Latest / The Start, Scale & Succeed Podcast / Can You Influence People with a Book They’ve Never Read with Everett O'Keefe (stage 3) - Ep. 414

Transcript

Can You Influence People with a Book They’ve Never Read with Everett O'Keefe (stage 3) - Ep. 414 · The Start, Scale & Succeed Podcast

• 0:00
  Scott Ritzheimer: Hello, hello, and welcome, welcome once again
• 0:03
  to the Start Scale and Succeed podcast, the only podcast that
• 0:07
  grows with you through all seven levels of your journey as a
• 0:10
  founder. I'm your host, Scott Ritzheimer, and if you've ever
• 0:14
  watched a less than qualified competitor walk away with a deal
• 0:18
  that you should have won, you know how frustrating it is to
• 0:22
  have expertise that no one can see, especially those of you who
• 0:26
  are fighting through level three, when you've got a whole
• 0:29
  bunch of mouths to feed to make things worse. So, the problem is
• 0:33
  that credentials, referrals, and even a great track record can
• 0:37
  all be invisible until someone already trusts you enough to
• 0:41
  ask, that's the chicken and the egg problem that most founders
• 0:44
  never solve. But today's guest has helped more than 150
• 0:48
  founders solve it, and he's going to show us exactly how.
• 0:51
  So, let me introduce him with us today, mr. Everett O'Keefe. He's
• 0:56
  a Wall Street Journal USA Today and international number one
• 0:59
  bestselling author, The Power of the Published is his most recent
• 1:03
  solo work. He's also helped create and launch more than 150
• 1:07
  bestselling books for his clients. Everett speaks across
• 1:10
  the nation on the power of publishing. He's the founder of
• 1:14
  Ignite Press, a hybrid publishing company that
• 1:17
  specializes in helping entrepreneurs as well as
• 1:20
  business and medical professionals to ignite their
• 1:23
  businesses by becoming best-selling authors. Well,
• 1:26
  Everett, welcome to the show. So glad to have you here.
• 1:30
  Unknown: Scott, thank you.
• 1:31
  Scott Ritzheimer: Yeah, so as I was reading, there's this line I
• 1:34
  told you this coming in that just kind of jumped off, and
• 1:37
  that is, I think it's more a question for me still. So maybe
• 1:41
  you can answer it for us, but the question is this: Can you
• 1:44
  actually influence folks, your prospective clients, other folks
• 1:49
  in the industry? Can you influence people with a book
• 1:52
  that they have never read?
• 1:55
  Unknown: Yeah, absolutely. So, Scott, thanks for having me on.
• 1:58
  I tell you, the there is great power in the unread book, of
• 2:01
  course. We all want our clients and prospects to read our books,
• 2:06
  but the truth is, the vast majority who people who
• 2:09
  encounter your book won't read it, right? They'll have heard
• 2:13
  about it, they'll hear your name associated with the title of it,
• 2:17
  maybe they'll see the cover, or maybe they'll actually have a
• 2:20
  copy of the book in their hand, but how many of us have books on
• 2:25
  our nightstands, right, or in on our bookshelves? Our best
• 2:29
  intentions to read, and we never get around to it, but it's one
• 2:34
  of the things I love about books, even if people never even
• 2:38
  open it up, it continuously sits there and screams your
• 2:42
  qualifications to your prospect or your client. They see it on
• 2:47
  their desk, they come across it on Amazon, or in your email, or
• 2:52
  in social media, or whatever. Just the fact that your name is
• 2:56
  associated with that book just gives so much credibility, and
• 3:02
  it's crazy, Scott. Right here, we are in this age where you and
• 3:05
  I are huge on streaming video, right, and streaming audio, and
• 3:09
  we understand the power of these things, but we still get, we
• 3:14
  still revere authors, we still give special credence and
• 3:19
  authority to authors, and that's true, even if someone never even
• 3:23
  reads the book.
• 3:25
  Scott Ritzheimer: Yeah, it's wild. It's wild. So it's such an
• 3:28
  irony to me, because I really couldn't agree more. We, we
• 3:32
  esteem authors, but we will pay $15 for a book where it's such a
• 3:38
  funny anomaly, but that's neither here nor there. What I
• 3:41
  really love about your approach is this idea that the book, in
• 3:45
  and of itself, yes, it should be good, it's a, it should be a
• 3:48
  work, but it's also a tool. So, if we think of a book as a tool
• 3:52
  for solving these business challenges that we've laid out
• 3:55
  here, how does it help us approach the book and the whole
• 3:58
  process of the book differently?
• 4:01
  Unknown: Yeah, it changes the dynamic entirely, because a lot
• 4:05
  of people think that a book is especially their first book,
• 4:09
  they approach it like it's going to be their opus or something
• 4:11
  like that, it's their, it's their big legacy piece that
• 4:16
  they're going to leave the world, when quite honestly, most
• 4:19
  people should approach their first book as their first book,
• 4:23
  and it should be approached as the world's best marketing piece
• 4:27
  for their business. There's nothing like a book to help
• 4:32
  convert prospects into customers, and to shorten that
• 4:38
  cycle, too. You put, you put a book in the hands of a prospect,
• 4:43
  your authority level goes up, they see you through different
• 4:47
  eyes entirely, and if they start to read that book, they're
• 4:50
  likely to engage with you much more quickly, and so I think
• 4:55
  that it causes us to look at the book differently, and what we
• 4:58
  would include in it. For instance, one of the things that
• 5:02
  people never talk about, about a power of a book, is the power to
• 5:06
  make better clients. When your prospects read your book, they
• 5:13
  come to you, and they are more inclined, they're predisposed to
• 5:17
  accept your recommendations, because you've already
• 5:20
  instructed them in the book, and showing your expertise there.
• 5:24
  So, when you say, "Hey, we should do this, they're like,
• 5:27
  "Oh, yeah, I read about that in your book. I totally want to do
• 5:29
  that, instead of you having to sit there and try to explain to
• 5:34
  them why you're recommending that particular thing. So, it
• 5:39
  tends to make more compliant and accepting clients, it, it also,
• 5:46
  you can allow a book to help you sort your prospects, because
• 5:52
  you're going to automatically attract the ones that really see
• 5:56
  and understand your ideology, and you're going to repel the
• 5:58
  ones who don't, and I'm, as you, as you teach your clients, you
• 6:03
  know, repelling people, repelling the wrong prospect is
• 6:08
  as important, and maybe more than attracting the right ones,
• 6:12
  and so these are these are things that you weave into your
• 6:14
  book, it's language about how you work, what you work, what
• 6:18
  you do, and why you do it, so that when they come to you,
• 6:22
  they're like, yeah, I'm on board, I want to do that.
• 6:28
  Scott Ritzheimer: When, when someone approaches you, I would
• 6:31
  imagine you have the luxury of being in this position, but you
• 6:34
  have a founder, they've had some success in business, they,
• 6:39
  they're, they're struggling with a degree of obscurity, at least
• 6:43
  relative to their goals, and they tell you, I want to write a
• 6:48
  book. What do you find are some of the most common
• 6:51
  misperceptions that they have about either the book itself or
• 6:54
  the process surrounding
• 6:55
  Unknown: hmmm. All right, yeah, some people think it needs to be
• 6:58
  a really long book, and they have in their mind that it's
• 7:02
  going to be three 400 pages that it needs to encompass all their
• 7:07
  wisdom, and it doesn't, you know, the sweet spot on the book
• 7:12
  is really about 25 to 40,000 words, and which is completely
• 7:19
  manageable, it creates a book of about 120 to 180 pages, and the
• 7:24
  idea there is that it's long enough to allow you to come to
• 7:28
  convey your message. It's thick enough to be a book, and it's
• 7:32
  short enough to be read on a cross-country flight. If you go
• 7:36
  longer than that, people either won't start it or they won't
• 7:40
  finish it, you go shorter than that, and people may not,
• 7:44
  they'll see it as a pamphlet, you know, or something,
• 7:47
  something along those lines. So, I think that's a, that's a great
• 7:50
  misconception, is how long does it need to be, and then, and
• 7:55
  that, and that you need to pour everything into it, you don't,
• 7:58
  you need to provide value, you need to solve problems for your
• 8:02
  clients and prospects, but you're going to leave things on
• 8:05
  the table, you're going to leave things off the table that you're
• 8:08
  going to be delivering to them in person or through your
• 8:10
  website or additional resources. It just think of it as the
• 8:16
  ultimate marketing tool. I sit there and I laugh at how much
• 8:21
  people spend on mugs and pens and other tchotchkes and stuff
• 8:26
  like that that they may provide to people, which provide no
• 8:30
  indication of your expertise, you know, or your wisdom, and
• 8:34
  yet when you put a book in somebody's hand, they have this
• 8:38
  continual reminder of your expertise, and, and by the way,
• 8:43
  we tend not to throw books away, right? They're like, like, it's
• 8:46
  almost, it's almost like a heresy to throw a book away,
• 8:51
  like, no, no, no, we can't do that. So they tend to hang
• 8:55
  around where those other things are like,
• 8:59
  Scott Ritzheimer: that's fascinating. I don't think I've
• 9:00
  ever thrown a book away. We've donated books. I don't think
• 9:03
  we've ever.. that's fascinating. I hadn't thought about that.
• 9:06
  Here's what I like about this, and it's especially for, like,
• 9:09
  the coaches who are listening to the show, or you know, CPAs, or
• 9:14
  folks who professional services that are doing knowledge work.
• 9:20
  It's increasingly less physical. There's not anything to show for
• 9:25
  it at the end, and so one of the things that I like so much about
• 9:27
  a book, and you've, you've mentioned this multiple times,
• 9:30
  but I want to draw it out. I was like, you can actually put it in
• 9:33
  their hands,
• 9:35
  Unknown: absolutely.
• 9:36
  Scott Ritzheimer: And, and so we try to do that through the
• 9:39
  tchotchkes, but you're right, putting something in their hands
• 9:42
  that one they won't throw away, unlike the cup or the like the
• 9:45
  19th, you know, whatever mug, I won't use anyone's brand names
• 9:49
  here, but that I have no more room for in my, my pantry, but
• 9:54
  so I love that, so we've got this kind of physical presence,
• 9:58
  we've got a state. Of your value to some extent, we have the what
• 10:02
  we call it the author's aura, when it, when it comes time to,
• 10:08
  to kind of get the book out in the world, if the goal isn't
• 10:11
  necessarily to get as many people to read it, but to use it
• 10:14
  as, as effectively as possible as a marketing tool, How does
• 10:17
  that change our approach in in launch season?
• 10:22
  Unknown: Yeah, it that's an important question. Because
• 10:24
  knowing who your target market is and how you plan to use the
• 10:28
  book and leverage the book are key. A lot of people are really
• 10:32
  writing for very narrow target market, and so while we will
• 10:37
  publish the book, so it's on Amazon and barnesandnoble.com
• 10:40
  and walmart.com and we'll carry out an Amazon bestseller launch
• 10:45
  strategy to make them Amazon bestsellers. Their target
• 10:49
  market's probably something much, much smaller, especially
• 10:52
  for a founder, an executive of a company. They know who their
• 10:56
  target market is, and it isn't the random reader on Amazon,
• 11:00
  right? It's somebody very specific, and that founder is
• 11:04
  probably going to encounter that target market in limited
• 11:08
  environments - it's speaking environments, it's coaching and
• 11:11
  consulting environments, or networking with proper people.
• 11:15
  So, having the access and the freedom to get copies into those
• 11:18
  people's hands, an unfettered freedom to do that is really
• 11:22
  important, and that's where, like, traditional publishing can
• 11:25
  be a little harder, because you may, you're selling your rights
• 11:28
  away for traditional publishing, and you may be limited in how
• 11:32
  you use it. In hybrid and self-publishing, you'll have
• 11:35
  freedom, complete freedom. You want to give, you want to speak
• 11:38
  somewhere and give everyone a copy of the book, do it. In
• 11:41
  fact, most authors, especially in the business world, will make
• 11:46
  way more money giving books away than they ever will selling
• 11:51
  them. I like to, I like to say that most of our clients would
• 11:55
  like to make their ROI back four or five digits at a time through
• 11:59
  a new client or a new relationship, then they will one
• 12:03
  digit at a time through selling a book on Amazon, so that that
• 12:09
  also allows you to really focus your language right in in your
• 12:13
  book, so you, and that's why it's important, if you're, if
• 12:16
  you're going to work with a publisher, make sure your
• 12:18
  publisher understands what you're really going to do with
• 12:20
  this, also, you brought something up, and it just made
• 12:26
  some.. it clicked on a story. I had a client who was working at
• 12:32
  the same rates for about 10 years. They were.. they wanted
• 12:36
  to raise their fees. They kept freaking out about, "Oh, if I
• 12:40
  raise my fees, I'm going to lose my clientele, you know that type
• 12:43
  of thing. So she published a book and doubled her fees and
• 12:49
  lost about 10% of her clients, you know. And if you do the math
• 12:54
  right, you doubled your fees, but you lost 10% of your
• 12:57
  clients. That's okay, that's pretty good math, and she really
• 13:02
  used the book, as you know, as one of the reinforcing points as
• 13:07
  to, as to why, and how she should be raising her rates, and
• 13:11
  that's another benefit of having a book out in the market.
• 13:16
  Scott Ritzheimer: Yeah, it's so good. So, Everett, there's this
• 13:19
  question that I have for you, as a question I ask all my guests.
• 13:22
  I'm interested to see what you have to say, especially from
• 13:24
  this perspective. So, the question is this: What is the
• 13:27
  biggest secret you wish wasn't a secret at all? What's that one
• 13:31
  thing you wish every founder watching or listening today
• 13:33
  knew?
• 13:34
  Unknown: Yeah, you know, Scott, thanks. I couch that in this
• 13:38
  terms that I don't know if it's a secret, I just know that
• 13:42
  everyone needs to know it, and not everybody does. So, it's a
• 13:45
  secret to some mastermind groups. I know, like, my
• 13:51
  business was struggling, and we were on the edge of cratering
• 13:58
  when I joined my first mastermind group, and that
• 14:01
  opened up so many doors, and I learned so much, and so I'm huge
• 14:06
  on mastermind groups. I host a publisher's mastermind group,
• 14:09
  and I have for about 13 years now, and we learn so much from
• 14:15
  each other, and yet I still bump into people in the world who
• 14:18
  either A, have never been in a mastermind group, B, they've
• 14:22
  been in one, but it really wasn't one, right? That you've
• 14:26
  probably encountered that, Scott. Mastermind groups that
• 14:28
  were really more group coaching or just networking groups,
• 14:32
  instead of people really pouring into each other, or or C,
• 14:36
  they've just, they just have maybe they've heard of one, and
• 14:41
  just never counted it, you know. And people hear the word, they
• 14:45
  just hear the word, but I have no idea what it is. So, but
• 14:49
  yeah, I still think I still think mastermind groups, and you
• 14:52
  know, on some podcasts I'm asked you, like, what are the things
• 14:55
  you would tell a 2020 year old version of Everett, I. We say
• 15:01
  join a mastermind group and publish a book. If I were, and
• 15:05
  if I were starting a new career, I would publish a book about
• 15:09
  that new career right away, even if it was just about like
• 15:12
  frequently asked questions of that. Oh, that's a, and Scott,
• 15:17
  that's another thing you talked about preconceived notions about
• 15:21
  what a book must be. A lot of people don't understand, they
• 15:26
  can very quickly write a book just around the frequently asked
• 15:30
  questions of their business, right. These are Scott, these
• 15:33
  are the things that you roll off, these roll off the top of
• 15:37
  your head every day when people ask you, what is this? What are
• 15:42
  what are the phases of scaling? What is one, you know, what?
• 15:45
  What are the greatest challenges people have with scaling? What
• 15:50
  things should I have in my mind when I look at scale? What time
• 15:54
  period should I be considering as for scaling? These are
• 15:58
  questions you could just answer. Bam! Well, answer those, dictate
• 16:04
  them into a dictate them into your phone, let the answers to
• 16:08
  those questions be the backbone of your book, and you know
• 16:13
  authors can business leaders and founders can write a book like
• 16:17
  that in very short period of time, especially using AI to
• 16:22
  help organize their thoughts.
• 16:26
  Scott Ritzheimer: Yeah, you just opened a whole can of worms that
• 16:29
  I'm really trying not to go down, because it is - there's a
• 16:34
  whole different set of tools that are available to us now,
• 16:37
  and I feel right and wrong ways of using those, but the one
• 16:41
  thing that I want to add on the mastermind thing, there's lots
• 16:44
  and lots of really wonderful ones out there. If you're in a
• 16:48
  spot where it's like, you know, I can't afford another x 1000 to
• 16:51
  be in a program, then start one. You know, the thing about
• 16:56
  masterminds, especially good ones, is that they are the group
• 16:59
  that is the valuable thing, not a curriculum or some other
• 17:03
  external structure, and so find a couple friends in your
• 17:06
  industry and see what you can learn from each other.
• 17:08
  Unknown: Scott, I man, I am so glad you said that, because that
• 17:12
  is exactly right. And people think they have to be the
• 17:17
  world's greatest expert in order to organize and host a
• 17:20
  mastermind group, and that's so not true, right? You know, the
• 17:23
  smartest person in the room is somebody beside you on any given
• 17:27
  moment, and being open to that huge, huge, huge benefit. And I
• 17:33
  would.. that's why everyone should be in one, even if I even
• 17:36
  think that, you know, garbage carriers could benefit from
• 17:40
  mastermind groups. I can't think of an industry that couldn't.
• 17:44
  Scott Ritzheimer: So true, so true, Everett. There's some
• 17:47
  folks who would love to explore what a book could do for them,
• 17:50
  or how to get their idea out into the world, and or they just
• 17:55
  love to connect with you and hear more. How can folks find
• 17:58
  you? How can they find your book, and what's a great next
• 18:01
  step for them.
• 18:02
  Unknown: Awesome, so you can always find me at our website,
• 18:05
  which is Ignite press.us that's Ignite press.us And then I have
• 18:11
  available one of my books, The Power of the Published: How
• 18:15
  Rapidly Authoring a Book Can Ignite Your Business and Your
• 18:18
  Life. And your audience can get a free copy of this if they go
• 18:22
  to my podcast perk.com my podcast perk.com and I think
• 18:29
  that people will find it is easier than they think to get a
• 18:33
  book out into the world, and a book will do more than they can
• 18:37
  ever imagine for their business and brand, and we love helping
• 18:41
  people make that happen,
• 18:45
  Scott Ritzheimer: yeah. Brilliant, we've got all those
• 18:47
  in the show notes for you. Go ahead and check it out, grab a
• 18:51
  copy of the book as well. I highly recommend it. Got a
• 18:55
  chance to read it, and so, yeah, Everett, thank you so much for
• 18:59
  being on, for sharing your wisdom with us really was a
• 19:02
  privilege and honor having you here. For those of you watching
• 19:06
  and listening, you know your time and attention mean the
• 19:10
  world to us. Hope you got as much out of this conversation as
• 19:14
  I know I did, and I cannot wait to see you next time. Take care.
• 19:18
  Hey everyone, Scott Ritzheimer here. Thank you so much for
• 19:22
  listening to the Start Scale and Succeed podcast. I hope this
• 19:26
  episode gave you exactly what you need for the level you're in
• 19:30
  right now. If you want to discover what level you're in,
• 19:34
  take our 10 question founders evolution quiz for
• 19:37
  free@foundersquiz.com That's foundersquiz.com it'll pinpoint
• 19:41
  exactly where you are and give you tailored tips to move
• 19:45
  forward and reach that next level in your journey as a
• 19:49
  founder. If you got something out of today's episode, don't
• 19:53
  forget to subscribe, rate, or review. It helps us reach more
• 19:57
  founders like you, and let's be honest, it means a ton to me, my
• 20:01
  team. And all our incredible guests, so keep starting,
• 20:04
  scaling, and succeeding, and I'll see you in the next episode,