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Scars And Stripes · Everyone Has An Ex

• 0:10
  Speaker 1: You're listening to a Mamma Mia podcast.
• 0:14
  Speaker 2: Mamma Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of the land and
• 0:17
  Speaker 2: waters this podcast is recorded on. This episode deals with
• 0:20
  Speaker 2: themes of domestic violence. Listen at discretion as advised. We've
• 0:30
  Speaker 2: all heard of the Great American Dream. The phrase was
• 0:33
  Speaker 2: first coined back in 1931, depicting a new kind of
• 0:37
  Speaker 2: social order, where life should be better, richer and fuller
• 0:40
  Speaker 2: for every red-blooded individual living and working in the US
• 0:44
  Speaker 2: of A. Over time, the concept morphed to include the
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: more material, owning a home, a stable family unit and
• 0:51
  Speaker 2: financial success, and the concept travelled across the globe. even
• 0:56
  Speaker 2: as far as an island on the other side of
• 0:58
  Speaker 2: the world called Australia.
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: Mum said to me, are you sure you're happy with Tom?
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: Because if you're not, we can make it all go away.
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: You never have to go back. I said, no, Mum,
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: what are you talking about? It's the best thing that's
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: ever happened to me. I'm living in America, I'm living
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: the dream.
• 1:13
  Speaker 2: But there might be a giveaway into the reality of
• 1:15
  Speaker 2: this concept in its very title, because a dream is
• 1:18
  Speaker 2: something that only happens in your mind. The very concept
• 1:22
  Speaker 2: of a dream is not reality at all.
• 1:25
  Speaker 1: The first time I thought I was actively faking happiness,
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: like I wasn't happy. Got to a point where I
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: was so dissociated from reality, I did not know what
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: was real or not. It was just, it was awful.
• 1:47
  Speaker 2: I'm Georgia Love and this is Everyone Has an Ex.
• 1:49
  Speaker 2: Come with me as we dive into a collection of
• 1:52
  Speaker 2: unconventional stories about relationships past, through the eyes and the
• 1:56
  Speaker 2: hearts of the very people who lived them. Meet Cassie.
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: She was 27 when this part of her story began.
• 2:05
  Speaker 2: And yes, it's a story of a relationship. I mean,
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: that's what this podcast is all about. But it's not
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: the story of her first. Cassie had actually just come
• 2:13
  Speaker 2: out of a serious relationship that had lasted eight years.
• 2:16
  Speaker 2: In her own words, he was a wonderful guy, they
• 2:19
  Speaker 2: loved each other and were happy. But sadly, she ended
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: up admitting to herself what she'd probably known for the
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: better part of half of those eight years. It just
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: wasn't it.
• 2:29
  Speaker 3: It just wasn't what I wanted.
• 2:33
  Speaker 1: I kind of knew if I stayed there that my
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: life would be prescriptive and I was looking for a
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: little bit more adventure, a little bit more excitement, both
• 2:42
  Speaker 1: in my life, my career and my travel and also
• 2:47
  Speaker 1: my relationship. So living in a house with three girls
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: after that was.
• 2:52
  Speaker 3: Just, it was great.
• 2:53
  Speaker 1: There was lots of drinks, lots of girl time, lots
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: of going out. And it was probably when Tinder started
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: to boom, which was all very exciting and kind of
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: was past the time when Tinder was maybe used just
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: exclusively for hookups. And we were starting to use it
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: to find potential partners. We're all like, late 20s, all
• 3:16
  Speaker 1: getting like a little bit nervous about turning 30 and
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: thinking that 30 was when we should be married with
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: kids and what the fuck are we going to do
• 3:26
  Speaker 1: to get us from 27 to 30 and getting that
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: kind of ideal dream that we were told we needed
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: and wanted, essentially. Most either Saturday or Sunday mornings would
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: all jump into someone's bed, would get on our phones,
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: would scroll through Tinder, would talk about who we're chatting to.
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: if someone would stop chatting to us. And there was
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: this guy that I'd been chatting to called Tom, who
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: the chat had been like, it'd been quite consistent, very lovely,
• 3:53
  Speaker 1: very well written and very respectful and very forward kind
• 3:57
  Speaker 1: of thing. Like he was keen to meet me. The
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: first impressions from his profile was like.
• 4:03
  Speaker 3: He's hot. He's very good looking.
• 4:07
  Speaker 1: His bio was very well written, which back then Tinder
• 4:11
  Speaker 1: profiles often weren't.
• 4:13
  Speaker 3: So that was a big kind of difference.
• 4:16
  Speaker 1: And the messages, yeah, he was always kind of like
• 4:19
  Speaker 1: asking about me, what I was up to. It wasn't
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: just him talking about his kind of life. He did
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: mention that he'd recently moved to Australia from America and
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: was looking to set up his life here.
• 4:32
  Speaker 2: What was there to lose? Cassie said yes to a date.
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: So we'd planned this date and I said yes. And
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: it was probably like a Saturday afternoon or something. We
• 4:43
  Speaker 1: had a time and place that we were meeting at.
• 4:46
  Speaker 1: And he actually tried to reschedule because he'd had a
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: big night out the night before. And I responded to
• 4:52
  Speaker 1: his message because he was like, I'm so sorry.
• 4:56
  Speaker 3: I got home way too late. I'm a little bit hungover.
• 4:58
  Speaker 1: Could we reschedule? And I said, we can cancel, but
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: you're not rescheduling. And he's like, I'll be there. So
• 5:06
  Speaker 1: I went on the date. He walked in and it's
• 5:09
  Speaker 1: so vivid in my mind even now. He walked in
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: and he's gone, wow, this is it. I'm going to
• 5:16
  Speaker 1: marry you. I'm going to marry you. I'm telling you
• 5:19
  Speaker 1: this now.
• 5:19
  Speaker 3: Literally when he just walked in and I was.
• 5:22
  Speaker 1: Obviously like taken a little bit back, but so flattered.
• 5:29
  Speaker 1: and so reassured and felt so like wanted. We had
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: a few wines at a pub that we'd, or like
• 5:38
  Speaker 1: a bar that we'd kind of decided on. Then we
• 5:41
  Speaker 1: went across the road and got a few more, but
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: just kind of got like pleasantly pissed, I would say.
• 5:46
  Speaker 1: And he was very charming, very charismatic and like better
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: looking in person than he was in his photos and
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: was telling me all about how He used to have
• 5:58
  Speaker 1: this career back in America but he always knew that
• 6:01
  Speaker 1: his heart was in Australia because he'd come to Australia
• 6:04
  Speaker 1: on a school trip and done a bit of an
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: exchange here and he just said that he fell in
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: love with it and that this is where he knew
• 6:11
  Speaker 1: he was meant to be. So once he'd saved up
• 6:14
  Speaker 1: enough money, he left his family in America and was
• 6:19
  Speaker 1: starting a life here. I'd been on a few dates
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: before then but they were always just kind of like
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: You go on a first date, then convo would taper off,
• 6:30
  Speaker 1: someone would ghost because life happens. So that's what I
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: was kind of used to. But in this instance, it
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: was like as soon as I got home, he was like,
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: when can I see you again by message? I really
• 6:42
  Speaker 1: enjoyed getting to know you. I have to see you
• 6:44
  Speaker 1: again soon. I can't wait till next weekend.
• 6:46
  Speaker 3: It went pretty quick, to be honest.
• 6:48
  Speaker 1: I reckon it was less than three dates and then
• 6:50
  Speaker 1: we were exclusive. Then we were boyfriend and girlfriend.
• 6:56
  Speaker 3: He was great.
• 6:56
  Speaker 1: He was very considerate. He gave me a lot of
• 7:01
  Speaker 1: time and I love quality time and it was never
• 7:04
  Speaker 1: a matter of when am.
• 7:06
  Speaker 3: I going to see you.
• 7:07
  Speaker 1: I always knew that I would see him that weekend
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: and it wouldn't just be a Friday night, it would
• 7:13
  Speaker 1: be the whole weekend and we'd spend the whole time
• 7:16
  Speaker 1: together and it would be great and it would be
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: midweek dinners. He made an effort to do the things
• 7:22
  Speaker 1: that I really liked doing, going for walks, exercising. finding
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: new wine bars, going on little day trips.
• 7:29
  Speaker 2: There was also extravagance, unlike Cassie had ever known.
• 7:34
  Speaker 1: It was going out for dinners and bottles of French champagne.
• 7:40
  Speaker 3: It was come over to my place, I've got a
• 7:42
  Speaker 3: date planned.
• 7:43
  Speaker 1: I'm like, what do I wear? He's like, don't worry
• 7:46
  Speaker 1: about it, just wear whatever you're going to wear. And
• 7:48
  Speaker 1: I'd come over and I'd walk into his room. He's like,
• 7:51
  Speaker 1: the door's open, just come in. And I'd come in
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: and there would be a designer dress on the bed, shoes, bag,
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: an open bottle of French champagne in a glass there
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: so I could get ready, a fancy car to take
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: us into the city to eat at top tier restaurants.
• 8:09
  Speaker 1: I was like, this guy's incredible. He was forever complimenting me.
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: I'd mentioned that like I had been in a previous relationship.
• 8:18
  Speaker 1: It was quite monotonous towards the end. It was like routine.
• 8:23
  Speaker 1: It was like we were saving to buy a house.
• 8:25
  Speaker 1: So it was like low cost dinners. And I'd kind of,
• 8:28
  Speaker 1: you know, I missed being taken out on dates. So
• 8:32
  Speaker 1: when Tom was like, well, I'm going to take you
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: out on dates and I'm going to spoil you. I
• 8:37
  Speaker 1: was like, wow, like, yes, like. I don't expect this,
• 8:41
  Speaker 1: but like it's so lovely. It made me feel really special,
• 8:46
  Speaker 1: really loved and thought about.
• 8:49
  Speaker 3: Like he'd plan things, he'd thought through things.
• 8:53
  Speaker 1: Would have like my favourite cheese when I would come over,
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: like all these big things but little things that just
• 9:01
  Speaker 1: was like he wants to do this because he wants
• 9:04
  Speaker 1: to make sure that I feel special and loved and appreciated.
• 9:08
  Speaker 1: Ticked all the boxes and I couldn't believe it. There
• 9:12
  Speaker 1: was excitement because we were always doing something new. There
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: was always just something new to look forward to and
• 9:20
  Speaker 1: it was always a bit of an anticipation. We're going
• 9:22
  Speaker 1: on a date and he says we're going to be
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: doing this but, you know, maybe we'll be doing something
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: a little bit different. So I kind of got hooked
• 9:28
  Speaker 1: on that excitement of never knowing what was going to
• 9:31
  Speaker 1: happen but always knowing that it would exceed my expectations.
• 9:34
  Speaker 1: With my friends, he was always really good at the start.
• 9:38
  Speaker 1: They thought he was great. He always made an effort
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: when he stayed over because I was living in that
• 9:42
  Speaker 1: house with three other girls to make sure he would
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: come over and come over with bags and put them
• 9:48
  Speaker 1: in the fridge and then surprise us the next morning
• 9:50
  Speaker 1: with like a big cooked breakfast, even if we're all
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: out separately and I was just with him. He made
• 9:55
  Speaker 1: an effort to speak with them, to get to know them.
• 9:58
  Speaker 1: He wanted to get to know their partners if they
• 10:00
  Speaker 1: were dating someone. Always, I felt he was quite protective
• 10:04
  Speaker 1: of them, which I really loved. And I always felt
• 10:07
  Speaker 1: quite protected by him as well. that like if anyone
• 10:11
  Speaker 1: looked or spoke to me the wrong way, he would
• 10:14
  Speaker 1: have something to say about it.
• 10:16
  Speaker 3: And I never had that before.
• 10:17
  Speaker 1: So that felt, yeah, it felt really nice to be
• 10:21
  Speaker 1: protected and to have my friends feel protected as well.
• 10:25
  Speaker 3: It was, yeah, it was heavenly.
• 10:29
  Speaker 2: For two people aged 27, one of them less than
• 10:33
  Speaker 2: a year into starting a new life in a new country,
• 10:36
  Speaker 2: the other not long out of an eight-year serious relationship,
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: Cassie and Tom felt like two kids, young and in love.
• 10:43
  Speaker 2: So after a little longer, Cassie felt it was time
• 10:46
  Speaker 2: for the next step, bringing in the family.
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: We'd been together now, I'm going to say seven months.
• 10:55
  Speaker 1: I think it had been seven months of... consistent, positive,
• 11:05
  Speaker 1: happy times. I would like, I was messaging his mum
• 11:08
  Speaker 1: on Facebook. And so I thought, well, it's like, I
• 11:12
  Speaker 1: want you to meet my family. You're now so important
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: to me. And we are starting to talk long-term. It's
• 11:17
  Speaker 1: only been seven months, but you're from America. I'm from Australia.
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: You've got a one-year visa. So you're starting to get
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: really close to that 12-month period. Like if we're going
• 11:28
  Speaker 1: to start looking at how you're going to extend your
• 11:32
  Speaker 1: time here, that's serious. Like I'd told my family I
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: was dating someone, but I hadn't introduced him on things
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: I'm quite protective of my family because everyone was devastated
• 11:43
  Speaker 1: when I ended up with my original ex, as they would,
• 11:46
  Speaker 1: because he was part of the family, I was part
• 11:47
  Speaker 1: of his.
• 11:48
  Speaker 3: So you take those.
• 11:49
  Speaker 1: Lessons and you learn them and I'm like, oh, my
• 11:51
  Speaker 1: family hurt. I never want them to hurt ever again
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: in their life. Sorry, I will never introduce someone until
• 11:57
  Speaker 1: I know I'm sure. I was nervous. I knew that
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: I'd love him or like him, but my family is
• 12:05
  Speaker 1: the most beautiful family in the world and they're very supportive,
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: very protective, and my sister especially, very protective. So he
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: met them at a family lunch and we drove up.
• 12:17
  Speaker 1: We had a lovely lunch together and then on the ride,
• 12:20
  Speaker 1: the drive home, I remember him saying, not only asking
• 12:26
  Speaker 1: but being quite insistent on what did they say about me.
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: At first it was, did they like me? I'm like,
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: of course they liked you. He's like, what did they
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: like about me? I'm like, I don't know.
• 12:39
  Speaker 3: They were nice.
• 12:40
  Speaker 1: I was happy that you were happy. And he's like,
• 12:41
  Speaker 1: I don't know, but I need like, give me, say,
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: six things. Like six things they liked about me. I
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: remember thinking it.
• 12:49
  Speaker 3: Was odd that he was, Like, fair enough, you asked.
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: Like, did they like me? Yeah, fair.
• 12:56
  Speaker 3: Yeah, no, babe, they loved you. Absolutely.
• 12:59
  Speaker 1: But to drill into that, I remember thinking this screams
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: a lot of insecurity and I hadn't seen that side.
• 13:08
  Speaker 1: And I put it down to, I thought at the time,
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: I'm like, he's meeting my family. He knows how much
• 13:13
  Speaker 1: I love them. Of course he's going to want to
• 13:16
  Speaker 1: know if they have any concerns because then he can
• 13:18
  Speaker 1: address those concerns. He can make those concerns better, go away.
• 13:21
  Speaker 1: He would chat with them. He would do that for me.
• 13:24
  Speaker 1: That's fine.
• 13:25
  Speaker 2: Cassie didn't love this, but Tom was on the other
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: side of the world, away from his own family. She
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: realised how important it was for him to feel ingrained
• 13:34
  Speaker 2: in hers.
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: Then it started happening with the friends. Did they like me? Yes,
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: of course they liked you.
• 13:40
  Speaker 3: It's so fun.
• 13:41
  Speaker 1: What did they like about me? Give me five things.
• 13:44
  Speaker 1: Met some more of my long-term school friends and their partners.
• 13:48
  Speaker 1: And it was the same insistent questioning afterwards. Did they
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: like me? Yes, of course they liked you.
• 13:53
  Speaker 3: It's so fun.
• 13:54
  Speaker 1: What did they like about me? Give me five things.
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: And then from there it started to be a little
• 14:00
  Speaker 1: bit I'd be at work and it would be like,
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: tell me 20 things you love about me. And I'm like,
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: this is odd, but sure, okay. I can name 20
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: things I love about you because then he would do
• 14:12
  Speaker 1: the same. I did think at the time it was
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: a little different, but maybe because we were starting to
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: progress in our relationship, I put it down to that.
• 14:23
  Speaker 1: He's wanting to make sure that he's wanted, valued and
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: loved by those around me, just as I did to him.
• 14:29
  Speaker 1: And if I was in America living with his family,
• 14:32
  Speaker 1: I'd want to know that they liked me too.
• 14:34
  Speaker 3: I may have gone about it differently, but this is
• 14:36
  Speaker 3: just his way of doing it.
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: And that's fine. If You want me to tell you
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: 20 things I love about you on Monday, Wednesday and Friday?
• 14:42
  Speaker 3: I can do that. That's easy.
• 14:48
  Speaker 2: There was another very real reason Tom could have been
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: feeling a bit insecure and needy at this point in
• 14:54
  Speaker 2: their relationship. He was about to go away without Cassie,
• 14:57
  Speaker 2: without anyone he knew for three months. You see, the
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: way some international visas work here in Australia is that
• 15:04
  Speaker 2: a person can stay and work for up to a
• 15:06
  Speaker 2: year without But if they want to stay longer, they
• 15:08
  Speaker 2: need to give back to the community. This usually means
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: farm work somewhere rural. And while Tom had always thought
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: he would probably want to stay longer than 12 months,
• 15:17
  Speaker 2: now he'd met and fallen in love with Cassie, he
• 15:20
  Speaker 2: knew it for sure. So off for three months he went.
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: The farm work was really challenging because we had gone
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: from spending so much time with each other to becoming like,
• 15:31
  Speaker 1: you know, pretty much codependent on each other. To him
• 15:34
  Speaker 1: now being away and not being in contact, he had
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: a job where he could be on his phone. And
• 15:40
  Speaker 1: then when he moved away, he wasn't able to be
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: on his phone and there was a distance and he
• 15:44
  Speaker 1: was living in the backpackers. And I had learnt in
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: that time that he was an ex-cocaine addict.
• 15:53
  Speaker 3: I know what farm life can be like, right?
• 15:55
  Speaker 1: You've got a bunch of backpackers, tourists, people trying to
• 15:59
  Speaker 1: extend their stay here. You've got them living in what
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: are effectively dorm rooms. And you've got little to entertain yourself.
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: So what's everyone going to do? They're going to turn
• 16:08
  Speaker 1: to alcohol, drugs and sex. So the three biggest concerns
• 16:13
  Speaker 1: that I had were now a massive reality. We kind
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: of got through that time with like a few issues
• 16:20
  Speaker 1: where maybe I couldn't get in contact with him for 24,
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: 36 hours.
• 16:25
  Speaker 3: But when I.
• 16:26
  Speaker 1: Did, I'm so sorry, lost my phone while I was
• 16:29
  Speaker 1: out picking, blah, blah, blah.
• 16:31
  Speaker 3: Oh, my God, I'm so sorry.
• 16:31
  Speaker 1: Like I just wanted to make sure you were safe.
• 16:34
  Speaker 3: Hated how, I'm.
• 16:37
  Speaker 1: Going to use the word obsessive I kind of became
• 16:40
  Speaker 1: over it through the lack of communication and my worry
• 16:44
  Speaker 1: for it as well. Having your partner somewhere that has
• 16:48
  Speaker 1: two of his biggest vices and not hearing from him
• 16:52
  Speaker 1: for 36 hours isn't a nice feeling. And then so
• 16:57
  Speaker 1: he would contact me And I would be like a
• 17:01
  Speaker 1: little bit distressed being like, I was worried about you. Like,
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: please just communicate. I don't care what you're doing. Like
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: send me a white heart or something. Just send me
• 17:09
  Speaker 1: something so I know you're okay. And he was like,
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: why are you so controlling of me and what I'm doing?
• 17:17
  Speaker 1: Don't you trust me? I trusted him. I didn't trust.
• 17:26
  Speaker 1: I trusted him and I felt that I Couldn't be
• 17:31
  Speaker 1: trusted to trust him. I felt like I was the
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: one overstepping the mark, that I was the one pushing
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: the boundaries by wanting to hear from him every 12 hours.
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: But that was on me because I should trust him.
• 17:44
  Speaker 1: But I felt that I did, but it was coming
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: across like I didn't. And I felt very, very bad
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: about that. And what was wrong with me to not
• 17:53
  Speaker 1: trust my boyfriend of almost a year. I believe that
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: was kind of the turning point. It was almost like
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: once I brought it up, it got worse. Conversation would
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: always be, why don't you trust me? What is wrong
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: in your mind that you don't trust? Your boyfriend, who's
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: spending three months of his life at a farm for you.
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: He's wonderful.
• 18:22
  Speaker 3: He's great.
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: He's sacrificing so much. And I can't not hear from
• 18:27
  Speaker 1: him for 36 hours?
• 18:30
  Speaker 3: Like, that's on me. That's on me.
• 18:35
  Speaker 1: Was he testing me? Was this a moment that I
• 18:38
  Speaker 1: needed to grow? Was this a me thing? Was he
• 18:41
  Speaker 1: trying to help me in a way to, you know,
• 18:45
  Speaker 1: be able to go three days without hearing from your partner?
• 18:49
  Speaker 1: At this point, I definitely started to notice I felt
• 18:55
  Speaker 1: a lot more anxious. I was kind of living on
• 19:00
  Speaker 1: the edge of wanting to reach out to him, to
• 19:03
  Speaker 1: speak to him, but not wanting to be needy. I
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: pulled away from social situations back home because.
• 19:09
  Speaker 3: I would sit home and wait to hear from him.
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: All I could do when I was out is look
• 19:15
  Speaker 1: at my phone and call and see. It's now been
• 19:19
  Speaker 1: 24 hours. It's now been 25 hours. It's now been
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: 26 hours. And I noticed myself turning a little bit crazy.
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: There was one thing Cassie would keep reminding herself. It
• 19:33
  Speaker 2: was only three months. And each day, whether it was
• 19:36
  Speaker 2: one she'd heard from him or not, that time was
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: ticking down.
• 19:39
  Speaker 1: Oh, when he came back, it was great. It was
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: absolutely amazing. I apologised profusely for how needy I was
• 19:48
  Speaker 1: and for my lack of perceived trust. Never, never vocalised
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: what it was that I was actually concerned about. I
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: didn't want to be perceived as being more crazy than
• 20:00
  Speaker 1: he currently thought I was. So never vocalised it, never
• 20:05
  Speaker 1: put it into words. Was just so happy when he
• 20:09
  Speaker 1: came back and that we could live together.
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, there was that too. While Tom had done
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: his three months work to get another year on his visa...
• 20:17
  Speaker 2: That would only get him another 12 months. The way
• 20:19
  Speaker 2: to stay longer? A partner visa. To get that, you
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: have to prove to the government you're in a legitimate,
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: serious relationship so you could stay with your Aussie significant
• 20:28
  Speaker 2: other as long as you both want it.
• 20:30
  Speaker 3: It was more sure than ever. Our relationship had been registered.
• 20:33
  Speaker 1: We were already starting to prepare for going through our
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: de facto visa, started to document a lot more.
• 20:40
  Speaker 3: And you have to have this evidence for.
• 20:42
  Speaker 1: Our it was either two or three years, I can't remember,
• 20:45
  Speaker 1: but it was a significant period of time.
• 20:47
  Speaker 3: So it was like, well, we need to.
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: Start now because we've got one more year in Australia
• 20:52
  Speaker 1: and we need to build up as much evidence we
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: can in that one year and then look at our
• 20:58
  Speaker 1: next steps. I took control of that and started looking
• 21:01
  Speaker 1: at what they would look at and it was like
• 21:04
  Speaker 1: joint financials, joint socials, joint livelihoods and joint family interactions.
• 21:10
  Speaker 1: We'd started joint bank accounts and we wanted to live
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: with each other. I wanted to live with him. I
• 21:17
  Speaker 1: wanted to live this excitement, like fun-filled, extreme happiness life
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: that I knew we could have. So we moved in together.
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: It was incredible. It was the first time officially living
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: with a partner. So I was very excited. We had
• 21:37
  Speaker 1: a beautiful one-bedroom apartment. We absolutely, I loved the fact
• 21:42
  Speaker 1: that he was just there, that it was fun, that
• 21:47
  Speaker 1: we could come home, watch our TV shows, cook together,
• 21:51
  Speaker 1: always be in the same bed, just being like there
• 21:54
  Speaker 1: with each other.
• 21:54
  Speaker 3: It was really, really fun to start with.
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: Trying to pinpoint when the natural progression happened, but.
• 22:07
  Speaker 3: It went from.
• 22:10
  Speaker 1: Always being excited when he would come home to being
• 22:14
  Speaker 1: quite anxious when he was coming home. The first time
• 22:17
  Speaker 1: was he came home and we just had the one car,
• 22:20
  Speaker 1: we had my car. I was working quite close to
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: where we were living and I could use public transport
• 22:25
  Speaker 1: so he would have my car. And I'd, before I
• 22:28
  Speaker 1: met Tom, I'd been in a pretty significant car accident.
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: So I was very, always very conscious about safe driving.
• 22:36
  Speaker 3: And at.
• 22:38
  Speaker 1: One point he came home having driven my car and
• 22:42
  Speaker 1: was so intoxicated that I couldn't understand how he drove
• 22:46
  Speaker 1: my car home safe.
• 22:48
  Speaker 3: So I got mad.
• 22:51
  Speaker 1: I got mad and I raised my voice and I said,
• 22:55
  Speaker 1: what the fuck are you doing? Do not endanger yourself
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: and do not endanger other people on the road.
• 23:04
  Speaker 3: And I was quite... strong in my anger.
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: And disapproval because I can't tolerate that, having known what
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: happens when people are unsafe on the road. And that
• 23:16
  Speaker 1: conversation did not go down well. That conversation resulted in
• 23:24
  Speaker 1: him raising his voice to extremes to some physical shoving
• 23:28
  Speaker 1: and I... ended up pinned against the wall, kind of
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: put his forearm on my neck and collarbone because he
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: couldn't believe that I didn't trust him to drive safe.
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: And I could smell the beer on his breath, the
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: bourbon on his breath, whatever, but I was up against
• 23:47
  Speaker 1: the wall and I didn't know what to do. I
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: remember thinking this isn't okay, but fuck, he's right. There
• 23:56
  Speaker 1: is this constant thread of me not trusting him and
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: I need to do better. I'm funny about cars and
• 24:04
  Speaker 1: that's a me issue and if I haven't dealt with it,
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: then I need to deal with it because I can't
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: make it a him issue and I can't take it
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: out on him because nothing happened. He got home safe.
• 24:13
  Speaker 1: He got home safe. Everyone else on the road was
• 24:14
  Speaker 1: safe that he crossed by and the car was safe
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: and we're in our apartment together. What more did I want?
• 24:21
  Speaker 1: You should never make someone that angry. I'm not an
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: aggravating person. I'm a calming person. I promise I'm going
• 24:27
  Speaker 1: to be able to get calm situations that are stressful
• 24:29
  Speaker 1: and here I am with the love of my life.
• 24:31
  Speaker 3: Pinned against a wall. Because I've angered him.
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: I angered him.
• 24:36
  Speaker 3: That was on me.
• 24:41
  Speaker 1: We ended up, I was pushed against the wall. I
• 24:44
  Speaker 1: ended up pushing him, so he pushed me again. And
• 24:47
  Speaker 1: there was a lot of yelling and I did end
• 24:49
  Speaker 1: up going to the bathroom and just closing the door
• 24:51
  Speaker 1: and locking the door. Because I just did not know
• 24:53
  Speaker 1: what else would happen. I was scared, I was frightened
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: and I was sad in myself.
• 24:59
  Speaker 3: I thought, this isn't him. He's not, never... done anything
• 25:03
  Speaker 3: to this.
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: Extreme he had been intoxicated it's a booze thing he's
• 25:07
  Speaker 1: fine you're fine you haven't seen him in this angered
• 25:11
  Speaker 1: drunk state before the safest thing to do for our
• 25:15
  Speaker 1: relationship was just to remove myself from the situation knowing
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: that in an hour or so I could let myself
• 25:21
  Speaker 1: out hopefully and it would be okay and then when
• 25:24
  Speaker 1: I did come out he was in tears and He
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: was mortified. I'm so sorry. You know that's not me.
• 25:31
  Speaker 1: You know how much I love you. Yes, I know
• 25:34
  Speaker 1: how much you love me. I love you just as much.
• 25:36
  Speaker 1: It's fine. It's okay. It's a once-off. But sadly, it
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: wasn't a once-off. Maybe a week or two later, we
• 25:45
  Speaker 1: were out. We'd both been drinking, not to excess, getting
• 25:50
  Speaker 1: a train home, and he was trying to get his
• 25:54
  Speaker 1: train ticket to work, and it wouldn't work. So I
• 25:56
  Speaker 1: went over to help him. and he hit me so
• 26:01
  Speaker 1: hard on the shoulder that some public transport officers came over.
• 26:05
  Speaker 3: He hit me because I was trying to help him.
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: I was trying to help him work his card, and
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: I shouldn't have made him to feel embarrassed or incompetent.
• 26:15
  Speaker 1: I should have just let him figure it out, or
• 26:17
  Speaker 1: I should have asked him if he wanted help and
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: not just gone over there and helped him. So he
• 26:21
  Speaker 1: hit me quite hard on the upper arm, quite violently,
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: The public transport officers came over and they immediately separated us.
• 26:33
  Speaker 1: One took him, one took me and asked me if
• 26:37
  Speaker 1: I knew this person. And I said, yes, he's my
• 26:40
  Speaker 1: long-term boyfriend. Asked me if I felt safe and I said, yes.
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: Asked me if he'd hit me and I said, no.
• 26:46
  Speaker 1: They're like, we saw it. And I'm like, no, I
• 26:49
  Speaker 1: just think you're at the wrong angle. It was fine.
• 26:51
  Speaker 3: I had a bruise.
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: It was significant.
• 26:54
  Speaker 3: I was scared.
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: And they said, you don't need to say anything. You
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: can literally like blink twice and we will just walk
• 27:03
  Speaker 1: you away and we'll walk him away in the opposite
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: direction and we'll make sure you get somewhere safe.
• 27:09
  Speaker 3: I said, don't be ridiculous. It's fine. We got like
• 27:13
  Speaker 3: obviously got back together at the train station and went
• 27:16
  Speaker 3: home and.
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: It immediately turned into a screaming match.
• 27:23
  Speaker 3: It was more screaming. It was more shoving.
• 27:26
  Speaker 1: I was so frustrated that while he was yelling at me,
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: I was digging my fingernails into the palm of my
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: hands to the point where I drew blood because I
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: just did not know how else to get out what
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: I was feeling.
• 27:37
  Speaker 3: I shoved him. So I was violent, which I later regretted.
• 27:44
  Speaker 1: That night resulted in me locking myself in the bathroom again.
• 27:48
  Speaker 3: But for the whole night, I didn't feel comfortable to
• 27:51
  Speaker 3: come out.
• 27:52
  Speaker 1: So I just slept on some towels, cried myself to
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: sleep in there. Eventually the banging stopped, the screaming stopped.
• 27:58
  Speaker 1: He went to bed and went out the next morning
• 28:00
  Speaker 1: to tears and apologies and I love you, I'm sorry.
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: And of course you're sorry. I'm sorry too. He's like,
• 28:11
  Speaker 1: you yelled at me as well. I'm like, yes, I
• 28:12
  Speaker 1: did yell. Yes, I did shove you back. I'm so,
• 28:16
  Speaker 1: so sorry.
• 28:19
  Speaker 3: I'm sorry. I'll make this better.
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: It changed the way I started to feel as a person.
• 28:32
  Speaker 1: Some of my friends and family started to notice. Yeah,
• 28:35
  Speaker 1: I had a few friends reach out and say, like,
• 28:39
  Speaker 1: are you okay? Is everything okay? The last few times
• 28:43
  Speaker 1: that we'd been out together in group situations, they had
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: noticed a switch in Tom at a certain point of
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: the night and me overcompensating. I became very good at overcompensating.
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: I became very good at lying to my friends and
• 29:02
  Speaker 1: my family because everything was fine. No, we didn't go
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: home and I didn't get screamed at for hours and
• 29:07
  Speaker 1: lock myself in the bathroom. At so many points, I
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: felt like I was so unsafe that I just did
• 29:15
  Speaker 1: not know what would happen if it were to continue.
• 29:19
  Speaker 1: The rage kind of outburst, I guess you would call them,
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: starting to get a lot more frequent.
• 29:26
  Speaker 3: Sometimes it could be drinking sometimes.
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: It could be because I was talking about money um
• 29:32
  Speaker 1: sometimes it could be because why am I making a
• 29:36
  Speaker 1: different meal for him when I'm making a different meal
• 29:38
  Speaker 1: for me when I've traditionally just eat like chicken and
• 29:42
  Speaker 1: salad and things like that and I know that he's
• 29:44
  Speaker 1: working he's a man so maybe he'd want some pasta
• 29:46
  Speaker 1: some carbs or whatever but how dare I give him
• 29:52
  Speaker 1: bulk cheap food? It got to a point where I
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: was worried about him coming home and what mood he
• 29:59
  Speaker 1: would be in to just constantly working on eggshells and
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: managing every situation.
• 30:07
  Speaker 3: It got to a point... One time, it was a
• 30:11
  Speaker 3: particularly bad time.
• 30:12
  Speaker 1: I think he'd come home drunk again driving my car
• 30:15
  Speaker 1: and I lost it, absolutely lost it.
• 30:18
  Speaker 3: So he lost it back at me.
• 30:20
  Speaker 1: But it was to the point where I'm like, I'm
• 30:23
  Speaker 1: not going to be safe even if I lock myself
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: in the bathroom.
• 30:25
  Speaker 3: I have to leave. I have to leave.
• 30:28
  Speaker 1: So I left and went to one of my friend's
• 30:29
  Speaker 1: houses and I ended up having to do that so
• 30:32
  Speaker 1: many times that I just ended up having to spare
• 30:33
  Speaker 1: key to her house.
• 30:35
  Speaker 3: She was very worried.
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: I think at maybe one point she may have spoken
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: to my sister about it. I was very good, very
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: good at convincing her otherwise and convincing that we don't
• 30:47
  Speaker 1: need to worry the fam. It's fine, babe. Every now
• 30:50
  Speaker 1: and then he comes home, he's too drunk and I
• 30:51
  Speaker 1: need to leave.
• 30:52
  Speaker 3: Like it's just better, I'll sleep better, blah, blah, blah.
• 30:56
  Speaker 3: She was trying her best.
• 31:00
  Speaker 1: She also, I could see she knew that if she
• 31:04
  Speaker 1: pushed too far, I would stop coming. And so she
• 31:09
  Speaker 1: was just happy to be a safe space because if
• 31:12
  Speaker 1: she had started to push, if she had started to say,
• 31:15
  Speaker 1: this isn't okay, you've come over one more time, I'm
• 31:17
  Speaker 1: telling your parents, I would not go over.
• 31:20
  Speaker 3: It was that simple. So she was doing all that
• 31:23
  Speaker 3: she could to.
• 31:24
  Speaker 1: Make sure that I was safe but that our lines
• 31:28
  Speaker 1: of communication were ever opened if I felt the need.
• 31:32
  Speaker 1: The escalation happened quite quickly.
• 31:35
  Speaker 3: It was almost like Once it happened.
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: And we got through it and we were fine and
• 31:42
  Speaker 1: we could get back to our high highs and the
• 31:45
  Speaker 1: fun and the excitement and the love and the admiration
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: for each other, oh, God, it was good. It was
• 31:55
  Speaker 1: like ecstasy. It was an addiction. I needed those high highs.
• 32:00
  Speaker 1: I needed that time. I needed us to be good.
• 32:03
  Speaker 1: We were still getting that. It was great when it
• 32:05
  Speaker 1: was good.
• 32:05
  Speaker 3: It was good.
• 32:06
  Speaker 1: It was good.
• 32:07
  Speaker 3: It's too good.
• 32:08
  Speaker 1: It was like this can't, like how am I so lucky?
• 32:12
  Speaker 1: How am I so lucky to have this person who
• 32:15
  Speaker 1: makes me feel this good and who I can make
• 32:18
  Speaker 1: feel that good?
• 32:20
  Speaker 3: That's awesome. That's special.
• 32:23
  Speaker 1: Then the lo-vo would happen and you deal with that,
• 32:28
  Speaker 1: the anger, the rage, the emotional.
• 32:33
  Speaker 3: Kind of control, the, gaslighting.
• 32:37
  Speaker 1: I didn't really know what was real and what wasn't,
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: and then the unoccasional physical abuse.
• 32:45
  Speaker 2: Now, dear listener, hearing this from the outside is a very,
• 32:48
  Speaker 2: very different thing to living it. Cassie has always been
• 32:51
  Speaker 2: a smart, switched-on, headstrong woman. She'd been in great relationships before.
• 32:56
  Speaker 2: She wasn't naive. She wasn't tainted by her past or
• 32:59
  Speaker 2: so desperate for connection she chose to ignore red flags.
• 33:03
  Speaker 2: But that's the thing about manipulation, coercion, love bombing and abuse.
• 33:08
  Speaker 2: They can weave their way into anyone's world, often without
• 33:12
  Speaker 2: them seeing it coming or even noticing when they'd well
• 33:15
  Speaker 2: and truly made themselves at home.
• 33:17
  Speaker 1: It would never intentionally hurt me. All these outbursts were unintentional.
• 33:24
  Speaker 1: It started maybe three months living with each other and
• 33:27
  Speaker 1: within the next six months I'd had to... Yeah, leave
• 33:33
  Speaker 1: the house at least once a month because I felt
• 33:35
  Speaker 1: unsafe and maybe every other second week was another blow-up
• 33:39
  Speaker 1: where it would be a locking in the bathroom or
• 33:43
  Speaker 1: locking him out kind of situation. I was losing weight
• 33:47
  Speaker 1: because of the anxiety and constant stress that I was
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: living in suppressed my appetite quite significantly. So, yeah, the
• 33:57
  Speaker 1: weight started to drop off a little bit, a bit,
• 34:01
  Speaker 1: would always make sure like things are like good and
• 34:03
  Speaker 1: clean and that dinner was equal and fine.
• 34:06
  Speaker 3: I was anxious a lot about I think.
• 34:10
  Speaker 1: Everything else was fine. There was nothing else I could control.
• 34:12
  Speaker 3: The home environment was good. I was good. I was
• 34:14
  Speaker 3: in a good mood.
• 34:15
  Speaker 1: I'd always greet him with the most excitement that I could.
• 34:19
  Speaker 1: It would just be I don't know what excitement I'm
• 34:21
  Speaker 1: going to get back. So that's what it started to be.
• 34:23
  Speaker 1: And it started to be a lot of managing in
• 34:25
  Speaker 1: social situations as well. He would be so over-the-top loving,
• 34:29
  Speaker 1: so over-the-top caring, So I was generous, but that I
• 34:34
  Speaker 1: knew my friends would be like, that's, I knew they
• 34:37
  Speaker 1: would think it was weird. He was doing it so
• 34:40
  Speaker 1: he could be liked. And so if I ever said anything,
• 34:43
  Speaker 1: it would just be discontinued. So I could never, and
• 34:46
  Speaker 1: I would never, absolutely not. I would bend over backwards
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: to make sure everyone knew how great he was and
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: how great we were. And yes, we were going to
• 34:56
  Speaker 1: progress our relationship. I never once questioned that we shouldn't
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: be together. that this was the right thing. I knew
• 35:05
  Speaker 1: what he'd sacrificed. I knew I loved him. I knew
• 35:08
  Speaker 1: he loved me and I knew we could make it
• 35:10
  Speaker 1: work and that I could make it better. And, yeah,
• 35:13
  Speaker 1: we were going to move to America together.
• 35:15
  Speaker 2: Whoa, whoa, whoa. They were going to what?
• 35:18
  Speaker 1: After living together for about a year, we made the
• 35:20
  Speaker 1: decision to go to the States. At that point, processing
• 35:24
  Speaker 1: visas was quicker offshore than onshore and I knew that
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: I didn't want to spend time with his family. to
• 35:32
  Speaker 1: meet them properly and meet his siblings and his friends
• 35:36
  Speaker 1: and see where he grew up. So I said we
• 35:38
  Speaker 1: would only, we both said actually, and Tom helped to
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: say that, we are only over there so I can
• 35:47
  Speaker 1: get to know his family and so we can process
• 35:50
  Speaker 1: our visa quicker so we can move back to Aus
• 35:53
  Speaker 1: quicker and start our real life here. So we would
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: both sit on that. We made that very clear to
• 35:58
  Speaker 1: his parents as well and they were very supportive of that.
• 36:01
  Speaker 1: After he'd sacrificed so much, the least I could give
• 36:04
  Speaker 1: was a yeah. Let's go to your home, your friends,
• 36:09
  Speaker 1: your circle, your community, your happy place, your, you know,
• 36:12
  Speaker 1: what you love, what you know, and show me all
• 36:16
  Speaker 1: of that and let me support you during that. I
• 36:18
  Speaker 1: had no reservations, no reservations whatsoever. I thought it would
• 36:21
  Speaker 1: be great. I thought it would be amazing. Yeah, that
• 36:23
  Speaker 1: it would just be this big adventure that would go
• 36:25
  Speaker 1: on together and how much fun are we going to have,
• 36:27
  Speaker 1: those high highs. That's all you remember. That's all you
• 36:29
  Speaker 1: kind of know. That's all you focus on. Everything else
• 36:31
  Speaker 1: just dissipates.
• 36:32
  Speaker 3: It doesn't matter.
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: It was all an accident on both our parts. And
• 36:35
  Speaker 1: he actually did go to AA while we were in
• 36:39
  Speaker 1: Australia before we left and he did stop drinking for
• 36:42
  Speaker 1: a while, which did help the violent outbursts. It helped
• 36:47
  Speaker 1: me because this is another thing he's doing for me.
• 36:49
  Speaker 3: Look at everything he's done.
• 36:51
  Speaker 2: Trying.
• 36:52
  Speaker 3: He's trying so hard.
• 36:54
  Speaker 1: So when all that started to happen and things turned
• 36:56
  Speaker 1: around for a bit, I was excited to show him
• 37:01
  Speaker 1: that I wanted to be in his life, that I
• 37:03
  Speaker 1: wanted to get to know where he was from, his history,
• 37:05
  Speaker 1: his friends. And then it wasn't just one way. I
• 37:09
  Speaker 1: was just as committed.
• 37:11
  Speaker 2: So off they went. They hopped on the plane at
• 37:13
  Speaker 2: LAX with a dream and a cardigan.
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: I thought he would be happier and calmer there.
• 37:18
  Speaker 3: I really did.
• 37:20
  Speaker 1: Who could not be happy going back to their family
• 37:22
  Speaker 1: home to see their friends, to, you know, like see
• 37:26
  Speaker 1: this life that he'd told me about that sounded wonderful
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: and sounded so, you know, social and beautiful and, you know, lively.
• 37:35
  Speaker 3: It wasn't the case.
• 37:39
  Speaker 1: When I first got there, it was lovely. I met
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: his parents who were beautiful. I met his siblings who
• 37:48
  Speaker 1: were great. And they were thrilled to have him back.
• 37:52
  Speaker 1: They were thrilled to meet me. They'd kind of gone
• 37:55
  Speaker 1: all out. They went above and beyond and they could
• 37:59
  Speaker 1: not stop thanking me for being with Tom. There was
• 38:04
  Speaker 1: a lot of thank you so much. You've done so much.
• 38:07
  Speaker 1: He would not be where he is without you. Thank you.
• 38:11
  Speaker 1: He seems to be doing well. He seems happy. And
• 38:16
  Speaker 1: he has someone who's like from what they could tell,
• 38:20
  Speaker 1: like quite strong, family orientated, good job, sensible and putting
• 38:24
  Speaker 1: measures into place to make sure we were building a
• 38:26
  Speaker 1: foundation to live off. I felt a lot of pride
• 38:29
  Speaker 1: with his parents saying thank you so much for being
• 38:31
  Speaker 1: with Tom and helping him through and getting him back
• 38:34
  Speaker 1: on track. Not that he wasn't on track, but thank you.
• 38:37
  Speaker 1: Like that made me feel really, really special. Like, yes,
• 38:41
  Speaker 1: I can help and we're a good team. Look at
• 38:44
  Speaker 1: how good a team we are together. And they could
• 38:47
  Speaker 1: see that.
• 38:48
  Speaker 3: It made me want to do it more. I didn't
• 38:50
  Speaker 3: feel any pressure. I felt excited. I felt energised.
• 38:54
  Speaker 1: I had a remote job so I could work anywhere
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: and I knew that while we were there he was
• 38:59
  Speaker 1: going to get into landscaping, which was a hiring job
• 39:03
  Speaker 1: over there at the time, and that we could move
• 39:06
  Speaker 1: around wherever his work was to get work because I
• 39:09
  Speaker 1: could work remote from anywhere.
• 39:11
  Speaker 3: Set for success, absolutely. What could go wrong?
• 39:17
  Speaker 1: We started by living at his parents' place because they
• 39:20
  Speaker 1: were often away. I started to get to know his
• 39:23
  Speaker 1: parents quite well and his father was consistently thankful and
• 39:29
  Speaker 1: his mother, I thought, was lovely but very, very reserved.
• 39:33
  Speaker 1: Like she didn't have a life, she didn't have a
• 39:36
  Speaker 1: social connection and highlighted the day. or every second day
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: was going to the grocery shop. So, yeah, I just
• 39:44
  Speaker 1: thought that she was isolated and quite sad in her
• 39:49
  Speaker 1: day-to-day life but then Tom's father would come home and
• 39:54
  Speaker 1: she was, You know, dinner would be already cooked and
• 39:58
  Speaker 1: she was happy and he was happy and everything was
• 40:01
  Speaker 1: kind of fine. And we became quite friendly, as I
• 40:04
  Speaker 1: did with his siblings and their partners. But the work
• 40:09
  Speaker 1: that Tom was doing while we were in the States
• 40:12
  Speaker 1: was a lot of contract work. So that meant that
• 40:15
  Speaker 1: we were often travelling together. a couple of hours from
• 40:19
  Speaker 1: home so he could do like a two-week contract. So
• 40:22
  Speaker 1: we were staying at Airbnbs that were quite cheap and
• 40:27
  Speaker 1: often the Airbnbs would be a massive house with 12
• 40:30
  Speaker 1: different rooms and there's different families, different couples living in
• 40:33
  Speaker 1: each of every room. But I was still working remotely
• 40:36
  Speaker 1: so I'd have to work from there and he would
• 40:38
  Speaker 1: leave and be gone for maybe 10 hours of the
• 40:40
  Speaker 1: day and I'd have no one else to talk to.
• 40:41
  Speaker 1: And during that time I did start to become quite...
• 40:46
  Speaker 1: depressed um I'd work out a lot so I really
• 40:50
  Speaker 1: had um and if he got home I'd be like
• 40:53
  Speaker 1: oh you know let's like do something or go for
• 40:55
  Speaker 1: a walk like I haven't had any social interaction it's
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: hard to make friends because we're constantly moving but then
• 41:01
  Speaker 1: like how could I make him want to be social
• 41:04
  Speaker 1: when he's just been out working all day so it
• 41:07
  Speaker 1: would be very much um yeah my need for wanting
• 41:11
  Speaker 1: to do stuff together doing the fun things that we
• 41:13
  Speaker 1: did back in Australia um um wasn't accepted over there
• 41:17
  Speaker 1: and it wasn't okay so asking for those things wasn't
• 41:21
  Speaker 1: okay I was living on like eggshells like already knowing
• 41:25
  Speaker 1: from like others what could happen if I upset him
• 41:27
  Speaker 1: um so was yeah I was just very very sad
• 41:32
  Speaker 1: very lonely a lot of times where he would come
• 41:36
  Speaker 1: home from work late very late I wouldn't know when
• 41:38
  Speaker 1: he was coming home and I was in a house
• 41:41
  Speaker 1: with 12 you know rooms with different strangers in them
• 41:43
  Speaker 1: or six rooms different strangers in them so I didn't
• 41:46
  Speaker 1: feel comfortable or safe to leave the room to, you know,
• 41:49
  Speaker 1: go out and make dinner in the communal kitchen or something.
• 41:52
  Speaker 1: So it would be 12, 15-hour days where I would
• 41:55
  Speaker 1: just be there, he would come home, probably having been like,
• 41:59
  Speaker 1: you know, drinking her out with workmates. So then as
• 42:02
  Speaker 1: soon as I recognised that, it was a no-go. It
• 42:06
  Speaker 1: was just fine, you're happy, we'll do whatever. And that
• 42:10
  Speaker 1: was just the way that we kind of lived. Not
• 42:13
  Speaker 1: quite the American dream.
• 42:15
  Speaker 2: For the first time in their now two-year-long relationship, Cassie
• 42:19
  Speaker 2: felt doubt. She'd been certain Tom being at home would
• 42:22
  Speaker 2: alleviate his stresses and make him happier, but it hadn't.
• 42:27
  Speaker 2: It made Cassie start to realise she wasn't happier either.
• 42:31
  Speaker 1: You know how they say once a mirror starts to crack,
• 42:34
  Speaker 1: you see a chip and then it starts to spread?
• 42:37
  Speaker 1: I'm thinking we've filed for this visa. I've convinced everyone
• 42:40
  Speaker 1: that this is fine. I've convinced myself this is fine.
• 42:45
  Speaker 1: This is what I want and now I'm having a
• 42:49
  Speaker 1: little bit of a doubt, a little bit of a
• 42:51
  Speaker 1: I'm not sure but I've gone too far down the path.
• 42:54
  Speaker 1: I now can't turn around to my family and friends
• 42:56
  Speaker 1: and say, actually, this relationship maybe isn't healthy. Then after
• 43:01
  Speaker 1: that it would be a few instances where I would
• 43:05
  Speaker 1: start to say, like, I'm actually not quite happy about
• 43:08
  Speaker 1: how that situation was handled or how you reacted, whether
• 43:12
  Speaker 1: it was, coming home too drunk and yelling or me
• 43:15
  Speaker 1: having to lock myself away or a push or a
• 43:17
  Speaker 1: shove or something like that. And he would just say
• 43:22
  Speaker 1: that never happened. Got to a point where I was
• 43:25
  Speaker 1: so dissociated from reality, I did not know what was
• 43:29
  Speaker 1: real or not. I had to start writing down everything
• 43:32
  Speaker 1: that happened in my day because I would not know
• 43:35
  Speaker 1: what was real or not at all, like anything, did
• 43:39
  Speaker 1: not know. I was, like, actually very worried. By then
• 43:43
  Speaker 1: I'd probably dropped close to seven, eight kilos. I'm a
• 43:47
  Speaker 1: little person so that's quite significant. During that time while
• 43:50
  Speaker 1: we were in America I had to fly home because
• 43:53
  Speaker 1: my auntie was dying. So I flew home for that
• 43:59
  Speaker 1: and was back in Oz for maybe three weeks. The
• 44:02
  Speaker 1: night that she passed I was still in Oz and
• 44:05
  Speaker 1: I ended up calling in being like, you know, my
• 44:07
  Speaker 1: auntie's just passed away. And that's all I said and
• 44:13
  Speaker 1: the rest of the conversation somehow flipped into me apologising
• 44:16
  Speaker 1: to him because I'd burdened him with this news when
• 44:20
  Speaker 1: he was trying to work and he was trying to
• 44:21
  Speaker 1: get a job and he was trying to help his
• 44:23
  Speaker 1: friends who were getting married and I'm upset but I
• 44:26
  Speaker 1: shouldn't be so needy, it's late, don't call. Because that
• 44:30
  Speaker 1: was a me thing, not a him thing, not an
• 44:31
  Speaker 1: us thing. And then I went back to America and....
• 44:39
  Speaker 3: We were at the family summer house and.
• 44:43
  Speaker 1: He was being really weird and I knew something could
• 44:45
  Speaker 1: happen while I was away but I didn't question it
• 44:46
  Speaker 1: because why would I question it because I'm not going
• 44:48
  Speaker 1: to start an argument.
• 44:49
  Speaker 3: Or start a rage blackout again.
• 44:51
  Speaker 1: And he proposed to me that night. And I just
• 44:57
  Speaker 1: went back and I was still pretty fucking devastated and
• 45:01
  Speaker 1: he was weird. We were on the little pier, little
• 45:05
  Speaker 1: dock at the summer house and I remember always saying,
• 45:08
  Speaker 1: I was like, I've seen you that would get engaged
• 45:10
  Speaker 1: because that was always what was going to happen and
• 45:13
  Speaker 1: I wanted there to be bubbles and fairy lights.
• 45:15
  Speaker 3: That's all I wanted. And there was nothing.
• 45:19
  Speaker 1: It was freezing cold. We were rugged up. I was sad.
• 45:24
  Speaker 1: I'd just seen my family. It was only us two.
• 45:27
  Speaker 3: He got down on one knee and said, will you
• 45:29
  Speaker 3: marry me?
• 45:30
  Speaker 2: There were no bubbles, no fairy lights. Cassie was deeply grieving.
• 45:35
  Speaker 2: It wasn't a special occasion or a special night in
• 45:37
  Speaker 2: any way. But this was the man she'd told herself
• 45:41
  Speaker 2: and everyone else she would spend the rest of her
• 45:43
  Speaker 2: life with. Nothing about this felt right in the moment,
• 45:47
  Speaker 2: but still she heard herself say yes.
• 45:49
  Speaker 4: It wasn't the time. It was so insensitive and I
• 45:57
  Speaker 4: just was a bit confused by it.
• 46:01
  Speaker 1: And I said yes and that was fine, put him
• 46:04
  Speaker 1: in the ring, gave him a kiss and he's like,
• 46:07
  Speaker 1: stay here, I'll go up and cook us dinner. He
• 46:10
  Speaker 1: didn't go up and cook dinner, he went into the shed,
• 46:12
  Speaker 1: got drunk, called friends, burnt dinner and I probably didn't
• 46:15
  Speaker 1: see him for four hours.
• 46:17
  Speaker 3: And it was just, it was awful. I went to
• 46:19
  Speaker 3: bed by myself.
• 46:20
  Speaker 1: I went to bed by myself, I woke up the
• 46:22
  Speaker 1: next morning by myself, went for a run, came back,
• 46:26
  Speaker 1: his parents were there because he told his parents and...
• 46:30
  Speaker 1: I had to be all happy and then we were
• 46:33
  Speaker 1: all happy. It was the first time I thought I
• 46:37
  Speaker 1: was actively faking happiness. I started to significantly question what
• 46:43
  Speaker 1: our life would look like and I did bring it
• 46:47
  Speaker 1: up to him once when he was calm and it
• 46:52
  Speaker 1: was to the point where I was like, I don't
• 46:54
  Speaker 1: think I can do this, like we are near ending. And...
• 46:59
  Speaker 1: He ended up convincing me to.
• 47:00
  Speaker 3: Do couple therapy.
• 47:01
  Speaker 1: It was like quite strong in my wording and he said,
• 47:07
  Speaker 1: if that's the case, I'm willing to work and I'm
• 47:09
  Speaker 1: willing to do anything for you. It was just after
• 47:11
  Speaker 1: we got engaged and it was one or two sessions
• 47:17
  Speaker 1: and then after that we had a really good period
• 47:19
  Speaker 1: so there was no need to go back. He was
• 47:20
  Speaker 1: making more of an effort to be back home, spending
• 47:24
  Speaker 1: more time together, doing fun things together. When you have
• 47:27
  Speaker 1: a few good weeks, it's done. Everything else fades away.
• 47:32
  Speaker 2: The addictive high was back. Tom was happy, which in
• 47:35
  Speaker 2: turn made her happy. The doubts, the concerns, the fear,
• 47:39
  Speaker 2: it all retreated. Cassie wasn't going to let that part
• 47:41
  Speaker 2: of her brain take back over. She had a wedding
• 47:44
  Speaker 2: to plan.
• 47:45
  Speaker 3: I was really excited about planning the wedding.
• 47:47
  Speaker 1: Really, really.
• 47:48
  Speaker 3: It was almost like, okay, we've done it.
• 47:51
  Speaker 1: We're We're good. Like this is it.
• 47:54
  Speaker 3: This is what we've been working towards.
• 47:55
  Speaker 1: So happy, so much fun. I came back to Oz
• 47:58
  Speaker 1: maybe once more because I wanted to see my family
• 48:00
  Speaker 1: after I got engaged, picked out my bridesmaid, went wedding venue, searching, had.
• 48:08
  Speaker 3: An engagement party over there. By myself, he didn't come.
• 48:14
  Speaker 1: But it was lovely. Everyone was really happy. This was
• 48:19
  Speaker 1: just before I was turning 30, so mum and dad
• 48:21
  Speaker 1: were like, great, we'll come over for your 30th birthday.
• 48:24
  Speaker 1: That was really exciting. I went back to America and
• 48:29
  Speaker 1: it wasn't too much longer until mum and dad kind
• 48:31
  Speaker 1: of came over.
• 48:33
  Speaker 3: The plan was for us to spend a week all.
• 48:35
  Speaker 1: Together at the family summer house and then mum and
• 48:39
  Speaker 1: dad and I would travel kind of like up the coast,
• 48:43
  Speaker 1: mum and dad and I, for two weeks and then
• 48:45
  Speaker 1: Tom was going to meet us in New York. That's
• 48:47
  Speaker 1: when my actual 30th was, but he had his mate's
• 48:50
  Speaker 1: Bucks party. So I said to him, like, stay for
• 48:53
  Speaker 1: the Bucks. Like, you know, you're going to be moving
• 48:55
  Speaker 1: back to Oz. We'll travel back for the wedding, but
• 48:57
  Speaker 1: you're here.
• 48:57
  Speaker 3: That's fine.
• 48:59
  Speaker 1: So my mum and dad came over and we spent
• 49:01
  Speaker 1: time at the summer house and Tom was odd.
• 49:04
  Speaker 3: Like, he was weird.
• 49:05
  Speaker 1: He was spending days in his room. He wouldn't come out.
• 49:08
  Speaker 1: I'd have to compensate, overcompensate. His parents were trying to overcompensate.
• 49:12
  Speaker 1: Mum and dad thought it was odd, but it's fine.
• 49:14
  Speaker 1: She seems happy and his parents seem lovely. We managed
• 49:17
  Speaker 1: to get through that week. We were travelling around. It
• 49:21
  Speaker 1: was my actual 30th birthday. Mum had taken me to
• 49:24
  Speaker 1: like it's gorgeous like winery tour came back and we're
• 49:28
  Speaker 1: preparing for dinner I said I'll go up to my
• 49:30
  Speaker 1: room freshen up so much my room freshen up opened
• 49:33
  Speaker 1: up the laptop which was Tom's um that I was
• 49:36
  Speaker 1: using for work and had been for ages opened it
• 49:40
  Speaker 1: up to play some music while I was getting ready
• 49:42
  Speaker 1: gave him a call hey babe, I miss you so much.
• 49:45
  Speaker 2: So, so much.
• 49:46
  Speaker 3: He's like, I miss you too. I wish you were here.
• 49:47
  Speaker 3: I wish I was with you. I'm so sorry.
• 49:48
  Speaker 1: I can't be there. I love you so much. I
• 49:50
  Speaker 1: can't wait to marry you.
• 49:51
  Speaker 3: Great.
• 49:51
  Speaker 1: Awesome. Going out here with mum and dad. It's like, awesome.
• 49:53
  Speaker 3: Have a good time.
• 49:54
  Speaker 1: I hung up and the laptop started getting like all
• 49:58
  Speaker 1: these like beeps, like these message notifications. I'm like, that
• 50:02
  Speaker 1: doesn't normally happen. Turns out I was, the laptop was
• 50:06
  Speaker 1: logged into his iMessenger and So I was just clicking
• 50:10
  Speaker 1: XXX to start. Like, I don't need to see those.
• 50:12
  Speaker 1: But then more came up and I thought it was
• 50:14
  Speaker 1: a girl's name. No name I recognised. I opened up
• 50:20
  Speaker 1: the message and it was pretty sexually explicit. Like, very
• 50:27
  Speaker 1: sexually explicit from Tom to her. Like, at, like, live
• 50:34
  Speaker 1: time happening right in front of my face. Photos that
• 50:37
  Speaker 1: he'd sent me while I was in Oz. I'm like,
• 50:40
  Speaker 1: I just got off the phone with you. I've seen
• 50:43
  Speaker 1: that image. I've seen that.
• 50:46
  Speaker 3: Why are you asking her and her hot yoga friend
• 50:49
  Speaker 3: to come over? So I call him again. He's like, what?
• 50:54
  Speaker 1: He starts getting angry, which I'm used to, right? Normally
• 50:58
  Speaker 1: I'd taper away. I said, I'm like, tell me, do
• 51:02
  Speaker 1: you want to marry me, yes or no?
• 51:03
  Speaker 3: He's like, yes, of course I do. Stop bothering me.
• 51:06
  Speaker 3: If you keep on being crazy like this, I'll say no.
• 51:09
  Speaker 1: I'm like, okay, okay, just checking, just checking.
• 51:12
  Speaker 3: It's my birthday. We're away.
• 51:14
  Speaker 1: You're at a box. He's like, yeah, like, it's fine. Like,
• 51:19
  Speaker 1: just go enjoy yourself. Like, stop bothering me. Stop having
• 51:21
  Speaker 1: all these trust insecurities. I hang up. More messages come through.
• 51:26
  Speaker 1: Literally seconds after, it was like complete shock.
• 51:31
  Speaker 3: I took screenshots, picked up my phone. He's like, what now?
• 51:38
  Speaker 1: Are you fucking kidding me? And I've just started reading
• 51:41
  Speaker 1: out the messages. He's like, no, no, no, don't, don't.
• 51:45
  Speaker 1: And I'm like, we're done. And I hang up. And
• 51:49
  Speaker 1: I've dropped to the floor in absolutely hysterics. My poor
• 51:55
  Speaker 1: dad's knocked on the door. Cassie, your mum's taking a
• 51:58
  Speaker 1: while to get ready.
• 51:59
  Speaker 3: Let's go to the bar and have a drink.
• 52:02
  Speaker 1: Knocked on the door again.
• 52:02
  Speaker 3: Cassie, Cassie, open the door.
• 52:05
  Speaker 1: I'm literally on the floor in hysterics.
• 52:09
  Speaker 3: Poor dad's just like, fuck, are you okay? And I've
• 52:13
  Speaker 3: just looked at him and been like, no. He's like,
• 52:17
  Speaker 3: I'm going to get your mum. Mum's like, what has happened? Like,
• 52:21
  Speaker 3: has someone died? What has happened? And I said, Tom's
• 52:25
  Speaker 3: cheating on me. I saw it all. I saw it
• 52:27
  Speaker 3: all on Messenger. He was messaging her. He was sending
• 52:31
  Speaker 3: photos that I've seen. I can't, I can't, I can't.
• 52:35
  Speaker 1: Mum's burst into tears, Dad's burst into tears, seeing your
• 52:37
  Speaker 1: father cry is awful, absolutely awful. They've just spent a
• 52:41
  Speaker 1: week at the family house. They've tried their best to
• 52:45
  Speaker 1: like him and accept everything that I've been going through
• 52:49
  Speaker 1: throughout it and, you know, take my word for it.
• 52:52
  Speaker 1: And everything that I'd lied for, everything that I'd covered for,
• 52:56
  Speaker 1: everything that I'd seated myself for had come to light.
• 53:02
  Speaker 3: And it was soul-crushing. It was just... horrific, horrific.
• 53:07
  Speaker 1: Not only was the love of my life cheating on me,
• 53:11
  Speaker 1: I'd like realised my whole last three years I'd been
• 53:18
  Speaker 1: lying to the people that loved and cared for me
• 53:20
  Speaker 1: to protect this person, to protect what I thought would
• 53:23
  Speaker 1: be a really beautiful life and now realising that I was.
• 53:26
  Speaker 3: A fool, I was stupid.
• 53:29
  Speaker 1: How could I have been so ignorant and how could
• 53:33
  Speaker 1: I have Deceited the people that actually love me to
• 53:38
  Speaker 1: protect someone that had been emotionally, physically abusing me. To
• 53:45
  Speaker 1: be left at this point.
• 53:48
  Speaker 2: And that wasn't all. The kicker?
• 53:52
  Speaker 1: Literally the day before this happened, our visa got approved.
• 53:55
  Speaker 1: He was now my legal financial responsibility in Australia. Are
• 54:00
  Speaker 1: you fucking kidding me?
• 54:02
  Speaker 3: Like what?
• 54:03
  Speaker 4: What?
• 54:05
  Speaker 1: It was awful. I did not know what to do
• 54:08
  Speaker 1: and I switched into gear and was like, nah, fuck this.
• 54:13
  Speaker 1: I'm calling his parents. So I sent them the screenshots
• 54:16
  Speaker 1: of the messages that I'd received and I said, your
• 54:19
  Speaker 1: son's just done that to me. They were mortified. All
• 54:23
  Speaker 1: my stuff was still in the family home. I am
• 54:26
  Speaker 1: not coming back. He's packing it up. I will never
• 54:29
  Speaker 1: see you guys. I'll never speak to you guys. I'll
• 54:31
  Speaker 1: never see or speak to him again. This is fun, 100%.
• 54:33
  Speaker 1: There's no going back from this.
• 54:36
  Speaker 3: He was trying to call.
• 54:37
  Speaker 1: He was trying to message.
• 54:39
  Speaker 3: He was in tears.
• 54:41
  Speaker 1: And then his dad kept on calling me, kept on
• 54:44
  Speaker 1: calling me and was like, you have to come back.
• 54:46
  Speaker 1: We'll fly for you to come back. Go to Australia
• 54:47
  Speaker 1: for a bit. We'll fly you back over business class.
• 54:49
  Speaker 1: You need to stay with Tom. You can't end it
• 54:52
  Speaker 1: this way.
• 54:53
  Speaker 3: And it was so unfair. He was emailing me.
• 54:55
  Speaker 1: He was calling.
• 54:57
  Speaker 3: He was messaging. His mum was just like, I'm in shock.
• 55:01
  Speaker 1: I'm so sorry. I'm so embarrassed. Like I don't know
• 55:04
  Speaker 1: what to do. But the fact his dad was, it's
• 55:09
  Speaker 1: not what you think it is. Tom would never do this.
• 55:12
  Speaker 1: It's not what it seems. He got cold feet. I
• 55:15
  Speaker 1: was like, are you? Like it was probably the first
• 55:19
  Speaker 1: time that I used the word manipulation in my head.
• 55:21
  Speaker 3: I'm like, are you manipulating me?
• 55:23
  Speaker 1: Because I'm pretty sure it's what your son's been doing
• 55:25
  Speaker 1: for the last three years.
• 55:27
  Speaker 3: He couldn't say otherwise.
• 55:29
  Speaker 1: I had evidence.
• 55:29
  Speaker 3: I had facts. And my parents were there. They saw it.
• 55:33
  Speaker 1: Seeing your child break down like that, how could I
• 55:37
  Speaker 1: have that person in our lives again? And if they
• 55:39
  Speaker 1: weren't there, I reckon I'd still be with him. That's
• 55:42
  Speaker 1: probably the only reason that it truly ended because I
• 55:47
  Speaker 1: was so mentally unwell and so manipulated in my mind
• 55:52
  Speaker 1: about what was reality or not that if they weren't there,
• 55:55
  Speaker 1: he could have talked me out of it and his
• 55:58
  Speaker 1: father could have as well. that they were there and
• 56:01
  Speaker 1: they saw that and I'm not bringing that pain back
• 56:03
  Speaker 1: into my family's world.
• 56:04
  Speaker 3: The flight home was awful.
• 56:07
  Speaker 1: And then I got off the plane and my friend
• 56:10
  Speaker 1: who I used to go to when, you know, she
• 56:13
  Speaker 1: got really bad and had a key to her place,
• 56:15
  Speaker 1: she was there waiting for me when I walked through
• 56:17
  Speaker 1: the gates and I just remember this sense of like
• 56:21
  Speaker 1: relief but sadness but also a guilt, the guilt I
• 56:25
  Speaker 1: felt for having deceived the people that love me I
• 56:30
  Speaker 1: felt foolish, I felt bad, but I felt like broken
• 56:35
  Speaker 1: inside because the man I thought loved me did not
• 56:40
  Speaker 1: care for me the way I need to be cared for,
• 56:42
  Speaker 1: loved me the way I need to be loved and
• 56:43
  Speaker 1: someone should be loved, but I had done wrong by
• 56:46
  Speaker 1: those who loved me and that's probably what hurt the most.
• 56:50
  Speaker 1: And then having to slowly say, like, I don't think
• 56:54
  Speaker 1: the relationship maybe was healthy and then it was also
• 56:57
  Speaker 1: having to realise I'd to contact the Australian government and say, hey,
• 57:03
  Speaker 1: all those legal documents that I wrote and signed and
• 57:06
  Speaker 1: my family and friends wrote and signed.
• 57:10
  Speaker 3: Turns out not true.
• 57:11
  Speaker 1: Turns out this was happening. Can this person please not
• 57:15
  Speaker 1: be on my visa? Can I please not be responsible
• 57:19
  Speaker 1: for them? So I had to submit an application to
• 57:22
  Speaker 1: get it all revoked, which was also a process in
• 57:24
  Speaker 1: itself because that's like the definitive end of that was
• 57:28
  Speaker 1: able to do that. The healing journey was eye-opening. I
• 57:34
  Speaker 1: had to move back with my parents because I didn't
• 57:36
  Speaker 1: have a place to live when I was 30 years old.
• 57:39
  Speaker 3: I stayed with some friends.
• 57:41
  Speaker 1: I didn't have a job back in Australia because I
• 57:43
  Speaker 1: was working remote for a company and the hours were
• 57:46
  Speaker 1: US hours.
• 57:48
  Speaker 3: So I had to end that.
• 57:49
  Speaker 1: So I was unemployed, 30 years old, and living with
• 57:52
  Speaker 1: my parents when I thought I was engaged and planning
• 57:56
  Speaker 1: a wedding. When it all kind of happened, I emailed
• 58:00
  Speaker 1: a psychologist, so I started to speak to her and
• 58:03
  Speaker 1: through that started to learn about words like gaslighting and
• 58:07
  Speaker 1: narcissistic tendencies and manipulation and emotional abuse and everything started
• 58:14
  Speaker 1: to make a lot more sense, which was comforting but
• 58:18
  Speaker 1: also really saddening as well that I was someone who
• 58:21
  Speaker 1: couldn't was had done 10 years of therapy beforehand to
• 58:25
  Speaker 1: be a you know just a healthy human being living
• 58:28
  Speaker 1: in the world that we're living in and wanting to
• 58:29
  Speaker 1: do the best that I could in all aspects that
• 58:32
  Speaker 1: I could be someone that could end up in that
• 58:34
  Speaker 1: situation like how how does that happen having lived through
• 58:40
  Speaker 1: it I can see how it happens you don't realize
• 58:44
  Speaker 1: when you're in it and when you're in it the
• 58:46
  Speaker 1: high highs and the low low it does become an
• 58:48
  Speaker 1: addiction and you do get addicted to the highs and
• 58:51
  Speaker 1: And then so when it's low, you crave, like, no,
• 58:54
  Speaker 1: I need, I need that, like, that intensity again, that
• 58:57
  Speaker 1: euphoric feeling that we feel after a fight. Like, that's
• 59:01
  Speaker 1: what kind of keeps you going and keeps the cycle going.
• 59:03
  Speaker 2: With a lot of work, a lot of help and
• 59:06
  Speaker 2: support from family and friends, and, of course, with time,
• 59:10
  Speaker 2: Cassie was able to pick up the pieces and start
• 59:13
  Speaker 2: to build back her new life. And three years after
• 59:16
  Speaker 2: she'd touched back down in Australia, totally broken, she had
• 59:20
  Speaker 2: not only built her life back up, but it was
• 59:22
  Speaker 2: one she was genuinely happy in, without Tom.
• 59:26
  Speaker 1: Managed to get through, got a job, got somewhere wonderful
• 59:29
  Speaker 1: to live, built up a beautiful community in.
• 59:32
  Speaker 3: The place that I wanted to live.
• 59:33
  Speaker 1: I'd blocked Tom on everything, numbers, emails, socials. I was
• 59:39
  Speaker 1: at work one day and I got a LinkedIn message.
• 59:42
  Speaker 3: It was from Tom.
• 59:45
  Speaker 1: Three years after everything, three years after last comms. Hey, Cassie.
• 59:50
  Speaker 3: Hope you're well.
• 59:51
  Speaker 1: Been wanting to reach out. Couldn't come back because of
• 59:55
  Speaker 1: COVID restrictions. I'm finally able to come back to Australia
• 59:59
  Speaker 1: and I'm really looking forward to trying to make it
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 1: work with you. Huh?
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 2: Are you serious?
• 1:00:07
  Speaker 1: Is this a joke? I didn't even wait for my
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 1: next psychologist appointment. I messaged her and said, hey, do
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 1: you have 15 minutes? And she called and I mentioned
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 1: it because I was like, do I respond?
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 3: Do I not respond? What do I do?
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 1: And he said he was coming back to Oz and
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 1: that he was looking forward to trying to make things work,
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 1: that he still loved me. But he didn't say where
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 1: in Oz he was moving back to.
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 3: So.
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 1: Discussed with her that would make me feel better if
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 1: I knew where in Oz, right? Maybe it's another state.
• 1:00:37
  Speaker 1: Who cares?
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 3: I've moved on, right?
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 1: He said, I'm moving back to near where we were
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 1: living at the time. He said, I'm on my way
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 1: now and two suburbs away for now and then I'll
• 1:00:52
  Speaker 1: look to move closer to home, home being where we
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 1: used to live, where I live. The physiological reaction was insane.
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 1: It was like a wave of like your body gets hot,
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 1: you start to lose vision, you feel sick, your head
• 1:01:08
  Speaker 1: starts to.
• 1:01:08
  Speaker 3: Get really cloudy.
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 1: Then the messages started. He'd obviously gotten a new number.
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 1: I had the same number. I blocked that number. Then
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 1: a new number would come up and he knew where
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 1: I was. So I went into the police station and
• 1:01:23
  Speaker 1: spoke to a police officer and And he told me
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 1: to sit down and then he took some notes and
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 1: then got someone else and they said that I should
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 1: file for an immediate interim restraining order. And I said,
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 1: I'm like, I don't know if that's necessary. And he's like,
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 1: do you feel unsafe? And I said, yes. And he's like,
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 1: then it's necessary.
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 3: It's okay.
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 1: And then that's when I kind of realised I need
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 1: to make sure I never feel unsafe again, that it's
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 1: not okay to feel unsafe. To have someone say that
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 1: to validate this actually isn't okay and if you feel unsafe,
• 1:01:59
  Speaker 1: it's not okay. And I remember feeling that and being like,
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 1: I felt unsafe for three years. I was unsafe living
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 1: in my house with my partner that I loved. Like
• 1:02:08
  Speaker 1: I was unsafe. I felt fearful every day. So I
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 1: followed up the interim restraining order because I had enough
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 1: evidence for that to be in place straight away so
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 1: that I would have served him and then I had
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 1: to go through the court system, provide evidence evidence of
• 1:02:25
  Speaker 1: everything that had kind of happened to go through the
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 1: proper process for a long-term like full effect restraining order,
• 1:02:33
  Speaker 1: which we have to provide quite a bit of evidence,
• 1:02:35
  Speaker 1: which I kind of had because I used to write
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 1: down what was reality in my phone. So having those
• 1:02:39
  Speaker 1: notes was a massive saviour in an aspect because it
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 1: meant going through that restraining order process was, it And
• 1:02:54
  Speaker 1: so I was going to see this restraining order through.
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 1: I was going to go to court. I was going
• 1:02:57
  Speaker 1: to do everything.
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 2: And she did. She was taking back the power he
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 2: had tried so many times and so hard to take away.
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 1: So I lawyered up, provided all the evidence to the court,
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 1: went to a hearing.
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 3: I was virtual.
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 1: He was virtual.
• 1:03:12
  Speaker 3: He'd got a lawyer as well.
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 1: And then I had to go back for the proper,
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 1: like in the next court hearing where more evidence was
• 1:03:19
  Speaker 1: provided and I was there in person. And it was
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 1: supposed to be like I'd be there in person but
• 1:03:26
  Speaker 1: it would be video calling from a separate room, like
• 1:03:28
  Speaker 1: these little safe rooms for people that had gone through
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 1: domestic violence just before the court kind of hearing happened.
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 3: I'm like, I need to go to the bathroom.
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 1: So they let me out to the bathroom and I
• 1:03:38
  Speaker 1: thought I was in a safe area and thought that
• 1:03:41
  Speaker 1: I'd been chaperoned. And I went to the bathroom, closed
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 1: the door, did a quick wee, came out, opened the
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 1: door and my chaperone wasn't there and it was Tom.
• 1:03:52
  Speaker 1: sitting right across the door from the toilet, staring at me,
• 1:03:55
  Speaker 1: me staring at him after having not seen him for
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 1: three years or something like that.
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 3: I've panicked. He's looked at me.
• 1:04:05
  Speaker 1: He's gone to speak. I've just turned to go back
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 1: through the door that I came through. That's the safe area.
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 3: That door's locked. That door's locked.
• 1:04:14
  Speaker 1: And I'm there and I'm like banging on the door,
• 1:04:17
  Speaker 1: being like, well, now I'm banging on the door.
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 3: It used to be him banging on the door. It's
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 3: all a lot. So that was awful. It was awful.
• 1:04:25
  Speaker 3: It was awful.
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 1: And we did the hearing and he, you know, disputed
• 1:04:30
  Speaker 1: everything or whatnot. And there was going to be a
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 1: third one. The third one you provide more evidence. I
• 1:04:36
  Speaker 1: provided more evidence.
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 3: And he was a no-show.
• 1:04:39
  Speaker 1: He was a no-show.
• 1:04:40
  Speaker 3: His lawyer was a no-show.
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 1: And the judge had looked at everything and the whole
• 1:04:44
  Speaker 1: thing maybe went for five minutes and she's like, I'm
• 1:04:47
  Speaker 1: giving this five years and, like, 2K.
• 1:04:49
  Speaker 3: He can't come within you. Done. Done. But I think
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 3: when you'd.
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 1: Been like what I now know to be gaslit so much,
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 1: you don't know what's reality, you don't know what's true,
• 1:04:59
  Speaker 1: you don't know what you deserve and you wanted something
• 1:05:02
  Speaker 1: and then that something turned out to be the worst
• 1:05:04
  Speaker 1: thing for you but you'd convinced everyone otherwise and then,
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 1: you know, telling everyone that he was awful, I was
• 1:05:12
  Speaker 1: made to feel like I was the one that was lying,
• 1:05:16
  Speaker 1: that I was making stuff up. But having had to
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 1: provide hardcore evidence... And having that evidence reviewed by a
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 1: legal professional, it gave me massive relief and a massive,
• 1:05:28
  Speaker 1: I'm not crazy, like this was all true.
• 1:05:32
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I was believed. I was believed. It's done. Simple
• 1:05:40
  Speaker 3: as that.
• 1:05:40
  Speaker 1: I can't hear from him, he can't hear from me
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 1: and got to a point where I'd sometimes forget it
• 1:05:46
  Speaker 1: even happened in a good way because I've dealt with it,
• 1:05:48
  Speaker 1: I've healed through it, I've got the right help for it.
• 1:05:50
  Speaker 1: I made very sure of that because I would not
• 1:05:51
  Speaker 1: let that take up any more time, space or energy.
• 1:05:54
  Speaker 1: It's taken up enough. That would have been four years ago,
• 1:06:03
  Speaker 1: five years ago, and I couldn't get less. To be honest,
• 1:06:08
  Speaker 1: I could see him walking down the street and I
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 1: would be like, oof, I don't even recognise him, he knows.
• 1:06:14
  Speaker 3: Like, we're done, we've healed.
• 1:06:17
  Speaker 1: And I'm so grateful that I had the friends and family,
• 1:06:20
  Speaker 1: that I had the professional support psychological help and I
• 1:06:24
  Speaker 1: gave myself time to do so because otherwise yeah I
• 1:06:28
  Speaker 1: wouldn't be where I am now so I'm very grateful
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 1: going through the court process and having to document everything
• 1:06:34
  Speaker 1: was traumatic but I think it helped I think it
• 1:06:39
  Speaker 1: helped having to write things down because I could get
• 1:06:42
  Speaker 1: them out I could get them on paper and I
• 1:06:44
  Speaker 1: could make them factual Because when you're living so long
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 1: in a state of disbelief with what's reality, what's not,
• 1:06:52
  Speaker 1: you do question everything. But getting it out, it was
• 1:06:56
  Speaker 1: like the final release of like, this happened. It wasn't
• 1:07:02
  Speaker 1: okay that it happened, but it's okay that I didn't
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 1: leave or.
• 1:07:08
  Speaker 3: I didn't do something. Everyone's like, why didn't you leave?
• 1:07:11
  Speaker 3: It was so bad.
• 1:07:12
  Speaker 1: That's so easy to say when you're not in it,
• 1:07:14
  Speaker 1: when you're not addicted to the relationship. It is an addiction. Unfortunately,
• 1:07:18
  Speaker 1: I needed something that was so significant to stop the addiction.
• 1:07:23
  Speaker 1: And seeing the messages I'm being cheated on in front
• 1:07:25
  Speaker 1: of my parents, having them there to witness my breakdown,
• 1:07:29
  Speaker 1: that was the thing that I needed to stop the pattern.
• 1:07:32
  Speaker 1: So going through it all with a lens of having
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 1: the education now to know what it all was, it.
• 1:07:40
  Speaker 3: It did kind of help in an odd way. I'm
• 1:07:42
  Speaker 3: not thankful for it.
• 1:07:43
  Speaker 1: I wish he never came back. I wish he never
• 1:07:45
  Speaker 1: had to go through it. But you always have to
• 1:07:47
  Speaker 1: look for some sort of a silver lining and that, yeah.
• 1:07:52
  Speaker 3: That was it.
• 1:07:52
  Speaker 1: It was nice and that was validated. I was told
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 1: that wasn't okay and that, like women, no one should
• 1:07:59
  Speaker 1: feel that way.
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 3: No one should feel unsafe in their house.
• 1:08:02
  Speaker 1: I would do nothing to ever compromise that peace and
• 1:08:06
  Speaker 1: to say if ever I feel a little bit uncomfortable,
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 1: a little bit uneasy, that that's not okay.
• 1:08:11
  Speaker 3: It doesn't have to be significant.
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 1: If you feel unsafe, if you feel uneasy, if you
• 1:08:16
  Speaker 1: feel controlled or the need to having to please someone,
• 1:08:20
  Speaker 1: that is not okay. And I feel like there's a
• 1:08:24
  Speaker 1: lot of people out there that have these small micro-violence situations.
• 1:08:31
  Speaker 3: It's not micro-violence, it's violence. It's that simple.
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 1: And I just hope that people listening will realise that
• 1:08:41
  Speaker 1: Anything small or little that makes you feel unsafe is
• 1:08:45
  Speaker 1: not okay. It's not small. It's significant. You are significant
• 1:08:49
  Speaker 1: and it matters. Anytime you feel like you have to lie,
• 1:08:55
  Speaker 1: deceive or convince others of your happiness in a relationship
• 1:09:00
  Speaker 1: or you have to make excuses for your partner, that
• 1:09:04
  Speaker 1: should be a really massive warning sign.
• 1:09:07
  Speaker 3: That's not okay. There's been no communication.
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 1: I don't believe he's still in Australia, but I have
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 1: no way of knowing because I am protected and I
• 1:09:19
  Speaker 1: am safe. And that is freeing. I honestly could not
• 1:09:24
  Speaker 1: care less. Could not care less. I do not wish
• 1:09:27
  Speaker 1: ill on him. I do think that he has some
• 1:09:31
  Speaker 1: deep demons. I don't think anyone who acts like that
• 1:09:34
  Speaker 1: is happy in themselves.
• 1:09:37
  Speaker 3: So I.
• 1:09:39
  Speaker 1: Do truly wish the best for him. I will not
• 1:09:41
  Speaker 1: harbour that hatred. I will not harbour that anger. I
• 1:09:44
  Speaker 1: will not wish ill on him because that just keeps
• 1:09:47
  Speaker 1: it alive in me.
• 1:09:48
  Speaker 3: I've made my peace with it.
• 1:10:01
  Speaker 2: Everyone Has an X is a Minty Media production and
• 1:10:04
  Speaker 2: proudly part of the Mamma Mia Network. This episode was
• 1:10:07
  Speaker 2: written and narrated by me, Georgia Love, and produced by
• 1:10:10
  Speaker 2: Linda Scott. If you have a story you'd like to share,
• 1:10:13
  Speaker 2: email everyonehasanx at mintymedia.com.au. You can support us by following
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 2: the show in your favourite podcast app and leaving a
• 1:10:21
  Speaker 2: five-star rating and review.
• 1:10:23
  Speaker 1: We'll see you for the next one.