Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / Breaking: Lucas Hernandez's step mom shot to death

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Breaking: Lucas Hernandez's step mom shot to death · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

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Speaker 1: Him Triumph Channel one. Thirty two five year old Lucas
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Speaker 1: Hernandez seemingly disappears into thin air, his dad out working
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Speaker 1: with an oil rig. The stepmother, Emily Glass with him
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Speaker 1: at home at the time, while she is taking in
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Speaker 1: that pie apparently slips out the back door. Well that's
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Speaker 1: certainly raised eyebrows with in the police department in the
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Speaker 1: last hours. A stunning turn of events. That stepmother Emily Glass,
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Speaker 1: who leads a private investigator after three months to little
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Speaker 1: Lucas's dead body under a bridge, has apparently been shot.
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Speaker 1: I mean, sy Grace, this is Crime Stories. Thank you
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Speaker 1: for being with us, and a bizarre turn of events
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Speaker 1: we learned that Emily Glass is found early early in
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Speaker 1: the morning in a home near Kellogg and Edgemore. This
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Speaker 1: is Lucas Hernandez is so called step mother. Officers respond
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Speaker 1: to the home around to a m to find a
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Speaker 1: woman with a gunshot wound, which taught police on the
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Speaker 1: scene right now joining me a very dear friend of
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Speaker 1: Emily Glasses. It's Shelley eber Heart. Shelley, thank you for
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Speaker 1: being with us, and I'm stunned by this turn of events. Shelley,
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Speaker 1: what happened? We really don't know. We just was at
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Speaker 1: home Shaney and I was at Shaney's house. She's my
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Speaker 1: best friend of over thirty years, and we've been on
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Speaker 1: the Emily Glass case Lucas Hernandez case since day one
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Speaker 1: and had our doubts in the beginning, but after seeing
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Speaker 1: more and more of the evidence and things that weren't
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Speaker 1: lining up, I started our own group on Facebook and
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Speaker 1: added Shaney as a co administrator. Very much. Our main
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Speaker 1: objective was finding Lucius, of course, and also supporting Annily
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Speaker 1: because a lot of her rights, her constitutional rights were
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Speaker 1: being violated, and then dealing with different things throughout the
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Speaker 1: legal system the past sixteen years and knowing different things.
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Speaker 1: I've never heard of a person being hell in gael
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Speaker 1: on a child in dangeroum a charge on a fifty
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Speaker 1: dollar bond, or that taste being publicized such as hers was.
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Speaker 1: She was basically tried and convicted. Just well, hold on, Shelley,
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Speaker 1: I thought that she was actually acquitted and walked through.
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Speaker 1: Now she did. But okay, because when you said she
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Speaker 1: was tried and convicted, I thought maybe I had my
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Speaker 1: facts wrong. So she was acquitted, tried and convicted in
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Speaker 1: the public side. Well, when you say that she was
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Speaker 1: had so much let me say publicity. Well, but wouldn't
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Speaker 1: you agree, Shelley. Everybody with me as a dear friend
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Speaker 1: of the stepmother Emily Glass, who was home alone the
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Speaker 1: only adult with Lucas Hernandez when he goes missing and
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Speaker 1: then leads a private investigator three months later to his
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Speaker 1: dead body in an obscure, obscure area under a bridge.
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Speaker 1: When you say her case got so much scrutiny, I
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Speaker 1: don't think it really had to do with her driving
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Speaker 1: after three bowls apart. I think the scrutiny was because
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Speaker 1: Lucas at the time was still missing and everyone felt
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Speaker 1: she had the maybe the missing answers to what happened
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Speaker 1: to him? Tell me why you think Do you think
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Speaker 1: Emily Glass was involved in Lucas's death? No, we don't
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Speaker 1: believe that she harmed Lucas. Yes, we have always felt
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Speaker 1: that she had information as to what happened to him
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Speaker 1: and about his disappearance, even from her first Gelhouse interview,
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Speaker 1: her video taped interview with k w H Channel twelve
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Speaker 1: here on which Tall, Kansas, she did state herself that
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Speaker 1: there was a story to tell, but that it was
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Speaker 1: not her story to tell. There was a story to tell,
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Speaker 1: but it's not her story to tell. Wasn't she the
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Speaker 1: only adult in the home when he went missing? Um?
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Speaker 1: There was also a homeles man there at the time
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Speaker 1: that Lucas went missing. Okay, and who was that? By
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Speaker 1: the name of Christian Route right, let me ask you, um,
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Speaker 1: what evidence supports the theory that there was a homeless
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Speaker 1: man in the home when Lucas goes missing. Um, it's
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Speaker 1: actually been reported and verified by the police officers. They
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Speaker 1: did bring him in for questioning and did have him
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Speaker 1: talk to Emily, trying to get her to talk. Um.
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Speaker 1: But unfortunately, just two weeks after he spoke to the
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Speaker 1: police and talked about his involvement in the Lucas Hernandez
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Speaker 1: case and his disappearance. He coincidentally wound up dad and
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Speaker 1: a hint and run accident. Well, my question is if
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Speaker 1: he first of all, what was a homeless man doing
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Speaker 1: in their home? If that's true, Emily is a very
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Speaker 1: empathetic person. It was called outside. It was just the
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Speaker 1: type of person she is, as far as somebody being
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Speaker 1: outside cold. Um. But we have since learned that this
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Speaker 1: Christian Riles has connections with bile mom Jamie Orr and
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Speaker 1: also has connections with Misty Cox, who has appointed herself
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Speaker 1: as the spokesperson now for the Hernandez Well for Lucas
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Speaker 1: Hernandez is um mom and Dad. Well, this is starting
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Speaker 1: to sound like a very vast conspiracy that a homeless
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Speaker 1: man was in the home at the time Lucas goes missing,
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Speaker 1: and he, according to you, has connections with Lucas's biological
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Speaker 1: mom who lived in a different city. Actually Jamie lived here.
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Speaker 1: Jamie lives in which talk Kansas ap getting a jump
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Speaker 1: from Emily and Jonathan's home and where to Emily and
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Speaker 1: Jonathan is their home in Wichita? Yes, it is. When
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Speaker 1: you say a hop skipping a jump. That that's interesting.
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Speaker 1: Let me rephrase. So according to you, and this is
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Speaker 1: according to Emily at the time the five year old
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Speaker 1: little boy goes missing under her care, she has invited
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Speaker 1: an unknown homeless man into the home. We now know
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Speaker 1: his name, and you are stating that he had connections.
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Speaker 1: Whatever that means to the biological mother who lived elsewhere?
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Speaker 1: Is that correct to Lucas's bio mom? Now, why would
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Speaker 1: anybody take a nap with a homeless man in the
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Speaker 1: home with your child? That I can't answer. Um, I'm
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Speaker 1: a mother of seven children, and I do know that
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Speaker 1: if my children were napping, I would try a nap
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Speaker 1: with them any time. I can take a nap your
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Speaker 1: own doctor, with a homeless man, with a homeless man,
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Speaker 1: a homeless man in my home. I've never done that,
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Speaker 1: but yeah, okay, So another thing. During these three months
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Speaker 1: that Lucas was missing, the homeless man was never taken
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Speaker 1: into custody. He was questioned after Glass pointing a finger
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Speaker 1: at him, but he was never taken into custody. Interested
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Speaker 1: for any reason? Why is that? Actually Emily Glass never
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Speaker 1: named him. The police actually found that found Well, that's
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Speaker 1: hold on, hold on, let me write this down. So
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Speaker 1: Lucas goes missing a five year old todd boy and
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Speaker 1: this is emily story. There's a homeless man in the home. Yeah,
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Speaker 1: when police come to find and look for the boy,
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Speaker 1: she never mentions a homeless man in the home. Okay,
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Speaker 1: you don't see a problem with that. She had told
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Speaker 1: Jonathan about it and he was fine with it. And um,
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Speaker 1: the police are actually the ones who found out about
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Speaker 1: the homeless man or Christian Ryles being there and they located.
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Speaker 1: I know, but that Jonathan may be fine with it,
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Speaker 1: which I frankly don't believe that any man, any father,
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Speaker 1: or any parent out of town will be okay with
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Speaker 1: a homeless guy in your home. You want to help
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Speaker 1: a homeless person, give them some money, take them to
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Speaker 1: a shelter, give them something to eat. Don't bring him
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Speaker 1: in with your own baby. Girl, and you're taught Stepson.
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Speaker 1: I find that really hard to believe, And that she
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Speaker 1: would take a nap with a homeless guy there with
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Speaker 1: a child, and that when that child goes missing, she
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Speaker 1: never tells police, Hey, I had a guy here giving
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Speaker 1: him shelter from the cold. Obviously he's involved. Now if
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Speaker 1: even in this scenario, which I do not believe. But
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Speaker 1: even in this scenario, if it were true, I'm more
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Speaker 1: about finding out the truth. Then why did she know?
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Speaker 1: Why did Emily Glass know where the body was? Okay,
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Speaker 1: where the top boy had been hidden? Okay, Um, Nancy,
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Speaker 1: this is Shaney. And from what we're understanding from Emily,
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Speaker 1: she was not sure where the body was. And she
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Speaker 1: kept telling this man, I think it's in Keascha I
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Speaker 1: I think it's in Keaschai. He drove her out to
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Speaker 1: Harvey County over this bridge of at least thirty times.
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Speaker 1: He said, I think he's out here, and he stops
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Speaker 1: the bridges and just happens to be the first bridge
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Speaker 1: just to fans off that and Lucas is under that bridge.
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Speaker 1: But if you listen to this, okay, well why why
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Speaker 1: why if you listen to the podcast audio that, yeah,
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Speaker 1: that's not what I hear. I don't hear him telling
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Speaker 1: her where to go. How would I mean, that's not
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Speaker 1: what happened. And when you look over the bridge, you
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Speaker 1: can't even tell, because I've seen it myself. When you
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Speaker 1: look into that gully, you can't even tell that that
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Speaker 1: is Lucas. You can't. And she told him that she
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Speaker 1: actually told him, I believe it's key Chi. I believe
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Speaker 1: it's key Chi. And she kept saying, I let Lucas down.
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Speaker 1: She let Lucas down because she could not defend him.
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Speaker 1: And what all is going on around her? If you
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Speaker 1: you mean because she led a homeless man in the
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Speaker 1: home that killed him and then concealed it from police,
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Speaker 1: I'm saying this homeless man did not just show up
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Speaker 1: on her doorstep by accident. I believe that. I'm saying
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Speaker 1: this homeless man did not show up on her doorstep
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Speaker 1: at all. But it's because it doesn't make sense to me.
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Speaker 1: How would she know where the Todds dead body was.
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Speaker 1: She led him there out of everywhere in the area.
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Speaker 1: She led him to this obscure location. The homeless man
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Speaker 1: show up at a doorstep because that was that was
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Speaker 1: private by which talked the police department and they took
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Speaker 1: him in and for a question. He was also arrested,
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Speaker 1: but all the other cases and they took a hand
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Speaker 1: over to the jail to talk to Emily. But she's like,
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Speaker 1: I don't know you. She was playing kind of crazy,
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Speaker 1: like I don't know you. Um, it was a it
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Speaker 1: was a situation that I don't think you're clear of
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Speaker 1: or any of us are really clear of. There was
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Speaker 1: drug usage going on at that time. There was things
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Speaker 1: going on in the home and the home that none
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Speaker 1: of us knew what was really going on. We've got
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Speaker 1: an innocent boy there, We've got an innocent baby girl.
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Speaker 1: But the day that Emily was taken into custody, the
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Speaker 1: woman had looked like she had been beaten, two black eyes,
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Speaker 1: her hands were all tore up. That was a woman fighting.
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Speaker 1: Her knuckles were completely bruised, like she was fighting to
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Speaker 1: protect somebody. That's why she says, Well, then why did
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Speaker 1: she ever tell any of that to police? Wouldn't it
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Speaker 1: be more important to find Lucas? And how would she
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Speaker 1: know that Lucas's body is in Key Chai? How would
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Speaker 1: she know that it wasn't even in Key Chai, that's
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Speaker 1: just that part. It was in Harvey County. Well, you
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Speaker 1: just said that. She continued to say, I think Lucas's
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Speaker 1: body is in Kee Chai. So well, then how did
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Speaker 1: she end up at an obscure bridge in the middle
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Speaker 1: of nowhere to tell the private eye where the body was.
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Speaker 1: He drove over that bridge over and over and he said, okay,
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Speaker 1: I'm going to tell you I think you know, or
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Speaker 1: Lucas is that isn't one of these bridges, so we'll
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Speaker 1: just stop at all of them. Nancy. I've listened to
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Speaker 1: all the audio, you know. David Marshburn, the p I
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Speaker 1: provided us every second of audio that Emily was with him,
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Speaker 1: and painstakingly we've all listened to six and a half
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Speaker 1: hours of it as they're driving around. And that's not
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Speaker 1: what I heard. So question to Emily's friend, where are
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Speaker 1: you getting the information as to what Marshburn said to her?
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Speaker 1: Where did that? Well? On one of the edited edit
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Speaker 1: party podcasts that you had, where it says right there
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Speaker 1: that he asked Emily which bridge and she's like, I
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Speaker 1: can't tell you. I don't know, and he says, then
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Speaker 1: a little this drive over all these bridges and we'll
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Speaker 1: get out and start looking. You know. I don't hear
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Speaker 1: him saying that. I don't ever recall that. But to
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Speaker 1: the point that's happening right now, Emily Glass has been shot.
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Speaker 1: Do you believe she shot herself? Ma'am, I've got and
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Speaker 1: I showed the police. I took my phone to night.
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Speaker 1: Jonathan Hernandez actually said last Winester Thursday, night if he's
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Speaker 1: seen Emily, he didn't know that he could keep himself
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Speaker 1: from killing her, because she asked, Jonathan, will you meet
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Speaker 1: up with me? No tape recorders, no cameras, no videos,
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Speaker 1: no metha, no phones. I want to talk to you
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Speaker 1: about everything that happened at night, And Jonathan told do
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Speaker 1: a friend, I can't I meet up with her because
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Speaker 1: if I do, I'm not sure I won't kill her.
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Speaker 1: Are you suggesting that the father of Lucas Hernandez shot
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Speaker 1: Emily Glass the stepmother? Yes, I am. Let me just
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Speaker 1: stay here that while Jonathan Hernandez, the father, was in
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Speaker 1: the home where Emily is shot and did call nine
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Speaker 1: one one. To my understanding, there is no evidence at
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Speaker 1: all that he shot Emily Glass. Right now, it is
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Speaker 1: undetermined as to the shooting. Go ahead, Dear Emily didn't
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Speaker 1: call anyone. He gets what the officers told him when
15:42
Speaker 1: they got there. She he said she was code blue
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18:07
Speaker 1: where police called to the home? As we know right now,
18:09
Speaker 1: the stepmother under suspicion and the mistreatment of a boy
18:15
Speaker 1: found dead under a bridge. Lucas Hernandez has been shot? Who, what, where? When?
18:22
Speaker 1: And widely give it to me in a nutshell, Nancy.
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Speaker 1: What happened was Jonathan Lucas's father called around a little
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Speaker 1: after one thirty am. He said he walked into the
18:31
Speaker 1: home off of South Edgemore and found a woman unresponsive
18:35
Speaker 1: with a gunshot. When police arrived a short time later
18:38
Speaker 1: and pronounced her dead. At this time, they're saying there's
18:42
Speaker 1: no evidence of homicide, but they're all they're not calling
18:46
Speaker 1: it suicide either. They're still investigating. It's still very early
18:49
Speaker 1: in the investigation. Very early in a developing story. Emily
18:53
Speaker 1: Glass has been shot. The person that finds her body
18:57
Speaker 1: is Lucas Hernandez, his father Jonathan, who spoke with in depth,
19:02
Speaker 1: joining me Emily's friends Shelley ever Heart. Uh, and you
19:07
Speaker 1: are convinced that she did not shoot herself? Yes, we are.
19:11
Speaker 1: I'm Shaaney how and she's showing ever heart. We're we're
19:15
Speaker 1: both her, both Emily's friends and um, we're both convinced
19:19
Speaker 1: you'd not shoot herself. After reading several text messages and
19:25
Speaker 1: things of Jonathan and the last week, saying when Emily
19:28
Speaker 1: was released from jail last week and the baby was found,
19:32
Speaker 1: baby Lucas was found that he would not he could
19:35
Speaker 1: not refrain himself from possibly killing her, and all she
19:39
Speaker 1: wanted to do was talk to him and explain things
19:41
Speaker 1: to him. He would not beat up with her. And
19:44
Speaker 1: I asked Jonathan, I said, Jonathan, do don't you think
19:48
Speaker 1: that there's enough killings going on? And he had this, um,
19:51
Speaker 1: he's it's been enough. People have died through all this
19:55
Speaker 1: and he put the loji sign. That's like hmm, let's
19:57
Speaker 1: see and now Emily did tonight Take a listen to
20:02
Speaker 1: what Emily Glass says from her jail cell before she
20:08
Speaker 1: was let Scott free. Can you tell me any more
20:11
Speaker 1: about what happened that Saturday when he disappeared? Just the
20:18
Speaker 1: fact that it took a shower and since we took
20:22
Speaker 1: it up like we always do, I'm putting down for
20:26
Speaker 1: a movie and it's cool because you know, yeah, back
20:30
Speaker 1: to this, please sleep. So that was why he had
20:32
Speaker 1: a qualrified oh when he had fallen a sleep after
20:38
Speaker 1: my shower, which is why I went down. Mm hmm,
20:46
Speaker 1: now I gotta go. You are hearing Emily Glass as
20:49
Speaker 1: she is speaking with Kate W. C H. Devin Fastbender,
20:55
Speaker 1: and at no time does she mention anyone else in
20:58
Speaker 1: the home as a matter of fact, through out uh
21:01
Speaker 1: questions um explanations. The homeless man she now points to
21:08
Speaker 1: being there emerged later. For ninety days plus search teams,
21:14
Speaker 1: a t v S, dogs, helicopters, volunteers look for the boy.
21:18
Speaker 1: It's only when private investigator Marshburn gets the stepmother in
21:24
Speaker 1: the car. They drive for four to five hours until
21:27
Speaker 1: she leads him to Lucas's dead body. In the last hours,
21:31
Speaker 1: Emily Glass found shot Lucas's father, discovers her body and
21:36
Speaker 1: calls nine one one with me. Two of Emily's dear friends,
21:42
Speaker 1: Jamie Howell and Sherry Eberhart to Susan Constantine, author of
21:47
Speaker 1: Idiot's Guide to Reading Body Language on Amazon. Susan, you
21:51
Speaker 1: have carefully combed over every single statement given by Emily Glass.
21:58
Speaker 1: Explain Yeah, when I did, Nancy is I conducted statement
22:02
Speaker 1: analysis on every single one of the statements and looking
22:06
Speaker 1: for areas that we're connecting or disconnecting. And overall, when
22:11
Speaker 1: I reading through there, there are several areas that just
22:14
Speaker 1: didn't make sense. They were incongruent to what she was saying.
22:18
Speaker 1: There's lots of filler words, additional words that were not there.
22:22
Speaker 1: And you have to understand that with statement analysis, the
22:25
Speaker 1: writer or the speaker chooses subconsciously every single word that
22:30
Speaker 1: they put down and what they say, So every word
22:33
Speaker 1: is examined on its own and then why is it there?
22:36
Speaker 1: For example, when we're looking at the one you were
22:38
Speaker 1: just talking about that they took a shower, um like
22:42
Speaker 1: he always dust, making it sound as if this is
22:44
Speaker 1: something that's routine. I put him down for a movie.
22:47
Speaker 1: Now here's the other information in his pull up. Now
22:51
Speaker 1: that part really doesn't really fit, does it. But there's
22:54
Speaker 1: a reason why Emily put that in there. And then
22:57
Speaker 1: she says, you know he has accident, all right, So
23:00
Speaker 1: no one asked her that question. She put that in there,
23:03
Speaker 1: so that's why we had pull up on him. So
23:06
Speaker 1: when I'm reading that, that's clear to me that saying
23:09
Speaker 1: that somewhat reason why he ended up abused is somewhere
23:14
Speaker 1: around the reason why he had accidents, And I see
23:17
Speaker 1: what you mean. Let me ask to the friends Jamie
23:20
Speaker 1: Howell and Shelley Ever heard people had noticed that Lucas
23:25
Speaker 1: was covered in bruises in the past. What do you,
23:28
Speaker 1: if anything, do you know about that. Did Emily ever
23:30
Speaker 1: explain that the bruises? Okay, this is what we've been told,
23:36
Speaker 1: and not just by Emily but by family, because Emily
23:40
Speaker 1: was pretty much the provider, and um not financially because
23:44
Speaker 1: she didn't work. Jonathan did. But as far as taking
23:47
Speaker 1: care of Emily, my own mom wasn't, which was Jamie
23:51
Speaker 1: was now in the pictures, not allowed to see him
23:53
Speaker 1: unless it was supervised. So Jamie or Emily had him
23:59
Speaker 1: all the time him. She took him to school, she
24:01
Speaker 1: got him home from school, she took him to the
24:03
Speaker 1: doctor's appointment, she got him home, she dressed him very well. Um,
24:08
Speaker 1: there was several times that we were told that Jonathan
24:12
Speaker 1: went on the attacked mode of hurting his own child
24:18
Speaker 1: and Jamie or Emily would have to pull him off,
24:23
Speaker 1: and then Jamie or than Emily would get beat But
24:26
Speaker 1: there's lots though. There's also a situation going on right
24:32
Speaker 1: now where Jonathan attacked one of James or one of
24:36
Speaker 1: Emily's biological sons and he's being charged for it right
24:41
Speaker 1: now in Sedgwick County Court. Fancy this is Ashley. Could
24:45
Speaker 1: I jump in because there's something really important I think
24:48
Speaker 1: that all listeners need to understand about one of the
24:50
Speaker 1: statements just made when when she stated that Emily took
24:55
Speaker 1: him to the doctor a dressed him. Well, here's the
24:57
Speaker 1: problem in our society as a whole. People tend to
25:00
Speaker 1: leave that. That means those people that dressed their children well,
25:03
Speaker 1: take him to the doctor, take care of them, take
25:05
Speaker 1: them out to dinner, feed them, don't abuse or neglect
25:07
Speaker 1: their children, And that's absolutely false statistically, and I do
25:11
Speaker 1: not want people to continue to have a perception and
25:13
Speaker 1: belief that just because a parent or a person who's
25:17
Speaker 1: a caretaker takes the child to the doctor and dresses
25:20
Speaker 1: him well necessarily means they're not capable of abuse or neglect,
25:23
Speaker 1: because it does not mean that. I want to follow
25:26
Speaker 1: up as she Willcott with child crime watch dot Com
25:29
Speaker 1: and juvenile Judge Lee Egan with me, investigative reporter with
25:34
Speaker 1: Crime online dot Com. Lee, when Lucas's aunt was so
25:41
Speaker 1: upset about Lucas being covered in bruises? Didn't those occur
25:46
Speaker 1: while the dad, who I think worked with the oil
25:48
Speaker 1: companies was gone? Yes, they did. I believe what happened
25:53
Speaker 1: was he was back in town and he was with
25:56
Speaker 1: Emily when they were visiting the aunt and she noticed
25:59
Speaker 1: the this then. But supposedly they happened when he was working.
26:04
Speaker 1: That's why I'm hearing, but there's no confirmation of that.
26:07
Speaker 1: I want to go back to emily glasses friends, Jamie
26:11
Speaker 1: Howell and Shelley Eberhart here with us. They say there's
26:15
Speaker 1: no way the gunshot wound on Emily Glass was self inflicted,
26:21
Speaker 1: that she would never have shot herself. Question to you, guys,
26:27
Speaker 1: I'm having a hard time understanding. Um. Emily Glass, as
26:31
Speaker 1: you say, and I think you're correct, had Lucas all
26:35
Speaker 1: the time, as you say, all the time, she did.
26:38
Speaker 1: So if she has him all the time, she's not
26:42
Speaker 1: responsible for all those bruises if she's got him all
26:46
Speaker 1: the time. And did she report the abuse? Did she
26:50
Speaker 1: take him to the doctor about the abuse? She apparently
26:53
Speaker 1: kept her own child in the home with the father
26:57
Speaker 1: even after she sees him according to her beating the child.
27:01
Speaker 1: I mean, if my husband beat my children one time,
27:07
Speaker 1: it would be a miracle if he walked out of
27:10
Speaker 1: this house a lot. But I tell you another thing,
27:12
Speaker 1: he would never have a second chance. There would never
27:15
Speaker 1: be another chance to beat the children. That would not happen.
27:18
Speaker 1: So you're telling me that she brought a homeless man
27:23
Speaker 1: into the home, that she then takes a shower and
27:27
Speaker 1: a nap and leaves the children with a homeless man,
27:31
Speaker 1: wakes up, the boy is gone, does not tell police
27:37
Speaker 1: about the homeless man, lets a search go on for
27:40
Speaker 1: all this time, leads the investigator to the body. But
27:44
Speaker 1: you don't think she had anything to do with his death. No,
27:47
Speaker 1: I do not. What do you think happened to him? Uh?
27:52
Speaker 1: I don't even know how to really go into sustaining
27:55
Speaker 1: what I think happened to him, because I think that
28:01
Speaker 1: there's a lot more people involved in this than just
28:04
Speaker 1: two or three people involved in the little boy's death.
28:08
Speaker 1: How could that be? She was the only one that
28:10
Speaker 1: we know of in the home that she wasn't That's
28:13
Speaker 1: that's what That's what you're okay, So let's just led
28:17
Speaker 1: to believe by Jonathan or whatever. But Jonathan, them all
28:21
Speaker 1: knew this homeless man. They all knew this homeless sin.
28:26
Speaker 1: They've all set up, They've all set up for him,
28:30
Speaker 1: Alan Duke, we have combed over the police reports and
28:34
Speaker 1: the investigative reports, so we've been able to get is
28:38
Speaker 1: there any indication that police believe anyone was in the
28:41
Speaker 1: home other than Emily Glass when Lucas disappears. I'm not
28:44
Speaker 1: aware of any and maybe Lee Egan can verify that.
28:49
Speaker 1: You are you have been on the scene at the jailhouse.
28:52
Speaker 1: What are you learning was there the police believe somebody
28:55
Speaker 1: was in the home other than Emily Glass, who has
28:59
Speaker 1: now been shot at the time Lucas goes missing. No,
29:03
Speaker 1: they do not, at least from what they're telling us.
29:05
Speaker 1: The only person of interest from what law enforcement has said,
29:08
Speaker 1: is Emily Glass. But according to Shamie Howell and Shelley Eberhart,
29:13
Speaker 1: there was a homeless guy in the home that she
29:18
Speaker 1: Emily felt so comfortable with that she went to sleep
29:22
Speaker 1: for three hours, leaving the children with a homeless guy. Well,
29:26
Speaker 1: the homeless man was in the house. The problem is,
29:29
Speaker 1: we're not sure what day he was in the house.
29:31
Speaker 1: He did he spoke to detectives, We're not sure what
29:34
Speaker 1: he said because they're not telling us, and shortly after
29:37
Speaker 1: he was killed, So we're not sure when or why
29:40
Speaker 1: he was in the home. Is there any indication he
29:43
Speaker 1: was there when Luce Lucas went missing? Do you think
29:47
Speaker 1: it had anything to do with Emily Glass's use of
29:51
Speaker 1: metha and fhetamine? Yes? In other words, was that her
29:55
Speaker 1: dope body? Probably? The plot seemingly thickens and now the
30:00
Speaker 1: culmination of the search and discovery Lucas's body, as Emily
30:03
Speaker 1: Glass has been found shot found by Lucas's father, Jonathan Hernandez,
30:07
Speaker 1: who calls nine one one. Maybe the people that have
30:11
Speaker 1: more insight than any of us. Are Emily's friends, Shelley
30:15
Speaker 1: Eberhard and Shane Howell. Guys, thank you for being with us.
30:18
Speaker 1: You say that so many people were involved with Lucas's death,
30:25
Speaker 1: It's really hard for me to believe. And I'll tell
30:27
Speaker 1: you why. And I'm not saying I'm not wrong. People
30:31
Speaker 1: cannot keep their yapp shut when there's a conspiracy or
30:34
Speaker 1: there are several people involved in wrongdoing, somebody always blabs.
30:38
Speaker 1: It's just you know, even in Watergate with the Okay,
30:43
Speaker 1: who do you believe are the people involved? And why
30:46
Speaker 1: would they cover up the death of a little boy? Okay,
30:48
Speaker 1: I believe that um uh Jenny was in something called wick.
30:56
Speaker 1: They're in something called wick. Have you ever heard of it? Yes?
30:59
Speaker 1: I have heard of wicka the a name for witchcraft.
31:04
Speaker 1: You now think that this is part of a witchcraft plot?
31:07
Speaker 1: I sure do, Yes, I do. And I believe that's
31:11
Speaker 1: why everybody else that's telling their story is coming up dead.
31:15
Speaker 1: I have been shot at, I have been ran off
31:17
Speaker 1: the road, and that's a warning to me. That's just
31:20
Speaker 1: a warning. I have been I have Facebook messages that
31:23
Speaker 1: are warning me to back off. That's just a warning,
31:26
Speaker 1: They say, why would you believe this has anything to
31:28
Speaker 1: do with wicker because that's what they were into. Who
31:31
Speaker 1: is they, Jonathan Jamie? Jamie's got the lens on the
31:35
Speaker 1: back of her car, which is a bio. Mom, is
31:38
Speaker 1: to you sacrifice your firstborn child, your birth firstborn son? Well,
31:43
Speaker 1: you were close friends with Emily Did she try to
31:46
Speaker 1: recruit you to Wicka? Oh? No, no, no, no, I wouldn't.
31:50
Speaker 1: I'm not. I'm a very I believe in God. I
31:54
Speaker 1: don't believe in anybody else but God. But then did
32:01
Speaker 1: Emily Glass discussed Wicka with you? No, she discussed it
32:05
Speaker 1: with a friend of ours. But but you were close
32:07
Speaker 1: to her. If she was in Wicka? Whatever what? I
32:12
Speaker 1: freaked out? I don't want to hear anything about it. Okay,
32:15
Speaker 1: right now, this is what we know. Emily Glass has
32:18
Speaker 1: been shot. The father of Lucas Hernandez. Call nine one one.
32:25
Speaker 1: I'm just sorry. I'm so sorry for everyone's to fucking Hill's. Okay,
32:32
Speaker 1: don't think you can do if her hair is moving forward?
32:35
Speaker 1: And where's them? I didn't get so wrong. I didn't wrong,
32:55
Speaker 1: got honest. That is Emily Glass telling private I David
33:00
Speaker 1: Marshburn that she quote did Lucas wrong? This is as
33:05
Speaker 1: they are finding the child's dead body, and that's what
33:08
Speaker 1: we're losing sight of right now with all the discussion
33:11
Speaker 1: of a conspiracy and a homeless guy on WICKA bottom line,
33:16
Speaker 1: Emily Glass was in the home at the time the
33:20
Speaker 1: talk goes missing. Emily Glass led police, excuse me, lad
33:25
Speaker 1: a private eye to the body in an obscure location.
33:30
Speaker 1: Emily Glass in the last hours has been shot. I
33:35
Speaker 1: want to go to Joseph Scott Morgan forensics expert, Professor
33:38
Speaker 1: of forensics at Jacksonville State University, Joe Scott Right now,
33:42
Speaker 1: it's all going to Hinge on a post mortem. What
33:46
Speaker 1: will they be looking forward to determine was this a
33:49
Speaker 1: suicide or a homicide? Well, she's been shot, Nancy. They're
33:52
Speaker 1: gonna be the first thing they're gonna be looking for
33:54
Speaker 1: is evidence on the body relative to range of fire.
33:57
Speaker 1: If this was, say, for instance, a shooting at a
34:00
Speaker 1: distance that would lean or list more towards, for instance,
34:03
Speaker 1: a homicide that some money was facing her or back
34:06
Speaker 1: of her, whatever the attitude was, and fired into her
34:10
Speaker 1: one thing at a time, one thing at a time. Distance.
34:13
Speaker 1: You're right, they're gonna look to see if this if
34:16
Speaker 1: the bullet wound was at close range. If it were
34:19
Speaker 1: at close range, that could suggest suicide. Not necessarily. A
34:23
Speaker 1: perp can hold a gun to her head or her
34:25
Speaker 1: body and shoot her a close range. But if it's
34:28
Speaker 1: not at close range, i e. Further than thirty six
34:31
Speaker 1: inches away, you will not get any gunshot residue. Right
34:35
Speaker 1: But within that, uh well, I like to I like
34:37
Speaker 1: to pare it down to about twenty two inches out,
34:40
Speaker 1: and in that you're going to get some kind of disposition,
34:44
Speaker 1: that is the distribution of unburned gunpowder on the body
34:47
Speaker 1: at that distance. Now one of the things they're gonna
34:49
Speaker 1: be looking for. Slow down, slow down, got me drinking
34:53
Speaker 1: out of fire? Hydright here, I've got u. Joseph Scott Morgan,
34:56
Speaker 1: renowned forensics expert jose Scott The point, and that is,
35:01
Speaker 1: if it is close range, maybe she shot herself. Maybe
35:05
Speaker 1: somebody else shot her. If it's not close range, then
35:08
Speaker 1: somebody else definitely shot her, because you can only hold
35:12
Speaker 1: a gun x inches away from yourself and shoot yourself.
35:16
Speaker 1: So if it's beyond say two ft, somebody else shot her.
35:21
Speaker 1: How do we know if it's beyond two ft you
35:23
Speaker 1: don't have gunshot residue invisible to the naked eye. When
35:26
Speaker 1: the gun is discharged, residue comes out of the gun
35:31
Speaker 1: and sprays to about thirty six inches max. So if
35:35
Speaker 1: there's no gunshot residue on her body, then she did
35:38
Speaker 1: not shoot herself. Next, yeah, and uh, we have to
35:43
Speaker 1: think about you know, one of the things they're gonna
35:44
Speaker 1: look at obviously is her arm length. You know, how
35:46
Speaker 1: how far away is she capable of holding this? This
35:48
Speaker 1: way my experience, in my experience, the line's share of
35:53
Speaker 1: cases involving suicides are going to involve what we refer
35:56
Speaker 1: to as hard contact or press contact gunshot wounds. The
36:00
Speaker 1: most common area is going to be to the head,
36:02
Speaker 1: and that means that the weapon would be tightly pressed
36:04
Speaker 1: to the head some locational head, more than likely the
36:07
Speaker 1: temple that's generally where people do it, or in the mouth.
36:11
Speaker 1: And then okay, now to me, we're rehashing. I'll tell
36:14
Speaker 1: you why. If it's a contact when you're not only
36:17
Speaker 1: gonna have gunshot residue, you're gonna have searing, in other words,
36:21
Speaker 1: a little bit of a burn around the bullet entry,
36:26
Speaker 1: around the gun barrel itself, on the head it's hard
36:31
Speaker 1: to find, but it's easy to find if you're trained professional.
36:34
Speaker 1: Long story short, if there's burning or searing, it could
36:39
Speaker 1: be a suicide. It could still be a homicide. I'm
36:43
Speaker 1: beyond that. I'm to the next thing, Joe Scott. What
36:46
Speaker 1: I'm saying is, if the shot was beyond thirty six inches,
36:51
Speaker 1: she did not kill herself. So if there's no residue
36:54
Speaker 1: on her body, then it was not thirty six inches.
36:58
Speaker 1: I'm past the contact wound. I'm past. Now we're gonna
37:05
Speaker 1: be looking at angle, angle entry, angle exit and entry. Explain,
37:10
Speaker 1: what you're gonna be talking about is if say, for instance,
37:12
Speaker 1: a perpetrator withstanding above her or at her same level,
37:17
Speaker 1: the angle of entry what and that gives you an
37:19
Speaker 1: idea of attitude and relationship between the victim and the shooter.
37:23
Speaker 1: And so we moved beyond distance. We're talking about angle
37:26
Speaker 1: of deflection. Now, let's say, for instance, you've got somebody
37:29
Speaker 1: down on the floor, all right, and they're begging for
37:32
Speaker 1: their life. That angle is going to be completely different.
37:35
Speaker 1: If we're standing at eye level and you pull a
37:36
Speaker 1: weapon and you shoot them in the chest or the
37:38
Speaker 1: face or wherever it is that you shoot them So
37:40
Speaker 1: that's gonna give you an idea. Remember, we can't go
37:43
Speaker 1: back to the scene in question the victim. It's gonna
37:46
Speaker 1: give you an idea of the dynamic that was going
37:48
Speaker 1: on in that environment. You know, what was going on
37:51
Speaker 1: at that particular time and where were they relative to
37:54
Speaker 1: position in the in the dwelling in this particular case,
37:57
Speaker 1: if she is in the dwelling, I still don't know completely. Well,
38:01
Speaker 1: let's go to her friends joining me. Uh, Miss Howell
38:04
Speaker 1: and Miss ever Heart. What are you learning about the
38:07
Speaker 1: circumstances surrounding Emily's gunshot wound? What room was she and
38:12
Speaker 1: was she on the floor? Was she in the bedroom
38:15
Speaker 1: on the bed? What do we know? We were not
38:17
Speaker 1: told we were not allowed to get close to the house.
38:21
Speaker 1: You think the front rooms? I believe it from room.
38:24
Speaker 1: I believe there might have been some kind of struggle
38:26
Speaker 1: between the front room and maybe the back door. What's
38:30
Speaker 1: the front room? Is that a living room or a bedroom?
38:32
Speaker 1: What is it living room? But there is question is
38:36
Speaker 1: this the same home you're talking about where Lucas was
38:40
Speaker 1: last seen alive? Yes, And I do know that since
38:45
Speaker 1: Lucas has passed or have been cameras hid in the home.
38:49
Speaker 1: So I don't know if Jonathan is aware of these cameras,
38:52
Speaker 1: but I think the witch Shot police department should be
38:55
Speaker 1: made aware of them. And you know what's interesting, We
38:58
Speaker 1: were told that for about a week before Lucas was
39:02
Speaker 1: reported missing, nobody had seen him. He was absent from
39:07
Speaker 1: school on no one called. He was sick with the flu.
39:12
Speaker 1: Did you see him? Um, No, I didn't. But his
39:16
Speaker 1: aunt which I spoke to from you at all, she
39:19
Speaker 1: said he was sick with the flu and he was
39:21
Speaker 1: put on bo friends to the kept hugan. So did
39:27
Speaker 1: anybody see Lucas because the school was apparently never called,
39:33
Speaker 1: and they did not. They were trying to call Emily Glass,
39:36
Speaker 1: but she would never call back. Why Lucas had been
39:39
Speaker 1: out of school for over a week. I believe the
39:42
Speaker 1: one that did see him on the fourteenth February was
39:48
Speaker 1: his bio mom, and she picked him up for Valentine's
39:51
Speaker 1: Day and went and got him a gift and brought
39:54
Speaker 1: him back February. Yes, suppose she supposedly she brought him
40:00
Speaker 1: back the fourteen is where are you learning this? Because
40:04
Speaker 1: there is a theory that he was dead by the eleventh. No,
40:09
Speaker 1: we were told by Emily had told her grandmother and
40:12
Speaker 1: her aunt that she was going to be introled by
40:16
Speaker 1: Jonathan because she let Emily or she let Jamie know
40:20
Speaker 1: where she lives, and she was not supposed to do
40:23
Speaker 1: that because they had already moved away from one place
40:26
Speaker 1: because Jamie was badgering them. So they had moved away,
40:30
Speaker 1: and they moved into this new house. And okay, wait
40:33
Speaker 1: a minute, well hold on, let me understand what you're saying.
40:36
Speaker 1: If they had moved away to a secret location away
40:38
Speaker 1: from the bio mom, then how could the bio mom
40:40
Speaker 1: have left all those bruises on the boy. The bio didn't.
40:43
Speaker 1: Maybe the bruises on them on him, the bio dad did.
40:46
Speaker 1: The real father he was abusive with her, and he
40:50
Speaker 1: was also abusive with Emily. All Right, she advocate and
40:57
Speaker 1: she's been called that they're out called to work with
41:00
Speaker 1: them before. Lee Egan, Crime Online dot Com reporter, Late,
41:04
Speaker 1: what are you learning about the shooting? What room was
41:07
Speaker 1: she and while she clothed? What time? Anything you can
41:10
Speaker 1: tell us at this point. Nothing. I'm looking at a
41:14
Speaker 1: live feed from k w c H and it appears
41:17
Speaker 1: that Jonathan's truck is no longer at the house um
41:20
Speaker 1: from the angle I'm seeing, and I did see it
41:22
Speaker 1: there previously, and I did want to touch on something
41:25
Speaker 1: with what one of the ladies just said about the
41:27
Speaker 1: fourteenth UH. Law enforcement did speak with Jamie and she
41:31
Speaker 1: told them that the last time she saw Lucas was
41:34
Speaker 1: in December celebrating his birthday, and she had not seen
41:37
Speaker 1: him in mutts mm hmm. That's an untrue statement because
41:42
Speaker 1: just two or three weeks prior to that, she showed
41:44
Speaker 1: up the beet Dolementary and tried to physically have a
41:48
Speaker 1: fight with it with Emily. She showed up at the
41:50
Speaker 1: boys school. I think that she's correct. I think that
41:54
Speaker 1: that did happen. What either shouldn't miss Howard and Shelley
41:58
Speaker 1: Amber Harder saying, I think that confrontation did happen, but
42:02
Speaker 1: still she was not with the boy. She was not
42:04
Speaker 1: with Lucas. The bio mom had an altercation with Emily Glass,
42:10
Speaker 1: but she did not get Lucas. To my understanding, the
42:13
Speaker 1: last time, according to police, the bio mom had Lucas
42:18
Speaker 1: was back in December at his birthday. Ashley Walcott joining
42:23
Speaker 1: in Juvenile Judge found her child Crime watch dot Com.
42:27
Speaker 1: Ashley in a scenario like this, nobody's a suspect. Everybody's
42:31
Speaker 1: a suspect because there's so many high emotions. But I
42:35
Speaker 1: always go back to what we know as to who
42:38
Speaker 1: was in the home at the time the boy goes
42:40
Speaker 1: missing and who led Marshburn to the body. Absolutely so,
42:44
Speaker 1: and Nancy. One of the things I've always said in
42:46
Speaker 1: this case is she either did it, Emily, either killed
42:50
Speaker 1: this child or she knows exactly what happened to this child,
42:54
Speaker 1: and who is in the home goes directly to that point.
42:57
Speaker 1: The other thing I want to say is it's really
42:59
Speaker 1: splitting hairs to say she didn't kill this child, but
43:02
Speaker 1: she wasn't comfortable, she was afraid, she didn't tell anybody
43:05
Speaker 1: what happened or who was involved. That's the same thing.
43:09
Speaker 1: If you know that a child is a victim of abuse, neglect, murder,
43:14
Speaker 1: and you choose not to report it and tell everything
43:19
Speaker 1: that happened and the truth around what happened, it's just
43:22
Speaker 1: as bad as if you killed the child yourself. And
43:24
Speaker 1: in this particular case, I think that's what's happened. Well,
43:28
Speaker 1: what the friends are doing here is they are struggling
43:32
Speaker 1: with the evidence, and they're struggling about what happened to
43:35
Speaker 1: Emily Glass. They're her friends. They are defending her because
43:42
Speaker 1: they know her in a way that we don't, and
43:45
Speaker 1: it's very hard to believe for them. I'm sure that
43:48
Speaker 1: she may have had something to do with Lucas's death
43:51
Speaker 1: or disappearance, And for all I know, they have evidence
43:54
Speaker 1: that I don't have. So I'm very intrigued about what
43:57
Speaker 1: they're say. Agree with you, and I think there's a
43:58
Speaker 1: lot of evidence to be there that needs to be
44:01
Speaker 1: shared with law enforcement and Price so it can be investigated.
44:04
Speaker 1: But I'm still gonna stand by what we all have
44:06
Speaker 1: to keep in mind. It's all good evidence, but anything
44:10
Speaker 1: that Emily has told them happened without some collaboration. Outside
44:16
Speaker 1: of that, hold on just one moment. I hear that
44:19
Speaker 1: Susan Constantine, psychologist and author, wants in Susan, you have
44:25
Speaker 1: sifted through everything Emily Glass has said, what are your thoughts? Yeah?
44:30
Speaker 1: You know. The last statement is probably the most telling,
44:33
Speaker 1: where she says I did Lucas so wrong. I did
44:37
Speaker 1: him wrong. Will you notice that her voice intensifies and
44:41
Speaker 1: the word I she's taking ownership. There was not we
44:44
Speaker 1: or us, So it shows one person did is the
44:47
Speaker 1: word of the act I did Lucas was the victim
44:53
Speaker 1: and the words so it's like saying I am so
44:56
Speaker 1: happy to see you or I'm so upset. So is
45:00
Speaker 1: a word that is something that happens over time. And
45:03
Speaker 1: then she uses the word wrong. Wrong is connected to
45:06
Speaker 1: the abuse. Something happened that created that. So when we
45:10
Speaker 1: look at it as I did Lucas so wrong, it
45:13
Speaker 1: is she takes ownership of the act. The victim is Lucas.
45:16
Speaker 1: She did it over time, and the act was abused.
45:19
Speaker 1: And then she says right after that, I feel so
45:21
Speaker 1: sorry for him. When she says Phil, she's talking about
45:24
Speaker 1: in present tense. Her voice and her words show remorse,
45:28
Speaker 1: so you can sense that she's feeling remorseful at this
45:30
Speaker 1: point in time. But then she says, Glass said she
45:33
Speaker 1: put him through hell or through hell, meaning a long
45:37
Speaker 1: duration of abuse. And then she gives you an affirmation
45:40
Speaker 1: this is the God's honest truth. Well, I want to
45:44
Speaker 1: just talk common sense for one moment. Common sense, Okay,
45:48
Speaker 1: help me out with this. Anybody that wants in alan,
45:52
Speaker 1: if a child you and are both parents, if a
45:55
Speaker 1: child is missing and you don't know where they are
46:00
Speaker 1: and you don't know what's happened to them, and you
46:03
Speaker 1: had some stranger in your home, and wouldn't the first
46:07
Speaker 1: thing you say, I had that piece of crap, Alan
46:11
Speaker 1: Duke in my home, and now my baby's missing. Go
46:15
Speaker 1: find Alan Duke. We gotta find Lucas, he may know.
46:20
Speaker 1: Instead of sitting on your thumb, Alan, I mean, if
46:25
Speaker 1: you don't know that Lucas is dead unless you know
46:29
Speaker 1: where he is, why wouldn't you track the homeless guy
46:33
Speaker 1: down yourself and go lead me to Lucas you were
46:37
Speaker 1: with my boy? Where is he? Or I will kill you?
46:42
Speaker 1: I mean, that never happened, and I can't imagine any
46:45
Speaker 1: other response. I can't imagine just being quiet when you
46:49
Speaker 1: know that child is under a bridge. So explained to me.
46:52
Speaker 1: Back to Miss Eberhart and Miss Howell. See, I think
46:57
Speaker 1: Emily Glass is the key to what happened to Lucas.
47:01
Speaker 1: You disagree. You may know more than me, But why
47:04
Speaker 1: would she she didn't already know Lucas was dead. Why
47:08
Speaker 1: wouldn't she have police out that night? You said she
47:11
Speaker 1: told her husband not police. Why weren't they looking for
47:14
Speaker 1: him to find out where Lucas was? Could have saved
47:16
Speaker 1: his life and the police for contact at first, then
47:19
Speaker 1: her husband came in from the Mexico and then I
47:23
Speaker 1: know that. But you said she only told her husband
47:26
Speaker 1: about an homeless guy in the home that night. Well,
47:30
Speaker 1: I don't really know how the police found out, because
47:32
Speaker 1: they did find out because they could be them in
47:34
Speaker 1: into custody, So somehow they did know. Was it was
47:39
Speaker 1: the lead that they got or what they what they
47:41
Speaker 1: did get, they did get to leave. Why didn't she
47:45
Speaker 1: tell police that? Not when she reported him missing around
47:49
Speaker 1: six o'clock. I told you, I think that she was fighting.
47:53
Speaker 1: She had bruises on her fingers, on her knuckles, two
47:57
Speaker 1: black eyes. I do believe there was a going at home.
48:01
Speaker 1: Lucas was injured. She was scaring for Mia, sparing for herself.
48:06
Speaker 1: She had already seen what whoever these people were did
48:09
Speaker 1: to her. She just wanted to wait from so instead
48:13
Speaker 1: of trying to save Lucas's life, I think she never
48:16
Speaker 1: reported any of this. Okay, that's a theory, but this
48:19
Speaker 1: is what I know right now. Emily Glass has been
48:22
Speaker 1: shot and we're waiting to find out for the medical
48:25
Speaker 1: examiner they cause and manner of death. Nancy Grace Crime
48:29
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