Transcript

Parenting · Reformed Thinking

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Welcome to the deep dive. This is where we take a stack of
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sources, maybe your notes, some research, could be a transcript,
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and we sort of dive in together. That's the idea.
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We want to pull out the core stuff, the really interesting
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bits, and help you feel like you've got a good handle on it
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without getting bogged down. Think of us as guides, helping
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you navigate the material you've shared, pointing out what jumps
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out, what connects. And today we're tackling
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something well. It's incredibly relevant for so
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many. Maybe you're knee deep and
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raising kids right now. Or perhaps you're thinking about
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it down the road. Or maybe you're just interested
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in a biblical take on family. This one's for you.
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We're diving into God centered discipline and you know what
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faithful parenting looks like according to scripture.
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We've got a pretty rich stack here.
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Detailed notes from a talk, Some research points, A transcript
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giving us a framework. Yeah.
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And our mission, really, is to make sense of it together,
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figure out what matters most, what resonates for you, our
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listener. All right, so let's start where
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these sources kick things off. They really challenge how we
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even define success in parenting.
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Yeah, this is foundational, laid out right at the beginning, and
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it kind of reframes everything else.
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The sources say successful parenting isn't ultimately
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measured by the outcome in the child.
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Wait, so it's not about how my teenager is behaving or if my
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adult kid is, you know, walking faithfully?
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According to this material, no, the success is defined by the
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parents faithfulness in applying God's ways.
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The measuring stick is what you did, your obedience, your effort
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before God. That's that's a different
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perspective. So the assessment is on my
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effort, my posture, not necessarily the final product,
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so to speak. Exactly.
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And the sources are really clear on this point.
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It takes a certain kind of pressure off, maybe.
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It does. It means my identity as
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successful parent isn't completely tied to something I
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can't actually fully control. Right, and they state it
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plainly. Parenting is definitely not a
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formula, you know. Do A&B and you're guaranteed to
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get C in your child. Your faithfulness.
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While God commands it and it's crucial, it doesn't
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automatically guarantee your child's salvation or even their
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future righteousness. Because children are born into
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sin. Yes, and it's the Lord alone who
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opens eyes, who grants new life. It underscores that spiritual
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reality. It's not just about technique.
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Yeah, at all. It means constant reliance on
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God. Which brings in that deep
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humility parenting requires. One source mentions a quote from
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the speaker's father, which I think hits home for many.
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I was the world's best parent until I had kids.
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Oh yeah, I've heard variations of that.
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You have all the theories and then reality.
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Exactly. It shows how hard it is, how
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humbling. And the sources don't ignore
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that they actually offer quite a bit of grace for those times.
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Maybe even long stretches where you look back and feel that
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guilt or sadness. Thinking I wasn't faithful
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enough there or I lost my patience.
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Yes. And the encouragement is clear.
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Yeah, run to the cross. There's forgiveness in Christ
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for those failures. Don't get stuck.
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There, so the foundation isn't perfect performance, which is
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impossible anyway, but it's about our posture, striving for
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faithfulness because of the grace we've received, and
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finding more grace when we mess up.
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That sums up this initial framing really well, and this
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whole discussion, it's set within the context of Ephesians
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chapter 5, talks about being filled with the Spirit
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submitting to one another. And then Chapter 6 applies that
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directly to the family, right, kids and parents.
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Precisely. Which brings us to the key
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tasks. These sources dig into Ephesians
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6 verses one through 4. They spend a lot of time really
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unpacking these verses. Exegesis, they call it.
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Exegesis. That means pulling the meaning
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out of the text, not reading things into it.
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You got it. The aim is to understand what
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Paul intended, what the text itself says.
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It's the opposite of isogesis, where you kind of find verses to
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prop up ideas you already have. OK, makes sense.
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So let's follow their lead. Let's excavate Fusion 6.1
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starts. Children, obey your parents and
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the Lord, for this is right. Who are these children?
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Good question. The sources point to the Greek
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word 10 non, they explain it generally refers to children
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still in the home, dependent on their parents.
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So old enough to understand a command and choose to obey or
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disobey. Right.
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Not infants and typically not adult children living
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independently. Dependent kids under the parents
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roof. What about say, a 25 year old
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still living at home? Does this apply in the same way?
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Well, the sources touch on that. They say while this passage
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isn't primarily designed for that specific scenario, other
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principles about respect, love, household order still apply.
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But Tenon here really focuses on that parent dependent child
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relationship during the raising years.
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OK. They also distinguished Tenon
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from Huios. Yeah, Tenon has more do with
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dependence age being raised. Huios is just son denoting the
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relationship itself, which never changes regardless of age or
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location. Got it.
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So dependent children in the household and the command is
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obey. What's the force of that word?
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Hypakuo. Hypakuo.
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It means more than just hearing. It's listening intently, really
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paying attention, and then heeding the command, doing
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what's asked. The sources use that phrase
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right away, all the way with a happy heart.
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They do. It captures the totality of the
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obedience called for. It means the child doesn't
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really get the right to debate it first or demand all the
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reasons, or even agree with it before they act.
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Like the wind and waves obeying Jesus instantly.
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That's the illustration used now.
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Wise parents do often explain things, but the obligation to
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obey isn't conditional on the child's agreement or full
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understanding. That definitely cuts again some
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modern ideas about negotiation with kids.
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It does, and the next phrase strengthens that in the Lord.
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This is crucial. It doesn't mean obey only if
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your parents are believers. Or only if the command is about
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church stuff. No, it qualifies the obedience
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itself. It means this obedience is God
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centered. The command to obey parents
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ultimately originates from God, so the child's obedience is
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rendered to him. Wow.
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So even if the parents aren't believers, or even if the parent
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is maybe not entirely right in that specific instance, the
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child's duty before God is still to obey.
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According to this passage, yes, because God is the one
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commanding it. It's obedience in the Lord
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directed towards Him. That's a high standard, and Paul
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adds for this is right. Right.
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It's not just one optional parenting philosophy among many.
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Requiring obedience from dependent children is presented
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as inherently righteous. In God's eyes, disobedience is
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unrighteousness. So it pushes back on just aiming
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for cooperation or being buddies with your kids.
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It prioritizes God's standard of righteousness within the family
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structure he designed. Authority and obedience are part
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of that structure. OK, but it's not just about
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outward actions, is it? Verse 2 brings in the 5th
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commandment. Honor your father and mother.
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Exactly. And honor goes much deeper than
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just doing what you're told. It's about the attitude, the
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heart. The sources define it as a
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reverent attitude. Reverent attitude.
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What does that look like and what does it rule out?
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It means holding parents in high value, seeing them as treasured.
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And it rules out things like reluctance, obvious anger,
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defiance, complaining, whining, grumbling, muttering under your
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breath. You know the stuff.
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Slight chuckle. Oh yeah, the obey with your face
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idea doing it but making it clear you resent it.
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That's the picture. A child might technically do the
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task, but if their face is sour, their tone is sharp, they sigh
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dramatically. That's not honor.
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It reveals a heart issue. And dealing with that heart
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attitude seems way harder and slower than just correcting the
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action. Oh, much harder, the sources
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quote Ted Tripp saying something like a change in behavior that
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doesn't stem from a change in heart is condemnable.
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Meaning just getting them to act right without addressing the why
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isn't the goal. It might even be harmful.
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Right. It can foster hypocrisy.
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Addressing the heart, The attitude is key, even though
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it's tough. It takes wisdom, patience, the
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sources say. It's like chipping away at it
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over time, cultivating a heart that genuinely values parents.
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And this command to honor is special.
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Yes, it's highlighted here as the first commandment from the
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10 commandments that comes with a specific promise attached in
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the Old Testament text. And Ephesians 6.3 gives that
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promise that it may go well with you and that you may live long
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in the land. What's the idea there?
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The sources break it down. That it may go well with you
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speaks to the quality of life. It connects to God's design.
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Parents guiding children leads to their well-being.
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That you may live long points to the quantity of life.
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Practically speaking, kids who listen to warnings are safer.
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Basically, yes. Don't run on the street.
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Don't touch that. Obedience protects them from
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danger, literally and figuratively.
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So the promise isn't just random, it shows obedience is
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actually good for the child. Exactly.
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Calvin's quoted saying the promise helps excite our hopes
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and impart a greater cheerfulness to our obedience.
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It frames obedience not as drudgery, but as something
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beneficial, bringing them into the families and God's sort of
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shelter and protection. Like bringing them back into the
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family circle when they stray. Conveying safety and care, not
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just rules. Yes, and that needs to come
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across in the parents tone and manner, not just the words.
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This is the place of blessing, of security.
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OK, that covers the kids side from verses 1 to 3.
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Then verse four turns to parents, specifically fathers.
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Why fathers? The Greek is Patera.
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While it can sometimes times mean parents, generally, the
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sources argue that here context suggests it's zooming in,
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focusing on the dads as the representative heads.
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Like the primary responsibility rests there, especially
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considering the Roman context. Right.
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In a world with patriot potestas where fathers had almost
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absolute power, Paul calls them to a very different standard,
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starting with a negative command.
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Do not provoke your children to anger.
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Which doesn't mean never make them angry, right?
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Correction can do that. Exactly.
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It means don't unnecessarily exasperate them.
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Don't embitter them through your own sinful patterns or
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unreasonable demands beyond what righteous correction requires.
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And the sources list of a lot of ways parents can do that.
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It's quite eye opening. It is things like being
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domineering, micromanaging, comparing kids negatively,
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smothering, neglecting, showing favoritism.
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Over disciplining, using harsh words, pushing worldly goals too
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hard. Condescension.
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Constant criticism for getting their kids.
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Marital strife spilling over making the home.
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Child centered disciplining in anger.
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Modeling the very anger you forbid.
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Double standards, inconsistent rules.
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Never admitting you're wrong. Wow.
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It's a humbling list. The sources mentioned Lupriolo's
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book The Heart of Anger, especially Chapter 2 for more on
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this. It shows how our sin can
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directly fuel sin and bitterness in our kids.
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OK, so that's the don't. Then comes the crucial but the
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positive command. But bring them up in the
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discipline and instruction of the Lord that but pivots to the
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active positive work God requires.
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And it's described as hard work. Yeah, because kids drawing from
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passages like Romans 3 naturally lean towards sin, towards well,
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unrighteousness and misery have left to themselves.
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Parenting is the God ordained work, using his grace to
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actively steer them away from that, towards him.
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It takes effort, engagement. And this bringing them up
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happens through two things, discipline and instruction.
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Let's take discipline first, Paydaya.
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Paydaya. It's broader than just
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punishment. Think intentional guidance,
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directing and correcting or train discipline.
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It involves both training, teaching, modeling, habit
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forming and discipline in the sense of correcting failure.
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So it's proactive shaping, not just reactive punishment.
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Right. Making sure they know what to
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do, helping them practice it, and then correcting when they
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get it wrong. The sources use a touch analogy
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A. Coach teaches drills, corrects
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mistakes. Yeah, that fits.
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And they point out the same word paydaya is used in Second
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Timothy 3.16. Scripture is profitable for
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teaching reproof, correction, and training in righteousness.
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It's about formation for godly living.
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And the primary responsibility for this paydaya rests with.
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Parents specifically highlighting fathers.
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Here, the church comes alongside, supports, but doesn't
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replace the parents. OK, that's Pedea.
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What about instruction? Nowthesia.
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Nowthesia. It's the root of Nowthedic
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counseling associated with Jay Adams.
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It emphasizes God's Word speaking to our issues.
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Right, the answers aren't just found inside us.
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Exactly. So nowthesia here is about
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verbal instruction, admonition. It's placing something into the
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mind, specifically God's truth. It's telling the child what
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God's Word says about their situation, their actions, their
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heart. So it's confrontation, but
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restorative. Using words to guide and
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correct? Yes, designed to correct without
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provoking or embittering. It's helping them know the words
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so they can do the word critically.
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It's not using the Bible as a weapon, a club to beat them
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down, but as the light guiding them.
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So payday is the whole training process, and nothesia is the
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vital verbal part, applying God's truth within that process.
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They work hand in hand. Absolutely, both are essential.
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Now the sources shift perspective a bit, drawing from
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Hebrews 12, which talks about God disciplining believers.
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How does that inform parental discipline?
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It's presented as providing both the foundation and the
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motivation. Understanding how God
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disciplines us is key to how we should discipline our kids.
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What's the foundational piece from Hebrews 12?
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2 main things. First, parents need to look to
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Jesus continually. Hebrews 12.2 to 3 says fix your
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eyes on him. Consider Him so you don't get
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weary or faint hearted. Parenting is exhausting.
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Uh huh. Physically.
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Emotionally. Right, and the source of
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strength isn't just trying harder, it's constantly looking
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to Christ, His work, His grace that fuels the faithfulness,
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especially in tough discipline moments.
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OK, look to Jesus for strength. What's the second thing?
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Consider your position as believers.
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We are children receiving God's paydaya, His trained discipline.
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And why does he discipline us? Hebrew says it's because he
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loves us, not because we're so lovely or deserving.
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So God disciplines us out of love, even when we're sinful.
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Just like Christ died for us while we were still sinners.
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And that shapes how we discipline moving towards our
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kids in love, even in their sinfulness, because that's how
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God deals with. Us.
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That's the connection. God disciplines us for our good
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that we may share in His Holiness.
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It yields peaceful fruit later. So our discipline should also
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aim for their good, their holiness, their growth and
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righteousness, not just stopping bad behavior or venting our
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frustration. Understanding God's loving,
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purposeful discipline of us changes everything, So what
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specific motivations for our discipline flow from that?
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The sources list a few key ones. First, it should model God's
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love. Discipline done rightly is an
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act of love, showing we care about their character and their
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relationship with God. Show the child that we, the
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parents, are also under God's authority and long to obey him.
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This means admitting our own sins, sometimes framing things
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as we both need to follow God's way here, not just you broke my
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rule. OK, Third, clearly communicate
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love during the process, saying things like, why am I doing
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this? Because I love you.
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I want what's best for you in God's eyes.
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They need to hear that repeatedly.
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It's not driven by anger. And 4th perhaps most
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importantly. Show them their need for the
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gospel. Every failure, every sin that
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requires discipline is a chance to connect their behavior back
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to their fundamental need for Jesus.
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Not a heavy-handed sermon, but linking their action, their
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heart attitude to their need for forgiveness, for grace, for the
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spirits. Help to change.
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Making discipline A pointer to Christ that really elevates it.
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It transforms it from just behavior management into a
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spiritual exercise, really. OK, so we have the biblical
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foundation, the motivation. How does this play out
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practically? The sources give some steps.
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Yes, a multi step process and the very first step is crucial.
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Discern the actual problem. Get to the heart issue, not just
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the surface action. How?
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Do you do that? Behavior is obvious.
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Hearts are hidden. Start with what questions?
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Especially with younger kids. What happened?
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What did you do? Get the facts.
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Identify the SIM clearly. Why?
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Questions can be hard for them to answer honestly or
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accurately. OK, establish the facts.
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Name the sin. Then then you try to probe the
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why in terms of thoughts and feelings.
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What were you thinking when you did that?
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What were you feeling? The goal is to uncover the
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motive, the desire, the fear behind the action.
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Like the example of staying out late.
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Right, the action was being late, but the heart issue might
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have been fear of man. Exactly.
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Using that hands, head, heart framework, What they did, what
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they thought, why they did it, the heart, desire or fear.
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And the parents role is to connect that heart issue to
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God's Word. Yes, using Authesia.
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Help them see what God says, then guide them to replay it.
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Think through how they should have responded biblically,
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putting off the sin, putting on Christ.
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It's teaching them slowly, baby steps, how to apply God's truth
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themselves. That's way more involved than
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just time out. What's next?
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Be consistent. Parents need to be predictable,
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self controlled, inconsistent parenting, sometimes strict,
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sometimes LAX, depending on mood makes kids confused, like
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emotional weathermen trying to guess the climate.
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Creates insecurity and dads should check with moms.
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Yeah, Ensuring they're on the same page, presenting a united
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front. Consistency builds security OK.
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Discern the heart. Be consistent.
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What else? Use biblical language.
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Frame things using biblical terms when you can instead of
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just you're in trouble. Maybe this was disobedience or
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that wasn't kind. Why is that helpful?
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It connects their actions directly to God's standards.
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It helps them understand the put offs and put ONS from scripture.
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Disobedience versus obedience, unkindness versus kindness, et
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cetera. It grounds the correction in
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God's truth, not just parental preference.
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Makes sense, even if finding the exact term for, say, a tantrum
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is tricky sometimes. Right, the effort to use
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biblical categories is what matters.
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So discern, be consistent, use biblical language.
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Now, how to actually administer the discipline?
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The sources break this down into before, during and after.
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Before discipline, there needs to be instruction.
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Kids need to know the standard before they're corrected for
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braiding it. Instruction should be ongoing,
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part of daily life, Deuteronomy 6 style, not just pulled out
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like a club during discipline. So correction reinforces
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teaching they've already had. What about during?
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Administer it in love promptly if possible, though a cool down
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might be needed if tempers are flared.
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Yours or theirs, and in private whenever feasible.
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Why private? To avoid public shame or
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focusing the child on what others think.
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Fear of man keep the focus on their sin before God and the
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parent. Public settings are tough, but
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the sources suggest if a child can remember to ask for candy
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later, they can remember to talk about their behavior later in
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private. That's a helpful way to think
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about it and the discipline itself.
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Should be consequential, felt, but not physically or
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emotionally bruising. Measured, controlled, gracious,
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reflecting God's discipline, firm but restorative, always
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driven by love and biblical principle, not parental anger.
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Get specific about the issue, seek wisdom and let love be the
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aim. And the crucial step after the
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consequence. Reconciliation discipline isn't
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finished until the relationship is restored.
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It's not just about punishment endured, it's about coming back
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together. What does that involve?
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Several things. Affection, a hug, holding them,
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aiming for warmth, smiles, even laughter.
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Eventually, if everyone's still tense, it's not done.
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Proclamation. Bring in the gospel.
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Talk about their sin, but also your sin, your shared need for
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Jesus. Supplication.
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Pray with them and for them. Bring it all to God together.
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Restitution, help them make it right.
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An apology, fixing what they broke, Redoing the action
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correctly. So the end goal is always
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restoration, pointing back to the gospel, bringing them back
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into that circle of love and security.
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Exactly. It's modeled on God's
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reconciling work with us through Christ.
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If conflict lingers, maybe the reconciliation piece needs more
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attention. Wow.
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OK, this has been a really thorough deep dive into these
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sources. We've looked at redefining
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success, dug deep into Ephesians 6, considered God's discipline
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in Hebrews 12 as a model, and walk through some very practical
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gospel centered steps. Yeah, it's definitely
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challenging material, but so important for parents trying to
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think and act biblically. We really hope exploring this
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together has shed light on the material for you, our listener,
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offering both solid biblical grounding and practical ways
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forward in this huge calling of parenting.
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It provides A framework that's really centered on God's word,
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on the parents faithfulness flowing from God's love, rather
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than just focusing on behavior modification techniques.
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So as we wrap up this deep dive, here's a final thought for you
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to Mull over. If the ultimate goal of
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discipline, biblically understood involves
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reconciliation and pointing towards the gospel, how might
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applying these principles change how you think about handling
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conflict or correction, not just with kids, but maybe in other
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relationships? Or even how you respond when you
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sense God's discipline in your own life.
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Thank you for joining us for this deep dive.
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We'll be back soon to explore more of the material you share
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with us.