33:41
  Speaker 4: And I didn't like, it was a joke for me.
• 33:43
  Speaker 4: Like I was born in 83. So like what I
• 33:45
  Speaker 4: did hear about it was like how ridiculous and absurd
• 33:48
  Speaker 4: it was. And the idea that a black person could
• 33:51
  Speaker 4: ever be president and how Jesse, and that was also,
• 33:54
  Speaker 4: we started to learn more and more about his, his
• 33:57
  Speaker 4: off the field issues. Like those, like it, it all
• 34:01
  Speaker 4: coalesced to make that all feel like a joke. And
• 34:03
  Speaker 4: now like going back and reading about all that stuff,
• 34:05
  Speaker 4: like recognizing that, the impact that he had is not
• 34:08
  Speaker 4: something that's going to be the like title of a
• 34:12
  Speaker 4: chapter in a history book, but the things that came
• 34:15
  Speaker 4: afterwards couldn't have been possible without it. And it's, it's
• 34:18
  Speaker 4: funny that we history, we like to think about history
• 34:23
  Speaker 4: as fact, but it is like, I mean, it is fact,
• 34:25
  Speaker 4: but it's selected stories and we select people and the
• 34:30
  Speaker 4: choices that were made around Jesse Jackson and the prices
• 34:33
  Speaker 4: that he paid for, his issues is inconsistent with the
• 34:37
  Speaker 4: way that we treat just about anybody else. Because nobody,
• 34:40
  Speaker 4: I mean, nobody really feels perfect. Obama don't got nothing
• 34:45
  Speaker 4: on his jacket. Everybody else got something pretty significant on
• 34:48
  Speaker 4: their jacket.
• 34:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Obama was thinking, Obama started playing the long game
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: before anybody else. Let me tell you who was not
• 34:56
  Speaker 1: about to get caught up sleeping with his wife's sister
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: at the office.
• 35:00
  Speaker 3: Oh, hell no.
• 35:00
  Speaker 2: No. No, Obama's not getting anywhere near that.
• 35:04
  Speaker 1: I am going to point this out, by the way,
• 35:06
  Speaker 1: because if you haven't seen it, this is the funniest
• 35:08
  Speaker 1: thing to happen after Jesse Jackson died. The most incredible statement.
• 35:15
  Speaker 1: I provided office space for him and his rainbow coalition
• 35:18
  Speaker 1: for years in the Trump building at 40 Wall Street.
• 35:20
  Speaker 1: Responded to his request for help in getting criminal justice
• 35:24
  Speaker 1: reform passed and signed when no other president would even try.
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: Single-handedly pushed along and passed long-term funding for historically black
• 35:33
  Speaker 1: colleges and universities with Jesse Loved, but also which other
• 35:37
  Speaker 1: presidents would not do. Responding to Jesse's support for Opportunity Zones,
• 35:41
  Speaker 1: the single most successful economic development package yet approved for
• 35:45
  Speaker 1: black businessmen and women and much more. I am fascinated
• 35:49
  Speaker 1: by the idea that Trump's people were ready for this, right?
• 35:53
  Speaker 1: They were like, the last thing anybody had on their
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: bingo card is positive.
• 35:58
  Speaker 2: They tried to act like black history month ain't going on.
• 36:01
  Speaker 2: And Trump was like, nah, that Jesse dude is all
• 36:03
  Speaker 2: right with me. Hold on, hold on.
• 36:06
  Speaker 1: Here's where you get it jesse was a force of
• 36:09
  Speaker 1: nature like few others before him he had much to
• 36:14
  Speaker 1: do with the election without acknowledgement or credit of barack
• 36:18
  Speaker 1: hussein obama a man who jesse could not stand he
• 36:23
  Speaker 1: loved his family greatly and to them i send my
• 36:26
  Speaker 1: deepest sympathies and condolences jesse will be missed and the
• 36:30
  Speaker 1: thing about.
• 36:31
  Speaker 2: That last party is Not one lie was told.
• 36:36
  Speaker 4: I don't root for the team, but that was one
• 36:42
  Speaker 4: hell of a play.
• 36:44
  Speaker 3: One hell of a play. Like it was, it was
• 36:47
  Speaker 3: the surprise of it.
• 36:48
  Speaker 4: And then like the accuracy and execution, because like there's,
• 36:53
  Speaker 4: Trump has not written or put out a respectful eulogy
• 36:58
  Speaker 4: of anybody.
• 36:59
  Speaker 2: No.
• 37:00
  Speaker 4: He burns everybody, even people that were like, I feel
• 37:04
  Speaker 4: like he went after McCain. He's on your side, man.
• 37:09
  Speaker 4: And in this case, the shock that it was a
• 37:12
  Speaker 4: favorable one combined with the slights at the end, it's
• 37:17
  Speaker 4: a well-executed play, man. It's well-designed, well-executed.
• 37:20
  Speaker 1: He hates Obama so much. It is so dedicated to
• 37:25
  Speaker 1: hating Obama.
• 37:26
  Speaker 2: That he wasn't missing any opportunity, right? He was like, oh,
• 37:31
  Speaker 2: this is a perfect time.
• 37:33
  Speaker 1: And I will note, I hope Obama's people, when he
• 37:36
  Speaker 1: put that out, I was like, oh boy, Obama better
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: step to the plate. You can't let Trump outdo you now, dog.
• 37:45
  Speaker 1: It's not an option. And by the way, he just
• 37:48
  Speaker 1: set a fairly high bar.
• 37:50
  Speaker 4: And he preemptively cut off any credit that you was
• 37:53
  Speaker 4: going to give him.
• 37:55
  Speaker 3: You ain't given him no credit before. Essentially, he ain't
• 37:57
  Speaker 3: even like you.
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: And you didn't like him.
• 38:02
  Speaker 3: Dirty move.
• 38:04
  Speaker 1: Man, that was, I mean, I will say, though, I
• 38:07
  Speaker 1: will never forget in 08 watching Jesse, who, like I say,
• 38:11
  Speaker 1: them two men had their.
• 38:12
  Speaker 2: Issues, right?
• 38:15
  Speaker 1: It's a very similar situation to, like, Jordan and Isaiah
• 38:18
  Speaker 1: Thomas fighting for the soul of Chicago, right? Like, Isaiah
• 38:22
  Speaker 1: being like, yo, I made it so that Mike could
• 38:24
  Speaker 1: walk these streets. Perfect.
• 38:25
  Speaker 2: And Mike don't give me no credit, right? Very similar, right? Yeah.
• 38:29
  Speaker 3: It's a perfect analogy.
• 38:30
  Speaker 4: I think that your point is like Obama was like
• 38:34
  Speaker 4: much more of the, I don't want to say Dr.
• 38:36
  Speaker 3: King because Dr.
• 38:37
  Speaker 4: King was different, but like Obama was, grew up in
• 38:40
  Speaker 4: a world and separate from the experience that Jesse had.
• 38:44
  Speaker 4: Like Jesse Jackson had a much more like, I guess
• 38:47
  Speaker 4: stereotypical might be the word, like stereotypical, like challenging black upbringing.
• 38:54
  Speaker 3: That wasn't, yeah.
• 38:56
  Speaker 1: And this motherfucker ain't said thank you one time.
• 38:59
  Speaker 2: That's like, that's, that's, that's Jesse's situation, right?
• 39:03
  Speaker 1: It's like, and he's not the only person who feels
• 39:05
  Speaker 1: this way. He's like, he ain't say thank you to
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: me one time. Obama's people, hey man, y'all better get
• 39:10
  Speaker 1: that statement cracking. Hey, hey, hey, you might want to, no,
• 39:13
  Speaker 1: not one of your Harvard, like if it was me,
• 39:15
  Speaker 1: not one of your Harvard partners.
• 39:16
  Speaker 3: Nah, nah.
• 39:18
  Speaker 1: Like, you need to, you need to, you need to
• 39:20
  Speaker 1: get on the phone with somebody you ain't talked to
• 39:21
  Speaker 1: in a while.
• 39:22
  Speaker 2: And get, and get them to crank that out.
• 39:24
  Speaker 3: You got anybody from Howard on your team?
• 39:26
  Speaker 1: You and I both, we read that from Trump and
• 39:28
  Speaker 1: we're like, yo, I can't. can't believe this happened.
• 39:32
  Speaker 4: It was tough you can't it's a it's a tough
• 39:35
  Speaker 4: comeback from now on man sometimes.
• 39:37
  Speaker 1: You know what that was they put that one in
• 39:39
  Speaker 1: the coffin corner.
• 39:42
  Speaker 4: No return. There's no return. There's no return. You got
• 39:45
  Speaker 4: to run your back up ways.
• 39:46
  Speaker 3: But you have to run it out.
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: You can't fair catch it, right?
• 39:49
  Speaker 3: Like, you got to. You got to.
• 39:51
  Speaker 4: I don't think that there's a, yeah. You got to
• 39:54
  Speaker 4: fair catch it and wait to the next one. We
• 39:56
  Speaker 4: got to get you to the next.
• 39:58
  Speaker 1: Trump put that down and was like, now you go.
• 40:02
  Speaker 1: Your turn. What you got to say about that? Who
• 40:06
  Speaker 1: in the office was like, no, I think we got
• 40:09
  Speaker 1: a winner here. You know what I'm saying? Like, I
• 40:14
  Speaker 1: think we can win on this issue, right?
• 40:16
  Speaker 2: And also, I get the feeling that Trump did like
• 40:20
  Speaker 2: Jesse Jackson.
• 40:21
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 40:22
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 40:22
  Speaker 3: I mean, yeah.
• 40:24
  Speaker 4: Far be it for me to try to pretend like
• 40:25
  Speaker 4: I can understand him.
• 40:27
  Speaker 3: No.
• 40:27
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 40:27
  Speaker 3: Unexpected.
• 40:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 40:31
  Speaker 3: It was unexpected. Unexpected. And I think that there was some, like,
• 40:34
  Speaker 3: mutual 80s celebrity.
• 40:36
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 40:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 40:37
  Speaker 3: Like, yeah.
• 40:39
  Speaker 2: They might have met backstage at Saturday Night Live.
• 40:41
  Speaker 3: For sure.
• 40:42
  Speaker 2: Have you ever seen the clip?
• 40:44
  Speaker 1: Because Jesse's relationship with Saturday Night Live is interesting. There
• 40:48
  Speaker 1: was this self-awareness. Maybe part of this was also ego.
• 40:51
  Speaker 1: But if you've never seen Jesse Jackson read, after Dr.
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: Seuss died, they had Jesse Jackson come on Weekend Update
• 41:01
  Speaker 1: and read Green Eggs and Ham. And he never breaks
• 41:08
  Speaker 1: Jesse Jackson character. He reads it. You imagine a comedian
• 41:13
  Speaker 1: being like, can you imagine Jesse Jackson reading Sam I Am?
• 41:16
  Speaker 2: Except it's not a comedian. It's Jesse Jackson.
• 41:20
  Speaker 1: And then there's the Eddie Murphy sketch that I don't
• 41:23
  Speaker 1: think I can say the title to, but it's Don't
• 41:25
  Speaker 1: Let Me Down. If you Google Jesse Jackson, I mean,
• 41:28
  Speaker 1: Eddie Murphy, Don't Let Me Down, you'll get a great time.
• 41:34
  Speaker 1: Rest in peace, Jesse Jackson.
• 41:37
  Speaker 2: You've not seen that one?
• 41:39
  Speaker 3: I saw the weekend update.
• 41:41
  Speaker 2: Oh, oh, oh.
• 41:45
  Speaker 1: Ryan, we're going to do a two-minute pause in the
• 41:47
  Speaker 1: record so that Dominique can watch Don't Let Me Down,
• 41:50
  Speaker 1: and then we will cut it back in with Dominique's reaction.
• 41:54
  Speaker 2: Don't let me down.
• 41:58
  Speaker 3: Oh, man. Oh, gosh.
• 42:01
  Speaker 4: It reminds me a little bit of the Black Jeopardy.
• 42:04
  Speaker 4: sketch where it's like uh all the connections and the
• 42:07
  Speaker 4: obvious points that no one else realizes until you put
• 42:10
  Speaker 4: it in a sketch it is pretty pretty impressive eddie
• 42:13
  Speaker 4: murphy hey man.
• 42:14
  Speaker 1: We both got big noses gold chains on our chest.
• 42:17
  Speaker 3: It's my favorite part that's what he said.
• 42:20
  Speaker 4: So many other lines that i i feel like i
• 42:22
  Speaker 4: can't repeat i'm not going to take the risk Oh, yeah. No, no.
• 42:24
  Speaker 1: My favorite one was the one right at the end
• 42:26
  Speaker 1: when he called out the brothers and sisters. Yeah.
• 42:28
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 42:29
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 42:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 42:30
  Speaker 3: Yeah, man.
• 42:31
  Speaker 2: I ain't risking my career on this.
• 42:34
  Speaker 3: Not on that one. It was funny for Eddie back
• 42:37
  Speaker 3: in those days. Yep.
• 42:37
  Speaker 1: Yep.
• 42:38
  Speaker 2: Yep.
• 42:38
  Speaker 1: Yep.
• 42:38
  Speaker 2: Yep.
• 42:38
  Speaker 1: No need for me to repeat that, which is no
• 42:41
  Speaker 1: need not be said. And now with the transition to
• 42:46
  Speaker 1: take us home, I was not around for the All-Star game.
• 42:51
  Speaker 1: I don't It's President's Day. We like to take a weekend.
• 42:55
  Speaker 1: It's not a great content time, so I typically go away.
• 42:58
  Speaker 1: But at least this time where I went somewhere that
• 43:00
  Speaker 1: was in a reasonable.
• 43:01
  Speaker 2: Time zone situation. So I watched a little bit of
• 43:05
  Speaker 2: the All-Star Game.
• 43:06
  Speaker 1: And it is amazing that the biggest thing from a
• 43:09
  Speaker 1: very good All-Star Game, it was two things. One, nobody
• 43:14
  Speaker 1: wants to get their shit pitched on television. And the
• 43:16
  Speaker 1: idea that the one guy taking this seriously is the condor,
• 43:20
  Speaker 1: that'll make everybody take it seriously. Just cause like a
• 43:23
  Speaker 1: six foot one guy could not dictate the terms of
• 43:26
  Speaker 1: this the way the guy that could pitch everybody's shit
• 43:28
  Speaker 1: could dictate the terms. But obviously the biggest thing about
• 43:31
  Speaker 1: the All Star Weekend is every clip of Kevin Durant
• 43:33
  Speaker 1: under siege on his phone because somebody decided to allegedly
• 43:40
  Speaker 1: leak his various burner tweets and direct messages and the likes, okay?
• 43:48
  Speaker 1: I am operating on the premise that those things are true.
• 43:52
  Speaker 1: I cannot say whether or not they are true. I
• 43:55
  Speaker 1: am operating on the premise that they are true because
• 43:58
  Speaker 1: it sure sounds like they are.
• 44:00
  Speaker 3: Has he denied it yet?
• 44:03
  Speaker 2: I don't think so because he hasn't had to do
• 44:04
  Speaker 2: any media.
• 44:05
  Speaker 3: Yeah, but I mean, when.
• 44:08
  Speaker 4: Has Kevin Durant ever waited for media to... to make
• 44:12
  Speaker 4: his opinion known. That was the thing. I had Jay
• 44:16
  Speaker 4: Kang on my show, and we talked a little bit
• 44:18
  Speaker 4: about this. And Jay pointed out at the time that
• 44:22
  Speaker 4: it had been 48 hours, more than 48 hours since
• 44:25
  Speaker 4: Kevin Durant had tweeted, which was the longest period of
• 44:28
  Speaker 4: him not tweeting since, I think, 2019.
• 44:31
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 44:32
  Speaker 4: And the behavior certainly is the behavior of somebody who
• 44:38
  Speaker 4: is uncomfortable with what's happening online in the world around him.
• 44:41
  Speaker 4: It's not like I imagine that if it was a hoax,
• 44:44
  Speaker 4: which is not fair, completely fair to say, but like,
• 44:47
  Speaker 4: wouldn't your first thing be like, Hey, I'm a tweet out.
• 44:50
  Speaker 3: Hey guys, that ain't me. That's some bullshit.
• 44:52
  Speaker 2: Well, I mean, look, we could just simply say that
• 44:55
  Speaker 2: boy was under siege.
• 44:56
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 44:57
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 44:58
  Speaker 1: He was under siege and you could perhaps extrapolate that
• 45:01
  Speaker 1: he is still under siege from the fact that we
• 45:04
  Speaker 1: have not heard anything from him.
• 45:06
  Speaker 2: And I just have to say this. This guy is hilarious.
• 45:15
  Speaker 1: Whoever this person is that is sending these things, I
• 45:18
  Speaker 1: wish we could get a little bit more of him
• 45:20
  Speaker 1: in front of the world because, I mean, I felt
• 45:23
  Speaker 1: like get off my Dickerson.
• 45:25
  Speaker 2: That's a great start. Also, get off my Dickerson, which
• 45:29
  Speaker 2: is the handle that he uses. Also hilarious.
• 45:32
  Speaker 3: It's a great start.
• 45:33
  Speaker 4: And the cocaine bear, I think, was the pinnacle of it. Ah,
• 45:37
  Speaker 4: it was a perfect description. The man's a writer.
• 45:39
  Speaker 3: Whoever it is, if it's him or not, he has
• 45:42
  Speaker 3: the ability of a writer.
• 45:44
  Speaker 1: Well, also, there was some, like, what he said about
• 45:47
  Speaker 1: Steve Kerr, get off by Dickerson, that is, where he says,
• 45:50
  Speaker 1: since MJ punched Kerr, he don't fuck with dark skins.
• 45:53
  Speaker 2: That's hilarious.
• 45:55
  Speaker 3: Good joke.
• 45:56
  Speaker 1: I swear I miss Ben Simmons. At least that N-word
• 45:59
  Speaker 1: would pass me the ball.
• 46:00
  Speaker 2: That is hilarious. He compared Frank Vogel and Devin Booker.
• 46:07
  Speaker 2: He called them two dictators.
• 46:09
  Speaker 1: Stalin and Hitler. Mussolini and Kim Jong-un.
• 46:13
  Speaker 4: And the face for trying to critique Steph during film session.
• 46:17
  Speaker 3: Like, everybody looked at him like that.
• 46:19
  Speaker 1: But see, I think the Phoenix stuff is the one where, like,
• 46:21
  Speaker 1: let's talk about this a little more because... The question
• 46:25
  Speaker 1: with that team always was about the relationship between Durant
• 46:28
  Speaker 1: and Booker, which also had a lot to do with
• 46:31
  Speaker 1: the relationship between Durant and the people around Booker.
• 46:35
  Speaker 2: Like, there was a lot going on there.
• 46:37
  Speaker 1: Kevin Durant, or excuse me, Get Off My Dickerson, clearly
• 46:40
  Speaker 1: believes that Kevin Durant frequently is asked to compete with
• 46:45
  Speaker 1: his teammates, including, he felt, Get Off My Dickerson believes
• 46:50
  Speaker 1: that Kyrie wasn't competing with him.
• 46:53
  Speaker 2: He was just a little cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs.
• 46:56
  Speaker 1: But that light skin that I would assume Get Off
• 46:59
  Speaker 1: My Dickerson is referring to Steph Curry and that triple
• 47:04
  Speaker 1: double cocaine baby.
• 47:06
  Speaker 3: That's my favorite one. That's just good writing, man.
• 47:11
  Speaker 2: I'm assuming Get Off My Dickerson is referring to Russell Westbrook. Yeah. Oh, okay.
• 47:20
  Speaker 2: The mildest things, though one might think the most impactful,
• 47:24
  Speaker 2: are the things that he says about his own team.
• 47:26
  Speaker 1: Excuse me, Get Off Mike Dickerson says about the Rockets
• 47:29
  Speaker 1: that he refers to as this shitty-ass team.
• 47:33
  Speaker 3: The best part about.
• 47:38
  Speaker 1: They're second in the West, or they're third in the West,
• 47:40
  Speaker 1: I think, or fourth, something like that.
• 47:43
  Speaker 2: Wow.
• 47:45
  Speaker 3: The.
• 47:46
  Speaker 4: I'm realizing it's the first time that I'm realizing that
• 47:49
  Speaker 4: all of the things that have gotten a lot of
• 47:51
  Speaker 4: traction have been like obvious insults with the exception of
• 47:56
  Speaker 4: the one that I find the most amusing.
• 47:59
  Speaker 3: Like, triple double cocaine.
• 48:00
  Speaker 4: Bear I mean it ain't clearly a shot like I
• 48:05
  Speaker 4: mean say your man play like a cocaine bear like
• 48:08
  Speaker 4: it ain't necessarily a compliment but it ain't calling him
• 48:11
  Speaker 4: Stalin say to get a bunch of triple doubles it
• 48:14
  Speaker 4: ain't quite the same as saying that you don't fuck
• 48:18
  Speaker 4: with dark skins like this is the nicest.
• 48:21
  Speaker 1: Thing you said I did not know that there was
• 48:23
  Speaker 1: recently a movie called cocaine bear that was based on
• 48:26
  Speaker 1: an actual cocaine bear yeah I, I, I triple, double,
• 48:31
  Speaker 1: I mean, cocaine bear. Uh, let me, let me make
• 48:34
  Speaker 1: sure I get this right about cocaine bear, which came
• 48:37
  Speaker 1: out in 2023.
• 48:38
  Speaker 2: I don't be paying.
• 48:38
  Speaker 1: Attention to movies, but I really ain't paying attention to
• 48:41
  Speaker 1: a movie called cocaine bear.
• 48:42
  Speaker 2: Sorry.
• 48:42
  Speaker 1: Carrie Russell, Carrie Russell, O'Shea Jackson jr. And it's got
• 48:47
  Speaker 1: the late great Isaiah Whitlock jr. AKA she in the movie.
• 48:53
  Speaker 1: and it is based on an actual factual cocaine bear
• 48:57
  Speaker 1: a bear that ate 75 um 175 pound bear that
• 49:03
  Speaker 1: fatally overdosed on cocaine because it came across a brick
• 49:06
  Speaker 1: and it ate it up 75 pounds worth.
• 49:09
  Speaker 4: Of coke and they was like what's up i i
• 49:12
  Speaker 4: i remember the movie and i remember hearing it's based
• 49:15
  Speaker 4: on a true story i respect myself too much to
• 49:17
  Speaker 4: have watched it i don't know if it was a
• 49:19
  Speaker 4: good time or not, but I didn't know Keri Russell
• 49:22
  Speaker 4: was in it. And like, I enjoy the show on
• 49:25
  Speaker 4: Netflix called The Diplomat where she is in there.
• 49:28
  Speaker 2: Oh, that's who she is.
• 49:29
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 49:29
  Speaker 4: Acting her ass off and being all profound and important.
• 49:34
  Speaker 4: She a cocaine bear. How do you make these choices?
• 49:39
  Speaker 4: That's not a good sign right there.
• 49:41
  Speaker 1: Somebody do something like say they in the Cocaine Bear
• 49:44
  Speaker 1: movie and they been in other stuff. That's when you
• 49:46
  Speaker 1: start being like, let me see your, you be gambling? Like,
• 49:50
  Speaker 1: let me get a look up that nose. Why you
• 49:53
  Speaker 1: always going to the bathroom?
• 49:55
  Speaker 4: I had to double check, make sure that Keri Russell
• 49:57
  Speaker 4: is who I think she was because I do get
• 49:59
  Speaker 4: confused sometimes. Like a lot of the stars be, they
• 50:02
  Speaker 4: follow the same template and I just get confused. Yeah.
• 50:05
  Speaker 1: But you know, so here's the thing about Durant. Durant's
• 50:09
  Speaker 1: going to survive this for a couple of reasons. One,
• 50:11
  Speaker 1: there's a big gap between the all-star game and when
• 50:13
  Speaker 1: anybody has to, like, come across him. So it's not
• 50:16
  Speaker 1: going to come up. Number two, we know him. You
• 50:20
  Speaker 1: know what I'm saying?
• 50:22
  Speaker 2: Like, this is always on the board.
• 50:29
  Speaker 4: The only challenge is, like, he got to go back
• 50:31
  Speaker 4: into that workplace. It's not just all previous people. It's
• 50:34
  Speaker 4: current people too.
• 50:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but you know, it wouldn't surprise me if he
• 50:37
  Speaker 1: says those things to them all the time.
• 50:40
  Speaker 2: You know what I mean?
• 50:42
  Speaker 1: Like, this is what I don't know is these are
• 50:44
  Speaker 1: only problems if he doesn't say these things to them
• 50:49
  Speaker 1: out loud. I also want to point out something that
• 50:51
  Speaker 1: is very interesting. He said he loved James Harden. He
• 50:54
  Speaker 1: said he's slightly delusional, but I understand him. James stayed
• 50:57
  Speaker 1: cool with everybody, except apparently with Kyrie. But James stayed
• 51:01
  Speaker 1: cool with Russell after they went and played together in
• 51:03
  Speaker 1: Houston and it didn't go well.
• 51:05
  Speaker 2: They still super cool.
• 51:06
  Speaker 1: He's still super cool with Durant. And we're out my
• 51:10
  Speaker 1: favorite James Harden quote of all time because there truly
• 51:12
  Speaker 1: aren't that many. Well, aside from Daryl Morey is a
• 51:15
  Speaker 1: liar and I'll never play for a team that he
• 51:18
  Speaker 1: works for.
• 51:18
  Speaker 2: I repeat.
• 51:20
  Speaker 1: Or I said Daryl Morey is a liar, is I'll
• 51:24
  Speaker 1: give him the shot myself. He was so mad at Kyrie.
• 51:28
  Speaker 1: He was the only one that was like, don't you
• 51:30
  Speaker 1: see what the problem is here?
• 51:32
  Speaker 2: I'll give him the shot myself if I have to.
• 51:36
  Speaker 2: But James Harden seemed to be cooler than we realized.
• 51:39
  Speaker 4: Did you watch James Harden on the like Netflix basketball show?
• 51:42
  Speaker 4: I didn't, but like, yeah, I feel like maybe we
• 51:45
  Speaker 4: could get some insight because you're right there. He's been
• 51:47
  Speaker 4: a bunch of different places and he behaves in a
• 51:49
  Speaker 4: way that I think turns off a lot of us
• 51:52
  Speaker 4: in media and fans who are not the fan of
• 51:54
  Speaker 4: the team that he is on or the team that
• 51:56
  Speaker 4: he's trying to get to.
• 51:57
  Speaker 3: But you're right. Routinely.
• 51:59
  Speaker 4: I can't really think of other guys that are that
• 52:01
  Speaker 4: big a star and move around that much. They have
• 52:04
  Speaker 4: a distinct style. It's a style of play that could
• 52:07
  Speaker 4: be annoying to teammates and opponents, but everybody loves him.
• 52:10
  Speaker 4: He's a good dude, I guess, in some capacity. Are
• 52:14
  Speaker 4: they messing with him in Philly? They didn't love him
• 52:16
  Speaker 4: so much in Philly. The fans or the team? Yeah,
• 52:20
  Speaker 4: but here's the thing about Harden, though. He a good time.
• 52:23
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 52:24
  Speaker 4: I hear James Harden parties be cracking. That's all we
• 52:26
  Speaker 4: know about him, man. That's all we know. He like
• 52:28
  Speaker 4: to step back, and yeah, he like.
• 52:31
  Speaker 3: To shake us.
• 52:33
  Speaker 2: He does like to shake.
• 52:35
  Speaker 3: That's all we know about him, man. Those two things,
• 52:37
  Speaker 3: and he got a beard.
• 52:39
  Speaker 2: He loves to shake. He's so addicted to the telephone, man.
• 52:46
  Speaker 1: Like that was my thought it's the all-star game and
• 52:48
  Speaker 1: I get that you under siege but you can I
• 52:50
  Speaker 1: guess it would be hard to put down the phone
• 52:52
  Speaker 1: under those circumstances but like he is he is on
• 52:55
  Speaker 1: the phone it is your reminder NBA players got a
• 52:59
  Speaker 1: lot more time than one might think practice the same
• 53:03
  Speaker 1: time games the same time rest of the time it's
• 53:06
  Speaker 1: on you it's not that much different from being a
• 53:08
  Speaker 1: professional podcaster I.
• 53:10
  Speaker 4: Don't know what, yeah, it's a lot of fun to
• 53:13
  Speaker 4: have this conversation, but I think that there is something
• 53:15
  Speaker 4: a little bit deeper and more interesting about the idea
• 53:18
  Speaker 4: of these essentially child stars growing up in this like
• 53:23
  Speaker 4: very different type of environment where they're kind of protected
• 53:27
  Speaker 4: and like a lot of the issues that, a lot
• 53:30
  Speaker 4: of the immaturities and behaviors that other of us have,
• 53:34
  Speaker 4: like those get sanded off because we just ain't great
• 53:37
  Speaker 4: enough to tell people to shut up and mind their business.
• 53:39
  Speaker 4: It's interesting combining that with social media and someone who's
• 53:43
  Speaker 4: obviously a little bit unique and super talented.
• 53:47
  Speaker 3: Who do you become in your 30s and 40s?
• 53:49
  Speaker 4: If that's the life that you led and your major
• 53:52
  Speaker 4: contact with the outside world is through the Twitter, I
• 53:55
  Speaker 4: don't know. I'm not pretending to psychoanalyze anybody, but I
• 53:59
  Speaker 4: think that that has something to do with the journey
• 54:01
  Speaker 4: of Kevin Durant.
• 54:02
  Speaker 1: It is amazing that he's the one guy that doesn't
• 54:05
  Speaker 1: have a podcast like that. right like i would check
• 54:09
  Speaker 1: his podcast out yeah he clearly has like he's not
• 54:13
  Speaker 1: the guy that would be like yo when he retires
• 54:14
  Speaker 1: he's gonna be on television sounds to me like he
• 54:16
  Speaker 1: would be excellent.
• 54:19
  Speaker 3: He would be i would enjoy.
• 54:20
  Speaker 1: It he's incredibly knowledgeable right he's very famous um funny
• 54:25
  Speaker 1: trying to get a cut every week right like that's
• 54:28
  Speaker 1: that becomes his own thing but i mean he he
• 54:31
  Speaker 1: seems like The takes are the hard thing to come by, right?
• 54:34
  Speaker 1: Like all these cats that have decided that they're going
• 54:36
  Speaker 1: to be podcasters, that's.
• 54:37
  Speaker 2: What they've learned.
• 54:38
  Speaker 1: The hard part is actually having opinions about stuff. He
• 54:42
  Speaker 1: has so many opinions that he argues with strangers. Like
• 54:48
  Speaker 1: a lot of this, get off my Dickerson guy, a
• 54:54
  Speaker 1: lot of this appears to be arguing with strangers. The
• 54:58
  Speaker 1: last thing that I want to point out, And it's
• 55:01
  Speaker 1: been a while now, so we haven't talked about this,
• 55:02
  Speaker 1: but I can tell you something right now that's real, okay?
• 55:06
  Speaker 1: I've only been in like up close with Kevin Durant
• 55:08
  Speaker 1: like a couple of times. One of them was at
• 55:13
  Speaker 1: the office at the seaport. The other was at a wedding.
• 55:18
  Speaker 1: And I don't know how exactly to refer to people
• 55:22
  Speaker 1: that I like who also really like Drake because like
• 55:27
  Speaker 1: it's not appropriate to say OV hoes.
• 55:30
  Speaker 2: About people you know. You understand what I'm saying? And
• 55:32
  Speaker 2: people you like.
• 55:34
  Speaker 1: However, this wedding was very much so people firmly planted
• 55:40
  Speaker 1: in the Drake camp. And not in the Drake camp
• 55:41
  Speaker 1: just because they liked the music, but people who knew Drake.
• 55:44
  Speaker 1: And you wasn't hearing no note of no Kendrick anywhere there.
• 55:48
  Speaker 1: Those people who were in proximity of that beef, it
• 55:52
  Speaker 1: was real to them, right? Like they picked their sides
• 55:56
  Speaker 1: and they got on the army and Kevin Durant was
• 55:59
  Speaker 1: clearly on the Drake side because we had a dude
• 56:02
  Speaker 1: put out his DMs that seemed very clearly to be
• 56:04
  Speaker 1: from Kevin Durant. And it's just all him going in
• 56:08
  Speaker 1: about this beef. You talk to Kendrick today? Why you want,
• 56:12
  Speaker 1: stop ignoring me, bro. I'm wondering if your daddy Kendrick
• 56:14
  Speaker 1: knows you exist. Like he, he, He was a infantryman
• 56:19
  Speaker 1: in the great beef of 2024. He's incredibly interesting.
• 56:23
  Speaker 3: You're right. Like a inside look like a Kevin Durant.
• 56:27
  Speaker 3: He might be the only player.
• 56:28
  Speaker 4: Cause as we get all these like documentaries from players
• 56:31
  Speaker 4: that they put out that most people find a little
• 56:33
  Speaker 4: boring because they're like sanitized and controlled by the players.
• 56:37
  Speaker 4: Kevin Durant might be the one that gets to the
• 56:39
  Speaker 4: point where he could actually give us like a real
• 56:41
  Speaker 4: look at who he is. That gets really interesting. Cause
• 56:44
  Speaker 4: he doesn't seem like, even though he hasn't owned up
• 56:46
  Speaker 4: to this, whether it's him or not, he doesn't seem
• 56:49
  Speaker 4: as like concerned about protecting his like air quotes, brand
• 56:54
  Speaker 4: or image as so many other players are like, he
• 56:57
  Speaker 4: feels a little bit more real than a lot of players.
• 57:01
  Speaker 3: Which is.
• 57:02
  Speaker 1: I mean, he is more honest about the whack things
• 57:08
  Speaker 1: about him.
• 57:09
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 57:09
  Speaker 1: Cause I mean, it's as someone who used to argue
• 57:12
  Speaker 1: with a lot of people on the internet, never under
• 57:15
  Speaker 1: a fake name, right? Get off my Dickerson is engaging
• 57:19
  Speaker 1: in whack behavior. I mean, it's kind of hard to,
• 57:24
  Speaker 1: it's kind of hard to ignore.
• 57:25
  Speaker 2: That, right?
• 57:26
  Speaker 3: Isn't it just art?
• 57:27
  Speaker 4: Isn't it just talking shit about your coworkers, which is
• 57:29
  Speaker 4: like everybody does.
• 57:32
  Speaker 2: To your name.
• 57:33
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 57:34
  Speaker 1: Like that's, that's my thing is I have never trapped
• 57:37
  Speaker 1: that there existed in an internet space that was in
• 57:39
  Speaker 1: anything other than my name. Yeah. If you're not going
• 57:42
  Speaker 1: to put your name on it, then it goes into
• 57:44
  Speaker 1: the whack place.
• 57:45
  Speaker 4: The only reason why I would defend that is because
• 57:48
  Speaker 4: they were DMs. He wasn't trying to propagate these rumors
• 57:52
  Speaker 4: about players publicly without putting his name on it. Like,
• 57:57
  Speaker 4: my understanding is while these people may not be his actual, like,
• 58:00
  Speaker 4: close friends, the people in the chat knew who he was.
• 58:04
  Speaker 4: And they're essentially his friends. And he's just talking shit
• 58:06
  Speaker 4: about his coworkers to his friends.
• 58:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, that is fair.
• 58:09
  Speaker 1: Like, that was one thing when I did game theory
• 58:11
  Speaker 1: that I recognized was I have no idea what these
• 58:14
  Speaker 1: people are saying about me when I'm not around.
• 58:15
  Speaker 2: But they are because I'm the boss now.
• 58:17
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 58:17
  Speaker 1: Like all these shows that I've done, it's like, somebody
• 58:20
  Speaker 1: got some shit to say about me when I'm not around.
• 58:22
  Speaker 2: Cause I know I got some shit to.
• 58:24
  Speaker 1: Say about them when they not around and only cause
• 58:27
  Speaker 1: it would hurt their feelings if they were around. It's
• 58:30
  Speaker 1: not because I am afraid it's that it is bad
• 58:33
  Speaker 1: for business, but sometimes you just gotta get it out.
• 58:37
  Speaker 4: There's some things that just aren't like not socially acceptable,
• 58:41
  Speaker 4: which I mean, to be fair, well, Part of the
• 58:44
  Speaker 4: problem with the NBA is things that should not be
• 58:47
  Speaker 4: socially acceptable have become socially acceptable, like fucking tanking.
• 58:52
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 58:53
  Speaker 4: And foul grifting and all the other bullshit that makes
• 58:57
  Speaker 4: the NBA a little annoying.
• 58:58
  Speaker 3: I can't wait to the playoffs. That shit be fun
• 59:00
  Speaker 3: as hell.
• 59:00
  Speaker 1: Oh, I also love that you deem that those things
• 59:02
  Speaker 1: are socially unacceptable. And this is why I love you,
• 59:05
  Speaker 1: because I'm right there with you. Like, I had to
• 59:06
  Speaker 1: say these.
• 59:07
  Speaker 2: They're not all for Friday.
• 59:08
  Speaker 5: Right.
• 59:09
  Speaker 3: They're not anymore is the thing. I wish they were.
• 59:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 59:13
  Speaker 4: Like that's the thing that when we try to change
• 59:15
  Speaker 4: all these things to incentivize players to do this, incentivize.
• 59:20
  Speaker 3: Let's change the draft. Let's change this incentivize.
• 59:22
  Speaker 4: Like there was one thing that always worked for incentives
• 59:26
  Speaker 4: in the past was you knew you will be shamed.
• 59:29
  Speaker 4: And we dove into this on my show, but that's
• 59:31
  Speaker 4: one of the big like results of like our optimization
• 59:34
  Speaker 4: culture is that we've all turned into these tiny little GMs,
• 59:38
  Speaker 4: which is something that I've heard.
• 59:40
  Speaker 3: You talk about before where we're like, well, it's the
• 59:43
  Speaker 3: best way to win. Why don't you just think?
• 59:45
  Speaker 4: Like there was a time when you would at least
• 59:49
  Speaker 4: pretend not.
• 59:50
  Speaker 3: To be cheating.
• 59:51
  Speaker 4: Like you had enough self-respect to like put out a
• 59:54
  Speaker 4: product that you could respect. But now we've all defended
• 59:57
  Speaker 4: them as like saying, this is the incentives. This is
• 59:59
  Speaker 4: the incentives. No, those incentives were there in the past,
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 4: but there was a stronger incentive. You ain't want to
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 4: be called a bum.
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 2: We got to normalize calling people losers.
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 1: Like when they're actually losers, we got to like normalize.
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 1: Calling people losers. I'm with that, bro boy. We'd be
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 1: here another hour talking about this. This is Dominique Foxworth.
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 1: Check him out on the Dominique Foxworth Show. Available for
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 1: all five podcasts and given away for free. My man
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 1: had a live show. He even did the whole thanks
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 1: to my audience sort of thing. You get a little
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 1: proud of what you built there. Got your little community.
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 1: Got your tribe over there. You know what I'm saying?
• 1:00:37
  Speaker 1: I will note this. Oh, when Charlie Kravitz did not
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 1: know if I was going to be there or not,
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 1: he sent me and told me I could get in
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 1: for free, but wasn't having me on the show.
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 2: Okay. Y'all done got big over there. Ain't no room
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 2: for your boy no more.
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 3: That is absolutely false. There's always room for you.
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 1: Nah, but seriously though, I think, was that on your
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 1: show where Marcus Spears said that he's afraid of cats
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 1: because he don't want nothing walking around his house that
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 1: can sneak up.
• 1:01:02
  Speaker 2: On him and he can't hear it?
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 3: It was a good point.
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 2: It was a great point.
• 1:01:05
  Speaker 4: I got a cat and I had to go ahead
• 1:01:08
  Speaker 4: and give him that one.
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 3: You're right, that's weird.
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 1: Ain't nobody tiptoeing at Marcus. First of all, there's no
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 1: way anybody's tiptoeing.
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 3: In that house. No, no, no, no.
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 1: They all.
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 3: Big and amazing.
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 1: Y'all want to get in no 4-4-5-0-5 contest of any
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 1: sort with the Spearses. Like, I met his wife once,
• 1:01:29
  Speaker 1: because people don't know Marcus White played in the WNBA,
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 1: and I met her at the office once. And it was,
• 1:01:33
  Speaker 1: you know, the couple that Jays together stays together, right?
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 2: They both got their Jays on. She damn near his height.
• 1:01:40
  Speaker 1: And their kids, like, I know their daughter was, like,
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 1: top volleyball player in America in high school or something
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 1: like that.
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah, top 10 basketball-playing son.
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 4: The younger daughter better at volleyball. Like the younger daughter
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 4: is also better. I went to see Marcus's son play
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 4: a little while ago and it wasn't one of those
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 4: like tournaments where it's all these future NBA players and
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 4: that boy special. And also I put on top of it,
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 4: there's something about when we've talked about this before and
• 1:02:12
  Speaker 4: like the professionalization of youth sports and how a lot
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 4: of these kids are, um, They're like trying to get
• 1:02:19
  Speaker 4: themselves in the right position to do that and trying
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 4: to protect and work on this part of the game.
• 1:02:23
  Speaker 4: And of course, all that stuff is true of Marcus's
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 4: son also. But Marcus is a football player and Marcus
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 4: talks to his son like a football player, which I
• 1:02:35
  Speaker 4: fucking love. Marcus is on the sideline. I'm sitting courtside
• 1:02:39
  Speaker 4: with Marcus and everyone else is like, yeah, run the floor,
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 4: get in position, set a screen. Marcus is like, put
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 4: his little ass in the basket. That's the type of
• 1:02:52
  Speaker 4: man they raising. So I think he's going to be
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 4: all right. Also keep in mind Marcus Cahoot.
• 1:02:57
  Speaker 5: Oh, yeah.
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 2: Marcus was a really good high school basketball player.
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 3: I loved it.
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 4: Yeah, man.
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 1: Brother, I appreciate you. And ladies and gentlemen, thanks so
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 1: much for joining us here on The Right Time. We
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 1: do this four times a week. Ryan Brumley handles everything
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 1: behind the scenes.
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 2: Thank you, sir.
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 1: Remember, follow The Right Time. Subscribe, like, rate us, review us,
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 1: give us five stars. You only give us four stars.
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 1: I'm inclined to believe you're a hater. Talk to you
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 1: guys in a couple of days.
• 1:03:19
  Speaker 2: Take it easy.