Latest / Something Extra / Finding Purpose Beyond the Bottom Line w/ Jeff Thomas

Transcript

Finding Purpose Beyond the Bottom Line w/ Jeff Thomas · Something Extra

• 0:00
  Jeff Thomas: And that's what I've found is, and I know you feel the same way,
• 0:03
  Jeff Thomas: more satisfying is when we live outside ourselves because that those are the two
• 0:07
  Jeff Thomas: big commands.
• 0:07
  Jeff Thomas: Right?
• 0:07
  Jeff Thomas: Love God and love people.
• 0:09
  Jeff Thomas: Alright.
• 0:09
  Jeff Thomas: Well, if we're gonna love people, what kind of people?
• 0:12
  Jeff Thomas: And where are they?
• 0:13
  Jeff Thomas: And what what's the cause we're going for?
• 0:15
  Jeff Thomas: So we gotta live outside ourselves.
• 0:18
  Jeff Thomas: That's where the juice comes from.
• 0:19
  Jeff Thomas: It's not from chasing the almighty dollar or or anything else.
• 0:23
  Jeff Thomas: That's that's the only place I I I've been able to find it.
• 0:29
  Lisa Nichols: It takes something a little more to lead with impact.
• 0:32
  Lisa Nichols: I'm Lisa Nichols, author of Something Extra, and this podcast
• 0:37
  Lisa Nichols: was inspired by our daughter, Ali, whose additional chromosome has shaped
• 0:41
  Lisa Nichols: how I see people in leadership.
• 0:44
  Lisa Nichols: Each episode features conversations with inspiring leaders from around the world
• 0:48
  Lisa Nichols: about what truly defines how they lead and serve others.
• 0:52
  Lisa Nichols: If you enjoyed today's conversation, please consider leaving a five star
• 0:57
  Lisa Nichols: review.
• 0:57
  Lisa Nichols: It helps more people discover the show.
• 1:00
  Lisa Nichols: And if you'd like to go deeper, my book Something Extra is available on
• 1:04
  Lisa Nichols: Amazon and through other major book retailers.
• 1:09
  Lisa Nichols: I'm delighted to have Jeff Thomas on the show today.
• 1:11
  Lisa Nichols: Jeff is an author, a podcast host, and the founder and CEO
• 1:15
  Lisa Nichols: of Arkos Global Advisors.
• 1:18
  Lisa Nichols: Well, Jeff Thomas, thank you so much for making the time today to be
• 1:22
  Lisa Nichols: on the Something Extra podcast.
• 1:23
  Lisa Nichols: I'm so delighted that we could make this work.
• 1:26
  Jeff Thomas: My pleasure.
• 1:26
  Jeff Thomas: Great to be with you.
• 1:28
  Lisa Nichols: It is great to be with you too.
• 1:30
  Lisa Nichols: And you're in Houston.
• 1:31
  Lisa Nichols: I'm in Saint Louis.
• 1:32
  Lisa Nichols: Thank goodness for technology.
• 1:33
  Lisa Nichols: Right?
• 1:33
  Lisa Nichols: Because
• 1:34
  Jeff Thomas: Yep.
• 1:34
  Lisa Nichols: May not happen otherwise.
• 1:36
  Lisa Nichols: But I have to give a shout out, our mutual friend, Becca Spradlin.
• 1:41
  Lisa Nichols: And I think maybe you've used, her company a little bit with what we're
• 1:45
  Lisa Nichols: doing.
• 1:46
  Lisa Nichols: Becca is the author of Lead on Mission, the founder of,
• 1:50
  Lisa Nichols: On Mission Advisors.
• 1:52
  Lisa Nichols: So thank you, Becca, because Jeff and I may not have met one another
• 1:56
  Lisa Nichols: if you hadn't have introduced us, but let's let's go back real quick.
• 2:00
  Lisa Nichols: I think you may have told me this the first time we met, but
• 2:03
  Lisa Nichols: I think I had forgotten it.
• 2:05
  Lisa Nichols: I know you grew up in Saint Louis.
• 2:07
  Lisa Nichols: You grew up in Kirkwood, I think.
• 2:09
  Jeff Thomas: That's true.
• 2:10
  Jeff Thomas: That's true.
• 2:10
  Jeff Thomas: Went to Kirkwood High School, and,
• 2:14
  Jeff Thomas: yeah.
• 2:14
  Jeff Thomas: So that's, that that's where I grew up.
• 2:16
  Jeff Thomas: My, sister still lives in Saint Louis, and, she's actually,
• 2:20
  Jeff Thomas: in St.
• 2:21
  Jeff Thomas: Louis right now coming to visit us, this weekend.
• 2:24
  Jeff Thomas: And so we try to, visit each other.
• 2:26
  Jeff Thomas: So I love St.
• 2:27
  Jeff Thomas: Louis.
• 2:28
  Jeff Thomas: Still a Cardinals fan.
• 2:30
  Jeff Thomas: And,
• 2:32
  Jeff Thomas: so, you know, one once a Cardinals fan, always a Cardinals fan.
• 2:35
  Lisa Nichols: The Cardinals fan.
• 2:36
  Lisa Nichols: Right?
• 2:37
  Lisa Nichols: Oil.
• 2:37
  Jeff Thomas: So, you know, even after thirty five years in Houston, I I like the
• 2:40
  Jeff Thomas: Astros, but it's not it's better now that they're in different divisions.
• 2:43
  Jeff Thomas: You know?
• 2:43
  Lisa Nichols: Right.
• 2:44
  Lisa Nichols: Right.
• 2:44
  Lisa Nichols: Right.
• 2:45
  Lisa Nichols: You don't feel like you're betraying one.
• 2:47
  Lisa Nichols: Right?
• 2:48
  Lisa Nichols: Well, we're from Kentucky originally, Jeff.
• 2:50
  Lisa Nichols: And,
• 2:52
  Lisa Nichols: when we moved to St.
• 2:53
  Lisa Nichols: Louis, we just couldn't believe how passionate
• 2:57
  Jeff Thomas: You're right.
• 2:57
  Lisa Nichols: Our old nation I mean, it's just like thing.
• 3:00
  Lisa Nichols: People don't really understand until you're here.
• 3:02
  Lisa Nichols: I mean, people are very, very passionate about their cardinals.
• 3:05
  Jeff Thomas: My my mother was a teacher, and she knew nothing about sports, but she
• 3:09
  Jeff Thomas: had every red, like, cardinals dangling earrings.
• 3:13
  Jeff Thomas: Every she would talk about who pitched last night.
• 3:15
  Jeff Thomas: Like, I grew up thinking that was normal.
• 3:17
  Lisa Nichols: Right.
• 3:18
  Jeff Thomas: Anywhere else, and you're like, wait.
• 3:19
  Jeff Thomas: It's like talking about the weather and the cardinals.
• 3:21
  Jeff Thomas: That's what you do in Saint Louis.
• 3:23
  Lisa Nichols: Exactly.
• 3:23
  Lisa Nichols: Well, you know what my parents talked about in Kentucky?
• 3:26
  Lisa Nichols: The Kentucky Wildcats.
• 3:28
  Jeff Thomas: Yep.
• 3:28
  Jeff Thomas: That's same idea.
• 3:29
  Lisa Nichols: I grew up in that.
• 3:31
  Lisa Nichols: There was some passion around that as well.
• 3:35
  Lisa Nichols: And, but I know that you grew up in a
• 3:39
  Lisa Nichols: mission minded family, Jeff.
• 3:41
  Lisa Nichols: In fact, your dad was a businessman.
• 3:44
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 3:44
  Lisa Nichols: And that's a funny story.
• 3:46
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 3:46
  Lisa Nichols: You know, turned, pastor.
• 3:49
  Lisa Nichols: But I'd love for you to tell us just a little bit more about
• 3:52
  Lisa Nichols: your parents because here's what I love.
• 3:54
  Lisa Nichols: You said that they were the earliest set of shoulders that you stood
• 3:58
  Lisa Nichols: on, and they were huge influences in your life.
• 4:03
  Jeff Thomas: Yeah.
• 4:03
  Jeff Thomas: My parents,
• 4:05
  Jeff Thomas: they they both grew up in a rural Pennsylvania, in the same little town,
• 4:09
  Jeff Thomas: but didn't actually know each other.
• 4:10
  Jeff Thomas: They're enough years apart, that they got set up on a a blind date,
• 4:14
  Jeff Thomas: I think, when they were in college back home.
• 4:17
  Jeff Thomas: And, but I think that has something to do with it just
• 4:21
  Jeff Thomas: kinda from, humble beginnings.
• 4:23
  Jeff Thomas: But,
• 4:26
  Jeff Thomas: my dad, his father died when he was about eight years old,
• 4:30
  Jeff Thomas: in a kind of an oil field as a result of an oil field
• 4:32
  Jeff Thomas: accident.
• 4:34
  Jeff Thomas: And, he had three older brothers, and, his mother was a very faithful
• 4:38
  Jeff Thomas: woman, my grandmother, Thomas.
• 4:40
  Jeff Thomas: And she had a teaching certificate, so she went to work, teaching
• 4:45
  Jeff Thomas: in a rural little schoolhouse there in Pennsylvania.
• 4:49
  Jeff Thomas: And, all three of my dad's older brothers all went off to the military
• 4:53
  Jeff Thomas: just to kinda have some opportunity
• 4:55
  Lisa Nichols: Mhmm.
• 4:55
  Jeff Thomas: Outside that small community.
• 4:57
  Jeff Thomas: And my dad, by the grace of God, got a full
• 5:02
  Jeff Thomas: scholarship to the University of Cincinnati in a kind of a work study engineering
• 5:06
  Jeff Thomas: program.
• 5:06
  Jeff Thomas: So he he was a mechanical engineer and then went to Purdue and got
• 5:10
  Jeff Thomas: kind of the what was then kind of the MBA for engineers and,
• 5:14
  Jeff Thomas: started working as a mechanical engineer for International Harvester in,
• 5:18
  Jeff Thomas: Indiana.
• 5:19
  Jeff Thomas: And when he was twenty nine,
• 5:22
  Jeff Thomas: the way I tell the story is that, well, he he tells it this
• 5:26
  Jeff Thomas: way, but I have a theory about it.
• 5:27
  Jeff Thomas: Anyway, the pastor of the church they were going to there in Indiana,
• 5:32
  Jeff Thomas: asked my father if, he'd ever considered going to seminary.
• 5:35
  Jeff Thomas: And I just figured he asked every loyal twenty something member.
• 5:40
  Jeff Thomas: Very funny.
• 5:40
  Jeff Thomas: Yes.
• 5:41
  Jeff Thomas: That's how I sort of imagined it, not necessarily true.
• 5:44
  Jeff Thomas: But, anyway, my dad did say yes.
• 5:46
  Jeff Thomas: He had considered it.
• 5:48
  Jeff Thomas: And, long story short, he ended up, working as an engineer
• 5:52
  Jeff Thomas: in the summers and then, going to Pittsburgh Theological
• 5:56
  Jeff Thomas: Seminary, full time.
• 5:57
  Jeff Thomas: And and, he he wrote his, he ended up writing his doctoral thesis on,
• 6:03
  Jeff Thomas: how to use business principles to run the church more efficiently.
• 6:06
  Jeff Thomas: And so, he kind of came a little bit of a mister fix it
• 6:10
  Jeff Thomas: for the Presbyterian church.
• 6:11
  Jeff Thomas: And so I never I never felt called to work for the church, directly,
• 6:17
  Jeff Thomas: the local church.
• 6:18
  Jeff Thomas: But I think we're all in ministry.
• 6:20
  Jeff Thomas: And, you know, he sort of bought brought business principles to,
• 6:25
  Jeff Thomas: the church.
• 6:26
  Jeff Thomas: And, I I find myself, maybe much like you,
• 6:31
  Jeff Thomas: often bringing hopefully biblical
• 6:33
  Lisa Nichols: Biblical principles to work.
• 6:34
  Jeff Thomas: business.
• 6:34
  Jeff Thomas: And so, anyway, we're all in ministry wherever we're planted.
• 6:38
  Jeff Thomas: It doesn't really matter whether you're a vocational pastor or
• 6:42
  Jeff Thomas: running a company like you or, or me and and, or whatever
• 6:46
  Jeff Thomas: you're doing.
• 6:47
  Jeff Thomas: Big and digits.
• 6:48
  Jeff Thomas: You're still in ministry.
• 6:49
  Lisa Nichols: Absolutely.
• 6:50
  Jeff Thomas: So it's a combination of those two things.
• 6:52
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 6:53
  Lisa Nichols: I fully, fully believe that as well.
• 6:55
  Lisa Nichols: Well, let's kinda get into what you did because you did not follow your
• 6:59
  Lisa Nichols: dad's footsteps.
• 7:00
  Jeff Thomas: That's right.
• 7:00
  Lisa Nichols: You didn't become an engineer.
• 7:01
  Lisa Nichols: You didn't become a pastor.
• 7:04
  Lisa Nichols: But you you were a CPA, and I think you started at Arthur Andersen
• 7:09
  Jeff Thomas: That's right.
• 7:10
  Jeff Thomas: Yep.
• 7:10
  Lisa Nichols: Back in the day.
• 7:11
  Lisa Nichols: But then at some point, you pivoted and said, no.
• 7:14
  Lisa Nichols: I I wanna be in the financial advising space.
• 7:18
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 7:18
  Lisa Nichols: Right?
• 7:19
  Lisa Nichols: I think you had some clients, right, as a CPA that you kinda
• 7:23
  Lisa Nichols: watch and you're like, I think I might like that side of the desk
• 7:26
  Lisa Nichols: better.
• 7:28
  Lisa Nichols: And here is the thing.
• 7:29
  Lisa Nichols: I mean, Jeff was very, very successful by the world standards.
• 7:34
  Lisa Nichols: I mean, you you reached the top two percent on Wall Street,
• 7:38
  Lisa Nichols: Jeff.
• 7:39
  Lisa Nichols: Yet you said that there was a moment where success that kind of success
• 7:43
  Lisa Nichols: stopped satisfying you.
• 7:46
  Lisa Nichols: What did you when did you really first realize that something was missing?
• 7:49
  Jeff Thomas: Yeah.
• 7:51
  Jeff Thomas: One one of my favorite lines is that,
• 7:55
  Jeff Thomas: everybody knows that money can't buy happiness.
• 7:57
  Jeff Thomas: You know?
• 7:58
  Jeff Thomas: But everybody wants to find out for themselves.
• 8:01
  Jeff Thomas: And
• 8:02
  Jeff Thomas: and, it's a good line.
• 8:04
  Jeff Thomas: Me, unfortunately.
• 8:06
  Jeff Thomas: So so I I just think that,
• 8:09
  Jeff Thomas: you know, I I was always a, I loved playing tennis, and I
• 8:13
  Jeff Thomas: love specifically playing singles tennis.
• 8:17
  Lisa Nichols: Yes.
• 8:18
  Jeff Thomas: And, while that's great, for your health, I love the sport,
• 8:23
  Jeff Thomas: still.
• 8:25
  Jeff Thomas: You know, it's a it's a solitary sport.
• 8:28
  Jeff Thomas: It's a individual sport.
• 8:31
  Jeff Thomas: And, everything's a competition.
• 8:33
  Jeff Thomas: You know, everything's a bracket.
• 8:34
  Jeff Thomas: There's only one winner.
• 8:35
  Jeff Thomas: I mean, even the even the great,
• 8:39
  Jeff Thomas: professional tennis players of today, if you if you see the behind the scenes
• 8:43
  Jeff Thomas: shows on Netflix and this sort of thing, it shows how lonely they are.
• 8:46
  Jeff Thomas: I mean, they have a team of people that sort of support them.
• 8:49
  Jeff Thomas: Of course.
• 8:49
  Jeff Thomas: So they talk about the team a lot.
• 8:51
  Jeff Thomas: But at the end of the day, they're out there by themselves.
• 8:54
  Lisa Nichols: Yes.
• 8:54
  Jeff Thomas: And you really have to rely on yourself.
• 8:56
  Jeff Thomas: And I think,
• 8:58
  Jeff Thomas: I had that kind of, you know, just just give me the ball and
• 9:02
  Jeff Thomas: let me let me play, and let's see how far I can get.
• 9:05
  Jeff Thomas: And so the,
• 9:08
  Jeff Thomas: the wealth management business, I started my career at Paine Webber that got bought
• 9:11
  Jeff Thomas: by, UBS and then there for eight years and then also seventeen
• 9:16
  Jeff Thomas: years at Morgan Stanley for starting our own firm, Arkos.
• 9:18
  Jeff Thomas: And so for twenty five year I mean, those firms do a
• 9:23
  Jeff Thomas: very good job, like, almost any sales organization, if you will, at
• 9:28
  Jeff Thomas: creating competition within the Salesforce.
• 9:31
  Jeff Thomas: Right?
• 9:31
  Jeff Thomas: Like, you knew exactly where you were at every single day.
• 9:35
  Jeff Thomas: Okay?
• 9:36
  Jeff Thomas: With the class you started with, in your, office,
• 9:40
  Jeff Thomas: in your city, in your region, in your country, and globally.
• 9:44
  Jeff Thomas: I mean, you knew every day you'd click on a button.
• 9:46
  Jeff Thomas: It was literally called the scorecard button.
• 9:49
  Jeff Thomas: And you knew where you're at.
• 9:49
  Jeff Thomas: Well, that was like catnip to a singles tennis player.
• 9:53
  Jeff Thomas: I mean, it was just another bracket.
• 9:54
  Lisa Nichols: Right.
• 9:55
  Jeff Thomas: What do you gotta do to win?
• 9:57
  Jeff Thomas: And so even though, you know, I was raised in the church, I knew
• 10:01
  Jeff Thomas: those principles.
• 10:04
  Jeff Thomas: Boy, I just sort of really bought into that that competition.
• 10:07
  Jeff Thomas: And, it motivated me.
• 10:09
  Jeff Thomas: I also did think, you know, hey.
• 10:11
  Jeff Thomas: If I could get a hundred really good clients, you know, that's sort of
• 10:14
  Jeff Thomas: like my dad could know really a hundred people.
• 10:16
  Jeff Thomas: Like, I think you can sort of shepherd as a pastor.
• 10:19
  Jeff Thomas: I was, you know, a hundred Yeah.
• 10:20
  Jeff Thomas: Treat people well.
• 10:21
  Jeff Thomas: I'll do a
• 10:22
  Lisa Nichols: And you did do that.
• 10:23
  Jeff Thomas: Yeah.
• 10:24
  Lisa Nichols: And you considered them your flock.
• 10:26
  Jeff Thomas: Exactly.
• 10:26
  Jeff Thomas: So you you can take care of them.
• 10:28
  Jeff Thomas: Also, I'll I'll treat them better than they would across the street, and we'll
• 10:31
  Jeff Thomas: do a great job for them.
• 10:33
  Jeff Thomas: But I also still have that motor of of competition.
• 10:36
  Jeff Thomas: And so, really built a team.
• 10:40
  Jeff Thomas: I got kinda blessed that business pretty quickly.
• 10:42
  Jeff Thomas: So we built a team pretty quickly.
• 10:43
  Jeff Thomas: And even after about five years, I was in my, about thirty one
• 10:47
  Jeff Thomas: years old, and there's a bit of competition.
• 10:50
  Jeff Thomas: Well, that's probably like most maybe salespeople in different
• 10:54
  Jeff Thomas: industries.
• 10:56
  Jeff Thomas: Within the industry, one firm you know, there's a lot of recruiting from one
• 10:59
  Jeff Thomas: firm to the next, and,
• 11:02
  Jeff Thomas: they're recruiting wars, and they'll sort of pay you to walk across the street
• 11:05
  Jeff Thomas: and do the same business there.
• 11:07
  Jeff Thomas: So Morgan Stanley came calling, and they they wrote me a big seven
• 11:11
  Jeff Thomas: figure check to walk across the street and and bring my clients over there.
• 11:14
  Jeff Thomas: And this is in the year two thousand when they actually had checks.
• 11:19
  Jeff Thomas: It would have been a wire today.
• 11:20
  Jeff Thomas: Right?
• 11:21
  Lisa Nichols: Right.
• 11:21
  Jeff Thomas: today then they literally handed me a check, the seven figure check, and I
• 11:24
  Jeff Thomas: remember and I remember the guy handing it to me, this regional manager, and
• 11:28
  Jeff Thomas: he said, well, hey.
• 11:28
  Jeff Thomas: What are you gonna do with this money?
• 11:30
  Jeff Thomas: You know?
• 11:31
  Jeff Thomas: And I'm thirty one, and I thought, I have no idea.
• 11:35
  Jeff Thomas: I I I sort of felt like the,
• 11:38
  Jeff Thomas: dog that caught the car.
• 11:40
  Jeff Thomas: I I really wanted you know, like, it was just symbolic to me of
• 11:43
  Jeff Thomas: success.
• 11:43
  Jeff Thomas: I didn't really have much use for it.
• 11:47
  Jeff Thomas: Of course, there's things you can do, but, you know, there's only so many
• 11:51
  Jeff Thomas: material things you could buy.
• 11:53
  Jeff Thomas: And I just thought, well, if if chasing that
• 11:57
  Jeff Thomas: dollar if I really thought that defines success for me,
• 12:02
  Jeff Thomas: I certainly have something wrong.
• 12:04
  Jeff Thomas: Like, that I know that's not right.
• 12:06
  Jeff Thomas: Mhmm.
• 12:06
  Jeff Thomas: And, and I'm like, I I think I was chasing that
• 12:10
  Jeff Thomas: that version of success.
• 12:13
  Jeff Thomas: I was holding that as more of an idol than I wanted to admit.
• 12:17
  Lisa Nichols: Right.
• 12:18
  Jeff Thomas: And I think that revealed it.
• 12:19
  Jeff Thomas: That moment revealed it to me.
• 12:21
  Jeff Thomas: Like, what is my purpose?
• 12:24
  Jeff Thomas: It's not chasing that check.
• 12:26
  Jeff Thomas: So what is it?
• 12:27
  Lisa Nichols: Yes.
• 12:28
  Jeff Thomas: I didn't really so I didn't know really how to answer that question.
• 12:31
  Jeff Thomas: So that was part of my crisis.
• 12:34
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 12:34
  Jeff Thomas: And, so that sort of led me down a a a trail of trying
• 12:38
  Jeff Thomas: to figure that out.
• 12:39
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 12:40
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 12:40
  Lisa Nichols: And I wanna get into that.
• 12:41
  Lisa Nichols: You know, I I read this where you said you you
• 12:45
  Lisa Nichols: got the golden egg,
• 12:48
  Lisa Nichols: but what you figured out was the golden egg was hollow.
• 12:51
  Jeff Thomas: Right.
• 12:52
  Lisa Nichols: And, you know, I mean, Jeff, you're not alone on that.
• 12:56
  Lisa Nichols: You know?
• 12:56
  Lisa Nichols: I mean, I feel like a a lot of people, myself included, I've gotten
• 13:00
  Lisa Nichols: off track before and what my real purpose is, and you can
• 13:04
  Lisa Nichols: be chasing those things.
• 13:05
  Lisa Nichols: But, boy, that's exhausting for one thing.
• 13:07
  Lisa Nichols: Right?
• 13:08
  Lisa Nichols: And, and it really comes up empty.
• 13:10
  Lisa Nichols: You know?
• 13:11
  Lisa Nichols: It's not fulfilling that it looks because then it's the next thing.
• 13:14
  Lisa Nichols: Right?
• 13:15
  Jeff Thomas: When does it get satisfied?
• 13:17
  Jeff Thomas: There there's always somebody ahead of you.
• 13:19
  Jeff Thomas: There's a bigger number.
• 13:20
  Jeff Thomas: Like, they they survey people, and they're like, well, who's wealthy?
• 13:23
  Jeff Thomas: Even if somebody's got a hundred million dollars, like, well, it's a person with
• 13:25
  Jeff Thomas: two hundred million.
• 13:27
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 13:27
  Jeff Thomas: There's always if you got a hundred grand, it's the person with two hundred
• 13:30
  Jeff Thomas: grand.
• 13:30
  Lisa Nichols: Right.
• 13:30
  Jeff Thomas: I mean, it never ends.
• 13:32
  Jeff Thomas: You can't it's unattainable in terms of a it's just a false
• 13:36
  Jeff Thomas: little g, god .
• 13:37
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 13:38
  Lisa Nichols: I totally agree.
• 13:39
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 13:39
  Lisa Nichols: Well, you know, this is all happening.
• 13:42
  Lisa Nichols: Right?
• 13:43
  Jeff Thomas: Right.
• 13:43
  Lisa Nichols: And then in two thousand five and and I love this, and I'd love
• 13:47
  Lisa Nichols: for you to talk about it, at the end of your book.
• 13:50
  Lisa Nichols: The okay.
• 13:51
  Lisa Nichols: So Jeff has a book, and we're gonna talk a lot about this, but
• 13:54
  Lisa Nichols: it's called Trading Up, Moving from Success to Significance on Wall
• 13:58
  Lisa Nichols: Street.
• 13:59
  Lisa Nichols: But you know what was kind of an interesting thing for me to learn
• 14:02
  Lisa Nichols: about you?
• 14:03
  Lisa Nichols: Jeff, it's always trading up, kind of what we just talked about.
• 14:06
  Lisa Nichols: There's a next.
• 14:07
  Lisa Nichols: Right?
• 14:07
  Jeff Thomas: True
• 14:08
  Lisa Nichols: You get one house and you trade up to a bigger house.
• 14:10
  Jeff Thomas: Right.
• 14:11
  Lisa Nichols: I mean, Dolly just seems like a a sweetheart.
• 14:14
  Lisa Nichols: That's your wife.
• 14:15
  Lisa Nichols: But before Dolly,
• 14:18
  Lisa Nichols: you you were trading up in women.
• 14:20
  Jeff Thomas: I mean, it it just yeah.
• 14:22
  Jeff Thomas: There there's just nothing on the earth satisfies.
• 14:24
  Jeff Thomas: You know?
• 14:24
  Jeff Thomas: You gotta have something eternal that you're chasing.
• 14:26
  Jeff Thomas: You know?
• 14:27
  Lisa Nichols: Absolutely.
• 14:28
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 14:28
  Lisa Nichols: Absolutely.
• 14:29
  Lisa Nichols: So this kinda did bring you to this crisis.
• 14:31
  Lisa Nichols: And you said, you know, really during this season, you turned back to scripture.
• 14:35
  Lisa Nichols: You kinda turned back to your roots.
• 14:37
  Lisa Nichols: Right?
• 14:38
  Lisa Nichols: You you joined Bible study fellowship, BSF.
• 14:41
  Lisa Nichols: Wonderful, very systematic way of studying the scripture.
• 14:47
  Lisa Nichols: Right?
• 14:47
  Lisa Nichols: And, yeah, I'm gonna read something here.
• 14:50
  Lisa Nichols: Let me see.
• 14:52
  Lisa Nichols: Let me get my readers on.
• 14:56
  Lisa Nichols: But, you know, you said that you started reading the bible and the rich
• 15:00
  Lisa Nichols: young ruler really bugged you.
• 15:02
  Jeff Thomas: It did.
• 15:03
  Lisa Nichols: It's this whole story about the rich young ruler and, you know, the rich young ruler.
• 15:07
  Jeff Thomas: It still kind of bugs me, to be honest.
• 15:08
  Lisa Nichols: Still kinda bugs you, to be honest.
• 15:10
  Lisa Nichols: Well, hey.
• 15:10
  Lisa Nichols: Listen.
• 15:11
  Lisa Nichols: God's okay with that.
• 15:12
  Lisa Nichols: You know?
• 15:12
  Lisa Nichols: He's not he's not afraid of our questions.
• 15:14
  Lisa Nichols: Right?
• 15:16
  Lisa Nichols: But, you know, this whole story for our listeners who don't know, you know,
• 15:19
  Lisa Nichols: this rich young ruler comes to Christ and says, Hey, what do I need
• 15:22
  Lisa Nichols: to do to get into heaven?
• 15:24
  Lisa Nichols: And Christ said, Well, you know, Jesus said, You know the commandments?
• 15:27
  Lisa Nichols: It starts Right.
• 15:28
  Lisa Nichols: And starts ticking them off.
• 15:29
  Lisa Nichols: And the guy says, well, I've done all of this.
• 15:31
  Lisa Nichols: I've done all of this since I was a kid.
• 15:33
  Lisa Nichols: Then Jesus comes back with a knockout punch and says, you still lack one
• 15:37
  Lisa Nichols: thing?
• 15:39
  Lisa Nichols: And he proceeds to tell him to give everything he owns to the poor.
• 15:43
  Jeff Thomas: Right.
• 15:44
  Lisa Nichols: Follow him and, you know, you could probably guess what the rich young ruler
• 15:47
  Lisa Nichols: did.
• 15:47
  Lisa Nichols: He turned around.
• 15:48
  Lisa Nichols: Off.
• 15:49
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 15:49
  Lisa Nichols: He turned around and went the other way.
• 15:51
  Jeff Thomas: Exactly.
• 15:52
  Lisa Nichols: You know, but you said, as I read this story again in two thousand
• 15:55
  Lisa Nichols: five, a new revelation came to me.
• 15:57
  Lisa Nichols: Jesus isn't trying to tell us that we all we need that all we
• 16:01
  Lisa Nichols: have, we need to sell everything, as I believe for so long.
• 16:04
  Lisa Nichols: He's telling us that he wants us to prioritize him above all
• 16:08
  Lisa Nichols: else.
• 16:09
  Lisa Nichols: I finally understood that in the story.
• 16:11
  Lisa Nichols: He was looking into the heart of the person he was talking to specifically
• 16:15
  Lisa Nichols: because it could have been another person, Jeff.
• 16:18
  Lisa Nichols: And that that person's heart was in a different place, and Jesus would have
• 16:22
  Lisa Nichols: said something different.
• 16:23
  Lisa Nichols: But the the the reality is it was about who are you putting
• 16:27
  Lisa Nichols: first.
• 16:28
  Lisa Nichols: Right?
• 16:28
  Jeff Thomas: Exactly.
• 16:29
  Jeff Thomas: I mean, what what if he was with the chariot maker?
• 16:32
  Jeff Thomas: And the guy's like, but sell all your chariots or or get a different
• 16:35
  Jeff Thomas: job.
• 16:35
  Jeff Thomas: He's like, but I'm great at making chariots.
• 16:37
  Lisa Nichols: Great at making chariot maker.
• 16:39
  Lisa Nichols: I make
• 16:39
  Jeff Thomas: the Rolls-Royce of chariots.
• 16:40
  Jeff Thomas: You're like, your car, your possessions,
• 16:44
  Jeff Thomas: relationships, any any of these things can be idols.
• 16:47
  Lisa Nichols: Absolutely.
• 16:48
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 16:48
  Lisa Nichols: It doesn't have to be a golden calf.
• 16:51
  Jeff Thomas: Right.
• 16:51
  Jeff Thomas: Right.
• 16:52
  Jeff Thomas: But it often is.
• 16:53
  Jeff Thomas: But it often is.
• 16:54
  Lisa Nichols: But it yes.
• 16:55
  Lisa Nichols: That's true.
• 16:56
  Lisa Nichols: That is true.
• 16:57
  Lisa Nichols: That is true.
• 16:58
  Lisa Nichols: But I love this, because in you in your book, you talk about
• 17:03
  Lisa Nichols: so you said, I asked myself, well, I'm not if I'm not in charge,
• 17:08
  Lisa Nichols: and Jesus is in charge, what does this mean for my life?
• 17:11
  Lisa Nichols: And you you you, likened it back to tennis.
• 17:14
  Lisa Nichols: And you said, you know, I've been acting as though I was a great
• 17:18
  Lisa Nichols: singles tennis player, when in fact, God was quietly playing doubles
• 17:22
  Lisa Nichols: with me, setting me up to hit easy overheads and waiting for me to
• 17:25
  Lisa Nichols: acknowledge him.
• 17:26
  Lisa Nichols: I just thought that was so beautiful, and that's really kind of where you
• 17:30
  Lisa Nichols: came to, you know?
• 17:31
  Lisa Nichols: And, kinda changed your whole
• 17:35
  Lisa Nichols: life from there, you know, and even what you're focused on today.
• 17:39
  Lisa Nichols: So let's talk about this because and tell about
• 17:43
  Lisa Nichols: Ron Blue because you said, you you described a moment
• 17:47
  Lisa Nichols: when you were with Ron Blue and you heard god say, no.
• 17:51
  Lisa Nichols: Listen.
• 17:51
  Lisa Nichols: Not in an audible voice.
• 17:52
  Lisa Nichols: I've never heard just for our listeners, I've never heard god Lisa,
• 17:56
  Lisa Nichols: this is you know?
• 17:57
  Lisa Nichols: But in your spirit.
• 17:59
  Lisa Nichols: Right?
• 17:59
  Lisa Nichols: You heard him say, I want you to scale what Ron Blue started.
• 18:04
  Lisa Nichols: Can you tell us that story a little bit?
• 18:05
  Jeff Thomas: Yeah, man.
• 18:06
  Jeff Thomas: That that was honestly, that's probably the put
• 18:10
  Jeff Thomas: me over the edge to have to write that down.
• 18:13
  Jeff Thomas: That moment was so powerful.
• 18:14
  Jeff Thomas: So I I really hope
• 18:17
  Jeff Thomas: God communicates to each of us.
• 18:20
  Jeff Thomas: I just think it's so cool individually,
• 18:23
  Jeff Thomas: uniquely,
• 18:25
  Jeff Thomas: and I think, I think it's always available, but I
• 18:29
  Jeff Thomas: think I was tuning him out.
• 18:31
  Jeff Thomas: Like, I literally wrote in the book about, like, in my twenties, like, I
• 18:33
  Jeff Thomas: would turn up the music just because I could feel his prep.
• 18:36
  Jeff Thomas: I I wanted to do things my way, and I didn't want I was
• 18:40
  Jeff Thomas: afraid he was gonna send me to Africa or something.
• 18:43
  Jeff Thomas: That's what I that's part of the rich young ruler.
• 18:45
  Jeff Thomas: I didn't wanna go.
• 18:47
  Jeff Thomas: Okay?
• 18:47
  Jeff Thomas: And but the truth is he's not he will give you an assignment different
• 18:51
  Jeff Thomas: from what you might think generally, but it's also gonna be way more
• 18:55
  Jeff Thomas: awesome than anything you could come up with.
• 18:58
  Jeff Thomas: Joyous.
• 18:59
  Jeff Thomas: Doesn't mean money.
• 18:59
  Jeff Thomas: And, that like, material success, but it but it does mean joy and
• 19:04
  Jeff Thomas: intimacy with him.
• 19:04
  Jeff Thomas: And so,
• 19:06
  Jeff Thomas: like, the way I tell the story of of that moment kinda leading up
• 19:09
  Jeff Thomas: to it.
• 19:10
  Jeff Thomas: Like, my twenties, I was just I was just kinda putting my head down,
• 19:13
  Jeff Thomas: trying to do things my way and asking God to bless my plans, which
• 19:17
  Jeff Thomas: is comical.
• 19:18
  Jeff Thomas: Yeah.
• 19:19
  Jeff Thomas: As though as though I was in charge.
• 19:21
  Jeff Thomas: I think, you know, he's in charge whether we acknowledge it or not.
• 19:23
  Jeff Thomas: Okay.
• 19:24
  Jeff Thomas: In my thirties, I basically repented of that, started doing real bible study
• 19:28
  Jeff Thomas: for myself to really try to understand the word, not trade on maybe my
• 19:32
  Jeff Thomas: parents' knowledge or just a Sunday school version of,
• 19:36
  Jeff Thomas: of knowledge, but kinda get into the word.
• 19:38
  Jeff Thomas: And so I started really feeling like I understood the word better, and
• 19:42
  Jeff Thomas: I really worked very hard to put him on the throne of my life.
• 19:46
  Jeff Thomas: Right?
• 19:46
  Jeff Thomas: It's still a daily struggle, but I But but but trying to get there.
• 19:50
  Jeff Thomas: And so sort of at forty, that's when this moment happened with
• 19:54
  Jeff Thomas: with Ron who is an amazing mentor of mine.
• 19:56
  Jeff Thomas: He had asked me to be a coach for this, kingdom advisor coaching
• 20:00
  Jeff Thomas: programs, a nonprofit that he started that, helps financial advisors implement
• 20:04
  Jeff Thomas: biblical wisdom into their practice.
• 20:06
  Jeff Thomas: Well, anyway, it was like a once a quarter thing in Atlanta for three
• 20:09
  Jeff Thomas: years.
• 20:09
  Jeff Thomas: And so, you know, in the late two thousands, I,
• 20:13
  Jeff Thomas: I said, hey, man.
• 20:14
  Jeff Thomas: I'll do it, but will you disciple me, and then we'll go into that
• 20:17
  Jeff Thomas: coaching session.
• 20:18
  Jeff Thomas: And so I would fly into Atlanta early, and we'd have these sessions.
• 20:21
  Jeff Thomas: And it was like after three years of this and, you know, you you
• 20:24
  Jeff Thomas: spend a lot of time with anybody.
• 20:26
  Jeff Thomas: My my folks here at our company, I'm sure yours are the same way.
• 20:29
  Jeff Thomas: They're like, oh, yeah.
• 20:30
  Jeff Thomas: We've heard that story from Lisa before.
• 20:32
  Jeff Thomas: Like, you know
• 20:32
  Lisa Nichols: Many times.
• 20:33
  Jeff Thomas: You tend to repeat, the same stories, but they're important, I think, for vision
• 20:37
  Jeff Thomas: and these sort of things.
• 20:38
  Jeff Thomas: Anyway, one of the stories that, Ron always tells,
• 20:43
  Jeff Thomas: is, that he's really a visionary, not an operator necessarily.
• 20:48
  Jeff Thomas: And I just thought there's just this amazing guy who,
• 20:52
  Jeff Thomas: started a wealth management firm,
• 20:55
  Jeff Thomas: that has biblical knowledge behind it, but somebody needed to really scale
• 21:00
  Jeff Thomas: that idea.
• 21:00
  Jeff Thomas: And I just felt God said, well, I want you to do that.
• 21:04
  Jeff Thomas: And that that's a very general idea.
• 21:07
  Jeff Thomas: He didn't say start a firm.
• 21:09
  Jeff Thomas: He didn't you know?
• 21:10
  Jeff Thomas: It it was just and then I so it was just a it was
• 21:12
  Jeff Thomas: like an assignment.
• 21:13
  Jeff Thomas: When I when I sort of heard him say that, I I did actually
• 21:17
  Jeff Thomas: think it was audible, and I I was like, Ron, did you hear that?
• 21:20
  Jeff Thomas: And he's like, no.
• 21:20
  Jeff Thomas: So I was like, okay.
• 21:22
  Jeff Thomas: Well, okay.
• 21:22
  Jeff Thomas: It wasn't audible, but I heard it.
• 21:24
  Jeff Thomas: Like Right.
• 21:24
  Jeff Thomas: Okay.
• 21:25
  Jeff Thomas: And, and I don't even know the theology of all that.
• 21:28
  Jeff Thomas: I don't need to know.
• 21:29
  Jeff Thomas: I'm like the blind guy that I heard it, and I'm trading on it
• 21:33
  Jeff Thomas: for the rest of my life until I get another assignment.
• 21:35
  Lisa Nichols: Yes.
• 21:37
  Jeff Thomas: So you know?
• 21:37
  Jeff Thomas: And and then I was like, yeah.
• 21:39
  Jeff Thomas: But I'm not some serial entrepreneur.
• 21:40
  Jeff Thomas: I said I said it would felt like a loving assignment, custom made loving
• 21:44
  Jeff Thomas: assignment.
• 21:45
  Jeff Thomas: So I love that part.
• 21:46
  Jeff Thomas: I felt really intimate. B ut then I had sort of had shot back with
• 21:50
  Jeff Thomas: this sort of sort of mental conversation with God where I was like, okay.
• 21:53
  Jeff Thomas: But I I I'm not I'm not a serial entrepreneur.
• 21:56
  Jeff Thomas: I I I don't know how to just start a business to do that.
• 21:58
  Jeff Thomas: I don't know how to do it.
• 21:59
  Jeff Thomas: And he goes, well, like a like a sweet grandfather.
• 22:02
  Jeff Thomas: I've got three grandkids now.
• 22:03
  Jeff Thomas: You know?
• 22:04
  Jeff Thomas: Like, chuckled I I felt like he was chuckling.
• 22:06
  Jeff Thomas: He's like, I know you don't know how to do it.
• 22:07
  Jeff Thomas: He go, I'll do it.
• 22:08
  Jeff Thomas: You wake up and take instructions and give me the the glory.
• 22:11
  Jeff Thomas: And I was like, okay.
• 22:12
  Jeff Thomas: So I was like, amazing idea.
• 22:15
  Jeff Thomas: I have no clue.
• 22:16
  Jeff Thomas: Oh, good.
• 22:17
  Jeff Thomas: You'll do it.
• 22:18
  Jeff Thomas: Yeah.
• 22:18
  Jeff Thomas: So I was like, no.
• 22:20
  Jeff Thomas: Let's do that trade.
• 22:21
  Jeff Thomas: So, anyway, at the time, I was at Morgan Stanley, and so we sort
• 22:25
  Jeff Thomas: of, you know, put ourselves into that, and maybe we can talk about that
• 22:28
  Jeff Thomas: path from there on.
• 22:29
  Jeff Thomas: But that was, I I just think that's available for everybody.
• 22:32
  Jeff Thomas: That's what I'd like people to hear.
• 22:34
  Jeff Thomas: That is available for everybody.
• 22:35
  Jeff Thomas: It's just I was drowning out my antenna in my twenties,
• 22:39
  Jeff Thomas: and then I started kinda working on tuning it in, and I I have
• 22:42
  Jeff Thomas: to tune it every day or or or the noise the way the noise
• 22:46
  Jeff Thomas: gets distracting.
• 22:48
  Lisa Nichols: Right.
• 22:48
  Jeff Thomas: But if you if you're willing to tune in, he will give you a
• 22:52
  Jeff Thomas: cool assignment that that well, it might be scary by human standards, but it's
• 22:56
  Jeff Thomas: gonna be amazing if you lean into it.
• 22:58
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 22:58
  Lisa Nichols: More than we could hope or imagine.
• 23:00
  Lisa Nichols: I understand.
• 23:01
  Lisa Nichols: More than we can hope or imagine, Jeff.
• 23:03
  Lisa Nichols: Well, that's a great stopping point.
• 23:04
  Lisa Nichols: We're gonna take a quick break, and we'll be right back with Jeff Thomas
• 23:08
  Lisa Nichols: on the Something Extra podcast.
• 23:10
  AD: Hey there.
• 23:10
  AD: In a challenging business climate like this, savvy leaders look to technology to
• 23:14
  AD: find an edge.
• 23:15
  AD: This can mean the difference between staying ahead of the curve or playing catch
• 23:19
  AD: up.
• 23:19
  AD: It's time to collaborate with the highly skilled experts at Technology Partners.
• 23:23
  AD: Our team of technologists draws upon decades of experience for your project, with
• 23:27
  AD: each bringing a passion for solving problems and a track record of success.
• 23:31
  AD: How can we help you overcome your biggest technology challenges?
• 23:35
  AD: Visit technology partners dot net to book a free consultation with one of our
• 23:38
  AD: leaders.
• 23:40
  Lisa Nichols: Welcome back, everyone, to the Something Extra podcast with Jeff Thomas.
• 23:44
  Lisa Nichols: So, Jeff, you kinda left us there.
• 23:48
  Lisa Nichols: What happened?
• 23:48
  Lisa Nichols: You were at Morgan Stanley, and you felt this call.
• 23:52
  Lisa Nichols: God, you need to scale what Ron, Blue Yeah.
• 23:55
  Lisa Nichols: Have done.
• 23:57
  Lisa Nichols: Twenty seventeen, You left this billion dollar book of
• 24:01
  Lisa Nichols: business, which had to be a little bit scary.
• 24:03
  Lisa Nichols: But then, you know, you were trusting you were trusting God on it, and
• 24:06
  Lisa Nichols: you founded Arkos Global Advisors.
• 24:09
  Lisa Nichols: Tell us about that story.
• 24:11
  Jeff Thomas: Well,
• 24:13
  Jeff Thomas: you know, we call it progressive revelation.
• 24:15
  Jeff Thomas: And so so when I when I got that sort of kingdom assignment, to
• 24:18
  Jeff Thomas: scale something, to honor God in this business,
• 24:22
  Jeff Thomas: I was already at Morgan Stanley.
• 24:24
  Jeff Thomas: I had started this little Christian focus,
• 24:27
  Jeff Thomas: group where I was hosting a little, little call, you know,
• 24:31
  Jeff Thomas: almost like a little Bible study once a month, and and it wasn't officially
• 24:34
  Jeff Thomas: recognized.
• 24:35
  Jeff Thomas: It's just sort of a little grassroots group.
• 24:36
  Jeff Thomas: And so I thought, well, okay.
• 24:39
  Jeff Thomas: Let's let's see how much of, the the culture at that firm we could
• 24:42
  Jeff Thomas: affect.
• 24:43
  Jeff Thomas: And so, we got it recognized by the firm.
• 24:45
  Jeff Thomas: I had some friends help, build that, and we got it up to about
• 24:49
  Jeff Thomas: six hundred members.
• 24:49
  Jeff Thomas: And, and long story short, you can read the
• 24:53
  Jeff Thomas: book for, some more details about how it kinda went down.
• 24:57
  Jeff Thomas: But at the end of the day, it did become kind of a culture
• 25:01
  Jeff Thomas: issue.
• 25:02
  Jeff Thomas: And it's a public company, and that means the public owns the shares,
• 25:06
  Jeff Thomas: and that culture is going to reflect the public.
• 25:08
  Jeff Thomas: And most of the public, is is not really
• 25:13
  Jeff Thomas: for publicly proclaiming maybe bible verses, which it was.
• 25:16
  Jeff Thomas: But, and, unfortunately, it's a bit of a minority.
• 25:19
  Jeff Thomas: So, anyway, that that that period sort of came to an end, and I
• 25:21
  Jeff Thomas: and I knew that the culture was not gonna flip, really fully to
• 25:25
  Jeff Thomas: a to a a biblical culture.
• 25:27
  Jeff Thomas: And so, that's the place I had felt called to,
• 25:31
  Jeff Thomas: and and I was on my knees the next day because the whole program
• 25:34
  Jeff Thomas: was to ask God what to do and then go do it and give
• 25:36
  Jeff Thomas: him the credit.
• 25:37
  Jeff Thomas: And so I was stymied.
• 25:38
  Jeff Thomas: I was like, yeah.
• 25:39
  Jeff Thomas: We we went as far as we could here.
• 25:40
  Jeff Thomas: What's the next step?
• 25:41
  Jeff Thomas: Or I don't know what to do.
• 25:43
  Jeff Thomas: And I felt like he was leading us to start a new company from
• 25:45
  Jeff Thomas: scratch with those principles as the basis.
• 25:48
  Jeff Thomas: And so I really you know, so things have evolved from there,
• 25:52
  Jeff Thomas: and we've had progressive revelation about, how to grow that business over the last ten years.
• 25:57
  Lisa Nichols: Right.
• 25:58
  Lisa Nichols: I like that progressive revelation.
• 26:01
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 26:01
  Lisa Nichols: That's awesome.
• 26:02
  Lisa Nichols: I've got a friend that says he'll give you enough light for the step
• 26:05
  Lisa Nichols: you're on.
• 26:06
  Jeff Thomas: Exactly.
• 26:07
  Jeff Thomas: It's the manna principle. Right?
• 26:08
  Lisa Nichols: Yes.
• 26:09
  Lisa Nichols: Oh, yes.
• 26:10
  Jeff Thomas: It gives you the enough for today.
• 26:12
  Jeff Thomas: And don't try to stuff yourself.
• 26:14
  Jeff Thomas: Yeah.
• 26:15
  Jeff Thomas: You know?
• 26:15
  Jeff Thomas: And you can I don't think he's mad at us for having five and
• 26:18
  Jeff Thomas: or three, five, ten year plans and all that?
• 26:21
  Jeff Thomas: Like, we when I started, we had a I had this, you know, the
• 26:24
  Jeff Thomas: spreadsheet up a one blinking.
• 26:25
  Jeff Thomas: You know?
• 26:25
  Jeff Thomas: And I was like, okay, god.
• 26:27
  Jeff Thomas: We're gonna help me help me write the business plan.
• 26:30
  Jeff Thomas: Let's start with the growth rate.
• 26:31
  Jeff Thomas: What's the growth rate gonna be?
• 26:33
  Jeff Thomas: And he's like, yeah.
• 26:34
  Jeff Thomas: You're not putting me on a spreadsheet.
• 26:37
  Lisa Nichols: That's so good.
• 26:39
  Jeff Thomas: Yeah, you're not putting me on a spreadsheet, buddy.
• 26:41
  Jeff Thomas: I mean, I'm not mad at you for having one, but
• 26:46
  Lisa Nichols: His economy is totally different than ours.
• 26:48
  Jeff Thomas: Exactly.
• 26:49
  Lisa Nichols: Right?
• 26:49
  Lisa Nichols: His economy is totally different.
• 26:50
  Lisa Nichols: Well, it's Arkos.
• 26:52
  Lisa Nichols: Ark and Telos.
• 26:54
  Lisa Nichols: What tell me about that because they mean something
• 26:58
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 26:58
  Lisa Nichols: Each of those words
• 26:59
  Jeff Thomas: mean Arkos .
• 26:59
  Jeff Thomas: It's a made up word.
• 27:01
  Jeff Thomas: When we were researching, branding and this sort of thing,
• 27:06
  Jeff Thomas: I heard a great talk about, it should be two syllables.
• 27:10
  Jeff Thomas: You can call your dog that, and then you tell the world what it
• 27:13
  Jeff Thomas: means.
• 27:14
  Jeff Thomas: Okay?
• 27:14
  Jeff Thomas: So, Google.
• 27:16
  Jeff Thomas: You know?
• 27:16
  Jeff Thomas: Come here, Google.
• 27:17
  Jeff Thomas: You know?
• 27:18
  Jeff Thomas: So Arkos, two syllables.
• 27:20
  Jeff Thomas: You tell the world what it means.
• 27:23
  Jeff Thomas: Ark as in Noah's ark, let's say.
• 27:26
  Jeff Thomas: So I always say,
• 27:29
  Jeff Thomas: you know, obviously, that's a a a safe place.
• 27:32
  Jeff Thomas: It's also here's my favorite part about it.
• 27:35
  Jeff Thomas: Remember how God downloaded blueprints to Noah?
• 27:39
  Jeff Thomas: I mean, exactly how to build the ark.
• 27:41
  Lisa Nichols: How to build the ark.
• 27:42
  Jeff Thomas: Right?
• 27:42
  Jeff Thomas: And so that was sort of my experience is, like,
• 27:46
  Jeff Thomas: in in, you know, in that case, he sort of downloaded all of it
• 27:48
  Jeff Thomas: because he had a very specific project.
• 27:51
  Lisa Nichols: Yes.
• 27:51
  Jeff Thomas: But for most of it's more progressive, but he'll still download those plans.
• 27:55
  Jeff Thomas: You know, if you'll ask him what those plans look like for you, they
• 27:59
  Jeff Thomas: may not be all in one time.
• 28:00
  Jeff Thomas: For me, it's been progressive.
• 28:02
  Jeff Thomas: But but he will give you those,
• 28:05
  Jeff Thomas: sort of a kingdom assignment as we talked about earlier.
• 28:08
  Jeff Thomas: So download plans.
• 28:09
  Jeff Thomas: I used to say even if they sound nuts.
• 28:12
  Jeff Thomas: Now I usually just say, and they will sound nuts.
• 28:15
  Lisa Nichols: They will sound nuts.
• 28:16
  Lisa Nichols: They will.
• 28:18
  Lisa Nichols: They sound nuts.
• 28:19
  Lisa Nichols: Everybody thought Noah was crazy.
• 28:21
  Lisa Nichols: Okay?
• 28:21
  Lisa Nichols: So Yes.
• 28:22
  Lisa Nichols: Download plans from God, and then Telos is the back end of Arkos,
• 28:26
  Lisa Nichols: a r k o s.
• 28:28
  Lisa Nichols: And that's what Jesus said on the cross, which is my purpose is finished.
• 28:31
  Lisa Nichols: So, Ark, kind of a safe place to finish your purpose, download plans
• 28:35
  Lisa Nichols: from God, and let's go execute.
• 28:36
  Lisa Nichols: So I So I think what we see in our business is,
• 28:42
  Lisa Nichols: an industry that kinda GMs people into a template.
• 28:46
  Lisa Nichols: We can talk more about that.
• 28:47
  Lisa Nichols: But it's it's, we don't want templates, and we don't want, state
• 28:51
  Lisa Nichols: planning attorneys or anybody else telling us how to do things.
• 28:56
  Lisa Nichols: The the tax stuff comes last.
• 28:59
  Lisa Nichols: Don't worry about the tax code first.
• 29:01
  Lisa Nichols: What is God telling you to do?
• 29:02
  Lisa Nichols: And then be tax smart about it.
• 29:04
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 29:05
  Jeff Thomas: So, a lot of those plans, we we we try to give oxygen
• 29:10
  Jeff Thomas: to those crazy God plans.
• 29:11
  Jeff Thomas: And then let's go do it.
• 29:13
  Lisa Nichols: Oh, you you just set me up.
• 29:15
  Lisa Nichols: That was the part of the segue because I was gonna talk to you.
• 29:18
  Lisa Nichols: You talk about putting people's narratives before the numbers.
• 29:21
  Lisa Nichols: Yes.
• 29:21
  Lisa Nichols: You know?
• 29:22
  Lisa Nichols: And, you know, that's exactly what you're talking about there, connecting.
• 29:27
  Lisa Nichols: Well, I'll let you talk about it.
• 29:28
  Lisa Nichols: But, you know, what changes when an adviser or a
• 29:32
  Lisa Nichols: leader start there instead of starting with the numbers and starting
• 29:36
  Lisa Nichols: with the KPIs and the metrics, putting people's narratives before that?
• 29:41
  Jeff Thomas: Yeah.
• 29:41
  Jeff Thomas: I mean, that is one of my favorite phrases, narrative before numbers, and
• 29:46
  Jeff Thomas: I know people can relate to this.
• 29:47
  Jeff Thomas: I think we've all had this experience.
• 29:50
  Jeff Thomas: If you've gone to see and and, forgive me.
• 29:54
  Jeff Thomas: There are amazing, estate planning attorneys out there.
• 29:57
  Jeff Thomas: They're great at the taxes.
• 29:59
  Jeff Thomas: I don't mean to pick on them necessarily, but I'm just gonna
• 30:03
  Jeff Thomas: use the estate planning process as a proxy for this.
• 30:06
  Jeff Thomas: Okay?
• 30:07
  Jeff Thomas: Normally,
• 30:09
  Jeff Thomas: if you no matter what amount of money you've got, if you walk in,
• 30:13
  Jeff Thomas: to an estate tax attorney, they're just you know, there's a big questionnaire.
• 30:18
  Jeff Thomas: Most people just wanna get, you know, hey.
• 30:20
  Jeff Thomas: We're going on a trip, across the pond.
• 30:22
  Jeff Thomas: We just gotta get something written down here.
• 30:25
  Jeff Thomas: And, you know, and it's pretty complicated.
• 30:28
  Jeff Thomas: There's, like, most industries, like, if you were trying to tell me about your
• 30:31
  Jeff Thomas: business, you could acronym me to death, and I would have no idea what
• 30:34
  Jeff Thomas: you're talking about.
• 30:35
  Jeff Thomas: Right?
• 30:35
  Jeff Thomas: It's and then they you're trying to just get this will and all these
• 30:39
  Jeff Thomas: trusts or whatever done as fast as possible with as little headache.
• 30:43
  Jeff Thomas: So people tend to kinda get jammed into a template where you just divide
• 30:46
  Jeff Thomas: your network by the number of kids you have.
• 30:49
  Jeff Thomas: And, if if the estate is taxable, you buy an insurance policy to pay
• 30:53
  Jeff Thomas: the taxes, and you're done.
• 30:55
  Jeff Thomas: And while that might be appropriate for you,
• 30:59
  Jeff Thomas: it might not.
• 31:01
  Jeff Thomas: And and the only point for us is we say time out.
• 31:04
  Jeff Thomas: Before we start jamming documents, can we please
• 31:08
  Jeff Thomas: slow down and listen?
• 31:11
  Jeff Thomas: Again, what is Gong downloading to you?
• 31:14
  Jeff Thomas: It may fit into that template, but it may not.
• 31:18
  Jeff Thomas: And if it doesn't, there are some really, really fun things you could do,
• 31:22
  Jeff Thomas: especially if there's oftentimes, we find with our clients that there
• 31:26
  Jeff Thomas: is something philanthropic that a cause.
• 31:29
  Jeff Thomas: You know?
• 31:30
  Lisa Nichols: Yes.
• 31:30
  Jeff Thomas: You have a D own syndrome daughter who this podcast is named for.
• 31:34
  Jeff Thomas: Okay?
• 31:34
  Jeff Thomas: God gave you her.
• 31:36
  Jeff Thomas: She he, he gave your daughter you
• 31:40
  Jeff Thomas: and your husband,
• 31:42
  Jeff Thomas: and it's been a blessing to everyone and and to the rest of us,
• 31:45
  Jeff Thomas: who get to participate in, the things you've learned.
• 31:48
  Jeff Thomas: So, that is a unique thing.
• 31:52
  Jeff Thomas: There God takes all of us through unique o pportunities
• 31:56
  Jeff Thomas: and challenges.
• 31:57
  Jeff Thomas: Yeah.
• 31:57
  Jeff Thomas: And what is what are the causes that, we care
• 32:01
  Jeff Thomas: deeply about that, you know, what breaks our heart?
• 32:05
  Jeff Thomas: So, usually, there are some other things, that can be included in
• 32:09
  Jeff Thomas: your sort of ongoing financial plan and your estate plan that, that
• 32:13
  Jeff Thomas: are beyond yourself.
• 32:14
  Jeff Thomas: And that's what I found is and I know you feel the same way.
• 32:17
  Jeff Thomas: More satisfying is when we live outside ourselves, because that those are the two
• 32:20
  Jeff Thomas: big commands.
• 32:21
  Jeff Thomas: Right?
• 32:21
  Jeff Thomas: Love God and love people.
• 32:22
  Lisa Nichols: Right.
• 32:23
  Jeff Thomas: Right?
• 32:23
  Jeff Thomas: Well, if we're gonna love people, what kind of people?
• 32:26
  Jeff Thomas: And where are they, and what what's the cause we're going for?
• 32:29
  Jeff Thomas: So we gotta live outside ourselves.
• 32:31
  Jeff Thomas: That's where the juice comes from.
• 32:33
  Jeff Thomas: It's not from chasing the almighty dollar or or anything else.
• 32:37
  Jeff Thomas: That's that's the only place I've been able to find it.
• 32:41
  Lisa Nichols: Real satisfaction and fulfillment.
• 32:43
  Jeff Thomas: So all we're trying to do in our is match up those plans.
• 32:47
  Jeff Thomas: We're not trying to tell them what to do.
• 32:49
  Jeff Thomas: Let's what is the narrative of what, w hat is God telling them?
• 32:53
  Jeff Thomas: Yeah.
• 32:54
  Jeff Thomas: To do?
• 32:54
  Jeff Thomas: And then let's just match the finances with the plan.
• 32:58
  Jeff Thomas: Simple.
• 32:58
  Jeff Thomas: Right.
• 32:59
  Jeff Thomas: But not jam a template into it.
• 33:00
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 33:01
  Lisa Nichols: I love that.
• 33:01
  Jeff Thomas: So that that's another thing that I think about.
• 33:03
  Jeff Thomas: Yeah.
• 33:04
  Lisa Nichols: I love that.
• 33:04
  Lisa Nichols: And I think it was you.
• 33:06
  Lisa Nichols: I think, Jeff, I I do read a lot and I meet a lot
• 33:08
  Lisa Nichols: of people.
• 33:09
  Lisa Nichols: I'm pretty sure this is you.
• 33:10
  Lisa Nichols: And if it wasn't you, I'm gonna still credit you.
• 33:13
  Lisa Nichols: It's fine.
• 33:14
  Lisa Nichols: You can take credit.
• 33:15
  Jeff Thomas: If it's good, I'll take credit.
• 33:16
  Jeff Thomas: Yeah.
• 33:16
  Lisa Nichols: But, you know, I think it was you that said, like, money, honestly, you
• 33:20
  Lisa Nichols: know, you you said the two greatest commands.
• 33:22
  Lisa Nichols: Love God, love people.
• 33:23
  Lisa Nichols: Right?
• 33:24
  Lisa Nichols: And I think it was you that said money is just a tool.
• 33:27
  Lisa Nichols: Exactly.
• 33:28
  Lisa Nichols: Money is a tool to love others better.
• 33:32
  Lisa Nichols: Right?
• 33:32
  Lisa Nichols: And whether that is I don't know.
• 33:34
  Lisa Nichols: Whether that's helping people with special needs or whether it's building
• 33:39
  Lisa Nichols: a, you know, new hospital or whatever it may be.
• 33:42
  Lisa Nichols: You know, you've been given this money.
• 33:44
  Lisa Nichols: You're a steward of the money, not an owner.
• 33:46
  Lisa Nichols: Right?
• 33:47
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 33:47
  Lisa Nichols: You're a steward of that money, and it's like, it's a way for us
• 33:51
  Lisa Nichols: to love others better and love them more.
• 33:55
  Lisa Nichols: And I think it's such a beautiful way of looking at,
• 33:59
  Lisa Nichols: you know, of money.
• 34:01
  Lisa Nichols: So let's talk about, and we've talked about this, but I'd love for
• 34:05
  Lisa Nichols: you just to,
• 34:07
  Lisa Nichols: and and we we've talked because you're talking about the narratives, but you talk
• 34:11
  Lisa Nichols: about generosity.
• 34:12
  Lisa Nichols: And I know that, generous giving and, I mean, you've been a part of
• 34:16
  Lisa Nichols: a lot of those type of movements in that.
• 34:19
  Lisa Nichols: Right?
• 34:20
  Lisa Nichols: Jeff, and you're more than welcome to talk about those if you want.
• 34:23
  Lisa Nichols: But Sure.
• 34:24
  Lisa Nichols: You said that really generosity isn't about twisting somebody's arm, but
• 34:28
  Lisa Nichols: watering a seed.
• 34:29
  Lisa Nichols: You were just talking about that.
• 34:30
  Lisa Nichols: So maybe whatever that narrative is, let's figure out how we can water
• 34:34
  Lisa Nichols: that seed and, but what does that look like in real life
• 34:38
  Lisa Nichols: conversations with clients?
• 34:39
  Jeff Thomas: Yeah.
• 34:40
  Jeff Thomas: Let let let me give you an example.
• 34:42
  Jeff Thomas: Let me be able to just,
• 34:45
  Jeff Thomas: tell a story or two.
• 34:46
  Jeff Thomas: You know, we we have,
• 34:49
  Jeff Thomas: I'm remembering a, a husband and wife that came in, and, the husband
• 34:53
  Jeff Thomas: just is a gifted business guy.
• 34:56
  Jeff Thomas: His wife is super administratively,
• 35:01
  Jeff Thomas: talented.
• 35:02
  Jeff Thomas: And, also,
• 35:04
  Jeff Thomas: they they have several causes, that they just love to support.
• 35:08
  Jeff Thomas: And,
• 35:10
  Jeff Thomas: and and so, you know, one one of the things that often when people
• 35:13
  Jeff Thomas: come in because they know we do a lot of, philanthropic planning.
• 35:16
  Jeff Thomas: And so they'll usually have tactical questions, you know, about, you know,
• 35:20
  Jeff Thomas: should I should I open a, a donor advised fund or
• 35:24
  Jeff Thomas: a foundation?
• 35:25
  Jeff Thomas: You know, they'll they'll usually, like, lead with a question like that.
• 35:28
  Jeff Thomas: And we're always like, okay.
• 35:30
  Jeff Thomas: Good tactical question.
• 35:31
  Jeff Thomas: Time out.
• 35:32
  Jeff Thomas: Write that down.
• 35:33
  Jeff Thomas: We'll get back to that.
• 35:34
  Jeff Thomas: But, again, let's go back to the narrative.
• 35:37
  Jeff Thomas: Right?
• 35:37
  Jeff Thomas: Okay.
• 35:38
  Jeff Thomas: What is God telling you?
• 35:39
  Jeff Thomas: Tell us more about the business.
• 35:41
  Jeff Thomas: What are your passions?
• 35:42
  Jeff Thomas: What are the causes?
• 35:43
  Jeff Thomas: And so so in answering, you know, this question even about,
• 35:49
  Jeff Thomas: the structure of do you do it in a donor advised fund, and there's
• 35:52
  Jeff Thomas: some advantages there.
• 35:54
  Jeff Thomas: But you like, in a donor advised fund, you can donate
• 35:58
  Jeff Thomas: appreciated stock and this sort of thing, and it's, you know, it can be
• 36:01
  Jeff Thomas: more anonymous about where you give and this sort of thing.
• 36:04
  Jeff Thomas: Where a foundation is like an entity.
• 36:06
  Jeff Thomas: It's like another little business to run.
• 36:08
  Jeff Thomas: Right?
• 36:08
  Jeff Thomas: But you can cut checks directly to buy a sandwich or, you know, whatever.
• 36:12
  Jeff Thomas: And so in most cases, a donor advised fund is is, less complicated and
• 36:16
  Jeff Thomas: that sort of thing.
• 36:17
  Jeff Thomas: In in this couple's case, it was just obvious from
• 36:22
  Jeff Thomas: her professional history that she'd be amazing at running that entity
• 36:26
  Jeff Thomas: and would love to do that and wanted to write checks to certain things
• 36:29
  Jeff Thomas: that weren't just nonprofits to support people.
• 36:32
  Jeff Thomas: And so just by hearing the narrative of what their skills were and what
• 36:36
  Jeff Thomas: the causes they wanted to support And just even the way the
• 36:40
  Jeff Thomas: cash would flow, they didn't have a lot of appreciated assets to donate at
• 36:44
  Jeff Thomas: that moment, but cash flow.
• 36:45
  Jeff Thomas: So, like, the narrative always informs.
• 36:48
  Jeff Thomas: So now we use the right, sort of tax structure to do it.
• 36:52
  Jeff Thomas: And and to watch people you know, they're just hesitant
• 36:56
  Jeff Thomas: to share these crazy plans with people.
• 36:59
  Jeff Thomas: Like you know?
• 37:01
  Jeff Thomas: Right.
• 37:01
  Jeff Thomas: And and because early when I started tried to do this
• 37:06
  Jeff Thomas: twenty years ago, before I kinda knew how to navigate these conversations, we had
• 37:10
  Jeff Thomas: a, we had a business owner who had become a believer kinda later in
• 37:13
  Jeff Thomas: life and so it started becoming more generous.
• 37:16
  Jeff Thomas: But his accountant that he'd had forever, outside accountant, was not
• 37:20
  Jeff Thomas: on board, okay, with with this sort of generosity.
• 37:23
  Jeff Thomas: Anyway, we sort of got together and redesigned based on his what he wanted
• 37:27
  Jeff Thomas: to do, he and his wife.
• 37:28
  Jeff Thomas: This new estate plan had all this generosity in it.
• 37:30
  Jeff Thomas: And we sort of took it to the new accountant, and she brought her
• 37:33
  Jeff Thomas: lawyer friend, and they're gonna kinda paper it.
• 37:35
  Jeff Thomas: Right?
• 37:36
  Jeff Thomas: And, he started the the business owner started sharing, what he wanted to
• 37:40
  Jeff Thomas: do.
• 37:41
  Jeff Thomas: And I'll never forget staring at the accountant, and she just
• 37:45
  Jeff Thomas: was just sort of jaw slack.
• 37:48
  Jeff Thomas: You know?
• 37:49
  Jeff Thomas: And she all she could utter was, why would anyone give away
• 37:53
  Jeff Thomas: that much money?
• 37:55
  Jeff Thomas: And I just think,
• 37:58
  Jeff Thomas: that is how much of the world thinks.
• 38:01
  Jeff Thomas: Right.
• 38:01
  Jeff Thomas: And so it kinda blew up the deal.
• 38:02
  Jeff Thomas: And so now we've had to learn, hey.
• 38:03
  Jeff Thomas: You gotta be careful who's in the room.
• 38:06
  Jeff Thomas: Whoever's in the room, you need to empower them to be part of the
• 38:08
  Jeff Thomas: plan.
• 38:08
  Jeff Thomas: There there are things that I did wrong in that Yeah.
• 38:12
  Jeff Thomas: Leading that, process that we try not to make those mistakes again.
• 38:16
  Jeff Thomas: But I tell that to to show the hostility that's available.
• 38:19
  Jeff Thomas: I think if you've shared these ideas with advisers who are
• 38:23
  Jeff Thomas: not aligned Yeah.
• 38:25
  Jeff Thomas: With the with your worldview Yeah.
• 38:27
  Jeff Thomas: And and, yeah, I think you need alignment in worldview, and then you also
• 38:30
  Jeff Thomas: need technical competence.
• 38:31
  Jeff Thomas: Okay?
• 38:31
  Jeff Thomas: You need you need both.
• 38:33
  Lisa Nichols: Right.
• 38:33
  Jeff Thomas: But you and it doesn't have to be our company, but, I mean, you
• 38:36
  Jeff Thomas: you that that's one piece of advice I would give.
• 38:38
  Lisa Nichols: That's a good piece of advice.
• 38:40
  Lisa Nichols: Because if you do not have the same worldview, they are gonna look at
• 38:43
  Lisa Nichols: you like you're crazy, and they're gonna probably advise you not to do
• 38:47
  Lisa Nichols: these things.
• 38:48
  Lisa Nichols: Right?
• 38:50
  Jeff Thomas: We've given thirty percent of Arkos to our foundation, and, I was interviewing
• 38:54
  Jeff Thomas: lawyers to paper our side of the deal,
• 38:57
  Jeff Thomas: and I couldn't find a lawyer in Houston that wouldn't try to talk me
• 38:59
  Jeff Thomas: out of it.
• 39:00
  Jeff Thomas: And I I finally,
• 39:04
  Jeff Thomas: I called a a friend of mine, in Memphis who did a similar thing,
• 39:08
  Jeff Thomas: and he said, just use my lawyer.
• 39:10
  Jeff Thomas: So I called his lawyer, and and I have to go from Houston to
• 39:13
  Jeff Thomas: Memphis to find a lawyer.
• 39:14
  Jeff Thomas: I mean, it's just ridiculous.
• 39:15
  Jeff Thomas: Anyway,
• 39:17
  Jeff Thomas: so I called her.
• 39:18
  Jeff Thomas: She's amazing, Mary Ann.
• 39:19
  Jeff Thomas: And and, I I'm telling her the story.
• 39:20
  Jeff Thomas: Hey.
• 39:21
  Jeff Thomas: Every lawyer in Houston I talked to has tried to talk me how to
• 39:23
  Jeff Thomas: doing this.
• 39:23
  Jeff Thomas: I will God's telling me to do it.
• 39:25
  Jeff Thomas: I'm gonna do it.
• 39:26
  Jeff Thomas: Like, I I don't know.
• 39:26
  Jeff Thomas: I can't have that in my ear.
• 39:28
  Lisa Nichols: Okay?
• 39:29
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 39:29
  Jeff Thomas: And, so Mary Ann says she goes she starts laughing.
• 39:32
  Jeff Thomas: I go, Mary Anne, why are you laughing?
• 39:33
  Jeff Thomas: She goes, well, truth is I tried to talk Alan, my friend, out of
• 39:37
  Jeff Thomas: doing it thirty years ago.
• 39:38
  Jeff Thomas: Okay?
• 39:38
  Jeff Thomas: He goes, but I've come around since that.
• 39:40
  Jeff Thomas: Okay?
• 39:41
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 39:41
  Jeff Thomas: So it's you have to really work in finding aligned
• 39:46
  Jeff Thomas: advisers who also have the technical competence.
• 39:48
  Jeff Thomas: But don't listen to unaligned,
• 39:51
  Jeff Thomas: people.
• 39:51
  Jeff Thomas: Listen to the guy who's got your back the most.
• 39:54
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 39:54
  Lisa Nichols: Amen.
• 39:55
  Lisa Nichols: So how does it work out for Alan?
• 39:58
  Jeff Thomas: Well, that's an amazing story.
• 40:01
  Jeff Thomas: He's in his sixties.
• 40:03
  Jeff Thomas: Over forty years ago, he was graduating from college, and he and his wife
• 40:07
  Jeff Thomas: were just getting married.
• 40:09
  Jeff Thomas: He's an engineer, and his parents had a had two little cranes that they
• 40:13
  Jeff Thomas: would rent out from what he calls the world headquarters of their, spare room
• 40:17
  Jeff Thomas: .
• 40:19
  Jeff Thomas: And, he made a his wife wanted to go into the mission field when
• 40:22
  Jeff Thomas: they got married.
• 40:22
  Jeff Thomas: He wanted to take over the family business of two cranes.
• 40:26
  Jeff Thomas: And so their compromise was they take over the business, but they would pay
• 40:29
  Jeff Thomas: themselves what the mission board, would have paid them.
• 40:32
  Jeff Thomas: And so they and they would give away every anything else.
• 40:35
  Jeff Thomas: Okay?
• 40:35
  Jeff Thomas: So they sort of set this sort of financial finish line right out of
• 40:39
  Jeff Thomas: college.
• 40:39
  Jeff Thomas: Okay?
• 40:40
  Jeff Thomas: The first year actually, his brother was part of this deal.
• 40:43
  Jeff Thomas: The first year, they made fifty thousand more than they, the mission board would
• 40:47
  Jeff Thomas: have been, and they gave that away.
• 40:48
  Jeff Thomas: I mean, that's pretty good.
• 40:48
  Jeff Thomas: Thirty years ago for a couple of twenty somethings, fifty grand.
• 40:51
  Jeff Thomas: You know?
• 40:51
  Lisa Nichols: Yes.
• 40:52
  Jeff Thomas: Well, now the business is doing just fast forward forty years.
• 40:56
  Jeff Thomas: Okay?
• 40:57
  Jeff Thomas: They've they've kept to that game plan.
• 40:59
  Jeff Thomas: And, they're they are, the business does one billion.
• 41:03
  Jeff Thomas: It's the fourth largest grain company in America,
• 41:07
  Jeff Thomas: and they're giving away, you know, somewhere north of sixty, seventy million
• 41:11
  Jeff Thomas: dollars, a year, fifty percent of the profits and reinvest fifty percent.
• 41:15
  Jeff Thomas: And, frankly, God has just blessed that bit the business.
• 41:17
  Jeff Thomas: I I think I think Alan and his brother are amazing business people.
• 41:20
  Jeff Thomas: They built an amazing team.
• 41:22
  Jeff Thomas: They have wild talent.
• 41:25
  Jeff Thomas: But I I I I don't know that Alan or anybody in the management
• 41:29
  Jeff Thomas: team would deny that there is something god math
• 41:33
  Jeff Thomas: Oh.
• 41:34
  Jeff Thomas: About what has happened, to that business to continue
• 41:38
  Jeff Thomas: to grow, and they have six committees to give it away.
• 41:42
  Jeff Thomas: The six committees cover six parts of the world doing amazing work all
• 41:46
  Jeff Thomas: over the globe.
• 41:47
  Jeff Thomas: Alan Barnhart, Barnhart, great company.
• 41:49
  Jeff Thomas: It's just so I've seen those kind of things.
• 41:52
  Jeff Thomas: God doesn't have to bless you financially in that way, but the joy
• 41:57
  Jeff Thomas: that Alan and his wife have Mhmm.
• 41:59
  Jeff Thomas: She gets to travel the world the way she always wanted to as a
• 42:02
  Jeff Thomas: missionary,
• 42:04
  Jeff Thomas: funding these things.
• 42:05
  Lisa Nichols: Funding these different causes?
• 42:07
  Jeff Thomas: She's she's probably funding a thousand missionaries.
• 42:10
  Jeff Thomas: Okay?
• 42:11
  Jeff Thomas: And getting to do life with them.
• 42:12
  Jeff Thomas: Yeah.
• 42:12
  Jeff Thomas: And, and all these other people on the committees.
• 42:15
  Jeff Thomas: And so, anyway, there's just
• 42:18
  Jeff Thomas: Alan doesn't pay himself squat, but, he's one of the happiest people you've ever
• 42:22
  Jeff Thomas: met.
• 42:22
  Jeff Thomas: And I think that's ultimately what people are looking for.
• 42:24
  Jeff Thomas: Right?
• 42:25
  Jeff Thomas: Where's that going?
• 42:26
  Lisa Nichols: Yes.
• 42:27
  Lisa Nichols: Oh my goodness.
• 42:28
  Lisa Nichols: I love that story.
• 42:29
  Lisa Nichols: Thank you so much for sharing that.
• 42:33
  Lisa Nichols: Well, gosh.
• 42:33
  Lisa Nichols: I've got a lot more, but we're running out of time here.
• 42:36
  Lisa Nichols: Let me ask you this.
• 42:37
  Lisa Nichols: You've got your wife, Dolly, and you've got two daughters.
• 42:40
  Lisa Nichols: You've got Ally.
• 42:41
  Lisa Nichols: And so who
• 42:42
  Jeff Thomas: I do have an Ally.
• 42:43
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 42:43
  Lisa Nichols: Now I do have an Ally, y ou know.
• 42:45
  Lisa Nichols: So that that connected us instantaneously too.
• 42:48
  Lisa Nichols: When you think about your daughters and generations that are gonna follow you
• 42:52
  Lisa Nichols: because you got three grandkids now, what do you hope that they learn
• 42:56
  Lisa Nichols: from how you've chosen to live your life and lead your life?
• 43:01
  Jeff Thomas: Great question.
• 43:02
  Jeff Thomas: I I I think the,
• 43:04
  Jeff Thomas: we we have twelve principles at Arkos.
• 43:07
  Jeff Thomas: They're on our website, but, if anybody's interested.
• 43:09
  Jeff Thomas: But one of them is empower, don't control.
• 43:14
  Jeff Thomas: And,
• 43:16
  Jeff Thomas: that's the first thing that popped into my brain, when when you said that
• 43:20
  Jeff Thomas: was,
• 43:23
  Jeff Thomas: there is a tendency for me and for, I think, most parents,
• 43:28
  Jeff Thomas: to say, you know, gosh.
• 43:29
  Jeff Thomas: You know, there's different stages of parenting.
• 43:31
  Jeff Thomas: Right?
• 43:31
  Lisa Nichols: Yes.
• 43:32
  Jeff Thomas: And as you're both of my, girls are adults.
• 43:37
  Jeff Thomas: And the number one thing, of course, that I wish for them is to
• 43:40
  Jeff Thomas: follow the Lord because I know where that leads.
• 43:42
  Jeff Thomas: That leads to a good place.
• 43:43
  Jeff Thomas: Mhmm.
• 43:43
  Jeff Thomas: Okay?
• 43:45
  Jeff Thomas: So that's number one.
• 43:47
  Jeff Thomas: But the way they do that and the causes they might support, you
• 43:51
  Jeff Thomas: know, God's gonna take them.
• 43:52
  Jeff Thomas: We have some shared experience as a family.
• 43:55
  Jeff Thomas: Mhmm.
• 43:55
  Jeff Thomas: But, you know, my oldest daughter, she was just in the office for a
• 43:59
  Jeff Thomas: little birthday celebration for one of our employees and this sort of thing, and
• 44:01
  Jeff Thomas: she had her little baby with her.
• 44:03
  Jeff Thomas: And I god is taking her I had two girls.
• 44:06
  Jeff Thomas: She's got three boys already.
• 44:07
  Jeff Thomas: Like, she's already she's got a different I mean,
• 44:11
  Jeff Thomas: they will support different things.
• 44:13
  Jeff Thomas: They will have different callings and causes.
• 44:16
  Jeff Thomas: And so I just want them to, know where the source
• 44:20
  Jeff Thomas: of truth and joy is and to pursue that without me
• 44:24
  Jeff Thomas: prescribing for them what that might look like.
• 44:27
  Jeff Thomas: And I think that is a that is not a natural
• 44:31
  Jeff Thomas: thing for me as a father or most of us as parents
• 44:36
  Lisa Nichols: Right?
• 44:38
  Lisa Nichols: Right.
• 44:38
  Lisa Nichols: No.
• 44:38
  Lisa Nichols: You're exactly right.
• 44:40
  Jeff Thomas: And I think it's a certain age.
• 44:42
  Jeff Thomas: You know, one one of my friends always do gives us talk about, you
• 44:45
  Jeff Thomas: know, the the the stages of parenting.
• 44:46
  Jeff Thomas: You know, you're you're a caretaker and then a, you know, a cop
• 44:51
  Jeff Thomas: and then a coach.
• 44:52
  Jeff Thomas: And, eventually, when they're grown, hopefully, you're a consultant.
• 44:56
  Jeff Thomas: Well, consultants only,
• 44:59
  Jeff Thomas: give advice when asked.
• 45:02
  Jeff Thomas: Right.
• 45:02
  Jeff Thomas: That's a bit of a challenge.
• 45:04
  Lisa Nichols: That is a challenge as a parent.
• 45:06
  Lisa Nichols: Yes.
• 45:06
  Lisa Nichols: It is.
• 45:07
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 45:08
  Jeff Thomas: So allowing space for that empowerment of how how can
• 45:12
  Jeff Thomas: we use all of our relational capital, our spiritual capital, our financial capital,
• 45:17
  Jeff Thomas: to to help them,
• 45:20
  Jeff Thomas: pursue their calling Yeah.
• 45:22
  Jeff Thomas: Whatever that might be.
• 45:23
  Jeff Thomas: And it's likely to be different from ours.
• 45:25
  Lisa Nichols: Sure.
• 45:25
  Lisa Nichols: Sure.
• 45:26
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 45:26
  Lisa Nichols: That's that's good advice.
• 45:27
  Lisa Nichols: Good advice, Jeff.
• 45:29
  Lisa Nichols: Well, yeah, I've just got one more question, then we're gonna talk about something
• 45:33
  Lisa Nichols: extra.
• 45:33
  Lisa Nichols: So in twenty nineteen, you wrote your book, and I wanna camp out for
• 45:37
  Lisa Nichols: a minute on this concept of trading up.
• 45:42
  Lisa Nichols: I just love that.
• 45:43
  Lisa Nichols: You,
• 45:45
  Lisa Nichols: kind of near the end of the book, you know, I'm just gonna read
• 45:48
  Lisa Nichols: I'm gonna read a little bit of the, so too much of my life
• 45:51
  Lisa Nichols: has already been spent trying to fill the god sized vacuum that is inside
• 45:54
  Lisa Nichols: of me.
• 45:55
  Lisa Nichols: Was that Descartes?
• 45:56
  Lisa Nichols: I think that was Descartes that said that.
• 45:58
  Lisa Nichols: Right?
• 45:58
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah.
• 45:58
  Lisa Nichols: Everybody has a god sized vacuum, that only he can fill.
• 46:02
  Lisa Nichols: People try to fill it with all kinds of things.
• 46:06
  Lisa Nichols: You know, he you said that tennis wouldn't do it.
• 46:09
  Lisa Nichols: Our Armani suit couldn't do it.
• 46:11
  Lisa Nichols: Promotions, benefits couldn't do it.
• 46:12
  Lisa Nichols: Money certainly couldn't do it.
• 46:14
  Lisa Nichols: Fantastic job.
• 46:15
  Lisa Nichols: Great wife.
• 46:16
  Lisa Nichols: We may be thinking all of those things could fill that hole.
• 46:19
  Jeff Thomas: All good things.
• 46:20
  Lisa Nichols: All good things.
• 46:21
  Lisa Nichols: Right?
• 46:21
  Lisa Nichols: All good things.
• 46:23
  Lisa Nichols: But you said, sheer surely, by god's grace, I've discovered the way out of
• 46:27
  Lisa Nichols: unhappiness and lack of satisfaction brought inevitably by mere
• 46:31
  Lisa Nichols: success and prosperity.
• 46:33
  Lisa Nichols: It's that this whole book and the greatest discovery in my life is about
• 46:36
  Lisa Nichols: you have to trade up.
• 46:38
  Lisa Nichols: You have to trade up from success to significance.
• 46:40
  Lisa Nichols: You have to trade up from a life that is self directed to one
• 46:43
  Lisa Nichols: that is God tethered.
• 46:45
  Lisa Nichols: Trade up from seeing one's job as a money field to seeing it as
• 46:48
  Lisa Nichols: a mission field, trade up from enduring life to attacking it,
• 46:52
  Lisa Nichols: to most of all, trade up our tired, worn out, wanna be gods for
• 46:56
  Lisa Nichols: the true living god.
• 46:57
  Lisa Nichols: I just thought that was a beautiful way to just end the sentiment
• 47:01
  Lisa Nichols: of what this book is about.
• 47:03
  Lisa Nichols: So I would highly encourage our listeners, go get the book.
• 47:07
  Lisa Nichols: I know that it'll be a blessing to you.
• 47:09
  Lisa Nichols: So, Jeff, this is called something extra.
• 47:13
  Lisa Nichols: What do you believe is the something extra that every leader needs?
• 47:18
  Jeff Thomas: I think, you know, we're, as we're recording this, we're in the,
• 47:22
  Jeff Thomas: you know, the final stages of football season, you know,
• 47:27
  Jeff Thomas: for college and and the pros.
• 47:28
  Jeff Thomas: And and it it it just seems that every every great
• 47:33
  Jeff Thomas: coach talks about the fundamentals.
• 47:35
  Jeff Thomas: You know?
• 47:35
  Jeff Thomas: Like, embrace the process.
• 47:38
  Jeff Thomas: It's true in business.
• 47:39
  Jeff Thomas: It's true in sports.
• 47:41
  Jeff Thomas: Embrace the process, and don't don't obsess
• 47:45
  Jeff Thomas: over the outcome.
• 47:47
  Jeff Thomas: Mhmm.
• 47:48
  Jeff Thomas: And and so so I I I think the, for
• 47:52
  Jeff Thomas: me, the most important fundamental, that
• 47:56
  Jeff Thomas: I I was missing in my twenties and since my thirties, has
• 48:00
  Jeff Thomas: completely changed my life is the fundamental of just spending
• 48:05
  Jeff Thomas: a little bit of time with God every morning.
• 48:08
  Jeff Thomas: I wake up, maybe it's just me.
• 48:10
  Jeff Thomas: Okay?
• 48:11
  Jeff Thomas: But I don't think so.
• 48:13
  Jeff Thomas: I wake up thinking about my agenda, the things I have to do.
• 48:17
  Jeff Thomas: Everything's on me.
• 48:18
  Jeff Thomas: I gotta get my to do list done.
• 48:20
  Jeff Thomas: I gotta you know, all these strategic things we I I I I
• 48:24
  Jeff Thomas: I I.
• 48:24
  Jeff Thomas: Okay?
• 48:25
  Jeff Thomas: It's what I wake up thinking.
• 48:26
  Jeff Thomas: Okay?
• 48:27
  Jeff Thomas: And,
• 48:29
  Jeff Thomas: and if I can spend just a little bit of time in in God's
• 48:33
  Jeff Thomas: word, it's a may my blood pressure literally falls.
• 48:36
  Jeff Thomas: And and I feel like all those pressures fall off of me,
• 48:41
  Jeff Thomas: and my priorities change.
• 48:43
  Jeff Thomas: Absolutely.
• 48:44
  Jeff Thomas: And so and, like, if a baseball analogy is like, I don't know how
• 48:47
  Jeff Thomas: these guys hit a hundred mile an hour fastballs.
• 48:49
  Jeff Thomas: I don't get it.
• 48:50
  Jeff Thomas: Like, how your brain you know?
• 48:52
  Jeff Thomas: Well, the only way that can happen is doing a lot of cage work,
• 48:55
  Jeff Thomas: you know, before you're in the real game.
• 48:57
  Jeff Thomas: So you have a group swing.
• 48:59
  Jeff Thomas: Like, it's cage work.
• 49:00
  Jeff Thomas: Like, we we gotta we gotta get a
• 49:02
  Lisa Nichols: Spending time in the Word, that's cage work.
• 49:04
  Jeff Thomas: Get swing ready.
• 49:05
  Jeff Thomas: So when the world throws you fastballs
• 49:07
  Lisa Nichols: Right.
• 49:08
  Jeff Thomas: You're not with them.
• 49:09
  Lisa Nichols: Yeah. That's so good.
• 49:10
  Jeff Thomas: Your swing is a little on plane.
• 49:12
  Jeff Thomas: If you know what I mean?
• 49:13
  Lisa Nichols: I love it, Jeff.
• 49:15
  Lisa Nichols: That is so good.
• 49:16
  Jeff Thomas: I think that's a simple idea.
• 49:17
  Lisa Nichols: Love it.
• 49:18
  Lisa Nichols: Love it.
• 49:18
  Lisa Nichols: Hey.
• 49:19
  Lisa Nichols: Thank you so much.
• 49:20
  Lisa Nichols: Thank you so much for spending this time with me.
• 49:22
  Lisa Nichols: I have absolutely loved this time.
• 49:26
  Jeff Thomas: This has been great.
• 49:26
  Lisa Nichols: I know our listeners are gonna benefit so much from just hearing from
• 49:31
  Lisa Nichols: you.
• 49:31
  Jeff Thomas: Thank you.
• 49:32
  Jeff Thomas: Thanks for having me on, Lisa.
• 49:33
  Jeff Thomas: It's been a joy.
• 49:34
  Lisa Nichols: Something extra with Lisa Nichols is a Technology Partners production.
• 49:38
  Lisa Nichols: Copyright Technology Partners Inc.
• 49:40
  Lisa Nichols: Twenty nineteen.
• 49:41
  Lisa Nichols: To learn more about this week's guest, check out the show notes at t
• 49:45
  Lisa Nichols: e I dot co slash podcast.
• 49:48
  Lisa Nichols: If you enjoyed this episode, consider leaving us a review.
• 49:51
  Lisa Nichols: Thank you for listening to Something Extra.